Would be nice if anyone could look over my decklist and give me some recommendations for changes. :) (Have mercy on me I'm new and it's my first deck haha) https://archidekt.com/decks/6323600/henzie_precon_edited
#Henzie deckbuilding help
magic forge
fading plover
one card that imediately comes to mind is [[the master multiplied]]
fair pineBOT
fading plover
means the henzie trigger to make you sacrifice the reanimated creature triggers but you dont have to sac it and the effect only happens once so theyre just permanently out
possibly also [[kokusho]]
fading plover
honestly here's my slimefoot and squee list that has a VERY similar gameplan. take a loot at it since its the same colours and everything you might find some great options https://www.moxfield.com/decks/DRGQTl-b_kS77OowXTBRVQ
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/who/146/the-master-multiplied
oohh i like that one ill look into it
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/ima/95/kokusho-the-evening-star
i love that one ill add it 100%
magic forge
honestly here's my slimefoot and squee list that has a VERY similar gameplan. ta...
ill look it up after this game rn
playtesting my deck a bit
and I feel like I should dump a few reanimator cards and take more carddraw
fading plover
Another include if you reduce your basic land count is [[hermit Druid]] to get some of those big creature cards into the graveyard for free or even [[palantir of orthanc]]
fair pineBOT
Creature — Human Druid
, 
: Reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal a basic land card. Put that card into your hand and all other cards revealed this way into your graveyard.
Seeking the company of plants ensures that your wits will go to seed.
1/1
magic forge
I'm not a fan of the self mill stuff
henzie doesnt reanimate he just gives them haste and them saccs them and i have so much reanimator in there rn that i am having the problem
that i get so much stuff to reanimate without even using henzie himself
i think ill change the deck a bit to focus more on sac stuff
Henzie deckbuilding help
fading plover
i get that. palantir isnt just self mill its also a free scry 2 and a potential free card draw if someone doesnt want to take the chance of getting 4 high cmc cards as damage
fading plover
so the deck is themed around self milling / discarding high cmc creatures with etb and or death triggers into my graveyards then bringing them back for cheap using slime and squee.
you have a few sac outlets or you throw slime in front of something as a blocker then you pay the cost and reanimate him along with another creature
ive only played it on tabletop sim so far and its kinda nutty in some situations
i originally built is as a simple reanimator deck themed around saprolings to get maximum value
but shifted to just huge guys
fading plover
the shotgun is the huge dudes
magic forge
Also I think ill take a lot of reanimator out and put ramp and sac triggers in there
magic forge
the shotgun is the huge dudes
fair
fading plover
cause he just busts outta the graveyard with a big heckin dragon or some other abomination
ramp in a deck like yours would def be a good option i think since youre still paying full cost for the cards effectively
slimefoot tries to cheat them out for a cheap as possible
magic forge
rn I feel like ramp is pretty decent but I could add maybe 2 or 3 more
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/who/146/the-master-multiplied
btw does this also prevent the saccing when it says "Sacrifice this creature at the beginning of the next end step"
im not sure if thats a trigger
fading plover
[[ignoble heirarch]] is a solid jund mana dork
fair pineBOT
Creature — Goblin Shaman
Exalted (Whenever a creature you control attacks alone, that creature gets +1/+1 until end of turn.)
: Add 
, 
, or .
He protects the fetid bog from light, life, and the hideous sound of laughter.
0/1
magic forge
[[ignoble heirarch]] is a solid jund mana dork
oh thats actually perfect for the deck cuz early ill always attack alone
fading plover
plus mana fixing is just super handy
magic forge
ye
altough I must say that manafixing is actually not a huge deal even with me just using precon lands + a few budget lands
fading plover
another include is [[ziatora]] since you have to sac the creatures anyway you can choose to sac a blitzed creature before the henzie trigger and fling them
fair pineBOT
fading plover
[[ziatora, the incinerator]]
magic forge
oh thats funny i like that
fading plover
yeah and you still get the blitz effect of it dying and you draw a card its literally just free value
fading plover
lol if youre doing online testing just have a play around with my slimefoot list
magic forge
Ill do that
Thanks for all the tips!
Actually one problem I might have that I just noticed is that im playing on a budget and the slimefoot list.. not only the mana prices are beeg
fading plover
yeah thats the problem with slime the deck list is NOT cheap in any way haha. you can still take a lot of notes from slime and apply them to henzie
like ziatora is only a couple bucks
magic forge
yeah thats the problem with slime the deck list is NOT cheap in any way haha. yo...
ye thats true ofc
magic forge
like ziatora is only a couple bucks
ye i added that one to the list already
i like it
also I just realised something
all my decks before this were either blue or had insane draw enginges in the commander so I never was missing cards..
this is what it feels like when you have to play normally ig haha
fading plover
if you need more card draw you generally add stuff like [[rishkar's expertise]] or possibly even greater good since you have to sac the creature anyway
fair pineBOT
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/lcc/254/rishkars-expertise
oh thats nice
fading plover
i know youre playing budget frienly but also [[ashnod's altar]] would be a great include
fair pineBOT
Artifact
Sacrifice a creature: Add 
.
"If you work at sawing up carcasses, you notice how the joints fit, how the nerves are arrayed, and how the skin peels back." —Ashnod, to Tawnos
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/368/ashnods-altar
I thought about that one but Im not sure what i want to use it for
fading plover
if youve you have cast henzie from the command zone twice and you had that on the field you could blitz solemn simulacrum out effectifvely for free. play it, sac it to ashnod's for 2 its cost is reduced to 2 and you just draw cards and flood the board with basic lands
fading plover
I thought about that one but Im not sure what i want to use it for
for extra value post combat main phase since you have to sac the blitzed creature anyway you can have some free extra mana
magic forge
for extra value post combat main phase since you have to sac the blitzed creatur...
I just dont know what I would do with those 2 mana/how often that would come in useful but i think ill try and see how it works out
Thanks for all the tips btw!
fading plover
It’s also just another thing on the board you can sac to if someone wants to exile a creature on your board as well even if you don’t use the mana
magic forge
It’s also just another thing on the board you can sac to if someone wants to exi...
Oh thats true
fading plover
No problem haha I’m still pretty new as well it just so happens I’ve built a very similar deck
magic forge
If you ever need help making a budget shorikai deck that wins by beeing passive and blocking everything for 10 turns and then wins in one turn by playing its entire deck you can hit me up and I can help haha
fading plover
haha that sounds hilarious. im actually in the middle of messing aroudn with a mono blue kraken deck with card draw as its main theme
uses watcher in the water as it's commander
[[watcher in the water]]
magic forge
haha that sounds hilarious. im actually in the middle of messing aroudn with a m...
its not, it sounds funny till you play it
fading plover
sounds lthe solution is playing removal hehe
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/75/the-watcher-in-the-water
ok thats funny
magic forge
sounds lthe solution is playing removal hehe
not really
you basically play a bunch of hard to remove vehicles and mana dorks n rocks
you will use a bunch of protection (all permanents get flying, hexproof) type stuff
fading plover
i see so you essentially need a player at the table with artifact removal specifically
magic forge
youll get a bunch of tokens and mana even in opponents turns so you start playing counterspells and boardwhipes like nothing else
until you draw into a combo piece which makes you draw and play your entire deck an infinite amount of times so you have infinite 1/1 tokens and your entire deck on the field
its funny
once
magic forge
i see so you essentially need a player at the table with artifact removal specif...
doesnt really matter cuz theyll get protection fairly quickly
basically kill the player before his 10th turn or so and hell do nothing but if you let him get to that point hell do a 40 minute turn and win
i stopped playing that deck cuz it gets boring quick and everyone else i play with hated it too lmao
suprisingly strong tho considering its just a precon with like 30 upgraded cards that total like 25 bucks
fading plover
my favourite deck i have so far is my kibo deck. its always just fun to crap out bananas for everyone to get value with but my board gets bigger and bigger every time you use them
fading plover
[[kibo, uktabi prince]]
fair pineBOT
Legendary Creature — Monkey Noble
: Each player creates a colorless artifact token named Banana with ", Sacrifice this artifact: Add or . You gain 2 life."
Whenever an artifact an opponent controls is put into a graveyard from the battlefield, put a +1/+1 counter on each creature you control that's an Ape or a Monkey.
Whenever Kibo attacks, defending player sacrifices an artifact.
2/2
fading plover
its a gruul monkey/ape kindred deck with a lot of artifact removal
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/j22/40/kibo-uktabi-prince
that is objectively funny
fading plover
it's so funny i always have a good time with it although i do need to add some more card draw in general
any combination of red green or black is just so much fun to me
magic forge
btw is there a website where I can look for cards with specifically combat triggers?
fading plover
probably scryfall
magic forge
any combination of red green or black is just so much fun to me
ye i feel that, I like black cuz most of the things it does are pretty simple but effective
the opposite of blue
fading plover
its probably why i like my watcher deck so much because its basically a green deck at its heart in the sense its mostly big creatures that give value
@magic forge https://scryfall.com/search?q=oracletag%3Aattack-trigger here you go attack triggers search on scryfall
magic forge
<@398163190149545984> https://scryfall.com/search?q=oracletag%3Aattack-trigger h...
Oh thanks thats perfect!
can I also make it only show cards with 4 mana cost and above that are in jund?
fading plover
if im trying to look something up on scryfall i just google scryfall and the general thing im after 9/10 times itll just spit out what i need. i believe you can change it to that yeah
magic forge
didnt work for me somehow
then ill just search through the attack triggers
still better than nothing
thanks!
fading plover
thats in slime its a super good include
fading plover
yeah and then you can flip it back over later too
you've only got 362 cards to go through hehe
fading plover
theres another card of a guy with a similar name from the same set im pretty sure too and he bascially just is wound reflection as a creature
magic forge
just made a friend exile his entire hand with elder brain
i can now play cards from his exile
fading plover
hehe
magic forge
hehe
also you were right ashnods is a good idea
I can force sac triggers that way
I just missed out on a free 6 mana creature from my deck cuz my creature got exiled
magic forge
I just played a game that took about 2 and a half hours i think
but I won
henzie ftw
fading plover
lol
fading plover
thats the way to play fren
fading plover
yeah thats a big cut to make
magic forge
I need to cut 3 rn but idk which to cut
I already cut a lot of dragons which hurts
but I dont wanna cut drakuseth
fading plover
i would say cut land but youre already at 34 which is a bit rough
fading plover
i still had it open from earlier haha
magic forge
I will go to sleep now ive been working on this for the entire day instead of studying for finals
magic forge
i still had it open from earlier haha
Oh the changes adapt? thats sick
fading plover
yeah
magic forge
I already deleted a good stuff creature I really liked beeing artizan of kosilek
but that dude is kind of just win harder so it doesnt matter too much
Just turned off my pc so note to myself for tomorrow: i really don't need viscera seer lol, scry 1 is terrible and i already have decent sac
fading plover
5 cards left to cut 
fading plover
I feel like I have too much ramp
you want ramp so you can blitz as much as possible
magic forge
you want ramp so you can blitz as much as possible
I had the problem where I had like 12 mana on turn 5 and nothing to use it for a couple games in a row
I cut 3 ramp cards and now it feels a bit better
magic forge
5 cards left to cut <:ultrakek:857188923179532308>
oh ye I added some more stuff in and gotta remove older stuff again
fading plover
I had the problem where I had like 12 mana on turn 5 and nothing to use it for a...
this is one of the reasons i suggested self mill cards so you can fill your grveyard
magic forge
this is one of the reasons i suggested self mill cards so you can fill your grve...
I dont really need to fill my graveyard early tho
I mean that It'd be smarter to just play big creatures that get sacced at the end of turn for some reward and I then reanimate those later with the few recursion spells i have
magic forge
actually
now that i think about it
a few self mill might be usefull
not a lot
but maybe like
3
or so
so i can start reanimating earlier
proper forge
I would personally lose all the mana rocks that aren't named Sol Ring, because you're able to use more stable land ramp with your green access. I also don't like Cloud Key at all here really.
I'm gonna study the deck a little to get better impressions
magic forge
I thought I need those for mana fixing cuz of the budget landbase I play
proper forge
That's fair enough
magic forge
but honestly im not sure anymore
most of the time im able to get henzie turn 3
without the rocks
snow merlin
Ok let's talk ramp.
I don't think your problem is so much how much ramp, but more how pure the ramp is and how it's leaving you with an open boardstate
My temptation would be to swap a lot of it out for cards like [[pitiless plunderer]] [[professional face breaker]] [[gala greaters]] [[greedy freebooter]] [[mahadi]] [[enterprising scallywag]]
The kind of things that can show up and block, as well as get the big hitters out early
fair pineBOT
Creature — Human Pirate
Whenever another creature you control dies, create a Treasure token. (It's an artifact with ", Sacrifice this artifact: Add one mana of any color.")
"Shame to let good gold go to the grave."
1/4
Creature — Human Pirate
When Greedy Freebooter dies, scry 1 and create a Treasure token. (To scry 1, look at the top card of your library. You may put that card on the bottom. A Treasure token is an artifact with ", Sacrifice this artifact: Add one mana of any color.")
Neither Nurgam nor the mycoid who laid the trap could quite believe their luck.
1/1
Legendary Creature — Devil
At the beginning of your end step, create a Treasure token for each creature that died this turn. (It's an artifact with ", Sacrifice this artifact: Add one mana of any color.")
"Welcome to the Wandering Emporium. Feel free to browse the bazaar. We have everything a lost soul could want, need, or afford."
3/3
magic forge
opinions on cloud key btw?
proper forge
I think it's a very rarely good card, and this is not its home
snow merlin
You want it in decks that are expecting to play a lot of cards in a turn where the discount will add up
proper forge
The standard for cost reducers is that you need to be using them on average more than once every cycle
snow merlin
Also why aren't you running [[riveteers ascendancy]]? You've got the mana base for it, and are expecting to be saccing a big thing a turn at least
fair pineBOT
magic forge
You want it in decks that are expecting to play a lot of cards in a turn where t...
Ok yeah that's what I thought too I just saw this card in deck techs a lot
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/snc/216/riveteers-ascendancy
I am
I have it in recursion
my sorting is a bit weird
snow merlin
Ahhh I'm with you, that makes sense
snow merlin
Ok yeah that's what I thought too I just saw this card in deck techs a lot
It's one of those cards that is "generically good" and a lot of low effort deck techs throw in all the time because it's fairly generic and makes a lot of combos easier to pull off/infinite, so it's easy to fill some time justifying it's inclusion
magic forge
Im dropping gruul and golgari signet fr enterprising scallywag and emporium master, a bit scary for colour fixing but itll be fine
magic forge
It's one of those cards that is "generically good" and a lot of low effort deck ...
I just felt like I need to cast 3 creatures for this to repay itself and those creatrures need to be mostly in the same turn to actually be worth it so ehh
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/lci/109/greedy-freebooter
is there a way to consistantly kill that dude turn one or two? i like the effect a lot but i feel like itd be hard to get that token cuz noone would block that
proper forge
If all you want is a treasure, that card is not the one to play
magic forge
also opinion on cauldron of souls?
magic forge
If all you want is a treasure, that card is not the one to play
fair
magic forge
also opinion on cauldron of souls?
I also saw this recommended a lot but
idk
it seems pretty good but im not sure
snow merlin
If all you want is a treasure, that card is not the one to play
This tbh, think of it as an early blocker and mana fixing/curve smoothing than strictly ramp
proper forge
Cauldron is a cool card, your deck can get a ton of leverage from Persist because of the high value creatures you recur.
It also helps solve one of the deck's bigger problems, in that blitzing creatures doesn't contribute to a stable board state. Getting a quick reanimation with this feels good.
snow merlin
Yeah I think this is a deck that can really use cauldron.
I struggle with it in general, cos it's worse case is pretty bad....but in your list if it only reanimates one thing before eating removal, its done its job
magic forge
yeah that was my thought too
i force people to use removals early on
also it repeats ETBs while also keeping sac triggers
proper forge
also it repeats ETBs while also keeping sac triggers
Just to clarify here - I'm not sure if you have an understanding error. A creature card that enters again is a new object, so the new creature will not have the "when this dies, draw a card" from having been blitzed
magic forge
Just to clarify here - I'm not sure if you have an understanding error. A creatu...
oh yeah but when it dies you get that
so it dies, draws a card and then returns
proper forge
👍
magic forge
Also do you think I should maybe dump some recursion or a tiny bit more ramp for more draw
proper forge
I don't know, but it's a living decklist. You can just...try it one way, and if you don't like it, change it again. You should not be shy about experimenting.
magic forge
thats fair
most anoying part about this deck is how every card has like 2-3 purposes making them hard to sort
proper forge
Yeah I don't do those sort methods, it makes me ill to look at it. I couldn't study the decklist because of it lol
magic forge
oh you can change it on the top right
where it says category
change to type
i switch around
I just always wanna know how much ramp and stuff I have
snow merlin
Everything you blitz replaces itself, which means you have a lot more draw than it appears.
I think you're fine for draw, but If you keep finding yourself with an empty hand, maybe [[brass' tunnel]] or [[samut, vizier]] are solid budget draw engines for this kind of list.
Tbh at this point, I'd say play the deck and change it based on common scenarios you find yourself in and what cards you wish you could draw in those scenarios
fair pineBOT
Legendary Artifact
When Brass's Tunnel-Grinder enters the battlefield, discard any number of cards, then draw that many cards plus one.
At the beginning of your end step, if you descended this turn, put a bore counter on Brass's Tunnel-Grinder. Then if there are three or more bore counters on it, remove those counters and transform it. (You descended if a permanent card was put into your graveyard from anywhere.)
Tecutlan, the Searing Rift
Legendary Land — Cave
(Transforms from Brass's Tunnel-Grinder.)
: Add .
Whenever you cast a permanent spell using mana produced by Tecutlan, the Searing Rift, discover X, where X is that spell's mana value.
magic forge
Everything you blitz replaces itself, which means you have a lot more draw than ...
Ive basically been playtesting the deck today for about 8 hours and constantly made changes n stuff, samut was one of the cards I dropped but tunnel grinder seems cool
snow merlin
Worth noting, tunnel grinder's discover is based on the mana value of the permanent, not the mana you paid for it. So your blitz discounts don't reduce the amount you discover for
magic forge
Worth noting, tunnel grinder's discover is based on the mana value of the perman...
wdym
magic forge
@fading plover btw which self mill cards would you add to the deck?
id be down for maybe 1 or two
if they give me some additional benefits
fading plover
both of the one's i suggest aren't exactly budget but they are good options. [[hermit druid]] and palantir of orthanc]]
fair pineBOT
Creature — Human Druid
, : Reveal cards from the top of your library until you reveal a basic land card. Put that card into your hand and all other cards revealed this way into your graveyard.
Seeking the company of plants ensures that your wits will go to seed.
1/1
fading plover
[[palantir of orthanc]]
fair pineBOT
magic forge
https://scryfall.com/card/tpr/175/hermit-druid
I feel like this one is a bit too much mill but palantir seems pretty damn cool
ok the price hurts but Ill definitely consider that for upgrades (or if it gets reprinted)
fading plover
its from the lotr set so its already ha da reprint haha
its like $5 cheaper than it was
magic forge
oh damn
a friend of mine went to the prerelease today
drew a blood crypt (black red shockland) and I was like oohhh reprints how much is it now
he: down to 20 bucks
man thats 1 single land
fading plover
land base is always something i struggle with
but its worth investing in for long term decks
magic forge
Quick question is this the official Mtg commander discord as in Wotc sponsored? Cuz I was on a mtg discord like a year ago that was official by wotc and we werent allowed to talk about prices (which is what made me stop wanting to play the game for a bit)
fading plover
this is the official commander discord run by the commander rules committee. So it's not officially Wotc
fading plover
theyre the group that are in charge of bans and managing the health of the platform iirc
it was originally headed by sheldon one of the co founders of the format and currated a group of people who he trusted to balance the format
magic forge
Wait so isn't that official wotc lmao
fading plover
no sheldon was not an official "employee" in the sense
magic forge
but isnt commander an official format
fading plover
it's officially recognised and supported but the people who are in charge of it are the rules committee
iirc sheldon was on an episode of tolarian community college with the professor and said they arent official employees per say but are compensated in ways
magic forge
Oh i see ok thats cool
fading plover
i thought it was supposed to be budget haha
tawdry parrot
I feel like you need to pick a color to go to 3 pips for unless you're going to be cheating everything into play
Living End wouldn't kill any tokens if you have Master Multiplied out right?
magic forge
i thought it was supposed to be budget haha<:ultrakek:857188923179532308>
I got the precon for like 25 bucks so I got like half the deck covered + for some reasons the prices on untap are inaccurate af
most of those cards that it says are like 5-20 on there are like 50 cents when i look em up
magic forge
I feel like you need to pick a color to go to 3 pips for unless you're going to ...
ill start paying mana costs honestly and once my graveyard is a bit full the swindling starts
whats master multiplied btw?
also I just switched out drakuseth for inferno titan so all my 3 pips are actually green now i think
magic forge
just calculated the price.. the deck would be 86 bucks but shipping would be 61 💀
luckily I have like half of the cards from the precon lol
saving a lot on shipping
fading plover
That makes more sense haha
severe blade
Here is my decklist
Its pretty strong, feel free to look through
There is an infinite combo with [[protean hulk]] , i can explain if you want
fair pineBOT
fading plover
theres a big combo possible if you have a sace outlet and [[su-chi]] you just have to stay on top of your library since you draw a card every time a blitzed creature dies
fair pineBOT
Artifact Creature — Construct
When Su-Chi dies, add .
Flawed copies of relics from the Thran Empire, the su-chi were inherently unstable but provided useful knowledge for Tocasia's students.
4/4
fading plover
that being said su chi is on the reserve list and is stupidly expensive
severe blade
Protean hulk just straight up wins you the game
You blitz in protean hulk and you win on your endstep
You look for [[Junji, the]] and [[viscera seer]]
severe blade
You sac protean hulk, sac junji bring back hulk
sac hulk, look for [[phyrexian delver]]
fair pineBOT
fair pineBOT
severe blade
[[mikaeus, the unh]]
severe blade
sac delver, it comes back due to the undying, bring back junji, sac junji to bring back hulk
sac hulk to get a [[gray merchant of]]
fair pineBOT
Creature — Zombie
When Gray Merchant of Asphodel enters the battlefield, each opponent loses X life, where X is your devotion to black. You gain life equal to the life lost this way. (Each in the mana costs of permanents you control counts toward your devotion to black.)
2/4