veteran-class

[gaunt hinge]

hoo yeah still works

[gusty bison]

I think its easier at higher difficulties to maintain hogh stacks

[unkempt lagoon]

good change overall though

[orchid nova]

I can shove twinned blast into my grenadespam build now

[gusty bison]

Cos more threats

[orchid nova]

This is literally the only change I notice

[fervent quiver]

Doesn't work if you have nothing defensive

[fast heart]

Finally The Gun

[brisk umbra]

i reallly doubt it with all the shit they throw at you

[untold mulch]

It is, but still requires you to be a headshot machine

Which sadly not all of us are

also more shit

[fleet drift]

I feel like my game stutter like crazy after the update

[untold mulch]

more melee to defend youself

[gusty bison]

I think its gun dependent

[untold mulch]

so lose stacks

[karmic musk]

RIP, never taking you over 20% Ogryn damage, your time is over

[gusty bison]

Try with vraks 7

[trim steppe]

Does Born Leader give toughness when at max, now that the talent is mandatory for middle tree?

[fervent quiver]

It would help, if we have scopes

[placid portal]

god help me

[brisk umbra]

Like, i don't know if it's just me, but two games and two times the AI director went insane like in pre-patch having at least 2 specials on screen at all times

[fervent quiver]

But apparently the bolter can't handle an acog without blowing it to bits

[placid portal]

rebuilding my loadout is heck

[hollow turtle]

It's funny how all of us are going through the tree and we're like, "yeah no. Fuck the keystones" anyways.

[untold mulch]

Yeah, I am not using autoguns

I could, but I ain0t playing a 40k shooters to use bullets

[placid portal]

Wtf is this arrangement

XP

[acoustic wyvern]

Update is in?

[placid portal]

ye

[karmic musk]

Go Tag or Melee or go broke

[acoustic wyvern]

Oh wow thats fast

[fervent quiver]

It's just funny that they made the trees better except for those keystones

[drifting oak]

Marksman Focus actually seems really good

[brisk umbra]

Melee keystone is great

[fast heart]

This is so scuffed

[brisk umbra]

Tag is passable and you're there anyway for the rending

[sleek perch]

VT2 got 50% nade free right?

[delicate moat]

fellas, how do i squeeze 2 points to get the reload speed bonus (knife/revolvo)

[drifting oak]

this stacks up WAY faster than you think it will

[untold mulch]

I am trying to make them work, but looks like its a wrap except melee vet

[drifting oak]

you climb on top of a box or perch on a railing

[gusty bison]

If you can hit headshots consistently

[drifting oak]

and it hits max stacks before you even realize it

[trim steppe]

Relentless is stil a separate talent instead of part of Executioner's RIP

[crude wind]

hahaha this fucking chat man

[karmic musk]

Reported for standing still

[crude wind]

30m ago the sky was falling

[placid portal]

God help me

[fleet drift]

Not to mention it prevent all the stack from being gone when you move

[sleek cairn]

do u favor left or right tree

[drifting oak]

you don't know the power of boxes, do you

[fleet drift]

It some down 1 at a time instead

[placid portal]

ngl some of the "Upgrades" to keystones are just not even

[fervent quiver]

It's called the stages of grief

[karmic musk]

I hide in boxes not stand on them sir

[hollow turtle]

I could sacrifice the cooldown on special kills, and hit the marksman focus, but I don't even know what ranged finesse is.

[crude wind]

totally depends on weapons i'm using

[drifting oak]

it can make it so that enemies can literally only attack you from a single angle making it trivial to maintain your position until a special threatens you

[crude wind]

v good v good

[sleek cairn]

cuz i like both, cant decide

[drifting oak]

it's powerful even as a meleer

[untold mulch]

Depends on how my next run goes, I am dropping the game until part 2

[karmic musk]

Crit or weakspot damage

[fervent quiver]

I learned it from my old sarge before I got thrown into the brig

[crude wind]

what weapon are you using?

[orchid nova]

Twin bleed frags are basically ogrynheimer for horde now

it's really strong

[placid portal]

Mandatory 25% ammo for shocktrooper

fml

XDD

[karmic musk]

More like overkill 1 out of 5 times

[iron marten]

this psyker has mad drip wtf

[sleek cairn]

rashad caxe2 and columnus

[acoustic wyvern]

Dammit. Voc got nerfed

[fervent quiver]

the headshot thing barely works with the bolter

[crude wind]

right tree

[gusty bison]

Finesse is extra damage on headshots and crits

[fervent quiver]

Those irons aren't gonna hit anything

[sleek cairn]

hell fking yeah

i love the right tree

[hollow turtle]

Hmm.. Guess it wouldn't hurt to switch those 2 points later when I come back.

[autumn wave]

new field improvisation description states it regens toughness now but psykanium testing doesn't show it to be the case

[crude wind]

weapon specialist very nice for Columnus

[frank ledge]

More descriptions that are weong

[crude wind]

you don't even necessarily need to take any of the upgrade nodes for it

[drifting oak]

ALso it's incredibly important to note

[upbeat light]

did they fix left side's toughness node making you take more damage on stacks?

[unkempt lagoon]

I feel like this really needs to be "or when walking while using weapon secondary action (ads/brace etc)", crouch walking is useless as most of the time you'll be obstructing your view

[drifting oak]

that the stacks for teh skill don't instantly fall off

[frank ether]

nope

[drifting oak]

If you dodge @ 10 stacks... you drop to 9 stacks.

That's it.

[sleek cairn]

the ammo one seems interesting

[hollow turtle]

It's like 1 second of movement per stack. Which is actually very easy to keep up since its 3 stacks per weakspot kill. That's not hard to keep up at all.

[drifting oak]

Combined with Camouflage just giving you more than 1 stack per second

[autumn wave]

I was about to test if improv ate resource for toughness gen but guess it's not working at all lmao

[drifting oak]

It's easy to keep it at 8+ stacks

[untold mulch]

YEP

[hollow turtle]

I'd go for the 15 stack tbh if I had the point to spare.

[raw turtle]

Exhilarating takedown fixed?

[hollow turtle]

or even the rending

[fast heart]

Sniper score for helbore is just what I needed

[drifting oak]

15 stacks is not good because it's exclusive with camo

camo is REALLY good.

[delicate moat]

that and the camo one is mutually exclusive no?

[placid portal]

Take it down no longer next to superiority complex

RIp

[undone grove]

did they fix the scavenger achievement yet or am I locked out of the penance hat forever

[karmic musk]

What if Marksmen is the actual Columnus IAG node, doesnt that thing have good weakspot bonus

[drifting oak]

If you don't take camo I don't think the capstone is worth taking period

[viral garnet]

That the new weapon customization update

[orchid nova]

Did mutant always have a ridic headshot multiplier

or is this new

[drifting oak]

yes

because their head is super weird

[hollow turtle]

Eh, I don't really need the camo. I'm pretty mobile so staying still, or even crouched, is not ideal.

[gaunt hinge]

why is the reserve ammo for the bolter 80

[drifting oak]

headshotting muties has always been sick damage

[undone grove]

small head in middle of torso that moves left to right all the time

[crude wind]

it's a good node just not really required for the columnus because of its huge mag size

[autumn wave]

either way I think toughness regen on medkits is not a great mechanic

[untold mulch]

Imma try it with laspistol now

[crude wind]

it also has insane critical hit modifier damage

[drifting oak]

no, man. The stacks it feeds you are really important even if you think you're the fastest headshotter in the west

[hollow turtle]

And that rending would help with the maulers. So keeping it >10 would be preferable.

[sharp ember]

wait is it not 85

[drifting oak]

i don't think you appreciate just how fast 1 free stack in less than a single second

until you just try aiming-andsometimes-sliding

[unkempt lagoon]

4 points to spare, any suggestions or changes?

[drifting oak]

just the psykanium alone

[hollow turtle]

Its not about being the fastest, Its the need to kill the mauler while in the horde.

[drifting oak]

you have to try to go below 8 stacks out of 10

[sleek cairn]

monstrosities dmg

[autumn wave]

either it drains resources for a replenishable health pool or they turn into free regen stations

[fast heart]

go scavenger for full support

[sharp ember]

5 bolt nerf

[unkempt lagoon]

true

[empty heron]

This looks hella fun imho

[unkempt lagoon]

I'll try

[untold mulch]

I swaer why there is no subnode for it not to deplete when walking

[unkempt lagoon]

or even when 2ndary action walking

[brazen ocean]

damn that is a phat skill tree

[karmic musk]

The more I think about the Marksman node the more I feel its for Columnus or full auto weapons lmao

[gaunt hinge]

i thought it was 75

[untold mulch]

Yep

Crouch walk lmao, time to crab walk a shooting gallery

[undone grove]

do I still get my endless toughness regen for plasma blasting

[karmic musk]

You always hitting some head with full auto anyways

[sleek cairn]

it has been hella fun

right tree is so efficient

[karmic musk]

And the rending helps full autoguns

[empty heron]

You running with something like that?

[unkempt lagoon]

I'll try

[iron marten]

ye, confirmed kill nerf still feels really good lmao

[sleek cairn]

i was running a similar structure BEFORE update. now its like even better

[sharp ember]

hmm let me pull up an old boltgun image

[sleek cairn]

holy smokes

[willow badger]

whats the gamer move now

[oblique horizon]

Just played a game with full left side build, think it works fine

[fervent quiver]

gotta find a new boltgun tree

[sleek perch]

Tagging skill look cool. with 8 stacks you can took down chaos spawn in 6 Krak

[willow badger]

executioner or vet shout

[hybrid burrow]

pretty sure bolter was 15+60, now 15+80

[karmic musk]

Aight all I need for Helbore build is to have ET fixed, so I can give up on Confirmed Kill and have Longshot on the way to it

[fervent quiver]

oh, mods working?

[kind scarab]

Revolver build ain't 100% gutted, it needs more.... "juggling" but technically can still oneshot everything. I can 100% sacrifice most of my tree and be able to just oneshot everything minus oggies/mutties (they'd need 2 shots) on probably every other build

[undone grove]

the tagging thing is weird to me, you have to actively not tag things to build stacks isn't that kind of anti-teamwork?

[unkempt lagoon]

Boltgun? 40k: boltgun???

[untold mulch]

You are giving it more thought than Fatshark did

[karmic musk]

You give up visibility for team damage

[oblique horizon]

New mission up on terminal btw

[karmic musk]

Tag every 10 seconds and keep dmg buff up on team

[iron marten]

the tag stacks build up really quickly

[low oar]

Team damage? You mean prepping for my plasma onslaught?

[crude wind]

this chat is cracking me up, it's like watching a hive mind

[frank ether]

twinned blast is %20 now

[forest scaffold]

Yes

[sharp ember]

no we're just stupid, it was always 80 reserve

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1046912126746374274/1162599953856729158/image.png?ex=65617095&is=654efb95&hm=c17d16eca866ff5de6296919572a352a8579b78a26797d8b85536d60bac9dbc7&

[frank ether]

they really want people to take it huh

[iron marten]

don't be afraid to tag a specialist just because you're waiting for focus target stacks

[undone grove]

I thought the tag only applies damage to the target not a team buff

[kind scarab]

Nice stability

[frank ether]

its still useless with smokes though

[untold mulch]

wow, so useful

[crude wind]

lol so cursed

[karmic musk]

No thats blasphemy I will rather let the Specialist kill all of you rather than not get my damage thank you very much

[earnest quiver]

Are people taking assassin or camouflage for keystone modifier?

[ruby fulcrum]

seriosuly

[iron marten]

[placid portal]

oh well

might as well attune to new skill tree

[delicate estuary]

dunno how to feel about the focus keystone for vet

[placid portal]

XP

[delicate estuary]

I like it

[frank ether]

still a meme with smokes, smokes still meme in general

[delicate estuary]

but its so mechanically intense 💀

[karmic musk]

Use it with autoguns

[delicate estuary]

just hit heads I guess

[karmic musk]

The full auto

[placid portal]

New keystone just feels like hassle, and tree is shuffled again

[sharp ember]

why is it not "do not consume a grenade when throwing" instead of double nades

[wanton dawn]

Rofl the hell is this tree

[undone grove]

firing from inside smoke should have a massive suppression multiplier or something

[placid portal]

Heck

[iron marten]

weapons specialist is sustained fire at home, just kill enemies and switch to your bolter, repeat 3 times

[untold mulch]

Its on crack, that what it is

[frank ether]

weapon specialist aint terrible but good luck getting any toughness DR if you can't make it to iron will

[wanton dawn]

They managed to make WORSE tax node

Am dead

[placid portal]

Middle tree is fucking Tax city

[drifting oak]

mid tree just sucks now

[raw birch]

idk why but i got this achievment ina mission mid way when i had voicehttps://i.imgur.com/OAYEPql.png?

[celest vine]

“3.3 percent rounded up”

[frank ether]

fatshark way of thinking is to nerf whatever seems popular

[gaunt hinge]

because they're waiting for someone to post their poker machine quad rolled double thrown shredder nades

[celest vine]

Just say 4% you fucks

[frank ether]

and buff whats not popular

[celest vine]

[iron marten]

lmao true

[placid portal]

Buff what's not popular?

[celest vine]

Swedish moment

[empty heron]

I've read through a lot of what people are discussing here. But honestly. For my personal playstyle the update seems like my playstyle gotten a lot stronger. Swapping a lot between ranged and melee

[iron marten]

WHY

[neon briar]

it's 3.3% per stack of your missing ammo, so you would get back 5 the first time, then 3, then 2, etc

[placid portal]

RIP

[sharp ember]

assumingly, that's great on revolver because minimum 1 round, just insta swap quickly between kills

[crude wind]

just found a 378 in my shop and turned it into this

[celest vine]

My ranged veteran is buffed

[crude wind]

very nice

[celest vine]

Two more skill points

[inner imp]

time to remake veteran build for the 100th time

[untold mulch]

WAIT WHAT

[inner imp]

[karmic musk]

73 damage roll, vendor it

[untold mulch]

Revolver western fans still winning

[crude wind]

people jumped to some pretty massive conclusions

[frank ether]

they somehow havent gutted agile engagement so you can stack it on top of the keystone and have giga damage

[untold mulch]

One shot Nurgle itself by 2025

[placid portal]

Revolver hecking Stronk anyways since first two buffs

[crude wind]

the tree is bloated now, yes

that can be fixed

[fervent quiver]

Oh look, time to ignore marksman

[sharp ember]

that's my theory, i'd love to test it after work

revolver juggling meta

[frank ether]

but the problem now is how do you get toughness dr for melee vet I think you just swallow it and go iron will otherwise you're paper

[karmic musk]

It will be fixed next week for sure

[crude wind]

but the keystones are strong and there's no two ways about that. overall power is up, but choices have to be made though

[iron marten]

gotta test it out now, but I need to see the new map first...

[low oar]

Are the auras still dumb?

[sleek cairn]

melee has always went mid tree anyway

[karmic musk]

5% damage aura what are you smoking

[sleek cairn]

right n mid

[untold mulch]

5% damage now

[celest vine]

Ammo is better

[drifting oak]

wow, 5%

[frank ether]

now you have less points to go middle and have more tax in middle

[low oar]

Ah so ammo is still a must pick

[drifting oak]

in a game about breakpoints

it's ammo or nothin'

[kind scarab]

I have a treat for you, gust gimme a second

[untold mulch]

Make me laugh,

[viral garnet]

Hope my main squad leader and elitand shooter killer builds as well as my recon build qre fine

[celest vine]

Its always been the one to have

[low oar]

Yes

[orchid nova]

I'm gonna make a build with all 3 toughness regen talents

[celest vine]

Damage needs to be 10% for it to be worth it

[jolly jacinth]

my build is shit now

[orchid nova]

for team leader

[karmic musk]

And still die?

[drifting oak]

mg12 with perks one-taps elite taggable shooters in 1 with fully stacked left keystone

[celest vine]

Plus take a breath is so good

[drifting oak]

it slaps

[gusty sonnet]

Guys, my internet is slow and update takes time, how's new vet tree?

[jolly jacinth]

Press F for me veteran

[drifting oak]

it feels GOOD

[orchid nova]

Wait one sec

Does Born Leader work with overflow toughness or no

[frank ether]

no.

[thick rose]

so...

[karmic musk]

nope

[viral garnet]

Wonder what build people are gonna make

[orchid nova]

Whelp

nevermind

that build is trash

[drifting oak]

779 damage on a flak gunner headshot with 0 stacks

[frank ether]

always has been

so its joever

[raw birch]

lmao that is the worst thing to add for a new mission

[drifting oak]

with 10 stacks, 1200

[fast heart]

Marksman's focus seems weak

[viral garnet]

Hope my green las forgot the name is fine

[celest vine]

Crit builds one hit it all the time

[kind scarab]

25 rounds of ammo, for all them kills

[drifting oak]

RNG sucks

this is 1200 on a noncrit

if you are stacked up with camo and click a gunner head, it dies

[celest vine]

My crit rate is 55 percent

[iron marten]

it's on normal damnation thankfully, but I can't use that to fully test the new vet tree smh

[orchid nova]

Recon is so stupid

[celest vine]

Before the headhunter blessing

[fervent quiver]

Just kinda going this

for my bolter

[drifting oak]

and you don't even have to bleed stamina to deadeye to get it

[languid rose]

Is melee build safe?

[celest vine]

No build is dead

[gusty sonnet]

Did they buff/rework fire team?

[orchid nova]

Buff

It's still trash

[frank ether]

riveting riveting, now take it to a game

[gusty sonnet]

what % now?

[orchid nova]

5

[celest vine]

You need to actually build vet intelligenly now

[orchid nova]

Why, you actually take that shit?

[kind scarab]

The gun worked fine for me last update, it'll work even better this one now

[drifting oak]

actually wait

[kind scarab]

[wispy oyster]

considering it took them a year until testers told them to buff many useless weapons... Doubt

[drifting oak]

you do 1100 with the 30% perk

so you don't even need 10 stacks

[topaz lance]

trying to run the weapon swap keystone with exe stance is pain

[frank ether]

I just want to see how it will work for you when you have to move

[celest vine]

If you built your vet properly youll see an extra perk point or two actually

[inner imp]

yo what the fuck for the emperor got nerfed?

?????????????????

[kind scarab]

I don't need the finesse tree for any of that tbh

[inner imp]

no shot

LOL

[fervent quiver]

Is this pd2?

[ruby fulcrum]

the least surprising thing in the entire update lmao

[frank ether]

they buff things in silly ways like smoke sucks? Ok increase duration etc

[gusty sonnet]

They should just rework it to be suppression immunity or whatever. supp imunity is flavorful from a flavor sense since middle is commisar-y

[inner imp]

i thought everyone slandered the shit out of my FtE what happened

been using it since class rework

[dapper vessel]

ok so

[topaz lance]

Is iron will still basically mandatory? Haven't seen a way in the tree to really replace it

[dapper vessel]

3% to 5%

[ruby fulcrum]

voice of command in general was by far the best option. and it still pretty much seems to be. it has the best lead up points and costs the least amount of points to use it properly lol

[dapper vessel]

thats uh

nice i g

[visual turret]

What mission type is it?

[iron marten]

ok note to self, don't stand near the charge, you get to 0 toughness

[ruby fulcrum]

feels that way

[strong pine]

is exhilarating takedown fixed?

[low oar]

It's a 66% increase 🙂

[frank ether]

its like your only form of toughness DR for a lot of builds

[karmic musk]

Nothing replaced it, Confirmed Kill got weaker but easier access

[iron marten]

rAID

[untold mulch]

Huh

[iron marten]

sorry caps

[grim dawn]

where is the new content ?

[karmic musk]

Because of 60s Grenade Recharge feat

[visual turret]

That's odd. Why raid. We have only 1 repair and 2 assassination

[ruby fulcrum]

and field improvisation too

[inner imp]

yeah but why did for the emperor get nerfed, VoC doesnt look like it changed at all

[low oar]

Probably because we're attacking a base

[celest vine]

Frag grenade users dont need grenade tinkerer anymore

[kind scarab]

I'll take the recon into a mission rn and see how it fairs through a full gauntlet of enemies

[inner imp]

they straight up just changed it to 10% dmg instead of 20% for buffs

[gusty sonnet]

No, exec stance was heavily taxed itself and infil is too far from ammo aura

[visual turret]

I mean we should have had a repair before a raid

[dapper vessel]

wdym

oh wait lmao

[low oar]

Repair the enemy base

[thick rose]

ay yo what am I building

[gusty sonnet]

5/3=1.666

[finite imp]

TFW tagging now increases damage and nobody can say they just don't want to do it anymore 😂😂😂

[karmic musk]

Tag every 10 seconds

[brisk umbra]

Carnival mission out

[robust mirage]

damn the left keystone sucks, who tought it was a good idea to say staying still in a game where staying still means death is a good idea

[karmic musk]

Oh wait tag every 16 seconds, must have max stacks sorry

[unkempt lagoon]

camouflage:

[robust mirage]

left keystone does not go into the camouflage tree

[celest vine]

That was everyones reaction to seeing it in the preview

💀

[kind scarab]

My guy, you can build stacks by killing enemies, using camo, not moving, or alternatively, kill something with a headshot or even shoot it in the face and you can move

You don't even lose all your stacks when moving

[trail knot]

This tree sucks
How does it cost 21pts to reach a keystone?
You know the other classes only cost 16~17pts to reach their keystones, right?

[kind scarab]

Just one at a time

[umbral scaffold]

i dunno, i can move while doming heads and it works out just fine, you gain more stacks than you lose anyways

[plush oracle]

oh come on really?

[ruby fulcrum]

i think im gonna end up just not using keystones again

[delicate moat]

im so lost on this new map

[low oar]

Or just tag whenever and save it up for a boss. It's not like you lose damage not tagging like normal. It's an increase and not mandatory

[karmic musk]

It makes me feel bad about moving so hell naww

[delicate moat]

lights out modifier on new map lul

[karmic musk]

If you are not max damage, are you even playing the game?

[trim hemlock]

The way it works is actively encouraging you to move while maintaining the finesse boost

[robust mirage]

my guy, i understand the idea is shoot move shoot move shoot move on paper now try to do thgat with a horde on your ass

[frank ether]

its what it is but you can still make it work without keystones

[low oar]

Or just run high RoF weapons

[karmic musk]

So early consensus on this cluster? Which are mandatory?

[ruby fulcrum]

none lmao

[inner imp]

no more commisar with rend and onslaught feelsbadman

[frank ether]

I'd say do it like in that screenshot if you're going to touch it at all

[topaz lance]

I knew it'd be like this but it's still disappointing

[robust mirage]

again i understand the idea, but fishing for headshots while getting swarmed seems a bit too much it feels like i'm realy handicaping myself way to much

[trim hemlock]

None. Base keystone is all you really need IMO, if you maintain your stamina properly/are not using Deadshot

[low oar]

Honestly, the talent and keystone on right side is an absolute clusterfuck of way too many nodes

[frank ether]

the good part about the keystone is you only need 1 stack for melee benefits if I recall correct so you'll swap to your revolver or whatever, get one ranged kill and your melee now has 10 seconds of buff

[rugged portal]

They should just combine some of these talents because I feel like I have about 5 less to work with now and get about half as much worth out of the same builds.

[kind scarab]

If I can use my revolver to dome people while stuck in the middle of a horde, you can use anything else to do the same

[robust mirage]

i feel shooty vet got fucked pretty hard 😦

[kind scarab]

You get freedom of movement on landing any headshots

[untold mulch]

Yep, I am doing with laspistol now

You are incetiviced for bad habits, stay still and aim too much

Unless you are godlike at headaiming, Marksman Focus is shit

[kind scarab]

Doesn't have to be a kill

[robust mirage]

i'm not using revolver tough

[drifting oak]

y'all are focusing way too much on "freedom of movement"

just fucking take camo lol

you'll be at 10 stacks before you even realize it

[frank ether]

sedition tier take

but honestly

[kind scarab]

I run camo regardless, cause you can move without losing any stacks

[frank ether]

with certain weapons I agree

[kind scarab]

(effectively, not literally)

[thick rose]

so. vet dead?

[drifting oak]

a dodge costs you 1 stack

[kind scarab]

Running for 1 second, costs you 1 stack

[robust mirage]

thats the problem take camo lmoa camo is not even part of the tree it's in wasn't the idea to push you into a tree

[drifting oak]

and then if you stand still literally for just long enough to line up a headshot you get it back

[finite imp]

I can see it's going to take a few days for everyone to figure out the new meta. In the meantime this place is gonna be bitch city 🙄

[trail knot]

Well at least I got this perfect Psword now

[untold mulch]

Nah, but sharpshooter vet requires too much finicky

[karmic musk]

This is one of those nodes where the "spirit" of it is trash but it may be good practically

[drifting oak]

no, I mean the node literally attached to it called "camouflauge"

[pulsar shore]

10 stacks of W-specialist reloaded 2 bullets in to my revolver. One for me I guess and second for the dev who made that keystone 🥲

[tender rose]

[frank ether]

this marksman keystone will dramatically increase the amount of vets that shoot shoot at chaff and die to poxwalkers cause they dont want to swap to melee or move

[finite imp]

Or aim for the head like youre supposed to be doing anyhow

[drifting oak]

this node makes it braindead to main 8+ stacks even while moving around like you normally would while shooting, dodging enemy shooters etc.

[trim hemlock]

Then don’t. It’s a situational boost, you don’t always have to have great value from it. I have not yet put it to tests, but the optimal situation for it to excel in is when you are engaging a lot of shooters/tough non-carapace elites and want to quickly eliminate them with a couple of well-placed Weakspot hits, or whenever a group of special enemies appears (which is VERY often on HiSTG Damnation)

[hollow turtle]

They just didn't want us to multi-role like we've always done.

[robust mirage]

ah you mean that camouflage mb i tought yopu ment the invis one

[grim dawn]

its anoying that the tech tree have been reworked

[frank ether]

at least weapon specialist incentivizes you to play the game the way it should be played

[untold mulch]

Paying 5+ points for situational boost to me its a bruh IMO

[drifting oak]

With 10 stacks I can no-charge headshot shooters with a helbore 3

[torpid hedge]

[grim dawn]

did they remoove exhilrating takedown still exist ?

[topaz lance]

but I am using deadshot

[frank ether]

its up at top left

[drifting oak]

no-charge, no-crit

[trim hemlock]

5+ points from where?

[drifting oak]

just pew

[astral blade]

focus target is good

[kind ore]

my laspistol build is no longer good

ggwp

[wanton dawn]

Cursed tree

[robust mirage]

then why even put it in, you cripple yourself by not going for the powerboost of a keystone but then when you have its so finicky

[kind scarab]

Cursed, but at least so far I have made two of my go-to weapons work with it

[trim hemlock]

Then you can either get value from Duck and Cover (or whatever the feat that gives stamina on dodge/dodge range fire), or pick one up from the keystone. See what works for you.

[drifting oak]

i dunno what games you guys play but I frequently see teams get bogged down in shooter standoffs

[kind scarab]

Gonna need to rework a bunch of other stuff, but that's for later while I test stuff in T5's

[potent iris]

I'm just going for weapon specialist and cosplaying zealot pretty much

[drifting oak]

standing on a ledge or something and working on killing the shooters below before dropping

[astral blade]

whats cursed?

[topaz lance]

It's a real possibility that the best vet builds aren't gonna use any of the keystones

[celest vine]

The keystones themselves are pretty weak

[wanton dawn]

I am working, cant test it rn

[kind scarab]

The amount of points you need to reach capstones

[blazing flame]

can you show me the new skins in the shop

[topaz lance]

true that

[celest vine]

Not even on par with other classes

[drifting oak]

left keystone is pretty dece for that, you hit OHK critless breakpoints with lasguns

[torpid hedge]

im in the carnival

[astral blade]

ahhh tis is true

[torpid hedge]

🍭

[celest vine]

It encourages bad gameplay to he honest

We thought the penances did that

[drifting oak]

nah, because you can maintain enough stacks

you don't need all 10

just some of them

[celest vine]

Walking gets rid of stacks

Thats terrible

[kind scarab]

Gets rid of 1 stack per second of walking

Or sprinting

You get 1 back, per 0.75 seconds with camo

[drifting oak]

I don't think you've actually tried it in psyk

[kind scarab]

You'll be fine

[drifting oak]

it's not a reset to 0

I'll take a clip of it right now

[karmic musk]

Makes you feel bad about moving in a movement game, good design

[grim dawn]

where is superiority complex and bring it down ?

[candid tundra]

Did they fix deadshot and exhilarating takedown?

[karmic musk]

Left and mid tree

[grim dawn]

top left

[karmic musk]

No to ET

[candid tundra]

So still bugged

[unkempt lagoon]

no new skins

[candid tundra]

Shame

[topaz lance]

sup complex
It's dead

[kind scarab]

I'mma go grab my recon lasgun, and go into a match with the left keystone

We'll see how things go lads

[grim dawn]

and bring it down ?

[karmic musk]

What does that even prove? You can go with no skill nodes and still win

[celest vine]

I wish one of the keystone upgrades got rid of the walking penalty

That would make it the best by a mile

[drifting oak]

TAKE

CAMO

jesus christ

[celest vine]

Never

[robust mirage]

i mean you get a grace oif 3 sec and recon has best hipfire so you mioght be ok but an ordanary lasgun feels like i'm getting shafted 😦

[trim hemlock]

It is - just so we’re clear, I’m trying to perceive a realistic use case for this keystone, but how it currently works is greatly overlapping with how SQL’s keystone works.

It requires a lot of build-up at a lot of effort, for a non-insignificant finesse boost, although it does not seem worth the effort IMO.

[drifting oak]

with camo the walking penalty effectively doesn't even exist as long as you stop for a millisecond here and there like you probably should while shooting

unless you sincerely lead-finger the strafe key and don't stop to shoot

I can stay above 8 stacks easily with camo just dodging as I normally would while ADS'd

[karmic musk]

Wait ppl actually stop moving in this game? lmao

[drifting oak]

and the moment you get a headshot kill or land a hit you won't lose stacks and start profiting

[drifting oak]

all the time, climb boxes or railings and you won't need to spaz out

[rugged portal]

Ogryn Keystones: Here, have some extra shit every few seconds that synergizes with what you were doing anyway.

Sharpshooter Keystones: Solves this rubix cube while we juggle cats over you to maybe get some small benefit you won't be able to percieve.

[drifting oak]

box tech is real

railing tech is realer

[thick rose]

why the hell are the trees split so early now

[umbral scaffold]

i dont really get much of the fuss about the stacks draining, you get 3 per headshot kill, and unless you have parkinsons its easy to rake those in to start snowballing

[thick rose]

surely they should have a bridge at least one more segment down

[grim dawn]

is lvl 30 still the max ?

[viral garnet]

Yes

[crude wind]

ogryn keystones are boring though. 1 is brain dead, one is hideously overpowered and boring, and one is terrible

[drifting oak]

also like yeah I can hold down the W key with my helbore 3 and as long as I don't miss a headshot I'm at 10 stacks before I realize it

[karmic musk]

Hmm interesting first game, had 2 crouch walking Vets behind us all the time

[torpid hedge]

there arent any

[drifting oak]

I'll probably get 1 stack from camo just from millisecond pauses to shoot too

[unkempt lagoon]

the hush tactic

[robust mirage]

why is the shooty class so ass at shooting

[unkempt lagoon]

heretics cant see us or hear us

[drifting oak]

oh god it's OG psyker warp charges all over again

[midnight patrol]

Did you expect any different?

[bitter scroll]

Is the Krak grenade having some weird shenanigans magentic homing device? I really hate it whenever I want to it to stick to Crusher and it decides to stick to Bulwark 2 meters away instead

[drifting oak]

playing around literally just maintaing buff instead of playing the game

[midnight patrol]

Not many high skill based marksman Vets.

[trim hemlock]

It’s a double-edged sword, really

[frank ether]

take a recording or two, I'm curious

[gusty sonnet]

At least there's no penance revolving around it

[robust mirage]

thats hte problem you should be rewarded for high skill but not get shafted beceasue you are of lower skill especialy in a pve game

[trim hemlock]

Either they learn to use it on the move, or will be taught bad habits re: its optimal use

[frank ether]

keystone for sedition gamers

[quaint valve]

Alright lets so how good/bad it is

[thick rose]

are we sure fatshark know what keystone means?

[frank ether]

tbh it shouldnt be an issue if they just fixed exhilarating

just pretend keystones never happened

[unkempt lagoon]

Good idea!
New penance awarding 14k aquilas:
Crouch walk for 600s consecutively, 5 times on heresy threat or higher

[drifting oak]

okay nerd

[astral blade]

What’s y’all opinion on the focus target? Keystone

[drifting oak]

focus target is a minor amount of damage on bosses

[winged sonnet]

i just tried a match with it, i like it personally

[karmic musk]

Tag every 16 seconds for the DEEPZ

[crude wind]

good. lets you cycle a buff with 100% uptime

[torpid hedge]

a free 5% damage on every ping for the low cost of like 28 points

[drifting oak]

oh, and muties, the mutie damage is noticeable

the problem is, as always, it costs an arm and a leg to reach

[unkempt lagoon]

I mean when you put it like that...

[sick charm]

I like it for my shotgun build. Also love the new color to it.

[trim hemlock]

Good and generic. With how much emphasis there is on dealing damage in this game, especially with Monsters and tough elites in mind, it is bound to be at least somewhat popular

[crude wind]

8 stacks of 1.5% is 12% constant damage buff, which stacks with whatever you've pinged

[astral blade]

Let’s hope part 2 will fix the vet tree

[karmic musk]

Cope

[umbral scaffold]

i dont really like focus target, i ping everything compulsively either for me to shoot them with better clarity or for someone else to deal with it while im occupied with something

having to delay my pinging just to get more damage off of it feels counter intuitive

[sick charm]

Personally I'm running the Marksman's focus keystone on most of my builds though. It's not as bad as people say. The charges don't all vanish once you start moving and the time on kills/weakspots lets you dodge when needed

[unkempt lagoon]

Next patch guys I swear we're fixing vet tree next patch, one more patch bro I swear bro

[karmic musk]

Plot twist: The Vet tree was actually fixed without Keystones

[winged sonnet]

gotta admit, not a big fan of the standing still mechanic in left tree. i get that its got leeway but im a very mobile player so its just eh

[crude wind]

i do too, and you will always bet getting some amount of +damage for just doing that

[topaz lance]

They aint gonna touch it for some time

[torpid hedge]

wait they nerfed it to 4% I swear it was 5% before

[sick charm]

Also for the ratling lovers out there you can just duck walk while gaining charges

[torpid hedge]

[crude wind]

it also stacks quickly

[dawn yacht]

What the hell's the problem with the tree?

I swear everyone has something to cry about and half the time it's pointless

[oblique horizon]

That last event on new map is something else

[drifting oak]

they kept all the really mediocre nodes and there are still a fuckton of tax no-picture nodes

[crude wind]

people are clutching pearls right now. it's got bloat but it's overall stronger than what was before

[calm shard]

so how are we feeling?

[karmic musk]

Go back to Psyker chat

[topaz lance]

takes 20 points to reach any keystone. That's my biggest gripe.

[umbral scaffold]

i'll have to feel it out for myself later, i only really got on to see if the talk about marksman's focus was as bad as it was

[fleet drift]

The mod’s working now?

[calm shard]

never stopped working

[drifting oak]

the main problem is it only affects a few weapons practically, IMO

[gusty sonnet]

They have to put that mechanic in place or the optimal way to play is to make an AHK script where you constantly spam the ping button to always have bonus dmg vs any special that enters your crosshair

[dawn yacht]

That's more of a fair gripe but travel nodes are never gonna be exciting

[sick charm]

always has been

[trim hemlock]

Action results in reaction. It’s also nice to discuss individual observations.

[astral blade]

To many points required to get to even half way

[fleet drift]

Somehow my mod hard crashed my game

[calm shard]

can one shot headshot dreg shotgunners with a columnus iag lol

[undone grove]

does the scavenger penance work yet

[tardy vine]

sisters... how bad is rework?

[frank ledge]

Keystones are literally unreachable if you debiate at any point.

[trim hemlock]

I was expecting more significant changes, but I’m pleasantly surprised by how little actually has changed

[drifting oak]

helbore 3 charged crits pretty much benefit zilch from the left keystone because they hit so fucking hard already

[sick charm]

Might be an issue with a different mod but weapon customization is still running.

[frank ledge]

Exhilarating Takedown is still bugged

[warm idol]

I haven't played the game ever since they added those new skill trees, are there any solid cookiecutter builds around or is it more of pick whatever looks good type of thing

[frank ether]

wow you're doing better than my lvl 16 psyker, I'm impressed

[topaz lance]

[sick charm]

As is Scoreboard and NumericUI

[potent iris]

the main problem is getting around the tree is very difficult with how big the tree is

[umbral scaffold]

eh, at the end of the day, its just saltzpyre's passive with more steps (waiting) *responded to the wrong person

[frank ledge]

We need lvl 35

[gusty sonnet]

WHAT. they just have to change an operator in the code

[drifting oak]

use infiltrate to catch up to the team, during a room fight just stand on a box and shoot literally everything with a helbore

[astral blade]

Mhm indeed we do

[sick charm]

I will say I do feel a bit weaker running a similar tree build as before...

[visual pendant]

Perfect

[karmic musk]

Immeasurably complex change

[drifting oak]

you have a shocking amount of luxury and you do actual effective DPS that way

[sick charm]

I hate how far down they moved the bigger they are talent

[untold mulch]

Fatshark needs 3 bussiness months to add a - looks like

[drifting oak]

it's an incredibly laid back but also effective playstyle on many maps

[frank ledge]

The fact we are reliably not hitting keystones is a big issue as veterans...because there's other better things

[drifting oak]

but sure "standing still is a sedition habit"

[karmic musk]

I feel like the keystones are baiting me

[drifting oak]

just stand on boxes, 4head

[karmic musk]

Maybe I should leave them out on some builds

[fleet drift]

Must be scoreboard or animation event then

[sick charm]

I've got both and I'm running just fine?

[trim hemlock]

Certain Psyker builds can also skip keystones, and Vet has good enough passive nodes that it probably will be a viable playstyle, too

[delicate estuary]

I want to like left side keystone

but man

[placid portal]

are we still trying to try out new map?

[delicate estuary]

your toughness insta pops

[sick charm]

I like it

[midnight patrol]

Its on Damnation and uh

Getting wiped a lot.

[placid portal]

Sheesh

[strange fog]

git gud

[delicate estuary]

yea new map

[astral blade]

I was able to reach the keystone those I had to sacrifice my field improv

[fleet drift]

The game straight up crash and say I am cunning a modded game

[delicate estuary]

on lights out

[placid portal]

new map sounds fun

[untold mulch]

I tried, but yeahhhhhhhhhh

[delicate estuary]

very interactive experience

[midnight patrol]

People still learning and the AI director is somehow even more brutal

[frank ledge]

Big sacrifices for not much gain

[unkempt lagoon]

penance details maybe

[placid portal]

AI director loves doing the kicking in testies

[midnight patrol]

I'm squadding up with 30 +10's and some 20+

Pain

[calm shard]

god the damage boost from left keystone is comically massive

[sick charm]

We might want to move this chat out of the vet class channel. But I'm running quite a few mods and have been fine running it this morning.

[frank ether]

lmao

are you by any chance part of the testers?

cause that would explain sooooo much

[drifting oak]

I have no idea what that comment is supposed to mean

[visual python]

we cant say if we're testers or not, its against the nda

[drifting oak]

but seriously

[dusty ferry]

Vets how has the new tree been

[visual pendant]

Think the problem is that vet was good without keystones, so what's the incentive to focus the build down into one tree to pick up keystones now, when I could just make the same tree as before

[viscid marlin]

christ those nodes are way the fuck down there

[drifting oak]

the fact you just laugh it off with "oh that's not real gameplay"

[wispy oyster]

no pls do say, It's not a trap at all

[loud zenith]

Crap, I forgot to take a screenshot of my build before the patch. 😭

[burnt adder]

imo it doesn't make sense to have a keystone that forces a player to essentially stay still in a horde style game

[fleet drift]

I can play normally after reinstall the game

[drifting oak]

tells me you understand literally nothing about the -tide engine slot system

[astral blade]

How dumb could you be to do this

[drifting oak]

and how standing on small objects breaks the AI

[untold mulch]

Sooo, use infiltrate

Go somewhere

Turret gameplay

10/10

[drifting oak]

no

reverse order

you stand somewhere to become a turret

[frank ether]

nah I'm just trying to see how your scoreboard changes the fact that keystone promotes turret gameplay

[drifting oak]

and you spend the whole room standing on that object

[unkempt lagoon]

then swap to exe stance mid match for max dps

[karmic musk]

Infiltrate still 4 subnodes *sigh

[undone grove]

lobby music changed

[midnight patrol]

Tunnel vision seems to proc quite often, was a bit surprising to me

[sick charm]

Have you kept up to date with the weapon customization mod?

[drifting oak]

infilrtate is literally just for a speed boost between rooms so your team doesn't leave you behind

[untold mulch]

I had to mentally check myself to not become a turret with the buff on

[drifting oak]

you use it after the fight is done.

[fleet drift]

Oh there’s an update?

[acoustic wyvern]

How many marksman do you know runs around sprinting and shootin

[frank ether]

my melee anti-chaff build was pulling similar if not better kills pre-patch and I have teammates that aren't bots so its not like I'm padding stats

[sick charm]

The mod is updated/hotfixed like 2-3 times a week.

[viral garnet]

Is an antingunner and elite vet build still a thing

[frank ether]

so thats why I'm asking am I supposed to be impressed

[astral blade]

Ahhhhh…..sir where your clown licence

[karmic musk]

I stopped using it, weapons disappeared too often

[sick charm]

Latest added sniper scopes

[sick charm]

Those have been mostly fixed I believe

[fleet drift]

I can run it just fine without update this morning but it seem to have problem after the recent patch

[drifting oak]

mad cuz bad

[karmic musk]

I tried it recently, nope not fixed

I will just wait longer

[drifting oak]

seriously

[wispy oyster]

tbf if they are actually right when crying 50% of the time, that says more about FS than it does the playerbase

[drifting oak]

stand on boxes.

Stand on railings

[undone grove]

I'm queueing for carnival but getting empty lobbies

[drifting oak]

suddenly become immune to everything but exactly 1 poxwalker at a time

you literally have time to push the poxwalker down, turn around, SWAP TO YOUR HELBORE WITH THE ENTIRE DRAW ANIMATION, shoot something threatening your team, swap back to melee weapon, push the poxwalker back down again

[dawn yacht]

Iunno, man, I'm just tired of being upset lmao

Surprised no one else is yet

[frank ether]

I'm just enjoying people gaslighting themselves

[drifting oak]

and when you get tired of your position, use infiltrate to rendezvous with your team again, but not before dropping all your poxwalker buddies a frag grenade first

[mellow bridge]

Everyone has been upset for the last 3 hours

[drifting oak]

so they all die

[astral blade]

laughing cause this man thinks that infiltrate is “bad”

[drifting oak]

because they're standing in hyperconcentration

[mellow bridge]

In fact. People have been nothing but upset

[dapper vessel]

first mark 6 I rolled this patch

[astral blade]

[karmic musk]

Why you come to Discord if you tired of being upset bruh

Ppl come here to complain

[dapper vessel]

2 good perks and free slots for me to change blessing as I want

[drifting oak]

but, you can escape the hyperconcentration because you were standing on a box and you just peace out

[calm shard]

I feel like you could just use a Mk VII headhunter, or revolver for melee vet and accomplish much the same thing without the need to deal with helbore draw animation

[midnight patrol]

.. There we go, you're not using Ex Stance.

[karmic musk]

Happy people are in game right now

[dapper vessel]

cleave damage is negligible

[placid portal]

man that terminal at the start is brutal

[drifting oak]

revolver doesn't have the sustain to kill every elite pull

[wispy oyster]

I get that, but that doesn't warrant directing it at the playerbase instead at that point simply because you are tired of it.

[drifting oak]

headhunter can't kill crushers and maulers in a timely fashion

it's helbore 3 crits or nothing

and i'm saying, that box-standing breaks the enemy melee AI that badly

[gusty bison]

One thing that the VII can never match the helbore on is shooter clear

[drifting oak]

you have infinite time

[dawn yacht]

That's not gonna stop me any more than I'm gonna stop you lol

[gusty bison]

Unless you have an aimbot or are god tier

[calm shard]

what kind of cope is this

[gusty bison]

Vraks 7 cant kill 2 shooters in 1 bullet

[calm shard]

exe stance Mk VII one shot bodyshots all shooters

[drifting oak]

and like honestly you "shouldn't" do the whole push and then shoot and then push again because you'll be spending 80% of your time weapon swapping

[burnt adder]

I use the revolver to kill maulers, it takes 3 shots

[calm shard]

and yeah in fact does overpen them

[wispy oyster]

I'm not complaining. Just explaining that FS has done more than it's fair share to get complaints. So it's not gonna stop all of a sudden out of nowhere, IDK what you expect

[gusty bison]

Helbore one shots two shooters

Without exec stance mind you

[karmic musk]

Behold my new Columnus Autogun build

[drifting oak]

yes and a typical elite pull has like 8 maulers in it, are you going to reload between every mauler

what realistically happens is that because of your boxstand

you hyperconcentrate the poxwalker backspawn

[calm shard]

?

[drifting oak]

then you drop a grenade on it and they literally all die

[jolly jacinth]

yeah middle tier is meh now

[dawn yacht]

Man they sure did just bunch these keystones onto the bottom of the tree lmao

[drifting oak]

and you keep shooting

[gusty bison]

Without a crit

[dawn yacht]

Yeah the point economy was the one thing I was worried about at all really

[astral blade]

Guess all the trolls have come out to play sorry to tell you people but the commodores ventures is running low on troll food so please don’t feed the trolls

[acoustic wyvern]

Wooo they condensed the grenade talents nearer

[karmic musk]

I wanted the rending node but it caused me to drop VoC subnode

[gusty bison]

Also do the dreg shooter

Thats the hardest for both of them to 1 tap

[jolly jacinth]

still making a lasgun bui;d

still shit

[gusty bison]

Thats 434

[calm shard]

yeah my Mk VII only has 20% against flak

[gusty bison]

Is that a helbore?

[calm shard]

with +25% it one shots stalkers on bodyshot

[gusty bison]

Shoot the dreg shooter

[brisk umbra]

the new mission is quite nice

[calm shard]

needs exe stance to kill dreg shooters on bodyshot

[jolly jacinth]

red light district

[gusty bison]

Know what doesnt.
Helbore

:P

[wispy oyster]

Born leader feels so out of place in the middle bottom

[drifting oak]

helbore shoots way slower, it's good for when shooters are scattered and doing their peek behavior

[wispy oyster]

just sitting there different from the other columns

[brisk umbra]

no light distric in my case, but yes

[drifting oak]

but sucks for doing the whole "kill teh shooter patrol before it has time to scatter"

the WHOLE shooter patrol

[kind scarab]

This match was going so well

[karmic musk]

The real loser of this patch is Smoke Grenades lmao not that grenades are more accessible. Nobody is discussing them too rip

[kind scarab]

Until my team decided to smoothbrain at the end of it

[gusty bison]

Im talking about hel 2

[calm shard]

also on the crusher thing

[kind scarab]

There's only one guy alive right now

[gusty bison]

which deffo does have the rate of fire

[drifting oak]

even hel2 is meh compared to what you can pull off with headhunters

[kind scarab]

Cause he blew up a flame barrel above my head and left me to burn to death

[drifting oak]

on shooter patrols who are caught in the open

[brisk umbra]

As much as i absolutely adore them, you don't have enough points if you go straight down, good luck using that one

[gusty bison]

Dont run exec on helbore

[drifting oak]

like it's good for killing peeking shooters

[gusty bison]

Like

[gusty sonnet]

They're still shit. End of debate

[gusty bison]

Just dont

[drifting oak]

yeah, the point is you take exec stance on HH for bosses and then getting to wipe shooter patrols is just a bonus

[brisk umbra]

Or just run Laspistol and run whatever you want? :p

[drifting oak]

it's part of the build, and thus needs to be considered

[celest vine]

One frag wipes patrols too

[wispy oyster]

Just delete smoke and think up a better nade to put in that slot

[gusty bison]

Helbore's main draw is it doesnt need exec

[acoustic wyvern]

Glitter

[gusty bison]

And thus is free to take shout (or infil)

[mortal frost]

What are you even on about take your meds

[gusty bison]

Both guns are great but they dont invalidate each other

[kind scarab]

Keep smokes, make them not block the teams vision and have the smoke cause enemies to attack each other by inducing rage

Ezpz fix

[drifting oak]

if smokes caused enemies caught within to take massive bonus damage, like a weakening effect/damage amp effect, that would solve everything

[calm shard]

you could also just run the blatant best ranged weapon on vet the columnus mk v

[drifting oak]

because "oh they're vulnerable and can't defend themselves"

[calm shard]

which nothing really compares to in my experience

[gusty bison]

Also Vraks has a worse dodge and jump stability than helbore

[drifting oak]

it'd make them viable for melee too

[calm shard]

the real appeal of the helbore is if you're bad and can't land headshots tbh

if you can headshot a Mk VII is just better

[gusty bison]

Nah you need to land heads on elites and specials

with helbore

[gusty sonnet]

also make them straight up block enemy shot

[karmic musk]

Wut I take Exec cuz I can't see my targets without it

[summer hull]

Marksman focus or focus target? both sound decent, but I have no idea which one to pick

[gusty bison]

The real appeal is the ability for the helbore to nail shots even under extreme pressure

[kind scarab]

I'mma go take a piss while this team does... whatever teh fuck they're doing

[gusty bison]

Try jumping with a V7

Vs a HB

[kind scarab]

or, nah. I guess I'll wait and watch.

[drifting oak]

fix your graphics settings lol

[kind scarab]

The match is at the end

[karmic musk]

its maxed out 4090

[drifting oak]

I play on some deepfried ass graphic settings

On potato mode

because it means I can actually see in the shadows

[drifting oak]

yeah no wonder you can't see shit

[karmic musk]

bruh

[sharp ember]

let's employ Creed tactics and let vets "redeploy" and appear wherever they threw the smoke grenade

[karmic musk]

i aint playing on potato with a 4090 RAY TRACING ON HIGH OR GO HOME

[delicate moat]

dude

[visual pendant]

Brother just throw a krak grenade

[delicate moat]

this last section of new map

super obnoxious

[acoustic wyvern]

Go big or go hooooome

[visual pendant]

What are you doing shooting crushers

[wispy oyster]

Was Confirmed Kill getting a nerf in the patch notes?

[calm shard]

I mean they're also wrong because headhunter deletes both of them

[fleet drift]

I think weapon mod is the problem but I don’t have access to the latest version

[sharp ember]

a handful of talent tweaks weren't in notes

[acoustic wyvern]

Shooting crushers is the top peak to do list in darktide

[midnight patrol]

God I really gimped myself with the shovel

[dapper vessel]

friends

[gusty bison]

Pros of Helbore

• More stable
• Faster guaranteed TTK vs most elites (no need to wait for surgical)

Pros of Vraks 7

• Able to 1 tap ragers
• Higher boss DPS

[wispy oyster]

Cause confirmed kill lost 20% toughness gain per elite kill

[delicate moat]

may the emperor help our souls

[acoustic wyvern]

Either you spend 3 mags or get lucly with 1 mag

[dapper vessel]

melee vet has been figured out

[gusty bison]

Like theres a reason to use both guns

[karmic musk]

Does this actually do anything? Assuming Devil Claw

[midnight patrol]

The two other Vets inthe squad are running the mk6 and they are so much more combact effective

[calm shard]

I don't use surgical on my headhunter because it's a waste of a blessing

it already one shot headshots things without crits

[unkempt lagoon]

Go on

[calm shard]

I use roulette, and opening salvo

[gusty bison]

In that case you lose the BP vs flamers

and ragers

[acoustic wyvern]

Vraks 7 has incredibly high weakspot dmg and shoots faster

Also zooms a bit further

[calm shard]

huh weird one shot him anyways curious that

[gusty bison]

Turn off exec stance

lol

[drifting oak]

bleeds hit bosses disproportionately hard, also bulwarks

[dapper vessel]

agile engangement isnt even needed anymore

[drifting oak]

beyond that, it's pretty bad

[calm shard]

why would I it's going to be up 90% of the time anyways

[gusty bison]

Because that means you arent running shout

[calm shard]

and it's not like vet struggles to get massive crit chance between deadshot and reciprocity

[dapper vessel]

I think you can go without any of the ability modifiers for the right keystone

[calm shard]

oh this is coming from an argument of "if you're bad then you need X"

[acoustic wyvern]

All builds are viable. If he wanna run exe he will run exe stance

[calm shard]

not accounting for player skill I suppose you should run shout if you get hit frequently

[gusty bison]

Its not fair to compare a V7 with Exec with a helbore without

[calm shard]

I am comparing helbore with

[prime sail]

i suck as veteran im a vet noob is there a boilerplate build i can be useful on damnation with?

[delicate moat]

im getting stutters sometimes on new map / new update, anyone else?

[gusty bison]

Helbore with should also hit the rager BP

[drifting oak]

take shout with a plasma gun and don't waste its ammo on poxwalkers

[acoustic wyvern]

Go grenades shredder and clear those rooms. 4 nades is plenty

[calm shard]

helbore hits better breakpoints without exe, but Mk Vii is vastly superior with, and identical in most without

[drifting oak]

that will make you more useful than 90% of pug vets, your build doesn't matter

[frank ether]

the instant toughness replenishment is not bad but probably not worth investing 2 points into it

[jolly jacinth]

@delicate moat i was but give it a second or two

[delicate moat]

i might actually bring smoke nades for this new map

[topaz lance]

the talent tree overhaul just dropped 😄

[drifting oak]

plasma will carry you

[jolly jacinth]

its good

[gusty bison]

Eh the rate of fire is barely better on the V7

Unless you are literally spamming on reset

[delicate moat]

the last arena section is insanely open

[prime sail]

i didnt like the plasma. i kinda like the revolver and the accatran vld

[calm shard]

yeah you can do that because opening salvo also coincidentally resets extremely quickly on Mk VII headhunter

[jolly jacinth]

still building give it a week we got them for sure

[sharp ember]

getting shot to pieces?

[gusty bison]

Its still nearly the same RoF

[calm shard]

the use cases where a helbore is better than a Mk VII are frankly very niche

[prime sail]

who even has weeks im ingame right now

[gusty bison]

While you rely on Exec stance

[prime sail]

😄

its a joke

[dapper agate]

I think they really need to thin how much shit is in the vet tree, cutting out a few stat nodes would help with this I feel. Also adding more paths when it comes to the grenade section.

[gusty bison]

Hel 2 once onslaught gets going has a batshit insane RoF

[delicate moat]

this new map has to be a nightmare on auric maelstrom

[kind scarab]

Moment of truth

[calm shard]

"once onslaught gets going" you see that's the problem

Mk VII headhunter you just click them

[kind scarab]

Haven't looked at the scoreboard yet

[calm shard]

and they die

[gusty bison]

Onslaught is hilariously trivial

[calm shard]

instantly

[delicate moat]

its easily the hardest damnation map rn

[gusty bison]

You get it for shooting

[kind scarab]

The scoreboard is a mess, there's too much info on here with the new scoreboard plugin I have

[dapper agate]

onslaught is for guns, no?

[visual pendant]

Yeah why is our enter/exit ability area still the three point travel shit

[gusty bison]

Like I said, there is a reason to use either gun.

[gusty bison]

Helbore has an onslaught blessing

[celest vine]

The lucius is janky and pretty unfun

Use what you like

[gusty bison]

The V7 also has notably worse stability

[dapper agate]

Oooooo, I was talking about the skill.

[gusty bison]

Try jump shooting a trapper at 25m

[dapper agate]

That's not confusing at all.

[calm shard]

why would I jump at all

[acoustic wyvern]

Why are you jump shooting

[visual pendant]

Who the hell is jumping

[midnight patrol]

Wow. I crashed and no option to rejoin the squad. Cool. Real cool

[acoustic wyvern]

Lol

[gusty bison]

To see over the horde

[calm shard]

I've genuinely considered unbinding jump entirely because of how worthless it is

[gusty bison]

duh

[visual pendant]

Unbind that shit

[gusty bison]

Its worthless on other guns

[dapper agate]

DOOMGUY be like.

[gusty bison]

its not on the helbore

[calm shard]

it's pretty worthless on most guns

[gusty bison]

Not the helbore

[celest vine]

You can penetrate multiple bodies now right?

[prime sail]

this seems to help me the most with my available arsenal

[celest vine]

Infantry lasgun can do that

[visual pendant]

You know you can just shoot through the horde, what are they gonna do? Tell you no?

[gusty bison]

Only 2-3 max for most guns

[acoustic wyvern]

Yes yes. With nades every 1 min amd 5% chance for nade you're the best support marksman

[tender raft]

How u guys building the new talent tree ?

[celest vine]

Good enough

[peak plinth]

is finess on guns crit ?

[prime sail]

nvm ill switch to ogryn so all the veteran theory crafters can be protec

[dapper agate]

With problems.

[celest vine]

Faster fire rate more than makes up

[prime sail]

😄

[celest vine]

[gusty bison]

I mean with a HH or Helbore its gonna take you quite a few shots.

[visual pendant]

Skipping the keystones, if I didn't need them before; then I don't need them now

[gusty bison]

vs 1 jump shot

[raw birch]

thank you big man we appreciate u

[celest vine]

Or two shots of an actually fun gun

[prime sail]

my choice is revolver and accatran vld for this

[celest vine]

Or one with the revolver or plasma

[median mirage]

Does this just replenish the clip from your reserve or does this actually give more total ammo?

[celest vine]

That works too

[gusty bison]

Speak for yourself. Helbore has had a following for months now

[jolly jacinth]

total ammo

[gusty bison]

Its deffo not an easy gun to pick up

[celest vine]

I did

[median mirage]

gives more total ammo?

[celest vine]

Its unfun

[acoustic wyvern]

I see, you can try the shotgun the brown version if you get tired of the revolver

[midnight patrol]

So many Vets trying out the new map lol

[calm shard]

also if that's your concern may I introduce a few other weapons that don't need to do gimmicky jump shots to shoot through hordes

[celest vine]

Use what you like

[kind scarab]

@frank ether

[gusty bison]

Fair enough, I can agree with this

[kind scarab]

There, I cleaned up the scoreboard for the Recon 6D run I did

[gusty bison]

Only 5 bullets

[whole moon]

any easy suggestions for a build for this? tend to use the blade more

[gusty bison]

Thats the main issue I have with the volver

[prime sail]

i dont even have ecenömy to support suggestives

[violet pebble]

I enjoy Helbore but can understand how it wouldn’t be for everyone. Tldr use what you like!

[gusty bison]

Like Im not gonna deny the Revolver is a great gun

[calm shard]

you could also use plasma gun

[celest vine]

Two- three shots of any other gun is enough to snipe the trapper

[calm shard]

or be weird and use the bolter

[visual pendant]

Replicated my pre-patch laspistol build, still one-tap all shooters in the head but now with the addition of confirmed kill; keystones be damned

[celest vine]

If your good with vraks use vraks

[violet pebble]

This!

[acoustic wyvern]

Keep hustlin reject. You'll rack the gold and resources soon