To not get spored
#competitive_discussion
foggy lodge
bold geode
Yeah now Ursa and Amoonguss in TR
Eeeehhh
Not great
bold geode
I think there's a turn too many for Zach
foggy lodge
facade into the right slot???
bold geode
Nah I think you
Acro Crash
foggy lodge
But he needs the bascu to wake up
bold geode
Amoonguss didn't protect, MAYBE?
foggy lodge
Amoonguss takes the acro
bold geode
Or Dire Claw sleep maybe
foggy lodge
And facade rage powder again
That was 100% winnable for Zachary I didn't get the Rilla switch
bold geode
He had to switch Rilla in for something, he just got the slot wrong
foggy lodge
Like the worst case is facade sneasler dies and spore bascu but
Then you can fake out rilla to stall TR and wood hammer kills
foggy lodge
He had to switch Rilla in for something, he just got the slot wrong
No the Rilla has to get the free switch
bold geode
Nah the switch turn was the last TR turn
Actually swapping Rilla in the Basc slot made more sense
You block Spore, Sneasler goes down, you have Fake Out, you Fake Out Last Respects the Amoonguss and next turn you either Last Respects the Amoonguss and Wood Hammer the Ursaluna or you Wood Hammer Ursaluna
bold geode
I mean
Only thing that screws that is if they flip the targets there but makes more sense to Spore the Basc that way in case Zach goes for a double and actually gets it
foggy lodge
The ursa has to kill something there cuz both bascu and sneasler threaten a KO on ursa which is the win con
That way you always get the free switch into rilla and its out of TR and you just wood hammer or fake out
bold geode
Yeah
Idk I don't think that swapping there was a bad play, but the slot was just wrong
foggy lodge
I think Zachary just tunnel vissioned on Sneasler
bold geode
Same
Honestly I think if you're going to switch then yeah you go for Basculegion switch cuz like
It's just less obvious tbh
foggy lodge
NINETALES???
dense latch
huge turn
foggy lodge
You have to double switch here
bold geode
I'm guessing he dropped Kingambit
foggy lodge
You can't really rage powder cuz you have to cover the blizzard
And it still has encore pressure
tera ghost?
bold geode
Oh wait
You just bring Basc back in
foggy lodge
Waits its over
dense latch
the ko is pretty good for him
foggy lodge
Its blizzard wave crash nothing survives
bold geode
Wave Crash Blizzard
foggy lodge
The P2 is the only thing that can survive
bold geode
MAYBE P2 SURVIVES but it still doesn't wanna swap in
foggy lodge
There's not enough resources left
dense latch
p2 probably lives but it wont live next turn
foggy lodge
its over
bold geode
It's done for
dense latch
yea ggs off turn 1 lmao
foggy lodge
He has to preach for P2 to survive the double up and get TR up but something always dies
bold geode
Eh
Rillaboom in the back though
foggy lodge
Wait but there's rilla in the back right
foggy lodge
Its not like Dylan has anything left to fo
dense latch
oh interesting
foggy lodge
33% from a resist damn
bold geode
Huh?
dense latch
p2 is really scary now
bold geode
Yeah idk why you're not swapping out the Basc ever like
foggy lodge
crit ice beam huge
bold geode
Yeah Dylan pulled it back there
dense latch
that switch might’ve just lost him all the advantage
bold geode
Why don't you switch out the Basc
It's such a free Spore fuck me man
foggy lodge
The P2 has to live
bold geode
It's done for
dense latch
ONE TURN WAKE
bold geode
THE WAKE
foggy lodge
WAIT WAIT WAIT IT LIVED THE ICE BEAM
foggy lodge
Glide switch
bold geode
Nah
Crash Glide
bold geode
NOW YOU SWITCH OUT THE BASC YOU FUCK
foggy lodge
AND IT'S ENCORE NOW
bold geode
Is TR over?
foggy lodge
NONO BUT ITS FINE
bold geode
Wait
Jet Encore
foggy lodge
P2 has to pull the 1v2
bold geode
Ah fuck wait
foggy lodge
c'mon p2
bold geode
Jet Encore
dense latch
did anyone catch the snow turns
bold geode
Protect isn't horrible I guess
foggy lodge
protect is fine
dense latch
oh shit
foggy lodge
Blizzard aqua jet and then encore
bold geode
That's not a lot
dense latch
CRITTT
dense latch
WHATT
bold geode
Nah wtf
foggy lodge
its encore
bold geode
P2 is a fuckass mon
dense latch
it should’ve been encore way earlier i think
bold geode
What the actual fuck
foggy lodge
yeah you encore on icebeam
No snow
Moonblast aqua jet
ZACHARY HAS TO STALL THE TIMER
bold geode
Just Protect over and over
foggy lodge
the encore was too late
bold geode
Don't attack with A9 until you have to
foggy lodge
NO WAIT WHY
WHY DID HE ATTACK YOU HAVE TO STALL THE RECOVER PPS FIRST
P2 IS GOING TO WIN
dense latch
that blizzard was a choke
bold geode
THIS IS THE MOST FUCKASS GAME EVER
foggy lodge
now is ice beam
dense latch
the extra damage after recover would’ve done it
bold geode
Wait
Does Struggle hit Ghost types?
foggy lodge
how many pps does aqua jet eve have
dense latch
Wait
Does Struggle hit Ghost types?
yes
dense latch
NOOOO
bold geode
That's crazy
tiny karmaBOT
Sableye version 4.29.0
foggy lodge
WAIT DOES THE ICE BEAM AQUA JET TRADES WIN
bold geode
No freeze plz
foggy lodge
DYLAN NEEDS A FREEZE
ZACHARY WON???
AQUA JET KILLS NOW?
fishing the frame perfect ice beam freeze
dense latch
NO WAYYYYY
bold geode
That's fucking ass
rustic mountain
holy shit
foggy lodge
dense latch
LAS VEGAS BABBYYYY
rustic mountain
wat a set lol
molten oasis
Brother got so bailed out lmao
bold geode
That was complete fucking horseshit
molten oasis
Crazy last game
dense latch
yea
foggy lodge
Zachary choked btw
rustic mountain
Zachary choked btw
not knowing encore pp was def rough
dense latch
he had chances for a9 to get an extra move out
foggy lodge
Everyone is running 5 recover pp now
molten oasis
Really?
bold geode
Bro deadass fucking gambled in Las Vegas on a freeze and got it
molten oasis
Win off rng in Vegas lmao
rustic mountain
hahah he had so many freeze chances
molten oasis
He did that is true and he got it
rustic mountain
cant give ur opponent those opportunities
tiny karmaBOT
Sableye version 4.29.0
bold geode
Anyways
P2 Ursa won
rustic mountain
that was a good set
rustic mountain
fuck gambit that fucking fraud
molten oasis
Who could have seen that coming
molten oasis
fuck gambit that fucking fraud
Ong
rustic mountain
yea aaron is right, he shouldve just kept protecting on the encore recover turns
chipping urself down as they recover it back wasnt it
molten oasis
That was bad
bold geode
yea aaron is right, he shouldve just kept protecting on the encore recover turns
Yeah but I think why he didn't was because as we saw
He didn't keep count
rustic mountain
hard to see in the moment but yea that damage really hurt him
dense latch
it used 5 ice beams in vs bascu it's just over a 40% chance for it to happen
molten oasis
Huh
foggy lodge
Idk if encore into ice beam would win earlier?
dense latch
i can understand the encore counting being hard to manage at such a nerve-racking moment but that blizzard while p2 was recovering was unnecessary
rustic mountain
i think they thought the war of attrition would favor them as well as giving themselves the chance for a freeze w/ blizzards
molten oasis
Is fishing for the moonblast drop even that bad
Not really but more chances to freeze 
rustic mountain
nd prolly by the time they realized it was too late
foggy lodge
I think fishing for the moonblast drop wasn't that bad too
dense latch
woahhh they showcased latam champions finally!! no more making our own graphics lmao
molten oasis
That’s great
rustic mountain
didnt realize u were latam erik
foggy lodge
Cuz the P2 had like 6 icebeam pps left and the more you extend the period the more chances you have to win because
Then it can't hit you
dense latch
didnt realize u were latam erik
yea im from peru
foggy lodge
im also from latam💔
rustic mountain
right, just a lot to consider in the moment
i feel like we have quite a few latam players here
dense latch
im considering going to santiago since it's over the summer for me
foggy lodge
Come to see ussss
bold geode
nd prolly by the time they realized it was too late
Yeah
Tense set so it's hard but he needed to just slow down for a sec there and just start clicking status moves and just
Start counting
dense latch
otherwise im hoping lima's gonna be my first in person event
rustic mountain
Yeah
Tense set so it's hard but he needed to just slow down for a sec there and ...
yea
tough tho especially wen u taste the w
and all things considering they almost had it still even despite those errors
foggy lodge
I have to check game 2 too
rustic mountain
weve had some really good finals in sv era
foggy lodge
Idk if I'm missing something but the switch into rilla was so weird cuz free switch into rilla out of TR into wood hammer Ursa just wins right?
Unless there were more TR turns than I remember
rustic mountain
yea they shouldve sacked
still wouldnt of been a guaranteed w but atleast give themselves a chance, still would be sleeping basc or sneasler plus low health rilla that dies to 1 pollen puff after wood hammer recoil
again tho, so much goin thru ur head at that point, nd he put it to an end game that relied on a lot of 50/50s
which is not great
foggy lodge
okay I watched it
Maybe he was scared of a rage powder facade play?
Cuz I thought like yeah you can just target CC wave crash into the ursa because it can't protect and if they spore bascu you don't get locked into a move
I think that only loses to a double protect
But yeah its hard to really take into account everything when its a finals being streamed
bold geode
still wouldnt of been a guaranteed w but atleast give themselves a chance, still...
Wouldn't it not be bad to swap in Rilla to Basc in the Game 2 situation there and sac Sneasler?
bold geode
The spore can go to either side
Yeah idk
I just feel like Sporing Basc was more obvious no?
bold geode
Man that's just
Stfu
dense latch
that's zachary weed's twitter btw
bold geode
Oh that is LMAO
bold geode
Real
Let's be real here
How many of us would've actually have been able to keep track there
foggy lodge
Me of course!
Nah but this is actually a good way to learn
If you are playing encore
Always bring a notebook or something to keep track of the PPs
Actually this is a change I kind of want
Maybe it's ultra super niche but showdown doesn't let you change your PPs
dense latch
chat three people were running this team at las vegas is this the new meta??
bold geode
Me of course!
No you wouldn't don't lie
bold geode
chat three people were running this team at las vegas is this the new meta??
Don't do drugs kids
foggy lodge
chat three people were running this team at las vegas is this the new meta??
Conversion to 4-4?
dense latch
they unfortunately combined for 2-22
upper zealot
yeah i would definitely forget tbh
dense latch
snowball annihilape had a win and in for day 2
foggy lodge
Excuse me what
dense latch
a wyrdeer team too
bold geode
Idek if I want answers to that one
tiny karmaBOT
Sableye version 4.29.0
foggy lodge
+1 if hitted by A9 or P2 basically
foggy lodge
@dense latch do you know who ScarletSkill is?
next stump
that is dylan
foggy lodge
Saw his twitter account
He tweeted something about dropping VGC and that this week
And then he won this regional lol
dense latch
o lmao
rustic mountain
shadow wind
Turn 1 🥀
shadow wind
Can we be so for real
molten oasis
Chi Yu’s signature move, double missing heat wave
molten oasis
Can we be so for real
Damn it came back to bite you
shadow wind
And then they double protected and won 😝
molten oasis
That’s rough
cyan smelt
Wow I should definitely play chi yu
shadow wind
Kalos in the nicest way possible no one wants to hear you complain about your gameplay
It's all you've been doing and it's a bad vibe
shadow wind
Cause it is
You look out for fire types and then gamble
I've been seeing loads of specs Chi yus too
Not a fan of them
Doing 25% to my AV bolt with heat wave
Guy must the rainbow up or something
stone trellis
I've been seeing loads of specs Chi yus too
Specs Timid?
stone trellis
Do you have anyone on your team that's naturally above 152 and below 167 Speed?
shadow wind
Nope
stone trellis
Try testing it out.
shadow wind
Twin I said I didn't
My Ogerpon is 169 speed and flutter is 193 and everyone else is below 120
shadow wind
My goat has this
cyan smelt
Is kommo-o easy to use
shadow wind
I would say no
It does feel like playing a bad restricted though
Also holy smokes, guy thinks he's Ttar
Kommo is fun though
Just kill me now
Ah heck nah
We saying dragons maw dragon fang draco doin 78?
cyan smelt
Yeah you're right nobody wants to hear me complain so I'll just try and figure out what I want to use ig
shadow wind
🫡
Kommo might 6-0
He did
I lead him and won
I OHKO'd the Dnite with body press
I take it back, Kommo might be easy
cyan smelt
Kinda bad to have a whole team of physical attackers isn't it
shadow wind
Fo sho
Ok this was a good example for why Kommo is sick
I killed the only mon that posed a huge threat and then set up and won
Also Kommo might be carrying me
62% 🥀
It's over
molten oasis
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2026regfbo3-2482793143
It was so over once Prima died
molten oasis
Nice
molten oasis
Yeah flutter seems rough for that team
If it breaks through volc and wellspring it just kinda has its fun lol
shadow wind
Like I haver QD volc and tera fire bulletproof Kommo but a single urshifu and it's over
molten oasis
Yeah and most flutter have shifu
shadow wind
It's rough
molten oasis
Indeed
shadow wind
I don't understand how rain doesn't dominate the format
molten oasis
Raging bolt
shadow wind
But Lando
shadow wind
Nah I would need a fairy resist
And I know Volc is
But it feels off
Amoonguss would fit but then I struggle into other Amoonguss
What in the 2-2-2
Time to gamble !!
cyan smelt
I'm gonna work on my mental before I play again
molten oasis
What in the 2-2-2
Hate that team sm
shadow wind
I'm not having fun against it
molten oasis
Obliterate your lead t1 then get stuck dealing with dozo
shadow wind
God might be good
molten oasis
God might be good
I wonder if you can beat the dozo
cyan smelt
Seems like ur playing well against a variety of teams
shadow wind
Holy moly
cyan smelt
Are you using bulletproof for basically shadow ball and being pretty much immune to flutter
shadow wind
Yeah
shadow wind
Cause my flutter MU is hot garbage
molten oasis
Are you using bulletproof for basically shadow ball and being pretty much immune...
Doubles as a dengo one too
cyan smelt
Does kommo-o have any moves to deal with flutter
shadow wind
I still lost because specs Chi yu hurts
shadow wind
Does kommo-o have any moves to deal with flutter
Iron head or shadow claw
I like shadow claw cause crit chance
molten oasis
I still lost because specs Chi yu hurts
Damn
molten oasis
I like shadow claw cause crit chance
But flinch!
tiny karmaBOT
Sableye version 4.29.0
shadow wind
110 speed
molten oasis
Oh
shadow wind
We not outspeeding and flinching anyone
cyan smelt
Is clangorous soul kommo-o a fraud then
shadow wind
I would say so yes
molten oasis
Man I need a better flutter answer
Hearthflame
cyan smelt
Landorus
shadow wind
I already got waterpon twin
cyan smelt
Orthworm?
shadow wind
Yeah I don't know what they thinkin
molten oasis
Aw hell nah lmao
molten oasis
I already got waterpon twin
Then it’s waterpon
Rilla also works as a flutter answer
Where’s your av?
shadow wind
Bolt
molten oasis
Hm, maybe not
shadow wind
I'm bout to not have fun
I also need an Amoonguss answer
So a fire type is what I need
molten oasis
Nooo lmao
real prairie
So a fire type is what I need
firepon over water pon?
shadow wind
Actually doesn't sound crazy
molten oasis
Bolt should handle every single water type perfectly fine
shadow wind
🥀
shadow wind
Trying my best
shadow wind
It's ok guys
molten oasis
Hopefully the haxing stop
shadow wind
+2 Gouging just did 9% to Kommo
real prairie
Full Para is probably the only thing in this game that makes me want to throw my switch at a wall, everything else I can accept
cyan smelt
Is gouging fire on fraud watch
shadow wind
I won with my lead
shadow wind
Full Para is probably the only thing in this game that makes me want to throw my...
Nah tbolt para into full para
tiny karmaBOT
Sableye version 4.29.0
shadow wind
Twave is a part of the game but tbolt para is tilting
molten oasis
Is gouging fire on fraud watch
Ddance gouging fire sets suck
shadow wind
Big ball of stats
molten oasis
Howl sets are fine
shadow wind
Yeah I really like howl support sets
molten oasis
Like yay I ddanced now I still don’t outspeed flutter and still struggle to take ko’s
real prairie
Twave is a part of the game but tbolt para is tilting
any % chance then the roll the effect is painful.
Remember in GC getting froze by a single blizzard in the rain
cyan smelt
I remember losing to covert cloak blursa and tilting so hard
shadow wind
Also tera fire Kommo clears tera steel
molten oasis
Cloak blursa is wild
shadow wind
Not getting burnt is so awesome
real prairie
Howl sets are fine
the heat crash sun sets seem decent
molten oasis
That’s probably okay too
But why pick gouging fire over bolt on a sun team?
I’d rather play wake even
real prairie
But why pick gouging fire over bolt on a sun team?
they usually have both
molten oasis
Do they? I guess they share dragon and ground only which isn’t too bad
shadow wind
Ok so now I have a question
shadow wind
Do I run overcoat or bulletproof with Amoonguss on the team
real prairie
is pollen puff a "spore" move?
shadow wind
Cause bulletproof blocks pollen puff
molten oasis
is pollen puff a "spore" move?
Its not a powder move
shadow wind
So I'm not sure
molten oasis
Spore sleep powder poison powder etc are powder moves
shadow wind
Rage powder
real prairie
Its not a powder move
i was about to say, thats peak if both its abilities block pollen puff 🤣
molten oasis
Would be crazy lmao
molten oasis
Sludge bomb is great into the ogerpons, maybe not as much hearth
But into wellspring it’s solid damage
molten oasis
Rilla ig
shadow wind
It's so weird
molten oasis
Pollen puff helps keep the guy alive
shadow wind
Kommo walls 50% of the meta then can't even hit the other 50%
Which means I would need to run overcoat
molten oasis
Kommo-o also wants to use body press which is horrendous into flutter
molten oasis
Also not sure how much it wants to deal with bolt
shadow wind
Probably offensive
real prairie
does he not get heavy slam? but i guess then what are you dropping for it
molten oasis
Not sure if I want offensive or support hearth
Hearth is one of those mons that can do all 3 lmao
Be fast be bulky hit hard (w/ Tera
shadow wind
Yeah but if I have Amoonguss I'd probably want offensive right?
+1 0 Atk Hearthflame Mask Tera Fire Ogerpon-Hearthflame-Tera Ivy Cudgel vs. 252 HP / 4 Def Landorus: 170-202 (86.7 - 103%) -- 18.8% chance to OHKO
molten oasis
I think 2 redirect is perfectly fine honestly
shadow wind
Ok wait this is wild
molten oasis
Hearthflame is a perfectly balanced Mon
shadow wind
Oh but 156 invest to always OHKO
shadow wind
Wait that's so weird
It's the same invest for Firepon to kill with tera and waterpon to kill no tera
shadow wind
shadow wind
I thought tera fire +1 would be more though
shadow wind
Oh I forgot the stab boost already
molten oasis
Yep
shadow wind
Like for waterpon
And then multipliers are funny
Also that paste
Anything look super terrible?
molten oasis
https://pokepast.es/6ef987355785070e
Solid, try it out
molten oasis
I can't hit fairies
To hit flutter for neutral?
shadow wind
Nah I mean tera fairy
molten oasis
Fair
molten oasis
True
molten oasis
Lmao
shadow wind
I would say a good first test run
I really like Kommo in this meta right now
Wow my team has 5 grass resists
2 quad resists
We HATE Rillaboom
And my team still only has 3 Legendaries
Whoa Amoonguss just did 50 to Ogerpon with Sludge
molten oasis
Solid
shadow wind
No invest on my Amoonguss either
0 SpA Amoonguss Sludge Bomb vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Ogerpon-Wellspring: 92-110 (59.3 - 70.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
That's a lot more than I would've thought
molten oasis
Nice
shadow wind
Dude Waterpon is so scary to play against
I just know that crit is coming
Team feels good so far but I didn't find any of the hard MUs so it will need more testing
molten oasis
lol
shadow wind
Didn't see a Dengo
But Incin should lowkey handle it
I'm so bad at using Incin
But I'm great at using bad mons
First time I've worked out a team and made it better
Usually I'm a first draft warrior
Don't mind the Raikou, he saved my child from a burning building once
stone trellis
That's a lot more than I would've thought
It is still a STAB 90 BP super effective move.
shadow wind
Oh yeah for sure
stone trellis
Unless the user is literally Smeargle and the target is named Kyogre, Groudon or Ice Rider, that shit will probably hurt.
real prairie
First time I've worked out a team and made it better
this calm mind Bolt?
molten oasis
Av
shadow wind
Yeah AV with snarl
I wonder if special moves are better for Kommo
Like instead of shadow claw I run like flame thrower or something
molten oasis
Like instead of shadow claw I run like flame thrower or something
Tera fire flamethrower seems solid
shadow wind
Yeah like that would make Dengo easier as a whole
I know I just added Hearthflame but shadow claw does not put in the work
Oh yippee I get to 3HKO a flutter mane
Do that with flamethrower anyway
real prairie
feel like with 2 redirects and a fake out user you could easily run CM Bolt
shadow wind
With what lefties?
Cause I got that and booster on the team already
And I’m not the biggest fan of magnet or lorb on CM
cyan smelt
yeah i definitely get too tilted even when playing randbats
molten oasis
Cause I got that and booster on the team already
Yes lefties calm mind
shadow wind
But Kommo already got lefties
And bro needs them badly
I mean I could go Sitrus
And give Incin the AV
rare pumice
does terrain pulse get turned into 150bp if used on terrain with mega launcher?
waxen dock
does terrain pulse get turned into 150bp if used on terrain with mega launcher?
i think
foggy lodge
waxen dock
https://x.com/tsltang0508/status/1990248621154111588?s=20
i calculated it too
rare pumice
does Azumarill ever run huge power sets where it invests more into bulk than attack? like for example using assault vest with some defensive ev spreads?
i feel like it's something worth looking into since huge power already takes its attack stat so far
foggy lodge
Huge power doesn't really take it that far
No investment only reaches 140 attack which isn't really a lot
stone trellis
Adamant would probably also help a little.
You could even run something like Bulk Up + Sitrus Berry so you get the best of both worlds.
shadow wind
No investment only reaches 140 attack which isn't really a lot
What makes Huge power so broken is that it doubles your eve and nature boosts as well
While he’s with no investment it can be kinda mid if you go 252 adamant it’s way way way better
stone trellis
Yeah, 252 Adamant makes it act like it has base 152 Attack.
And then Choice Band makes that 254.
latent ember
bro im ngl koraidon is kinda cooked in champions
no tera is rooooough
and primal kyogre does not sound fun to deal with
maybe better in dynamax formats?
stone trellis
and primal kyogre does not sound fun to deal with
I'm far more concerned with Primal Groudon.
What the fuck is Korai going to do to a guy whose entirely uninvested Defense at level 50 is 180?
latent ember
maybe better in dynamax formats?
helps gmax zard and along with paradox mons, maybe ran aside a restricted less reliant on weather/terrain like zacian or something? especially since zacian will likely excel in dmax formats
stone trellis
And it's not like Flare Blitz makes up for CC's problem because Groudon's part Fire now.
latent ember
What the fuck is Korai going to do to a guy whose entirely uninvested Defense at...
yeah but un-overrideable rain is damn near impossible to beat lol
stone trellis
I really hope Desolate Land activates Proto.
latent ember
i'm 90% sure it will
stone trellis
yeah but un-overrideable rain is damn near impossible to beat lol
So is un-overrideable sun.
latent ember
So is un-overrideable sun.
sure but at least koraidon can function in sun
stone trellis
I think Pdon + Zacian would still be great.
latent ember
for sure
rustic mountain
tera helped a lot for certain mons things will def b different in champions. idt it makes koraidon outright bad but def will make its life a lot harder
latent ember
protosynthesis mons, gmax solar power zard, chi yu
stone trellis
Especially since Pdon can genuinely run whatever it wants.
latent ember
tera helped a lot for certain mons things will def b different in champions. idt...
GOODBYE HORSIES 😹 ✌️
stone trellis
Icy + Primal Kyogre would be objectively really funny.
latent ember
god i hope we never have a tera format with xerneas
although
they're definently inclined to create a tera + restricted format
because of that damn tera turtle
even though terapagos has been some ass in the later half of scarlet violet
rustic mountain
GOODBYE HORSIES 😹 ✌️
csr will still b good
solid frigate
Honestly with Xerneas being here people wouldn’t hate CSR this much
stone trellis
Name one Tera that saves Xern from Zacian and Pdon.
solid frigate
But CSR is a whole different thing so we are not gonna ignore them anyway
stone trellis
Poison, Steel and Fire are all victims to the hellspawn lizard.
latent ember
yveltal also matches up great into the horsies
rustic mountain
i dont even think cir will b bad w/o tera it just gets worse
stone trellis
Xerneas is the freest Primal Groudon + Zacian upscale ever.
stone trellis
i dont even think cir will b bad w/o tera it just gets worse
Yeah, my GOAT will no longer be in the top 3.
You hate to see it.
rustic mountain
Xerneas is the freest Primal Groudon + Zacian upscale ever.
good thing xern has teammates and another restricted partner in that case
latent ember
bye bye hard trickroom ✌️
rustic mountain
stone trellis
Who, Pdon?
latent ember
you had a decent run in SV
stone trellis
Pdon is the best Pdon counter anyway.
solid frigate
yveltal also matches up great into the horsies
If Xerneas is here then Yveltal ain’t gonna be that common
rustic mountain
u think xern has reasonable checks then ppl just counter those checks and xern is still good regardless
stone trellis
Mega Ray dies to Zacian and Primal Kyogre is probably the best option.
latent ember
If Xerneas is here then Yveltal ain’t gonna be that common
depends how good zacian is
stone trellis
Which is why I hope Raging Bolt can slam the whale.
stone trellis
depends how good zacian is
You got that reversed.
Zacian's quality will depend on how many people run Xern.
latent ember
fair yeah
rustic mountain
you had a decent run in SV
hard tr isnt going anywhere tho, it exists in every gen
same way tw ho exists
latent ember
hard tr isnt going anywhere tho, it exists in every gen
was it winning multiple regionals in previous gens?
rustic mountain
it won like 1 this gen haha
latent ember
Which is why I hope Raging Bolt can slam the whale.
raging bolt getting double buffed by pdon mirai
stone trellis
Give MDB some time to figure that out.
latent ember
it won like 1 this gen haha
2 technically but yeah
my point is, with CIR viability going down, so will hard trick room's
stone trellis
raging bolt getting double buffed by pdon mirai
All three are Pdon victims.
I genuinely love how that thing is so broken, its only real weaknesses are itself and Landorus.
latent ember
is incin in Z/A?
stone trellis
It is.
latent ember
is lando?
stone trellis
Nevermind, I don't know.
rustic mountain
my point is, with CIR viability going down, so will hard trick room's
eh maybe in higher level formats, stuff like lunala will still exist idt its completely joever either
latent ember
defo a lunala nerf without tera sadly
solid frigate
I don’t think CIR is gonna be like out of Meta territory
Maybe without Tera it would lose some of the potential but like it would not be gone
rustic mountain
I don’t think CIR is gonna be like out of Meta territory
Maybe without Tera it ...
exactly
latent ember
neither is lando
fuuuck we're not getting a repeat of worlds 2022 then lol
although maybe i don't miss the rock slide merchant thaaaat much lol
rustic mountain
we dont really know wat will be allowed wen champions drops tho
latent ember
yh fair
stone trellis
is incin in Z/A?
I know for a fact that Modest Pdon hits slightly harder than Lorb base Groudon, who already rolls for a KO 56,25% of the time.
So EP would kill.
solid frigate
Like if you are in a out of The meta territory (SV Groudon for example) then you have some problems (either with the environment of the meta or something literally does thing better than you)
rustic mountain
p much yea
latent ember
I know for a fact that Modest Pdon hits slightly harder than Lorb base Groudon, ...
honestly hard TR's best hope is Ursaluna matching up well into pdon lol
rustic mountain
groudon was like fringe meta tho (borderline top 10 restricted) id say out of the meta is like the rays, necrozmas etc
latent ember
i think ursaluna is gonna get even better in restricted formats in champions
solid frigate
It already is (I fucking hate Miraidon Lunala lol)
rustic mountain
but wat u said is still tru torrent, it did hav issues into the meta and did have things that did a better job
foggy lodge
it won like 1 this gen haha
2*
rustic mountain
i think its tough to really envision wat the strength of a lot of things will be before knowing the format
foggy lodge
More respect to my god CIR
solid frigate
Isn’t that Koraidon
latent ember
i mean, CSR*
solid frigate
fuck u tenor
Embed fail
latent ember
Isn’t that Koraidon
sucker punch with 0 atk investment obliterates shadow rider
and CSR Zama was the team to beat going into worlds
solid frigate
I mean in terms of bringing Bonnet
rustic mountain
ofc monke comes in just for that
bold geode
Yeah
solid frigate
ofc monke comes in just for that
Kinda expected already anyway
bold geode
What else did you expect
rustic mountain
i guess nothing
bold geode
Wow
Bro has no faith in me
bold geode
Pagos was cooked before Champions LOL
latent ember
pagos unironically worse then necrozma
foggy lodge
You think?
bold geode
Horrible mon
foggy lodge
I think that if you are allowed to have both tera and mega
bold geode
Mega Tera Stellar Terapagos
rustic mountain
any1 who made it to finals w/ that mon is a tru gamer
foggy lodge
It will be cooked cuz the hitting teras for SE will no longer be that good
bold geode
Super Tera Stellar Terapagos
rustic mountain
u cant even activate its other ability
solid frigate
Its already a fact about Pagos is ass
It hits like a wet noodle even with Specs
latent ember
It will be cooked cuz the hitting teras for SE will no longer be that good
make tera starstorm super effective against megas
foggy lodge
pls
latent ember
mostly joking
solid frigate
Compare to idk Miraidon who can nuke everything
foggy lodge
To cook mega gengar
rustic mountain
how do u even switch to stellar tho for the form/ability change w/o tera
itd just b base w/ tera shell
foggy lodge
I remember Alex had a +6 Terapagos at EUIC with tera clicked tera starstorm into tera fairy av Miraidon and did like 60%
Dude wasn't even close to killing LMAO
latent ember
I remember Alex had a +6 Terapagos at EUIC with tera clicked tera starstorm into...
LOL
bold geode
how do u even switch to stellar tho for the form/ability change w/o tera
The only thing I can think of is if they separate the abilities which is so ass
solid frigate
I remember Alex had a +6 Terapagos at EUIC with tera clicked tera starstorm into...
It’s just Lugia 2.0
If you can see the similarities
latent ember
why does scream tail lowkey feel kinda goated into primals
rustic mountain
The only thing I can think of is if they separate the abilities which is so ass
wdym
latent ember
i might be straight lying idk
rustic mountain
they already are separated they require certain conditions to activate
nd if those conditions cant be met in champions then like thats kinda it
bold geode
they already are separated they require certain conditions to activate
Yeah but like
Make one of them a hidden ability
bold geode
Yeah either or which is still ass
foggy lodge
latent ember
idk one of my biggest hopes for champions is seeing new abilities for a bunch of the older restricted
solid frigate
Honestly the bulk of Pagos is almost non existent
rustic mountain
major cope
bold geode
I just don't think it's ever good LOL
bold geode
"Got games on your phone?"
solid frigate
Like wdym you get Killed by one Close Combat
latent ember
how is ursa gonna do in dynamax formats
rustic mountain
i think ogerpon will suffer a bit too, sure it wont be bad necessarily but not being able to flex between the 2 abilities was one of its biggest strengths
foggy lodge
Like wdym you get Killed by one Close Combat
That's why we run bold
latent ember
i think ogerpon will suffer a bit too, sure it wont be bad necessarily but not b...
god rest in piece hearthflame my glorious king you were so funny
bold geode
i think ogerpon will suffer a bit too, sure it wont be bad necessarily but not b...
I think if they like
Did the thing I mentioned about Pagos with Ogerpon it actually wouldn't be too bad
latent ember
grassy glide gaming will live forever 😔
solid frigate
That's why we run bold
That one Choice Band Urshifu saying hello
rustic mountain
ur forgetting tho like the abilities have secondary impacts tho, ogerpons gain +1 in their respective stat and pagos can hit teras for se and starstorm becomes spread
latent ember
if i could choose any pokemon to get nerfed going into champions
its easily urshifu
rustic mountain
those arent negligible
bold geode
Actually that wouldn't be bad for Ogerpon cuz there's like basically one ability for each form you'd rather have LOL
The only one you'd debate is like
Wellspring
rustic mountain
it wouldnt be good, ur still forgoing the benefit of getting +1 atk, +1 sp def etc in certain instances
idt ogerpon suffers as much as pagos will but still
they also might just not allow them in the game for those formats
latent ember
they put Zmoves right at the front just to make it loud and clear the end is coming
rustic mountain
which champions does offer the flexibility on
foggy lodge
I need champions
latent ember
i think we get champions in like march or sum
rustic mountain
looks like april/may release
latent ember
if i were to guess
rustic mountain
maybe march
latent ember
didn't we get confirmation on worlds 2026 in champions or sum? i might be straight lying
rustic mountain
yea
not outright stated but implied since we know champions will be wats played on for worlds
latent ember
i wonder how reg f would look if we didn't have raging bolt
rustic mountain
bolt isnt even that bad ppl overexaggerate so much
latent ember
i don't hate him that much but he certainly has a pretty huge effect on the meta
so are we just waiting until christmas to bring back walking wake or what
latent ember
ngl i might be schizoposting but
i think game freak REALLY wanted hard trickroom to work going into SV
since it's such an easy team to pick up and play for newer players
indeedee and ursaluna and CIR are geniunely insane buffs
solid frigate
bolt isnt even that bad ppl overexaggerate so much
You have Lando,Flutter and Pao
More than enough
foggy lodge
Worst part is the indeedee buff was accidental LMAO
latent ember
Worst part is the indeedee buff was accidental LMAO
yuuuup LOL
god i like Lele but goddamn psychic terrain is annoying sometimes
bold geode
it wouldnt be good, ur still forgoing the benefit of getting +1 atk, +1 sp def e...
Yeah in certain instances it's bad but like
It's definitely not a horrible thing cuz like
latent ember
dude the idea of a non-restricted format with paradox mons + Koko sounds fucking crazy
foggy lodge
I miss Tapu Fini
latent ember
ON GOOOOD
bold geode
You got Rock that wants Sturdy more
Teal wants Defiant
Hearthflame is kind of good without Mold Breaker so it would like Embody Aspect if it can choose to run that ability unless like maybe SD sets with Mold Breaker are fine
Wellspring is the only one that really has a really tough choice
latent ember
fini my beloved
foggy lodge
The dexit of this game was kind of shit
bold geode
Wellspring has to choose between the Spdef boost or Water Absorb
foggy lodge
No ultra beasts no marowak no ferrothorns
latent ember
i still think miraidon might lose dazzling gleam
bold geode
Actually @rustic mountain If anything it's not the ability interaction loss that sucks, it's the fact it can't change type
latent ember
being able to turn into a baby xerneas on a whim with tera fairy was crazy
i hope the pon will still be good
latent ember
yeah you're right that motherfucker has follow me and ivy cudgel
plus for some reason the masks give flat 20% buffs lmao what were they thinking
would not be shocked to see that buff be brought down to 10%
bold geode
That's the thing
I think that it can pick abilities just fine if they go that route, but there's certain instances where Ogerpon likes or needs to drop the Grass typing and without Tera you cant do that
latent ember
im glad that worlds ended this year with a tera stellar sealing the set
because we are never seeing that shit ever again lmao
foggy lodge
And people thought tera stellar was bad
latent ember
to be fair
its also fucking fluttermane
god i just know they're gonna nerf my goat
bold geode
And people thought tera stellar was bad
Tera Stellar Sash sets are peak
latent ember
quick name a fast frail focus sash tera stellar user that's competetively viable other than chien pao and flutter mane
fuck its sneasler
latent ember
ts is not fast in the big 2025 🥀
ok so
was gigantamax urshifu ever any good?
more so than normal urshifu?
foggy lodge
Nah
latent ember
thank god
foggy lodge
Urshifu didn't benefit from dmax
latent ember
they're kinda sick tho i can't even lie
the gmax forms i mean
im impartial to base shifu aside from his impact on the meta
crazy how they balanced CIR and CSR around gen 8 and then created tera the next generation
one more thing
what are the odds that terapagos can override the primals weather condition
the turtle's last hope
dense latch
was gigantamax urshifu ever any good?
you'd usually have other pokemon you'd much prefer to dmax
ursh dynamaxing was usually a last resort
stone trellis
Doesn't Dynamax also not work with the Choice items or something like that?
dense latch
yea choice items would be disabled when dynamaxed
stone trellis
Yeah.
Scarf Shifu's objectively the best one out of the four variants too.
So losing access to that is kinda bad.
dense latch
sash was the better item for it in swsh
foggy lodge
It was an eleki format so makes sense
dense latch
plus all the dmax moves that would just delete anything
thundy max lightning/airstream and lando max airstream
rustic mountain
Yeah in certain instances it's bad but like
It's definitely not a horrible thing...
yea ogerpon is still a solid mon i just do think it loses some value w/o tera and what it does for them
bold geode
Yeah for sure
rustic mountain
thundy max lightning/airstream and lando max airstream
max airstream 
i love how they implemented the nerfs for fighting and poison but speed they r like nah
dense latch
lol i was just about to mention that
rustic mountain
like bruh
dense latch
like it'd still be really strong with the nerf
rustic mountain
yea
maybe something they change in champions
im curious how they decide to rotate formats
dense latch
yea same
also wonder how many gimmicks they'll allow at the same time
I don't see Dynamax working next to the other gimmicks
solid frigate
also wonder how many gimmicks they'll allow at the same time
Probably 2
Like in Gen 7
rustic mountain
I don't see Dynamax working next to the other gimmicks
maybe w/ z moves
otherwise hell no
shadow wind
Dynamax Tera dragon mega Zygarde or whatever
rustic mountain
almost assuredly well have z moves and mega at some point together
the others? gets dicey
shadow wind
Z moves and megas are splashable gimmicks cause they’re items
But the rest are way too sporadic
solid frigate
I’d say Mega+Tera can work but like it’s still pretty much confusing
craggy dagger
prolly not
shadow wind
How do they have an entire team that loses to Incin
foggy lodge
By using your own Incin
shadow wind
Scream tail 6-0'd me
My fault for not having a way to hit fairies
Encore disable + double fake out is just a noob check and I failed it
wooden gyro
Is this good
wooden gyro
A decueye
With a adamant nature
With spirit shackle solar blade leaf blade and brave bird
shadow wind
Whoa +2 defense Kommo just did 88% to a Bolt
wooden gyro
Then a incineroar with flamethrower sunny day darkest lariat and flare blitz
shadow wind
🥀
Twin just make a paste
Man I think I suck at non restricted formats because my self preservation is so bad
I have no 700 BST guy that can just win for me
shadow wind
I wonder if Waterpon is now better on the team now that I have flamethrower on Kommo
shadow wind
Is Kommo just non restricted Zama?
Like I know that Zama has a way better typing and all that and there's been a lot of body press guys in the past
bold geode
Is Kommo just non restricted Zama?
Closest to it I guess
cyan smelt
Poor hoodra
shadow wind
Hoodra even has shell armour
Man I just had the most intense game of my life just for game 2 to be ended on turn 3
Ogerpon-Wellspring @ Wellspring Mask
Ability: Water Absorb
Level: 50
Tera Type: Water
EVs: 20 HP / 156 Atk / 4 Def / 140 SpD / 188 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Ivy Cudgel
- Horn Leech
- Follow Me
- Spiky Shield
Also is this spread like ok
It outspeeds Timid Lando and OHKOs with Cudgel on 252 hp Lando
Literally the only thing I calced it to do
I just realized my team doesn't have a steel or ground move
Gweezing was not fun
molten oasis
Huh
foggy lodge
I just realized my team doesn't have a steel or ground move
Galarian Weezing my goat
But he can't play without restricteds💔
shadow wind
Yo screw tera grass Landorus bro
A whole loser
I hate tera so much
Let the mon with 2 weaknesses be able to keep those weaknesses
Like how does Landorus manage to be the pain of my existence in every meta
foggy lodge
Slap ice shard pao on your team
shadow wind
Just make it a real Zama larp
Grassy seed Kommo
I finally found my line into that one Crown team
Cause AV bolt and Waterpon kinda rip it apart
I think I have a really bad problem of trying to bring Kommo every game
shadow wind
I love when my Kommo does 92 to a Landorus with body press
I think I might make him slightly faster though
I need to invest 2 more speed to outspeed timid Landorus after an icy wind
Might be one of the hardest games I had to play
Tera darkfu wicked blow just blows up everything
They definitely hard called me turn 1 which made it way harder but everything after that I was cooking
I've been seeing way more Glimm recently
shadow wind
Oh cool
foggy lodge
WE ARE GETTING SIDE STREAM FOR ICS LET'S GO
rustic mountain
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2026regf-2483303667-eiyykck26ynaii2g50aom26s28haxs4pw
wen ur opponent thinks they have a bolt counter
shadow wind
Was about to ask that
Bulk up -> hard switch to the top
Man my GXE will never be above 70 in non restricted formats
It ain't even close
My consistency when Groudon leaves the teambuilder 📉
shadow wind
Got to 1380, definitely don't want to come tumbling down
shadow wind
I have indeed tumbled and all I can say is I strongly dislike crits
Played #5 on the ladder and lost game 3 to a crit
molten oasis
Damn
shadow wind
Yeah
Wasn't too happy with that one
And they were playing that new Glimm HO that takes around 4 braincells to pilot
Ok wait
If I change my Incin to AV and change my Bolt to lorb I wonder what MUs get harder and easier
molten oasis
X
shadow wind
Wait I know that name
I think they do limitless tours
And yeah it really does feel like that
I need to enter the lab tomorrow and build a good Kommo team
Oh wait ror2 dlc 3 drops tomorrow
In the next week or so I need to enter the lab
real prairie
Morning
cyan smelt
sup
real prairie
Actually not much, have had a couple months of pure hell but the clouds broke yesterday and things are looking bright now 😄
WBU?
cyan smelt
haven't felt like playing pokemon much
need to get my mental in order before i start playing again because i tilt too easily even in randbats
real prairie
haven't felt like playing pokemon much
I've suddenly got a urge to team build, need to build something I think can get top cut in B'ham
need to reclaim my title
waxen dock
need to get my mental in order before i start playing again because i tilt too e...
So play dou
Its a meta with avlot of noobs and its similar to vgc
cyan smelt
i'm not doing that, i need to have a better attitude to losing first
solid frigate
need to get my mental in order before i start playing again because i tilt too e...
Honestly same but I’m just depressed more than anything about Playing the matches mental
modern cliff
Could someone help me pick out moves for this team is for bd Infernape
Ability: Blaze
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Close Combat
- Acrobatics
- Thunder Punch
Roserade
Ability: Natural Cure
Tera Type: Grass
IVs: 0 Atk
Gyarados
Ability: Intimidate
Tera Type: Water
IVs: 0 Atk
Honchkrow
Ability: Insomnia
Tera Type: Dark
Electivire
Ability: Motor Drive
Tera Type: Electric
IVs: 0 Atk
Gardevoir
Ability: Synchronize
Tera Type: Psychic
IVs: 0 Atk
real prairie
what format? and please use paste's
modern cliff
im eating right now and its anything goes i just need help with the moves
real prairie
im eating right now and its anything goes i just need help with the moves
not many people here play singles, so we will struggle to help