New randomizer idea (Anti-mech&opener)

[fierce berry]

My start point is how to force mech/opener loop break, while normal stack won't be too hard to maintain.

Here's my brainstorm:
Insert some duplicating pieces between bags.

More detailed:
Add an indicator at the top (or somewhere), to show when&what dup pieces will come.
e.g. 4xO in coming: 4bags

So as i thought, mech or opener can no longer last, but normal player can get ready for it, won't be a big deal?

Obviously that's all my imagination, I have nowhere to test. How do you think about this?

[mossy pendant]

in which scope

[fierce berry]

any? how will it affect ur opinion

[flat ermine]

In my opinion altering the randomizer with loop detection is unintuitive, as it's hard to justify initially allowing something associated with a core gameplay design, yet take it away mid-game if being used. This also causes either confusion when less indication is present or obtrusion with clear indication, since a twist like this is unexpected when 7-bag implicitly allows loops

Players know about 7-bag but do not know that loops are discouraged; if loops are superior and need to be less effective, this should be done using clear and consistent gameplay mechanics that the player is meant to either expect with prior experience, or grasp with intuition.

(i.e. players should be able to understand the game by playing; adding hidden mechanics that go against established foundations interferes with the player's expectations and intuition of how to play)

[mossy pendant]

tl it just wont be viable i think, e.g. for what had0j said

qp2 thats. cancel sickness.

the only other scope is.. solo??? or custom rooms??

[dense arrow]

Bluntly, How to beat opener loops/mechs: skill issue them

[fierce berry]

well for me personally i never get annoyed by loop/mech, but some ppl are (and they hate so much)

[fierce berry]

you are right, thats what i do
i think "being too predictable" is a major disadvantage in higher level versus, e.g. i can 6-7 phonk just because i know how to counter sd extended

but, you know, few ppl knows how to use those extra information, especially lower ranks/newer players

i kept hearing the discussion about how to nerf mech?
so here i just treat this question as a pure question

to ppl's surprise, 7+x cannot do this job
what can break loop/mech immediately? maybe dup pieces is an answer
surely there are more common answers like totally random but they also affect too much to normal gameplay
so i come up the idea with an indicator included
yet, i dont really know how normal gameplay can react with this tho, maybe this thing is the most interesting for me

[flat ermine]

In my opinion, changing gameplay solely to nerf memorised setups isn't enough; this should be done from the perspective of game design, which involves doing so in an intuitive and reasonable way. Establishing 7-bag with an allowance of loops only to then prohibit them with hidden mechanics when they are used creates a contradiction within a fundamental gameplay aspect.

[young orbit]

add a random pentramino after bag 2

[flat ermine]

this would very likely confuse new players

[young orbit]

i was thinking just for qp, i think in tl its a core part of the game and shouldn’t be touched