#Completely Lost On Upgrading Mothman Precon

129 messages · Page 1 of 1 (latest)

raven void
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Let me start by saying I haven’t played Magic since 2004 and my eldest son brought me back, and I’m lost on this deck building/upgrading ok so I have 2 builds for my Mothman deck the first build is https://archidekt.com/decks/7390570/wingatron and playing it I really didn’t do much both times I tried to pull out Mothman I was shut down by Counterspell and Chupacabra, the second build is https://archidekt.com/decks/7460160/wingatron_5000 I really just don’t know what I’m doing with this guy it seemed like 1/1 Counters was the way to go but I sat there with my hands in my pocket all Friday Night, tomorrow is Commander night again and I’d really love to play this deck but don’t know what to do… I should note the people at my LGs are probably playing at higher power decks anywhere from 8-9 power levels

Archidekt
Wing-A-Tron • (Commander / EDH deck) • Archidekt

The Wise Mothman - Commander / EDH deck

(1) Commander • (7) Creature • (3) Drain • (7) Draw • (1) Evasion • (1) Finisher • (2) Instant • (36) Land • (10) Mill • (1) Proliferate • (1) Protection • (11) Ramp • (4) Recursion • (12) Removal • (1) Sorcery • (1) Stax • (1) Theft

Archidekt
Wing-A-Tron 5000 • (Commander / EDH deck) • Archidekt

The Wise Mothman - Commander / EDH deck

(1) Commander • (1) Counters • (11) Creature • (2) Drain • (4) Draw • (2) Enchantment • (5) Instant • (36) Land • (13) Mill • (4) Proliferate • (1) Protection • (9) Ramp • (6) Recursion • (4) Removal • (1) Sorcery

dull gate
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OK, so, between the two list the 5000 makes more sense to me. It's easier for me to read through and see how it would work.

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There are some cards you cut from it though like [[Delighted Halfling]] that I think help with some of the issues with counter spells.

wide cometBOT
dull gate
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Did you buy the cards individually or are you working from the deck?

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Is it OK if I take the two decklists and do a hybrid of the two?

dull gate
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So, you have parts of infinite mana combos, and at least one potential infinite mill combo, so I feel like you're not averse to combo wins.

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Also the Ballista inclusion

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Would you rather have infinite mill or infinite mana

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I think there are also a handful of cards you don't have that I would add that aren't expensive. I think the most is currently a dollar

raven void
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I bought the precon and trying to make upgrades to it

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I also have every card on both list

dull gate
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But, how do you want the deck to win?

raven void
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My initial thought was 1/1 counters full swing that’s what the wing-a-tron build was based on but I couldn’t even get it up and moving and get any counters started

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For the past year I’ve only really played precons main tokens go wide this is my first time trying to upgrade a precon instead of just buying more precons

dull gate
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OK

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Token go wide, mill, infinite mana and infinite turns are all available based on what you're shoping here

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Just tell me which you want to go with. Tokens/Turns probably combines together, but still

raven void
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Well I’m try to stay with the mothman theme with the rad counters, so I guess mill… I thought it was 1/1 but it might not be it, I just don’t know what else goes with the rad counters since it’s a new mechanic

solemn shale
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hi im here sorry

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So basically, if you're wanting to go with the +1/+1 counters, and you're playing Mothman, we want Proliferate cards

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and if we want proliferate cards, there's nothing quite like [[$Roalesk, Apex Hybrid]]

wide cometBOT
solemn shale
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i'll take a closer look at the lists themselves here later but for right now that's my #1 card i'd be putting in any mothman deck that maybe doesnt immediately come to mind

raven void
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Yeah I have all the cards in both list I ran around to 10 different LGs in my area getting them all last week that I didn't have

solemn shale
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oh, and one more is probably you should run [[$Staff of Compleation]] if it's not in the lists

wide cometBOT
solemn shale
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idk how expensive that card is though

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ah, $6

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[[Staff of Compleation]]

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solemn shale
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this card says tap pay 3 life proliferate on it

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if we're proliferating, [[Astral Cornucopia]] becomes really powerful, too

wide cometBOT
raven void
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I have 1 Roalesk from War of the Spark shockingly

solemn shale
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good! that card's really nice for mothman

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gives you another flyer you can throw +1/+1 counters on too

raven void
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I'll add these to the EDH one I just did for right now to the maybe list incase the other 2 list are to badly screwed, lol

solemn shale
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good plan!

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I also suggest using Moxfield to build decks over Archidekt, if you can

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Moxfield has a lot of tools that help with deckbuilding

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but that's not as important right away

raven void
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The way I read Mothman, and the way it was explained to me is 1/1 counter matter, mill is just the side effect...

solemn shale
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Mill is just the thing that makes your opponents easier to kill, mostly, yes, but you want to proliferate because it both increases the number of +1/+1 counters AND gives opponents more Rad Counters which gives you more +1/+1 counters and makes them lose more life.

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and you can Proliferate any number of targets when you Proliferate, so

raven void
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The decks I normally play is Galta Primal, Wilhelt, Teysa, Isshin, LotR Food, I have many more but these I default to so this is something new I'm trying to learn

solemn shale
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right

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So on the surface, this seems like a mill deck, but actually this is just a big stompy creature deck with extra steps

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which is great because it gives you a more consistent gameplan to work towards

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the win condition of Mothman is to hit your opponents for 21 commander damage with Mothman and kill them

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and everything else is just secondary to that

raven void
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So It's the same as my Galta deck swing big with commander

solemn shale
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yeah, sorta!

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The difference is you have very good reach with the deck because of the incidental lifeloss from Rad Counters

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and if you want you can even include Infect to threaten lethal with Proliferating

raven void
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but works like my sons Ezuri's deck if I'm catching you right

solemn shale
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Yeah, you want to put a bunch of +1/+1 counters on things and the best ways to do that are Hardened Scales, The Ozolith, and Proliferating

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so you can go wide with flyers to kill, or just kill someone with your commander outright

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oh, right, this one's not in the decklist i saw elsewhere but

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[[The Ozolith]]

wide cometBOT
solemn shale
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not that one

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although that one is really good too

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helps you retain the size of your Mothman between people killing it

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[[The Ozolith, Shattered Spire]]

raven void
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Still keep my Great Hedge in there?

wide cometBOT
solemn shale
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The Great Henge is nice, yeah

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Ozolith the Shattered Spire + The Ozolith are really, REALLY good cards for Mothman

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and if it's not in the deck? [[Thrummingbird]]

wide cometBOT
solemn shale
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card rules

raven void
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Thrummingbird is there it was in the EDHRec

solemn shale
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yeah i figured it would be

raven void
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It's one of the 7 Proliferate cards

solemn shale
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definitely include Staff of Compleation though if you can get it

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that card makes Mothman REALLY hard to deal with

raven void
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Ok I'll have to send my LGs owner a message on discord in the am a to see if he has one for commander night tomorrow

solemn shale
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alright 🙂

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I'd just cut a few things that don't fit the actual gameplan, include the cards we talked about, and run it for commander night and see how it goes

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Mothman's also really popular so pretty much anyone can help you build it because most people have already built it or played against it

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so definitely talk to people at commander night for suggestions too

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anyway, im gonna nap a bit, i'll check things out more thoroughly when im awake

raven void
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I've tried to talk to people there, not many people willing to help people out sadly

solemn shale
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😦

raven void
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ok have a good one thanks for the help!

solemn shale
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np! 😄

solemn shale
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alright getting back to this while stumped on my own thing

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  • This deck really doesn't care for mana dorks as much as ramp spells, so I'd probably drop Birds of Paradise for like, Astral Cornucopia.
  • (I would swap Rampant Growth for Kodama's Reach every time)
  • I'd probably drop Marcus for Roalesk.
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  • I also don't think Bruvac is particularly good here, mostly because he will burn all of your rad counters for everyone and make it impossible to proliferate them.
raven void
solemn shale
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moxfield has better tools for looking at your mana curve, pip density, and a WAY better playtest mode

raven void
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I can sure pip and curve on archidekt, playtest mode that I can't determine

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You can mouse over the rings and they will tell you how many pips and how many producers

image.png
solemn shale
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anyway looking at the deck

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you've actually got a slot!

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"99 main deck" does include the commander so

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honestly this deck looks really nice

raven void
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I have 2 because I didn't move cultivate out yet

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Moved out Tinybones, because I can't find my copy, and if I'm playing this tonight only want cards I have in it

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I have a BUG [[Sidisi]], not sure if she works, and I saw in one list [[Scavenging Ooze]]

wide cometBOT
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Multiple cards match “Sidisi”, can you be more specific?

raven void
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[[sidisi, brood tyrant]]

wide cometBOT
raven void
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I also have [[Crucible of Worlds]] and [[Conduit of Worlds]] I could add...

wide cometBOT
solemn shale
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those are pretty solid cards for this, yeah

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mostly Conduit more than Crucible

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because it gives you the advantage in a topdeck situation

solemn shale
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Scavenging Ooze is probably a good card here though

raven void
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oops I read it wrong I thought I was to pull it for Kodama, sorry just woke up, lol getting ready to switch my schedule from working 6a-6p to 6p-6a in 2 days

solemn shale
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lmao totally fine

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you want both they're the same card

raven void
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Ok what about [[Duskshell Crawler]] or [[Arwen, Weaver of Hope]] for that last open slot?

wide cometBOT
solemn shale
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Either is fine!

raven void
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I'm not firm on [[Nuka-Nuke Launcher]] being in there, I know EDHRec says it should be

image.png
wide cometBOT
solemn shale
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It probably should be, the card's pretty solid, Intimidate is a good keyword and also if you target the player that goes before you it basically prevents them from playing at instant speed

dull gate
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Just combining the ones you had. But I was getting stuck on cuts.

raven void
dull gate
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I don't have my glasses on and read there as here

raven void
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So, I played my new build tonight... and mana screwed was the name of the game... so I probably just need some more shuffles and plays