why does the popo get 4 assault anti boss anti mob anti rager grenades
#veteran-class
calm shard
that smoke grenade is very good
spark helm
Smoke grenade gud
calm shard
genuinely better psyker bubble that you can get 4 of
spark helm
:> (serious)
tall torrent
smoke is ~3 buffs away from being really good
calm shard
I already use them all the time in havoc when I'm not using exe
signal garden
at the very least let us see shit in the smoke/see through it
spark helm
does 40k do stupid shit with like healing smoke or something?
tall torrent
does 40k do stupid shit with like healing smoke or something?
no
signal garden
it does in mortis trials
calm shard
at the very least let us see shit in the smoke/see through it
You can see through the smoke if you're standing in it
spark helm
at the very least let us see shit in the smoke/see through it
I just maintain object permanence and fire
Or go into it myself
signal garden
ugh
spark helm
And yknow, hit ping
long dove
new special ability, You press F and a volley of lasgun fire appears from offscreen and blankets the area. No it doesn't make sense, fuck you
signal garden
im still traumatized by me sthrowing a smoke nade down
and my teammate getting sniperd through it
tall torrent
think that's been fixed
spark helm
Yeh
calm shard
spark helm
It's been a while but when that was happening could you see the laser?
tall torrent
spark helm
Like if you were in it.
barren cave
Anyone know the dump Stat on shredder auto pistol
signal garden
yeah i could see the laser through the smoke
spark helm
Can you see the flash through it?
signal garden
it slowly moved onto my homie and turned my homie into someone who needed to picked up in the next room
nope
hollow ibex
Anyone know the dump Stat on shredder auto pistol
Mobility
signal garden
at least back then like 2 months ago
barren cave
Cool
signal garden
then i was like "im good dog"
spark helm
Shredder autopistol > all.
signal garden
back to shredders and krak
sly orchid
think that's been fixed
infinite stamina smoke
tall torrent
at least smoke not as buggy as arb dog
dog is the single most buggy entity this game has seen yet
signal garden
im so sick and tired of all the suppression veteran has
as if the number one threat to vet isnt annoying ass infested poxwalkers
long dove
Anyone get the moments where DT just has sudden drops in FPS and just chugs for no reason unless you restart the client?
signal garden
DT has severe memory loss issues
sly orchid
dog is the single most buggy entity this game has seen yet
ngl i havent notice black magic with the dog
tall torrent
infinite stamina smoke
I rly think smoke is ~3 buffs away from being really good
long dove
DT has severe memory loss issues
ah I figureed it was that
signal garden
so yeah every 3-4 hours of continuous play you have to restart
tall torrent
ngl i havent notice black magic with the dog
dog was so bugged where if u swapped from a dog-having loadout to lone wolf you immediately crash your game
Then when u load back in, you delete the lone wolf class, you crash again
Then u load back in, click on your original loadout, and it crashes again
Then u load back in and remake your build from scratch
yea ik this because I experienced this multiple times
tame lodge
signal garden
what in the fatshark could cause those crashes
tame lodge
Couldn't play with a vet on the team
signal garden
swedish coding, eternally a mystery, even to the coders themselves
tame lodge
💀
tall torrent
very peak balance fatsharl
void dragon
I rly think smoke is ~3 buffs away from being really good
what buffs they need in your opinion?
long dove
swedish coding, eternally a mystery, even to the coders themselves
It's code from Ikea
void dragon
It's code from Ikea
only at Obesefish balance team
long dove
It's funnier/worse when you remember that Chubbyguppy helped design the engine used in this game
tall torrent
what buffs they need in your opinion?
counter bombers' line of sight
much shorter fuse (preferably impact detonation)
some sort of interaction with stamina management
maybe some sort of interaction with stagger (makes staggering easier)
sly orchid
counter bombers' line of sight
much shorter fuse (preferably impact detonation)
...
hmmmmm
cloud rock
I need to know if the Lucius is any good or if I’m stupid for excessively using it as a sniper
sly orchid
smoke threat reduction?
void dragon
enemies in smoke take increased impact seems like an interesting path
tame lodge
I need to know if the Lucius is any good or if I’m stupid for excessively using ...
Top weapon rn
tall torrent
smoke threat reduction?
no
tame lodge
Competing with Plasma
long dove
Lucius is Helbore right?
tall torrent
4 people in a smoke
congratulations none of yall will benefit from threat reduction
tame lodge
Lucius is Helbore right?
Yup
void dragon
btw, what's up with the C.shotguns? were they buffed? they feel around the same of bad
cloud rock
Top weapon rn
I mix it with krak in case armored enemies get too close
tall torrent
smoke threat reduction?
yam with all due respect I don't think u understand what threat reduction actually means
sly orchid
yam with all due respect I don't think u understand what threat reduction actual...
enemies dont target you
cloud rock
Lucius is Helbore right?
Yes
sly orchid
ive played shroudfield plenty
tall torrent
enemies dont target you
no
sly orchid
not camo vet tho
tall torrent
it makes u a lower priority target for enemies, compared to ur teammates
cloud rock
Competing with Plasma
Plasma is pretty good, rn I’m running a trench raider themed loadout though
long dove
and since when is Helbore a tope weapon?
tall torrent
it interacts with the slot system
calm shard
it was already pretty damn good before that buff
sly orchid
got buffed and is now real good
tame lodge
and since when is Helbore a tope weapon?
Forever
calm shard
just annoying to use
tall torrent
before then it had some pretty big dealbreaker issues
tame lodge
(it got buffed recently)
long dove
really? Cause of the changes to zoom and pull out?
signal garden
it had big dealbreaker issues balanced out by it being a wildly pwoerful melee weapon
like, it had triple its current attack speed
but the same power, not at all unlike kerillian's javelin
void dragon
Helbore's swap speed is insane good nowadays, that alone is a MASSIVE buff
tall torrent
really? Cause of the changes to zoom and pull out?
mainly, draw to fire being faster, and higher maniac ADM making it actually not abysmal dogshit vs flamers
and the hitscan size got bigger for easier headshots
void dragon
and the gun now has better time hitting headshots
signal garden
irnically it has a harder time hitting headshots in melee
tame lodge
really? Cause of the changes to zoom and pull out?
And maniacs
signal garden
used to be you could aim in the geenral direction of something and stabbing it and it would be a headshot
cloud rock
and the gun now has better time hitting headshots
Not when hip firing (obviously)
tall torrent
with that said it's still a little off from being perfect
void dragon
Not when hip firing (obviously)
nah, its even better now, you bad /j
signal garden
hey a charged shot has decent hipfire accuracy
past stratus
don't talk about my baby like that I loved the Helbore before the buffs 😠
tall torrent
if it had good sights and like 15~20% faster charge speed I think it'd be perfect
signal garden
you can literally see the reticle tighten as you charge
void dragon
i actually land hipfire headshots sometimes
tall torrent
also vet needs better dmg talents
signal garden
so the base weapon sights arent bad
sly orchid
also vet needs better dmg talents
vet needs to be better
tall torrent
helbore currently misses some key breakpoints by 1 dmg
signal garden
the vostrayan pattern sights are abysmal
void dragon
vet needs new perk tree
tall torrent
yes 1 dmg lol
signal garden
its literally pay to suck
signal garden
thaanks fatshark
void dragon
yes 1 dmg lol
that sounds like BS but i believe that it can happen, its Obesefish after all
long dove
Hmm I guess I should try out my helbore again
long dove
exec stance not the play though right?
tall torrent
the 5% ranged dmg node needs to both be 10%
sly orchid
how the vet rework will feel
tall torrent
and the 5% melee dmg node needs to be 10% as well
I sent a bunch of wild ideas to playtester
compact oracle
exec stance not the play though right?
exec stance is strong its just less safe than voc
past stratus
I think I can one shot almost everything with the Helborne currently on Auric at least since I don't have the mod for the psykhanium. 2 shot Crushers with FT
sly orchid
https://tenor.com/view/happy-steam-steamhappy-gif-11912067498964962572
which one...
signal garden
way less safe
void dragon
@tall torrent does the combat shotguns got real buffs in last patch or they got scammed with spagetti code? they dont feel better so far i have tried them
tall torrent
which one...
wdym which one
signal garden
at least with ogryn you can just fire away and generate TGH
calm shard
exec stance not the play though right?
It's technically viable in the sense that if you have at least decently competent teammates you can use it
tall torrent
I sent them like 4 pages of just talent changes and new stuff
calm shard
You can't really carry with it
long dove
yeah I know Exec is less safe but sometimes I wanna have some variety I guess
signal garden
vet is pressing F to fiddle around and think twice about swapping back to melee
sly orchid
I sent them like 4 pages of just talent changes and new stuff
aquilla
signal garden
nuncio aquilla
sly orchid
you said playtester singular
tall torrent
<@366562874039992331> does the combat shotguns got real buffs in last patch or t...
agripinaa mk7 pretty good rn
tall torrent
you said playtester singular
johnny
sly orchid
or did you send it to multiple?
tall torrent
and arthiio
sly orchid
ahaaaaaaaa
tall torrent
tho arthiio I think less active rn
tall torrent
I didn't send to cole cuz i'm pretty sure cole will say "ur crazy for this" x30
void dragon
agripinaa mk7 pretty good rn
agri is the best because fullbore and good precision, but the guns feel still quite meh
sly orchid
I didn't send to cole cuz i'm pretty sure cole will say "ur crazy for this" x30
Do it anyway
sly orchid
You could just explain your changes
tall torrent
I'm significantly more radical on the "buff thing" side
compact oracle
changing peoples minds doesnt happen on the internet
and you wont change my mind about this
void dragon
kantrael was always underrated
you mean the accatran? or the Zarona is now good?
signal garden
fire shotgun
compact oracle
it was originally kantrael
sly orchid
Cole is pret receptive to changes
compact oracle
but its now accatran
long dove
a shotgun build I have running +6 Stam and deadshot is surprisingly fun
compact oracle
they changed a bunch of the names a while back for... reasons
signal garden
i just assume its agri for long range, kantrael for fire, i could be wrong on fire
compact oracle
agri is great for bossing
signal garden
regardless both are pretty good
compact oracle
but ive been too busy using other stuff
signal garden
the fire one is great for bossing
void dragon
agri headshot do feels good
signal garden
more DPS than the exterminator
tall torrent
Cole is pret receptive to changes
I'll tell u one small part of the doc I sent to johnny
combining every changed or new talent in there, I think it can get u somewhere like 55% faster melee atk speed on veteran
signal garden
agripinaa just happens to be able to perform at long range
sly orchid
I'll tell u one small part of the doc I sent to johnny
combining every changed o...
Thats silly
Unless its quite situational
tall torrent
Thats silly
and u can quite easily stack ranged crit chance to like 35~50% off the bat without any blessings
signal garden
i cant imagine playing beetus just to equip a combat shotty
narrow frost
whuh?
past stratus
I'm significantly more radical on the "buff thing" side
Did you tell em to remove the annoying caveats on every talent? I don't want to get skill checked by the game constantly. I want to kill herectics and have fun
tall torrent
Unless its quite situational
trench fighter drill 10%
competitive urge (rework) 10%
arch-militant (new) 10%
weapon specialist (rework) 10%
invigorated (rework) 10%
ok 50%
close enough
compact oracle
i cant imagine playing beetus just to equip a combat shotty
that and executioner has better sounds
signal garden
best sound is the elephant gun
too bad the elephant gun has the worst damage per bullet of all 3 shotgun types
the fuck fatshark
long dove
Exec stance with infantry Autogun is pretty fun
tall torrent
I can see why your views are quite radical
also one of the designed build synergy was smoke giving inf stamina with 0 stam cost while u stand inside smoke
which gives inf deadshot uptime
and deadshot is reworked to only cost stam on shot fired, not over time
plus the talents that can get u like innately 35~50% ranged crit chance (without deadshot or blessings)
the result is like, if u stand inside smoke and have deadshot u can casually have like 70%+ crit chance for ur gun, while having 0 stam cost
sly orchid
i did like your idea that vet could generate stims
tall torrent
also one of the designed build synergy was smoke giving inf stamina with 0 stam ...
then u add crit blessing and u can easily reach 100% ranged crit chance basically permanently
long dove
i did like your idea that vet could generate stims
More like it's finding stims while running around
past stratus
Surgical should be a vet talent
you're good at shooting, you should do more shooty damage when you aim
compact oracle
More like it's finding stims while running around
nah, vet is so high that their blood can be turned into stims
signal garden
Vet should have the zealot talent that grants recoil and spread reduction on dodge
long dove
nah, vet is so high that their blood can be turned into stims
I was more making reference to the fact Guardsman are known for scrounging
or stealing shit
tall torrent
https://tenor.com/view/batman-thinking-gif-18107621495886085895
the idea is that u can avg at like 20~30% extra atk speed if u rly spec into melee
trench fighter moved up into top side to be more accessible but is melee only
comp urge is reworked into cumulative RNG and boosts melee atk speed
arch militant is new, deeper down the tree but improves both melee and ranged atk speed
weapon spec nerfed from 15% to 10% melee atk speed but subnode gets u 10% so if u invest hard u can get 20%
void dragon
nah, vet is so high that their blood can be turned into stims
do we have money to be that drunk? thoug that the guardsmen only did smoke, hence their nades
past stratus
did you tell them to scrap infiltrate and exec stance and give us Disengage from Ranger Veteran, path?
😌
tall torrent
did you tell them to scrap infiltrate and exec stance and give us Disengage from...
no
compact oracle
do we have money to be that drunk? thoug that the guardsmen only did smoke, henc...
money is not an obstacle, theres whole tanks of perfectly non-deadly stimms in missions
tall torrent
I can actually send u that document lol
past stratus
I thought you were on our side...
tall torrent
I don't mind
signal garden
Yeah remove smoke nade and infiltrate and combine it into one thing
Give vet shredder nade, krak nade, and melta bomb
past stratus
yeah sure send me the doc
signal garden
Combine infiltrate and exe stance to be like kruber
Stealth into yuge range damage
sly orchid
fatshark isnt going to do that
strange crow
I can actually send u that document lol
Could I perchance see the document? It's a list of all the changes you'd like to see for vet right?
past stratus
stealth needs to be group wide to work in this game imo, the Disengage bomb is perfect because of that
signal garden
I feel like the best potential weapon right now for zealot would be helbore
Since only the helbore can realistically stab a boss in its weak spot from behind it
tall torrent
here
calm shard
shit
tall torrent
it's the same
signal garden
And TGH from dodge and dodge on sprint are a blast
tall torrent
just specified what base stats are changed
tall torrent
hell yeah 200 toughness again
at the cost of no toughness boost nodes in tree
signal garden
Or just do what arbites does, unavoidable +50 tgh
tame lodge
is remove all grey nodes
Vet innate ranged damage 
calm shard
tremendous
sly orchid
at the cost of no toughness boost nodes in tree
80%tdr
tall torrent
tremendous
wait till u see marksman's focus and the new stuff lol
this is NOTHING compared to the stuff at the bottom
signal garden
All of this is fair and balanced I'm assuming because Arby's has a shield
sly orchid
only vs ranged
some would chew you into little pieces for this document lol
sly orchid
i think its a bit overtuned
tame lodge
I overshot a lot of things
sly orchid
vet is a monster in melee then
tall torrent
also remember that this does not include talent structure
I wasn't told to remake structure
signal garden
Wat
tall torrent
if I did structure I think some of ur evaluations might change
calm shard
hm
signal garden
So the tax will stay and we would just be stat machines?
sly orchid
if I did structure I think some of ur evaluations might change
even if you put it at the bottom it would still be picked
tall torrent
So the tax will stay and we would just be stat machines?
just read lol
tall torrent
even if you put it at the bottom it would still be picked
no
calm shard
assumedly the majority of the shitty tax nodes were replaced by real talents
with real effects
tall torrent
assumedly the majority of the shitty tax nodes were replaced by **real** talents
I mean
I literally wrote out what the new grey nodes are
at the start
calm shard
you think I can read?
tall torrent
GREY TALENT NODES
+5% total crit chance (×1)
+1 stamina (×1)
+10% ranged damage (×2)
+10% melee damage (×2)
+5% movement speed (×1)
no defense grey nodes
sly orchid
still think grey nodes should be gone like arbites
calm shard
neat
calm shard
still think grey nodes should be gone like arbites
arbites has 5 grey nodes
sly orchid
arbites has only 2 stat nodes
calm shard
wait no 7
tall torrent
good ideas but some of em err
I overshot some things so that even if they're to be nerfed in the discussion phase they'd still be good
whereas if I write them as "balanced" imo then they get nerfed then they won't be good enough
tall torrent
you think I can read?
ya
read the whole thing before u reach conclusions
because if u think smth is broken/op then it's very likely that smth even better is a few lines below
calm shard
oh my god it's Ranger Veteran from Vermintide 2 :)
sly orchid
I overshot some things so that even if they're to be nerfed in the discussion ph...
now hear me out path
calm shard
Ranger Veteran heheheheeheh
sly orchid
give vet a talent that does increasing stagger with consecutive weakspot hits
can only minor stagger ogryn enemies and maulers and doesnt work on bosses
has a grace period of 5 seconds
so you dont lose it with silliness
tall torrent
give vet a talent that does increasing stagger with consecutive weakspot hits
maybe smth for exploit weakness
but idk
compact oracle
please make it in such a way that i can stagger a crusher in 1 second of autopistol fire
tall torrent
I don't rly want vet to be a stagger oriented class
sly orchid
I don't rly want vet to be a stagger oriented class
this is more rewarding precision
which vet is centered around
tall torrent
this is more rewarding precision
did u read the whole thing yet
tall torrent
vet to me should be more cleave/finesse oriented
also some ideas I had aren't present in this
signal garden
Zealot should be cleave oriented
tall torrent
cuz I made this ~same time as arb release
signal garden
Vet should be finesse oriented
tall torrent
I've since had some newer ideas that are perhaps dumber
compact oracle
maybe itd be bad but i kind of want bh's ability
tame lodge
Zealot should be cleave oriented
They kind of already are
compact oracle
one enormous shot
tall torrent
we put some bounty hunter stuff on vet
I just want u to know that I put the "press ult to reload gun" feature into a keystone
tame lodge
Their unique weapons have some high cleave
And they either stagger and reduces mass
Or have access to Perfect Strike
past stratus
being Bardin is all I want
let me play Ranger Veteran in 40k Fatshark >:(
make survivalist a passive and let me drop little ammo things on the ground
so I can choose different auras without getting the stinky eye
tall torrent
oh my god it's Ranger Veteran from Vermintide 2 :)
did u finish whole thing yet
calm shard
I just got to the new stuff
signal garden
Yeah just add in like an aimed plasma pistolshot
calm shard
very good
signal garden
Actually an inferno pistol
signal garden
Put it on like a 20sec cd
calm shard
going away if you miss
instead of from fucking walking
I can kind of imagine running it just for the absurd passive toughness replenishment on melee vet
signal garden
your crime is your miserable existence, your sentence is death blam
tall torrent
going away if you **miss**
I wanted all 3 keystones to be mediocre-ish baseline but got significantly better as u invest more points into them
calm shard
pure melee vet just running this+ 20 stacks for the 100% toughness replenishment
barely using their gun
tall torrent
pure melee vet just running this+ 20 stacks for the 100% toughness replenishment
Nah WS is still way better for melee in this document
calm shard
yeah I know
tall torrent
But MF is designed to be used as a mega-investment keystone
calm shard
but still
deep bone
What Blessing should I run on Mk.IX Infantry Las
tall torrent
oh also is Chink in their armour universal rending
Rending is “total”
deep bone
I was using HH Falter
tall torrent
What Blessing should I run on Mk.IX Infantry Las
Ghost + headhunter
calm shard
related question because I would like to use infantry autogun with this
is there a cooldown when losing stacks from missed shots
tall torrent
is there a cooldown when losing stacks from missed shots
No 
deep bone
I was thinking Deadly Accurate but ghost works
calm shard
well I can still work with that
tall torrent
No cooldown from missing headshot so u can lose stacks incredibly fast on automatics
signal garden
Zealot uses it better
Tight hipfire, reduced recoil, high crit
It even has a shoot faster button
deep bone
Yea but I don’t play Zealot lol
calm shard
No cooldown from missing headshot so u can lose stacks incredibly fast on automa...
Alternatively I can gain them fast by just not missing
I see no way this could possibly backfire
signal garden
Then stick to a recon gun
tall torrent
Alternatively I can ***gain them*** fast by just not missing
Yes, it’s designed for skill
signal garden
Ilas has annoying recoil
signal garden
You'll like it more when it performs well
deep bone
Negative infinity
I enjoy it on my Vet build
And I ain’t gonna be convinced otherwise
little path
What's the best vigilant mk
signal garden
Probably the one that doesn't burst fire
little path
coolio
past stratus
MKV and MKIII Helbore do a good job at being a better Ilas
little path
infantry las could use some minor help
doesn't need to be super strong but at least let it be not awkward and painful to use
signal garden
Poor beam width, exceptional recoil
ilas fucking sucks
Laspistol performs more in line with the ideal lasgun
Minimal recoil, ease of use, efficient
tall torrent
yeah they're just good
cuz the reaction I got from @grand perch who plays helbore is very different
calm shard
I don't really see anything substantially wrong with it, but I do want it
carnally
now that you mention it
little path
a stim regen talent would be fun
makes it so people don't only go for greens
or save it until the final boss fight then instakill him
calm shard
I would actually run field improv if it gave me free stimms periodically
signal garden
To be fair all the stims are unilaterally good in havocs
calm shard
Hell yeah I'll spend one skill point to have the emperor himself plant a red stim in my pocket
sly orchid
I would maybe exclude the yellow stim
little path
oh yeah, stims are great
tall torrent
carnally
+150% ranged finesse
+40% rending
+100% toughness replenishment modifier
+20% reload soeed
insta-reload for ranged on ult use
1s immunity vs ranged atks on ranged weakspot hit
compact oracle
generated stims should look fucked up
little path
but most people don't use them to make sure a fight goes smooth
calm shard
I'd like yellow stimms on builds that aren't exe
Exe doesn't need it for obvious reasons
but yellow stimms are good
little path
people usually pop stims when they're on the verge of dying
signal garden
Which is ofc dumb
calm shard
I use stimm to kill faster
I am not chancing that unbalanced shitshow of an enemy any more than I have to
signal garden
Yeah it's bizarre
little path
Which is ofc dumb
yeah but it's that hording mentality
you don't know when you'll get another stim and you don't wanna waste it
signal garden
Throw all the grenades, shoot all the ammo, better hoard stimms and kits
tall torrent
I would actually run field improv if it gave me free stimms periodically
ya I think it just need a little extra oomph to be competitive with the rest
the best kinds of support talents are those that are taken for selfish reasons but end up benefitting the team
calm shard
yeah
I literally never take field improv as it is now
It's a nice novelty, but too situational
Only usable 4 times a mission with crates your team may not even find
(or remember to use lol)
Or they spawn at the absolute ass end of the mission
little path
Could also be fun if you started the mission with a random type of crate
tall torrent
if field improv gave stimms I might take it on at least 50% of my builds
calm shard
I would take it all the time
Getting a free blue/red stimm every once in a while
And I can just pawn the yellow stimms off to people with abilities that benefit from it
tall torrent
I would take it all the time
I think the other stuff I put in there are super competitive
calm shard
Yeah but like me personally
I play exe vet for the boss chunking
Free red/blue stimms would help a lot with that
signal garden
I think the stabby power sword is underrated for boss chunking
That said power sword is a frustrating weapon to use
Dagger is also good at boss chunking, although at that point a helbore is mandatory to do damage to force shields
deep bone
All that matters to me is that I enjoy ilas
signal garden
And then one big problem is you need to get a perfect block to preserve your charge vs a boss
marble mantle
Man I forgot how addicting combat blade is
signal garden
Which one the horizontal slasher or the OG
signal garden
I have no idea what
marble mantle
Oh uh
signal garden
Which is which
The OG one has the stabby power attack
And the new one has the slashy one
marble mantle
Yeah that one’s the one I like
Thinking about doing the knife DB WS setup again, recollect it was pretty good
signal garden
Well IMHO if you intend to go against bosses with force shields you'll need the helbore bayonet
signal garden
Although ive seen people clear rooms by playing chicken, idk what they're doing but it involves running ahead and emptying their double barrel like 4 times
marble mantle
I just meant in like auric for fun
signal garden
Auric isn't fun unless it's histg
There's not enough enemies so everything you try to shank gets executioner shotgun'd
And it's fustrating
calm shard
Although ive seen people clear rooms by playing chicken, idk what they're doing ...
4 times seems like a lot for what man stopper is capable of
signal garden
What can be said, there was a lot of enemies I'm assuming
Real question is should one go super reload or just embrace the thrill of reloading in exchange for more damage
marble mantle
Mmmmmm I love manstopper
signal garden
I guess trappers are immune then
What is better in life, sustainable veteran elephant hunter, or sneaky zealot Elmer fudd stealth cannon
Or the forbidden psyker fudd
tall torrent
5 more to go
marble mantle
5 more to go
The goat
steel veldt
trying exe stance, it's not that bad.
I mean sure I need a team to basically baby me but I kill specials at least?
surreal rune
krak grenade penance might be the most miserable thing ive ever had to do
fervent citrus
im starting to depend on the laspistol build too much and idk what can be equal to it :(
steel veldt
I only died twice!
calm shard
I mean sure I need a team to basically baby me but I kill specials at least?
you can kill everything with exe sta
steel veldt
this laspistol ain't doing it tho
calm shard
The real problem from exe stance is that your teammates need to actually know how to melee (unlikely)
calm shard
this laspistol ain't doing it tho
Are you sure?
steel veldt
It's cuz mine is at 300 power haha
calm shard
oh
steel veldt
it shreds everything outside of maulers and crushers
or any carapace
it's that this event is ALL carapace...
past stratus
Exec Stance is "If I kill a lot my team will surely hold their own and not die"
VOC is "I will shout to save my team from their mistakes"
One thing happens more often than the other.
signal garden
That's a weird flex
steel veldt
yeah I suck
signal garden
There's no excuse for the helbore to have no optic
tall torrent
it's that this event is ALL carapace...
the event enemies have big DR vs ranged
dats why
this is a very melee-centric event
past stratus
why would we need a sniper when we're constantly in tiny ass corridors and stuff?
cloud rock
at least the M41 equivelant to an ACOG
signal garden
You say that, I'm more terrified by the constant stream of grenadiers
steel veldt
the event enemies have big DR vs ranged
oh
cloud rock
why would we need a sniper when we're constantly in tiny ass corridors and stuff...
the hellbore is already a sniper
the fuck do you mean?
tall torrent
I think I cooked with the block stance icon here
past stratus
The Helbore is a high impact rifle
signal garden
He means a scope optic
steel veldt
I'll give my zealot a bolt pistol
signal garden
A sniper scope to make the enemies head a very big head that you click on
past stratus
if your only requisite to be a sniper is range then the Plasma is also a sniper 
cloud rock
a fucking DMR
signal garden
It's true a plasma is a sniper except
They made it completely unable to one shot things
past stratus
the thing has a godman bayonet
signal garden
That it used to be able to one shot
cloud rock
the thing has a godman bayonet
We used the M16 as a sniper for a while
guess what goes on the end of that barrel?
signal garden
Not a bayonet if you're sniping
cloud rock
also literally- every sniper from the first and second world wars did that too
cloud rock
no I want
signal garden
Literally no designated marksman would ever fix a bayonet to snipe
steel veldt
Does this not count with exe stance? I swear I did it
cloud rock
a scoped weapon
past stratus
a scope for what we barely get 20m hallways in this game
compact oracle
i would use weapon customization but it tanks my performance
past stratus
wanna zoom in on plague ogryn to see its guts on 4k?
cloud rock
yes.
signal garden
It's not the hallways that's the issue, any time an optic enhances your visibility of the desired target it is doing its job
cloud rock
I wanna see the specific pustules I am hitting
signal garden
If the head becomes the big head, the optic is doing its job
compact oracle
plenty of huge open areas anyway
cloud rock
quick side tangent
compact oracle
i would probably just end up hipfiring it most of the time but its not like the game is 90% hallway
signal garden
Well the issue is the best headshot guns in the game right now are hipfire guns
And then the bolter
cloud rock
Not a bayonet if you're sniping
at some point people thought bayonets made you hit more targets.
mostly russians and apparently mosin owners think this?
signal garden
Everything else, the infantry auto gun is also better at headshotting rapidly from the hip
past stratus
I think the Helbore is already the limit of how much you can safely stand around and aim without getting your shit destroyed. I can't imagine having a weapon that is even more tunnel vision.
fervent citrus
so is there any other melee weapon that can work as well as the power sword or dueling sword
signal garden
The iLas is ironically dog shit at precision
cloud rock
I think the Helbore is already the limit of how much you can safely stand around...
yes but funny
compact oracle
id take iLas sights for helbore though
signal garden
Because massive recoil and a small projectile
fervent citrus
I can’t find a good balance between crowd control and single target on my vet melee
I have the extremes
past stratus
The Ilas is just dogshit at everything, someone in Fatshark really hates that gun with a passion
cloud rock
I can’t find a good balance between crowd control and single target on my vet me...
literally any mele and percision weapon
signal garden
Oh wait all 3 marks suck bad at something lol
They're all shit in their own special way
Thanks fatshark
fervent citrus
literally any mele and percision weapon
I mean on my melee weapon specifically
cloud rock
I need ideas for other trench raider loadouts
signal garden
No shovel unfortunately
cloud rock
are you using mele for single targets or multiple then?
fervent citrus
Power sword does hella crowd control, dueling sword does hella single target
signal garden
Because shovel is like thunderhammer, where the fuck is the damage
fervent citrus
I want both
signal garden
Power sword does both
cloud rock
get both
past stratus
the Power Sword does really good single target damage
signal garden
One of the marks has a push stab
fervent citrus
I have both
past stratus
wth
fervent citrus
the Power Sword does really good single target damage
idk I’ve been struggling with it lately and idk why
past stratus
well probably because Vet ain't that good in melee to begin with
but the Power Sword is a pretty strong weapon
fervent citrus
some days I feel like a god some days I can’t even deal with a single Crusher
lilac kayak
I want both
Rashad axe
signal garden
You have to go WS for Rashad I think
The slow attack speed is insufferable otherwise
past stratus
I think desperado trench fighter is enough but yeah ws helps
steel veldt
mfw when I use 300 power weapons on Auric Malestrom
cloud rock
I think desperado trench fighter is enough but yeah ws helps
my two trench raider-esq loadouts are: hellbore and shovel or Vraks autogun and shovel
for now that is.
wild hearth
im done with vet
cloud rock
Because shovel can't kill shit
you
wild hearth
absolutely worthless class
cloud rock
don't shovel right then
lilac kayak
absolutely worthless class
?
cloud rock
jab them in the di- BONKED BY ZEALOT
signal garden
Yeah okay go histg
I want to like the shovel, but you don't get TGH for staggering shit, which is what the shovel is damn good at
cloud rock
jab them in the di- *BONKED BY ZEALOT*
tall torrent
@calm shard would u prefer if blessings were sorted all together or if they were made into a separate section for each weapon family with details as to whether it's good
tall torrent
cuz ngl I'm preferring the latter but that'll be quite some work from current version
sly orchid
<@199236663174627328> would u prefer if blessings were sorted all together or if...
Weapon family
lilac kayak
end me M'lord
signal garden
Knife is a better trench themed weapon
sly orchid
Just like gameslantern
tall torrent
Weapon family
ya dats wat I'm thinking
like
it'd be:
power sword mk3
power sword mk6
power sword blessings
signal garden
At least thematic while being bearable
tall torrent
then a new weapon type below
sly orchid
I do so enjoy using taxe on vet
tall torrent
I might even scrap current blessings completely for publishing? then add them later on
hybrid plover
Shovel good
cloud rock
I wish they had saved loadouts for classes
fervent citrus
wait
hybrid plover
I will not stand for shovel slander
lilac kayak
I wish they had saved loadouts for classes
They do
cloud rock
so it'd be easier to set up a particular loadout and playstyle
tall torrent
Shovel good
in rogue trader act 1 yea
past stratus
also Vet's melee weapon selection is just a bit miserable. What I found out here is that you just have to go with whatever fits your playstyle and practice like crazy. Like how Papa Wily plays Chaxe, everyone else thinks its dogshit but he makes it work. Or that one guy that is really enthusiastic about Heavy Swords, also a Havoc 40 player
cloud rock
I have not found thy function
hybrid plover
also Vet's melee weapon selection is just a bit miserable. What I found out here...
W-
signal garden
Heavy sword is actually good
cloud rock
also Vet's melee weapon selection is just a bit miserable. What I found out here...
I normally make a shit loadout and make it work
cloud rock
Chaxe is bad???
YOU'RE A SHOVEL GREMLIN GO BACK TO BONKING HERETICS
signal garden
Yeah bonking heretics while real classes get the kills
cloud rock
and somehow
hybrid plover
YOU'RE A SHOVEL GREMLIN GO BACK TO BONKING HERETICS
YES THIS IS TRUE BUT CHAXE IS ALSO A PERFECTLY VIABLE WEAPON
signal garden
Idk why they make it do so little damage
cloud rock
I still end up doing a shitload
cloud rock
I sharpen my shovel
tall torrent
uncanny + skullcrusher/decimator
signal garden
I put on my bayonet and staplb shit in frustration
tall torrent
and it's still low dmg lol
signal garden
Gottem
past stratus
I like the Chaxe, at least the mark with the light shredder but I only began to level it recently
signal garden
Chaxe is stressful, it's a shame it's on classes that don't get free benefits on staggered enemies
marble mantle
*Are you sure?*
Is that heavy or light one
lilac kayak
top tier gaslighter
paul was
faint beacon
Atleast shovel makes a nice sound
marble mantle
Buff shovel pls that shit fun
faint beacon
Tsk tsk
marble mantle
Bonk
faint beacon
Should be using Taxe
signal garden
The bonk is satisfying, the damage is non-existent
lilac kayak
both still are
I thought paul got buffed
sly orchid
Gale i literally main taxe on vet now
marble mantle
I thought paul got buffed
Barely
sly orchid
Stoopid
cloud rock
The bonk is satisfying, the damage is non-existent
And I still pull my weight
tall torrent
I thought paul got buffed
yea and it's still a gaslighting tier weapon
just like shovel
signal garden
Whatever you tell yourself bud
calm shard
Is that heavy or light one
p sure I was using the heavy one in that screenshot
marble mantle
p sure I was using the heavy one in that screenshot
Hm maybe I’ll give the heavy one a go. Usually I go with the light one.
calm shard
light one is mostly just better
marble mantle
Heavy one felt a bit too slow for my taste.
hybrid plover
Shovel is havoc viable. :)
signal garden
Let's put it this way I think of a minimal brain surface area weapon like that bully club ogryns use
marble mantle
Shovel is havoc viable. :)
Everything is havoc viable
signal garden
The one that does 5 timesorendsmage than the entire team combined
marble mantle
Depends on your skill and tenacity
signal garden
No push, no heavies, just lights
signal garden
And then I see the shovel and I get upset when people say to fat shark "this is an acceptable weapon and it's in its current state perfect"
hybrid plover
The one weapon I just can't justify using in Havoc
lilac kayak
Shovel is havoc viable. :)
any melee wep is havoc viable trust
fervent citrus
ok if i can utilize the knife to the fullest then this'll work, just gott get it mastered up to the mk3 to really try it
signal garden
You flail it and it does severe emotional damage to you for bringing it
tall torrent
chainsword is basically shovel but with worse blessings lol
hybrid plover
You get crushed.
fervent citrus
chainsword is basically shovel but with worse blessings lol
i dunno ive been able to FUCK with it as arbites
signal garden
Yeah at least chaxe gets a stagger on crushers
hybrid plover
You can give the arbites a fucking paper ball and they'll do just fine
They're an arbites.
signal garden
That's because arbites can do crazy damage just by lovetapping shit on the head
tall torrent
i dunno ive been able to **FUCK** with it as arbites
I think with arb's stagger stack it can reach dreg rager stagger but it's still just meh
it's more arb doing the heavy lifting, not chainsword being good
signal garden
Arbites would literally be broken with a knife just because you bonk a head and suddenly an enemy is staggerdd
hybrid plover
It doesn't say much when the overpowered class makes a weapon decent
steep flower
I overshot a lot of things
Yes you did; like an actual overbuff~ We can all laugh & giggle but in a serious tone; too much on soo many things and i haven't even read the whole thing yet 
steep flower
I think with arb's stagger stack it can reach dreg rager stagger but it's still ...
i tested chainsword with arby
tall torrent
Yes you did; like an actual overbuff~ We can all laugh & giggle <:KEKW_ogryn:102...
a lot of it is warranted
and a lot of it is overshot
steel veldt
Curious, can bolt pistol work on vet?
marble mantle
Curious, can bolt pistol work on vet?
Yes
signal garden
bolt pistol is fantastic on vet
past stratus
the bistol is legit
marble mantle
Bistol is great in general tbh
signal garden
speed, one shot power, quick TTKs
tall torrent
I literally wrote this for chainsword in guide lol
if u see a melee weapon with / / / / in major stagger basically u can just give up
fervent citrus
Bistol is great in general tbh
oh yeah i need to make myself a grenade build one of these days
marble mantle
I literally wrote this for chainsword in guide lol
Pros: good at killing like a little dude
Cons: like everything else
steep flower
I think with arb's stagger stack it can reach dreg rager stagger but it's still ...
and yes you can stagger ragers out of their combo with chainsword on arby; hell you can even stagger a crusher out of any animation on heavy attack rev to the head and with 1 stack of 'Forceful' keystone you can hit the body & stagger
past stratus
the bistol is great with grenade build and WS
it one shots a lot of shit with the guaranteed crit
marble mantle
what talent tree works best for it? I assume anything but exe stance
Well, if you’re trying to make a gun pop (pun intended), exe stance will almost always make said gun pop. That being said, it might make everything else more difficult.
Exe stance is the only ability vet has that isn’t a get out of jail free card
fervent citrus
wait why is the bolt pistol good for grenade builds
marble mantle
Exe stance is only as good as its user
tall torrent
wait why *is* the bolt pistol good for grenade builds
lethal prox buffs all explosion radius by 25%
hybrid plover
wait why *is* the bolt pistol good for grenade builds
Lethal proximity
marble mantle
wait why *is* the bolt pistol good for grenade builds
Something something lethal prox something something
fervent citrus
even the grenades?
hybrid plover
Yes.
marble mantle
Yes
fervent citrus
oh wow
steep flower
even the grenades?
ANY explosion
signal garden
based
fervent citrus
oh ok
steep flower
even the grenades?
like it buffs crusher for zealot/arby explosion radius even
the weapon
like it matters but still
calm shard
jesus christ it makes enemy crushers explosions bigger?
steel veldt
Well, if you’re trying to make a gun pop (pun intended), exe stance will almost ...
I like infiltrate a lot
steep flower
jesus christ it makes enemy crushers explosions bigger?
ofc but the explosion itself is so small the gain is small too... wait no
steel veldt
but doing the volley fire penace rn
hybrid plover
Another thing thats never really talked about but lethal prox also makes bistol really good at close range firing
signal garden
wasnt the explosion bigger when the weapon was new
hybrid plover
Since the arming distance doesn't exist with it.
signal garden
like blam, knock everyone in the room down
well, if it was a sufficiently small room ofc
hybrid plover
So if you see a trapper in the middle of a horde, quick draw, dome it, and anything around it also gets staggered.
steep flower
So if you see a trapper in the middle of a horde, quick draw, dome it, and anyth...
is nice 
long dove
3 damn Havocs i na row where we wipe in the first section to hosts
hybrid plover
3 damn Havocs i na row where we wipe in the first section to hosts
Smelter?
signal garden
i dont even know what the best weapon is anyrmore on vet for DH
hybrid plover
Power Sword
signal garden
tacax?
yeah thats if youre helping a teammate
i wouldnt try to powersword while being whaled on, and getting pushed back while trying to charge my sword and chase my teammate down is annoying
hybrid plover
I've taken on a dh with power sword
long dove
all I wanna do is just complete this damn havoc penance
hybrid plover
Shout helps give you time for really big burst damage.
long dove
and get to clearance 25
hybrid plover
That push attack is no joke.
But then again I also use a bunch of nodes to give me extra damage on shout so actually, that's probably a case by case basis
Really, if you're talking like, a safe option, probably combat knife with lacerate?
Or dueling sword obviously
lilac kayak
all I wanna do is just complete this damn havoc penance
?
steep flower
and get to clearance 25
need help?
lilac kayak
need help?
pub havoc is da way
signal garden
no he needs to ||pay2win with arbites||
steep flower
pub havoc is da way
Stop the cap
lilac kayak
Stop the cap <:staregryn:1022085083844325376> <:KEKW_ogryn:1022077188322906163>
its so much fun wdym
hybrid plover
Pub havoc when you have the knife veteran who runs up ahead and triggers all the spawns
steep flower
its so much fun wdym
Can be but we all know the general outcome
steep flower
Only veterans.
sometimes arby, rarely ogryn, psyker... psyker never even gets ahead cause he would die
long dove
need help?
Yeah apparently
steep flower
Yeah apparently
now the question is; are you too pissed to play now or you wanna go regardless?
hybrid plover
sometimes arby, rarely ogryn, psyker... psyker never even gets ahead cause he wo...
Scrier's Gaze would like to have a word with you, kind sir.
lilac kayak
help 50 people with assignments
u can cheese or do it the fun way
long dove
now the question is; are you too pissed to play now or you wanna go regardless?
I can try. I swapped back to vet, was on my psyker
steep flower
Scrier's Gaze would like to have a word with you, kind sir.
Nobody runs Scriers in Havoc
hybrid plover
Nobody runs Scriers in Havoc
I do. :)
signal garden
they should
would be better to carry 3 people than support 3 baddies because imagine that
signal garden
a prolonged 40 minute boutof suffering
hybrid plover
Don't get me wrong. You have to play your god damn balls off to do it but it's possible.
steep flower
@hybrid plover @long dove https://discord.gg/yuVHuqcJ
signal garden
its pick your poison at that point
hybrid plover
I wish! I'm on break at work.
hybrid plover
prolong suffering when u see BON
If you position right, a force greatsword on Gaze will tear a bonbon apart
The damage is absurd.
And it's not that hard because you have the length to take it on at least somewhat safely.
You take Gaze when you want to be a boss killer because it does the job well.
lilac kayak
And it's not that hard because you have the length to take it on at least somewh...
yes but that is if u can afford to focus on BON while keeping tabs on everything else
hybrid plover
That's what I mean by playing your balls off.
hybrid plover
It's not optimal to be fair because not many people can pull it off. But I've played it. I've seen it once.
You will 100% be topping the damage number.
hybrid plover
https://fximgur.com/a/7vqAa9G
See?
And that wasn't even with the sword.
A thrust on max damage with Scrier's can do like
Probably like a third of a bonbons health on a good day
lilac kayak
Bosses are the least of my worry tbh in havoc
orchid hemlock
would be better to carry 3 people than support 3 baddies because imagine that
Supporting.....
Baddies? 😊
signal garden
yeah and think about it
would you rather die fast
or support 3 subpar people and die slowly
if you had to choose between the two
its like a bandaid
calm shard
excellent
lilac kayak
Strong in the right hands yes
Gunker playstyle in havoc leaves no room for error tho
calm shard
It's soooooo goddamn fun though
Enemy density is so high in havocs you can get back to back force greatsword waves
Just from the amount of poxers your initial swing kills
lilac kayak
Enemy density is so high in havocs you can get back to back force greatsword wav...
what blessings do u run on bfg
calm shard
what blessings do u run on bfg
wrath+shred
Assail synergizes very well with FGS
2 swings then toss an assail and switch back gives you much better horde clear
and keeps Malefic Momentum stacked
sharp trail
how do i use knife cause this feels really awkward to play ngl
hollow ibex
how do i use knife cause this feels really awkward to play ngl
Which knife
marble mantle
how do i use knife cause this feels really awkward to play ngl
If you’re using 3, use 6.
3 is weird like that.
sharp trail
mk3 yeah, was using it with db weapon specialist
sharp trail
what are the best combos for 6?
marble mantle
what are the best combos for 6?
You ought to check the doc pinned in this channel. Then ctrl + f combat blade. It’ll list the combos, and BiS setup.
sharp trail
ty
marble mantle
Plus a lot more stuff I don’t understand.
No prob.
@steep flower you still up or nah
I’m trynna get that chaxe build and talent setup from you
Whenever u see this can you DM all it to me if u got it, curios and all. Preesh
Sorry. You’re weird. I don’t make the rules.
cyan verge
doesn't the 3 have that nice stab
yeah all I need from my knife is to turn faces of specials and bosses inside out
marble mantle
Push atk on 6 is stab
steep flower
<@341264830273028099> you still up or nah
Not today; sleepy 
marble mantle
Not today; sleepy <:Sitgryn:1016269420638765107>
Honk shoo mimimi
Well guess I’ll follow a YouTube video and do things horribly wrong
steep flower
Honk shoo mimimi
tomorrow?
steep flower
i added ya
strange crow
what are the best combos for 6?
For blessings:
- Always have uncanny strike
- If focusing solely on single-target, also flesh tearer
- If you want to have decent horde clear, also get precog or riposte (riposte preferred)
For perks: - If not running stam curio, +2 stam (preferred method so you can get more toughness)
- Unyielding for bosses/ogryns
- Flak/maniac (iirc) if you have a stam curio
marble mantle
Thanks g
marble mantle
For blessings:
- Always have uncanny strike
- If focusing solely on single-targe...
Damn you were typing that for a while I thought you were writing a diss track
junior grail
Is it weird of me to want a third knife mark?
steep flower
Is it weird of me to want a third knife mark?
Not at all
junior grail
A big choppy machete version, like the "That's not a Knoife" movie
atomic void
dense belfry
BY THE EMPEROR!!!
pallid jetty
Rep = represent. (wait. realised you meant the name)
wait for who
dense belfry
wait for who
realisation.
calm shard
BY THE EMPEROR!!!
that steel legion set was from the release of the game and has never returned
there have been recolors of it tho
marble mantle
Male cutthroat in my opinion has some of the best voice acting and lines in the game to me.
No one in the game sounds so purely angry
spark canopy
i fucking hate this one
spark canopy
it requires you to play in such a horrible playstyle
calm shard
not too awful to do if you just use your melee while at max stacks
or use the Mk XIV recon lasgun
since that one has cleave and damn near infinite ammo
pallid jetty
i fucking hate this one
bro every time i see someone complaining about this penance i want to become very violent
spark canopy
bro every time i see someone complaining about this penance i want to become ver...
because it's a horrible fuckass penance?
pallid jetty
literally one of the easiest
spark canopy
"one of the easiest"
god damn son what color was the stone that lobotomized you
this shit is annoying as fuck
pallid jetty
you take autogun, and you shut your mouth and you fuck off to the high intensity missions
spark canopy
yeah it's "easy" but it is time consuming and requires you to mess your play style around
become a slothenly creature that crouches around everywhere
pallid jetty
crouches?
spark canopy
and you shoot into every fuckass horde you see instead of conserving ammo
spark canopy
post how many hours you got rn
pallid jetty
spark canopy
10 weeks straight worth of playing right there
pallid jetty
1669 hours papa
spark canopy
you'd be able to have made some friends in 10 weeks
pallid jetty
are you proud of me papa?
spark canopy
i pity your mother
calm shard
and you shoot into every fuckass horde you see instead of conserving ammo
just shooting into hordes works
serene bough
why are there two cats fighting in vet chat
calm shard
like I said earlier the Mk XIV Recon lasgun has cleave
serene bough
get these animals back in their cages
calm shard
good for horde clearing just aim at head level and hold LMB at everything
calm shard
don't use autoguns
zero reason to if you want to crowd clear to get the penance done quickly
pallid jetty
recon it is then
calm shard
none of the autoguns are
little path
did he say he was using a shotgun for that penance
pallid jetty
i dont remember having any troubles
marble mantle
did he say he was using a shotgun for that penance <:KEKW_ogryn:1022077188322906...
Hey I mean, use the wide shot
Bunch of stacks right there
spark canopy
balls.
little path
especially with the low uptime of exec stance without the extensions
pallid jetty
papa take recon papa
marble mantle
What infantry lasgun y’all use
calm shard
IIb
arctic rampart
What infantry lasgun y’all use
laspistol is an option
marble mantle
laspistol is an option
Yea I know I be using that too but my space cowboy has to have all the las weapons
little path
hope you have the full auto mod if you're using the infantry las
marble mantle
hope you have the full auto mod if you're using the infantry las
I’m on Xbox. I’ll suffer, don’t you worry.
calm shard
and damage is lower
laspistol is only doing less damage than infantry lasgun on a non crit bodyshot
pallid jetty
just use the smallest one and shoot fast