veteran-class

[cyan verge]

it encourages you to be swapping frequently and it kinda comes natural after a while since you spend a lot of time in melee then swap to your gun to blow up a random special nearby

it perfectly synergizes with your role

[cursive lion]

Suppression immunity goated tho

[cyan verge]

there have been a couple times in havoc where I'm like I wish I was not suppressed right now but for the most part it has not been a problem for me

[pallid jetty]

i prefer shooting shooters or gunners until they stop shooting back so i stop being suppressed

[cyan verge]

true

[pallid jetty]

and thus save that suppression immunity point to take something actually useful

[tropic stratus]

chat why is the recon lasgun so fun on this class

[pallid jetty]

like field improvisation

cause every weapon is fun to use

[austere pine]

what a fugly tree

no close quarters killzone

no infil

no demolition team

😔

[pallid jetty]

demo team is too good to not take

[austere pine]

no literally

i yeet all 3 nades, i kill dudes, i have 3 more nades

all in one encounter

[pallid jetty]

he has 60s +grenade already so its ok

[cyan verge]

yeah this is for my plasma

[austere pine]

plasma 🤮

[pallid jetty]

bruh what you run plasma with this tree

omfg

[austere pine]

why not take mark for plasma? so much better for it

[cyan verge]

I don't know

[pallid jetty]

bro wants to lose all ammo in the first 5 mins of the mission to trigger the 25% melee damage

[austere pine]

melee spec stacks to 1

[cyan verge]

I am not using it in havoc

[austere pine]

so thats not happening

[pallid jetty]

well glad to hear

[austere pine]

but still, mark

mark with the left talent

[pallid jetty]

i thought its like bolt pistol or laspistol build

[austere pine]

or even an infantry gun build

fwiw

[pallid jetty]

but not the plasma

dont say you use power sword also

[austere pine]

(im literally just a plasma hater but mark is better for plasma 9/10 times)

[cyan verge]

nah DS4 with this

[pallid jetty]

at least like, shovel

[austere pine]

🤮🤮🤮🤮🤮

[pallid jetty]

ds4 is ok

[austere pine]

spoiled

"ok" like its not the most broken melee rn

[tropic stratus]

chat is this a good build with dueling sword + recon lasgun. i don't know how to play this class

[pallid jetty]

i mean its fast

thats the point

[bitter turtle]

exploit weakness is worthless

[austere pine]

fast, has clear, has range, has carapace

[pallid jetty]

you dont need rending on melee crit

[tropic stratus]

ok what would i get instead. 10% rending on all attacks?

15% to elites?

[austere pine]

id go for the right or left sides at tbe start

[bitter turtle]

im running exaclty ds4 + recon in havo40 rn

ill give you my build but tweaked for auric

[pallid jetty]

toughness damage reduction on the left maybe

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/15124f757685e70c553e8d40f96c400e.png

here

[pallid jetty]

or stamina cooldown

i dont remember

[tropic stratus]

is the krak nade not good

does it not 1 shot big boys in havoc

[bitter turtle]

you have the single best weapon at killing crushers

why do you need a krak nade

[pallid jetty]

why do you need krak with saber

[bitter turtle]

havoc is about crowd control

so

[cyan verge]

krak is unfortunately pretty weak in havoc

[bitter turtle]

shredder wins

shredder wins normally tbh

smoke is lowkey really good too

[cyan verge]

smoke is even better yeah

[pallid jetty]

havoc? get some more toughness sustain then

like 5% on kill

[bitter turtle]

if you are playing havoc i can give you what i run in it

it looks weird though

but

[pallid jetty]

or 15% on headshot

[tropic stratus]

i am not playing havoc on this class but when i am bored with psyker vet is what i play (:

i would like to try it

[bitter turtle]

well just play that one i linked then

i also do infil in havoc so idk if you would care to use that anyway

[pallid jetty]

infil is sooo risky

just for clutches

and only

[cyan verge]

I think krak even in like normal missions is like, fine, I think it just matters less and kraks do appreciable boss damage, so there's at least that

[austere pine]

infil is literally clutch city nowadays

[bitter turtle]

not just for clutches

it can solo objectives

that is why i bring it mostly

[austere pine]

you cant do a specialist killer playstyle in higher diffs

[cyan verge]

but in havoc it's really nice to have shredders, to like clear out hordes etc and it's nice to have smokes to block ranged

[bitter turtle]

makes stuff like metalfab ez at the end

also the nade spam + stealth

[pallid jetty]

good teams cover each other on obj

[bitter turtle]

good team or not

trying to hit all 4 switches

[pallid jetty]

and stick together

[bitter turtle]

moving through teh entire area

is really fucking annoying

and easy for things to go wrong in 35+

meanwhile i can just tell my team to sit on a medipack and i solo the event lol

[austere pine]

sure but thats something integral to the ability. other things people did with it were emergent behavior

[bitter turtle]

carnival has a similar situation

the dark circular room

dont need to hold the center

[cyan verge]

wow I got invited to a squad randomly so I click accept while I'm doin my talents and get instantly loaded into a dying havoc game

[bitter turtle]

since i can just hack with stealth + low profile

[austere pine]

also end of carnival where you need to run to the middle to interact

[bitter turtle]

refinery as well, with the 4 random hacking spots

that's the other one but yea

[austere pine]

carnival shmarnival

[pallid jetty]

i prefer to not go from the team ever

[cyan verge]

yeah and if you do go down, welp

that's a death

[austere pine]

i prefer to actually not be with the team if possible

[bitter turtle]

yea but if you go down while stealthed its literally a skill issue

like

[austere pine]

yeah it is, sadly

[bitter turtle]

you have to run into a sniper shooting someone else tier skill issue

[austere pine]

only way to die stealthed is by running into stuff intentionally

like fire, gas, or big attacks

[cyan verge]

no I mean you can be stealthed all you want but what do you do when it runs out

[bitter turtle]

its 20 seconds of stealth

like

[austere pine]

low profile saves you

[bitter turtle]

i would hope

u can do the obj

in 20 seconds

unless you're really really bad at the auspex minigame

also if your team gives you a cdr stim

you can permastelath

until it runs out

[austere pine]

theres a couple of them. hab dreyko i still have no clue how to do

[bitter turtle]

makes it even more safe to hit everything if its particularly a long walk

like metalfab

[pallid jetty]

that sniper when i infiltrate:

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1167148332490166335/1215438171538456587/goku.gif

[austere pine]

snipers know you exist

this is me with annoying piece of shit scab shooters

and my revolver aimed at thejr cranium

[bitter turtle]

anyway doing stuff like the 1st event on gloriana or the last event on metalfab normally fucking sucks

[tropic stratus]

do people use power sword in havoc?

[bitter turtle]

like u have to deal with a gorillino gunners and shooters spread out everywhere

meanwhile stealth infil = ignore them lmao

kill them after event is over

[cyan verge]

unless you know something I don't stealth is 8 seconds

[bitter turtle]

i think its kinda bad

[bitter turtle]

low profile

[austere pine]

gloriana is fun with exe stance infantry las

[bitter turtle]

-90% aggro is essentially more stealth

[cyan verge]

I mean fair

[bitter turtle]

unless your whole team is dead

[cyan verge]

but I dunno

[bitter turtle]

then its not

[cyan verge]

I could see using this on like one or two maps like smelter yeah but I dunno more often than not it'd probably be best to just use VoC

[bitter turtle]

there are few maps where it is not the case

and anyway

even in normal gameaplay its good

well placed 2x shredder grenades saves teams

plus 30% boost from sneak attack

lines up perfectly with 2 underhanded chucks and then break stealth

[tropic stratus]

besides dueling sword, what melee do vets run in havoc?

[cyan verge]

duelling sword and power sword

[bitter turtle]

knife and caxe should be good

[cyan verge]

and rashad

oh and knife I guess sure

[bitter turtle]

i ahve not seen psword past 30

and i would not use it either personally

[austere pine]

caxe feels bad if you have moebian 21st modifier

[cyan verge]

yeah power sword is strong but it hurts your mobility really bad unless your primary is a laspistol, which, you could use

[bitter turtle]

you still kill 4 in a swing

with bromentum

why would rashad feel bad

[austere pine]

must have a garbage rashad then

because i was struggling

[bitter turtle]

might be missing their heads

[austere pine]

im not a servitor, thank you very much

and heavies werent a problem

it was more so me getting swarmed by a big number of dudes i had to push attack

which took at least 2 push attacks or lights to kill

[bitter turtle]

well

you can ask path

[austere pine]

making rashad unusable

[bitter turtle]

since they use rashad more

but i will say

its nearely impossible to miss with heavy

[austere pine]

my rashad is basically garbo

[bitter turtle]

so that wouldnt really be surprising if you hit weakspotw ith heavy but miss with lights

[austere pine]

i bought it from melk because it had bromentum 4 and like, something else

[cyan verge]

bro

[austere pine]

and never bothered with it because it worked on auric

[pseudo fiber]

I beat 40 with psword the horde clear it gives on 21st is very valuable

[bitter turtle]

im sure its possible

[austere pine]

and i used quite a bit of it so skill issue isnt a problem, rather the damage

[bitter turtle]

i just think its really dependent on your team

[pseudo fiber]

Ontop of good single target for crushers

And it is nice against ragers too

[austere pine]

might have to try 21st with psword

[bitter turtle]

im just not sure when i would want to use it over caxe

[austere pine]

which seems weaker now after the armory update

all my stuff feels weaker actually

[pseudo fiber]

Well I don't get why almost everything in that update got buffed

[austere pine]

yeah exactly

i seriously dont understand why my weapons dont deal as much damage as they used to

[bitter turtle]

in auric or havoc?

[austere pine]

especially the revolver, which used to oneshot most things

[cyan verge]

power sword just destroys everything so at least you get power for the slowness of it

[austere pine]

auric so far because havoc is out of my range for now

[bitter turtle]

psword is atually slower than rashad at horde clear

[austere pine]

yup. need to activate and only get up to 3 good swings

[bitter turtle]

both kill 4 at a time, psword needs to power every 3 swings

tbh if i did bring psword

it would be a sunder psword probably

[austere pine]

you do get the push tech but unless you stab, you dont get an attack off faster

of course its a sunder psword

i remember the glory days of psword revolver veteran being the best you could ask for from a teammate

[bitter turtle]

idk i didnt really notice a difference in terms of bps, what did they change besides gunner behavior?

[austere pine]

maybe my luck with crucian?

or... i dunno rending on hand cannon?

and psword might just be me having nostalgia flashbacks of being able to rip through hordes only marginally worse than a zealot or ogryn

[pseudo fiber]

Old psword 8 powered swinfs

How balanced

Mk6 psword infinite powered swings because of a bug at release

[austere pine]

not even talking about that

talking about the time nobody but psyker had access to dsword

because that weapon has no reason to be that good

only reason i can see it being that good was because it was the psyker who had it

[pseudo fiber]

And even then it was overpowered on psyker too

[austere pine]

it was, and then the dedicated melee classes gained access to it

like... what was the thinking?

it was kept in check because it was the wimpy psyker using it

[livid fractal]

anyone got a fun squad leader build

thinking of playing veteran agin

[austere pine]

@bitter turtle

send one of yours

[bitter turtle]

i dont know what squad leader entails

[austere pine]

middle tree

[bitter turtle]

yea but every single build goes down middle tree

[austere pine]

like mostly middle tree

[bitter turtle]

since tac awareness and iron will

[austere pine]

starts with charismatic, voc, maybe mark but ws is also a good option

sorta like a commissar vibe

pistol and sword

[bitter turtle]

funny thing is

for a pistol + sword i would go down right instead

for WS

[austere pine]

or axe but sword is more evocative of a squad leader

[bitter turtle]

so thats why i cant really answer without knowing the weapon choice

[austere pine]

exactly but this is vibes

[pseudo fiber]

Done

[bitter turtle]

idk if its vibes then just pick every talent with the word "team" or "coherency" in it

[austere pine]

can i get a link to the build editor? its gonna take forever for me to get to it

[bitter turtle]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/build-editor

[austere pine]

or

[bitter turtle]

no leave no one behind

wow

[tropic stratus]

what's the dump stat on power sword

[bitter turtle]

roleplay vibes where

[bitter turtle]

mobility

[tropic stratus]

thanks (:

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/8380ded2cfbfde74333a52ea81589372.png

maximum roleplay vibes

questionable effectiveness

:^)

[austere pine]

yeah good idea

i was maybe going for a very leading melee commander

leave no on me behind was too far

[worldly plover]

2 points for a perk that a curio slot can do

[bitter turtle]

but the vibe

[austere pine]

movespeed

[bitter turtle]

of like

[austere pine]

and vibes

[bitter turtle]

ur the squad leader

[quiet valley]

Cleave Targets

[bitter turtle]

and your people are down

and you charge in and drag them away

[quiet valley]

spreading misinformation smh

[bitter turtle]

and they're like LEAVE ME BEHIND CAPTAIN

and you're like NO

[bitter turtle]

cleave targets is still useful if you go sunder

[austere pine]

"tell my mother i love her"
"TELL HER YOURSELF"

[quiet valley]

who goes sunder over BM?

[bitter turtle]

a lot of people?

[worldly plover]

id dump leave no one behind and take the 8 stacks focus target and communal toughness distribution instead for RP

[quiet valley]

who wants to use a 60% mob p sword

💀

[bitter turtle]

mobility at 80 and 60 doesnt really make a difference

[austere pine]

nah not worth it

[bitter turtle]

8 stack focus isnt really that good

[pseudo fiber]

I dump cleave targets because that dodge distance increase at 80 is real to me!

[worldly plover]

better rp

[quiet valley]

its a bigger difference since Psword dodge is so trash

[bitter turtle]

but i literally just rp'd

out

why leave no one behind is necessary

[worldly plover]

snoy

[austere pine]

not even because you want to be issuing orders more often

and waiting for charges means you're not issuing orders

[worldly plover]

you dont need max stacks

in fact its better not too

[austere pine]

sure but whats the point in getting 8 stacks then

[worldly plover]

to keeps the max buff going if you ping again and kill something

you only need the stack once

[bitter turtle]

yea

but think of it this way

[austere pine]

that happens for

like

a singular boss

[bitter turtle]

its only 4.5% more dmg on redirect

to go 8 stack

[livid fractal]

anyone got a fun VoC build for vet? kinda feel like just locking in n popping heads rn

[bitter turtle]

do you really want a conditional fire team

that doesnt seem VIBES to me

[quiet valley]

I mean is pretty much perma dmg for entire team

its global too

[bitter turtle]

so is fire team

[austere pine]

like in what world do you have to re-ping an enemy that isnt a monstro?

[livid fractal]

hows the Vraaks VII rn? is it still basically just a physical kantrael

[quiet valley]

it stacks redirect fire

[bitter turtle]

yea thats what im saying

its 3 more stacks of redirect = 4.5% more dmg

its a worse fire team

[quiet valley]

Fire team is coherency only tho

redirect 8 stack is global

[bitter turtle]

what kind of squad leader

is playing

out of coherency

the vibes

[quiet valley]

I mean take both? what

[bitter turtle]

but then you have to drop leave no one behind

and that is the ultimate rp

[austere pine]

you take charismatic specifically to be in coherency longer

[quiet valley]

Charismatic is garbage tho

[bitter turtle]

this isnt about optimization

its about the vibes

[quiet valley]

vibes or nah

its bad haha

[bitter turtle]

otherwise i would not have taken covering fire

[austere pine]

optimization is going ws ds

[quiet valley]

WS i sleep

[bitter turtle]

charismatic = what kind of squad leader has no charisma?

your soldiers are going to mutiny

[quiet valley]

Orders are orders

[bitter turtle]

its non negotiable

same with BORN LEADER

[pseudo fiber]

DS4 and Bolt pistol

[worldly plover]

9 billion dead commisars

[quiet valley]

who tf is ignoring imperium orders in 40k

[bitter turtle]

a lot of people actually

[quiet valley]

a lot of dead ppl

[livid fractal]

is the Graia Mk VII any good? or am i just better off using a kantrael

really wanna just lock in and pop heads rn so im tryna set up a good semi auto wep

[bitter turtle]

if thats the case then why is chaos winning

[quiet valley]

ask the writers

[worldly plover]

exodite sweep, surely they get a set

or lore, or anything ever

[bitter turtle]

spess mehrines

more spess mehrines

also i thought about it more

https://i.gyazo.com/9d6b185b04be63c6b54eb0a76a38d4a3.png

but i think revive shout has more vibes than upgraded crates

[quiet valley]

WHAT IS THAT

[bitter turtle]

did you miss the entire convo earlier

[quiet valley]

go krak fire team tho

[bitter turtle]

this is the ultimate vibes rp experience of a squad leader build

[quiet valley]

why shredders

[worldly plover]

shredders are good

free stagger always available

[quiet valley]

what happened to squad rp lol

[bitter turtle]

i dont think shredder or krak inherently feel more squad leader vibes

if anything

shredder helsp you save your teammates

[austere pine]

physical infantry las, said it yourself. its worse than them, though, because it has less shots to shoot at enemies with and relies heavily on surgical to be able to kill in 1-2 shots

[bitter turtle]

by clearing the horde around them

when you revive them

[quiet valley]

Kraks have enough stagger to res

[bitter turtle]

therefore it has better squad leader rp value

[austere pine]

all infantry autoguns are good

[frank ledge]

Hey Boss how havok doing?

[austere pine]

wait weapons got renamed

whats graia mk7?

[livid fractal]

Vraaks MK7

[austere pine]

"vigilant" or infantry

[livid fractal]

"Vigilant"

its the vraaks headhunter

[bitter turtle]

is it the 1 2 or 3 shot

[austere pine]

yeah no use kanty 1a

one

[livid fractal]

1

[bitter turtle]

its pretty good

[livid fractal]

Kant 1a? aight

[bitter turtle]

except in havoc

but i dont think ilas is very good in havoc either

[austere pine]

its not

[quiet valley]

Havoc is las heaven

[austere pine]

too slow and hordes are horrible

[bitter turtle]

advantages of the vigilant is, it has pretty high carapace dmg

[quiet valley]

inf las is ok in havoc 40, las pistol just does the same thing but better imo

[livid fractal]

oooh i can work with that actually

[austere pine]

yeah, but its not like youre gonna be shooting carapace anyway

[bitter turtle]

1 taps both gunners in auric

can 1 tap flamer as well

disadvantage is its shit against maniac rager

[livid fractal]

im not doing high level havoc on vet, truth be told

if im doing havoc im on literally any other class

[quiet valley]

why not

[austere pine]

its not bad. its an opinion difference on what you want to oneshot or kill quickly

what isnt a thing of opinion is the fact that inf las has better value/shot

due to having more and shooting more and not relying on surgical

[bitter turtle]

you dont rely on surgical on v7

its nice

but you dont rely on it

[livid fractal]

which las is the good one

[bitter turtle]

theres actually someone here that even says hh is better even if i dont agree

[austere pine]

in testing, it was the only thing helping me get reliable and quick kills

[austere pine]

1a

[livid fractal]

there is no Ia

[bitter turtle]

u should be able to 1tap gunners with no crit

so maybe you built it wrong?

[austere pine]

the not slow and not fast one

the not blue and not brown one

i dunno

[livid fractal]

also thanks hadron

[austere pine]

das the one

[austere pine]

thats a relic keep it

[livid fractal]

a relic?

[bitter turtle]

no

keep rolling

why would you want to dump ammo

i dont think stability does anything

[livid fractal]

no

stability my beloved

[bitter turtle]

no like literally

i dont think it does anything

[livid fractal]

id most likely dump mobility

[quiet valley]

mobility dump imo

[austere pine]

like

[bitter turtle]

i used to have a 20 stability ilas

[austere pine]

not use it

[bitter turtle]

i did not notice a difference

[austere pine]

but keep in inv

because funny roll

i have a 1% damage psword

[livid fractal]

anyways Graia VII or Kantrael VII, that is my plight

[austere pine]

preference

try em out

[livid fractal]

ill take em into meat grinder rq and see which i like the feel of

also can i get a decent build for just locking in and popping heads? either counterfire or voice of command, i love both

[austere pine]

try a mission if you can

its really not terrible either way but knowing them in combat scenarios helps more

[austere pine]

exe stance for that

lemme get you smth

[livid fractal]

ighty sweet

i remember i used to be nuts with OG counterfire

would just use the Kantrael IV, hit F, proceed to wipe out every gunner in a 5 mile radius

[austere pine]

with this, you have 2 spare points

wait no

hold on

this

i forgot i hate that keystone

[bitter turtle]

btw

you dont really need surg to kill hte main targets its meant to kill

[austere pine]

i run something like this on my las with stormtooper and suppression immunity

real sniper hours

epic embed fail

[bitter turtle]

gyazo is being a little shit and wont let me download the vid

so

live with the link

o

it finally fucking started dl

[livid fractal]

no grenade tinkerer?

[austere pine]

what setup do you run for that?

[austere pine]

why?

[livid fractal]

big boom

[austere pine]

you can i guess its just not a talent i take much

[bitter turtle]

like you mean tree?

[austere pine]

nah gun

[livid fractal]

wait this build doesnt run krak

krag grenades my beloved

[austere pine]

yeah no

[bitter turtle]

unarmored/flak

[livid fractal]

*krak

[bitter turtle]

maniac doesnt do anything

[austere pine]

you cant run krak with a pinpoint weapon

[bitter turtle]

so you drop it for unarmored to 1tap dregs

[austere pine]

blessings?

[bitter turtle]

surg+DA

[austere pine]

hmmm

i wonder why

meh, im addicted to clicking heads with a las already

and i sold my vraks

[livid fractal]

ok so

i like vraaks killing power

[pseudo fiber]

This video is really funny

[livid fractal]

BUT

the scope is ass and i dont like it lol

and the Kant feels a lot more consistent at hitting heads

[bitter turtle]

if you're on pc

just download wep customization

[austere pine]

might be why i dropped it

[bitter turtle]

stick whatever you want on it

[austere pine]

fuckass iron

i liked the reflex

[livid fractal]

yeah i really like the temple sight

[austere pine]

and i couldnt mod because of gfn

[livid fractal]

on the lasguns

welp, time to roll for funny lasgun

[livid fractal]

can this be modified to take kraks my beloved

[austere pine]

figure it out

you have 3 points to spare since you dont need to take both talents going into exe stance, just the right one

[livid fractal]

also what melee would u run iwth this

[austere pine]

and 2 if youre going lasgun

shovel, psword, caxe, dsword, knife, chainsword

very flexible on not-havoc

[livid fractal]

thanks brunt

[austere pine]

good shit

[livid fractal]

took me like 6 rolls

[austere pine]

if you can upgrade stats that is

[livid fractal]

well ill be able to eventually

[austere pine]

when does that unlock btw? what mastery

[livid fractal]

max stats is usually 19

but u can upgrade it pretty high before then

what bleesings/perks on kant las

[austere pine]

hh

deadly accurate and something

[livid fractal]

also im thinking combat axe

really want a just back to basics build here

[austere pine]

deadly accurate headhunter

deadly accurate because who wouldnt want those stats

and headhunter because stormtrooper crits

[livid fractal]

ok so why would I not take supression immunity btw

[analog yacht]

iirc ilas already has good suppression resistance

[austere pine]

not enough if youre being shot at by a gunner

[bitter turtle]

ilas?

[austere pine]

infantry las

[bitter turtle]

ilas suppression is awful

[analog yacht]

Then I recall wrong and am thinking of rlas or something

[austere pine]

the idea here is to shoot gunners down regardless of whether or not theyre shooting you

[livid fractal]

ok so
after modifying for Krak grenades, heres what i should got
I have 1 spare point

what should i add/change

[austere pine]

stormtrooper

[bitter turtle]

you dont need determined

[austere pine]

shocktrooper?

[bitter turtle]

if you are playing executioner stance

[livid fractal]

oh shock trooper?

[bitter turtle]

assuming you can keep up exec

also maybe think about rending strikes?

ilas vs flak is awful

though amybe its just not even worth shooting

[austere pine]

not terrible

think dreg gunners go down in 1 most times for me

[livid fractal]

and combat axe is still headtaker/bomen?

[analog yacht]

I think ghost might be a better pick than deadly accurate

[austere pine]

yuh

youre not killing with bodyshots

[analog yacht]

Except for like 2b it's way too inconsistent

[livid fractal]

which axe is best rn

combat or tac

and which mark

[austere pine]

rashad

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/a151e9ee3f27ecb5af612d07ab8794c4.png

i consider this awful

also dreg gunners have unarmored heads

[analog yacht]

Rashad is headtaker/brutal momentum

[austere pine]

opposite, no?

[bitter turtle]

nop

unarmored head + flak body

[austere pine]

or

eh

[analog yacht]

The cleave on headshot kills is mandatory

[austere pine]

i know theres one enemy who has armored head unarnorwd body and another of the other faction is opposite

[livid fractal]

bro wtf
Just burnt 110k dockets and this was the best i got

[bitter turtle]

well

its not gunners

cause scab gunner is full yflak

[livid fractal]

that 1% is going to kill me in my sleep

[austere pine]

stalkers?

bruisers?

bruisers is obv but i know about a ranged whos like that

[bitter turtle]

bruisers are like that

yea

[analog yacht]

Helmet heads

[bitter turtle]

shotgunners are not reversed

so idk what you would be thinking of

[austere pine]

stalkers then?

[thorn lark]

bucket heads

[analog yacht]

Oh right, I just woke up lmao

[bitter turtle]

i dont think dreg trash mob shooters have any armor on them

[analog yacht]

I knew what I typed sounded wrong

[thorn lark]

looks like a pot or a bucket yeah

[austere pine]

gimme like 15 minutes

[wicked epoch]

hear me out..

[austere pine]

@bitter turtle i can get a oneshot headshot on scab gunners pretty consistently with the las

i don't get a 3hit reaper though

not without crits

WAIT A DAMN MINUTE

SINCE WHEN ARE SCAB RAGERS CARAPACE

[bitter turtle]

last patch

[austere pine]

OH NOH

[bitter turtle]

scab gunner is always easy to headshot

dreg gunner is the hard part for most weapons

also its just the chest

head is still flak

but yeah,a bout gunners, for some reason fs decided dreg gunner should be tankier than scab

[austere pine]

they chomk

oneshot with either exe stance and 5 stacks of focus leave the dude with 5 hp

[bitter turtle]

yea

thats something vigilant has over ilas is what i was saying

dont need any bonuses to 1 tap them

[austere pine]

mind that i have imperfect blessings and perks so oneshots of dreg gunner are possible

which is fine

it really is a preference thing

[bitter turtle]

ilas is much better against maniac

they are just opposites

in a way

vigilant = shit maniac damage, good against flak

ilas = shit against flak, good aginst maniac

[austere pine]

but with how scab ragers are now carapace, my preference might change

[bitter turtle]

a vigilant can spam into mauler body and kill them p fast, like in 3 or 4 shots depending on deadshot rng

a ilas is torture to try that

but ilas delete maniac rager

vigialnt is really shit unless you're a god at headshots

[austere pine]

still prefer ilas

but vigilant definitely has its perks

@livid fractal here's what i run for my build but it's a lot of things i like but aren't necessarily perfect for the playstyle

you have like no melee in this build though

@bitter turtle this is something i've been cooking up for a braced autogun since yesterday

do braced autos get suppressed at all?

[bitter turtle]

not in any meaningful way at least

[austere pine]

what about adding deadshot and tunnel vision?

[bitter turtle]

brauto has pretty bad finesse values

i wouldnt

especially since its a close range weapon

you probably want your stamina

[austere pine]

deadshot mark with stam regen mark talent?

[bitter turtle]

you can try it

but both marksman focus and deadshot are not going to gfive big gains to brauto

since they are dependent on finesse dmg of the gun

[austere pine]

deadshot might be good due to the sway decrease

and i switched marksman's to mark because why not

the idea was for the build to evoke this guy

because he's swag

[pastel yew]

am I gonna have to

meta slave to even get low easy havoc missions not rejected? outside of discord lfgs n shit

oof

I've had every invite rejected..... I think the chain axe will have to be left behind

[pastel yew]

deadshot always good

dont think about it... just embrace...

[austere pine]

don't chainaxe

it's the simplest thing to do

[pastel yew]

chainaxe is fun tho

it's literally

low havoc

why are people meta slaving

LEMEEE INN

[austere pine]

if chainaxe = fun

[pastel yew]

https://tenor.com/view/let-me-in-gif-13767303

[austere pine]

then every other melee weapon is an opioid drug with how fun it is

[pastel yew]

nah not at all

only really if you equate strength to fun

which is often true but not always

the chain axe is a good weapon

its only bad by comparison to some of the ludicrous shit we have in the game

[austere pine]

why not just use chainsword?

[pastel yew]

because the chainsword is objectively worse and has none of the flair?

[austere pine]

?????

do you mean chainsword 13g?

[pastel yew]

chainsword excels at horde clear, and thats it

[austere pine]

because that's arguable

[pastel yew]

the chain axe... sucks at horde clear... but is good everywhere else

it's not arguable like

[austere pine]

but chainsword 4 is objectively better at all things than either chainaxe, save the active agaisnt armor

[pastel yew]

the elite TTK on the chainswords just bad

the chainsword mk 4

is better against elites than the chainaxe/

which one shots them?

say cap

say you havent used the chainaxe

[austere pine]

brother you are so high

on drugs

have to be

i said it's better at things save for that one

"save for" is a way to say "except for"

[pastel yew]

no

I understand what you said?

I'm saying the only thing the chainsword is better at is horde clear

its gunner ttk is worse

its specialist ttk is worse

[austere pine]

are you running a melee only build?

[pastel yew]

running weapon spec as

unfortunately you need to with the chain axe

for the +25% attack speed

else you're gonna get killed by level 1 chump

[austere pine]

like just get a gun that can deal with picks like that

and get a melee that clears

[pastel yew]

I mean I agree you can do that

but that doesnt make the chain axe a bad weapon

its clear is aight with weapon spec

just awful without

[austere pine]

if the melee can clear and pick off targets then you run it, eg psword, caxe, knife (sorta) and dsword

it's inferior to most if not all

[pastel yew]

a chain axe can do those things

I'm not arguing its an S tier weapon

all I'm saying is that its good

if you compare the weapon to the difficulty of the game, its good

its just other weapons are so stacked op

that they excel because of that

[austere pine]

like i'm not saying i wouldn't take you into a party but chain axe is really not it for melees

[pastel yew]

its low havoc

[austere pine]

wait do you mean that every other melee weapon is op?

[pastel yew]

if I'm clearing auric maelstrom and dealing more damage than everyone else

its good enough for low havoc lmao

[pastel yew]

not every weapon, just the main ones

combat axe, combat blade, dueling sword

[austere pine]

so anything except tac axe and heavy sword, if we're not comparing chain axe to chain axe

[pastel yew]

power sword I think is fine, I'd rather use a chain axe if I have weapon spec

but I'd rather use a power sword without

[austere pine]

because you can make everything else work

[pastel yew]

my opinion on those weapons being op has nothing to do with the chainaxe

it has everything to do with them being generalist weapons that excel at most things and have no clear weakness that matters

I would say chainaxe is the ideal balance point for weapons

good level of strength at its strong points

noticeable weakness

it just needs a base attack speed buff

[austere pine]

that is an opinion wow

[pastel yew]

I mean if you want every weapon to play the game for you with no drawback to play around thats cool but

[austere pine]

that's just ds

[pastel yew]

bro the rashad hello?

[austere pine]

every other has something you have to play around

[pastel yew]

the combat blade is also stacked

[austere pine]

just... agree to disagree i fear

[pastel yew]

the power sword only barely squeaks by because it has a weakness with its charge and even thats not mega

what do you have to play around with the rashad

great horde clear, great elite clear, great armor damage, good boss damage, good movement

truly an oppressed weapon with noteable drawbacks

at least it has a complex moveset to draw that strength out

L1 L1 L1 L1

H1 H1 H1 H1

[umbral scaffold]

I am a power sword enjoyer and i can tell you that if you play Veteran more reserved. It's not bad at all

[pastel yew]

yeah the power swords super good

in a fairly good place

[cursive lion]

I am simply a knife user

[pastel yew]

you dont gotta justify using these weapons btw its not flame

I've used a lot of each of them

except the combat blade

they're just overpowered

[umbral scaffold]

You just need to play Veteran in a more reserved way with it. You stay a bit further back and snipe specialists and elites. If a horde or something does get close, you activate it, delete whatever is infront of you and then go back to sniping heads with the Plasma gun

[pastel yew]

I doubt any of this stuff is gonna get nerfed anyway

no plasma gun nerfs in eons, no autogun nerf no blah blah blah

you get the picture

I just hope they dont start balancing around hav40

[cursive lion]

That power do be creeping

[umbral scaffold]

I think they will nerf things, if they're too dominant and make other things boring

I kinda wish there was a different version of the boltgun that didn't feel so clunky and akward to use

[pastel yew]

plasma gun has been the best weapon for like a year at this point? longer?

well

I guess it isnt anymore

but not because it got nerfed

because psyker got stronger

I think gunker does outperform it now, and the voidstrike wasnt that far behind it

[umbral scaffold]

Plasma gun is good because of the ammo count

[pastel yew]

its good because it has no weakness

[umbral scaffold]

Boltgun has you reloading every 5 seconds

[pastel yew]

outside of the charge which can throw people off but personally the charge doesnt really affect me

[umbral scaffold]

Plasma gun needs time to get used to but other than that it's great

[pastel yew]

mhm for sure

[dry niche]

Plasma has weakness but they are massively overshadowed by the positives

[pastel yew]

its only weakness is its mobility and

imo that doesnt matter

because the only thing that's going to be in melee range of you now is poxxies

[umbral scaffold]

Well Plasma can't be used to just mow down a horde

[pastel yew]

it can

it's horde clear is actually nuts

[umbral scaffold]

It can but not as effectively as others

[umbral scaffold]

At range yeag

[pastel yew]

its probably one of the best ranged weapon horde clear for vet

[umbral scaffold]

At range the projectlie gets massive

[dry niche]

In a tunnel maybe

[umbral scaffold]

And it overpenetrates

[pastel yew]

definitely better there but if they're at all packed its going to delete loads of them

[umbral scaffold]

I am trying to make Boltgun work but volleyfire feels so restrictive

[pastel yew]

idk the plasma gun just gets mega privilege

it gets a heat mechanic rather than reload

[dry niche]

Unlimited pen is nuts

[pastel yew]

it gets amazing breakpints and ignores suppression innately

I dont think you should use it for this but it can explode carapace rapidly

eh

the only thing it sucks at is clearing regular non elite gunners which doesnt really matter outside of havoc

[umbral scaffold]

I think it's fine. I think all guns in this game should be nuts if you know how to build them and what you're using them for

[cursive lion]

Am I old news still using a lasgun

[pastel yew]

I just think the upper limit of the plasmagun is too high

[pastel yew]

nah lasguns goated

[cursive lion]

I love it

[pastel yew]

I regret exclusively using that throughout year 1 as

now I'm sorta burned out on it

[umbral scaffold]

I think we could use a few more marks and a few other guns but that's a bit of a symptom of the game being melee first

[pastel yew]

but yeah I really like that weapon, super thematic

[cursive lion]

Which variant

[pastel yew]

most ranged marks are just fast fire/low damage mid/mid slow fire/high damage

[umbral scaffold]

The Sisters of battle have a far stabler boltgun with a higher capacity. That would be a nice mark to be added to the game as an example

Plasma pistol would also be cool

I wonder if we'll ever see melta stuff

[pastel yew]

I dont really want another boltgun mk tbh though

I'd like a focus on other weapons

[pastel yew]

calling it now but if we do it'll be a zealot weapon

[umbral scaffold]

I was about to say it lol

[pastel yew]

it fits them too much and fills a hole in their kit

[thorn lark]

I am sure we will get a plasma pistol

[umbral scaffold]

Cause i play Zealot with Bolt Pistol

[thorn lark]

The mechanic is already there

[umbral scaffold]

With Zealot, you use a strong pistol primary to just delete something you don't like every now and then

[pastel yew]

I'm just not sure what a plasma pistol actually brings to the game though

[umbral scaffold]

You see a specialist you want dead before you reach the melee? Pop the bolt pistol

[pastel yew]

compare the boltgun and the bolt pistol, the bolt pistol was added as more of a marksman weapon which is better in that role but not as versatile

the plasma gun is just THE marksman weapon, and excels at everything

[thorn lark]

Tknives

[pastel yew]

theres not really a niche for the pistol to fill

[umbral scaffold]

Not as fun as the sound of a boltgun but i also use them

[thorn lark]

Yeah bolter sound design is seriously nice

[umbral scaffold]

I still don't understand how to boltgun. I want to use it as a primary and mow down anything that looks wrong at me. But that doesn't seem to be the way you're meant to play it

[pastel yew]

depends

on zealot thats totally acceptable if you take throwing knives

on zealot its more of a spray anti armor tool

on vet its... I mean it was meant to be a special sniper and I guess it still is? it just has the option to spray which gives good boss damage in some builds

but generally I'd just say the bolt pistol is better

its faster, it has easier to hit 1 shot break points

[umbral scaffold]

I just want to mow down hordes with it man. Why must it be so unstable and i need to reload 24/7?😔

[pastel yew]

do it then

embrace the darkside

if you dont want it to be unstable use ES

unironically exec stance hipfire spray is good

[thorn lark]

Embrace Agri brauto

[pastel yew]

press f, room of elites... dakka dakka dakka

[thorn lark]

And dance of death on zealot

[umbral scaffold]

I tried that. But then i got clapped in melee cause i couldn't breathe with VoC

What's ES?

[thorn lark]

Exec stance

[inland orchid]

The shooty stance

[thorn lark]

Ultimate on the left side

[umbral scaffold]

I could try it again

But i found it too restrictive. I would be in melee with no ability

What i never see people run is infiltrator

[pastel yew]

dance of death is such a fun talent

[umbral scaffold]

But the higher i go, the less veterans i see. I see moslty Zealotsnand and Psykers

[pastel yew]

I don't say this to be rude but that is primarily just a skill thing

you'll get better as you go along

[thorn lark]

It's ok overshadowed by voc. And stealth has a bad rep because of certain zealots

[pastel yew]

voc does give you loads of safety but its not always necessary

[thorn lark]

It's also very costly

[pastel yew]

infiltrate is good

[thorn lark]

Pathing not idel

[pastel yew]

I mean like

its really selfish

but its good

I think the issue with it is that its a lot more utility focussed for objects, getting around the map, revives

rather than proactive like exec stance, or hyper carry like voc

I enjoy infiltrate though, get your zoomies

[umbral scaffold]

Yeah i know, don't worry. I play a lot of Solo and i often find myself needing that "Let me breathe button". Ex stance seems cool when you have people to communicate with and just melt down elites and bosses with it

[thorn lark]

You could go inspiring pinning fire on your bolter with exec

[pastel yew]

the way to look at it is that VoC is more reactive or steadily helping with its gold toughness and stagger... where exec stance is proactive, you kill everything before it becomes a threat. This is why it doesnt really need defence boosts because you already have loads of toughness generation on weakspot from vet tree + you should be able to kill the main nasties off before they can create complex fucked up situations which end runs.

[thorn lark]

That plus confirmed kill and iron will could help you find your groove

[bitter turtle]

Chainsword is a weapon that needs no talents on the tree so it's a nice pick on gun talent heavy builds

That or shmaul

[bitter turtle]

Depends on how you use it

I bring it to havoc 40 to solo obj which simplifies a lot of events

[thorn lark]

It likes reciprocity and to a lesser extent despe

[bitter turtle]

Major ones in the havoc rotation would be clandestium gloriana first event (last one too, kinda if you get flipping breakers), refinery last event with the 4 random hacking spots, metalfab final event with the levers you have to pull on each corner of the map

[bitter turtle]

It does the job fine without them

Compare that to say, knife

[thorn lark]

Yeah but that's not a big investment

Oh yeah

[bitter turtle]

It loses a lot of power if you can't take those two

Chs benefits sure

But it also doesn't rly matter if you don't either

[thorn lark]

It's a well balanced weapon

[pastel yew]

yeah I agree just, most of its usage isnt going to be that and it's not going to actively help the team as much as ES or VOC will

it's good just niche and I think thats why it's not played as much

[bitter turtle]

Even in normal fights

[pastel yew]

didnt actually know chainsword needed no talents

I figured itd need weapon spec to get that nuts horde clear though

[bitter turtle]

Getting into good position to stealth underhand grenades is extremely strong

[pastel yew]

but thats most weapons I suppose, outside of the ps

[bitter turtle]

Surprise attack 30% boost synergizes well

[pastel yew]

also the cooldown on the stealth is

too fuckin high

you can take the node to have two charges but that makes it worse in the moment even if better overall

[thorn lark]

https://tenor.com/view/jimmy-mcmillan-too-damn-high-high-gif-10410151

[bitter turtle]

Idk i think the cd is fine

[pastel yew]

I can get them all having 30s cooldowns if they're of even strength but stealth could stand to chill a little

[bitter turtle]

My only problem with it is the talent taxes

[pastel yew]

or at least remove the +15 seconds

[bitter turtle]

But demo stockpile should be moved

[pastel yew]

demo stockpile is just

such a problem talent

it should be the connecting node all builds have to go through

because every build is going to take it without fail

[thorn lark]

Voc should have its CD increased at least

[pastel yew]

either that or remove it and adjust the nades a little

thats one way to go about fixing it

if the gold toughness is kept then yeah cd increase, but I'd rather the gold toughness just be axed

[inland orchid]

Reminder of the talent that lowers cooldown on specialist/elite kill

[pastel yew]

both of its add on nodes are just so boring....

[inland orchid]

It wouldn’t matter in the long run imo

You’d just shoot things and get the shout back

[pastel yew]

having them be impactful short duration team buffs would be way cooler, as then you have to actually think on when to use VoC to get the most value

and it actually feels like you're rallying the team rather than

f on cooldown

[thorn lark]

Yeah but you would shoot more and voc less

I think

[inland orchid]

Depends how many heads you’re claiming in your volleys

[pastel yew]

itd matter a fair bit

it'd make it so you cant literally have 100% uptime on gold toughness

[bitter turtle]

Also wep spec is a weird choice for chs imo

[pastel yew]

it'd still be strong though

[bitter turtle]

Just because it's kinda bad into elites

[pastel yew]

why/

yeah the chainswords not ideal into elites

[bitter turtle]

Well if you want to even be able to kill them you have to drop rampage for bletter

And even then

[pastel yew]

but all melee weapons gain from +attack speed. it's a multiplicative buff in a game of additive buffs

[bitter turtle]

The animation lock is eh

[pastel yew]

its honestly insane that it gives you 25%

your horde clear will be 25% faster though

not a bad buff for an already fast weapon

[bitter turtle]

Yes but it goes back to what I said, it's still clears like 100 poxes in 14 seconds talentless

[pastel yew]

not bad at all

[bitter turtle]

You don't need it

And the chs isn't well rounded as a melee

So personally I don't really like the idea of building heavy into melee for it

[pastel yew]

chainsword could use some love though

the saw attacks all feel pretty limp but the chainsword has the worst of it

[bitter turtle]

Since it's lopsided purely in favor of killing horde

[pastel yew]

mhm

praying for the day they make the saw attack do % damage rather than nothing nothing nothing huge burst

like a force sword...

[tall torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1185515538475134998/1315586614495547485/lol.mp4?ex=6757f303&is=6756a183&hm=0fbea70325e78a350fcb6db2feab58f353799df47e58cb19627b1a99848ac81d&

[pastel yew]

0.0

[tall torrent]

Obscurus force sword

[pastel yew]

what the fuck am I looking at

jesus

why... why did the second hit do 300

[tall torrent]

Probably the best “all rounder” psyker melee now

[bitter turtle]

Did something change about it

[tall torrent]

It’s an assassin strike and the angle really sucks for hitting weakspots

[pastel yew]

ahhhhhh I see

I thought head was hit

[bitter turtle]

Idk much about psyker but I thought people called it the worst one

[pastel yew]

with uncanny strike it should have done more than 300

yeah thats wild though

[tall torrent]

H1 overhead damage buff
H2 sweep now chains into a new L0 diagonal swing loop for horde clear

[pastel yew]

I dont know enough about em really

[bitter turtle]

Cool

[pastel yew]

I think the deimos has the best empower/

[tall torrent]

Used to be

[pastel yew]

never used them, always just defaulted to ds on psyker

[bitter turtle]

I don't use special action on any of them except illsi

[tall torrent]

Now it’s like
Prob the best all rounder

Because it does everything u need for a psyker melee

[bitter turtle]

I want to like force gs

But I think it's meh

[pastel yew]

not used it yet but getting hit causing you to lose all charge

sounds so very lame

[tall torrent]

FGS8 is cool

[bitter turtle]

I don't really care abt that part

[inland orchid]

not a fan of its attacks?

[bitter turtle]

Just that it's slow and the moonlight gs attack is really situational with how slow it builds + decay + all or nothing on the gauges (a half filled gauge does nothing from what i can tell)

The moveset is nice though

But not nice enough that I'd like it over the flaws I mentioned

[pastel yew]

psyker slow move speed + heavy weapon are a little off putting I wont lie

where zealot has dash to get in and generally insane movement

maybe its not that bad in practice though but its the last of the new weapons I'm gonna try

[inland orchid]

As a guy who’s using a bottom roll mobility greatsword it is very noticeable

[pseudo fiber]

Force greatsword push attack into heavy is so goated

[inland orchid]

But you can always swap to your ranged weapon

[bitter turtle]

Yea that part is awesome

Like I said the moveset is cool

[inland orchid]

If u really need to get to a place quicker

[bitter turtle]

But it's just so fucking slow

[pastel yew]

wouldnt be me using a fucking 6% movility chainaxe recently while leveling it in auric

never again

moving so slow with such awful dodges isnt fun

[bitter turtle]

And the special action is kinda disappointing

[inland orchid]

beautiful combo

[bitter turtle]

But yeah push attack can open up bulwark with the force push

[inland orchid]

Much like the rest of the psyker, the special stuff is better when u grab talents that compliment it

[bitter turtle]

And then you smack them in the face

[pastel yew]

the psyker sword might also seem cooler if it didnt get massively outshined by another cooler 2h greatsword in the same patch

[bitter turtle]

Really cool

[inland orchid]

Granted figuring out which talents like the GS is another thing

Def experimenting rn with crack of bone

[pseudo fiber]

The light swings feel weirdly unimpactful