competitive_discussion

[bold geode]

Yeah I'm just saying there's no way a sober man made that up

[sudden remnant]

hit its partner????

[lost sun]

was it invented a few minutes ago by u

[versed river]

lightning rod also redirects i guess

[shadow wind]

No on my life it’s a thing

[versed river]

its special coverage is so ass

[sudden remnant]

no ep is a little unfortunate

[versed river]

it gets fairy and rock thats it

[sudden remnant]

rock is good for charizard meta

[shadow wind]

Maybe but that doesn’t make it not true

[hollow latch]

Hi guys. Saw some Champions stuff and what mon they leaked. I want to build rain Team with arch,pellippet, the mudkip mega or maybe dragonite and gets some feedbacks or ideas for missing teammemebrs

[versed river]

true
raging bolt is also good for charizard since it has priority super effective and gets boosted by the sun

[lost sun]

I don't think swampert is itg

[hollow latch]

Ye Rille kills it

[versed river]

why are we dropping unspoilered leaks now 😭

[shadow wind]

Mega Swampert in a dynamic speed game could be interesting

[versed river]

gglide ohko

[lost sun]

rilla isn't in anyway

currently

[sudden remnant]

i dont care tho cuz im not using raging bolt

[hollow latch]

So hmm can u explain why it wouldnt benefit the team? I mean its a eletric immunty plus Hits everything

Curious maybe i am missing something

[versed river]

where are yall even seeing the legal mons for m-a

it hasnt been announced yet

[shadow wind]

I bet it lives a -1 glide

[hollow latch]

Celebi

[versed river]

you mean serebii?

[lost sun]

I think it would benefit but as of rn no one has shown swampert to be in the game unless it's on some site I've not seen

[shadow wind]

100/110/110 is a lot better than I thought

[hollow latch]

Oh yeee

[sudden remnant]

im assuming the non-legendary megas are just gonna be there but if not im chillin

[versed river]

even at -1 a 252 hp swampert dies most of the time to offensive rilla glide

[hollow latch]

Ah ye just saw pelipper and arch confirmed and thought of a mega that could benefit it from and thought it was a starter so it would come;/

[versed river]

-1 252+ Atk Miracle Seed Rillaboom Grassy Glide vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Swampert-Mega in Grassy Terrain: 196-232 (94.6 - 112%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO

[hollow latch]

Ye rilla is the biggest opp

Ngl

[sudden remnant]

i wanna do a team with lucario z and a silly second mega but altaria isnt quite fast enough without also slapping on tw

[hollow latch]

I am kinda curious what the ability will be

[rare pumice]

do you think lucario z would manage to work well in both singles and doubles?

[hollow latch]

Singles for sure

[hollow latch]

But doubles idk

[lost sun]

very frail

[rare pumice]

yea i'm not very good at using frail pokemon in doubles

unless like, i've partnered it with farigiraf or indeedee

[lost sun]

how would farig help

[rare pumice]

i just meant in general

idk if it would be helpful to lucario z

[lost sun]

maybe a little

[rare pumice]

though being immune to shadow sneak, aqua jet, all that stuff is still nice for a frail pokemon

especially grassy glide

[versed river]

lucario z could be good in vgc if it gets dark pulse because it outspeeds and would ohko shadow rider

[versed river]

fake out

imprisoning tr for such a fast mon

[rare pumice]

i know the perfect pokemon that can ohko shadow rider before it moves

[versed river]

sucker punch anyone

[rare pumice]

specifically mega banette

[versed river]

and then they have a sash and helping hand +2 astral barrage kos your team

[versed river]

mega banette is not good bro 😭

[rare pumice]

i'm still gonna try using it for at least one battle anyways

[versed river]

iirc the only result banette ever got was when wolfe "i won a regional with it" glick won a regional with it

[rare pumice]

pdb says lucario gets shadow ball and dark pulse in z-a

[lost sun]

could be different for champs but I doubt it would lose both

[versed river]

i think it already had dark pulse

[rare pumice]

mega gengar and froslass are both gonna hate mega lucario

[foggy lodge]

Tbh it wasn't even the main mega on that team

It was the Venusaur

[versed river]

yeah

[sudden remnant]

please be mega launcher

[rare pumice]

that would be the most insane thing ever

[sudden remnant]

please nintendo you like lucario give it mega launcher

[versed river]

is flash cannon part of mega launcher

[sudden remnant]

uhhhhhhh

[rare pumice]

it would be ashame if it gets an ability that doesn't strengthen vacuum wave in some way

[sudden remnant]

i think so????

[rare pumice]

mega launcher is water pulse, heal pulse, dragon pulse, flash cannon, dark pulse

[versed river]

and origin pulse

[rare pumice]

and terrain pulse i guess

[versed river]

also aura sphere no?

[sudden remnant]

ye

aura sphere gets boosted by mega launcher

[rare pumice]

oh i thought i put aura sphere on that list

[versed river]

dont think lucario would even run vacuum wave

aura sphere flash cannon dark pulse/nasty plot protect

[lost sun]

120 power aura sphere from lucario z would hit like a truck

[rare pumice]

idk i feel like there must be some good reason to run vacuum wave

[versed river]

nah

other than maybeee aura sphere flash cannon vacuum wave protect i guess

you need protect you want double stab and you want coverage or setup

[rare pumice]

if it was in singles then vacuum wave would make more sense than protect i think

[versed river]

you outspeed everyone but regieleki anyways

[versed river]

true, i only talk about VGC since thats all i play
in doubles it needs protect to make up for its horrible bulk

[lost sun]

isn't it only bulky stall Pokémon with healing items or abilities that want protect in singles

[versed river]

but even in singles id bet you run nasty plot or a second coverage move over wave given how fast you are already

[rare pumice]

maybe protect was used in singles when dynamax was around but other than that idk

maybe lucario z would rather run steel beam in singles than vacuum wave though just for a last resort now that i think about it

[versed river]

if it gets mega launcher? doubt it

thats only 20 more bp and misses 5% of the time and has a huge drawback

[rare pumice]

my face when my blissey gets hit by a +2 steel beam from lucario z

or no wait

[versed river]

isnt chansey bulkier

[rare pumice]

just aura sphere duh i'm dumb sometimes

[versed river]

lmao

[rare pumice]

wait i don't think chansey will be a problem for the forseeable future until baby pokemon are allowed in champions

[hollow latch]

https://tenor.com/view/buh-gif-14465458220549268962

[rare pumice]

i'm wondering if people will be running dragon pulse since multiscale mega dragonite is gonna be taking up space

or for like feraligatr for example

[hollow latch]

Man still sad that they didnt give us rain for dragonite

[rare pumice]

for hurricane/thunder spam?

[hollow latch]

Ye and having multi scale as ur first ability give u the oppertunity to Set up too

But now i think people will still play salamence

[lost sun]

maybe froslass too

[rare pumice]

well it still learns rain dance i think

[hollow latch]

Was thinking about using it in a rain Team

[hollow latch]

Frolass is definitly a good Edition

[lost sun]

could work especially if they add swampert

4x resist grass then doesn't miss hurricane if u can keep rain up

[hollow latch]

Ye that wasmy idea

[rare pumice]

i feel like lucario z might run psychic with how many fighting types there are

[hollow latch]

And u can still play dd espeed

Just for prio

[rare pumice]

mega dragonite loses attack stat i think doesn't it

[hollow latch]

Oh really

[rare pumice]

i think it's 10 less

[hollow latch]

Forgot

Btw do we know how terra and mega work

[rare pumice]

i've heard mega will be the only one available at start so i'm assuming they just cycle out the gimmicks with each season

[next stump]

99% sure they’re not allowed together

It would get way too messy

[hollow latch]

Could i run mega and terra normal and decide when i play which gimmick i will use

Okey i see was gonna say

[rare pumice]

if they do allow gimmicks to be used in the same format, i would hope that there's like a dedication clause thing where you have to commit to one gimmick when you make a team, and that the gimmick you chose is displayed to your opponent at the start of each battle

where you could still hide which pokemon you're using the gimmick with, but like, if i'm using a mega lucario and my opponent suddenly turns into a ghost type when i thought we were both gonna mega, that would be kind of insane

[shadow wind]

Something something mega Tera normal Dmax Khang

[hollow latch]

https://tenor.com/view/monkey-anguish-despair-gif-13915908866750092639

[next stump]

https://x.com/jacobskraw/status/2037599053173678361?s=46&t=fDxHQLlKCKU_ddfszOAZ6w

Skraw! VGC (@JacobSkraw)

I genuinely cannot believe what I am about to say and my hands are shaking as I type this. The prize pool of the Grand Champions Festival is now $10000. I’ll be making a follow up post revealing some of the partners making this all possible in the next day or so.

X · Mar 27, 2026, 6:34 PM

[placid thorn]

have you guys seen togekiss in champions in any of the trailers? i can't remember

[rare pumice]

all of my plans are going to fall apart if togekiss doesn't make the cut

[forest arrow]

10,000 prize pool is insane

Everyone is done with SV lmao

[hollow latch]

What Team would togekiss fit in?

[forest arrow]

3300 registration right now, holy moly

[hollow latch]

Isnt it just a garchomp counter ?Idk so much about vcg history

[hollow latch]

Damn not bad

[next stump]

biggest VGC tournament ever

I don’t envy the judges having to deal with it

[hollow latch]

Hope we will see wolfey con perish

With mega gengar

[leaden fox]

I don't know if it has; would be nice if it is

[rare pumice]

i thought it was a good follow me pokemon

with ground and dragon immunity, and how much it eats fighting type moves

[foggy lodge]

14 swiss rounds holy shit

[forest arrow]

From the info graphic of what we’ve seen so far, I’m not seeing Togekiss

[foggy lodge]

And possibly 15

[forest arrow]

Hugest VGC tour ever

[placid thorn]

it looks like it ain't there yet

[forest arrow]

Might want clef to run the show for a little since mega Clef and Togekiss are so similar

[leaden fox]

Though not all of the mons have been dropped overall I'd imagine, only the ones we've been able to see

Because I bet the mons we've seen is maybe only one-fifth or one-sixth of the whole lot

[forest arrow]

Like we’ve seen Maus but no Ape

Armarouge no Deedee

[leaden fox]

Yeah exactly

[forest arrow]

I agree, we just gotta wait til the 8th

Bro megas will be final gambit food now that I think about it

[leaden fox]

Honestly believe we'll know all the mons when it drops for sure; but I know that the "Starter Pack" will also be worth it, £4.49/$6 is all it costs for a one-time purchase that is permanent 🙂

[placid thorn]

yea I figured that'd be the case, hopefully the whole list will be released soon

[leaden fox]

It should do; we'll know day one after all 🙂

Though will have to update my Pokémon HOME sub; since that runs out in May xD

Thankfully I have an idea of what teams to build for Champions; just need to see what changes to their move sets are 😅

[placid thorn]

same here, I'll wait for the final list to be revealed tho to finish things up

[leaden fox]

Same here

[forest arrow]

https://x.com/joeux9/status/2037617948920054194?s=46&t=gEcvvuDLBwqjwOC0yfoRYg

Joseph Ugarte (@JoeUX9)

VGC players after surviving a tournament with 18 rounds of swiss and 6k players

X · Mar 27, 2026, 7:49 PM

[sudden remnant]

dragon counter. isnt togekiss literally called the dragon killer

and mega clefable thought it was gonna be shit but its just togekiss from temu

[sudden remnant]

we saw archaludon so we do have mouse bridge

[hollow latch]

idk about sneasler never played it before but that its my idea for now

for a rain team in champions

snealers stuff is cope because idk if its even worth in this team

[leaden fox]

If Mega Drampa gets Drizzle 😏

[hollow latch]

https://tenor.com/view/sly-smile-got-em-smirk-evil-smile-gif-16501976

we might then cook

[leaden fox]

Oh yes 😛

[hollow latch]

what is his speed

[leaden fox]

And I know Drampa gets Thunder, Hurricane and Hydro Pump 😅

36 speed

[hollow latch]

so it could replace dragonite

[leaden fox]

But has a 160 spatk

[hollow latch]

so rain trick room team

[leaden fox]

and reasonably good bulk

[hollow latch]

i mean u could play this team with giraff and replace pelipper and dragonnite with ursa

[next stump]

I think mixed dragonite might be bait

[hollow latch]

ye thought maybe if i wanted to play two megas

so i could switch it up

but u could just replace it dd with protect. still think keeping espeed but u might be right

[next stump]

yeah e speed would be as far as I’d go

[hollow latch]

do u have an idea for the 6th mon or maybe a replacement for sneasler

[next stump]

amoonguss slaps on rain if it’s in the game

[hollow latch]

Spore, redirection and pollenpuf Set?

[bold geode]

@next stump y'know what I didn't even think about

Bro
Are we sure that Limitless can even fucking handle that tournament

[next stump]

dude who knows

it’s gonna get close to 5k players

[bold geode]

Bro they might actually crash the server LMAO

Holy shit it's at 3.8k now, fucking insane

[chrome knot]

https://gif.fxtwitter.com/tweet_video/HC7GTvMXwAEdBZA.gif

[sudden remnant]

me and my coworker played 20 questions guessing pokemon and she got mine immediately after asking if its cute

(it was skitty)

[sudden remnant]

https://tenor.com/view/uma-musume-67-helios-daitaku-helios-daitaku-gif-5229936164780903038

[forest arrow]

Brain rot central-

https://tenor.com/view/tekashi-69-fade-out-peace-gif-15141419

[chrome knot]

do u not fw 67 @forest arrow

[forest arrow]

Any form of brain rot lol

My only exception is pookie

He knows who he is

[chrome knot]

hater

[forest arrow]

🙂‍↔️

[chrome knot]

yes

[forest arrow]

It’s just not amusing to me, sorry?

[forest arrow]

I’m not

[rare pumice]

can flying pokemon still be hit by priority moves in psychic terrain?

[dense latch]

yes

so long as they stay ungrounded

[foggy lodge]

If a mon doesn't touch the ground it can be affected by prio moves in psychic terrain

But it has to not touch the ground by technicalities not by its animation lol

Magneton is still inmune to prio moves

[rare pumice]

has greninja ever been particularly popular in any competitive formats? i feel like i've never heard of it being used before

[molten oasis]

Not in vgc

[bold geode]

Nah never been good
At most it was incredibly niche on some Reg H Rain teams as a Mon that could proc Archaludon Stamina

[rare pumice]

growing up is realizing that maybe protean wasn't as good as it sounded as a kid

or maybe that's just the evil nerf from gen 8 talking in my ear that was created for the sole purpose of making cinderace look better by comparison

[bold geode]

I think Greninja wasn't good enough but like
Protean was better technically before

[rare pumice]

it's just strange they would nerf that pokemon so hard, and twice no less

[grim storm]

Is there a site or something that I can use to make a team?

[rare pumice]

if you use dragon darts in doubles, and one of the opponents protects, the two darts will instead hit the single other opponent right?

[grim storm]

Like I want to use a pokemon but I never played competitive before

[rare pumice]

there is a battle simulator site that lets you teambuild pretty effeciently called pokemon showdown

i don't think it needs an account to be used either

[near crag]

Any thoughts on this? Accidentally went for the Montana Evans here https://pokepast.es/d6601d4cfb65a1c1

[shadow wind]

Jumpluff makes zero sense here

Team is already incredibly weak into CIR

And you have mad prio with CSR Korai

Tw isn't needed

Also giga impact is maybe the worst possible option on dnite

[near crag]

What do you suggest instead of jumpluff then? Trying to get some help against flutter and maybe some redirection while were at it

[near crag]

Could always do outrage

[foggy lodge]

Amoonguss does both

[near crag]

Need to stop her icy wind somehow

[shadow wind]

Why?

[foggy lodge]

https://x.com/CbuttyVGC/status/2037699261740028243?s=20

Farigiraf's Strongest Soldier 🔜 Utrecht 🇳🇱 (@CbuttyVGC)

15 round swiss achieved

X · Mar 28, 2026, 1:12 AM

gulp

[rare pumice]

i really want to use a mienshao if it's in champions

[bold geode]

Bro idk if I really wanna compete in it, there's gonna be like 25 Swiss rounds when it starts

Its at 4212 now btw

[foggy lodge]

Eh I mean im gonna play it

I doubt I day 2 anyways

[bold geode]

Bro Day 1 is gonna leak into Day 2 fym

Start time: 9 AM
End time for Day 1: 9 AM

[rustic mountain]

dude wtf

now i might not sign up 4000 is a lot of participants lmao

[chrome knot]

its gonna take foreverrr

[rustic mountain]

how do they even manage this lmao

[rustic mountain]

no like actually

[chrome knot]

they have regional level judges

[rustic mountain]

oh shit, nice

[chrome knot]

ik torontos TO is a judge

[rustic mountain]

atleast helpful to some degree tho 4000 is still pretty large

[chrome knot]

dunno

im just emma

[rustic mountain]

im glad champions is bringing in the hype tho

[bold geode]

I thought you were Goggles Incineroar and Mega Gengar and many more

[rustic mountain]

just hope it translates to actual growth for the scene

[bold geode]

I imagine it does

[rustic mountain]

no need to worry about the hardcore vgc players, but does 1-2 years down the line keep retention for new players while continually bringing in more

[bold geode]

Hell if anything seeing that many people wanting to play Champions is a good thing and probably gets even more eyes on the game imo

[bold geode]

Eh who knows
Only time will tell

[rustic mountain]

oh ofc

[chrome knot]

baabbaadoo

[rustic mountain]

we thinkin we get a format april 1st or they wait like 2-3 days b4 release

[chrome knot]

my guess is on release lol

[rustic mountain]

also an option tho thatd kinda suck lol

[chrome knot]

whys that

[rustic mountain]

different kind of game then the usual mainline, not the same kinda pacing to figure things out for a format ladder day 1 wen like ur main objective is doing comp specifically

atleast from my pov, some ppl might like the chaos

[left bobcat]

Reh h lalalalalalala

[foggy lodge]

Idk if I want to play too tbh

If I beat a pro player im happy

[cyan smelt]

how do yall keep up with the pace of reg i? from watching some games it feels like a brutal format where one mistake can cost you

[shadow wind]

Honestly the pace Reg I flows at is where I’m most comfortable and maybe that’s cause I really locked in when G hit so restricted formats are all I know but it’s weird to explain

[versed river]

depends fullyyyyyyyyyy on the team youre using. HO the game can be over instantly but trick room teams or teams with a great defensive backbone do have alot of positioning and defensive play

[waxen dock]

Ho mentioned

[next stump]

maybe the least anyone has cared about watching a regional this weekend

[versed river]

this record will be held for less than a month

i swear there are gonna be like 2 people watching the prague stream

[next stump]

yep haha

[versed river]

but yeahh

i opened the stream and the casters were talking about there being original teams and all i saw was crown psyspam vs dozogiri 😭

[forest arrow]

There was a gouging howl team with Annihilape instead of shifu

So original lol

[foggy lodge]

I'm gonna watch Prague while playing pokemon champions with my pokemon champions shirt my pokemon champions hat and my pokemon champions shoes

[versed river]

i meant cos of skraws tour lmao

same weekend

[foggy lodge]

https://x.com/FolagoR/status/2037846480153620613?s=20

FOLAGOR (@FolagoR)

Hay un chaval compitiendo en Pokémon con el mando de Mario Kart.

X · Mar 28, 2026, 10:57 AM

[waxen dock]

well i reached it at like last days but i still reached it

1612 bo3 reg f

almost 80 gxe

[bold geode]

It's on my TV but idec about it LMAO

[bold geode]

Me too Quagsire
Me too

[versed river]

reg i is lowkey boring but im going to utrecht what if i just bring some shit like indeedee drifblim calyrex dondozo tatsu zama

and go 1-3 drop

[foggy lodge]

Use body press koraidon

[bold geode]

I almost got bodied by that the other day

Moreso cuz it was of course double bike so

[versed river]

i know someone who used double bike+raging bolt and the korai was body press

[bold geode]

The one based team with Miraidon and Bolt
There was this one team with Groudon and Miraidon and they had a Life Orb Tera Electric Bolt with Rising Voltage

[foggy lodge]

everyone who didn't go to seville should be happy

[waxen dock]

I almost went

But there were no flights

So im going to utrecht instead

[rustic mountain]

[versed river]

im going to utrecht too!

[versed river]

gigas 😭

[rare pumice]

is it weird that i feel like one of the best teams i ever made was with a drednaw in reg h

[waxen dock]

In seniors?

Or masters

[versed river]

seniors this year, going to masters utrecht next year if its there though

[waxen dock]

So we have a chance to get paired

[versed river]

ooo

[waxen dock]

Do you usually do good in regionals?

[versed river]

havent been to any yet lmao

[waxen dock]

Me too

[versed river]

only irl tour ive been to was this years euic which i got 3-4 in

[waxen dock]

Are you doing good in the gcs?

[versed river]

i dont like bo1cts much tbh

wbu

[waxen dock]

I do good in the gcs

Like my average elo is around 1680 or 1700

[versed river]

oo thats really good

i think i did like one gc where i got ~1600

[waxen dock]

1697 average

[waxen dock]

What gc?

[versed river]

first one of this season iirc

[waxen dock]

I did 1768 12th place that one

[versed river]

ooo nice

[waxen dock]

What team are you bringing to utrecht?

[versed river]

gonna wait to see some meta developments first, we havent had reg i in like 8 months

[rare pumice]

would trick + choice strategies be a bad idea in mega evolution formats with how common megas will be to find?

[versed river]

dont think you can trick away a mega stone

[lofty tartan]

You can't

[rare pumice]

no i mean is that why it would be a bad idea

since trick won't work on megas, do you think it's a bad idea in mega formats

[versed river]

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2026regf-2569671638-q2gbl18kiglulcmb1jjs9yjrpir6tuppw
reg f is so funny bro this is high up on the ladder too 😭

[lofty tartan]

Trick + Choice is fairly niche anyway and usually only shows up on an extremely small amount of mons. It works against 5 of 6 pokemon on a team so it'll probably be just about as useful as it is now

[versed river]

ohhh
probably worse than rn and its already not great now

[rare pumice]

thank you

if gholdengo makes it into champions, i'm thinking of maybe bringing him with specs to counter mega metagross and maybe skarmory if i use thunderbolt

as well as just eat fairy/steel type attacks in general

[versed river]

it will make it into champs gamefreak loves that guy

[rare pumice]

do you think i should just run a second coverage move alongside thunderbolt, shadow ball, and make it rain if i'm not gonna be using trick

[next stump]

coverage moves gain a good bit of value IMO with tera gone

power gem threatens charizard, volc, etc.

but if you’re specs you’ll need tailwind or icy wind support

[lofty tartan]

And yeah Mega Meta is pretty fast and is gonna deffo be running coverage moves.

[waxen dock]

I thought you hated bo1 cts

Wo now you are abusing it

[rare pumice]

i have a mega with tailwind and intimidate

[versed river]

in official tours

its funny on showdown

[waxen dock]

Cts is cts

[rare pumice]

do you think it's ok to have a pokemon with haze on the same team as an intimidate pokemon? i think that clashes a little but i feel haze will be extremely important

[versed river]

happened alot in reg h

im 99% sure dozogiri will be in reg m-a so yes haze will be very important

[rare pumice]

i kind of want to use crobat for haze for some reason

[placid thorn]

have you thought about milotic?

it also gets boosts if incin switches in to intimidate your partner

[rare pumice]

that's a great steel resist option honestly, i hadn't thought of that

[placid thorn]

pretty good against dondozo due to the water resist, i just thought i'd share it with you

[rare pumice]

i'll check out its moveset, but i'm sort of doing a tailwind/offense team so i'm not sure if it'll fit in yet

[placid thorn]

good stuff

[versed river]

dragonite

[rare pumice]

if mienshao makes the champions cut, i'm gonna have the best mienshao anybody's ever seen

uh i'm being told that crobat gets knock off now in starting with z-a please god let crobat into champions

[versed river]

it could just lose it
in legends arceus a bunch of mons got random moves that they lost afterwards iirc and theyre definetly gonna adjust the moves from whats there in z-a
golurk is not keeping fissure

[rare pumice]

yea i suppose so

[sudden remnant]

no guard fissure 💀

without setup

[lost sun]

did anyone check if golurk got fissure

[versed river]

in champs? dont think so

i havent seen it at least and i think i wouldve heard about it

[rustic mountain]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mak5VkqLocE

[foggy lodge]

u watched it?

[tawdry urchin]

How do I make hoopa usable in singles? The thing is a FRAUD 💔

[rare pumice]

which form are you using?

[tawdry urchin]

unbound

[rare pumice]

hoopa unbound is kind of unfortunate because its typing and defense stat leave it super super weak to bug type moves, with u-turn being pretty well distributed, so maybe you'd want to pair it with a steel type that can threaten bug and fairy types that threaten it

[tawdry urchin]

"singles", doubles is boring

[rare pumice]

hyperspace fury is its best dark type since it's a good base 100 move that can hit through protect, maybe zen headbutt for fighting types that resist it but it's lower accuracy

i know, i mean that you can have a steel type in the back that it can swap with

so that like if hoopa sees somebody who might have bug or fairy moves, the steel type can come in for it

you can have it hold a choice scarf and then you can use the move trick so you can trap some pokemon with scarf too if you wanted, and it lets you make use of magician later

and then i guess maybe gunk shot for the final move just for strong coverage

[versed river]

hoopa isnt even legal in doubles. doesnt mean you cant have any synergy on your team in singles

[bold geode]

Idk if it's even legal in singles
I don't have Smogon knowledge but that'd be the only place it'd even potentially be allowed

[rare pumice]

it's really confusing to me that they invented two separate abilities in gen 9 called wind rider and wind power that do almost the same exact thing

[chrome knot]

o god

[rare pumice]

wait so wind power doesn't have the immunity then?

[shadow wind]

Nope

But wind rider does

[tawdry urchin]

Ok? 💔

[foggy lodge]

https://fixupx.com/PSaber97/status/2038014430881972678?s=20

PSaber97🎨 (@PSaber97)

**💬 3 🔁 53 ❤️ 507 👁️ 5.0K **

FixupX · Mar 28, 2026, 10:04 PM

This guy is leaking my sun team

[sudden remnant]

the same as wvery other sun team going into the game probably

mega zard y and clorophyll venusaur

[chrome knot]

leaking the most known duo gg

[ocean pawn]

why am i struggling to find the last 2 mons

[chrome knot]

what

[ocean pawn]

https://pokepast.es/bec9a5ffc6d213a3

forgot the paste

[rare pumice]

it is kind of strange to me that we live in a world where gengar was allowed 50 bonus points into its special attack with its mega, but then a pokemon like greninja is stuck with base 133 special attack when it megas

[indigo coral]

"Stuck with base 133" like that's not still a great statline

Not everything needs to be Flutter Mane

[ocean pawn]

you do know 133 is only 2 points less then flutter mane

[rare pumice]

idk i think that becomes harder to accept when it also got 30 of its points into physical attack

[indigo coral]

You mean the pokemon that famously runs mixed sets really well still has the ability to run a really good mixed set when it megas? What is there possibly to complain about there

[rare pumice]

i thought greninja wasn't picked very often in vgc?

[indigo coral]

Not everything is about VGC, BSS still exists and is still officially supported. But also once again, not every Pokemon needs to be Flutter Mane. Greninja's Mega does a great job of preserving what made it good already and strengthening it's strengths. That is optimal design for a Mega. There is nothing to complain about.

[chrome knot]

tbf 90% of this chat is vgc players

[indigo coral]

Like, Flutter Mane was far and away the best new Generation 9 pokemon, and Mega Greninja has 2 less SpA points. That's amazing

[foggy lodge]

Greninja is not designed to be good in VGC and that's fine

[rare pumice]

well i apologize for sounding pessimistic about it, i guess i just was thinking about how we had to lose battle bond greninja to get this current greninja (which i'm not sure was ever used in vgc, that was sort of before i started playing)

especially with the protean nerf in gen 8

[indigo coral]

Mega Greninja is also faster than Flutter Mane while hitting functionally just as hard, while also having the ability to run mixed, access to multiple setup moves, access to hazards, access to utility moves. Genuinely how are you complaining, in a vacuum this is comparable to the single strongest pokemon released last generation

[chrome knot]

lol

its typing

[indigo coral]

Typing wouldn't be fixed by a Mega

[rare pumice]

i'm also not sure if protean is a good ability for a pokemon taking up the mega slot, but i think i'd have to see it in action before i could say that for sure

[chrome knot]

compare apples to oranges

[rare pumice]

in vgc at least, i guess i should start specifying that

[indigo coral]

Battle Bond Greninja has never been legal on the Switch as far as I am aware. To my knowledge it's been banned every format on the Switch due to an obscure obtainment method where it was not possible to reroll natures or IVs locked to a console where it is no longer possible to obtain the demo or even purchase the console from store shelves.

Protean is also a completely fine ability still post-nerf, Meowscarada saw play and success in VGC in a few different ScVi Regulations.

[chrome knot]

in the first regulations

sv didn’t have a centralized gimmick, which makes wasting mega slot on greninja is meh

[rare pumice]

the rational i was thinking with was that having your mega slot locked to a single typing, losing out in potential resistances as well as dual stab, i felt that will be a detriment to greninja, but now that i've thought some more about it, maybe people will run torrent greninja, swords dance/nasty plot before mega, then use an attack they want to the typing of for the battle?

[indigo coral]

Meowscarada saw play in Regulation H as well. Didn't see play in Restricted metas due to the aforementioned Restricteds being extremely format warping though, but tons of strong mons aren't viable when Restricteds are legal. Thankfully, there are no Restricteds in Champions.

[chrome knot]

it was not used for long in reg h

like i remember seeing 1 team max

[dense latch]

yea it was alright in the very early stages but not much success afterwards

[indigo coral]

Wdym, it was used for well over half of the first Reg H run. Just didn't see as much play in the second Reg H run due to the format being completely solved and hyper optimized to the point it became an unpopular format

[chrome knot]

it literally wasn’t

i went to 3 reg h regionals and there was none

[rare pumice]

i think i considered using overgrow meowscarada over protean at one point back then just for the extra power to a tera flower trick

[solid frigate]

Meow kinda sucks in Reg H especially with how many things going against

Not to mention, S N E A S L E R

[chrome knot]

H I T L E R

[rare pumice]

ooo maybe mega greninja could make good use of icy wind in vgc, that seems interesting actually

[indigo coral]

"I went to three regionals total across two seperate four month periods that were a year apart" is not the counter to "Meowscarada saw play in the first two months and change of the first one of those four month periods" that you think it is.

[chrome knot]

i went to the first 3 NA reg h regionals.

so constantly had an eye on meta trends

[solid frigate]

Also D U G is just insane

[chrome knot]

this was before dat

[rare pumice]

does protean make it so you get the stab boost before you use the move you transform into the type to? i think a long time ago i heard that you don't get the stab on turn one for some reason

[indigo coral]

Strange, you should remember the 12 regional top 8s it got in Generation 9 then. Including one just this month.

[chrome knot]

honkshoooo honkshoooo

[solid frigate]

Yep

You click the move,before you attack Greninja would change to the type the move was,including water and Dark

[rare pumice]

thank you

[chrome knot]

vijay sood isnt a normal person

[solid frigate]

I already have two teams that used Greninja during GC anyway

[rare pumice]

if greninja keeps vacuum wave and nasty plot in champions that'll be a major help to what i'm trying to figure out here

[chrome knot]

all of these results are one offs mostly in Latam region lol

[indigo coral]

Huh, this is when you played. Didn't you just say there was one top, then change your answer to zero when it was convenient? Strange when people cite sources isn't it. Also I was wrong, Meowscarada saw much more play than I remembered.

https://limitlessvgc.com/pokemon/meowscarada

[chrome knot]

idt 2 players known for the most random teams count toward “meta threat”

[solid frigate]

Literally never seen it in NA or EU lol

Actually even JP didn’t use it right

[rare pumice]

if a protean pokemon uses weather ball do they change into a normal type or the type of the weather?

[chrome knot]

@solid frigate wild statistics chud found at 10:30 at night

[dense latch]

1 or 2 people using it in a regional is not high usage at all lol

less than 1% and that’s generous

[solid frigate]

Unless you mean Greninja then there’s actually one Greninja streamed if I remember

[chrome knot]

guys i brought scream tail and beat marco fiero i think scream tail is a big meta threat lol

[rare pumice]

i think i remember there being a scream tail perish song thing going on at one point in gen 9 but idk what format it was or anything

[indigo coral]

Big talk coming from someone constantly moving the goalposts every time someone cites sources proving them wrong. You're allowed to admit you were wrong and move on you know, no need to stoop to the kind of talk used by literal children.

[solid frigate]

@foggy lodge

[chrome knot]

no im just staring at statistics that don’t help your case

since ik you know not much about the actual metas lol

[solid frigate]

Don’t mind me,just sitting here watching the show

[chrome knot]

im nor sober so its fun for me too

[cyan smelt]

https://tenor.com/view/michael-jackson-popcorn-gif-8880020

Me lurking

[solid frigate]

So true

[rare pumice]

weather ball might be a great choice for mega greninja too depending on how things play out, i think i'm actually excited about mega greninja now

[chrome knot]

he types for long time

[indigo coral]

I played VGC more than you did lmao, being disabled and unemployed means I can devote 100% of my time to this since I have no other responsibilities lol.

You said, and I quote, "there was zero Meowscarada usage". Actually, you at first said there was one team, then suddenly decided there was zero when it was convienient. There are 12 top 8s. You are wrong, factually and provably. Changing the goalposts does not change the fact you are wrong.

[chrome knot]

hurry up bruh

[chrome knot]

on god i don’t care

[solid frigate]

It depends?

If it’s pre nerf Protean it would be interesting,but for now it’s rather mid,you better off using 4 attacking moves with different type if you are playing Regular Specs Gren

But Mega Greninja I want to see the protean interactions first

[rare pumice]

i was just saying earlier that since the mega gets protean, i'm thinking maybe running torrent on base will be the better choice to get off nasty plot or swords dance safely, then choose a type to commit to

so yea it's a lot more interesting than i considered originally

[solid frigate]

You could potentially get 5 versions of the move so it’s funny as hell if you manage to pull it off

[rare pumice]

i remember mega gengar being an icy wind user at some point too in the past so if gren keeps that then maybe it could do something similar?

[indigo coral]

You said, and I quote, "there was zero Meowscarada usage". Actually, you at first said there was one team, then suddenly decided there was zero when it was convienient. There are 12 top 8s. You are wrong, factually and provably. Changing the goalposts does not change the fact you are wrong.

You gonna address this or are you going to continue to be childish while bragging about not being sober in a server full of minors?

[chrome knot]

idt i was bragging

also you should log off for the night gang

[solid frigate]

During Gen 6-7 Mega Gengar is one of the faster mons because we all just eyeing on Base 100

So it can abuse icy wind hard

[rare pumice]

i think mega gren outspeeds mega gengar too, by like a wide margain

[chrome knot]

https://gif.fxtwitter.com/tweet_video/HC7GTvMXwAEdBZA.gif

[rare pumice]

i accidentally already used an ability capsule on a greninja yesterday now that i want a torrent one, do you think base greinja would be fine running a physical spikes set in a singles 6v6 format, or is special just the way to go for greninja always?

[solid frigate]

https://tenor.com/view/kamen-rider-ooo-building-throw-throw-away-eiji-hino-gif-20195508

[chrome knot]

narrrr

[foggy lodge]

How much did scream tail help into the marcofiero mu

[chrome knot]

look i have a bunny one too

[chrome knot]

auto win mon

[foggy lodge]

As it should

[chrome knot]

he could never play cm bolt mode

[foggy lodge]

Strongest mon of SV i love it so much

[chrome knot]

game 1 he lead incin bolt

[indigo coral]

Genuine unrelated question, do you find that joke funny while sober or is it funnier while drunk? Was under the impression that joke was dead as soon as millenials starting using it

[chrome knot]

and taunted my tail so i jus dgleamed for 50% over 2 turns lmfao

[foggy lodge]

wait how

[chrome knot]

he realized ts was not gonna fly

im not sure i just remember in my notes it did a fuck ton

[foggy lodge]

crazy

[solid frigate]

Well singles you don’t mind Greninja being Mixed attacker,and spikes is usually go for other mons

Doubles you just mostly go special,I did use two Greninja sets back in GC which both are special attacking

Just one of them is Grass Knot because it’s Restricted Format,and Sludge wave cuz I was pairing with Archaludon rain

[chrome knot]

i think we ran 12spatk to always kill dursh & have roll for roaring moon lmfao

[rare pumice]

thank you

[gentle crag]

inferioritycomplex55 has given 1 Gen Rep to morrispxg456

[chrome knot]

uhhh not sure abt drunk but high makes EVERYTHING funny so ig

[foggy lodge]

I liked scream tail for balance a lot

One time i found a guy using scarf urshifu and specs flutter with calm mind bolt

[chrome knot]

yeah my pick 4 also featured a wellspring pon that was 252hp 12atk 244def

[foggy lodge]

Tera ghost scream tail just didn't let him play the game LOL

[chrome knot]

so it lived tera ice icicle crash from 55%

[rare pumice]

i feel like low kick is a good choice on mixed greninja but i'm having a lot of trouble figuring out movesets for base greninja, it's like there are way too many options to choose from

[foggy lodge]

Impish?

[chrome knot]

yes

[foggy lodge]

holy

[chrome knot]

then to close out the game 2

was spiky + aerial ace into rilla to confirm game

[solid frigate]

What is that Ogerpon spread btw

[dense latch]

wtf how

crazy tank

[chrome knot]

252hp 12atk 244 impish

the whole team was jus bulk

which also had this during sisterhood where this bolt was +2

[solid frigate]

Yeah that checks out-

[foggy lodge]

Was it booster bolt

[chrome knot]

i wanna say i think lefties but it may have been booster

it was lefties she had a bundle

being a weird flexible player makes it hard to predict pick 4s for opps which i like

lead like wellspring gholdengo into this cm bolt team and it cooked

[solid frigate]

RIP Shifu

Anyway

[rare pumice]

the pokemon champions subscription being 50 dollars a year is kind of crazy to me

[solid frigate]

I feel like it’s optional cuz stuff are still in the store

[rare pumice]

yeah the only thing about it though is that it says it adds more battle team options, so i think it means like, you can only have 1 or 2 teams ready at a given time without it

that on top of the base 30 box limit, i mean idk, i think i can manage without it but it's not nice knowing what i'm missing out on at any rate

[chrome knot]

im #purchasing

[solid frigate]

You do have Home so that’s an extra 30

[rare pumice]

yea i guess so, it's just that it taes like 5 minutes for it to open up and log in, and then another like 30 seconds to open and close each gam ei transfer to

[bold geode]

I would say sober but like
Honestly I feel like I'm a sober dude with a bit of a stoner's mindset

[foggy lodge]

Is air slash worth it on Charizard Y

cuz i was looking at some calcs against the mons in theory shouldn't want to hit with a fire move but

[rare pumice]

i would say that unless there's a fighting type that can handle the overheat that you really need to win that match up against, air slash isn't worth it in my opinion

[foggy lodge]

Yeah I haven't found like any mon that is weak to flying and resists fire

[rare pumice]

if it's a singles format then maybe will-o-wisp or scorching sand could be useful

if doubles then i'd just go for protect

though maybe fire spin could be useful too, idk

[molten oasis]

What you cooking?

[deep cypress]

Anyone here for Union Circle?

[rustic mountain]

i did

[sudden remnant]

#1040555642668199936

chat do we know where worlds will be this year (if not do we know around when we’ll find out?)

[sudden remnant]

fire spin mega zard would be crazy

funny but crazy

[rare pumice]

idk if it's actually a good idea or not but i figured if magmar can make use of it idk maybe charizard could but idk

[solid frigate]

It’s not

[sudden remnant]

its not thats why it would be funny

just dont use fire spin 😭

[rare pumice]

yea i figured as much

i was just sort of thinking of possibilities i guess, that's why i said protect first

[sudden remnant]

most pokemon want protect 🫩

idk if megas necessarily want it specifically but i know for sure mawile ran protect back in gen 6

[rare pumice]

i just figure that if i'm struggling with a fourth move in a doubles format, i just choose protect and then see if i'm missing anything in battle afterwards

[sudden remnant]

can i just say i hope zard gets tailwind back in champions

[rare pumice]

idk i kind of prefer the idea of partnering it with a tailwind pokemon so that it spends more time making it impact if that makes sense

[sudden remnant]

idk bro the option of tailwind in a format thats gonna be as fast as this one sounds pretty nice

[rare pumice]

yea it's just that like, for example whimsicott was a really good partner for charizard in sword and shield vgc and i think that ran sunny day and tailwind, but now that it can mega again that frees up one move for whimsicott

[sudden remnant]

still

if i can have the extra tailwind i want it

especially with the potential removal of ivs which can cause issues to try trickroom strats

but we’ll have to see how that goes

[rare pumice]

i might try a whimsicott zard y strategy at some point, especially since whimsicott has the room for like solar beam to help protect charizard, i'm really excited for that in particular

though maybe energy ball is a safer pick because of all the weather counterplay

[sudden remnant]

zard learns solar beam bro

[rare pumice]

oh yea i forgot about that part my fault

[sudden remnant]

and has uh slightly higher SpA than cotton ball

yk just slightly

[rare pumice]

yea i guess there are other options for whimsicott in that case

[sudden remnant]

im considering lucario z and absol z but we'll have to see the abilities before i finalize that

[rare pumice]

i'm sort of hesistant about absol, i guess having three immunites is super fun, but having your two stabs be ghost and dark seems like a bad idea to me

fake tears whimsicott would actually be kind of insane next to charizard y

[sudden remnant]

1 weakness tho

which is nice

and being fast as fuck

[sudden remnant]

look at that juicy speed stat

[rare pumice]

i've never been particularly good at using hyper offense glass cannons like that anyways, so i guess that's also why i'm hesitant

[sudden remnant]

i mean you dont need to give it much speed investment in theory so you could probably give it some bulk

[rare pumice]

oh yea like the fluttermane set that makes sense

[sudden remnant]

😁

[rare pumice]

mega lopunny's gonna eat mega absol up, so scary

[sudden remnant]

hm

[rare pumice]

i guess outspeeding that one's a priority

[sudden remnant]

PLEASE GIVE ABSOL Z SHARPNESS OMG

IT HAS PSYCHO CUT

PLEASE SPEED I NEED THIS

[rare pumice]

my friend was saying that earlier, i think that's a little too much hope though

[sudden remnant]

anyways

[rare pumice]

though i mean like ,what other pokemon would they have made that shadow claw buff for

[sudden remnant]

it has psycho cut with 154 base attack. lopunny who?

[rare pumice]

do you think playrough is an option?

[sudden remnant]

play rough could be good

but if it gets sharpness it will probably be psycho cut by default

[rare pumice]

the accuracy alone is probably good enough reason to i guess

close combat seems like an obvious choice too

[sudden remnant]

theyve supposedly buffed a few moves so maybe theyll finally fix play roughs accuracy

[rare pumice]

imagine they buffed icicle crash to 100 accuracy

too little too late for that i think, ice spinner and triple axel replaced that move

[sudden remnant]

yeah

[rare pumice]

i wonder if there'll be a pokemon that uses air slash with sharpness some day

base 90 air cutter or aerial ace is interesting too i guess

[sudden remnant]

shadow claw and dragon claw got buffed

theyre now slashing moves (boosted by sharpness)

[rare pumice]

if they give mega absol sharpness and then we find out it gets sacred sword now i'm gonna lose my mind

[sudden remnant]

heh

night slash shadow claw psycho cut sacred sword would be so funny

[rare pumice]

shadow sneak is still there too

[sudden remnant]

yeah but why run it when youd have toughness boost on a base 151 speed

[versed river]

into speed control

[rare pumice]

idk could still be useful eventually

[versed river]

but yeah shadow claw night slash sacred sword protect

[rare pumice]

idk i'm not sure if i'd run both night slash and shadow claw on the same set

[sudden remnant]

or if its not sharpness maybe play rough

[versed river]

double stab

[sudden remnant]

why the hell not?

[rare pumice]

yea but they have a lot of crossover type effectiveness don't they?

[sudden remnant]

stab tho

ESPECIALLY with that beautiful attack stat

[versed river]

i guess?

does it get enough sharp coverage to make up for the lack of dualstab

[sudden remnant]

lemme see

[versed river]

night slash psycho cut protect and?

x scissor i guess to hit dark types

[sudden remnant]

aerial ace (i think) slash fury cutter psycho cut night slash buffed shadow claw x scissor false swipe (but no one is ever using false swipe in comp lmao)

[versed river]

id rather it just get tough claws or wtv its called so it can get boosted play roughs and close combats too

unless it gets sacred sword in champs

[sudden remnant]

that would be awesome

does it have it in za lemme check

[rare pumice]

wait i guess detect would be run over protect now huh

[versed river]

oh it gets detect?

[rare pumice]

i don't think sacred sword was in z-a

and yea absol's had detect since gen 3 i think

[versed river]

you always run detect over protect for imprison

[versed river]

it was

[sudden remnant]

if a mon has the option of detect you use it no exceptions

[rare pumice]

i thought i tried to find it on gallade and didn't see it, maybe i'm thinking of something else idk

[versed river]

tthe only mons that learn it in za are the swords of justice

[sudden remnant]

rip gallade rip absol rip aegislash

[versed river]

gallade will keep it

i think aegislash will too

[sudden remnant]

ik but like in za rip to those 3

[rare pumice]

if gallade doesn't have it in champions i will riot

[versed river]

did absol have sacred sword before?

[rare pumice]

not that i' maware of

[sudden remnant]

x to doubt

[versed river]

ohhh
gallade still gets cc no

[sudden remnant]

idk i dont use gallade

[rare pumice]

i used gallade a little in reg h last year

[sudden remnant]

ive been team gardevoir since rse

[rare pumice]

i like having it as an anti-trick room

and its sacred sword one shots archaludon so that's nice

plus since its speed is so middling that trick room can be useful for it, or it can work in tailwind, i think it's a really nice sweet spot kind of pokemon

[versed river]

it ties with gholdengo which is always awkward for someone who struggles with gholdengo

[sudden remnant]

i wish mega altaria was just 10 points faster

[rare pumice]

if they gave mega absol z encore then those three type immunities would look a lot more interesting all of the sudden

or i guess that might be too predictable maybe

[versed river]

you can also just pair whims with it

[sudden remnant]

the evil and sinister ally whimsicott:

[sudden remnant]

great minds think alike 🤝

[versed river]

then youd definetly need something that hits dark for se on absol though because prankster and absol struggle into dark types

[sudden remnant]

absol gets play rough and xscissor

[versed river]

yep i know

[sudden remnant]

both could be good

[versed river]

was just saying because we were talking about shadow sneak or duostab earlier

[rare pumice]

what dark/ghost type move would you plan on using if it doesn't get sharpness?

[sudden remnant]

and whim itself ~~ could~~ should run moonblast

[versed river]

knock off

[sudden remnant]

knock off shadow claw

[versed river]

if it doesnt get sharpness i am not running shadow claw 😭

[sudden remnant]

it doesnt have anything else ghost thats good 💀

[versed river]

yeah

[sudden remnant]

shadow claw and shadow sneak are literally it

[versed river]

give it rage fist

[rare pumice]

maybe it'll get technician?

[sudden remnant]

(phantom force isnt worth talking about)

doubt of all time

[versed river]

the 2 turn moves are so funny bro

in a draft league im in someone brought power herb dig raichu to deal with my glimmora

[sudden remnant]

doesnt phantom force ignore protect

[versed river]

i didnt even bring glimm

[versed river]

yes but youre still not doing shit for a turn

[sudden remnant]

which is the issue

it has 154 attack you want to be using it 100%

[rare pumice]

unless you partnered it with shadow tag i guess

[sudden remnant]

thats NOT the problem

the problem is your wasting your high attack for a whole turn

[versed river]

phantom force is like only good on certain band dragapult sets for if you need extra damage in the lategame when theres less ways to play around it

[sudden remnant]

so id still use shadow claw

unless it gets last respects

omg if it gets last respects its so over lmao

[versed river]

it could

[sudden remnant]

imagine the damage

[rare pumice]

if it just gets super luck again i think i'd be super sad

[sudden remnant]

i mean

high crit on night slash and shadow claw (just examples)

[versed river]

and run focus energy for the guaranteed crit and while youre setting up focus energy a flutter moonblast ohkos you and you lose the game

[rare pumice]

i guess if it got super luck on the mega it could run defiant pre-mega so it could have an intimidate boost

[sudden remnant]

redirection left the chat i guess

[versed river]

though i suppose if it gets super luck dragon cheer might actually be viable

[versed river]

flutter dazzling gleam*

[sudden remnant]

i was just thinking about dragon cheer LMAO

[rare pumice]

i was actually thinking earlier that protean on mega greninja might be nice if you run torrent on base so that it can save the type change for later in the battle

[sudden remnant]

uhhhhhhhhhh

[versed river]

i wonder if it reprocs when you mega

[sudden remnant]

probably

since ttar reprocs its sand stream when it megas

[rare pumice]

it would make running nasty plot or swords dance more flexible at least

[versed river]

ya

and clicking protect wouldnt ruin your plan

[sudden remnant]

the issue with me using absol z is would lucario z even be a good second mega for the team

[rare pumice]

realizing this actually is what saved mega greninja for me, if i had no choice but to just change my type instantly on turn one for my mega locked pokemon, i think i just wouldn't use mega greninja in vgc

[sudden remnant]

i wonder if a battlebond greninja will be locked from holding the mega stone

[rare pumice]

i was wondering that too but i heard it's not allowed in official formats

[versed river]

battlebond isnt even in the game no

[sudden remnant]

otherwise genuinely just run the battlebond variant and mega after you proc it

[sudden remnant]

it is in SV

its just completely gutted

[versed river]

ah i didnt know

but yeah iirc its illegal for vgc

[sudden remnant]

no

[rare pumice]

yea now it's just a free atk/sp.atk/speed boost if you knock out a pokemon

[sudden remnant]

well not “free” but yeah

and its 1 time use like post nerf intrepid sword and post nerf dauntless shield

[rare pumice]

does the battle bond boost get reset if you swap in or out or is it one ues per battle

oh nevermind

[sudden remnant]

its literally one time use

[versed river]

why would it be one time

[sudden remnant]

cuz it is

[versed river]

ogerpon gets it permanently 😭

[sudden remnant]

you mean embody aspect?

[versed river]

yep

[sudden remnant]

how will ogerpon work without tera

[versed river]

it probably wont

[sudden remnant]

it wont have the signature ability anymore

[rare pumice]

did they lower absol's stats just to get absol z as strong as it is

[versed river]

at least not nearly as good

[sudden remnant]

doesnt look like it

unfortunate absol has pressure and not a signature variant of cloud nine

since its whole thing is warning of coming disaster

[rare pumice]

they really just dumped almost all of its mega stats int ospeed then huh

[sudden remnant]

they dumped 76 points into speed and 24 into attack

genuine minmaxxed mega

[rare pumice]

do you think pressure or justified is the choice for pre-mega?

[sudden remnant]

im gonna be trying justified and super luck

justified next to best up whim

[rare pumice]

i can see justified working in singles or doubles but pressure might be interesting now that protect is only 8 uses

[sudden remnant]

what does pressure have to do with protect

[rare pumice]

oh no wait i forgot

pressure only affects targetting moves doesn't it

[sudden remnant]

it only targets moves that actually damaged the weilder of the ability

[rare pumice]

yea i thought it affected all moves on all opponents until just a few days ago

[sudden remnant]

very unfortunate ability icl

i wonder if i run a cheese non-mega gengar with like spite and cursed body

if spite is even in the game

although if i find a bulkier cursed body mon gengar is NOT staying

[rare pumice]

does cursed body affect all attacks

[rare pumice]

galarian corsola seems like the tankiest option for that

[sudden remnant]

it affects moves that damage the weilder

do you know how wrong it feels to hear that

[rare pumice]

well i imagine they were very picky on what pokemon to give the ability to

[sudden remnant]

i mean

[sudden remnant]

100/70/105 isnt bad

[rare pumice]

i always figured water absorb wsa the better choice on jellicent before i learned i was bad at everything

[sudden remnant]

and it being ghost is fine since absol doesnt have anything of ghosts weaknesses

[rare pumice]

jellicent gets strength sap too i'm pretty sure

[sudden remnant]

i hope for everyones sake youre lying to me

[rare pumice]

no it got it in gen 8

i remember being super excited about it when i found out

[sudden remnant]

💀

oh HELL yeah

wait lets compare rq

[rare pumice]

protect might not even be necessary on jellicent if you wanna be activating cursed body as much as yo ucan

[sudden remnant]

60/100/100 vs 100/70/105

[rare pumice]

i would forget about corsola for the time being since unevolved pokemon aren't gonna be in champions for awhile

[sudden remnant]

yeah

but when its added this will be fun

60/100/100 with eviolite is pure insanity

[rare pumice]

then we find out strength sap has like 8 pp now all of the sudden

[sudden remnant]

thats more than fine

i just need it to pp stall while my absol kills stuff

[rare pumice]

i think the water typing makes jellicent a better choice for helping mitigate metagross damage then

the steel resist seems super important

[sudden remnant]

and double ghost is great cuz its a middle finger to incinicringe

[rare pumice]

unless it's a metagross running thunder punch-

[sudden remnant]

if it has thunder punch jellicent might just die cuz mega metagross has tough claws

[rare pumice]

what is cursed body chance of activation like 10 percent?

[sudden remnant]

OH 💀

[rare pumice]

that seems wildly disruptive

[sudden remnant]

i wonder what i could calc absol z to live with defensive investment

[rare pumice]

i just checked a calc, jolly mega metagross has a less than 45 percent chance to one shot jellicent with thunder punch and that's without any hp or defense evs

[sudden remnant]

cuz like 65/60/60 is uh, not great, but also not the worst i guess

[rare pumice]

indeedee taught me not to underestimate anything no matter what anymore

[sudden remnant]

yeah but indeedee is literally just that guy

[rare pumice]

water spout hits both targets right?

[sudden remnant]

affirmative

[rare pumice]

i think that's a standard move on jellicent then, especially with strength sap

[sudden remnant]

uh

[sudden remnant]

WHAT 😭

[rare pumice]

jellicent has a crazy movepool

[sudden remnant]

what the fuck is this 💀

does it get icy wind too

[rare pumice]

it gets will-o-wisp, scald, water spout, strength sap, ice beam, sludge bomb, psychic, dark pulse

hex and shadow ball for ghost moves

it does in fact get icy wind yes

[sudden remnant]

probably doesn’t get scald anymore since they took it away from lot of pokemon going into gen 9

[rare pumice]

i thought the scald redistribution was in gen 8

[rare pumice]

oh ok

well so far we have icy wind, strength sap, and water spout on this cursed body jellicent

and i think protect is off the table to ensure cursed body activates as much as posisble

i think a good final choice would funnily enough be endure just as a last resort to make sure you have one last chance of cursed body activating

[sudden remnant]

wisp could always be good

[rare pumice]

taunt is probably a good option too

[sudden remnant]

id be running a cotton ball already

[rare pumice]

will-o-wisp doesn't affect strength sap's recovery i think does it

[sudden remnant]

the evil and nefarious cotton ball

[sudden remnant]

i wont lie i have no idea

i dont believe so

[rare pumice]

yea i think strength sap's recovery total is based off base attack stat so i don't think burn affects it

[sudden remnant]

i know physically dropping the stat through like intimidate and growl lowers its healing

[rare pumice]

apparently big root also affects strength sap's recovery but idk if that's a good choice

if jellicent gets haze in champions i think this is a done deal

[sudden remnant]

idk about indirect reduction like burn or tablets of ruin

[rare pumice]

idk if you'd want them, but the only three remaining moves i could think of for it are destiny bond, whirlpool, and acid armor

[sudden remnant]

this is all assuming jellicent is even in the game

[rare pumice]

i'd probably go rocky helmet for its held item unless you want leftovers to keep water spout as high damage as possible

[sudden remnant]

ill be trying a few different things again assuming its in the game

[rare pumice]

it's one of my top ghost types personally

at least the blue one is

the pink one not so much...

[sudden remnant]

wowwwww

what did female jellicent do to you

[rare pumice]

nothing, it's just that the blue one looks like the monopoly man so i think it's infinitely better by default

[sudden remnant]

im using a female one out of spite

[rare pumice]

my monopoly man is named King Seafoam

[sudden remnant]

absol jellicent whimsicott hmmmmm

we got quite the team here

[sudden remnant]

fuck yeahhhhhhhh it gets spite

[rare pumice]

i think people use to run night shade on it too just for consistent damage on water type resists

[sudden remnant]

if i cant deal damage im probably fine clicking spite icy wind and strength sap

speed control damage control+healing and more pp reduction

just gotta hope jellicent is in the game

[rare pumice]

idk spite just seems kind of low impact to me personally, but i hope it works out

[sudden remnant]

why would it be low impact

it reduces the last move used pp by 4

it doesnt even have to hit jellicent

[rare pumice]

but it isn't a consistent 4 i think

[sudden remnant]

see

[rare pumice]

o i guess it use to be a random number

[sudden remnant]

im wondering if i add a raichu

(non mega)

[rare pumice]

i was thinking about having a non mega raichu to pair with charizard y just so it can redirect lightning and help it outspeed things with nuzzle

[sudden remnant]

fake out, nuzzle,

just who do i run as a second mega just in case and who would be mon 6 after that

[rare pumice]

well if you're at a loss of options it's always good to fall back on creating a core i think

[sudden remnant]

the thing about fire is im not using incin for 2 reasons

[rare pumice]

one core with whimsicott, absol, and a dragon type as a fantasy core, then a second mode with whimsicott, jellicent, and a fire type as another core?

[sudden remnant]

i dont like it AND it disrupts my own strength sap

[rare pumice]

how is that?

[sudden remnant]

it lowers attack with intimidate

[rare pumice]

oh you meant as your partner, i thought you meant as an opponent for some reason, sorry

[sudden remnant]

lmao

yeah i ideally want a dragon and a fire type

[rare pumice]

well there aren't many pokemon that are both of those i think

[sudden remnant]

whim absol jellicent raichu insert dragon insert fire

[rare pumice]

really only one option that fits both, and it is a mega

[sudden remnant]

zard x is not an option cuz im not doubling up on physical attacking megas

i want one physical and one special

[rare pumice]

are you against megas that only have one typing

[sudden remnant]

which leaves me with like chompy z, altaria, zard y

maybe a few more i dont remember

[sudden remnant]

not at all

[rare pumice]

houndoom is not on the menu i'd say

[sudden remnant]

physical

[sudden remnant]

oh

special. wow

[rare pumice]

yea but it's also a dark type

[sudden remnant]

which isnt an issue

[rare pumice]

even if it doesn't share weaknesses do you really want your megas to share stab?

[sudden remnant]

absol isnt weak to fighting or bug
houndoom isnt weak to fairy or bug

so it being dark isnt an issue at all

[rare pumice]

idk i think the stab overlap is a big deal personally

[sudden remnant]

and it means absol can run shadow claw play rough xscissor(?)

[rare pumice]

i mean i guessss

[sudden remnant]

no knock off

hm. maybe its houndoom i dont run a dark move on then

even if its special knock off would still be good utility

and it has detect 😄

[rare pumice]

i think the primary issue with houndoom is that its ability is dependant on sunny day or other pokemon enabling it

[sudden remnant]

the evil and nefarious whimsicott:

moonblast tailwind sunny day encore

and then id want a dragon

[rare pumice]

yeah but liiike then you're impeding water spout's damage and then your only fire resists will be effectively taking neutral fire damage but if it's what you want sure

[sudden remnant]

i dont think id want jellicent next to houndoom anyways

[rare pumice]

if garchomp z gets a crazy good ability it might be a good special attacker that can eat ground type moves before mega

mega salamence is also notorious for hyper voice aerilate

[sudden remnant]

ehhhhhhhh no

[rare pumice]

a lot of people have been talking about mega drampaaa

[sudden remnant]

HELL no

[rare pumice]

well then garchomp z is kind of the only special attacking mega dragon type left

[sudden remnant]

grandpa cloud is way to slow

[solid frigate]

HELL YEA

[rare pumice]

unless you ran a special mega dragonite

[sudden remnant]

im liking the houndoom honestly

[solid frigate]

Nah if it gets drizzle Mega Drampa could potentially make TR rain possible lol

[rare pumice]

i just today learned that apparently whimsicott gets both tailwind and trick room so that's pretty whacky

[sudden remnant]

yeah whim gets tr

-5 prio instead of -6. hooray 😐

[rare pumice]

yea but i meant more like as anti trick room since indeedee was kind of ruling the world for awhile

[sudden remnant]

as i said indeedee is just that guy

[solid frigate]

It’s not in the game yet so into the Farigiraf purgatory lol

[sudden remnant]

okay lets take stock. mega absol z mega houndoom jellicent raichu whimsicott + a non mega dragon

[sudden remnant]

physical, special, special, adjustable to be mixed, special

definitely want a physical dragon

[rare pumice]

garshomp cries in the distance

[sudden remnant]

garchomp is an option for sure, could try non mega baxcalibur, uhhhhhhhhhh dragapult maybe, dracovish if it exists,

scratch that dragapult is a straight no

chompy, bax, demon fish dragon, and i feel ive forgotten someone

flygon and haxorus thats who im forgetting

probably just chomp i guess

idk tho cuz the only mon on my team that wouldnt mind sitting next to an EQ is whim

okay so absol z houndoom raichu jellicent whimsicott chomp/bax/dracovish (please give me dracovish nintendo gf and tpci)

[rare pumice]

earthquake may not be a great choice because of rillaboom's potential return anyways

[sudden remnant]

i wish they would throw a rilla at my absol and houndoom

id love nothing more than to torch that fucking thing

[rare pumice]

idk if absol z survives a grassy glide from rillaboom in grassy terrain

[sudden remnant]

i can ev it to live it

its speed is in a tier where i dont need much investment in it so i can give it some bulk

and if my calcs show absol is cooked regardless i have a whim and a dragon in the back that can eat the gglide

[rare pumice]

yea but dracovish is neutral to rillaboom and that terrain would probably push that over the edge i think

[sudden remnant]

we eat those

90 hp 100 def

sand rush for literally what reason

nevermind it makes sense its a fossil

[rare pumice]

i think strong jaw might be the choice since it affects fishious rend i think

[sudden remnant]

naturally id be using strong jaw

[sudden remnant]

it does that was dracovish’ whole thing

strong jaw boosted fiscious rend

[rare pumice]

i've heard it was used more in sandstorm teams to make sure the double power fishious rend activated

with like choice band or something

[sudden remnant]

252 max speed tailwind