veteran-class

[hollow ibex]

Boss dps is kinda mid still but yes very nice for killing ogryns

[steep flower]

I would say its above mid; its good but not amazing if we compare everything else like thunderhammer or boltgun

Needs space to rev in peace for sure so CC is required… but so does boltgun & thunderhammer

And even if you get interrupted your bleed carries you; 300+ dmg per tick is no joke

And then i combine it with accatran shotgun (fire slug) which at max 10 burn stacks gives 200+ dmg per tick

So even if can’t engage a boss; it takes solid 500+ DoT

Also great vs captains & twins cause once bleed is applied and shield comes back they still take hp dmg; a sight to my eyes every time i bled a captain to death cause they decided to shieldgate at ~2k hp only to die in some seconds after

[soft trellis]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/206466559672188928/1336144554323218454/Sigle_optimized.gif

Actually terrifying

At least enemies don't spawn directly behind you sometimes already in the middle of their attack animation, like they do in vt2

That's such a stupid thing

[stable socket]

does maniac on plasma help with any h40 breakpoints? i hear the recommendation is flak unarmored, i'm currently running maniac unarmored but am not sure if maniac is actually helping

[tall torrent]

Yes

Flamer 1 crit headshot
Trapper 1 body shot

Both require some buffs active tho

[stable socket]

i see, thanks! and flak is probably gunner 1shs? iirc scab bombers are also flak on the body but idk if flak can 1sbs them

[austere mica]

It’s also just the most common armor type

[tall torrent]

Flak is for shotgunner

And mauler body shot

It’s pretty difficult to push 1 taps on gunner in havoc with plasma

Too much investment to be worth and still very conditional

It’s much likelier that you get a crit headshot on a flamer from being in melee with WS

[stable socket]

it definitely feels that way... i was hoping flak might help in that regard, but i guess 50% more hp is just too much

[tall torrent]

And this only requires rising heat 1 stack

Or red node

[tall torrent]

Basically pop a few shots to suppress and dive them as a team is better for plasma

Being locked into ranged fight vs multiple gunners is generally not a great idea

Too ammo costly

[stable socket]

yeah

[tall torrent]

And u don’t even kill that many of them quickly enough

[stable socket]

if only helbore wield speed were faster...

[tall torrent]

Helbore can do sniping but it’s pretty dedicated backline

I think its swap speed is ok rn
But charge speed needs to be better by 15-25%
also functional sights for them

[stable socket]

that would be nice... currently i mostly run either WS power sword + plasma or focus target duelling sword + laspistol because both are very straightforward to play, but it'd be nice to have a slightly more responsive helbore to compensate for my skill issues

[tropic notch]

I hope vet gets a talent like soul gilt scan

[hollow ibex]

Dude I would be happy if vet got ANY of Arbis 15 percent damage boost talents lol

[solar valve]

tbh, I think a tree squish would help vet quite a bit

then take a look at infiltrate/ES modifier nodes

I dont think vet needs that much

[junior grail]

For the Vet is the +1 Grenade talent significant?

[solar valve]

imo not really

[junior grail]

Cause I could save up some talent points if I skip that lol

[hollow ibex]

Helps a lot with kraks

Otherwise it’s just a nice to have

[heavy rover]

Useful for more breathing room with shredders and smokes too

Plus the extra crit node doesn't hurt

[midnight wyvern]

nurgle quaking in his boots

[slow spade]

it's alright

I only take it when doing some meme right side vet build

[narrow widget]

only with kraks imo
the 2 points you save by not taking it could go a lot further with other talents

[junior grail]

Thanks for the input fellas, Beloved kisses~

[spark helm]

Wanted help playing around with an idea. Doesn't need to be minmaxed exactly yet but I just like fiddling around anyway.

[steep flower]

For kraks; rest don’t matter

[grand perch]

average bolter spam arby

[midnight wyvern]

I read that in Morrow's voice

[hollow ibex]

lol gotta love outdamaging ogryns and shock maul arbis with plain old shovel vet

[faint beacon]

Full of ammo

Suspiciously ammo tin shaped throat

"We outta ammo"

[sudden cedar]

@hollow ibex Skill Issue?

[hollow ibex]

Ogryn prob could’ve out damaged me if he played like an asshole

[jovial lodge]

me playing staff psyker

[steep flower]

How 2 Teamwork 101
https://cdn.steamusercontent.com/ugc/11682612620955036771/E22193B7C0AA09B82373053A24B16E51C4817D30/

[sudden cedar]

Beautiful

[mortal aspen]

Disgusting

[steep flower]

Its an acquired taste

[sudden cedar]

Teamwork? In MY Darktide?

[hollow warren]

Why can't FS just give us a proper looking commissar coat with these fancy epaulettes? What is this acid trip nonsense?

[steep flower]

They put pijamas with the working uniform into the same washing machine is all

[hollow warren]

this coat really does look like it's made out of the same fabric an Atoman noble would use for their nightdress

[tame lodge]

Those are Barquette colors, no?

[hollow warren]

Yup

[steep flower]

It has special properties of flashing the enemy with bright colors, rendering them blind

[hollow warren]

with the zebra pants

[hollow warren]

Moebian 6th heretic sees a veteran dressed in that: /dies of cringe/

[muted peak]

normal chaxe W

I like chaxe if I dont get an elite spam and my team helps in horde clear

btw papa willy

what blessings do you recommend for chaxe mark 12?

I was always using headtaker and slaughterer I'm thinking of changing it a bit

I also want to do nice boss damage

[steep flower]

I would recommend not using it
But in all seriousness; if you can cope with the lack of CC then slaughterer & headtaker will be goon on it on paper cause cross slashes is what you’ll be doing alot of the time and for that you need cleave which str provides

[muted peak]

CC?

[steep flower]

Crowd Control

[muted peak]

Oh I see

what do you recommend for single target

[steep flower]

Ppl say ‘best crowd control is to kill the enemy’; common mistake

[muted peak]

my dumbass cannot pull much complicated combos thats why I'm always using simple moveset weapons

chaxe is easy to use

[steep flower]

Bloodletter & thrust will do on it nicely

[muted peak]

how about mixing crowd control and single target?

and which is better? headtaker or slaughterer?

[steep flower]

Mk4 is simple 2; horde you just push attack into a heavy & repeat
Singles you rev light att

[tall torrent]

U start by giving up because it’s a weapon with only single target stagger atk

U can’t break multiple ragers’ combos at once

[muted peak]

no I meant on blessings

not by usage

like mixing a crowd control blessing and single target one

[tall torrent]

Headtaker + bloodletter then

[steep flower]

Headtaker on paper cause its on hit despite lower value; however slaughterer will increase the bleed dmg from bloodletter, headtaker wont despite having str listed for some reason

[muted peak]

also is it the same for mark 4?

[tall torrent]

Works

IV is a bit better than XII

[steep flower]

Yup

[tall torrent]

But both ultimately meh

[muted peak]

what? I heard otherwise most of the time?

[tame lodge]

Wouldn't recommending push attacking on mk4 for crowd rotation

[steep flower]

Cause ppl haven’t used it in havoc most likely

[tame lodge]

6.5 cleave as opposed to 8 from both heavies

Less damage as well

[steep flower]

Its about the push

Gives you more control

[muted peak]

hm

but which is better in special attack?

[tame lodge]

Still wouldn't recommend push attack for crowds

[muted peak]

mark 4 or mark 12?

[steep flower]

Mk4 cause its safer to utilize to its fullest

[muted peak]

hm

[steep flower]

Its what keeps you alive when it gets dense

[tall torrent]

IV light atk for single target is a bit more flexible

[tame lodge]

No
The push is
The attack isn't

And you can just

[muted peak]

what about elite killing and boss damage?

[tame lodge]

Push heavy

[muted peak]

god loosecannon voc voicelines are awesome

[tall torrent]

Chain weapons have big problems with single target damage because ur stuck in animation for their single target attacks and they don’t have good stagger to fight multiple elites

[steep flower]

Its less yea but push allows you to control better and push att despite being weaker than heavy can still generate dmg

[steep flower]

Infiltrate too

[tame lodge]

Or you can just skip it directly into the heavies

[muted peak]

yeah Ik that, I just asked which has higher damage potential against elites or bosses, since the usual killing method is slow, I need to shorten the time killing them

[steep flower]

Takes longer and you don’t get the value of space you generate with the push cause you have to reset the push in order to not do a push att

[tall torrent]

XII technically
IV realistically

[muted peak]

because usually ragers are problem for me, can handle maulers and crushers if I have space

[tame lodge]

You can just push then heavy it's not that hard

[tall torrent]

But again both are meh lol

[steep flower]

Thats why you take bloodletter; observe the enemy animations & find gaps where you can sneak in a rev

[muted peak]

hmmm, gotta try

[steep flower]

Rince & repeat

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/true-truth-nuke-super-truth-nova-truth-meme-gif-16889273424352737553

[muted peak]

I didnt need it with mark 12 heavy attack, will try on mark 4

since usually rev+ heavy on mark 4 is usually enough to send even a crusher to warp

[tame lodge]

All capped weapons are shit 🗣️

[steep flower]

Can do

[muted peak]

my 20 hours on chaxe:

[steep flower]

If you wanna i can show you around it tonight
Will be late home tho but still it should not take long to showcase & teach

[tame lodge]

I'm so sorry for your loss

[steep flower]

Btw i love that image; its soo goofy

[tall torrent]

Chainaxe is like 5-8 buffs away from being good

[muted peak]

Nice

[tall torrent]

IV anyway

[atomic void]

but then when it gets buffed its le power creep

[muted peak]

Always up for chaxe gameplay

[tall torrent]

XII idk how to make it good without being op

[muted peak]

Just ping me when you are available

[umbral scaffold]

new guns when

[steep flower]

Will do; added

[tame lodge]

Just remove the cap

[tall torrent]

Game’s already being balanced around havoc, who cares at this point

[tame lodge]

The lights are underwhelming already

[atomic void]

valid point

[tall torrent]

Nah not enough

[umbral scaffold]

everyone else also has the problem with recon's muzzle fucking obscuring vision? I don't even see what I'm blasting at

[tame lodge]

Might let you use all the 8 cleave on it

And it won't change much because damage distribution

[muted peak]

Its the other way around for me, chaxe is the most enjoyable weapon on vet arsenal(imo)

[tall torrent]

It’s not enough

[steep flower]

Can be a problem but one can cope with it

[tall torrent]

Because u still can’t stagger >1 melee elite at a time

On a weapon that has weaker dodge stats

That also really wants atk speed

[steep flower]

Same; gets very good value on him of all classes really in terms of being surprised it works

[tame lodge]

But at least it removes the cap

And that's a huge win already

[tall torrent]

Nah

[muted peak]

Only bad outcome you can encounter with chaxe is having no space with 5+ elites

Which is darktide but its still enjoyable

[tall torrent]

There’re essentially 2 schools of melee weapons at the top level

Cleave / stagger

Chain weapons do neither well

Best cleave melee weapons are like power sword and Karsolas pickaxe

Break multiple elite atk at once

[tame lodge]

Except my goat evis15

[tall torrent]

Same problem

[tame lodge]

Bugged light attacks stagger profile

"Stagger" pretty much everything

[tall torrent]

Best stagger melee is crusher

[tame lodge]

Yeah that's agreeable

[muted peak]

Best definition of jack of all trades, master of none

[tall torrent]

U can stagger every enemy and skullcrusher insta dps

[tall torrent]

What’s the jack of all trades here lol

Below avg horde clear

Animation locked single target

[turbid ibex]

jack of no trades

[tall torrent]

4 dodges with negative dodge distance

No stagger on >1 melee elite at a time

[muted peak]

Hm

Well its neither good on a subject but can perform

[tall torrent]

Yea u can use it

Doesn’t make it anywhere near good when it could be so much more

[muted peak]

Wait

Translated my sentence and I'm taking it back lol

[steep flower]

Everything could be; even your PS

[muted peak]

Jack of no trades seems better like he said

[tame lodge]

That's just the melee state of darktide

[tall torrent]

Power sword is the ultimate stat stick of this game

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/mus8029-dj-khaled-gif-3555378993500057042

[tall torrent]

It’s literally the ultimate stat stick that tops 2nd~3rd across every metric

[steep flower]

stat stick is key wording

[tame lodge]

Stat stick
Blessing stick
Parry stick

That's a lot of sticks already

[steep flower]

Dogs would be in heaven

[tame lodge]

2nd?
What would be the 1st?

[tall torrent]

Power sword is not highest in boss dps but it’s very high up there
Power sword is not highest in mixed horde clear but it’s also very high up there with cleave through carapace

[turbid ibex]

fatshark really fumbled a lot of iconic weapons in 40k imo

[tall torrent]

Pretty sure Karsolas pulls ahead for mixed horde clear until running out of cleave

[steep flower]

Whats the 1st?

[tall torrent]

Which is like
Yea ur comparing a stat stick vs another stat stick

[tall torrent]

Which metric

[steep flower]

Overall as you stated above

I’m genuinely curious

[tall torrent]

There’s no weapon that’s top 1 across every category

Top 1 boss is not the same weapon as top 1 mixed horde clear

[turbid ibex]

chain weapons, ilas, Power sword, etc

[tame lodge]

So boss dps
Another pick axe?
Hammer?
Dueling Sword?

[turbid ibex]

at least they nailed it with the bolter

[tall torrent]

Basically the only melee weapons that scale above power sword in boss dps

[steep flower]

Nice escape; but if you stated its accross every metric to be 2nd/3rd; what is the no 1

[tall torrent]

Are kinda meme

[turbid ibex]

god imagine if they fumbled the bolter

[steep flower]

Thankfully they didn’t

[tall torrent]

“Power sword is top 2-3 in every metric” does not directly suggest “there exists a melee weapon that’s best in every metric at the same time”

[steep flower]

What it perfectly insinuates that

[muted peak]

@steep flower forgot to ask, what is the time on ur country atm?

[turbid ibex]

no?

[steep flower]

As in; not perfect; just better

[tame lodge]

So basically Psword is the best generalist in the game

But

[steep flower]

There has to be

[tame lodge]

Poor dodges

Has to be activated

[turbid ibex]

it just means in each individual category the power sword is really high up

[tame lodge]

Truly one of the Fatshark greatest

[steep flower]

3.26pm; should be back home in… 7h i think today; i will be in touch

[tall torrent]

No. It just means that it is top 2-3 in every dps metric
There can exist another weapon that beats it in one metric but not all

Like

Thunder hammer on a meme build is better boss dps

Except if u don’t meme they’re pretty close in boss dps

[tame lodge]

Specialized weapon moment

[tall torrent]

And thunder hammer is very significantly worse against elites

[steep flower]

Not really a meme but ok

[tall torrent]

Stealth martyr is pretty meme

[muted peak]

Oh great , if you were in us it would be problematic its 16.27 here

[steep flower]

Sadly; imagine your first target bonus being lower than of a Hsword

[steep flower]

I was thinking charge tbh

[muted peak]

Just ping me when ur ready

Imma leave good evening chat

[tall torrent]

Yea then it’s not that far ahead of power sword

[tame lodge]

Foft can 2-3 tap with hammer

[tall torrent]

Especially when enemies scale hp up in havoc

[tame lodge]

But the 1 tap lies within Shroudfield

But it's Shroudfield 💀

[tall torrent]

The other thing is

Thunder hammer only leads in monster dps

[steep flower]

I tested a build in havoc 40; it was satisfying to do 25k+ dmg to a boss of any kind

[tall torrent]

It’s not as good vs captains

[turbid ibex]

mfw two separate +100% damage modifiers

[steep flower]

It 2 taps them

[tame lodge]

Health gates?

[tall torrent]

I’m pretty sure knife meme also gets above power sword in boss dps

[turbid ibex]

why the fuck do people use it to run away like a bitch

[tall torrent]

But it’s class specific and is pretty meme too

[steep flower]

Cause need to finish the mission fast cause i need to pee

Or smth

[tame lodge]

Speed addiction

[steep flower]

[tall torrent]

Shield gate for captains
And it’s not as good vs twins

[tame lodge]

Lemme guess

Zealot

Turning that 3 finesse into 8 or something

I don't remember the math

[tall torrent]

U run mercy killer + precog + duellist and do >5k per push atk

[tame lodge]

Another zealot w

[tall torrent]

But it is pretty much a meme build

[tame lodge]

Welp
Doubt it strays further away from current The Build™

[tall torrent]

Duelling sword has a specific boss setup that gets close too but it’s pretty deranged

[tame lodge]

Relentless yeah

I will not fall for that propaganda

[tall torrent]

Not just that

U drop uncanny and run relentless + precog

Basically everything that beats power sword in boss dps is deranged in one way or another

And lose out on other metrics

[plain osprey]

Ive usually run thrust and uncanny on duelingsword. Two shots crushers on any character and any build. Have yet to find another setup that does that

[tame lodge]

Good

Relentless is pretty much unreliable

Won't proc at hordes

[steep flower]

Not the best but serviceable; managed to ~5 tap sword twin as i remember

[tame lodge]

Elites are prone to die before you can make any use of it

Bosses outside of havoc are quite inexistent

Damnation+ is guaranteed at least 1

[tall torrent]

It’s more like 4-5 and very heavily dependent on buffs

To maximize it u need to trade away a lot of things

[turbid ibex]

i wouldnt say inexistent

[steep flower]

Less present

[tall torrent]

Like, if u take 20% infested/unyielding dmg talent with martyr u prob don’t have TWBS therefore no grievous wounds

[turbid ibex]

even on heresy they show up like at least 3 times

[turbid ibex]

ye

[tall torrent]

As a result ur big 2h hammer can’t break rager combo

[tame lodge]

That means you rolled for bosses 3 times

[steep flower]

GW is stagger… not dmg

[tame lodge]

So there's a chance that you'll have 0 at heresy

[tall torrent]

To maximize martyr u also don’t get +stamina curio for the worst block cost melee in the game

[turbid ibex]

then what the fuck is my luck

[tame lodge]

Idk

Which is hilarious

[tall torrent]

I just said below that losing out on GW = no rager stagger for this weapon = massively worse vs elites

[steep flower]

I dunno i have headtaker & thrust & managed to a couple of times

[turbid ibex]

am i a fucking monstrosity magnet

[tame lodge]

Damnation is guaranteed to have at least 1

[tall torrent]

It’s playable that way u just have to waste ammo when ragers show up

[tall torrent]

Not on first hit

Takes like 2-3

Which is not safe vs multiple ragers

[turbid ibex]

my psyker has had like 8 different missions that had a boss show up right at the start

[tame lodge]

Yeah it's a pain in the ass that you need Grievous Wounds
But it's so good on hammer 😭

[steep flower]

You have charge for that + it makes dreg ones easier cause slower combo

Cause you get closer

[tall torrent]

It’s also on a weapon that does ~300 damage per hit vs maniac

[turbid ibex]

one of them was on the literal first fucking mission i played with him

level 1

starting gear

and just bots for my teammates

[steep flower]

What difficulty was it?

[turbid ibex]

it was the first mission with that character

[tall torrent]

9 heavy atks to kill 1 (yes, one) Dreg rager in damnation

[turbid ibex]

worst part is that i actually managed to kill it just to die to a burster later

[tame lodge]

Heh definitely why I use lights for single target damage on Crucis
And why I don't like Ironhelms

[steep flower]

Ye but… what difficulty was it? I presume it was uprising cause first lv?

[turbid ibex]

yes

[steep flower]

Omg thats soo unlucky to have a boss on that difficulty

[turbid ibex]

it was a slug too so i couldnt even try to cheese it with the parry on the sword

im pretty sure most of my damage was me spamming bb

[tall torrent]

Makes not much difference

Crucis light atks can’t cleave through most elites

[turbid ibex]

all the while i had bombers and flamers constantly restricting where i could go cause of the event

[tame lodge]

But at least can damage them

The alternative is special heavy

But then you have to special heavy

[tall torrent]

No

Special + light

[tame lodge]

But then I wouldn't be getting value from Thrust

[tall torrent]

Thrust value overrated

[steep flower]

Both are good, depends on the situation

[tall torrent]

And then thunder hammer is also mega borked by enemy hp bonuses in havoc

[steep flower]

Depends if you can 1 shot or not; after all duelist will be most likely proced

[turbid ibex]

i wish thrust scaled with attack speed

[steep flower]

Even when you have orange buff it does well

[turbid ibex]

learning that it doesnt feels bad :/

[tame lodge]

I never really understood how the code messes that up

[tall torrent]

It doesn’t

[tame lodge]

It's windup increases strength or something

[tall torrent]

Thrust scales at fixed time intervals

[tame lodge]

But the windup speed doesn't affect it somehow

[tall torrent]

It’s just shy of 2 taps on important enemies without martyr

[tame lodge]

Yeah I know

0.25

Or 0.2

Depends on the weapon

Because Fatshark

[steep flower]

I don’t run martyr

And it was good

[tall torrent]

Yea then it’s just shy of 2 taps

In base game u can special + light 2 tap crusher

In havoc u can’t even 1 tap with full thrust special heavy on crusher

Need other buffs

[tame lodge]

windup_increases_power

[steep flower]

Need buffs for that too

[tall torrent]

And it sucks massively vs elite waves

[tame lodge]

Which would led me to believe that increasing windup_speed would affect it as well

But no

[tall torrent]

It’s consistent buffs from being in combat like headtaker

[tame lodge]

Coding shenanigans

[tall torrent]

Unlike stuff like martyr

That require u to do a specific thing

[turbid ibex]

they prob simply forgot to do that

[steep flower]

Dying

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/i-believe-you-john-bruh-i-trust-you-i-have-faith-in-you-gif-25015623

Fucking

Ceaseless Barrage

[tall torrent]

So yea all in all power sword top 2-3 across every dps metric

[tame lodge]

Still the same buff on all tiers

[tame lodge]

Best generalist in the game 🗣️

[turbid ibex]

also not very fun to use

[tame lodge]

Yeah that fits the Fatshark metric

Boring = strong

[tall torrent]

Nah

[tame lodge]

Fun = weak

[turbid ibex]

bolter

[tall torrent]

It’s a rhythm weapon

[tame lodge]

Mine is messed up because I'm so used to power Cycler 3

From when Hadron gambling was a thing

I keep reactivating every 2 attacks

[steep flower]

Aren’t all of them really? Unless you stack insane att spd

[turbid ibex]

huh

[tame lodge]

Yeah
Ceaseless Barrage is the same number across all tiers

For Fatshark reasons

[turbid ibex]

what number is it

[turbid ibex]

huh

[tall torrent]

Nah this one is kinda specific because it’s one of the few weapons where u have to learn push atk vs push then atk, and it’s a low dodge weapon with a pretty significant no damage window that can be exploited by enemies

[turbid ibex]

what are the numbers supposed to be?

[steep flower]

In that sense i guess

[sudden cedar]

https://tenor.com/bpGHG.gif

[tame lodge]

Ok so ceaseless Barrage is 20% suppression and damage against suppressed for every % of magazine spent

Across all tiers

[tall torrent]

A lot of weapons don’t need to care about the difference between push atk and “push then attack”

[tame lodge]

Also new blessings on brauto code

And superiority (force sword) will be buffed

So maybe new blessings incoming

Ooh

Push then attack weapons

[turbid ibex]

big if true

[tame lodge]

Does that include Cleaver and Ironhelm

Oh and Dclaw 1

Dclaw 1 still shit btw

[tall torrent]

Ironhelm yes

Cleaver I forgot

[tame lodge]

Well cleaver 1 got an Strikedown after a push

[tall torrent]

It’s specifically notable on power sword because otherwise u can get surrounded pretty easily then activated state gets cancelled cuz u get hit out of nowhere etc etc

[tame lodge]

Not cleaver 1, cleaver 6

Lemme see if there's any new blessing that I don't recognize

[turbid ibex]

what did you find btw

for the new stuff

[naive needle]

How does cleaving strike compare to crowd control on a melee weapon? So far best weapon I have used is the starting shovel, everything else I like less.

Not got any cleaving strike weapons yet but seeing it as a stat online

[turbid ibex]

by stat you mean one of the bars that ranges from 0 to 80%?

[tame lodge]

It's probably one of those words on the weapon icon

Like Torrent

Versatile

[naive needle]

Yeah, that one

[turbid ibex]

oh that

they dont really mean anything tbh

[tame lodge]

It probably means the weapon has multiple attacks with good angles that can hit multiple target

But ultimately they don't really mean much

[naive needle]

ahh right

Well, I know I like hitting multiple targets

And the shovel does well at that

or perhaps I just need to wait until I have more weapons to play with

[tame lodge]

For infantry auto

Nothing new for vigilants it seems

Oh also Shooting while sprinting for iag

Forgot the blessings name

Let's see if these make to live

[turbid ibex]

run n' gun

[tame lodge]

Yeah that one

If any of those make to live servers

It's going to be beautiful into my hands

[turbid ibex]

ngl these look really cool for a run n' gun playstyle yeah

[tame lodge]

I already have the run and gun play style with MMF and Iags

These are just cementing that play style

I'll probably check more later

No time rn

[turbid ibex]

prob wont dethrone stuff like dumdum as the true meta but it'll be fun to use

[tame lodge]

You know
We got some new weapons marks and shit like that on the code a while ago

And now some new blessings that I particularly haven't seen before

The odds of new weapon + new blessings are quite high rn

[turbid ibex]

big if true

[tame lodge]

I don't want to get hopes up but like

[turbid ibex]

for which weapons?

[tame lodge]

It's there

[turbid ibex]

like are we getting guns with more than 3 marks?

[tame lodge]

It was like a new powersword

Some hammer for ogryn

[turbid ibex]

OGRYN HAMMER

[tame lodge]

The leaked model for 2h Chainaxes

[turbid ibex]

[tame lodge]

Recently Syllogism spotted Power Falchion (fire wastes)

So like

[turbid ibex]

more 2h melee weapons for ogryn is big

[tame lodge]

Stuff is lining up too good to be true

https://tenor.com/view/james-doakes-doakes-curious-suspicious-questioning-gif-14390669560130901665

[steep flower]

Imagine if ironhelm would get energize blessing

[steep flower]

Run & gun

[steep flower]

Don’t tease me pls

[tame lodge]

Also 10 months since they promised a weapon for veteran

Don't want to get hyped

But lots of lining up

Too good to be true

Too good to be false

https://tenor.com/view/dexter-doakes-squint-stare-suspicious-gif-14432154109786838518

[sudden cedar]

2H Chainaxes. Sounds nice.

[turbid ibex]

thats what the maulers use right?

[tame lodge]

Autopistol also has the reload speed on dodge in the code

[sudden cedar]

Yes, the Mauler weapon.

[tame lodge]

Seems like nothing new to bolter

[sonic kayak]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1056793826532012102/1387177258632085614/hooheehoohaa.mp4?ex=68bbf9be&is=68baa83e&hm=efcd4acac87732b2852d4b7e019dfb47fd9d9806726a58062cde22d5843a24ba&

[sudden cedar]

Mauler Moshpit

[turbid ibex]

makes sense

[tame lodge]

Rending on CRIT for Bistol

Handcannon?!?!?!

On Bistol?!?!?

[turbid ibex]

bolter getting mobility related blessings woul-wait what

[tame lodge]

The thing is

It might just remain on the code forever

Kruber still doesn't have the grenade launcher

It's been 7 years

[turbid ibex]

tbh even if it did make it into the game im not sure people would use it much

cause it already has DA for big crits

[tame lodge]

Probably has good Adms yeah

@tall torrent what do you think about Bistol if it had Handcannon

[turbid ibex]

bistol damage

[tame lodge]

It has the fame of having not having the greatest breakpoints as well which is also weird

When path mentioned that Arby's could make it meet bps it was kinda funny

[turbid ibex]

zarona revolver damage

[tame lodge]

Nothing new for Chaxe it seems

Nothing new for Evis

[steep flower]

Thats definitely gonna be zealot exclusive

[sudden cedar]

Jokes on you, it'll be an Ogryn weapon

[turbid ibex]

ye i dont see vet getting those

[naive needle]

Comparing Vraks MkII braced autogun and Vraks MkV infantry autogun, would it be accurate to say that braced are more dmg but can't aim down sights properly? So presumably closer range weapons with higher damage output

[turbid ibex]

same for psyker and arb

[steep flower]

Excuse me what

[tame lodge]

Not quite

Infantry Autoguns are the dps monster in the game

But requires aim or crits

[steep flower]

That… is still a W

[tame lodge]

Brautos are just there for the sake of spray and pray

[sudden cedar]

I have no clue, it was a joke.

[steep flower]

An okay weapon

[tame lodge]

But brautos are the king of suppressions

[turbid ibex]

isnt that the autopistol

[naive needle]

Oh really? Stats show the Vraks variant of each as comparable ammo capacity but the braced one is more damage

The other variants for infantry yes they are more damage but also less ammo

[hollow ibex]

damage stats in this game are lying half the time

[naive needle]

Are there other hidden modifiers then

[hollow ibex]

just test the gun's dps in psykanium

a lot of IAG damage comes from finesse modifiers

[turbid ibex]

only on non-crit bodyshots

braced also doesnt have dumdum

[hollow ibex]

yeah just don't rely on the game's damage numbers lol

test with an actual build, blessings, perks in pysk

even then there are times when that won't be entirely correct either

[midnight wyvern]

https://tenor.com/view/dexter-doakes-squint-stare-suspicious-gif-14432154109786838518

[tame lodge]

Me to Fatshark next update

[midnight wyvern]

I hope next one includes a rework of a class

maybe vet weapon

and a new mission

bucket list

time to not get any of those things

when is next havoc mission change?

[tame lodge]

I know it's about Weapons

I just can't prove it

[sharp epoch]

that would be the twink stubber

[tame lodge]

Last time I checked they didn't have 2 to 8 (mark/braced dependant) suppression value per shot

https://tenor.com/view/desiler-giga-chad-gif-9574825124538696572

In fact all 3 of the twinks have 2.5

The Hstubber has 6.5

[steep flower]

Shots way slower tho

Thus balanced

[tall torrent]

Not rly relevant

[tame lodge]

Figured the Adms would be good already

[tame lodge]

@tall torrent do you know the internal name for Devastating Strike?

Is it this?

[tall torrent]

no

[tame lodge]

Ok just checking

This is for the Assault Chainsword

Perfect Strike is not that

And I'm not sure if that is DevaStrike

It could be an entire new blessing

Or just DevaStrike but I don't recognize

So yeah possible new blessing or not

Which is going to go hard with Shred

[steep flower]

They better be good tho cause contesting wrath & bloodletter is a thing

And buff finesse for chainsword; why is it it has 1.1x modifier but shockmauls have 1.15x

Also no att spd increase

[tame lodge]

Chainswords can carry the critical damage across all targets hits

So infinite cleave CRIT is just free damage across all targets

It doesn't say pass_past_armor_on_crit (Perfect Strike) though

So it might stop at carapace

Who knows

This might be nothing at all

Seems like nothing new on combat Axe, tactical axe and shovel

Nothing on knife

Ok just saw same infinite cleave on CRIT on the Dclaw

It might be DevaStrike

[sudden cedar]

Devil's Claw

[tame lodge]

If that's the case so nothing new for the chainsword

Nor dclaw

Combat Sword P1

[orchid hemlock]

Behold, the sixth layer of hell

Violence 😞

[tame lodge]

Nothing new for Combat Sword P2

Aka Hsword

Seems like nothing new for Combat Sword P3 (dueling sword)

Yay

[tame lodge]

Lasgun P1 (infantry Lasgun most likely)
Increased_zoom

💀

(I'm going to main this one)

Seems like Recon will get the increased movement speed and the increased reload speed on slide

[turbid ibex]

makes sense

[tame lodge]

Laspistol with Reload speed on dodge

[turbid ibex]

pog

[hollow ibex]

you can't be fr

[hollow ibex]

why

as a blessing?

or baked in?

[turbid ibex]

blessing i assume

[tame lodge]

Ogryn Club P1 (most likely Power Maul) increased CRIT chance on special attack hit

[tame lodge]

As a blessing

I'm checking the code rn

There's new blessings in there

The thing is

It may never make it to live servers

[hollow ibex]

oh lol yeah makes sense then

[tame lodge]

So I'm just checking for self amusement

[hollow ibex]

would be funny to take, but i doubt anyone who cares even mildly about the meta would take taht

[tame lodge]

There's Even bloodthirsty but for Force Greatsword

Which is?!?!?!?

[turbid ibex]

ye i doubt any of these would dethrone the actual meta blessings

[tame lodge]

I'll certainly use them

As long as you keep the core blessing

[hollow ibex]

i feel liek there should be a slot for purely utility blessings

[tame lodge]

It'll just work

https://tenor.com/view/todd-howard-it-just-works-bethesda-this-all-just-works-gif-20598651

Wait a minute

There's Ogryn club P1, ogryn club P2 and Ogryn power maul

Am confused

Ok

I think I got it

P1 is shovel

It has Brutal Momentum

Oh ok now it makes sense

[muted peak]

Can I kill a crusher in one hit with duelling sword or axes(chaxe excluded)

[tame lodge]

So this is is shovel punch, it's in game already, ignore

[tame lodge]

Yes you can

But it's easier on Dueling Sword iirc

There's a video somewhere of a vet one shotting 5 crushers in a row with the Rashad

[muted peak]

Wtf

How

[hollow ibex]

prob super impractical

[tame lodge]

Probably the usual Precision Strikes, Desperado
Bring it down
Superiority

Marksman

Agile Engagement

[hollow ibex]

yeah it's gonna be "stack every buff available on your talent tree"

[tame lodge]

Usually with these 4 and 5 stacks of headtaker you can 2 shot a Reaper with heavies

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/fist-of-the-north-star-hokuto-no-ken-hey-as-long-as-it-works-as-long-as-it-works-winging-it-gif-5037582307183355084

[tall torrent]

Marksman x10

[tame lodge]

Tbf they asked if it was possible

Oh, No Guts Not Glory is the same value on all tiers huh

Ok my theory is that Fatshark will repass on the blessings next update

Hope they fix No Guts No Glory working on coherency logic

[turbid ibex]

which one is that

[muted peak]

is there any other blessing on DS that helps with crowds? (except rampage)

[tall torrent]

Nothing rly meant for horde

[tame lodge]

Slapping elites regenerate toughness over time

[tall torrent]

U just have to accept that it does not kill horde well

Especially mixed horde

[tame lodge]

But it works in coherency logic, aka getting targeted in melee stops

And most Elites will be attacking in melee

Which is

Eh

Just peak Fatshark right there

Found the infinite cleave on CRIT at the Cleavers

[orchid hemlock]

No

[tame lodge]

It's DevaStrike yeah

[orchid hemlock]

Pls don't make the DS any better

K thx ❤️

[severe jolt]

your STAFF is meant to help with hordes
because DS is meant to be a PSYKER weapon

[tame lodge]

Ogryn Gauntlet Windup increases power

Pinpoint?

Thrust?

Doesn't have thrust so should be Pinpoint

Why does heavy Stubber have Between the eyes

Ogryn is already immune to suppression

https://tenor.com/view/monster-versus-vs-alien-monster-vs-alien-gif-16037253809360562033

Huh

Infernus for Heavy Stubber

.weapon_trait_bespoke_ogryn_heavystubber_p2_burninating_on_crit

Oh it's a thing already?

I really don't know shit about it

However I'm seeing Powderburn

It seems

[fresh spire]

Urinate on hit???

[muted peak]

what blessings for chaxe mark 4?

[tame lodge]

Golden Mark 🗣️

[muted peak]

its on vet arsenal too

[tame lodge]

Yeah so does the staff

[covert fable]

give it 15 cleave

[tame lodge]

(Loadout config moment)

[tame lodge]

Wont do anything useful with current cleave damage distribution

[muted peak]

[blazing jetty]

https://tenor.com/view/empty-wallet-no-money-broke-pulp-fiction-john-travolta-gif-13868803

[sudden cedar]

We play that guessing game again, guess the loadout.

Also, True Survivor for Crom!

[midnight wyvern]

why does it look like your ogryn is floating

[sudden cedar]

Because he is! Of course.

[midnight wyvern]

lol

is killzone any good?
it reads like a bit of extra damage but its only increasing base damage, so not as helpful as just a damage increase

dumb requirement too but

[steep flower]

it is nice

[midnight wyvern]

Ive had it on because

damage

but just checking if its not as good as it looks

[hollow ibex]

it's ok

[turbid ibex]

isnt base damage increase way better than just damage cause its multiplicative with literally everything else?

[tired cargo]

I just watched this video https://youtu.be/Ht0ikkjvkao?si=ApkZtzdeyjVCYA7I and they keep often bringing up how they don't like infiltrate and I just had an good idea, I think??? and I want to hear what you guys think

[spice shard]

you forgot to include your idea

[tired cargo]

I agree it does not fit The Veteran, because the veteran is supposed to be a soldier not someone hiding around.

I think they should take away infiltrate and put it on a rattling whenever they show up because that would fit and instead.

what they should give the veteran and hear me out!!! is some type of explosive ultimate.

essentially something that has to do with "demolition" what I'm thinking and once again hear me out, is like the Bounty Hunter in vermontide 2 where you pull out a unique weapon with your ultimate that does incredible amount of damage.

it's either some type of grenade launcher or a giant grenade that you throw that! is the ultimate!!! and it does both high damage against a single target it hits and then you can upgrade it / change it to also do more aoe damage because that feels like something a veteran would have and I think the ability should be called "Tactical artillery" how does this sound?

[tired cargo]

here is my idea

[spice shard]

we arent getting the ratling unfortunately

also pretty sure thats just taking the ogryns rumber and grenade and giving it to vet

[turbid ibex]

i think infiltrate is a really good idea but its executed fucking horribly

[tired cargo]

yeah kind of but it would be unique and that function like it you press essentially the ultimate button you pull it out and so long as you hold your finger on the button you don't fire and then you release and you fire a bigger grenade than the rumbler shoots

[turbid ibex]

besides it wouldnt fit at all with what the right path of the tree is going for

[tame lodge]

Bro's forgetting commandos

[tired cargo]

well the video and what I'm talking about is you know reworking The Veteran like total replacement of all the Paths and where they are????

[spice shard]

im ngl if i wanted to play a class that could shoot explosives i'd just play ogryn

[turbid ibex]

i watched the video

[tame lodge]

Ratling mention

[turbid ibex]

and there is 0 need for a complete replacement of the paths, specially their identity

[tropic notch]

Mr E some ass

[tired cargo]

I mean yeah but the veteran is the demolition class because they have so many paths passives that boost explosives and regenerating explosives and stuff

[spark helm]

Do people just think that soldiers don't get stealth training at all or something? Or have missions where they need to maintain a lower profile?

[tired cargo]

so imagine if they remove some of the blank nodes and add even more passive explosive Buffs / explosive related and then they change infantrate and make it into a explosive ultimate and now you have an entire explosive path in the tree

[spice shard]

i mean that logic can also apply to arbites since they also get regen grenades

[tropic notch]

There is only like 3 or 4 good dt YouTubers

[tired cargo]

[tame lodge]

Or act behind enemy lines

[spark helm]

The anti-infiltrate hate got to an intellectualized level i guess.

[tropic notch]

Ainz, frip, and Reginald

[tame lodge]

If you let go of the best part of his kit

The doge

https://tenor.com/view/omni-man-invincible-look-what-they-need-to-mimic-a-fraction-of-our-power-gif-25672186

[tropic notch]

Yeah dog is amazing lol

[spice shard]

yeah but "regen grenades = demolition class" according to blackfire

[spark helm]

Medicinal demolition err, uhm.

[tired cargo]

because in my opinion and this is another common under the video by the way I have already written in my opinion the veteran should never ever pull out a melee weapon they are not a melee class you should always have you gun out

so one path should be exclusively range then the other one should be a little bit mix between switching between Range and melee which already exist and then the third class would be as which between Range and explosives

[turbid ibex]

even in the video he said that infiltrate can still be a stealth ability

[tame lodge]

Even worse

Vet literally has the best generalist melee in the game

[turbid ibex]

thats one of the worst takes in the game

ive ever seen

[tropic notch]

https://tenor.com/view/ragebait-rage-bait-lol-lmao-gif-3554026694133497645

[mortal aspen]

nah, just make Infiltrate like Huntsman's ult

[spark helm]

That just means a lot of nothing, melee is literally the cornerstone of this game and veteran absolute has melee in spades and hasn't stopped. Where is this coming from?

[turbid ibex]

the game gives you a melee

[mortal aspen]

ez

[turbid ibex]

you should still be able to use that melee

[tame lodge]

And veterans have literally lines about fighting in melee range

So now you're going against lore

[tired cargo]

this is not rage bait you are a fucking soldier guardsman you should never switch to your melee in my opinion you should always have enough ammo to shoot whatever gun you have and it should be your best option

[tame lodge]

So what now

[turbid ibex]

vet should definitely be more focused on ranged damage over melee but saying "you should never switch to your melee" is an absolutely horrid take

[tropic notch]

Play psyker if you want pure ranged

Nice ragebait btw

[tired cargo]

I seriously fucking hate the veteran it was the first class that I made back in the Beta and I was so disappointed how weak the range felt for that class

[tropic notch]

https://tenor.com/view/jgmm-cat-meme-ragebait-cat-think-cat-ponder-gif-7034802297606826390

[turbid ibex]

that is completely fair

[mortal aspen]

https://tenor.com/view/bait-thats-bait-tom-hardy-mad-max-gif-5055384

[tired cargo]

I hate the psyker even more and I recently started finally making it it's the last class I have made and I hated even more because it's even more squishy

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/knife-fight-gif-26616020

[turbid ibex]

but going from that to saying vet should never use their melee is insane

[tropic notch]

either vet needs buffs or Arby needs a nerf if anything happens I’ll be happy

[mortal aspen]

I don't even think that Vet is squishy
not until you get into high havoc

[turbid ibex]

both

[faint beacon]

This sentence is how you can tell someone hasn't invested enough time into Veteran

[turbid ibex]

both is good

[spice shard]

"you should never swap to your melee"
bro even psyker swaps to their melee wtf are you on

[tired cargo]

are you a guardsman or are you not a godsmen?

[faint beacon]

imo Veteran should be a class that rewards consistent weakspot hits

[spice shard]

you do realise soldiers had melee weapons too right?
like actual real life soldiers

[mortal aspen]

I am a godsman

Allah is on my side

[spice shard]

it does with one of the keystones

[spark helm]

You're a conscripted criminal that barely gets to be trusted at the end of a probationary execution that is marked on your person.

Plus, you're a soldier. What soldier doesn't know empty-handed martial arts?

[spice shard]

granted it sucks cus walking but yknow

[tropic notch]

Psyker is amazing at wiping the entire screen and effectively killing stuff before it kills you

[tired cargo]

**I'm talking about how I think they should change the class are you fucking listening I'm saying "changing" they need to "change" "rework" The Veteran so range is vastly superior to melee and you should almost never switch to melee unless you in close quarters and you force to **

[faint beacon]

Needs a huge rework

[tame lodge]

Guardsmen in lore also go in melee

[mortal aspen]

but why

[tame lodge]

So now what

[turbid ibex]

hell prob one of the most fun playstyles on vet is weapon specialist with its whole weapon swapping thing

[spark helm]

There are melee focused builds and there have always been veteran builds that make it so that your melee is either amazing or stable.

[faint beacon]

I mean you realize that like

[mortal aspen]

Vet already has ranged focused builds

[faint beacon]

Veteran will almost certainly be forced into Melee

in Auric and Havoc

[spice shard]

yeah
i genuinely think that was the worst penance i had to do for vet

[faint beacon]

cause of how fucking insane horde clumps get

[tired cargo]

because all the other classes are vastly better in melee and are more mainly focused so how come the veteran is not more specialized into range? when it's supposed to be the "Range" guardsmen class

[faint beacon]

One moment

[mortal aspen]

but he is specialized into range, what do you mean

[spice shard]

i think you're either baiting or you got hit with the shovel a few too many times

[tired cargo]

oh my god not enough listen watch the video I share because that's also what it's about

[turbid ibex]

zealot can still use a gun fairly effectively

[tropic notch]

NO DUDE I WILL ONLY PLAY IT LIKE COD AND TAKE COVER WHEN IM SHOT AT ILL NEVER BE FORCED INTO MELEE BECAUSE I SHOOT IT BEFORE IT REACHES ME!!!!!!!!

[steep flower]

Mah boi never played in havoc; its ok tho

[faint beacon]

these 4 are like the Bread and butter of melee for Veteran

[tame lodge]

If that video is just like what you are saying

Then no

[spark helm]

I'll be real with you here, I don't need to watch a video to vouch and know what I'm talking about with melee for veteran lol.

[tame lodge]

It's still not good

https://youtu.be/m8ZBwNg-5CI?si=F4hzri1vhMGk6pil

[mortal aspen]

Buff left ability and keystone and you have your "ranged specialist" veteran, no need to change rework the class or gut his options

[tired cargo]

even though I disagree a lot with Mister E we both agree that The Veteran should be a fucking range class, the Range class in the game

[atomic void]

guardsmen should never pull out their melee
guardsmen are always pictured withe chainswords, shovels and other stuff ect

[tame lodge]

Guardsmen engage in melee combat

[turbid ibex]

its not anywhere near as deranged as these takes

[tropic notch]

Dawg In all honesty I will never listen to Mr e

[turbid ibex]

at least from what i watched

[mortal aspen]

it should not be a pure ranged class
no class in the game should be

[spice shard]

nah mate
chainswords are clearly for fishing or whatever guardsmen do in their spare time

[tropic notch]

He loves misinfo

[atomic void]

REAL

[tame lodge]

Veteran also literally has the best generalist melee in the game

[faint beacon]

Veteran is the "Hybrid" class of the game

[tame lodge]

Psword my zap swish swish swish zap swish swish swish zap

[mortal aspen]

it's a guard veteran, not a tau fire warrior 💀

[tired cargo]

then what I'm talking about is irrelevant to you because I'm referring to the video and what I wrote way above is specifically about something he's talking about in the video

[faint beacon]

they are good at a bit of everything

[spark helm]

This class has literally been out there with ranged damage out the ass. This doesn't need to top the already inflated numbers people need from a leader board mod to be true, like plainly.

[steep flower]

even ogryn shoots; so does vet even melees - cope with that however you please

[tame lodge]

Ogryns are also depicted with the Ripper

[tropic notch]

https://tenor.com/view/iamrigbycat-gif-17122096475275233787

[mortal aspen]

Ogryn shoots the mostest and the hardestest

[tame lodge]

Ogryn should only use ripper

And only shoot as well

[atomic void]

I just dont see how a pure ranged class would work in this game where u NEED your melee to fight off giant hordes, no ammo in the world will be enough
only alternative is infinite cleave shit like purg staff just burning everything but u cant make every single weapon infinite cleave

[turbid ibex]

saying vet should be really good at ranged is something i agree with
saying they should only be ranged is insane

[mortal aspen]

well, psyker can do it, right?

xdd

[atomic void]

i mentioned purg straff

[spark helm]

Can things be made differently? Sure they can just roll some talent bonuses into each other anf replace it with something cool but what the hell are you trying to talk about when you say that the class's ranged options don't exist or have efficacy?

[mortal aspen]

should've mentioned it in the first half of the message
i dun wanna read

[atomic void]

skill issue

[steep flower]

The only class that can be pure range is psyker... because staffs are infinite and thats primarily why... and the fact the staffs (primarily trauma) can be used instead of melee cause its that potent

[tame lodge]

So yeah

I'm a guardsmen

And like all guardsmen

I saw my fair share of melee

Engaged on my fair share of melee

The emperor protects

[spice shard]

i cant take him seriously when i found out he made a video about his arbites name getting reset when it was "FourtEpercentCop"

[tame lodge]

The guard prevails

[mortal aspen]

what if this is just an elaborate hoax from Mister E's alt to boost his viewership

[turbid ibex]

tbh a pure "ranged" psyker with staff feels pretty different compared to using like

[spice shard]

its failing

[tired cargo]

what I'm talking about is The Veteran is incredibly fucking week and that is not a "biased or discussion" opinion it is almost the weakest class in the game and on some points it is the weakest because if you don't play a super hyper meta build you will fold incredibly fast and do barely any damage compared to any other class if they went meta

[turbid ibex]

an actual gun

[spark helm]

It's probably not that deep and if so, still dumb.

Veteran is the weakest class in the game?

[tropic notch]

I like how he complains about things needing nerfs then will use the op things because he sucks

[mortal aspen]

if he's weak, buff his numbers, why change the whole idea for the class?

[steep flower]

i don't take ppl seriously when they are 'prominent' ppl of the game & mistake basic info about class they review like... cooldown of an ability...

[frail citrus]

people will say this then turn around and say “i think gold toughness needs to be removed because it’s the games easy mode”

[tired cargo]

I have multiple times try to play the pure range veteran build where I avoid any upgrades in the tree involving melee and I will fold like tissue paper if something sneezes on me

[tame lodge]

Yesnt

[atomic void]

that has nothing to do with being a pure ranged class tho
its just old trees vs new trees

[tropic notch]

And go down and die then baby rage

[tame lodge]

He's a pretty much jack of all trades

[mortal aspen]

💀

[tame lodge]

While the others end up more specialized

[hollow ibex]

have you tried using power sword

[tired cargo]

that's what I'm talking about if you don't play the middle path upgrade, how good is The Veteran?

[tame lodge]

So basically they excel at more points than vet

[spice shard]

yup
especially if they claim to not use mods and then make false info because of said mods we know who im on about

[tired cargo]

tell me without the shout ability how good is The Veteran actually?

[tame lodge]

Anyways here's infinite ammo weapon that can instakill crushers

[tame lodge]

Pretty good

[frail citrus]

not very, but their middle path is still broken to an extreme measure

[tame lodge]

Executioner Stance has the best ranged buffs in the game

[meager echo]

Try ps, stagger everything. In h40 hongkong no one run ds, they play vet like pure melee, only gun for special.

[spice shard]

decent
execut stance is nice

[spark helm]

Exestance is phenomenal.

[atomic void]

dork should have just not came out 3 years ago so they dont take 10 business years constatnly updating trees and making power level discourse so common

[tame lodge]

Infiltrate can drop all your aggro so you have free objectives

You can spam grenades left and right

[frail citrus]

i would only say the other trees are “bad” because they’re so overshadowed by VOC, you can make it work but why take anything else when you can keep your team alive forever

[turbid ibex]

it drops all your aggro into your teammates

[tame lodge]

You have the best generalist melee in the game

[spice shard]

the fact the infiltrate penance sucks so much is pain to get
plus it shows what you shouldnt do with infiltrate rn imo

[tame lodge]

You have good ammo economy

[tired cargo]

is it better than a Zealots? Arbites? Ogryn? I think all of those classes are way better than a veteran even if you don't play meta and just play funny builds

[turbid ibex]

and shout can also give you pretty free objectives with the gigastagger

[tame lodge]

Survivalist moment

[turbid ibex]

zealot no lmao

fucker has a singular build

[spice shard]

reworked class is stronger than non reworked class

say it aint so

[tired cargo]

and I think all three of those classes are better than a veteran both Range and melee wise

[frail citrus]

this is so true

[turbid ibex]

arbites and ogryn though yes i do agree

[atomic void]

vet wasnt considered weak pre ogryn rework

[steep flower]

so wrong it almost baited me to rage

[tame lodge]

Yeah stronger than Arby's
Not quite stronger than zealot
Weaker than Ogryn

[frail citrus]

it was good but nothing compared to what it is now

[hollow ibex]

that was 800 years ago

tbf

[narrow widget]

ex stance chill
don't run infiltrate tho

[hollow ibex]

hi, infil main reporting in

[tired cargo]

yeah then what the fuck is all of this shit about "The Veteran is strong" it's not strong! it's weak!!! and the video above is fucking about how it should be reworked

[atomic void]

just proves my points that its just new trees vs old trees

[spice shard]

ah yes
this is strong so this is clearly weak

jfc mate

[atomic void]

a class with voc, power sword and hellbore/plasma/bolter is not weak it just has the same issue as zealot where the tree needs a rework

[spark helm]

Infiltrate works with freaks. If you can't learn to play with it, literally just play shroudfield and try again later it's the same fundamentals at play with different passives attached to it.

[narrow widget]

there is something not right in your head sirosky

[tired cargo]

I personally dream of one day being able to run a pure range veteran and roleplay as a guardsman without having to then play also on low difficulties otherwise I will be clapped

[steep flower]

sounds like to me its a You problem; go play more arby

[turbid ibex]

yeah a tree rework would already be pretty much guaranteed to come with a ton of other adjustments to his stuff

[hollow ibex]

idc about infil i just like right side talents

[spice shard]

by chance do you think a kilogram of steel is heavier than a kilogram of feathers

[hollow ibex]

vet is strong, vet is weak blah blah

this is all that matters

[spice shard]

greatest name

[turbid ibex]

lmao

thats fucking hilarious

[steep flower]

you already do; you die trying to have pure range build

[narrow widget]

bottom right corner of the tree with ws is the best part of the tree and no one will ever change my mind

[tired cargo]

no? because they weighed the same because you said they weigh the same

[frail citrus]

might be a hot take, but i don’t think any of the classes are “bad” or “too weak”. some definitely outshine others but you can do really good with any of them

[tame lodge]

Vet is strong
Only class with infinite ammo ranged that 1 shots crushers

[hollow ibex]

thanks, it was VetTopFourClass but had to change it when arbi came out

[tame lodge]

[meager echo]

Good luck with arby getting accept in high havoc tho, in hongkong sv its very rare for abry to get accepted xD.

[turbid ibex]

i mean yeah they all have their strengths

[spice shard]

holy shit thats you?

[tame lodge]

Yeah I heard about that

[spice shard]

[tame lodge]

They know Arby's is mid out there

[spice shard]

good
fuck arbies

[tame lodge]

Or just don't want to be bored to death

Arby's gameplay

[tired cargo]

why do I not die if I make a pure range Ogryn? or Arbite? because that's very fucking easy and durable and works on highest difficulties besides havoc

[tame lodge]

🛌

[spice shard]

probably the former ngl

[hollow ibex]

only briefly, was Cadia-Shouts-Alone before that lol

[frail citrus]

me when the arb runs ahead and dies to a million reapers and then leaves

[hollow ibex]

and then arbi came out so i changed my name

[spark helm]

I just like sneaky shit and don't care. Can play with just about anything unless the loadout is just fighting itself that hard.

Can't speak for havoc but most infiltrate vets that I've seen fail are just playing the same way they play with shroudfield. They don't really know to actually play with risk before a stealth button gets involved so they just die.

[atomic void]

pure range arbi and ogryn? u mean run out of ammo i nthe second room

[tame lodge]

Not the whole I don't die in x class

My kin

You are getting hit

That's not a character issue

[mortal aspen]

yeah, because they're overtuned and broken

[tame lodge]

[tired cargo]

why can I play pure range Ogryn? or Arbite? but not a pure range veteran even though it's supposed to be the ""Range specialist""

[hollow ibex]

you use break the line to make fights easier, i use break the line to run ahead of my team and take all the ammo

[atomic void]

u literally cant be a pure range ogryn

[tame lodge]

You can

Literally Recon

[atomic void]

and if u do you're annoying