veteran-class

[analog yacht]

this is solid for a signifcant chunk of builds. last 4 points depend on your weapon

[primal dune]

It's important to have a way of dealing with crushers packs, you can get away with mid horde clear

[analog yacht]

some weapons need focus target to hit good breakpoints though

also yeah if you can't deal with crusher packs or do boss damage you're not doing a lot when shit hits the fan

[mortal kite]

how does one deal with Crushers/boss

[analog yacht]

have good weapons tbh

[mortal kite]

weapon dependent or genades

[analog yacht]

having a good super armor melee weapon typically

some ranged weapons can be build to deal w/ them too

[primal dune]

For crushers you could run knife/dueling sword/chainaxe/combat axe/power sword/

[drowsy aspen]

Thiiiis is kinda real. Uncanny Shovel + Bistol does well enough on Crushers, but sometimes it feels like I'm ticking bosses with a feather

Still, the specialist/elite killing makes it all worth it

[primal dune]

You can get away with bad boss damage if you're running infiltrate and are good at living

[mortal kite]

I'm a fan or revolver type ranged weapons so what's a good melee to pair with it

[analog yacht]

I've been running dueling sword 4 on my auric damnation runs w/ zarona

horde clear is a bit slow but w/ agile you can just perma kite them

ranged trash packs are a little tough but vet has so much toughness generation that it's pretty fine

[primal dune]

Yeah DS mk4 is overpowered as hell

[mortal kite]

what blessings/perks do u use ?

[analog yacht]

idk ds is good but other stuff goes hard too

[primal dune]

Yeah but DS is easy to use, it's very safe and doesn't really need any melee perks

[analog yacht]

on the zarona surgical and hand-cannon. on the ds agile and riposte

you can swap agile for precog if you're good at the game and don't need infinite dodges

i still run agile bc i like the comfort

you can also put uncanny strikes on it bc 100% rending

silly blessing tbh

i run these 4 talents w/ ds + zarona but arguments can be made for other stuff

I like having the extra ammo w/ revolver

but if you're not giga special/elite sniping you don't need it

superiority complex is only worth it if you take the ammo

always prepared is like, mandatory w/ revolver

[slow spade]

Not getting the other +25 toughness node :c

[analog yacht]

on your toes is the most flexible but it gives you so much toughness sustain vs. ranged spam

[mortal kite]

if you use plasma gun instead of revolver can you go without always prep

[wet ether]

Honestly I’m curious about what people think of my final build

[analog yacht]

plasma is a slower weapon overall

w/ weapon spec you can bank a guaranteed crit after 2-3 kills

whip out revolver for 500ms to blast something

[slow spade]

Its also got a refire delay which is a pain

[mortal kite]

what about bolt pistol?

[analog yacht]

i don't like it personally

[wet ether]

This final build of mine what y’all think

[analog yacht]

revolver hits so many absurd breakpoints w/ this build

[wet ether]

It’s a frontline/support hybrid

[analog yacht]

as long as you can headshot i think zarona is better

just a minor thing but combat ability cdr has reciprocal scaling so you kinda wanna go all or nothing imo. it is only 12% tho

[winter grove]

Which is why you should get DBS

[analog yacht]

more sigificantly wounds are a bad thing to spend curious on

like aside from the fact that on higher difficulties you often just don't get rezzed anyway, more hp/toughness means going down less

[winter grove]

Also

[analog yacht]

stamina isn't worth it unless you're doing a stamina heavy build. 17%hp/toughness is a lot

[winter grove]

Health stims just become better

[analog yacht]

that too

popping a stim to regen 50% hp in the middle of a boss fight is big

[winter grove]

Stam, toughmess and hp is a no brainer curios pick

Like if you're unsure what to do

Do those

[analog yacht]

path.exe's vet guide in pins has a bunch of hp value breakpoints that you want to hit

gist is that you want 200 hp

then main curios go to toughness

the perks on them can go a bunch of places but you also want a sniper res

which bumps sniper damage under 100

so you can survive a sniper shot twice or once at 1 wound

200 hp is also for pox bursters

[wet ether]

When I equip that stamina curio pretty sure my stamina goes up to 10 bars

[analog yacht]

are you using 10 bars

[wet ether]

Of stamina yes when picking someone up

[analog yacht]

idk i mean your build is fine, it just has a lot of stuff informed by trying to be a 'support' which isn't a real thing in darktide

if things aren't that bad your teammate can wait 10 seconds for trash to be cleared for the rez. If there's a crusher pack or a boss then 10 bars of stamina doesn't make a difference

it's usually better to kill the things killing your allies than trying to revive them after the fact

and like, you have 90% of the talents for that

but when a crusher pack gets pulled during a boss or something is when that last 10% matters

[primal dune]

Best defense is a good offense

[wet ether]

if only you knew my play style

My melee will clear a path through Trash mobs

To get to my teammates

Also don’t bother telling me how to play my build I asked what y’all thought didn’t ask for an explanation

Also if you think support isn’t real in darktide then you got another thing coming bucko

Want me to name a few support talents

[analog yacht]

I'll admit that you came in here like "look at this build i've been having fun with what do y'all think" and not "i want an in depth critique of my build" so my bad there

[fossil basalt]

I think losing the +30 damage from infil for field improv is a harsh pick, but otherwise it's pretty good

[wet ether]

Leave no one behind, psykinetic’s aura, shield of contempt and soften them up

Are just a few support based talents

That I can name

[vivid silo]

You can definitely play a more supportive role. Now, some people are likely going to come and say "ackshually killing enemies is better", but don't mind them

[wet ether]

As I said earlier my build is a hybrid of frontline and support

[vivid silo]

Aye it makes sense, not many builds are 100% a single thing

[wet ether]

If I need to switch gears I can quite easily be a shooter as well if need be

[tame lodge]

I wouldn't use Psy's Aura as an example
Since it requires killing elites and specialist

Which uh

Encourages support by killing

Yeah

[wet ether]

Flanking getting aggressive

[wet ether]

It was just an example it was

Low profile can be used as a offensive tool or defensive in this case flanking

[primal dune]

I like to run infiltrate without the -threat note since you can turn eyes in your direction and your teammates get free reign

[wet ether]

That’s you those I take low profile for either objectives, revives, getting a flank on a high priority target or just using it to aggro dump to get the enemies off me while I get free reign to kill them

Low profile on its own is far more flexible than people give it credit for

[slow spade]

100% heretic killing builds 💪

[wet ether]

Ahhh now that’s where my chain sword comes into play

That’s the frontline weapon right there that I use with savage sweep and rampage being the blessings

While I could use the power sword instead I find it lacks the dodges required

So when I use my weapon spec for my chain sword

That when the front line part truly shows

Allot of time was also spent arguing/debating with fellow veterans what I should use for this build

[fossil basalt]

Infil having both toughness regen and aoe suppression on stealth break means it is very very flexible in its own right

[wet ether]

Yep throw in low profile and well the flexibility just becomes more noticeable

Hell even went to the ogryn chat about this build got some pointers there from them

Respect those big fellas I do

[fossil basalt]

Wish I saw infil more, it's a better VoC without the brainless

[primal dune]

It's good but i wouldn't say it's better

[winter grove]

Infil is a better shroud

[wet ether]

Let me stop you there

Shroud is more damage orientated

[primal dune]

Shroud let's you 2 shot bosses, it's also in a better spot on the tree compared to vet

[winter grove]

Better spot??

Brother zealots pick loner for shroud

That alone makes me hate every stealth zealot

[winter grove]

Plus you two shot on a boss killer build

[wet ether]

Please tell me this ain’t true spoke

[winter grove]

Which leaves you at being worse at everything else

[primal dune]

Well some people are silly

[winter grove]

Exactly

You get 6 seconds at best to delete one guy

Which is what chastise also does

Except it has two charges

Also zealot really wants cool keystone bonuses

And keystone that stealth zealots pick ain't exactly good

[primal dune]

Not nearly as good though

[winter grove]

Introducing

Zealot crit builds

That spam chastise

Every fucking 5 seconds

[ocean idol]

What are your favorite weapon combos for weapon specialist and agile engagement build?

[slow spade]

Double barrel

instant reload on flip + funny crit + funny damage

its not optimal but it certainly works

[winter grove]

I liked DBS and rashad

Sucks to not kill anything farther than 5 meters

[slow spade]

the guaranteed pellets + crit usually kills anything that far out

[thick kestrel]

chainsword + Vraks mk5 autogun is my go to "tryhard" loadout.

for giggles I'm currently running the double barrel shotgun as I work on mastering it and tend to switch melee depending on need... combat axe tends to be "ol reliable" but chanisword, dueling sword and devilsword all make appearances.

[slow spade]

takes me 1 shot to kill snipers

[tame lodge]

OI @tall torrent
If I had 50% extra finesse damage
Would the weakspot be around 600 or something?

[heady garnet]

hey, do I get it right, that for power sword cleave targets is a dumb stat cuz you use brutal momentum which ignores cleave mass?

[pseudo fiber]

More the powered mode covers cleave for you

[sleek garden]

Typical lasgun game

So good

[serene bough]

does salvo w/ exe stance 1hko scab gunners

[nimble canyon]

one of the goofiest games ive ever had as a veteran wtf. look at the mike's stats. 999 damage taken

dude was chill as hell tho

[tall torrent]

Generally you’re not going to take every single TDR node on the tree
Exhilarating takedown needs Longshot which is just not good rn
10% TDR needs superiority complex/marksman pathing which most weapons don’t need

[ocean idol]

i tried double barrel, not that good tbh

[ocean idol]

what second blessing btw?

[hidden linden]

Hey, what do you guys prefer to pair with a Boltgun/Plasma Gun? I'm guessing a lot of people like Rashad, but I'm not sure I like the feel of it

[terse idol]

Hacker is very good with manstopper

And weapon spec

Or at least okaay

[ocean idol]

hacker? What?

[terse idol]

Hacker double barrel shotgun

That's ze name

[ocean idol]

What is hacker?

[terse idol]

The double barrel shotgun

[ocean idol]

yes, it is ok, no more than that

I tried making 1 melee kill-bunchg of kills with shotgun

swtiching between the two

is ont that impressive as it should be

[slow spade]

it isn't, its mostly just for funsies

Agile Engagement + Weapon Specialist buffs it to the point it decimates ragers

very funny to see your name instantly fill the kill feed

[crude ice]

I just really want the veteran to get the Hellgun

[slow spade]

that would mean adding an interesting weapon

impossible sadly

[crude ice]

I know, but In my dreams I can be using the Hellgun

[grand perch]

quite proud of that shot

[ocean idol]

what second blessing for it?

Death spitter?

[ocean idol]

is not recon pretty much that?

[crude ice]

not really

[tall torrent]

Hell gun would innately be able to deal good damage to carapace Armor because it fires hotshot

[crude ice]

indeed

I also want Kasrkin cosmetics

with the full helmet

[slow spade]

I put Manstopper + Deathspitter for weapon specialist

[broken reef]

"Good shooting veteran!"

[ocean idol]

Which infantry lasgun the best?

It fell of the grace so far

i used to like sniping with it

now it feels ass

better take bolter

[slow spade]

idk the name anymore but MG La was my go to

[hollow ibex]

prob MG II rn

least breakpoint dependent

[serene bough]

IIb and VII w/ exe are good picks

IIb doesnt necessarily need exe

[sturdy karma]

Gaaaawd the armourbane penance is a grind

It’s the final vet penance Iv got to do

[tame lodge]

My honest scab only modifier reaction

[sturdy karma]

Bulwarks count towards it yeah?

Iv been krak’ing those fat boys up non stop

[fast sundial]

scab ragers count

[tall torrent]

Throw krak at bruisers & scab shooters

[fast sundial]

scab bruisers too

[tall torrent]

As long as they’re flak core, it counts

[fast sundial]

we out here wasting valuable explosives on completely overkilling trash mobs

great penance design

[slow spade]

you act like we wouldn't try to bring the leman russ demolisher if we could

[serene bough]

armourbane is truly the worst penance

at least you can cheese the MF penance by being a crab

[sturdy karma]

Yeah it seems the most grindy, rest of them were a breeze you get them just passively playing

[left patrol]

Managed to get it during the 21st event

Thank god

[serene bough]

i just got it naturally without thinking

but it was so slow

[placid shoal]

I'm still trying to get used to sliding through peoples backs to get the backstab

[placid shoal]

ITS BEEN SO LONG!

[serene bough]

hello again glide welcome back to darktide

[placid shoal]

hell ya

it's feeling really good right now

[serene bough]

currently should be doing by job instead of procrastinating lol

yeah the recent updates have really polished the game its great to play now

[ocean idol]

Should you ever be using heavies with comb at axes?

Seems like lights have higher dps?

[severe gale]

for what

[modern mirage]

One thing I would like to ask for is a new Veteran persona that's... reserved, blunt, and to the point. Where the others would say, "Traxis-- uhh, the one with the net," they say, "Trapper" or "Net one." Someone who compulsively says as few words as possible.

Maybe even give em a voiceline that's just (% proc on specialist kill): "[quietly] Eat [inaudible]"

[severe gale]

combat axes? on carapace, use heavies

at least with rashad

[tall torrent]

Carapace & unyielding
Yes

Everything else
Not so much

[severe gale]

pretty sure it’s for all axes though

[ocean idol]

I like Antax more

[terse idol]

Hmm? How come?

[slow spade]

sometimes I use heavy to kill ragers faster

[terse idol]

Not much changed it just deletes shooters

[slow spade]

but usually when they're focusing an ally

[severe gale]

it wasn’t changed, just power crept

[ocean idol]

Are shock mauls good on vet?

[severe gale]

shock mauls are solid on all classes

not OP, not weak

they’re great generalist weapons

[thorn plinth]

Guess Overkill damage being higher than Actual is just something I'm going to have to deal with on Dueling Sword

[severe gale]

ignore overkill damage, it’s a pointless stat to worry about

it’s not like you’re actively consuming a resource to overkill, wasting damage

[tall torrent]

No, u just shouldn’t heavy stab as much as u do rn (for horde at least)

[thorn plinth]

Funny Commissar that just runs in and stabs melee elites in the face and quickswaps to bolt pistol to counter-snipe the sniper across the map is somehow more fun than Psyker and Ogryn

[severe gale]

it’s just how weapons work

yah what path said

[thorn plinth]

Mostly do it because my slashes don't kill dreg bruisers that fast

[terse idol]

Huh?

[thorn plinth]

Kill scab bruisers really fast but the dregs take a minute

[terse idol]

I think it's still good for what it dooes

[severe gale]

honestly main source over overkill is just 1-3 lone chaff

[terse idol]

Kill all gunners

[severe gale]

yah

it wasn’t changed, and it was just powercrept by other options

[terse idol]

It's mainly been that the entire time

Not reeeallly

You're not really shooting regular gunners with the boltgun

Or the bistol

[tall torrent]

U can also turn off overkill damage in scoreboard

[terse idol]

Its not ammo efficient

[severe gale]

probably just*

[thorn plinth]

Also probably during horde, it's probably me trying to stab an elite and a poxwalker Mister Presidents the hit

[severe gale]

lmfao

[terse idol]

I mean it's not overkill imo, for regular gunners it's your source of generating toughness with MF on an ilas build

[severe gale]

i do

but i’m just swag

[terse idol]

And then your 1 shot BP for scab gunners

[severe gale]

marksman’s focus is stupid

[terse idol]

If you're talking about an ilas build that is your most potential

[severe gale]

i would rather (and do) go keystoneless than take MF or even FT

[terse idol]

How you gonna say power creep

[tall torrent]

Outside of recon, nah

[severe gale]

i also go keystoneless for helbore

[terse idol]

Weird

I only go keystoneless for recon

I wasn't talking about helbore too

[severe gale]

marksman’s focus and focus target r just not worth the effort of keeping up imo

[terse idol]

Focus target is just free damage

[tall torrent]

Focus target is basically no effort of keeping up

[severe gale]

yeah but it’s annoying to have to ping every time

it’s free damage yes

[split grove]

i don't like pinging things because when i look at them i kill them

[terse idol]

Mf is easy to keep up with either an automatic weapon OR an infantry lasgun

[severe gale]

but it’s annoying for me to use

[tall torrent]

Take redirect fire ?

[severe gale]

so i dont use it

[thorn plinth]

Currently keystoneless on my saber build

[split grove]

so i run keystoneless

[vagrant scroll]

I've been running without a keystone as well with recon, seems to be working alright

[severe gale]

mmm

no thanks

:3

[tall torrent]

[split grove]

a lot of the vet nodes are high value stuff to take and none of the keystones feel amazing for me so i just never take em

[severe gale]

the only keystone i take on vet is weapon specialist

which is bad on helbore anyway

so

no keystone for helbore

[severe gale]

yeah but it’s tedious

[split grove]

buff vet by making the nodes all cheaper to take and i'll pick up a keystone

[severe gale]

like yeah it’s probably good

i just do NOT care to use it

[tall torrent]

MF needs a rework ngl

It’s not fun to play

[grand perch]

(i think it is)

[severe gale]

MF is just DD but worse

[severe gale]

well ur opinion is wrong

[tall torrent]

MF needs to be FNP but finesse

[severe gale]

bow down to us

[tall torrent]

Then we’re talking

[severe gale]

listen to everything we say

[grand perch]

https://tenor.com/view/disintegrate-gif-22469816

[vagrant scroll]

Lol

[severe gale]

taking damage removes stacks?

[severe gale]

forming your own opinion is not allowed here

listen to the personalities

[grand perch]

luckily path is so based and doesnt try to force everyone to conform to his opinion

[severe gale]

booorriiiing

[terse idol]

Real

[severe gale]

(but he does argue his opinions very strongly)

[tall torrent]

No
Non-weakspot hits remove stacks
Weakspot hits & kills gain stacks back

[terse idol]

I only make value because I face tank the regular shooters

[tall torrent]

This is my idea for marksman’s focus rework:
Hold 10 stacks (up to 10 stacks) of Focus by default, each granting +7.5% R.finesse and +1% reload speed.
Non-weakspot ranged attacks drop 1 stack per attack.
Gain 1 stack per ranged weakspot hit.
Gain 2 stacks per ranged weakspot kill.

Subnodes:

1. Each Focus stack also grants +2% R.crit chance. Locks subnode-2.
2. Each Focus stack also grants x(1+5%) toughness gain. Locks subnode-1.
3. Increase max Focus stack amount from 10 to 15, also normally hold 15 stacks.
4. Melee attacks also generate Focus stacks (1 per weakspot hit, 2 per weakspot kill).

[thorn plinth]

Funny commissar

[severe gale]

oh so like trickshooter on revolver

[tall torrent]

Ya

[terse idol]

All I'm saying is it isn't power crept

Lmao

Ilas

I'd

The same as it ever was

[ocean idol]

fuck train mission

[thorn plinth]

You know, I just thought of this, of all my scoreboards from team comps, why is three ogryns the one where I actually take damage

[terse idol]

https://tenor.com/view/david-byrne-same-as-it-ever-was-always-has-been-same-gif-22266189

[grand perch]

that needs stamina regen to keep deadshot up

[severe gale]

i think this would be too OP ngl

[terse idol]

Except the mk12 got power crept by the other 2

[tall torrent]

You shouldn’t need deadshot to begin with ngl

[tall torrent]

It’s still ranged finesse only, doesn’t benefit melee weapons

[grand perch]

but you should have the option to keep it up by clicking heads good

[severe gale]

20% crit chance, more toughness regen

[tall torrent]

Either or

[severe gale]

still both are really good

[tall torrent]

Yea

[serene bough]

i take MF and wep specialist

FT is the least interesting

[tall torrent]

Really good but you have to drop talents elsewhere

Because the thing is

Veteran keystone usually takes at most 1 subnode

[earnest bone]

https://tenor.com/view/you-start-today-pc-principal-peter-charles-south-park-s19e5-gif-20528338

[tall torrent]

And it still doesn’t benefit melee weapons

It’s still very much a “ranged weakspot” keystone

[idle swallow]

MF update where you get 150% more ranged finesse damage permanently but if you miss 10 shots you explode and die instantly

[earnest bone]

give that to auto spam psykers and make it 3 shots

also make them to die, instead of taking 1 wound damage

[arctic rampart]

MF is the lowest winrate keystone for me. What weapons do you like it with?

I just can't seem to get it in my builds. Then again I've been running plasma almost exclusively. Can't seem to want to use a revolver in 40k

[serene bough]

i use for ilas

[grand perch]

counterintuitively its best with high rof guns

[serene bough]

it's a picky keystone it works for very few weapons

[idle swallow]

I only ever do it with the laspistols

[grand perch]

but i do like using it with ilas and "vigilant" autoguns

[formal hamlet]

Is there a mod guide on what are the go-to mods to get?

[vagrant scroll]

what's a good autogun setup? I've only been running ilas and recon but I know i should eventually level up the other weapon masteries ><

[formal hamlet]

I'm kinda jelous of my friend's ability to see post-game stats.

[tall torrent]

Animation events
Scoreboard / powerDI
Creature spawner
Collectibles finder
Decode helper
Show crit chance
Show remaining dodges
Numeric UI
Full auto

[terse idol]

Columnus infantry autogun

[arctic rampart]

@formal hamlet I guess most people use modpack that does it all for them. I add spidey sense if I'm blasting music but otherwise my list is ```Healthbars
CustomFlames
FullAuto
animation_events
scoreboard
psych_ward
true_level
book_finder
KeepSwinging
Coherency_Keeper
NumericUI
ForTheEmperor
CollectibleFinder
show_crit_chance

[formal hamlet]

Oh boy.

[terse idol]

Infantry lasgun is a okay point and click adventure build

[formal hamlet]

Do people still use mods that let them add their own sights to iron sight guns?

[arctic rampart]

weapon customization. I turned it off on locked and loaded but its probably updated since

[slow spade]

yes

[formal hamlet]

I'm guessing I get these mods via mods nexus yeah? Don't think I saw steam workshop support.

[slow spade]

works fine now

[arctic rampart]

its a really well designed mod but its brittle on updates

[slow spade]

I got it from the modding server

#📌communities

my bolter uses the kantreal sight now c:

[arctic rampart]

Oh god that reminds me of using bolter at release and absolutely hating the iron sights... haha gdmn

[slow spade]

lol yeah...

fixed now though >:)

the heretics never see it coming

[arctic rampart]

I really want to play around with the new bolter I keep seeing people using it again. Must be significantly better. But its hard using a poop tier gun when you got a maxed out

[terse idol]

The bolter isn't bad doe

[slow spade]

one of the best vet options now

[arctic rampart]

Agreed, but my bolter that I have is. Just saying I dont have it unlocked

[terse idol]

Like really only the recon las is still "eh" tier

And the shredder is garbo

[tall torrent]

Nah

[arctic rampart]

I bet there's lots of EH guns like the slow firing laspistol and half the lasguns

[terse idol]

Is it better now?

[tall torrent]

Recon is top 3 gun for veteran

[terse idol]

I've been using it abiiit more

Wooah

[tall torrent]

Top 5 are like

[terse idol]

Keystoneless recon

[tall torrent]

Zarona revolver
Vraks V
Recon XII
Boltgun / plasma (4th - 5th)

[arctic rampart]

My experience is recon is bad by default but if you do 20 runs and tweak your spec repeatedly you'll end up in a happy place

[tall torrent]

Recon’s downside is that it costs the most points to run by far

[terse idol]

I've done a few runs i gotta play it more

[tall torrent]

XIV doesn’t need onslaught but u still have to go shock trooper for the most part

[arctic rampart]

I made the mistake of trying to fit recon with power sword which kind of needs weapon specialist. But recon kind of sucks with that keystone. I bet recon would be a lot more palatable with knife or dueling sword.

[slow spade]

psword doesn't need weap specialiat

just pick up Focus Target if you want a keystone on recon

[terse idol]

Just use like

Dueling sword

I mean

Heavy sword

[arctic rampart]

You know they nerfed PS so the charge breaks super fast now. You do need the dodge distance increase from WS now to have a good experience IMO.

[slow spade]

reverted yesterday

[tall torrent]

They patched the charge-up this patch

It now works properly as a budget Rashad

[slow spade]

psword is back on the menu

can finally drop rashad

[arctic rampart]

They fixed the activate => re-activate bug supposedly. But the break-on-hit didn't have a patch note.

[slow spade]

only breaks if you get stunned

[broken spade]

just don't get hit

[slow spade]

don't get stunned

typically, you get stunned if you're melee'd from behind

[arctic rampart]

My games yesterday I had to fix graphical settings.. if they fixed psword breaking on any single poxwalker hitting you with full toughness that'd be a nice unexpected bonus.

In lock & loaded they introduced two bugs for charge weapons -- 1.) re-activate is buggy 2.) if you get hit by anything even with full toughness it'll break your activation. this combination was really annoying, basically made psword unusable.

[slow spade]

we know

its fine

I use it in Aurics

[tame lodge]

Uh I think getting hit deactivates charge attack has been a thing way before UnL

[slow spade]

no longer do I need to spend 5 points to do what my psword does out of box

[slow spade]

yeah it was stuns and maybe stagger

being hit is fine

[arctic rampart]

It was a chance before, but with lock & loaded they made it almost a sure thing

[terse idol]

Just dodge 🥺

[arctic rampart]

Anyway good to hear its fixed, I will try it out. If I can stop stabbing people with dueling sword

[slow spade]

yippie c:

[arctic rampart]

this guy telling me to get good. wait till u get old buddy! I still get 0 damage taken aurics once in a while lul

[terse idol]

I am old!

I'm 28!

Come on maannn

[arctic rampart]

Im 48

[terse idol]

Yeah

[slow spade]

I find psword with a -0.25 stam delay node pretty good

[terse idol]

I'm half your age

[slow spade]

lets me block spam

[terse idol]

I'm old!

Annd you don't need like insane reaction speed come on mann

[ocean idol]

How is heavy sword on vet?

[vagrant scroll]

i was looking at that node but I wasn't sure how much of a difference it would make, maybe I should go test it a bit tonight

[terse idol]

Unless you're going for perfect parries on pox walkers

You don't need to be fast

[wild summit]

somehow darktide is way more tense without music

[ocean idol]

How much cleave revolver has?

[wild summit]

yes

[ocean idol]

Thinking if i should take revovler or bistol for weapon specialist build

[arctic rampart]

Why use heavy sword when dagger, dueling sword, power sword exist? Or if you're a chain axe or rashaad type of person. In what way is heavy sword better ?

[slow spade]

Psword is reliant on pushes and push attacks so I've been messing with different stam combos.

I believe Stam regen + sprint efficiency nodes SHOULd be enough for Psword but still messing with it

[wild summit]

rvolver 100%

[ocean idol]

Because they have literally opposite purpose???

Heavy sword is anti-horde weapon

[wild summit]

always prepared keystone is sooo fun, you get to kill something mele then hotswap to your ranged weapon and back to reload the revolver mid fight, it is an extremly fun minigame imo

[slow spade]

Always Prepared is also funny on double barrel due to its 2 round cap

[arctic rampart]

power sword, rashaad, chain sword are just much better at anti-horde though

[slow spade]

heavy sword is redundant

[wild summit]

does it refill 2 shots or just 1?

[arctic rampart]

dagger and dueling sword can be totally fine against horde too and fast

[slow spade]

but hey sword is sword

[slow spade]

always 1

3.3% round up to 50% UwU

[wild summit]

both would be kinda hilarious ngl

[slow spade]

we take it

reminds me of the good old days when Survivalist rounded up too

Rumbler getting 4% ammo regen with no cooldown

[arctic rampart]

we'll probably be saying that about voice of command in 2025

[severe gale]

wait what changed

[tall torrent]

They fixed the charge-up

Rashad lite is back

[severe gale]

what was wrong with it

[wild summit]

those were the days

[arctic rampart]

Fixed an issue where some of the weapons with a Special activate action failed to correctly refresh their activation if the Special action was performed again while in the active duration of a previous Special activation.

[broken spade]

recharging it didn't refresh duration for a patch

[slow spade]

this meant you couldn't trust how many swings you had left AND how long you had left

[broken spade]

it was just annoying

[slow spade]

AKA Psword was unreliable

[broken spade]

made me not want to use it

[arctic rampart]

AND it broke when you got hit by anything at all including psyker spit

[slow spade]

attacking a rager and your sword turns off lmao

[broken spade]

trying to recharge your sword at the last 0.1 second of your duration and realizing it did nothing

[hollow ibex]

Sword just bounces harmlessly off the ragers skull

Teehee oops

[arctic rampart]

Then you pull out your revolver and realize you left it at 0 ammo again

[slow spade]

at least now you can replace rashad with psword

should be a lot more reliable

[tame lodge]

It happened

[slow spade]

yeah that's how I died for the first time in 21st moebian lol

[hollow ibex]

i mean rashad is basically an always-on PS

[arctic rampart]

NO rashad is just a filthy old weapon its not powered by the emperor

[tame lodge]

(somehow better that way)

[arctic rampart]

I will admit rashad is pretty good otherwise, dangit. especially with that brutal momentum blessing

[sleek garden]

I still don't think the Rashad should just happen to be the best all rounder weapon at everything

[tame lodge]

Yeah it's brutal momentum carrying

[hollow ibex]

shhhhh it's fiiiine

[sleek garden]

it doesn't fit the role at all with brutal momentum suddenly making it a horde clear weapon

[slow spade]

not even close

but sure

[slow spade]

I shudder to think what would happen if they touch brutal momentum

so many weapons use it as a crutch

[arctic rampart]

I almost never see anyone using rashad

[hollow ibex]

guess you've never used a properly built rashad before

[slow spade]

I literally did before they fixed psword

[hollow ibex]

the only thing that comes to mind that PS is much better at

is killing rager hordes with sunder

[slow spade]

its why I can confidently say I miss Psword

[terse idol]

Gonna be real and say that it is just a knowledge based weapon

[arctic rampart]

I see tons of trash piles using knife and then a few godlike people using knife. Lots of people having fun with dueling sword like me too

[slow spade]

rashad was 100% a downgrade

[terse idol]

Mediocre otherwise

[slow spade]

"sunder"

[hollow ibex]

don't blame the weapon if you don't know how to use it

[slow spade]

explains a lot

[slow spade]

I do...

why do you claim I can't lol

[terse idol]

Hence why so few people use it because only people who know how to build it use it

[slow spade]

I've been playing since relase

[hollow ibex]

then you would know what rashad is capable of, and wouldn't be spouting shit takes about it lol

[arctic rampart]

sunder is pretty fun but its just not brutal momentum the damage downgrade is massive

[slow spade]

yeah

that's why I know Psword is better

[sleek garden]

I've been using the blue combat axe because I just had it sitting in my inventory

[hollow ibex]

and for the record, 80% of my time with psword is with brumentum

[sleek garden]

lots of thwock sounds

[slow spade]

??? it should be like that

[misty delta]

maybe its just my lobbies but I’ve been seeing a lot of chain swords and chain axes 🤔

[hollow ibex]

just letting you know 🙂

[sleek garden]

Because they're fun and effective in all roles

[terse idol]

QP is random grab bag

[arctic rampart]

I respect anyone using the powered axe 4 that thing shreds then gets you killed lul

[misty delta]

can’t deny that

[slow spade]

mk3 is objctively inferior to mk6

using the worst sword yet claiming idk how to use rashad

lol

[arctic rampart]

Its a playstyle difference block push vs activating while sliding. Mk6 has the stab though so it is stronger

[slow spade]

it doesn't make you particularly convincing about Rashad :p

[undone jungle]

Hi Veteran chat are we having a good one

[slow spade]

its not just that

-25% block cost, light attack horde clear, better push attack, animation cancel on charge

idk why they dumpstered mk3

but it is what it is

[noble cove]

363++++++

[misty delta]

we are once again talking about the axe. Otherwise good I think

[arctic rampart]

I find mk3 more fun lining up perfect heavy attacks. But it is weaker

[undone jungle]

I am having fun and being joyous

[arctic rampart]

I dont even use push on mk3 since it doesnt have a push attack lul sadness

[slow spade]

sadly for some reason they made it so light and heavy attacks basically do the same damage :c

[sleek garden]

Is mk3 the fat one with the straight sideways heaviez

heaviez

[slow spade]

its technically different but no breakpoints

[sleek garden]

Heaviez

[slow spade]

yes

[sleek garden]

Wtf

Heavies

thanks phone

[undone jungle]

Nice auto correct nerd hahaha everyone bully him

[arctic rampart]

mk3 is the one you can activate on glide slide, it has 2 fun things!

[sleek garden]

I've been using it with sunder I thought it works pretty well

but the lights hardly hurt anything

[slow spade]

it works but its just not as good

[sleek garden]

Unpowered

I mean

[rocky jacinth]

make mk3 hold charge if you get hit and I'll use it

[slow spade]

yeah unpowered is only really for staggering to buy time to charge again

[sleek garden]

With veteran i tend to value melee near exclusively for horde clear

so I favor the mk3

[slow spade]

mk6 can horde clear too

[sleek garden]

but it depends on the build and teammates

[undone jungle]

Tbh mk3 slide activation is pretty sweet because I feel like a slug when using mk6

[slow spade]

just use light attacks

[slow spade]

mk6 can animation cancel its charge

[undone jungle]

Yes and?

It saves a few frames wow

[sleek garden]

Yeah of course but to hit 3 maulers with a blessed powered heavy

[slow spade]

so you charge faster AKA no slowdown from charging

[slow spade]

it removes the slowdown...

[sleek garden]

you can block instead of having to stare at it mid horde

[undone jungle]

Don't you block to cancel it or am I forgetting something

[slow spade]

yes

[undone jungle]

It's still stinkin slow with the cancel but I guess mk3 is too

[slow spade]

I mean if psword wasn't slow it'd be way too op

[undone jungle]

Does mk3 have better dodges or is it really just poop

[hollow ibex]

Who the fuck said i was using mk3. ChatGPT hallucinates less than this lmao

[slow spade]

no, stat-wise roughly the same for dodges (unless it changed)

[slow spade]

you use Sunder on mk6?

[undone jungle]

since mk6 dodges are pretty poup too

[sleek garden]

That's the main reason I don't use the power swords

[slow spade]

you know that makes you look worse right?

[sleek garden]

I just hate how bulky they make you feel

[undone jungle]

Yeah pretty much same

I mean insta killing crushers is nice I guess

[slow spade]

now I know you don't know how to use psword if you use Sunder on mk6

opinion ignored

[undone jungle]

Sheodoq I agree with you but you should really seek employment

[sleek garden]

I don't like the duelling swords even before the update because the dodges were too good and I would go flying off cliffs lol

most most weapons are a good middle ground

[rocky jacinth]

i tried psword with those melee pressure challenges in the monster spawner mod and it's kind of miserable

[slow spade]

bro why do you think I spend time arguing on discord. My job is so slow

I'd be playing Darktide if I was unemployed

[sleek garden]

I had to use a power sword on water purification in the torrent in the final rush and it sucked so bad

after that I put bonus stamina and block cost reduction on the sword

[ocean idol]

What is opinion on quiockdraw revolver?

[rocky jacinth]

yeah, if you have stuff coming up behind you and you have to fight solo it's real rough, worse than just about anything else decent

[slow spade]

funny and I like that it demolishes bosses

[misty delta]

zarona good, agripiina funny but less good

[rocky jacinth]

one tap from a poxie and you eat shit because you can't clear with attacks

[slow spade]

but objectively worse than the Zarona

[ocean idol]

i accidentally took it with my weapon specialist build

and i surprisingly liked it

[misty delta]

they’re both technically called quickdraw revolvers and I dislike that xd

[sleek garden]

that's actually my main gripe, you can see that the sword is technically always powered, but the uncharged attacks are just so weak

[sleek garden]

They do draw pretty fast though

[misty delta]

https://tenor.com/view/so-true-gif-24068595

[slow spade]

I wish you could change weapon reticles for specific weapons

[rocky jacinth]

i managed to make it work together with bolt pistol and the point blank blessing to stagger groups, do you think block efficiency on top of that would be worth it?

[slow spade]

as I want to use the precision reticle on the Agri revolver :c

[arctic rampart]

you can with weapon customization mod.

[slow spade]

oh good to know, I'll mess with it more

I only used it for funny guns and sights so far

[broken spade]

or crosshair remap mod if you just want crosshairs

[slow spade]

got it, I'll take a look at both and see what reticle abomination I can conjure

[arctic rampart]

boltgun is the #1 use case for the mod afaikt

[slow spade]

Helbore is pretty bad too but yeah I would have dropped bolter with its iron sights

at least with Recon's terrible sights you're not really missing

[rocky jacinth]

for me it's autoguns

[arctic rampart]

that one recon can hipfire super good too

[rocky jacinth]

bolter hitbox is the size of a toyota hilux you literally can't miss

[misty delta]

I’m a masochist so I use the mod to remove sights from inf lasguns

[slow spade]

I find them pretty usable at least not so bad that I feel it actively hurts my performance

[slow spade]

god bless the hotbox buff, I've been killing gunners behind cover because of it lol

[hollow ibex]

Given that you struggle with the most braindead melee weapon in the game, I’m not surprised you’re also illiterate.

[slow spade]

actually learn to use your weapons before talking to me

[rocky jacinth]

lmao yeah, i think they overdid it a bit since I'm popping enemies literally around corners with no part visible

[slow spade]

indeed, they even made it so it prioritizes head or torso when possible

[misty delta]

if plas can shoot through walls I see no problem with bolters shooting around them

[slow spade]

so the -50% damage penalty that normally plagues dreg gunner isn't an issue

[slow spade]

to be fair, bolter also has wall pen

[rocky jacinth]

hadron secretly loading our boltguns with servitor shells...

[hollow ibex]

Says the guy who can’t make the easiest melee weapon in the game work.

[slow spade]

I sometimes have to shoot dogs that pounce allies that moved too far ahead

[slow spade]

never said I couldn't

its just worse

[hollow ibex]

And for the record, being the good meta slave I am, PS is my most used melee weapon in the game

[slow spade]

can't read nor knows your weapons

maybe you should read the guide in the pins?

https://1drv.ms/w/c/e2a0a519389b2f30/EciPxKdXTJlPiEj2LUHKr58BbN_LckMOC4bba3qnlO8THg

for you

[hollow ibex]

That’s funny because path disagrees with you on this you know

[sleek garden]

I haven't used the bolt pistol enough to tell

[slow spade]

yeah? Doesn't mean I'm wrong

[misty delta]

oh neat.. you learn something new every day

[sleek garden]

I always bring frags to deal with hordes

[hollow ibex]

Trying to appeal to authority, but said authority agrees with me, not you

[slow spade]

sadly its not as good as plasma's wall pen but hey it can beam a gunner hiding beside light metal

[slow spade]

"appeal to authorty" fucking read I said LEARN your tools

then I directed you to the GUIDE

[sleek garden]

I have found the most use of a plasma gun to be basically a revolver as well

[slow spade]

stop being stupid and read

[sleek garden]

One you never need to reload

[slow spade]

true lol, everything boils down to revolver

[sleek garden]

Except for emergencies

[rocky jacinth]

same but i feel like I'm crutching on them a bit too hard

[sleek garden]

Where you charge all your shots to kill 5 crushers

[hollow ibex]

Where the author of the said guide disagrees with you. Maybe you should try reading the guide

[sleek garden]

frags are balanced I wouldn't worry

[slow spade]

I did, that's why I developed my own opinion. Funny that you think knowing something means people MUSt agree with you?

do you just copy Hammer's build 1 to 1?

[tall torrent]

Wat

[hollow ibex]

Even if I did, it’s clear that at least I can work with the easiest melee weapon in the game lol

[tall torrent]

What did I do

[sleek garden]

by balanced I mean I start with 3, it takes 2 if I want to decimate a horde and even with grenade regen I am not always guaranteed to have one

[misty delta]

oh shit its the cops

[hollow ibex]

He’s saying Rashad is much worse than PS 🤷‍♂️

[slow spade]

I can too, its not hard. It doesn't mean there aren't better weapons like Psword

[slow spade]

arguing again c:

[tall torrent]

I mean
The 5-point cost is there

[sleek garden]

They're overpowered and limited as your panic button

[slow spade]

"Rashad is better" -> uses Sunder on Psword

[hollow ibex]

Yes but not his point.

[slow spade]

gee I wonder why...

giving up Power Cycler or Brutal Momentum..

[sleek garden]

I use sunder on it because it's funny

[rocky jacinth]

sure, I'm just thinking of the absolute war crimes i committed with them last time i ran melee only mael

[slow spade]

yeah but the argument was for what was "better"

[hollow ibex]

Dude. Aren’t you embarrassed to demonstrate your illiteracy to the chat over and over again lol. I would be

[slow spade]

Sunder is cool but definitely not better than Power Cycler or Brutal Momentum

[tall torrent]

If ur talking purely what’s better in fully decked out optimal builds, Rashad wins

[rocky jacinth]

but then maybe the unbalanced thing is the blessing interaction with your weapons

[slow spade]

yet you never pointed what I "misread"

[sleek garden]

this is the #1 worst thing about the power sword/rashad, that you absolutely have to use certain blessings or it's too ineffectual for people

[slow spade]

why don't you reinterate your point?

[tall torrent]

But power sword has flat -5 point cost and it enables a bunch of other builds

[sleek garden]

what do you mean 5 point cost

[slow spade]

I agree but its funny arguing with Sirosky

[misty delta]

it really wants the melee talents

[hollow ibex]

Because a bot like you would still somehow miss the point. Scroll up and read on your own time. Pre servitor.

[tall torrent]

Power sword doesn’t need anything in bottom right whereas Rashad wants trench fighter (5 points in)

[slow spade]

Rashad REALLY likes the nodes from right tree

specifically Trench Fighter which is a minimum of 5 points

[sleek garden]

On my veteran the only talents that benefit my melee is like

[slow spade]

not going to? Don't care

[sleek garden]

Precision strikes

I get by pretty well

[tall torrent]

If u play Rashad that 10% atk speed node is basically non-negotiable must have

[terse idol]

You need 5 extra talents for rashad to be true optimal

[slow spade]

yeah that can work too. Its just if you want Rashad at its peak. Trench Fighter really sets it apart

[terse idol]

You can use 5 less if you use the psword

[misty delta]

with the new update its less of an issue but yeah some people simply dont have the information that we do

[terse idol]

So it's more versatile

The rashad IS better than the ps but it's also a higher talent point cost

[hollow ibex]

Keep making a fool of yourself then.

[slow spade]

sadly regardless of Psword or Rashad. You will never be free from the shackles of Brutal Momentum

[slow spade]

k

[tall torrent]

I want it nerfed

[sleek garden]

I tried for a while to use power sword without power cycler for a while and I'm sad that it genuinely isn't good enough to keep up without power cycler

[broken spade]

Rashad is overall better but Psword is still good at things that i miss having sometimes
mainly the push attack

[sleek garden]

I hope they tweak the power sword to have better uncharged strikes

[hollow ibex]

Why did you do that? Do you enjoy suffering?

[terse idol]

You can use energized 😌

[slow spade]

Honestly? The fallout of all the weapons that suddenly dramatically change would be so interesting to see

[sleek garden]

Because I like trying different things

[terse idol]

Never imo

[slow spade]

yeah its just such a pain

[terse idol]

Once uncharged becomes abit better than dclaw and other things might see less use

[hollow ibex]

Fair, I cba

[terse idol]

Imo at least

[tall torrent]

Buff combat axe light atk cleave to 5, rework achlys moveset and give achlys H1 high cleave & distribution

Then nerf BM to 2 targets only

Ez

[sleek garden]

it takes 5 unpowered lights to kill a single scab bruiser to the head

Catachan mk1 and 4 take 4 I think

[faint beacon]

Hear me out

[misty delta]

nerf brutal momentum keep deathbow 🚬🗿

[faint beacon]

Shovel

[sleek garden]

depending on your stuff

[elder fiber]

Antax should get a new moveset too imo

[tall torrent]

Nerf deathblow too tbh

But

[faint beacon]

🗣️

[sleek garden]

Antaxe is the one with the spike attacks right? I think it's interesting

[misty delta]

yeah the joke is that they’re the same

[tall torrent]

Mainly combat axe needs a rework

[slow spade]

oh that'd be nice. The changes to the other axes is also a nice touch as I feel Rashad is too useful compared to the others.

2 heads instead of 4 would also be interesting. I wonder if how much that would affect my sword that has Cleave Target dumped

[terse idol]

Daats what I'm saying

Uncharged can't really be a thing

[sleek garden]

they really don't, I think

Their role is very clear in all out, very consistent single target damage

[rocky jacinth]

make psword perma active until you get hit

[terse idol]

Dueling sword when-

[slow spade]

I used Antaxe instead of Rashad trying to use its Heavy swing but man I just couldn't get a hang of it :c

[tall torrent]

They’re too good at horde clear for “single target powerhouse”

[sleek garden]

no, the Rashad with brutal momentum is

[slow spade]

that was basically Psword on release

it was WAY too oppressive

[broken spade]

not having information is a big deal
Brutal momentum just isn't intuitive from the description alone. I had to explain it to my friend before he could understand why rashad was good, cause he'd just swing it at an elite in psykanium that doesn't get one shot and ask "why is this better?"

[sleek garden]

Try the other two and you'll understand

[slow spade]

yeah information is king in Darktide

[tall torrent]

Brutal momentum is too good yes
But if u nerf brutal momentum down to 2 targets then combat axes have basically no horde clear lol

[sleek garden]

It is the tradeoff

all the weapons are a tradeoff

[tall torrent]

Buffing base cleave so u can still stagger enemies is a better way to go about it instead of flat nerfing BM down to 2

[rocky jacinth]

oh i know, but we were all shit at the game back then and weren't running auric maelstroms back to back

[slow spade]

Its shocking how many people that play Darktide for a long time but don't interact with the community make "bad" builds (due to not knowing stuff like that damage is multiplicative)

[sleek garden]

Technically the antaxe would be the safer option to Rashad as it has a cleave bonus

"bonus"

it mostly effects block attack

[rocky jacinth]

psword ain't that hot anymore, it's not very lore friendly, it's stuck with a mandatory blessing and it's hard to balance

[slow spade]

true lol but still would need some extensive tweaks imo

[misty delta]

reverse-shoutout to all the youtubers I see taking weakspot and/or crit dmg perks

[terse idol]

YouTube builds be like-

[tall torrent]

0.3 more cleave on light is not changing anything lol

[terse idol]

"NOW THIS IS HOW YOU CAN BE, AN IMPERIAL GUARDSMEN"

[sleek garden]

I did mention the push attack

It might help with dealing with poxwalkers though

[slow spade]

Its really a shame too because they're making reasonable guesses but that's just not how the game works :c

[tall torrent]

Damage is not multiplicative tho

[sleek garden]

I don't trust YouTubers I saw a guy use a power maul and not power it and not use back to back heavies and said it sucks

[tall torrent]

It’s the stuff that’s not damage but affects damage that’s multiplicative

[sleek garden]

It made me really mad

[slow spade]

oh its not?

[misty delta]

okay they’re not wrong about that one- fighting for your life and struggling is just another day in the guard

[terse idol]

It's feelings over facts

😭

"I feel this is what you should use because it FEELS good"

[slow spade]

ah I'll have to take a look again at the guide to make sure I understand that :c

[sleek garden]

On my antaxe I think I have shred and headtaker but I'm not sure

[terse idol]

"Not that I did the testing"

[slow spade]

I mean to be fair "+10% crit damage" in most games is typically a good pick

[gusty niche]

I use a power maul but only use light attacks and the occasional special on heavy enemies

because it's fun

[sleek garden]

veteran in particular I always add defensive bonuses on melee because I intend not to get into horde battles unless I have to

[gusty niche]

and I feel cool smashing things with a mace

boink

[sleek garden]

You're missing out on the absolute most important part of the game

The ragdolls

[slow spade]

"he's not in melee? Spawn the teleporting poxwalker"

[sleek garden]

hit a poxwalker horde with the powered power maul

Watch them fly out of the map

It's actually glorious

[gusty niche]

Then again I also think the vigilant autoguns are fun, so I might be a little bit biased

[slow spade]

it always scares me using knockdown weapons as I've died a few times from being "stuck" on enemies thinking they were dead but were ust down

[sleek garden]

When I was working on the veteran guns I tried all 3 marks of the vigilants and didn't know what to think

[broken spade]

i have my corpses set to 1 so this happens way less often

if i see something, 99% of the time it's alive

[hollow ibex]

They’re ok but I like IAGs more lol

[sleek garden]

It's not that I don't like the vigilants it's that they do like 20 body damage and 800 headshot damage

[terse idol]

Me as I shoot a dead body cause I thought it was alive

[gusty niche]

I'm disappointed by the sheer recoil of the infantry autoguns

[terse idol]

[sleek garden]

The hipfire is tight but it's a bummer hitting a trapper in the neck 3 times but it's not the head so whatever

[rocky jacinth]

i've basically diluted my veteran melee weapon pool down to knife or duelling sword just to abuse uncanny strike on frags

[terse idol]

Its not bad once yoou get used to it

[sleek garden]

Crouch

[hollow ibex]

It’s worth it

[rocky jacinth]

feels kinda weird

[terse idol]

Crouching also makes it easier

[sleek garden]

crouching helps

I was surprised

[gusty niche]

but I like actually using sights so fuck the braced autoguns

[terse idol]

Counterstrike ass tactics

[sleek garden]

It does the opposite on the infantry lasguns

It makes the recoil worse

[slow spade]

hmmm that's a good idea but less bodies makes me sad :c

[gusty niche]

tried that, but sometimes crouching locks up my controls for no reason

[rocky jacinth]

you need to play it like cs or valorant and stand still + burst for max accuracy

[hollow ibex]

That reminds me. Some of the vigilants have some pretty bad irons

Which is funny

[slow spade]

oh the funny Vraks one?

[rocky jacinth]

then you can enjoy popping ragers in 2 shots out of your 54 round magazine

[sleek garden]

I like the brown infantry autogun

[hollow ibex]

The IAGs all have very good irons

[gusty niche]

It was great when it worked, but if it's gonna just stop me from playing the game why bother

[slow spade]

I tried using the Vraks rifle but I had to replace it via weapon custom lol

[hollow ibex]

The agri irons are bad. Not helbore bad tho

[sleek garden]

Executor stance aim at chest level

[slow spade]

oh I haven't tried the Agri one

I'll take a look just to see :p

when I can finally play that is :c

[hollow ibex]

Agri is probably my favorite because it’s an AN 94 at home

But the irons can get annoying

[rocky jacinth]

btw protip use marksman's focus with the vraks iag, when you start popping shooters in a single headshot you know you're on the right track

[slow spade]

Monster Hunter early beta is today and I can't play 😔

[gusty niche]

I might, but the battle cries from VoC are just too addictive

[sleek garden]

If you can make the midrange infantry autoguns work I think they are the best thing to bring in rolling steel

[hollow ibex]

Don’t develop VOC dependency

[sleek garden]

Fellow marksmans focus user

[hollow ibex]

It takes forever to work out of

[slow spade]

ah I haven't missed with the Agri sady :c I only used the Vraks based on what other people said

I should really branch out...

[slow spade]

too late for me 😔

Its terminal

[sleek garden]

Vraks vigilant or vraks infantry?

[hollow ibex]

I think they’re all good tbf. Can’t go wrong with any of the vigilants

[hollow ibex]

F in chat

[hollow ibex]

Vigilant

[tall torrent]

They’re all the same iron sights

[ocean idol]

I start to think that recon is underrated

[slow spade]

oh that's good to hear c: Thankfully Hadron isn't fucking us anymore so I can actually afford to try them all lol

[sleek garden]

Honestly this is the only game where I feel I'm wasting bullets with burst fire

[tall torrent]

III and VII have higher zoom

[ocean idol]

I th ink it is one of the best weapons now

[gusty niche]

When I get home I'm gonna share my current build here and just wait for people to complain about inefficiencies

[sleek garden]

I like the two burst vigilant

[tall torrent]

Top 3 gun for veteran

[hollow ibex]

Oh maybe that’s why. The Agri front post is tiny.

[slow spade]

oh lol rip.

[hollow ibex]

Yeah agri

[ocean idol]

Speaking of recon

[tall torrent]

Best V.auto is prob VII tho

[ocean idol]

Marksman vs Focus Target?

[tall torrent]

Hardest to build but best

[ocean idol]

on recon

[slow spade]

to be fair, its normally if you ask for advice that you get the min max advice

meme builds are fine

[tall torrent]

Skip keystone for recon, u can’t rly afford them

[hollow ibex]

Which one is that again

[sleek garden]

I think it depends on what you're doing with it

[ocean idol]

nah, i ignore right side, you don't need it recon

[sleek garden]

A lot of people here like it to melt bosses

[slow spade]

it IS funny c:

[gusty niche]

it's not even a meme build, I'm just a casual

[tall torrent]

Reciprocity, 5% crit chance, potentially onslaught

[sleek garden]

I tried to use it as a really really high capacity lasgun

[slow spade]

60k hp? Gone 😎

[rocky jacinth]

my recon build has focus target, it's easily worth it

[sleek garden]

Even the fastest one does enough damage to 1-2 shot scab shooters to the head

[ocean idol]

Don't need em

[tall torrent]

It’s mid-low tier boss dps

[rocky jacinth]

it does such shit damage that it's not reliable for MF

[slow spade]

Someone queued into an auric maelstrom with LITERALLY no skillpoints and we still won. You're probably fine

[sleek garden]

so I take marksmans focus to make it 1 every time

[tall torrent]

On a recon? Nah they’re good

At the very least the crit chance stuff

[sleek garden]

I also like the increased crit damage and reload speed of marksmans focus

[ocean idol]

Onslaught definitelly not needed, it is way faster to kill crushers with DS

or Knife

or PS

may be i could take +5% crit chance

[tall torrent]

Yea, get reciprocity + 5% crit chance

[sleek garden]

and if you take tunnel vision/exhilarating takedown you can refresh your toughness instantly by spraying into a horde at head level

It takes like 3 kills

[ocean idol]

Anyway, that's no answer, which keystone is good for what?

[rocky jacinth]

onslaught seems to pump up the dps on reapers by a cool 500 so i'd take it with the fast shooter

even if you're not gingerly beaming down crushers

[sleek garden]

view it as either constant low boost (marksmans focus) or a boost against big targets (focus target)

[ocean idol]

i mostly use heavy recon

[ocean idol]

I think big thing is stamina replenishment

With Marksman you restore 10% stamina on headshot kills

[sleek garden]

Take marksmans focus and tunnel vision

[ocean idol]

with Focus you can restore up to 40% stamina on marked target kill with full stacks

[sleek garden]

I forgot about that modifier for focus target

[tall torrent]

Practically it’s 10% per tagged enemy killed

8 stacks is bait

And target down benefits from the minimum 2 stack refresh on kill

[slow spade]

sadly 8 stacks is basically a +4.75% damage buff

[ocean idol]

Because yuo won't have time to replenish them?

[slow spade]

which is eh

[sleek garden]

Okay a really silly build I did with marksmans focus/tunnel vision is lawbringer (zarona) shotgun with manstopper and deadshot

[hearty panther]

basically

[tall torrent]

Wait 14 seconds to have 8 stack ready for 1 tag

[hearty panther]

the only times you get 8 stacks on a target is at the very opening of a new fight

[slow spade]

"fuck that sniper get him NOW"

[hearty panther]

or during a monster fight

[rocky jacinth]

i have a tunnel vision/exhilarating takedown/iron will build with vraks iag, it's hilarious

[sleek garden]

Tunnel vision modifier on marksmans focus gives you 10% stamina on headshot

[rocky jacinth]

it's like having ghost on an autogun

[ocean idol]

how to use Reciprocity well? I barely ever feel effect from it

[slow spade]

I usually only take 8 stacks when queueing with pre-mades as the +12% damage is going on actually useful teammates

[rocky jacinth]

literally tanking multiple gunners without gunner resist curios

[ocean idol]

that's called "fuck this sniper in particular"

[sleek garden]

With a fast firing guns if you're planning on mowing down bruisers hordes it's worth a look at least

[slow spade]

also when you get downed and you mark for revenge :p

[rocky jacinth]

ok so you fight the enemies, and you mash dodge

[sleek garden]

I never take iron will I feel like it's either iron will or grenade regen

I take regen every time

[ocean idol]

i mean without specifically trying to trigger it as much as possible, i don't think it is worth talent slot

[slow spade]

Iron Will is a trap. REAL Vets never get hit UwU

[tall torrent]

Dodge ranged horde & shotgunners

[rocky jacinth]

i take both

[tall torrent]

Dodge melee enemies

Dodge mutant & trapper

[sleek garden]

I would if I had the points, I usually go all the way down the left side of the tree

but yeah ideally I just don't get hit much

[slow spade]

I usually find that Iron Will helps a ton for chip damage

[rocky jacinth]

i dodge in combat all the time so it just kind of happens on its own

[slow spade]

I get hit twice? only lost like 4 hp

[sleek garden]

My secret: I don't forget to use medkits

I jest

[hollow ibex]

Yeah same. It should really just proc naturally

[sleek garden]

Sometimes it happens and I get whacked by a couple poxwalkers down to 60 hp

can't help it

[slow spade]

Honestly, I've been in those situations where I just drop a med because I don't trust my team to live

[gusty niche]

Ough that reminds me

[slow spade]

so I understand (even if you're joking :p)

[gusty niche]

I have hoarder tendencies specifically in this game and maybe a couple others

[slow spade]

"Do not resist, you are being healed"

[terse idol]

Sometimes I gotta use my mic for someone to drop their medicaide

[hollow ibex]

If you had a will of iron you’d prob be ok

[sleek garden]

I mean I don't go down a ton depending on the team

[terse idol]

Its frustrating when everyone's loooow including the person and they'd rather die than remeber to use the medkit

[gusty niche]

I almost never place ammo boxes or medkits because I might need them more later

[terse idol]

Just put it doown

[gusty niche]

I know it's there

[sleek garden]

I am 90% certain marksmans focus lowers your threat level

I see groaners run past me

[tall torrent]

No, doesn’t

[slow spade]

I try to ask if I should drop before doing so but I see that psyker with 1 wound and like 10 hp lol

I know they're not living :p

[gusty niche]

but what if we're 20m from extraction, dry on ammo, and all at 5-10 health

[terse idol]

This ain't final fantasy 7, we're not saving 500 ethers for sephiroth

[gusty niche]

then I'll regret it

[terse idol]

But you could have been

100% hp

And 100% ammo

At extraction

[sleek garden]

It always depends on the situation

[terse idol]

If you used it earlier

[gusty niche]

no

[terse idol]

The cost-loss

[gusty niche]

because if I use it earlier, that ammo gets used before time

[rocky jacinth]

when two players drop medkits into the airlock right before a med station

[elder fiber]

I hold on ammo boxes b/c fuck the dweeb at red who blew their entire load on trash

[terse idol]

You save it for so long that you're actually at a lower health and ammo value than you would be

[slow spade]

dropping in elevators pisses me off

[terse idol]

You know who's giving you those medikits and ammo boxes?!

[slow spade]

like its THE place to never drop boxes