veteran-class

[undone jungle]

yaaa with vets easy access to bleed on hit it's quirked up

been running it with mercy killer and executioner i think i forgot the name of the bless

man i gotta poop BRB

[old cobalt]

oh yeah you need Always Prepared for the Zarona meme

[remote sonnet]

Knife has uncanny

[old cobalt]

so it regens the ammo

forgor about that

[undone jungle]

is that the one upgrade to weapon spec

if so then yes

[old cobalt]

yes

[undone jungle]

yeah

[old cobalt]

its okay i just got rid of Field Improv

[undone jungle]

show us your tree

[old cobalt]

hnggh

sec

[undone jungle]

why you moaning in my ear for

[old cobalt]

because i gotta

make the build rq

[undone jungle]

okay

[old cobalt]

on editor

[undone jungle]

https://gif.fxtwitter.com/tweet_video/G2aKPodasAAynVp.gif

[undone jungle]

just take the pics

deadass just print screen

I don't care

[old cobalt]

no i will format it fucking correctly

[undone jungle]

just be lazy

[old cobalt]

no

[undone jungle]

it's okay nobody gaf

[remote sonnet]

The one thing I don't like about Roulette on Zarona is that with WS, I only shot once or twice then switch, so I don't really tap into that crit bonus.

[old cobalt]

i will live

[undone jungle]

i don't think that's how it works

unless they changed it

[old cobalt]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a00a28f1-6211-4753-8d82-2db0cc0bc365/nixs-funny-little-thing

[undone jungle]

I run this on the ds2 revolver build

also for curios nowadays ppl just run 2x tgh 1x stam with stam regen, sprint eff and combat ability regen tbh but it's preference. helps u stay mobile nd shit

[remote sonnet]

You get the crit after the the round is spent.

So the 1st shot doesn't get any bonus.

[undone jungle]

alt

[old cobalt]

i run health for the poxwalker breakpoint/some surv and i dropped the extra stam for double sniper to beat the sniper isnta-kill after 1 down breakpoint

[undone jungle]

oh then surg is better in this case for sure

[old cobalt]

swap cruc for surg?

[undone jungle]

probably better in this case yeah

[old cobalt]

got it

[undone jungle]

you usually deadshot max with revs

you don't even gaf abt the stamina consumption

[old cobalt]

how do you take a screenshot like this anyhow?

[undone jungle]

just because high crit damage and big rend

[old cobalt]

viewing full build just brings up a list

[undone jungle]

I'm on phone XD

[old cobalt]

fucker

[undone jungle]

too lazy to get up

[undone jungle]

ig just ctrl + -

so ur zoom on PC is lower

[nimble finch]

what's good bolter build?

[undone jungle]

then ctrl shift s

[undone jungle]

how metaslave do you need it to be

like can it be mostly good but really fun or does it have to be 100% optimal but kinda boring

[nimble finch]

mostly fun

[stable wave]

dumpstat for helbore ?

[undone jungle]

I'll get on my puter nd copy mine down for ya give me 5

it's based on a build someone else posted here that I liked

[old cobalt]

pins has a guide that has the best perks/blessings/stats for every weapon vet has

[undone jungle]

your enjoyment of the game /j

[undone jungle]

it's outdated sadly

[old cobalt]

is it?

[undone jungle]

dumpstat there is prob good tho

[old cobalt]

rip

ya but lets be real its

probably mobility

stability

[undone jungle]

hammer of the emp on microsoft docs one?

[old cobalt]

its stability

[old cobalt]

yee

[undone jungle]

it's stability yeah

you actually kinda want mob

[old cobalt]

i had to check mine like

[remote sonnet]

Roulette is only if you run Agrip.

[undone jungle]

cus equip time so long u will be moving with it

[undone jungle]

i see

[old cobalt]

"I know i have a god roll i just forgot what i dumped"

[tropic halo]

we all know that the dump stat for all weapons is melee

[nocturne mulch]

Ammo is dumo stat

[tropic halo]

you all playing wrong

[nocturne mulch]

You have infinite ammo so its pointless stat on helbore

[stable wave]

hm

[undone jungle]

pooping rn

ama

[stable wave]

thinking about it

[tepid otter]

nice

[old cobalt]

i would honestly have two

60% ammo 60% stability

[undone jungle]

perfectly fine if u shock troopermaxx but also stability is doing nothing for u whatsoever

[stable wave]

One ammo one stab ?

yea

[old cobalt]

cause that 60% ammo is gonna fuckin suck if youre ever NOT running the lasgun perk

[stable wave]

Yeahhh i mean stab is just recoil shit no ?

[undone jungle]

yeah basically no issue on bores

[stable wave]

and I am running shock trooper on the helbore build

[undone jungle]

if you think stability is useless on helbores wait until you see what it does on laspistols

still not the most useless stat in the game that'd be warp resistance

[stable wave]

• 200k

minus *

[undone jungle]

badass

[undone jungle]

so like 1% of your net worth

XD

[stable wave]

Nah i'm actually broke

xd

[undone jungle]

that's smth like 4 heresy missions u will recover

[undone jungle]

just do an aur mael don't they give like 85k

[stable wave]

I just finished levelling my final character

[old cobalt]

huh

[stable wave]

So been making 2-4 builds on each

[old cobalt]

i forget how fast this game will jump the shit out of you

[undone jungle]

I like to make 1 build for every ability, nade and keystone

it fun

[nimble finch]

bro forgor

[stable wave]

Yep, I usually pick either ability or weapon i like

[undone jungle]

I'm on the shitter

I ate a big breakfast...

[undone jungle]

been using infiltrate lately on nademaxx

+30% damage then spam ultrabuffed nades

practical? no.

fun? YES.

[undone jungle]

okay was it the boltgun build my ass forgot

[nimble finch]

yes

[tepid otter]

I got mine from someone here too that ive been liking

[undone jungle]

can u give me a funny image to use for the darklantern build icon

[nimble finch]

no image perm

[undone jungle]

you can dm me i will not kill yuo

[slim pulsar]

this was a ruse

[nocturne mulch]

And why wouldnt you have shock trooper?

H40 is trivial when you have infinite ammo and just pop heads all day with infinite ES and buffed MMF

[undone jungle]

stability just deadass does nothing and sometimes you get crit cucked/miss and your ammo eco eventually trickles down unless you run shock troop + scav which is a bit excessive

[nocturne mulch]

But it never runs down

You realise shock trooper procs on misses?

And you have near 100% crir

Crit

Survivalist gives positve ammo efficiency

I can go entire h40 without picking up ammo pack and only reloading maybe 1 or 2 times

[undone jungle]

@nimble finch https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a00a3427-05b3-40fd-840e-e13b3df93d5d/build-i-stole-from-a-dude-but-made-better

ty for the image

[nimble finch]

trans titus

ty

[undone jungle]

dont forget the read teh q/a

[nimble finch]

mark 3 is better than 2b?

[undone jungle]

completely different guns

mk3 you wanna use to mag dump groups of elites

fantastic for plasma spam rn

2b is boss DPS goat

mk3 is actually not a boltgun mark

its an upsided bolt pistol

with a blicky switch

thats how u wanna use it

[nimble finch]

k

[undone jungle]

if you want an OG 2b build uhhh fuck idk you can prob run VoC and left keystone would work with it

grab ability modifiers for big damage bucks

most ppl have already given up on 2b on vet and delegated it entirely for arbites cus arbi can make it work 90% as well while being way better in melee </3

[tropic notch]

id drop nade tink for skirmisher

[nimble finch]

what perks should i use?

[undone jungle]

agile engagement is a good trade too

if you dont mind a 25 tgh hit you can grab both

[tropic notch]

for bolter eh

[undone jungle]

i like extended duration smades tho

[tropic notch]

nothing wrong with that

[nimble finch]

on bolter*

[undone jungle]

rlly tho i mostly use this for low havoc up to maybe 30ish

eventually knife just

turns from gold to shit

its not a havoc build first and foremost XD

if it was it'd have corrupt res

[tropic notch]

i do puncture shattering impact

[undone jungle]

on that one flak maniac is what i run

u want pinning fire on the new boltgun

[tropic notch]

cara unyielding

[undone jungle]

on old shitter shat is good

[tropic notch]

oh new one

[undone jungle]

yaaa

[tropic notch]

yeah pinning

[undone jungle]

new one the only big enemy youll be mag dumping will be reapers and the soft side of nurgle slugs

[nimble finch]

dumpstat on bolter mk3 is mobility?

[undone jungle]

you can dump reload if you run volley adept but mobility is a safe bet

collat probably helps since

yanno

big aoe, pinning fire

likely makes no difference tho

since collat breakpoints are unserious

for mk3 i'd prob say mobility > reload > collat you wont see a major difference dumping any of these unless you don't take a reload talent for reload dump or you're using it giga high havoc so the breakpoints of 60/80 collat somehow come in to use

for auric this is perfectly servicable, actually makes the new event hilariously easy

[tropic notch]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/a00a382e-05b3-4642-98b3-106184bcd08e/vet-db-knife @undone jungle if i do knife on vet i do this

if you want krak drop grenadier for nade tink

[undone jungle]

looks like fun

i like playing stupid bullshit so ill try it out

[tall torrent]

Havoc itself doesn’t change stagger breakpoints

[undone jungle]

thats nice

[tropic notch]

yeah it sucks alot i make terrible builds

[tall torrent]

The modifiers can and when it does it basically means u cannot stagger

[undone jungle]

oh ya those are annoying

[tall torrent]

-100% impact is essentially doing 0 stagger

[undone jungle]

thankfully the mk3 aoe means it'll stagger some other schmuck

so pinning still gets value

[mortal aspen]

he transitioned from first gen to primaris

lore friendly

[tropic notch]

how do i get good at this game

[undone jungle]

rashad + plasma + shredders + voc and alt+f4 when you get downed

[tropic notch]

rashad

[undone jungle]

as someone with 80 iq who has to manually breathe i am offended that you'd dare react this way

[mortal aspen]

if we're power creeping anyway, fatshark, give Taxe uncanny

[undone jungle]

that'd be sick

[mortal aspen]

https://tenor.com/view/kratos-ares-destroy-my-enemies-and-my-life-is-yours-gif-7965707800203237625

[undone jungle]

imo brutal momentum should be replaced and every weapon who used to have it given it passively as part of the damage stat or smth

but then balanced to make it different per weapon/swing instead of a flat 5

but then again the blessing system is kinda fucked to begin with

[mortal aspen]

I just want Taxe to be better vs carapace

then it will be the best weapon ever

[tropic notch]

best i can do is play crit zealot

[tame lodge]

I just want Tactical shit to have its cap removed

https://tenor.com/view/crying-one-piece-anime-gif-4502646032764566609

Orestes 12 had it removed

😭

[undone jungle]

wdym cap

[mortal aspen]

but zealot is cringe

[tropic notch]

[mortal aspen]

maybe rending strikes + onslaught Taxe

🤔

[undone jungle]

u could do all or nothing

[grand perch]

no cleave cap on taxe

[tropic notch]

Das a meme

Only would be good on Arby too tbh

[grand perch]

eh would only be good for carapace

[tame lodge]

Iirc AoN is some sort of different type of damage

So it's better than it seems

[tropic notch]

Tac axe has 100 on adms except Cara right

[grand perch]

flak adm is less than 1

rending strikes helps a little here but its not really a detrimental weakness to flak, and thus barely noticable

depends on the attack as well, i think some already have 1 adm vs flak? not 100% sure off the top of my head

[undone jungle]

ya ik

arby maul aon is crazy

i think i was one of the first ppl to get on it

cus i remember talking abt it like week 1 in #arbites-class and they were calling me a false prophet and shit

[zenith carbon]

arby everythin is crazy

[undone jungle]

i remember we had that 1 day where

ppl were trying to make the mathmatically worst arbites build

and it ended up being tax + vigilant autogun

hilariously cus of buffs

thats a very good build now

💀

[limber karma]

hi, i noticed that I get 1 shotted by maulers/ogryns even with a full toughness + toughness reduction loadout

any tips to survive?

[zenith carbon]

dodge

[limber karma]

should I get +1 wound?

[undone jungle]

space bar

rebind dodge+jump to dodge only and bind your jump to some shit you never use like ctrl or alt

[willow prairie]

please do not woundmaxxing

😔

[undone jungle]

so you always dodge and not whiff

[zenith carbon]

i have jump on V

[limber karma]

i mean, at havoc 40, I am spamming dodge but sometimes i get randomly stuck

[undone jungle]

yeah thats just life

feet shredders + voc is your only savior there

[zenith carbon]

corral hordes to not get stuck

[willow prairie]

run 2 health 1 toughness

you insta die in havoc 40 otherwise

not even downed

[undone jungle]

^

trvth

[limber karma]

oh it's a health issue?

not the toughness?

[willow prairie]

yes

[limber karma]

any figures I should be aiming for?

[limber karma]

does wounds help preven the 1 shot? or just go all into health + toughness

[willow prairie]

no wound doesn't help

[stable socket]

wounds doesn't prevent the oneshot

it only lets you get downed 1 more time before dying

[limber karma]

is this okay?

i pick up an extra +25 toughness node too

and have all the tougness reduction keystones

[tame lodge]

Don't get hit

[grand perch]

damage res against bombers is pretty much pointless, you have to get out of there asap in any case
toughness regeneration speed only applies to the coherency bonus, not to other sources of t.regen. not worth it

damage resistances you want are gunners and maybe snipers

[tame lodge]

taxe heavies and push attack are capped at 3 targets

so the 4th target and so on takes 0 damage

regardless of your cleave

but dont worry about it

orestes 4 heavies are also capped

at 4

[undone jungle]

havent used chaxe in deadass like over a year

didnt know it was this cucked tho

[tame lodge]

the good news is that orestes 12 had their cap removed

[undone jungle]

the wet noodle?

huh

[tame lodge]

yeah those lights are 💀

and they were capped

not anymore though

[undone jungle]

if it felt more fun to use i might actually look at it

[grand perch]

when'd you record that?

[tame lodge]

Today

Taxe 7

[tame lodge]

at least the cap is gone

[limber karma]

what other perks would u get

[tame lodge]

victory

at least

for orestes 12 that is

jobs not done

34 min body damage is crazy though

Hsword min body is 52 iirc

[tepid otter]

Any thoughts on smaul

I kinda dig it, idk how to properly use it atm

[grand perch]

im asking because spawning stuff with the creature spawner mod breaks their health bars, making it really hard to test how many you have indeed hit and damaged. what do you use?

[tame lodge]

It's too consistent to be a mod breaking

[mortal aspen]

people really bring recon lasgun veteran to civi

[tame lodge]

Underrated

[mortal aspen]

what the fuck

[tame lodge]

It usually 1 shots specialists

2 shot human sized elites

Beat on Ogryns

[mortal aspen]

yeah, that recon is gonna do well vs 20 crushers and 30 maulers

[tame lodge]

Just really struggles against monstrosities

[dry cloak]

i would like to get rannciks revovler as a skin

would you?

[tame lodge]

Overall underrated

[tepid otter]

What blessings and perks for it

and the mark huehuehue

[dry cloak]

normal shockmauls are big underrated because they dont ,,KILL,, fast

mark which ones moveset suits you better

for perks its flak maniac imo

[tame lodge]

I personally use Muni

With Skullcrusher + Hammerblow/Falter

[dry cloak]

for blessings falter and skullcrusher

[tame lodge]

To help break ragers out of their combo

[dry cloak]

falter allows you to stagger crushers hard

also special opens bulwarks

[tepid otter]

what about the uhh, combo

i just spam lights ngl

[dry cloak]

munitorum horde clear is heavy light

[tepid otter]

what about killing specials

or is it the same, and I dont use PA

[tame lodge]

Usually heavy 1 shot

[dry cloak]

then start using push attacks

[tepid otter]

hmmm, i'll gib it a go

[dry cloak]

they help

alot

[tepid otter]

yeah alright

I thought it'll have some sort of moveset like when you do with psword or falc with the PA, L1 repeat kind of thing

[dry cloak]

no?

[tame lodge]

I've had dogs barking
Trappers laughing
Ragers raging
And everything else for 5 minutes on my screen by now

I should've muted

[tepid otter]

You in havoc?

[midnight wyvern]

is civi no ammo pickups?

[sudden cedar]

People don't bring that. Honestly. They queue into Auric Maelstrom without reading what mission is up and complain about it once they realize it.

[mortal aspen]

yes

[mortal aspen]

probably

[midnight wyvern]

yeah ive seen that a few times and done it before myself

[mortal aspen]

but maybe the logic is also: hurr durr, shock trooper infinite ammo

[midnight wyvern]

only once but

[mortal aspen]

except you can`t kill anything with that ammo

[undone jungle]

it's Auric maelstrom they'll be fine

[mortal aspen]

no

it`s CIVI

they were absolutely not fine, they were doing nothing

[willow prairie]

melee only me beloved

[mortal aspen]

CIVI still spams specials, especially snipers

but people are just not prepared for the mauler and crusher spam

[tepid otter]

whats CIVI

[tame lodge]

"Scab melee"

"No ammo maelstrom"

[tepid otter]

No ammo? wth

[tame lodge]

Straight up no ammo

Except that one period where ammo spawned

[willow prairie]

https://youtu.be/fQcq5Kmt7jE

vermintide 3 real

[tepid otter]

wheres the rats

[azure narwhal]

They made eye and space hulk deathwing so

I'm trusting this one

Might buy it blind

[tepid otter]

I know Deathwing, whats Eye about

[hearty panther]

That's a dangerous question.

[tepid otter]

How so

[hearty panther]

EYE is an absolute shitfuck of a plot.

And a game.

[tepid otter]

So.. not so great game?

[willow prairie]

no it good

idk why they have to make it sound like it actually ass

[knotty hill]

Because lying is fun

[void dragon]

No it's not

[knotty hill]

See, that’s the spirit

[tepid otter]

[turbid ibex]

Civilization

[azure narwhal]

EYE is a FPS/RPG hybrid with its own unique cyberpunk-y style i'd say. Has a good story and endings but the gameplay depth is nuts, quite fast paced

Has quite the cult following

Some people REALLY swear by it

But i'm more of a space hulk deathwing guy

Cause 40k hurr durr

Yknow

[tepid otter]

You and me both

also plus i like dark angels

[azure narwhal]

I find it heavily underrated

Its biggest fault imo

Is not explaining shit

But the game itself?

Cinema

Once you figure it out

How to dodge, how to build, how to grind

[tepid otter]

I didn't mind honestly finished it with some mates, it was great

[azure narwhal]

Oh the campaign is fine

I was talking high level pve

It's very fun

Once you get into it

But takes time to learn by yourself

[tepid otter]

Ahh, guess I was more casual, I didn't play that far ahead after finishing the campaign

[azure narwhal]

Honestly give it a go if you still care. I love dark angels too, i had a fun time collecting all successor chapter designs

[tepid otter]

Actually playing it with my brother during my off time lmao

Nothing too serious when we go multiplayer with some randos

[azure narwhal]

Neat

Yeah most people are new

Vets either play rarely nowadays or play solo

[tepid otter]

Well thats fair, i guess it considered an old game now

I still see people with like levels up to 800 tho

wild

[azure narwhal]

Yeapp

Well granted part of them are the russian hackers

[knotty hill]

Classic

[tepid otter]

guess theres always some huh

[azure narwhal]

Cheap obscure 40k game?

Absolutely

Most players and guides are in russian or translated from it

[tepid otter]

wonder if we'll ever get to see a continuation of deathwing tho, i'd be down for that

[azure narwhal]

I hope. I thirst for a great fps space marine/terminator game

Imagine if it's fully immersed

You see what marines see inside their helmets

Auspex readings

[tepid otter]

that'd be sick

[azure narwhal]

Targeting devices

I hope

[tepid otter]

id like to see a deeper take on how terminators actually fight as well

[azure narwhal]

Definitely

Shdw for all its good

Doesn't capture the actual brutality, weight comined with the speed of a terminator

They are still very mobile

[tepid otter]

Ikr, makes me kinda excited to see Pederson's Astartes 2 just cuz of a tease about a terminator helmet from his teaser

[ember nest]

yes

SM1 helped people understand that dreadnoughts aren't slow

I'd love a game that shows the same about termies

[tepid otter]

Maybe in SM3 but that prolly won't be soon

[agile mango]

whats the right attack pattern for horde clear on the mk 6 knife?

[fair shale]

Some part of me misses deathwing

[tepid otter]

Its a nice game

[twilit mirage]

is reload speed dump alright for stub revolver x.x

[undone jungle]

yes actually

but it means you always have to use these two talents with it

[twilit mirage]

ah am already using weapons specialist

will take always prepared too

[undone jungle]

yea then no loss

[twilit mirage]

thank youu \o/

[tame lodge]

Push attack

Push attack heavy heavy light heavy light heavy

Heavy heavy light heavy light heavy light...m

[undone jungle]

you can just heavy heavy block cancel too

if i remember correctly

[tall warren]

Did the new bolt gun not get given to zealot?
NEW

[knotty hill]

It’s a mark, it’s specific to the gun not the class

[crimson wyvern]

well atleast theyre honest

[midnight wyvern]

I initially thought you said eve

[hollow ibex]

are they running smite?

[midnight wyvern]

and it made perfect sense

[midnight wyvern]

The liability is horizontal again

[fair shale]

Yk the allegory of the Cave?

EYE is a game about the allegory of the cave

Very fun and very jank

Goes on sale for like $1 real often

And has 64 person co op

[long ridge]

/builds

[faint beacon]

/gamemode 1

[narrow frost]

/timeset day

[mortal aspen]

-apso -water red

[gilded wraith]

Has anyone tried out a lethal proximity krak build post rework? Any value?

[cedar imp]

Focus Target is inconsistent sadly. I had a pretty nice build with it but somehow at some point of the game, your tagging can desync and 90% of the time from this point, the tag wont work which breaks my toughness regen and the damage boost. Very sad. Im stuck again to play Weapons specialist only in havoc.......

Thanks Fatshark.

Because there is a bug or whatever we call it, that at some point in the game you can be ''out of sync'' everything will be delayed for over 0.5 seconds. So delayed kills, delayed blocking, everything is out of whack. Since this ALSO affect tagging, it means that Focus Target can simply not be something that exists for the remaining of an entire game. As the other stuff mentionned above wasnt bad enough.

[grand perch]

ive never had that happen

[red robin]

Damn

Is that a desync issue?

Or is that hard baked into usage of the keystone?

[cedar imp]

What is weird is that my ping and connectivity stays the exact same. Theres just something in the game that decides at some random point that I am desynced with the game

[cedar imp]

Nah all the symptoms above also shows up

best way to do is leave and come back

[red robin]

I feel like the servers always got like a little bit of desync

How it feels to use the las pistol and get phantom headshots

[cedar imp]

Bro

No regs are the bane of my existance

dont wonder why no matter the buffs, precision weapons cannot be a viable high level thing in this game

[red robin]

Buffing the vigilant autoguns by buffing the headshot hitbox don’t matter if I still get phantom hits

[cedar imp]

framerate is bad (Frame pacing), scopes are horrid, no regs and desyncs

[grand perch]

nonsense

[cedar imp]

you have that or you could just take the Bolter and spam bodyshots and one shot em anyway with some decent settup

[red robin]

Sucks that hit reg factors fps performance big times

[grand perch]

youre blowing hitreg issues out of proportion

[red robin]

My cpu is a tad bit outdated and can’t get super high frame rate

[red robin]

You don’t understand, I must blame the game and my lack of consistency in skill

[cedar imp]

huh. They are not the end of the world. But definitely a huge factor

[red robin]

My hubris won’t allow it

[cedar imp]

In this case, I was desynced till a reconnection which made thinks 25% if not 35% less consistent

To adapt would be to mod specifically to speedrun reconnections

Which I should look into

[vapid nacelle]

Does "Leave No One Behind" activate on players who are hogtied? I'm trying to figure out what exactly happened in a match I did yesterday

[sharp epoch]

I got that yesterday after an error 2014 dc, but it's not really a regular issue

[vapid nacelle]

Maybe a dumb question but does "Stun Immunity" prevent the stun that happens when you block when out of stamina?

[tall torrent]

no

guard break bypasses stun immunity

[vapid nacelle]

I'm so confused then. Yesterday I was in a game trying to revive my entire team and failed, and got swarmed by like 20 guys, and somehow I just kept blocking and dodging everything even though I ran out of stamina. I had Get Back In The Fight but I didn't run out of Toughness in that situation. It literally saved the entire run. I feel like I'm missing something.

I had nowhere to dodge either, I ran out of dodges and was a bit boxed in either way

[cedar imp]

I dont run into this issue (error 2014), we might have different triggers or different problem here

[vapid nacelle]

this is what I was running and I was blocking with a Mark 5 duelling sword if it matters. I guess this isn't really important but I'm really curious if there's some lesser mechanic I forgot about

[grand perch]

i dont think anyone'll be able to tell what happened without a video

[sharp epoch]

if you have stun immunity though after you run out of toughness and theyre doing hp damage you can still revive

[vapid nacelle]

I don't think they did any toughness damage at all. I really need to make a habit of recording stuff lol

[gilded wraith]

@tall torrent Has your build recommendation for the Mk3 Vigilant changed post rework? I'm currently building it off the Word document guide.

[vapid nacelle]

But even if they did hit my health bar I only had like 20 health left, so I surely would've died

[tall torrent]

maniac, flak, surgical, deadly accurate

[gilded wraith]

Thanks!

[fluid gust]

Hmmmmmm

Born Leader + Exe Stance?

[grand perch]

things you dont want to see the zealot using in havoc 40

[hollow ibex]

aint nobody got ponts for BL

[upbeat horizon]

hey anyone has a good build for the new mark boltgun?

[grand perch]

he also had the wrong thammer

and charged forward when everyone pinged to go back so someone could spawn closer

how did they ever get to h40 i wonder

[hollow ibex]

just run the generic bolter build

[vapid nacelle]

surely this will shake the havoc meta

[cedar imp]

Based

The curio in question :

1 wound

• Corruption resistance Grimoires
  -Damage resistance Tox Flamers
• Damage resistance mutants

I hope someday we gonna have a curio system rework, I feel like I have thousands of them in my inventory and 90% of the traits are severely bad compared to the 10% remaining, would definitely shake up the meta

[hollow ibex]

yeah curios were def forgotten in the itemization rework

[cedar imp]

I do think they just need to merge stuff

Grimoire and corruption resist = Global Corruption resist
Bombers and flamers = Flame resist
Damage resistance Gunners +Snipers = Global gunner resist, they could lower % but make gunner resistance ACTUALLY resist against gunners. Many of them has exemptions
Ordo dockets + Experience

Toughness regen speed + Revive speed (to give selfish reward for cooperating) and builds that benefit from coherency

Many more, those are simple examples

[sharp epoch]

bomber resist apparently applies to tox bombers as well 🤓

[cedar imp]

well they could fit into corruption resist

corruption resist aint really good on curios on its own

[tropic notch]

Turn gunner res into ranged damage res

[cedar imp]

basically

[tropic notch]

Like the oggy talent

[sharp epoch]

I run corrupt resist

pretty decent

[tropic notch]

I never found a use for corruption res

[cedar imp]

hum I dont see the use

[tropic notch]

It’s nice

[tropic notch]

Burster res

Tox flamer res

Dog res

[sharp epoch]

so in havoc most enemies do corruption damage so any chip damage you just get corrupted, corruption resist lets you not get as corrupted

[tropic notch]

Bon res

Cspawn res

[leaden condor]

How does one properly use the plasma guns jesus christ

[cedar imp]

fair

[cedar imp]

Crosshair change mod

and spam m1

[sharp epoch]

literally just headshot

[tropic notch]

Flak unarmored gets hot rising heat

[sharp epoch]

bonus points for collateral headshots

[tropic notch]

You can technically dump thermal res

[red robin]

What if was elite/specialist resist

[cedar imp]

could, theres so many ways to make it work

[tropic notch]

The min max dump is @tired egret

[sharp epoch]

my plasmer

[red robin]

God

[cedar imp]

As long as it is coherent and competitive, theres many ways to make a new curio system more appeling

[cedar imp]

Unarmored?

Why so?

[sharp epoch]

havoc dreg gunners mostly

[cedar imp]

is there a breakpoint idk of?

[red robin]

In the future full scale vet rework, I hope they add a cleave node

[cedar imp]

ah

[red robin]

Or weakspot hit mass reduction

[hybrid plover]

Dreg tox bombers too

[sharp epoch]

and most specials/maniacs you can one tap

[tropic notch]

I hope theses some changes to the zealot tree

[cedar imp]

dont give me hope

[tropic notch]

But atm it’s pretty good

[red robin]

I just be missing hotshot tier 1 applying to melee

[cedar imp]

I didnt even know about it

sounds funni

[sharp epoch]

I thought they patched that

[tall torrent]

this guy

[cedar imp]

lmao

I love the Bolter with the talent tree changes, pulling it out faster with a better Focus target is nuts

It one shots many stuff in Havoc

But to do so, I reduced its boss killing potential severely

[tropic notch]

I love that I never hear these dudes spawn

[sharp epoch]

i kinda dont like FT because you gotta spam ping to use it optimally

[red robin]

Yeah man I miss it, it’s gone 🙁

[cedar imp]

Yeah, it annoys me too

But damn 24%-30% toughness regen for entire team around me is nuts

you kill 2-3 enemies and everyone is full

Its ping spam but tight group doesnt run out of toughness

[red robin]

Born leader is pretty solid for team toughness

[cedar imp]

Yeah, I want to lean into it but 1 less point could be the difference between bolter 1 shots and doesnt

[red robin]

Vet with million sources of toughness replenished over time adds up

[cedar imp]

Imma need to think what I can sacrifice but would be pretty neat

[tropic notch]

Born leader makes vet a actual medic lol

[sharp epoch]

thing is most other classes regen toughness way faster

[red robin]

I mean, it’s 5% grenade regen, revive speed, or born leader

Out of those 3

All pretty good ngl

[hollow ibex]

grenade regen is basically mandatory tbh

unless you're playing on heresy or lower

[red robin]

For optimal play probably the 5% nade recovery is the best option

speaking of curio rework

would be neat if toughness coherency regen was changed to just toughness replenishment

with super toned numbers

like 5% or something along those lines

[tropic halo]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1040068038109712434/1231275601793384458/ezgif.com-video-to-gif_1-1.gif

how

[cedar imp]

hum I feel the issue is that there isnt a number that would make sense for both

5% on already very very slow regen (tough coherency) wouldnt do anything

but toughness replenishment curio slot would def be interesting

they would need to have a different number for both imo if it were to happen

[red robin]

toughness regeneration speed only influences toughness generated from coherency, in a game where 90% of units are in melee distance, the perk has next to no uptime or utility

toughness replenishment is like a modifier that increases toughness gained from talents or blessings by a percentage, like marksmen focus node tunnel vision which increases it by 40% or 60% (when at 10 or 15 stacks)

[agile mango]

frags or kraks in havoc40?

[hybrid plover]

it depends

what are you running

[red robin]

one of melee or range can answer carapace? shredders, if neither has that option, krak

shredders can destroy a dense pack of armored elites if you hold onto a combat stim

[warm schooner]

destroy the servers too

[hybrid plover]

honestly, it's moreso bulwarks that end up being the real utility for kraks imho

[red robin]

bolt pistol with lethal proximity and grenade tinkerer for the shredder aoe is essentially a screen clearer

[hybrid plover]

since you'll get literal walls of them at times

[agile mango]

mk6 knife and plasma VoC

[hybrid plover]

smokes

half joke aside, shredders would be a good complement if ur running serrated and mercy killer

since you don't have to hit something first to start proccing the weak spot bonus

[hearty panther]

how is it almost 2026 and some of you fucks are still simping for mercy killer

[red robin]

uncanny strike makes shredders into a truth nuke if you set it up

[agile mango]

I love mercy killer

[agile mango]

that's been my experience, but some people keep telling me that kraks are better than frags now regardless

[red robin]

ehh

shredders still top dog grenade wise

[hybrid plover]

because it's unironically not a bad choice now that serrated isn't completely out of the way to get to

it was cope to try and use it before the rework, not so much now

[willow prairie]

how does power level work in vt2

[red robin]

uh

I'd ask in the vt2 discord

or find a video of it on youtube

[hybrid plover]

with that in mind, i don't even run my mk6 with mercy even with serrated

at least not recently

[red robin]

what blessings do ya run on knife?

[hybrid plover]

executor and flesh tearer

[red robin]

neat

[tall torrent]

both are good

[red robin]

inb4 20 million uncanny strike mfs show up to tell you how to play your game

[hybrid plover]

makes it particularly geared for horde clear compared to the other setups i've run and it makes a big diff in h40

[tall torrent]

tho krak pulls ahead significantly in rot armor

[red robin]

damn i never thought abt rot armor

ok kraks are definitely more up there now

[hybrid plover]

kraks are unironically top tier now

smokes also

it's almost like

veteran actually has options

[red robin]

^

huge rebalance W

[hybrid plover]

i do think they need to adjust the tree a little more

[red robin]

but ngl rightside of tree is where vets power went

[hybrid plover]

because right bottom is genuinely beefed up

but otherwise, i'm realizing vet somehow

may have become the second best class at least

[red robin]

quoting from someone else here

but psyker and ogyrn still ahead of the curve

zealot, arby and vet are like similar in power behind the top 2

[hybrid plover]

it's not solely power i'm talking about

vet has a lot of power and a lot of utility too

[red robin]

yeah

ngl for my fun and enjoyment, vet is number 1 with zealot being 2 on my list

[tall torrent]

nah

just psyker

vet is basically 2nd best

[red robin]

ngl

[hybrid plover]

they have so much going on rn that they actually do challenge ogryn

[red robin]

i think youre the one who told me that way back before when the patch just came out

so the tier list has been reevaluated

[hybrid plover]

tier list imho

psyker
vet
ogryn
zealot
arbites

and i'm not kidding about arbites being lowest either

[red robin]

damn

poor arby

[tame lodge]

Arby's was always lowest

[hybrid plover]

they're not very far off

[tame lodge]

[hybrid plover]

but they just don't have a lot of utility

[sharp epoch]

arby is not the worst wat

you can straight up solo carry as arby

[hollow ibex]

Honestly I think the playing board is very even now except for psyker

[hybrid plover]

with the rework, that's possible for pretty much every class now

it's not that arbites is "the worst" because they are still really, really strong

[meager echo]

The more you good at the game, the weaker arby is

[hybrid plover]

but every class now, is also really, really strong

[sharp epoch]

no i havent seen psyker or veteran solo h40

[hybrid plover]

i mean we're still early in the patch

some madman is gonna do it

[meager echo]

Solo h40 is different from 4 mans h40.

[sharp epoch]

i dont think so psword is just too bad mobility wise

[meager echo]

Every other classes can boost team mates in some sort of way.

Arbies cant

Thats the whole point.

[hybrid plover]

if we're talking "solo"

then maybe that changes

but the game isn't traditionally a solo game

[sharp epoch]

if you can solo havoc im pretty sure you can do the same in a team

[hollow ibex]

i mean perma knocking every elite on its ass is a form of support

[meager echo]

Ogryn can do that, and take agro as well.

[void dragon]

also, arent they the ones that can make skullcrusher damage boost have 100% uptime?

[hollow ibex]

nowhere near as well given BTL uptime/dog/impact nades tho

[meager echo]

Its not that arby is weak. Its the lack of synergy or utility he can provide.

[hollow ibex]

yeah and SC is silly

[meager echo]

His raw numbers alone can not consistently win games for everyone.

[faint beacon]

Castration stance exists

[hybrid plover]

and yet, no one actually plays or even takes arbites into havoc even now

thing is we're talking about the basis that a class can solo h40 but

this is not a normal thing for a player to do

[faint beacon]

Simply no longer caring for bursters the ability is fucking hilarious

[void dragon]

there is a perk that makes enemies headbonked count as staggered

[hybrid plover]

ainz did it because they're just absolutely cracked out of their mind

that is not going to be like

99.9% of the playerbase

the times i've seen arbites in havoc

[meager echo]

Arby strong point is not needed in h40.

[hybrid plover]

they usually just completely fold under pressure

[leaden condor]

Barbitor

[hybrid plover]

and they just don't have a lot of utility compared to what the other classes can offer

[meager echo]

On the other hand, i think arby is the best class to learn havoc. Since its so forgiving and jack of all trade.

[hybrid plover]

yea, that's where i think arbites' strength really lies

it's a safe class to play

but being safe only gets you so far

[faint beacon]

It’s the dedicated frontline and debuff stick user for High Level Havocs tbh

Debuff enemy

[hybrid plover]

the last time i've actually played with an arbites in a high level havoc

i cant even remember

[faint beacon]

Thammer zealot press special

And delete boss

Arby is still incredibly safe in High havoc

vet is arguably squishier now cause of CDR nerf

That and reliance on toughness for tanking

But they still hit hard

[hybrid plover]

vet is a gambler's class i think

[faint beacon]

Vet fills the niche of stretch class better tbh

[hybrid plover]

the highs are extremely high and the lows are low

[faint beacon]

They cover weaker bases easier

Especially after the buffs

Lacking a bubble or some sort of anti ranged spam?

Smokes

Kraks for Rotten armor if team is lacking in Cara clear

[jaunty tinsel]

do you think krak would be the better nade option when a recon lasgun and psword?

[faint beacon]

Shredders as a general horde option

[hybrid plover]

i suppose

i guess zealot and arbites are kind of back to back to where they are actually

[faint beacon]

Zealot and Arby honestly serve different roles but both are useful

[hybrid plover]

given both of your weapons provide means for horde clear, i think so yes

[fair shale]

Gets me revives tbf

[sharp epoch]

ive played with plenty of arbies h40-

[hybrid plover]

this might just be a server thing honestly

[fair shale]

Tbf the other classes got reworks and are like, usable now lol

[faint beacon]

I’ve noticed less Vets

For some reason

I think it’s cause it’s risky to frontline but incredibly rewarding

[hybrid plover]

i've noticed like, no arbitrators in h40

[meager echo]

Ogryn is the better frontline.
Taunt to get agro
40% brittleness debuff
Skull crusher
Soften them up.
Arbi is no where near it. Not even close.

[faint beacon]

People would rather be safe

[hybrid plover]

and this was before the rework

[woven oak]

Why do you take Serrated Blade over Field Improv or Get Back in the Fight?

[hybrid plover]

because extra damage and it's actually better team support

believe it or not

[woven oak]

I don't know much about Veteran, and less since the rework.

[meager echo]

If you talking about holding crushers, Ogryn can take grenadier gaunlet and hold infinite crusher forever.

[hybrid plover]

Field Improv only provides value when you have a med kit or ammo box down, which isn't gonna be all the time.

And GBIF is kind of a meme

[meager echo]

Literally perma stun, pack of crushers.

[tall torrent]

sunder power sword

[fair shale]

Bleeds are free extra damage

[hybrid plover]

and with sunder ps, horde clearing, you're eventually going to start building up tons of bleed damage that ignores cleave distribution

[faint beacon]

Casti stance to force a push
BTL for quicker response to a horde pileup

On demand SKC on any boss vs needing taunt or charge

[tall torrent]

it's not that much on its own but it is decent extra vs mixed horde
and gives ogryn DR, zealot crit chance

[faint beacon]

Arby has its use as a dedicated debuffer with crusher

[woven oak]

Makes sense

Thank you for explaining

I need to go through and figure out Veteran builds/weapons. Not sure what's good now. Also need to do the same for Zealot.

[faint beacon]

The Arby or Ogryn exist as an assist to nuking a boss especially when a Zealot is present

[hybrid plover]

serrated is also good with knife and mercy killer or any of the bleed blessings like lacerate or flesh tearer

[meager echo]

Castigator stance cant do anything if pack of crusher run past you. The only thing help is break the line to knock them to the ground.

Even with the special exploit, arbies cant provide the cc ogryn do.

[woven oak]

If only I could make knife work for me. I've tried on every class, but it just doesn't click.

[hybrid plover]

i think vet's the class that really uses it the best imho

at least now it is

since serrated actively benefits its use

i was running a knife with executor and flesh tearer in a h40 yesterday and it was surprisingly potent for horde clear and single target

one crit netting 10 bleed stacks is no joke

or, actually

vet likes mk6

[faint beacon]

No shit lmao Casti is insane for pushing a ranged pile ups

Not even acknowledging how insane dog is as utility

[hybrid plover]

zealot likes mk3

[meager echo]

Vet smoke + psyker bubble = no range.

problems solve.

[woven oak]

Yeah, I believe Psyker uses Mk6 as well. I play a lot of Psyker, and can't make the knife feel good for me there, either. Not saying it's a bad weapon--I know it's good--I just can't get the feel for it

[faint beacon]

They assist they don’t kill the problem

[sharp epoch]

I feel like since plasma gunner nerf the main threat is just the rotten armor stimmed crushers

I just run kraks nowadays

[faint beacon]

The dog is literally click and forget and that thing will die

[hybrid plover]

knife is weird on psyker because you can actively feel how surprisingly slow the base attack speed is on it for what it is

it's very fun regardless

but knife is a weapon that likes attack speed

[faint beacon]

Pretty damn positive Psyker has an Att Spd Talent

[hybrid plover]

and zealot and vet provide that in spades

[hybrid plover]

10%

and only that

[faint beacon]

I mean Vet has that also just depends if you only take TFD or WS by itself

[meager echo]

Let's look at the problem this way. You are in a big room with gunners on top of the ledge, how castigator stance solve that problem for you? It's the same for vet infiltrate to disable gunners. It will not work.

[faint beacon]

You notice it shoot you more when paired together

[hybrid plover]

I wouldn't use knife with anything that isn't WS based tbh

[faint beacon]

Press F when toughness starts getting chipped move to cover or use it to kill them?

[meager echo]

what cover ?

[faint beacon]

The DR on Casti is no fucking joke dude

[hybrid plover]

i'd be using tac axe if i was using another keystone

[meager echo]

let me put some specific map

[faint beacon]

Like I can tell you haven’t used it

[meager echo]

silo cluster opening stair.

[sharp epoch]

they took our old stance 😔

[meager echo]

the desert map with 3 batteries event.

train hallway of logistratum

[hollow ibex]

Golden toughness in all but name lmfao

[narrow frost]

excise vault

[meager echo]

bridge section of chasm station

[sharp epoch]

its better

[hollow ibex]

"golden toughness bad"

what if we added an ability that gave golden toughness, but didn't make your toughness bar yellow

[sharp epoch]

somehow poxbursters dont corrupt through casti

[hollow ibex]

the only thing about casti that's worse than VOC is that it only applies to yourself

and not the rest of the team

[meager echo]

You can definitely win those map and event without smoke + bubble.
But with smoke + bubble in the team, it's definitely easier.

[surreal rune]

is it worth taking any extra grenade talents for smoke grenades?

[faint beacon]

The ironic part is how you can pair it with even more DR or Dog and literally easily shut down a shooter build up

[surreal rune]

other than grenade regen

[faint beacon]

Arby isn’t weak

[hybrid plover]

i find it funny how this has become a point of contention because of my opinion lmao

even though i still think arbitrator is just fine to play in h40 if u know what you're doing but it does feel limited in utility compared to other classes

[faint beacon]

Nor does it serve no purpose on havoc lmao

[hybrid plover]

all of the classes are just way more evened out now

[narrow frost]

Nothing every happens, we need more buffs

[faint beacon]

Arby needs a rework

Duh

[hybrid plover]

This is definite proof

[woven oak]

I might try it again. My go-to Zealot weapon is the Evis XV. Or Relic X if I am trying harder.

For Vet, I usually use caxe or psword, because I am boring and basic.

[hybrid plover]

That we need to buff psyker.

They're too squishy and weak

[faint beacon]

Exactly

[woven oak]

Yes, more buffs for Psyker please. I only did 4.3m damage in my last H40. Need to break 5m.

[hybrid plover]

good god man

[undone jungle]

anyone freeballing it rn

[meager echo]

You know what i hate the most about psyker. It's the venting shriek mentality. It's like how long can I get away until bon spawn.

[hybrid plover]

tiding it?

[fair shale]

Arby is good it's just a selfish class for the most part, imo

[undone jungle]

i mean. not if you build it right

[meager echo]

If you play rotten armour + stim, or purple. If bon spawn on top of packs of armour it's instantly wipe.

[undone jungle]

aquila + dog is very useful for the team :P

[woven oak]

I went down because a silent mutant carried me into fire, but was otherwise fairly safe.

[fair shale]

Well, there's not many wrong ways to build arb outside using terminus warrant tbf

[undone jungle]

trvth

my fav build is supportmaxxing as arbi since imo thats their strongest niche in havoc

[hybrid plover]

inferno staff is a perfectly balanced weapon

[fair shale]

I dont prefer dog with NA tbh

[undone jungle]

shock mine stallgaming, NA, close dog it up

[fair shale]

I prefer NA with Shock Mines and LW

[undone jungle]

(seperately)

[woven oak]

Totally balanced.

[undone jungle]

yea i like smines and LW

close dog is nice too tho

[fair shale]

Elite dog?

I dont run dog keystones normally tbh

[woven oak]

I had an Arby running shock mines and nuncio last night. It was nice.

Kept the rotten armor crushers off of me

[fair shale]

Ye, is good for that

[woven oak]

What's the general opinion on smoke grenades now? I always liked them, but they were in a bad position on the tree before.

[meager echo]

I think the only slot arbi can fit in the team now is to replace zealot.
Ogryn, Vet, Psyker is way too strong to give up.

[hybrid plover]

Good.

Treat them as bubbles and you'll see good use out of them.

[woven oak]

Is vet that good now? I thought Zealot looked stronger after the rework, but again, I only know Psyker well.

[hybrid plover]

Vet is very powerful.

[woven oak]

I just haven't had good vets then, ha

[hybrid plover]

Zealot got a more fleshed out tree than vet but vet's tree has some crazy numbers to achieve that aren't hard at all to get to

Problem is, it's mostly on the bottom right of the tree

[meager echo]

This game is very complicated, you can't just look at numbers and say this class is weaker or stronger. Numbers don't win game. It's the unique utility that the classes bring define how strong they are.

[hearty panther]

I cast fireball for 9999999

[hybrid plover]

So pathing is still a concern but geting 70% extra damage for playing the game was

A choice.

Oh and back to the serrated point.

[meager echo]

Even before new patch, most my h40 run zealot deal like 40% total dmg of everyone else. And no the class is not weak at all. Without him the run is way harder.

[hybrid plover]

45% of that damage affects your bleed too.

[hearty panther]

Basically everyone has the means to deal double base damage now so that's not especially unique. Toughness gen per second was also made very abundant. It's just a question of how many triggers can be active at once and with what level of uptime.

Zealot definitely leans more towards having easier survivability access than Veteran but it's not like their damage is lackluster.

[meager echo]

The cdr nerf hit zealot hard. Before he has the niche as the hard support. Now he is worse vet.

[hybrid plover]

No, it hit chorus hard.

[hearty panther]

Uh, not really.

[hybrid plover]

And with need.

[hearty panther]

VoC took the hardest hit.

And Zealot now has the best cdr node for uptime with free cdr just for tapping heads lmao

[hybrid plover]

Zealot as a class right now, is more solidifed as an aggressive frontliner.

[meager echo]

Zealot is only exist in chorus form in my sv.

[faint beacon]

It was necessary but Infil also got hit in the Crossfire

[hybrid plover]

Well then tell them to stop it.

[hearty panther]

Was shocked they didn't reduce its cooldown tbh

[meager echo]

I cant. It's been this way since forever.

[hybrid plover]

Chorus uptime across the board is nerfed.

[faint beacon]

Yet again vet only having 2 good ability choices

Nothing ever happens

https://tenor.com/view/nothing-ever-happens-chud-chudjak-soyjak-90-seconds-to-nothing-gif-9277709574191520604

[hybrid plover]

I'm sure they're gonna do something with infiltrate.

[fair shale]

There's a pretty strong market for SF Zealot rn imo

[faint beacon]

SF is on par with FOTF now

Cause of its sheer uptime

[hearty panther]

As far as I'm concerned XStance > VoC in all instances unless you're building something that somehow uniquely sucks with xstance somehow but I can't even conceive of what that could be

[meager echo]

Voc is always better because of gold man.

[faint beacon]

VOC offers occasional Crowd control and obviously golden

[hearty panther]

Fuck gold toughness.

[hybrid plover]

I disagree.

[faint beacon]

But that gold uptime went from 15 to now like

22.5-30

Depends on how lucky you are

[hybrid plover]

Executioner's Stance is no joke now.

[fair shale]

Im ngl I think the intel shared exe stance can bring a team can defo be more valuable than gold toughness if they capitalize

[hearty panther]

Yeah it's no longer guaranteed 100% uptime or even overlapping casts.

[fair shale]

Shared exe stance+smokes is really nice

[hearty panther]

Xstance is 8s of refreshing stun immunity. That's all I need.

[sharp epoch]

shout could be spammed like in 5-10 seconds on havoc too

[hybrid plover]

Even without the enhanced version, it can still be more value.

[meager echo]

Voc is gold for the whole teams. No way exestance beat that.

[faint beacon]

Cause of special surges

Fun fact

[hybrid plover]

Toughness regen.

[hearty panther]

Xstance + Born Leader

[faint beacon]

Psyker can still overlap 2-3 bubbles

Because of havoc

And even in auric

[sharp epoch]

born leader still meme

[faint beacon]

The nerf did nothing

Lmao

[hearty panther]

Born Leader is massive actually.

[hybrid plover]

what

[faint beacon]

Didnt they buff it

[sharp epoch]

yes to 20% from 15%

[meager echo]

the point of gold is for you to not out right die instantly. Ive never take toughness curios. It's like gold or die.

[hearty panther]

High Havocs especially

[sharp epoch]

and gave some coherency range

[fair shale]

Im ngl most of the time when I'm not playing vet i dont notice when a vet has born leader

[hybrid plover]

Like the only thing about born leader that's bad is that you're still kinda stretched for points at the bottom

[hearty panther]

Genuinely why would you. You got your own shit to manage.

[hybrid plover]

but as a node, it is genuinely really powerful if you're a vet that knows what you're doing.

[fair shale]

Well most of the time I'm on Og or Arb or Psyker and I just don't need the assistance for toughness regen.

[hearty panther]

But if a Vet is just doing regular Vet things he's generating something like 15-30 toughness base for the entire team

Per second

[sharp epoch]

i dont think the math maths

[hearty panther]

Not percent, flat amount, and still gives it out even if the Vet is capped out.

[hybrid plover]

confirmed kill

[sharp epoch]

your saying hes gaining around 100 toughness per second?

[hybrid plover]

yes.

[faint beacon]

A good vet should be tbh

[hybrid plover]

because that's actually completely possible

[faint beacon]

They’re kinda just a toughness battery for the team

[hearty panther]

CK stacks. XStance 10%. Marksman Tunnel Vision if you want it. O4B and ExhilTakedown etc.

[sharp epoch]

lets see confirmed kill gives 20% over 10 seconds, which is 2 per second

[faint beacon]

If you’re weird OYTs WS node

[sharp epoch]

each elite/specialist is 10% so thats 2% toughness

[hearty panther]

So the Vet is earning % gains but what's shared is the flat value.

[sharp epoch]

xstance is 10 per second so thats also 2%

[hearty panther]

Plus all melee kills already being 5%

Shit adds up

[hybrid plover]

Reason why exe stance feels so good is because that combined with killing elites, results in crazy toughness regen

that makes you feel like you can't actually get touched sometimes

[sharp epoch]

whats an actual build that takes all those nodes though? out for blood born leader and confirmed kill?

[hearty panther]

I mean you could meme by leaning into it hard but you could also just take it and still benefit immensely.

Even with just VoC it's potent since it's your total toughness + 50 / 20% instantly

[meager echo]

Meanwhile, voc 2 point = maximum effectiveness.

[hearty panther]

Almost guarantees your teammates can hit gold toughness as soon as you shout

[midnight wyvern]

kung fu panda lookin ass

[hybrid plover]

shredders obliterating a 100+ horde with out for blood and born leader is hilarious

[stuck gorge]

does demolitionist apply to teammates?

[sharp epoch]

I tried making a build with born leader ck and out for blood, you lose either agile engagement or precision strikes 🤔

[stuck gorge]

i was gaining grenades outta nowhere as zealot in my last game

[hybrid plover]

i run born leader with smoke builds personally

[sharp epoch]

nho

[midnight wyvern]

ni

you wish

[meager echo]

If they remove gold toughness from the game, i rather play other class than vet. Too high effort compare to other.

[stuck gorge]

then i have absolutely 0 clue how i was gaining grenades last game randomly

[midnight wyvern]

were you picking up ammo from ammo crates?

[orchid hemlock]

The god Emporer