veteran-class

[zealous wyvern]

with a team, you just need to stick with them

[fallen helm]

Aight

[zealous wyvern]

also shredder grenades help

[celest vine]

I love dogs

[fallen helm]

Using the frag cloud thing rn

I'm happy with my build I just need to actually mess around with blessings

[celest vine]

:))))))))))

[fallen helm]

because I haven't optimised for shit rn

[sharp ember]

a comfortable melee weapon goes a long way for not getting downed by basic hordes

so like, not a tactical axe

[zealous wyvern]

SIGMA 33 UP AHEAD

or maybe this is a majoris even

look at that chaos

nevermind dont

[fallen helm]

I'm fine with weapons

It's movement/teamplay

[sharp ember]

you do want to make sure you’re next to at least 1 meatshield

most of the time being with your team in a bad position is better than being alone in a good position

[fallen helm]

Ok

[zealous wyvern]

for both you and your team

and therefore the missions success

[sharp ember]

when you notice a particularly cooperative teammate and cover eachother’s backs it’s really nice

[fallen helm]

So no ogryn ever

[sharp ember]

taunt ogryns usually have teamplay in mind

no guarantee for gungryns or bull chargers

[fallen helm]

I've played with like

2 good ogryns

every other one was just bashing rocks on their keyboard and hoping to get above 60k damage

[sharp ember]

a good ogryn is amazing and always has you covered

[fallen helm]

Yeah when I did meet a good one it was an easy match

[agile yew]

Its the other Chainsword everyone uses?

[tiny summit]

this feels...wrong

[placid portal]

So

you've come to the darkside

[tiny summit]

I'm trying it. I'm not joining

[placid portal]

Obrez Lucius

[tiny summit]

Adding sights removes the charge up UI

[last parcel]

reenable crosshairs when ads

[placid portal]

Faith and Patience

[remote osprey]

Nope, it is not (can be tweaked in mod settings).

[rain badger]

Would this be any good? Meme with crit chance?

[agile yew]

Finesse is crit modifier so kinda ruined

[sick marsh]

yup. that sucks

[rain badger]

Hey, I know you

[sick marsh]

finesse is 2nd most important stat modifier.

[rain badger]

TIL, if finesse was at 80, would crit be good for a meme at least?

[sick marsh]

mobility is the one there that doesn't matter really.

[agile forge]

Crit isn't a meme I think?

[placid portal]

some weapons have really good crits

And finesse also affects weakpoints

[rain badger]

Sweet, don’t know much about swords. Just assumed crit was just super niche on bet weapons

[bitter turtle]

eh?

https://i.gyazo.com/6c6d737c1a38bb6b9e71046bdcb0be5f.png

[tiny summit]

Settings for me do. Gonna have to tweak them

I'm also not heretical enough to put a scope

[crude ermine]

Tweakin settings

Yeah idk

I'm booored

[bitter turtle]

go back to the manganese ore mines

[crude ermine]

oh right

Silly me

[white minnow]

there's a setting in weapon customization that removes crosshair on ADS if you have a sight iirc

[obsidian umbra]

does the ui not show when exhilarating take down is active?

[rigid whale]

what melee do yall use for a stealth vet build

i've been using the standard issue shovel since it's my best melee for him lol

[crude ermine]

Bayonet

But in all seriousness uh

[sharp ember]

it does, the buff bar will show the damage resistance stacking up to 3

[rigid whale]

i suck with the helbore cause i just cannot aim that well

tried it before, not a bad weapon but i dont perform well with it at all

[sharp ember]

i use chainaxe so i can handle any target

and the melee talents still let me handle hordes with a chainaxe

[agile yew]

How is chainaxe horde clear though?

And which of the two models?

[sharp ember]

not* the fastest but good enough to be pretty safe with

[rigid whale]

i'm really surprised you can take both -90% threat and -50% toughness dmg reduction on infiltrate

[sharp ember]

i prefer mk12? the new one

[crude ermine]

More rectangular

Square

[serene sage]

what gun is this?

[tiny summit]

The new chainaxe feels like it needs slaughterer for horde clear.

[agile yew]

I have been stockpiling Chain Axes on Zealot and Veteran so id have few suitable candidates to craft from

Web browser app for shop means all my ordo dockets go to good rolled items across 4 characters

[sharp ember]

you can use basically any blessing combination that you prefer to your playstyle

i like using bloodletter + thunderous for cheesy crusher 1 saw kills

[agile yew]

Says Zealot guide

[tiny summit]

It does. Shows the stack count too

[rigid whale]

are ogryns not considered specialist enemies? am i losing it?

[sharp ember]

they are elites

because they just exist in the map without a special spawn noise

[tender pasture]

An Ogryn specialist would be quite funny

[sharp ember]

(disclaimer: snipers count as special even though they don’t have a noise outside of sniper gauntlets)

[tender pasture]

Bull charges and pancakes you

[rigid whale]

not that they need one I don't think

[obsidian umbra]

evens specials dont have spawn noises any more lol

[thick rose]

anyone got much experiance with daggers on vet got any tips?

[untold mulch]

For all purposes they just spawn

Half bursters I am sure they are legit just spawning from corners

Like we playing L4D2 versus and is a cheeky player

[sharp ember]

mercy killer + uncanny strike blessings with the serrated edge talent gives you a great damage boost and you can aim purely for headshots

gives you a good damage boost to kill things immediately instead of trying to bleed them out

push attack spam does the same damage as heavy stabs, but is faster if you’re willing to burn stamina

[thick rose]

any thoughts on 3 vs 6?

[timid otter]

Had a silent burster yesterday that came from a spawndoor that proceeded to wipe out 3 people.

[dusty sluice]

suggestions?

or bricked

i'm using columnus iag with this btw

[sharp ember]

i think i prefer 3 for consistent heavy stab chain. the 6 is fine but doesn’t stand out

the slightly more horizontal attacks don’t feel like enough

[sharp ember]

i hear ruthless backstabbing is funny but that’s outside my field of experience

i would maybe just deal with the blessings and change perks

gotta have at least flak

unarmored is useable, you can forego maniac if you plan to shoot them

[dusty sluice]

might put backstab to riposte since i have the iag with onslaught

and put one of the perks to flak

[sharp ember]

riposte is crit chance? sounds good

[dusty sluice]

ye

ill be at 45% crit chance if riposte procs

i think hadron wants me to use this in a certain way

i could do a meme kinfe with this one

[forest blaze]

It's fine. I've used Mk 12 a ton in aurics and even hard mode twins. It's not super fast but it knocks hoes around really well and you can deal with mixed hordes well. I pair it with plasma VoC and weapon specialist.

[dusty sluice]

plasma rashad is very fun

[astral ingot]

reminds me of bestigors

[merry glade]

heresy difficulty at level 10 hit different tho

[bitter turtle]

hb2

[dusty sluice]

what perk would be better to keep?

[terse idol]

Ehh uh I don't know about that, I usually don't hear trapper spawns but that's usually very quiet

[dusty sluice]

i use special tracker so i can listen to other things while playing

[terse idol]

I just Play vanilla maybe I'm lucky but I rarely get silent anything, and only maybe when the audio levels are getting drowned out by thr audio increase that crushers do

[dusty sluice]

i use "just a few" mods

also yay this is unbrickable

[terse idol]

[fresh saddle]

[serene sage]

just swap onslaught for something bad and it's brickable again

[hollow ibex]

hadron approves

[atomic zephyr]

is there a reason to use a mk1 helbore over a mk2 besides just preference?

[slow spade]

Iron sights preference could affect gameplay

Other than that, yeah

Hadron decides which one you use anyways

[bitter turtle]

yes

mk2 struggles to hit a lot of oneshot breakpoints on slightly hardier elites

pretty sure mk1 can do it

[slow spade]

Really? Surprised to hear that

Granted I dumped way too much plasteel into helbores

[bitter turtle]

well, just my guess

i only have a mk2

it just barely misses some enemies w

[atomic zephyr]

oh i see

last time i rolled a mk1 brunt gave me garbage so i just said fuck it and kept using my mk2

[bitter turtle]

yeah

just tested it

crit headshot bp is possible on mk1

not really on mk2

at least without keystones

that being said

mk2 charges so fast it might as well be instant

which is nice for the lighter enemies like gunner

since you still need to charge slightly to oneshot them without a crit

[slow spade]

Ah I'm using Ping Keystone so I'm pretty reliably getting a minimum 16% damage boost on targets

[bitter turtle]

i run full on bayonet focus

so i use mk2

[idle swallow]

For my skill setup I gotta take unarmored or elite damage on mk2 helbore to 1 shot headshot dreg gunners without crits, mk1 does it raw

[bitter turtle]

since i dont shoot ragers

i just run in and stab the shit out of them

so fast charge to knock out gunners is fine by me

[slow spade]

Oh that works vs the scab ragers?

[bitter turtle]

it works against everything

[slow spade]

I noticed mine doesn't wirk well vs the flak bois

[bleak jackal]

any1 notice the armorseeking kraks?

[slow spade]

Ah I should move some points around

[bitter turtle]

i do the same damage

to maniac and flak

ragers i eman

[slow spade]

Odd

[bitter turtle]

1.1k

[slow spade]

I need to mess with mine more then

[bitter turtle]

well

1.1k with agile

but i try to keep it up constantly

[atomic zephyr]

mk2 helbore with t4 onslaught is fucking crazy tbh

[slow spade]

Ah

[bitter turtle]

960 without agile

[agile yew]

We need gun with chainbayonet you can rev

[bitter turtle]

agile lets me 2shot ragers with a head stab

[slow spade]

I don't run Agile :c

[bitter turtle]

so its nice

[slow spade]

So 3 hits for me

[bitter turtle]

well like i said, its really a bayo build more than the gun lul

[slow spade]

Indeed while I went for guns lol

[dire olive]

In lore they are magnetic

[bitter turtle]

well

even if you dont run agile

if you do fire team

instead of close and kill

you can hit just barely 1k

[eternal sable]

not a problem

[bleak jackal]

makes sense

[south garnet]

WHERES THE MONEY FATSHARK?

[slow spade]

The ping keystone helps hopefully lol

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/c53658879118343bc8bbde4864050f69.jpg

this is no agile but with fire team

i just like running close and kill with this build

[hoary stratus]

wait, mk1 charges slower than mk2?

[bitter turtle]

yes, mk1 is the middle child

[slow spade]

Yeah

[bitter turtle]

medium damage medium charge

[hoary stratus]

damn it

now I have to build a 3rd helbore

[dire olive]

You might also notice they don't stick to unarmoured targets

[hoary stratus]

I thought 2 was middle

[slow spade]

I think I'll drop the +5% crit node for the +10% melee dmage

[bitter turtle]

alternatively

[bleak jackal]

only to carapace afaik

[bitter turtle]

run no respite

[slow spade]

Rip shock trooper

[bitter turtle]

which is part of why i do lcose and kill

[dire olive]

flak too

[idle swallow]

If the damn mk3 didn't have that stupid as hell diagonal bayonet slash I would actually wanna run it

[bitter turtle]

cause i do 900 and then the followup stab gets buffed by no respite

[slow spade]

Ah I'll see if I can

[bitter turtle]

so its a kill anyway

[slow spade]

Idk what I have locked atm

[bitter turtle]

no need for fire team

[bleak jackal]

ooh nice

[dire olive]

Maybe even unyielding?

pretty sure they stick to monsters

[bleak jackal]

never noticed since i use them only against monsters and ogryns

[slow spade]

Carapace and unyielding

Krak only guides to Carapace

[bitter turtle]

they stick to everything

er

sorry

[slow spade]

Oh they also stick to Flak

[bitter turtle]

stick to flak/unyielding/carapace

but they only magnetize to carapace

as in the part where you can miss by a mile and it still changes directions to stick

[dire olive]

useful for popping the crusher/mauler in a horde

[slow spade]

Meanwhile the scab melee going "GET DOWN MR. PRESIDENT" when I throw a krak UwU

[last parcel]

k k k k kwak gwenade

[bitter turtle]

that is also part of why

i prefer shredders

hoenstly they're just more reliable

sometimes if ur throwing krak into a pack it magnetizes to the worst guy possible and takes out only one

[slow spade]

I use kraks on anything but plasma

Plasma gets shredder

[bitter turtle]

shredder is just really good at everything

[dire olive]

Shredder is objectively better tbh yeah

[bitter turtle]

knockiong down crushers and killing everything else in the room is pretty much just as good as taking out the crusher

since a lone crusher is

harmless

[dire olive]

better to deal with 4 elites and no horde than a horde and 4(-1) elites

[slow spade]

I just wish it was easier to tell what talents buff shredders

[bitter turtle]

this is my current bayonet build lul

https://i.gyazo.com/a4af1b285fbf4ec51a8cd502fcb5bb79.png

also

there's a list

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3094038976

damage is increased by damage buffs from Bring it Down!, Close Quarters Killzone (if within 8m to the enemy), Competitive Urge, Covering Fire (if applied to Veteran by another Veteran), Grenade Tinkerer, Longshot (if not within 8m to the enemy), Redirect Fire! (if tagged), Skirmisher, Superiority Complex (against elites), Surprise Attack, and aura Fire Team; damage can also be affected by weapon perks and blessings if Veteran swaps to weapon before the grenade explodes

but yeah, one of the few builds i can actually afford to run infiltrate without kneecapping myself since bayonet doesnt need much in way of keystones or talents

also its just hella fun

stealth and bayonet charge behind enemy lines and wreak havoc

lol

[hoary scaffold]

Is there a detailed veteran build?

[bitter turtle]

for what

[bleak jackal]

and here i sit with my Kantrael XII because i luv me las

Make Kantraels great again pls

*even greater

[hoary scaffold]

My friend just reached level 30

[bleak jackal]

depends highly on his role he wants to play and weapons he wants to use

[bitter turtle]

you cant just ask for a build without saying what weapons you want to use

at the very least, is it automatic or semi auto

and what melee weapon

[atomic zephyr]

shout is reliable for a close-quarters playstyle, exe stance is for shooting things, infiltrate I like for stealth stabbies

can decide on a build from there

an infiltrate sniper build is also a possibility but I think exe stance is better suited for it

essentially, the game’s his oyster

[bitter turtle]

nah

most snper guns dont want exec

at least the good ones

since they can hit their own bps fine without it

for something like v7, exec literally adds about 100 damage per shot on a crusher and that's about it

[atomic zephyr]

mm true

[bitter turtle]

evverything else it already one taps

if anything, sniper guns would love infil but most of them just end up taking shout because its too hard to pick up infil AND all the talents to reach the correct bps

[atomic zephyr]

I just like it because I don’t have to worry about accidentally missing an elite because it’s too dark

[bitter turtle]

but that -90% aggro would be great to stand there and pick off gunners without being bothered by poxwalkers lol

[gusty bison]

RIP the Kantrael Lasgun.

How far it has fallen TT

[gusty bison]

What even wants exec

Braced auto and?

Shredder?

Does MG1a need exec to hit BPs?

[copper barn]

Las brothers stick together. Las superiority!

https://tenor.com/view/predator-hand-shake-gif-12948959

[bleak jackal]

now and then i run heresy just to play with a kantrael

[gusty bison]

It needs better handling I feel

thats the main thing keeping it down

[forest blaze]

IIRC there some BPs you can hit with exec on plasma to one shot basically everything. To be fair tho, you can already one shot basically everything with plasma without exec

[gusty bison]

Those BPs you can hit with focus target as well

[forest blaze]

Yes

[gusty bison]

Like 2 stacks is enough iirc

[forest blaze]

Yah it’s something like that

[gusty bison]

Which you always have 2 stacks so

[slow spade]

Ah good to know

[forest blaze]

Sniper plasma you’ll pretty much just do focus target and either shout or infil. Shout being your strongest team one and infil being your clutch button for bad teams.

[slow spade]

Oh I'm running a completely different build lol

Don't have a pic sadly

But basically a Ping Keystone with Deadshot and Survivalist

[dusty sluice]

what perk would be better to keep?

[agile forge]

I have accidentally started Ogryn chat talking about knife builds, and they're all raving about it on Veteran. How would you best do this?

[bleak jackal]

why knife when i have a sword with more knifes

[nimble sentinel]

ayo I'm shopping for a wireless headset, y'all got recommendations?

[hollow ibex]

Take any build with frags, equip a knife and voila

Mk3 if you don't mind carpal tunnel, otherwise mk6

[spare ore]

Aye fellas

While playing vet what’s the ideal acatran build

Fastest damage output

Because I typically use the first variant the quickest to fire

But I’ve heard others are better

[dusty sluice]

recons aren't very goon rn

[spare ore]

Yeh I’m talking the las rifles

Not the recons

Just the pew pews

[dusty sluice]

oh mb

i forgot about the 1a

[spare ore]

I’ve got one of each of the main three that are all pretty decent on stats

But I wanna figure out which one I could best min max damage for

[slow spade]

There's only Accatran recon guns though

I assume you mean the Kantreals

[spare ore]

Yes yes

Sorry

:(

I don’t remember names well

It’s funny bc I’ve been playing since it came out on Xbox

[slow spade]

Its ok, important to note because you could also mean the Lucious lasguns

[dusty sluice]

same but with some weapons

[spare ore]

The hellebores?

[slow spade]

Lucius*

Yeah

For pure damage per shot, MKXII is best

For sustain, its preference between MK4 and MG La with the main difference being shots per kill

I'd recommend the MG La

Pack Rending because they have relatively poor flak damage

Iirc the MG La has something terrible like 60% damage vs flak 😔

MG La can one shot kill reliably on weakspot hits

I haven't used MK4 much

[nimble sentinel]

ooooooooooooohSHIT we talkin kantraels? 😄

everything sheodoq said about the Ia is correct, I am a die hard fan of the IV

click on a regular shooters head and they die on the spot, fire rate is good enough to blast in a horde, bigger lads without damage bonuses like tagging or standing still will mean 2-3 shots but they go out so quickly you hardly notice

[west lake]

I love my XII, it's my beloved

[nimble sentinel]

if your aim is goated get a 4, if you're just learning the glorious ways of the gun the 1a has your back

[west lake]

Just left click heads, easy

Turn on flashlight for twin linked mode

[nimble sentinel]

another bonus the 4 has that the 1a does not, ADS movement speed increase. You can kite (with effort and practice) while clicking heads

[west lake]

Honestly the biggest sad about the kantrael is lack of penetration, so while you'll be killing things left and right, it's only one at a time

Helbore's pierce through, giving you a marginal option in horde situations. Plus, slightly better versus carapace enemies

[nimble sentinel]

all 3 will drop a poxer in the dome though

[bleak jackal]

hello fellow Las enjoer

[slow spade]

Clearly we need 100 cleave kantreals like the plasma gun UwU

[west lake]

Brutal momentum but for a gun

I've been messing around with the shovels more to compensate for the lack of crusher damage, and man I've been missing out

The shovel on ogryn is wacky, but the shovel on vet isn't far behind

[muted knot]

what do i do here gamers

[west lake]

Hard choice

[muted knot]

idont knowman

[west lake]

Right probably does more overall damage

although don't remember the cutoff for close range

[muted knot]

8m i believe

but im also unsure of the perks

i dont reallyneed flak

[soft blade]

take deadshot and fish for crits

las guns have high finesse so you’ll basically wanna just crit constantly with headhunter and deadshot

you’ll also probably want rending to help counteract their weird inverted falloff and bolster their god awful flak damage

[dusty sluice]

this is mine (ignore the infernus i don't have da yet)

[soft blade]

mg 1a as previously mentioned is your best choice

second is the mg IV

[finite imp]

https://tenor.com/view/stitch-maniatic-laugh-risa-malvada-laugh-gif-13172371

[dusty sluice]

change both blessings?

[soft blade]

the mg 12 can be used for exe stance builds but atp just run a helbore

[finite imp]

what was ordained HAS COME TO BEEEE

[nimble sentinel]

slander, real imperial patriots use the mg4

[finite imp]

THE AGE OF KNIVES RISES

[soft blade]

and for the love of god bring a melee that can do damage against carapace

[finite imp]

ZEALOTROUS ELATION

[soft blade]

don’t be the guy trying to magdump a crusher with an ilas

[nimble sentinel]

mk 3 shovel is goated

[finite imp]

HAVE I GOT THE MELEE FOR YOU

[dusty sluice]

i bring uncanny kinfe and ps6

[soft blade]

knife is not good with ilas so please don’t tell him to use that

[finite imp]

OH MAMA

[soft blade]

power sword is definitely the optimal choice tbh

[finite imp]

THE KNIFE

[soft blade]

but that’s lame

[finite imp]

THE POWER SWORD IS LAME AND YOU ARE LAME

[soft blade]

shovel and rashad are my recommendations

[nimble sentinel]

nearly had to call the exterminatus on yo ass

[soft blade]

the new shovel to be more specific

[gusty bison]

Knife has solid carapen thou

[soft blade]

it does but then you’re lacking for hordes

[finite imp]

KNIFE ANSWERS EVERY THREAT IN THE GAME

[nimble sentinel]

yeh I'm with sunrise on this one knife isn't bad on cara

[soft blade]

hard

[gusty bison]

Eh its vet

Vet knife clears hordes ok

[nimble sentinel]

MG4 is good with hordes

[finite imp]

KNNNNNIFE

[nimble sentinel]

so are frags

infinite frags

[finite imp]

KNIFE COUNTERS DARKTIDE

[gusty bison]

Cos mercy killer + precog is nuts

Lights start shreddin

[soft blade]

i feel like you’d be better off just not running an ilas atp though

[gusty bison]

Thats correct

[finite imp]

THEY ALL SAID I WAS CRAZY

[gusty bison]

Only use iLas if u really like the feel and for the challenge

[soft blade]

i’m responding to the dude asking for an ilas build lmao

[finite imp]

THAT I WAS UNHINGED

INSANE EVEN

[gusty bison]

If u must run iLas, MG1a is ok

[finite imp]

THATS MY SECRET DOC

[gusty bison]

Id run vraks 7 over it

[finite imp]

I AM INSANE

AT DARKTIDE

[gusty bison]

But its ok at its job

[dusty sluice]

its fun

[cursive nebula]

What's the best auto gun

[dusty sluice]

columnus

[finite imp]

agri brauto

wait no

[soft blade]

columnus

[finite imp]

yeah CIAG

[gusty bison]

Headhunter or infantry autogun

[dusty sluice]

silly

[gusty bison]

Cos like

[finite imp]

ciag is the knife of the gun world

[cursive nebula]

Ooo mixed reviews

[gusty bison]

Very different worlds here

[finite imp]

NO NO NO

LISTEN TO THE KNIFE MAN

CIAG

[gusty bison]

Best infantry autogun is columnus, but the other two are also very very good

[finite imp]

https://tenor.com/view/funny-banging-hard-furious-head-gif-10391823

[gusty bison]

If u want something with more stability at longer ranges

Theres also the vraks 3 headhunter which pretends to be an infantry autogun

[dusty sluice]

just replace the other blessing right?

[finite imp]

if you add the rending buffs to CIAG it becomes a fucking death sprayer

[gusty bison]

The vraks 7 headhunter is ur traditional dmr

[dusty sluice]

also this mobility is fine?

[finite imp]

i was SHOOKETH when i saw it rip through a crusher

[gusty bison]

I mean

SD is decent

[finite imp]

https://tenor.com/view/breaking-bad-walter-white-gif-8086630669522815021

[junior needle]

Yes. Bugged dumdum and whatever else pleases you because the second blessing barely matters

Mobility isn't really important on ranged weapons

[finite imp]

dum dum is the best for dum dums like meeee

[dusty sluice]

ye just making sure

[soft blade]

yeah as long as you got dum dum you’re laughing

[finite imp]

CACKLING EVEN

[dusty sluice]

This is my other ciag lol

[cursive nebula]

So recom and laz guns aren't that good compared to the autos?

[soft blade]

correct

it’s not even close when it comes to recon las

[junior needle]

Recons aren't good compared to anything, the other lasguns are better but none of them stand out apart from helbore 1/2 with bayonet memes

[dusty sluice]

they are better than the shredder tbh

[finite imp]

What blessings should I put on these knives

[junior needle]

The shredder at least can get great dps on maniacs baseline, the recons don't perform well against any damage type. It also has some utility with being able to floor things with the stagger.

But the shredder is near the bottom too

[cursive nebula]

So weird that the guards main weaponry isn't even that good lol

[soft blade]

i mean welcome to video game balance ig

[pearl granite]

gud on vet? 😄

[junior needle]

A lot of weapons have weird and unnecessary jank in this game

[dusty sluice]

oh true

[soft blade]

if everything in the game was based on lore there’d be zero reason to ever use autoguns

[junior needle]

Agri revolver
Nope

Not atm

[soft blade]

unless we could suppress them for stealth or something

[dusty sluice]

its fun tho

[soft blade]

fun and good are two different things doe

[junior needle]

It's fun to shoot boolets fast, not fun to miss like 3/5 of your shots on a midrange target at least

[dusty sluice]

i have a meme build for it lol

[junior needle]

There's just no reason to take it over old revolver if you want to do old revolver things. And if you're taking it to blow up hard targets at close range there's much better options that don't gimp you for longer ranges.

[terse idol]

The lasguns are fine

[soft blade]

the mg 12 could use a bit of help but otherwise yeah

[junior needle]

Not exactly at odds with the statement. They're "fine" in a vacuum but don't really stand out as being that good compared to alternatives.

[dusty sluice]

whats wrong with it currently?

[junior needle]

low dps

Largely inferior to the 1a

[soft blade]

^

1a buffs made it pretty much irrelevant

[junior needle]

Although I suppose it is the highest alpha damage option

So if you want maximum one shots it's still the best option for that, but 1a has better general usability

[finite imp]

God how I wish the agri was worth a GOD DAMN

HEY YALL WHAT IF WE TOOK THE ABILITY TO AIM AWAY FROM A 5 ROUND PISTOL

OH AND WHAT IF WE NERFED IT

AND THEN AND THEN AND THEN WE TOOK ALL THE ARMOR PEN OFF JT

[hoary stratus]

my kingdom for a 6th round on the revolvers

[junior needle]

What if we gave it shit accuracy

[soft blade]

we did it patrick we saved darktide

[finite imp]

NOW WITH FANNING YOU CAN MISS TWICE AS FAST

[soft blade]

https://tenor.com/view/we-did-it-we-saved-the-city-patrick-spongebob-spongebob-fire-gif-24201500

[finite imp]

Revolver sacrifices everything for damage. Why would you then take away two of its ONLY GOOD STATS for rpm

ACCURACY AND DAMAGE BYE BYE?? WHY

LITERALLY ATTACH FANNING TO THE SPECIAL OH MY GOD

ROCKET SCIENCE

[hollow ibex]

Lost its cleave too

[finite imp]

I could have designed a better revovler by fucking accident

This shit was on purpose

[hollow ibex]

Which is just fucking awful in mixed hordes

[finite imp]

Give it the damage of the og revovler, it being inaccurate as fuck from literally 20 meters is such a brutal nerf

Like GOD

[soft blade]

nerf it again

[finite imp]

Yeah just make it as bad as the recon gums

Guns

[gusty bison]

Its not inaccurate thou

[bitter turtle]

ngl

idk

[gusty bison]

It has plasma crosshairs but it has very little spread

[bitter turtle]

fanning revolver is actually a more fair revolver

[gusty bison]

It just doesnt have well

[bitter turtle]

i think its perfectly fine

[terse idol]

But the pinpoint accuracy 🥹

[gusty bison]

"Fat bullet"

[bitter turtle]

it might feel a little worse on vet because of how zarona synergizes wstupidly well with wep speccialist

so the instant reload feels less significant

i can see it being preferalbe on other classes though

[gusty bison]

Agri volver also doesnt get as fat of a bullet

I think

[bitter turtle]

you still delete like half the roster of enemies in 1 shot anyway

[gusty bison]

So u need to aim more with it

[finite imp]

Don't listen to this person they're a zealot in disguise

[bitter turtle]

well i mean

even for vet

[finite imp]

You wouldn't trust a zealot would you?

[bitter turtle]

i think its still a top weapon

lol

[gusty bison]

Vets are zealots in disguise

Whatcha mean

[bitter turtle]

compared to the majority of weapons

like

[gusty bison]

U use a knife ffs

[bitter turtle]

it still deletes like 90% of enemies in 1 shot

with basically no punishment

[gusty bison]

That either makes u a zealot or a brit

[bitter turtle]

what do you want from it

[junior needle]

I was aiming pretty well with it (center mass on flamers) and 3/5 my shots would go wide at midrange

[soft blade]

“knifemaxxer” throwing accusations of zealotry

hmmmm

[finite imp]

https://tenor.com/view/surprise-wow-i-cant-even-surprised-shocked-gif-16276620

[gusty bison]

It has movement inaccuracy

[finite imp]

Oh shit

[acoustic sapphire]

Finished the refining. I'm very happy with my new axe.
Crushers and Plague Ogryns aren't as scary as they used to be.

[finite imp]

The only thing I'm zealotrous over is KNIIIIVES

[bitter turtle]

like frankly

[finite imp]

Whose frankly

[bitter turtle]

i don t think revolver SHOULD be a portable quickswap sniper rifle

that also penetrates armor

[acoustic sapphire]

You shut your heretic mouth.

[gusty bison]

And has cleave

[finite imp]

You just want all the guns to be SHIT cuz ur a zealot

[gusty bison]

And has a bottomless clip

[junior needle]

So in other words, it only has acceptable spread if you stand still

[gusty bison]

And has fat bullets

[gusty bison]

Yep

[junior needle]

On a peestol

[gusty bison]

Tbf

[finite imp]

Standing still in damnation lol

[gusty bison]

U can let go of WASD for the moment u shoot

Then keep moving

[bitter turtle]

if you really have to move

then just shoot twice for body shot or something

it reloads the whole clip at once anyway

[gusty bison]

But why should i ever need to reload

Its a volver

[soft blade]

heheh

[finite imp]

Nope it's confirmed it sucks. It says it right here in this thing I'm reading "it sucks ignore the zealots"

[bitter turtle]

you're right, it should be effective at all ranges, have a bottomless clip, have 100% rending, and also make my breakfast for me

how could I be so foolish

[finite imp]

Mind you the font is insane scrawlings

And the thing is a napkin

[finite imp]

You're telling me your revovler doesn't suck your dick and do your taxes???

Riddle me something whimsical do the zealots get reload speed/attack speed buffs

[junior needle]

It doesn't seem to even have acceptable spread if you're standing still. Pewpew mod is great for visualizing shots.

[finite imp]

I genuinely do not know

[gusty bison]

To ranged? They get like

One reload speed buff

And its meh

[bitter turtle]

need 10 melee kills to get 30% reload speed

no gun attackspeed buffs iirc

[gusty bison]

The main ranged buff that zealots get is -75% spread -50% recoil

Which is usually always on

[finite imp]

I should try zealot a little

[gusty bison]

Zealot brauto is a drug

Gun becomes a laser beam

[finite imp]

It's only fair that if I trash a class that I'm also an expert and can make my insults accurate and personal

[bitter turtle]

idk i can consistently hit a headshot in meat grinder at 15m

beyond that its more unreliable

but that's like

ok to me

[gusty bison]

Try moving

And shooting

[bitter turtle]

i meant standing still

moving i have to be closer

[gusty bison]

Ah ye

[finite imp]

Imagine not one shotting things so far across the map it bugs the hitreg

You see the blood splat and no damage happens

But it still dies

[gusty bison]

I feel like zarona needs the following two changes.

Cleave reduced from 5 to 2.
Fat bullet removed.

Prolly still strong AF after that but not braindead to use

[bitter turtle]

imo

[finite imp]

How about I remove a fat bullet from you

[junior needle]

"A" headshot is the keyword there. The first shot is accurate, the others fuck off into nowhere.

[bitter turtle]

it should just not fucking kill crushers

at least as easily as it does atm

[gusty bison]

Im ok with this but like

I feel like crusher killing atm is such a massive joke

[finite imp]

You're just mad cuz crushers keep slumping before you can reach them

[bitter turtle]

well do you really need more than 1 for things u usually headshot

like its still volver

it deletes basically anything smaller than mauler in 1 hit

well u need to crit for rager ig but yeah

[finite imp]

He's right tho

[gusty bison]

Like if volver doesnt kill crushers

[finite imp]

Crushers can die in 2 or 3 shots

[gusty bison]

Im just gonna swap to shovel

[idle swallow]

had someone compliment my bolter vet and inspect my loadout post match, that always feels nice

[bitter turtle]

that's fine

im just saying

[gusty bison]

And 1/2 tap the crusher

[bitter turtle]

its part of why ppl go

"why does bolter even exist"

cause yeah

[junior needle]

On agri revolver? Yes, absolutely.

[bitter turtle]

why even use bolter when you have a fast gun that does the exact same thing

[trim hemlock]

Isn't Zarona's cleave 6.5?

[gusty bison]

Bolter is a bodyshot gun tbf

[finite imp]

I had someone ask if my hands hurt after a game once

[gusty bison]

U rite

[finite imp]

That was as close to a compliment as I've goten

[bitter turtle]

idk i 1shot flamers, gunners, etc still

[gusty bison]

Volver isnt so good with bodyshots

But like

[bitter turtle]

and reapers are fat enough that its fairly reliable to fan

[gusty bison]

Volver also has fat bullets

So it doesnt matter

[finite imp]

CLEEEEEAVE

[trim hemlock]

That doesn't change my opinion on changing its cleave, though

Cleaving one poxwalker is fine

[finite imp]

Don't you wanna kill 7 shotgunners in one shot

???

[trim hemlock]

but cleaving 4 and hitting something behind them is ridiculous

[gusty bison]

Ye drop it from 6.5 to 2

[finite imp]

Revolver h8rs

[junior needle]

Yeah I only do that on crits and you can't guarantee that nearly as well because lmao no surgical

I suppose you can run surgical on it too but

[finite imp]

If they come for my gun I'm coming for yalls

[bitter turtle]

https://i.gyazo.com/078fce3be1b99642259ab85ad75dd6ef.jpg

idk i do it fine with a few stacks of focus

i dont have redirect fire so if u just run it with redirect you should be able to do it reliably with 1 stack

[junior needle]

idk i do it fine with a few stacks of focus
a few stacks of focus

[bitter turtle]

ya as in like 2

like idk

im just saying

is that so wrong anyway

my v7 cant oneshot flamers either w/o crit even if you dont want to run focus

and i also have to dump like 10 bullets into a crusher to kill it unlike volver

[junior needle]

v7 doesn't have handcannon

[bitter turtle]

yes

[junior needle]

If it did well

[bitter turtle]

im not saying it should have it

im saying

is it so wrong that agri actually has a weakness

i think its actually a way more balanced volver lol

and like fair while still being a good gun

[finite imp]

Against still targets the argument is DIRTY

[bitter turtle]

instead of the glorious 1000 folded steel gun that oldvolver is

[gusty bison]

I dunno tbh

[finite imp]

Made of glorious niipon steel

[gusty bison]

U cant have DA, Surg and HC

[bitter turtle]

and like

if u reall yneed 100% reliability

[junior needle]

I do not think it's a good gun and would never use it with no changes even if the regular revolver got nerfed into the ground

[bitter turtle]

fan twice bodyshot into flamer still kills

[tall torrent]

does anyone know if deleting the user settings config file resets all the settings to default

[junior needle]

it should

[gusty bison]

Fuckit

Im making an agri volver build

[tall torrent]

I might have tweaked one too many things and somehow my GPU temp went berserk

[bitter turtle]

idk what you're showing here

[nimble sentinel]

become mccree

[fiery wave]

[nimble sentinel]

or whatever his name is now

[fiery wave]

New Reddit cope

[nimble sentinel]

X or whatever

[junior needle]

I get nowhere close to a noncrit weakspot kill on zealot

[bitter turtle]

that's on zealot

[soft blade]

ecks dee

[bitter turtle]

idk if its actually good on zealot tbf

but i used oldvolver similarly

with speedload handcannon

before they nerfed the shit out of speedload into being a piece of trash

so im sure its decent

as in

[woven tide]

I have a feeling that that person doesn't know how smoke works at all and has some horrible aim to boot

[bitter turtle]

i woul djust bodyshot dump things and then reload super fast

and rely on the 25% crit on zealot tree for crushers

[junior needle]

[fiery wave]

I have a feeling they are carried every game

[bitter turtle]

by dumping shots until i crit lul

[bitter turtle]

im not saying its as good as surg handcannon lul

but it worked

fine

[fiery wave]

Then assume grenades are why they win

[bitter turtle]

and felt decent

maybe not as good as hand surg but that's literally op as fuck

[bitter turtle]

like let me ask

what do you think revolver role should be

[white minnow]

ye and your mod settings will also disappear since they're stored in that file

[woven tide]

99% chance of that being the case

[bitter turtle]

cause personally i feel like it should be a close range sidearm to take out light-medium elites

which agri does fine

[fiery wave]

100%

[bitter turtle]

i dont think it needs to be a 100000 range sniper rifle that deletes armor

[white minnow]

i'd copy-paste that stuff, save it somewhere, and then delete the config file if you're planning to do it

[junior needle]

I do not think, makes my bone ead implant tingle. I only feel if gun is shit.

[bitter turtle]

idk

i dont think its shit when comparing it to my v7

that's just my experience if we're going off that then

feels like i trade long range reliability for armor pen

which is fair

[junior needle]

Different gun line

[bitter turtle]

yes but similar role

and one of the reasons guns like v7 are not considered top tier is bc of guns like revolver and plasma

that just do the same thing but with armor pen

so why even bother unless u just like v7 for its niche of killing gunners faster when they're not stacked

which the other two do fine anyway in reality

just slightly slower at worst

[junior needle]

Darktide has a big problem with guns just being weaker versions of other guns

[rigid whale]

standard issue shovel stands above

[bitter turtle]

ya

but worse version doesn't necessarily mean recon tier

i feel like agri is comparable to v7 in power

its good but with clear weaknesses

and i think that's a good place to be

it doesnt need to be a do-everything gun like oldvolver

[junior needle]

I haven't used the vraks 7 so I can't comment on that, but I'm severely unsatisfied by how inaccurate fanning becomes.

If it actually kept the shots fairly tight I'm sure it wouldn't feel nearly as bad

[white minnow]

should've just been accurate but higher recoil that you could manually control

[junior needle]

But when I fan and visibly see my shots disappear into the distance around my target

[bitter turtle]

if it kept the shots tight then u just fan everything so why even make it a choice there

[white minnow]

cuz you can balance it by adding more recoil

[bitter turtle]

fanning is meant for close range

[junior needle]

You ads for everything with old revolver

[bitter turtle]

yes

because its a shit design weapon

[junior needle]

You ads for everything with most guns if you can help it

[bitter turtle]

i genuienly hipfire quite often on v7 personally

its part of why i build it to oneshot gunners without a crit

[junior needle]

While that's nice, you're removing the benefit of surgical by doing it

[bitter turtle]

so i dont need to ads on literally everything with surgical

yes

that's actually the point lul

[nimble sentinel]

my mg4 gets more hip action than I do

[bitter turtle]

stay more mobile that way

[junior needle]

Just dodge

[bitter turtle]

if i just hipfire headshot a squad of gunners w/o ads it lets me stay on the move much more than adsing on them

[nimble sentinel]

hipfire is good on hordes

[bitter turtle]

that too but i dont v7 into hordes if i can help it

sometimes tho yes

like i said, though

there's a point to it

[gusty bison]

What gun wants to into hordes anyway

Hordes icky

[bitter turtle]

so yes

imo

[nimble sentinel]

mg4, infinite ammo bruv

[bitter turtle]

revolver going "lmao just ads always" is shit design

why even have a button for it then

or a choice at all

[gusty bison]

Yea but just steb the horde

More effective

[nimble sentinel]

magdump a mixed horde, come out with more ammo

they never get in range to smack your balls

[old quail]

my infested/groaners poxwalkers agri brauto

[junior needle]

You still can hipfire and hit things, it's just inferior. Which is how essentially every gun in every shooter works.

[bitter turtle]

i mix adsing and hipfiring on all the guns i play, v3, v7, iag, even hb2

[gusty bison]

Imagine not smacking their balls with ur shovel/axe/sword/knife

[bitter turtle]

except when i play revolver bc lul

[junior needle]

[bitter turtle]

if ur wondering why hipfire hb2

becaus ei play it melee range btw

lul

quick activations of agile engagement

[gusty bison]

Its to proc agile

Ye

[nimble sentinel]

that's when they get in ball smacking range, but momma didn't raise a trooper to have 0 dps until the shamblers shamble

[finite imp]

YEEEEEAAAAHHH BOOOOY

[bitter turtle]

like idk

oldvovler is so fucking boring

[gusty bison]

If ya shooting ya aint sprinting at their balls

:P

[finite imp]

Skill issue

[nimble sentinel]

their balls will sprint for me

[finite imp]

Captain longballs

[gusty bison]

Ergo if u sprint for them u get there in half the time

:P

[nimble sentinel]

balls so long slaanesh wanna find me

[junior needle]

While you may find it boring, it is very effective. And also very satisfying for others for that reason.

[bitter turtle]

that's fine

but i think there's no argument that it's overtuned

[gusty bison]

Its more that its braindead easy

[junior needle]

I'm fine with the fanning provided my shots don't go ridiculously wide

Even if it takes more shots to kill things than old revolver

[gusty bison]

Cos u can miss with the zarona and still headshot

[bitter turtle]

fanning bodyshots is reliable up to 15m while standing still

i dont see the problem

10m if ur moving

[junior needle]

Only if you do them spaced out, one at a time. I posted a video earlier where you can see them going wide as fuck if you actually fan and not just tap it.

[bitter turtle]

u were way beyond 10m though

i mean ig i can make a video but i literally am not missing a single time while strafing fanning on a rager at 10m

bodyshots

mind u

but that's the point of fanning

at least how i see it

its for panic shots at close range to get shit off you

[gusty bison]

I wonder if the recoil reset on rmb is faster than the lmb fire rate

[junior needle]

That's not exactly impressive. You could argue about it being oriented as a "close range" gun and that such a design would be appropriate, but why would I use the fanning revolver for that when I can use plenty of other guns that do a similar or better job and dont suck at range.

[nimble sentinel]

I think we are all wrong on this day, hipfire has its uses and og revolver is meant to never hipfire

everyone except me tho

shoot the hordes

[bitter turtle]

like what?

and dont say oldvolver

[junior needle]

For deleting most enemies nearby? Laspistols, iag's, brautos are great for casual hipfire and function at a longer range than 15m, shotguns work for it too and more usable at range.

[bitter turtle]

most of those dont have armorpen that can drop a crusher in 1 second

[nimble sentinel]

laspistol aint it chief

[bitter turtle]

even the ones that do have armorpen need onslaught and 4 points down that tree and time to build up the stacks

plus

i'd argue the most popular iag at least

@ colu

is not really any more reliable than revolver bodyshotting at long range

[junior needle]

Oh yeah, boltor

That exists

[bitter turtle]

yeah

the gun that takes 10 years to pull out

and reload

[nimble sentinel]

tbh double rending recon las would be viable

[junior needle]

Taking onslaught isn't a big deal

[bitter turtle]

yes

[nimble sentinel]

for this niche scenario

[bitter turtle]

even with onslaught

u get 2k dps

with iags

compared to me just doing 3.6k on a test on a crusher rn with agri

maybe more if u do deadshot meme on iag

but that has its own obvious problems

[junior needle]

Yeah I think a measly 2k crusher dps is a fine price to pay for substantially improved usability overall.

[bitter turtle]

reliability at what

like i said

colu is hardly reliable at long ranges either compared to just bodyshotting on revolver

15m is just for headshot reliability

u can just do 2 body shots if its a problem

and plus

like i said

4 points into onslaught

you may say its not important

but 4 points is still 4 points down that tree

[junior needle]

You can struggle to hit 2 bodyshots while fanning if you don't space your shots at about that range

[bitter turtle]

a lot of colu builds dont take keystones just because they need to dip into 3

[bitter turtle]

spacing them i sliterally like delayin ghalf a second at that point to steady bodyshot

columnus has to do the exact same thing

[junior needle]

Well the gun doesn't "need" to do it. It's just better value.

[bitter turtle]

unless you're literally spraying at long ranges hoping to hit shit

there's areason i swapped off colu myself

[gusty bison]

Aimbot

:D

[terse idol]

I'll say, I find it hard to believe folks can't just run focus target for 1, since in theory you're running the rending talent and onslaught anywho

[junior needle]

There's a difference between needing to pace yourself at 15m and 30+

[white minnow]

i don't run focus target specifically because my teammates benefit from it

[bitter turtle]

you dont need to pace bodyshots at 15m

[white minnow]

that damage belongs to me and me only

[flint onyx]

Column build without keystone sounds interesting, I don't tag enough to justify the middle one and the other two sound too situational

[bitter turtle]

like

i can record it if u dont believe me

[hard briar]

I run focus target on my plasma but that's because I hate the right tree and hate the left tree

[bitter turtle]

im fanning into a flamer at 15m repeatedyl bodyshots

it is killing him

every single time

without missing

[terse idol]

Oh is this discussion on Agri revolver?
Cause I thought the damage is pretty bad

[timid otter]

They both suck. Which one is better?

[hollow ibex]

Kill the target faster and your team won't benefit smh

[white minnow]

i vote grenadier

[hard briar]

I vote grenadier

[hollow ibex]

Grenadier is great

[terse idol]

Yeah and focus target is just the most generalized

[gusty bison]

Always leave ur teammates behind

[timid otter]

Based

[white minnow]

might depend on the grenade you're taking, but i vote for grenadier especially with shredders

[soft blade]

[hard briar]

I run all the nade feats I can with plasma for kraks

[bitter turtle]

part of me also doesn tunderstand why its such a crime to wait a half a second between shots when you literally already do that on oldvolver anyway tbh

for surg

[hard briar]

Why? Because its funny

[white minnow]

you're a sick bastard

[bitter turtle]

if you're going for headshots at 15m i mean

like i just finished emptying the entire clipi at 15m with body shots and didnt miss

[crisp orchid]

is sustained fire any good? i don't know whether i should replace it with raking fire or swap a perk to flak

[woven tide]

Grenadier

[bitter turtle]

if u do miss occasionally at this range while fanning its not a regular thing

[hard briar]

What was the acronym Stan made up yesterday for this scenario? ANIL?

[gusty bison]

Swap sustained for dum dum

[white minnow]

ainl

[junior needle]

Until you get this happening repeatedly

[white minnow]

get yo facts right

[hard briar]

Ainl

[crisp orchid]

no have

[gusty bison]

That FAT fov

Holy shit

[bitter turtle]

ok

let me just take a video

idk

maybe my agri is just magic???

lol

[junior needle]

You can, but it's not relaible

Is what I'm trying to say

[bitter turtle]

im going to empty my entire clip

[hard briar]

Why did it not die?

[bitter turtle]

which i already did twice now

[junior needle]

Shots went wide as fuck, look at the lasers

[tall torrent]

Aimed at neck height, then recoil kicked up

[junior needle]

chest height

Although it is pretty close to the neck there

[hard briar]

Aim at his nuts

[tall torrent]

I’d put this in “neck height” personally

[junior needle]

The issue is that multiple shots just fucked off into the void nowhere near the target

[timid otter]

12% damage or 55% mobility?

[bitter turtle]

u are definitely aiming higher than me

that is for sure

https://i.gyazo.com/b8b2c05348b625333cfcbcc84cd34cdb.jpg

ive dropped 70 bullets without a single miss at this height

[terse idol]

Okay I got it

[bitter turtle]

or 60 idk i lost count

[terse idol]

Why even have the fan function if it doesn't delete everything in front of you, the issue being why use agri and space out shots when the revolver just does that and is better

I seriously hope

They make the regular revolver AP focused and the Agri have Hollow point

Because, damn

Agri got noothing

[bitter turtle]

because

as i was saying earlier

yes

oldvolver is better

[white minnow]

and it's still a weakspot weapon in terms of its damage profile

[terse idol]

[bitter turtle]

and oldvolver is also a piece of shit designed weapon that shits one verything

in comparison

[white minnow]

it's not like the brautos which have a high base damage and middling finesse multipliers

[terse idol]

So sad

[bitter turtle]

agri revolver is honestly a perfectly ok and fair version of revolver

[tall torrent]

Wish it had cleave tho

[bitter turtle]

why are we trying to buff it to be the same as oldvolver

[white minnow]

cuz i hate random spread mechanics

[bitter turtle]

when oldvolver and plasma are literally shit designed overpowered trash

[white minnow]

give me something that i can interact with and control instead of RNG

[terse idol]

I don't want to buff it to be the same to be fair, I want it to be able to fit a niche
Maybe focus on dredge ragers and unarmoured, and the oldvolver can focus on AP targets

Struggle vs maniac

but I dunno if FS even has this frame work thought out

[bitter turtle]

it has a niche

like i said

[junior needle]

You'll get more bodyshots for sure if you aim at the stomach, but then you're giving up weakspot hits

[bitter turtle]

if i compare it to v7

[terse idol]

My b my b

[bitter turtle]

which is honestly a good gun

i consider it

i lose range but gain armor pen

both are anti-elite/specialist focused guns

[wanton dawn]

Now that i tried a melee build with plasma: it is just stupidly powerful

[bitter turtle]

but unlike v7 i dont need to throw 120541820 shots into a crusher to kill it

but on the other hand i cant snipe at 40m away

that's fine

that's fair

that's a tradeoff

unlike oldvolver which is just v7 but with armor pen :^)

[bitter turtle]

you dont just ge tmore

like i said

[finite imp]

You still talking about the zarona

[gusty bison]

Oh i know who uses agri volver good now