Big Rebalance Concept

[unkempt knoll]

While being Max stats (def/dmg buff) at mk1

Cos uh
Im getting It to mk2 soon
But mk3 having a bonus IS just crazy cooked

[unkempt knoll]

100%
This shits dumb broken
U cant kill It if u use aopo w it

This shouldnt be like this

[vocal vector]

Yea ik

Lio is even worse than Nuo

Nuo is atleast killable

[unkempt knoll]

I mean

Deabatable since nuo solos lio in a solo Game

Lios just the better support

For robots

Earlygame

And nuo works better lategame

[vocal vector]

Mk3 Lio gives waaay too much defence points

Nuo can maybe kill it cuz of defence mitigation

Thats why Dux and Titan weapons are good at countering Lio

[unkempt knoll]

Yeah

If defense mitigation didnt exist lio would be way too broken

But nuo can kill It w raw dmg tho

[fallow fractal]

take to t4 titan

Disagree
bonus damage to titan 450% -> 300%
Base damage 100% -> 150%
cooldown 12 sec -> 10 sec

Disbalance

No
+25% hp
+35% shield durability
+3 km/h speed
+50% damage from ability(it was much more with nuclear amplifier)

NO-NO-NO!!!!! Did you forget orochi with 18 sec cooldown and 5 sec duration ability?

You forgot ONE think:
trickster and deciver
No reload
5 bullets/second -> 10 bullets/second
dot duration 5 sec -> 15 sec(intel nerf)

[vocal vector]

We dont need more broken rust shi

[vocal vector]

Fulgur/Tonans is made to eliminate titans and not robots

[empty thorn]

Sirius:
T4 -> T3
HP -10%
DP 120 -> 200
Remote Assault's Bullet speed +75%
Legend Pilot for Sirius:
Unique Skill 1 Remote Assault's Bullet speed +25%
Unique Skill 2 HP +25%
Unique Skill 3 Gives Last Stand (Lower HP70%)

[vocal vector]

Good idea but i cant include it yet cuz i have used all the space i have

There is a maximal cap of 2000 letters per message

[plush quartz]

Nuo is a little busted but it’s okay

Lio is the problem

To be honest, both should be changed to this

Nuo
-Amount of Damage Stacks 25–>(35)
-Additional Damage per Stack 25%–>(5%)
-Damage Dealt to trigger per Stack Accumulates Slower
-COUNTERBLIND Stacks to Linked Allie 5–>(2)
-COUNTERBLIND Stacks to Self 5–>(3)
-Ability Cooldown 10s—>(13s)

Lio
-Amount of Defense Point Stacks 25–>(35)
-Additional Defense Points per Stack 25–>(5)
-Damage Absorbed to trigger per Stack Accumulates Slower
-COUNTERSUPPRRSSION Stacks to Linked Allie 5–>(2)
-COUNTERSUPPRESSION Stacks to Self 5–>(3)
-Ability Cooldown 10s—>(13s)

Would limit turning a robot into a unstoppable tank but at the same time still provides solid buffs to self and the linked allie

[glossy zenith]

This is actually good

[vocal vector]

Nuo’s dmg bonus IS +5%/stack

[vocal vector]

Yep

[unkempt knoll]

Pretty sure lios Is too

So if 5% IS doing that

Then id say lower to 4-3.5

%

[vocal vector]

5x25=125dp=+-55% resistance which wouldnt do much

Idk about lio

Or if % then 125% resistance, which isnt possible

[knotty acorn]

Most of this should be done

Good stuff good stufg

[vocal vector]

Thanks

[prisma mica]

Specializations need to be tweaked in genreral. Why choose self heal which gives like 600 per sec when i can choose repair amp ( gives healing, immunity’s, and defense points, and repairs grey hp)

Ue weapons need rebalanced. Ue orkans preform worst then regular ice rockets despite its rarity, ue storm does significantly less then mogwan, ue pulsars are rendered useless, ue squalls do less dmg then vajira 💀 💀 (blows my mind)

[vocal vector]

Yep, ik, would like to introduce all the changes u suggest me (sometimes with lil tweaks) but i have used all possible space

There is a cap of 2000 characters per message (including spaces)

[unkempt knoll]

Id argue lio needs to be higher than nuo
Since lios defense can be mitigated

Unlike nuos dmg

Counterblind>countersupression

[vocal vector]

In early game that isnt a problem cuz nuke amp/dux/titan users arent there yet

[unkempt knoll]

Perhaps theres hella snipers

Especially with webers

Or

Gauss

Lios defense percentatge should be way higher than nuos dmg percentatge
Otherwise ur gonna make nuo way better than lio
When theyre arguably on par rn

Since counterblind Is also better than suppression
So i dont get why u'd nerf lio way more than nuo

[vocal vector]

Nuo is almost instantly dead when it runs out of counterblind

While lio nah

[unkempt knoll]

Lios also situational

If theres gauss/webers snipers or duxes/Titans u cant play it

Thats why nuos for lategame
And lios for early game

[vocal vector]

Yea but even dux has hard time killing it

[vocal vector]

Yep

[unkempt knoll]

Whilst lios defense can be mitigated
Nuos dmg cant be mitigated or anything like that

[vocal vector]

Both have their pros and cons

[unkempt knoll]

Yes

Exactly why if u nerf lio the same way as nuo
Itll die as a robot

[vocal vector]

sad suppression noises

[unkempt knoll]

Webers ravager dont care tbf

[vocal vector]

If there would be a supression meta then Nuo is cooked

(Weaps which apply suppression)

[unkempt knoll]

Yes
But we are talking about what the meta is rn

Meta is kinda
Brought back def mitigation stuff since of lio

If u nerf It as much as nuo ur just gonna make It go from situational
To unplayable
Because nuo Will still deal decent dmg
Whilst lio Will struggle against meta weapons that deal high dmg or just mitigate def

Its broken if enemy team doesnt have def mitigation which shouldnt be like that

[vocal vector]

I will change the rebalance values as i always do

[unkempt knoll]

Seems fair

I just think that

Since theres hella amounts of def mitigation

In this meta

Then lio shouldnt be nerfed as harshly

Thats my point of view

Imo if u wanna nerf It as much as nuo

Make nuo cap at 20 def or 15
And lio flat 15

Stacks i mean

While slightly nerfing percentatges too

Ex:
25%->17.5% per stack

[vocal vector]

Yep

[abstract kiln]

UE Squall actually does less than regular Squall.

[vocal vector]

When are they gonna buff UE Squall😭

[fallow fractal]

Rust?

[fallow fractal]

They cant destroy and titans, and robots

[vocal vector]

Oh sorry, i thought its the rust weapons

U mean the dot ones

[vocal vector]

Then i can just increase the multiplier

[unkempt knoll]

uhh

raps nerf when

[vocal vector]

Raptor?

[unkempt knoll]

Yes

Its AN absolute unit of a robot

Still S tier pretty easily

[vocal vector]

Yep, its annoying

[unkempt knoll]

Reflector shouldnt get a nerf or maybe yes

[vocal vector]

Reflector probably nah but hp or ability dmg yes

[unkempt knoll]

Both prob

Imo -15% HP and
Mk3
-25% gray hp-> -15% gray hp-
Because raptors also hella annoying on mk2

[vocal vector]

Yea

But lets wait if they do smth with it in the #🧪│test-server-updates rebalnce

[uneven path]

I’ll be glad to see your opinions on that guys

[unkempt knoll]

Baglio doesnt need buffs

Its pretty good

But if u wanna give It some speed well

Ig

I mean It is

Slow

[uneven path]

Just slightly more speed

Yeah

[unkempt knoll]

And no way bro didnt nerf my boy ravager to oblivion

Nerf the dmg on mk3
From 50->40%

MK2 It should stay the same imo

[uneven path]

It’s so tanky I barely can kill it

That’s not gonna make it dead or anything

[unkempt knoll]

Well ur nerfs arent gonna kill it

Its still gonna be S

Tier

[uneven path]

Yeah just make it less powerful but not to the ground

[unkempt knoll]

So why not nerf dmg as well

In the process

[unkempt knoll]

Man
I use brawling rvger

And im telling ya

15% HP only isnt doing

ANY thing

[uneven path]

I’ll do that if you agree with that

[unkempt knoll]

U need to nerf dmg

Too

[unkempt knoll]

MK2 cna stay same
But mk3
35% or 40% not 50%

[uneven path]

That’s phase nr 1 of the nerf

[unkempt knoll]

Like bro how dumb Is It that he can even use moderator

Ability cd isnt doing anything either tbh

[uneven path]

Bro these changes are by me not everything will happen we can talk about it and change what should be changed

[unkempt knoll]

I know
Im speaking as in a hypothetical case where these nerfs happened

Ravager would still be S

[uneven path]

You suggest more nerfs to it or not 🙂

[unkempt knoll]

I just did?

[unkempt knoll]

.

[uneven path]

Ok I’ll add it soon let’s chat about the others

[unkempt knoll]

Lemme take a look

[unkempt knoll]

Weapons only those seen?

I feel like Sonic family Is well balanced as a weapon

Its not S tier
Prob High or mid A

What is in need of a nerf is

Csgs

Arms

And well, nanea/leinani

[uneven path]

These are still new they barely ran in sells

[unkempt knoll]

Yeye

I mean later on

They need a nerf

[vocal vector]

Most of the changes are ok but Baggylore doesnt need a buff at all

[uneven path]

Yeah I forgot these I’ll make some change on them together with nanea also

[unkempt knoll]

Seems fair

[uneven path]

Just slightly more speed it’s ridiculously slow🗿

[unkempt knoll]

Not dealing w nanea ravager

[vocal vector]

Mauler is ok as it is

[unkempt knoll]

Hell no

[uneven path]

Dude it’s still op imagine I put tonans on it and I won against ue mino with munnin

[unkempt knoll]

Maulers anything but balanced
Its not the #1 titan only cos of devourer being meta
Whenever DEV gets a nerf It Will be undoubtedly #1

[uneven path]

The problem is that I don’t have all the informations about some robots I can’t nerf randomly

[unkempt knoll]

As for mauler hook doesnt need changes
What needs to b nerfed harshly IS darklight

Like It shouldnt give u 600%+ dmg

Thats just dumb broken

[uneven path]

Does it provide that much damage ??

[unkempt knoll]

Yes

More than 600% since i think every stack IS i think 60 or 40% dmg
And It has 15

[uneven path]

That’s why I killed ue minos with one clip of tonans on it

[unkempt knoll]

Thats how dumb It is

If It provided 250% dmg mauler would prob still be top 2 Titan 😭

[uneven path]

You see I didn’t know that because I don’t have these informations I need a site that contains all the stats of robots if it exists

[unkempt knoll]

Id change It so its 250% but stacks faster
That way u have 250% all the time of the ability

[uneven path]

That’s good man but I gotta go now I’ll back in about 30min

I hope I’ll find you because I need you to make some changes

[unkempt knoll]

Aight

[uneven path]

I’m back

Sorry that was more than half an hour

[fallow fractal]

not right
Shadow walk: 20 seconds
Essense shift 10 sec duration
Cooldown same

[safe viper]

IN MY OINION LIAM CRAG -15% BOTH
DUX,RAVAGER AND SAMJOK COMPLETE RETHINK

[snow cypress]

Very necessary

[uneven path]

Shadow walk has never got 20sec cooldown

[fallow fractal]

pixo prefer destroy devouver ability than make it rare, but strong

[quick wolf]

More nerfs

[quick wolf]

Dam, they removed my joke

[gray quartz]

@vocal vector you are doing rebalance better than pixonic

[crisp pendant]

I don’t know how they will nerf lio without making him useless, because rn he obviously is basically unkillable, but he will become a paperweight if the pilot ability is changed because tbh it’s the only thing that helps him survive, once you lose your link with a teammate you’re cooked

[vocal vector]

Thanks

[unkempt knoll]

Way better

[unkempt knoll]

Lio after nerf Will still be pretty good
As weapons also got balanced
So tbf It was only fair It got a harsher nerf than nuo

Like nuo got hit hard Because of the weapons
It didnt get nerfed
But weapons got harshly nerfed too
So technically both recieved a harsh nerf

[vocal vector]

I think its cuz i listen to feedback of ppl lol

[fallow fractal]

TRUE

[uneven path]

Yeah but the numbers are quite too much I mean 66% more health doesn’t make sence

[vocal vector]

66% more hp on what?

[uneven path]

Sorry it was more damage to the bulava

That would make it an ultimate bulava💀

[vocal vector]

I put +66% cuz its dmg is low compared to a shitty vortex

And bulava is a titan weapon, not light weapon

Even if it ignores defence systems

[uneven path]

Imo it should fire one shot but combining the damage of both shots

[vocal vector]

So basically dmg +100% and shots 2 -> 1

Good idea cuz it can unload all of its dmg in 1 shot

[uneven path]

Yeah and one shoting titans with that probably 🗿

[uneven path]

I wanted that since the beginning

[vocal vector]

Im gonna tweak the post now cuz pixo is doing a rebalance too

I will remove the “useless” changes now

[uneven path]

Yeah but they should reduce the reload of so many different weapons like tonans

[vocal vector]

Yep, ik i aint removing those

[uneven path]

Yeah

[versed fog]

i was hoping for an ocho stampede cast buff

[tranquil rain]

i hope they nerf ravager even more

[vocal vector]

Same

[unkempt knoll]

The ravager was never the problem lol

The problem were the weapons

The bot itself wasnt good unless used w meta weapons

[uneven path]

You can make the molot perform like an Ultimate molot with all the damage boosts that it had

[unkempt knoll]

Not at all

Ravager w punishers or stuff like that wouldnt be able to kill sheet

Dux vs ravager prenerf was the prime example

Ravager didnt scratch dux
Dux absolutely cooked rvger
Perhaps when rvger used mogwans it could compete

[quick wolf]

We all kinda knew with that level of fire power it should be a little more like a crisis

But maybe just a little more durable not not brawler level by any means

I'm satisfied with the nerfs so far since everything getting touched down a bit

[low blaze]

No mauler nerf?? YASSS IM SAFE. But anyways this okish. Some parts I disagree but not bad not baf

[tranquil rain]

It did get nerfed

2 second nerf to dot conversion

Less DoT resistance

[low blaze]

I dont see it in this list

[vocal vector]

Finally u dont hate on this post

[low blaze]

I was talking about @vocal vector nerf post
Not the actual nerf that happening smh

[tranquil rain]

Oh

[vocal vector]

[vocal vector]

…

[uneven path]

Hey everyone

What are the most hated nerfs that should be straightly up changed

Let discuss to get an answer for Pixonic

[vocal vector]

Fafnir, Hawk, Ochokochi, Dux, Newton, Tonans…

[abstract kiln]

Yes it was. Stacking to a million HP with ease is a huge problem.

I used it with all sorts of off-meta weapons. Hussar, Hazard, Havoc, Mace, etc. All did very well.

[uneven path]

Fafnir needs slightly even more speed I think and the hawk needs its reflector upon takeoff and landing and the ocho needs a speed ability buff and a little bit more dot resistance and the dux needs its gey hp restore back but not as much as before maybe 50% less hp restore rather than removing it completely and the newton needs more durability and maybe less cooldown and the tonans needs less reload maybe 8sec although tbh the damage they do deserves 5sec reload because they do nothing but I know it can’t be so 8sec would be the ideal choice to go

Pixonic pls take care of our feedbacks if you wanna be a better game

[torpid spear]

Definitely need to start listening to the players if they want to retain players of all types. The way they are going they are living on borrowed time.

[vocal vector]

Yep

[karmic token]

Oh how I miss the good fafnir. I had one when it first came out to a random data pad and it was so good until one day where I realized it wasn't the same.

[vocal vector]

Yea

[placid juniper]

Why do we even try if Pixonic does not care about the game anymore they over buffs new weapons and robots and after that overnerfs weapons and robots... And this meta cycle would continue until there's nobody going to buy shit in this game

[rustic wave]

Don't forget Devourer on pilot healing 75% to 15% , this nerf makes the titan obsolete. 40% would be reasonable.

[vocal vector]

Lets bomb TS feedback form with bring back dux grey healing

[unkempt knoll]

Yeah

[vocal vector]

Yep

[uneven path]

Hello

[vocal vector]

Hi

[quick wolf]

I had message pix in-game as a suggestion that sniper titans weapons are useless because they easy to time and counter and that sniper titans don't work because of over nerfing, where as the one thing they depend on is damage out put that doesn't surpass regalar tank or brawlers anyways

Seems they didn't get the message because instead of buffing Newton they just nerf Bersag

The fact that they can't brawl or been nerf to not do enough damage to warrant running

WR is simply not the game to play if you're looking for a sense of balance or roles
For example a 5 weapon sniper Ravager can tank and brawl better than a Tank Fenrir

[vocal vector]

Yup, i know but i atleast try

Devs already 3 times responded to my skirmish concept post

The most upvoted post in the whole server

[nimble onyx]

With "nope"

[copper briar]

Wtf

[vocal vector]

?

[vocal vector]

Bug

[unkempt knoll]

They BETTER NOT nerf my boy imugi

[vocal vector]

We are so back

.

[flint ginkgo]

Great addition to shell, however i think it should be 15 seconds not being under fire.

[tranquil rain]

Give nubji the ability to teleport around the map

[vocal vector]

Yup, smth like teth

[vocal vector]

What robot?

[flint ginkgo]

Yeah.

[vocal vector]

I gotta update this post anyway cuz its outdated

I will do it in the following days or even today some stuff too

[vocal vector]

I finished it now i think

[unkempt knoll]

Ur making a new rebalance?

Count me in

I have some ideas

If i may have a say
In this

[compact rover]

100 upvotes this is WWWW

But the huginn muninn part is...

[strange rose]

Honestly if that Minos buff were to actually happen imo it would make Minos meta

[worldly fiber]

I dont think itll happen anyway

[vocal vector]

W

[vocal vector]

Tell

[nimble onyx]

numbers are beautiful

[vocal vector]

5:1 ratio isnt that bad

• all the dislikes are the P2Ws cuz they dont want their toys get nerfed💀

[unkempt knoll]

My takes:
Nerfs
Bagliore:
Damage boost from 69%->55% (only affects mk3)
Teth:
Forcefield now only reactivates upon not recieving damage for a short period of time
Forcefield reduced by 90k
Defense points no longer stack with teths forcefield
Pathfinder:
No longer can use its ability through walls
Samjok:
Reduced turrets damage By 7%
Piercers: nerfed them to a Max of 8 fatigue stacks
Reduced damage PER fatigue By 10%
Arms:
Percentatge damage 1->0.8%

Here are some of my takes on nerfa

Nerfs*

As for buffs:
Fenrir -> speed increased By 10%
Tyr: now heals 1% gray hp/sec for 15 seconds upon ability activation (shapeshifting)
Physical shields now constantly regenerate
Condor:
Gray hp heal : 2->3%
Biw damage BUFFED By 10%
Phys shields HP buffed By 15%
Raptor:
Now activates reflector for 2 seconds after ability usage (but Is now only 25% reduction).

These are some of my takes

As for meta bots ive got them in another suggestion i could paste them here

[unkempt knoll]

Dux: drones now have good accuracy even at Max range
Cryos:
Damage BUFFED By 15% (unusable rn)
Skadis: damage BUFFED By 25% (same reason)

Tarans: damage BUFFED By 25%

(redeemer IS its counterpart and its miles better)

[vocal vector]

I totally forgot about Bagel😭

It def needs a dmg boost nerf

[unkempt knoll]

Omao

Lmao

Yeah

I didnt do a harsh nerf tho since i want the bots mentioned before to still be good

Just not broken

Like

I aimed to be

Fair to put It like that

[vocal vector]

Yuh bot Samjok’s turret def needs nore dmg nerf than 7% and +55% for Bagel still makes it crazy op

[unkempt knoll]

U'd be surprised By how much a 14% nerf does tbh

Arms for example
If they got around 15-20% to their overall performance theyd probs die out

[unkempt knoll]

nerf

Overall i mean percentatge and base dmg nerfs

Samjok just needs fuel to be nerfed tbh

Then its fine

But yeah mines are just ideas

Feel free to use em

[vocal vector]

Thanks

[vocal vector]

Nah, problem is not the bot itself but the turret’s damage

And its unkillableness

Samjok is so unbalanced

Imo it requires:
-Less fuel
-More between phaseshift cooldown
-Way less turret dmg
-Little to no speed boost in ability

Because its so annoying cuz it requires zero skill and deals insane dmg

[unkempt knoll]

As much as i agree with samjok needing nerfs
We should honestly aim to make the Game better and more fair for players in general
Samjok (nor any bot ingame) deserves to suck entirely
They deserve to be usable Imo
Its just a Matter of nerfing the fuel duration and recovery so that samjok dies competitively but Is still usable

Even as somebody Who hates stuff like Pathfinder which gives 140% dmg Buff against one targetted enemy, sb w pilot and lockdown i only feel like It needs a slight nerf so that It cant use its ability through walls
Even tho It could be arguably more annoying and toxic than samjok
Because otherwise it'll die as a robot

Also some other nerfs i've had in mind would honestly be

Prismas
Reapers (slight nerf)
Lio (slight nerf)
Sword (substantial nerf)
Kaji (Big nerf)

[copper briar]

Samjok needs a harder nerf

[unkempt knoll]

Can agree to this

But not less fuel+ cd + way less dmg to turret

Maybe 10% less dmg
-20% fuel recovery
And -15% ability duration

[copper briar]

It needs less dmg tourret but ability interval cooldown reducted to 5-6 seconds

[unkempt knoll]

Ig

Also about lio

And

Kaji
Sword
Reapers

What do yall think bout them

[copper briar]

Reapers needs a dmg nerf and a cooldown buff

-30% damage
15 or 12 seconds cooldown to 8

[unkempt knoll]

I feel like lio might need a slight tweak
Kaji needs a harsh nerf
Insane damage w deathmark
Sword needs smth like slight base dmg nerf and Lil bit more cd
Like -15% base dmg
+2 sec cd

[unkempt knoll]

Id honestly just do -20%
And 10 secs cd

[copper briar]

Also kaji for some reason bypasses shields while it shouldn't

[unkempt knoll]

Ye needs to be fixed

For lio tbh uh

I dont rly think It should be changed a lot Imo but if u wanna tweak It a lil

Then we could make mk3 bonus a little less

[copper briar]

Maybe its because the aoe is so massive that its even bigger than ue tulumbas aoe

[unkempt knoll]

Like

[unkempt knoll]

Yeah...

[unkempt knoll]

Imo
Lio would be like
From 75->70% defense
Not much

Both nuo/lio are alright Imo

Just maybe not lio entirely

Cos of the buff

But a slight nerf Will do It
Maybe also

Tweak durab

So It doesnt tank that

[copper briar]

75% to 60% or slightly more

[unkempt knoll]

Much

[unkempt knoll]

Id honestly leave It at 70% and nerf durability By 12.5% or 15%

Or more

Depends

Aopo maybe could also get a slight nerf

[copper briar]

The issue with sword is the absorber duration and the absorber makes 50% of the damage you receive in absorber to sword damage

[unkempt knoll]

So that lios not as op w the extra HP

[unkempt knoll]

Ye
A cap needs to be added

[copper briar]

Yeah like 150k-250k per slice

[unkempt knoll]

Like lets say

Maybe a percentatge of base dmg per slash

Picture this

150% damage cap
Which Is maxed at 4m damage

Wouldnt be too bad
Right?

Or Is It too much

[quick wolf]

I strongly disagree with absorber duration nerf Atlas feels like it doesnt have much durability but mine is not maxed

Mauler has a lot of passive durability in comparison, why dont you try to nerf that?

[quick wolf]

The community caused mars and nether death

They cause angler death

A lot of older robots over nerfed cause people wouldn't stop crying it down

But current p2w players would never mention teth needing a nerf because they using it

They only want things they don't have to get nerfed

These boom bash weapons a really really broken, guilty for using it but teth counter I have

I will also say the motherships are good how they are currently
Leave the motherships alone
All you doing is making pixonic nerf the motherships then they going to release new motherships that over perform x10
And all it will result to is the motherships people waste resources trying to aquire and max being useless and forcing people to get something else

[vocal vector]

Frederick definetly needs a little bit of nerf cuz its crazy af

[vocal vector]

Ig ur right cuz its not the duration but the shield itself as a problem. Its just so impossible to hit

[quick wolf]

I agree but at the same time think dark light needed a small nerf as well

[vocal vector]

Imo i’d make side absorbers a back absorber or nerf the total angle in which they block dmg

[vocal vector]

True cuz the dmg boost is crazy af

Mauler+Frederick is just so insane

[quick wolf]

Atlas is such a funny titan if amp not charge or so and the game lags or rubberbands for a few seconds in a brawl it could die within that half second

Plus so much weapons by pass shield when I turn to the side I wonder if it is a bug

[vocal vector]

Huhhh?

Bruh

[vocal vector]

Funny cuz its so hard to hit

I mean i use mauler and i admit DL needs a nerf but so does Atlas

Only titans with shieldbreaking ability are Atlas itself (w/pilot) and Bersag (w/pilot)

Which makes other titans trash

Thats why absorber angle or some absorber wise nerf is needed

[quick wolf]

Must be a bug then

[vocal vector]

Yuh

[quick wolf]

Atlas main benefits is it mobility

[vocal vector]

And the shields

Mauler “only” from DL

[quick wolf]

It really needs that chef jump to catch up to Eiffels, Ming, Bersag

People don't really understand atlas play

Consider If being shot at by a arbiter ming then heavy plating is kinda useless, they could still one clip you through it if not careful

The strategy is often to catch your counters of gaurd

I even put deft survivor and it hardly makes a difference
Maybe when I max it out I will be able to tell

[vocal vector]

(Which makes it broken af)

[unkempt knoll]

Mars and nether didnt deserve It tbh

[quick wolf]

I actually sold those boom weapons, if people leaving matches when hit by them, I can't be so heavily part of the problem with this game

Sold samjok, sold pshent

I would use stryx if I get it or maybe another crisis

[vocal vector]

I have meet an Ophion with 1 Bash and 2 Regulators. Only the Bash was taking me away like 10% hp per hit. That was insane

[versed fog]

let me just say this, i don’t even have my atlas at max and im fighting meta all the time, the fact that my atlas was only level 70 in combat with only durability skills max up to level 50 and still able to brawl w most f2p and even p2w robots if your actually a good player, on the other hand getting shot at w shield break or a mind or bersag isn’t that big of a deal as they would prob have more trouble trying to get to u than u avoiding them if you really know how to play the atlas right, i’ve been shot at through the shield and got to safety but never have i just been wiped out bc i never seen someone with the shield break do that

not unless u truly aren’t paying attention and/or bad

and btw a level 70 atlas is like a 1 million hp luch from back in the day when this game wasn’t so op

[unkempt knoll]

Ngl

Ive changed my mind about pathfinder

Once meta weapons which home come out this mf goes back to being popular asf

Nerf both boom family and pfs damage pls

Like this things so absolutely darn broken

Ability goes through walls
U get dealt 140% dmg when targetted

It has bonuses like gray hp
Or attack/speed which stafk

Stack*

Also has built in SB and lockdown

like bro

This robot has gotta be ragebait

Istg Bros 10 times more annoying than samjok

And samjoks annoying asl By itself

[vocal vector]

Why is everyone complaining about PF😭

Its out for a really long time and people started complaining about it just now

But i understand your point

[vocal vector]

I added Bash/Boom/Pow but i have no space for Pathfinder left

I have used all possible space

[unkempt knoll]

Its like bagliore

People havent complained at all till now

[vocal vector]

I have always complained about bagel

But others were stupid so they just now

69% dmg boost for 4 heavies is insane

[pastel rivet]

Lol, don’t make such a list again(or do better research). the most obvious and funny one is ue shredder! He says nerf that by big 25% and does not mention ue tulumbus. You still dont know what is really an issue!
And buffs to a t3 titan(minos) is funny..

[vocal vector]

Lol also read the date when the post got posted before laughing in someone’s face

I didnt have time yet to remake all changes

Lol

And whats wrong with buffing other stuff than t4?

[pastel rivet]

Well fair, my bad that one.

[pastel rivet]

The buff is simply too much!

[vocal vector]

👍

[vocal vector]

Minos was t4 back in the day. I could reason the buff with “t3 -> t4” change

[unkempt knoll]

Tbh bagels not even annoying atp

Pathfinder is

Like

THE BANE OF MY EXISTANCE 💔

I suggest slight nerfs for both of em

Like
Pathfinder:
140->120% damage boost
Ability cant go through walls
Bagliore:
69->55% damage boost
Healing from pilot reduced from 40->30%

Would already be fine

As theyre not meta bots

Theyre meta killers

Bots which are solid but not to the point where theyre so oppressive

Hence why i believe a slight nerf like this to both Will tune em down

Tbh everything heres fine except for these few robots:
1st
Teth
Even tho its gotta be nerfed its supposed to be a brawler/type assasin with It being n assasin but tankier
Ur just straight Up making It ass 😭
In my rebalance i nerfed its shields HP a lot then forcefield By 120-150k
And also fixed the Glitch which makes It absolutely broken (which IS dp stacking w forcefield)
2nd
Minos:
Dont get me wrong
Minos isnt the worst titan to recieve a Buff
But It doesnt deserve to b better than luchador or indra
Whom arent too far appart from minos, this Buff IS enormous and would probably catapult minos Up to the top 2
U should bear in mind we arent in a meta where stuff shreds instantly
And in this meta a 20% Buff can make something go from B to S tier.
Nuo/lio should personally not get nerfed much
Theyve shown to be able to compete w meta but then again, theyre in a similar position as bagliore/Pathfinder are rn and thus shouldnt be touched much, they can compete sometimes
But dont stand a chance against well built meta.
Id argue nuo doesnt need any nerf
Whilst lio does need some slight nerfs.
With the rest i can agree with as theyre rly good takes
But most of the stuff that isnt entirely meta that is f2p
In this case nuo/lio would be nerfed to the ground
Essentially making this whole rebalance pointless
As It would mean a hangar reset for most f2ps

Meaning p2ws would have a way to get newer meta
And f2ps would be stuck with bad bots
Essentially making this thing pointless Because the cycle would repeat all over again.

I dont think a rebalance aims to kill the bots entirely
Its supposed to make the Game more fair for everyone
Which in this case
Due to a few takes
It doesnt Imo

[vocal vector]

Hmm, thanks for the feedback

[unkempt knoll]

Np

[unkempt knoll]

Sorry for writing this much btw

😭🙏

[vocal vector]

I’ll think and remake some changes when i have time

[vocal vector]

Its ok. Theres no other way to discuss about rebalances than writing walls of texts

Especially if its a 4000 letter list like mine💀

[unkempt knoll]

Goat

[unkempt knoll]

LMAOOO

[vocal vector]

I’d add Bagel too but im out of space 😭

[unkempt knoll]

I mean u could add It like
Below maybe

Its what i did w my past rebalance

Cos uh It didnt fit

[vocal vector]

I could edit the message i have under to further list, good idea

[unkempt knoll]

👍

[vocal vector]

Lets go 6k letters😭

I will make the post itself specs, pilots, drones, titan weps and titans rebalance

2nd message will be robot weapons and robots

3rd will be more robots/weapons and MSs

[vocal vector]

About Minos, what would you say if i would tune down the values a bit and add “T3 -> T4” for it?

[vocal vector]

@unkempt knoll so what do you say. Is it better now?

(Still working on it)

[vocal vector]

Yo i have recooked the post. Check it again if you want

[vocal vector]

Now done

[unkempt knoll]

Sorry i was out

[unkempt knoll]

Honestly
Minos should recieve little to no Buff atm Imo

Its still usable on champs and performs rly well

Stuff like heimdall/sirius do need a buff

Minos is alright as It is

Reliable titan

A slight Buff maybe like small HP Buff id take It ig

But

Other than that

Its fine

Like 10% Hp Buff would be nice

But minos Is already good

Also piercers need to be on this list tbh

[opaque current]

Reduce both cooldown and fuel recovery

Fuel should be something carefully managed, not something u can spam for 12 seconds invincibility each 5-7 secs

[opaque current]

For sword flatten the absorber conversion rate for the sword and make it so that both arms and it's ranged ibw have very little flat dmg but maintain the %

[opaque current]

It's that way to sell a solution to the sword and atlas problem they created

[opaque current]

Not rly, it's programmed to work that way imo

Aoe shouldnt do that, if it did the compact aegis would be bypassed by any rocket launcher

[opaque current]

Do 60-65% and buff durability by 15-20%

[opaque current]

Make it 25%

i think stupidity in this kind if game should still be punished

[opaque current]

Community preference dont matter for balance, only money oriented decisions

[opaque current]

With atlas u simply have to turn sideways for 2 seconds every 10 and u're pretty much invincible

also a lot of mobility, blind with pilot and emp

[opaque current]

Pf is okay, issue are boom family

they shouldnt even exist in the first place, but since they're staying, make the homing curve much more diagonal so that it doesnt ignore all covers (more like dune), nerf reload and nerf dmg

[opaque current]

80%

from deathmark double effect on booms

[opaque current]

Bc it counters absorber meta

[opaque current]

If ability cant go through walls the bot is guaranteed to get killed before it can get more than 1 or 2 stacks

[opaque current]

Heimdall just make the phys shield regenerate over time and decrease it's defence points by a bit

[unkempt knoll]

Well built pf without boom family can still melt bots like lio btw

If u say pfs ok
Lio might asw be ok

And i can assure ya

Lio AINT OK

At all

[unkempt knoll]

It supposed to be played carefully
Not recklessly
Just aim for specific targets or use burst weaps

[unkempt knoll]

With this i agree

[unkempt knoll]

Bear in mind pf has more dmg boost against a target than prime nuo btw

• built in sb

• stacks of dmg/speed

• gray hp heal

• lockdown

• also affects teammates

It sounds as broken as It is

Pathfinder cant be argued to be balanced

Its just not deabatable

Its like if u said prenerf nuos damage was balanced

Its just absurd lol

Booms just An extra reason to Nerf Pathfinder
So It doesnt have the chance to wreck havoc once newer gamebreaking weapons like these drop

[opaque current]

Lio is not broken, i was just making it a little bit more susceptible to % dmg while nerfing flat dmg o arms and sword ranged ibw

[unkempt knoll]

Lio mk3 can solo teths on 1v1s lmao

If linked to a teammate ofc

[opaque current]

Almost any target can one tap u

[unkempt knoll]

Same can be said for almost every dmg dealer

Why should pf be different?

[opaque current]

If teth doesnt know the basics of it's abilities, yes

[unkempt knoll]

Lio triple arms + linked w gray hp immunity

Full arms + csgs teth

[opaque current]

Bear in mind most pf die before the third stack bc they are so fragile almost any homing weapon can blast him very quickly

[unkempt knoll]

Most pfs arent pfs in champs

"Most"
Could be said for every damage dealer
They die fast
Ur supposed to play carefully

Look at nuo

Heck
Even dux
Which i wouldnt consider a damage dealer
Dies fast asl

[opaque current]

Yes but dmg dealers have mechanisms of defense through abilities

pf doesnt

[unkempt knoll]

Me when countersupression

Me when freezo:

Y could even argue countersup doesnt do much
But freezo does tho lmao

The problem is how toxic It is and how absurdly op It can make ya and ur allies

[opaque current]

Pf is squishy enough to die extremely fast even with that

[unkempt knoll]

Freezo Pathfinder tanks as much as brawlers
And besides, It tanks similar to every dmg dealer w countersup lol

Basically tanks nothing

Because theyre supposed to tank nothing

Theyre dmg s
Dealers...

[opaque current]

While most likely removing a lot of potential firepower from the team for almost 3 minutes while u get ur charges

[unkempt knoll]

Theyre supposed to be played carefully

[opaque current]

if no one in the enemy team has boom or dune family ofc

[unkempt knoll]

Not quite

[opaque current]

if they do u just die and call it a day

[unkempt knoll]

If ur 1 on 1 yes

If theres atleast a teammate w ya

Then its worth using pf

And bearing in mind its a half support bot

Ur most likely to be stuck with teammates at the back

[opaque current]

This means there's somewhere else sone of ur teammates are in a serious disadvantage

[unkempt knoll]

Not rly

If there even was
Same could be argued for EVERY support bot

Pfs way better than most support bots

Arguably better than nuo atp

And nuo was considered meta when
Last season?

💀

Also ability has 600m range
So u could use It to help that teammate in a disadvantatge in the worst case scenario

Its a team play Game
Ur obviously gonna be in a disadvantatge sometimes

[opaque current]

Yes bc fast movement and 5 blind charges made it somewhat survivable too

[unkempt knoll]

And now It gets outclassed By other dmg dealers including pf
Wow

Totally balanced

Because nuo itself is the most balanced thing on earth asw

[opaque current]

pf doesnt have any way of surviving besides hiding

[unkempt knoll]

Freezo....

[opaque current]

and that doesnt work too well now

[unkempt knoll]

Hiding in the back of the team...

[unkempt knoll]

It works way too well wdym

Boom just made It non deabatably the BEST damage dealer ingame
If ur not counting sword/kaji

Actually could be argued to be better than sword w boom lol

But anyways

Pathfinder isnt balanced

And its deservant of a nerf

Anything that can compete w meta is NOT balanced

And Pathfinder can

Just as well as bagliore
And other off meta bots can

Besides
Not like this small nerf Will do anything
This Will only affect those pf players Who only stay on the back of the team

If ur good at the Game u should be just fine

[opaque current]

Boom family...

works only after applying suppression

[opaque current]

Ye but that's boom family ruining the entire game, not just pf

[quick wolf]

Pix love adding things that don't need to exist huh

I couldn't see the point of boom if dunes already exist

Say they try to make the bash set like some modern vortex but smite discipline already exist

[opaque current]

Yes

[quick wolf]

Then it's going to be hard to rebalance something like boom without making it just useless

[opaque current]

bc they milk more money fron those short term

that pleases investors bc they're not anxious all the time

[quick wolf]

I imagine dunes would be better than boom eventually

[opaque current]

Money

And punishing free to play users in lower leagues too, not just champs

[flint ginkgo]

I mean they are unique as a weapon, they fire only 1 missile.

Whilst dune fires many.

[opaque current]

They only need one with that dmg

[quick wolf]

Idk but I seeing a lot of guys that use to be in high champs lower these days,

[flint ginkgo]

Yep.

[opaque current]

Also completrly vertical impact, ignoring all non orb shields and all covers in the game

allmost all*

[flint ginkgo]

Keep in mind I’m not justifying how strong they are.

[quick wolf]

Nothing can justify the point of ue redeemer when redeemer already decent and balanced

[flint ginkgo]

The meta cycle…

[quick wolf]

Oh yah, money

[flint ginkgo]

There is something that can justify it, and that is my.games/pixonics greed.

[opaque current]

Ye i defined hard netas and soft ones on another chat

there are some soft metas used as both money generator fron whales and competitive rich clans and a containment measure against high frustration on players to prevent permanent quitting, and cycle them with harsher metas designed to be extra difficult for f2p users across all leagues (f2p users are very likely not using optimized tank setups, therefore high dmg cover ignoring weapons are especially harsh on them)

[quick wolf]

I think they need to change the way Pathfinder ability works

The air lockdown gets annoying

[rigid hearth]

Your missing one robot: Mender. Buff base HP and make total healing with skills 200k

[vocal vector]

They are💀

[unkempt knoll]

Nvm then

[unkempt knoll]

Pf just needs tuning down as a bot itself
In a balanced Game
A bot which deals 140% damage
Lockdowns
And SBS
Cant exist

Theres no going around It
Sorry

[unkempt knoll]

Instantly activates upon getting hit 💔

[worn zinc]

Tbh, this is good
Especially ocho buff

[opaque current]

120%
Also given how fragile it is, u're very probably not gonna get past the 60% bonus mark before dying

[opaque current]

Does it apply to the hot that applies the counter suppression?

meaning, does it prevent u from being one tapped by booms?

[unkempt knoll]

Yes It does lmao

[opaque current]

Mb then

[unkempt knoll]

140% upon ability activation

[opaque current]

iirc 20% per stack, 6 stacks max

Ability dm is 40%

max would be 160 (i'm assuming they're additive bonuses, the dm and the stacks to each other, which i havent tested and might be higher), but u're probably gonna die before 100%

[vocal vector]

W

Ocho on top

[worn zinc]

Ocho best bot frfr

[vocal vector]

Fr, Rex is trash

Teth too

Mauler is ok

[worn zinc]

Ocho ez solo teth

[vocal vector]

Yes

[vocal vector]

Real

[unkempt knoll]

Realll

[unkempt knoll]

Its not stacks vro

Ability activation grants 140% dmg against the target u activate It at

That

• The stacks make It dumb broken

[unkempt knoll]

This at mk3

Dont u know how pf works?

[opaque current]

No?

And the stacks, separately

[opaque current]

Also this

Death mark dmg bonus isnt increased further than 40% for that ability

[unkempt knoll]

Oh i thought It was 140%?
Might be It + the stacks

Regardless of that tbh its still pretty broken

Instantly shutting down anything

[vocal vector]

140% if you count 100% as base dmg

But its +40% or 1.4x

[unkempt knoll]

oh i see

tbh i feel like the stacks also do alot in here

yee the stacks in total are 120% bonus

dmg

[vocal vector]

So should i tune down stacks instead of deathmark?

I’d keep deathmark at 40% and put stacks down to 10% (60% at max)

@unkempt knoll

[unkempt knoll]

Ye probs

[vocal vector]

Done

[opaque current]

I think 15% per stack would be the limit without making it being only able to be an ability spam bot with no chance to do anything else

keep in mind most of the times u'll die before getting the 4th stack

[quick wolf]

I'd buff Huginn Muninn 10% but reduce the fire rate 30% slower
That sounds more like pix

[vocal vector]

But i am not pix💀

And its 100x simpler to nerf inly the dmg

[vocal vector]

Then should i put it back to 15% per stack?

[unkempt knoll]

I think probably around 13.5% would be the swiftspot

Cos 15% would be like

90% damage at Max stacks

Speed per stack shouldnt be touched tho

Only damage

[opaque current]

If u survive until max stacks u deserve a big dmg boost

u're extremely likely to die before ur 4th anyway

quite literally one person on the enemy team charging MS once = u die without any chance to survive

[unkempt knoll]

Isnt 13.5% which Is like 70+% enough

Thats more than bagel
And ability gives An extra 40%

Its fine

It gives everybody Who assisted a boost asw

[opaque current]

Yes but remember this is going to happen very few times per match on average, and while u do that u probably arent going to be shooting unless u have booms or moranas

or maybe some shocktrains

[late meadow]

hear me out

all physical shields regenerate for t3 below

Bulwark buff
48>>51kph
Damage dealer>>Brawler pathway
Aegis regenerates in Aegis mode

[unkempt knoll]

Hussars also work
Just like other weapons
Such as brawler weapons w pf if u use freezo
Wdym

Theres plenty options

For It

Theres like just
Too many builds

Pf can make just about anything usable

[opaque current]

Ye but i'd try not to overinvest in a weapon that will get nerfed

Also u dont want sustained fire weapons bc pathfinder dies the moment they shoot at it

[unkempt knoll]

Perhaps my point isnt that the weapon might get nerfed itself

But rather that hussars underperform in champs

But Pathfinder makes em work well

Really well

[unkempt knoll]

Freezo Pathfinder is the most optimal/effective build im afraid

And the most used asw

[opaque current]

Only with enough stacks

[opaque current]

Ik, but still it has very little hp and anything with good dps can delete it pretty easily

Also keep in mind if u use a pf there will be almost at all times sometjing chipping at ur hp

[unkempt knoll]

Literally 1 or 2 stacks Is enough...

[unkempt knoll]

Not quite

Ive seen freezo pfs which Cook teths w ease due to their dps

Especially pfs with weaps like ue storms

Only thing that can melt em is

Boom/Pow
Or
Arms

[opaque current]

Not at all, unless u have full ue weapoms like 3 ions

[unkempt knoll]

Hussars themselves w 1 or 2 stacks works pretty well

And hussars are trash

Like lets not lie

Hussars absolutely suck

And pf makes em work w ease

U cant make It up

[opaque current]

Csgs, or quite literally any homing weapons

[unkempt knoll]

Not w freezo

[opaque current]

or, more simply, one beholder and bye bye bot

[unkempt knoll]

Freezo pf>>>>any weapons that arent phsent/boom/arms

[opaque current]

Even with freezo take some disciplines and u can safely chip it away

[unkempt knoll]

Quite literally

[unkempt knoll]

LMAOOOOO

LOLLLLL

Brochacho disciplines tickle even nuo

[opaque current]

I see that happen all the time tbh

[unkempt knoll]

😭🙏

[unkempt knoll]

Ur not facing pf freezo builds
As simple as that

Give pf a freezo and It becomes a semi brawler lmao

[opaque current]

Maybe nerf freezo then?

i dont see base pf being the problem tbh

[unkempt knoll]

Freezo isnt broken
Their combination Is

UE rayker freezo

Isnt op

[opaque current]

Only pf uses ot anyway

[unkempt knoll]

Its just good enough

[unkempt knoll]

UE rayker

And UE rayker doesnt outperform pf

By any means

[opaque current]

Their role is not the same

[unkempt knoll]

Its actually quite balanced amongst ues

[opaque current]

pf is a support bot

[unkempt knoll]

Ofc
Im just stating pf w freezo works far better than ue rayker

Essentially

[opaque current]

tho i'm gonna say, pf's cooldown is too short

[unkempt knoll]

Pathfinder IS the problem

Because freezo works just fine with other bots
But pf?
It becomes broken w it

[unkempt knoll]

CDs not the problem

Either reduce damage/stack

Or make It unable to go through walls

Simple as that

[opaque current]

9s cooldown on lock + dm + group sb is too short

[unkempt knoll]

If u want a cd nerf

[opaque current]

u kill the bot if u do that

[unkempt knoll]

Itd have to be a harsh one tbh

[opaque current]

13s is enough

[unkempt knoll]

Freezo pf being its BEST build
Not quite

It can be exposed a lot w freezo

Pfs whole problem would be being squishy
Freezo gets Rid of that problem lmao

[opaque current]

every single time i see a pf go in the open no matter the build it just disappears

[unkempt knoll]

U just dont see freezo 💔

Thats all

[opaque current]

also literally anyone on the enemy team can delete it with a beholder drop

[unkempt knoll]

Also snipers are literally meta
Anything gets melted By bagel prisma/piercers
Or anything w solar

Even lio
Since solar has def mitigation

[unkempt knoll]

Freezo pf doesnt die to beholder
And neither does a decently built pf...

Stop lying gng 🥀

Its not that squishy lmfao

I have one myself 💀🙏

[opaque current]

Freezo doesnt activate on ms hits iirc

[unkempt knoll]

Decently build pf doesnt die to beholder...

[opaque current]

bc u activate countersuppression on weapon/drone hits

[opaque current]

Havent seen any survive so far

[unkempt knoll]

Ms do trigger countersup

[unkempt knoll]

And counterblind

[opaque current]

neither on masters or champion

[unkempt knoll]

Btw...

Y can test this w nuo itself

Or lio

[opaque current]

actually nvmnd u're right

they die anyway tho

[unkempt knoll]

Again
Not with freezo

[opaque current]

also with freezo

[unkempt knoll]

Nuh uh

Also even if beholder was to kill pf
(Which It doesnt)
Beholder absolutely sucks ahh compared to
Avalon
Paladin
And frederick
In this meta
Where theres a whole lotta tanky bots

[opaque current]

Avalon meh, paladin and fred yep

tho just wait for the new lne

[unkempt knoll]

Sekhems ass too 🙏😭

[opaque current]

if they're giving fred on gold chests it means the next one is gonna be absolutely busted

[unkempt knoll]

Also theres this thing called uh...
What was It?
Bifrost

Which IS also insane

And can make any bot tank anything

Whilst having dmi

So ye

Beholder/sekhem be useless atm

[opaque current]

Yep that one is also good

tho most ppl i face use fred or beholder

[unkempt knoll]

If u wanna account for people using beholder

Might asw say pfs using one of those

Which unless its freddie

Its surviving

So its quite irrelevant anyway

[opaque current]

I see beholder users all the time deleting bots that rely on cover

[unkempt knoll]

Ive seen more bifrost which IS way harder to get
Than beholders
Atleast in champs

[unkempt knoll]

Only bot that beholder post nerf can delete Is crisis tbh

Competitive bots im talking about

[opaque current]

From clan u get similar numbers

it's easier if u go for silver chests, but most go for gold

[opaque current]

A bit less than fred, but not too much

[unkempt knoll]

Beholder isnt on the clan rewards anymore

[opaque current]

Wait i swapped it for fred

[unkempt knoll]

Paladin/Fred/avalon are infinitely more used than beholders tbh

[opaque current]

[unkempt knoll]

Beholders the type of MS that is only good in experts or below

[opaque current]

I still see it in champs all the time

and they delete bots just as well, just not tanks

[unkempt knoll]

Every time i see It on champs It tickles lmao

Like i've had absolutely no problem at all

Even my samjok whilst running out of ability survives 😭🙏

Lets not Talk about my bagliore or lio

Free ra charge

😭✌️

[opaque current]

There's 0 chance of scamjok surviving an upgraded beholder without the ability

[unkempt knoll]

When they dont use lockdown cannon u survive at 1 HP

That or Sonic boom makes It die tho

Honestly stuff like keel does way more dmg than beholders rn

[opaque current]

Beholder is much faster than no ability scamjok

[unkempt knoll]

And keels meant for Titans

[unkempt knoll]

I do use speed skills
But regardless of that
Beholders ability doesnt do full dmg unless ur not movin

[opaque current]

they obviously always come with good offensive turrets

[unkempt knoll]

If u wanna take into ACC beholder which isnt quite used as much as avalon/paladin/Freddie
U could also take avalon and paladin which heal Up and make u survive beholder asw

And bifrost
But its not as used as paladin/avalon

Also pf has support Pathways with last stand

Thats just An extra

[opaque current]

I think i've only seen one guy use avalon in champs

[unkempt knoll]

Really?
I see plenty

[opaque current]

and that's probably bc he didnt have fred yet

Defensive ones i see are mostly bifrost and paladins

[unkempt knoll]

Half of my team uses avalon
And the other half uses Freddie usually
Also avalon outclasses paladin

Overall

Due to cleanse mainly tbh

[unkempt knoll]

All 3 can survive beholder
And It would be unfair to not have them into account and have beholder be in the equation asw

[opaque current]

Might be, but most ppl dot have optimized setups and they require large amounts of shield or defense

so they go bifrost or paladin

[unkempt knoll]

So yeah
Beholders not much of a problem when those 3 are in the top 5 most used ms ingame

Anyways
Moving to something else
Because beholder argument has concluded since theres plenty ways to counter It

Anything else?

[opaque current]

It's much more likely to have one of the 6 enemies slap u in the face with a beholder drop as a pf than to have ur ms ready

[unkempt knoll]

Again
Would literally be low chances for u to be slapped By beholder
Several times
But if u wanna take It into ACC
Some tanks can also be melted By several beholders
Just not one alone

Any damage dealer/support can be killed w 3 beholders except lio

And maybe khepri

/mender

So not rly a valid argument since other damage dealers die to this asw

It would be too much of a Casualty to get slapped By 2 let alone 3

And would put the enemy team on a huge disadvantatge Because
Freddie/avalon/paladin
Against beholder isnt a fair match

Same for bifrost

[opaque current]

Every time i drop with my pf i get one or 2 simultaneous drops within a minute, so i'd say it's pretty likely

[unkempt knoll]

2 is quite unlikely
Unless ur being annoying
Which quite frankly IS pfs specialty

[opaque current]

It's actually quite frequent

bc ppl get obsessed with killing pf asap when they see it

[unkempt knoll]

Use avalon+last stand and ur good
Or freezo itself

[opaque current]

Never said they didnt

[unkempt knoll]

Other damage dealers have been balanced
Tho
Thats the difference

That theres a counter to It doesnt mean its balanced as well
Forgor to mention that

[opaque current]

Issue with pf isnt the dmg per se tho bc u're not likely to live enough to get max stacks, it's the frequence which u can activate the mark with

[unkempt knoll]

Its like if u said prenerf lio was balanced Because webers ravager existed

[opaque current]

Depends

[unkempt knoll]

This is just another problem

[opaque current]

it's balanced if the counter is within the normal use of ur set

[unkempt knoll]

No It doesnt
Lios prime wasnt balanced

✌️

[opaque current]

and it's skill dependant

(Motherships with beholder type of homing isnt skill based at all btw)

[unkempt knoll]

Neither was webers ravager

It onetapped lio

Same for nuo

And both were plenty popular

[opaque current]

Yep but that was bc it was even more broken

Ravager had an insane dmg buff when it fired

[unkempt knoll]

It was just a concept
Pfs not as broken
But its counter isnt as Broken either

Similar situation
Different Tiers in the meta

One beholder isnt enough for pf if u use last stand or freezo

Neither would 2 be in freezos case tbh

[opaque current]

Havent seen a pf survive 2 beholders yet

Maybe if the ms isnt upgraded

[vocal vector]

Imo 15% is ok cuz as rey says its so hard to get all 6

[unkempt knoll]

Hmm
Alright

But then id honestly make CD a bit higher

Like from 8->10

Seconds

[vocal vector]

U need to be extremely cautious to get all 16 stacks

[vocal vector]

CD is 10sec

[unkempt knoll]

It is?

Then fine for me

[vocal vector]

Yuh, it aint 8

You have probably mistaken it for the 12 -> 10sec which happened a bit ago

[vocal vector]

The Bulwark buff idea is nice but i can only add the specialialization changes cuz im out of space

[opaque current]

Can a second balance message be pinned in this thread?

[vocal vector]

They are all under eachother on the beginning but yea

@iron eagle could you pls do it so people dont need to scroll?

If u can

[iron eagle]

which one , coz I am not scrolling either lol

[cursive crescent]

Yo can you pin this
Js kinda annoying when it puts me all the way down to the latest message and I have to search for a person who replied to the rebalance message

[flint ginkgo]

Paladin is still very good however.

Avalon is useful due to all the random and obsene amounts of effects rn.

[ivory steeple]

👎

[vocal vector]

The main message or the one under it

This one

[vocal vector]

Thanks

[unkempt knoll]

Never said It wasnt
It was my to go
Till avalon tbh

Avalon just heals more when using tanks too

[quick wolf]

There is soooo much maulers tbh

You come across games where the enemy has 4 or 5 maulers out at the same time

And team the same

And if not find myself a team lacking titan power

[opaque current]

Yes it's a titan ppl have had time to upgrade and is still good

[quick wolf]

I cannot even understand that first part of that sentence

I just still think dl deserve a nerf

And Fredrick

[opaque current]

It'll probably either get nerfed when the next titan comes out, or get overshadowed by how broken it will be

[flint ginkgo]

Considering how strong atlas is, i shall dread the next titan.

[unkempt knoll]

Yeah

Atp its nearly guaranteed for It to get nerfed...

[quick wolf]

Atlas kinda ahh
Just push up on it point blank and its dead
You don't know you can force your titan through purple shields, is how to kill a bedwyr too
Plus so many Atlas counters
Yet I not saying Atlas don't need a nerf
Multiple of them could be menacing or if your team don't have the right combo to deal with it

Players often take the wrong move
Because if I'm trying to get behind the Atlas so is my teammate
He doesn't realize I'm trying to turn it for him

[opaque current]

It's shield doesnt work like bedwyr's

also it can jump and create an emp field that also immobilises enemies for a while and deals dmg to them

Right now u can only kill an atlas if u happen to coordinate a mauler with a pathfinder, or if the atlas is so bad at the game he dies by not using the abilities at all

"Multiple of them can be a menace"
Man, just one of them can wipe half of the enemy titan roster at once

[opaque current]

U're forgetting it has abilities like jump and the field

[unkempt knoll]

If u consider atlas ahh then
Indra
Mauler
Lucha
And the rest are beyond unusable

From ur point of view

Because the only Titan thats on top of atlas rn IS ue Arthur 😭

[quick wolf]

Yeah but Atlas will not survive a nerf

Much champs don't even use it

[opaque current]

And not so much bc everyone on champions is either using atlas, ue arthur or versag/eiffel with devourer weapons

aside of maulers and some bjorn enjoyers

[opaque current]

Bc bersag with devourer weps are all over the place

And even then atlas users just wait for bersas to get killed and then when they deploy nothing can kill them

[unkempt knoll]

Yes
I didnt mean Titans which can counter It but rather the meta chart

Atlas Is #2 ingame

So if he considers It bad

Then the other Titans are straight Up garbage

[opaque current]

Atlas is #1, but it's so broken everyone has spent money on the only thing in the game that happens to counter it, sacrificing effectiveness for other things

[unkempt knoll]

Arguable tbh

UE Arthur has no Window to hit It whilst atlas can be hit for 1-2 secs

Its not much but

In a brawl UE Arthur wins Because of that unless atlas Is using idk

Arbiters

But regardless of that

We can all agree

Atlas Is dumb broken

[opaque current]

Arthur is very vulnerable all the time to anything explosive, while atlas can turn sideways for 2 seconds and have 0 vulnerability window

Effectiveness in battle also is not measured with how much 1v1 potential it has

one mauler can be a decisive factor on a battle with a well timed dl on a push while it would lose on a 1v1 agaibst indra if the indra know how to use it

despite that, indra cant have that much game impact

[unkempt knoll]

UE Arthur pros:
Wins in 1v1 unless atlas has explosive weapons
Cons:
Vulnerable to 2/3v1s
Atlas
Pros:
Can 3v1 or 2v1
Has inf SHIELD HP
Cons:
Gets hardcountered By Pathfinder

[unkempt knoll]

Indras top 4 ingame normal titans atm

[opaque current]

Ik

[unkempt knoll]

Actually top 3 nvm