why does pix REFUSE to fix the match making?

[gleaming wasp]

in my last 14 random matches i have run into 5 full clans....so in the matter of 30 minutes or so there have been full clans looking for battles and they don't get put against other clans..they get to chew up randoms and ruin the game for everyone who isn't pay to win....it is tiring to deal with this week after week

[warm crest]

Hahahahaha probably have a high win %

[modern briar]

Ok so, let’s say pixonic do decide that they should fix matchmaking.

What would they like more? A new op robot that they will sell in the offers and make a Ton of money

Or fix matchmaking

You see the state that matchmaking is rn is that you either pay, or you lose to other ppl who pay

And they will never do anything about it

[acoustic minnow]

If we think in a negative way, Pixonic doesn't even need to change the MM : losing to overly strong opponents will trigger your credit card on your side. Bingo, mission accomplished, money acquired

[zenith yew]

That's it; it's the same issue as the tanking problem.
For pix, tankers are just salespeople, showcasing the meta stuff to the lower league players, and showing both what they can have, and what it can do, if they just 💸 💸 💸
It's the lack of real matchmaking that enables this, as each player can manipulate their own league score, by 'tanking' down thru the leagues.

For the above reasons, I guess pix doesn't think it's worth 💰 implementing real MM

[warm crest]

There is no fix to MM. everyone wants their own little world of MM that doesn't satisfy everyone. It's. A 10min game.

[acoustic minnow]

When playing 10 games in a row against overly strong players this is not 10min anymore. If this happened like once in a while, 1 game on 10 for example, this could be acceptable if the 9 other games were impeccable. The problem here is that it's not even the case in WR.
So yeah at a local view of time this is only 10min or insatisfaction (often less) ; but multiplying that by the number of times it occurs and you the real implication of why people want a good MM

[warm crest]

And why do u think pix has a win % based out of 50 games? Not 10,20... 50 games average. And that's where mm will put u. It wants its daily average %

[acoustic minnow]

Si your hypothesis is that you get matched against literal gods only to push down the win% ? 🤔

[warm crest]

Look at it. And see what happens after every 5 matches. Doesn't matter if those 5 games are in one set or 5 games total all week.

[acoustic minnow]

🤔

There will always be the "moron factor" in Beacon games, but I kinda see where you are going. That's a point of view I have never seen debated to be honest

[warm crest]

How do u think tankers get to where they are. They manipulate that win %

Stat sheet is there for a reason. U have to look at every detail.

[acoustic minnow]

Yeah I saw people with MK2 hangars but 26% win rate and low Dmg average : they probably just switched back from a Cossack hangar a few games ago

[warm crest]

Isn't that hard to do.

People will always whine about MM. they can't stand to lose. But mm wants its average solo % at a certain point. Win some, lose more. It's the way it always worked. It hasn't been changed since it's inception

[acoustic minnow]

Yeah I know, people don't like losing but the two teams are both sides of the same coin. What people tend to complain about is unfair losses. You can lose a match and still say "damn I enjoyed it", when the beacon score is tight for example and you did your best. But losing crushed by a tanker in a Khepri does not feel the same

[warm crest]

Mm doesn't care if ur squadding or gettin easy wins. As soon as u go solo, mm puts u in a bracket to get its percentage. P2p and tankers screw its algorithms up. Either spend more to get back at those who beat u, or take the loss and grind on. Ull get those rare 1 or 2 games of just equality. But then it's back to the grind.

[zenith yew]

'The only factor to determine here is the matchmaking rating of players. No hangar level, no equipment/robots levels are taken into account.' - pix
I've always understood this to mean league score, not win rate, cos it's the league score that determines your league, and your league determines your competition.

[acoustic minnow]

Maybe that factor is determined by multiple parameters. This is a very cryptic term 🤔

[warm crest]

If u know how to manipulate MM so u lose more then ur league points drop.

[zenith yew]

It is, but the next sentence clearly declares that they're leaving out the most important element 😫

[acoustic minnow]

And matching people with high win% against people with low win% to revert the balance is not a dumb hypothesis, and why Tankers are so deadly

[warm crest]

It all goes back to MM and its percentage. League is just a bigger picture of potential avenues of MM

[zenith yew]

I don't understand how you reach that conclusion

[acoustic minnow]

It's time for a little experiment then

[warm crest]

Read the discussion @zenith yew like sentence for sentence

[warm crest]

Which is what

[zenith yew]

Hey dude, if you can't be polite, then I'll just ignore you

[acoustic minnow]

Registering all our games into a table function of win% and taking all necessary data from them. To see if win% has a seemingly real effect on MM, your team and the opposing one

[warm crest]

Play 50 games and take notes of every little instance. Tankers, league, win %, hangers, stats page.

[warm crest]

I'm actually serious. From what @acoustic minnow is talkin about and what I'm discussing. Read it all and re read it. Then run ur own experiment. @acoustic minnowdoesnt seem offended by this discussion at all

[acoustic minnow]

Yeah you may behave like a troll sometimes, bit this discussion actually makes sense for once. You seem to have other PoV on things, it is not always seen good by other people but now I see where you're going with that

[warm crest]

After those games are done, experiment with hangers to be in the middle of the pack at the end of the game

[zenith yew]

No one's offended by discussion; let's keep it that way

[warm crest]

Ull see how u can actually get around anything in MM. everything is a factor but MM win% is the key to it all @acoustic minnow

[zenith yew]

Some experienced folk do swear that win rate is a key factor

[warm crest]

I know it's the key factor.

[zenith yew]

So, what abt leagues, then?

[warm crest]

What about leagues?

[zenith yew]

🤨 They're the things that they use for MM

[acoustic minnow]

The league is just dependent on your overall performance I guess. If you deal only 1M damage per game you should not be in the same league as someone who does 4M for example

[warm crest]

Those are very easy to manipulate. If u know how to manipulate mm, then leagues are nothing.

Stick with MM and ull see what u can do to leagues @acoustic minnow

Damage output means nothing

[acoustic minnow]

That's what they are telling us, and now I'm beginning to see how they might be only the emerged part of the iceberg 🤔The notion of League/Rank is easier to grasp than a win% running through a selection algorithm

[zenith yew]

'Should' and reality do not match; it's league score acquired from success in games, that determines the score, and ultimately the MM

[warm crest]

Output is just an individual stat th t people like

[zenith yew]

like I say, that's why ppl tannk

[warm crest]

Wrong direction of thought. Go backwards @zenith yew on that sentence

[acoustic minnow]

So what tells me that I'm in Gold and not Expert 🤔 This is where things get foggy

[zenith yew]

the league score; that 4 figure number

....or five, for some champs

[warm crest]

It's the points u acquire when u look up ur league

League and the points number under it

That's easy to manipulate too

[acoustic minnow]

Is the win% determining your league or is there other factors in place ? The Trophy count just seems directly linked to that value because of MM and balance between win/loss 🤔

[zenith yew]

I don't think so

just league score

[acoustic minnow]

But that league score is itself heavily reliant on win/loss ratio, as a loss makes you lose much more than a win for the same place in the team

[warm crest]

Stig has it backwards

[zenith yew]

I think it'll all be factored in to the points/score you receive for each match

[warm crest]

@acoustic minnow do ur experiment and see what comes from it.

@zenith yew a lot of what ur post has u think in it. Run the experiment and do ur own data analysis. MM win% is the biggest determining factor

This debate can go forever with each of us going "I think this is such".

Grind the number and see

I'm still doing my analysis.

[zenith yew]

but that's impossible, cos that would mean that a champ with a 1% win rate would be matched with ....what...... a private, or bronze league?

[acoustic minnow]

If I win 1st place I may get like +10 Trophies ; if I lose 1st place I gain like 3 Trophies ; losing last place may make me lose 20 or 25 of them. So the League counter with Trophies relies on your own performance, but also which side is winning. If you get 1st place each game at some point you will grind up, but if like me you make the yo-yo in the team you are sure to make the yo-yo inside your league and stay into it. And according to what we said, the win/loss balance seems heavily influenced by the win%

[warm crest]

No. He would be paired up with the master league players who have a bigger win% but not the league points.

[zenith yew]

No doubt, it's part of how much score you get, but then it's that score that determines the MM

[zenith yew]

So, it's still the league that matters most

[warm crest]

Potentially

[acoustic minnow]

And we can assume that if the win% doesn't stop shrinking, then it will impact your League at some point because you lose too much, thus lose too much Trophies 🤔

[warm crest]

Then pix catches u for tanking

[acoustic minnow]

Because on their side they did everything to make the job easy I guess

[warm crest]

And u wont lose league points if it's too much in so little time

[zenith yew]

I can see what you're saying, that win rate determines matching within the league, but my point is that league score is the main/overall factor

[warm crest]

League score is not the overall factor. It's the win% of it all

[acoustic minnow]

In a sense yes, so you don't get within Bronze matches if you have MK2 stuff

[warm crest]

U can if u manipulate the system

[acoustic minnow]

And inside your league you get matched based on win% 🤔

[zenith yew]

My MAIN point is that they (intentionally) miss the most important factor- equipment, and levels

[zenith yew]

as I understand it

[acoustic minnow]

Sure, that's what many people have been saying for ages and Pixonic refuses to make it

[zenith yew]

OH yes you do, if you tank

[warm crest]

Ur not missing anything. That's the way it was before mm was implemented. Seal clubbing it was called

[zenith yew]

that was only cos they didn't properly implement it, again, maybe on purpose

[warm crest]

Lvl 1 gep with max lvl weaps on it. Made for horrendous matches for newbs

[acoustic minnow]

Oh yeah my brother crushing everything in a Thunder Schutze back in the days... Crushing absolutely everything for cheap

[warm crest]

People found the loophole and it got exploited badly

[zenith yew]

they just had to close the loopholes, is all

[warm crest]

And so MM was invented and running

[acoustic minnow]

The problem with loopholes is that you don't usually see them at first glance. And Pixonic fell in that

[warm crest]

And now people found the loopholes in that and exploited it as wel

[zenith yew]

yeah, but you know, updates, lol

[warm crest]

There is no clear way to fix the issue

[acoustic minnow]

Updates for more than skins and new OP stuff ? You're high man 😂 Oh and with bug fixes you know, don't have time to fix MM

[warm crest]

Play some games and talk at a later date to see what ur numbers come up with @acoustic minnow

[zenith yew]

Like everything, they know the levels and power of everything in the game; it's reeeally not rocket science

[zenith yew]

Yeah, well, we know what their priorities are, don't we?

[warm crest]

But the big picture is how much the company runnin the game wants to fix it.

[zenith yew]

indeed

[warm crest]

They make money and continue to do so ignore most of the smaller issues. No real problems with MM in their eye. It runs smoothly to them in their data.

[zenith yew]

the $$$$ data is what they're concentrating on

[warm crest]

Win% is still the base determining factor of all games

[zenith yew]

..... within the league system, sure

[warm crest]

I'm grinding

[zenith yew]

I really don't know if I can be bothered; I'm either the whale, or the whale meat; nothing in-between; easy win, or no chance to win 🤷‍♂️