Depends on the games you play
#veteran-class
marsh shard
loud belfry
i wish i could just like...sell my 4070 ti. not have to deal with anyone, it's just gone and i get the money
then i live on a 980 ti and pray that i get a 5080 or something
burnt vortex
yeah, Cyberpunk reqs are still kinda nuts
marsh shard
If you sink most your time into a couple games and arent some avid gamer that plays a truckload of different games, just look at benchmarks for your game(s) of choice
unreal nova
Unstable 80fps for many games on med high with 3060 ti tbh.
Dooktide alone is spiky.
arctic rampart
As a typical 20s-30s gamer if you don't go drinking or smoking and save up your $ you can buy one in a few months
unreal nova
You mean starving for a few months? Cos I don't drink nor smoke.
arctic rampart
If you just wanna play hellokitty adventure island or league of legends or such casual u can probably get away with the integrated graphics these days
burnt vortex
integrated 
unreal nova
Bills alone eat half the pay.
loud belfry
integrated gpus are getting good these days
arctic rampart
Welcome to adult life it's always been like that
unreal nova
Govt eats 15% into an acct I can only use when 75.
hollow ibex
Bills alone eat half the pay.
For me, that’s taxes alone. 
unreal nova
For me, that’s taxes alone. <:KEKW_ogryn:1022077188322906163>
I make too little so tax free. Only suffer GST taxes.
burnt vortex
integrated gpus are getting good these days
Oh yeah, some CPUs have them right?
arctic rampart
U can sit on your ass and bitch or do something about it. Do one thing to improve yourself that you dont' wanna do a day. Duo lingo. Some kind of technical skill. You can do it I believe in you Karien the emp wills it
burnt vortex
We got a real motivational talker here.
hollow ibex
Brb overthrowing the government so I don’t have to pay taxes
marsh shard
College is overrated
burnt vortex
Brb overthrowing the government so I don’t have to pay taxes
This honestly. Who's house do I gotta throw a molotov through to get better wages for all.
unreal nova
Ppl want actual certs, my family was too poor so lil sis got higher education. I had to just skip it.
Even then, it was paid for mostly by whole fam pooling in and awards.
arctic rampart
Brb overthrowing the government so I don’t have to pay taxes
You will be a future ass polyp popper servitor!
marsh shard
College = read book = be in debt for decades = make $30-40/hr (if you get job you went to school for)
Tech school/production = learn skill = get apprenticeship = $30-100+/hr no debt
arctic rampart
Colleges were supposed to teach critical thinking to make minds zoom. Instead it just made wallets zoom
burnt vortex
oh wtf, this is vet chat. This wasn't shitposty enough for zealot.
unreal nova
Well, she gets paid 5x what I do so certs do mean something.
marsh shard
It teaches you how to be woke before running off with tens of thousands of your dollars
burnt vortex
LOL someone believes in the woke boogeyman
loud belfry
Oh yeah, some CPUs have them right?
most intel CPUs have them i think, i think AMD is starting to add them into most things too now.
unreal nova
oh wtf, this is vet chat. This wasn't shitposty enough for zealot.
I mean, the numbers on specs and such didn't tell you it's vet mains?
arctic rampart
AM5 cpu have integrated graphics
burnt vortex
I mean, the numbers on specs and such didn't tell you it's vet mains?
Card discussions were on both. But yeah.
arctic rampart
and btw crush intels these days.. intel latest sux
loud belfry
yeah intel isnt doing too good
arctic rampart
I had a bad experience with 5900 but the 9800x3d is flawless so far
unreal nova
I sometimes wonder if my bottleneck is actually the cpu.
marsh shard
Yeah, ppl def need to look into the games they play as the first step of building their pc
unreal nova
I7 9700, I think.
arctic rampart
this game is optimized to shit these days u need to turn some settings off for it to run. even on a high end pc you will get stutters stock config
marsh shard
my religious belief is that darktide is cpu bound
Yeah, many of the games I'm into lean heavily on processing power
Tons of enemies on screen
arctic rampart
this game really really likes DLSS frame generation that'd be my #1 recommondation
can't speak for the AMD equiv
marsh shard
Tide games, sm2, warframe, path of exile, warband/bannerlord, MMOs
Hordes upon hordes of enemies
Processing power is key
loud belfry
dlss frame gen is goated cuz the game is cpu bound
arctic rampart
I think I turned volumetric fog off as well, and some shadow setting
unreal nova
Problem with CPU is, to upgrade, I need a new motherboard and that's gonna add extra cost of needing a new windows copy as well.
A.K.A. absolutely out of budget.
orchid hemlock
Problem with CPU is, to upgrade, I need a new motherboard and that's gonna add e...
What cpu do u have rn?
tall torrent
dlss frame gen is goated cuz the game is cpu bound
Is FSR frame gen a lot worse or
unreal nova
What cpu do u have rn?
i7 9700
Cos it survived till now, unlike my old 2060.
Currently have a 3060ti.
Cos it was the cheapest thing I could get.
pseudo fiber
3060ti love that card
remote sonnet
The way they tuned their program to put down AMD skew Nvidia and Intel products as well, so much that even Intel and Nvidia banned them on their subreddit and forums.
loud belfry
Is FSR frame gen a lot worse or
not really sure. ive never used it. i havent heard too many great things about it
tall torrent
not really sure. ive never used it. i havent heard too many great things about i...
It causes artifacts in DT
Guess the DLSS version of FG doesn’t
loud belfry
there are probably some but it's way harder to notice
bitter vessel
What is genuinely the best way to farm resources? I haven’t done anything higher than damnation so far but I am interested if that’s the case
loud belfry
most of the artifacts i get with dlss FG are related to text and elements that have been modded in
loud belfry
Problem with CPU is, to upgrade, I need a new motherboard and that's gonna add e...
you dont really need to activate windows but even if you did you can buy keys for like <$20 usd
unreal nova
you dont really need to activate windows but even if you did you can buy keys fo...
Yes, but a new motherboard though, that's not cheap either.
loud belfry
yeah you basically need a whole new pc. guess you should just wait for a good deal to show itself
unreal nova
Bar GPU, I guess.
loud belfry
if you have a real key of windows you probably dont need to get a new key. if you have an OEM...maybe do, idk
ive never had to do it but i have a real key of windows
remote sonnet
The hard drive can be kept, too.
loud belfry
wtf i just joined a game and im totally alone
remote sonnet
PC can be upgraded part by part. Most of the parts that are usually tied together are the MB, CPU and Ram.
GPU, PSU, Storages, and some other stuff are more modular.
arctic rampart
randomed into someone's havok, feels weird
hollow ibex
Imagine buying windows lol
unreal nova
PC can be upgraded part by part. Most of the parts that are usually tied togethe...
The RAM should be fine, is just new CPU and MB is going to be a fair bit pricy.
main rivet
whats the dump stat on plasma gun?
unreal nova
whats the dump stat on plasma gun?
Something 69 thermals, 71 charge speed.
tall torrent
whats the dump stat on plasma gun?
Doesn’t have one
You’re looking for max stats (80%) in damage, stopping power and ammo
68~69% in thermal resist
And 71~72% in charge rate
main rivet
gotcha thanks
lucid bough
Which blessing is more important on the combat knife for a veteran who has serrated blade talented: Uncanny Strike or Mercy Killer?
|| I miss my bleed on crit and want to replace one again ||
hollow ibex
just take both
formal ice
Which blessing is more important on the combat knife for a veteran who has serra...
Lacerate 
hollow ibex
if you absolutely have to take tearer, i'd just drop serrated blade and go uncanny + tearer
if you're going to go tearer, i feel like you might as well lean into the bleed, even though quite frankly it's just not that good lol
lucid bough
Lacerate <:chadgryn:1161142998214656090>
I prefer Flesh Tearer over Lacerate
formal ice
I prefer Flesh Tearer over Lacerate
Yeah I said that joking
For some reason people here REALLY HATE lacerate
Omisaraiah sees you all
hollow ibex
I prefer Flesh Tearer over Lacerate
a mediocre blessing is still better than an actively harmful one
austere mica
Which blessing is more important on the combat knife for a veteran who has serra...
Uncanny Mercy killer is the combo for Serrated in vet
hollow ibex
he wants to take FT as well
austere mica
For some reason people here REALLY HATE lacerate
Because its bad as utilized by 99% of the community
austere mica
he wants to take FT as well
Ok then take uncanny
tall torrent
What is the point of serrated blade if you’re already taking flesh tearer
austere mica
What is the point of serrated blade if you’re already taking flesh tearer
This is a good point
remote sonnet
Riposte + Flesh tearer works pretty wall vs mixed horde imo.
scarlet cave
https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9a565016-bd70-4fe0-8c82-1080bc73412e/veteran-squad-leader#talents Is this build still relevant/meta for Havoc?
I see it used frequently but I'm curious if there are other options
hollow ibex
never was
most builds on gameslantern that are highly upvoted can be safely ignored
especially that one
tall torrent
https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9a565016-bd70-4fe0-8c82-1080bc73412e/ve...
This is not a good build
tall torrent
What weapons are u using
tall torrent
Which saber
scarlet cave
plasma cannon seems a bit limited
idk. I have 300 hours as a zealot so this is my first time leveling another class.
tall torrent
plasma cannon seems a bit limited
Are u using the charged shot function
scarlet cave
yeah, sometimes. Still only at 300 mastry atm
so I have some time to optimize that.
tall torrent
Plasma has fairly strict builds to follow for its 1 tap breakpoints
It’s also headshot reliant
scarlet cave
ahh Okay. I was looking for more of a brawler/shout for shield class
lucid bough
most builds on gameslantern that are highly upvoted can be safely ignored
I wish this wasn't true
tall torrent
ahh Okay. I was looking for more of a brawler/shout for shield class
Combat axe
scarlet cave
Really? That's interesting. I haven't considered that \
tall torrent
Top 3 best melee on veteran and debatably best, depending on what you’re looking for
scarlet cave
I always thought it was kinda underpowered but that's as a zealot so I am excited to try a new melee
tall torrent
Nah it’s very strong on zealot
Just doesn’t scale as high for zealot as for veteran
unreal nova
Is just outclassed by the toothpick so ppl sleep on it, lul.
scarlet cave
that tracks
tall torrent
It’s not outclassed by the duelling sword
If anything it’s quite a bit better than duelling sword, at least on veteran
unreal nova
On Zealot, DS4 simply outclasses the CAxe.
Only thing the Caxe has over is better horde clear.
tall torrent
Axe is still top 4 for zealot
Not sure where people get the idea of “combat axe is not good” from
scarlet cave
What about talents?
tall torrent
Then again he’s asking about veteran, what are you talking about
tall torrent
What about talents?
Depends on the weapons u run
tall torrent
and plasma cannon
For havoc? Or base game
unreal nova
Well, is more, why he thinks it's not so great on vet is probs just carried over from playing Zealot.
heavy rover
You can still have different loadouts for havoc
Like on my end I run the mk ii infantry lasgun, but that's because I like maximizing Ghost
tall torrent
are those relevant for havoc
Very much so
trim steppe
Caxe on zealot slaps hard
remote sonnet
Most of my loadout works for both havoc and base game. Of course it is not the utter most optimized for either.
trim steppe
Caxe is lackluster only on Psyker since he has hardly any melee talents and it's pretty slow
tall torrent
Caxe is lackluster only on Psyker since he has hardly any melee talents and it's...
That’s not the reason
tall torrent
The reason is that psyker can’t hold bruiser 1 tap nearly as consistently as veteran & zealot and usually requires taking unarmored + flak which drastically lowers the weapon’s ability to kill crushers & monsters
scarlet cave
I jsut wanted a build for havoc* lmao
trim steppe
The reason is that psyker can’t hold bruiser 1 tap nearly as consistently as vet...
Because of... talents?
tall torrent
I jsut wanted a build for havoc* lmao
tall torrent
Because of... talents?
Because u can’t keep permanently upkeep +damage talents so u need to drop both perks just for bruiser 1HS
It’s still very good at horde clear
Better than every psyker melee actually
Psyker has an easier time grabbing the 10% atk speed talent compared to veteran
But psyker also doesn’t want to bother with melee horde clear half the time, and because axe won’t hit bruiser 1HS without locking into 2 perks for psyker, you don’t get a carapace/monster dps stick out of it
For veteran, unarmored is QoL perk for base game and only “required” for havoc with Moebian 21st modifier
You can drop unarmored for elite and get better breakpoints vs like 3 other elites
remote sonnet
https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1185515648206512168/1319846207660626010...
Shock troop works on plasma?
tall torrent
Shock troop works on plasma?
This is generic axe build, ranged weapon can vary
If taking plasma, I’d recommend CQKZ as final pick
Can go smth else as well
Stam regen delay reduction is not bad (makes veteran generally feel better to play)
5% crit chance is not bad either, since plasma can only hit potential gunner/flamer 1 taps in havoc with crits
scarlet cave
Right on. I appreciate all the suggestions and advice.
tall torrent
Right on. I appreciate all the suggestions and advice.
For axe
Rashad mk3
80% everything, 60% in mobility
Carapace
Elite / unarmored (up to preference)
Brutal momentum
Headtaker
For plasma gun
80% in damage, stopping power & ammo
68~69% in thermal resist (matters for how many shots you can fire before venting)
71~72% in charge rate (matters for left click’s pre-fire delay)
Unarmored
Flak
Rising heat
Gets hot
scarlet cave
👍 dope
tall torrent
The build I sent u is not 100% consistent breakpoints for base game
Flamer 1HS requires at least 1 rising heat stack (2 shots’ worth of heat generated)
Or if red nodes are active
Or it if crits
If u play normally it’s somewhere like 95%+ consistent breakpoints
bleak dome
are the pump shotguns anygood if so which mark?
remote sonnet
The build Elrows followed is extremely ranged heavy, the given melee is okish but get hard time to carry in harder difficulty. I saw so many people with that build and many of them are rage quitter.
hollow ibex
are the pump shotguns anygood if so which mark?
combat shotguns? not very good
least bad one is the slug shotty
remote sonnet
But what do I know, I use Dclaw for many things.
unreal nova
are the pump shotguns anygood if so which mark?
At that point, just use a Bolt Pistol if you thinking of the Slug shottie.
THe only real advantage the slug gives you is super stagger on 1 target.
Unless you are planning on some close range vet things and are talking about the double barrel.
terse idol
At that point, just use a Bolt Pistol if you thinking of the Slug shottie.
Well
You do get manstopper
orchid hemlock
yo best frame just dropped
warm bolt
Yo it goes hard
barren nimbus
The double barrel is really fun on heresy missions, just walk around nuking enemies and using melee to reload
remote sonnet
Mauler frame
remote sonnet
Chain axe is way better than I remembered. The mk12 is so damn strong.
sleek garden
i thought they said these were out in february?
hollow ibex
its a joke
marsh shard
Chain axe is way better than I remembered. The mk12 is so damn strong.
IMO the mk4 is better
Once slaughter and headtaker getting going youre dunking on all elites, carapace or not, in 1-2 lights
Issue is the horde clear is ass
For both chaxes
faint beacon
Thats like a multi year project to upgrade to something like that
im relatively fine with what i got but give it ehh another year im gonna upgrade my stuff
marsh shard
The one that isnt doodoo
formal ice
I don't know which one is doodoo
remote sonnet
Issue is the horde clear is ass
I find the mk 12 horde clear is pretty good.
The light doesn't lock and actually hit multiple targets.
orchid moth
5000s are out everyone
remote sonnet
The heavy is rev and 1 quick heavy kill even mutant, with Slaughter, mauler is possible. With thrust, it can 1 activate heavy kill crusher without crit, which the mk4 can't.
Hold on, my axe is at 400, it is not even max out. So the mk4 probably can when maxed out.
Still mk12 is still very decent at clearing.
warm bolt
Question, which Braced Autogun yall prefer?
I havent tried any for aesthetics reasons (i only really like drum-fed autogun and it's not in the game 
) but my friend swears by the medium one
I forgot it's name
marsh shard
Hold on, my axe is at 400, it is not even max out. So the mk4 probably can when ...
Ye mk4 uses push attack and heavies to clear
I wouldn't ever rev the mk4
It can 1hko a crusher with a rev, but rev takes too long for the payoff
Mk4's lights come out so quick you can just stick to those
Vs all elites
crude fiber
Question, which Braced Autogun yall prefer?
Browns the best, I like the green the most, blue is fun but memeish
formal ice
Browns the best, I like the green the most, blue is fun but memeish
Yeah I prefer the green
The blue isn't very controllable
crude fiber
If it gained accuracy like twice as fast as it does right now it might be nice
formal ice
Less controllable but you are able to keep the small accuracy longer
Now I question if Fartshark will add a 4th mark type for weapons
It would be fun
crude fiber
cant wait to get a 4th variant of the same weapon but with a different fire rate. i say that but anything they do to add content would be nice
crude fiber
what if they just nerf the mk4 heavy damage a bit then add a heavy thrusting sword that would gets stupid pokes but has lower mobility 
marsh shard
The damage isnt the issue
IMO
There are plenty of weapons with awesome damage
The key issue is the mobility
crude fiber
i actually use cleave damage as the dump stat on my mk4 so ill have max mobility lol
tall torrent
The damage isnt the issue
The damage is the problem (more specifically the finesse)
Or well
Zealot’s duellist talent needs to get looked at, specifically
FS has an interesting mechanic (cleave damage distribution cap) in place which limits weapons’ horde clear, but it’s on the wrong weapons
Instead of being on chainaxe / evicerator / bully club, it should be on knife / duelling sword
Cap them to like 2 for light atks on knife & duelling sword
And reduce duelling swords’ heavy poke’s finesse bonus against flak, maniac, carapace & unyielding
dry cloak
yeah cleave cap on bully club that weight roughyl 10kg+
dry cloak
And reduce duelling swords’ heavy poke’s finesse bonus against flak, maniac, car...
deadly toothpick is just overtuned in this department
tall torrent
It’s the finesse bonus that scales off the charts in conjunction with zealot’s duellist talent
Duellist needs to get looked at on its own
It’s simply way too much value for a single node that’s easy to grab for most good builds
It doesn’t scale linearly between weapons and favours some weapons too much
marsh shard
The issue isnt with dueling sword
Damage wise
As stated, some nodes are terribly balanced
tall torrent
Move speed bonus can use a small nerf but I think it should still be faster than most weapons
marsh shard
I agree 100% with the cleave suggestion
marsh shard
Move speed bonus can use a small nerf but I think it should still be faster than...
Hence my tac axe suggestion
tall torrent
As for the “same mobility as Tac axe”
That’s not a good comparison
Because Tac axe is standard mobility
It has no additional +move speed in a normal perfect roll in comparison to other weapons
You get +0.09m/s
This itself I think can use a buff
grand perch
yes please
marsh shard
Right, tac axe should be brought up
tall torrent
Because the “slightly bigger axe” has the exact same sprint speed bonus while doing almost 3x of its single target dps vs large targets
grand perch
i always have to pull out my bistol to run faster on taxe build
marsh shard
And dueling sword should be made to match tac axe
Both should be above average mobility
tall torrent
I think Tac axe and duelling sword should be around +0.4~0.6 (same as revolver)
But not as fast as knife or laspistol
tall torrent
That’s sprint bonus
marsh shard
Tac axe does have better dodge distance
tall torrent
If you’re talking about dodge
marsh shard
Right
marsh shard
The sprint doesnt necessarily need to be great
tall torrent
I don’t think dodge is the biggest problem for duelling sword
grand perch
pretty good for all intents and purposes
narrow frost
The efficient dodges on it go crazy
tall torrent
Because duelling sword is at best +8% (unless mk5)
2% better dodge distance over Tac axe
Is not so big a difference
Imo
tall torrent
In the mobility department
Buff Tac axe sprint bonus
Nerf duelling sword sprint bonus
That’s about it I think
I don’t think their dodges need major changes
marsh shard
Yeah, in the end whatever they do I just feel those 2 weapon classes should be equal in the mobility department
tall torrent
However u also have to consider
A perfect Tac axe has 60% mobility
A perfect mk4 duelling sword has 80%
So duelling sword will be a little bit faster
marsh shard
In my head, theres like 5 different tiers that should exist:
- Dagger
- Light weapons (Force, Taxes, DS)
- Average (stuff like catachan and chain sword)
- Heavy 1 handed (power sword, chaxe)
- 2 handed
tall torrent
Perfect mk2 dumps mobility tho since cleave damage helps its H2 diagonal a bit
Avg rn is very well defined in terms of mobility
Almost (all?) every one of them is 60% mobility dump which is
+0.09m/s sprint bonus
+1% dodge
5 dodges
I think this is reasonable
marsh shard
Very
Taxes and DS should be able to dumpster carapace/elite but be slow vs hordes
Hence why I'm in alignment with your cleave suggestion
grand perch
nah dont make taxes suck vs hordes
tough tiger
@tall torrent which taxe do u think is most viable
grand perch
it should have okay cara dmg at best
tall torrent
I think tac axe’s current identity is fine as a light weapon that’s still good vs elites
But
Their single target vs carapace & unyielding is
marsh shard
The thing needs to have a reason to exist
grand perch
mk VII taxe is best
tall torrent
<@366562874039992331> which taxe do u think is most viable
I like 7 most because it can hit 1 tap to BM bruisers
narrow frost
Every weapon has a reason to exist, to be different from the rest to fit in someone else's hand better
marsh shard
Actually, I change my opinion
tall torrent
I also basically only play Rashad on veteran
So I would want more melee weapons to be good
So I get more variety
marsh shard
Taxes should be the light weapon designed to deal with mixed hordes and prob should struggle into carapace
Thatd give it a different niche
grand perch
thats...already what it is
tall torrent
I don’t think it should suck vs carapace
I don’t agree with “slightly smaller axe” having 1/3 the dps of the “slightly bigger axe”
marsh shard
thats...already what it is
Just needs improvements in the mobility department
grand perch
no it needs cara and boss damage. only minor mobility buffs as stated above
marsh shard
Yeah, we are on same page for mobility
But if its slightly worse rashad with signif better mobility then everyone would just move to tac axe
grand perch
see i dont think they would
grand perch
also much easier moveset
marsh shard
Tac Axe already has a ton of synergy with crit
tall torrent
Tac axe has better practical ttk vs ragers
Better stagger that actually matters
Would have better sprint speed
In exchange for worse attack swing angles and slightly worse dps vs carapace & unyielding
Being more dependent on crit
That seems reasonable to me
Except it doesn’t do that rn and it’s frustrating
I look at veteran’s melee weapons that I want to play and it’s like
marsh shard
It would be if vet/zealot didnt already give a truckload of incentive to go crit
tall torrent
“Ya I would like this a lot more if it actually was half as good as Rashad”
grand perch
so you dont consider the extra challenge enjoyable?
tall torrent
I don’t enjoy chainsword in their current state for veteran, yes
marsh shard
Tac axe is one small change away from being meta af is my take.
They nerf DS and adjust tac axe and itd be the king of DT
tall torrent
Tac axe is one small change away from being meta af is my take.
They nerf DS an...
It’s 2 changes
marsh shard
I just err on the side of caution is all
tall torrent
Buff carapace & unyielding damage massively
Buff sprint bonus to revolver level
marsh shard
The thing is already nasty with headtaker + shred
Not a fan of bromentum on it because it doesnt have great range. Trex arms
tall torrent
For veteran I think BM + headtaker/AoN is the best pick
Well, mk7 anyway
On mk4 prob forego BM
grand perch
mk VII has great PAs too
marsh shard
The followup of the mk2 to the pa is also a diagonal swing
Whereas iirc mk7 is an overhead
grand perch
its also diagonal
tall torrent
Whereas iirc mk7 is an overhead
No, loops back to H1 diagonal
marsh shard
I love the dclaw
marsh shard
I hate being spawned into a game with 2 dead people, a bot, and the game starts me out with a sliver of health in the middle of a mixed horde
ocean otter
L class
thorn lark
so we're talking about my favorite weapon
tough tiger
Uh sorry but that's MY favorite weapon
You can have the shredder pistol in the corner
frank ether
I also basically only play Rashad on veteran
easier to reach there by making rashad not what it is
or DS for that matter
pseudo fiber
Like blessings, mark, all that stuff
Mk2b
Ghost/deadly accurate + headhunter
Flak + maniac
warm bolt
Aight, thanks a lot mate!
frank ether
What's the best build for infantry lasgun?
you're gonna dislike this answer but the best build is to equip laspistol
warm bolt
Yeah, i will
heavy rover
Second this, mk ii infantry lasgun is my go-to for havoc
lucid pike
Which of the grenade talents before voice of command is the best in your opinion?
warm bolt
Yeah extra nades gives more flexibility in pick ups
lucid pike
Thats what I thought aswell (since its the only one thats always active) but twinned blast is kinda funny tho
warm bolt
But i have seen the field improv one being used somewhat often
unreal nova
But i *have* seen the field improv one being used somewhat often
All the time if I'm around. Don't care, it gud unless teammates dumbo grabbed grims.
light ridge
Thats what I thought aswell (since its the only one thats always active) but twi...
Twinned blast by itself isn't reliable enough, it becomes better the more nades you generate through the other talents
unreal nova
Thats what I thought aswell (since its the only one thats always active) but twi...
It's also only good with frags seriously.
tough tiger
twin krak is funny when it happens
unreal nova
twin krak is funny when it happens
I know, but it's usually pointless unless two big dooks next to each other but too far away for 1 krak.
lucid pike
krak for anything else is a waste
what if there are like 5 crushers next to eachother
crimson wyvern
You guys are being tight with your nades as veteran? 
Dont you get those every 60 seconds for free?
tame lodge
You guys are being tight with your nades as veteran? <:staregryn:102208508384432...
As a battlefield nade spam enjoyer
FRAG OUT
🗣️
heavy rover
what if there are like 5 crushers next to eachother
By the time that happens I chuck shredders at their feet to keep them staggered while I spam heavies with combat axe / duelling sword
unreal nova
You guys are being tight with your nades as veteran? <:staregryn:102208508384432...
I dunno them, I think boomies is fun and Bolt Pistol boomies be extra fun.
light ridge
Could Stripped Down be interesting on Recon for Havoc?
light ridge
what if there are like 5 crushers next to eachother
Shredders at their feet, back off while unloading my Onslaught Recon in their faces
calm shard
hey so I see the shock maul has Falter on it
what does that make it stagger that it doesn't normally
light ridge
Not much in my experience, Hammerblow works much better for extra stagger
calm shard
also related question does zapping someone with the special count as a stagger for skullcrusher
light ridge
Yes
granite wraith
Anyone around to help me with a penance? I’m trying to complete the “on overwatch” one to complete a malice mission without taking melee damage
Or am I in the wrong spot for that my bad if I am
dire olive
You can try the LFG channels
granite wraith
👌🏻 ty
crisp oak
Could Stripped Down be interesting on Recon for Havoc?
Have a funny setup idea that uses stripped down, run n gun, and duck and dive
That makes you immune to gunners as you eun and shoot them
sullen jackal
psykers: "look what they need to match a fraction of our power"
clever citrus
Anyone around to help me with a penance? I’m trying to complete the “on overwatc...
Same here it's a pain in the ass
granite wraith
Same here it's a pain in the ass
I was so close my last try and got hit a single time lol
clever citrus
It's all I need and then I finish out the for the emperor penances
Hardest one I swear
remote sonnet
It's not that hard really.
crisp oak
Same here it's a pain in the ass
He doesnt know the secret way
Anyway ask in lfg for that and some people should be able to help
remote sonnet
You can run 1 or even 2 +3 stamina with the Dclaw and just parry your way through.
pseudo fiber
I was so close my last try and got hit a single time lol
You're allowed to be hit you can't take health damage.
If you get melee'd at full toughness you take no health damage
crisp oak
Fun fact death by dropping off cliff doesnt count as health damage
According to fatsharks genius code, unless they fixed that.
pseudo fiber
I think that still works
dire olive
I mean it's not melee damage
pseudo fiber
Yeah exactly
remote sonnet
I prefer to do it without cheese.
dire olive
Shout-out to back in the day when the -90% aggro perk wasn't tied to an ability and you just stood still and enemies ignored you 
odd sparrow
remote sonnet
The camouflage expert was so dumb.
calm shard
Old camouflage
It would be nice for exe stance to still have a -aggro upgrade
so that I stop getting bothered by that one poxwalker nobody can be assed to kill while shooting ranged enemies
sullen jackal
According to fatsharks genius code, unless they fixed that.
I mean is it even damage, you're just set into the death state
crisp oak
I mean is it even damage, you're just set into the death state
Yup
So if you just do that
sullen jackal
...this theoretically also means a bug may exist where you can move into another not death state by a bugged melee attack
unreal nova
I mean, just be good at VT2.
My GF did it at lvl 3.
By accident, as melee shovel only vet.
crisp oak
I mean, just be good at VT2.
Cant didnt play vt2
unreal nova
Cos she hates the starter gun.
crisp oak
dire olive
Every normal person hates the infantry las
crisp oak
Every normal person hates the infantry las
Every person without mods hates the ilas
dire olive
Mods don't fix it's dumpster tier damage/firerate/recoil
crisp oak
Exactly
crisp oak
Mods don't fix it's dumpster tier damage/firerate/recoil
I mean it does enough damage when getting carpal tunnel by clicking it so fast
unreal nova
Just gud at VT2 highest diff.
crisp oak
Aka what the mod is for
loud belfry
Mods don't fix it's dumpster tier damage/firerate/recoil
there kinda is a mod that can help with some aspect of recoil
unreal nova
So it translates to op at melee in this.
unreal nova
Also, gitgud at stupid pings.
frail narwhal
hi
unreal nova
Server host is still better than the avg peer2peer.
Unless you play with someone in the next room.
faint beacon
ILAGs are good they’re just the white bread gun so I use others over it
dire olive
Take an iLas into havoc 40 and see how "good" it is
crisp oak
how do people think the infantry lasguns have bad damage
Cuz they dont hit heads
dire olive
The only times it does damage is with exe stance or MF stacks
crisp oak
Its good against anything without carapace armor
frail narwhal
Not much, have any questions about the game?
i only have 1 question
crisp oak
Ok
dire olive
Laspistol is just better in every way
faint beacon
Take an iLas into havoc 40 and see how "good" it is
Shock trooper, Headhunter, Surv
calm shard
like, any substantial damage boost and this one shots
faint beacon
🚬
frail narwhal
how i can play with friends?
calm shard
or a crit even and crits on vet lol
unreal nova
how i can play with friends?
Social, invite to strike team.
faint beacon
Recon just does its job better cause you can put DOT on it more effectively
crisp oak
how i can play with friends?
You go into social, then got to find player, and enter their fatshark code
faint beacon
ILAGs are more for sniping specials
crisp oak
Then you invite them to strike team
calm shard
yeah
faint beacon
And besides when you go into havoc
dire olive
There's also the terrible RoF
calm shard
infantry lasgun has the best maniac damage of any ranged weapon if I'm not mistaken
faint beacon
infantry lasgun has the best maniac damage of *any* ranged weapon if I'm not mis...
I believe there’s like a rare few that does it better but yes
It drops ragers insanely quick
dire olive
Yeah have fun in Havoc 40 when the pus hardened dreg gunner has taken 5 headshots and isn't even staggered
faint beacon
You have teammates
calm shard
also it takes multiple plasma shots even then
faint beacon
And you’re running shock Surv Econ feedback loop
frail narwhal
You go into social, then got to find player, and enter their fatshark code
that easy?
faint beacon
You can waste ammo
calm shard
5 headshots from an ilag is less ammo than any amount of plasma fire
shock trooper survivalist lmao
infinite ammo gun
dire olive
Laspistol >
faint beacon
shock trooper survivalist lmao
The holy feedback loop bonus points if it’s headhunter
dire olive
Helbore >
calm shard
works with the helbores too and they do plasma gun tier damage if you're willing to put up with their bullshit
faint beacon
Laspistol >
Laspistol is meta on everything so idk why it’s being brought up
calm shard
wait hang on the guy complaining about the terrible fire rate of the Infantry lasguns
dire olive
Because it does essentially the same job better
faint beacon
Because it does essentially the same job better
Recon does its job better
So don’t use Laspistol
See how stupid that argument is
dire olive
Yeah because laspistol is better than recon
dire olive
is recommending the Helbores?
At least the helbores don't necessarily need follow up shots
unreal nova
Ilas and Hlaspistol is like, only op with autoclicker. Recon gets outclassed if you have one.
calm shard
helbore is fun though
I mean the infantry lasguns don't need followup shots if you have any substantial damage boost either
dire olive
Not in havoc
faint beacon
Yeah because laspistol is better than recon <:chadgryn:1161142998214656090>
In your dreams with pus modifier
Instant max stack burn
crisp oak
I would *not* say the helbore is meta ever
Shhh
grand perch
absolutely is in havoc
faint beacon
It’s “off-meta”
crisp oak
In havoc though, actual unlimited ammo is a major boon to it
crimson wyvern
Ive seen people hate Helbore so much that they never switch off of it. Only use bayonette for your melee
grand perch
fair nuff
crisp oak
Yeah Just pointing out surgical infernus probably works on like a mk1
Mk3 2 shots pus hardened gunners on 40 I think
heavy rover
I take infantry lasgun to havoc 35+ regularly and I've never run out of ammo
faint beacon
Helbore forces something called
crisp oak
I take infantry lasgun to havoc 35+ regularly and I've never run out of ammo
Do you take any ammo tins?
faint beacon
Committing
heavy rover
Rarely
faint beacon
Aka you swap you stay swapped to that weapon
crisp oak
Because the helbore literally doesnt ever need them
heavy rover
If anything I pass them off to the rest of the team
grand perch
zealots get a weird grin and big eyes when i mention they can take all the ammo
grand perch
and they still go ammo red on flamer
crisp oak
As long as you let surgical stack, you never use any ammo
heavy rover
I want to take helbore to havoc but the time to draw it out is frustrating
unreal nova
zealots get a weird grin and big eyes when i mention they can take all the ammo
Me forgetting I have a flamer.
crisp oak
I want to take helbore to havoc but the time to draw it out is frustrating
Yeah they should fix this
lucid pike
Ive seen people hate Helbore so much that they never switch off of it. Only use ...
I swear they should just add a spear that's helbore's bayonet on a stick for the Veteran
faint beacon
Why the Las weapons regardless which one you choose are good for havoc cause of the feedback build you can make with them
grand perch
one motion helps a little with helbore draw speed
faint beacon
one motion helps a little with helbore draw speed
It’s not massive but it helps
heavy rover
The Ghost perk is a huge help, and it's why I switched to infantry las
crisp oak
The Ghost perk is a huge help, and it's why I switched to infantry las
If you are running ghost I prefer the pistol personally
heavy rover
I like the fast fire rate of the mk ii lasgun
calm shard
my biggest gripe with infantry lasgun that pushes me to the helbore/laspistol is suppression
grand perch
the ADS walk speed on IIa is a nice boon too
heavy rover
Yeah, the suppression is annoying, I picked up Determined on the talent tree because of it
Pretty much cemented my role as the anti-range in the team
crisp oak
The laspistol running speed is so nice
faint beacon
Reminder that no one uses the passive on vet of being able to peak over cover
And that determined should just be a baked in passive
calm shard
nobody uses it because enemies will shoot you through pixel sized gaps in cover
since they're programmed to never miss no matter what
faint beacon
Yeah it’s a useless passive tragically
Which is why determined should either just be baked in, or that cover peaking should be buffed in someway
calm shard
anyways we were talking about laspistol is Concentrated Fire any good?
It just seems like a worse headhunter
faint beacon
anyways we were talking about laspistol is Concentrated Fire any good?
Desperado
You’ll get more value out of
Concentrated seems good on paper but unlike Headhunter it drops all stacks if you miss once
calm shard
okay but it seems like desperado only applies on dodging melee attacks
which is unlikely when using ghost
faint beacon
Recip talent + Desperado just gives you a more solid way to maintain it
faint beacon
which is unlikely when using ghost
Very likely actually
Your not immune to melee and pistol gives you a shit ton of mobility to work with
Desperado and Recip will cause your Crit to jump very quickly
clever citrus
On over watch has to be the dumbest penance
frank ether
is recommending the Helbores?
the fast helbore is practically faster than iLas without the visual recoil
now it has that horrible helbore mobility/swap speed still
but at least the gun part is reliable
calm shard
but I like using MKIV because 2 shotting crushers is fun
frank ether
is that what they call the slow helbore now?
rustic beacon
On over watch has to be the dumbest penance
Was that the no melee damage one? If so just „abuse“ golden toughness from shout and you should be good
clever citrus
Was that the no melee damage one? If so just „abuse“ golden toughness from shout...
That's actually genius
frank ether
I'd consider it on zealot if it was available, don't see why I'd bother with it on vet when you can juice much faster weapons to work just as good
calm shard
yeah slow helbore is the MKIV now
frank ether
I think helbore has some real issues, its too strong in some areas and too cumbersome in others
I think what slow helbore needs is a better bayonet first
calm shard
no kidding
like even if they wanna keep the stupid overhead attack make it swing faster
or have better cleave
frank ether
and then take that swap speed time and make it differentiate between the marks
calm shard
or make it go side to side with better cleave
frank ether
fastest and middle marks should have a tad faster swap speeds
frank ether
or make it go side to side with better cleave
I think hb already has ok cleave but its put to shame by broken guns like plasma
rustic beacon
He means the special melee attack
frank ether
or in current havoc meta ppl just prefer stuff thats AoE in nature
like purg or flamer
shit that needed no buff but overbuffed to please reddit anyway
faint beacon
I think the wildest fucking thing is how hotshot buffs two of the mediocre vet melees by a big margin
Shovel and Shock Maul
frank ether
He means the special melee attack
you can already cleave horizontally with it, it just doesnt have the damage spread.
slow helbore can drag melee attacks horizontally to cleave multiple heads
well, I assume so can the fast ones I suppose if you're quick enough
faint beacon
slow helbore can drag melee attacks horizontally to cleave multiple heads
Don’t let the other variant users hear you say that
frank ether
problem is, you have no damage left after the first target
back when brutal momentum was bugged and applied to bayonet, you could use that to clear poxies with slow helbore.
and fast helbores could just spam it
faint beacon
Hotshot could help if it’s cleave as the issue but I’m assuming it’s more so the damage dis
wooden stirrup
Middle hellbore is the best mark generally?
faint beacon
Classic Damage distribution
Fucking over decent weapons since the dawn of this game
rustic beacon
Middle hellbore is the best mark generally?
Most people consider it the worst I think. But I like its shooting the most
frank ether
brutal momentum worked because as long as you got a kill your full damage would apply to the next head in the row, this is not how hotshot works
and as such its just not good
wooden stirrup
Most people consider it the worst I think. But I like its shooting the most
Heard the opposite in zealot chat idk
I'm trying out hellbore and chain sword for my vet
faint beacon
Ironically enough hotshot is always up which allows you to buff melees that lack In cleave blessings
Biggest note being shovel
rustic beacon
Hotshot on hellbore applies to your melee?
faint beacon
Yes it’s always active for some unknown reason
wooden stirrup
What's the dumpstat for Helbore?
rustic beacon
Neat info, ty
faint beacon
Probably going to get patched
Literally the only two melees that heavily benefit are Shovel and Shock Maul
calm shard
this a decent build for laspistol gun vet?
hollow ibex
i feel like running laspis on exec is a bit of a waste tbh
calm shard
midnight totem
Ironically enough hotshot is always up which allows you to buff melees that lack...
What
faint beacon
What
Hotshot is always active
Even when you’re on melee
Free 50 cleave on Weakspot hit
midnight totem
WHAT
faint beacon
Again the melees that massively benefit from it are Shovel and Shock Maul
Massively shovel
midnight totem
I mean, so would knife
faint beacon
Ehhh… kinda?
midnight totem
Chainsword
faint beacon
Mainly mk6 but like
faint beacon
Chainsword
Cleave cap on them
midnight totem
Oh right
faint beacon
Mk6 you’re pushing it tbh seeing it’s a knife
But like the only notable ones are shovel and Shock mauls
desert viper
what blessings do people use on infantry lasgun?
serene bough
Ghost + Headhunter
pseudo fiber
2b
serene bough
I think IIb is the best one, but VII is also good too
desert viper
alright
calm shard
yeah okay tried out laspistol
desperado is basically never active on it with the way I play the game
serene bough
https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9dae207f-6a4f-4862-ae10-5dfd41b2a242/havoc-mg4knife this is my build for IIb
calm shard
gonna use dum dum or smth instead
serene bough
alternatively you could lean less on the left tree and grab middle tree perks for a FT oriented build
frank ether
desperado is basically never active on it with the way I play the game
bit of a you issue on that one
on vet right tree you have a stacking crit talent that works the same way
calm shard
yeah I have reciprocity on because when I'm actually dodging attacks I have my melee weapon out
because I am killing the annoying fuck that's trying to hit me
frank ether
if you don't want to play for crits then you can take marksman focus and play for headshots
calm shard
and ghost doesn't count as dodging
or desperado doesn't count ranged attacks I dunno which actually
frank ether
and if you don't want to do that you'll just forever suck with laspistol because finesse is %66 of your dps
and for havoc infernus which is also tied to finesse
calm shard
any time I am playing gun vet I am using focus/exe stance
it's my go to "holy shit I am sick of basic shooters" playstyle
loud belfry
a gigantic amount of the time when I dodge melee enemies I kinda ignore them to look at the rest of the world
gets me hurt a lot but then I just blame my teammates for not being perfect
frank ether
again, there will come many times where you need to dodge something in melee while shooting at a trapper/sniper/gunner etc
crit on dodge works at that moment, which is arguably the most important moment
calm shard
yeah but dumdum is 35% damage just for like...shooting things
I have good enough aim I think, but concentrated fire going away entirely if you miss once is still too much for me
I'm confident in my aim enough to play this build, but not that confident
oak gorge
anyone else feel like this when they throw a grenade into a group of specials
just a chill guy
hollow ibex
tactical grenade roll 👌
empty root
Not recommended IRL
I don't understand why so many builds are opting for 5% toughness per kill over close order drill and confirmed kill
I thought toughness damage reduction was a pretty coveted stat
calm shard
could be overestimating the swap speed benefit
if you don't know a lot about the game 25% swap speed sounds like a lot
empty root
I take it for weapon specialist builds
But for focus target/marksman focus builds I go down the center
sour chasm
anyone else feel like this when they throw a grenade into a group of specials
sometimes, although I mainly just use Krak Grenades
crisp oak
But for focus target/marksman focus builds I go down the center
Its mainly with aoe kill guns
Or say a columnus
Where you spray into a horde, all toughness back super fast
empty root
Is it ranged though?
I interpret it as from the standard melee kills
10% instead of 5%
hollow ibex
O4b? it's from anything
you toss a shredder into a horde and you restore 100% toughness 🤷♂️
empty root
It's wording it bad then
It should just say get 5% toughness from kills
Or does veteran get toughness from range kills as a base?
hollow ibex
i don't believe so
technically the wording is right
you get 5% more
on top of 0, that's 5% more
light ridge
Technically correct
But yes 5% from every single kill, no exceptions, tends to better than ranged weakspot or specials only
light ridge
Turns grenades into an extra shout for yourself
empty root
So all ranged kills give 5% and melee gives 7.5%+5% for a total of 12.5%?
light ridge
Add in Shout, Born Leader and FT (with Toughness talent) and you're a Duracel Toughness battery for the group
hollow ibex
But yea I guess I take out for blood every build now
i rate O4B on par with CK
wouldn't say O4B is a must-take for every build
esp since like you said, you lose out on free TDR
but def worth trying out, esp with frag builds
thorn lark
o4b vs CK boils down to: do I have enough points?
pastel pumice
What do you mean
faint beacon
o4b vs CK boils down to: do I have enough points?
It’s more like what path do I prefer
thorn lark
Its the same gale
faint beacon
Cause you can take either pathing
pastel pumice
Middle and Right pathway take the same amount of points
That is, if you're grabbingg 3 of the nodes per side
hollow ibex
Cause you can take either pathing
take both
pastel pumice
Are you grabbing all 4 in the middle
thorn lark
All 4?
pastel pumice
So you're taking COD, CK and Charismatic?
thorn lark
Also I play mostly bolter on vet so if go right I am tempted to take all the nodes
Just cod and ck
serene bough
generally i think O4B is better
light ridge
It's the more reliable one
serene bough
i take it over CK any day
the path is also better imo
TDR from other nodes doesnt matter much as long as iron will + VoC spam exists, and I always value move speed over 1+ stamina
thorn lark
Hmmmmm maybe I will try that
empty root
What's your name ingame
serene bough
Hmmmmm maybe I will try that
only thing i'd recommend is checking how much sup complex is helping your breakpoints
thorn lark
Me?
empty root
Yea
serene bough
may not be needed
empty root
A man of culture
light ridge
One step down to right on the left tree gives a permanent 10% TDR regardless of coherency
thorn lark
only thing i'd recommend is checking how much sup complex is helping your breakp...
You're right. I take it by force of habit.
frank ether
yeah but dumdum is 35% damage just for like...shooting things
It doesnt rly come into play with the slow laspistol whatever I want dead is dead in a shot or two to the head and if not its probably something to be handled with melee
to my much more important that I stack infernus fast and move on or have some utility like ghost in havoc
thorn lark
One step down to right on the left tree gives a permanent 10% TDR regardless of ...
Except I will try to be in coherency most of time to use shout
frank ether
god iLAS needs some attention badly
serene bough
You're right. I take it by force of habit.
idk what melee you're bringing but i'd personally build this
but this really depends on how much sup complex + marksman affects breakpoints
light ridge
Except I will try to be in coherency most of time to use shout
Same but I mostly play PUG and sort of gave up...
serene bough
those 4 points over on the right are usually a must have in all my builds, it's just strictly superior melee prowess
thorn lark
but this really depends on how much sup complex + marksman affects breakpoints
It depends. DS/ knife bolter on havoc
empty root
Lots of good stuff on the bottom right even for shooting
serene bough
if knife then definitely recommend trench fighter & desperado
empty root
Reciprocity, onslaught
light ridge
Same but I mostly play PUG and sort of gave up...
More important to keep me alive when half the party is running off in opposite directions
empty root
The only real variation in my builds is if I'm taking focus target or weapon specialist
And shock trooper
oak gorge
bro playing microsoft excel
thorn lark
I am sure DS will benefit a lot from the those talents... But it's already op as fuck
serene bough
i'd say give it a try
serene bough
and if you dont find it necessary keep your left tree DPS nodes instead
i personally value melee buffs a lot since it makes vet feel so much smoother in melee
thorn lark
bro playing microsoft excel
Power di is too taxing on perf:(
What I like with your build is that I am trading coherency tdr for +25 toughness
calm shard
trying this out for laspistol gun vet atm
crisp oak
trying this out for laspistol gun vet atm
Longshot doesnt do much tbh
narrow frost
does exhilarating takedown work?
calm shard
yeah
used to be bugged and make you take more toughness damage somehow
got patched at some point god knows when
serene bough
trying this out for laspistol gun vet atm
idk im not a fan of investing more than 3 points at the top of the tree
calm shard
yeah that's my concern too
serene bough
the two points you have for ET and Longshot could be used more meaningfully, like 25+ toughness and BiD in the middle of the tree
calm shard
I'm mising out on a lot of the big boy damage nodes down low
empty root
idk im not a fan of investing more than 3 points at the top of the tree
This. So much good stuff at the bottom of the tree before capstones
pastel pumice
Vet's juicy dinner is towards the bottom
empty root
You need to get past the F ability with the fewest points possible then go to town
calm shard
but I also really like exhilarating takedown
serene bough
i also think all the MF nodes are really garbage except the main one
I wouldnt recommend taking any of them
calm shard
I don't really see how 50% actual toughness replenishment boost is bad personally
empty root
For last pistol long range I would go cod and ck then go straight to shredder
serene bough
50% assumes you're going to be at max stacks of MF all the time which is usually not a good assumption
empty root
Maybe Longshot with a spare point
serene bough
I only recommend taking MF if you know for a fact it's going to push breakpoints meaningfully for your gun, which it def will on a laspistol
serene bough
that's 4 headshots
i just think investing in more consistent damage is a better choice
unless you find yourself really starved for toughness
empty root
The time you lose toughness you are gonna be moving and dumping all your toughness stacks
serene bough
id do this personally, sup complex could be swapped w/ marksman too
id recommend giving a point somewhere for desperado too, but depends on how you feel about your melee weapon's ability
empty root
id do this personally, sup complex could be swapped w/ marksman too
Put demo team into marksman
calm shard
I've been using knife with it and just relying on shredders for horde clear
stab anything armored to death
empty root
Shredders aren't supposed to be consistent horde clear, they are for mixed hordes and emergencies
calm shard
damn shame they regenerate so often then huh
if they "aren't supposed to be consistent horde clear"
sure always happen to have them on hand
serene bough
personally if you're using a knife i'd grab trench fighter
you could opt out of using trench fighter but i'd definitely recommend desperado
just some build options for you to consider
empty root
if they "aren't supposed to be consistent horde clear"
Like are you getting into situations where you are surrounded by poxwalkers and you have to drop a grenade and kill them?
calm shard
having only confirmed kill for toughness regen seems awkward
but I guess elites are everywhere
calm shard
Like are you getting into situations where you are surrounded by poxwalkers and ...
not really, but it saves time
and hey I'll probably get it back next time the game spawns 10 gunners anyways
empty root
having *only* confirmed kill for toughness regen seems awkward
Just don't get hit bro
serene bough
having *only* confirmed kill for toughness regen seems awkward
if you think the extra toughness regen node is worth it on MF then go ahead and use it, but CK procs often and stacks
if you're dispatching elites/specialists often the value is insane
narrow frost
with 2 grenade regen talents taking out for blood might be better than confirmed
serene bough
im really not a fan of the MF subnodes i think they're all crap
only one you could make an argument for is camo, but i really recommend against building stacks by standing still
calm shard
honestly camo is so obviously the worst one there that I'm not sure why anyone would consider it
faint beacon
im really not a fan of the MF subnodes i think they're all crap
I’m gonna say it right now, if it synergized with melee it would be insanely good
calm shard
actually 5 stacks could be worse I dunno how many breakpoints that effects
10% rending is also p bad
faint beacon
Even if it’s buffs were heavily nerfed on melee use
serene bough
10% rending is the worst node of the 4
calm shard
okay but camouflage is just like
faint beacon
It would be really good outside of Armor node
calm shard
click the head of a poxwalker one time
save yourself the time and look like less of an idiot standing there
serene bough
15 stacks is usually useless, and even if it did push a bp it's not good to reach max stacks to get it
faint beacon
I wish it was
Click head regardless of weapon cause then you could totally upkeep your stacks
calm shard
I mean I know the toughness replenishment node works with melee kills
empty root
Try this
narrow frost
left
calm shard
because it affects all sources of toughness replenishment
faint beacon
That and it would reward consistent Weakspot hits
calm shard
except for coherency, unless the mod I'm using that makes descriptions more detailed is wrong
serene bough
the only time I think MF is worth grabbing is when you know for a fact a low stack count would help to significantly push a breakpoint
faint beacon
the only time I think MF is worth grabbing is when you know for a fact a low sta...
Issue
WS exists
bitter vessel
whats the dump stat for chainswords
serene bough
for example, 25% flak + 10% elite on IIb will push 7 breakpoints with 3 stacks of MF @ >15m
empty root
Mobility
bitter vessel
thank you!
serene bough
laspistol i'd take WS
faint beacon
bad option for ilas
FT
serene bough
still bad for ilas imo
bitter vessel
whats your favorite ways of farming resources pre-havoc?
faint beacon
MF is just incredibly weak vs the other two options tbh
orchid hemlock
@tall torrent https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xt_opWoL89w
bitter vessel
im poor and need to empower lots of stuff
faint beacon
I just think it needs even if it’s incredibly weak or nerfed a melee synergy
serene bough
esp at the volume of enemies, constnatly having to reapply FT vs just clicking 1 head and recieving 7 new BPs is just less efficient and more point investment than I'd prefer
faint beacon
And it’ll instantly be on par with the other two
calm shard
I could see marksmans focus counting all weakspot hits/kills for the sake of resetting its timer at least
calm shard
so you don't start losing stacks while smacking at hordes
faint beacon
I could see marksmans focus counting *all* weakspot hits/kills for the sake of r...
I’ve been wanting this for ages
empty root
Honestly they just need to remove the movement peice to it
calm shard
like if I stab a poxwalker in the face that should reset the grace period
or have it lose stacks by something you do less frequently than fucking walking
faint beacon
I love the idea of being rewarded for consistently hitting Weakspots
serene bough
i still think FT is inferior to MF for the IIb
empty root
Have a stacking buff that refreshes on headshots and slowly decays
Just a capstone that rewards headshots. That's it.
faint beacon
or have it lose stacks by something you do less frequently than fucking *walking...
Hit body
Lose stack
empty root
Don't punish movement
faint beacon
That simple
serene bough
MF helps to smooth out the inverse damage fall off of the weapon too, and pushes BP on scab stalkers and dreg shooters, which can be helped by FT
serene bough
not to mention rending strikes & BiD aren't that useful for the ilas whereas sup complex is jsut overall better for the threats ilas usually handles
the subnodes definitely need to be revamped, all of them
theyre dogwater bad
final charm
no no we need a new class, that is what will fix everything.
faint beacon
the subnodes definitely need to be revamped, all of them
I honestly just think MF is due for a rework it’s incredibly weak when compared to FT and WS
It’s useable
It does its job
But you don’t get a shit ton of value out of it vs the other two options
serene bough
id argue its niche, not weak
because there are few situations where i prefer MF over FT, despite FT being generally better
but yes, some buff or rework wouldn't go amiss\
faint beacon
Extremely rarely prefer MF over something and that’s when I’m committing the grave sin of focusing gun far more
serene bough
i wouldnt call ranged playstyles a sin, just preference
you can get similar or better value from MF over FT for the ilas with significalty less point investment imo
faint beacon
I genuinely think camo should be removed if melee gets integrated into MF
Seeing you can have upkeep alone from melee
serene bough
but i will say, it does depend on your melee choice, i'd go MF when using knife bc of the stam regen node but i'd go FT if i was using rashad
faint beacon
You tend to always run WS when it’s Rashad for TFD
literally just cause that 10% melee speed is huge for Rashad
serene bough
wouldnt know i guess since i dont use rashad often (or at all honesty)
i just hear the bottom of the middle tree is better for rashad
faint beacon
I used to use it
serene bough
but again, WS for ilas is bad