veteran-class

[craggy relic]

ok

[hollow ibex]

it's a trap

[craggy relic]

should I grab rending instead?

in the mid tree?

[hollow ibex]

depends on weapons

it's often good, but it really depends

[craggy relic]

bolto

[hollow ibex]

oh

no

[craggy relic]

aight

[hollow ibex]

don't need rending

[craggy relic]

you sure?

[hollow ibex]

bolter fucks up armor all the same

[craggy relic]

huh

any perks you reccomend?

[hollow ibex]

you take rending on weapons that do poorly against armor

[craggy relic]

passives even?

[craggy relic]

ohhhhh

[hollow ibex]

if you're taking FT

make sure you take redirect fire

the subnode to the left of FT can be nice too

[craggy relic]

is that the damage one?

[hollow ibex]

yeah

[craggy relic]

I have that ye

hmmm

any other reccomendations?

[hollow ibex]

otherwise can't really make reccs without seeing your build

[craggy relic]

want me to post here?

[hollow ibex]

yeah that'd be easiest

[craggy relic]

just the perks?

or the whole

[hollow ibex]

just the talent tree

but what melee are you running with bolter?

[craggy relic]

rashad axe

[hollow ibex]

oh ok rashad will want right side perks too

[craggy relic]

I do manage to get by without them

getting constant best in offense which is what I aim for

[hollow ibex]

i'd run something like this instead

with 1 flex point

[craggy relic]

hm...

[hollow ibex]

you really want to go down top right instead, because bolter without one motion is painful

[tall torrent]

For Boltgun, run Tac reload

[hollow ibex]

oops

yes you want tac reload as well

[craggy relic]

Im usually the guy that kills a lot of elites

[tall torrent]

Extra ammo is nice but not required in base game

[craggy relic]

I do havoc so I need the extra ammo

[hollow ibex]

1 flex point (which i'd put into extra ammo personally)

[tall torrent]

If ur bringing Boltgun into havoc you prob can’t afford a Rashad on the same build

[craggy relic]

how come?

with my current build Ive been managing fine with it0-

[tall torrent]

Rashad wants red nodes + bottom right side

[craggy relic]

are there other weapons then that help with the egregious hitmass then for later levels?

[tall torrent]

Well

Rashad isn’t gonna 1 tap Moebian 21st groaners

[craggy relic]

what sdoes?

[tall torrent]

Most of horde clear is done by psyker anyway

[craggy relic]

I do wanna help with the horde as well as take out straggling elites

[tall torrent]

Rashad can, with red nodes active

[craggy relic]

ok, but other than that?

[tall torrent]

Power sword, if you want to put unarmored on your sword and use BM on it

But power sword is better with sunder in havoc tbh

[craggy relic]

what about chainsword?

[hearty panther]

pffft, tac reload

just channel your inner autismo

[umbral matrix]

the heck is a moebian 21st groaner

[craggy relic]

personally I'd prefer the elite kill one

[tall torrent]

It’s definitely a weapon

[hearty panther]

and reload cancel everything forever

[sturdy snow]

Achieved my first 500 weapon

[craggy relic]

nice!!

[hearty panther]

armored horde in havocs

[craggy relic]

ok, so now Im lost on what to do for a build lmao

it looks like I need a new melee weapon

[umbral matrix]

oh, i cant get havoc to work. Are they a permanent thing?

[tall torrent]

This is a fairly normal axe build for havoc I’d say

[hearty panther]

frequent enough

[craggy relic]

so shreedder IM getting at is good

for havoc

if I may ask how so?

[tall torrent]

Throw 2 frags at hordes of melee elites

Will help deal a good chunk of damage to everything that’s not a crusher

Red nodes help Rashad meet the increased health on most enemies in havoc

[craggy relic]

how's this

[narrow frost]

close

[tall torrent]

Exploit weakness is not worth it

I don’t think BID is particularly valuable for havoc either

If ur gonna take a consistent damage node, take superiority complex

[craggy relic]

wait... whioch node-

sorry IM blind Xd

[tall torrent]

Right below ammo

Take a look at what I posted

[craggy relic]

I didnt grab it

I jsut showed you the new build

everything's the same except the bottom

[tall torrent]

Well, what u showed is neither good for Boltgun nor good for axe

[craggy relic]

oh

[tall torrent]

So I kinda don’t know what ur trying to run

What havoc difficulty are u mainly playing anyway

[craggy relic]

IM trying to use bolt gun for big damage against the elites n stuff

melee to pick off low health stragglers and horde clear

[tall torrent]

Are u making a build for havoc? Or just base game

[craggy relic]

uhhh... general use?...

both for base and havoc

[tall torrent]

Well, they’re not gonna be the same build

[craggy relic]

so far my build has carried me to havoc 26

[tall torrent]

Best use case of Boltgun for base game is with exe stance

[craggy relic]

yeye

I used exe stance for havoc

[steep prairie]

what curios are we running for havoc?

[craggy relic]

I may just go back to what I was running- we spiraled so far lmao

3 stam, 21 health, 17 tough

[tall torrent]

2 toughness 1 health
3x toughness perk
3x CDR perk
Remaining perks up to u

[normal sparrow]

Whats with the red nodes allergy?

[tall torrent]

What red node allergy

[normal sparrow]

Skipping the common red noded
The one to the right of recipro and the 10% team ones

*nodes

[tall torrent]

FTE is not as good as born leader or KTHD in havoc

And I circled CQKZ as a good pick

[narrow frost]

@faint river

[normal sparrow]

Ahh fair enuff

[normal sparrow]

Didnt notice that
Tbf thats red circle over red node

[tall torrent]

Pink circle

If ur not running Lasgun I think CQKZ is best pick here

Marksman + CQKZ

I run that with axe + plasma for havoc

[normal sparrow]

Close enough

[tame berry]

guys dose the middel focuz target key stone work ?
becus the icon dose not reset from 5

[tall torrent]

Yea, you need to figure out how to tag enemies first

[tame berry]

k

[tame berry]

tagged as in hitting em with sword and dying counts ?
becus i did that,,,

[tall torrent]

Tagged as in, pressed the keybind associated with “tagging” on an enemy

Not all enemies can be tagged

[tame berry]

ah

[tall torrent]

Specialist / elite / boss enemies can be tagged
Others can’t

[tame berry]

They have to be highlighted

[tall torrent]

Yea with the outline

[tame berry]

ok understood

[tall torrent]

That’s how this keystone works

[tame berry]

XD

[tough tiger]

How long do FT tags work?

[narrow frost]

we all start from somewhere

[tall torrent]

25s

[tame berry]

oh btw dose that keystone work with gun if you tag ?

[tall torrent]

It increases damage received by that tagged enemy from all sources, including melee & ranged attacks

[sage adder]

I like tagging enemies it makes it so much easier to shoot them through all the fog bullshit that are sometimes about

Especially flamers

Holy hell it does wonders for helping with aim against them

[tame berry]

k

ty

[tall torrent]

You should very naturally tag enemies as you’re playing to let teammates know where dangerous enemies are

Red outline also makes headshots easier

[sage adder]

I tag everything

Just cause it helps me aim

Selfish yet not at the same time lo

[hollow ibex]

just don't bind tag to LMB

[sage adder]

MMB is good enough for me.

[crude fiber]

me setting ping to LMB and using an auto clicker set to once every 10 milliseconds

[hollow ibex]

that's fine, but don't expect me to pick you up when you go down

[tough tiger]

@tall torrenterm... which lasgun is dead for dealing with shooters in general?

the renames screw me over

idk which is which now

[tame berry]

do teammeates also get the dmg buff if i ping/tag and they shot/hit em ?

if they do this is good

[hollow ibex]

yup

[drowsy aspen]

Idk if it's the best keystone but I'm always so happy when a Vet is running that

Of the super grindey keystones for penances it was also probably my favorite to do

[tame berry]

support vet :D

[tall torrent]

what

[steep prairie]

if i use bolt pistol should I use KTHD or Born Leader?

[tough tiger]

sorry, which helbore is good for dealing with shooters in general?

xd

[tall torrent]

V

But frankly none cuz they don’t have ghost

[hearty panther]

i wish they had DA too

and efficiency (lie)

imagine how much better the helbores could be if they had efficiency. you cant because it wouldnt be

[tough tiger]

is armorbane worth it on helbore?

[frank ether]

I think my problem with helbore is its too much dedication to make it worthwhile in both talent tax and playstyle. Hipfire charging takes surgical out of the equation too which just tanks your dps

with exe stan now allowing weapon swap and bayonets getting gutted value for hb is weak compared to just running like, any other las weapon, except maybe iLas

[frank ether]

maybe on the quick one but its kinda gutting your options at better damage for ''suuuuupoooorting''

and the slow helbore already has absurd carapace/unyielding profiles so its like, pointless. Besides it really wants the blessing for faster charge rate.

[tough tiger]

yeah ive already settled on surgical

armorbane is meh

[long condor]

what are some recommendations for a melee build? (dueling sword since its crazy but if yall have a better pick shoot)

[frank ether]

I think I'm disappointed with the way slow helbore has been treated where it potentially has very good synergy with no respite into monstro and it could become a skill weapon for big game hunting however the gun is so painfully slow that you just have to have onslaught

I also really miss brutal momentum interaction, I think it should be baseline for all hbs

[frank ledge]

Maybe if it's bayonet didn't stink it wouldn't be as harsh

[frank ether]

even tho what I'd really like is to have the special action just be a change stance button and let me use the thing like the VT2 halberd with full moveset

[tall torrent]

I think surgical + hotshot is best

[frank ledge]

[frigid tusk]

Weapon spec

[tough tiger]

hotshot?

50 cleave?

[tall torrent]

Tooltip is wrong

[frank ether]

I just think melee action for all (ranged) weapons is in a pitiful state and it deserves a complete overhaul. The one on slow helbore is so pathetic that I'd much rather have the weapon hold two more blessing slots for melee and have the special action button serve as a ''weapon swap'' to use it more like a halberd/spear depending on the mark

[frank ledge]

[tame lodge]

Not really

[frank ether]

oh yeah, did you do the math on this? I havent bothered to even try

I havent used hb in so long I forgot what cleave values they even have baseline

[tame lodge]

It's 3

All of them

[frank ether]

thats lame

I'd expect it to scale mark to mark

tho more disappointing is the blessing itself I suppose

[tame lodge]

Stabby bayo are 3
Slashy is 6.5

[frank ether]

that for bayos

or the gun part?

[tame lodge]

That's for bayo

[stoic thorn]

Exhilarating takedown is so ass

[frank ether]

oh, thats pretty useless for slashy then no? Considering it just runs out of damage on the first target usually anyway

unless they changed it in my absence

[frank ledge]

[tall torrent]

Yes
U take hotshot for the gun portion of Helbore, and your melee weapon

[frank ether]

wait, it applies to your melee?

fatshark why are you like this

we're having the reverse BM bug now

[tall torrent]

No one expects a blessing called “hotshot” to improve cleave on melee weapon

Which is exactly why it works in its intended way

(It’s also like, the only way shovel is worth playing in havoc lol)

[frank ether]

I cant decide if fatshark is terrible at balance, coding, or both

[tall torrent]

It’s sort of a balanced blessing

I wish it was on infantry lasgun tho

[frank ether]

It is but for the wrong reasons

[tall torrent]

Would actually run that on infantry lasgun

[frank ether]

yeah iLas be very boring

[tall torrent]

Or better yet just make hotshot a talent for veteran

That all builds can take

Would be peak

[frank ether]

I'd rather have that replace shock trooper

I have never been a fan of it

[tall torrent]

Have that replace determined, and make suppression immunity baseline for veteran

Would be peak

[frank ether]

I dont need that

I just need guns that are less ass

and maybe have marks mean something other than slight changes

[frank ledge]

I just want the game to work as you think ot should

None of this ranged weapon works on grenade/melee crap

[tall torrent]

More guns need to have faster ADS move speed

Enough with this 2m/s ADS move speed crap

No one in the history of fps games have ever enjoyed walking like a turtle the moment they ADS with their gun

[frank ledge]

Tactical games work like that

[hollow ibex]

sorry but this is a realistic warhammer 40k milsim

[frank ledge]

Atleast the ones that are actually tactical, not that r6 crap

[frank ether]

oh yeah, another reason why I dont run helbore anymore lol

well not just ads speed but generally slow ass gun

absurdly slow

[tall torrent]

It’s like 1/3 the reason IIb is the best infantry lasgun

[wanton dawn]

Hotshot applies to bayo ?

[tall torrent]

yes but the cleave dmg distribution is horrendous

goes from like 670 first target to 67 second target

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/812451078221463632.gif?size=64

[wanton dawn]

Ah yes, thats...

[normal sparrow]

Bruh brutal momentum at home

[tall torrent]

Nah it’s not remotely the same

[normal sparrow]

Fine
Bm x savage sweep at home

[tall torrent]

It’s really more like psyker’s warp splitting talent

[normal sparrow]

Ah yea that fits better

[tall torrent]

Except instead of being tied to %peril, it requires weakspot hit

Wish it was a talent

[tall torrent]

@narrow frost what did u cook

[narrow frost]

I forgot which shotgun it was, but the long shot one

Using this for the past week

Tac axe my beloved

[tall torrent]

I would change flak to maniac

Also swap CQKZ for reciprocity

Free crit chance for axe

I don’t think u need BID + superiority complex at the same time (would go superiority complex for shotgun)

[narrow frost]

Misclicked

I have reci

[tall torrent]

Get agile engagement cuz that gives u slug 1 bodyshot flamer if full bore is active

Also

Taking charismatic over confirmed kill is definitely a choice

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/812451078221463632.gif?size=64

[narrow frost]

Yes

I love dps

[tall torrent]

Idk I kinda prefer top right pathing now

U sorta get everything with that

[narrow frost]

I don't like my team

[tall torrent]

I think O4B is a lot nicer for recovering toughness when u actually need it

[narrow frost]

The stam node with middle pathing is nice

[tall torrent]

It’s alr

[narrow frost]

I'm a PA enjoyer

[tall torrent]

I don’t think it’s required for anything besides knife

[tall torrent]

That’s the nice part you can do PA + heavy combo and the timing is just enough for stamina to regen even at the base regen delay

[narrow frost]

Interesting

I probably felt that but didn't notice since I don't have stam on my hud

[tall torrent]

If you’re insane enough you can play AoN + BM on Tac axe

AoN is basically always up

[narrow frost]

When does the 25% power start

Isn't it like 50% stam

[tall torrent]

It’s 7% more strength than headtaker and has arguably better uptime (since you’ll sprint into fights)

[tall torrent]

AoN is +8% melee strength for every 20% missing stamina

[narrow frost]

I see

[tall torrent]

If u take top right pathing

You only have 3 stamina

So it’s very easy to lock yourself at 4~5 stacks of AoN

[narrow frost]

Hmmmm

[tall torrent]

Just by doing basic combo

[narrow frost]

Something to try

[grand perch]

hello im no1 tac axe enjoyer and i approve this message

[narrow frost]

I'm trying right pathing with AoN

[narrow frost]

"tac axe is bad"

[tall torrent]

It’s literally always up if you’re using PA + heavy combo

[narrow frost]

Yeah, pa removes 33% stam

[tall torrent]

And u start fights at max AoN since you’ll likely sprint into them (with very low stamina)

So it’s 32~40% variable vs 25% reliable

Downside of your build is not having reliable anti-carapace & boss dps options

[narrow frost]

Krak for bulwark and tax axe

I'm good enough to deal with them

[tall torrent]

Tac axe is like

Almost 1/3 of combat axe’s dps vs carapace & unyielding

It’s very sad

[narrow frost]

Yup

But I do like the difference between the 2

I find tac way more fun than combat

[tall torrent]

If they had better carapace & unyielding dps (like 60% more, so it’s still lower than combat axe’s), they’d be in a much better spot

[narrow frost]

Probably keep unyielding and have the heavies deal more cara

My thoughts

[tall torrent]

Can also just bump their crit finesse vs unyielding instead of buffing base unyielding damage

[tall torrent]

I also find Tac reload to be a better fit for combat shotguns than always prepared

Much more intuitive to use

[narrow frost]

Weapon special not reloading the slug is sad

I would honestly take a point tax to have that talent

[tall torrent]

U should take both, but if u can only take one, I’d go Tac reload

For Tac axe perks, maniac & unarmored

Not taking carapace cuz the damage is so bad it’s not worth sinking a perk into

[narrow frost]

This for tomorrow @narrow frost

[tall torrent]

Maniac gives 2 hit mutant on heavy/PA and 3 hit dreg rager with heavy/PA

Unarmored gives scab bruiser 1HS for BM, and 2HS dreg gunner & Dreg Shotgunner

Flak doesn’t have major breakpoints on its own

[narrow frost]

I see

[dim citrus]

Anyone know the name of this helmet?

[placid portal]

Isnt that the skull cap helmet?

[frank ledge]

Unreleased

There's no helmet with a line like that

The model is the beta/skulls helmet

and by the tone of black I'd say it's skulls

[dim citrus]

The guy said it came from an old event

Even had a border I've never seen

[frank ledge]

Sus

Been here since release there's a similar border and helmet

but not that one in particular

[placid portal]

Oh I remember

Its the rose thingy

[frank ledge]

That's not the book reading

The helmet, the outline does look like it but very low poly

[dim citrus]

"Enter a promotional code prior to Darktide website prior to May 18, 2023 in order to receive the items. Seen in official tweet here."

[ember junco]

question; on the bolt pistol, how does Lethal Proximity work? is it the combo the melee strike into fire where you shoot it sideways? idk how else to word it

don't really care if it's meta, or even good. it just sounds fun

[tough tiger]

Lethal prox makes your bistol shots explode regardless of distance from target

Usually it has to travel a certain distance before it explodes, lethal prox makes it go off even at point blank

What you really should be asking about is whether lethal prox work on shredder frags or not. And it does

25% extra radius for shredders is great

[ember junco]

unintended mechanics woooo

thanks for the info, bud

[quartz nymph]

What's are the good marks, blessing, and perks for a revolver?

[gritty mural]

the non fanning revolver with maniac and flak would be my go to mark and perk

[rustic beacon]

Zarona with point blank+surgical/crucian/hand cannon

[quartz nymph]

What blessings? Surgical and hand cannon?

[dry cloak]

yes

[gritty mural]

what the guy below me said yea

[calm shard]

the original chainaxe mark is the better one right

not the blue one?

[dry cloak]

the blue one is easier to use

[patent rapids]

What's the difference between the two?

[pallid jetty]

color

[grand perch]

quite different movesets

[dry cloak]

and how attacks behave

[calm shard]

blue one the heavy attacks get stuck on enemies, green one it's the lights

green one uses push attacks and heavies for horde clear, blue one uses light attacks

[crimson wyvern]

https://tenor.com/view/angry-npc-gif-18081028125043451729

"I only leave the game when I know its grim and maybe a bot can save the game"

[winter grove]

Fellas is it just my rough luck or the AI director is pissed off today?

[winter grove]

Mf pumped out 3 specials every 20 seconds

[tough tiger]

that sounds normal lol

[winter grove]

It does

Unless it's 3 specials of same type

[tough tiger]

it do be like tht

[winter grove]

At some point it was just

"Oops! All bombers!"

[hasty rain]

Yesterday I can 3 netters at once, and they all fired at differant times

Pain

[brave pond]

Had a game where they decided to spawn 3 reapers and fill the rest of the room with gunners. It was like I was playing a Japanese Bullet hell game.

But yea special spam is very real (and annoying) when it’s nothing but Netters or Hounds.

[warm bolt]

I had like 8 snipers in one room during one mission yesterday so i guess it's rough luck

[mellow dome]

Sniper builds are so bad in this game. I know it's a horde shooter so why would you even try but I'm attempting the penance for using the marksman keystone and it's so bad

[calm shard]

https://tenor.com/view/luna-crunchycat-judgy-gif-10816385895034373873

how are you building it

[mellow dome]

Building around ranged weakspot damage already seems stupid in this game but a build that punishes you for moving is even dumber

[calm shard]

it punishes you for moving IF you are not landing headshots

also focus stacks build in like 5 seconds

just click 3 dudes in the face

shit if you're using a helbore or something just fire vaguely head level into a crowd of poxwalkers because that works too

[mellow dome]

Is helbore the best choice for this? Anything else worth using

And is Deadshot a must-have

[calm shard]

I would not say helbore is the best choice for it, but it's the one I use because MK IV 2 shotting crushers is funny

deadshot is stupid and I honestly never use it anymore

It's a lot of crit but I like my stamina

[mellow dome]

The bullet weapons are so low accuracy but the lasweapons feel so pathetically weak

The only Las gun I'd ever take is the accattran and that one is hard to get headshots with cos you fire so fast you kill enemies with bodyshots by mistake

[calm shard]

huh

[mellow dome]

I'm standing there shooting into a horde one at a time thinking "I could just use my shotgun build and clear all that in one second"

[calm shard]

how do they feel weak though

why are you shooting into a horde

use your melee weapon

[mellow dome]

To farm the marksman keystone penance

[vivid silo]

You can get that with melee weapons too. Just get max stacks and switch to melee.

IIRC at least, its been a while

[mellow dome]

Are you kidding me

I could be doing melee weakspot kills this whole time

[vivid silo]

Just make sure to reach max stacks before switching

[remote sonnet]

Or just get camouflage then standing still and shoot...

Using the braced AR.

That penance is way easier than it looks. People are just too focus on the headshot part of it.

[light ridge]

Just hold left mouse on a recon into a horde at head level

I added the standing still talent to help build stacks but didn't worry about it too much

[remote sonnet]

It only needs the stack to be max, it doesn't matter if the kill is headshot or not.

[dire olive]

Laspistol benefits greatly from MF, plus it's easy to quickly whip out and grab stacks with even just hipfire

[calm shard]

If you're just going for the penance I feel like the recon lasgun and braced autoguns are obvious choices

[dire olive]

Braced autogun for MF??????

[remote sonnet]

No, for the penance.

[dire olive]

Even still

[remote sonnet]

And actually, it is not a bad deal using it for MF either

just hover over a horde and you get ton of bonus damage.

[dire olive]

[remote sonnet]

Braced has pretty good damage per shot.

[dire olive]

But not finesse

Infantry auto has finesse

Use infantry auto for that

[tough crest]

Is there a place I can see all the stats for the Veteran? Like dodge distance, slide, etc. Gameslantern only has sprint speed and stam. The rest of the stuff isn't what I am looking for.

[calm shard]

pinned guide in this chat has all of the base stats right at the start

[tough crest]

Thanks, now I just need to find them for the rest of the classes.

[calm shard]

also pinned in their respective chats here

I think they have the base stats anyways

[tough crest]

Mm, I checked Ogryn already and it doesn't. The only information resource is the Ogrynomicon and that just discusses dodge sliding, it doesn't give stats for anything relating to distance of dodge, slide distance, innate stam, etc.

[tough tiger]

Has anyone used exec stance in havoc?

Does it work at all there?

[warm bolt]

I tried it on ~20 and sorta?

[tough tiger]

I'm looking for 40 xd

[tough crest]

Found it a different way. Zealot's pins have a link to their guide on Steam and that guide has links to other guides for the other classes made by the same person and they have the base stat info. Not sure why it's not in the Ogryn's...

[warm bolt]

Oh doubt it'll be useful, if you're planning to use it with marksman anyways

VoC just feels way too important cause it's like a second chance

[wanton dawn]

Exe stance in h40lfg might send a bad signal to teammates

Best gun for mf penance is vrak inf autogun

Stop trying to use monoshot weapon for this penance...

[latent parcel]

instructions unclear. running infiltrate and charge zealot in h40's

[wanton dawn]

Would be less controversial than exe

[pastel yew]

man I was 100% convinced the melee bruisers had toughness bleedthrough when you had full health

I'm not sure how this piece of info has set into my brain but ye they can't

[calm shard]

counterfire is really fun to play in havoc

casually stand infront of shooters not moving and just let ghost infantry lasgun have their bullets phase through me

[grand perch]

man i wish havoc had a bigger map pool

[calm shard]

yeah we can add more maps

and then to compensate we can remove gloriana

[grand perch]

its the hardest one for sure but still my favorite map

but why they didnt just add all maps, except for maybe rolling steel, no idea

[calm shard]

rolling steel is way too easy for havoc

[faint beacon]

Well after they reworked the defusing sections to be more pub friendly

Unironically it’s too easy

Still my favorite map cause it’s a gatekeeper on skill LMAO

[viral nacelle]

Rolling Steel would be massively easier in havoc because I wouldn’t be dropped in halfway because a group of morons got slaughtered trying to stop the first bomb

[remote sonnet]

Pre-nerf rolling steel was so much for fun.

[wanton dawn]

am gonna play a few games, got time ?

[pastel yew]

whaa why remove gloriana...

I enjoy that one

[pastel yew]

rolling steel not being in havoc is the best thing about havoc

[grand perch]

best visuals for sure

[pastel yew]

imagine if all maps looked good on lights out

imagine if we had a universal flashlight instead of it being weapon specific for 0 reason...

[wild bolt]

what do you guys think is the dump stats for the catachan blade?

[crisp oak]

mobility

[wild bolt]

and for the helbore lasgun?

[remote sonnet]

Im going crazy...

After over a month not playing stealth knife Vet, I find using Lacerate better than Flesh tearer.

[calm shard]

I dump stability

but I think charge rate is the normal dump?

[remote sonnet]

I was always running Flesh Tearer before.

[remote sonnet]

Stab is the normal dump for helbore.

You might want that little charge rate on slower marks.

[terse idol]

I think you are going crazy

Cause imo, taking the one bleed talent in your tree is enough for the bleed synergy

[remote sonnet]

Riposte Flesh tearer were my to go, but after a few failed games, I tried other blessing and find Riposte Lacerate are quite versatile.

I don't like Mercy Kill.

[faint beacon]

Run Uncanny Lacerate with the Recip talent

Uncanny will make your bleed DOT skyrocket

Run Mk6 if you really want to turn you brain off cause it’s swing patterns hit both body and Weakspot proccing both

[latent parcel]

eating lunch now i was in a long ass h40 gloriana when u pinged me. mb

[crimson wyvern]

So as it turns out, going for the veteran shout that revives team-mates instead of gold team-mates means you win more auric games with randos.

Will be running without gold toughness on rando auric from now on

[formal ice]

I think its skill issue from randoms part

[crimson wyvern]

I dont have enough friends to be playing high level gameplay with me I got no choice

Im just specced into rez and things that help me rez more, so block resist and impact that'll help me rez and chew through as many shitty rando wounds as I can

just trying to keep them mulching through their wounds long enough for the next medikay

[brittle turret]

I hope this is trolling

[crimson wyvern]

It's not, but I can't prove it to you with facts and numbers. Because Darktide is an incredibly fluid and voltaile game.

but as I've witnessed in multiple games =

1 team mate goes down = 1 team mate goes to help goes down = 1 team goes -

Domino effect.

Rez shout fixes them walking into the slaughter house one by one

[pastel pumice]

I wouldn't recommend using it

Easily stun those around you long enough to stick a rez

Without the rez node

[crimson wyvern]

Nope. You didn't think about the multiple ranged threats that wont be stunned

the flamer the sniper

the bomber etc

theres so much you didnt think about

[pastel pumice]

Then you should clear them before sticking a rez...

[crimson wyvern]

"just clear them 4head"

[pastel pumice]

Exactly

[crimson wyvern]

No one is taking out any of those threats in rando squad, everyone is focusing the horde

You have about 10 - 15 of them

You're not John Darktide Fuse

[wanton dawn]

If someone goes down in a position where shout rez would help, going out of my way to rez would put me in danger anyway

[pastel pumice]

You're a Vet, no?

[crimson wyvern]

youre not going to kill them all

[pastel pumice]

Right, you shouldn't be going for a rez in any position like that

[formal ice]

Leave them to die

[pastel pumice]

And you shout rezzing them in the middle of what you just said, snipers, bombers and more, would be a waste of your ability

[formal ice]

Only the strongest survive

[brittle turret]

I get that you came to that conclusion based on numbers but it might be better to an analysis of why that is the case and look at your kit in general.

Vet has enough general cc to get a revive without scuffing their ult that will otherwise not do much for half the game.

As for bomber and flamers - you can actually just scam your teammates with shout revs if you rev them into that if they have a low hp pool.

There's plenty of ways to take out ranged threats on Vet.

I also think it might be a sign of how you play the game - for example, are you actually giving gold toughness to teammates or are you using it out of their range so you're waiting for them to die?

Another thing to consider is that are you actually creating a worse gameplay loop for yourself by playing more defensively instead of applying pressure which will cause people to die

[brittle turret]

At the end of the day, play however you want man but

It's such a dogshit node

You're spending a talent point on making your ult more shit

[crimson wyvern]

On one hand: "Never take coherancy nodes you'll never be in coherancy with each other in good teams, everyone solos and does their own thing"

The other "Actually gold toughness is great beceause you can buff everyone in- wait a minute"

Which is it

[pastel pumice]

Who said that

[crimson wyvern]

NO one sticks to each other as much as one would try, EVERYONE runs off

[wanton dawn]

Which coherency node ?

[pastel pumice]

Again, it depends on what you're running

Its not black and white

Do a little brewing

[brittle turret]

?

[crimson wyvern]

I'm the one that's brewing and experimenting, thats why I'm running rez

[pastel pumice]

Better nodes you could use that 1 point on

[terse idol]

Waa! Am I late?!

[wanton dawn]

All the good coherency node applies to yourself first

[terse idol]

Basically

[faint beacon]

Your job as a veteran is always going to boil down to killing priority targets regardless of your build

[wanton dawn]

And most of the good coherency node are also pathing talent anyway

[terse idol]

The domino effect happens because people don't take safe revives

[faint beacon]

If you play veteran that’s your job

[terse idol]

It takes 15 seconds to clear enemies off to make a clear revive

It takes 1 second to die because you rushed a revive

And it isss better to take your time even if the person dies

[wanton dawn]

In any case, you are free to take rez node if it helps you win game

But you probably dont want to try to convince vet chat that it is good

[terse idol]

Rez node at least imo and yeah craime is right

Rez just has the issue that

A its increasing the cd

[brittle turret]

Aside in very particular scenarios i.e you're rushing to get a chorus zealot up, it's off CD and without ressing them at that moment, it could snowball etc

[terse idol]

So one of the best uses of voc was spamming it is lessened

And B

If you don't safe rez someone

They can drop like a sack of shit to say

Fire

Or a crusher overhead

[wanton dawn]

Ah yes, shout rez into fire is quite the riot

[terse idol]

Even with rez shout it has to be safe for them to get up

[crimson wyvern]

Im not saying gold toughness is better than rez btw. Im not sure how many of you play with level 40's trying to do auric maelstrom on the daily

[terse idol]

So they can't be surrounded so you have to get into range to stagger the ememies

[crimson wyvern]

Its choosing what you're going to be up against, and I've seen you, fellow true-level 200+'s you think you can go it alone and you dont do it and you never do it alone

[terse idol]

I play alot of damn and auric damn like

[light ridge]

Counterintuitively, shout rez is so unexpected that by the time they realize they've been rezzed, they've died again (happens to me)

[crimson wyvern]

you leave when you go down and you leave us with a bot that will not save the game, it just makes us losing the game SLOWER

[terse idol]

Even then any time you're rushing a rez

[sleek garden]

I lose a lot of my auric maelstrom games to weird teammates

[remote sonnet]

Before Havoc 40, guess what we played?

[terse idol]

You risk missing a disabler enemy

Or anything thst could break the rez

[sleek garden]

the only ones I blame myself in are scab only monstrosities/melee only

the class loadouts i use aren't great for those

[terse idol]

I just simply don't leave

[remote sonnet]

Just clutch

[brittle turret]

Ay, there's a higher risk element to it. The costs generally outweight the pros but there are times it doesn't

[calm shard]

I AM THOUGH

[wanton dawn]

I go into scab only expecting to do all the heavy lifting alone

[sleek garden]

I hate this

[terse idol]

And people leaving on down even if i hate it just spawn a body for potentially a bot to save

[sleek garden]

it happens literally every game

[terse idol]

Its not ideal but that's how it happens sometimes

[crimson wyvern]

You must be protected at all cost, you are a rare person that I can not find anywhere, you are the only person that plays the game like this, you are the only morally correct person in Darktide left

[calm shard]

I want the havoc leaver penalty to be present for auric games

[crimson wyvern]

it makes me just want to quit

all together

life

[sleek garden]

stealth zealot manages to go down like a moron and quits

you have to group up

[brittle turret]

@crimson wyvern I think you'd just enjoy playing with pre-mades more

[calm shard]

Genuinely a system that temp bans people for leaving games all the damn time would be so nice

[light ridge]

I'll leave when I'm short on time, or rescue area is far from the party, or the party was all over the place and I don't feel like dealing with it
But if the party works together, I'll stick around to see if they can get me out

[wanton dawn]

I would quit less if it was not the fastesst way to load back into morningstar

[sleek garden]

Rescue area far? Really?

[crimson wyvern]

Why quit and make everyone elses load times and game expierence worse because you want a better expierence? Why be so incredibly selfish

[light ridge]

Have you seen some PUGs and how much time they take to get to you?

[remote sonnet]

Even in pub, I rather take overshield because before going to rez someone, I should be able to take care of myself 1st.

[terse idol]

I mean as far as I've seen, people leave and then come back to potentially save the run which is 100% cheating

[sleek garden]

Yeah, alternatively instead of waiting 5 minutes you could go back to lobby and play for 40 minutes to get back to the spot you were at before

[faint beacon]

Just be me

Don’t revive anyone

[terse idol]

Iirc they may have fixed that vut

[remote sonnet]

If Im not going to use overshield, then Infiltration can also do the job.

[pastel pumice]

Or me, taking out all problematic ranged units and general pressure before going for the rez

Plus the VoC + Shredder nade combo is a godsend combo

[faint beacon]

I’m just saying if your ass got blasted by

30 gunners

[terse idol]

Again I'll argue always against rez shout but if it works for you das okie

[faint beacon]

I’m letting you die

[sleek garden]

I've had people go down with like 1 enemy that we kill nearby and then they just leave anyway

[terse idol]

Me getting blasted by only 29 gunners

[serene bough]

sometimes i just decided mid game i dont want to play anymore and leave

🙂

[terse idol]

[sleek garden]

clandestium gloriana leavers should be hung

That's all

[faint beacon]

Post clutch I’ll fucking do that

[crimson wyvern]

I skid and do all that cringe anime shit to avoid gunners DW, but theres many times people dont go for rez when its free because you chickened out and you were too concerned about keeping your health full to risk a chip to it

[faint beacon]

If it’s my second or third in a row it’s a lost cause

[crimson wyvern]

people dont talk abou the other side of doing well

[light ridge]

I will alway stick around to see if they can get me up
I really don't understand the quitters who fall and by the time you get to them to pick them up, they're gone and you're on your own with a bot

[sleek garden]

Prove you're the best player and then leave them all to die

[terse idol]

I meann ahhhhh

[faint beacon]

Exactly LMAO

[sleek garden]

Incredible

[terse idol]

Its less about chickening out and like

The opportunity cost

Is it worth it to rush a rez

[remote sonnet]

I'd rather have them leaving than rescue them for the 10th time.

[faint beacon]

I don’t want to strain my mental sanity pulling 5+ clutches

[serene bough]

sometimes i leave if people are playing way too slow

[pastel pumice]

I am amazed at what kind of random pool you're getting your teammates from in pubs

[serene bough]

like, i reallllly hate when people drag their feet through a mission

[faint beacon]

The moment it’s hitting 2-3 I’m already considering leaving

[sleek garden]

I keep forgetting my Columnus autogun doesn't have ghost on it

[faint beacon]

If they’re back to back especially

[sleek garden]

I would kill for ghost on the autogun

[terse idol]

Sometimes you get a team that you perfectly synergize with

[faint beacon]

Stripped down

[terse idol]

Those feel goooood

[faint beacon]

Duck and Dive

Pair that and it’s basically the same

[serene bough]

true

[sleek garden]

It has stripped down but it's more about me playing the game like a shooting gallery

[serene bough]

but then you get the ones where people bubble and hunker down every single engagement

[pastel pumice]

Went into an Auric maelstrom with 3 psyker randoms, it was funny and fun

[sleek garden]

In auric damnation I can shoot people fast enough to keep my toughness up

[pastel pumice]

Really smooth too, even if I was the only Vet

[serene bough]

and it takes forever

[crimson wyvern]

I'm in EU region, dunno what its like in US but very few expierenced players, and the ones that are expierenced leave after going down once and leave with a bot making the game 10x harder cause lots of the time game doesnt find a new player

[faint beacon]

Issue is that gun is like an SMG so it demands you rush anything down

[sleek garden]

but if I don't kill someone I might break toughness by accident

[formal ice]

When are you accepting lost?

Can we change topic

[sleek garden]

M y roommates dog just walked over and burped on me

[pastel pumice]

That's a bummer, I also have a few EU friends who struggle with shitters like you described.

[sleek garden]

I mean the brown iag

I use it more midrange

[brittle turret]

I'm EU myself and don't have that issue. You could try running NA east if you're that concerned

[faint beacon]

The Graia?

I use Stripped Down Duck and Dive on it

[sleek garden]

I think they swapped the name to Columnus

[faint beacon]

It’s good

You literally use it to close the gap to get to cover

[sleek garden]

I use terrifying barrage and the one that gives bonus headshot damage on the second and third shot

[faint beacon]

Shooters loath you

[crimson wyvern]

I play my darktide game till I go down. If my team-mates go down however shit I rez them. I rez them till they have no wounds. AND IF I GO DOWN I DO NOT LEAVE LIKE IM A CHILD I WAIT TILL I SEE THE ENDING SCREEN OF MY FACE IN THE VOMIT AND PUSS AND GET MY PITY REWARDS.

[faint beacon]

Dumdum + Stripped down with like Duck and Dive talent

[light ridge]

Also EU, quitters are a problem
Get jumped by a dog, a net and go down (not dead) and they're gone
And I'm the idiot who just ran across half the map to pick them up again, now I'm alone with a bot and a horde...

[faint beacon]

Pref WS Keystone

[formal ice]

Leave? Who said we leave?

[faint beacon]

Absolute kino

[formal ice]

[sleek garden]

I don't have enough points in the skill tree for that

maybe I can do an infiltrate build with it

[crimson wyvern]

https://tenor.com/view/nörd-luwig-nördig-ludwig-nörd-ludde-nördig-ludde-ludde-nördig-gif-26170961

[faint beacon]

I could throw something together for it give me a bit I’m at work

[sleek garden]

I use the same build as my infantry lasgun but I just swap out the gun

[faint beacon]

Is it exec

[formal ice]

Wrong gif

[faint beacon]

VOC Infil

Ability? Is basically what I’m asking

[sleek garden]

exy stance

I like not dealing with recoil

Destroys shotgunner conga lines too

[faint beacon]

Give me a bit I can cook up something

[wanton dawn]

I am having a lot of fun with combat axe atm

[faint beacon]

You might want to run the weakest keystone actually

MF

Exec MF on an IAG is pretty kino

[formal ice]

Actually aren't this you trying to defend rez?

[wanton dawn]

Like this

[faint beacon]

What melee do you want to run with it btw

[faint beacon]

Similar

[crimson wyvern]

My reasoning was very simple, its great when you consistently find yourself the last one alive. That was my entire thesis

[faint beacon]

I’ll have to spice it up I got something else in mind

[faint beacon]

@sleek garden

[pastel pumice]

You should try LFGing in here

People in here are great

[wanton dawn]

I am terrible though

[formal ice]

Ok

Still terrible

[pastel pumice]

And won't leave your ass to dry like actual randoms

[wanton dawn]

I would

[pastel pumice]

Lmao

[sleek garden]

I do already

[crimson wyvern]

Its a different point of view. In Darktide (and other games) I like using the unused stuff and blessings no one picks, all the zainey fun picks on Shock Maul or Power Maul or all the fun stuff no one picks because the damage is just too sweet to pass up. That's really the long and short of it.

I think there's some misunderstand in the room like I'm saying rez is the superior talent over Gold Toughness when it's not what I'm saying.

You can go "that's nice" and dunk on me now and win the whole conversation

[sleek garden]

shoot people build

[wanton dawn]

That's nice

Dunno about double dipping on ult buff though

[crimson wyvern]

I'm always surprised how many talents are specifically targeted toward Ogryns and Monstrosities on all classes

[sleek garden]

i use lightning reflexes its funny to stagger ragers

[sleek garden]

they're tanky

[faint beacon]

Yeah I can change this up a bit

[wanton dawn]

Also taking the middle fire support stuff ? It is bold

2 point for that is VERY costly and it is situational at best

[formal ice]

That's nice

[crimson wyvern]

Ive always been an insane fan of catachan blades and going for the skillbased perfect parry shots so ragers haave always been super fun to play around for me. (if theyre not already dead by a zealot magdumping their entire mag)

[sleek garden]

my teammates run in so i shoot at stuff around them

[sleek garden]

i use devils claw 1

[crimson wyvern]

oooo

ive yet to properly try that

[sleek garden]

i stack headshot damage

i can kill many enemies in one shot now in the first seconds in exy stance

[crimson wyvern]

wait devil claw 1 is the one everyone likes

yeah i used 1 all the time

[sleek garden]

no

its the one everyone hates

side to side heavies

[crimson wyvern]

OH

yeah yeah you right

[sleek garden]

everyone likes the one that starts with the overhead

i like to not get in those situations

my sword is meant for dealing with hordes

[crimson wyvern]

i cant remember the marks but I love the bottom one, I think its 7 or 9, it has the forward stab on block push that is way stronger than it has any right ot be

Fuck you Dueling Sword users I know you're the best golden child in the game right now I hear you shouting, just sit in your damn corner I know its better than the block push of catachan

[serene bough]

you can choose your own build but in general its not a good idea to preemtively pick talents for poor playing

[sleek garden]

you expect your random teammates to not die

get real...

[serene bough]

that being said, i do think one of the downsides of res shout should be moved to Duty and Honor to nerf it

[wanton dawn]

I expect not to count on them

[sleek garden]

sometimes i want to take the one psyker talent that maexes everyones toughness when someone goes down

[serene bough]

i definitely dont expect myself to pick talents to cater to and babysit them

[sleek garden]

because in my experience people tend to go down one by one like dominoes fast

[crimson wyvern]

me and you think alike, we should play together sometime

[wanton dawn]

Also in pubs maelstrom i like to test random crap so dont count on me if i rando

[serene bough]

same

still trying to make the shock maul work

but its unyielding dmg makes me cringe

[crimson wyvern]

I want to love shock maul I just cant love it

I tried so hard to

[light ridge]

Hammerblow+Skullcrusher
Unyielding can be rough but anything that's staggered or knocked down is not hitting back
Bosses are for your gun

[wanton dawn]

I need to try heavy sword next

[crimson wyvern]

I can't quite explain it, but I feel like it should leave some sort of low damage electrical DPS on enemies it hits, like a pseduo torch of fire to spread around your...electricallyyness, then I'd be okay with its poopy damage

[wanton dawn]

I dont see much hsword. Nor do i see much caxe tbf

[sleek garden]

im using the chainaxe right now

[crimson wyvern]

Nah he meant Combat Axe

[sleek garden]

oh combat axe

[crimson wyvern]

Chain Axe is Chax

[sleek garden]

i take those in scab only

i like the blue one

its okay in hordes

[wanton dawn]

Scab only i bring sunder carapace elite ps

[sleek garden]

i used to do that

but the power sword feels so garbage to maneuver with

i hate using it

especially the mark they just didnt change so blocking and activating is hard mid horde

[crimson wyvern]

Power Cycler on Power Sword is the only thing that makes that weapon barely playable to me

without it it feels like im wielding a Fisher Price toy

[wanton dawn]

Thats fair. I got comfortable with crusher on ps

Add shredder and plasma and you got enough damage to pass the dmg check

[crimson wyvern]

I see the plasma gun in space marine 2 and want that plasma gun.

I dont own or have played it but seen the gameplay

[sleek garden]

im trying to figure out how to get my autogun a two hit headshot kill on a scab gunner

i only need 30 damage at midrange to make it two shot

[crimson wyvern]

autoguns need a buff imo, the columbnus being based doesnt excuse the other 40 of them that kinda struggle

but dunno if thats a spicy take

[sleek garden]

without exy stance

i think they're all decent

i like the middle tier one the best

might switch to agripinaa and give it a go

they have spiky headshot damage

[crimson wyvern]

wait which autogun, theres braced, infantary, vanilla, chocolate, banana, caramel, with fries, without fries...

[faint beacon]

@sleek garden general purpose one I could throw together with Duck and Dive

[faint beacon]

It’s cause unpowered is incredibly nerfed vs powered

[crimson wyvern]

Yeah you really feel it. The relic blade unpowered still feels usable atleast

[serene bough]

it feels great when you get WS + Agile on horde enemies and ligher elites, but it feels suprisingly weak against cara

i almost feel like i should get serrated blade w/ some bleed applying weapon just to help its boss DPS

also sucks that it doesnt smack around ragers enough

[light ridge]

FT helps it a lot, but then FT helps all weapons

[serene bough]

idk it goes really well w/ WS

if only it wasnt so crippled against monstros

guess i need to take kraks

[pale pecan]

Interesting

[sleek garden]

no grenade regen?

[pale pecan]

the Parry on a Catachan sword counts as a heavy attack

[sleek garden]

most special attacks count as heavies

autogun feels good

kapow

[sleek garden]

it doesn't have exhilarating takedown

im actually taking a version with smoke and it just saved my ass

[faint beacon]

Honestly the reason I put that on was mainly for the feed back of feeding into toughness paired with O4B and Duck and Dive letting you be extremely mobile

Plus if you’re running an IAG you should probably not run camo seeing it would counter the playstyle

Yeah it’s free stacks but 1 bullet on a headshot will get you a stack

(They seriously need to rework MF)

Give it a melee function and feedback bare minimum

[faint beacon]

Also grenade regen is coming from Demo Team

The regen node would be too taxing to take

Welcome to veteran build making

Lmao

[warm bolt]

Wait demo team is not worth taking?

[serene bough]

its really good if you run shredders, but not always necessary

and i guess kraks too, but kraks are kinda doodoo

[hollow ibex]

i always take demo team because i move muh nades

[sleek garden]

I'm not using camo, i'm using tunnel vision

[hollow ibex]

all nades are great

[sleek garden]

i'm assuming tunnel vision boosts exhilarating takedown but im not sure

[faint beacon]

If you have the regen already the one above VOC

It’s kinda just a bonus talent if you want it

[sleek garden]

i like to take both so i can spam shredders

[faint beacon]

But if you can’t afford that take Demo team

That makes up for your regen

[sleek garden]

but you are right

i see the benefit of dropping it for something

i will look

[faint beacon]

Exhil isn’t terrible

But it’s generally weaker

Vs Confirmed Kill

And Out For Blood

[sleek garden]

really? gives tdr and more toughness back than out for blood

[serene bough]

worse part about ET is you need to take Longshot to get it

[sleek garden]

i just had a team of all infantry guns it was glorious

[faint beacon]

O4B will give you more toughness over all from everything

[sleek garden]

infantry lasgun and infantry autos

true

[faint beacon]

Regardless of special or elite

[sleek garden]

but generally i like to have my gun out

[faint beacon]

You kill a poxer with your gun

You get 5% vs 0

[sleek garden]

not usually

if theyre in my way

[faint beacon]

Yeah it’s for the scenario

[sleek garden]

you get 15% for shooting the poxer in the head though

[faint beacon]

But it’s mainly against shooters

You now the guys

[serene bough]

ET isnt bad if you're going to constantly pop heads, but O4B is just generally better since you get toughness from all sources and all kills

[faint beacon]

That give you no toughness on kill

[serene bough]

shredders giving 5% toughness per kill is honestly crazy

[sleek garden]

i did not know shredders could do that

ive been taking smokes in an alt build right now that has fireteam instead of survivalist

[serene bough]

yeah O4B applies to every single kill, even ones which normally dont regen toughness

just a flat 5% recovery per kill

[sleek garden]

i appreciate how nice it is to drop smoke at your feet and then people cant shoot you anymore

[wanton dawn]

I still favor ck over otb

[sleek garden]

ck?

[hollow ibex]

confirmed kill

aka middle tough regen talent

[sleek garden]

you don't take both?

i take confirmed kill and exhilarating taekdown

[serene bough]

i generally don't invest in the top of the tree

[faint beacon]

You only really need 1

[serene bough]

just path down middle or right

[faint beacon]

1 of the three is just a good choice

Exhil is the weakest

CK and O4B you get the most value

[sleek garden]

generally for placement of the tree and what i like to do when i play i think exhilarating takedown does what i want best

if i was more melee heavy id take it

i have an infiltrate build with it

[hollow ibex]

longshot aside, i feel like exhil's pretty good for gun-heavy builds

[serene bough]

by all means ET isn't bad

[hollow ibex]

i mean ig that's what it's intended for

[serene bough]

esp if you're going for a marksman kind of playstyle

its just the weakest path of the 3 options, esp bc you need to take longshot

i still think it should recover 20 or 25% toughness per headshot though

[faint beacon]

It’s the weakest vs the other two

Seeing the insane value of CK

And O4B being on literally everything

[serene bough]

i know its the weakest but its still not egregiously bad

[hollow ibex]

taking CK always makes me paranoid, because i've definitely been fucked before by not having sources of tough regen

[faint beacon]

Yeah I think it’s fine

Very build dependent

But I’m mainly going to take CK and O4B over it

[serene bough]

honestly the only reason i dont take it more often is because of longshot

[faint beacon]

Longshot getting nerfed

[serene bough]

because i like the idea that popping heads rewards you buffs

but swap speed or TDR from coherency is just better than the completely negligible damage longshot gives

[faint beacon]

Keep in mind you don’t even get that damage bonus if the enemy is 12.5m near you

Fucking criminal

Lmao

[serene bough]

yeah, and even when you do get it, I cant think of a single breakpoint it helps to push

just throwaway useless damage

[faint beacon]

Situational bonus damage

Aka why bother when I can just get my extra damage lower on the tree

[serene bough]

really they should just remove it and replace it with something else

like they did with the right side of the tree

[hollow ibex]

bring back sprint efficiency

[grand perch]

just buff longshot again you cowards

[faint beacon]

They won’t

[grand perch]

left side tree is dead because of it

[faint beacon]

Left side of the tree has the most mediocre options

Consistently

[sleek garden]

its over

[faint beacon]

Obviously there’s outliers like

[sleek garden]

i went into a new match and my aim fell off hard

[faint beacon]

Precision Strikes

Etc

[sleek garden]

i am just not hitting people in the head anymore

[faint beacon]

Use a VA

Force yourself to aim at the head

[grand perch]

precision strikes, shock trooper, superiority complex, i dont think left side is mediocre by any means. middle tree is just bonkers

[serene bough]

True

Middle tree is busted

[faint beacon]

Fully loaded I’m biased towards cause I like having more ammo but like

It’s mid

Lmao

Bottom right side tree is fucking insane also

Mainly left side and keystone

[grand perch]

dunno im playing marksman focus in high havoc right now and really appreciate extra ammo

[faint beacon]

Literally everything on left is good to overpowered

Left side of right tree

[grand perch]

youre not wrong

theyd need to make you an absolute ranged oneshot wonder in the left tree to compete

[serene bough]

Middle tree w/ VoC is really the most busted vet combo currently

Right tree has plenty of valuable melee talents which should almost always be taken

[faint beacon]

I’d argue WS VOC

It let’s Vet practically Solo Mael

[serene bough]

Left tree has plenty of useful talents, but Middle is just OP

[faint beacon]

Right and Middle are incredibly stacked

Vs left which has too many mediocre options

I want a MF rework

[serene bough]

I dont agree mediocre, just the power of middle is too high

[faint beacon]

I unironically want it to be reworked where it rewards you for hitting weak points regardless of melee or ranged

Cause I would main the fuck out of MF

If that were so

[serene bough]

Sup complex, precision strikes, marksman, fully loaded, shock trooper

[faint beacon]

I’d honestly say fully loaded is a mediocre option

A lot of weapons don’t need the extra ammo

[serene bough]

Theyre all great talents, but tac awareness + VoC + Iron will + demo team being all right next to one another in the best position of the tree

[faint beacon]

Plasma and Bolter can be helpful

But that’s kinda about it

[serene bough]

For a havoc game I'll always take it

Helps to buff survivalist as well

Auric maybe not as necessary

But again, Middle is just ridiculously overpowered, right tree is definitely strong but I don't always take WS

[faint beacon]

I’m saying outside of Havoc

Cause havoc demands you adapt 24/7

So you’ll be changing your builds a lot

[serene bough]

Eh, i more or less use the same build for havoc but rotate weapons depending on modifiers

I dont really play havoc anymore though

[faint beacon]

More so Generalist

Aka Maelstrom

And under

(Outside of CIVI)

That’s the rare Mael that demands you change your builds

[serene bough]

If we're talking meta, there's really one path you should be taking

Then changing some points here and there depending on load out

[grand perch]

going back to mael makes you feel invincible

[faint beacon]

Basically the path called not fucking touching the left outside of like precision strikes

The left side needs a bit of adjustments

I mainly want a MF rework

And weaker talent tweaks

Exec is kino now

After they made the refresh base and it doesn’t drop on melee

[serene bough]

Sup complex and fully loaded is an important havoc pick up

[faint beacon]

Fun fact you can continue uptime with melee kills on Exec now

[serene bough]

But if we're just discussing auric, yeah, left isn't as great bc middle tree let's you solo the game, and I guess to an extent right tree too

Again, middle really needs some nerfs in addition to left buffs

[faint beacon]

A good chunk of right tree can

There’s a few stinkers

Mainly the absolute end WS keystones

Onslaught

Skirmisher

(Imo Serrated)

[serene bough]

Almost all of the right tree is bad except for the four nodes down to trench fighter

[grand perch]

they should patch in the launch talent "trees" again

for april fools