veteran-class

[hybrid plover]

Yeah.

It exists basically.

[austere mica]

And focus target has niche support usage in addition to damage

[hybrid plover]

i guess i should give an actual build for this one

[fathom umbra]

recon las whats the dump

pls

[hybrid plover]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9f7ef969-08ca-4a9c-ba4a-3d5cf517506e/power-helbore?utm_medium=website&utm_source=gameslantern&utm_campaign=share_button

there. curios can be up to preference though, and you could switch For The Emperor for Born Leader, and Marksman for Superiority Complex but I use this in Havoc and having the big burst in damage after shout does help out a lot for taking care of bosses quick

oh wait, yeah, dump cleave targets on power sword and stability on helbore

[honest quiver]

collateral

[unreal bone]

Krieg Combat Engineer finally finished..

[calm shard]

looks nothing like a krieger tbh

[unreal bone]

Well it's meant to resemble Krieg Combat Engineers..

[calm shard]

yeah

not even a passing resemblance outside of the gas mask

[unreal bone]

I mean if the cloth was a different color it'd be better

but I'm working with what I got

Also no revolver shotgun.. Hey fartshart add the revolver shotgun :smiel:

[honest quiver]

looks cool, maybe use these pants instead

since it has the little pockets on the site

[unreal bone]

Yeah I posted those pants in the driptide channel.

Oh wait you just posted my pic didn't you lol XD

[honest quiver]

yeah

[unreal bone]

Yeah those are probably the legs I'm gonna use till uhhh

1 sec lemme find the ones I want but don't own

[honest quiver]

i mean it looks similar enough to the mini considering the limitations of what you're given

[unreal bone]

Waykeeper recon fatigues got some nice shin armor

[honest quiver]

i love how if anyone tries to make their character look like a mini they're told it's shit because it's not absolutely 100% spot-on

hate posting drip, 40k fans are insufferable

[marble ocean]

Use whatever drip you like

Who cares what randoms in the internet think

[honest quiver]

i'm going to find them

how dare they tell me what they think

[unreal bone]

Speaking of krieg, has the OLD krieg set ever even came back?

[honest quiver]

no idea

[marble ocean]

There always be a dude who will start criticizing every little thing

[unreal bone]

Or did they abandon it after they released the bluecoat krieg sets

[honest quiver]

i always miss kreig launches

😔

[marble ocean]

Golden skull?

The very first one?

Nope

[unreal bone]

Wym golden skull?

[honest quiver]

mostly because by the time they put krieg shit back in the store i'm bored with the game

[unreal bone]

I'm talking about the first krieg set

[honest quiver]

maybe in 2 years

[unreal bone]

The helmet I'm using is part of it

[marble ocean]

Gold skull emblem in shop

When it arrived

[unreal bone]

Doesn't the blue krieg set also have the same "premium" store icon

[marble ocean]

I was lucky enough to get og set when they first added it

For vet

Running around with it rn

[unreal bone]

I also got it for ogryn, vet, and psyker

not zealot because I'm sick and tired of Fartshart thinking the only way to make a zealot set look zealoty

is to put candles on the shoulder

[marble ocean]

Didn't have moneh

[unreal bone]

Try not to put fucking candles on the shoulder challenge impossible

[marble ocean]

And if i had to pick it always would be vet for krieg

[marble ocean]

Warhammer loves its candles

[unreal bone]

Yeah but it's not the only way to make a set look religious and fanatical grr

Cover it in parchment and purity seals

not just candle on right shoulder every time..

Now I also gotta decide what build to go with for my vet now..

I feel like I'm getting sick of plasma gun

But at the same time.. Plasma my beloved.

[marble ocean]

Just for ya

[unreal bone]

https://tenor.com/view/crime-war-crimes-criminal-criminals-uhgg-gif-9294414266865576889

The struggle bro..

So many fun sounding options for vet

Helbore, Plasma, Shredder Bpistol, Accatran recon las..

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/yungviral-gif-13520736873899911730

One accatran is not like the others

[unreal bone]

Wym huh

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/omori-imposter-among-us-imposter-among-us-impostor-gif-23714315

Accatran shotgun

[unreal bone]

Oh lol

I forgor yeah

I never use combat

Accatran recon*

I do actually like accatran shotgun cause I think dragon's breath rounds are funny

But I don't like it THAT much

[junior grail]

When I first jumped into darktide, I called recons as Accatran and helbores as Lucius because that's how I knew them from the setting lol

[unreal bone]

Yeah same

And I used to call the semi-auto autogun's vraks because that's what they were called

then apparently fartshart name changed them

It's hard for me to pick a build to dedicate to on veteran because veteran has so many ranged options I like

[junior grail]

Make a build for every gun haha

I make builds for fun different playstyles, not so much meta

[unreal bone]

Eh I do prefer to dedicate myself to 1 build more than the rest

I'll sometimes pick up others for variety, but I always like to focus on one build that I can sweat hardcore at

[junior grail]

Fair play

[unreal bone]

Also fuck it I'm going to have to reinstall the weapon mod again

because Fartshart are losers

[junior grail]

Get the latest version

[unreal bone]

The iron sights on the Helbore are atrocious

And of course they sell a version in their paid store that looks better

But y'know.. Rotation

[junior grail]

From the mod discord, they fixed the arbites shield

[unreal bone]

Ah yeah I know

[junior grail]

Do you use the plugins for weapon customisation?

[unreal bone]

I did a LONG time ago, but recently I play vanilla.

[junior grail]

Was wondering if I should try

[unreal bone]

There's 2 really good mods I'd suggest that genuinely make the gameplay experience on certain classes less aids

The weapon customization mod really helps out on guns with god awful iron sights

like Helbore for example

and the FullAuto mod also helps out on guns that are semi-auto, helps out a LOT on the guns that are semi-auto with a charge up

like helbore, plasma, or staves

Getting the weapon customization mod to put a red dot sight on your helbore if you use that will literally save your eyes so much strain it's not even funny.

Who the fuck looked at this and was like yeah, our players will love that.

[calm shard]

Mk Iv sights are usable

[unreal bone]

Yeah

They still suck a lot, but they are a bit better.

Honestly ngl the normal helbore sights wouldn't be as bad IF the helbore had a flashlight on it

so you could illuminate the target making it stand out from your irons

[hybrid plover]

Full Auto mod is awkward. I recommend this one. https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/496

[unreal bone]

I didn't have any problem with the fullauto mod

[pine plume]

for true connoiseurs i recommend this one https://www.nexusmods.com/warhammer40kdarktide/mods/510

[unreal bone]

You ADS you press trigger it charges and fires on full charge, although this also sounds like a good solution to the problem

[honest quiver]

trigger ...

[hybrid plover]

It's caused a few instances of me firing an extra shot when I didn't want it to.

But that sorta meets it in the middle by making right mouse charge the shot and left mouse trigger it.

The charge up also doesn't force the shot when you're aiming until it reaches the max threshold to hold it.

[unreal bone]

Is it still worth it to skip a keystone on veteran?

I know that used to be a pretty meta build way back when on vet where you just didn't get a keystone and instead grabbed a bunch of perks from each different tree

Was checking out some builds on a site and this one has so many god damn upvotes lol

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9e08cee7-3443-4279-a634-e3450b786a57/an-actual-good-kriegsman-build

[grand perch]

that one's not terrible but i would debate putting the 2 points going to o4b into going for bring it down instead

[little path]

Kind of hard to stay a pysker main in the current enviroment

so few staffs and gunker is cool but no ammo regen makes it harder to just fuck around with off meta guns

Feels like vet has the most variety for random shit to mess around with (at auric) rn

[hollow ibex]

you shouldn't have ammo problems if you take assail

[little path]

yeah but I'm using an off meta gun so I can use the off meta gun

not so I can off load all the work to crit assail

plus with arbites still being the most common class there's like a 2% chance I get a vet on the team for the ammo regen if i'm gunker

[unreal bone]

I'm trying it right now the split t the beginning really helps with tankiness.

Man ngl vet would be so much cooler if

One of their grenade options was Melta Mines

[unreal bone]

How does assail help with psyker ammo problems? Genuine question

I never take assail.

[hollow ibex]

because assail is a ranged weapon with a lot of cleave

that regenerates

[unreal bone]

Ah I see

[unreal nova]

Just throw them, they are like free bullets.

[hollow ibex]

you can literally just use it as your main weapon if you build for it

and if you don't build for it, it still really shores up your ammo usage

[unreal nova]

SHHHHHHHHH.

[unreal bone]

Ah ngl I don't have anything against Assail I just find the other options more fun.

[hollow ibex]

assail can be pretty satisfying

[unreal bone]

Brain Burst used to be the least fun option for me until they added Kinetic Flayer

[hollow ibex]

and it's the main blitz for gunker for good reason

[unreal bone]

getting passive brain bursts is stupid fun

[tame lodge]

Run Ek M1 build

https://tenor.com/view/desiler-giga-chad-gif-9574825124538696572

Better than most guns

Fr fr 💯🙏🔥

[unreal bone]

I run heavy laspistol on psyker

with force greatsword

I wonder if you can make a grenadier build with plasma

[grand perch]

Sure, but one motion is of little value since the helbore draw speed was buffed, and out for blood, while amazing, would get somewhat compensated by the 25 toughness node you get by going for bring it down

[unreal bone]

Yeah I'm tryna decide if I wanna use one motion for plasma gun

I think plasma gun draw speed is okay

[grand perch]

Think it's pretty much only bolter now where the difference is really noticeable

[viral chasm]

what about hellbore

[unreal bone]

Funny lol that's what started the discussion

[surreal rune]

noticeable difference on the time where in the draw you can charge a shot

[unreal bone]

The build uses a helbore and one motion

tbh I never really saw the need for one motion

[viral chasm]

i just arrive lol

[grand perch]

Helbore draw speed is like 0.7 seconds now so one motion doesn't do a whole lot anymore
I see it as a taxe on o4b mostly

[unreal bone]

Yeah

o4b with grenadier shredder spam is nice

Also uhhh for Lethal Prox + Grenade Explosion how does that work again?

Do you need to hold then gun then throw the grenade, or have the gun out when the explosion happens

[calm shard]

o4b is worth 2 points

[grand perch]

Not if you're already going middle route imo

[calm shard]

yes so just don't go middle route

easy

[red fox]

I've tried that for a few builds but confirmed kill is so good for regen imo

on higher difficutlies elites are everywhere

constantly having regen toughness is amazing for survivability

[normal bay]

I see shout is not staggering the event enemies much. I think I just made the crushers mad

[unreal bone]

What's the chainaxe dump stat

mob or def

I checked the Zealot page and it says def, but idk if that applies to vet

[normal bay]

You use push attacks a lot, which defences reduces the stam drain. So you can justify mobility dump too

Especially on vet where stam is an issue

[unreal bone]

Yeah I have both a mob and a def one

ALSO

Isn't 400 +3 stam a fake max stam curio?

Someone said 400 is not +3

[normal bay]

It is possible that gives you +3 stam

But it's not a guarantee at 400

You have to check the difference is psychanium AND in mission to see if it changes

[unreal bone]

Man this new event honestly blows bro

[normal bay]

Have you tried the HI-Int version yet?

Woe, CIVI Maelstrom be upon ye

[unreal bone]

Fym?

I've done every maelstrom they aren't that bad.

They can be a little annoying, but not as bad as 20 crushers every 30 seconds

[normal bay]

That's Auric CIVI lol

[unreal bone]

Oh I see what you mean though

It's Rotten armor + something

I think Rotten armor + shock trooper is ass

[grand perch]

I had to solo carry one of those and it took like a bit over an hour

So many HP to chew through, not going to play the event for fun

[unreal bone]

Yeah the event is not fun at all

I just killed a combined total of 40 maulers and crushers in about 45 seconds

with nothing but plasma and literally hitting twinned explosion on all of my shredder frags

AND THERE WERE SILL FUCKING MORE OF THEM

[normal bay]

You need at least one good pickaxe Ogryn or you're in trouble lol

Ideally 4

[crude gazelle]

Quick question. If I'm in a middle of a run and see a Veteran unloading all their ammo on a pox burster close range with a recon lasgun and can't kill it and it's just bursting on the teammates. Should that Veteran be doing Havoc?

[balmy flume]

…most probably not.

[normal bay]

Havoc 10 maybe

[balmy flume]

So many layers of wrongness here…
The barrage should have killed the burster…
They should know to push the burster away instead of shooting at close distance…

They could even suicide charge to take the hit…

[crude gazelle]

Like I understand if it was one time but it happening multiple times to point a zealot rage quits in a middle of havoc is saying something

Is there a mod that showcases weapons before a match starts so I can avoid this shit??

[balmy flume]

Possibly mute trolling by that vet in all honesty, or they are just that ill suited for Havoc.

[crude gazelle]

cuz it felt like they were using a 300 lasgun

[balmy flume]

There should be a mod that shows greater details than the standard display

Not sure about name though

[spring ocean]

honestly

[crude gazelle]

ahh no worries

I just needed to rant a bit

[spring ocean]

it sounds like its a new player jumping too early into havocs

happens way more often than you think

[crude gazelle]

wasted a hour and trying to figure whats going on

[crude gazelle]

damn 😔

[spring ocean]

my best answer to that is to try and use true level to gauge how long they've been playing

[normal bay]

You got a bad random, what's there to think about?

[spring ocean]

otherwise, I would say just move on, it's not something to really worry about.

[frigid shuttle]

randoms are randoms

[crude gazelle]

Well

I did revive them and they immediately went back down

not once but twice

[spring ocean]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[crude gazelle]

that probably was another sign lmao

yeah I'm moving, just wanted to rant

[spring ocean]

understandable

[crude gazelle]

thanks for the consoling

[unreal bone]

One is def not enough

I just joined a group in progress

They were 5 seconds into their mission and ther was 30 crushers in their spawn area basically

[spring ocean]

arbites shock maul is also enough for them

its a little dumb how great it is at mulching armor/carapace

[normal bay]

I've done 3 and two didn't make it to the first medicae

[bitter scroll]

I got by with just a knife

Three heavies and they go down

The problem is that's only for one crusher

[unreal bone]

Real

I even swapped to arbite and went like full anti armor and there's just so fucking much lol

I swear to god if they add Rotten Armor to havoc I'm never playing havoc again

I always wondered if they do these events to test out possible future havoc modifiers that offer more variety than just "Different enemy color = different buff"

[steep flower]

Ofc they do; cranial corruption, moebian 21’s were once event modifiers

Even recent inferno event was in havoc

[unreal bone]

I didn't see inferno in havoc

I like inferno

I do not fucking like rotten armor it's so ass

I can only imagine just how horrible rotten armor will be, since just in plain old Auric there are 30 man blobs of maulers and crushers

[steep flower]

It was a rare 3rd modifier just like pox gas or power supply interruption

[unreal bone]

Give us inferno and take out fucking heinous rituals

heinous rituals is a heinous pain in the nuts because it keep breaking

[bitter scroll]

I fucking hate inferno

I CAN'T SEE SHIT

EVERYTHING'S DARK AND ON FIRE

Fucking California modifier

Also the portrait frame you get from flamers was better than the inferno one

[normal bay]

It has the same issue as pox gas, where you just have to sit around and wait for the flames to clear lol

[bitter scroll]

Flames you can at least bunny hop over

And they don't corrupt you

[grand perch]

Now combine inferno and rotten armour into one havoc match

[stiff glacier]

Hi pox gas

Emperors fading light

[bitter scroll]

Pox gas buffs dregs, corrupts you, forces you to reposition, limits visibility, etc etc

It's not very fun

Shock Troop Gauntlet probably my favorite mod

And uh

Power interruption is okay but annoying on certain maps

Like uh

What's the one where you gotta go through a maze to get to the next part
It has a small drop you can fall from and you have to backtrack all the way back

[normal bay]

I experienced that yesterday, stuck on a narrow platform, surrounded by armour, entire floor was on fire. It was truly a time

[bitter scroll]

OH

Consignment yard

[normal bay]

Yup

Lmao

[unreal bone]

almost 20 crushers and 7 snipers

https://tenor.com/view/cat-share-this-cat-if-you-already-lost-your-mind-insane-lost-your-mind-share-this-gif-11044010788421076558

This new event modifier..

[bitter scroll]

I just did it for the diamantine (I am already running low)

[steep flower]

Thematically they do not fit

Now rotten armor, pox gas, blight spreads & pus hardened; thats a theme for a mission

[real flicker]

TR or charge rate dump for plasma?

[unreal bone]

I'm doing it for the portrait because I'm stupid or something

even though I'll never use it.

It's such an ass event it's crazy

[bitter scroll]

I'll take it over inferno any day

[unreal bone]

I almost want to redownload the scoreboard mod to see how much damage I am pushing out because I'm iterally killing maybe 50 crushers a minute

Inferno was fine

[grand perch]

Ah yes, the "play arby with rebreather or die" modifier

[marble ocean]

I changed portraits only when i get new class one

[bitter scroll]

What does rebreather do

Sorry I don't have arby

[grand perch]

Huge reduction of tox damage and corruption resistance

[bitter scroll]

Ah, wonderful

[steep flower]

Rebreather still in the same tier as simple minded for ogryn; too niche to be considered taken for an experienced player

[unreal bone]

I'm about to whip out the super shotgun bro

the 4 round double barrel

[bitter scroll]

The four evenly spaced barrels

[unreal bone]

With a 90% reload..

4 round double barrel means 2x double barrel shot with 90% reload..

[steep flower]

Its time to wake up son

[unreal bone]

wymmmm

[bitter scroll]

Double barrel with lucky bullet

[unreal bone]

Nah bro no lucky bullet here

Castigator stance supreme

almost 100% damage reduction

[steep flower]

Tbh… it is in fact the worst ability for arby right now (by no means bad ofc; just in comparison)

[grand perch]

would you like to see a bad opinion on arbites skills?

[steep flower]

I understand your sarcasm but consider what other 2 abilities do for you and for your team first

[grand perch]

no sarcasm here

i saw this in response to someone complaing arbiters always rush forward

"vox useless"

[unreal bone]

I actually think no keystone on vet is fun.

[unreal bone]

I think it's best, if not the best then atleast the second

The raw damage and tankiness you get is insane.

[bitter scroll]

No keystone on vet actually feels viable

[unreal bone]

And the uptime you get if you go left keystone

Brother what the fuck is this

[bitter scroll]

You only really have two worth considering anyways and they're not game changers

[unreal bone]

IT'S THE FIRST FUCKING ROOM OF THE MISSION

[bitter scroll]

"Challenge me on green mode, Reject"

[unreal bone]

Chaos Spawn with 15+ rot armor maulers and crushers

I swear to god bro if they add rotten armor to havoc I'll crash out

[spring ocean]

they won't.

[unreal bone]

They better not.

[steep flower]

Consider the team benefits this gives you and then compare them to other 2 options & maybe you’ll see

[bitter scroll]

Fatshark is watching

[spring ocean]

these are supposed to be fun events anyways

its not shocking that every now and then they miss their mark with them

[unreal bone]

I've used all the options, and Nuncio is okay if you yourself don't die but I've seen a lot of arbites run nuncio and then die

[steep flower]

Holy Emperor; i wanna play with that guy in havoc & show him/her whats what

[unreal bone]

Yeah but that doesn't mean rot armor wont show up in havoc

like inferno did apparently

[spring ocean]

if it does show up then you can always just skip it and play someone elses havoc lol

not like it doesn't happen already

[steep flower]

Skill issue then; arby is soo powerful it can make chainsword stagger a crusher… no joke, i tested it

[steep flower]

Btw mah man; how do you feel about chainsword?

[grand perch]

used to like it like 1500hrs of playtime ago

today? shit tier

[spring ocean]

brrrrr

[steep flower]

What if i tell you on arby you can stagger a crusher with it?

[grand perch]

i tried it twice on arby but i still dont really like it there

tac axe is too crazy on arby to use anything else when you love taxe as much as i do

[spring ocean]

tac axe is very fun

[steep flower]

I did some late night testing and omg i need some field practice; its stupid

[spring ocean]

meat blender godx

[grand perch]

yeah but then again what melee isnt stupid on arby

[spring ocean]

I tried the arbites shock maul after some time and while the dmg against crushers and maulers is good, I like my horde clear more.

[grand perch]

imagine if they got psword

[steep flower]

If you wanna then maybe even tonight? If you get some will & time?

[grand perch]

maybe yeh

[spring ocean]

imagine if they buffed power sword to be like the relic blade

[steep flower]

Then street smarts talent would carry them

[steep flower]

Will let you know once i come back

[steep flower]

Thats why i tested the chainie & Holy Emperor

[unreal bone]

Yeah I mean skill issue for them, I ran it fine.

When it comes to arbite abilities I think Nuncio is cooler, but man I can't pass up being literally immortal with castigator

allowing me to 3v1 bosses

[spring ocean]

get out of jail free card really.

what's that? there's ten billion enemies chasing you and you're cornered, with multiple gunners and reapers starting at you? prime the castigator, remote detonation, you're out without losing any hp lol

[unreal bone]

If you're bad yeah

If you have to use Castigator to save your life then you are using it wrong imo

Castigator really favors the what I call "Doom 2019" gameplay

[spring ocean]

not the only thing you use it for but it is one of them that does it without much issue

[unreal bone]

You get attacked by enemies > You pop castigator and start hot swapping between melee and ranged like mad

[spring ocean]

on top of being able to flex into other roles

much like break the line.

[unreal bone]

Castigator is REALLY good for letting you play a hot swap build

Constantly bouncing between your melee and a shotgun without taking any damage

Can't block with a ranged, but it doesn't matter if you have over 80% damage reduction and constant toughness regen

Can't block with a ranged unless it's shotpistol I mean*

I'm gonna have to play rumbler ogryn for this event I stg

[spring ocean]

just use arbite shock maul

[unreal bone]

Dude I have

I don't think you get it, there's so fucking many of them

Dude even the rando that joined my match threw this out at the end 🤣

This event is actually more aids than encroaching garden pus hardened max havocs somehow

Joined a mission > They're literally 5 seconds into it all dead and I'm the only one alive.

[spring ocean]

dunno, I did alright with people lagging behind hard in dealing with them

[unreal bone]

I need to install the scoreboard mod

I wanna see my damage in this event when I'm chewing through SO many crushers

Me when I shoot 4 rumbler shots in a row cause lucky bullets

and there are still more enemies

[spring ocean]

thats the reason why their names are "placeholder_text"at the bottom; I was getting a memory leak from so many spawning at once

[unreal bone]

I've done like 15 or so event missions tonight

and only succeeded in 2 lol

Most of the time I just load into a teams already going run

and they're all dead in their spawn room

[spark helm]

Been noticing a lot of people mentioning that helbore gets a lot of value off having stability be its dump stat. How come?

[unreal bone]

Cause it's not a rapid fire weapon.

Kantrael is how fast you can click and accatran recon is brrt

Helbore is charge up then let go when you're ready

[spark helm]

Yeah. I'm still getting used to Helbore. I feel more comfortable with stabiliy being higher but I'm pretty sure I've never used one that has it.

[unreal bone]

Stability is not required at all for the helbore

[spark helm]

It's just that accurate still then.

[spring ocean]

yep

the time between shots is just enough for it to reset to be accurate wherever you're pointing it.

[unreal bone]

Yeah all stability does is influence your recoil

You really don't care about that on a gun you have to charge up between shots.

[steep flower]

Pepegas

[tepid otter]

what weapon did y'all use to achieve that penance where you have to keep executioners stance active for over 20secs or something

[tame lodge]

Vigi 7

[grand perch]

Any gun or melee weapon

[steep flower]

Just use ‘Counter Fire’

[normal bay]

Bolter, just pace your shots

[bitter scroll]

melee works for exec stance?

[tall torrent]

Any highlighted kill you get from any means will refresh exe stance

[bitter scroll]

pog

[tepid otter]

neato

[spark helm]

This was way back but all I did was just use the infantry lasgun and I just kept running down anything highlighted. Standard, specialist and elite human-class ranged units typically are extremely vulnerable to just getting dropped with 1-3 shots from it.

I wasn't explictly hunting the penance but if you have a solid enough build and get used to playing with it, nearly any class exclusive penance doesn't take long to achieve in my experience.

[tepid otter]

Which Mk did u use

[spark helm]

Forgot the mark but it should be the default one you start out with. Solid damage through most difficulties (I have no idea how it fares in havoc if that's where you play and I have no havoc experience), great ammo reserves, high magazine capacity.

[tepid otter]

Got a solid build for Exec with Helbourne actually, fun weap but I was kinda getting tired of having to charge the weap to do decently when wiping out elites

I like the Infantry Lasguns too but I kinda struggle with it on higher difficulties

[spark helm]

I usually compensate with just having strong melee weapons that don't need heavy investment with talents to excel at their purpose like power swords, duelling swords, shovels, etc.

[grand perch]

https://tenor.com/view/jason-bourne-bourne-identity-target-gif-15085273

[spark helm]

And making sure that I don't worry about shooting anything with a gun.

[grand perch]

the helbourne identity

[spark helm]

Something that helps in my experience with the infantry lasgun is preemptively popping exestance in situations where we got waves just coming in. As long as you kill something marked, you maintain the ability so sometimes staggering kills can be necessary. When you have swarms of enemies, there's almost always going to be guaranteed viable targets for exestance to highlight.

Sharpening your tracking can help but sometimes there's less point in doing that compared to aiming in zones. Eventually, you'll notice how some enemies with difficult heads just move. Aim within the zone and take your shot when you're good to go.

Trust yourself to hit the target and eventually, you'll get more deliberate even when under pressure.

If you need it, take the talent that gives you suppression immunity to allow yourself to contest and trade into enemies. Also, take curios that give you resistances to gunners because you don't want to try being a counter shooter just to get beamed down by three random grunts.

Or absolutely mulched by a machine gun when you have no toughness or anything else to save yourself.

[past stratus]

I think you can also get Ghost with the Ilas, no? If you're having issues with gunners

[spark helm]

Ghost isn't bad either yeah.

[tepid otter]

Yeah, I got too used to using VoC so switching over to Exec is kinda disorienting the way I usually play vet, just wanna nab the helmet the penance gives for some cosmetic purposes

[spark helm]

Yep, you gotta actually accept consequences with exestance lol

[tepid otter]

I like the change of pace I guess, just a guardsman reject running around with a lasgun kekw

[spark helm]

It's not what I would exactly call hard mode, but rather "hey, buddy, you remember that you're surrounded right? Okay, thanks: here's twelve crushers and 20 ragers clipped into one. You're welcome"

Director: You will take me seriously.

[past stratus]

my problem with the Ilas is that the MkV and the MkIII Helbore are better Ilas than the Ilas 😔

[tepid otter]

Yeah nah, pretty much helpless getting cornered by those lmao

Would Shredder nades be better for a vet that has exec

Torn between choosing that for wave clears or the Krak for the random elite waves every now and then

[analog mural]

Shredders are always good

[spark helm]

Up to how you slant your talents. I usually take shredder purely for the point efficiency when pathing down my build but krak isn't bad either.

I'd only recommend smoke grenades if you're also a "weirdo" that likes right tree veteran to a very unhealthy degree.

[past stratus]

Smokes are really good, they just take some learning. Shredders are more used because it is literally just "try to hit big hordes with it" type of blitz, it is impossible to fuck up and always useful

[spark helm]

Shredder is cc for bigger enemies up to monstrosities and bosses iirc, but it's also wave clear filler and even mixed horde damage.

I usually forgo shredder if I'm feeling like improving my melee a little more since veteran gets access to some pretty clean melee options like I mentioned before.

If I'm running the mk3 power sword, I'm not really too worried about horde clear because if they're getting that close, I'm already just cleaning them up with the energized heavies.

[past stratus]

In general Vet has good blitz, Kraks are kind of dog at higher levels but they are good while you're leveling and doesn't have good weapons to deal with big threats like Crushers

[spark helm]

And yeah, smoke grenades came a very long way but for newer players they may be a little lacking. I've been having a lot of fun with a copied build I've been trying out for a support utility control veteran

Damage is mediocre but that's what better weapons are for and it works. It's also just kind of goofy?

[late jungle]

off-meta is always fun ((as long as its viable enough

[bitter scroll]

They never tell you how fun smoke nades are

[spark helm]

I kind of have a really weird version of smite just slapped on to my gun with that build because I'm just abusing suppression lol

And in mortis trials well.

[past stratus]

Smokes are literally a psyker dome that doesn't get popped out of existence in a second by a wall of gunners

I think the Dome can only last 6s if it is getting constantly shot

Smokes always last the full duration

[spark helm]

https://tenor.com/view/clown-ready-nobi-nabung-crypto-gif-26922503

I literally don't have to actually do anything. I just exist and shit isn't allowed to move

If everyone else dies I have 4 stacks of infiltrate because why not?

[bitter scroll]

Smiteran

[bitter scroll]

The absolute state of Psyker rn

The power of the Immaterium at the palm of their hands, mogged by a funny smoke bomb

[past stratus]

Dome is still pretty good, toughness regen and all of that

[spark helm]

I even juiced up revive speed on the curios I use in the build.

[bitter scroll]

Yeah I was about to say

[spark helm]

And took no one left behind.

[bitter scroll]

I don't run anything other than dome- I'M RED NOW

https://tenor.com/view/rotation-bird-damnation-damn-ptak-gif-10894242033685746664

[spark helm]

https://tenor.com/view/revive-me-bro-gif-23666481

[tame lodge]

Hotbox that green boof

https://tenor.com/view/war-make-boof-gif-26213687

[bitter scroll]

https://tenor.com/view/wuklamat-wuk-lamat-milk-brain-wuk-lamat-ffxiv-brainrot-gif-5788911379515850040

[past stratus]

it's good stuff

though the most powerful thing Smoke bomb can do is allow your Infernus Psyker to bring Venting Shriek without feeling guilty

[bitter scroll]

i haven't been able to practice much with shriek because of bubble's utility

[past stratus]

Venting Shriek feels real good to play with

[bitter scroll]

i like it

hearing loner psyker go sicko mode is fun

wait

oh i confused the skills

[past stratus]

Venting Shriek is the one you pull enemies away and quell peril

[bitter scroll]

i meant gaze lol

thank you

i haven't tried out that one much aside from when leveling psyker up

[past stratus]

idk much about gaze, I don't play psyker that much, I know that the soulblaze nodes on fire build make venting shriek real nice

[bitter scroll]

soulblaze is fun

although that's a talk for another channel

[spark helm]

Only class i barely play is like ogryn. When im in the mood im in the mood.

Otherwise, meh someone else can do it.

[spring ocean]

what, don't like being triple the size and getting blasted by gunners?

[past stratus]

more like having triple the size and being virtually immortal with certain builds?

[spring ocean]

... yes. that's what the kappa is there for.

[tame lodge]

Gunners?
Oh
The ticklers

Funny guys

[spring ocean]

their projectiles need to be pointier, it's like a massage at times

[spark helm]

Honestly, ever since knives got better for ogryn, I've been enjoying the class even more. If only greandier gauntlet was allowed to be more dangerous as an improvised melee option or if, hear me out.

Ogryn got to do pro wrestling shit.

Broken, yes, also: balance is a suggestion I routinely disregard.

[normal bay]

BAH GAWD, IT'S GRUG FROM THE TOP ROPE

[spring ocean]

I love the club and the knife tbh

especially the slaps

extremely, extremely hilarious to me

[bitter scroll]

shield and maul is so fun

[spark helm]

https://tenor.com/view/will-ospreay-flip-will-ospreay-japanese-wrestling-gif-20210079

If my ogryn can't do shit like this, I don't want it.

My head canon is stupid and I don't care.

[bitter scroll]

explode a crusher's cranium with a big hunk of metal

[spark helm]

I got a bonehead who dreams of developing Ogryn martial arts and teaching it to other ogryn based off his experiences in fight pits and working in mines.

I want my Ogryn to do sweet chin music to a plaguegryn because he deserves it.

[spring ocean]

so when do we get the talent that upgrades the rock to spiked steel? I want armor piercing on my friendly rock

[bitter scroll]

checks our mutual servers

are you a roleplayer by any chance

[spark helm]

And is totally NOT made in the likeness of a fighting game character who does pro wrestling.

[spark helm]

I use roleplay as an excuse to write yeah. Have some notes for reserve character sheets for some other game that I need to review for tomorrow anyway.

[bitter scroll]

🤝

[spark helm]

Well, more like an opportunity for practice and I've fallen off for some time now.

[spark helm]

https://tenor.com/view/quasimodox-zangief-nod-gief-street-fighter-gif-6211895137216155972

I did NOT make 40K Zangief. Nope. (Lie)

Fuck, now I want to play Ogryn. FUCK

[spring ocean]

https://tenor.com/view/ogryn-party-gif-27273801

[spark helm]

But seriously where's my charged lariat? Just a crumb of wrasslin'

Oh wait, I was wrong too, I changed my Ogryn from Zangief to something more personal. But dude's primary concept is still the same via the little preset choices with extra fixings.

Except guy looks different has different name.

I just want to decapitate something with a clothesline, or just launch a mfker into a wall with a drop kick.

Idk, make me burn stamina during bull rush for directional attacks or something.

Imagine, an Ogryn chop.

https://tenor.com/view/big-show-paul-donald-wight-ii-wwe-world-wrestling-entertainment-wrestler-gif-17829988

[bitter scroll]

the closest you can get to punchy ogryn is grenadier gauntlet

[normal bay]

Nah, mk2 club

[spark helm]

That's why I like the knife. Whichever one gives the uppercut

That shit is hilarious.

[normal bay]

Slap - punch combo

[spark helm]

Bop (my Ogryn's name): All Ogryn arts is best fighting art. Bop will defenestrate (he means demonstrate).

Ogryn does have access to the magician's brick though so that's cool.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvAyPBuqGFU

[tame lodge]

Brunt's Pride mentioned

Deploying jab

[spark helm]

I want an elbow strike.

Or a headbutt

Ogryn botched suplex.

https://tenor.com/view/2024-wwe-crown-jewel-tama-tonga-apron-swanton-bomb-jey-uso-gif-669763738198986349

Whatever the fuck this is

"But Ogryn's can't move like that, they're too heavy."

Nah. These mfkers got boulders for quads. Them shits can launch after some momentum./

Gimme a flying cross chop or something.

But only off bull rush and forward + jump.

[marble mantle]

I don’t really use recon much, and I don’t really plan to, but I want to have it set up in case I do. What’s y’all’s favorite mark?

[tame lodge]

XIV

[marble mantle]

Word

[spark helm]

12 because it's a funny sounding weapon.

It sounds like an edited clip of a bunch of layered bites of like children doing that raspberry noise.

Or just making noises to make noise. But a legion

But in all seriousness 12 is a very easy recon lasgun to use to the point of it being the W + M1 mark imo.

[marble mantle]

Man I just go down so much lol idk how y’all do it

Positioning for sure

[spring ocean]

and dodging

dodging helps alot too.

sliding as well, since you dodge projectile attacks during a proper slide.

if you have a mouse with extra buttons, rebind the crouch button to one of the side buttons, makes a huge difference in how you're able to move around at times.

[normal bay]

Being sensible with what you can achieve too. If you try and force stuff like you can on other classes, it will end badly

[hollow ibex]

VIc

[marble mantle]

Damn everyone prefers somethin different eh

[marble mantle]

This is rly good advice actually

[spark helm]

Trying to remember if there's anything special about dodging with ranged weapons compared to melee. But that's something between Vermintide and Darktide that's pretty consistent. Unless you're using a ranged weapon that has very generous dodge properties on it, it's far more risky to dodge with ranged out in a broad sense.

Forever, Darktide has things like dodge sliding which makes this much safer to do.

[sudden cedar]

Why is it "far too risky to dodge with ranged out" ?

Iam curious.

[spark helm]

It's not that it's a total wash, it's more that newer players can end up committing to much to it and put themselves at a loss. If you need to block for any reason, you won't be able to. You won't be able to push anything that you can take advantage of in the heat of the moment for example.

[past stratus]

half of helbore's gameplay is dodging while aiming when the swoosh sound plays

[hearty panther]

Dodging with a ranged weapon means your dodge will not break melee tracking from attacks, and therefore your dodge has to be perfect

[spark helm]

Since dodging and pushing leads to push attacks and other things that flow into more efficient combos for horde control. Some ranged options actually can be useful for melee in wider situations like high suppression weapons, things like plasma gun and the like.

And what exploits said. I forgot but that's a huge small thing.

[sudden cedar]

For me this sounds like a part of managing your defensive resources

and thus, doing it wrong is a missmanagement of it.

[spark helm]

Yes, it's part of better defense fundamentals.

[sudden cedar]

I don't see how ranged takes a special spot in that.

[spark helm]

Fundamentals can be incorporated and expanded on.

You can just take those things from melee, and apply them to ranged when appropriate. Eventually you'll develop that judgement for yourself obviously, but better habits earlier can round a player out by the time they're interested in harder things. The majority of higher difficulty play genuinely comes down to how consistently you apply your fundamentals on top of what your output can be with your loadout and its own potential/risk-reward whatever.

I know that I'm going to be fine while shooting with an approaching horde on my position because I might know what's immediately around me in a 360 so even if I commit to ranged to pick away at targets, I'm already dodging the trapper behind me even if I'm not focusing on them right now.

Because my fundamentals are strong enough to just trust myself with that choice.

[sudden cedar]

Sorry, "can" i take those things from melee or "can't"? That difference is quite important here.

[spark helm]

But when I was newer to fatshark games from as far back as vt1, one of my worst habits was literally overdoing it on dodging with ranged out and being confused why I ate so much shit when things got bad.

[spark helm]

You're doing the same things because you're performing the same actions with a dodge in this case. But what I'm talking about is more about forming habits that can mitigate riskier choices. Unless you're dedicated to hanging on to a static way of playing, you're going to probably dodge while shooting at some point.

But you'll do it better because you know the differences and have experience with applying that knowledge over time.

[sudden cedar]

I agree with that.

Practice makes perfect after all.

Or something close to it, of course.

[spark helm]

I say practice makes progress. Perfection isn't a thing but that's a whole other conversation lol

[heavy rover]

yep, welcome to vet chat. We've got millions of different builds that can be viable

even the most shitpost of builds can work with the right approach

[spark helm]

There's a lot about this game that players can just exploit with enemy behaviors and interactions in a way where once you know them, you genuinely can turn the tables on some of the worst situations. A lot of it at that level comes down to how well you understand the basics and what you can do with that.

Lots of clutch situations people are in where they naturally feel the pressure but they may panic at a point where honestly, they would've been fine if they just stopped fighting, slipping between dudes and repositioned somewhere where the enemy will be forced to funnel themselves for easier management. Or groups of players that may struggle with sussing out VIP enemies because they just don't value using pings through crowds because they don't know or maybe haven't gotten used to just sliding that action in during a heated fight. Maybe someone is easily intimidated by plague ogryn because they just haven't developed the rhythm to dodge the thing while also dealing with a horde. Yeah it's a mini boss, but it's like, the easiest one to manage and manipulate barring you get smacked off the stage or something.

I've been in situations where I just said fuck it and let the bastard launch me because my back was to a drop that gets me away from the horde. Stuff like that.

[heavy rover]

yeah, adding to that, especially with the helbore, I get so much satisfaction in pinging a specific enemy through a crowd (e.g. sniper, genadier, gunner, etc.) and landing a shot across multiple heads to reach them

[grand perch]

did someone say shitpost build?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9nBh7uT7Ug

[marble mantle]

Mmmmmmmm helbore

Mmmmm

Favorite ranged in the game helbore

[spark helm]

It's pretty much longbow behavior and I like doing it.

[heavy rover]

ah, greetings fellow helbore enthusiast 🤝

[spark helm]

Because that shit feels extremely cool to do in vt2.

[heavy rover]

now this is peak flashlight gaming

[sudden cedar]

That is one hard hitting las bolt

[marble mantle]

My favorite melees have been taxe and knife

Taxe is a little more practical though

[clever hedge]

Knife is peak gaming though. Can feel the serotonin enter my brain when pulling a slide dodge on a sniper into a crit stab

[steep flower]

I like the way you speak mah boi; we should play togethah sometimes

[sudden cedar]

@steep flower He has some good insights.

[marble mantle]

Does power sword always need to be activated?

[narrow widget]

yea

[hollow ibex]

Yeah unless you want a pool noodle for your melee

[narrow widget]

it hits like a wet noodle if it isnt

[sonic kayak]

https://tenor.com/view/ace-attorney-phoenix-wright-objection-capcom-gif-20965907

u're mom gae

[narrow widget]

!!!!

[hot crag]

Hey best 2 perks to use on tactical axe? Flak/carapace?

[marble mantle]

That fuckin sux honestly

That’s one of my two main issues with the weapon

I don’t want to HAVE to reactivate it every 3 hits

[hollow ibex]

Yah old weapon design

FWIW

It forces you to really hone your melee fundamentals lol

[narrow widget]

what if instead of reworking the weapon at all we just make it 1 tap everything

[narrow frost]

Flak + unarmored(faster horde clear)/carapace(faster mauler and crusher/unyielding (faster unarmored ogryn and bosses)

I use flak unyield

But I mainly play havoc

So I see more bosses then a normal would have

Also, flak maniac honorable mention

Taxe bullies ragers

[hot crag]

Thanks 👍🏻

[tame lodge]

Best we can do is the Rashad

(Or the Branx Pickaxe)

[tall torrent]

Finished 8 weapons’ moveset charts today

5 veteran melee weapons left

After that, enemy breakdown + curios

Then example builds

Then publish

[heavy rover]

The day it is published shall be a glorious day

[hollow ibex]

Soon tm

[tall torrent]

I’ll make a separate guide in the background for making changes to the published version once it’s published

[teal canyon]

Okey. I dont really know what they did with helbore but it actually good now

[ember nest]

as soon as you finish it fatshark will release a full rework of both vet and the powersword moveset 😈

[teal canyon]

im not stressed out when using a lasgun

wow.

[tall torrent]

Hell yea

The sooner the vet rework the better

Full vet tree rework would only be 12 changed sections lol

I think the first post-publication add-ons I’d do would be other classes’ exclusive melee weapons

I don’t think I’ll cover ogryn stuff

Only the 4 human classes

Ogryn stuff already covered pretty well by ogrynomicon even if I don’t agree with everything

[void dragon]

What things don't you agree with?

[tall torrent]

It’s not as detailed as I’d want, mainly

And some subjective opinions in there

I don’t think thrust and crunch are worth it still

On any weapon

[normal bay]

It's too detailed for Ogryns, they should remove information

[void dragon]

Because currently light attacks on Ogryns are just kings, right?

[tall torrent]

Well

Even if u just heavy attack twice it’s still better most of the time

Prob the most typical thrust+crunch weapon is Branx pickaxe

U can run trials till the end of time

[narrow frost]

I can really only see it worth for crusher/mauler 1 taps in havoc

[tall torrent]

Light spam on branx is still higher boss dps than thrust+crunch

[narrow frost]

ogryn probably struggles the msot against red enemies

[tall torrent]

While being way safer cuz u can cancel attacks into block

[narrow frost]

so 1 tapping them is the msot value

[normal bay]

I think mk1 club is significantly better with Thrust

[tall torrent]

Also Ogryn’s ranged weapon selection is pretty sad

It’s kek or cringe most of the time

If ogryn has a shield + gauntlet ranged it’d be peak

[normal bay]

We can dream

[tall torrent]

I think shield+shotpistol was their first experiment towards it

[sudden cedar]

Ogryns need more rations.

[tall torrent]

Since it works now they’ll prob add shield+gauntlet for ogryn later

Cuz it’s literally on the tabletop lol

[void dragon]

I tried that, and it's about the same, but you have the added capacity to erase purple enemies and it helps some swings because even on fast use of heavies you get at least the minimum bonus from time to time far too consistently

[tall torrent]

Nah u can just take +stagger from heavy hitter where ur attacks just put enemies onto ground in 1 swing then they die before they ever get up

[void dragon]

Maybe as new GG mk?

[tall torrent]

The dps loss from doing thrust + crunch is tremendous

[narrow frost]

I should try pic ogryn more

[tall torrent]

If limbsplitter didn’t reset it’d literally be thrust but always better

[void dragon]

Pick ogryn is really powerful

[narrow frost]

lol

I know

back in havoc 1.0 thats the only thing I ran

that and flip shovel

[void dragon]

Karsolas is borderline DS but ogryn shaped

[tall torrent]

They just need to remove limbsplitter cooldown resetting then it’s just thrust pro max plus

[narrow frost]

me keje and ham doing ogryn havoc 1.0

[quiet valley]

Hey I didn’t know if you know, but pick is really powerful

[narrow frost]

Hey I didn’t know if you know, but pick is really powerful

[void dragon]

Weapon blessings rework patch when they bring the mechanics class *inhales copium mountain

[narrow frost]

https://tenor.com/view/kill-people-gif-25984064

[tall torrent]

2046 buddy

[grand perch]

guys

the ogryn pick

[normal bay]

I would guess it'll be a different weapon, since it can make use of different blessings

[narrow frost]

lizard

[grand perch]

is it good?

[quiet valley]

Brit moment

[void dragon]

Nah, 3042

[quiet valley]

no

[grand perch]

https://tenor.com/view/disintegrate-gif-22469816

[tall torrent]

No, new weapon

It should be slower handling but have shield, basically

Should have diff attacks from current GG as well

[void dragon]

Already have the resources to farm it

[tall torrent]

Imagine if u could hipfire GG

[void dragon]

Love me shields

[tall torrent]

I think I’d like GG more if I could hipfire it tbh

[void dragon]

Question: how do you Helbore enjoyers manage to shoot enough to need ammo? Played some aurics where consistently didn't need any ammo at all to complete the missions, seems SUPER ammo efficient

[sly orchid]

shield gg

[quiet valley]

Pure Gluttony (Weight of Fire users)

[void dragon]

But what about the lighter mk?

[quiet valley]

🤷‍♂️

[tame lodge]

So I should Limbsplitter + Thrust on my Branx

https://tenor.com/view/jetstream-sam-my-beloved-gif-22029076

(Doing that since forever)

Kek

[normal bay]

You trying to rend a hole in the warp with that?

[tame lodge]

I'm fucking up the combo and accidentally using the sweeping heavies instead of the verticals

[teal canyon]

met some guys with titles like "budding interrogator" or something
worst teammates in my fucking life

its like im back in time

[normal bay]

That's just for finding skulls

[teal canyon]

Shift+W+M1

[normal bay]

It means even less than ASS

[teal canyon]

if not for ogryn who actually understand teamwork we'll be done

[sudden cedar]

Budding Interrogator is 1000 Missions isn't it?

[teal canyon]

Alot of enemies: fight? Nope. We speedrun

Getting more enemies

its not like im fightighting a fucking flesh and steel wall of stink there

nope. arbitrator and zealot run forward

[sudden cedar]

Most Ogryns i see right now just mindlessly spam rumbler

[normal bay]

Oh, I thought it was a blue title

Slight difference

[normal bay]

Between this and the changes to quickplay + mission select, the games becoming incredibly unfun

Why are we even speedrunning? Theres no extra loot, theres less heretics to kill

[teal canyon]

There is alot of enemies

they just dont care

[normal bay]

Yeah, coming from behind lol

[teal canyon]

nope

those guy just suck

i was always feeling as last survivor

[thick kestrel]

same reason most people try to cheese, they've let the grind overtake the fun in their heads.

same issue occurs in places like Warframe where you have people who don't care about playing the game any more, just completing the mission as fast as possible to get a reward and then go again.

got to have the best gun/armour/trinkets possible because that matters more than enjoying the trip

[teal canyon]

there is always a wave of crushers+maulers+armored ragers who stink gas, yet im the only one who fighting them

[thick kestrel]

you get to a point where you and parts of the community optimise the game to the point it's no longer enjoyable. it's a live service thing evolved out of the same phenomena in MMO's.

[teal canyon]

where is my team? Oh, i have no idea

[crimson pebble]

@faint beacon

[normal bay]

But what is the grind? No speedrunner is grabbing materials and if you play higher diffs, you've no shortage of ordos

[thick kestrel]

never said it was smart ^^

[narrow frost]

antax Caxe with helbore, stance

based havoc 40 vet

its a marty vet too

[thick kestrel]

but it is a symptom of wider gaming which has a bad habit of creeping it's way in. missing that the true path is to use what you enjoy and master it as far as it'll go.

be more like Ogryn, enjoy life! enjoy rations! smash heretics!

and if it stops being fun? stumble off to find something else to do for a bit.

[faint beacon]

@lucid hinge all I’m saying is at least it’s not me millionth DKOK

[lucid hinge]

The message of me saying "I don't hate steel legion" is not there

[faint beacon]

Out of context SS moment

Armageddon is a hellhole though, I still love the Steel Legion

[faint beacon]

But admittedly so much shit goes on there it’s shocking it hasn’t become Cadia 2: Space Debris Boogaloo

[tall torrent]

Ur just not gonna need ammo pickups period if u have both survivalist and shock trooper

[tall torrent]

U will be treated as DKOK and u will like it

[faint beacon]

Stole the drip bar for bar

[void dragon]

Can become the scalpel when my ogryn rumbler eats all the ammo but still somehow miss the trapper that got him...again

[tall torrent]

Helbore’s biggest team benefit is to enable some obnoxious ranged spam playstyles

[hybrid plover]

If you're not using WoF, its honestly impossible to run out of ammo. You're even hard pressed to without survivalist.

Well. Assuming you're shock trooping

Which, why wouldn't you

[void dragon]

helbore and recon can do that, almost feels that the lasguns are the support tools of the class in ammo saving

[tall torrent]

Even with WoF it’s borderline impossible to run out of ammo

[hybrid plover]

The person telling me that it's a scab melee and I should conserve ammo as I gun down every specialist on the field

It's funny when I come across that case of a person that's never touched vet before so they don't actually know.

[patent birch]

is Helbore finally good?

[signal garden]

finally?

people are using it en masse now

but it was never bad

[tall torrent]

It’s very close to being perfect

[signal garden]

it was perfect

right now its balanced

[tall torrent]

It just needs a little more

[signal garden]

it had more

way more

[teal canyon]

helbore is okay

[patent birch]

Helllbore dump stat?

[calm shard]

stability

[teal canyon]

i dont really like blessings on helbore tho

[patent birch]

65 stab 75 charge ok or?

[calm shard]

well charge is your fire rate

so no

[patent birch]

surgical onslaught?/

[calm shard]

a little bit

[teal canyon]

Surgical is ok but it worse than bolter surgical (or its just a problem with text and not really exist)

[calm shard]

a smidge okay

It's an alright gun

https://fximgur.com/a/RXk2Lkf distinctly adequate even

[patent birch]

so what are perks and b lessings

[tall torrent]

Helbore IV
Dump stability
Maniac
Unyielding
Surgical
Weight of fire

[calm shard]

Oh I do maniac carapce

unyielding is prob better but I like one shotting crushers

[tall torrent]

Unyielding is cheaper talent spec for reaper 2 shot

And monster damage

I just run power sword and melee

[patent birch]

show skill tree?

[teal canyon]

Guess the number of times those big guys are problems to me? Eh, about 1% of runs

[tame lodge]

Erm
Onslaught was renamed to Weight of Fire

[calm shard]

you're not gonna like it

You can also run it on more sane builds with unyielding as path said

[patent birch]

i have the tag tree running rn

good enough?

[past stratus]

Depends on marks, Mark IV definitely Surgical, Weight of Fire

[normal bay]

The IV can still two shot a crusher with shout, just needs one crit with cara lol

[narrow frost]

I put terrifying barrage on mine cause I wanna be scary

[normal bay]

What's the advantage of maniac? Flamer chest one taps?

[calm shard]

it makes killing them and ragers more consistent yeah

[tall torrent]

Flamer 1hs in h40

If it had 1 point more damage it’d be always active

But currently only at >10m, or crit headshot

[calm shard]

also unrelated note about flamers I hate this

why does their backpack have such absurd damage reduction

[normal bay]

Why?

Because fuck you

That's why

[calm shard]

and then it explodes which leaves barrel flames

that do fuck all damage to enemies

and direct health damage to players

I miss when they didn't have that feature

[tame lodge]

It's just a little

0.35 modifier

[calm shard]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-eye-twitch-cat-eye-twitch-cat-camera-gif-26361958

[teal canyon]

i would like barrels to throw enemies as much as players

instead of just knocking them over alil

[tame lodge]

Double checked

0.2 actually

[teal canyon]

anyway. i find helbore sights better than lasgun or laspistol sights

because i can actually see the battlefield and not this freaking dot

btw. isnt bolter could do same shit as helbore or i missing something?

[calm shard]

bolter doesn't have infinite ammo, draws and reloads slower, and does less damage per shot

[signal garden]

laspistol? really?

laspistol is a beast of its own accord

so accurate and stable the sights are there for shits and giggles

you should essentially be playing HALO or DOOM with the laspistol since its always hitting center screen

hipfire king

imo the biggest problem with the bolter is im 90% sure itll be great when they remove the 2-4 pt talent tax vet has

[spark helm]

https://tenor.com/view/scout-gif-25786536

[teal canyon]

tried this. inconsistent as fuck

[calm shard]

skill issue

[long dove]

Anyone noticing the lack of quality in Havoc lately?

[teal canyon]

One trick pony and trick ain fucking working 50% of the time because setup is not ready

[narrow widget]

bolter is already great wdym

[signal garden]

i think its good

its not great

[calm shard]

https://imgur.com/a/mz6Go3q surely

[signal garden]

wow! one isolated standing still plague ogryn using the most riskiest ability in the game!

[long dove]

I'm running something like this on Arby

[crimson pebble]

this might be doable faster on arb now

[calm shard]

plague ogryns aren't exactly hard to headshot

[calm shard]

no they don't even get close to one magging it

Unless you have a stacked castigator's stance damage boost

Which is even less practical than max MMF stacks

[signal garden]

a lucky super crit bolt pistol has a better chance of doing the same result and safer, just in more time and with less risk

and at longer range with consistency

[calm shard]

https://imgur.com/a/RXk2Lkf Helbore is a bit more consistent than Bolter but godDAMN the bolter is fast when you get the ideal scenario

[signal garden]

but ive found the more i use veteran lately, the more my ultimate bane is the infested

yeah arbites is good at getting the ideal scenario

mark with dog, whip out gun, ZZAP

[calm shard]

without the damage that gun vet has to capitalize on it yes

[signal garden]

go to town on the face

[long dove]

I wish I had a good Helbore build. I'm just using a Exec build that lets me one shot crushers on Auric

[signal garden]

gun vet sucks

[calm shard]

correct

[signal garden]

dont tell me otherwise lol

[calm shard]

but the damage is not why they suck

gun vet has the best ranged damage in the game

[signal garden]

yeah but since they suck at what they suck at youll be dead awaiting pick up so your ideal situation will never happen

[calm shard]

probably highest boss damage too

[signal garden]

incorrect

2x incorrect

because its unfair, but ogryn exists

[long dove]

Wait so using a gun with Vet is bad?

[narrow widget]

shroudfield t hammer martyrdom zealot:

[signal garden]

and IM 100% sure when they give us 4 more damn talent points to work with veteran will actually be able to maintain TGH

@long dove gun vet is average, in fact its fun

[calm shard]

It's more overinvesting in left tree is bad

It's viable in havoc but please do not hurt yourself trying

[signal garden]

but its not great because fatshark put all the good talents all over the place

so you have to work way hard

[calm shard]

You absolutely can play exe stance vet with a Bolter/Helbore in Havocs and absolutely faceroll every enemy bigger than a poxboy

But don't

[long dove]

idk, recon with onslaught seems to do a lot.

[calm shard]

Because you need teammates with functioning braincells to do that safely

[signal garden]

so you get my point then

bolter is very unforgiving

[long dove]

yeah been seeing a lack of that lately

[signal garden]

at least with recon you can go brrrrrrr and evade and shoot wildly

its as much a long range sword as it is a ranged weapon

vet used to have weird ways to drop aggro too so you could shoot with impunity

and the reload on exe stance was really good on bolter

reload + insta equip

also psyker is a better suppression platform than vet

also arbites has the damn dog to peel for you while you shoot

[long dove]

Then don't play Vet

[signal garden]

hell even ogryn knocks shit over when it evades into them

[long dove]

while the rest of us has fun with it

[signal garden]

im not saying dont play vet

[long dove]

You pretty much are

[signal garden]

im saying fatshark needs to think about how to rebalance the class

[long dove]

all you've done is shit talk it so far

[long dove]

They are

[signal garden]

i literally said its good, not great

[narrow widget]

yeah he's too strong nerf survivalist

[signal garden]

@narrow widget again even

give it a 10 sec cooldown

[long dove]

"It's good! But it sucks with 1,2,3,4.5.6

[signal garden]

dude

im sorry i didnt slobber all over your favorite class

[long dove]

Not saying that

[signal garden]

that doesnt mean im blinded by the many hoops you need to jump over to get an ideal scenario

why are you being so defensive

are you married to the class

[long dove]

I've yet to see you say a positive

[signal garden]

did you forget to sign a prenup

[long dove]

just negative after negative

[narrow widget]

yea

[calm shard]

okay so arbites DOES get to one mag pogryns

but only because of the increased clip size

takes 18 shots to kill them instead of 15

But you need to have every buff active

[signal garden]

not even that but it gets to get a free stun on it too to make sure the head stayss still

[calm shard]

Castigator's excluded because frankly that's luck more than consistent

[signal garden]

youre juggling a kraknade and a bolter with vet

which you know

kraknade lmao

[calm shard]

who the fuck uses kraks on vet

worst goddamn blitz in the game

[narrow widget]

yea fym kraks

[long dove]

I use it when my weapons aren't the best at carapace

[signal garden]

thats what im saying so you end up needing to save VoC for it

[calm shard]

also arbites has a bit of a problem in this context of not having swap speed

[narrow widget]

you get voc back insanely quickly anyway

[signal garden]

i think of the two paths of gun-hunter arbites

dog with setup

or just evade boss and dance around a shock mine

[calm shard]

but yeah without buffs from killing trash active 18 bolter shots on arbites leaves them on this much health

[stone zealot]

@narrow frost they ate me dodge... my butt stink now...

[calm shard]

tree

[signal garden]

ugh good luck getting 30 stacks until they fix it

[long dove]

yeah I've only hit 30 a few tiems

[calm shard]

not bugged in the psykhanium

[signal garden]

all im saying is theres zero reason they took away the reload on F

[long dove]

On exec or?

[signal garden]

yeah on vet volley fire

[calm shard]

on exe yeah

its gotten a fuckton of nerfs to pay for veteran being meta in the early days

[signal garden]

BLAMBLAMBLAMBLMABLAMBLABML into F into VLAVMALMVLAMVLAMVLBMALB

[calm shard]

and they never really rebuffed it with the power creep the game has seen

[long dove]

I could have sworn they kept that. I barely use it so I may not remember it

[signal garden]

to be fair when half the modifiers were YOU CANT SEE SHIT

it made sense for the OG darktide team to be 4 vet 4 bolter 4 squadsight-volleyfire

[long dove]

SO they take away the reload but Ogryn get it?

[signal garden]

just a fun ass time

yeah doesnt even make sense that ogryn gets it

since ogryn already gets a hyper reload on F too

with a conjoining talent to grant you like 40% TGH on reload or something stupid

[calm shard]

hey maybe when vet gets reworked in 2025

[signal garden]

yeah when it gets those new weapons fatshark promised it

last year

[hollow ibex]

2025?

[spark helm]

gun vet solid. I shoot gun, it dies. I unload boltor into monstrocity, it hurts/dies.

:U

[signal garden]

iits really quite simple fatshark

if you remake vet

give it the option to wield 2 guns or 2 melee weapons

[tall torrent]

if vet talent rework is not at least 4 pages long then it's not good enough

[signal garden]

if its two guns grant vet like 50% dodge duration and + 1 effective dodge

[last depot]

Sly Marbo style

[spark helm]

Just go all out and get saltzpure rapier-gun. :^)

[signal garden]

let vet get like 4 + 1 grenades

because fuck

you

arbites

[hollow ibex]

Make vet dlc and we’ll get a rework tomorrow

[signal garden]

in fact make it 4 + 2