veteran-class

[tawny badger]

hell naw

[charred dome]

or it's a sword idfk

[short fern]

Flamer with ds and knives feels too safe

[pastel yew]

the heavies on the chain axe sound so fucking good

[short fern]

Eviscerator is god tier tf

[tawny badger]

the illisi force sword iirc

[charred dome]

you can poke them and charge a blast into them but you can also just throw out several heavies in that time

[pastel yew]

the eviscerator is good yeah but the 1h chainsword and chain axe are like

varying levels of mid

the chainsword can get really nutty horde clear but thats about it

[charred dome]

what makes evisc better

[tawny badger]

more damage

[analog yacht]

1h chainswords are probably worst weapons in the game

[crude wind]

killing power

[short fern]

Mk15 has best cleave in the game

[pastel yew]

nahh no way

their horde clear is good

one of them at least

but yeah that's all they do

[tawny badger]

evis is just a straight upgrade to the chainsword imo

[pastel yew]

other weapons do that +

[analog yacht]

so is heavy sword, except that doesn't give up literally everything to do it

[pastel yew]

all of the best melee weapons just do literally everything

[charred dome]

okay so I'm looking at it

it IMMOBILIZES you?

[pastel yew]

heavy sword is trash into armor ig

is the trade off

[tawny badger]

you can cancel it with dodge tbf

[pastel yew]

heavy swords are goated tho

[analog yacht]

so is cs

[pastel yew]

also you can dodge and hit while dodging you effectively cut the immobalisation down

[charred dome]

yeah but the second you actually hit something with the attack you have their 3 mauler/crusher pals doing overheads

[short fern]

This is why most Evis zealots run heavy bolter with unyielding and carapace with throwing knives, you’re a god, highly recommend

[pastel yew]

the real awful thing is that the chain weapons work as a burst

so they do 0 damage unless you complete the animation

[tawny badger]

that’s why you gotta be mindful to not rev attack into a team of maulers/crushers

[charred dome]

like I'd spend more time sawing them, revving it up and repeating than just throwing out heavies it feels like

[pastel yew]

they're just funky force swords and its the worst

[stoic thorn]

Nah, I'd win

[pastel yew]

the chain weapons might be mid but

they got drip factor

[tawny badger]

they’re fun

[stoic thorn]

I'm John Cadia

[analog yacht]

yeah i mean fs has a habit of making the coolest weapons the worst ones

[tawny badger]

hi john pile of rocks

[inland orchid]

Omg who told the ragers about chain weaponry we’re karking screwed

[stoic thorn]

And we use cadian chainswords in this Inquisitorial Vessel

[inland orchid]

[pastel yew]

yeah I'm having a blast with the chain axe... (especially now my mobility stat isnt 6%)

[short fern]

Evisc is literally best in slot for zealot besides maybe dueling sword. Don’t knock it til you try it

[analog yacht]

they learned from games workshop

[charred dome]

So I'm assuming you rarely ever actually rev it or

[stoic thorn]

The close combat weapon:

[stoic thorn]

If I feel like it I get a rev out

[pastel yew]

uhh I mean you rev for bosses

and big boys

the chain axe heavy has a sorta half rev built in

[charred dome]

implying there's ever only one big boy

[pastel yew]

in that it sticks and does multi hits

[tawny badger]

chain axe lights

[short fern]

Heavy attack one shots elites and specialists and rev one shots carapace but too risky vs hordes. That’s what ranged is for

[stoic thorn]

It's borderline orgasmic chainsawing a heretic

[pastel yew]

you're vet, dodge, shout do whatever

[tawny badger]

uh

[charred dome]

had some games in heresy, not even damnation that had a crusher or mauler patrol every other room and I don't know why since that's never happened

[stoic thorn]

It's just feels GOOD

Especially dreg bruisers

[umbral scaffold]

new to the weapon update, I found this well rolled weapon in the temp shop, in order to get these stats maxxed out do i just play normally with it or is there a way to expedite maxing out the stats

[stoic thorn]

Sparks coming out their head

So satisfying

[pastel yew]

I do hope they give the chain weapons a little quality of life love

honestly the chain axe is only really bad in comparison

[slow spade]

attacked the Carapace factory 😔

[pastel yew]

like

it does its job well

[tawny badger]

go to hadron
entreat hadron
empower weapon

[pastel yew]

its just we have so many degen weapons in the game that are way too good

[charred dome]

like I've had auric damn games that had nowhere as much armor

this was plain fucking heresy, no modifiers

[umbral scaffold]

tyvm!

[short fern]

I personally don’t like savage sweep. Rampage is top tier though

[analog yacht]

as you increase weapon archetype mastery, you unlock the ability to stat up weapons at hadron. The mastery isn't attatched to that specific weapon, just the whole archetype

[pastel yew]

you want some kind of cleave blessing on the chainswords tho no?

I think

I cant remember which is good

one of them makes your horde clear among the fastest in the game

and if you're using the chainsword you'd probably best play to its only strength

[slow spade]

Brutal Momentum?

[charred dome]

is bruhmentum on chains?

[slow spade]

no

[charred dome]

rip

[pastel yew]

brutal momentum out here making every cleave blessing look like a joke fr tho

[slow spade]

I thought they were asking what blessing boosted your hordeclear the most

woops

[charred dome]

I'll miss when they made ogryns immune to it lmfao

take out an entire crusher pat in one overhead

[pastel yew]

nah the chainsword blessing

wait you cant do that anymore??????

whaaa

thats so sad

[charred dome]

so a while back they made it so

[analog yacht]

dependw which cs

[charred dome]

I forgot if it's crushers or ALL ogryns

but bruhmentum can't just like stack off them

[analog yacht]

one of them wants cleave and the other wants damage

[pastel yew]

I remember watching the ogryn one tap like 4 maulers in a conga line

hillarious

[charred dome]

you can't take out an entire crusher pat in one overhead

I think maulers still eat shit to it

lemme ask in ogryn chat they'd know

[pastel yew]

mmh

I'm hoping the new ogryn stubber is good as

I finally have a reason to play ogryn

it only took them 2 years to add weapons that were interesting

[charred dome]

It's a sniper, just remember you have literally zero ammo

you do onetap just about everything though

[stoic thorn]

Ogryn needs more weapons

[pastel yew]

all I care about honestly

[stoic thorn]

More funds to research ogryn proofing guns

[pastel yew]

all the other ogryn ranged weapons sorta suck

not strength wise

[short fern]

Nah. Ammo dumping stubber is the one that makes the girls go 😱

[pastel yew]

mechanically uninteresting to me

[charred dome]

if you want a pocket sniper just use ripper mk5 or kickback

ripper mk5 if you want carpal tunnel

shit has so much fucking recoil lmao

[stoic thorn]

Who needs twin stubbers

[pastel yew]

for all of a bout 5 games till the novelty wears off

[stoic thorn]

Let us rip out an assault cannon

[pastel yew]

DUDEEE

the fact they gave the ogryn another stubber rather than an auto cannon

is such a missed opportunity

[charred dome]

but nah the only complaints I've heard about the stubbers now is they sound weak, and ammo

[stoic thorn]

Wheres our fucking heavy bolter

[short fern]

I mean that’s all I use along with recon lasgun on my vet. I enjoy it

[pastel yew]

a heavy bolter is just gonna feel like normal bolter with more ammo

honestly I want like... power fist

melta gun

[stoic thorn]

We better get the Boltgun heavy bolter

[charred dome]

If you want something that hurts and also goes boom then just go rumbler or nade gauntlet

[pastel yew]

needle weapons mayhaps... though I dont think theyd fit

[stoic thorn]

The monkeys paw curls

It's Veteran that gets the power fist

Zealot gets the melta

[pastel yew]

the nade gauntlets fun

[charred dome]

The new stubbers is just delete anything on the spot

[pastel yew]

the rumbler I really didnt like

[stoic thorn]

Actually fine the monkeys paw uncurls

[pastel yew]

also if the new stubbers one shot

[charred dome]

Rumbler is honestly, to me now mid because they gave monsters explosive resis

[pastel yew]

the ammo cant be THAT bad

[stoic thorn]

Ogryns now get Multi-Meltas

[short fern]

Well only an ogryn would have the strength to wield it and idk if that’s canon or not.

[pastel yew]

I mean an ogryn usually wouldnt be given one

[short fern]

Why the fuck would it auto correct to cannon

[pastel yew]

there's like.. one ttrpg called only war

where there is one subclass that lets you

[stoic thorn]

The only thing keeping ogryns from getting more shit

[pastel yew]

but thats all I really think there is on that

[charred dome]

They have no ammo stat too but anyways, just don't be blasting hordes with it for no reason and it's fine

[stoic thorn]

Is Mechanicus can only really ogryn proof a few weapons

[charred dome]

had an ogryn just hosing hordes with his stubber when he had a club lol

[pastel yew]

controversial take (as much as I love them) ogryn was a terrible choice of 4th class

they were always gonna have these issues as they have 0 overlap with other classes

[stoic thorn]

4 rocks to the face.

Death.

[charred dome]

I need my fat foot knight

[pastel yew]

they're funny

[charred dome]

kroobah never dies

[pastel yew]

it's just

there is no universe in which they werent gonna have weapon variety issues

[short fern]

Honestly if you guys are dead set on using ranged for trash just main a psyker already. You’ll really enjoy it

[stoic thorn]

Slabshield when?

[pastel yew]

ranged for trash is just to support weapons with lesser horde clear

you're not only using it

also there are some weapons that vet will handle better

weapon specialist is like... a huge combat increase for the double barrel

and for your melee

[charred dome]

Guess I'm gonig

1 wound, 1 tough, 1 stamina curio

[pastel yew]

at least for the chainaxe I feel you basically need weapon spec

+20% attack speed helps a lot

[charred dome]

then triple stam regen and sprint eff

[pastel yew]

1 wound?

[charred dome]

I'm not even going to try and pretend to be one of those sweaty peeps with zero wound curios

[short fern]

My only gripe with double shot on vet is how do you deal with gunners and snipers if your team is struggling? You don’t really have any options like zealot

[pastel yew]

I guess if you think you're gonna die its fair

[stoic thorn]

Wait

[pastel yew]

or.. die twice even

[stoic thorn]

The one we have is a Slabshield oops

Brute Shield when?

[inland orchid]

Relatable

[charred dome]

It's a condom for when I get trapped through a wall lol

[hollow ibex]

running no wounds isn't even a sweat thing lol, it's just the standard

[pastel yew]

if you only die once though you're basically only 6% health down

and you have that 21% extra to avoid going down in the first place

[charred dome]

Allegedly

[short fern]

If you’re running wounds on anything besides martyrlot you’re just handicapping yourself

[hollow ibex]

wound curios come at the expense of your defense

[charred dome]

Also the bruhmentum nerf was ALL ogryns, I thought it was just crushers

[stoic thorn]

A bruteshield would provide better protection than a Sladshield

[hollow ibex]

don't forget that

[pastel yew]

yeah, unless you think you're gonna die twice

inwhich case its worth

[stoic thorn]

Instead of the goofy ass material shield of the Slabshield

Bruteshield just gives us a forcefield I think

[charred dome]

It's just a condom in case some shit happens so I don't get back up with like 10 HP

Same vibe as taking sniper resis on ogryn, I've literally been shot from behind because my body blocked the laser so I never saw it LOL

[short fern]

But statistically players that run wounds lose more games, you’re relying on your brainless monkey teammates to revive you at that point

[charred dome]

so what swap the wound for HP or tough

[pastel yew]

you're coming back up with 66% of your max, rather than 50%. if you just run a health curio, you're less likely to go down initially and likely have more total health but I'd have to do the math

[hollow ibex]

well you're cucking yourself by taking less hp or toughness. also med stimms become substantially less effective.

[pastel yew]

yeah because people that die twice lose games

[short fern]

I typically run 2 toughness and one health

[charred dome]

so HP or tough then

[umbral scaffold]

i just blindly follow this document

[hollow ibex]

i usually run 2x hp, 1x toughness

[pastel yew]

I think the giga optimal is health

[hollow ibex]

can't go wrong

[pastel yew]

because it lets you tank a sniper shot after going down

[charred dome]

I do have iron will so

[pastel yew]

but honestly + toughness is better imo

[hollow ibex]

well you just need 200+ hp

rest can be dumped into toughness

[slow spade]

not true

just don't get hit

[pastel yew]

true

[slow spade]

optimal is stam UwU

[pastel yew]

all stam curios

[charred dome]

I mean I'm running a stam

[pastel yew]

that's my boltpistol build

all stam baby

[charred dome]

I'll never find a 3 stam but whatever

[hollow ibex]

https://tenor.com/view/yes-wink-gotcha-you-tube-thanks-gif-19039548

[pastel yew]

+3 +2 +2

deadshot gaming

I fucking love deadshot

absolute god talent

[slow spade]

Recon XII + Deadshot

[charred dome]

friend said something about +3 stam isn't actually +3 unless it's like

[slow spade]

stamina gaming

[charred dome]

410 and over or something?

[pastel yew]

wait is that

true

[slow spade]

400

[charred dome]

I gotta remember that

[pastel yew]

why is that the case wtf

[slow spade]

supposedly and honestly I don't doubt it

[charred dome]

fartshart coding

[pastel yew]

truly....

[slow spade]

toughness regen speed is shit

[pastel yew]

if you're running shout though I think the giga optimal is 3x cooldown recovery

[slow spade]

only affects coherency

[pastel yew]

since it lets you kill 2 specialists and then your shout has 100% uptime

[charred dome]

what is the cdr again

[pastel yew]

4% or something I think

12% total with all three

okay 4% doesnt sound like a lot... and thats because its not...

but

[charred dome]

TDR comes in when you're stripped on tough and there's nothing nearby to slap around

It ain't useless but it's not all that

[slow spade]

trusting youtubers for "builds" was your first mistake

[pastel yew]

the point is that 3 of them opens up having to only kill 2 things to have shout up 100% of the time

[charred dome]

I think I'd rather get block efficiency

[pastel yew]

I think the thing is though

most youtubers are good at the game

and the build they have is enough to beat the hardest content

[hollow ibex]

sprint eff is good on vet

[pastel yew]

so even if you get a bad youtuber build

failure is a skill issue

[slow spade]

doesn't change they give dogshit builds

[hollow ibex]

not worth on vet

our cdr talent is insanely strong

[pastel yew]

its like

no

like

you take it with the cdr talent

thats the point

12% cooldown + 2 specialist kills with the cdr talent

means 100% uptime on gold toughnes

[slow spade]

cdr cudios are only good for 2x charge stealth builds

as it saves like 6 sec then

[hollow ibex]

totally unnecessary, esp on higher difficulties where there's 20 specialists every minute

[charred dome]

I do find it funny how in vermintide you literally had to take BCR on cata or else everything would snap your block in one hit

[hollow ibex]

better off taking other perks

[pastel yew]

okay

30s base cooldown
x 0.88 from 3x cdr curio = 26.4
-12 from two kills = 14.4

[slow spade]

but now you can just pull a .75 cal diamond tipped bolt round into their head

[pastel yew]

14.4 is less than 15

thats why it is good

does the game need that much optimization?

i'd say not

but it is optimal

[hollow ibex]

it isn't lol

[slow spade]

its not

[pastel yew]

I'd say running 3x pennies is better tho

[slow spade]

you're completely ignoring the time spent between shots

[pastel yew]

extra coins is objectively the best

[charred dome]

I think it's more because it's such a small change I'd rather take something far more useful lol

[hollow ibex]

ok i can get behind that

[pastel yew]

?

[hollow ibex]

more money is always good

[pastel yew]

true

money is also the only one that affects outside of the game

if you were already not gonna lose

[hollow ibex]

mourningstar crypto my beloved

[pastel yew]

then not taking it is a lot less cashola

[somber adder]

Curio reward chance is good for farming

[slow spade]

no its not

[pastel yew]

I've never actually tried it ngl

[slow spade]

just buy melk curios

[pastel yew]

I just assumed best is melk yea

[somber adder]

Since you can just make your own perfect weapons but curios are an rng fest

[hollow ibex]

curio reward chance is awful

[pastel yew]

especially now melk is useless

poor guy

[hollow ibex]

just camp the armory with the browser extension

[somber adder]

You need a lot of melk bucks to get a triple set of max rolls for each stat

[hollow ibex]

no need to handicap yourself

[slow spade]

melk has been nerfed constantly since release

[pastel yew]

eh fuck that, way too much effort

[hollow ibex]

don't even need melks

[pastel yew]

what else you spending them on tho? outside of weapon xp

[slow spade]

we literally never use them

its the ONLY thing melk bucks are good for

[pastel yew]

nice if you want to save.. 1 game of xp grind ig

but thats like

8 ? curio rolls

you could have instead

8+

[serene bough]

I can see an argument for it in higher difficulty havocs

but im not sure how useful it'll actually be

[hollow ibex]

the 3x slots are prob better used on corruption resist tbh

[serene bough]

VoC is basically mandatory and spamming more often is always more helpful

[pastel yew]

I mean if you're focussed primarily on melee, you're gonna get a lot less

all of the minor things on the curios are pretty meh

outside of the money one

[hollow ibex]

dealing with specialists is something everyone should be doing

[serene bough]

ive seen a few zealots build more heavily into book/corruption cleansing

[wraith locust]

Cdr is good on curios

[hollow ibex]

i'm regularly killing specialists with DB shotgun build

[serene bough]

from the few missions ive done

[hollow ibex]

because it's everyone's job

[pastel yew]

are you killing as many with your db as you are with a more focussed ranged weapon?

everyones job =/= everyone does the same amount

[hollow ibex]

fewer, but still a lot

a lot of specialists run up close

and you can still snipe specialists with DB anywya

so there really is no excuse

[pastel yew]

12% reduced cdr is still good

[clever hedge]

CDR is basically mandatory in havoc as golden shields and toughness regin become essential

[pastel yew]

it stacks on top of the cdr talent like

[wraith locust]

^^

[pastel yew]

having more is NEVER bad

[wraith locust]

Most of the other curio perks are bad anyway

[pastel yew]

just engage in the brainrot vet gameplay of press f on cooldown

[hollow ibex]

i think it's ok

gunner resist has become more important though

so those that ignored gunner resist are prob going to want to start taking it

[pastel yew]

the only ones I really care for are money > toughness > stam regen > health or cdr

gunner resist might be important with the new havoc condition

cant comment there

[orchid hemlock]

Must..... Not.... Mention......

HIS NAME 😡

[pastel yew]

but it absolutely is a dead pick on anything outside of havoc

[hollow ibex]

gunners got buffed generally

3x is prob still overkill in auric

[serene bough]

put it this way, ignoring tac awareness for a second, a 45 minute game w/ 12% CDR can get you 12 more casts of VoC

[wraith locust]

Yea gunner is good, I run gunner/cdr/toguhness

[hollow ibex]

but it's not bad either

[pastel yew]

I've not really noticed any increase from them in regular auric ngl

[serene bough]

and thats not including psykers w/ ability cd

[pastel yew]

45 is a long fucking game

most games are not going that long

[serene bough]

some of these higher level havocs are that long or longer

[pastel yew]

hmm

[serene bough]

based on what im seeing from others

[pastel yew]

yikes then

[faint beacon]

He got hard carried by dorn and got mad you can't be a generalist based class in havoc if that makes you happy

🚬

[serene bough]

who

[orchid hemlock]

Wait he did?

Why did Dorn help that fucker?

[faint beacon]

Dorn took any opportunity to play with him

LMAO

Cause last he played with him was like

a while ago

[orchid hemlock]

How big was the gap?

[serene bough]

but yeah just to further corroborate your point, 12% CDR w/ psyker CDR and tac awareness is simply going to keep better uptime for VoC during a game, which is mandatory due to golden THP

[faint beacon]

Him vs Tanner?

[serene bough]

it may be just a few seconds, but it's still great

[orchid hemlock]

Yes

[pastel yew]

seconds add up

[orchid hemlock]

Mister E I already know was carried to 40

[faint beacon]

I said hard carry cause he was crashing out from going down over small shit that becomes

[slow spade]

but then teammates won't die and I won't get my penance for revives

[faint beacon]

incredibly dangerous

[pastel yew]

man I love mister e

[faint beacon]

on Havoc 30+

[pastel yew]

I dont think hes like

that knowledgeable

but hes a nice dude

[orchid hemlock]

No he isn't, he's a grifter 💀

[pastel yew]

is he?

[orchid hemlock]

And he is friends with Tanner

[serene bough]

idk any youtubers besides tanner, and thats moreso bc of his infamy

[pastel yew]

I've interacted with hima few times in comments but thats it

he seemed chill

tanner is

volatile

I cant tell if its a bit

or of the hate he gets is unjust tho

he does seem to get dunked on constantly by the community

[faint beacon]

He crashed out over Spamming Plas into hordes on Havoc

and then eating shit for it

[serene bough]

he's getting better i guess, but i usually base my builds and opinions on the vet guide pinned here + my own experiences/preferences

[faint beacon]

🚬

[orchid hemlock]

Tanner is banned form this server for being too much of a gamer

[pastel yew]

is that a real fact/

[faint beacon]

Racist

[pastel yew]

what'd he do

[orchid hemlock]

Yes

[faint beacon]

🤫

[pastel yew]

O H

yikes

[orchid hemlock]

Have u seen his videos and posts?

[pastel yew]

no I dont like his voice

[slow spade]

Chocobo c:

[pastel yew]

I've just seen a few videos

[orchid hemlock]

He had this Chinese segment that was extremely racist

[pastel yew]

and the uhh

[orchid hemlock]

He even used the C slur

[pastel yew]

one he made about reginald

[faint beacon]

Oh joy

[pastel yew]

C * * T?

is that so bad

or

[faint beacon]

No

[pastel yew]

are we talkin the racist one

[faint beacon]

the one used towards Asians

[serene bough]

sounds like clink

but change a letter

[pastel yew]

ahhhh

wow I didnt realise he was such scum

I figured he was just

lol cow with temper issues

[faint beacon]

40k fans

[pastel yew]

truly

[faint beacon]

lmao

[serene bough]

true

[orchid hemlock]

I said Chinese

[pastel yew]

yeah I missed your message before the one I replied to ngl

[serene bough]

at any rate

[orchid hemlock]

He also acts like a 2 year old

[serene bough]

i hope I get to try havoc 30+ soon

[orchid hemlock]

And can't take criticism

[serene bough]

i really wanna experiment but i havent had the chance to go higher yet

[pastel yew]

reginald mentioned something in his video about cleave changes?

in regards to havoc

anyone know what was changed if anything

[serene bough]

enemies have higher hitmass/HP

[pastel yew]

I might just be misunderstanding

[serene bough]

so cleave is more difficult

[orchid hemlock]

And he lied about why he got banned, saying strawhat is a power hungry freak 💀

[pastel yew]

brutal momentum even better then?

[pastel yew]

lmao what

strawhat seems cool

[serene bough]

not necessarily, idk if weapons can still 1hko

[pastel yew]

hmm

[radiant chasm]

worse if your weapon can't oneshot

[pastel yew]

I Guess if they cant then bm is a lot worse

yee

[radiant chasm]

wrath and savage sweep become better

as well as sunder

[serene bough]

path.exe thinks rashad is dead

bc it can no longer 1hko the trash enemies

so bromentum no bueno

[radiant chasm]

yea i think it might be the return of antax

with headtaker decimator

[pastel yew]

even with headtaker?

[radiant chasm]

or something

[serene bough]

dunno, havent experimented enouhg yet

[pastel yew]

mmh

[serene bough]

reee

why must i work

[radiant chasm]

on vet you might only hit the bare bones basic chaff and even then, you could fall off in higher havocs

[faint beacon]

he thinks its still viable

[pastel yew]

I really hope they update the psykanium as

I dont wanna math out breakpoinst

[faint beacon]

he had a 180 realizing shooters and bruisers

[pastel yew]

I feel like visual indicator helps a lot

[faint beacon]

aren't effected by havoc HP increase

[serene bough]

oh really

[faint beacon]

so Rashad

[serene bough]

just elites/specialist?

[faint beacon]

MIGHT STILL BE ON THE MENU

no Poxers/Groaners

and Specials/Elites

[pastel yew]

rashad is too fuckin good anyway 🚬

[serene bough]

horde enemies and elites/specialists

i see

[pastel yew]

be good if the new mode knocks it down to reasonable standards

but like

surely all the alreadymid weapons

are now EXTRA mid

the breakpoints on the chain axe are already so tight

I dont think you're gonna be able to one tap with even a full heavy

and that'd be REAL bad for how slow it is

maybe with stam... heavy+thrust into push attack on the mk12

[orchid hemlock]

Strawhat is just the CM

They didn't even ban Tanner, they just talked to him saying that they will unban him if he starts to reform and take accountability for what he did.

Instead Tanner made a public post about about Strawhat, lying thru his teeth about and banning mods in his own discord 💀

[pastel yew]

straw hat seems to actually engage with the community though

which is nice

even if most of what is said to them amounts to literally nothing

things got a lot less toxic with them around

especially on reddit which is already a cesspool

[faint beacon]

So what I got from this is

He's a Lolcow with an extremely high ego

literally just burnt a bridge

LMAO

[pastel yew]

narcisist by the sounds

[orchid hemlock]

Yeah

[pastel yew]

lol cows are always such a sad situation as their audience just ends up egging them on for amusement

[faint beacon]

Devils Advocate

its really funny watching it when they know better

[orchid hemlock]

I don't like using the term "lol cow"

Because kiwifarms is arguable worse in many situations than the content creators they feed on

[crude wind]

he seems quite mentally ill

I hope he gets help

[pastel yew]

kiwi farms is cancer

[crude wind]

saw those posts, they are extremely unpleasant to Strawhat

[pastel yew]

I think lolcow as a term though is

very descriptive

theres not really another word to describe that type of person so succinctly ig

[orchid hemlock]

BTW this is all public information

http://youtube.com/post/Ugkx_xTfkQ0YzjnfPEsC9EQNAPzniQQOXykU?si=n0OWqSrk3uM_AUOG

[pastel yew]

for every voice saying get help there will be 4 more encouraging it

[faint beacon]

comments jerking him off per usual

genuine lolcow shit lmao

[atomic zephyr]

lol who tf

[orchid hemlock]

The good news is, his community isn't nearly as large as he thinks it is and has basically made 0 influence onto this discord

[pastel yew]

I mean given how negatively people reacted to him I cant imagine any of his fans would actually comment

better he's just banned though

harassment aint gonna be good for anyone

[orchid hemlock]

If u scroll up u can also see him go into a tantrum

[pastel yew]

what about uhh

ryken XIV

he's cool right?

we dont got many content creators for darktide

least not ones that focus on build/balance etc

[orchid hemlock]

http://youtube.com/post/UgkxEFGXMAt-hA420b-H-CJJy6m_6epsekS6?si=2NSyfH7cimaOqyBV

He is literally lying

[slow spade]

ChocoB is my favorite darktide creator

[orchid hemlock]

You know why I know he's lying?

Because he doesn't post any screenshot of the convo 💀

[pastel yew]

okay this is off topic but that fucking comment

"sounds like a woman to me" BRROOOOTHER WHYY

[slow spade]

off-topic? here? in vet-chat? impossible

[pastel yew]

yeah he's the best for sure, just more gameplay oriented

[balmy flume]

...I have never heard of those people before lol

[orchid hemlock]

https://youtu.be/B8kvzfPDang?si=pRj16oXA6nS_4cr8

[slow spade]

"if it makes my dick hard its a woman" has changed my mindset on 40k

[pastel yew]

tbf this is... starting to change... a little..

[orchid hemlock]

I hope so

[pastel yew]

boltgun canonically a woman in my eyes

🚬

either way maybe its good

[slow spade]

good

[orchid hemlock]

I'm tired of toxic narasasists dominating competitions in video games

[pastel yew]

all the sexist racist shit can stay in his chat

quarantined from the rest of the community

[pastel yew]

I mean it's just what happens when you're good at something

you think you're better than others

which means you stop accepting criticism

and when that happens you just spiral in your own little ego bubble

I Dont think that will change

[crude wind]

not entirely true. it can go two ways

[slow spade]

I mean its not hard to develop that when you play with the average PUG

[pastel yew]

yeah I mean not everyone that is good is a narcissist

[orchid hemlock]

TRUUU

[slow spade]

personally I felt it was inevitable

[crude wind]

if you embrace humility, when you're good at something you can do the most generous thing of all, help others with the knowledge

but our society is based around invidualism and ego

[slow spade]

na they should suffer like I did

[crude wind]

so sadly many do not go that route

[pastel yew]

I mean as a content creator you're also sorta... incentivised... to put yourself on a pedastal

why would people listen to you if they think you're just another guy

[slow spade]

today, my coworkers ate my butter cookies. VENGENANCE

[pastel yew]

death, kill them

[crude wind]

i think its important to know your facts and present opinions

[orchid hemlock]

I can understand being mad at someone via skill

But being mad as someone and dodging because they are a woman? 💀

[grand perch]

they saved you from those dastardly calories

[crude wind]

but acknowledge they are opinions and not gospel

[slow spade]

but tasty D:

[crude wind]

this is a PvE game atm the end of the day, there is no reason to meta slave this game

[pastel yew]

nah I mean... if you wanna be a good person or have integrity yes. but winning an argument is never about being right, its about being convincing

[crude wind]

play what you enjoy, have fun, win

[slow spade]

tbh I'm curious what would happen if a gamedev started a "build guide" channel lol

[orchid hemlock]

Idk if u can anymore with Havoc 😔

[vernal sundial]

the fun comes from optimizing builds for a lot of ppl

[pastel yew]

tell that to the 3 ds in every game i play

;-;

[orchid hemlock]

[slow spade]

to be fair, the dodge and mobility of DS is just fun

[pastel yew]

I cant criticise because I abused the fuck out of this weapon when I was playing psyker but, it's so tiring seeing it in every ame

game

[slow spade]

"i'm wrong? hotfix tomorrow"

[crude wind]

best way to convince someone is to bring them over to your point of view. That's not done by shouting at someone and telling them they're wrong

[crude wind]

and fair enough to those people!

just let people play how they want

[pastel yew]

I mean that's what convincing someone means, but doing that doesnt mean you're correct

you see it all the time, people completely in the wrong will win popular opinion by being convincing

even if what they say is very clearly incorrect, it doesnt matter

[orchid hemlock]

We don't need another gameslantern 😔

[pastel yew]

whats wrong with gameslantern/

[crude wind]

well it does matter otherwise you wouldn't be saying they're very clearly incorrect 🙂

[orchid hemlock]

Gameslantern is ass tho because it's filter system is fucked

[crude wind]

if you can see it, then others can too

[slow spade]

people make shit builds

[crude wind]

those people are just loud and the desperate flock to them

[slow spade]

and then it gets spread around

[pastel yew]

if 90% of people believe something false and convincing, you're not gonna get much done

[last peak]

Hello, I'm a ps newbie. Are there any weapons considered outright bad that i should avoid? I've been liking the chain axe, bolter, and infantry lasgun

[orchid hemlock]

Its not that gameslantern as a whole is bad, the problem is that the filter system benefits people who out up builds back 2 years ago over what is actually good

[pastel yew]

shredder auto pistol

[charred dome]

avoid duelling sword

[crude wind]

it's never that high though. You will always have those people

[slow spade]

melee weapons are basically fine

Don't use the Shredder autopistol lmao

[grand perch]

gameslantern mentioned
OH BOY IS IT TIME FOR [SQUAD LEADER BUILD] AGAIN???

[last peak]

Good to know lol

[charred dome]

I need the lore on this one

[slow spade]

the only weapon that's genuinely bad is Shredder Autopistol imo

[crude wind]

agre

[grand perch]

top upvoted vet build on games lantern is squad leader and its bad

[orchid hemlock]

Squad leader build coming up 👨🏻‍🏫

[crude wind]

DID SOMEONE SAY SQUAD LEADER

[pastel yew]

I think the worst melee weapon I've used in that they've struggled at certain things, is the chain axe and even that is really good

[grand perch]

but it comes up a lot in this chat by people who cant know better

[pastel yew]

maybe the shovels are? a bit rough

[crude wind]

I AM READY TO LEAD THE SQUAD

[orchid hemlock]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9a565016-bd70-4fe0-8c82-1080bc73412e/veteran-squad-leader

[pastel yew]

I know they have good crowd control but like, most weapons do

[crude wind]

the og shovel is hilariously very safe and good

[grand perch]

my eyessss there it is

[slow spade]

yeah it doesn't help that the "squad leader" builds don't really take the best "team" points

[pastel yew]

googles "veteran squad leader build" >> sits at the back the entire time

[crude wind]

og being original gangster and not ogryn

[pastel yew]

average vet experience

[crude wind]

just to clarify

[vernal sundial]

"squad leader"

no field improv

[pastel yew]

original ogryn..

[crude wind]

oo

[slow spade]

doesn't even have Born Leader lol

[vernal sundial]

or born leader yea lmao

[pastel yew]

the one with the thrust? I thought was fun

[slow spade]

"squad leader" -> doesn't have born leader

come on man its in the name

[hollow ibex]

squad leader
doesn't take born leader.

one job bro

[orchid hemlock]

The real question is

[crude wind]

the vet shovels all have thrust iirc

[pastel yew]

but honestly they're all in the sorta ehhh category for me. not visually interesting, not really iconic, not really good enough to be fun

[stray storm]

Me furiously wiping all my builds bcz I’ve relied on gameslantern

[orchid hemlock]

Why do they take 3 toughness regen curio perks

But not born leader

[pastel yew]

they do?

on h1?

[orchid hemlock]

💀

[pastel yew]

or maybe it wasnt h1

[crude wind]

you mean the blessing thrust?

[hollow ibex]

i can get meme builds for thematic reasons

[pastel yew]

nah not the lessing

[hollow ibex]

but this isn't even a good thematic build

[crude wind]

you mean the pick axe move

[pastel yew]

I'm remembering a specific shovel with that good thrust but its been ages since I've looked at em

[vernal sundial]

thoughts and opinions on deadshot w/recon lasgun? wanna try out the gun and heard its a fun way to play it

[pastel yew]

nah the flip is different

I'm probably just misremembering

[crude wind]

ohhh

you mean the poke move

?

[pastel yew]

based.

[grand perch]

attaboy. though obviously not all are bad

[crude wind]

thats the og shovel, yeah. That one is good

[pastel yew]

I mean it is a fun way to play it

its unsafe though

[slow spade]

if you have Deadshot, you want a lot of stam curios and Duck and Cover lol

[pastel yew]

because you'll be running stam curios

probably more than one...

though you can just keep deadshot as a slight damage boost and not

the good thing about the recon is it's hipfire is goated

so you dont have to activate deadshot to use it well

[orchid hemlock]

Oh shit yall seen the regi recon buil? 💀

[pastel yew]

no?

I pray for 3 stam curios

[slow spade]

I don't look at builds tbh lol

[pastel yew]

I think they're worth looking at if you're new

[slow spade]

though I think the only "controversial" thing I take is the +50% coherency aura

[pastel yew]

because even if one is wrong you sorta put together a larger idea of the games balance

[slow spade]

because I like team buffs c:

[pastel yew]

I watch them on occasion even though I''m not gonna use the weapons, while I eat n stuff

I have no idea how big the aura is anyway tbh

it seems reasonably large

[slow spade]

8m

Charismatic makes it 12m

[pastel yew]

say an ally is 10m away

they get your coherency

but do you get theirs?

[slow spade]

yes

[pastel yew]

hmm hmm

[crude wind]

that actually affects Shout radius

so can be very good

[pastel yew]

oh thats cool

[slow spade]

the main reason why I take it is so I can be more certain I cover them with VOC

[orchid hemlock]

behold: https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9d799ecb-e636-48b3-b088-df38d767c119/recon-lasgun-jeficus

[slow spade]

on top of Focus Target buffs

[pastel yew]

it just has real strong competition

[slow spade]

so more stam/toughness/damage for everyone

[pastel yew]

SO FUCKING COOOOL

YEES

I was hoping itd be 3x stam curios

[grand perch]

i never thought about that but i still think its a wasted point when CK is right there

[pastel yew]

god I disagree with like

[orchid hemlock]

Jef thinks this is a meta build btw 💀

[slow spade]

what the fuck

[pastel yew]

literally every decision in this build outside of the stam curios though

this has to be troll

[crude wind]

yah you always take CK, but that other node is not a bad option if you're running shout

[slow spade]

made like every mistake possible

[pastel yew]

also I'm gonna throw out the controversial take now but onslaught is fucking garbage

and a complete waste of ammo

[slow spade]

Rending Strikes exists and that's all I need

[hollow ibex]

tbf he took iron will

so good on him lol

[pastel yew]

I dont even think rending strikes is all that good in most builds....

[slow spade]

true lol, I've seen people not take it

[orchid hemlock]

On recon it is required

[slow spade]

its not like you can go wrong with more damage

[pastel yew]

why are you

shooting carapace with your recon

[orchid hemlock]

Recon has horrible armor Modifyers

[slow spade]

because fuck them

[pastel yew]

you have

kraks and melee and stuff

[slow spade]

have you seen Recon's Maniac ADM?

[pastel yew]

vet is the least starved for fuckyoucarapace options of any class

[slow spade]

its dogshit

[pastel yew]

I think my recon has +maniac on it

[orchid hemlock]

I'm thinking about switching my crit rate to maniac tbh 🤔

[slow spade]

doesn't change it has shit ADM vs maniac

[urban axle]

guys i need help, is bolt pistol better than spearhead boltgun?

[pastel yew]

its not so so bad

[orchid hemlock]

Bolt pistol is more comparable to the revolver

And yes the revolver is better

[slow spade]

no, Bolter has bigger mag, full auto, and access to Pinning Fire

[pastel yew]

bolt pistol is the better marksman weapon

boltgun is the better generalist weapon

[urban axle]

ah ok

and duelist sword also the best melee?

or should i change it for something else

[pastel yew]

yeah probably

I mean depends

[slow spade]

its not the best but its up there

[pastel yew]

with no melee talents the mk6 is really good

[slow spade]

it won't fail you

[charred dome]

Is it just me or are some dh spawns impossible to sneak past lol

[urban axle]

mk6?

[pastel yew]

mk6 powersword

[slow spade]

there are some REALLY annoying spawns

but all of them can be sneaked past

[pastel yew]

its really good because it doesnt need melee skills to be good

[charred dome]

just had one on hab draeko where it blocked the large area before the final elevator

[urban axle]

does it look cool?

[slow spade]

able to be sneaked past but its like really annoying

[pastel yew]

just if you go bolt pistol be sure to take deadly accurate or whatever its called

[charred dome]

I hugged the wall and still set it off lol

perfect run besides that happening

[pastel yew]

deadly accurate is goated on the bp, it lets you one shot most things which is huge

[urban axle]

because duelist sword looks kind of cool on my character

[pastel yew]

my usual set up is deadly accurate + surgical + deadshot from skill tree and then a stam curio

[slow spade]

I tihkn mk6 looks cool

[slow spade]

ah it was triggered

[urban axle]

ooo

[slow spade]

triggered DH has bigger radius :c

[pastel yew]

dh keeps getting angry when I shine my flashlight in its eyes...

I just wanna see their face

[orchid hemlock]

Rashad

[pastel yew]

rashad is better generalist

but duelist sword is waaaay better for elite stuff

like no competition

dueling sword is the min max

[orchid hemlock]

nah rashad can oneshot most elites with the lights

[slow spade]

there's a mod to give Psword the boss sword effects

[urban axle]

what about the heavy sword

[slow spade]

pretty neat

[orchid hemlock]

the only thing DS is better at is crushers

and u need to invets more for Rashad

[pastel yew]

can the rashad one shot most elites???????? on a light

the most common ones are the gunners and I dont think it one shots those

[orchid hemlock]

yes if u have max HT stacks

u can even oneshot thru a horde sometimes

[pastel yew]

hm

still dueling sword better defence + raw elite clear

[slow spade]

rashad is the best melee option but it needs investment

DS is the safest imo

[pastel yew]

yeah you need all the melee skills

[slow spade]

Psword is the cheapest

[pastel yew]

its breakpoints are tight

[heavy rover]

Yeah, Rashad needs the perfect roll. If you do get it, it's so worth it

[pastel yew]

honestly all of these weapons need some adjustment but

its never gonna happen

the darktide balance team is smokin

[slow spade]

they could brick the balance in an instant for funnies

[orchid hemlock]

Rashad also can stun ragers

DS can only stun one

[slow spade]

"Removed Brutal Momentum"

[pastel yew]

you dont need to stagger them really with the ds tho

because your defence is so cracked

and the range poke

[orchid hemlock]

when u have 20 ragers on u, u will wish u had a PS or Rashad 😔

[pastel yew]

I mean I've used the weapon loads on psyker

probably like 90%+ of my total psyker playtime

and not once have I thought that

and the weapons better on other classes

not by much

its too good defensively

[orchid hemlock]

for this havoc modifiers im wondering if brittle counters the blessed armor? 🤔

[pastel yew]

if only you could test this in the psyk

maybe a mod will add it

creature spawner mod might update to account for stuff like that so you can test

[pearl mango]

whats the perfect Rashad stats ?

[orchid hemlock]

just dump mobility

perks, the big one is cara but the second is either unarmored or elite

blessings is almost always HT and BM

[pearl mango]

thaanks

[tall torrent]

No

When u have 20 ragers on you you’re better off with duelling sword & knife

Just to outrun them

[orchid hemlock]

impossible

nah i fight

[tall torrent]

U talking havoc? Or

[charred dome]

wait rashad isn't flak cara?

[tall torrent]

Because Rashad in havoc is like 5 hits to kill a single Dreg rager

[orchid hemlock]

flak on vet i dont think makes any breakpoints

[umbral scaffold]

Hi i just started the game and i am wondering. Is voice of command+krak+Plasma and power sword a good way to go for veteran class?

[tall torrent]

Very basic but strong yes

[orchid hemlock]

but havoc stats are too crazy i dont think it matters anymore

[tall torrent]

Wouldn’t call it a “good way to go”

[charred dome]

so maniac or elite

[tall torrent]

Nah

Unarmored/elite

[charred dome]

elite cara then

laspistol is unyielding maniac lol

[tall torrent]

Nah

Unarmored changes a couple breakpoints for Rashad (easier to access) and functionally is the same breakpoints as elite

Laspistol maniac + elite/crit chance prob

[charred dome]

I'd run crit chance but I have enough of that I think so I'll go elite on the las

then there's the question of shred or headtaker

since shred seems to carry over when I swap to laspistol

[tall torrent]

Doesn’t

[charred dome]

Weird the buff stays down there but it doesn't actually apply?

[tall torrent]

It’s “melee weapon’s crit chance”

[charred dome]

It just says bonus crit chance for me

[tall torrent]

Yea, tooltip is super misleading lol

[charred dome]

Too lazy to get the mods that unfuck the item descriptions lol

[tall torrent]

Pretty much every single talent & blessing tooltip is at least partially wrong

[charred dome]

I still don't know if I want headtaker ffs

[tall torrent]

That mod is not accurate either

[charred dome]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1207699631958659082/1228082580130238574/RDT_20240328_0624042440260500575334817.gif

[tall torrent]

If u play combat axe it’s just
Carapace + unarmored/elite
Brutal momentum
Headtaker

[pastel yew]

eh I think maniac can be swapped out for unarmored

[tawny badger]

atp just let your soul guide how you play
fuck descriptions, fuck builds

[charred dome]

your name alone is what's making me say no to that

[pastel yew]

the breakpoint unarmored gives is adjusted by like.... any stacks of head taker

its nice

but its not must have ultra necessary

[tawny badger]

😇

[tall torrent]

Without unarmored/elite you lose Dreg gunner 2HS

[pastel yew]

with headtaker?

[tall torrent]

And maniac doesn’t change breakpoints much

Yea

[pastel yew]

maniac is just nice damage against annoying enemies

idk I've tried both and

both feel almost identical

[tall torrent]

It doesn’t give u mutant 1 tap

[umbral scaffold]

What's a good way to go then? I don't understand the strenght and weakness of all of the guns yet. I just think shouting, plasma and a power sword are cool 😂

[pastel yew]

rashad is a borin weapon anyway

[tall torrent]

It doesn’t give u Dreg rager 2 tap

[charred dome]

elite covers both ragers and stooped gunners tho

[tall torrent]

How new are u exactly

[pastel yew]

very new if they call out continous S tier things asking if they're okay

I'd imagine no community interaction and sub level 30

[tall torrent]

Maniac on Rashad only really matters in havoc

[umbral scaffold]

I just started today morning. I just wanna play at higher diffs that are more intense

I am lvl 13 😂

[pastel yew]

take +10% xp on all your curios

on every curio slot

its one of the sub buffs

so you have your main benefit from the curio, then the three little ones. thats where the xp is

[tall torrent]

Learn melee first

[umbral scaffold]

You mean there's more to just wild swinging?

[pastel yew]

a little more yeah

depends on the weapon

[tall torrent]

A lot more yea

[pastel yew]

I dont really subscribe to the notion its really complex though

[umbral scaffold]

I like the power sword but i don't know what the strenghts and weaknesses of the weapons are

[pastel yew]

most of the complexity is in the build side of things rather than the player mechanics

[umbral scaffold]

I use melee to fight hordes and my gun to kill specialists and bigger targets

[terse idol]

It.... caaannn be if you're going for vermintide application *sweat
Not that I know if some of the things you can use in vermin are applicable in danktide

[pastel yew]

its just a good all rounder, the mk6 doesnt really need melee talents to be good which is its primary strength. it has a good push attack combo that deals with bosses and armor

[pastel yew]

didnt really get all that into vermintide so I cant much compare the two tbh

[tall torrent]

Strengths

• takes almost no talent investment to be good
• can actually fight everything

Weaknesses

• seriously bad dodges
• may crack under heavy melee pressure

[pastel yew]

but a lot of weapons in darktide are literally.. spam light or spam heavy

some weapons have more interesting optimal horde clear

some weapons have useful push attacks

some weapons have none of that

I feel the biggest player hurdle is dodging more than anything

[umbral scaffold]

That's for the power weapon yeah?

[pastel yew]

yeah it is

[tall torrent]

Power sword specifically

[terse idol]

Well

[pastel yew]

are the power sword dodges that bad?

[terse idol]

Past that I'd say for someone like me too

Its not over dodging

And relying on block for chaff

[pastel yew]

block is

int

never block

or.. almost never block

[terse idol]

Look its more complex

[tall torrent]

Nah

[umbral scaffold]

That's something i noticed That's rough and why i wanna build around ranged and controlling my area more. I loaded into the mission where you boss fight the twins and they kept doing nasty things to me in melee

[pastel yew]

there's basically never a reason to block in this game

[terse idol]

You dodge too much

You over dodg

And now you have no dodge when it's important

[tall torrent]

Blocking a hit is better than taking a hit if you’re not at 0 stamina

[pastel yew]

you only overdodge if you run out of dodges then get hit

[terse idol]

You have to block more

[pastel yew]

yeah 100%

but they're not a trade off

[terse idol]

I mean

[pastel yew]

you can block AND dodge

you should never just block

[terse idol]

You can just over-dodge and run out of doges

[pastel yew]

outside of some very specific circumstances

[terse idol]

Doge

[pastel yew]

the risk to reward on block is just not good

[terse idol]

I mean

Yes it's a balanc

[pastel yew]

if you get hit out of stamina you're fucked

yeah its a balance of only dodging because dodging is broken and has no cost

lmao

[terse idol]

But if you run out of dodges and get forced to block you're extra fucked

You can literally over dodge for things you don't need to dodge

[pastel yew]

I mean this is gonna depend on the class

[terse idol]

Like that single pox walkers

You can bloc/parry those

[pastel yew]

some weapons have pretty bad dodges but even then they're not the worst

[umbral scaffold]

I also noticed that i often ran out of ammo with the recon lasgun. The one i had the most sucess with so far has been the autogun

[terse idol]

You need shocktrooper

[pastel yew]

theres a skill further in the tree you dont have yet

[terse idol]

Which you don't get yet if you're only level 13

[tall torrent]

You need to learn melee

[pastel yew]

which makes critical hits not consume ammo

[young bison]

The rule of thumb I was taught was swing-swing-dodge-repeat.

[pastel yew]

also yeah

theres a reason your melee weapon is your primary weapon

[young bison]

You don't outpace your dodge regen

[terse idol]

True but also

Now is the time to learn to block

And parry

[pastel yew]

but why would you block most of the time

even at best

its just wasting stamina

[terse idol]

To save a dodge

[pastel yew]

dodging is free

[terse idol]

It won't kill your stamina

[terse idol]

Well

[pastel yew]

but you dont need to save dodges? they come back instantly

[terse idol]

"Free"

[pastel yew]

at most you shove once

[terse idol]

You used a dodge counter

[umbral scaffold]

The tree seems interesting. I am going down the middle line and not really looking at the rest. I wanna see where it ends up

[terse idol]

Imo you gotta balance all of it

[pastel yew]

yeah I mean take some time to experiment a little

dont poison your mind with vet chat stuff yet

[terse idol]

Dodges are so useful that when you can't dodge anymore that's when you're in trouble

[pastel yew]

stuff in here is going to be the 100% optimal

and you dont need that to enjoy the game

variety is good

[young bison]

A lot abilities proc on dodges as well, so players are incentivised to use dodges to get the most out of their builds; only a few seem to rely on active blocks.

[pastel yew]

variety will keep you engaged so you can improve your skill level which is the primary way to get stronger

[pastel yew]

yeah I mean exactly

[tall torrent]

The block ones are usually not good

[terse idol]

well and challenge yourself by playing harder difficulties

[pastel yew]

dodging is not only defensively stronger, less of a cost, its also just better

[tall torrent]

The only good one got nerfed

[terse idol]

I meeannn

[umbral scaffold]

Yeah I'll experiment now. I just naturally enjoy optimization and higher diffs

[terse idol]

Its a cost