veteran-class

[tame lodge]

I'd love to argue against it, but there's nothing to argue, it's just that good

[torn inlet]

whats that

[shadow aurora]

Survivalist aura

[torn inlet]

i don’t follow your logic. explain?

[tall torrent]

For better gameplay, no
For doing penance, yes

[shadow aurora]

Plasma has nutty ammo economy with survivalist and if you play your cards right you can just never run out of ammo

[torn inlet]

because its fun and synergistic with blaze away when you 3 primary fire and 2 alt

[torn inlet]

maybe there has been a patch i didn’t follow but this isn’t the case for me

[tall torrent]

(This blows you up)

[torn inlet]

nope

you can have a max of 3 alt fires before 100%

[frank monolith]

ill just spam my m1 in peace

[shadow aurora]

Idkw youre talking about my guy survivalist has always been super strong and due to how plasma works you can spam the thing

[tall torrent]

Also carapace armor just blocks cleave (unless you have special blessings that change the cleave interactions: sunder, brutal momentum, deathblow, perfect strike)

[torn inlet]

the ideal max burst dmg combo is 3-4 primaries ( depending in TR ) and 2 alt

[tall torrent]

Plasma has by far the worst scaling with survivalist

[frank monolith]

being honest i always thought you cannot cleave through crushers, but this is a nice info to know. Thanks 😄

[tall torrent]

Yea u can’t cleave through carapace bits on maulers, bulwarks & reapers either

[shadow aurora]

I use it with survivalist and ive never had to pick up ammo so im not sure what youre talking about

[frank monolith]

lemme check maulers since my brain rmb it cleaving one, unless i was just hitting its flak armour part

[torn inlet]

What missions do you usually play?

[tame lodge]

Numbers, Mason

[shadow aurora]

Damnation-auric damnation

[thick flint]

yo guys quick question
what blessings should I be looking out for on a infantry lasgun?

[frank monolith]

I have some ammo problems on vet, unless im running it with 2/3 people with the ammo perk

[thick flint]

I got crit weakpoint damage cuz thats a no brainer

[tall torrent]

You’re aware that survivalist scales off reserve ammo right

[torn inlet]

I feel like I am missing something then

[shadow aurora]

Yes

[thick flint]

what else would pair well with that

[tall torrent]

Alr just making sure

If ur teammates are actually killing things without u having to shoot everything then yea

[fresh mango]

this shovel worth grabbing?

[tall torrent]

Or u melee a lot of enemies

[tall torrent]

Wouldn’t

[shadow aurora]

Tbf that is not a guarantee on pubs

[fresh mango]

well damm

been lookin for a new melee cause im kinda tired of power sword

[frank monolith]

ye you rite, i was hit their flak armour on my memory

[shadow aurora]

Rashad axe

[tall torrent]

(Don’t go for it unless you’re sitting on a tremendous pile of resources)

[shadow aurora]

Or if you're feeling lucky

Punk

[fresh mango]

You wanna know my luck?

thats how lucky i am

[shadow aurora]

Chainclub

[fresh mango]

its honestly my prized collection

at least part of it

[shadow aurora]

Could go for a claw sword. Those are fun

[gleaming lynx]

why do i have one extra grenade sometimes? is it a mission modifier or someone else's perk?

[fresh mango]

Oh i just remembered, i got this shovel, this any good?

[fresh mango]

do you switch builds often with one of them having the +1 grenade talent?

[gleaming lynx]

no, none of my builds have it, i've also noticed it on Ogryn

[fresh mango]

probably a mission modifier then, sometimes maelstorm has em

[tall torrent]

No

[tall torrent]

Maelstrom enhanced blitz gives +2 blitz

[tame lodge]

You might think it's useful when you're using Deadshot

I gotta ask if Take a Swing actually works as intended though

[wanton dawn]

Uh-oh, a loner shroudfield zealot and a speed aura vet

[tall torrent]

It’s currently bugged

[tame lodge]

Hah, I had the feeling that it would be the case

Which sucks because shovels have good push attack

[fresh mango]

man I really wish smoke was better

[tame lodge]

It's better than before

[fresh mango]

it WAS buffed?

i assume it just didnt work right?

[shadow aurora]

If you could see through smoke itd be goated

[tall torrent]

It works “properly” now

[tame lodge]

Aka ranged enemies stop shooting

[fresh mango]

yeah if enemies in smoke were highlighted or something that would be nice

[dense tartan]

Had a swing at make every shot count. Missed 10 shots on a 74 ammo shotgun. I need to get it down to 7 misses or less.

However I'm happy to report that my knife is absolutely incredible.

[dense tartan]

I still think smoke grenades should be on there same side as executioners stance.

[terse idol]

Well I mean think about it this way

The more you miss the more shots you need to hit to compensate

It's okay to even miss the max amount of shots for your maximum ammo

It just means you're gonna need to pick up ammo to get back up to 90%

[dense tartan]

Oh true. Just need to get to 100 shots fired then I can miss 10 times

[terse idol]

It's how I got make every shot count with a revolver, with a random vet who had Survivalist who was also trying to get it

[terse idol]

Yuhh

[tame lodge]

You can throw slightly behind you and play at the edges

[dense tartan]

Will try again Monday night. See if I can get lucky.

[terse idol]

Just throw it ontop of you worst case

[austere pine]

just got trap barraged by 5 separate trappers, ama

[terse idol]

You'll still get the benefit of not getting shot and you'll see outside

[wanton dawn]

Did they get you ?

[austere pine]

yes

[wanton dawn]

Shame

[tame lodge]

And since they stop every ranged enemies from shooting, there's no real reason to throw somewhere else, unless pinned teammates

[dense tartan]

Petition for trappers to net heretics if they hit them.

[tame lodge]

Otherwise, I'd recommend throwing at the enemies, but in hindsight I only did that to make gunners/reapers to stop shooting

Since they would move

Rip smoke grenades skill expression

[terse idol]

Throwing in between isn't the worst ro be fair

[austere pine]

is it really skill expression if, in order to make something useful, you need to think so far outside the box scientists would argue if you're still in the universe?

[terse idol]

You just don't really want to throw them on top? Cause they could just like

Run out of it yeah

[terse idol]

It's not thaat far

It's just proper smoke useage

If the game really wanted to be dickish they could have made it so the enemies could shoot you when you just exit smoke before you could see the enemy just like in most Mil sims

It's just, apply that logic to smoke in danktide

Throw the smoke as far in the enemies LOS without being ontop of them

[tame lodge]

Just how awareness is also a skill expression, even though every player I know has eyes and ears

[shadow aurora]

Id say so

Been playing gw2 and one of the characters has a bomb ability you can use to lauch yourself across the map

Not intended ofc

[tame lodge]

The only problem with throwing smokes like that is that you move the enemies around, getting shot from every side is bad

So you better shoot them first

And I mean it

[vernal harbor]

smoke grenades are meant to temporary save you

i need everyone to attend my ted talk on this

[woven vigil]

Vetbros, been trying to build my first plasma gun. What should I change/focus on this?

[tame lodge]

I'll be around

[woven vigil]

also I heard that apparently you're not supposed to really use the charged shot? and just keep shooting the primary instead?

[wanton dawn]

yes. yes.

[wanton dawn]

You want get hot instead of either blaze or glory. Personnally I'd keep blaze but it is not 100% take

for perk ehhh

Let's just say it is a really good gun already

[tame lodge]

Something about ammo consumption and heat generation not being a great trade for damage, I'm not sure because I don't use plasma

[wanton dawn]

Charged shot is 3 times the ammo consumption, about 3 times the cleave, but 2 times the damage per shot

[vernal harbor]

if you ever run smoke just humor me and retain them and when a moment comes where you look up as everyone’s nearly dead and see a gaggle of gunners taking aim, toss it right at their feet and then everyone sprint the fuck out of that and regroup in a better formation, it’s like the only real use I have found for it but when it works boy it clutches

[wanton dawn]

Also you risk exploding

Also dps is lower

[woven vigil]

I see, I see

[wanton dawn]

keep in mind that base shot already cleave through 6 maulers body, and that charged shot still does not go through carapace

[woven vigil]

so I guess just carefully placing my shots into clumps of gunners and ogryns?

and aim for the heads?

[wanton dawn]

carefully

[woven vigil]

I know, easier said than done

will most likely panic magdump into a group of ragers in the heat of the moment, when I start getting surrounded or something kek

[wanton dawn]

plasma is one of the rare gun that can stagger crusher or mutant out of animation

[tame lodge]

A horde will probably be involved, it's definitely going to be difficult to even acknowledge that smokes stopped the gunners

Hmmn, Archivum, Magistrati....
Those places (and others that I can't remember the name) do have some gunner placements that are consistent through the matches

The elevators

Specially the one where you wait for it from the merchant side

Also please stop waiting for it out in the open

That place is a death trap

[marsh grove]

I am level ten currently and if anyone can could you suggest the best weapon combinations

[shadow aurora]

Just use what you like

Level ten you dont gotta be worrying about that

Just dont use recon

[marsh grove]

Got it

[woven vigil]

just did an auric shock trooper gauntlet with my new plasma gun

https://tenor.com/view/always-sunny-frank-oh-my-god-i-get-it-gif-22328165

that shit slaps specialists and elites around like no tomorrow. I been really sleeping on it

[wanton dawn]

Standard reaction when we tell ppl not to use charged shot

[lethal lantern]

guys how should i go about with this?

[thick flint]

mby change elite

to cara or maniac

[tall torrent]

No

Elite is basically mandatory

[thick flint]

mby even unyielding

is it?

[tall torrent]

Yes

[thick flint]

breakpoints?

[tall torrent]

You need either elite or unarmored for Dreg gunner 1HS

Elite is better because it’s more general purpose

Also helps shotgunner 1 bodyshot

[thick flint]

what about 15% elite talent?

[tall torrent]

Yes that’s taken in conjunction with elite perk

Unarmored hits it without +15% elite

[thick flint]

I see

[tall torrent]

If you don’t have unarmored, you need +15% elite talent and elite perk

But you basically should always take that talent for plasma

So elite is better

[thick flint]

I have not used plasma guns

in like a year

[wanton dawn]

And what about focussed fire ?

Sorry, redirect fire

[tall torrent]

Redirect fire allows Dreg gunner 1HS without tagging it

Normally u need 15% elite, elite perk, then 2 stack tag or 5 stack RF or longshot

[thick flint]

is tag mandatory for plasma guns?

[tall torrent]

Some people play weapon specialist

[wanton dawn]

Either tag or weapon specs

but tag is easier

[tall torrent]

But tag is just +dmg

[wanton dawn]

weapon specs if for fun melee build abuse

[tall torrent]

On a weapon that benefits more from +dmg than +crit chance

[thick flint]

do you have to have a keystone?

im not big on vet keystones

[wanton dawn]

With plasma ? not taking focus fire is a huge loss

[tall torrent]

Let’s just say that most things within 2 points reach do not compete with consistant +15.5% dmg

[thick flint]

its annoying to use though

[tall torrent]

Force of habit tbh

[thick flint]

yea i get that

[tall torrent]

I spam tag (not binded to m1) because I want outline for easier headshots

So it’s just very natural for me

[thick flint]

the only reason whc is not my fav from vermintide

[wanton dawn]

Not tagging as vet is a detriment

well, not tagging is a detriment

[dusky flare]

Vet keystones themselves are pretty good but they take too much investment

The middle tree in particular is extremely long and bloated

[dawn garnet]

marksman's is kinda mid

[hollow ibex]

It’s niche but wouldn’t say it’s mid

[dawn garnet]

middle has bring it down and rending strikes

[dusky flare]

Which are on the same tier..

And marksmans focus is self sufficient. Focus target needs at least 2 modifiers.

[raw steppe]

i dont think this is true lol

this was true a few months back

but anybody who's saying it now I straight up think is wrong

[dusky flare]

Still is

[raw steppe]

you can literally take every single "good" node on the vet tree now

basically for free

[dawn garnet]

you may not like it but this is the ideal vet general purpose build

[dusky flare]

Yeah, without a keystone.

[raw steppe]

you can definitely take a keystone lmao

[dusky flare]

Not in the middle tree

[raw steppe]

the nodes leading up to keystones are quite good

you're crazy

middle tree especially

has the good nodes

10% rending, 20% ogryn damage either of those nodes are quite good

[dusky flare]

Yeah you get some good nodes but not all of them

[raw steppe]

then you have 25 tg

then you have iron will and demo team

how the fuck are you gonna tell me

[dawn garnet]

yeah jokes aside this is what i actually use

[raw steppe]

the nodes in the middle tree are not good

[dawn garnet]

middle is nice

[raw steppe]

can you actually explain to me why you think they're bad

or are you just parroting some dumb shit you saw on reddit

because i'd love to hear it

[dusky flare]

No one said that lol you're fighting your demons. I said the tree is too long.

[raw steppe]

you said it's long and bloated

[dawn garnet]

bloated means needlessly long which means bad

[raw steppe]

and i dont think it's long or bloated because every single tier of choice has multiple 'good' options lol

it's like saying "x skill is bad because the text is too long"

text being long usually means shit is overpowered

just fyi

[dusky flare]

What dee heeell

[dawn garnet]

actually do i have a reasonable question how do coherency radius buffs actually work

like if i have one and someone else on my team doesnt are we both in coherency because my radius is higher?

[raw steppe]

yes

lol

[dawn garnet]

hmm i thought both had to overlap

[raw steppe]

no

[dawn garnet]

still a waste of a point tho

[raw steppe]

only because it's competing with confirmed kill

[trim hemlock]

It’s not really a waste of point

[raw steppe]

it's actually quite good

if you have an extra point

[dawn garnet]

but vet tree is nice theres so much other good stuff

[raw steppe]

coherency radius is actually kinda disgusting in terms of how strong it is

[trim hemlock]

It’s more uptime for CODrill and easier application of Focus Target buffs whenever they proc, and potentially toughness replenishment

[late hatch]

I feel like coherency buffs could be a bit stronger, but toughness regen and surv aura is pretty dank

[dawn garnet]

eh idk if the team is good enough a little increase in radius wont matter if theyre not good enough then the radius could be map wide and it wont matter

[raw steppe]

radius in general in darktide is very very very strong on everything

because of how area works

for example, on grenade tink

25% radius is a 56% increase in aoe

[dawn garnet]

thats not the same thing

its easier to compensate for coherency radius

[late hatch]

yeah its like how you go from a 8" to 11" pizza but the outside couple inches is a massive area coz its on the outside of a circle

[raw steppe]

similarily, a 50% radius increase in coherency, is more than double aoe coverage

225% of it to be precise

[raw steppe]

yes, going from 8' penis to 11' penis

[dawn garnet]

speakin from experience there?

[raw steppe]

tldr, 8" pizza is about 50 sq in, 11" is about 95 sq in

so even though you only gain 3 inches, it's almost double the size

[late hatch]

then you just end up with cold balls

[raw steppe]

of the pizza

but ye

50% coherency radius is surprisingly powerful

[late hatch]

esp if you have bullrush ogryn or charge zealots

[trim hemlock]

Oh, not to mention larger coherency radius also benefits from other classes’ things

Like Psykinetic Aura on Psyker

[raw steppe]

but yeah that's why shredder nades with grenade tinkerer + grenade regen + grenades on elite kill is so crazy insane

because the grenades will basically hit your entire screen

[trim hemlock]

Or at least makes it so it carries more easily to Psyker’s teammates

[raw steppe]

due to how much aoe 25% radius is

[tame lodge]

Me going down so the psyker can give everyone toughness (it was definitely on purpose)

[tribal tangle]

Anyone know which devils claw has the most horizontal moveset, and recommended blessings?

[raw steppe]

m1 has the most horizontal moveset, however, m4 is generally recommended since it has a vertical strikedown that helps a lot against priority enemies

for blessings, most people would rec rampage+SS; or rampage+shred if you are taking crit talent on tree

[tribal tangle]

okay, ty

[tall torrent]

Added known veteran callout codes

[final stag]

I like how the cutthroat says the codes when the enemy is dead but says their name when they're alive so their team can understand the callouts.

Cutthroat understands the zealot, psyker and ogryn don't know the codes 💀

[dawn garnet]

very based

[last parcel]

it's "Intercession 5-Rho" for the help callout. the guy just heard it wrong

[dawn garnet]

now write fan fiction featuring loose cannon and enforcer psyker

[tall torrent]

ok

[final stag]

;) enemies to lovers arc

[tall torrent]

fixed

[last parcel]

the Lex has FOUND YOU intense strap on action

[final stag]

PPPFT

[tall torrent]

also, anyone available want to test the current version of the document

using link share

[last parcel]

sure, send me all that malware babygirl

[tall torrent]

It’s fairly complete for the most part

Just needs builds added

[tall torrent]

dm

[tame lodge]

Fem Agitator x Fem Savant

~~They are soooo made for each other ~~

[final stag]

Male LC and Fem Savant goes pretty hard too 👁👁

He teases her because he does some shady shenanigans

[tame lodge]

ahem I don't see how it would work, in fact, it's already bad and should never be thought again

[final stag]

Male cutthroat and Male savant are boyfriends however

[tame lodge]

oh yeah

[final stag]

Definitely boyfriends there's no arguments

[tame lodge]

"Is that a laugh?"

[final stag]

WAIT I HAVE A VL

The smile one :3c

[tame lodge]

Hehe, call me cutthroat the way I love savants

[final stag]

My cutthroat is a gay man and these voicelines give me life

I have another one where he laughs

[austere pine]

"Something... something... SNIPER"

"med station... there's a code for that, too"

"traxis something... something with a net"

or, my favorite one, "gunner"

[tame lodge]

Caught on camera

[final stag]

Cutthroat has such an ugly laugh
Makes him more endearing

[austere pine]

i'd say he's got an ugly voice in general but that's a preference thing

[final stag]

I love his voice
His laugh is simply ugly fndnd

I find his voice attractive but it is a preference thing

[austere pine]

or, well, a much too rough voice

[final stag]

Hfjdjd different taste in gents

[austere pine]

don't even have a taste for gents but he's got a "gang boss" kinda voice

[mossy roost]

its a voice of someone whos been through the worst and expects no good! perfect for vet

[final stag]

To be fair my main build I call hive ganger and do my best to make him look like a thug

[austere pine]

and since i'm neither 1. into men 2. into gang leaders, it's not really for me

[final stag]

Fbjsjd fair enough

[austere pine]

i'm so done with playing auric on my zealot. i cannot deal with crushers and the game just keeps on spawning them

[tame lodge]

Lemme tell you about the evis 15....

Just kidding, ogryns are better dealing with crushers

[final stag]

Kill them faster than they can kill you 😈

[tame lodge]

Kill them until they die

[austere pine]

i got trapped by a trapper. an ally hit a barrel i was next to, a fire barrel, and even though getting rid of a net takes 0 seconds, they stood there as i was in the fire, unable to move

keep in mind, there was time b4 the barrel blew up to get me up

[final stag]

It's wild people don't understand how quick getting someone out from a net is

It's my first priority whenever someone is netted.

Get to them by murder and unnet asap

Unless they're surrounded by elites then you're kinda fucked

I'm no ogryn can't charge through em

[last parcel]

"I can take on 10 elites!"
"I can take on 10 elites~"

[final stag]

Same

[austere pine]

they're also using a recon lasgun

[final stag]

Sad

I'm all for off meta but you gotta make the weapon work
And recon doesn't work 😭

[austere pine]

gunlugger ogryn and me with a flamer

surprised we have bullets

[tame lodge]

I like my braced Graia Mk IV

[last parcel]

brace my nuts lmao

[tame lodge]

You nuts look heavy

Let me help

[raw steppe]

I think that is an easily solvable issue that boils down to skissue or build issue

Every build needs to be able to deal with crushers

[austere pine]

there ain't shit skill can solve when the only solution to them is heavy sword special-first heavy-special-heavy-special-heavy

[lethal lantern]

anyone know the ideal blessings for plasma gun?

[austere pine]

and that helps with singular enemies but not when there's a 5 group of crushers and many smalls

[raw steppe]

What gun are you taking?

[austere pine]

flamer

not saying it's a good combo but it's fun

and crushers make it unfun

[raw steppe]

Its not a very good combo but flamers can easily handle crusher packs

Just flame them and chastise and they all die

[austere pine]

i'm not looking for solutions here btw. the easy way to deal with this is to either just do evis or revolver

which i am doing, but i'm poor

can't afford to roll for KARKING SHRED

[vernal harbor]

lol

[austere pine]

you must be fun at parties

any

hway

i mentioned my frustration to spark conversations with people who also get slightly irked when they see crushers

[vernal harbor]

this is vet chat baby

we incoherent

[austere pine]

you ever see the zealot chat?

[vernal harbor]

no they stand too close to me

lol theyre just playing a whole ass nother game

[austere pine]

always are

it's either "look at my scoreboard" "look at my gun" or a different game

[vernal harbor]

bout the same here

theyve been debating stats and viability of the same shit, everyday, with the same data from 4 months to 10 months ago

definition of insanity in here

[balmy flume]

Bad night for PUG
Everyone trying to outrun spawning…

[tall torrent]

@raw steppe I did a bit of maths on sniper shot from the info u provided

Sniper shot is 1225 toughness dmg but it we can reduce it enough that it’s lower than the amount of toughness we have, we can fully absorb the full spillover effect and not take any dmg

So I was thinking if there’s a way to prevent health dmg from sniper without VoC overtoughness active

20% sniper resist (x3)
Iron will 50% TDR
Close order drill 33% TDR
5% TDR node

This results in:
1225 x0.8 x0.8 x0.8 x0.5 x0.66 x0.95 = 199.6 toughness dmg

If I have 140 toughness post-talent-tree, and I take triple +16% toughness curios

140 x1.48 = 207.2 toughness

I should theoretically be able to tank a sniper shot

Without VoC overtoughness

Is the math right here

[final stag]

What's the math of a crusher overhead because hunters resolve allowed me to survive a crusher overhead twice

[tall torrent]

Thinking about it again, if I have 140 toughness and build +43z from curios, I can hit this 200 toughness breakpoint to survive a sniper shot without any health dmg

[tall torrent]

520 dmg
2x multiplier to toughness (1040 toughness dmg)
Block bypass (can only be denied by DC parry or Ogryn shield)
Full spillover (if it breaks toughness, it minimum 25% of your health regardless of toughness mitigation)

Assuming you had Close Order Drill with full coherency, Iron Will and Hunter’s Resolve

1040 x0.33 x0.5 x0.5 = 171.6 toughness dmg

If you had 172 or more toughness at the time, you could take a crusher overhead and not go down

[final stag]

Makes sense as to why I tank those crusher overheads

I have 212 so

[tall torrent]

Yea I’m ngl

With this new enemy dmg info

I’m rly starting to rethink my curio choices

[last parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/rethink-my-life-im-going-home-im-out-realizations-gif-5324608

[final stag]

When I tanked the crusher overhead the first time I was like

HOLY SHIT IM STILL ALIVE????

[tall torrent]

I’m prob gonna go
+16~17% toughness
+16~17% toughness
+3 stamina

20% sniper resist (x3)
+5% toughness (x2)

• this is enough to tank sniper shot with 140 base toughness
  20% gunner resist
  12% stamina regen (x2)

[tall torrent]

I kind of want to touch on the enemy dmg stuff in my guide ngl

Like at the very least talk about the sniper resist stuff

It’s either

Use none

Or use on all 3

[final stag]

The crusher overhead tip maybe nice but very niche cause you have to use infil

[tall torrent]

I’m gonna put it in somewhere

Mauler overhead is a lot less dmg

[final stag]

I know that
That's why I was shook when I tanked the crusher

[tall torrent]

Mauler is 375 Dmg with 2x toughness multi

Iron will + close order will cut that down to 247.5

[final stag]

So they'd be a sneeze to my hunter resolve vet

[tall torrent]

Seems like hunter’s resolve is shaping up to be an insanely strong defensive node

[final stag]

It lasts 10s too

[tall torrent]

If u have hunter’s resolve, this is much safer

[final stag]

GRAAAAAH INFIL HAVING A SILLY USE

I use hunters resolve over the -90 threat

[tall torrent]

If you have triple sniper resist, 5% TDR (ofc u do), Iron will + Close Order + Hunter’s Resolve
You only need to be at 98.3 toughness or more to survive a sniper shot

Without taking any health dmg

[final stag]

You can tank 2 sniper shots then

Well my vet can tank 2 of em

Without health damage

Wait no

The iron will only works from 75% and above fuck

[tall torrent]

Ogryn & vet are the only 2 classes that can tank sniper & crusher hits head on without taking health dmg I think

[final stag]

That's actually wild

Vet being tankier than a zealot is insane

Not consistently but for 10s

[tall torrent]

Although

I don’t think hunter’s resolve is absolutely mandatory

If you’re playing a sharpshooter build with

Exhilarating takedown 3 stacks (x0.7)
Close order drill full coherency (x0.67)
Iron will (x0.5)

[final stag]

Still wild that vet can tank those

[tall torrent]

These 3 combine with 5% TDR to cut crusher overhead from 1040 toughness dmg to 231.7

Actually yea you kinda need hunter’s resolve for tanking crusher without overtoughness

Infil not bad ig

Infil talent tax tho

[final stag]

Sadly

But I like running it.

Still hilarious to think a vet just eats an ogryn slamming concrete on top of his skull and being like "barely a scratch" then

My cadian built of solid steel

[tall torrent]

Yea I’m changing my curio build now

The sniper resist breakpoint is 200 toughness because the max reduction you can get without going out of ur way is -83.7% against sniper shots

So that cuts sniper shot down to 199.6 toughness dmg

[frank basin]

[raw steppe]

Ye but if someone walks out of your coherency

Then you get fucked

You can test this

With creature spawner I think

Spawn a sniper and turn invisibility off

[tall torrent]

Right

But that still seems like a much more impactful breakpoint than other things

It’s a pretty good safety net on top of VoC’s overtoughness

[final stag]

Tbf I don't have close quarters drill and I take very minimal health damage like not even 20 hp lost from a crusher overhead

[tall torrent]

https://tenor.com/view/halo-reach-shoot-running-head-shot-gif-16967340

So I don’t randomly go down like this

[final stag]

If I did have Close orders I'd be even beefier in melee

But I like 20% increased reload makes reloading my revolver in a pinch actually effective though vanguard is kinda ass.

[last parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/brain-damage-gif-25961554

[final stag]

Pov: you're a crusher slamming your stupid hammer over my cutthroat (he's not a red smear?!)

[midnight totem]

this vet

died 6 times

I regret carrying him

[last parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/goofy-trial-crazy-evil-ill-fucking-do-it-again-gif-17111514

[neat stratus]

So which game series is more overrated; The Witcher, or Battlefield

[final stag]

To be fair we have our bad days. I have bad days every so often and makes me feel like a liability

[sinful palm]

6 times are rookie numbers . I had a match where 1 guy named Zek died 14 times😂😂😂 such a legend

[final stag]

Or when I start a mission and I have a rough start but ramp up in the midgame

Usually that happens when I first get on
Warming up on hi int shock troop

[sinful palm]

Yeah happens to me also on my first match

[final stag]

But when I hit the mid crescendo my muscle memory kicks in lmao

[midnight totem]

he had another vet with him that died 5 times

so it was really just me and this zealot doing most of the map alone

columnus op

[final stag]

I never died more than twice in a match. And usually I understand where I fucked up in

Or the pox burster was shoved back towards me

[hybrid token]

outdamaging 3 zealots with my infenus recon

https://tenor.com/view/fire-gif-10341555270454130792

[final stag]

Imagine being outdamaged by a recon
Also to be fair they were probably doing more meaningful damage against elites/armor/bosses unless you just outdamage them their too so skill issue on their parts fnnfnf

[thick flint]

zealots are just crazy

psykers are just weird

ogryns dont know where to go half the time

veterans do all the job fr

[austere mica]

Or plink at the horde with a lasgun

[thick flint]

in a world of weird magic, crazy manifestation powers and ogryns

regular man does it again

[dusky flare]

I mean zealots have been the lowest damage class for a while now

[grand perch]

thanks emp, cool gift

the extra carapace damage is going to bring this weapon around

[final stag]

53 damage to 1 damage against carapace wait! No. 2! Damage. Big improvement

Big E is watching over you

[hybrid token]

i dont think ive ever been outdamaged while playing vet

maybe if i played shredder

that gun is the big suck

[final stag]

I don't know if I get outdamaged or not sadly. But I do manage to kill a little bit of everything besides bosses so I'd assume I go second on most things and last on boss unless we have a psyker who isn't gunsyker

[hybrid token]

boss damage tends to be

is it beast

i do the most

is it the other 2

i do not

luv me that big ass weakspot

[final stag]

Oh yeah if it's the beast I can outdamage easily with certain builds but the other two is too hard to hit their weakspots especially CS

[tall torrent]

As long as I’m killing stuff my build is good at killing idrc abt chasing dmg

[hybrid token]

angy meatball

[grand perch]

https://tenor.com/view/mando-way-mandalorian-star-wars-this-is-the-way-gif-18467372

[hybrid token]

YOU were just in my stim checking mission

i think

[grand perch]

yeh, i was

hi bro

[final stag]

Yeah the only thing I really strive for is the voicelines praising your character fjndnd

[hybrid token]

when ogryn tells me im doin good

https://tenor.com/view/ascending-energy-galaxy-gif-17739196

[final stag]

I can do everything BUT I really want those praises for killing stuff quick

"DEATH. IS MY. BLESSING!"

On average I get 2 per horde and I can live with that

[tall torrent]

That one is cool but if teammates are playing certain builds you basically will just not get complimented

Like, if there’s a blaze trauma psyker just blowing everything up, you’re very unlikely to be complimented for killing stuff lol

[final stag]

I just accept it and fill the other void of just playing like a guerilla fighter and ambushing gunner positions and inevitably reviving blaze psyker after they eat an overhead

[hybrid token]

amazing how quietly crushers can sneak up on you

[final stag]

I never see them take out their melee which is fair they have a great horde clear

Crushers are the sneakiest of the ogryns hilariously enough

[hybrid token]

one of these days im gonna jam my foot up hadrons ass

[final stag]

Do it now

[tall torrent]

Both are good rolls

[grand perch]

I don't really see the issue either

[hybrid token]

but the number isnt bigger 😦

also raking fire is ew

[grand perch]

That is indeed a travesty

Numbers must be big, like ogryn

[hybrid token]

hadron has greater offenses to pay for

hadron

i will give you

3000 diamantine

if you unlock the other 2 slots

i know you can do it you fucko

[tall torrent]

I’ll be honest if it’s 540+ with great perks & blessings, it’s about as good as it can be

[neon briar]

did boltgun get any buffs between now and december?

[tall torrent]

Not rly?

[neon briar]

havent played in a few months and now it feels like it reloads faster and hits a bit harder

maybe i just dont remember how it used to be

[grand perch]

you have grown older and slower since and the bolter now seems like fast young whippersnapper

[neon briar]

damn, too real

or did marksman stance get any buffs?

it doesnt look like there have been any balance changes since november 😐

that must mean the game is perfectly balanced already

[grand perch]

Yes. Saying otherwise is considered heresy

[final stag]

I mean bolter has a slighty faster draw time.

But that's all I've noticed

[tall torrent]

Announcement for penance update soon

[rigid pilot]

Bolter does hit harder on headshots and crits, I think reload wasn't touched but we can run multiple reload talents now

[final stag]

Well bolter is a finesse weapon (funnily enough)

[rigid pilot]

Bolter has replaced hellbore for my surgical sniper build

[vague smelt]

hhh

Why people don't move in auric missions

[dreamy spade]

Because theres a horde every 2 seconds lol

[agile forge]

It is a particular skill to be able to make progress through the tide

[dusky flare]

But hitting things gives neuron activation

[dreamy spade]

Plasma gun blessings are the worst in the game istg

Get hot is okay but why crits??? It has a awful crit multiplier

[vague smelt]

Something many players don't have

[dreamy spade]

Volatile only makes a small difference for your first few shots, and you shouldnt be using charged attacks for plasma anyway

[vague smelt]

[dreamy spade]

Blazs away would be good if it didnt last 0.0000001 seconds

[vague smelt]

Blaze Away lasts longer than you think

Just don't swap it

[dreamy spade]

Glory hunter is okay but there are plenty of better vet toughness talents

[vague smelt]

Glory Hunter is a blessing, not a talent

[dreamy spade]

Yeah ik

If I add glory hunter it will do nothing

Because i already have amazing toughness regen talents

[sinful palm]

Glory hunter is trash imo

Better blaze away and volatile

[vague smelt]

Volatile for what

What purpose you see on Volatile aside shooting faster something big

[sinful palm]

More damage

[vague smelt]

That's DPS no more damage

plus

[sinful palm]

Yes

[vague smelt]

you overheat faster

[sinful palm]

Dps damage

[vague smelt]

I don't see anything good on that besides spamming against a monstruosity

unless you can aim fast sure

I stick to BA/GH

[sinful palm]

Idk i don't have problem with tough. Regen on the vet plenty of skill points that helps with that so i don't see that glory hunter that big of a deal

[vague smelt]

What does Glory Hunter has to do with all this

[sinful palm]

I preffer more dps over that

[agile forge]

The crit multiplier can still be enough to push the gun over a breakpoint

If you hit for 900, crit for 1000, and gunners (say) have 1000 HP

[dreamy spade]

It's good, but it's counter intuitive

[agile forge]

Then effectively crits double your damage

[vague smelt]

You will always reach high overheat

which already have crits on demand most of the time

[dreamy spade]

Its like getting lacerate on a knife

[agile forge]

Is lacerate the shit bleed blessing that only applies on non weakspot hits?

That's massively different since if you are playing well it never triggers

[slate hawk]

I believe so

[agile forge]

But Gets Hot will be triggering all the tume

Absolutely no comparison to be made at all

[vague smelt]

[slate hawk]

This is my beauty, not 100% perfect but she's mine

[vague smelt]

I have the power to switch any perk at any time

[slate hawk]

I can do the same, honestly just hoping they announce that Red rarity weapons are coming

[dreamy spade]

Red rarity?

[dawn garnet]

pls no

[junior needle]

Yes

Trap blessing

Gloryhunter is a fine alternative to blaze away due to blaze dropping very quickly and the fact that you want to aim for one shots on everything to begin with

It may seem redundant depending on what level of difficulty you play on though

But then again so will blaze

[dreamy spade]

Hence, plasma blessing are trash

[slate hawk]

In vermintide 2 there was a red rarity that had its rng % rolled perks always be maxed

[dreamy spade]

I think they should just add a way to convert stat points

So convert 10 defense into 10 damage

[junior needle]

Plasma blessings are not particularly impactful as the gun is already amazingly powerful just from having the right perks

Glory is still nice in histg and above levels of challenge

[rough palm]

Just played hab dreyko on high intensity damnation and revived the whole team by myself 2 times in a row in that last section

Fucking exhilarating

We won too

Holy fuck that level sucks

[slate hawk]

That missing is fun but hectic

Mission*

[rough palm]

What a blender at the end lol

We got 2 snipers pinning us down and the director sent everything it had while we were cornered lol

[slate hawk]

Back to work I goes but here's shovel time :3

[rough palm]

Bonk machine

[slate hawk]

Love me bonk

My current bonking stick, Except it has the tier 4 10% damaged blessing and damaged vs maniacs

[agile forge]

I'm trying to craft a mark 7

It is not going particularly well

[slate hawk]

I think both are good I just don't like the mark 7

[agile forge]

What don't you like about it? I've never used a vet shovel

[slate hawk]

I could just be bad but heavy attacks for hoard Clear just isn't my thing

[agile forge]

Fair enough, less brawly I guess

[final stag]

How does one attain
L o n g b o m b

[agile forge]

I got it at the end of enclavum baross

[slate hawk]

The end event during the train mission is good

[final stag]

Okay bet

[agile forge]

I just threw a bomb from a corner platform towards the spawn at the far end

[final stag]

The assassination mission?

[agile forge]

And it triggered

[slate hawk]

Just stand at the very top of one and look for a long sideline for a bomb

[final stag]

I'm assuming

[agile forge]

He might mean the raid too

Chasm Station Logistratum or something

[final stag]

Shhfheh god long bomb is such a pain for no good reason

[agile forge]

That finale looked good for it too

Just keep trying to get it by accident tbh

Any time you see a good situation for it, have a go

[final stag]

I just throw wild bombs

[agile forge]

We get so many free bombs

[final stag]

Hope for the best type beat

[slate hawk]

It's the one when you disable the AA guns and there's typically ragers or shotgunners protecting them

For the life of me I don't know the names of the missions in dark tide

I don't know if this is 3 minutes of play time or 3 minutes of fun

[frank basin]

3 minute of constant sweating

Wasd and space crouch

[slate hawk]

Abxy

I play on controller on xbox

[dreamy spade]

If I get behind nurgle i can kill it in 15 seconds lol

Still not better than hammer

Idk what zealot build that is but it can 1 shot demonhosts

[slate hawk]

Probably a stealth Marter build

[slate hawk]

Boltgun I presume?

[dreamy spade]

Oh no plasma

[dire olive]

I have over 1000hrs, and I don't, no one does

[slate hawk]

I would like to see this display of gamer skill so maybe I might learn

[dreamy spade]

Ill record it next time

It getting benind thats the problem

[slate hawk]

Why couldn't the names be easy to understand like a V2?

[dire olive]

Not grimdank enough I guess

https://tenor.com/view/cat-shake-head-sicko-mode-orange-tw-aesthetic-gif-22443433

[slate hawk]

I finally got the rescue 500 operatives border

Still need Dream team

[pastel geode]

New drip out?

[agile forge]

Is this workable as an anti-crusher weapon? Pairing it with a hellbore

[slate hawk]

I think?

[agile forge]

The guide says uncanny/thrust are the only blessings to consider

[slate hawk]

I believe thrust might be required

[agile forge]

but skullcrusher might be decent for the hordeclear?

[slate hawk]

But I could be wrong

[agile forge]

yeah, that was what I was thinking

skullcrusher/thrust might not be the worst, idk

I should probably just keep trying to make them but hadron and brunt are not helping on this particular craft

[slate hawk]

To understanding skull crusher is the only plus damage hoard clear for shovels

[agile forge]

in theory I'll be using my bayonet for that mostly

but I don't know how that works in practice

not having blocks and pushes sounds bad lol

[slate hawk]

https://youtu.be/MdYrUcrCbpw?si=hXdOPxpb16-Lj2A7

[slate hawk]

I know not everybody likes this man

But maybe this video might give you some knowledge

[vague smelt]

Just ignore the rant and just listen to what exactly puts in practice

[dawn garnet]

with tanner listen to descriptions and ignore opinions

[dawn garnet]

also idk about mk7 but with mk3 but decimator 4 is +80 damage at 10 stacks

i would rather go with the guide here uncanny thrust is better

[junior needle]

Tanner varies between reasonable or extremely questionable takes and is generally not to be trusted

Decimator is also a big pain in the ass to keep high stacks on

[hoary horizon]

Need good build to kill shooters so ogryn not get shot

[analog mural]

Colum mk 5 will never fail you

If you want anti shooter take exe stance and marksmen focus

[junior needle]

My favorite take is when he titles a video "Recons are GOOD" and says to ignore anyone who says otherwise, and then in his video states one of them is ok and the other two he considers bad

[hoary horizon]

Is it good or no!? Make up mind

[hoary horizon]

Have that but need more info on what use

[junior needle]

He knows they are bad, but wants to make a clickbait video

[hoary horizon]

So... he bait clicks? What is click? Fish? Why he want fish he hungry?

[dreamy spade]

I've been using the shovel since the start😎

[hoary horizon]

Am proud!

[analog mural]

I'm on mobile right now lul

[analog mural]

I would probably use something like this

[hoary horizon]

Thanks!

[slate hawk]

Probably a cringe take but I reject the veteran keystones

[hearty panther]

i went to double check and i do not use any keystones either

veteran tree is fucking cracked for choice, it's ridiculous

[slate hawk]

Almost too cracked lol

[tame lodge]

I'll make one about Eviscerators and just talk about the Mk15 for an hour

For the meme

[woeful ibex]

by may 31 right?

[serene bough]

Im guessing we'll see an update in april some time

[lavish solar]

Focus target is alright (not amazing but alright) imo

[serene bough]

all the keystones have their uses, but none of them are mandatory for a build

[lavish solar]

True

[tribal tangle]

I think weapon specialist is good, I use it on almost all of my melee builds

[serene bough]

MF is definitely the weakest of the bunch, but it has some use on certain weapons where it pushes it up a few breakpoints

[agile forge]

MF is great on IAGs

Variable damage boosts like that are bad for breakpoint focused weapons imo

It's like scrier's gaze and disrupt destiny

Better on precision rapid fire weapons with good Finesse multipliers

It also kinda leans on using your gun vs everything

[lavish solar]

Yeah but again focus target is a flat (albeit based on the level at time of application) damage increase that doesn’t really need ramping up so for killing elites and/or specials I feel like that’s maybe easier to use

I may be just dumb tho

[agile forge]

Yeah, I like FT a lot more for stuff like Plasma

It's the stronger option in general

[serene bough]

its weapon dependent, FT is great on things like plasma or bolter, whereas MF is better for weapons like krag mentioned

[agile forge]

But with an IAG I focus on clearing shooters too

And mowing down corridors etc

[lavish solar]

Makes sense, thanks!

[agile forge]

MF doesn't really care what I shoot at, special or regular shooter goon

[hearty panther]

all the keystones in isolation are ridiculously strong

[agile forge]

FT is definitely better but you can make specialised builds that abuse ES and MF in a really satisfying and powerful way, it's just you get sad if you're forced to fight in small rooms

[hearty panther]

the problem is reaching them vs. other ridiculously strong choices already in your tree

[agile forge]

The only bad keystone is burst limit override.

Which is ogryn only and even then you can use it with a flechette build

[hearty panther]

oh i meant veteran specifically

[lavish solar]

Interesting, I’ve never really tested MF in any extended form and now kind want to have a go at it

[agile forge]

Yeah, all of ours are great

[hearty panther]

cause yeah some keystones are meh

[agile forge]

I have a really bullshit PS6/CIAG build I could share

[hearty panther]

but vets are all arguably the best of any class lmao

[agile forge]

Give me a minute

[lavish solar]

Thanks!

[serene bough]

MF paradoxically works on weapons that you wouldn't expect it to work on

i.e. fast firing DPS weapons

whereas slower firing precision weapons it tends to be less meaningful on

[lavish solar]

Wait how does that work? I thought generally high rpm weapons have a relatively hard time scoring weak spot kills

[serene bough]

because after you bullethose a few headshots you get a massive finesse multiplier to further increase your DPS

[agile forge]

It helps to have E stance too

Since that tames high-recoil weapons

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/build-editor?id=9bac38a0-aa51-470f-a78e-e4c2b3c5ee4c

[lavish solar]

Ahh that makes sense

[agile forge]

Be warned, this build has no grenade talents lmao

It's best run with at least 2 stamina curios too

As I said, highly unstable absolute bullshit

[lavish solar]

I imagine also hits like a truck when ads-ing

[agile forge]

But the power

[lavish solar]

psyker voice SUCH POWER! SUCH POWER!!!

[serene bough]

I use MF on my Mg4 iLas because it's helps to bump up a few breakpoints and compensates for its general lack of firepower, but I dont use MF on my Mg1a iLas because exec stance can bump up a lot of breakpoints without needing MF

[agile forge]

I would also try it with headhunter autoguns

[sinful jacinth]

"Unpopular opinion" you don't need grenades.

[agile forge]

Possibly accatran laspistol

Tbh with this build you do miss them a bit

Small rooms will kill you

[serene bough]

maybe you don't need grenades, but you'll miss your shredder frags when they clean an entire shotgunner patrol for 0 effort

[agile forge]

But you are the undisputed king of hallways

ES and CIAG deals with the shotguns np

[lavish solar]

Headhunter, especially MK7, is in a bit of a weird place imo as they just somehow naturally hit a lot of headshot breakpoints without needing the damage boost from ES or (I think) MF

[sinful jacinth]

I dunno. One time event or more points in stuff you get to use all the time.

[serene bough]

gunner patrols are very common

[agile forge]

You are the king of antishooter with this

[sinful jacinth]

It is satisfying if you can do it not gonna lie.

[agile forge]

It's not the gunners and shitgunners that make you miss the grenades

It's just the poxwalkers

You want to avoid getting gummed up and tied into melee

[sinful jacinth]

Yes, but if your team know what they are doing. They are already gone before you can throw your grenates.

[serene bough]

in general shredders do everything sans carapace

hell, if you have a weapon w/ uncanny strikes they can even deal with carapace

[slate hawk]

I just wish you could mark more than one enemy

[sinful jacinth]

Yes and no.

Useful when used right.

in lower ranks spam will happen like crazy.

Everything will light up.

[serene bough]

conversely, if you know what you're doing you can clear the patrol before you team even realizes there was one

[lavish solar]

Yeah I do hate it when I mark a boss and the 5 seconds later reflectively mark that poxhound running toward me

[slate hawk]

8/10 times my team doesn't know what there doing, at least it feels like it sometimes

[serene bough]

technically you dont "need" them to win, but it's just so much power considering how easily spammable they are thanks to multiple grenade regen perks

[agile forge]

Yeah, I'm just saying that the part of my kit which is deficient is in melee generally (since it only really has the power sword with no backup)

Melee and dealing with multiple Crushers (and you're not even weak, just slightly slow and methodical)

[prisma herald]

what does blessing "+1 wounds" mean?

[last parcel]

it splits your health bar to have another segment, so you can go down one more time before dying

[prisma herald]

i see, thank you

seems like i also figured the secret difficulty? was hitting the belts and i got teleported infront of the lair)

[serene bough]

if you do the secert hardmode on a lower difficulty, you'll be able to unlock a bell that lets you spawn in there immediately without going through the whole sequence again, just FYI

that way you can instantly go to the boss fight on damnation

[prisma herald]

ohhh i see

[radiant willow]

I know it's a bit subjective but do we have a best lasgun? I like laser guns and want to use them but I usually see revolver or bolter

[prisma herald]

i feel the same, but from what i asked seems like they aren't really good

compared to other weapons

i might try the laspistol though

[serene bough]

recons bad, ilas and helbore are good

pistols are also okay i think but I dont use them often

[radiant willow]

I hear that the laspistol is a Crit machine so that might be a good idea atleast I'm still using laser gun

[serene bough]

considering their mobility and quick draw time it's definitely a solid option for melee hybrid builds

they do a decent amount of damage to flak to assist in dealing with ragers and maulers

[lyric dock]

That is true

And a fun fact. Laspistol has a base crit chance of 15%

Even worth attempting to salvage from Brunt....Probably not

[agile forge]

I think laspistols are probably the best class of laser weapon tbh

They tend to get more favour from zealots and psykers though

Built in suppression immunity is really nice too

Great weakspot multiplier too

[lavish solar]

Wait what

[tiny summit]

I like the laspistol. It's good. They don't answer all your problems like the other top weapons but all lasguns are good except for recons

[agile forge]

Yeah, certain weapons ignore suppression

laspistols and plasma guns both do for example, iirc

[tiny summit]

Laspistols and helbores

[agile forge]

you can also use executioner's stance to make yourself immune on other weapons

[lavish solar]

Laspistols does that even when ads-ing?

[tiny summit]

Yes

[agile forge]

really helps you out if you're in a face-to-face shootout

[lavish solar]

Hmmmmmm that might be the reason I like to use it on zealot then

[tiny summit]

Or if it's not immunity it's really not affected

[lavish solar]

I found it very easy to use without ever noticing the suppression immunity

[agile forge]

My zealot uses a Zarona which is very much not suppression immune lmao

[tiny summit]

I liked my Exe MF laspistol games. Pretty fun since it easily keeps MF stacks up even while strafing around

[agile forge]

Yeah, that sounds like a solid combo

I'd consider running that with shout perhaps too, since it's already suppression immune

[tiny summit]

Don't care for shout

[agile forge]

but the damage bonus and enemy highlighting is great

so many good elements to ES

and it's still weaker than old volley fire lmao

[tiny summit]

But it's still lacking to just how much value VoC gives. VoC was a mistake

[vernal harbor]

LETS GET TO THE KILLING

https://tenor.com/view/unrelenting-force-fus-ro-da-gif-12260139

the implication the shout can stop the momentum of large monsters is hilarious

“okay fuck man” - plague ogryn

“shit”

[tiny summit]

The real lore is that the vet is saying a chaos slur that even heretics are like "woah man..."

[vernal harbor]

“wtf dude you’re gonna get canceled for that don’t say that”

[jaunty sphinx]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7DPyLbiMzI

this but with the vet

[lavish solar]

Yeah, my vet laspistol build uses shout and (I think) most of the grenade-related talents there is. It’s for the memes but also surprisingly fun to play with

[agile forge]

VoC just needs a longer CD imo

It's fine on a 30s cooldown, but no veteran has ever had to wait 30s between uses of it because of the CDR

[prisma herald]

and the autopistol?

[agile forge]

Autopistol simply isn't very good

very bad finesse values

it used to be carried by Pinning Fire being OP but now it's crap so it's just a bad (but faster) braced autogun

[hearty panther]

it has one niche and it's murderizing any maniac between you and fifteen meters

[agile forge]

you can get some value out of inspiring barrage with it

and just treat it as a toughness battery

oh yeah, good antimaniac

[hearty panther]

but like, REALLY good

[prisma herald]

i see

kinda makes me sad that most weapons aren't really that good

mostly meaning recon lasguns by that

[agile forge]

I think you can kinda make the 6d work with Onslaught, and the 7a isn't so bad too

but they're still mostly just bad, ammo guzzling IAGs

with better recoil, fancier graphics

and shitty shitty fucking shit maniac and finesse multipliers lol

[prisma herald]

yeah, was trying that with onslaught before, but it doesn't really work well due to the low dmg imo

like, it works

but there are better options

[agile forge]

It's really hard for me to come off of my CIAG honestly

[prisma herald]

although, the autopistol is pretty nice for pleb cleaning

[prisma herald]

CIAG?

[agile forge]

Columnus Infantry Autogun

[prisma herald]

ohhh

[vague smelt]

Columnus getting nerfed this year

I can smell it

[prisma herald]

trying it with smokes and infiltrate rn

[agile forge]

tbh if you have smokes and infiltrate, you probably have a melee that's handling the plebs already

I'd probably take a revolver or a plasma in that set-up

[prisma herald]

i see

[violet shell]

Started my first vet today. Any suggestions for weapons, curios, and skills? (Wanting to go shout on skill tree)

[gray crown]

Someone (don't remember the name) made a very funny and interesting video on a vet that uses zero keystones and instead just spams frag grenades for specialist and heavy enemies control, with the shout skill for incredible toughness boosts

That might be a build to look into

So the point is to just take frag grenades, all four grenade upgrades, the shout ultimate with only one of the upgrades (not the one that revives allies) and the skill that reduces the skill countdown time by 6s every time you kill a specialist

[lavish solar]

That or take krak instead of frag and make sure to carry the ammo box

Then if and when a boss appears

Drop said ammo box and shower the boss with all the krak grenades it could ever want

[gray crown]

The issue with krak is that it doesn't have the very efficient stagger and bleed that the frags have

And iirc kraks also have one less grenade reserve

[lavish solar]

True, I’m suggesting taking it for maximum boss delete memeing capability xd

[lavish solar]

Yes so a default of 2 instead of 3

[agile forge]

tbh an autogun can already meme on bosses to a ridiculous extent with dum dum and raking fire

[gray crown]

Yep, thing is this is a control and party survivability-oriented build, not really a boss-one-shot build, so krak technically weakens the point of this build

[agile forge]

huh, actually, maybe veteran has the lowest boss meme capability thinking about it

zealots have bonkhammers

ogryn have PBB fire

psykers have SG/DD CIAG degeneracy

[lavish solar]

Okay that makes a lot of sense

[agile forge]

MF/ES is good too but a little less silly

and stops after 5 seconds on a boss

[gray crown]

Lemme see if I can find the video again

[lavish solar]

thanks！

[gray crown]

https://youtu.be/nBCn8qIPebk?feature=shared

Here it is

[lavish solar]

Watching rn

[gray crown]

Have fun

[violet shell]

Thank you

[dire olive]

I don't take keystones on most of my own builds tbh

Vet has a lot of good talents

[shadow aurora]

Fourth keystone???

[dire olive]

(none)

[gray crown]

Watch the vid lol

[shadow aurora]

Oh i thought i missed a patch sjsldnxowlamz

[shadow aurora]

No

[gray crown]

Then Rogue gave the answer lul

Fourth keystone: none

[dire olive]

[tall torrent]

He’s wrong on a lot of notes

Not exactly to his fault

Because the game doesn’t explain everything that it should

[raw steppe]

tbh i dont think there's any point to not taking a keystone anymore

i think it made sense when p13 came out and the vet tree was a huge clusterfuck

but given the reworks and the compacting, you can take everything you want + sink 1 point for tag/weapon spec now

[wanton dawn]

There is no way a keystoneless build cannot be improved by taking focussed fire

[raw steppe]

and not sinking that 1 point just doesnt make a whole ton of sense

yes

exactly

[wanton dawn]

Unless your tag is unbinded

[raw steppe]

1 point for tag or 1 point for weapon specialist will 100% be better

than not taking it

[lavish solar]

I’m…

Wow

That video is something

Thanks, imma go throw grenades now

[wanton dawn]

Frags grenade spam in auric is real

[tall torrent]

Frag spam only really requires demo stockpile + demo team

[wanton dawn]

I can get 15-20% dmg out of frag in a game

[lavish solar]

Actually how much mileage does demo team provide

[wanton dawn]

The higher the diff, the better it is

[lavish solar]

I feel like it’s heavily affected by game intensity but never systematically tested it out

[wanton dawn]

Absolutely bonker in no ammo maelstrom

[tall torrent]

HiSTG = profit

[lavish solar]

Okay I see

[wanton dawn]

I can get 250k dmg from frags in a game

[tall torrent]

It’s avg 1 nade for every 20 elite/special kills

[lavish solar]

And it counts as long as someone in coherency kills right?

[wanton dawn]

Not actually reliant on coherency

[tall torrent]

Huh

[wanton dawn]

Might want to retest that one though

[tall torrent]

It’s 5% for any elite/special killed anywhere?

I thought coherency

[wanton dawn]

To be rechecked

[lavish solar]

I mean if it’s anyone within coherency it’s already very good

If it’s anywhere that’s even better

[tall torrent]

TLDR is if you’re playing Hi-Hunt / HiSTG, you’re gonna be getting a lot of extra grenades over the course of 1 mission

[wanton dawn]

It also makes charismatic worst

[lavish solar]

Got it

Thanks!

[wanton dawn]

I have launch up to 80 grenades on some mission

[tall torrent]

And
Keystonless is not very worth it on veteran

[wanton dawn]

Is there really a class where keystoneless make sense ?

[lavish solar]

I agree with that, although for the most part I just take focus target since it’s the most braindead to use

[tall torrent]

Especially if you’re going for grenade spam of all builds

[raw steppe]

no lol.

there's no opportunity cost to keystones

there's a only all benefit and no downside

p13 vet had a case because you needed so many talent points to path to and invest into a keystone

but nowadays the tree is compacted and the keystones are very close

[wanton dawn]

P13 keystone were not vet keystone though

[tall torrent]

It’s pretty hard to find 2 points on the tree that really compete with “+15.5% dmg”

[raw steppe]

cuz i think you used to have to take a bunch of useless nodes

like born leader

to get to the keystones lmao

[tall torrent]

Born leader (with a specific build) is actually not shit

[wanton dawn]

... i had forgotten mandatory born leader

[tall torrent]

But yea back then born leader was horrible

[raw steppe]

I kinda would be happy if DT went a little bit wilder

with the keystone design

like for example, if zealot's keystones had both a upside AND a downside

[tall torrent]

If u run gloryhunter plasma then born leader can get very strong

[raw steppe]

where psyker's had an additional gear slot where they can have like a "focus" or something, that'd be perks/blessings on their blitz