veteran-class

[radiant chasm]

You can simply stop dodging for half a second and you’ll get all of them recharged

[faint beacon]

Agile if it was on literally anything else might be noting but on the two weapons that already have extremely good dodge profiles

It’s basically a bait blessing

That and it encourages a bad habit

[radiant chasm]

It’s fun but yea bait

Kinda like everlasting flames

You never NEED to magdump multiple fuel tanks worth of fire, it’s inefficient

[faint beacon]

As overpowered as BM is it just gives you more vs Agile anyways

15% vs 10% that and it actually lets you horde clear multiple chaffe with the Taxe

[hollow ibex]

BM not great on mk4 tbf

[faint beacon]

Far more efficient than Agile

Besides Shred HT is there but BM HT gives more value for the Taxe in general

[haughty marlin]

I miss plasma vet before skill tree got juggled around

https://discord.nfp.is/?v=https%3A%2F%2Ffiles.catbox.moe%2F0uutdn.mp4&w=1920&h=1080

[faint beacon]

Plasma Vet is still extremely strong 🚬

[haughty marlin]

oh yeah, and you can call out target focus

but I feel like it was easier to just straight up bodyshot flak armored gunners

[hollow ibex]

Yeah agile is a trap

Running relentless strikes and HT rn. Sounds like a meme but it's actually pretty good.

[haughty marlin]

used to be able to just take every single flat 5% ranged damage node in the tree and go ham

[hollow ibex]

Best combo I found for mk4

[last marten]

blasma blessings?

🫄

[terse idol]

Thought agile wasn't that bad

[tame lodge]

Gets Hot Rising Heat number 1 choice

[terse idol]

There's always this discussion between agile and precog

[tame lodge]

People that say that precog is bad are tripping

Or just like Riposte more

Now Agile

You can stop dodging for 0.85 secs and get all your dodges back

Or you give up on a potential damage blessing for agile

[terse idol]

[queen fox]

Agile reduces brain cell requirements from 2 to 1

[tame lodge]

The appeal of brain off gameplay can't be underestimated

[radiant chasm]

It isn’t bad but it’s low value, it’s basically fun over function

It’s actual stat power is low and unlike BM, the effect isn’t worth say, getting much better breakpoints

If it was on say, thunderhammer, chain axe, 2 handed swords, hell maybe even power sword

It would be competitive

Ogryn would love it and it would fit on the cleavers for sure

[quartz nymph]

For clarification:

Single target:
[SP1 → L2] → [H1 → H2 → PA/L3]

This means sp1 and l2 can loop indefinitely. You can continue the combo from there with h1 > h2 > pa or l3 and that also loops

I just want to make sure I'm reading it right

[tame lodge]

Seems about right

[last marten]

🤔

[thorn lark]

You don't really need agile. Because you'll be push attacking a lot and using kinetic deflection. So it's very safe to block and regain all your dodges and start again

[hollow ibex]

Honestly taxe has such good dodges I don't think KD is needed

[thorn lark]

You use KD to spam PA

[hollow ibex]

Wdym

[thorn lark]

Your won't use your stam to block, so you'll have more of it for the rest. And Psyker has the best Stam Regen value.

[hollow ibex]

You don't need to block much anyway

So that's why I was saying KD isn't particularly important for taxe

[thorn lark]

You're in the blocking position to push attack.

[hollow ibex]

I actually don't run KD on most my builds

[hollow ibex]

Yeah but that's like 10 milliseconds lol

Before the PA comes out

Irrelevant exposure

[thorn lark]

I don't use KD on Psyker unless taxe or knife

[hollow ibex]

The main use of KD on something like taxe is if you want safer revives

Which I can understand

It's a personal choice though

[thorn lark]

My experience as taxker is the following: it's a nice to have. I can block more, rez safely, spam push attacks.. and

AND

It's on the way to DD

And I have no use for the other talent lmao

[hollow ibex]

Yeah I mean whatever works

I'll take KD for patching reasons usually, and that's about it. Don't find myself ever actually needing it.

[quartz nymph]

Peak team

[grand lintel]

happened to me yesterday too

Weird because I don’t see any ogryns on difficulty 4 or higher

[faint beacon]

You’ll see then occasionally in Auric

More common to see the 3 Human classes

[quartz nymph]

I want to get a naturally occurring 4 man ogryn stack one day

[verbal fulcrum]

I made a high crit shot gun vet build, can't send a pic but i got over 800 critical hits in a game.

[tropic halo]

Rare sight

You might see one or two ogryns in a match from time to time but three or even full squad is a pretty rare occasion

[grand lintel]

canon reason is that the more ogryn there are the more cramped it is, making it harder for Zola to try to convince them to get in the valkryrie

[unreal nova]

Just offer triple rations.

[grand lintel]

Triple rations and a reminder that the emperor thinks they’re very brave

[tame lodge]

Offer triple rations and you'll have to stack ogryns like tetris inside the valk

[uncut pebble]

Nonsense. They'll stack themselves.

[gilded wraith]

Does decimator buff bleed? I didn't think that it did, but youtube has me questioning my sanity.

[indigo totem]

It does not, i just made a video and realised i mistook it for All or Nothing, which does @gilded wraith

[azure stream]

any weapons where the 5 CHC on weapons is worth? Been trying to clean my inventory

[hollow ibex]

5 chc?

[azure stream]

whoops thinking borderlands, the uhh 5 critical strike chance on weapons

[hollow ibex]

hmm

off the top of my head, i can only think of infernus recon

[radiant chasm]

No not really, maybe the fast firing recon but 25% damage perks are insane for priority targets, and affect the burn damage from infernus and bleed etc

The only crit chance weapon i know is voidblast with blazing spirit

[unreal nova]

One trick pony VoidStrike can use it as well.

But you can run it without. It's just to push the odds more in your favor.

[azure stream]

Hmmm true. I do have an Infernus recon with it, and a Columnus with the 5%. Still not used to the name change.

[radiant chasm]

Voidstrike gets true aim

[unreal nova]

It now sucks. Need 5 individual blasts for a crit.

[radiant chasm]

I mean you have flak and maniac as core, and unarmored and unyielding as alternatives, maybe carapace on a few weapons

[unreal nova]

1 stack per shot so...

[azure stream]

and alright. Thanks i'll sort through my stuff, (I need to reinstall the grid inventory mod)

[dapper plank]

reccomends for power sword blessings? power cycler + ???

[pallid jetty]

i run power on hit or kill, i dont rember

is there also brutal momentum

havent touched ths weapon for a while

[tame lodge]

Power Cycler then Brutal or Sunder

[dapper plank]

does sunder increase all cleave, or just on heavy/heavy energized?

[hollow ibex]

brumentum's better outside of havoc

[dapper plank]

does both of those make the second target take full damage or something?

[tame lodge]

Brutal Momentum makes 4 targets take full damage on weakspot kills

[uncut pebble]

Brutal momentum makes every target you hit, assuming the one before was a headshot kill, be considered the first target, so you do full damage.

It lets you do funny things, like behead five ragers in one stroke.

[pallid jetty]

like stroke five ragers

[tall torrent]

Recon & infantry autogun

[azure stream]

thanks

[dapper plank]

oooooo

but sunder is mostly for the cleave right?is it a big cleave bonus to all hits? or just to heavy energized?

[hollow ibex]

the cleave bonus is to all attacks

the damage bonus is to heavies

(energized)

you're still better off using brumentum outside of havoc

[dapper plank]

yeah i think so, and i'm unlikely to go havoc with power sword, it feels terrible to use

[tall torrent]

Sunder is 4x effective cleave and enables cleave through carapace

[white musk]

squeak (what are the 2 dump stats for assult chainsword?)

squeak (rat assumes the first is mobility)

[tall torrent]

U start by like, not using that on veteran tbh

[white musk]

squeak (rat must try everything)

[tall torrent]

Mobility is dump

[hollow ibex]

who let the rat in

where's the cat

[tall torrent]

Shredder stat is not too useful usually but it’s still damage

[white musk]

squeak (okay thank you frens) ❤️

squeak (what are some melee weapons you would usually recommend?)

squeak (say the top 8)

[tall torrent]

Veteran has 4.5 good melee weapons

[white musk]

squeak (the shock maul?) 😄

[tall torrent]

Combat axe III
Power sword VI
Combat blade VI
Duelling sword IV
Heavy sword IX (is the 0.5 because it doesn’t fight carapace well)

Tactical axe VII is pretty close to being good tho

Just need 3 extra perks and 2 extra blessings

[hollow ibex]

taxe mk4 😭

[tall torrent]

Not as good as VII

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/wrong-drumpf-trump-stupid-gif-6220235

(it lets me lmb spam with no effort or skill required)

[hollow ibex]

why do you prefer taxe 4?

lmb spam enjoyer?

[terse idol]

Do yall ever not take brutal momentum or similar talents ever?

Like, is there a situation where like... you couuld have more than 4 max cleave

So you don't take BM?

Or is BM just insane

And you take it or the equivalent every time

[hollow ibex]

i don't take brumentum on taxe

[terse idol]

Does BM like, limit your cleave to 4 max?

[hollow ibex]

because i don't use mk vii

[terse idol]

[radiant chasm]

Oop

Wrong reply

[radiant chasm]

Taxe struggles to hit BM breakpoints outside of horde, while it is useful there, it won’t so the big elite multikills the other BM/dblow weapons do

[hollow ibex]

yeah that's why i don't bother with BM on mk4

it's prob worthwhile on mk7 i would think

[radiant chasm]

Taxes also have a fair bit higher cleave than the combat axes as well

So they can use strength stacking well, and ofc shred is good with their high finesse

[wild vortex]

What do you use

[radiant chasm]

HT, shred, relentless, decimator

[wanton dawn]

Getting up from bad sleep and i see a red azreal

Tomorrow it is. But it is also 5 am

Fair enough

[radiant chasm]

Also god damn if taxes were better baseline they’d be insane

This feels like chaxe situation 2.0, their blessings are insane

And less carpal tunnel inducing

[wanton dawn]

"Top 5"

[radiant chasm]

Also the weird quirk with lights doing more dps to carapace

[terse idol]

damn I'm really underestimating the taxe

[radiant chasm]

Problem is taxe is between 2 amazing weapon types so it’s a middle child no one wants

[terse idol]

When the weapon isn't nuclear and my perception is fucked up

[hollow ibex]

HT / relentless for me. but shred would work too. i was just suprised at how well relentless work because i never take it on anything else.

[wanton dawn]

Well, is it better than shovel ?

[radiant chasm]

You want crit? Dueling and knife. You want axe? Combat axe. It’s about on the level of chain axe for me

But that’s my bias

[hollow ibex]

taxe is beautiful because even without melee talents, it's still not bad

good survivability stick

[radiant chasm]

Shovel doesn’t make my hand lock up after 2 matches

[hollow ibex]

i just use keep swinging

[wanton dawn]

I mean, boltpistol is also bug carried no ?

[radiant chasm]

What is bugged with bistol

Inb4 nades

[wanton dawn]

And strongest melee aka bayo was also bug carried

[uncut pebble]

This sounds really wrong. It functions like a diet rashad, at least for mk1 shovel.

[radiant chasm]

They fixed it for crusher maul but left nades, it’s most likely intended or else the blessing would be useless on all classes

[hollow ibex]

diet rashad (it's an african child that hasn't had food in two weeks)

[wanton dawn]

Cant lower in ranking cuz of that is ma point

Also didnt tax used to have a macro ?

[radiant chasm]

Shovel is my beat stick

[radiant chasm]

Taxe, chsword yee if we are thinking of the same one

Stack uncanny and bonk heads

https://tenor.com/view/tf2-soldier-team-fortress-2-soldier-tf2-beta-trailer-tf2-beta-soldier-gif-9350415498134172135

The sfx for mk1 is peak especially when you hit carapace

[wanton dawn]

I need a link to answer when ppl mention psyker macro about fs doing nothing or banning or other crap

[radiant chasm]

The link was in reference to simple macro (one action)

[hollow ibex]

wait what's the macro for taxe?

[wanton dawn]

I meant a video link

[radiant chasm]

I do not think it is a fair assumption that it would mean all macros are allowed

Oh

I thought you meant the old hedge forum post

[wanton dawn]

Well, could work as well. I cant find ref to it

[radiant chasm]

Idk if this is the same one craine is mentioned, but chswords and taxes had a macro back in the day that repeatedly swapped back to your melee and used L1 at ridiculous speeds

[wanton dawn]

They nerfed something

[radiant chasm]

It’s toned down no?

[wanton dawn]

Well, 40% slower IS something

[radiant chasm]

I’ve seen taxe QQ recently but not at the level of the oldschool macro

[wanton dawn]

You are bad psyker but i dont think it is macro related

[radiant chasm]

Also imo fatshark should discourage swap canceling since it’s unintuitive to new players (but that’s my opinion)

[wanton dawn]

I dont mind it

[radiant chasm]

Block canceling is better and healthier

Someone who’s first shooter game is darktide isn’t going to organically figure out swap canceling is the most efficient

[wanton dawn]

You are talking to a mono class stan who somehow got 300 more lvl than hour of playtime

[radiant chasm]

Yes i said swap canceling

[wanton dawn]

Am 1800 rn

[radiant chasm]

Not animation canceling in general

[wanton dawn]

Tru

[radiant chasm]

Animation cancels are good skill expression but they need to be something that players can stumble into organically

[wanton dawn]

Cant even answer back, they write themselves for me

Man i am too predictible

Rofl

Where the lvl 10k at

Must have at least one by now

K, i think the sleep pattern is knocking. Am gonna try squeezing 1 more hour of bedtime. Peace

[hollow ibex]

lmao ic

[honest pine]

Is the helbore lasgun considered not a very good weapon?

Heard this somewhere wanna verify

[tame lodge]

It's one of the best weapons in the game

Only held back by draw time

Good ammo economy
Good damage overall

Bayonet

Stable

[honest pine]

Okay yeah cause that was my thoughts lol

That its actually a goat las weapon

[fiery raft]

whats the general opinion on the infantry lasgun?

[honest pine]

slimy dog water

[fiery raft]

:(

[honest pine]

Yeah unfortunately it kinda just sucks

completely outclassed by Helbore & Recon las

Its like a jack of all but really mediocre about it

Doesn't have a niche

[tame lodge]

Havoc goated

[honest pine]

fr? 😂

[fiery raft]

what about the chainaxe?

ive never used it, i want to

[honest pine]

Its a fun weapon, better on zealot imo but still good

You can cancel the special by dodging

[fiery raft]

how does one build it?

[honest pine]

I'm bleed-pilled on it would need someone who's more numbers minded to weigh in on that probebly

Personally I live and die by the shovel/axe/tac-axe/knife on Vet

[tame lodge]

Ammo economy and access to infernus which ignore phs

[honest pine]

Helbore with Shock Trooper is that for me 🤔

[tame lodge]

Well Ilas will be faster at anti ranged duty

[fiery raft]

unfortunately i dont play havoc just yet

i just play auric damnation mostly

[honest pine]

I guess but its damage is so stanky

[fiery raft]

but i will keep that in mind for havoc

[honest pine]

Helbore 1shots ranged bozos

Charge-peek-blam, repeat

[uncut pebble]

Ilas also has ghost.

[tame lodge]

Just try to not get shot while charging/waiting for surgical

[honest pine]

okay that's one thing i can't argue with

[fiery raft]

what abt bolt pistol?

whats the build with that?

[uncut pebble]

Bolt pistol can be built for weapon specialist shenanigans with deadly accurate and puncture to shore up breakpoints or as a stat-stick for shredders to become even more room clear-y.

[fiery raft]

and the general consensus

i see

[honest pine]

@fiery raft btw don't worry much about havoc optimization havoc is its own little deranged corner of the playerbase that's ultra-hard at high levels, way more than even auric maelstrom missions

unless you're into that shit

[fiery raft]

rn im trying to get past being just a casual damnation player

like i said ive mostly been doing auric damnation

[uncut pebble]

Fun builds don't make that happen. Personal skill does.

[tame lodge]

Decent
Weird breakpoints but decent

[fiery raft]

yeah i know

im just trying to find new stuff to use rn

[fiery raft]

alright

i might try to build it then

rn im trying to fully master combat knife, chainaxe, and doublebarrel

[tame lodge]

Bistol has the Surgical Deadly Accurate for hunting heads
Surgical Puncture in case your crit doesn't kill the bleed will
Then Run and Gun Lethal Proximity for grenadier build

[honest pine]

The way I generally make builds is I'll try a weapon, see what I don'tlike about it and then pick talents that solve what I don't like about it as well as enhancing what its already good at

[uncut pebble]

You don't need surgical on vet. Weapon specialist exists.

[fiery raft]

the thing is that i dont know if its a me problem or a wep problem yk?

[honest pine]

For instance the double barrel shotgun I hate reloading in the middle of a brawl so I took weapon specialist with "always prepared" to auto-reload 1 shot every time I get a melee kill

[fiery raft]

i dont know how good i am at the game at all lol

oh well yeah for problems like that i understand

but especially with melee weapons

its hard to tell for me

[uncut pebble]

Vet, fortunately, is the class that allows you to approach your loadout that way.

[tame lodge]

But what if I'm not going Weapon Specialist

[uncut pebble]

Zealouts and psykers do not have such luxuries.

[tame lodge]

Well I guess Point Blank exists

[fiery raft]

what do you mean?

[uncut pebble]

Zealouts approach a loadout with a melee in mind, then choose a ranged option to shoer up the melee's weakness. Psykers do the opposite. Vets get to throw whatever and it sticks because you have powerful talents that let you brute force anything, with anything.

[fiery raft]

sweet

[honest pine]

Random tangent: Is it just me or is the marksman keystone just fucking garbage

[fiery raft]

just out of curiosity

what about ogryn

[tame lodge]

It's extremely niche

[honest pine]

Like moving constantly is so core to darktide gameplay especially in higher difficultis

[tame lodge]

Yeah you can do that with MF

[honest pine]

Standing still for any mount of time is a death-sentence

[tame lodge]

You don't need to stand still with MF

3 to 6 seconds grace on weakspot hits/kills

[honest pine]

Yeah but like

In the heat of a horde

With ragers running you down

And crushers

And muties

And gunner walls

[round canopy]

1 burst head height into a horde of trash and you have max stacks

[honest pine]

"Lemme just land a bunch of perfect headshots in the middle of this total clusterfuck"

[round canopy]

then use those stacks to kill everything that's tanky

[tame lodge]

Yeah

[round canopy]

use it with a fast firing weapon

[tame lodge]

Problem is that it'll force you into mostly ranged combat

[fiery raft]

i use it with bolter

probably not the best idea but its fun

[tame lodge]

And only a few weapons benefits of MF

[uncut pebble]

Ogryn is fat zealout.

[round canopy]

1 burst from recon lasgun into a bunch of poxwalkers and you have max stacks then use the massive damage boost to kill crushers or whatever else

[fiery raft]

ah i see

[tame lodge]

Unfortunately recons aren't really finesse-y weapons

[round canopy]

columnus then

[tame lodge]

So the MF buff is kinda eh

Yeah infantry autoguns go brrrr

So once again
MF is just a super niche keystone

Forces you into mostly ranged play style

Doesn't synergize with most weapons

[lunar sedge]

Does meta for vets on havocs all the same like always? DS + Plasma + VoC? For keystone the melee right one should be more fitting?

[austere mica]

Not even close

[uncut pebble]

MF allows you to hit some funny breakpoints but the drawback is you usually wind up fucking yourself out of any and all melee buffs that vet so desperately needs. Also, most weapons that could benefit from it, don't need it, because they already one or two tap the things you want them to, like green ilas dropping both gunner types in two headshots.

Or, yknow, helbores just instakilling every elite on contact.

[austere mica]

Including crusher

Just cause

[uncut pebble]

Helbores, with a specific setup and a blue stim, can kill a daemonhost before she fully wakes up.

[wild vortex]

I am using Recon Lasgun to do this and getting about 70-100 on the progress bar per match

Grindy? Yes. But at least it allows me to actually play the game normally and have fun

Or you could just do psword crab walk shenanigans idk

[hollow ibex]

ok i'll admit that lacerate knife isn't as much of a meme as i thought it was

probably because of how shit the mk3's attack patten is

not too bad for a 28 minute match

granted prob only hit 94k bleed because of flechette, lacerate and shredders combined

[astral ibex]

whats the best way to get the grenade achievement? get 5 hits with a grenade without bouncing

[slow sky]

throw it high up to where it explodes before it touches the ground, ideally above a horde

you can get an eye for the angle in the psyk, then do it in game in an open area with a high ceiling

[astral ibex]

on damnation for more spawn of cultist sto kill?

[honest pine]

I just modified my helbore build to do marksmen instead of tag keystone and aiming at around head-height into crowds as much as I can

Now that I'm getting used to it the rending & bonus damage isn't so bad....

[wild vortex]

I've never used helbore

[narrow frost]

@tall torrent you up?

[honest pine]

Its so satisfying

[tall torrent]

Wot

[honest pine]

Its what I wish the infantry las was like with the scope and everything

But having a bayonette is sick as hell too

[unkempt lichen]

Do puncture on bolt pistol and shredder nades have separate bleed stacks?

[narrow frost]

This

[honest pine]

I'm willing to bet that bleed has a shared max stack but I'm curious to hear 👀

[normal sparrow]

Still one stack no?

[honest pine]

I have no actual info on how it works just pure conjecture on what would "make sense" but this is fatshark

[hybrid plover]

no, they share stacks

[honest pine]

My assumption would be that all DoTs max out at like 12 each or something

[hybrid plover]

they max out though

[honest pine]

So if you're chadmaxxing DoT you'd want all 3 types of DoT being applied by a team

[hybrid plover]

Bleed maxes at 16

[honest pine]

Well that's purely based off of blessings saying "Maxing at 12"

Ah ok

Burn

I guess each DoT type has its own max stack

Its specifically Infernus I'm looking at

And I think soulfire says the same?

But I'm not checking so I'm probably wrong

well yeah i said I'm basing it on assumption & incomplete information

[indigo totem]

bleed and Sblaze is definitely 16 (not sure if you can still shriek to get 20+ stacks) i believe burn is the same iirc, infernus blessing indeed does work that way

but helps a zealot flamer get to max stacks and maintain it

DoTs are more or less a debuff on the enemy

all players share stacks

and use the initial persons application for damage

depending on their blessings, talents etc

and much like sharing stacks different team members can refresh those stacks

[hybrid plover]

Blessings like that mean just that that specific source caps out at that amount

Like Blazing Spirit for the force staves

[slow sky]

bleed is 16, soulblaze and burn are 31

[hybrid plover]

Caps out at 6 but using another source of that same kind of DoT will push it past the cap of the blessing

[indigo totem]

thats right gunlugger, a good reminder ty 🙂

[honest pine]

I c i c

How exactly do you get longbomb

Cause the frag doesn't stick

And you can't cook it

Do you just have to chuck it to africa

Like across the gulf on the underside of the hab block

[faint beacon]

Practice the angle but over 20m+ it'll detonate in the air

[hollow ibex]

airburst it like gale said

easiest is on maps with high vantage points overlooking where enemies come from

[honest pine]

So like the carnival with the drop-downs into open areas cool

[faint beacon]

Carnival, Clandestine, any Throne-side mission

as long as it has long corridors with open ceilings you can very easily do it

[honest pine]

Throwing it down immediately on gloriana and hitting a demonhost

[cedar reef]

i been playing with recond las,combat blade, running with bleed and burn crits. Feels pretty week sometimes. Anything like ogrynomicon for vet? or any recomendation for a really solid dps all rounder?

[honest pine]

there's one guy making a mega-vet-guide but uh

no eta on that being done

[cedar reef]

i was just hoping lol, the nomicon is extremly detailed

[lunar sedge]

Anyone? I'm very curious what people are mostly using on vet in havocs 30+, when everything is in constant state of chaos and with anti range hardened enemies

[lunar sedge]

In pins there's Hammer of the emperor. It's kinda updated for the moment, I think?

Still WIP

[faint beacon]

That’s post Itemization but it’s being reworked again for Steam + Grim Protocols

[tall torrent]

U can just ask me

Guide ETA is like a few months maybe lol

By the time I have it done they’ll have dropped first major patch of the year so stuff would need to be tweaked

[cedar reef]

lol ok , it seem like a huge undertaking

[cedar reef]

awesome ill take a look ty

so i love the recon lasgun, but it feels pretty weak sometimes, trying otu stuff i see in vids and guides, plasma gun comes up , it seems so awful lol what am i missing? ill end up using melee a lot or reloading for a million years when in high intensity it seems like

i assume im suposed to focus 100% on elite/spec/boss and do charged shots with it then reload and repeat all game?

[light ridge]

Recon Lasgun wants the Shocktrooper talent for ammo preservation, it is also one of the few guns that does very well with Onslaught to debuff enemy armor

[cedar reef]

im not feeling anything so far thats any better, everything i try feels weaker and or worse in some way lol

im using sustained fire and infernus on it usually

and shredder genades feel terrible to me

krak is so god

[terse idol]

Now I will push back on myself to say onslaught isn't nessasary

[terse idol]

you can certainly make alot of value from like

dumdum and infernus

[unreal nova]

Wot. Hordes are more deadly as you go along. Shredders do way more generally. Also just turns on Zealot and Oggy stuff instantly.

[cedar reef]

i was kinda th inking it makes getting surrounded not as abig of a deal, but i usually obliterate any spec and boses, krak deletees crusher groups, how do i deal with them with recon las?

using power swword seems to work great , but takes a lot more time than krak

[light ridge]

It isn't but it makes the Recon more fun

[light ridge]

I run recon with:
10% Elite Damage (almost everything worth shooting is an elite)
5% Crit chance (crit reduce ammo use and add fire, which further reduces ammo need)
Dumdum
Infernus

I run Shocktrooper and Onslaught, Onslaught helps kill Crushers, Maulers, bosses, ... and helps my team kill them

[light ridge]

Krak loses utility fast at higher difficulty, Shredder keeps getting better

[vernal trench]

Yes

[vernal trench]

Crowd clear is so bad with knife

I use mk6 sometimes and its rare to pass 1.2 mil

With powersword i can reach 1.2 mil very often

[lunar sedge]

Onslaught is great, but when taking recon in hands vets should remember that it ain't glued to them. I always take onslaught with my recon, but if I don't need to shoot maulers/crushers then I don't - psword or DS can clear them if situation under control. Otherwise it's enables damage on armoured enemies when shit goes wild. Also annihilates bosses. ( This wasn't directed to you specifically, but it's too often vets forget about primary and just shoot everything )

[latent parcel]

noob

[vernal trench]

F u

Go carry karien

[latent parcel]

Karien doesnt need a carry

she IS the carry

[vernal trench]

@unreal nova hes awake get his ass

[vernal trench]

U wish

[lunar sedge]

What's happening

[vernal trench]

U and ur fatgrym

Fatgryn

[latent parcel]

ur so mean to me

im leaving

[vernal trench]

Cuz i just woke up

[vernal trench]

Come back friend

[light ridge]

True, recon is so versatile that you can forget that it's not always the best solution
Shredders and Melee of choice (Chainsword) help to conserve ammo

[vernal trench]

Why u shootin a crusher with recon

[lunar sedge]

I liked to run with PSword - horrible mobility but complete single target annihilation with push attack + L1 and good horde clear WHEN everything is not going shit insane (I fucking hate losing charge on hit), but seems like DS introduction made a very clear and broken choice - just worse horde clear, but not that much

[vernal trench]

Powersword is still one of the best weapons

[light ridge]

Mixed horde, poor visibility, distance
Shoot and debuff crusher, kill collateral shotgunners, reapers, gunners around them

[lunar sedge]

With onslaught you debuffing em and bringing respectable damage either with recon or other means. But as I said it should be used as last resort, not at every opportunity

[vernal trench]

Yea last resort

Or just grenade him

Meleeing 10 crushers at a time is too risky i like mag dumping my boltgun

[light ridge]

Killing them isn't really the goal, softening them up is

Mixed horde I'll throw some Shredders and spray and pray until it's gone
Switch to melee if they get close

[vernal trench]

Shredders good

[light ridge]

Use recon to debuff by spraying all 10, makes them easier to kill in melee

[lunar sedge]

Brittleness is a debuff that stacks, a group of crushers with bulwarks can be debuffed with recon and then cleared quicker with two shredders, then without a debuff

[vernal trench]

If i had a recon

I rarely use it

[light ridge]

My favourite gun, my precious

[lunar sedge]

Also sometimes it just happens that you are out of shredders

[vernal trench]

Boltgun is my favorite

[vernal trench]

Ye

Boltgun is so satisfying to use

[lunar sedge]

I was metaslaving plasma until they buffed recons. Then I tried something with them. It was a bit hard to leave the old plasma play style

But when I got that infernus with onslaught, then did a few hours of testing and playing, my reaction was:

It's was before everyone figured out how good recons became, and while recons is even simpler then plasma - I really enjoy recons more

[vernal trench]

Ive used plasma once or twice

I just dont like using it

Too op tbh

[calm shard]

I don't like using it because it's slow and boring

[lunar sedge]

Boltgun right now competes with plasma, at least somewhat. I have a stance boltgun build that just annihilates everything, and It's so fun on aurics. And sometimes playing not VoC is also fun, tho challenging if there is no other supporting abilities in team

Who could know that legal wallhacks are actually good?

[vernal trench]

That too

[vernal trench]

Yea but u need executioner stance just to compete with a normal plasma

Bolter is just not as strong atleast in dealing with armored

The difference really shows when u got pus hardened

[lunar sedge]

On overall usability and versatility - yeah. In dps department? Questionable.

[vernal trench]

Ur always gonna kill things faster with a plasma

[lunar sedge]

And I not really talking about Havocs, for this kind of talk I don't have yet experience

[vernal trench]

Im talking about havocs

Plasma performs better but u shoot slower

i just dont like plasma and its playstyle so i dont use it at all

But plasma goes through pus hardened way easier

Ammo is always tight with boltgun when theres pus hardened

[light ridge]

Boltgun and PS feel like they poured lead in my boots

[vernal trench]

Yea the dps is insane

1.2 mil pretty consistently

Or more

[light ridge]

I saw the light before the buffs, wasn't great but serviceable

[vernal trench]

Its pretty much impossible to do less than 1 mil damage with ps and bolter

[lunar sedge]

In aurics I one tap crushers when few buffs are online. I don't disagree that plasma is OP - in fact it's too long OP and for some reason even got a few minor buffs

[vernal trench]

Yea plasma is too ip

Op

Its instant pull out pretty much and 1 shots a lot of stuff

Bolter is slow and clanky even tho u can mag dump

[lunar sedge]

For exe stance I would still use bolter - as it's the only build on vet that I have that making that gun feel good. And recent minor buffs helped

On zealot I have bolter with spray and pray setup

[vernal trench]

Hellbore goes hard with it

U can get 1.8 million damage with a hellbore exec stance build

[lunar sedge]

And holy emperor it's so ass on havocs just close to 30, not even above it

[vernal trench]

Bolter works fine for zealot its just nowhere near as good as on vet

[lunar sedge]

I don't believe it works on zealot after I played with flamer

[vernal trench]

It works pretty well

Ur just on boss duty most of the time with it

Its not as good as a flamer for dps

[lunar sedge]

Nuh uh, even in that regard on havocs I feel must more shitty. In aurics/damnation it's actually good, but I don't really see the value for it in havocs - everything is too fat, for some reason even dumping into bosses wasn't so successful

[vernal trench]

Half the zealots i see either run flamer or bolter

It works well but ur not gonna use it much

its mostly for dumping armored hordes and bosses

[calm shard]

all the zealots I see spam bolter into anything bigger than a poxwalker because they're scared to melee

[vernal trench]

Ur not gonna run around shooting single targets much

[lunar sedge]

I don't know what I did wrong, but the moment I switched from flamer to bolter I felt my secondary being useless, besides sniping specials

[vernal trench]

Whenever u see 10 crushers and theres a boltgun zealot ur gonna be hearing that boltgun spam sound lmao

[vernal trench]

Idk i dont play zealot

[lunar sedge]

Yes, that was, and I don't really remember mods on that mission, but I did jackshit to that pack

Like it was so bad I actually was really surprised

[vernal trench]

U see them pretty often in havoc 40s

If its an armored game

Hundreds of crushers and maulers and bulwarks

Sweet grenade damage

Bolter is really good at if ur cornered and u need to kill the one or two crushers infront of u quickly

[steep flower]

And here i am chainaxing into an elite horde; guess i’m built different

[light ridge]

Stab them in the face with a dagger

[molten gazelle]

Is the recon lasgun also viable for higher Havocs? I'm not even into higher Havocs though. Still doing some Mastery after a long looong break from the game

[pseudo fiber]

It is yeah

[wheat stratus]

Only using recon in high havoc here

[molten gazelle]

cool cool, with the shredder grenades?

[wheat stratus]

ofc

gotta spread the burn, that's the key

[tame lodge]

Lasguns ammo economy is top tier, they are often used on havoc due to reduced ammo per tin/stash

[molten gazelle]

Think I need to melee more, I'm already running out of ammo on Damnation haha

[opaque cypress]

just sprint ahead to take ammo even if you die and just type "hungry" when asked wtf you are doing

[molten gazelle]

nom nom nom

[light ridge]

Need to eat it before Ogryn gets there

[opaque cypress]

who reaches the ration first? starving humie, or ogryn on a mission

[light ridge]

Humie gets there first but his fingers are part of the Ogryns rashuns

[opaque cypress]

extra crunchy rations?!

what a delight, praise emprah

[unreal nova]

Wot. I sappart, you carry.

[unreal nova]

Weh?

[tropic halo]

Exe Stance with recon lasgun or bolter are one of the most useful choices

[tender pasture]

I remember a time when the infantry lasguns would have been the consensus best choice and the recons were super soakers

[tropic halo]

you can try to share a screenshot of your build

[tame void]

https://tenor.com/view/sure-grandma-lets-get-you-to-bed-yes-grandma-gif-6683134261581381982

[tropic halo]

Is this more of an support role for team as long ranged veteran to deal and supress gunners?

This is what I went respectfully with the tree you wanna go for

Take this with a grain of salt, i am not the best with certain skill tree roles but i went to go with your idea if you also to use lasguns for ranged

[austere pine]

@steep flower how did you have your zealot built when you guys carried me through that havoc 40?

[tropic halo]

About the weapons, i think someone else can help lot more i am not the smartest when it comes to right perks and blessings

[austere pine]

i had that exact setup a couple months ago

[vernal trench]

Stompt needs ur carty

Carry

He cant win without u

[austere pine]

funnily enough, you do not want smoke, which makes enemies relocate to try to shoot you from elsewhere or come into melee, which means they can still be a problem

[tropic halo]

I tried to go for shredders but wanted to be nice enough with the build idea they were going for

[austere pine]

if you're running infantry las, you don't need marksman's focus to onehit shooters and stalkers harassing you, and

[unreal nova]

Wot. I need carries.

[austere pine]

you're either not getting hit anyway because dudes are shooting your teammates, hence you can hit them, or you're killing them and suppressing them while not getting suppressed, yourself, so smoke is a good idea but you seriously lack outside of long range engagements if you don't have shredders

[vernal trench]

Papa willy

He loves carrying

[austere pine]

i need him to carry my build ideas

thought the chain axe was cool

how do i even build 🅱️istol

[tropic halo]

Commissar

[austere pine]

if your commissar looks like this, hit me up with her number

[unreal nova]

I know. He tried. Server kicked me in extraction lift. Run did not count for me.

[vernal trench]

F

Get him to carry again!

[austere pine]

do i run book to level the build properly?

[unreal nova]

Why poke Stompt as well, 2 carries better.

[unreal nova]

Hrm, poke you as well. 3 carries hoi!

[vernal trench]

At this point u can just sit there afk and well win the game for u

[vernal trench]

Papa only runs it cuz hes a nice guy

Charge zealots will perform better but u wont give golden toughness

[fiery raft]

doing a wep spec build

what other melee could i use

[vernal trench]

[vernal trench]

Shockmaul

[fiery raft]

alright, shock maul

anything else?

i am having fun with chaxe but im curious what else works besides the axes

[unreal nova]

Well, I'll still wave the icon around and stuff.

[calm shard]

the knife

[fiery raft]

you think knife could work as a primary wep?

doesnt it lack horde clear?

[unreal nova]

In auric, knoife is fine.

[austere pine]

even in havoc you mean?

[tame lodge]

Mk6 does have a workable horde clear

[calm shard]

I use knife/bolt pistol in havoc

[unreal nova]

So still fine then.

[tame lodge]

Alternatively you just spam push attacks on the mk3

[calm shard]

you're a veteran you can just chuck a shredder at any moderately threatening crowd of enemies

[fiery raft]

using krak atm

[fiery raft]

ill try out mk6

ty

[vernal trench]

Ywa

[austere pine]

i do not believe that

fake news, even

[vernal trench]

Papa runs book to support the team

[vernal trench]

U prolly can if papa is there

But if its just me and stompt ull prolly die pretty quick

[unreal nova]

Thus, drag you two along to DPS while I just spam icon and dunno what papa runs.

[tropic halo]

It give you more damage agaisnt armor types if I remember

[fiery raft]

i think its just percentage armor pen

like 10% rending

[tropic halo]

Both melee and ranged

[fiery raft]

remove 10% armor

pretty much

[tropic halo]

They really dont explain in detail these damage types perks

[fiery raft]

you should use enhanced descriptions mod

very small mod but makes all the difference

[tropic halo]

I dont got the game open now but it is some sort like that

But yeah using the enchanged description mod helps so much in full detail for everything

[fiery raft]

yeah

here i got u

one moment

[vernal trench]

If u queue partyfinder u can win!

[molten gazelle]

And I believe Rending only applies to YOUR damage.
Brittleness does the same thing but for the team?

[fiery raft]

yeah

[calm shard]

yeah but brittleness has a hard cap of 40

[fiery raft]

brittle acts more like a debuff

[calm shard]

exploit weakness, and the flamers are the exceptions because they have a special brittleness debuff

[fiery raft]

while rending is more like a buff to urself

[unreal nova]

Nope. Do you think ppl wanna deal with a panicky skitterish person?

[vernal trench]

Yes

[unreal nova]

Nope. Also, my Zealot lacks any real lvls to ppl with that mod.

[stoic thorn]

get downed in fire
teammate picks me back up while I am still in the fire
fucking die

[light ridge]

Gotta love it when they help you die faster

https://tenor.com/view/ralph-wiggum-simpsons-hi-bye-gif-16529059407582436389

[stoic thorn]

The ammo economy on the shotgun is so ass even with the +25% ammo reserve

[unreal nova]

I mean, the only time you pick ppl up in fire is if they will not last the bleedout.

[austere pine]

if shotgun (close range) makes you think that meleeing is optional because you already have a short range gun (shotgun), you're doing shotgun wrong

that shit is a long range pick weapon, i'm telling ya

[light ridge]

Or when someone is booking to refill their Toughness immediately

[unreal nova]

Or just VoC at the right time usually buys enough time.

[light ridge]

I've learned to hit Infiltration immediately

[molten gazelle]

The other day I picked someone up who died almost instantly again. He blamed me for rezzing in the midst of ragers.. As if I would stand there in the midst of ragers...

[unreal nova]

They didn't run, I guess.

[vernal trench]

Just let them die most of the time if they go down

Theyll die again after u rescue anyway

[molten gazelle]

I also had a game yesterday where we had an extra bot helping us out with 4 players

[light ridge]

Or drop out the moment you start picking them up...

[vernal trench]

Lmfao

[light ridge]

I hate it when they do that
Go down half the map away, I run over, gone
I'm now surrounded with a bot instead of a player

[vernal trench]

Had a psyker rage quit havoc cuz he was so dogshit

[stoic thorn]

Mr when I'm Low-key fucking carrying the team when I go take the medicae and then get touched by every disabler and special while my team is off fighting poxers

And die because the lvl100+ players don't know how to disengage

[light ridge]

Or the only one running objectives and actually trying to take out the snipers and bombers

[stoic thorn]

It's something I whip out to kill specials and elites

Maybe thin the horde

Because crits from WS is godly

[austere pine]

yeah see that's where you're wrong

best utilized as a different revolver

kill a single guy harassing you from 10 feet away (be it with slug or fire shell because both of them have good range. fire shotgun has good range without special also), wreak havoc in melee through WS (where you have at least always prepared so you can utilize tactical reload for all the shotgun shells)

[unreal nova]

The classic in SEA btw.

[vernal trench]

Level 100 is low, u should see the level 1500+ that are bad

[stoic thorn]

God I LOVE sea players

I LOVE not being able to communicate with them

Them LEAVING THE MOMENT THEY GET DOWNED

Them having really shitty microphones and jumpscaring me

[light ridge]

What's SEA?

[stoic thorn]

South East Asia

[light ridge]

Ah

[stoic thorn]

(Literally just Hong kong)

90% of them is Hong Kong players I think

Hence why 99% of the lobbies I'm in have the block names

[unreal nova]

They have their own server.

[light ridge]

I mostly get Cyrillic names...

[stoic thorn]

Why am I getting shoved into there then

[unreal nova]

Some of the blocks are just Singaporeans using Chinese characters.

[stoic thorn]

I'm in singapore

[unreal nova]

You can tell by the accent.

[vernal trench]

U sound like thar

Thet

That

[stoic thorn]

I keep hearing Mainland accents thoufh

[tropic halo]

Clearly you not built to fire

[unreal nova]

Naw, I just have a generic asian accent unless I do the stereotypical Asian uncle voice.

[stoic thorn]

Mainlanders really like putting the -er sound onto a few words

[vernal trench]

Asian

[stoic thorn]

And them jumpscaring me with shitty mics and unintelligible shit

Has greatly decreased my appreciation for the chinese language

I can understand chinese but Holy shit that is near earrape

"This silence offends slaanesh" ahh

[vernal trench]

[stoic thorn]

I get whiplash everytime a mic booms to life

[unreal nova]

IDK where you play then. My games are usually silent ping spams in damnation.

[stoic thorn]

It's infrequent

But it's enough to make me pissed off

I still don't know HOW chinese/japanese/korean players can play Darktide considering their characters are now BLOCKS

[tropic halo]

I had a guy that kept telling daemonhost on the mic só loudly everytime there was a DH close whispering and that shit jumpscared every single time like I am deaf

[unreal nova]

Mods.

[stoic thorn]

Ah yes, □□□□□□

Pinnacle of communication

□□□□□ xie cai □□□□

[tropic halo]

I already knew of the DH before the guy could say on mic but holy shit the mic was so loud giving me a heart attack

[stoic thorn]

These mfs really think they helping the team ong

[unreal nova]

I usually am too soft now.

[tropic halo]

Almost making jump out the chair LOL

[stoic thorn]

I wish I could play on English servers

[unreal nova]

Ppl complain about my fan more than me.

[stoic thorn]

So my curses can make it through to people who can understand it

And also what's with the chat filter in DT

Can't even call the magic cathedrum the evil ass meth building

[tropic halo]

If you have the mic toggle on I think is fine but if you using open mic all the time that become annoying with the fans of the PC

[vernal trench]

Go on them

[unreal nova]

No. Actual fan.

[stoic thorn]

Lag goes crazy tho

Lag but be able to curse people out

Shitty teammates but no lag

[unreal nova]

I have a big fan next to me.

[stoic thorn]

Like a stalker or

[unreal nova]

I'm in Singapore.

What do you think a fan is?

[stoic thorn]

Yes I know

There's one hanging above me

[unreal nova]

28 inches of pure wind.

[stoic thorn]

The fan I have is ceiling fan

[unreal nova]

Right next to me.

[stoic thorn]

Tbh all the fans I've had were ceiling fans

[unreal nova]

Stand or minis.

[unreal nova]

Is open, I don't have a spare button on my controller for mic toggle.

And switching to keyboard to push to talk is a death sentence.

[tropic halo]

Ah I see you play on controller

[tropic halo]

I would say that you can use the toggle to on and off with a single key press for not to deal with the pain of push talk

[unreal nova]

Since it takes 2 inputs to register, and then another input on said controller to go back to controller mode. Might bug out the light aim assist as well.

[tropic halo]

Unless that is not a feature in DT?

[unreal nova]

Not for controller.

You either open or mute.

[tropic halo]

Thats insane FS

[unreal nova]

There's no controller rebinding for one.

[rustic beacon]

I am happy that ps5 controller has the mute button which makes it an easy decision

[austere pine]

i do not like 🅱️istol

what am i doing wrong with it that it's working worse than a pick weapon for specials/elites and worse than a bolter and flamer for different kinds of big enemies

i don't see where it's good, honestly

[unreal nova]

It's for 'nades. Unless you mean Zealot. Then it's just a mini bolter for quick pickoffs.

[stoic thorn]

CREEEEEEEEEED

[light ridge]

It's a sniper, it deletes specials in one to two shots

[austere pine]

zealot because vet has better guns

imo

but might try recon las for zealot also because piety might be funny with it

[tame lodge]

I will not rain on your parade

I will not rain on your parade

I will...

Anyways XIV with Infernus for Discount Flamer

[unreal nova]

You mean "inf" range flamer.

[tame lodge]

The XII with 15 stacks of IJ and rof bonus from chastise

For maximum brrrr

[uncut pebble]

Vet builds it in one of two ways: to take advantage of the guaranteed crits from weapon specialist with deadly accurate and clean up any breakpoints with puncture, or by taking lethal prox and your favorite blessing as the 2nd option to maximize shredder distance.

Psyker doesn't really benefit from it much. Zealout can get away with it being a free scourge builder.

[vernal trench]

Its the infiltrate hater!

[austere pine]

this shit is literally revolver with worse handling why do people like it

need to 2 hit a gunner shooting me and pissing me off? need to apply a tech to hit my 2nd shot

revolver sights in, shoots twice, boom done

[vernal trench]

U can shoot it more instead of relying on weaponspecialist

[tribal tangle]

It's a revolver alternative with less cleave

[calm shard]

and more ammo, and the FUNNY blessing that makes grenades even better

[austere pine]

it's like if all the above mentioned weapons had a child and it sucked at life

[queen fox]

It's best on zealot imo, it's best use case is lethal poximity + runngun, you can suppress whole hordes of shooters and gunners while sprinting to close the gap and force them into melee

No other ranged weapon does this as well as bistol does

[austere pine]

hear me out

book

[tribal tangle]

This is vet chat

[calm shard]

wasting 2 skill points on the worst active ability in the game

[queen fox]

Book is on 30s cd, bistol is on a 2-3s reload

[tribal tangle]

It's not even a book, it's an icon

[calm shard]

I am not going to hear out book

[austere pine]

zealot chat is a hellhole

[queen fox]

The worst active in-game is zealot invis

[tribal tangle]

[queen fox]

Not book

[calm shard]

the dps of a stealth zealot is higher than the dps of a book zealot

[queen fox]

Book is a clutch god tool imo

[tribal tangle]

Nah shrouds actually good, people are just bad or misuse it rampantly

[queen fox]

Bistol has a niche it does better than any other weapon

[light ridge]

Bistol is like revolver with worse cleave but more ammo and faster reload
I.e. it allows you to try again if that first shot isn't a headshot
Also it is more flexible in determining what counts as a headshot e.g. for Shotgunners the head starts at its little toe

[vernal trench]

By far

Book zealot is the weakest zealot

Ur sacrificing a lot just to support a team thats not worth supporting

[tropic halo]

How we feeling veteran cadian fellows

[hollow ibex]

yeah i only ran it because it's supplemented with frags/DB

[grand perch]

Dont know I've been feeling fragmented lately

[sleek garden]

The tech is standing still

Or adding puncture

Or aiming for the head

If your revolver and bolt piston aren't one shotting gunners you aren't bringing the right stuff

[unreal nova]

Or both.

[sleek garden]

I don't use the bolt pistol much but I usually just fire into crowds as I walk at them so I start the fight with half the enemies bleeding or on the floor

Not the most efficient way but the most fun

I can still shoot the real bad guys

[drifting verge]

How good is the normal Lasgun

I’m gonna use it no matter what just how handicapped am I

[calm shard]

IIb lasgun is one of 3 ranged weapons that are arguably the best vet gun in the game

[pseudo fiber]

Its pretty good yesh

[drifting verge]

Oh sweet

[hollow ibex]

eh

it's mid

[uncut pebble]

It's definitely not mid, but it's harder to use than other options due to reverse damage falloff.

Ilas deals less damage the closer your target is to you.

[calm shard]

well more importantly on its difficulty is how heavily reliant it is on its massive finesse modifier

if you ain't crittin' and clickin' heads

shit ain't dyin

[uncut pebble]

They take the term "flashlight" quite seriously here.

If you aren't hitting vitals, you're just aiming a spicy flashlight at the heretics.

[hollow ibex]

nah mid is the perfect way to describe a gun that really only works well under specific circumstances

[pseudo fiber]

Isn't niche the right term

[queen fox]

Yeah

Mid is a gun that does nothing well

Like shredder

[hollow ibex]

no lol

[uncut pebble]

Autopistol actually has a hilarious amount of stagger.

But anyway, ilas is not mid.

[hollow ibex]

mid is just mediocre, as the boomers will tell you

[uncut pebble]

It's not niche, either.

[queen fox]

Never feels like it ingame

[hollow ibex]

how do you use it, ilas pro?

[uncut pebble]

Go tap a trapper with exactly one bullet. She will stagger.

[uncut pebble]

I run it with a deadshot meme build and still top damage.

[hollow ibex]

that sounds like mid to me lmao

[queen fox]

Yet the 3 gunners keep shooting me when I magdump on them

[calm shard]

"specific circumstances" like headshottin things?

Which you should be doing all the time with any gun?

[hollow ibex]

if you need deadshot to make the gun sing

[faint beacon]

ILAS with Falter hard staggers everything outside of Ogryns on one shot

[drifting verge]

Oh that explains a lot

[queen fox]

If you can't do well with ilas, you have a skill issue and should play some aimlabs

[hollow ibex]

back in my day, bait actually had some effort involved 🥱

[calm shard]

download Osu and play it for 300 hours until you forget about Darktide

do it for your aim

[uncut pebble]

I dont need deadshot, I just use it because it's funny. This build can drop both deadshot and duck and dive for better talents.

[queen fox]

Back in my day kids could land headshots, now all they do is play roblox buy skins and lie

[drifting verge]

Isn’t t that also what the recon las does

Which everyone swears by

[calm shard]

no deadshot SUCKS on recon las

[uncut pebble]

Weapons are taxe 2 with flak maniac bm headtaker, green ilas with flak unarmored headhunter ghost.

[drifting verge]

Idk man I got the game yesterday and saw some meta recon las build and just said

[calm shard]

I'd also say it sucks on the IIb infantry las, but it's distinctly okay on the VII

[drifting verge]

Nah lasgun and chainsword

For the guard

[hollow ibex]

is that why you run recon las in havoc when we played

[calm shard]

chain sword is in a really bad place right now

Recon las is one of the aforementioned 3 ranged weapons competing for best veteran gun

[drifting verge]

Idc cool weapon

[calm shard]

(It's winning)

[drifting verge]

Yarrick will protect me

[uncut pebble]

?

[hollow ibex]

because ilas is too op

[uncut pebble]

I never said ilas was op.

Where are you pulling these strawman arguments from?

[hollow ibex]

lol

[uncut pebble]

I said ilas wasn't mid.

[pseudo fiber]

I'm gonna keep using my las pistol love Las pistol

[queen fox]

Which is true

[drifting verge]

They said this not op

[uncut pebble]

As to what they were saying for ilas being top 3 vet guns, there are many reasons why.

[hollow ibex]

i'm not saying that's what you said, but i still haven't heard why you think it's not mid

[drifting verge]

They just said it’s one of the three good guns for vet

[hollow ibex]

you guys actually are telling me with a straight face

[calm shard]

one of the three best guns

not one of the 3 good ones

[faint beacon]

It’s a white bread gun

[hollow ibex]

that ilas is contending with bolter, plasma, recon las and revolver?

[calm shard]

uh yeah

[drifting verge]

They explained it read up

[faint beacon]

There’s nothing fancy about it that makes it stand out but it’s a good default choice

[hollow ibex]

shut up and sit down

[calm shard]

it actually hits surprisingly similar breakpoints to revolver if you build for it

[uncut pebble]

Comfortable 2shot breakpoints on ranged elites, barring reapers, which die in 4 or 5 shots, no crits involved, good ammo economy, especially with shock trooper, ghost...

[drifting verge]

No :>

[hollow ibex]

on the mk2?

[drifting verge]

[uncut pebble]

Yes, the green one.

[calm shard]

IIb gets close to revolver damage

[uncut pebble]

The blue one has to work a little more for the 2shot breakpoints.

[calm shard]

With MF+Exe it can infact do revolver one shots

[uncut pebble]

Brown one is bad.

[faint beacon]

Don’t touch the XII it got power crept

[hollow ibex]

wtf are the colors

[faint beacon]

Or whatever the heavy one is

[hollow ibex]

which one is mk2

[uncut pebble]

Brown is heavy.

[calm shard]

IIb is the blue one

[uncut pebble]

Blue is light.

[calm shard]

VII is the green one

[faint beacon]

Yeah I know

[uncut pebble]

Green is the middle ground.

[faint beacon]

The brown one is insanely power crept

[drifting verge]

Wait there’s different versions of the same gun that aren’t the rarity level <.<

[calm shard]

yeah

[faint beacon]

Blue and Green are the only good choices

[hollow ibex]

ok well yeah that's MF and exe lmao

[drifting verge]

Which ones the good one <.<

[uncut pebble]

Yeah we are talking about the model of the weapons. The green one is best, the blue one is ok, the brown one is bad.

[calm shard]

With more normal damage boosts it'll 2 shot headshot things, and 1 shot headshot most maniac health enemies

[drifting verge]

Oh ok

[uncut pebble]

Fatshark changed the numbers and I cba to remember them now.

[drifting verge]

Green is good

[calm shard]

because Ilas have stupid high maniac damage

[drifting verge]

Simple enough

[wheat stratus]

wait we talking about recon here?

[uncut pebble]

Anyway, @hollow ibex , see here what I meant by ilas isn't mid.

[drifting verge]

Infantry

[calm shard]

green best, blue okay, brown bad sounds like recon

it'd be blue best, green okay for ilas

[uncut pebble]

Nah, recon says blue is best.

[calm shard]

worth noting green Ilas will 2 shot reapers

[uncut pebble]

Ilas says green is best.

[hollow ibex]

with mk vii?

[calm shard]

Very cool gun

[uncut pebble]

Yes.

It's a great weapon.

[drifting verge]

I just wish my aim were better

[uncut pebble]

By no means op, but still very strong.

[wise fossil]

Is this secret Havoc Meta that I'm unaware of? Just played with a Zealot that had this

[uncut pebble]

They're insane.

[calm shard]

If you use Ilas enough it'll come naturally

[drifting verge]

My hands twitch and tremor too much for all that “good aim” stuff

[calm shard]

That gun does not kill things if you don't headshot them

[wise fossil]

I am vaguely aware that top left is not very good

[hollow ibex]

no weapon that forces me to take determined will ever be a "great" weapon

[uncut pebble]

You don't even have to take determined, you can just fish for a ghost proc and go from there.

[calm shard]

It's one skill point on a class where the default build has what 4 or 5 spare points?

[uncut pebble]

I take determined so I can be aggressive.

[hollow ibex]

yeah i mean it's kinda annoying not having it

if i feel like i should take it

that's a talent point tax

[drifting verge]

It’s hard for me to lose my vermintide brain

I’m a veteran who is barely using his lasgun

[uncut pebble]

Again, it's not a talent tax, you have ghost.

[hollow ibex]

and i hate wasting talent points on something like determined

[wise fossil]

Oh, it's not even that good. They took Fortitude in Fellowship instead of Purge the Unclean

[uncut pebble]

Fish for a proc and go from there.

[hollow ibex]

see above

[drifting verge]

So this game is more gun based than vermintide

What should and should I not be using my gun on

[uncut pebble]

Methinks you are just looking for something to complain about regarding ilas for no reason.

[hollow ibex]

i'm allowed to like the gun (which i do despite its issues), and complain about its issues at the same time

[uncut pebble]

The answer depends on whether or not you're using exe stance.

[pseudo fiber]

The like General fodder zombies

[wise fossil]

Just play psyker

[drifting verge]

I plan on taking voice of command

[faint beacon]

“Secret Zealot Meta” and its the most crack pipe sourced build I’ve seen

[drifting verge]

NO

[wise fossil]

or zealot tbh

[uncut pebble]

But you aren't giving proper complaints, you're just saying it's mid and not saying why, despite getting clear evidence that it's not mid.

[drifting verge]

Eh yeah after I get better at veteran

[wise fossil]

Zealot is great but you do have to learn how to throw the knives. That's most of the aim you'll need

[uncut pebble]

"I have to take determined" is the only reasonable counter you have, and even then, you don't have to, because you've got ghost on the damn thing.

[queen fox]

Use your gun on enemies you can't reasonably get into melee range with

When you start meleeing most enemies, the group will put down their guns and charge you

[faint beacon]

VA coping by running Elite + Maniac to make it actually good cause it’s ADM against maniac is horrendous 🚬

[hollow ibex]

talent point tax, reverse damage dropoff, stupid recoil, not as fun/outclassed by the top tier options. the main thing that i like about it is funny shoot forever build.

happy?

[drifting verge]

So I should not shoot ragers

I should just square up?

[calm shard]

Well if you're gonna be using Ilas it absolutel annihilates dreg ragers

Which is a very nice quirk of the weapon since a lot of guns don't

[queen fox]

If you can kill them reliably in melee

[uncut pebble]

Again, not a talent tax. Recoil is entirely visual. Reverse damage falloff is a feature of the weapon.

[loud belfry]

using your ranged weapon is a crutch. thoughts?

[crisp oak]

Ragers can be a hard shot sometimes

[drifting verge]

Should I take chainsword or Chainaxe (I will accept no alternative no matter how ass the weapon may be)

[uncut pebble]

Only valid gripe so far is reverse damage falloff, which isn't even bad.

[trim badger]

Play Zealot then

[faint beacon]

Agri 9 VA + Taxe 7

Against a Trauma Bubble, DS FOTF Flamer Zealot

[hollow ibex]

Lol I explained why. Agree to disagree

[faint beacon]

I will state this right now you just have to learn the fucking gun

[queen fox]

Depends on the weapons you have tbh, I generally shoot ragers just because it's easier, but if I'm using something like a chainaxe, shock maul or chainswors with a stun special, I'll melee them to save ammo

[crisp oak]

Chainsword works with no investment, chainaxe works way better with investment

[hollow ibex]

Agri?

[crisp oak]

But needs some getting used to

[uncut pebble]

I'll just agree with you being silly and ignorant and call it a day. :)

[faint beacon]

Agripinna Vigilant Autogun

[calm shard]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1046912126746374274/1326350550991896599/Warhammer_40000_Darktide_2025.01.07_-_18.41.43.117.DVR_online-video-cutter.com.mp4?ex=67af3a75&is=67ade8f5&hm=48b8231f3c9782f3ccd7f233161060cc2b9a754bbfa035ae41a81e65959fb739&

(the recoil is not visual on the infantry lasgun)

[drifting verge]

That’s not recoil that’s sway

[hollow ibex]

I mean I don't want to hear it from the guy saying he'll carry me in h40 and then not carrying shit

[trim badger]

That's supression not recoil

[drifting verge]

Recoil is the inaccuracy from firing

[calm shard]

but they were talking about Determined

the talent that removes suppression

[queen fox]

Green ilas deserves its spot as one of the best because it's what cadia uses, emperor approved best weapon for human soldiers

[trim badger]

"How are things going for Cadia?"

[hollow ibex]

For the record, I enjoyed playing with you. But if you're going to be an ass and play the ad hominen card. Two can play that game.

[drifting verge]

Steel Legion is my preferred cannon fodder :)

[loud belfry]

cant we all just get along

[crisp oak]

🪨

[drifting verge]

This started from me asking how good my preferred veteran gun was

[light ridge]

Opinions vary

[hollow ibex]

Now you should go to psyker chat

[drifting verge]

[hollow ibex]

And ask what the best force great sword mark is

[wheat stratus]

it's 8

stop asking

[calm shard]

6 every day