Is this a design space you want to see more or, or less?
#(8-29-23) How do you feel about outside-the-game cards (Dungeons, Attractions, Stickers, The Ring)?
hushed nymph
celest forge
I don't like them, because they feel like you need the tokens for them to not be confusing
Like, if you have the tokens, practically speaking they're fine
But I don't like them from a design perspective because of that
Like, if you run initiative in an EDH deck, you should probably have 5 initiative tokens ready to go if you want to be good mannered about it
acoustic scroll
Dungeons and attractions make more sense than the rest of them, for me, at least. I dislike stickers bases solely on my distaste for putting stickers kn cards
The ring is....interesting. I ound it a little hard to keep track of but it is ultimately rather fun.
celest forge
I wish tempt had been like,
- Legendary, Menace
- Curiosity
- Deathtouch
- Each opponent loses 3 on hit
It'd just be so much easier to explain and write out
But all it's abilities are really fiddly, so you basically need a token to make sure you don't forget anything
wintry drift
I don’t like them on a base level, but the ring is cool mechanically
foggy spear
Initiative and monarch are cool
acoustic scroll
I really just don't want to have to bring more Stuff to a game.
celest forge
Monarch is simple enough that I'm cool with it
gusty cove
I like monarch because it's easier to track
wintry drift
Personally I wouldn’t put monarch in this class of mechanics
celest forge
I would. It may be simple, but it's still something brought into a game by cards that is not defined by those cards.
empty badge
With the exception of Tempt, I actually quite like all of these. They show up rarely and the social expectation that the person who introduces the mechanic brings everything to make it clear works.
Monarch and Initiative both work to encourage casual players to attack, and dungeons/stickers/attractions are all something the player does to themselves.
Tempt is the exception cos I still dislike that being tempted by the one ring is strictly positive
celest forge
Mmm, I'd also like it it had an inherent lose 1 or 2 life when you tempt, but also had 5+: draw a card.
foggy spear
Role tokens are probably one of my least favorite cases of this yet - it requires you know what the tokens are with little to no reminder text many times
Especially with the precon commanders not having any reminder text
celest forge
Yeah, tho at least the precon will have the tokens
patent cedar
I don't mind it in theory, but I much prefer simple ones to the more recent complicated ones
keen island
In theory - cool mechanics. In practice - impractical, clunky and not well executed. With the exception of dungeons, I feel like all of them were the opposite of ATBGE. Great taste, but awful execution.
terse urchin
Love them in theory. Will use them. Hate that there's no way to interact with them once they're moving
ivory wolf
I like those kinds of mechanics as long as they don’t involve an extra deck.
terse urchin
I find attractions the least offensive probably cuz artifact removal can whack them
ivory wolf
I’m still not a fan.
ancient vector
I think outside the game mechanics are fine, and honestly I like dungeons. I would love to see more. initiative feels like monarch, so it encourages players to attack and speeds the game up.
weary sable
I don't mind it in theory, but I much prefer simple ones to the more recent comp...
This is where I’m at too. Monarch and OG dungeon mechanics are great, but the more the opponents need to actively track the thing the more annoying it is
I want to use the undercity but including initiative cards is such a headache
ivory wolf
Day/night is entirely up to the person who introduced it to that game to track.
If they miss it, it’s their fault.
foggy spear
Day/night is entirely up to the person who introduced it to that game to track.
While that can be true in commander, in 60 card you have to track it lest you get a failure to maintain boardstate warning/punishments
obtuse anchor
I don't like these - too much complexity added, the initiative in particular is obnoxious due to being everywhere and basically requiring a solid knowledge of the way that dungeon works as well as requiring everyone to have the rules card for it to track it
foggy spear
I think outside the game mechanics are fine, and honestly I like dungeons. I wou...
Monarch-esque mechanics are typically fine but all these other ones are annoying to deal with
ivory wolf
While that can be true in commander, in 60 card you *have* to track it lest you ...
Then it’s still up to the day/night player. It’s only their board state that would change.
foggy spear
Then it’s still up to the day/night player. It’s only their board state that wou...
Doesn’t matter
Not in 60 card
Failure to maintain proper boardstate applies to both players at all times regardless of who owns or controls the card
Except in the cases of optional actions
unkempt plinth
On the one hand, as someone with ADHD, I appreciate the sub-game aspect in non-cEDH games because it helps keep me focused. I'm not always as excited about other people playing them.
Just because of missed triggers, etc.
foggy spear
But assuming every trigger is required you’ll both get punished for your opponent missing a trigger
ivory wolf
But assuming every trigger is required you’ll both get punished for your opponen...
bruh
foggy spear
On the one hand, as someone with ADHD, I appreciate the sub-game aspect in non-c...
It is pretty fun to have some stuff like that but with stuff you have to track outside of simple mechanics like monarch they just become a chore
unkempt plinth
They can. As I said though it helps keep me focused by giving my brain something to keep track of.
Like a busy-work coloring book.
foggy spear
Haha that’s true
I just stay focused by absolutely annihilating the hell out of my cards by flicking them lol
unkempt plinth
cEDH or high-interaction games I don't do well with them added in because it splits my attention too much.
foggy spear
My autism requires I stim to play magic
unkempt plinth
My husband hums/sings or "musically" taps.
foggy spear
Oh god I annoy the shit out of my partner doing that too 😂 I’m sorry on behalf of him, we can’t help it
I was in bands for about 70% of my life so I’m constantly doing something related to music
exotic sail
I think there's a good amount of potential to these off brand mechanics but they are so unlikely to ever get new supports outside of their original set. So it feels underwhelming when you want to go really hard on say, Time Travel or Tempt when you have one set to work with and builds might feel very samey.