veteran-class

[terse idol]

No wayy

[strange sparrow]

which is like primary gamemode for me after getting bore

[terse idol]

Just get all the bush upgrades

I love the bush

[strange sparrow]

you stuck with a white staff until like close to the end

Also guess how much I hate peril system in VT2

250 hours perfecting Kerilian Melee and Range entire arsenal Moveset

[terse idol]

well

You can just

Find an upgrade

plenty of opportunities to swap out

Or upgrade to a yellow

[strange sparrow]

SotT, pretty good
buy the DLC
Giant nerf

[terse idol]

Or a red on the last stage

[strange sparrow]

Ok so, I guess I don't get to play Poison knife women

[terse idol]

I just think she wasn't for yooou

And then when FS like

Made the nerfs

To align her closer to the vision they were going for

You did get burned

[strange sparrow]

Now, not a lot of people play her because she's a support

just like why there isn't a lot of smite dome psyker around

If winning is so darn important, every game should have 1-2 smite dome psyker

[terse idol]

hnmm

I

Think nooot

[strange sparrow]

Just Smite for 9 seconds

then get your buddy to smite for you when you quell peril

instant win button 9/10

[terse idol]

I mean

*shrug

[quasi widget]

Which shotgun should you spec for? Lawbringer or mark 1?

[strange sparrow]

I mean no one like to play support, that just pretty much the case

[drowsy kayak]

for the standard issue shovel is Limbsplitter or Skullcrusher better?

[idle swallow]

Probably skullcrusher, if you're aiming for a hordeclear role

[torn root]

yeah VoC is a crutch indeed

im going back to it lmao

the damage isnt worth

from exec stance

[strange sparrow]

You need to learn to play without VoC tbh

Eventually it’s gonna come anyways

[torn root]

oh no i can play without it

[idle swallow]

The question is how

[torn root]

just gotta be less braindead

things on screen are dying way faster but i cant cc so my teammates dont die

[drowsy kayak]

i moved away from VoC to Infiltrate

[idle swallow]

I was more saying how they gonna nerf VoC but yeah you got guns use em play smart

Probably cooldown or no more full Regen from empty toughness

[gritty mirage]

theres plenty of ways to play without voc

yea infiltrate was my old go to as well

[drowsy kayak]

I wish the support aspect of it was stronger with people disregarding Only In Death most of the time

[hollow ibex]

going from crutch to handicapping yourself

[drowsy kayak]

every time I played with executioners I felt like if a heretic breathed on me wrong I would fold like cardboard

[strange sparrow]

VoC is strong because IronWill give you 50% toughness damage reduction

And it doesn’t affect how you need to be 75% above toughness

[terse idol]

???

That's just you

Warrior priest with the bubble was good

HOLD OON MY MAN

Ranger bardin

Support

ranged

Iron breaker

Tank-support

Kruber Knight

Come ooonn

[shrewd nova]

i'm not gonna lie; i'm only leveling vet atm, because i can play an invincible shouting melee shit head

Had no interest in the class when it was just call of duty man

[teal abyss]

They’re kinda both crutches in a different way lmao voc “all these enemies are on the ground and I’m fine now” infiltrate “all these enemies are on my teammates and I’m fine now”

[strange sparrow]

Warrior priest HAVE DAMAGE

RANGER BARDIN HAVE DAMAGE

IRON BREAKER IS A TANK

KRUBER KNIGHT HAVE DAMAGE

WDYM

ALL OF THEM HAVE DAMAGE

THEIR SKILL NOT FUNNY HAHA DoT

It’s like saying vet taking VoT is support because I give my team 50 toughness(EHP)

[limber egret]

what melk has currently

even tho ammo is 50% it looks decent

besides the perks and sustained fire?

[strange sparrow]

It’s good

[idle swallow]

If you're doing shock trooper ammo doesn't really matter that much

[strange sparrow]

Onslaught is always needed

[teal abyss]

Yeah don’t worry about ammo lmao I’d snag it

[strange sparrow]

The perk need a rework but it doesn’t matter

Cara doesn’t give breakpoint

[limber egret]

oh well heres my helbore

which is the Mk III version for maxium damage

[strange sparrow]

No onslaught

Shamfur display

[idle swallow]

Mk3 bayonet is cringe do mk1

[teal abyss]

Falter to onslaught and sprint efficiency to Maniac and shits almost perfect

Buy the one for blessing

[limber egret]

so get the melk weapon for onslaught?

[strange sparrow]

It’s not the same shnail

That’s a Mk1

[teal abyss]

Well I would, many people say Onslaught and Surgical the best blessings for Helbore

[strange sparrow]

This is a mk3

They don’t share

[teal abyss]

You can swap blessings between Mks?

Pretty sure they do lol

[limber egret]

here

so hows this now?

[teal abyss]

Looking good

[limber egret]

which i did Mk III even if the bayonet is worst on this

because i wanted the one that did the most damage

[torn root]

yeah VoC is a crutch

[teal abyss]

I personally think the Bayonet is small price to pay for the damage yeah but everyone has preferences

[strange sparrow]

Wtf

[torn root]

but not just for the vet, all of their team lmao

[teal abyss]

lol that hurts not knowing that til now

[limber egret]

i got my power sword for horde clearing

[strange sparrow]

You could swap blessings like that?

[idle swallow]

I liked bayonet charging in BF1 a lot so I may be biased

[limber egret]

just works better if i do heavy attacks since wide swings

[strange sparrow]

So you could grind PC4 on PS3?

Then swap to PS6?

[white minnow]

blessings are shared between weapons of the same weapon family

[wooden lotus]

if the weapon is literally in the same archetype, as in literally different versions of the same weapon, they share

[teal abyss]

Yep

[white minnow]

they belong to the same weapon family if they have the same name after the mark number

[wooden lotus]

the knives share, for example

[strange sparrow]

Wait then what about revolver

Agripinaa and Zolana

[white minnow]

both quickdraw stub revolvers share blessings

[limber egret]

also damn

that would had been great if stopping power wasnt that low

[teal abyss]

Yeah if that was 42% ammo I would murder for that gun

Oh it’s a II nevermind

[limber egret]

tho yeah is the III helbore i have now great?

with what i added onto it?

[teal abyss]

Yeah definitely good/great, Flak instead of unyielding and Level 4 surgical would make it perfect but nothing you can do about that so definitely more than usable

[limber egret]

oh yey

tho is the Mk I the actual best one?

since has that funny bayonet while doing lots of damage?

[strange sparrow]

Mk 1 is great

Mk2 is better for most people

[teal abyss]

Definitely debatable, I love the sights on the Mk 3 and the fact that it hits like a truck (you two shot Crushers with a surgical crit headshot in damnation) so I’m a ride or die on the 3

[strange sparrow]

Due to very very fast charges shot but breakpoint wise, you need more investment

[strange sparrow]

Download the customisation mod

[teal abyss]

Xbox

[strange sparrow]

I put mk3 barrel and columnus sight on my mk2

[limber egret]

i did also rolled this at some point

this good stats?

[teal abyss]

Yeah you don’t need good stab either with this type of weapon

[strange sparrow]

Mk1 doesn’t need great roll to be great

Mk2 need god roll

80% damage and 80 stopping power something

[ripe totem]

hadron be like

imma put stamina effic. on it

[strange sparrow]

I have a 76% damage and 80% stopping power Mk2

[limber egret]

i also have this which i guess is decent

tho charge rate is rather low

[stiff pasture]

Behold, my new auric weapon because apparently I’m crutching with plasma and revolver

[umbral scaffold]

Nice with stability like that you’ll get to experience marksmanship when you’re in crutches

[midnight totem]

ayyy

[umbral scaffold]

That weapon is as stable as my parents marriage amen brother

[neat sluice]

best shotgun variant?

just for raw dps

crushers specifically

[umbral scaffold]

I can’t remember all the variants off the top of my head but you want the slug shotty

There is a shotgun variant that shoots what amounts to flaming confetti, you do not want that one

[terse idol]

Agrinapinna

Well what do we got

Slug shotgun

And Lawbringer

Not bad

[neat sluice]

i have a 505 lawbringer from emperor

no idea if i should keep it or take the tier iv bless on it

immune to range on close range kill

[terse idol]

Wahat's it look like

[idle swallow]

Kantrael has a specific meme combo of scattershot+flechette with the flame round but it's more for fun than actual practicality

[umbral scaffold]

Immune to close range isn’t awful but I don’t feel the shotgun has the raw killing potential to make the best use of it imo

Autoguns will mow down enemies in close range much more effectively than the shotty making better use of that particular blessing

All shotguns feel a little anemic in this game

[limber egret]

is this blessing good?

this looks very bad

on this gun currently

[grand lark]

It's not inherently terrible but there are just much better options

And it's as you would expect very niche in it's use

I forget whichever blessing the name is, but the one that does extra damage on crit weakspot hit + surgical would be good

But that's not a great weapon in general you have. The sprint efficiency is meh anf the stat roll isn't amazing overall

47% stab on a headhunter might be rough lol

[limber egret]

sadly has sprint efficency

and i already replaced one of the perks

so either would have to be stuck with the bad perk or the not really great blessing

im probably just gonna attempt to get a new one

hopfully maxed out damage, ammo and stopping power

[grand lark]

Yeah it's not terrible but def can do better

[true umbra]

Finally 100% both the old and new penances for the Veteran... Do I try a new class already? 🤔

[grand lark]

yea

[umbral scaffold]

Don’t listen to the detractors spend all your time on the same class 24/7

[true umbra]

I have 250 hours on only veteran... 🥲

[grand lark]

jfc

[true umbra]

I just have little interest in the other classes

I'll have to explore

[muted knot]

Go for ogryn brother

Ogryn best

[true umbra]

i try i try

[brazen meadow]

Man, I got this back when I first hit level 30 probably about... 10 months ago? STILL havent found a pinning fire 4

[junior needle]

autopistol is dumpster tier now unfortunately

[shrewd acorn]

Any blessing or perks i should change on this?

[muted knot]

I'm not sure but 10months ago the autopistol might have actually had a use in the game

[junior needle]

You aren't missing out on much

[brazen meadow]

Autopistol still goes hard imo

Fun gun'

[junior needle]

Apparently perks are more important on pgun so probably both perks

Ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[muted knot]

Crit to maniac elite to unyielding like (thank you soldier 69)

Would be my guess

[true umbra]

wouldnt even consider auto pistol on damnation

[junior needle]

Na, it wants maniac/unyielding

[muted knot]

You could go for carapace but with shattering it's eh

Oh right

Don't mind me

[junior needle]

Autopistol knocks things on their asses still but the damage is lacking against anything that isn't a maniac

[muted knot]

Wait what's maniacs again ?

Muties ?

Trappers

[junior needle]

Muties, most specialists and disablers

ragers

[brazen meadow]

Basically anything green

[muted knot]

Gotcha

I keep getting confused with the tags

[junior needle]

It's just massively outdone by the ciag in every way apart from knocking things around

[brazen meadow]

buff my baby 😦

The stagger is why I like it tbh. Nice to see a whole group of ragers get knocked over

[junior needle]

See, you could stagger a bunch of ragers

Or you could just murder them

harder

[brazen meadow]

That is a fair argument

[torpid sundial]

I've been having a lot of fun with lazpistol killing mainly specials, gunners and ranged shooters

dunno if I should change infernus to dum dum though

And Ghost is surprisingly great since I can find a good spot, stand still and shoot everything one by one

[junior needle]

It's preference. Infernus isn't as valuable as it used to be even a couple patches ago, since it no longer stacks onslaught.

[hollow ibex]

i feel like infernus isn't that good on the kantreal laspistol

[torpid sundial]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/459631486925013012.webp?size=48&name=Hmmtera&quality=lossless

dumdum it is

Probably better to hit breakpoints on the elites

[junior needle]

Yeah it's less useful on the heavy one

I didn't even notice it was the new one

[torpid sundial]

Whats the difference between the old and new

[hollow ibex]

new = slower rof, bigger alpha

[junior needle]

fire rate, damage

[torpid sundial]

ah

[hollow ibex]

old = faster rof, lower alpha

[junior needle]

Same as most other guns

[limber egret]

is this any good?

[junior needle]

You don't sprint much/at all while you're in the shit so the value is limited

[limber egret]

oh Oof

also so i have this

very good right?

[junior needle]

Pretty good, the only improvement would be unyielding>maniacs but it's a very overtuned gun so you'll outperform others without it

[limber egret]

oh deer

tho i usually like having unyielding

[torpid sundial]

I know power sword is meta and all but holy shit the catachan devil sword parry is so fun

prefer using it over the power sword

[torpid sundial]

even if I get hit more because I panic parry and miss the elite atacks

[limber egret]

also heres my power sword

since speaking of

[torpid sundial]

Power cycler doesnt exist in my world

so I'll never use the power sword

[limber egret]

its also one of my oldest weapons

[torpid sundial]

I started the game about a week ago so thats also the issue

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/512688851320569906.webp?size=48&name=aquaSmug&quality=lossless

[limber egret]

like this exact power sword (just not including the blessings) is like somewhat near the release of the game

like a month or two after

been using it ever since

[brazen meadow]

power sword supremacy

[limber egret]

i must be one of few players who likes the power sword in lore wise

like not just in game

why i been using it only

[ebon umbra]

based

[limber egret]

i do like thunder hammer the most for power weapons

but power sword my second favourite

[vale ledge]

I wonder if there’s such thing as a “Power Bayonet”

[limber egret]

i know dawn of war 1 had it as an upgrade

but not sure about in lore

i presume it does

just not common

[vale ledge]

It’s an Ogryn Bayonet lol

[stiff surge]

Hmm. That crit bonus is kinda cringe...

[wraith locust]

entire roll is kinda scuffed

back to farming

[torn root]

BET IT BRICKS

gotta farm plasteel first

[torpid sundial]

which mod is that to show the dps

[lofty lintel]

Thats been a brick since it was grey

[torpid sundial]

I dont think I even want to use plasteel on anything without at least the dps stats below 75% and min 360-370+ base rating

plasteel is perma at 0

[torn root]

perpetually Zero'

frfr

[tiny summit]

hadron salivating on the horrors she can inflict

[crisp rapids]

i am actually pretty surprised

i had so many fukcing goated weapons

on my vet

[torn root]

i know ppl gunna hate me but i legit want weakspot damage and carapace on it

i just wanna know if i can 2 tap crushers

[torpid sundial]

mine already bricked so I'm using the devil claw because its more fun to parry

[torn root]

oof

[lofty lintel]

That aint bricked

[torpid sundial]

🤔

[lofty lintel]

Crit dmg for flak or maniac and supercharge for pc4 and its good to go

[torn root]

can anyone clip themselves killing a crusher with Special Attack>Bash Attack>Light

on the power sword*

[lofty lintel]

Where do you see the brick

[stiff surge]

on it

[torpid sundial]

Thought brutal momentum wasnt the right blessing either

[lofty lintel]

2nd best one

First is pc4

[rare fulcrum]

whats the best gun for vets?

[lofty lintel]

Depends

[rare fulcrum]

im ab to hit 30 so i wanna start working on specific gear

[torpid sundial]

okok

[lofty lintel]

What did you like using when you were levelinc

[torn root]

thought brutal momentum was the go to, it covers wave clear, special and elite kills and crusher kills because ofthe damage no?

[lofty lintel]

Yes

[rare fulcrum]

rn im runnin bolt but aparently its ass now

[lofty lintel]

BM is the go to blessing

[torpid sundial]

but do I commit to another catachan sword

[lofty lintel]

If you want and have the plasteel

[crisp rapids]

hadron really said "u gaming today"

first try this shit

[lofty lintel]

Thats 1/4 so far

[torn root]

can't 2 tap crushers without brutal

[torpid sundial]

I mean are the base stats here better than the trancendent one

I know its 380 but the damage/cleave damage is slightly lower

idk if it affects it much

[lofty lintel]

Not a lot

[torpid sundial]

mmm

[lofty lintel]

50+ mobility gives you one more dodge

Id give the 380 a shot but if anything you can just fall back on your current one

Its good enough

[torpid sundial]

aite

I like the sword a lot so I'm committing to it

parrying berserkers and bosses are some of the most satisfying things ever

I cant tell if the parry is aoe or st

[fading grove]

what are the go to plasma gun blessings

[torn root]

volatile + blaze away

some people like gets hot

[stiff surge]

Can't get it with my powersword lmao, the finess is just barely under the 2shot breakpoint

[torn root]

i think im gunan have a not so bad time crafint mine

I think i only care about damage and finesse

weapon gets damn near infinite cleave anyway from the special

[brazen meadow]

Is this bricked ? Not sure whats good on the Boltgun anymore

[torn root]

big time bricked

[brazen meadow]

big time sad

Ty

[lofty lintel]

Eh

[gilded rock]

Grenade tinkerer should increase Krak radius just a tad imo

[lofty lintel]

You can make a sniper bolter build replacing gloryhunter for shattering impact and crit damage for flak or maniac

[gilded rock]

Weird to toss one into a crowd of crushers and maulers that are stacked inside of each other and still only one dies

[floral sun]

I would pull t4 surgical because stability and mobility stas are borked

[lofty lintel]

Stabilty is fine enough

65< and it was a brick

[brazen meadow]

I have pinning 4 and SHattering impact 4 in the bank

[lofty lintel]

If you have nothing better id pick it up

Itd be a 3/4

With good base stats

[gilded rock]

Wait hold on there's literally no reason to grenade tinker for Kraks, it still one shots crushers unless you care that much about boss damage

[brazen meadow]

Yeah it makes no sense to have

[lofty lintel]

Yea grenade tinkerer is a waste of point for kraks

[brazen meadow]

Ima log back on and show you the boltgun Im using now

[gilded rock]

Glad I caught that

[floral sun]

unless you're taking middle aura not sure why you would use grenade tinkerer tbh

[gilded rock]

Been wasting a (now recently) very valuable vet tree point 🤡

[brazen meadow]

This is my current boltgun, has low collat so thats why ive been trying to get a new one

[stiff surge]

Hmm, never really used the combat axes, this roll doesnt seem terrible

[lofty lintel]

Its a brick

[bitter turtle]

It's a pretty significant increase in boss dmg

[stiff surge]

meant more stats wise, or are blessings and perks a make or break on the combat axes?

[lofty lintel]

Low cleave and 0/4 so far

Stat wise the dumpstat is the wrong one

[stiff surge]

Really? Low cleave on a strikedown weapon is bad?

[floral sun]

idk axe moveset but you probably want cleave on higher difficulties as vet with an axe

[terse idol]

it'll hurt your horde clear something terrible

[lofty lintel]

Yes

Itll hurt it very bad

[terse idol]

Like, well okay we want to get into it like

[lofty lintel]

Also no cleave means less stagger on the tougher enemies youre supposed to use the strikedown on

[terse idol]

Yeah, this is why Vets take Unarmoured on a Rashad

Because if you can't cleave, you're gonna

feeel it

[lofty lintel]

Yep

[digital cargo]

What's your go-to Vet weapon? Not in a "what's best?" way but a "I just like this" way

[lofty lintel]

Helbore

[floral sun]

Plasma gun and power sword

[patent swift]

Boltgun chefs kiss

[lofty lintel]

And vraks mk3

[terse idol]

Lasgun is slaapping

[crisp rapids]

why the fuck sometiems my palsmagun simply wont shoot

[terse idol]

I'm trying the MXII

[crisp rapids]

and or the projectile wont show?

[terse idol]

Whew hits like a truuck

[crisp rapids]

tf is this shit

[terse idol]

it is shooting

It's a bug

[wind echo]

plasma gun or recon lasgun

[digital cargo]

I shoulda said melee weapon but this works

[terse idol]

Sometimes your plasma will just shoot air but it'll still shoot and kill

[floral sun]

known bug

[crisp rapids]

MG12 is nuts

i thought i was not shoting i also disconected when the bug happen

[terse idol]

If you're speaking of melee weapon, Dlclaw my beloved

[stiff surge]

Chaxe Mk12, shrimply too easy to use.

[lofty lintel]

Melee wise standard shovel

There is definitely not a pattern in my answers

[terse idol]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer-warhammer40k-vraks-siege-of-vraks-death-korps-gif-20931228

[lofty lintel]

https://tenor.com/view/warhammer-gif-8197900

[torn root]

XIIIg got a smooth brain move set

and i love it

[junior needle]

I would like to use one of my multiple godrolled 6d recons but the entire line is in the dumpster and I can’t justify the performance

[wind echo]

chainsword my beloved

[torn root]

swing to you heart content to clear hordes lmao, literally just light attack

[gilded rock]

Chainsword def my staple melee, but I switch between boltgun, plasma gun, and recently Columnus Mk V

[torn root]

XIIIg and Columnus, best load out, change my mind

[south garnet]

On new laspistol, if I have +10% specialists for one perk, what should I do for the other? Flak or maniac preferable? I haven't looked into BPs for it at all

[torn root]

you shouldnt take +10% specialist especially if you havent looked into BPs

ever

[lofty lintel]

Flak

[south garnet]

I want to keep specialists because big number good lower number bad

[torn root]

those broader perks only really ever work if you can hit BPs with them

[south garnet]

(lol)

[lofty lintel]

Uh

Specialist dmg for flak

[south garnet]

Alright, thanks for the pointer

[lofty lintel]

https://tenor.com/view/iron-man-iron-man-hammer-iron-hammer-robert-downey-robert-downey-jr-gif-15959050

[gilded rock]

Is there some niche use for serrated blade or is it not just dog?

[stiff surge]

Ayo..? Isnt this like, perfect?

[lofty lintel]

Almost

360 is higher chance of t4 blessings and mobility below 50 means 1 less dodge

But id still take it

Just get flechette on it and go ham

[crisp rapids]

. (pinging for ppl in my squad)

[stiff surge]

Didnt know there was a break point for that

Hmmm

Semi bricked afaik

[thick rose]

why you gotta be like this brunt?

[south garnet]

alright well tried the new laspistol. Think I prefer the old one tbh

"alright alright we heard you, how about a 380 with maxed mobility like you asked and dumped damage. OH SHIT that's right it was the other way around, huh? we'll get you next time for sure"

[midnight totem]

what should I put on this revolver

I actually like gloryhunter too

[jaunty tinsel]

Is there any way to block Maulers?

[south garnet]

parry

[lofty lintel]

Groaners for maniac/unyielding terrifying barrage for flechette and its good to go

[spring rose]

Carapace and unarmored I would say

Or flak

[junior needle]

The answer is always surgical/hand cannon for the 2a.

[spring rose]

Since u got rending blessing

[junior needle]

He needs surgical or hand cannon won't be doing much

[spring rose]

Tru

[midnight totem]

which perk do I change?

specialist to flak?

to maniac?

[lofty lintel]

Specialists for maniac gloryhunter to surgival

Surgical

Might be flak look for BPs on flak enemies

[spring rose]

Surgical tier 3 will do as well, don't greed for tier 4

[junior needle]

You still want t4 ideally

[midnight totem]

huh

the revolver can go through things

[stiff surge]

The Zarona has really high cleave

[jaunty tinsel]

What blessings work best for plasma gun?

[lofty lintel]

Blaze away/gets hot/volatile

[patent swift]

Is focused fire a wasted point?

[jaunty tinsel]

What perks would you play with that? Was thinking +25% vs Unyielding or carapace

[midnight totem]

alright, the laspistol does extraordinary amounts of damage with crit, wtf

[lofty lintel]

Those are fine

Unarmored/flak/maniac/cara/inyielding

U*

[ember folio]

planning on using revolver and looking to fight twins, recommendations for talents and such?

[wanton dawn]

Revolver will have meh dps on twins, your boss dps will be your melee weapon through the fight

[gilded rock]

Is 15% the maximum toughness you can get on a vet curio, or have I been unlucky?

[crisp rapids]

WHY THIS GUN SUCKS?

[wanton dawn]

17%

[gilded rock]

So same as other classes, unlucky it is 💀

[wanton dawn]

Hh are the weakest autogun category atm

[crisp rapids]

but its perfect roll

legit

it doesnt get better than that

[patent swift]

63% Stability must hurt no?

[crisp rapids]

not really

[wanton dawn]

So what ? Perfect recon sucks

[lofty lintel]

Never used the agri hh but the vraks 3 is insane

[wanton dawn]

Deadly accurate is also a mixed bag

[crisp rapids]

:XD:

showing the build in vs

i cant see shit

[lofty lintel]

Wtf

[crisp rapids]

vraks HH is nuts

bot

both*

[lofty lintel]

Darktide in 1950

[thick rose]

this game is quite insistent that I play IAGs

at this point id take a good lasgun to mix it up

[umbral scaffold]

why is death spitter considered good over other blessings like fire frenzy?

as far as i know its only a relatively small amount of power every 3.5 seconds vs other blessings that stack damage every hit/kill like dum dum and fire frenzy

[midnight lark]

why does it have to be ammo man

[thick rose]

is power preferred because it gives more than just dmg?

[thick rose]

gotta go fast!

[midnight lark]

Brunt took all my moneyyy

[umbral scaffold]

i think it is multiplicative of many things but i think for pure DPS you're better off with other blessings

[midnight lark]

can i see your columnus MK V gun

[thick rose]

posted all of them I think

if thats what you mean?

[spark helm]

fuckers won't stop trying to shove the atrox into my hands. I'm not using that shit.

pls

[midnight lark]

like the stats and blessings

[jaunty tinsel]

What is Ranged Finesse?

[torn root]

?

ammo is negligable

[spark helm]

weakspot and crit math on weakspot @halcyon current

ooh

[torn root]

shouldn be running survivalist anyway

[spark helm]

wrong person lol

[midnight lark]

yeah i just check it in the pysch im tripin

[thick rose]

its a bit of a minger

[umbral scaffold]

tbf the ammo % also does affect how much ammo you get from ammo pickups

[spark helm]

@jaunty tinsel ranged weakspot and crit math on weakspot I believe.

[midnight lark]

still got plenty of rounds

[stoic mantle]

What blessings do yall recommend on the power sword? power cycler, obviously, but rampage or slaughterer for second?

[spark helm]

That's just what "Finesse" means in this game anyway

[umbral scaffold]

brutal momentum

[thick rose]

think most people want deathspitter / dumdum and flak / maniac ?

[spark helm]

brutal momentum is a massive winner. can cruise with bm2 if you have power cycler 4

[stoic mantle]

Really?

[spark helm]

Yeah.

[dusk pulsar]

slaughterer or brutal momentum , whatever you want the sword to be better at

[stoic mantle]

Weird, I'm used to zealot shit where brutal momentum is a troll roll

[spark helm]

in summary, the way it interacts with anything in particular is going to run through with your powered up cleave.

[midnight lark]

i see..time to start rolling for dumdum ty

[spark helm]

might as well have cleave blessings on at that point with how it plays out with brutal momentum. idk how brutal momentum plays out for other weapons save the rashad axe

[stoic mantle]

All I know is its dogwater for zealot

[spark helm]

but for psword for now before anything else changes, power cycler 4 (3 works too but you'll have to pay more attention to your cycled power-ups) and brutal momentum are what's safest imo.

Plus, it's easy to land your headshots with that weapon anyway.

[stoic mantle]

God it is

nothing but heads at all times with that perfectly flat swing

[spark helm]

with the other psword, i think whatever the mk6 is idr your push attack light followups when powered up just melt carapace.

and, again, you're cleaving bcuz psword charge so you can see where this is going

[midnight lark]

i rolled this 10mins ago but yeah i need power cycler

[spark helm]

you'll be able to do the same with the mk3 psword, just mostly on heavies.

Sunder would be nicer if power cycler 3-4 just wasn't mandatory.

Strictly that's the blessing you need for it to be more efficient at higher difficulties unfortunately.

[thick rose]

I reckon fatshark will nerf cycler before I can roll the bastard

[spark helm]

Quality of life blessing

I mean, likely not.

idk. it's a very strong setup but you have other ones that are easier to come by for veteran. plus, i don't really think they'd do that without maybe changing something else to make the weapon less of a hassle to use without it.

[thick rose]

I just think it wont roll for me at this point, mostly.

[spark helm]

you dont need the power sword is what I'm saying. You have alot of other options that have wider blessing variety because they're not as restrictive as psword

[thick rose]

oh sure

I have a useable dclaw, rashad and shovel that are all good to use.

[spark helm]

mmhm

[thick rose]

I just wanna try the OP hotness while its around

[serene sage]

i didn't know the game can do this

[spark helm]

I just fucked myself over with hadron because I forgot that the standard shovel I wanted to bump up was already locked with the blessings. I...really don't understand why the fuck you have limited blessing edits. that's just kind of stupid.

[junior needle]

You found me

You spawned into my game as it ended

[spark helm]

Like I guess lock things down but at least omit blessings imo

but then again, there wouldn't be a need for the perks to work the same way either.

[serene sage]

wait lmao

send me an inite

we run it back

[junior needle]

Aight

[junior needle]

It says you're offline

[serene sage]

o.o

[junior needle]

actually wait

[serene sage]

there we go

[junior needle]

It was just fatshark client being shit

[thick rose]

it would be so cool if you could just swap in and out whenever you like blessings you hve unlocked

[serene sage]

we run it back

[thick rose]

just so you could try stuff on a whim and play around with things

[junior needle]

That one was pretty yikes

[serene sage]

relay station is more yikes

[junior needle]

Only game I lost in a hot minute

[jaunty spindle]

Anyone got the scoop on the build I keep seeing with a braced autogun

[spark helm]

my main thing is is that there's genuinely no other method to building up oyour arsenal without being forced to engage with the rng gamebling loop between brunt, melk and hadron.

[south garnet]

don't you feel ENGAGED? not like you have beaten wife syndrome but the GOOD KIND?

[spark helm]

This game is interesting enough on its gameplay alone for people to just be okay with building up whatever weapons they want, then mixing and matching them as they please for the same materials that are already used.

[serene sage]

🤨

[spark helm]

Makes building multiple weapons and all that shit not this much of a pain in the ass.

[south garnet]

I actually wish all weapons were presented with identical stats

[spark helm]

Or you know...have a scaling cap between the tiers or something to not run into the bullshit of having a nice stat spread just to get shafted on the vendor shit. literally some place your bets type shit then running around to get your gambling money ready lol

been in the casinos enough to know the vibe

[thick rose]

would be cool if you could pump stats with diamantine

[spark helm]

`I want my fucking materials partially or fully refunded on a earn bless

like

[torn root]

YUP!

[spark helm]

that is what annoys me the most.

[torn root]

crafting was too free in vermintide so they absolutely nerfed it

Yes the crafting is shit

[spark helm]

Realistically, you run into the inevitable "problem" of people maybe just cruising on a select few weapons, rotating through those weapons and builds and never changing it.

But...then...you're going to have address weapon balance and blahblahblahblah

[torn root]

still a horrible reason to gut crafting

[spark helm]

things that to me, come back to not building up certain kinds of games with progression running alongside eternal balancing and all that

[spark helm]

Oh no, see I'm not saying that that's necessarily a bad thing in the first place. You actually getting the materials for one, getting multiple possible drops for two and finally just the ease of transitioning between difficulty tiers in vt2 made the crafting not even remotely as taxing as it is here.

[torn root]

nah you dont get it

vermintide was grindy af

AND STILL HAD BETTER CRAFTING

[spark helm]

I just never felt the grind.

[lofty lintel]

Yea the crafting is shit

[torn root]

it got changed for absolutely NO REASON

[spark helm]

Like, after a bit, it never occurred to me that I'd even be grnding. I just had the resources.

[torn root]

we get only 1 item for winning int he highest difficulty INSTEAD OF 3

[lofty lintel]

Absolutely horrible

[spark helm]

So I never really was lacking.

[torn root]

you can't lock stats to reroll others

[spark helm]

Oh I'm talking about vt2 just being better for item progress.

[torn root]

THERE IS AN EXTRA RESOURCE TO GRIND FOR NO REASON

fat shark legit on some shit

[spark helm]

Getting three possible drops, even if it wasn't shit you wanted, just guaranteed dismantled resources.

[torn root]

but then again this is the game that had a working cash shop before all else

[spark helm]

relative to this game, much much better.

[south garnet]

please lord all I want is an auric mael with no mentally stunted zealots

[shrewd nova]

plz be kind 2 zealots

[south garnet]

[serene sage]

come join

we running it down

[south garnet]

Just hit my limit for the night, gonna go re-bed down my tiny dude, I'm down next time though!

[jaunty sphinx]

got ghost and dumdum on my laspistol yaaaaay

[serene sage]

weak smh my head

[rare fulcrum]

whats the best perk combo for the devils claw. just got one with max melee dmg to elites and max dmg to carapace armor

[bitter turtle]

Idk I play only one build right now bc I can't afford anything else

And the only other build I have I'm bored of

Rolling for weapon is so demoralizing

[solar sky]

I'm working on a comprehensive veteran guide, and wanted to check in with y'all. Is there any particular aspect of the veteran class that was difficult for you to learn? Or is there a particular weapon that just never seemed to click with you?

[gilded rock]

My experience was that it was hard to make most of the guns feel impactful until the later end of leveling up and when I got more knowledge, I think an easy-to-digest summary of each gun and their marks would be so, so very helpful.

[thick rose]

fatshark what are you doing... give
https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/warhammer40k/images/8/88/Salvar-Chem_Dog.jpg

[serene sage]

lol what are you, poor?

[bitter turtle]

Yes

[thick rose]

But I, being poor, have only my dreams; I have spread my dreams under your feet; Tread softly because you tread on my dreams

[torn root]

yes

YES!

I CAN 2 TAP CRUSHERS

YEEEEES!

it works!

i would have ruined the entire sword if it didnt!

[rapid hedge]

pog sword

[native furnace]

Damn! Double-heavies?

[torn root]

no

shove attack light

1 second kill

[umbral scaffold]

The dirtiest trick in the book

[dim citrus]

This a decent support perk?

Like is it ANY kill?

I'm redistributing my Left side build since I think I don't use the capstone enough

[torn root]

It's beautiful

just gotta get my clicks down now

[dim citrus]

So its pretty much a flat 10% damage buff for everyone?

By the Emperor

How do I share a build?

I'm surprised there's no zoom out function

[torn root]

gotta make one on the website

[dim citrus]

Ah

I got a spare point

[torn root]

you dont need to highlight enemies for team mates

you could get something else to hel the team if you really want to supp, just in general you can get something better for yourself

how many points do you have left?

[dim citrus]

1 spare

[torn root]

yeah get rid of the highlith for team mates

use the 2 points to get for the emperor

[dim citrus]

Sure but personally I appreciate a vet who has it as I don't have great eyes

[torn root]

like the other person suggested

ahh well i guess that's that

you could take charismatic

[dim citrus]

Yeah I like it because some dumbs dumbs don't get the hint

[tidal rapids]

I certainly appreciate it as it seems to count for the penance

And I can keep running VoC instead.

[torn root]

VoC OP!

[dim citrus]

Voice of Command is great

[torn root]

correction

it's the best

no slander on the goat

[dim citrus]

It is my main build

This is just my Left Side build I put on time to time

[tidal rapids]

I cannot live without VoC as a vet

[dim citrus]

cough Skill issue

[torn root]

neither can your team, learned that today

lmao

[dim citrus]

Don't need toughness regen if you don't get hit eh?

[tidal rapids]

More that I just like VoC that much, I would rather not consider a build without it

[torn root]

this legit si the one instance i will tell someone to take weakspot or elite damage over anything else

[dim citrus]

I recommend at least making one build for each side

So you can fully understand the class

[torn root]

NO ONE TOLD ME YOU COULD KIL CRUSHERS THIS FAST AND SMOOTH

[dim citrus]

So you can better argue why VoC is the best

[torn root]

i still love my XIIIg but now I have an actually sweaty sword

[tidal rapids]

Power sword?

[torn root]

yes!

[terse idol]

Infil is the best

[tidal rapids]

I fully agree with your choice

[torn root]

dude like they were talking about it with me earlier but legit weakspot or elite is the way to go

[tidal rapids]

Cleaving through hordes and 3 hitting crushers with my mk6 power sword

[torn root]

elite 100% if you can get it

[dim citrus]

I don't like the Right side simply because if I want melee I rather go Zealot

[rapid hedge]

bois does blaze away only go up to tier 3???

[torn root]

nah we not 3 hitting crushers

we double tapping dat

[terse idol]

Man I thought you said yoy played all trees

[dim citrus]

Like its cool but if I'm playing Vet I rather focus on...well the Ogryn

[terse idol]

Or err sorry

Yall

[dim citrus]

I said I didn't like it but that doesn't mean I don't play it

[torn root]

right side is for guns

mk5

[terse idol]

Thought ya played all builds 🥹

That's fair

[dim citrus]

I tried it out, its good, just not for me

[torn root]

dont be fooled by the melee nodes

[terse idol]

I just feel like it's very different

[torn root]

SMUDGELS

[terse idol]

From anything zealot offers

[torn root]

YALL WERE WRONG

[terse idol]

Wah

About what

[torn root]

ELITE/WEAKSPOT WAS WORTH

[terse idol]

On what

[torn root]

Power Sword

[terse idol]

I dont talk about powersword often

[torn root]

I took the gamble and hit the BP

[midnight totem]

Do you still get rending?

[torn root]

nah i think its the only time its ever worth takig elite damage ngl

[terse idol]

Yoo

Let's goo

[torn root]

but that shit cray

[midnight totem]

What's your build?

[terse idol]

Valiiid

[torn root]

preference trumps everything

[terse idol]

I just think right side infil is just bettah imo

[dim citrus]

VoC is just too good

and the voicelines

[torn root]

don't force yourself to use something

[terse idol]

For yourself and kill potential

[dim citrus]

PUT THE KARKING BOOT IN

[torn root]

i didnt even use Power Sword until i wanted to test shennanigans

[terse idol]

I'm just hit with flashbacks

[torn root]

whos?

[terse idol]

https://tenor.com/view/loktar-ogar-horde-world-of-warcraft-gif-18813851

[tidal rapids]

HAMMER OF THE EMPEROR

[native furnace]

I have weakspot on a shovel, and it unlocks a bunch of one-hit-kill headshots.

Often without being stuck in.

(Crushers require the full in/out cycle unless I'm coming out of stealth with them marked.)

[torn root]

I dislike the shovel

thats why i wanted this to work

its so fast and smooth lmao

[native furnace]

Fair call!

Are you on a bunch of melee talents?

[torn root]

the same combo kills maulers and everything else

[native furnace]

Curious what the build you're using is, so far as +damage to melee is concerned.

[torn root]

except mutants*

nvm

[spring rose]

FIGHT! OR ANSWER TO ME!!!!

[torn root]

literally no melee nodes

[native furnace]

Glorious!

[torn root]

https://darktide.gameslantern.com/builds/9ae54218-3657-4ab2-8eaa-c996e9c94323/veteran-gunzerker

weapon wasnt meant for this but imma start using it i think

still love my XIIIg tho

skill tree just has but loads of damage

[spring rose]

XIIg is goated, horde? Left click go brrrr

Elite close range? Brr Hold left click brrr

[torn root]

yeah it has my favorite moveset out of all the weapons in the game

[valid marlin]

Brr brr

Doing the laser xii one

[spring rose]

Bar none, fully agree with you man

[valid marlin]

For using bullet guns, is it better to use the ammo aura ?

[spring rose]

Same with new eviscerator

[spring rose]

Yes

[torn root]

ammo aura is the best aura for vet imo, but 100% yes

[terse idol]

Survivalist is uh, s+ tier
I would say even for lower ammo weapons its good

[spring rose]

Honestly I don't really find use for other auras at all, I always go for survivalist

[terse idol]

Don't let people force you to take it though regardless

[valid marlin]

i use damage aura for las because. well honestly dunno why

[terse idol]

Not worth hurting your build for it

[torn root]

this

[spring rose]

^

[torn root]

plus if there is another vet with it it doesn't stack

so there's that

[spring rose]

Don't let me stop ya from picking other auras

[torn root]

how much grinding do yall think imma have to do to get brutal momentum 4?

[spring rose]

Depends on luck

[torn root]

took me 4 days to get rampage 4 on my chainsword

[spring rose]

You might get it in one roll

[torn root]

emperor hates me

[spring rose]

Or it might take years

[torn root]

screw fatshark

give me plasteel in place of my diamantine

[valid marlin]

Found +5 damage to be good, got 2 copy builds w only aura difference

[torn root]

30k sitting there for what?!

[valid marlin]

so can click-switch to ammo aura

but lasgun 12 on that

dunno found it comfy, tried all the guns while playing and found lasgun 12 to be the most comfy so just stuck with it, but gonna do a run w differen guns now

[opal root]

try the 1a if you like the 12

[tidal rapids]

I generally alter between 12 and ciag

[torn root]

join the CoD crew

embrace the Columnus

until it gets nerfed

[frank ether]

I'll just ride agriag when that gets nerfed

[frank ledge]

Join the headhunter gang

We'll remain like we are for many patches

[bitter turtle]

I honestly prefer graia

Over column

Feels better for carrying

[stiff pasture]

I’ve been running around with the 4

It’s fucking funny when the 100 percent crit weak spot procs and all of a sudden a beast of nurgle keeps over

So what exactly does 100 percent crit weak spot damage mean?

[tardy vine]

why is ushanka being sold separately?

[bitter turtle]

💰

[torn root]

FATSHARK NEEDS YOU TO PAY FOR THEIR BAD PRACTICES

[bitter turtle]

💸

[torn root]

pay them so it can validate the bad choices

[tardy vine]

im not buying valhalla uniform without ushanka

[rapid hedge]

My brothers in krieg i just wanna confirm, for plasma gun , blaze away only goes up to tier 3 ? theres no tier 4?

[torn root]

its only t3

[rapid hedge]

alrighty thx

[torn root]

power sword has guard cost reduction....

wtf is this

[cedar pecan]

is deathspitter on autoguns good? I'm wondering if I should get the t4 blessing from Melk

[torn root]

yes

deathspitter + dumdum is one of the combos

[cedar pecan]

the gun overall is actually pretty solid for a Melk item

excluding ammo

[bitter turtle]

Kinda low stopping though

Too

[cedar pecan]

yeah

perk and blessing-wise though it's almost perfect

[hazy basin]

what are the best weapons to choose during the leveling stage?

[spring rose]

Damn that ammo Stat...

[spring rose]

Use whatever you like honestly especially if you're playing below damnantion

All weapons are viable

[hazy basin]

i just really want the plasma gun... guess ill have to grind some medium levels until i am there

[spring rose]

Yeah

Plasma gun I dunno which level you unlock em

You can check the Armoury see if it's available

[spring rose]

Just checked it you get them at level 16

[white reef]

Guys, may I ask what’s the difference between mk3 and 6 power sword? And which one is better?

[idle carbon]

m3 is more horde clear, mk6 is better against elites

most people will opt for the mk6 becuause you can 2-tap crushers with a push stab into overhead, though

down to preference in any case

[copper shell]

mk6 has better defensive stats and better overall moveset but mk3 is easier to use

[white reef]

I heard that mk6 charge slower than mk3?

[torn root]

so how many melee weapons on vet actually kill Crushers fast?

just new shovel and Psword?

talking like 1 second-ish

[copper shell]

chainaxe and chainsword can kill them pretty fast with correct build especialy the chain axes

[torn root]

hmm well i know the chainswords cant kill crushers fast no carapace pen the axe, i ahvent been lucky with my blessings yet

lucky tho melk gave me and axe with headtaker 4

[strange sparrow]

Rashad doesn't cleave much it seem

Is there certain build that make it great

[barren cave]

What's the moveset for the old evis

[strange sparrow]

Exhilarating Takedown Replenishment over Toughness stack or

[tiny summit]

ET

[torn root]

reword?

assuming you are asking if is works on extra toughness maybe?

if that's the question, the answer is yes

[strange sparrow]

Exhilarating Takedown -> Headshot kill -> Toughness and Damage Reduction -> Stack over 3 times

If Im max out of ET, do I still get Toughness Regeneration when popping heads

[torn root]

yes

everytime you kill something its +15%, if you are missing any, at max stacks it just refreshes to 3

30% toughness damage reduction

[frank ether]

HH doesnt mesh well with melee vet

otherwise already got myself a nice HH3

[torn root]

i might become a melee vet

also for yall that spoke out against elite damage and weakspot damage as a perk

i found the one instance where they actually work well lmao

[frank ledge]

Melee vet can make use of it, pull ain-t too bad

just need yell

[fading grove]

Melee vet with old shovel is based

[frank ether]

just need VoC, precision, deadshot, marksman focus, some rending, bring it down, superiority complex aaand would you look at that I made a ranged vet again

[torn root]

the one situation where elite damage and weakspot damage will ever matter on a weapon i feel like

[frank ledge]

oh no

[torn root]

actually tested, you need them for it to work lmao, either both or either with carapace

[frank ether]

you... don't need either to two shot crusher

[fading grove]

Try it with the brittleness stacks node on the graia braced shit melts crushers

[eternal venture]

Remind me why people take Deadshot with the Helbores again

[frank ether]

I don't

[torn root]

pretty sure i cant 2 shot them as well as everything else unless i have both present on the weapon

[eternal venture]

when you already run Surgical with the most stable gun in the game

[torn root]

been rooling it and testing for a while now

[frank ledge]

I prefer middle tree even for helbore

[eternal venture]

People were talking about how Deadshot with Helbore was good earlier and I was like huh

[torn root]

sitting on just carapace means i need more swings else whereand that would still require weakspot damage from the tree

[eternal venture]

Middle tree for Focus is the best for Helbore breakpoints + constant rolling damage and small stam/toughness regen for the team

I just have no idea why people would take Deadshot with one

[frank ether]

I don't have carapace, elite or weakspot, and I can two shot crusher fine with mk6

[torn root]

show?

is it double stab or the exact same combo?

[frank ether]

push attack combo

with precision strikes

or desperado

[torn root]

im not using a melee node just to enable that ngl, and double stab is slower

point is to kill them asap

activating 2 times is clunky

[frank ether]

I'm doing the exact same combo you're doing

[torn root]

show?

well i actually believe since its finess

not worth wasting the a skill point imo

rather use nodes that affect both weapons and all damage

[frank ether]

fair, thats a choice you make

[tiny summit]

I think it was just for the sake of maxing out crit chance not that it was completety goated. I just run exe MF helbore. I also take Born Leader

[eternal venture]

It's probably just to reach max crit chance quicker with surgical

If I had to guess

[tiny summit]

idk, surgical is enough

[eternal venture]

it def is

[frank ether]

I can, but first you must answer a very important question

do you believe in our lord and saviour voice of command

[tiny summit]

VoC stinky

[frank ether]

my specific build revolver around no keystone and spamming shout for ability modifiers

[torn root]

yeah, dont believe in requireing to use it before killing a crusher tho

[torn root]

dont you dare slander

[strange sparrow]

Exec stance IAG is funny

[frank ether]

well they don't really come in single numbers

[torn root]

so much damage

[strange sparrow]

I have a weird build that just use Exec stances and Marksman Focus stack

It’s great I love it

3 seconds weakspot kill doesn’t lose stack is fun

[torn root]

eeew Marksman Focus

are you allowed to kite?

like really kite, without losing the stacks?

i wish the time you got for the headshots was 5 seconds

[strange sparrow]

Weakspot hit give 1 stack

You lose stack you gain stack

And Columnus just shoot everything down the yard so

It’s more of a boss killer to me and reload speed booster for 3 talent point

[torn root]

That's fair, dont have to build around keeping the keystone active 100% of the time

i just like my lazy boy pings

[strange sparrow]

The keystone are active like 70-80% of the time on auric Mael

Just shoot a general head direction and you get full stack

[torn root]

i think it was a mistake not allowing you to just walk with the stacks tho

[torn root]

how does it feel with deadshot

or haven't tried?

[frank ether]

you could also do this with exec or infil as long as you take power/damage modifiers

[torn root]

the point is to not require a skill to activate tho 😦

[strange sparrow]

Tried, doesn’t like that I’m swapping out curios

[torn root]

want to be able to kill a pack of crushers while kiting without having to scream in terror the whole time

just because i shouted too early

[frank ether]

Idk whats the point of taking your skill if you're not gonna use it on a crusher pack man

[strange sparrow]

It’s a lot of DPS but I can’t push anything now

[frank ether]

you do you though

[strange sparrow]

And shout can’t be played like “i want to buff team)

[strange sparrow]

Because I take Kraks

[frank ether]

y'all are saving your stuff to the grave

[strange sparrow]

Crusher and Bulwarks has been the least threat to my playstyle

[torn root]

that's not the point, not particualarly going to hold it until i run into a crusher pack

so like what happens if they come when i have 15 seconds on cd

[strange sparrow]

I wish Shredder have an option to “blast” upon impact

[frank ether]

focus mark also does it

in two hits

[torn root]

I have focus target

[frank ether]

its actually pretty good keystone

[strange sparrow]

I play VoC to buff teammate for 50 toughness

[torn root]

just chose not to use it in the demo

[torn root]

GOAT

[strange sparrow]

You play VoC to escape problem

We are not the same

[torn root]

actually i spam it anytime im in a fight

it's my biggest problem

just so happens that when i have it again its time to retreat

[frank ether]

no you're supposed to spam it

[torn root]

can't be going down in auric

feels like there are fingers pointing at you

[frank ether]

its better to use it preemptively

unless

u expect something

[torn root]

while you're down and out

[frank ether]

cause of cooldown reduction

better to stun lots of dogs, muties etc and get cooldown resets

[torn root]

I legit use it off cd like 80% of the time, if there are enemies to fight

[frank ether]

thats how its meant to be used for the most part you're doing it right

[torn root]

not so much when fighting shooters

[frank ether]

the stun is good

but its not always needed

but yellow toughness op

[torn root]

Iron Will OP