yep
#veteran-class
royal pike
and the train mission is best
can i stay at the back for the whole mission?
or like be downed
dry cloak
theres cheese for it
royal pike
alr
agile forge
Gold toughness op
tall torrent
critical attacks from plasma gun generate x40% of the normal amount of heat (that is immediately gained from firing)
queen sky
wait, why? surely that's a downside?
tall torrent
the heat amount gained during the pre-fire delay is unchanged
queen sky
oh, 40 percent
tall torrent
it's 1-3 extra shots before forced venting depending on RNG
queen sky
i read that as x40
thanks
is Infernus laspistol still good for melting tough targets?
tall torrent
which targets
queen sky
uhh, monstrosities, maulers, crushers
ragers
can you just dump a magazine into them and wait for the burn to melt them?
pseudo fiber
You mainly used that on pus hardened enemies in havoc but theyre gone so
queen sky
aah ok, so now it's just a hipfire hose?
tall torrent
can you just dump a magazine into them and wait for the burn to melt them?
infernus only stacks burn up to 12, which isn't that much dmg most of the time
it's just "there"
if u had to use it, use it on mk2
mk2 is overall much better than mk10 as well
gilded rock
i read that as x40
If you crit you FUCKING DIE 
Do NOT crit on a plasma build, worst mistake of my life
unreal nova
If you crit you FUCKING DIE <:LETSFUCKINGGOOOOO:989672320404713492>
Or you just run insane crit, but only shoot once every min or so.
manic badger
it's 1-3 extra shots before forced venting depending on RNG
The other blessing gives me guaranteed 2 extra shots maybe 3 can’t remember if it was a total of 10 or 11 shots before overheat. Seems like that’s just a superior blessing unless you really want to constantly gamble for one extra shot.
calm shard
WS gives you ONE guaranteed crit
the fire rate is the only thing that persists for your gun
tall torrent
The other blessing gives me guaranteed 2 extra shots maybe 3 can’t remember if i...
optimized cooling loses all stacks when u stop continuous fire
focused cooling works better if u shoot a few shots at a time
stoic thorn
WS gives you **ONE** guaranteed crit
Guh.
manic badger
I don’t think I have ever played a single other game that does as bad of a job at wording and elaborating upon mechanics as this game does.
frank basin
focused cooling works better if u shoot a few shots at a time
Focused cooling mentioned 
calm shard
I don’t think I have ever played a single other game that does as bad of a job a...
yeah
don't forget the ones that are outright wrong
unreal nova
I don’t think I have ever played a single other game that does as bad of a job a...
Well, I guess you don't play their older games. XD
gilded rock
don't forget the ones that are outright wrong
Grenade tinkerer having used to give stun immunity is so funny
thin minnow
Best ability?
calm shard
Voice of Command
quiet valley
Talent point? Or Active Ability?
calm shard
the other 2 aren't close
viral chasm
any tips for getting long throw penance?
thin minnow
Voice of Command
Augmented volley fire is bad?
And is there a DMR like weapon? Like a sniper that's not too slow
calm shard
executioner's stance is usable if you are EXTREMELY good at the game
But it'll still be worse than Voice of Command
viral chasm
And is there a DMR like weapon? Like a sniper that's not too slow
the second variant of vigilant autogun and hellbore lassgun maybe
calm shard
And is there a DMR like weapon? Like a sniper that's not too slow
Graia Vigilant Autogun, Mk IIIa and Mk V helbores
viral chasm
too bad this game only have scope for lassgun
calm shard
Oh yeah Mk VII lasgun is also adequate for a marksman-esque weapon
thin minnow
Nothing else has a scope? Smh
calm shard
Or the Agripinaa infantry autogun
Also yes without mods the lasguns and laspistols are the only weapons with reflex sights
calm shard
no weapon in game currently has a scope
(without mods)
closest you get is the lasguns and laspistols that have reflex/collimator sights
(red dot sight basically)
thin minnow
Don't like those bleh
What about pistols
Any you can use for long range?
Bolt pistol maybe?
calm shard
I think every pistol in game has quite good range
thin minnow
65% mobility autogun, nice
calm shard
except for the blue revolver variant that doesn't ADS and instead fans the hammer
thin minnow
I think every pistol in game has quite good range
Shredder autogun
Is that one any good?
It looks cool
calm shard
Shredder Autopistol cannot ADS
It is best used as a secondary for a very melee focused playstyle
So it's really more a Psyker/Zealot thing
Heard it's pretty fun with Executioner's Stance though since it makes your spread much tighter
distant plaza
But it'll still be worse than Voice of Command
i'm kinda new to the game, what makes VoC better than ES?
thin minnow
Seems to just refresh armor and stagger enemies
calm shard
It's just much more versatile
thin minnow
Just something very cheap and simple
atomic void
golden toughness and stagger
calm shard
The stagger and durability allows you to play much more aggressively
calm shard
And even if you're using your gun primarily the area stagger gives you plenty of breathing room to aim without having to dodge for a few seconds
tame lodge
Aoe extreme stagger with normal toughness replenish that can be turned into golden toughness
viral chasm
I wanna go for an officer look with a pistol
you got bolter pistol
tame lodge
Golden toughness would be able to tank the black fortress and save Cadia
thin minnow
you got bolter pistol
Nice
tame lodge
calm shard
I would say as far as pistols being a primary go the Laspistol would be the best one followed shortly by Bolt Pistol
Revolver doesn't have enough ammo
remote sonnet
But pistol as the main weapon
Laspistol
It is commonly used by officers and commissars. It has more ammo and versatility than bolt pistol in game.
For vet especially, you get las weapon talent, which makes it even better.
warm idol
i'm kinda new to the game, what makes VoC better than ES?
knockback + toughness regen on demand + gold toughness which means you dont take chip damage
distant plaza
knockback + toughness regen on demand + gold toughness which means you dont take...
so a kind of 'oh shit' button?
warm idol
plus unlike zealot's beacon where you can't attack while using it and needs to pulse for the full effect VoC lets you go straight into the action since it instantly applies the effect and doesnt holster weapons
warm idol
so a kind of 'oh shit' button?
you can use it for that while also just using to give your team the extra toughness and create some breathing room via staggering enemies
it's very versatile
and each specialist you kill shaves off a part of the cd
distant plaza
huh, well i guess i'll have to give it a try now
hollow ibex
so a kind of 'oh shit' button?
You can be literally about to die, hit F, and become invincible for ten seconds
warm idol
exe stance and infiltrate require so much more effort to use
it's kind of sad
but atm voc feels like the only thing vet has going on in havoc outside of ammo and nades
remote sonnet
VoC stagger also works on bosses.
warm idol
yeah it's also amazing for that, and useful for things like getting teammates out of a chaos spawns grab
remote sonnet
"If you can breathe, you can kill."
"If I'm dead, I can't kill."
Literally the Cadian vet voice line.
unreal nova
but atm voc feels like the only thing vet has going on in havoc outside of ammo ...
It basically is though. Everything else needs buffs. If we take Oggy to be the standard now.
warm idol
HAMMER OF THE EMPEROR
remote sonnet
Basically, you kill more by the fact that you are alive.
warm idol
NO DYING TILL I SAY SO
unreal nova
yeah it's also amazing for that, and useful for things like getting teammates ou...
Just walk close as a last resort.
warm idol
yeah it's kinda crazy how strong oggy is
like yeah it's a fucking ogryn
but you can run an fnp taunt build and still do great damage
warm idol
while having stuff like rumbler
unreal nova
but you can run an fnp taunt build and still do great damage
While vet either goes ultra paper glass and still does less.
remote sonnet
GL is such a strong Orgryn weapon.
unreal nova
Or goes tankier but also does even lesser than the avg oggy of equal skill.
remote sonnet
I find it more versatile than the rumbler.
warm idol
you mean grenadier gauntlet?
they have different uses tbh
rumbler is more versatile with it's group killing and monstority damage while gg is better for specialists
unreal nova
Rumbler also is better at higher ping cos AoE anyway.
elder fiber
Rumbler is more versatile in that its broken
unreal nova
GG at over 50 ping, GL hitting anything.
unreal nova
Projectile direct hit weapon + 300-400 ping = ...
hollow ibex
Rumbler is more versatile in that its broken
thin minnow
Made a zealot for fun lol
arctic rampart
zealots are an investment in insanity
red robin
zealots are an investment in insanity
ADHD mfs play zealot and it’s like taking meds to relax
Speaking from experience
remote sonnet
Which one?
For the lore, the Mk10, powerful slow shooting.
For gameplay Mk2, fast firing, high dps, benefits more from blessings.
agile forge
I love the talent that makes ogryn not slow down while prepping a heavy
With the speed boost from bullrush
Feels like I'm figure skating, swinging a cruise ship's anchor around
remote sonnet
Zealot talent tree needs some change, but zealot itself is pretty strong.
worldly coyote
A lot of zealots swapped to ogryn
I rarely see zealots in matches I noticed. Mostly ogryns. That's probably why
sharp epoch
Zealots were the most popular class, but h40 meta is looking like 2 ogryns, 1 psyker, and a zealot/vet
agile forge
Havoc is a specific thing though
sharp epoch
Well anything below that there really isn't a meta because any comp will do
spark cipher
Zealots were the most popular class, but h40 meta is looking like 2 ogryns, 1 ps...
h40 quad ogryn
sharp epoch
its really about having the most ogryns without missing anything important, golden toughness and bubble
unless the ogryns are just good emough to do without those
hollow ibex
Zealot talent tree needs some change, but zealot itself is pretty strong.
tbh relic blade goes a loooong way for zealot
red robin
strongest braindead class to the next strongest
So who’s the thinking man’s class, psyker or veteran? I know this vet chat but try to be objectively non-biased
faint beacon
So who’s the thinking man’s class, psyker or veteran? I know this vet chat but t...
At this point im torn on Zealot or Veteran from how Dated they've both become
though veteran when not in a good scenario of killing things
will fold far faster than Zealot
red robin
Like, which of the two requires more thought and work to situate themselves in a bad situation
quiet valley
Zealot tree is just boring, Vet tree is just bad
faint beacon
Psyker when its not an OP Build or Vet
red robin
Even that wording has my bias in it
faint beacon
thats honestly my opinion
quiet valley
I'd agree Zealot/Ogryn are the two easiest classes to play
They have a lot of safefy nets for bad players to make mistakes and not get punished
red robin
I’d say I try harder with aiming on vet, but on zealot I just hipfire or spam shots I barely use
Lmao I got way better ammo management playing zealot than I do on vet
spark cipher
Like, which of the two requires more thought and work to situate themselves in a...
Psyker doesn't really have much for "safety nets" besides shield
red robin
Yeahh
Psyker is really just breathing room management
If you can independently manage that without requiring teammates to babysit you or be overdependent on smite, you in the upper echelons of psyker playing
warm idol
is it just me or is the fps on hourglass maps absolutely awful
warm idol
like i'm on a 4080 and it still drops to below 60 there
hollow ibex
Psyker doesn't really have much for "safety nets" besides shield
psyker gets a lot of defensive tools, it's just up to you whether you want to bring them really
red robin
But maybe delete your shader cache and verify game files to clean out the bloat
red robin
psyker gets a lot of defensive tools, it's just up to you whether you want to br...
Does puncture on bolt pistol proc on assail without holding the bolt pistol? Or do you need it in your hands before it hits to proc it
hollow ibex
assail is affected by puncture?
i knew warp slice was
if it's the same thing, then yeah you need the bistol in your hands while the shard hits the enemy
spark cipher
psyker gets a lot of defensive tools, it's just up to you whether you want to br...
I mean yeah there is kinetic deflection and force sword/fgs with deflection, but nothing quite like VOC, Chorus/FotF, or ogryn just pressing left click
red robin
Lmao ain’t the zealot throwing knife immediate so puncture would just apply on throwing knives?
If you have the weapon equipped of course
spark cipher
Lmao ain’t the zealot throwing knife immediate so puncture would just apply on t...
yeah, pretty sure zealot can't even equip them, it's just a quickthrow
hollow ibex
I mean yeah there is kinetic deflection and force sword/fgs with deflection, but...
fortunately psyker doesn't get golden toughness
it's a braindead enough class already
spark cipher
fortunately psyker doesn't get golden toughness
wasn't so much saying golden toughness, I was referring to a quick "refill toughness option"
hollow ibex
wasn't so much saying golden toughness, I was referring to a quick "refill tough...
well it's not instant, but quietude can be pretty fast
same with mettle on the right setup
agile forge
wasn't so much saying golden toughness, I was referring to a quick "refill tough...
All psyker abilities can give a bump tbh through quietitude
Venting and SG both quell 50%
And dome at least regenerates toughness while standing in it
Which helps so much if you're having hits slip through in melee
faint beacon
Psyker's only weakness when it comes to the class in general is if you generally dont know how to manage your toughness you will go down a lot, but they do have a handful of safety net talents that being very ease of access Toughness Gen talents and Empathic which turns off the biggest threat to taking chip damage in the game
that being ranged enemies
Veteran just recently got a Talent that can let them ease against ranged chipped which is Catch a Breath's change but admittedly its not the best for the sole purpose of even if you block an attack it goes down on Cooldown
I'll admit the Psyker's skill floor is the highest cause people get funneled out by how squishy it is
but it literally can nuke maps when you know how to play the class correctly
spark cipher
Veteran just recently got a Talent that can let them ease against ranged chipped...
Granted, the entire game really discourages blocking as a whole beyond absolute emergancies
faint beacon
Which I think is stupid imo
Cause Relic Blade is the one rare melee where blocking is generally useful in a handful of scenarios
Its stamina consumption on block is incredibly low thats the big reason
that and Activation-Deactivation is counted as a blocking state
spark cipher
ogryn and psyker are the only classes I really end up ever blocking with, and most of that blocking on ogryn is just the autoblocking during a revive
faint beacon
Zealot can block a bunch as well
the reason Veteran is discouraged heavily from it is cause
Low stamina and High Delay on stamina
so you generally dont have much up time with stamina outside of your keystones
Honestly that and the 2 delay decrease nodes vet can pick up are really the only big things helping with keeping your stamina topped off outside of Duck and Dive and thats not incredibly helpful in dire scenarios
its an okay talent
but why path that way when Reciprocity is right there
Its honestly a big reason I've been viewing veteran very much as a class that's "All or Nothing"
cause if you cant get kills you will feel incredibly weak
but if you are getting kills you actually feel useful
Keep in mind this is keeping VOC out of the question cause thats probably the one big glaring issue Veteran has
spark cipher
I feel like the only class that isn't hard bottlenecked in ability choice is ogryn tbh
faint beacon
Zealot is ancient and the other choices massively kneecap your DPS
Zealot is probably the biggest Bottlenecked by Ability choice followed by Veteran
Ogryn and Psyker are probably the only 2 that genuinely can choose their 3 choices and still be incredibly useful and or have a really good build
the only issue Psyker has is probably the tax on trying to reach a Far Left/Right keystone
Like shriek into Disrupt if you're trying to run that for some reason
I Guarantee right now if the tax on Veteran's tree was trimmed we'd see a lot more EStance and Infil users but also consider that VOC is just so fucking strong
quiet valley
Vet rework 2026
quiet valley
faint beacon
Dead serious they should return the Instant reload to Estance and give it either like TDR on ADS or Regen on ADS so it can at least compete with VOC
Infil?
I Have no fucking clue I dont play it enough
but it does need its tax nodes trimmed a bit
hollow ibex
instant reload definitely
idk what to do about durability
maybe make it like FOTF
50% toughness restore
hollow ibex
nah durability is def an issue
quiet valley
Instant reload I sleep
hollow ibex
esp with the way the tree is currently set up
quiet valley
Ranged TDR is what it needs
spark cipher
I Have no fucking clue I dont play it enough
I mean it's not as terrible as people make it out to be, just extremely prone to misuse.
calm shard
stacking TDR and toughness regen for weak spot kills during exe stance?
and that persists shortly after it ends?
quiet valley
like crazy ranged TDR during ability
calm shard
or just the old 75% TDR it used to give on activation
faint beacon
Personally I just like the idea of if you're actively aiming you get rewarded with regen
quiet valley
I should pop Exec stance and be able to peek gunners on H40
faint beacon
and TDR? Could either be very high when ADSing or just like 50% or under if its static the entire time the ability is up
quiet valley
VoC should not be better at picking gunners than Exec lol
TDR only for ranged attacks
spark cipher
Like infil is great for res and objectives, I just think the cooldown is a bit too high (considering voc is 30 seconds) and there's too many tax nodes
faint beacon
45 seconds, gives max Toughness and drops all agro on you
that and its longer than shroud its pretty fucking good
just VOC literally does what it does better
quiet valley
Stealth is just bad in Havoc thats all
faint beacon
Its bad mainly cause you're fucking your team over
it really serves like 1 purpose and 1 purpose only
quiet valley
Shit needs to die on havoc
calm shard
Shit needs to die on havoc
easy make infiltrates 30% damage boost base kit
(and also 10 seconds instead of 5)
spark cipher
(and also 10 seconds instead of 5)
isn't it 8 seconds base?
calm shard
isn't it 8 seconds base?
the damage boost node
quiet valley
Also make Kraks do dmg XD
spark cipher
the **damage boost** node
oh
calm shard
faint beacon
Honestly Idk how to explain Veteran
he's "weak" cause he's just old
very dated
There's a lot of things he has that could use the most minor changes and a handful of actual talents that need reworks
and then the obvious tree shuffle to help with the insane point tax
and boom
Fixed
quiet valley
Covering Fire dead since release
faint beacon
Smoke needs some sort of gimmick to encourage you or your team to stay inside of it even against melee
spark cipher
Demolition stockpile being a 100% pickrate
calm shard
Covering Fire dead since release
forever worthless
faint beacon
I know path said it should give you massive stamina buffs inside of it
calm shard
shit was even on the pre class rework talents and still useless
quiet valley
Smoke is mostly fine, just needs to remove ground effects/gas
faint beacon
Call me insane but you think this should get changed to "You and your Team"
quiet valley
that would be nuts
sonic kayak
Let him cook
faint beacon
Kindaish?
dry cloak
remove voc
faint beacon
Its more like they just nerf VOC
and raise the bar for Infil and Estance a bit
and its fine
dry cloak
just place normal plus 10 tougness node
faint beacon
but remember
a majority of players play Veteran on Malice
they will freak the fuck out if VOC gets nerfed
as much as I want it to happen
hollow ibex
if ogryn and psyker can exist
so can voc in its current state
and this is coming from a guy that doesn't play voc
warm schooner
been looking at builds in havoc party finder to see what people are playing
oh no
quiet valley
Post the treee
hollow ibex
he had agile engagement AND serrated blade
Tbf could be extreme based on the right build
quiet valley
Dclaw serrated blade 💀
orchid hemlock
One Crusher:
grand perch
Dclaw serrated blade 💀
extended dclaw usage would make me desperate for any kind of bonus damage too
faint beacon
Im getting behind Skirmisher when im specifically running more stamina focused builds mainly cause im constantly keeping stacks above 2+
that and bless every keystone for having at least an option of being able to get stamina back from doing X thing
spark cipher
extended dclaw usage would make me desperate for any kind of bonus damage too <:...
Dclaw: Making flak feel like carapace since release
faint beacon
time to try out shredder pistol exec + mmf build
I mean it is mainly cause you could do VOC
but yeah it destroys Bosses
tame lodge
Plus extra impact on exec
grand perch
it destroys ragers as well
ngl its kinda fun but mmf is so hard to keep up
you need like all the ammo on the map
those unholy ammo pickups
void dragon
time to try out shredder pistol exec + mmf build
Wish that every other autogun was not just a lesser Vraks, really don't see the niche of the others when it just performs so good in almost every scenario
It's not an anti sniper but that's the only thing I feel it doesn't outperform
hollow ibex
Agri is ok tbf
hollow ibex
those unholy ammo pickups
Shredder never changes
sharp epoch
Wait you got 5 ammo crate charges wtf
grand perch
2 psykers and an ogryn that didnt need em
sharp epoch
I've had a bolter zealot take 7 charges while I was vet could be worse
shredder ap is pretty ammo hungry I guess
calm shard
I've had a bolter zealot take 7 charges while I was vet could be worse
bolter zealots infuriate me
brother you are a melee class with a fucking dueling sword
the best anti-elite melee in the game
why do you magdump your bolter into literally everything that isn't a poxwalker
what are you D OING
void dragon
what are you **D OING**
You are telling me they don't only mag dump prior engaging in glorious melee combat against the champion of the arch enemy? Sissies
atomic void
why do you magdump your bolter into literally everything that isn't a poxwalker
because its peak
dueling sword is boring
me boltah helps me kill armor better
shrimple as
thin minnow
of course you cant, there is nothing there
mossy monolith
tame lodge
something wrong with my vet
Nice Geodude
mossy monolith
mr arm
unreal nova
bolter zealots infuriate me
Be self-sufficient enough to not need crate charges unless forced to clutch with room clearing frag spam.
heavy rover
primal scarab
Hello, what blessings to take for the tactical axe?
tame lodge
Shred Headtaker
Shred Brutal Momentum
Headtaker Brutal Momentum
primal scarab
Thank you
trying new weapons, wondering if it's the same for the regular axe
gonna try them out yet, dont know which does what.
primal scarab
For the Combat Axe is Headtaker Brutal Momentum
remote sonnet
Wish that every other autogun was not just a lesser Vraks, really don't see the ...
Agri has similar dps to vraks.
Columbus is lower, but it has better ammo eco.
agile forge
It's not an anti sniper but that's the only thing I feel it doesn't outperform
In E stance it's good vs snipers
tall torrent
Agri has similar dps to vraks.
not rly
hollow ibex
Once the range is long enough it will
void dragon
Agri has similar dps to vraks.
When the distance is enough to justify a Helbore lasgun then sure, otherwise Vraks just annihilates every competition in its preferred range
elder vessel
trying new weapons, wondering if it's the same for the regular axe
Regular axe is CBT
Tac axe is slightly better. Still CBT
narrow frost
Guh?
slow sky
If by cbt you mean cock and ball torture
Whar
elder vessel
imagine not cleaving in this meta
narrow frost
What
elder vessel
what's not clicking
narrow frost
Do you know what Brutal Momentum does?
narrow frost
Even without it, it'll cleave
Besides maybe mk4 taxe because moveset
And BM also adds extra damage
slow sky
I mean yeah in the case of caxe
But that blessing kinda instantly makes whatever weapon that has it OP
slow sky
Bm/db moment
tame lodge
Needing a blessing for basic functionality
I mean
With the exception of Achlys combat axe lights
All axes cleave
🤓
slow sky
Wholesome 1.5 cleave
pseudo fiber
blessed 1.5 cleave
tame lodge
Even the chain axes that have no cleave in some attacks have cleave in another
faint beacon
Achlys Caxe moveset be so good till you realize everything else about it is doodoo-dogshit
spark cipher
Achlys Caxe moveset be so good till you realize everything else about it is dood...
Literally me
tall torrent
Achlys Caxe moveset be so good till you realize everything else about it is dood...
moveset is not good about it
Needs rework
slow sky
Mostly overhead lights meaning it can't make any use of bm
Lole
supple laurel
deadass my dumbass made the dumpstat cleave without noticing 🥀
narrow frost
do not take hp melee damage
you can take toughness damage
so run center ability on a low intensity malice mission
frank basin
Or lfg someone will guard you for extra measure
I done with my friend doing over watch penance
remote sparrow
fair enough
narrow frost
and keep spamming ability to keep up gold toughness
remote sonnet
When the distance is enough to justify a Helbore lasgun then sure, otherwise Vra...
Not from my experience
faint beacon
deadass my dumbass made the dumpstat cleave without noticing 🥀
The accidental perfect dump stat
faint beacon
Power Sword tends to prefer Mob seeing its a lot more helpful on veteran
@narrow frost Your Favorite
primal scarab
cring
I did 2 maelstorms with the tac axe using the second mark, I am more concerned with the weapon's armour pen dmg than the cleave itself to be fair
cobalt lance
I have the ghost blessing on my vigilant autogun
Yet whenever people shoot at me while im clicking heads I get damage indicators
remote sonnet
It lets you know that something is trying to kill you.
Same thing with Psyker invul to ranged attack on crit hit.
void dragon
really not love how weakspot hit dependant is the inf Lasgun, on averanges it CAN deal comparable damage than a Recon but its lowest of body shots are DREADFUL when compared to the ones from the recon, you NEED to land headshots or you have a nerfed weapon, whch would be fine if the recon and infantry had the same recoil on shot, but spaming shots on its makes quite easy to miss
void dragon
really im physically struggling to play veteran, its just doesnt feel right
void dragon
Wait till you see it's maniac damage
doesnt really feel that different, what's the issue with maniacs?
narrow frost
Always has felt lacking but I might be thinking of vigilant auto
void dragon
recon and infantry do averange same damage, but recon stacks fire MUCH faster (woncer how much that is carrying the weapon)
hollow ibex
really not love how weakspot hit dependant is the inf Lasgun, on averanges it CA...
worst part imo is reverse dropoff
faint beacon
Always has felt lacking but I might be thinking of vigilant auto
Actually yeah you're thinking the opposite
Las and Vigil are inverses oddly
narrow frost
I see
faint beacon
Vigil is better with Flak and Las is weaker against Flak
void dragon
close and with headshots it deals LESS than a recon what in the actual HELL?!!
faint beacon
but Vigil is god awful against Maniac
void dragon
obesefish plz
remote sonnet
Manstopper round. Lore!
hollow ibex
and Las is good against Maniac
laspiss is bad against maniac too though
hollow ibex
but that's just laspis
void dragon
worst part imo is reverse dropoff
who was the idiot to test the inf lasguns and said "yeah, this is good" ? it should have benefits for good gameplay, not detriments from using it how the game will demand the most!
hollow ibex
its a pistol
shredder: am i a joke to you still
hollow ibex
who was the idiot to test the inf lasguns and said "yeah, this is good" ? it sho...
implying they test anything
remote sonnet
Laspis has damage drop off instead of reverse drop off...
faint beacon
Pistols usually deal less damage at the cost of more ammo and just good burst damage
in games that is
hence I think Deadshot Lasp X is honestly
pretty damn good
quiet valley
hence I think Deadshot Lasp X is honestly
I've been summoned
LasX propoganda lets goo
faint beacon
I've always wanted an excuse to use LasX for ages
I just never found the way to harness it and then Deadshot is just
right there
LMAO
quiet valley
XD
faint beacon
Deadshot helps with Vigils but I'll admit
seeing I've dumped what
2k hours now into that gun alone?
Deadshot is more of a huge QOL buff
but can go without it
faint beacon
Its pretty good but dont run MMF
you dont get enough stam uptime
FT is better for it
quiet valley
Deadshot is dmg and ammo efficiency for LasX
faint beacon
So if you do, run Deadshot on Vigil do FT + Target Down!
cause its way better Stam Effeciency for it
hollow ibex
Its pretty good but dont run MMF
i've only been running MMF because of the meme toughness regen tbh
faint beacon
even though MMF is insane on Vigils
hollow ibex
maybe i'll try deadshot instead
faint beacon
Deadshot is dmg and ammo efficiency for LasX
Makes it not feel sluggish either if you run Powersword cause that fucking mobility will always make me feel off
quiet valley
You can out pace stam drain with FT on the XIV Recon
quiet valley
Makes it not feel sluggish either if you run Powersword cause that fucking mobil...
Laspistol Mobility slaps
remote sonnet
I wish that they buff the slow firing laspis.
faint beacon
I think its honestly okay
but thats how I feel with the Vigils
they're fun to play when built correctly
remote sonnet
It should get the actual HEAVY laspistol title.
tribal owl
I cant seem to stay alive as vet is there anything that gives good toughness regen? or do i just need to not be dogwater?
faint beacon
but idk if its cause they've been powercrept or if they're just niche choices that I happen to like
remote sonnet
I cant seem to stay alive as vet is there anything that gives good toughness reg...
VOC
quiet valley
I cant seem to stay alive as vet is there anything that gives good toughness reg...
Vet is kill stuff or Die atm
faint beacon
dying to melee or ranged is my question
tame lodge
I cant seem to stay alive as vet is there anything that gives good toughness reg...
Out for blood
faint beacon
Also yeah what Scab said
tame lodge
faint beacon
veteran is very much a class of Drought or Drown with toughness
if you cant kill you're in a drought of toughness and you'll tend to get hit more
if you're killing, you'll be set
tribal owl
fair
void dragon
the guide suggest ghost and desperado for the blessings of the lasguns, i take inferno while useful isnt great for the ammo econ of the weapon?
narrow frost
Depends what you are using it for
And where
If you already using Deadshot and opening salvo, you probably don't need more crit so you can use burn. But burn doesn't do much outside havoc besides unyielding. Unsure on how much it does in havoc
grand perch
Burn is good in havoc
narrow frost
Considering the density of unyielding yeah
quiet valley
Infernus only really gets value on Unyielding and Maulers for H40, It will save you a couple extra shots randomly but the main thing is the non weakspot boss dmg which is so good
quiet valley
Yes iirc
grand perch
You know what would be fun? Giving vet the ADS mobility of laspistol on every weapon as a passive
quiet valley
Vet cope 2026
faint beacon
Do bulwarks take unyielding burn damage?
I believe they do
grand perch
Zoom around with bolter aimed
hollow ibex
You know what would be fun? Giving vet the ADS mobility of laspistol on every we...
would make up for shooter vet builds being fucking glacial lol
grand perch
Yeah that's the thought behind it
hollow ibex
(in addition to having shit stam)
void dragon
still quite shocked how dreadful the stamina regen of vet is
what's Path's posture on Infernus for laspistol?
quiet valley
yeah Vet is old or smth
void dragon
current one i mean
grand perch
look cadian vet just doesnt get to jog and build consitution a lot anymore, on account of the planet being gone. cant run on space dust
void dragon
needs his cane to keep up with the common Ogryn and Psyker player
smiker using the shredder like is an actual good weapon, meanwhile vet is shaking its fist on new stuff
hollow ibex
shredder's good on vet too
faint beacon
Live image of veteran players waiting for any new weapons
void dragon
Live image of veteran players waiting for any new weapons
New weapon? im sure that deal is delayed in need of an actual perk tree that is better than the mess we have live
umbral scaffold
what should I be running on duelling sword for perks and blessings
uncut pebble
Live image of veteran players waiting for any new weapons
Live image of zealout players waiting on a new tree:
frank basin
Live image of veteran players waiting for any new weapons
Tbh I’m bored of Darktide for now
void dragon
<:5_joe_thinking1:1177002783652716615> what should I be running on duelling swo...
The "Emperor's Hammer" guide in pins have the answer
void dragon
Tbh I’m bored of Darktide for now
Kinda same, Psykers and Orgyn feel quite neat to try some variations of builds, but not only wish that smite and Brain burst on Psykers were more engaging, zealot and veteran are genuinely not much fun to play imo
frank basin
Kinda same, Psykers and Orgyn feel quite neat to try some variations of builds, ...
They need tweak for more fun
Skill tree is same corner I was uninterest at first seeing
Keystone zealot is okay and some node kinda boring
Veteran keystone need make more interest to play rather snipe yell dodge and shoot
Looks to me like wannabe zealot
Except the snipe and shoot
I get guardsmen is marksmen infantry
void dragon
Keystone zealot is okay and some node kinda boring
Nah the zealot keystones are garbo, they are just damage with a ribbon, there is not an engaging mechanic or game style unlocked by them
frank basin
I wanna play veteran like ogryn
You know machine gun
Dakka dakka
But ogryn took vet job after talents rework
Now he’s just sniper zealot commander
void dragon
I want to play Tank paladin zealot and Rambo machinegun Vet, absolutely they should have weapons like that (the braced A guns should be slow but be kings of dakka
frank basin
I want to play Tank paladin zealot and Rambo machinegun Vet, absolutely they sho...
Rambo Machinegun vet is my favorite
Seeing on talent art on left
He shooting machine gun
void dragon
Yeh
frank basin
I still have machine gun Rambo loadout is keystone less
My ogryn is a tank machine gunner with ammo hungry but vet is sort fitting for machine gun role since survivalist
That were nerfed
void dragon
They really need to fix the perk tree of that 2 classes, I want to use the lil bro zealot, I think I have figured enough orgyn builds for a while, from grenadiers to leman Russ tanks
Meanwhile zealot has...oops, they are basically all the same carp
umbral scaffold
The "Emperor's Hammer" guide in pins have the answer
Appreciate it
umbral scaffold
Getting back into the game seeing so much has changed lol
Vet still suffering with barely any new melee
frank basin
Just the maul
umbral scaffold
💔
frank basin
The maul is cross class new melee
umbral scaffold
Yeah Is it any good or meh
frank basin
Not really my kind
void dragon
I do have ogryn run GG with PBB
Honestly GG feels that it has a lot of ribbons and restrictions on its damage for no good reason
umbral scaffold
It shock enemy electrocute target
Well I used it a bit before I took a long break
But never fully dived into it
void dragon
Imo vet only has Knife and power sword as melee options (I don't and never will count DS)
void dragon
The Shredder is legit scary on a psyker
frank basin
True
void dragon
Heavy sword still trash?
Heavy sword is probably the non meta best weapon it has, it's REALLY good horde fighting tool, but struggle with caparace
void dragon
Idk why the overhead swing doesn't have ok caparace damage, it's not that easy to chain and its not like it's horde clearing is SOO good, it should deal more damage imo
frank basin
How heavy sword got little outperform to devil claw?
umbral scaffold
For power sword is there a big difference between its marks or nothing really
frank basin
Eh I run Taxe when I use plasma
narrow frost
For power sword is there a big difference between its marks or nothing really
Mk 3 heavy spam
Mk6 is PA into lights
PA can 1 tap anything outside boss and crusher
But the follow up light will kill
void dragon
For power sword is there a big difference between its marks or nothing really
Mk6 is the clearer winner of the Power swords
umbral scaffold
Hmmm
void dragon
The capacity to turn it on for immense cleave AND being able to combo from 100 to 0 a crusher in the right build is valuable
void dragon
The guide is quite accurate for today's Darktide until ObeseFish decides to make changes to the weapons on a significant way (probably would still be usable even on a Zealot and veteran post perk rework)
formal ice
Heavy sword still trash?
Is Dclaw still good
formal ice
Its the universal sword balance
narrow frost
If you need something from the newest one I can check it
stoic thorn
Is the shock maul good
dry cloak
shockmaul is better than chainsword in my experience
it will serve you well
try it
just done expect miracles
also tazing crushers balls is fun
faint beacon
An extremely low bar to climb admittedly
tame lodge
Smykers?
Only if you pick Charged Strike
But you know
It's charged strike
But just thinking about it
You won't have boss damage at all on psyker if you go smite shock maul
No sustain for a gun
No Assail for long range DD fishing
stoic thorn
shockmaul is better than chainsword in my experience
I like the chainsword more
grand perch
chainsword is so sad but tricks people into liking it by having easy horde clear and a seemingly good single target
tame lodge
💀
umbral scaffold
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GqjF3yvXwAEXScG.jpg
“2005 Ram 2500, emissions deleted and new injectors. $35,000 firm, I know what I have.”
grand perch
autopistol with exec and MF is really silly fun. if only they gave you more max ammo
severe jolt
Shock maul is great because it can straight up punch through a bulwark's shield with the special attack.
deep bone
grand perch
autopistol with exec and MF is really silly fun. if only they gave you more max ...
stupid fun
just delete ragers np
agile forge
autopistol with exec and MF is really silly fun. if only they gave you more max ...
Does autopistol even have decent finesse modifiers?
I can see E stance being good to tighten up the spread though, at least
grand perch
It's about 1.5 finesse modifier now I think
balmy flume
just delete ragers np
Wow that is full gangster mode...
finite carbon
Hey, is desperado an additive buff to your finesse, or a multiplicative buff?
calm shard
additive with weak spot damage/critical damage, multiplicative with other sources of finesse
at least I think that's how the crit mods stack
dry cloak
stupid fun <:KEKW_ogryn:1022077188322906163>
good you have seen the light
yeah ammo in the only probelm
grand perch
good you have seen the light
i mean its not quite the cowboy revolver vs bosses but this dinky pistol comes close
dry cloak
agripvolver is in its own league
lime pendant
stupid fun <:KEKW_ogryn:1022077188322906163>
Can you break down the pistol build? I can’t decipher the perks specifically
Is it crit percent chance and elite dmg?
Oh wait I was misreading the chart. It’s flak and maniac. Nevermind.
lime pendant
Just ran a match with that build, it IS fun.
grand perch
well ive done this
unyielding instead of flak. no flak bonus damage hurts but not too bad
lime pendant
Wouldn't it be better to substitute flak for maniacs as maniac classified enemies are also flak armored plus including a few others like the various gunners?
Genuine question, still learning.
Or is this specifically for "I fucking hate ragers" type of build
grand perch
maniac type enemies arent flak armored, theyre maniac armored
dry cloak
yup
grand perch
shredder has bad flak armor damage, so +25% on top of that wasnt that much
hollow ibex
lol yeah i have a dedicated boss SAP
i wonder if i should dump collat on it instead of mob
lime pendant
I thought they were flak torso and carapace heads?
hollow ibex
scab ragers are flak heads, caparace torso, dreg ragers are just maniac
lime pendant
Ah thank you for the correction!
So damnation and auric would likely benefit from carapace and flak reworks
midnight wyvern
i mean its not quite the cowboy revolver vs bosses but this dinky pistol comes c...
whats the funny build for the revolver?
Ive just been using a bolter setup to nuke bosses/wake up and kill Daemonhosts
grand perch
whats the funny build for the revolver?
Ive just been using a bolter setup to nu...
theres a variant where you go marksmans focus instead of FT, which can do more damage but is very hard to pull off, Ft is more consistent
that build does this:
its really meme though, due to overspecialisation
umbral scaffold
Does the pinned guide say what curios set up we should be using? And what perks we should use on it
hollow ibex
Does the pinned guide say what curios set up we should be using? And what perks ...
there's a curio section
should cover what you're looking for
fossil creek
calm shard
its really meme though, due to overspecialisation
and also because the bolter can do the same thing with more ammo, and being better everywhere else
orchid hemlock
brother was holding on to dear life
loud belfry
floral flicker
anyone got a good plasma/power sword buuild for me to spring off of. havoc 30+ ready that is
paper totem
sonic kayak
anyone got a good plasma/power sword buuild for me to spring off of. havoc 30+ r...
They all build the same way really; only question is if you want frags or smokes
floral flicker
always frags
sharp epoch
@floral flicker
sharp epoch
combat regen on cuurio im guesssingg
I like taking like one or two of everything
2 combat regens 2 stam regens 2 toughness uhh 1 block efficiency 1 spring efficiency 1 revive speed I forgot what else
lime pendant
2 combat regens 2 stam regens 2 toughness uhh 1 block efficiency 1 spring effici...
Revive speed instead of voc rez?
sharp epoch
Revive speed instead of voc rez?
for curios
hollow ibex
Revive speed instead of voc rez?
and never take voc rez
slow spade
Voc rez is a noob trap
tame lodge
Revive speed instead of voc rez?
It's better to just yell really loudly very often to keep your team alive than save the shout to Rez someone up
warped ruin
hallo convicts
i has question for 2025 veteran
Does power cycler not stack as a blessing anymore. (for the power sword of course)
slow spade
Does power cycler not stack as a blessing anymore. (for the power sword of cours...
You can't stack Power Cycler 2 and 1 if that's what you mean
hollow ibex
max you can get is 3 powered attacks before recharging
warped ruin
Is it worth as a blessing or would you recommend something else
hollow ibex
PC is mandatory
warped ruin
Ty praise the emperor
hollow ibex
unless you enjoy being far less effective, and enjoy suffering that is
warped ruin
xD
slow spade
I always find it funny Power Sword has one of the widest selections of useful blessings but you can only really use 1 because Power Cycler is mandatory
sharp epoch
I always find it funny Power Sword has one of the widest selections of useful bl...
thats vet, taxes on everything even blessings 😭
royal pike
what does a plasma gun god roll look like
loud belfry
68.x (where x is an unseeable decimal value where you can shoot 8 times without it overheating) thermal, 72 charge
aka 68 thermal 72 charge but not all 68s are created equal
grand perch
@tired egret
floral flicker
torpid grotto
aka 68 thermal 72 charge but not all 68s are created equal
I keep seeing this but I also hear this was due to a bug that was patched
loud belfry
dont think so
last time i saw someone mention themselves having a 68 that could fire 8 times without damage was just a month ago
grand perch
I keep seeing this but I also hear this was due to a bug that was patched
You're thinking of something else which is based on misinformation regarding the charge rate dump
hollow ibex
I keep seeing this but I also hear this was due to a bug that was patched
Reddit lies
torpid grotto
Tell me lies tell me sweet Reddit lies
tall torrent
what does a plasma gun god roll look like
tall torrent
I keep seeing this but I also hear this was due to a bug that was patched
bug about this was patched yes
but it's godroll for an entirely different reason now
the bug was charge rate affecting damage (has been patched)
but the godroll distribution is same because it gives u max number of hipfire shots before venting, while giving u lowest possible pre-fire delay so it feels more responsive to shoot
torpid grotto
I see
loud belfry
i wonder what the value needed to get 8 shots is. is it 69.01 or some shit like wtf
void dragon
hey @tall torrent can i ask you about what you recomend for the Hlas pistol? i know what the guide suggest but want your PoV on stuff like infernus and concentrated fire
tall torrent
hey <@366562874039992331> can i ask you about what you recomend for the Hlas pis...
concentrated fire is abysmal dogshit
infernus just exists
dum dum basically mandatory
ghost is super strong for dealing with infantry
mk2 is a lot better than mk10 (much better dps and handling)
void dragon
mk2 is a lot better than mk10 (much better dps and handling)
thanks for the review info, think i got all i needed
tall torrent
I tested boss dps between the two
dum dum + infernus
mk2 hit better boss dps than mk10, even when mk10 is using deadshot
both mainly aiming for headshots (mk2 is hipfiring for headshots)
mk2 has instant sprint to fire (which mk10 doesn't have)
mk2 has slightly better sprint bonus and aim movement speed (because it dumps stability so it has max mobility)
void dragon
how much dps is lost on non infernus ones?
tall torrent
how much dps is lost on non infernus ones?
not much
if u had to use infernus, mk2 still uses it better because it shoots faster
it doesn't matter for any particular "breakpoint" or "shots to kill" case against priority enemies
void dragon
think will give ghost a permanent spot, it has saved me some times in havoc, again thanks mate
tall torrent
infernus stacks burn up to 12
which is not that much dmg
it'll help boss dps a bit but that's about it
quiet valley
MKII has better burst DPS than MKX but its not nearly as ammo efficient
Burn ticks are good value, you can get them to tick for 400/500 a sec in Havoc with debuff/buff stacking
You don't have time to burst a boss 1-100% all the time with weakspot dmg, so the consistent 12 stack ticks are very comfy in high pressure situations
You apply stacks and deal with something else
quiet valley
I think generally MKX is better for full ranged build, MKII is a better sidearm for melee builds
tall torrent
mk10 base total dmg is 46.13k
mk2 base total dmg is 43.5k
both with +25% reserve ammo
mk10 has a 6% lead there
but it's worse in pretty much every other metric
mk10 also has 10m better falloff
ig that sorta matters
quiet valley
The main draw for me is better Deadshot stam eco, and the handling feels better when you can 1-tap most shooter/specials
tall torrent
but both are pretty bad at long range
tall torrent
would have been a very different story if those were scab ragers
void dragon
would be crazy to make the Auto pistol have better dodge speed/distance and sprint prorfiles than the Infantry? pistols are supposed to be more handly and fast, but the gun is basically the same in those stats
i think it has even worse dodge distance than the bulky hand cannon that is the bistol
yeah just checked and even worse sprint speed, what the hay?
mossy monolith
finish a achievement, tho why is it so tiny
void dragon
Never heard of any auto pistol
remember that weird evil ninja guy that was fighting a bunch of turtles? well, i think we made him a gun
willow canyon
Is there a blessing or node that makes it to where I restore ammo on elite melee kill
void dragon
the "Survivalist" aura has exactly that effect
willow canyon
Ty
quartz river
narrow frost
a classic ip grabber
shrimple as
https://tenor.com/view/hello-wyd-cat-scratching-cat-scratch-cleaning-screen-gif-15994084353171838166
charred dome
what do you guys prefer on the rashad?
narrow frost
BM HT
really the only combo that makes it excel so much
BM is that strong
Brutal Momentum
charred dome
Oh I am using bruhmentum
I just noticed decimator and was like I wonder if I want this over headtaker
what perks? I've been using cara and elite
charred dome
why unarmoured?
charred dome
I'm trying to test the breakpoints and I keep critting 
bruisers die in oneshot at max headtaker stacks, I can't even test it on gunners because it keeps critting lmao
I'll try flak unarmoured
umbral scaffold
For power sword what perks should I be using on it?
umbral scaffold
The most obvious one to take
Oh that’s blessings lol
I have my blessings done
I just wasn’t sure what I should do for the perks
formal ice
Perk and blessing
Potato and broccoli
All the same thing but one is worse
Anyways its carapace and maniac
umbral scaffold
Anyways its carapace and maniac
sharp epoch
cara unyielding gang
tall torrent
what do you guys prefer on the rashad?
unarmored/elite
carapace
brutal momentum
headtaker
tall torrent
For power sword what perks should I be using on it?
carapace
elite
gives u best breakpoints with minimal talent dependency
can also 1 combo (2-hit) crusher and bulwark in h40 with red nodes active
orchid hemlock
No Rashad in Havoc 
umbral scaffold
carapace
elite
Appreciate it
Time to get back into the game for havoc and mortis trials
formal ice
Appreciate it
Hey wheres my thanks?
I was the one who suggested carapace first
He is just copying me but better
umbral scaffold
Hey wheres my thanks?
Thanks for the help as well💯
tall torrent
Appreciate it
sharp epoch
is that rampage brutal momentum on it?
serene bough
been considering running unyielding on psword for boss DPS
wish i could test breakpoints in H40
magic trout
Dump stat for helbore?
sharp epoch
been considering running unyielding on psword for boss DPS
yeah cara unyielding is the way
sharp epoch
Dump stat for helbore?
stability
magic trout
Thanks
tall torrent
is that rampage brutal momentum on it?
power cycler + BM
tall torrent
wish i could test breakpoints in H40
u can, just do maths
tall torrent
been considering running unyielding on psword for boss DPS
it doesn't matter too much cuz power sword's sustained boss dps isn't that great
losing elite means no more dreg rager 2-hit (base game) or 3-hit (havoc)
manic badger
Is there something I don't know are Kraks considered bad or non meta?
tame lodge
Something something only purpose deleting bulwarks something something
manic badger
it deletes clusters of maulers and crushers all the time
tame lodge
Current meta melee deals with that with ease
manic badger
the dueling sword instantly deletes 8 maulers stacked on top of each other?
tame lodge
So, do you need crushers stacked for Krak?
Why not go frag with an uncanny weapon
No need to stacking
See?
tall torrent
Is there something I don't know are Kraks considered bad or non meta?
they're a bit niche and can use some buffs
but they do achieve what they're supposed to be good at
tame lodge
In case you go with a melee/ranged incapable of carapace damage
hollow ibex
they're way too niche righ now
tall torrent
In case you go with a melee/ranged incapable of carapace damage
nah they're ok even for weapons that can kill carapace easily
because it still removes whatever u chuck it at
I just think they need to be a lot better for single target crackdown, specifically bosses
manic badger
I just bring them on havoc seeds that have crusher/mauler spam with the empwoered enemies that heal
hollow ibex
they realy need to do meaningful boss damage without tossing 3 of them
and explode much faster
manic badger
They should apply stacks of brittleness with grenade tinkerer similar to how shredders get increased radius
slow spade
A faster detonation would be nice
tame lodge
Real
tall torrent
They should apply stacks of brittleness with grenade tinkerer similar to how shr...
nah it won't matter
people grossly misunderstand what brittleness actually does
manic badger
is it not just team wide rending?
tall torrent
do u know what rending does then
manic badger
interacts with whatever armor damage modifiers a weapon has
so low ADM gets more benefit
tall torrent
yes, so
attacks that have high ADM don't benefit nearly as much
40% brittleness is only 10%dmg for attacks that have 100% or higher ADM against that specific armor type
manic badger
yea but if the explosion applied brittleness in its radius things like bleed and burn would benefit alot
and soulblaze
tall torrent
not necessarily
because soulblaze and burn both have 100% or higher ADM against everything but carapace
manic badger
on carapace it would no?
tall torrent
and you're not counting on it to kill carapace basically ever
it'd be a lot better if krak applied a x%dmg taken effect to all enemies hit by its explosion
that's a much more transformative increase to dps
tame lodge
Aoe Skullcrusher huh
manic badger
I don't have any hope of seeing any changes inside of a 5 year period
tall torrent
Aoe Skullcrusher huh
skullcrusher is not x%dmg taken
manic badger
I think they've washed their hands of the trees
tall torrent
skullcrusher code is wack
but it's +%dmg
not x%dmg taken
x%dmg taken would be soften them up
tame lodge
tall torrent
I think they've washed their hands of the trees
someone said next update is gonna be big
in terms of weapon balance changes
sharp epoch
new vet weapon this year
serene bough
u can, just do maths
wheres the list of H40 health pools again
serene bough
Is there something I don't know are Kraks considered bad or non meta?
they're basically used for Boss DPS and removing bulwarks
tall torrent
just x1.5 to every elite and specialist
x1.7 to every monster (not captain)
x1.35 to every chaos faction horde enemy
serene bough
every now and then if you have extra you toss at a reaper whos harrassing your team, but otherwise thats their only niche
serene bough
just x1.5 to every elite and specialist
x1.7 to every monster (not captain)
x1.3...
tyty
ive actually come to appreciate kraks a bit more in higher havocs
void dragon
carapace
elite
is the lack of maniac not an issue for Psword? i remember i have it with it due the guide, its this better?
tall torrent
is the lack of maniac not an issue for Psword? i remember i have it with it due ...
maniac gives mutant 1hs with energized push atk with a specific setup, but only works for base game
it applies to neither havoc nor mortis due to increased enemy health pool
slow spade
found that out the hard way :c
also depending on your setup, you can also 1 hit mutants with a heavy attack on the weak spot
tall torrent
also depending on your setup, you can also 1 hit mutants with a heavy attack on ...
needs sunder for that
slow spade
needs sunder for that
yeah :c
Focus Target + Precise Strikes lets me get it on the Mk6
but without talents, needs the funny blessing.
hexed wave
Marksman's Focus should be replaced by an ability that let's you temporarily wield a specialty weapon I.e Hellgun, Grenade launcher, Longlaz selectable as a ability modifier
void dragon
MAN, i tried a build without any of the nade regen perks and it REALLY itch not having them, veteran struggles to get off situations where masses are immense, and not even mention bulwark congas, when you dont have shout for it or it spawns too frecuently is quite opressive.
slow spade
yeah that's why frags + nade regen are an easy go-to pick
void dragon
Marksman's Focus should be replaced by an ability that let's you temporarily wie...
isnt it better to swap exe stance? sounds more like an active skill than a keystone
slow spade
one of the few true "crowd control" abilities Vet has
slow spade
isnt it better to swap exe stance? sounds more like an active skill than a keyst...
make it activate both 
void dragon
one of the few true "crowd control" abilities Vet has
yeah, veteran really lacks many "ok you jerks GET OFF" buttons outside of shout and frags, which sucks because kraks should also do similar cc but when sticking that aoe is quite small
thinking of, making execute stance more of a keystone and replacing it with a skill to bring a heavy cc weapon for a small time (from a light machine gun from the art to the grenade launcher) would be really cool
hexed wave
isnt it better to swap exe stance? sounds more like an active skill than a keyst...
sorry a little drunk atm, yeah
grand perch
would have been a very different story if those were scab ragers <:KEKW_ogryn:10...
yes i would have deployed some of my 5 grenades