veteran-class

[late hatch]

yeah its also hard to play "properly" while you are talking, but it was pretty obvious they dont actually know how to play the game at anything beyond a casual level

[timid otter]

I wouldnt be surpised if recons are low tier

[serene bough]

https://tenor.com/view/palpatine-star-wars-emperor-do-it-go-for-it-gif-17446081

[timid otter]

but competeing with the lawbringer is something

I hate recons generally speaking so i never bothered building any.

A straight laser with no recoil wasn´t that interesting of a weapon.

[frank basin]

Is a laser weapon

Ofc laser has no recoil

[junior needle]

So here's a baseline comparison of maniac dps, with the ciag being the IAG rep. Max or near max damage stats, gray, talentless.

[serene bough]

he did it lads

he posted the vids

[junior needle]

IAG's are finesse weapons btw

And the damage difference becomes much bigger when you show headshots

[stone dome]

where new guns

[soft blade]

they kind of are doe

[timid otter]

I dunno

they never relessaed

[soft blade]

gone

[late hatch]

dust and fumes and crush hazard etc, i have a fork ticket and did it casual for a bit. not the worst job around but not my cuppa. i loved building. out in the fresh air, travel to diff places, meet lots of people. sure there were downsides too

[soft blade]

lost to time

[tall torrent]

Idk man putting HB3 over HB1 and HB2 is some special dedication

[frank basin]

No compensation on injuries

[potent iris]

my brother does removalist work and likes it though you obvs get some nightmare fuel whenever you have to clear out a hoarder house or smth

[junior needle]

Here's headshots. Recons suffer from very low baseline dps, poor modifiers to multiple damage types (typically unyielding/maniac with only 7a not having worse unyielding damage for some reason), and terrible ammo economy even with shocktrooper.

That ciag does 2944 headshot dps without crits btw.

[late hatch]

you pay for your own insurance. and as a contractor I earned some pretty decent $

[frank basin]

Corporation indeed

[serene sage]

that's more on the goverment imo

[late hatch]

yeah ive done some work for the NDIS, and some of the places i worked on where so disgusting. people with 5 cats and they never empty the litter box etc

[frank basin]

Well the company itself won’t pay injuries. Government kinda little bit ignore people getting killed by job incidents

[forest scaffold]

I'd honestly say that the recon lasguns are balanced well

and its everything else that's the problem

instead of people arguing the other way around

way too much shit is super overtuned for no reason

[frank basin]

@junior needle

[late hatch]

I live in Australia. we have pretty good regulation and workers rights here

[frank basin]

Oh, then in US are not

[junior needle]

Everyone must do watergun dps and take forever to kill things

[serene sage]

it depends. if you are an employee then you have worker's comp
if you're a contractor then youre on your own (but you are basically your own boss as well)

[forest scaffold]

the lasguns don't even if you build em out correctly in the tree

they're just not as braindead overpowered as the colomnus IAG

[frank basin]

I see

[junior needle]

They still do very poorly by comparison to even the other iag's.

[forest scaffold]

That's uh

[timid otter]

I dont fundamentally think that strong weapons are even the problem

[forest scaffold]

my point soldier

nerf everything else to bring the recons back in line

[timid otter]

I think the problem is when a weapon like the colomnus takes the job of every other actual gun.

[forest scaffold]

instead of buffing the recons

[keen sedge]

what perks should i use on plasma gun

[forest scaffold]

maniac/anything

[serene sage]

so... the strong weapons are the problem?

[forest scaffold]

unarmored, elites, carapace, unyielding, flak

it just doesn't matter

so long as you get maniac on there

[timid otter]

Nah more that it completely outcompetes what other weapons like braced, other infantry are doing.

It performs better then them at pratically every range, situation.

[forest scaffold]

Yes.

[serene sage]

yeah, that's why it's a problem

[timid otter]

The plasma does still have its weaknesses

[serene sage]

idk boss

[forest scaffold]

not. . . realy

[serene sage]

[forest scaffold]

mostly swap swap keystone though

[junior needle]

Can't really agree with this notion, would just make the game miserable for everyone. Especially if you're aiming for mk2 levels of dps.

[timid otter]

Theres atleast some drawbacks when using a plasma compared to ex a bolter.

Their minor sure

but they exist.

[forest scaffold]

I mean, I'm not calling for no buffs. The mk2 and mk6 are just outright bad

only the 7a is acceptable

bring the 2 and 6 up to the 7a

fix their maniac modifier across the board a bit

[junior needle]

The 6 actually has the best baseline dps (with rending). The 7a is the middle of the pack.

[forest scaffold]

7a has less problems with range

We're not shooting at pointblank 24/7

just ragers and maulers, usually.

But on everything else 7a comes out ahead

[junior needle]

Rending counters damage falloff

It really doesn't

[forest scaffold]

sooooooooooooooooooorta

rending doesnt apply to unarmored

so dreg stalkers/dreg machinegunners/dreg shotgunners are completely unaffected by rending

and you can kill a flak shotgunner/machinegunner in about .25s or so with a recon

regardless of rending or not

[junior needle]

True, but you don't exactly need fantastic performance on unarmored compared to other types.

[junior needle]

Don't both of the latter have flak parts?

[forest scaffold]

and veteran has access to power sword and rashad combat axe

so there's no reason to shoot crushers/maulers

[forest scaffold]

their heads are unarmored

and that's where I'm shooting

[serene bough]

headshots on these dudes is flak

[forest scaffold]

I don't shoot bruisers

I melee them

[junior needle]

Mhm, well the 6d doesn't have that bad unarmored modifier. But for your viewing pleasure, you may observe the dps differences with just rending taken into account.

The 7a is about 210 dps behind the 6d. When modifiers are ironed out, which they should be if you're using recon as the rending talents are mandatory, it just does less dps.

[forest scaffold]

unless im using a plasma gun

and can line the pack up

then they get fuckin yeeted with the fury of a 1000 suns

[serene sage]

Thousand Sons?

traitor

[forest scaffold]

my backup keyboard is bigger than my old one

muscle memory made me a traitor

my fingies dont know where to go on this keyboard

[stiff merlin]

I don't think that's fair, can you imagine spending your whole working day working on a game to come home and then play your work? Plus, if you have family and kids you don't have that much time to actually play a game. Also, there's a big difference between Developers, the people with the big ideas who design stuff, and Developers, the people that do the heavy lifting, and the Developers who are the balance team for any kind of game that is live or competitive. As a person who also plays War Thunder, I know these are distinctive teams of people and to expect them to have time to, much less want to actually play their game is a big ask. That's why we have playtesters. Though, the gaming industry is also vastly soulless like most industries.

[frank basin]

[forest scaffold]

I also forgot how much I hate memchanical keyboards

so much god damn pressure to activate a button

I miss my cherry mx reds

[serene sage]

but but mx reds are mechanical 😔

[forest scaffold]

I love mechanical keyboards

and specifically cherry mx reds the most, even if they're kinda loud

[keen sedge]

this fucking game on god sometimes
https://medal.tv/games/warhammer-40000-darktide/clips/1TBzzjEqgt8o08/d1337ctAjGGI?invite=cr-MSxYclgsMTkxMDIyMjAyLA

[late hatch]

while in same cases I agree, look at palworld. $10k usd budget, most of the modelling done by a kid who worked part time in a totally unrelated job. massive success.
people who love the games they make i think do a better job in the majority of cases

[serene sage]

my bb

[serene sage]

I... think that's embellishment

[forest scaffold]

yeah I think that's something people tend to forget

If you spend 40 hours a week on something, sometimes 60-80

[serene sage]

can I get a source on that? cause from what I can tell Palworld takes a lot more than that

[forest scaffold]

you're NOT using it as part of a hobby

[late hatch]

MS has reached out and giving them a lot of support now to get it onto xbox

[forest scaffold]

so developers don't actually spend a ton of time learning the game

just making it, and using internal metrics and a hired crew of specifically trained game testers to sus out problems

[timid otter]

Im pretty sure FS has some devs that actually need to spend time playing the game

Mostly due to the genre

[serene sage]

which is very fair, I don't expect a guy who makes the tire for F1 cars to be a good F1 racer, no matter how passionate that dude is about racing.

[timid otter]

The main thing im pointing towards is the combat of the game that needs testing.

[junior needle]

Which results in a lot of developers making games that they do not really understand on a gameplay level, and some of these developers are in charge of balancing it too.

It happens with league where the balance team is usually silver level players who theorycraft and only occasionally is a higher ranked player temporarily shuffled into there so riot can go "look our balance team isn't actually silver".

[timid otter]

I know also already from information that fatshark has a dedicated team that works on combat.

They are the ones that design the actual weapons for the game, their movesets.

[forest scaffold]

I straight up can't really be assed to care for this, if I'm being honest. They're people. They deserve to find their own hobbies, not make their WHOLE life about a game because they happen to work on it.

[somber axle]

Can we get a bolt pistol

Want a pistol that hits hard and doesn't feel piddly like the new laspistol variant

[forest scaffold]

People who get madge at devs not understanding their games are vile.

Simple as.

[junior needle]

I only care about how good they're doing on the game. If fatshark devs can make good balance decisions only playing occasionally in malice, I don't really care.

But if understanding the game at a high level is crucial to good balancing, which it overwhelmingly is, them game familiarity should be part of the job they get paid for.

[forest scaffold]

Well, ideally, they'd hire a completely separate team to do that.

Which is what fatshark has.

There's a group of people who explicitly only work on the combat.

[hearty panther]

no im pretty sure the guy who designs the ferraris is also a world class racer

how else would he design the cars

duh

[forest scaffold]

I can only imagine they're at least more than passingly familiar with the mechanics.

[serene sage]

you are deliberately missing the point

also I said the dude who made the tire

[late hatch]

idk its kinda like if you get a movie with a bad soundtrack and then go well the musician is just doing it to get paid, you cant expect them to actually care about bringing out emotion and building suspense with a finely crafted score. just be happy they know how to play a few instruments

[serene sage]

so you're not even right on technicality

[forest scaffold]

it absolutely is not

as the musician is there doing ONE job

people get mad at the WHOLE development team

like the guy building the backend has anything to do with the information he's plugging in

its someone else taking care of the damage numbers, for example - and another dude plugging that lego in

[hearty panther]

no puri its all one guy

a sooper expert

[serene sage]

it's john darktide himself

[late hatch]

bit of a strawman. we direct criticism towards the dev team because it is their job to do the whole thing, including making sure all the depts are doing their job right. just like the director usually gets the flak even when it wasnt actually a problem with directing

and most people cbf to learn all the individual positions and who is actually responsible for things can be difficult to determine from the outside

[zenith hinge]

not that we could really know for sure

[frank ether]

doing that opens the witch hunting can of worms

I'm not gonna name and shame individuals when dislike an aspect of a game

thats ridicilous

[serene sage]

scapegoat the fuck out of the intern

[serene bough]

all and all i think FS have done pretty well so far

[frank ether]

doing that is the pathway to real toxicity not the other way around

[serene bough]

game launched like trash but they've really come around over the last year

ive played games far worse in regards to developer competency

[hearty panther]

something ill remember maybe forever is battlefield 4. everybody knew suppression really sucked and weapon recoil was way much and people pilloried the balance team over it

[frank ether]

I'd agrree

there are far worse out there

[late hatch]

yandere simulator

[hearty panther]

then it turns out the problem was that every recoil effect was a hardcoded animation, not a value you could change, and the animation team was too busy making the DLCs

[serene sage]

one thing that I dislike is that some people just dogpile on a game for the drama

[hearty panther]

so it took two years to fix it because well money politics really

[serene sage]

people love a dumpster fire

[frank ether]

some games deserve it

[serene sage]

and some games have to be that

[frank ether]

Its usually

more to do with

marketing and monetization decisions

than individual game design choices

PD3 got a lot of flak for being ''always online'' (except when servers are down lmao) and you know lackluster content game with DLC at launch

[late hatch]

always online games set themselves up for backlash if they dont handle it well. its pretty bad when you cant play a game you paid for properly due to bad servers and stuff. DT has had this problem a bit too

[frank ether]

If you're doing live service you put yourself in that position willingly yeah

[timid otter]

DT launch was something else.

Ive not really had a game with such a bad launch before

[frank ether]

Its amazing it didn't die as fast as PD3 did

but the thing is people liked core gameplay at launch

unlike payday

the opinion was game cool, everything else surrounding it is rough

[timid otter]

Performance issues, ai issues, terrible grind. And the devs only releassed the cash shop from beta to launch.

[frank ether]

yea cash shop was there before crafting

and crafting launch was a disaster

[timid otter]

The amount of glitches in the game was also not fun

[serene sage]

ive seem a lot worse lmao

Payday3

Warcraft 3 Reforge

[timid otter]

I remember veteran taking damage through 100% toughness.

[iron marten]

Man, the days when you had more diamantine than plasteel

[timid otter]

I usally avoid launches but in darktides case i got a beta code.

[frank ether]

I just played vt2 very late and thought dt would release just as polished lmao

[zenith hinge]

that's now wdym

[iron marten]

ngl, FS making VT2 free, was a good move, else I wouldn’t have cared about DT

[tranquil bronze]

Dis gud yes?

[iron marten]

True… but at least it’s now possible to have more plasteel!

[crude fiber]

stats and onslaught good, everything else is meh

[tranquil bronze]

So what do I swap out Sustained for?

[crude fiber]

surgical, youll want unyielding/maniac for god roll imo

[tranquil bronze]

Flak is at least still decent so not too bad

[finite imp]

Y'all down have to run power sword and plasma

I'm just a day trader

I can just go home

I can make it worth your while

Take you to an ATM with 14 grand in it

[frank ether]

sure

I wouldnt really run flak but its fine I guess

if you have nothing better you can buy it

Its just that I think you already one shot flak enemies regardless

[junior needle]

It only took them around a year to get the game to a state it should've launched at

[woeful ibex]

comrades. Got this from Auric, are the blessings good?

[junior needle]

The blessings are good.

[umbral scaffold]

might want maniac

over flak

[junior needle]

Last I checked it already handles flak enemies quite well and maniac can get you bodyshot breakpoints

[woeful ibex]

alright

thanks

[civic knot]

WTF! This was an emperor's gift? Do you know how slim the chances of getting a 380 weapon from a match is?!!

[woeful ibex]

Auric man

One in a mill

[frank ether]

I believe it reduces mutant bp by one less shot

but I didnt do that math with keystones in mind

[serene sage]

me and the boys

[serene bough]

forgivable considering the gameplay was actually good, unlike others who stop working on it after a year or so

[serene bough]

is this game good

[serene sage]

yuh

it's a little grindy for sure

but I like

[serene bough]

still need to beat rogue trader

[torpid pier]

I have found out that i really hate plasma gun

most boring weapon I have played with yet in darktide

[zenith hinge]

I found it to be one of my favorite guns

[junior needle]

forgivable

[torpid pier]

being ammo hungry + heat absolutely kills my momentum and any fun I have

but I guess if I combine it with Psword it might be a little more fun

[serene sage]

embed????

[torpid pier]

but yea It's incredibly strong but really boring

[junior needle]

Quality discord embedding

[zenith hinge]

not supposed to spam it. plasma gun encourages using your melee weapon

[torpid pier]

yea that is what i noticed by the end of my first mission with plasma gun

[serene sage]

.............

[torpid pier]

Need all rounder like Psword

[zenith hinge]

or starter shovel

[umbral scaffold]

or the devil claw sword... that thing is my go too

[torpid pier]

I am used to having 2 weapons that cover each other weaknesses

[zenith hinge]

starter shovel is epic

[serene sage]

I give up

[torpid pier]

but with Plasma and Psword they both kill everything and u just swap between them

[serene sage]

[torpid pier]

haven't really delved deep into shovel and Dclaw, might give them a try next

[zenith hinge]

plasma does kill everything but due to its nature it's specifically for single target, taking down "that fucker in particular" with a lot of armor

[serene sage]

single target
100 cleave

[torpid pier]

yea i get what u mean

[serene sage]

[zenith hinge]

if you use it fir crowd clear you're using it wrong

[serene sage]

idk man

plasma is not single target , it's single direction

[umbral scaffold]

lmao yep

[serene sage]

it deletes a direction

not target

[torpid pier]

yea It was my first mission with plasma gun and it just felt super awkward

[zenith hinge]

it doesnt hit in a wide enough area, nor is it ammo efficient enough, to be a crowd clear weapon

[umbral scaffold]

its that one phyker staff in gun form

[serene sage]

idk man

[torpid pier]

yea While using it on crowd clearing the ammo disappeared quick

even with survivalist

[umbral scaffold]

so use knife rather than gun

save bullet

[zenith hinge]

if it were ammo efficent yeah you could crowd clear, but survivalist aint gonna cover you enough for that, and there's plenty of tools that do crowd clear waaaaaaay better even just in the gun category, let alone melee and blitz

[torpid pier]

so I just went the majority of the end part of the mission with my melee and grenade for clearing

[umbral scaffold]

yeah might even be worth taking frags over krak grenades

[zenith hinge]

easily

[umbral scaffold]

though krak nades are fun

[torpid pier]

I had shredder with 60sec replenish + 5% chance replenish so my shredder grenade were carrying a bit

[zenith hinge]

shredder grenades compliment plasma way better

no need for anti armor grenade when your gun is a krak with no cooldown

[torpid pier]

oh also 20% chance to throw 2 grenades

for horde clearing

which prob is an overkill but yea

[zenith hinge]

nah it isnt

[torpid pier]

but yea gonna try plasma again when i get power cycler tier 4 on psword

seems like an interesting combination

but otherwise gonna put plasma gun on hold for now

[umbral scaffold]

so whatcha picking up

[zenith hinge]

all personal preference

[torpid pier]

not sure i keep cycling through new stuff

might try bolter next

[umbral scaffold]

not a bad thing to do to be honest

[tall torrent]

U don’t rly need it

[torpid pier]

I love my Vrak 7 and Bolter is close to home for me so probably gonna enjoy it

[tall torrent]

It doesn’t proc enough of the time to matter in times when it would matter a lot

[torpid mortar]

how does one get the rights to post pictures? is it just activity?

[zenith hinge]

so I'm trying to play around with marksmans focus. probably wont fit my playstyle in the end, but I need some help theorycrafting ideas. please dont offer any meta related comments

[tall torrent]

MF is not bad with high finesse guns like vraks3 and laspistol2

[torpid pier]

yea wish in scoreboard u can see grenade dmg only so I can compare a run with and without

[tall torrent]

Just demo stockpile + demo team is enough most of the time

[umbral scaffold]

i wish i didnt need a mod to see my damage

[torpid pier]

prob the case

[tall torrent]

Remember that grenade blast & bleed dmg inherit perks & +dmg blessings from the weapon in your hand

[zenith hinge]

vraks3 has high finesse?

[torpid pier]

yea absolutely, but some people feel it could be toxic. Seen that debate on many different games lol

[torpid mortar]

oh man, I tried marksman focus and really didn't like it for some reason

[tall torrent]

It’s not that high (like v7) but it can crank out a very hilarious amount of damage because of HH+DA combo

[torpid pier]

Woooah, i actually didn't know that. ty for thatinfo

[zenith hinge]

whats hh and da?

[tall torrent]

Headhunter + deadly accurate blessing combo

[zenith hinge]

I'm not a Vet main so not very lingual here

[tall torrent]

You have to have both of these on vraks3

[trim steppe]

those are blessings, Headhunter and Deadly Accurate

[zenith hinge]

ah deadly accurate, the funny blessing

[tall torrent]

But once you do (and the perks aren’t complete garbage), it’s one of the highest dps guns you can have

[umbral scaffold]

yeah but for self improvement and also just progressing through the game it helps by acting as a trackable metric, though yeah alot of pricks who will just flame the poor performing people though dont think its worth not having

[junior needle]

All the headhunters do

[zenith hinge]

I already have and enjoy the laspistol so might try that first

[tall torrent]

V3 finesse is nerfed btw

Can still kill crushers with like 2.4k dps

[zenith hinge]

whats the difference between laspistol 2 and X?

[tall torrent]

X is slower firerate more break-point focused and has better carapace modifier (still not good)

Mk2 is faster firing less focused on breakpoints and just a spam gun

Both have high finesse

They all have pretty drastic dmg falloff over range so you rly want to stick to up to around 20m for most of ur fights (if you don’t run longshot talent)

[zenith hinge]

nah the leaderboards removal was very much a good thing. mot for the sake of toxicity, but because it can never portray the value of builds that provided defense and crowd control instead of damage. you can already feel very clearly when you're performing well or not, or at least if you were contributing as much as others, dont need a leaderboard to tell you that

[tall torrent]

Also mk10 has a little more visual recoil

Actual recoil-wise both have none

But mk2 has like actually zero visual recoil

[zenith hinge]

can carapace damage be good enough when combined with say, +20% rending and carapace perk do you think?

[tall torrent]

Mk2 uses 2 ammo per shot
Mk10 uses 3 ammo per shot

[torpid mortar]

I mean, the leaderboard stats shouldn't affect you that much. I just enjoyed comparing things when I was playing with friends

[trim steppe]

How much would I notice 25% maniac and/or T4 DA?

[tall torrent]

It can be ok for a laspistol but won’t kill crushers nearly fast enough compared to actual anti-carapace weapons

[zenith hinge]

rip

maybe if I can pair it with onslaught... but I already have that build but without marksman

[tall torrent]

You don’t need onslaught for the vast majority of weapons

[zenith hinge]

it's so much anti-armor though. the brittleness is really nice, especially if you dont bring kraks or single target melees

[tall torrent]

It’s only good for killing crushers with high firerate guns that aren’t good vs carapace but the point sink is real and you’re always at a huge ammo deficit going for crusher kills with your gun

[zenith hinge]

worked wonders for my shredder

[tall torrent]

It’s usually better to just use smth that didn’t suck vs carapace in the first place

[zenith hinge]

but that's the ideal weapon for it so yea

[tall torrent]

Also onslaught being applied on DoT got patched

[zenith hinge]

oh I didnt even know it used to do that

[tall torrent]

So there’s rly no reason to take it unless u specifically want to kill crushers with autoguns (or recon lasgun if ur into that)

[junior needle]

Outside of crushers, it's very helpful on a few automatics for helping with negative modifiers and falloff damage.

[zenith hinge]

unfortunately most of the weapons that are ammo efficient enough to be your primary weapon suck against armor

[torpid mortar]

lazgun with infernus kinda helps for terrible armor performance for me

[junior needle]

Onslaught is quite good itself, the only downside is the point sink if you aren't going right side

[torpid mortar]

oh yeah I am invested in onslaught as well

[junior needle]

Well, maybe not depending on your gun

[torpid mortar]

but hey my lazgun can easily kill 3 crushers with one mag

[junior needle]

It's not good on semis

[trim steppe]

could always run plasma then xD it is a great anti armor primary

[torpid mortar]

nah, I mean my MK VI d lazgun

[zenith hinge]

ye but I'm tryna make a marksman build

plasma dont go well with marksman methinks

or maybe it does if I plan on shooting multiple enemies in a row

[junior needle]

You absolutely do want it on that, and also rending strikes. On an infantry las/laspistol/hb3 onslaught would be bad though.

Just as a heads up, the recons are notorious underperformers atm.

[torpid mortar]

I got really lucky with my first lazgun right after reaching level 30 on my vet.
I would send a pic of the roll but I don't have image perms yet

[torpid mortar]

oh yeah, I use rending strikes as well

[junior needle]

If you message it to me I can appraise it for you

[torpid mortar]

ok

you probably have to check your message requests

[tall torrent]

It’s ok for recons but that’s about it

[umbral scaffold]

ok so the replacement to a trackable set of values is just feels? you said it wasnt toxicity but because it wasnt an accurate way to value performance of stats like stagger, which the mod version so happens to track. not that i care to much the mod exists, it just seems pointless to remove the leaderboard, heck if you really wanted to just make a personally leaderboard that only shows your own stats i since vt2 have used that to make builds it is usefull dont blow it off because it didnt track stagger

[tall torrent]

The rest either don’t have horrendous modifiers or don’t shoot fast enough to make use out of it

[frank ether]

its fury of the faithful at home

[terse idol]

Well, it just depends on that point, I mean FS just lets you mod it

[tall torrent]

[junior needle]

On any automatic that has modifiers that dip below 85%~ it's a good pickup over rending strikes. Iag's start at like 72% on flak for example excepting the ciag, which has better modifiers close but much steeper falloff and it's very useful for that.

[terse idol]

I don't mind either way, and anytime my friends showed me their leaderboard it's just for my ego

[frank ether]

I think its pointless for slower firing ones

because you kill things in a few shots

I feel like its kinda for recon and ciag and thats it

there is also graia brauto I guess

[tall torrent]

Idk, I find rending strikes just generally a better pick if I wanted to go rending
Easy point investment & works all the time on all targets regardless of firerate

Onslaught is only really good for recon6d and columnus5

I don’t even think it’s worth it for the 600rpm guns like graia8

Just not enough value to justify point sink

[frank ether]

just better off putting those points to

juice your melee

which doesnt have problems like ''ammo''

[tall torrent]

For 4 points (if not spending into right tree) to get onslaught, you could be getting a lot of value that works much more universal than just to have smth that helps your high firerate gun deal with crushers (still not amazing at it)

[frank ether]

Its kind of a difficult node to balance so I feel like it will always suck

[junior needle]

It does depend on the gun, but it's hardly limited to recons (especially not only the 6d) and the ciag. You forget brautos and the autopistol.

Also, more universal armor type damage just for shooting things like you normally do is hard to beat.

[opaque kayak]

what to take for a speedy vet

[last parcel]

cocaine

[opaque kayak]

Well, yeah. And there are some obvious talents too, just trying to figure out how to max stamina and sprint.

[tall torrent]

Autopistol I guess? But onslaught only stacks on single target and the accuracy makes it a bit more difficult to stack on anything that’s either not very close to u or not very large

Braced autoguns, I tried and legit could not tell if it actually made my gun more effective compared to just running left tree with +15% elite, I think it’s a hard point sink unless you’re already running duck & dive to combo with stripped down

[rancid yarrow]

😭 damn i missed that, ty for the heads up (another nerf for recon lasguns smh)

[junior needle]

If you assume that any gun is going to miss all its shots then any talent is bad

And yes, you only get value for what you're shooting at. Much like other talents

[tall torrent]

I don’t assume missing all its shots, I just remember it only being able to stack on single targets

[junior needle]

You can run both elite and onslaught

[zenith hinge]

"feels" because being shown a list of numbers largely related to damage output gets the idea that damage output is all that matters, when cc and defense are extremely important in this game. of course damage is too, but cc and defense are crucial parts of giving yourself the opportunity to deal damage

[tall torrent]

That’s really point heavy and basically means no melee talents

It can work, I just didn’t find the investment very worth it

Besides the 2 super high firerate guns

[junior needle]

Back in my day we didn't have melee talents to hold our hands

[junior needle]

it a bit more difficult to stack on anything that’s either not very close to u or not very large
It's not that bad to the point that you can't hit anything that's outside of near melee range. I'm pointing out that's a bit of an exaggeration.

[tall torrent]

It’s more than melee range obv

But it’s not very far

For the braced guns

For autopistol you have about 9m to work with where the crosshair is about the same as as a mauler’s torso

[mellow sable]

Which is better to have on a chain axe thunderous 3 or slaughterer 4?

I have a pos chain axe that has those two and need to know which to turn in for

[tall torrent]

Slaughterer + headtaker pairs well (for both anti-armor and some horde clear)

Thunderous + bloodletter pairs well (more flexibility in dealing with elites via rev atks)

[mellow sable]

Ty

[junior needle]

Worth taking just for flak alone honestly, but the other two also have fairly steep falloff even if they start positive.

The accuracy is also not that bad up to 15m at least

[rain flower]

scale 1-10 how good is this and what should i change?

[junior needle]

On the agri brauto onslaught is not as good and can be substituted for rending strikes alone, assuming you don't care for crusher killing with it.

[tall torrent]

It’s workable, I guess I’m just too used to more accurate weapons

[junior needle]

Sadly I can't easily see the armor values for the other 2 variants because lmao no stopping power

[terse idol]

Pretty alright

Probably want to change Unyielding to Flak

And get a better DA

[rain flower]

i'm pretty sure i got a better one at hadron's

[tall torrent]

Btw question on autopistol

Does the spread increase horizontally like the crosshair suggests when u brace it?

[rain flower]

anything else apart from that?

[terse idol]

Nope

like

Maybe

[rain flower]

should be good for a sharpshooter build then

[terse idol]

Just getting another lasgun with a minimum 70 in all damage stats

63 damage hurts

[rain flower]

eh, it's an mg xii, hits like a truck anyway

[junior needle]

Seems to maintain roughly the same spread but the crosshair (and your camera) move around as you fire

Moves to the sides mostly

[terse idol]

I mean

Ahhh

you want every bit of damage

Also, I will preface to say, try the IA

It's just a better Mxii

[tall torrent]

Yea it still has pretty hefty recoil but I mostly just considered brace on autopistol as “minimize initial recoil for short-mid range”

[rain flower]

would, but the game either doesn't give me the IA or gives me crappy ones

[junior needle]

Brace is extremely necessary just to use the gun, the hipfire is awful

You should always brace it for every circumstance

[tall torrent]

I only use hipfire at very close range dw

[junior needle]

It looks like the flak modifier for non-agri brautos goes from 75% to 60% at range.

And their maniac mod goes from 100% to 80%

Unyielding seems to be the same, I'd say onslaught is worth it on them for flak

[tall torrent]

I wish graia4 braced had the same ads (braced in this case) move speed buff like MG4

[frank basin]

The what MG4 move speed buff?

[tall torrent]

MG4 moves noticeably faster than most other rifle-sized guns when you ads

And has the fastest sprint-to-fire out of all infantry lasguns

[frank basin]

No shit

[serene sage]

what is the mod that lets you skip the mourning star?

does anyone know the name?

[frank basin]

Skip mourning star so you can access missions terminal in menu?

[white minnow]

psych ward?

[frank basin]

Well if you don’t want in Morningstar and quick play mission through character selection is a can’t.

[white minnow]

you can with psych ward

[frank basin]

Shoot range/meat grinder

That possible to start mission?

[white minnow]

i mean that you can queue for a mission on the mission board from the character select screen

psych ward also lets you go to the meatgrinder from the character select

[frank basin]

There is mod for that let you go in meat grinder through character selection

Without entering Morningstar

[white minnow]

yeah that's psych ward

psych ward lets you do that as well as queue for the mission board

[frank basin]

Is mod menu iirc

[white minnow]

are you referring to this

[trim steppe]

Psych Ward, like Arcotash said. It's incredible, you can bypass the Mourningstar for EVERYTHING except completing your weeklies

[white minnow]

in the red square

if so, that's psych ward

damn do you have to load into the mourningstar to finish weeklies?

[frank basin]

More of a press esc and it give you all accessibility

[trim steppe]

yeah to collect the bonus 1000

[white minnow]

this?

[frank basin]

Correct

[white minnow]

modular menu buttons

[frank basin]

This one opposite

Can’t open mission terminal or quick play

But allow open melk bounty

[gaunt hinge]

runescapetide

[white minnow]

gamer graphics

the human eye can only see 4x4 textures

[frank basin]

I believe Darktide has some advance coding

I know nothing about graphic coding

[serene sage]

finally, matching helmet

[clever niche]

huh

where the camo pattern go

[serene sage]

how about now

[frank ether]

the lack of camo customization is rly holding this game back

[frank basin]

Are you using #for-The-drip?

[junior needle]

It's done on purpose to sell you low effort recolors made with an already in game color modification tool

[wanton dawn]

Doesnt hurt the bottom line

[shadow aurora]

Oh my goodness i think i just had the worst game of my life

Ogryn and psyker went down like ten times

[frank ether]

not in the short term

[shadow aurora]

Had to be rescued multiple times each

[serene sage]

final call on this drip or does it look dumb?

I kinda dig the pattern

[shadow aurora]

Drip

[frank basin]

Cartel pattern

[frank ether]

you rly do look like a cartel mercenary

[serene sage]

perfect

[frank basin]

[wanton dawn]

When gameplay ppl start taking interest in drips is when game start to die

[serene sage]

im here to kick ass and fuck bitches
and bitches don't like me

so

you know

[frank basin]

Like team fortress 2

[frank ether]

I wouldn't neccessarily agree

[shadow aurora]

Oh wait nvm

[frank basin]

Did drg dying?

[frank ether]

you can be competent at a game and care for a little bit of drip

[shadow aurora]

No

Theyre doing great

Even if season four was underwhelming at best

[frank ether]

actually if it was up to me I would just want more penance gear unlockables

[frank basin]

What they have season four?

[frank ether]

as that is my preferred way of earning cosmetics

but games would rather just sell it to you outright

[shadow aurora]

More lithophage stuff stingtails which yank you from miles away flinging you through the air into a horde

And septic spreaders which are the worst

[frank ether]

I don't hate it

[frank basin]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patchy-the-pirate-thats-it-disappointed-gif-27280238

[shadow aurora]

Yep no new weapons or anything

[frank ether]

stingtails are nerfed now I think

still hella annoying but

[shadow aurora]

THANK GOD

[frank ether]

at least they die fast

[wanton dawn]

Half tf2 "skin" have gameplay effect though ?

[frank basin]

https://tenor.com/view/patchy-the-pirate-spongebob-spongebob-betrayed-us-betrayed-patchy-gif-27400564

[shadow aurora]

Septic spreaders still need toned down

[frank ether]

uh.. not really? just cosmetic

[shadow aurora]

They used to years and years ago

Now its only cosmetic

[frank basin]

Entire cosmetic just drip show

[frank ether]

I remember when sets were a thing that requires hats

that was like

decade ago

[frank basin]

Tf2 no longer merc killing but drip killing style

[wanton dawn]

Granted, tf2 is kinda living its life with a loyal playerbase

[silk nexus]

Do we get new cosmetics last Friday or are we getting them this Friday

[umbral scaffold]

fun fact those sets do in fact still do something (they place a little gravestone when you kill someone)

[shadow aurora]

"Living"? Things on life support its been in a coma for years

[frank ether]

Its still more active than

most other games

[wanton dawn]

I though we were talking about skin keeping game alive

[shadow aurora]

Oh for sure

[frank ether]

TF2 being on ''life support'' and simultenaously being one of the top games consistently every year

[frank basin]

Fan be like #savetf2

[shadow aurora]

Life support is the fanbase. Getting crumbs from valve

[frank basin]

Next 2027 tf2 gonna pull life support

Like valve loss interest

On tf2

Ending up like dirty bomb

[frank ether]

Giving players the tool to host their own server helps

doesnt matter if matchmaking is infested with bots because you can just ignore it

[shadow aurora]

Still. Bots are a major issue

That shouldve been fixed months ago

[wanton dawn]

Sounds like alive like sc1, or w3

[frank basin]

Coding to ban bot isn’t easy

For developer has big brain yes easy solve

But I don’t think this dev tf2 know how to solve bot problems

[shadow aurora]

Valve can do it. They simply choose not to. They want to use there recourses on there other games

[frank basin]

Rather fixing maps bugs

[wanton dawn]

Code to ban bot is arguably not standard programming skills

[frank basin]

Yeah they just make freenium not able to chat or use voice chat like bots until there’s premium bots got infested and completely failure the fixes

[frank ether]

like with cheating its just not simple

[frank basin]

Someone have minded to make bot able to cheat

Like a genius Black hat

[shadow aurora]

Yes its not simple I never said it was. If it was we wouldn't be having the issue in the first place

[frank ether]

thats not as difficult

its difficult to tell real player from bot without having people handling cases one by one

and no having super intrusive anti-cheat that sees your dirty folders can't do it either

[shadow aurora]

Valve has a shit ton of recources if they really wanted the issue gone they could do it

[wanton dawn]

It isnt that its difficult. But it is an ongoing arm race

[frank basin]

That’s the problem how to solve bot crisis when there’s one of them imposter player it.

[shadow aurora]

Yes so it's difficult?

[frank ether]

what tf2 needs is like actual updates to its code

its ancient

its a buggy mess

[frank basin]

True

[wanton dawn]

Personally i dont like coding stuff that die 2 months in

[frank basin]

VAC is outdated

[shadow aurora]

So fucked someone managed to trick people into thinking the game stops working if you remove a coconut png from the files

[frank basin]

If the bot coder does pay value $5 to steam and let bot roam free then valve are corrupted

[serene sage]

now that is quite something

should I main zealot now bous

[forest scaffold]

my favorite tinfoil hat theory pertains to tarkov in this regard

cheaters getting banned gives bsg more money

[shadow aurora]

Do you enjoy showering?

[forest scaffold]

so bsg. . . doesn't ban cheaters

[wanton dawn]

Fair

[forest scaffold]

you're missing the second part

[frank basin]

This is lobbying

[forest scaffold]

that makes it go from "understandable" to "what kinda crack"

[serene sage]

I bath everyday but only in the tears of the enemy

[shadow aurora]

Go ahead then ig

[forest scaffold]

but yeah, on the cheating topic

if your game becomes a target of cheaters, there's uh

nothing you can do

[wanton dawn]

You miss the tinfoil part

[frank basin]

Save tf2 just like save earth from plastic pollution

[wanton dawn]

Bsg... provide

[forest scaffold]

I dunno. I like tarkov. The cheating problem is rampant.

But its rampant in literally everything right now

[frank basin]

Like gta lobby

[forest scaffold]

so I just stopped caring.

if I get domed sussily whatever

put on a new kit and try again

its really not that hard to figure out

[shadow aurora]

Sussily

[frank basin]

It get boring being killed by cheaters constantly

Like playing impossible dark soul

[wanton dawn]

I mean, when ppl can pay 55$/m for a cheat software on LoL you know some dude will sell their soul

[forest scaffold]

what I have found surprising though is the absolute lack of cheaters in darktide

I've seen ONE video of a completely blatant aimbotter

[shadow aurora]

You can still win against certain cheaters depending on the game. Most cheaters are using it because they suck so they will have really ass positioning and game sense

[forest scaffold]

and spectated a random in my game that left as soon as they died

who were uh

strangely accurate

in 1700 hours I've only experienced one clear example, and seen in the community one example

[frank ether]

why would you cheat in this game though is the thing

[forest scaffold]

guess its just the nature of the game.

[frank ether]

like to what end goal besides ruining enjoyment of others

[wanton dawn]

0 incentive really. You can only make your pp hard by being so obvious ppl will just manual report you

[shadow aurora]

People cheat for whatever reason

[forest scaffold]

there's a million reasons to cheat

[frank basin]

They find is fun so they cheat

[shadow aurora]

Probably got mad about losing all the time

[forest scaffold]

making money, pp big hard

laziness

rage hacking

[frank basin]

Cheats is laughing and feeling godlike

[frank ether]

Its just not the same as rats using silent hacks in like tarkov or csgo or whatever

[frank basin]

But other stare you down

[frank ether]

those at least have an understandable motive

I don't agree with it but I understand lesser brains

[wanton dawn]

Also who care if someone steal dockets ? No player marketplace anyway

[frank ether]

^

absolutely meaningless resource

[frank basin]

What?

Meaningless resources?

[bitter turtle]

meaningless in the sense that there's no reason to risk cheating for it

[frank ether]

If I'm cheating to kill things I'm already removing the incentive to have a good roll that feels good to use

[wanton dawn]

Meaningless in the sense that even if cheating to get it, there is nothing meaningful to spend it on

[frank basin]

It could be reason dislike of challenges, cheats just put training wheel on bike run freely.

[frank ether]

you can just play malice

[frank basin]

Cheating could be also bringing people attention and attention seeking.

[shadow aurora]

But they want to feel strong

[wanton dawn]

Sure but if you arent playing dt for the challenge what are you playing really

[frank ether]

I think part of why might be because

there are not a lot of cheat devs for games like this

[frank basin]

I means majority pvp games

[bitter turtle]

pretty much

[wanton dawn]

Dt is not pvp

[bitter turtle]

its not like I run into cheaters in niche fighters lol

[frank ether]

what engine does this game even use

[frank basin]

I don’t means dt, I meant like tarkov

[wanton dawn]

Sure but i am talking dt

[frank basin]

You switching game genre

[wanton dawn]

We are litterally in a dt discord

[frank basin]

We just discuss dt thought they are in dying state

Ending up like tf2 because the cosmetic

[wanton dawn]

Dt got tf2 update schedule already

[frank basin]

What are you saying?

[wanton dawn]

Am dissing

[serene sage]

I don't cheat cause I'm good 😎

[frank basin]

You just confused me

[zealous wyvern]

did you just say darktide is dying?

[wanton dawn]

I said a lot of thing but not that one yet

Not unironically

[zealous wyvern]

its not a mainstream game

i mean

the other

the bird

[frank ether]

people seem more excited for shop rotation than content at this point anyhow

[ebon umbra]

kek

[frank basin]

Yeah is becoming like tf2 mindset

Drip over content

[frank ether]

tf2 has content tho

[wanton dawn]

Then game must truly be dead

[frank basin]

Community content*

[shadow aurora]

Idkh with how high the prices are hiked

[frank ether]

people always say that

and then buy anyway

[frank basin]

Dt don’t have community content just same repeatedly show gameplay clip and weapon flex

[frank ether]

fomo is real

[shadow aurora]

Ive sworn off buying anything. Purely from petty spite. Now i may toss money into a fire elsewhere

[junior needle]

Cosmetic releases happen consistently. Content drops are basically whenever with little warning.

[ebon umbra]

horde clearing plasma fun

[frank basin]

They gonna say cosmetic shop is endgame content

Spending endless bottomless money on cosmetic

[ebon umbra]

barber shop is endgame content

cuz u wont use it until ur bored out of ur mind

[frank basin]

They have job to spend money on cosmetic

That’s pretty much the cycle

[thorn lark]

for the drip or new cosmetic?

[frank basin]

For the drip

[junior needle]

bruh

[mystic belfry]

The true meta perks

[frank basin]

It is bad?

[junior needle]

The perks, that were chosen entirely willingly, are quite bad

[frank basin]

I want see the comment

[tall torrent]

They’re not just bad
They’re like the worst possible picks u could have on a plasma gun right next to +groaner&poxwalker dmg and +stamina

U could pick +weakpoint and be more useful than that lmao

[terse idol]

I am convinced these pauldrons were added as an afterthought

[frank ether]

yea

something something clipping

[thick wolf]

even in some non-paid skins like the ones with bandaged hands there's clipping on them

[edgy dew]

https://i.gyazo.com/e03d689022f5ea024a202454acce9b36.png finally getting good with the agripinna shotgun, its like plasma that actually takes a bit of finesse

oh hey my names not grey anymore \o/

[pastel geode]

That set still the newest one in the shop?

[empty creek]

how much toughness is enough toughness

[near sable]

that's not 300+

[frank basin]

Man I missed 320 toughness

Shit so high like I’m the heavy armored

[wanton dawn]

Still os by crusher overhead

[frank basin]

https://tenor.com/view/respawning-in-attack-knock-down-shut-down-defeat-gif-13857985

[thick wolf]

which melee is best for infiltrator ability

[hollow ibex]

prob knife

[frank basin]

Knoife

[urban steppe]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/728174260878704643/1178364672756437022/salvatory_ogryn.gif

you said what ?

[terse idol]

yeah

[warm swallow]

He saved you cuz he wanted the kill

[uneven hawk]

kick

[urban steppe]

https://tenor.com/view/darktide-ghost-barrel-explode-fly-gif-10528166394804192796

https://tenor.com/view/goodbye-chat-darktide-40k-warhammer-warhammer-darktide-gif-8052621726047573409

[near sable]

RAHHH WHERE ARE MY LASGUNS

[near sable]

ITS OKAY

[minor copper]

What’s going on here is this commissar chat now

[woven tide]

Mayhaps

[sharp ember]

https://tenor.com/view/imperial-guard-cat-warhammer40k-gif-23254825

[dusty nacelle]

HA

oh that was hours ago

[rare tartan]

for the meowuard

[deft crystal]

Best perks on a plasma?

[pearl granite]

what do I need on a boltgun nowaday? how does this one look?

[deft crystal]

Good

Shattering and pinning are BIS i think

You could refine reload speed probably

[placid portal]

my brother in christ this man has shattering

[placid portal]

Could swap shattering for Surgical

crits = weakpoint dmg modifier

both have 1.6x multiplier

old boltgun iirc had worse weakpoint at 1.5x or somthing

[pearl granite]

thanks

[placid portal]

Fun stuff how boltgun cavalcade stacks every shot

and sorta works while ADS

[pearl granite]

my current boltgun t4 blessings...

[placid portal]

nice

[pearl granite]

what's max tier of pinning fire?

[placid portal]

IV

5% damage per stack

so every shot can potentially stack to multiple if you shoot into normal hoarde

[pearl granite]

got it

[placid portal]

Yee

Just gotta get used to the recoil reset stick animation

from my experience the iron sights recoil then immediately fix itself

Really fucks my aiming imo

[pearl granite]

hope they would buff boltgun somehow, like reduce the switching time 🤔

plasma is everything boltgun ever wanted

[placid portal]

the switch isn't too bad, I just exe stance

I'm just not a fan of the irons

good thing I use mods

[pearl granite]

same here XD

make me feel tacticool

[gaunt delta]

Does the mod fix the wonky recoil reset? Or does it just mitigate it?

[pearl granite]

I don't think so, the mod only let you attach stuff onto the gun

doesn't change how it work

[gaunt delta]

That’s what I thought too

[pearl granite]

like, you can even have holosight on your plasma if you want

or stick a hammer head on top of your psyker's staff...

[gaunt delta]

Having a big open holosight probably helps

I saw someone swap an IAG receiver with the brick hammer

Hi-Point 40k

[placid portal]

ay man the psyker staff melee animation is based

[pearl granite]

guess this will work? 😄

[limpid hull]

whats meta on vet these days

[pearl granite]

revolver and plasma

[agile forge]

Or CIAG

Melee Power Sword VI mostly

Voice of Command with the overtoughness, but NOT the revive shout

Ammo aura is the single most important node

And no karker seems to run it besides me atm

[placid portal]

Who uses revive shout

I only met like 1

[agile forge]

People who like going down by not having 100% uptime on yellow toughness

[placid portal]

Legit only met 1 guy

Powersword is meh, I love me Chain axe or Claw

[agile forge]

The node which gives CDR on elite/special kill is also basically essential

[placid portal]

Heck mk3 Shovel

[placid portal]

Only works on specials iirc

Instant Refill on Hunting grounds

[agile forge]

I WANT THOSE KARKI WANT THOSE KARKI WANT THOSE KARKI WANT THOSE KARKERS DEAD

[stone dome]

real guestion, don't crucify me. isn't slaughterer better than brutal on power swords? does ps ever encounter hitmass issues

[agile forge]

Bromentum is misleading and better than it looks

I don't know the exact numbers, but let's say a typical Cleave damage distribution for a weapon might be like

100, 70, 40, 10, 0, ...

Bromentum, if you kill a target with a weakspot hit, will mean that the next target hit gets the same part of the distribution

[blissful flame]

take heart, i run shouta ammo as well

[agile forge]

So if the first one dies, it would be 100, 100, 70, 40, 10, 0, ...

If your weapon is really good, you might even still one-shot that next enemy, and maybe another one

So 100, 100, 100, 100, 70, 40, 10, 0, ...

This is why Bromentum is so strong

[stone dome]

i see, thanks for the explainer!

[agile forge]

It is also why sometimes it feels like it's crap

[blissful flame]

bromentum is a lot of fun on axes that got good horizontal swings

[agile forge]

If your weapon doesn't support it

[agile forge]

Case in point

If your Rashad doesn't quite one-shot stuff

It is very, very sad

If it does, it's literally the best weapon ever.

[stone dome]

what's the breakpoint of rashad being good?

[blissful flame]

i'm a lil mad that i got a pretty good axe, but it's literally 2 damage away from the breakpoint on bruisers for a light attack

[agile forge]

Better hope you can get an 80 80 80 80 with the right perks and Headtaker+Bromentum

If you miss any of that, it's a brick lol

My least favourite design in this game

[deft crystal]

LETS KARKEN GO

I ROLLED DUM DUM FINALLY

[stone dome]

ah. welp

[agile forge]

MAKE THE KARKERS PAY

[deft crystal]

Columnus + fire frenzy

• dum dum

[agile forge]

The other little'uns find it easier to reach the breakpoints

Veteran needs it to be perfect

Or like 2 points short of perfevt

It really is very tight

[deft crystal]

Gotta show those wannabe veterens show em how its done

^^ referring to gun psychers

[stone dome]

what would be a good enough powersword and mk5 axe? i just generally prefer those

[stone dome]

thats what she said

[agile forge]

Power Cycler III at least on a PS6

Then do what you like lol

Bromentum or Sunder ideal other blessings but it's very strong regardless

[stone dome]

ah

[agile forge]

If you can get it to one-combo Crushers with activated push attack -> light

It's gold

[stone dome]

stats are fine i suppose as long as above 70 and movement 51 or up

[blissful flame]

power sword mark 6? How come? I usually like the mk3 for wide swings

[dire olive]

Mk 6 has the poke

[blissful flame]

i've been on hiatus a while and still learning how the metas have shifted

[dire olive]

Which does a billion damage

[deft crystal]

The poke is the answer to all your mauler, crusher, rager problems

[blissful flame]

and you can still get a few wide swings on the 6 i assume

[stone dome]

they are abt the same but mk6 has the push attack poke and block can cancel half the charge animation

[white minnow]

mk6's horizontal swings are its lights

[blissful flame]

i mean for me, my solution for maulers and ragers is my brased autogun and dumdum. Krak grenades for krushers. Worked well enough for me so far, but then again I'm still cozy on malice

[agile forge]

Mk6 does light attacks

[stone dome]

first 3 lights on mk6 are still wide so it doesn't matter that 4th is not

[white minnow]

the lights of course do less damage, but the trash clear performance ends up being the same if you can hit the bruiser one-shot BPs because of brutal momentum

[blissful flame]

and if you got power cycler, you're probably only getting 3 good swings anyway clearing chaff

hmm, i'll have to give that a try. My axe has been more fun than it should be though

[white minnow]

yeah it's a nice option once you grow tired of the axe (however many hours that will take)

[deft crystal]

which axe?

[empty creek]

parry

[dim citrus]

This a good Power Sword?

[crude ermine]

No

[gusty bison]

Nop

[dim citrus]

Righty then

[wanton dawn]

Dont need thoughness if you just dodge

[empty creek]

i do a lot of movement tech abusing the dodges so i don’t always have them

i find safety in frags & perfect dclaw parries

the toughnsss is BC I play w/ a lot of my real friends & they R nowhere near as sweaty as me & they love playing the higher difficulties so i gave myself the higher safety net so i can better keep them alive so they can have fun

[dim citrus]

Amazing damage

[wind patio]

When do I get to use heavy sword on vet

[dire olive]

When do I get to use duelling sword on vet

Literal military sabre

[crude ermine]

Never

It's our sword

Keep your greasemonkey hands off them

[dire olive]

But I barely ever need melee as psyker

Wasted potential smh

[placid portal]

Damn people were not lying how ADS Cancelling with boltgun improves accuracy by alot

[agile forge]

Mutant says "Rawwwwr! Roooaaaarrrrrr! ROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOAAAAAAAAAAAA"

the 5 mutants following it also say the same

[placid portal]

https://tenor.com/view/joe-biden-thumb-uncanny-canny-mr-incredible-gif-13123031614149167572

[dire olive]

Congrats you figured out where the "barely ever" was

[placid portal]

nice

[solar garden]

What woudja put in that last slot and why

[zealous wyvern]

i heard you can oneshot crushers

with right setup

[agile forge]

@sterile garnet , I summon thee

[zealous wyvern]

maybe that something worth checking

[solar garden]

Oooohhhh that would actually be worth going carapace

[agile forge]

actually I think I saved his one

[dire olive]

Go in psykanium and check if you can already

[agile forge]

nope, can't find it in my screenshots

nvm

[solar garden]

Going now

[agile forge]

Mankar's can apparently oneshot anything south of a monstrosity

[solar garden]

It half healthed them when it was grey

[dire olive]

Thrust alone is a huge buff

[solar garden]

LMFAO cucked.
Leaves them at 25 health

[dire olive]

[solar garden]

Still, easy enough to tap em once more

[placid portal]

damn

[dire olive]

And with a team they'll probably have some chip damage anyway

[solar garden]

Yup

Okay so, not carapace then...

Maybe just Elites?

Or generic weakspot dmg?

[dire olive]

Maybe, I would also see how the lights do on poxwalkers, could maybe go Infested if it improves horde clear

[zealous wyvern]

honestly just check some breakpoints in meatgrinder

[dire olive]

Never weak spot

Never, ever use weakspot

It bad

[zealous wyvern]

yes

10% on only the weakspot part of damage dealt. pretty sad

[dire olive]

Not even actually 10%

Overall

[solar garden]

I mean... I never did just... thought maybe it'd make sense here :/

[zealous wyvern]

wat

oh yeah

[solar garden]

Ooohhhhh fug

[zealous wyvern]

thats what i mean

[solar garden]

So like VT2 crit dmg bonus

[dire olive]

Say your normal weakspot does 200% of base damage

[solar garden]

Was ass for the same reason

[dire olive]

Now it does 210%

A 5% increase overall

[solar garden]

[dire olive]

Which is nothing

[solar garden]

Why why why

[dire olive]

And the Darktide crit bonus

[solar garden]

Why would they repeat the same issue of the useless crit dmg bonus blessing from VT2??????

Ffs

Okay well, noted, and thanks for that xD

Well I'm just a touch off of 2SHS scab bruisers and dreg shooters
And just a touch off of 1SHS dreg ragers without weapon special so....
I'm thinking unarmored or maniac

[fresh grail]

They really do be making it sound like its an overal "+30% damage when hitting weakspot" on the talent tree, but ye its just an extra 30% of the bonus damage. Seems a bit weird way to do it

[solar garden]

Everything else dies in 1 thrust heavy or 1 thrust special heavy lol

Imma go unarmored and try that

[dire olive]

Can also test the push-stab

[fresh grail]

Flak and maniac are never bad perks if you're struggling to decide. I usually opt for maniac because ragers are

[dire olive]

Love me a push stab

[agile forge]

Mostly depends on breakpoints though, but 90% of weapons work best like you say

[dire olive]

Tbh

[solar garden]

Flak is on basically every melee I have lol

[agile forge]

Some weapons really need unarmoured

[dire olive]

I feel on vet you're probably just gonna shoot the ragers

[fresh grail]

True, if there are breakpoints you can get from the other perks then something else might be better.
For things like the power sword i like carapace too because i only pull it out against them, and have BRauto against all others

[solar garden]

This was my thought.
I'm planning on running this Caxe with a Graia Braced

[agile forge]

https://images.app.goo.gl/8XLgiGTAjEdEBszf7

[fresh grail]

maniac helps against muties too, which is nice

[sterile garnet]

@zealous wyvern

This will one shot crushers

Elite + carapace

[dire olive]

Muties are gonna die to a heavy rev regardless

[solar garden]

Hol up... does the saw rip stack Headtaker?

[sterile garnet]

Maniac not necessary on mk12

[sterile garnet]

Unfortunately no

But still useful

[solar garden]

Thx all 🙂

[sterile garnet]

Yw

[solar garden]

Gonna try unarmored for a pinch in a horde and faster ttk of bruisers/shooters.

Then if that doesn't feel like it's helping, elites

[sterile garnet]

Go elites

[solar garden]

Hrnmmm

Alright

[dire olive]

I don't think it's bad to compensate for a weak point (hordes) personally

Depends on your priorities

[solar garden]

Well

[thick rose]

I like unarmored caxe, one shot scab melee

[dire olive]

If you only want an elite killer or if you want a little more versatility

[thick rose]

without stacks

[solar garden]

I see the point... I'm not always going to be able to score a fully thrusted special heavy on ragers, maulers, etc

I'll prolly end up trying them both but, imma try elites first

Thx all

[dire olive]

And they're not always going to be full hp

[solar garden]

Truuu

Ironic, it's usually ME saying that when people go on about breakpoints xD

Now here I am doing myself xD

[dire olive]

TBF it mostly applied to big threats that everyone is going to want to deal with

[solar garden]

Yup

Big threats, slow weapons

Where it counts most

[dire olive]

Well I mean in terms of getting looser with breakpoints

[solar garden]

Welp, it's Auric time. Loading in xD

[dire olive]

Like that 25hp diff on a crusher

Likely at least one other person will touch it

And if you're on your own and there's a pack of them, a grenade will make it up

Since you'll probably throw one anyway

To stagger them at least