veteran-class

[unreal forge]

the only way it's outdone is by overwhelming single shot strength like plasma and helbore

[signal garden]

Full Max RoF shot groupings are terrible

Helbore does better

[unreal forge]

you can say that but helbore and plasma are doing fine

[past stratus]

I think a better option for shit like the Ilas would be just buffing Veteran's usage of that weapon. As in making talents for the veteran class that make those las weapons better.

[serene bough]

plasma is a different beast, but helbore is not comparable bc it's intended to hunt more heavy armor targets

[signal garden]

iLas has the same shortcomings as the bolt pistol

[unreal forge]

naw they both serve the same purpose

[serene bough]

ilas and recon and shooting for the same kinds of enemies

[unreal forge]

shoot the shooty guys, shoot the elites and specialists

[signal garden]

Spastic recoil animation that makes no sense and doesn't help with repeat shots

[unreal forge]

helbore just does more on top of it

[signal garden]

And we haven't talked about the current king of precision

[serene bough]

the difference is handling/draw speed makes helbore more effective at heavier elites whereas ilas/recon would dispatch softer elites more effectively

[signal garden]

The exterminator shotgun

SHOOT in their GENERAL direction

[serene bough]

like, you can use a helbore to clear any enemy but recon will get rid of shotgun/gunner clusters faster

[unreal forge]

erm

no

[signal garden]

Aim at the broadside of the proverbial barn

Still hot what you're aiming at

[signal garden]

There's zero excuse for the iLas to have such poor hipfire

[serene bough]

ilas and recon in that sense are going for similar targets of softer elites, so the comparison of effectiveness between them makes more sense than comparing helbore

[unreal forge]

mk3 loses most of its kill effectiveness over 15m

even an ilas would've killed that guy in the first second

[serene bough]

i mean, i guess you could also bullet hose crushers with recon, but i wouldnt recommend

[unreal forge]

takes my mk3 like 4 seconds and 4/6ths of its magazine to do it

[signal garden]

Yeah but the exterminator would clean a pack up in 4 shots, or ~2 seconds

[unreal forge]

that gun is not defined by precision

[serene bough]

in summary, ilas will likely always be inferior to recon with the current state of recon

[unreal forge]

that's fine, equal balance is impossible and not worth pursuing

[serene bough]

id rather weapons with higher difficulty be more rewarding, but thats just my opinion

im generally not a fan of spraying/spamming weapons to complete combat encoutners, I like to actually think and navigate a fight with tools that have clear strengths and weaknesses

[unreal forge]

there's not much more to guns than point and shoot dude xd

[serene bough]

you're entirely missing the point tbh

[sly orchid]

Have you tried getting closer to it and using flak

[unreal forge]

no I get what you mean

I just don't believe that would be too fun

[unreal forge]

you're missing the point

[signal garden]

Right now iLas has the same problem as the bolt pistol

[unreal forge]

this was in response to "Exterminator being the king of precision"

[signal garden]

Incredibly bad accuracy past the first shot

[serene bough]

by that argument, shredder pistol and plasma are the same bc you just point and shoot

[signal garden]

Although in the bolt pistol that's by design

[unreal forge]

also that Mk3 has flak

[serene bough]

the point is to have an arsenal that does the same function but by different mechanics to allow diversity of choice and playstyle

[signal garden]

I imagine it's an indicator of how outdated the design of the iLas is

Right, and blessings that make sense

[red fox]

how are you guys liking the rotten armour event

[serene bough]

its accurate, but the hitbox is small and you need to actually aim and line up your shots more than other weapons

[hollow ibex]

it's ok

i'm not sure it actually changes the gameplay much for me lol

[compact oracle]

i cant see shit

everything is just pox gas

[serene bough]

giving ilas a similar treatment to helbore would be a nice start, the little aim assist they built into it i mean

[signal garden]

Yeah but the optic drifts wildly

[sly orchid]

https://tenor.com/view/gas-fortnite-minecraft-gif-21299773

[red fox]

It's mostly this and arbites running past the gas while im choking to death

[signal garden]

Especially if you're firing max fire rate on the fastest firing ilas

[unreal forge]

on neither Vet or Zealot have I noticed the gas doing damage

[signal garden]

It damages quick

[unreal forge]

I think it's not real

[serene bough]

i know, ive been agreeing with you for a majority of this discussion

[red fox]

It oculd be the big crusher i coudn't see inside the gas

[signal garden]

It's like double the damage of gas

[red fox]

potentially

[serene bough]

ive been consistently saying they should buff the ilas handling profiles and small buffs to damage

[signal garden]

I feel like people need to stop being stupid

[compact oracle]

only bothers me when a mauler comes out of the fart gas and sideswipes me so i start taking real damage

[signal garden]

Big ask

[red fox]

I feel like these new guys is not even worth wasting ammo on they're so tanky

[signal garden]

If I mark a crusher through a cloud it's because I want to see the silhouette

If there's 2-4 crushers I want them marked as well so we can see the damn overhead through the damn cloud

At least when it's an Arby's team they mark shit for the doge

[red fox]

my last game was just

ping sound ping sound ping sound ping sound ping sound ping sound ping sound

every time i hear that i just imagine the cop freaking out begging his dog to help

[compact oracle]

they have like 50% ranged damage reduction

if people in this discord dont lie

...maybe thats why it takes so long to kill them with surge staff, shit

[unreal forge]

flamer on zealot didn't feel too good either

[red fox]

That might be why it feels like they crumple in melee

[compact oracle]

no one knows how to mark these days

[red fox]

but eat my bolter shots like it's nothing

[unreal forge]

I have my tag key on scrollwheel

[compact oracle]

dont complain when you get overheaded by a lone crusher because no one but you knew it was there

did anyone confirm if the rotten armour enemies count as infested

that might be why bolter sucks against them also

[unreal forge]

healthbars mod could probably tell

if you choose to have it show armor type hit

[compact oracle]

but ill be killed with hammers for installing it

[red fox]

healthbars mods look so view obscuring

[signal garden]

Vermintide 2 just had more intelligent players on average

[quick burrow]

its true i was one of the few idiot players i mained kermillion and used trueshot arrow ability with trueshot bow

[signal garden]

@red fox most mods look so obscuring

[little path]

you can change what does and doesn't show healthbars with the mod

[signal garden]

Don't get me started on damage parsers

Those people should be thrown out an airlick

[red fox]

Damage parsing as in scoreboards?

[signal garden]

Airlock

No as in printing out damage dealt into chat

Automated damage announcing

[red fox]

im considering the custom UI one to get the health in the middle but feels iffy to me

[quick burrow]

verm 2 had a score at teh end of the game and u wanted to hunt the green circles so u can say your better than your team

[unreal forge]

scoreboard aint even necessary once you play the game enough youll know whos underperforming through gameplay

[little path]

that's in darktide?

oh wait yeah, I saw that one recently

[compact oracle]

people do that?

weird

[red fox]

really? Im just trying to make sure im not getting carried

[signal garden]

It's a mod, and almost always used by shitters

[little path]

the idea being "oh, you can let people on console see their damage"

[red fox]

never seen that

[signal garden]

Don't get me wrong I like to chase green circles as a point of personal improvement

But fuck these non ressing, non objective doing tryhards

[little path]

It's a newer mod and it's honestly very pointless

[quick burrow]

i do it to show im better than you with my entire auto aim kit as elf

i am the 99%

[signal garden]

Elf is base

Best melee class, handmaiden with javelin

[little path]

the scoreboard has a use

[compact oracle]

the worst ive run into is one guy who i think had something that pinged whatever he had the mouse over

repeatedly

[tall torrent]

https://youtu.be/VnuH21DSad8?si=FuDej4lula0OtZCY

[signal garden]

Best defensive class, sister o the thorn

[little path]

you can see your breakdown of damage

if you did more burn, more melee etc

[signal garden]

Best deleter, shade with twin daggers

Kerillian is based

[quick burrow]

is the helbore build shout vet with WS going down into shock trooper ?

[signal garden]

Kerillian is, well, arbites coded

[little path]

if everyone is swinging into a boss and you want to know if your boss damage is good you can compare

[autumn ferry]

everyone needs to know that i top damaged on ogryn how else would they know theyre worse than me and im better smh

[signal garden]

Most people who haven't fought a rat ogre, stormfiend, or bile troll will probably run away from a darktide boss

Ogryn is so unfun to play with

I want to pop heads, too bad everyone is on the floor

[little path]

stormfiends and bile trolls are a joke

[quick burrow]

i liked that one boss in the ice level that once u get him down he turns into a chaos spawn and u have to fight him again

[signal garden]

I want to play the game, too bad I can't see shit because explosions everywhere

[autumn ferry]

i dont mind oggies (not at all biased because i play ogryn)
arbites are the ones i cant stand

[compact oracle]

ogryns the best class to play with, because he'll always be the one getting obliterated by 30 gunners

also yeah arbites

[signal garden]

I want to heal, too bad ogryn is takingcmore damage then the whole team combined times 2

[compact oracle]

dies in 3 seconds every time

[quick burrow]

yes thats why i like him

[signal garden]

Ogryn and psyker compete to make sure I don't have fun

And it's honestly neck and neck at times

[compact oracle]

i curse you with 3 shock mine lone wolf arbites, forever

[signal garden]

Don't get me started at how my eyes are burning when trying to headshot purple lightning'd, blue flame burning enemies

[grand perch]

wild path yt channel spotted

[autumn ferry]

arbites are both the worst players ive ever seen while also getting top damage just by spamming left click

[calm shard]

I do appreciate it consistently shaming chorus zealots for not contributing

But I don't use it myself because I don't like mods that directly affect other players

[quick burrow]

shock maul with the toughness gen on stagger weak shot auto stagger then toughness gen on chained strikes = i swing my weapon and walk forward

[signal garden]

I love havocs , because these people fold hard vs bosses, the one thing thry can't stagger lock forever

[compact oracle]

not my first thought on seeing damage numbers posted in chat

[unreal forge]

skill issue

[compact oracle]

shouldve pushed it with your mind

[little path]

also in vermintide 2, sienna also can just use the trauma staff

but now it guarantees burn

[unreal forge]

and the better inferno staff

we fr need a beam staff

[little path]

And also the fire tornado staff

[compact oracle]

worse stagger though

please

green beam

it must have the shotgun altfire, its mandatory

[atomic void]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/735819155608961044/1075903515718848622/spingryn.gif

good stuff

so many snipers lmao

[unreal forge]

how does bro keep track of his toughness

I can't imagine having to look down to a corner to see my current hp

[signal garden]

the starcraft effect

information on the bottom

the gameplay on the screen

although in 2025 Ultra wides are a problem

[unreal forge]

in just about every shooter game a center HUD is better than corner info IMO

[trim badger]

I just lost a Havoc run to something like this

[unreal forge]

should've ran true grit #$killissue

[trim badger]

I was vet :(((

[autumn ferry]

vets being taken out of yet another job
now the bursters are shooting themselves when near a player smh

[normal bay]

Ahh, the classic "Let's drop down for the medicae without clearing out all the ranged enemies" strat. I know it well.

Nice clutch though

[tame lodge]

It's shit (didn't play yet, maybe I'll play tonight)

[void dragon]

It's FINE(TM), but imo not interesting enough to grind, a little annoying but most classes can facetank the explosion of gas

[halcyon blaze]

Yeah I notice that as a player who started playing literally two days after theGrim Protocols update, I noticed I had to be careful about looking up guides and advice that was out of date.

[tall torrent]

uh
seeing?

idk I never had issues like that

[void dragon]

You either behave like you have all your toughness or you have none

[tame lodge]

I have all my toughness all the time
I'm effectively immortal

[ionic trail]

fun if you like fighting armor /dancing with them in melee. seems like armor spawns in clumps at 2-3x the frequency with the modifier

[void dragon]

Ogryn and Arby moment

[ionic trail]

often feels like you might as well call it "armor strike teams" modifier since i've found they'll just come at you in waves

you clean up one group and another swarms in

[tame lodge]

Uh no

[void dragon]

Uh yes, the fact that you can do it with different classes is irrelevant

[tame lodge]

Nah

[void dragon]

You are f@&#!Ng invincible

[ionic trail]

meh, i get around this by simply practicing binary skill

you see, it's either 1 or 0.

1, i take little to no health damage throughout the mission and feel like a good player

[tame lodge]

It's not

[ionic trail]

or 0. I suddenly lose all of my toughness at once to an attack I could have avoided and nearly go down, so I feel like trash.

[tame lodge]

I'm immortal as a psyker with no toughness curios

[tame lodge]

I'm immortal as a martyrdom zealot at 1 hp

I'm simply built different

[void dragon]

Are you build by IKEA?

[tame lodge]

Those are

Swiss? Right?

[void dragon]

Aren't you immortal by virtue of being a zealot with until death privileges anyway?

[tame lodge]

No I'm immortal because I dodge hits

[balmy flume]

Playing Arbites after being a Vet for the longest time feels…
Like an odd sense of Deja Vu

In a weirdly good way

Also shotguns that actually does something lol

[void dragon]

The Pay2Vet experience

[tame lodge]

Pay2mid

[void dragon]

Poor Vet, Perfect Q says you are Mid

[tame lodge]

[compact oracle]

not vet, arbites

theyre the psyker agendaposter

[tame lodge]

Vet has helby
Insta goated

[void dragon]

And yet Perfect Q called Veteran mid

[compact oracle]

reread

[tame lodge]

Nah he won't
He'll keep his agenda up

[void dragon]

Pay2Vet = Pay2mid, substract the Pay2 part

[compact oracle]

unread

this place needs a vet glazer

[compact oracle]

there needs to be someone so vocal about vet being the best class that it gets nerfed next update

[void dragon]

A Free2arby lover

[tame lodge]

I mean

There's the people that complains about the future nerfs

That should be enough no?

[void dragon]

Vet will be nerfed by everything else being broken being kept and even buffed more as Veteran is kept in obscurity

[compact oracle]

oh right plasma is potentially getting its kneecaps broken

ogryn rework 2: heavy hitter is now baked into the class, we added grenade regen talent and plasma gun 2, exclusive to ogryn

[void dragon]

The plasma changes are so you need to use the M2 more, so the explosion rate will go up, the real kneecap breaking is for DS and is not even enough

[compact oracle]

did the chinese patch notes or whatever they were turn out to be real

[plain osprey]

Id pay good money for that to happen

[compact oracle]

ogryn rework 3: added a dog because ogryns deserve it

[plain osprey]

Translation:

Skillissues will be exposed

[plain osprey]

Yes, and we need to be able to feed it broiled groxliver midgame (iykyk)

[compact oracle]

complete immunity to damage during the animation of course

[signal garden]

vet? nerfed? again? is that possible in its current state

its been nerfed so many times i fee

feel

[normal bay]

"We have reverted the Helbore" 🗣️

[signal garden]

that would be a buff

[void dragon]

They will Nerf VoC, and take our Helbores

[compact oracle]

make the sights worse

[void dragon]

Ok now that's evil

[plain osprey]

Honestly, the class needs a complete rework with most of the human guns and melee its using

[signal garden]

kek

[tame lodge]

It wouldn't but go on

[compact oracle]

would an actual sniper scope be worse

i cant decide

[tame lodge]

🗣️

Yes

[signal garden]

i like how the ranged keystone is basically like playing for a penance

[tame lodge]

But make it so

[signal garden]

which is to say, actiively trolling your team as hard as yoyre trolling yourself

[tame lodge]

You can't hear attacks whoosh when scoped

[plain osprey]

Youre probably right.

I never liked and seldom used the pgun to begin with because i can Land headshots with a braced autogun on hipfire bit for the life of me i cant seem to hit a fucking barndoor from point blank with the p gun

[compact oracle]

make it so enemies will go for their most dangerous attack every time if you're scoped

[signal garden]

thats so awful, the best guns right how are hyper accurate hipfire guns

[plain osprey]

All memes aside, just for nerding out, what would you change? I would give exe stance some sort of survivability, like tdr or trgn, or serverly reduced enemy radar presence like it supposedly had in the beginning.
Id also scrap the infiltrate ability and replace it with something completley different and original, although i dunno what

[void dragon]

Vet should get bonuses for staying in ADS, like increased crit rate or toughness regen

[compact oracle]

oh yeah its pretty funny that ogryn is the one that gets tgh for staying braced huh

[plain osprey]

Fair, and thats probably why i see alot of zealots use it, i just like the chunk chunk chunk it makes on every human classes, so i even use it on gun and melee scriers gaze psykers

[tame lodge]

Ooh I know

[plain osprey]

*increased rending

[void dragon]

Give us a skill that let us do a Rambo but with a grenade launcher

[past stratus]

we had a guy come here once while we were discussing some of the better Arby features and he got real mad and told us that Vet has a bunch of broken things that needed nerfs. Like VoC, Plasma and other stuff.

[tame lodge]

Make it so scoped shots have really high suppression

[void dragon]

That could work too

[past stratus]

not a Vet glazer but a Vet hater

[plain osprey]

Id be down for that.

[tame lodge]

Suppression builds twice the aggro than kills

[signal garden]

EXE stance should refill the gun as it used to

[plain osprey]

Bro read one 1 year old salty reddit post and his opinion was formed lol

[past stratus]

Max suppression build with a recon so my team misses every shot

No more headshots

[signal garden]

and it should tighten hipfire recoil and spread to "i dont need to aim down" levels of holy shit

[past stratus]

average reddit user

[plain osprey]

Yeah, ogryn gets that on his gun ability but Veteran, THE gunclass, doesnt.

*Cues loose canon: "such a shame"

[plain osprey]

Probably lol

[signal garden]

actually i think the most tragic thing about EXE stance is the fucking FOV adjustment

bitch im getting mobbed here, i set my FOV to what it is so i can have better situational awareness

[autumn ferry]

i saw someone say they shouldnt because then they could double magdump the bolter but idk if thatd really be that bad

[signal garden]

why the fuck does it narrow vision by like 20 degrees

@autumn ferry imagine being upset because dumping 20% of your ammo is somehow a good thing in darktide

it should be an option, but on no planet is it busted because you can only keep up that level of damage output for so long

[past stratus]

back in the day the double mag dump was the shit, nowadays with havoc it is mid. Good job you killed a guy and now you have no ammo for the rest of the match, yipee.

[signal garden]

yeah scavenger didnt have a freaking 5s cooldown

[autumn ferry]

actually vet always keeps it up because they just stole your ammo pack while you werent looking

[signal garden]

of course it was """""OP"""""

based, im taking the ammo and my ogryn can take his thumper and shove it up where the light of the astronomic relay doesnt reach

[quiet valley]

Exec stance used to be broken because is was 75% DR against everything when it was supposed to be ranged DR only

[plain osprey]

Castigators stance is everything exe stance wishes to be.

Its the ability its wife tells not to worry about.

[quiet valley]

But now we have Castigator Stance so...

[signal garden]

40 second cooldown is admittedly a long ass time

[tame lodge]

[signal garden]

although its true, the ability to shoot shit with impunity and not worry about all these damn infested nipping at my shit is truly a goated feeling

[tame lodge]

You mean no ranged buffs?

I don't think exe wants to be that

[plain osprey]

Especially since it aims to be the "Sharpshooter ability".

Everybody knows that snipers have a super wide pov via their spotter and setup and only zoom in for the shot

[tame lodge]

[calm shard]

https://fximgur.com/a/9UXdUQc castigators doesn't give me an immediate damage boost

[signal garden]

@plain osprey i heard the sniper program in the US has had a bit of a paradigm shft back to no spotter

[tame lodge]

Nor recoil

Nor spread reduction

[quiet valley]

Yeah but its safer than Exec stance and the dmg scales with Melee and Ranged and Grenades, etc

[tame lodge]

Nor suppression immunity

[plain osprey]

Agree with alot of this, thx for writing it out.

Only the last two points worry me. Ive always loved survivalist. I dont wanna miss it. So making the alternatives just as viable id probably prefer

The last one you need to explain the logistics and reasoning to me, especially since for arbites and zealot grenades too are blitzes

[plain osprey]

Ok, wasnt caught up to that.

[signal garden]

i only heard this im not 100% sure

[compact oracle]

moving the weird spread out grenade talents into one keystone/nodes for that keystone

interesting

[signal garden]

you know what survivalist should do

the fucking thing bardin does

like comeon the current way is so lame

[compact oracle]

dropping actual ammo pickups?

[plain osprey]

True, but it prevents you from being clobbered to death by that one annoying powalker you missed behind you. And while you were focussing on shooting that thing crept up on you....

[tame lodge]

Like unironically
The Boombox has better ranged buffs than casti

[signal garden]

@compact oracle yeah

although i have a wet dream where a new nonsprinting ranged class called the "tempestus scion" can walk over gunner corpses to generate 5 seconds of infinite ammo

[past stratus]

They should shamelessly and unapologetically just copy paste most of the things Ranger Veteran has to Veteran. Scrap dogshit Infiltrate and Exe stance and give me Disengage, PLEASE

[signal garden]

if only so we can have that gunner experience

[plain osprey]

I commend the for hitting those 3 weakspot hits, i probably would have missed at least one of them

[signal garden]

@past stratus right, have the smoke grenade be ranger veteran's thing

instead of "too bad youre still gonna get your ass blown out by a sniper"

[plain osprey]

Fair. But i dont wanna live in a world without it

[signal garden]

smoke grenade would instantly become goated

[compact oracle]

maybe dont point your ass at the snipers

that seems like a bad tactic

but i do like the idea of exec stance a lot

i dont want it gone

[signal garden]

the first mission i took it out to get the penance

[calm shard]

it was 2 weakspot hits :(

[plain osprey]

As someone who doesnt know who Ranger Veteran is, could you pls explain?

[signal garden]

i threw a smoke grenade out, couldnt see the sniper laser, and got shot through the cloud, smoke grenade is genuinely trolling

[tame lodge]

And the one you hit was denied by hit reg

💀

[calm shard]

https://fximgur.com/a/YzYeU9s I do be hitting weakspots a lot tho

[plain osprey]

Still woulda missed at least one

[compact oracle]

ranger veteran is the first subclass for bardin in vermintide 2

[past stratus]

Scrap infiltrate and Exe Stance, roll them together into 40k Disengage. Make the 3rd new ability something that synergizes with the WS gameplay, maybe melee thing or a defensive thing. Something to that extend.

[plain osprey]

You must be watching my Gameplay 💀

[compact oracle]

as base passives, he can spawn ammo pickups when a special dies

[signal garden]

Passive traits for zealot: high hp and stamina sustain

passive traits for vet : high TGH and remarkably poor cardio

the fuck is that

[plain osprey]

That was alot of highlight aura. Really kept it going

[calm shard]

don't forget you can peek over cover :)

[signal garden]

you know what vet needs

"wallhax shot"

bless one shot to have stupid cleave and damage

[calm shard]

plasma gun

[past stratus]

It's the Ranger Veteran ultimate, he throws a smoke grenade on the ground and instantly generates an area of stealth for his whole team. It also staggers enemies and he gets a few buffs while in the zone. Increased ranged damage, crit and shit like that. There are talents to make it help allies inside heal temporary HP(toughness but Vermintide) and other that allows him to keep the stealth for a period after leaving the zone

[signal garden]

put it on like a 15 second cooldown

[past stratus]

it is just waaaay better than the dogshit we have

Ranger Veteran is what a ranged focused class should be a in a horde game imo

[signal garden]

that or bounty hunter

just good ammo economy

[plain osprey]

I would like a frienzy ability, where you cant use range, but your tdr increases, your melee damage does, your speed and you get a red haze fog on your screen like with the glugger ability for ogryn.

[tall torrent]

vet is not even high toughness lol

[signal garden]

well highest

just not high for how the game currently works

[plain osprey]

Yeah, a fuck this, we're out ability does lack

[signal garden]

half of veterans stuff is just "what if i were a walking penance"

the core tenets of a penance being to troll yourself and the team

[tall torrent]

not even highest

highest is ogryn by far

[last depot]

Doesnt vet have 200 base?

[past stratus]

A lot of Veteran's neat things always comes with a caveat, like Deadshot is a neat idea because marksman class. But it drains your fucking stamina dry and make you a sitting duck. Like why? That's not fun

[plain osprey]

Ah ok, that makes sense.

[compact oracle]

100 base if gameslantern isnt lying to me

[tall torrent]

2 years ago yea

[calm shard]

I wouldn't even mind if it at least didn't turn off at 0 stamina

[tame lodge]

Ages ago

[compact oracle]

everyone else is around 70-75

[calm shard]

Like p l e a s e

[tame lodge]

💀

[compact oracle]

except for ogryn and arbites

[tame lodge]

Launch vet moment

[past stratus]

you regenerate Toughness if you don't get hit by anything :)

[tall torrent]

deadshot rework is actually easy

just remove the drain over time
and increase stamina cost per shot

[past stratus]

if I'm not getting hit by anything I don't need toughness fuck you fatshark

[quiet valley]

Deadshot will actually be viable for Helbore pog

[tall torrent]

this is exactly what I had in mind when I sent my idea to playtester

[past stratus]

yeah see that would be super reasonable

[calm shard]

I use deadshot helbore it's uh

suffering

Even with my aim and MMF's stamina restore on headshot

[quiet valley]

honestly atm it doesnt even need Deadshot

your crit rate with Opening Salvo and Surgical is pretty high

[calm shard]

I understand where you're coming from but please believe me when I say that every time I have switched off of it I have run out of ammo

[void dragon]

Imagine Desthshot meta

[quiet valley]

Deadshot is meta wdym

[calm shard]

Because I am killing every elite and specialist on the map

[void dragon]

Even MORE meta

[calm shard]

usually by myself

I do not suffer the gunner to live

[signal garden]

@past stratus vet, "you get more TGH IF you arent getting attacked, hit, or targeted"

what the hell is that

those are literally not reasons to need TGH

might as well tell me i get more hungrier so long as i dont eat

THANKS

[void dragon]

I already run the LasPistol deadshot, it's fun with the stamina regen of the focus target

[past stratus]

yeah it is obnoxious, everything with Vet has some sort of catch

[calm shard]

I make do

[past stratus]

like we need to be skill checked every second of our existence in a match

[calm shard]

I am using laspistol in this screenshot don't ask why I don't have superiority okay

[tall torrent]

vet is just 3x effort for 1/3rd value

get used to it

[signal garden]

based

[ocean swallow]

98 health in high havoc 💀

[past stratus]

like MMF, why isn't it like Surgical? You spend some time aiming, you get a bonus. You use that bonus, reset stacks. One node raises stacks meaning you have to aim for longer which is risky but does more damage. Why do we lose stacks when we walk or do other shit? That's so stupid

[tame lodge]

You can already tank one sniper shot

[void dragon]

We should riot at ObeseFish HQ for Veteran rights

[signal garden]

every shooter in havoc is a strafing, infinite ammo, pinpoint burst, stealthy death machine

meanwhile vet is struggling to juggle mechanics to make sense of anything

unironically vet is the IKEA of darktide

[tame lodge]

FS has Launch vet PTSD

[past stratus]

Imagine we were like Oggy and Arby that get bonuses and buffs while fighting. Because that's when you need them and you get those buffs by executing actions that you would in a fight. Imagine that concept but Veteran

crazy

[tall torrent]

if vet was a lv40 character then he's basically equal to them

[tame lodge]

Isn't that just Weapon Specialist

[balmy flume]

I will be honest I do miss VoC even as Abites

[past stratus]

and that's why WS is the GOAT keystone

and the only thing I would fight tooth and nail to keep in the Vet tree

[signal garden]

launch vet? you mean every map is foggy as all hell god forbid we use our wallhax, team cohesion, and bolters to make the game a cool team shooter

[past stratus]

https://tenor.com/view/bleak-it's-bleak-shaking-head-its-bleak-black-and-white-gif-9592734580409210082

[signal garden]

5ish patches ago WS used to affect the melee of helbore

[tall torrent]

for 10 more points u get somewhere like 104% more dmg lol

[signal garden]

now helbore doesnt get affected by anything melee specific but the stupid 2stack bleed on melee

i mean WOW 2 bleedlmao!

[tame lodge]

So all FS has to do is cut 10 nodes from veteran

[tall torrent]

honestly

[tame lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/freaky-freaky-smile-sukuna-sukuna-smile-freaky-sukuna-gif-4852549280133734300

[tall torrent]

just cutting 4 would be good

5% reload speed
5% TDR
25% suppression
25% reserve ammo

cut these

[past stratus]

roll all the shitty tax nodes into one and name it "I'm sorry it took so long"

[signal garden]

so what does arby/ogryn have that vet doesnt, it CAN go all 3 grenades, it CAN go all 3 abilities, it CAN go all keystones, and both have top heavy TGH sustain

thats easily 4 talent points freed up, up to 6-8 if you factor in going from one side to another

looking at vet and zealot ofc

and then you factor in the classes like chorus with the class ability tax

[void dragon]

Why THE gun class needs to pay royalty perk taxes to reload good?

[signal garden]

right meanwhile arbys gets 50 TGH

nbecause you cant not get 50 TGH

duh

[tame lodge]

They will not be saying sorry

💀

"After some long period of analysis we came to the conclusion....."

[signal garden]

meanwhile x2 veteran needs to go deep towards 2 keystones to get stamina delay down to being less worse than zealot

[void dragon]

The Emperor provides (when he feels like it)

[signal garden]

you think fatshark would do that, have us take extra damage withtout telling us thats a thing

[marble mantle]

Should I run WS or FT for havoc? Or are they both pretty viable?

[past stratus]

"...we're putting more buffs for Veteran in the form of extra tax nodes you can chose instead of other useful or fun talents."

[signal garden]

@marble mantle does it have to be vet

[marble mantle]

Huh?

[void dragon]

They already make us suffer on a daily basis...as a bug

[past stratus]

it largely depends on what you want to do in terms of loadout. WS and FT play pretty differently

[tame lodge]

Iirc the modifier for vet while sprinting is currently x1

[marble mantle]

Yeah, I’m more used to weapon specialist, but it’s also probably been close to a year since the last time I played vet

[tame lodge]

1 while dodging

And 0.5 when sliding

[past stratus]

I think FT is a safer and easier option if you have been away for a while since WS kind of rewards more aggressive playstyle and generally wants you to spend more time in melee than ranged

[surreal rune]

good build for doing the smoke grenade penance?

[tame lodge]

If you compare to zealot
They have 0.5 on all of those

[signal garden]

@surreal rune no build

[marble mantle]

Bet, you got a build for me? Prob gonna run either taxe or power sword. Don’t have a strong preference to primary, probably bistol ?

[signal garden]

just max out how many greandes you get

[tame lodge]

But Ogryn has 1 in all of those

[surreal rune]

ah, pain

[signal garden]

and go wilfully do nothing to progress in Mortis trials

youll be done in like 10 minutes lol

[void dragon]

You think zealot will get 1.5 after the rework?

[marble mantle]

Also, y’all fw the fit? I was going for like grimdark cowboy

[past stratus]

I think the safest you can be is Power Sword and Plasma with something like this. 2 extra points wherever you feel like

wait

I forgot Iron will

[hollow ibex]

you do not skip iron will

[marble mantle]

Do I uh…. Have to use plasma? I don’t want to be another bad vet using plasma

[past stratus]

you need Iron Will

[hollow ibex]

and FT really needs redirect fire

[past stratus]

I don't like redirect fire but sure yeah Redirect fire

[void dragon]

Push attack power sword can live without the stamina regen of that other perk, and redirect fire buffs team

[hollow ibex]

you don't like a constant 7.5% damage boost to you and your team? 🤔

[past stratus]

here correcting the bottom part. The Plasma is stupid easy to use, the other good weapon would be the Helbore but you need practice with that

[void dragon]

Helping team is for noobs that don't speedrun the game and don't trigger additional horde waves

[marble mantle]

Helbore kinda sick as fuck

I’ll fw helbore, practice makes perfect

[past stratus]

if that buff will not help them reach any breaking points and it will just pad cosmetic damage to the board, no not really. The toughness is generally better imo. Though idk it could help with grenades and bosses in Havoc

[marble mantle]

Every time I see plasma I think of the many, many vets I’ve played with that hard crutch plasma

[void dragon]

In higher Havocs the added damage will take a better help than the toughness because you would lose all of it even Vs pox walkers

[past stratus]

I prefer the Helbore as well

[hollow ibex]

it would impact breakpoints. it's not like it's some paltry sum of damage.

[marble mantle]

So 2 q’s

How do I set up helbore

And how do I set up pissword

What’s the dumpy on both, to start

[past stratus]

I think the hammer of the emperor guide on the pinned post of this channel is still updated on those two so you can use them

[marble mantle]

Oh I didn’t even know vet had a guide

When did that happen

[hybrid plover]

Surgical is a must for Helbore. Other blessing is between Weight of Fire, Hot Shot, or Armourbane

[hearty panther]

Yesterday, I made it before bed.

[past stratus]

Psword iirc is just Power Cycler/something while the MkIV Helbore is Surgical and WOF almost always

[hollow ibex]

falter's aight too

[cinder token]

Today I tried Helbore for the first time. Honestly, doesn't feel that bad. The swap speed is honestly alright. It would shine with a reworked build tree.

[hybrid plover]

WoF isn't almost always

It's actually kind of overrated

[hollow ibex]

on mk4 it's pretty important

on the others whatever

[hybrid plover]

Oh mk4. Yeah I guess it is.

[past stratus]

I'm talking about IV here, the other marks have different setups. I don't use them often

[tame lodge]

Nah
Zealot is the melee™ guy
He needs the tools to get in melee range

[hybrid plover]

But if you're talking Havoc and you wanna use the other marks, Hot Shot is not a bad choice at all.

[signal garden]

why exactly is power sword "n attack buff that runs out if you get interrupted on this class that easily gets interrupted"

why is it so unfun and janky

FATSHARK?

[past stratus]

because Vet GRRR

[void dragon]

Could probably get different tools in trade of maybe becoming a bruiser, kinda like an actual build focused on using stuff like the crusher more like a mini ogryn (it's how I actually enjoy playing the class more)

[past stratus]

give zealot rocket boots :)

[signal garden]

zealot has rocket boots

[void dragon]

Yeah, why it's the active still being cut in the middle if you are hit while still having swings? Didn't they fix that?

[signal garden]

although soome verticality to their current dash would be cool

@void dragon hell no, i finally got around to maxing out the masteries and i found out the hard way

its just not a fun weapon to use

like i like priming the charge and 1shotting a mutant with the stab

[void dragon]

They supposedly fixed that? What gives?

[signal garden]

but that doesnt make up for how annoying getting gangbanged by infested is

[hybrid plover]

That one reason is why it's hard for me to use it in Havoc

[past stratus]

dashing is for weaklings, real ones Jump on enemies

[hollow ibex]

psword is unironically a great weapon to force people to learn melee fundamentals

[signal garden]

brother with how inconsistently attack speed affects and doesnt affect hte helbore stab im convinced they just keep rolling back fixes and changes

[hybrid plover]

That shit will actively get you killed.

[calm shard]

I think my favorite part of playing exe vet is that chaos spawn and beast of nurgle are perma aggroed on me

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/well-yes-but-actually-no-meme-aardman-the-pirates-pirate-gif-26563702

[calm shard]

Because my 3 teammates are completely incapable of doing enough damage to bosses to get them to leave me the fuck alone

Even when I haven't done any damage for like 40 seconds straight

[signal garden]

without telling us, like that one time that one company (was it fatshark?) kept rolling out the incorrect versions of games (due to dev vs test vs active builds) to the main game and shit just wasnt getting fixed

and theyre like "we're fixing it! its fixed, we fixed it" and everyone and their dog just knew "its literally the same broken trash"

[void dragon]

You actually need to be on point to your dodge game to use it while absolutely surrounded to weave activation attacks, it's interesting because it's powerful enough to avoid those while slow enough to need to be mindful

Almost like a weakness of the weapon and it's strengths make sense

[hybrid plover]

It's a weakness that's way too exaggerated by a single hit deactivating it though.

[void dragon]

Also what does this means?... ObeseFish moment?

[hybrid plover]

If they fixed that, it'd be in a much better spot

[signal garden]

it should not be "n attacks"

stuns just reset the character

so it resets the weapon

make in an n-second buff ffs

if not on the basis of OPness, then on the basis of QoL

because it feels like shit

and once again its vet in a nutshell "this shit works if you dont get hit or targeted"

the fuck?

[hybrid plover]

I've went down solely because while I don't actually take the damage from a hit, it deactivating during me trying to clear a really dense horde really messes me up and that will definitely get you outright slaughtered in Havoc at times.

It creates a really unignorable inconsistency in its performance.

[signal garden]

@hybrid plover JuST usE VoiCE Of ComMAnd!

[deep bone]

Yo what is the best Version of the Tac Axe?

[calm shard]

I think all 3 are equally okay

[tame lodge]

None

[calm shard]

roughly anyways

[tame lodge]

2 or 7

[hybrid plover]

Honestly, preference

[tame lodge]

7 being the popular

[void dragon]

The Mk7 had good results for me

[calm shard]

2 or 7 are better for brutal momentum because they have better attack arcs

[hybrid plover]

Mk7 is my preferred though too.

Good moveset.

[signal garden]

brutal momentum as a blessing for helbore when

[calm shard]

I like Mk IV :)

[tame lodge]

Mk4 isn't bad

[hybrid plover]

Just use Hot Shot :)

[tame lodge]

It's just bad vibes

[void dragon]

What's MK4 Taxe supposed to excel?

[hollow ibex]

it was not fixed

[signal garden]

tac axe? excel?

i think its plus was always that it was wellrounded

[hybrid plover]

Hot Shot does kinda give your melee brutal momentum in a way anyway.

[void dragon]

So an ObeseFish moment indeed

[signal garden]

the heavy attack literaly exists because "oh in case your build revolves around heavy attacks"

[hybrid plover]

Speaking of.

Shock maul with Helbore and Hot Shot.

Not bad at all.

Kinda fixes the major issue with the maul having no cleave.

[hollow ibex]

single target ig

and light spam funnis

[signal garden]

you know who would use tacax best

freaking ogryn

and the damn 50% crit damage talent

man what a damage bonus

[void dragon]

Stuck on a class that doesnt use crits that much

[unreal forge]

alright man

[hybrid plover]

Lowest innnate crit in the game too

[atomic void]

what is bro doing

[unreal forge]

he really really really doesn't want the yellow stim

[signal garden]

why exactly is it so hard to do, i dont remember administering/giving being so hard to aim in vermintide

[hollow ibex]

tbf there's no reason they'd know you're trying to injnect then with a stimm

unless you tell them lol

[signal garden]

and it wasnt an issue in vermintide 2

[unreal forge]

there was also no reason for him to run into the shotgunner blob

[signal garden]

you could give a potion no problem

the aim is so off

[hollow ibex]

there's a good reason

he's a pubby

[signal garden]

you need to be like melded into them

[tall torrent]

no

[ember nest]

Has that been debunked? Is that video on it wrong

[tall torrent]

what video

[ember nest]

Oh do u not know

Lvl 1 hotshot does funky things

[tall torrent]

ik how hotshot and BM works

[ember nest]

Ill grab it

https://youtu.be/zuAB-eBhaPk?si=x8ki4NkhMhV7aIkk

[tall torrent]

if u think hotshot allows u to do the same dmg to all enemies

this is wrong

because that's not how it works

[hybrid plover]

"Kinda"

I know it doesnt carry the damage across all targets

[tall torrent]

the reason ur ranged attack does the same damage to everything hit, is because ur ranged attacks (usually) do not have cleave dmg distribution

melee attacks do

hotshot does not interact with cleave distribution whatsoever

[hybrid plover]

But it does significantly raise the cleave value or rather, decrease the hit mass.

[ember nest]

^

[unreal forge]

I will never take hotshot over surgical or weight of fire bruh

[ember nest]

Bro went into the sourcecode to look at this

In the 1st vid

[tame lodge]

Hotshot is just Shock and Awe

💀

[tall torrent]

I literally knew about hotshot months ago lol

[signal garden]

going into fatshark source code?

[hybrid plover]

Surgical is a non option.

[signal garden]

must be like plunging headfirst into a jungle

blind

[hybrid plover]

The second depends on the mark

[signal garden]

and reduced FoV

[tame lodge]

Not quite

[unreal forge]

yeah for Mk4 not getting WoF feels terrible

[hybrid plover]

Hot Shot is a perfectly fine choice if you're not using mk4

[tame lodge]

Some stuff is easy to manage

[ember nest]

Sure I'm not disagreeing

I'm just saying that level 1 acts weird

[tame lodge]

Fatshark actually name some stuff very helpfully

Then there's 3 types of axe

[tame lodge]

One of them being the shovel

Or all different kinds of combat blades

💀

[hybrid plover]

Yeah we're aware.

[tall torrent]

combat blade = ogryn cleaver
combat knife = knife

[tame lodge]

What's devils claw again

[tall torrent]

combatsword_p1

heavy sword is combatsword_p2

duelling sword is combatsword_p3

[signal garden]

heavy sword? whys it called heavy

does it mean im going to need a carry?

[tame lodge]

See what I'm talking about?

Some stuff is properly named

Others are just 500 versions of combat sword/axes

Autoguns

Staff

💀

[signal garden]

and then shovel i imagine is rolledupyogamat_p1

[tame lodge]

It's one of the combat axes

[void dragon]

I mean, shovels are kinda like axes...maybe in 40000years in the future (?)

[hybrid plover]

It's an oversized falchion

Falchions are already naturally heavy so I guess it checks out

[signal garden]

big sword

little damage

like the eviscerator

[hybrid plover]

Wat

Heavy sword actually does good damage. Against anything that isn't carapace tbh

[signal garden]

theres some ramp up isnt there

[hybrid plover]

But that's the big problem with it.

[signal garden]

like you need 3-5 swings

which is antithetical to a veteran sharpshooter who only needs to get a pack of enemies off to start shooting again

powersword, with tis stupid activation ability, which is antithetical to getting a pack of enemies off

not to mention blocking dissipates the charge for no reason inconsistently

[arctic rampart]

in DND falchions are versatile and scale off dexterity. you're welcome, I know you enjoyed this useful information!

[hybrid plover]

True. They're also surprisingly heavier than one might think.

[signal garden]

a slashing sword needs to be heavy i fee

like i dont go about cutting people but you cant cut through a hunk of meat easily unless your knife has a decent amount of weight to it

[hybrid plover]

Yep. Needs the weight for the momentum.

[signal garden]

like a roundhouse kick, you follow through and if you kick right your ass is in danger of leaving the ground in some cases

[grand perch]

another h40 applicant. chainsword inclusive

[arctic rampart]

h40 chainsword? y u hate yourself?

[signal garden]

goes for stamina cost reduction in havocs, but not stamina on ranged evade

the mad lad

[grand perch]

ive seen shittier builds but not many

[signal garden]

all 4 stealth ability nodes

"no sir I dont want my tax exemption, in fact i want to opt into MORE TAX"

[calm shard]

dude I don't even know how to approach this one

[signal garden]

@calm shard "im sitting here for hours waiting to be accepted into a party!"

[hybrid plover]

I did not take a picture but one of the applicants for a Havoc I was doing yesterday

Smokes.

VoC

But no golden toughness

With a devil's claw and revolver

[hollow ibex]

maybe he's doing a challenge run

[hybrid plover]

Nah I'm fairly certain he was newer.

[hybrid plover]

Cuz he was clearance level 16 meaning he must have just did an auric Maelstrom and said, "well now I'm ready for a havoc 35!!!"

They'll learn one day.

[narrow frost]

@grand perch

[hybrid plover]

Oh dear god.

[narrow frost]

a baby level 31 in my havoc 40

instant accept

[hybrid plover]

This poor little baby.

[grand perch]

the horror

[hybrid plover]

LMAOOO

[hybrid plover]

I mean. I guess this can work but what does the rest of the tree look like then?

[calm shard]

the rest of their tree is not funny

and thus irrelevant

[little path]

It would be cool if the always prepped talent was better

but it only really works with the revolver and double barrel

revolver is fine, only issue is havoc scaling

[past stratus]

https://tenor.com/view/mike-o-heam-giga-chad-gigachad-sigma-male-gif-14252379233135682789

[little path]

double barrel is odd

[signal garden]

why exactly does revolver have such poor ammo economy

[little path]

it was the original armor killer

[signal garden]

and for that matter, why is the double barrel worse that the executioner shotty in almost every way

@little path to be more specific, when they started powercreeping, why didnt it get more ammo to compensate

[little path]

the revolver was the original "Fuck that guy in particular" gun so they wanted it to have bad ammo

it still does a very good job of that

[narrow frost]

@grand perch

[little path]

just that the # of enemies has increased to make it awful

[tame lodge]

Because it's a broken (compliment) weapon

[little path]

also havoc scaling

[tall torrent]

revolver is the best gun outside of havoc

[little path]

basically does the job the plasmagun wants to do

make that crusher have a really bad day

[signal garden]

@narrow frost the absolute kings who wait to lv30 to graduate from malice difficulty

[little path]

as for the double barrel

holy shit does the base cleave need to be bumped waaaaay up

[signal garden]

less ammo than the executioner, less range, less damage per bullet

double barrel im convinced is a joke weapon

[calm shard]

nah just man-stopper abuse

[little path]

yeah that's what I mean

did you roll a crit? Congrats entire horde is gone

did you not roll a crit?

congrats you kill 8 poxwalkers

[signal garden]

which on vet is not bad

arguably

[little path]

the change that I would personally want

is for another DB mk

maybe an over under double barrel

[signal garden]

yeah, make it an SB

same ammo, more damage per bullet, good at all ranges

[little path]

side by side sawed off that we currently have gets its base cleave massively bumped up without needing manstopper

[signal garden]

yes i m aware thats jsut a mansized kickback

[little path]

so it can act as a more proper medium cluster enemy weapon

[calm shard]

the uh

double barrel we have is the short one

[little path]

ye

[signal garden]

the max-mastery skin has pretty long barrels

[calm shard]

Yes those skins are for the "base" mark of the weapon

Sometimes this is not a weapon mark that they currently have available

[little path]

basically just add another mark that acts as the elite killer that we want it to be

and keep the current one as a horde clearing one

that doesn't purely rely on manstopper

[tame lodge]

Tactical Axe Limbsplitter

https://tenor.com/view/desiler-giga-chad-gif-9574825124538696572

[little path]

60 fin

[hybrid plover]

60 finesse

[signal garden]

since when do melee hits reset the CD

[tall torrent]

so based

[hybrid plover]

I cri evritiem

[tame lodge]

Forever

Afaik

[little path]

it's weird

[tame lodge]

It's not the Efficiency blessing

[signal garden]

i feel like ive never seen it on the tooltip thats crazy

[little path]

it's like he read about good stuff

but doesn't apply it correctly

[calm shard]

yes because the tooltip doesn't tell you that xd

[little path]

he wants more strength so he took limbsplitter

[tame lodge]

Oh that's enhanced description mod

[signal garden]

@calm shard im having a meltdown here

[little path]

he heard that sprint efficiency is good

but he put it on his melee

[hybrid plover]

I mean, limb taker isn't the worst thing there at least

The 60 finesse though

That's. That's just shooting yourself in the foot at that point

[signal garden]

@hybrid plover yeah i think of all the things that isnt doing

[tall torrent]

it is

[signal garden]

less crit damage, less weakspot damage, less attack speed

all things the damned tacax needs

[calm shard]

god this mod should not allow me to do things like this

[signal garden]

and youre like "that i can do without"

[hybrid plover]

I dunno man, it's really bad but the dump stat honestly feels even worse.

[little path]

erm, it has limb splitter so why would he be aiming for weakspots? He should be aiming for the arms and legs

therefore, finesse is the dumpstat

[hybrid plover]

That is basically neutering the entire point of the tac axe

[signal garden]

i feel like attack speed should never be the dumpstat

[tame lodge]

Finesse dumped
Even worse weakspot/critical damage

So he doesn't need shred

[signal garden]

he doesnt need to be in that party either

[calm shard]

I wonder if shred is better than decimator if I don't have the damage for brutal momentum

[little path]

There's a line between for fun vs bad

this guy is sprinting past the line and trying to outrun the border patrol

[narrow frost]

@upbeat rapids

[grand perch]

yeah what are they thinking

[signal garden]

thinking?

[upbeat rapids]

based tbh

[misty canopy]

how to deal with crushers

😭

[sly orchid]

https://tenor.com/view/max-verstappen-shaking-head-its-bleak-v33tappen-gif-6331394222344426550

[pallid jetty]

dont play veteran

(no joke)

[calm shard]

okay manstopper agri with knife weapon specialist

kinda fun

I didn't expect agri to actually be able to do good enough horde clear as a knife sidearm

just a maelstrom but almost keeping pace with inferno psyker p gud

[gaunt hare]

krak

[calm shard]

veteran has a lot of good tools for dealing with them like the power sword, plasma gun, revolver, bolter, or even just taking rending on the skill tree to make crit weapons kill them too

[gaunt hare]

recon las headshots are also good

[calm shard]

Kraks are probably the worst option they have for them, but they've got options in their weapons and talent tree to help with them

[signal garden]

Kraks are a reasonable option I think

By ut only in a histg type scenario

[grand perch]

except for onslaught, recon lasgun does terrible carapace damage so dont do that

[signal garden]

Where the 5% procs like every second

But at that point probably it's an indicator your team in is carrying you hard

[narrow frost]

whuh

[calm shard]

For Bulwarks only tbh

[signal garden]

Oh well'st

Make krak 4 grenades base

Reduce the arming and detonation time

[serene bough]

3 kraks base is good enough i think

[elder fiber]

nah, kraks are the weakest nade but that doesn't mean we need even more easy crusher deletion

[serene bough]

they regen really quick with demo team in havoc

[narrow frost]

kraks are fine

no needc for change

[serene bough]

kraks could use a damage boost and some other tangent buffs

[elder fiber]

I'd rather kraks be the weakest nade option over the strongest

[serene bough]

they already do what they need to by removing reapers/bulwarks immediately they just need more boss dmg

[teal yacht]

Heya guys I’m trying out a knife vet build - would it be worth taking flesh tearer and mercy killer on the knife if I take the serrated blade talent?

[ember nest]

the grenade tinkerer node should make kraks explode twice

idc if it makes sense

[tame lodge]

No

[narrow frost]

mercy killer if you run serrated for the funny but bleed blessings are overated and arent worth it normally

[tame lodge]

Try Uncanny Strike

[elder fiber]

nah, mercy killer with serrated is okay but you're better off dropping that talent node

[calm shard]

If you take serrated you don't need a bleed blessing

[teal yacht]

Ah mega thank you all - I use flesh tearer nd riposte with no serrated atm

[narrow frost]

I use serrated lacerate flesh tearer

https://tenor.com/view/silly-funny-reaction-meme-stan-twt-horse-gif-5445268815333743861

[ember nest]

surely this horse would not lie

[tame lodge]

I still recommend to try Uncanny Strike

[grand perch]

there ainz goes leading the youth astray again

[teal yacht]

Aye I’ll swap out flesh tearer for it see how it works ty!

[narrow frost]

nuh uh

[teal yacht]

Still very new to all this

[grand perch]

yuh uuuh

[narrow frost]

@teal yacht try this out

[teal yacht]

Lovely thank you again!

[misty canopy]

thanks :)

[tall torrent]

what's ur melee

[past stratus]

you hit them in the head but you don't let them hit you in the head

[misty canopy]

maccabian dueling for now

[tall torrent]

That’s like
One of the best crusher killing melee weapons in the game

How are u struggling to kill crushers with it

[misty canopy]

idk when theres like 5+ of them

[orchid hemlock]

Have u tried poking them in the head? 🤔

[misty canopy]

will give it a go

[orchid hemlock]

[marble mantle]

Is there a preferred mark of power sword? Or dealers choice

[tame lodge]

Mk6

It's slightly

And I mean

[teal yacht]

How comes?

[tame lodge]

Slightly better

Than mk3

[marble mantle]

So, doesn’t matter that much?

[past stratus]

Mk6 cleaves a bunch

on lights and heavies

which is what you need on vet

[marble mantle]

Ah

[tame lodge]

It does matter because slightly better still better
It's just that mk3 doesn't really fall behind

Specifically because mk6 push attack is better single target

[hollow ibex]

Mk 6 is a decent amount better tbh

[tame lodge]

Than mk3 pa

[marble mantle]

Dueling sword and knife both dump mobility, yes?

Or no

[tame lodge]

Yes they both dump mobility

Dueling Sword second dump option is cleave

But that one affects Unarmored damage

[past stratus]

Mk6 you click power up and go M1 M1 M1 and everything in front of you should be dead

[marble mantle]

Got it, thanks

Ok last q for now

What kind of curios does vet want for a VOC FT build?

[tall torrent]

VI
It’s all around better than mk3 in every metric

[marble mantle]

Word

[tall torrent]

Health / toughness / stamina
Perks kinda up to u

[marble mantle]

Oh so one of each?

[tame lodge]

My advice is to get 201 HP then the rest toughness or stamina

[marble mantle]

Interesting

[tall torrent]

Yea it’s good

Health
Toughness
Stamina

Gunner x2
CDR x2
Corruption / docket x2
Toughness x3

This what I run

Corruption for havoc

Docket for base game

[tame lodge]

Still running dockets

https://tenor.com/view/peaceemote-peace-peaceful-gif-15091939045954194911

[tall torrent]

Yea why not

[past stratus]

my problem is rarely dockets, it is usually diamantine 😔

[tame lodge]

I don't know you but I've hit the cap

https://tenor.com/view/hay-money-sleep-gif-14635828

[normal bay]

The eternal struggle

Until one day, it isn't

And you are free

[floral hearth]

hey, i havent been able to access the pinned veteran guide of yours for a while, is this a known issue?

Or just something on my end

because it wont go further than the first page

[normal bay]

Works ok for me on mobile

[hybrid plover]

You want uncanny tbh

You already have good base crit with knife. You wanna try and stretch what the bleed can actually damage since it does virtually nothing against carapace and uncanny helps significantly on thst front

Personally tho, precog or executor + uncanny are also good

Executor especially on mk6 with the cleaving heavies and really accurate push stab

[deep bone]

Ngl I’m absolutely having a blast with the Mk.VII Infantry LasGun

Gun is doing me justice

I got Headhunter and Falter on it

Might switch over to HH Deadly Accurate

[signal garden]

Try it on ||zealot||

[deep bone]

No

I don’t play zealot

[signal garden]

Wow

[deep bone]

lol

The only class I have rank 30 is vet

I don’t enjoy the other classes

[signal garden]

Playing all the classes I've learned to be respectful

[deep bone]

That’s fair

[signal garden]

I expect my zealot to try

[deep bone]

I don’t mean disrespect

[signal garden]

My vet to try

[deep bone]

I just don’t play the other classes so I can’t really try it

[signal garden]

My ogryn to need a diaper change from how braindead they are

And my psyker to fail

And my arbites to run out of ammo

Insight is a healthy thing

[tall torrent]

have u tried opening it as a pdf file

[half glade]

Wanted to ask for a while: are everybody ok with how grenade (blitz) automatically bounces back to previously used weapon after each throw, or it's just me who don't think it's convenient? In many cases you need to throw several of those, and it's super-awkward when you need to constantly go to it again. Or do I miss some checkbox somewhere in Controls settings which allows to customize it? It just feels like it would be much better if you could just manually go back to previous weapon by hitting Blitz button again, when you are done throwing nades

[signal garden]

In many cases?

[hybrid plover]

When you see the arbites with a Mk3 and you realize you're never seeing a single big ammo bag

[signal garden]

There's a quick toss mod

I.dont use it but I'm aware they have your gripe

@hybrid plover what are they gonna do, race me to the red bag? Good luck

[radiant compass]

After blitz mod too

[half glade]

well, if you need to quickly clear a room, you need to drop two frags

[signal garden]

If I need to clear a room I'm finna use my gun

[half glade]

that's won't be fast enough in too many cases

[hybrid plover]

You're an arbites. Your very existence will clear the room basically.

[signal garden]

I feel like waiting for a room to die to shredder bleed is marginally slower than shooting the room

Marginally faster I mean

[half glade]

two frags immediately remove all chaf in a room in 100% cases, while dropping to the ground everything else. then you just kill what's left with 1 hit each

[signal garden]

Well regardless there's a mod for that if you want to quick nade

[half glade]

you are not supposed to fix it with mods, though, it doesnt' appear as useful to me in the first place, so I wonder if it's just me and why FS decided to do that

also, not sure if that mod correctly handles throwing grenades from stealth. You need to underhand throw them to not drop stealth immediately. Important for a stealthy fragger build

[sonic kayak]

SOULJA, UP AND WEAPON READY, NOW!

[signal garden]

I feel like any offensive move that keeps you in stealth is very much against design philosophy and unintended

Like, straight up bug

And that shouldn't matter since the grenade should be staggering anyways

Your opening move is a free stun at that point

[half glade]

not really, if you consider how shitty vet's stealth is, it really has NO upperhands over other two Abilities even like that.

[hybrid plover]

It does when you're in the middle of a really dense horde tbh

[half glade]

it has a niche use as a rat build for havoc, but the rest is just meme/fun builds

[signal garden]

If you're using stealth to run into a really dense horde I'm not sure that's a correct use of stealth

[half glade]

like, in almost any case when you'll consider to use an Infiltrate build in this game, you will 100% in much better place with Shout or even Executioner Stance

[signal garden]

Other classes swing away or do something else, and besides you get free suppression in reveal

[hybrid plover]

Assuming you'd run into the horde and not that you're already in the horde since you don't have an automatic stagger button

[signal garden]

It almost sounds like you're selling me on why I shouldn't use stealth

Which most people seem to be suggesting already

[half glade]

and lol? you have 45s base cooldown, and the Shout has 30s, makes you invulnerable to tons of things and throws/staggers everybody around you

[hollow ibex]

that works tbh

[signal garden]

So what even is the issue

[hybrid plover]

Run into horde. Throw many shredders. Many things die.

[hollow ibex]

run into a crowd. drop some eggs, unstealth (stun), and start meleeing everything

https://tenor.com/view/watchmen-gif-8794746