competitive_discussion

[spiral ridge]

Yeahhh

Prob just move metal coat and lo

[rustic mountain]

u could go a little wacky and go specs

for pult

[spiral ridge]

Yeah but I wanted it physical as lots of special attackers already

Wait no wrong way

[rustic mountain]

ud b split 50/50 no?

whims/dengo/pult for sp and gambit/gallade and h arc for physical

[spiral ridge]

No gallade here

I think I did this before some other guys so I didn’t know the damage split

[rustic mountain]

oh i didnt realize the items got swapped on the gallade team

[spiral ridge]

I quite genuinely can’t remember but I did have a reason for physical I promise 😭

Might’ve just been there was shit moves to choose

[craggy dagger]

[rustic mountain]

well the move choice u had on the og pult one is a bit weird, usually u want like dragon darts, ghost move, u turn for pivoting and the 4th slot is usually flex i have p force there. outrage dragon tail and psychic fangs are all pretty meh for it

[craggy dagger]

uhhh
pult likey physical though
plus takes advantage of clear body

oh is scotty showing the original

[rustic mountain]

it can be special though they were running 3 atk goth i didnt think that was too far out there considering haha

[craggy dagger]

mm yeah

scotty why are you hiding because i’m here

[cyan smelt]

Do you think perish trap will make a comeback

[craggy dagger]

you know i don’t bite

[rustic mountain]

nah. itll be around somewhat but idt its winning anything in reg h

unless like wolfey picks it up again or something

[craggy dagger]

toed trap

[cyan smelt]

You can still pivot out with U turn and parting shot right

[rustic mountain]

yea

[spiral ridge]

No hi just went on insta for a sec

[spiral ridge]

[rustic mountain]

[spiral ridge]

Okay this is cus I suck ar switching and making right call and outrage is cus I forgot it went into random slot. And dragon tail was to bring palafin back to zero form

I had u turn originally and never used it lol

[rustic mountain]

well thats stuff u gta work on haha. nd wdym bring it back to zero form

[spiral ridge]

Yes this is how goth fell apart 😭

[rustic mountain]

u turn doesnt really get clicked too often but i click it somewhat, it has merit

[spiral ridge]

If you dragon tail it out during hero form doesn’t it revert?

[forest arrow]

https://pokepast.es/46ae943b84e77fbc
debating on going back to Pollen Puff over Sludge Bomb but heres a sand team im liking atm

[spiral ridge]

I actually never had a chance to test this

Went to bed before I could

[rustic mountain]

no? ive never heard of that

[spiral ridge]

Okay so that’s TWO issues with this team of me not understanding mechanics

[rustic mountain]

once palafin switches out unless neutralizing gas is active, once it switches back in, itll be in hero form

u cant revert it once its transformed

[spiral ridge]

I thought it could go back and forth. I see

I was not here for early Regs to know this😭

[rustic mountain]

yea its a lot of mechanics and interactions to get down

no worries

[spiral ridge]

So yeah that’s the 3-5 am ass pull team

[rustic mountain]

jus stuff u now know going forward

[spiral ridge]

I have worse teams from when I was a kid and didn’t even know what a reg was. So I did anything goes and used stuff I liked

I
Zero attacking moves blaziken

You don’t wanna know

[rustic mountain]

i didnt event know vgc existed wen i was younger

def wouldve played it

[spiral ridge]

Same here

I just remember some YouTuber about singles showdown videos where he got people mad by being good

[rustic mountain]

lmao

[spiral ridge]

Which now looking back he only did singles to abuse stuff

As singles is much easier to fuck up

[rustic mountain]

i mean singles is its own thing

some of those yt accs are gimmicky and some ppl were even found to fabricate the videos

[spiral ridge]

He only did annoying gimmick stall shit that would be infuriating and suck joy outta playing

Where’d nova go did she hide away when I got back
@craggy dagger helloooo I also don’t bite get back here

[rustic mountain]

i got into comp during swsh and i started w/ singles. stall is the reason i jumped ship to vgc and i never really looked back tho i did recently have a streak playing randbats

[spiral ridge]

Love randbats

[plain drum]

I bite

[spiral ridge]

Especially FFA with friends

Hey eni

[plain drum]

You two doing good?

[spiral ridge]

Yuh just chilling in bed

[rustic mountain]

yea randbats are honestly fun. its been a few weeks but ill get back into again. i was thinking of maybe going for top 500 for fun i was like 300 or 400 points off

[spiral ridge]

Listening to records

[rustic mountain]

1800s atm and its like 2190s or 2200 for top 500

[spiral ridge]

Ah good luck
Just curious what’s your reg H points?

[rustic mountain]

i have like 4 or 5 accs in top 500, 3 are 1400 +

[spiral ridge]

Jesus nice

I’m struggling to break 1300 I got super close once but then bad matches. Moving around the 1200-1250 mark usually when I stop playing to chill

[rustic mountain]

its early format nothing crazy haha im jus really enjoying reg h so far

[spiral ridge]

It’s been fun for me. Basically playing same way as last reg

Instead of knowing how restricted play it’s just a pool of things that play in a similar way to each other and can do some strong shit

The restricted in this reg is just knowing what things do what combos and stuff

[rustic mountain]

its all about improvement, if u feel ur making progress its fine. its not always about the rank its about the quality of game and what your takeaways are from your losses and even wins

then the consistency follows

[spiral ridge]

Oh I’m having fun dw about that

[rustic mountain]

nice

[spiral ridge]

I’m not a competitive person I hate the anger people have during competitive shit

I’m here for fun and can’t hurt to try and go higher

[rustic mountain]

ahh ok, well thats fine too i think knowing what u want out of the game is the most important

[spiral ridge]

Yeah I take it seriously and will get upset if few bad matches but I get genuinely upset legit only to alolan muk

Cus I know the match will just be hell

[rustic mountain]

wen i ran into it i had palafin

so haze jus came in clutch lol

[spiral ridge]

I have sacred and kowtow so accuracy and defenses don’t matter

[rustic mountain]

its an annoying strat to deal with. generally i find all my friends are dead is the best way to approach it (ko all its partners and then deal w/ it with presumably an abundance of more resources if u play it well)

[spiral ridge]

It’s just hard to balance their second slot especially when they bring out a big boy attacker

[spiral ridge]

Yeah just if it’s a moody Strat letting it get damage stats is terrifying cus drain punch typically

[rustic mountain]

drain punch muk? i dont think ive seen that

usually they are minimizing for 3 turns so u dont really need to worry much about it

knock off/toxic/minimize and protect or poison stab i think are its staples

[spiral ridge]

I’ve gotten drain punched

[rustic mountain]

weird set then lol

[spiral ridge]

Moody attack boosted drain punch and I’m the one who’s moody after 😭

[knotty briar]

I'm preparing a trick room team for reg H and this is what I've got so far
Any suggestions for the last 2 mons?

[knotty mirage]

Primarina i guess it should be on good
trick room

[knotty briar]

Prim? Really?

That's unexpected

[knotty mirage]

I mean it can cover your water coverage and can decimate dondozo with perish song

Or you know just go for fem indeedee and armarouge

[knotty briar]

If I did go prim, what should my last mon be

[knotty mirage]

I'm not sure the reg not even started yet on in game ladder maybe the only thing i can think off is prankster mon like murkrow grimmsnarl or klefki

[knotty briar]

Most prankster mons don't fit too well with this team

[knotty mirage]

I mean dual screen support seem's useful too me

More survivability for BM ursa

[knotty briar]

Always useful sure, but it's not really a trick room strat...

[knotty briar]

That thing has been tearing up reg G
I'm not worried about it's survivability in the lower power level of reg H

No urshifu, no ogerpon, no iron hands, no caly ice, no problems for blood moon

Ooh, maybe I'll use hydrapple

[cyan smelt]

You might need something for when tr runs out

[mighty stump]

Bold statement

[knotty mirage]

[cyan smelt]

Isn't mausape and rilla a significant problem for bm

Also pelipper arch

[mighty stump]

MausApe is less so if you have Farig

Peli Arch is dependant

Rillaboom is definitely a threat against BM lol

[knotty briar]

How's this?

[craggy dagger]

prankster trick iron ball though

[craggy dagger]

ooo
that looks nice

[knotty briar]

Should I go bulk instead of speed on arch since this is a trick room team, or should I leave it as is so it can function outside of trick room?

I'm also thinking about running power herb instead of av so arch can have protect and not always have to rely on peli

Any thoughts?

[craggy dagger]

ehhhhh

[still river]

Arch needs AV

It can't really do its whole thing without it

[craggy dagger]

i’d keep AV on archa as well as replacing dragon pulse for draco meteor-
you’re running electro shot so you should be fine to lower your SpA a little bit

[still river]

After all, pelipper is necessary on your team to counter dangerous weather based mons like torkoal

[knotty briar]

Gotcha thanks

[craggy dagger]

ehhh
archa doesn’t need AV

[knotty briar]

Trying to improve my team-building after all

[craggy dagger]

especially in this reg since there’s no Lando I staring you down imo-
but that special defense boost is really nice

[still river]

I mean without av it becomes kinda similar to ursa-bm

And man it does not take special hits well

[craggy dagger]

better than Bloodmoon-
by a lot

[knotty briar]

Should I keep damp rock on peli or is there a better item to use

[still river]

Sorry I meant without

[still river]

Focus Sash or sitrus berry

[knotty briar]

I'll probably go sitrus then

Thanks

[still river]

No problem

[craggy dagger]

also for archa maybe i’d run a 5 EV spread?
having stamina and um
not having any defense EVs is a bit weird to look at-
as wel as um
hp bulk is also appreciated quite a bit

[still river]

Archa tends to run a really high ev investment in hp

[knotty briar]

Bulk instead of speed
Gotcha

[still river]

Usually it'll go 252 in hp and sacrifice some special attack evs for special defense evs

[craggy dagger]

yeah!

i mean you’ll add a bit into speed anyways but when you’re stamina and AV there not too much you need to worry about

[still river]

I'm excited for the regionals happening during reg h

It'll be super fun to play against the variety of teams people will bring

[craggy dagger]

but worlds-

[knotty briar]

How much sp att should I sacrifice for sp def

[still river]

Worlds is always fun lol

[still river]

I personally run 204 special atk but I apologize, it actually sacrifices it for speed evs

[craggy dagger]

this was a-
um
set that Tofu made for Reg F
Archaludon (F) @ Assault Vest
Ability: Stamina
Level: 50
Shiny: Yes
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 12 Def / 4 SpA / 236 SpD / 4 Spe
Modest Nature

• Flash Cannon
• Snarl
• Body Press
• Breaking Swipe

[still river]

252/0/0/204/0/52 is what I have

[craggy dagger]

though this is much more supportive instead

[still river]

Interesting

Tho for reg h archaludon has much more potential as a damager

[knotty briar]

I'm using a much more offensive set for reg H

[craggy dagger]

maybe something like this for offensive?
Archaludon @ Assault Vest
Ability: Stamina
Level: 50
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 HP / 36 Def / 36 SpA / 116 SpD / 68 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk

• Electro Shot
• Flash Cannon
• Body Press
• Draco Meteor

[still river]

This is pretty good but why the defense evs

[knotty briar]

Stamina makes defense evs almost irrelevant

[craggy dagger]

you could use a little extra for a kick in body press stamina-

[still river]

Haha true actually

[craggy dagger]

maybe 4 EVs into defense and add more into speed

[still river]

Or if u run dual speed control u could put it into special attack or defense

[craggy dagger]

but it’s inefficient to run a 4EV spread so

[still river]

Honestly reg H is the format I've seen dual speeds be the most viable ever

It's cool to see

[craggy dagger]

i just added a bit more in um
defense

[knotty briar]

Yeah I'm probably gonna put it in sp attack

Ok so this is the ev spread I'm probably going to use
How's it look?

[craggy dagger]

that looks good enough-

though i'd calc some stuff just to be sure it can take specific hits

[knotty briar]

I'll run a few test matches in showdown later

Mind helping me polish off the peli set?

This is what I've got so far and I'm well aware it need adjustments

[craggy dagger]

i mean peli is pretty simple
252 SpA 252 Spe 4 Hp, timid nature
sash
weather ball hurricane tailwind protect/wide guard

[knotty briar]

Speed instead of bulk on peli
Gotcha

[craggy dagger]

mhm

plus whatcha gonna get out of 252+ Defense?

[knotty briar]

Was going for bulk before I remembered tailwind

[solid frigate]

The set its meh but why sitrus

[knotty briar]

Ok, so how's this

[knotty briar]

Was told sash or sitrus on peli

[craggy dagger]

i would still run sash-
though if you wanna sitrus you’d have to make a 5EV spread imo

[solid frigate]

heah

[knotty briar]

Alright, now what about the tera

[craggy dagger]

[knotty briar]

Yeah but misspelled

[solid frigate]

[craggy dagger]

i knowww
i’m just teasing him

[solid frigate]

[knotty briar]

I currently have tera ground, but should I run grass to prevent spore and rage powder?

And lilligant sleep powder

[solid frigate]

I usually run Tera Steel Water and Flying Coverage takes out the weakness

[knotty briar]

Tera steel peli eh?

[solid frigate]

you can use Ground if you want

[craggy dagger]

a steel peli?

[knotty briar]

Out of curiosity, what does steel give it that grass doesn't?

Unless I'm given a reason to go steel over grass, this is the team

How's it look?

[solid frigate]

more resistances and Steel is weak to Fire,Ground and Fighting which Weather Ball and Hurricane can deal with

[knotty briar]

The only thing grass peli would have to be truly worried about is poison and Landorus-incarnate won't be in reg H

[modern harbor]

does anyone know if the static pokemon like bloodmoon ursaluna have different stats during the battle portion from after you catch them?

[pearl wind]

they are the same during battle and when caught

[knotty briar]

I've been using this team to shred through reg G, so reg H is gonna be pretty jarring

[pearl wind]

thats why resetting for 0speed and 0atk is possible with that arbolivia method thingy because you can check the stats of ursa-bm during battle

[modern harbor]

so i can use a mon thats 1 speed faster than min speed and just wait for it to outspeed? instead of catching it

[pearl wind]

yep

[craggy dagger]

ælyzzzzz

[pearl wind]

[knotty briar]

After spending so much time and effort perfecting my reg G team, I'm somewhat disappointed that I can't use it after this month

Welp I gotta get some sleep
Nite everyone

[craggy dagger]

gn!

[modern harbor]

UM???

I WAS RESETTING FOR BLOOD MOON URSALUNAS AND I GOT A 0SPEED 1ATK

LITERALLY PERFECT

[still river]

Nice

[mighty stump]

@torn parrot would u mind just adding Regulation G in full for both the rentals just so it’s searchable thanks

[gentle crag]

woodtofu has given 1 Gen Rep to mayahoppins

[odd sandal]

I am making a team for the new regulation so far I've got Sneasler, rillaboom, Incineroar and ursaluna blood moon. I'm not sure what other mons I should put on the team, any suggestions?

[mighty stump]

Probably something to enable BM Ursaluna to actually work.

Spamming Fake Out cycling isn’t sufficient.

Easy slot on would be Farigiraf so you don’t have to play the FO mirrors, get additional TR for BM Ursaluna, and help cover the MausApe MU better

Cause with those 4 you’ll definitely get rolled by MausApe

[odd sandal]

So if I use Farigiraf what should go into the 6th slot?

[mighty stump]

Completion of FWG would give you a pretty standard defensive core. Somethjng like Palafin or Primarina can be considered. The only thing with FWG is that sometimes it has trouble dealing with Archaludon as well.

So in that asoect, Primarina can help

It does however give fairly limited options when dealing with something like Dondozo

With HH BM from Ursaluna being one of your few options to try and burst it down

[zinc totem]

i wonder if its beacuse gambit apes /hazekrows that tatsudodo isnt seen much in reg H

[next stump]

There are two supported game modes, Single Battles and Double Battles. Single battles are 1 pokémon on each side of the field at a time whereas Double battles feature 2 pokemon on each side of the field at a time.

The official competitive mode that the Pokemon company sponsors with real life tournaments is the Double Battles mode, otherwise known as VGC (Video Game Championship).

In VGC, you create a team of 6 pokemon and choose 4 to bring to each battle. When you play battles, you gain or lose ranks on a global leaderboard depending on if you win or lose.

The game undergoes various rulesets that usually last 3-6 months. These rulesets either allow additional pokemon (usually legendaries) or ban some pokemon. We are currently in a ruleset called “Regulation G” which allows basically all pokemon (no mythical pokemon) but you can only have one restricted legendary on your team. We are about to enter a new ruleset though which will ban Paradox pokemon and legendary pokemon.

If you have any other questions feel free to ask them, I just covered the VERY basics

[gentle crag]

.tw1st3d_m1ndz. has given 1 Gen Rep to mlbd

[next stump]

You can only terastilize once per battle, but all 6 of your pokemon will have a tera type just like the story mode. Some pokemon have tera types that cover their defensive weaknesses, others choose a tera type that accentuates their offenses

[mighty stump]

Lol, if you disrespect dozogiri in Reg H that’s just a foolish thing to do

[zinc totem]

oh i dont disrepect tatsudozo, that one is most annoying thing and probs only combo im losing mainly, im just surprised it isnt run more regularly beacuse its probs one of top duos along mausape

tho i need probs drop hoodra to hazecrow probs or swap pelipper and basculegion for something else. Wish pelipper got haze tho haha

[chrome knot]

gm tofu

[civic sphinx]

hi everyone! im new to competitive pokemon (first time o bought switch online, and first time i play any online mode in pokemon), and im getting familiarized with the mechanics. its better to start training from level 1 the IVs or its ok to just train one of the pokemon i already have?

[next stump]

you can only hypertrain a pokémon’s IVs if they’re level 50 (I think it’s level 50 now)

[plain drum]

Yep, 50 for SV

[mighty stump]

gm emma

[mighty stump]

yea

[chrome knot]

hello.

[ornate elk]

Hypertrain Ivs?

[mighty stump]

Emma i’ve figured out a team methinks

[chrome knot]

yeah?

[jade dust]

We need a new water steel

Empoleon is sadly bad

[chrome knot]

@torn parrot

[jade dust]

If it had scald or a non hydropump water move would be better

Well water pledge

[mighty stump]

Yeah but it’s Reg G

0 clue if it works but we ball

[chrome knot]

christ

[nocturne holly]

Tofu what do I need to calc for support maus?
Putting it in this https://pokepast.es/518d67eeb4263592

[molten oasis]

Morning

[molten oasis]

I’d suggest looking at wave crash from Pala and drain punch from ape

[foggy lodge]

I found this

[molten oasis]

ZACIAN MADE IT LETS GOO

[foggy lodge]

It's the usage stats from 1700 ladder in showdown

[foggy lodge]

https://tenor.com/view/mike-wazowski-monster-inc-magazine-photo-gif-13639031341708838979

[molten oasis]

Wow wellspring has more usage than corner and hearth, didn’t expect that

[foggy lodge]

probably because of Urshifu

[molten oasis]

Probably yea

[foggy lodge]

And Kyogre had a jump in usage

[molten oasis]

Kyogre good

[foggy lodge]

Idk how well Ogerpon works as a Urshifu counter since it can safely u turn it but yeah

Maybe for the sash sets that are more common

[jade dust]

I’m surprised Incineroar isn’t 1st anymore

[chrome knot]

ursh & rilla serve a fuck ton more utility rn

[jade dust]

Eh

That’s questionable

[chrome knot]

no it aint

[jade dust]

To say

[foggy lodge]

Rilla gives you match up into Miraidon and psyspam things with Caly Shadow

Urshifu deletes everything lol

[molten oasis]

It’s not an urshifu counter lol

It’s more a “I can’t click surging strikes” now

Close combat and u-turn still do a lot of damage

[jade dust]

Yeah but incineroar has intimidate, parting shot and being able immune to prankster

[molten oasis]

What’s the, what’s going on?

Oh I see

[jade dust]

Rillaboom removes terrain but also is considerably weaker if they remove grassy terrain

[knotty mirage]

Just taunt the ogerpon should do the trick most of the times

[molten oasis]

If you have a taunt Mon

[knotty mirage]

Well i mean i always pair urshi with torn anyway

[molten oasis]

Still doesn’t hurt shifu that much to click close combat and it’s not hard for it to pivot with u-turn

If you’re not scarf then ig that’s fine

[molten oasis]

Rilla’s also a faster fake out and a lead like rilla/shifu is a lot of immediate pressure on the field

[jade dust]

Being faster isn’t always a good thing when weather and terrain are to consider

[molten oasis]

And rilla being slower than miraidon immediately gives it the upper hand against it

[jade dust]

Yeah but min speed Indeedees

[chrome knot]

incin is good with a purpose, you named tools incin has but that is it

[jade dust]

And this thing

[molten oasis]

First of all are there a lot of indeedee’s rn?

[chrome knot]

if you lead rilla into an indeedee team ur stupid

[molten oasis]

Exactly

[chrome knot]

i understand high elo stats aren’t for everyone and if you don’t get it, thats okay!!!

[molten oasis]

this is a genuine question lol

[chrome knot]

yes csr indeedee is rly good rn

[knotty mirage]

I really want to try banded shifu should be really good if paired with torn in theory

[jade dust]

Well considering I made it top 500

[molten oasis]

In cart

[chrome knot]

i do not care about cart ladder sorry.

[molten oasis]

The by far easiest way to hit top 500

[jade dust]

Wdym

[solid frigate]

i literally made it into top 500 in 5 FUCKING WINS

THATS HOW EASY IT IS

[molten oasis]

It’s just not hard to hit top 500 in cart

[jade dust]

You drop later in the season if you don’t keep winning

[molten oasis]

Ok

[jade dust]

What cart

[solid frigate]

idc about cart ladder

[molten oasis]

Showdown has better players, cart is the game itself

[jade dust]

Why call it the cart

[molten oasis]

Most of us here climb on showdown, which has a much higher skill ceiling

[solid frigate]

especially if you want your team to accel on the gameplan and Composition then Showdown is easier get that thing

[chrome knot]

cartridge

[molten oasis]

Cartridge, game cartridge

[knotty mirage]

I can only play on cart ladder because i don't think my phone can play showdown at all

[jade dust]

Ah lmao

I thought cart as shopping cart

The first thing came to mind

[molten oasis]

Ic

Anyway impressive feats on cart ig would be top 100, ig

[solid frigate]

Insert Facepalm

[molten oasis]

Idt grinding carts a good idea anyway

Cart has very weird stuff

[chrome knot]

top50 lmao

[molten oasis]

Gtk

[jade dust]

It gets tougher but I managed to stay top 500, but yes top 100 would be impressive

[solid frigate]

just grind Showdown lol

And i just double Para someone in Shodown kek

[knotty mirage]

Just wondering is it true most of cart player is japanese player ?

[solid frigate]

Yep

[jade dust]

Yes

[knotty mirage]

In my experience in there i always meet japanese name that is

[jade dust]

There are so many Japanese players

[knotty mirage]

Oh okay that makes sense now

[solid frigate]

which honestly its fine if you want to learn Japanese Meta but i digress

[molten oasis]

Japanese circuit is bo1 CTS I think

[solid frigate]

not a lot of Japanese played in Regionals anyway

[solid frigate]

yes which is just sad

[molten oasis]

Idt it’s bo3 OTS like it is here

[knotty mirage]

It's more like i can't really play showdown because device problem

[jade dust]

CTS?

[molten oasis]

Closed team sheets

[knotty mirage]

That's what why i only play cart ladder

[jade dust]

Ah

[molten oasis]

Open team sheets, OTS

[solid frigate]

they have it,Just not in SV but in Japan Nationals

[jade dust]

Yeah a lot of Japanese players run weird shit that can catch you off guard

[molten oasis]

Oh was that, oops

[chrome knot]

no Japan Nats was BO1 CTS until top cut

[molten oasis]

Ah

[jade dust]

But I’m not one to talk when I run a weird team

[solid frigate]

i mean it does exist

[knotty mirage]

Most of times it can makes my blood pressure go up because closed team sheet

[molten oasis]

Oh ig the first 3 letters of that are bad, gtk

[jade dust]

I like the idea of open teams so you don’t fall for weird shit

[molten oasis]

Anyway didn’t this start due to a misconception with incin and rilla/shifu usage?

[jade dust]

Incineroar is the goat so yes

[solid frigate]

wait who started it first?

[knotty mirage]

Well i mean there a reason why people despise global challenge

[molten oasis]

Shrekers and, uhhh

Idk if anyone else did much

[jade dust]

I said I was impressed Incineroar wasn’t 1st

[molten oasis]

I’m not

Shifus insane, makes sense it’s #1

[solid frigate]

I’m not as well

It makes sense Shifu and Rilla are close due to more consistent with specialised Matchups

[molten oasis]

Unfortunately incin is the bane of my existence

[jade dust]

The thing is Incineroar always does its thing and nobody really builds a direct counter to incineroar, while for urshifu, people make direct counters

Incineroar kinda always does its thing

[molten oasis]

Shifu is a incin counter, kinda

[solid frigate]

Its honestly Pretty easily to beat Incin lmao

Urshifu exists lmao

[molten oasis]

Incins also a skill check Mon

[chrome knot]

if you have a brain incin isnt an issue

[molten oasis]

Also right, shifus a check

Check>counter usually

[knotty mirage]

Is there even build that let incin live surging without tera ?

[chrome knot]

no

[molten oasis]

If you invest heavy into physical defense it has a chance

[chrome knot]

actually maybe

[jade dust]

Well Iappa berry

[solid frigate]

If you give it sitrus berry i guess

[molten oasis]

But idk anything is guaranteed

[jade dust]

With a berry it lives

[chrome knot]

sitrus berry in an amoonguss format

[solid frigate]

[1.Why Iappa]

[molten oasis]

I’ve seen one live my own SS without Tera or berry

[jade dust]

Those berries that restore 33% hp

[solid frigate]

Sitrus Does the same thing lmao

[molten oasis]

But I also only run 156+

[knotty mirage]

Okay so need huge investment on defence and berry

[molten oasis]

No

Sitrus is 25%

[jade dust]

Not really, max HP is enough with a berry

I use max hp and max atk

[molten oasis]

Tell that to a calyrex on the field

What

[solid frigate]

What

[molten oasis]

On an incin???

[knotty mirage]

[solid frigate]

BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD

[knotty mirage]

Kek

[jade dust]

Yes, max atk to have strong knock off and flare blitz

[chrome knot]

LOOOOOL

[molten oasis]

[solid frigate]

BRO WHAT THE FUCK LOL

[molten oasis]

That’s not, no lol

[solid frigate]

DONT TELL ME YOUR TEAM IS ALL MAX MAX MIN

[chrome knot]

alright wrap it up guys i found the issue(he doesn’t understand stats bc hes low elo)

[jade dust]

No lmao, some things have split defenses

Or investment in a defense and hp

[solid frigate]

yep exactly.

[solid frigate]

we love some Scream Tail Propaganda

[jade dust]

You’re bullshiting rn

[molten oasis]

Ok well incin needs to have its attack evs out into defense to maximize its bulk and get more intimidate/parting shots off or go max speed since you’re running CIR

So your incin is always slowest under tr

I believe I’ve seen some people do that

[solid frigate]

Incin in Reg G is pretty darn Flexible so makes enough sense

[molten oasis]

Don’t run max attack incin

It’s worthless for the role it’s trying to accomplish

[knotty mirage]

Okay the thing is i have incin with max HP and respectable defence EV with sitrus berry it still got one shot by urshi

[molten oasis]

Because it’s shifu

Shifu just built different

[solid frigate]

yep

anyways

[molten oasis]

Anyway uh, I’m gonna try playing again next week, I’ll be around

Goal of the month is fixing bad habits

[jade dust]

I run min max in caly but that’s obvious

[solid frigate]

Tbh i might still build teams cuz none of the teams Click in Reg H

[jade dust]

Max Hp and atk is what caly needs

[bold geode]

Eeeeehhh

[molten oasis]

You can always let the meta develop

[solid frigate]

there are some Caly Ice which invest on some Special Bulk

[solid frigate]

yeah exactly

[molten oasis]

Not always

[bold geode]

Patrick Connors didn't have max max

He won NAIC just fine

[molten oasis]

The extra investment in bulk is helpful

Or speed investment can be nice for mirrors

[knotty mirage]

Just going to say this i seen alot of people on cart ladder use AV caly ice not sure why tho

[molten oasis]

Incin isn’t as much of a problem

[solid frigate]

You don’t want this to happen in Endgame without Tera lol

[foggy lodge]

Really?

[solid frigate]

I can’t edit lorb atm

[molten oasis]

That’s what I’ve heard

[bold geode]

Also did I just see max attack Incin from chat

[molten oasis]

It’s shrekers

[solid frigate]

yep of course is from him.

[jade dust]

I mean caly ice is naturally bulky and needs to get those initial kos to get going

[molten oasis]

[foggy lodge]

idk what you do to other calys being faster tbh

[bold geode]

Aight let's not shit on people here

[foggy lodge]

Maybe i'm just oblivious

[molten oasis]

It has 165 attack

Base, it’s fine lol

I was letting you know who monke

[jade dust]

Yes but still isn’t enough to 2 round an electric seed farigiraf

[bold geode]

Now that being said, it don't need max attack to get those KOs, you can get them via playing the board, just as long as Caly I finishes the job

[jade dust]

Which is fucking annoying with foul play

[molten oasis]

Bruh that’s electric seed Fari

Thah should be expected

[bold geode]

Electric Seed Farigiraf is there BECAUSE of the Caly Ice MU

Or the item at least

[knotty mirage]

I mean i guess it could work there one time when i got caught off guard with close combat incin

[bold geode]

Just double the fucker

[bold geode]

You smokin somethin?

[solid frigate]

about that…..

252 SpA Life Orb Quark Drive Iron Crown Tachyon Cutter (2 hits) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Calyrex-Ice Rider: 218-266 (105.3 - 128.5%) -- guaranteed OHKO

[molten oasis]

Yep

[jade dust]

Well Tera water already makes caly ice very hard to remove

Psychic ice is shitty typing

Literally pure Tera ice is better

[foggy lodge]

I love the electric seed set of Farigiraf

[solid frigate]

have you not seen the Floor is Yellow-

[jade dust]

No, fuck it

[molten oasis]

I think I’m gonna play miraidon if I play reg g

[solid frigate]

exactly

[solid frigate]

eyyyyy need some sauce?

[torn parrot]

Sure thing 👍

[molten oasis]

I love zacian

[torn parrot]

https://tenor.com/view/miau-cat-meow-gif-9406008167044251375

[knotty mirage]

I mean i only play on cart ladder so yeah i don't think what i'm saying mean much

[molten oasis]

She’s great, I hate how weak I feel to fucking CSR

with Miraidon I get Bloodmoon/fari

[jade dust]

Oh yeah the reason I had max atk incineroar is cuz it could ohko zacian in swsh

Now I remember

[solid frigate]

Miraidon is Fine against Caly Shadow or Caly Ice

[bold geode]

I mean it was a thing, but like
I don't really think of it as something to recommend lmao

[torn parrot]

Oh gawd I really hit the weird limit

[molten oasis]

I’ve never heard that statement before

[jade dust]

What the fuck are you smoking, I need it

[solid frigate]

idk i just dont know that i am fine against it due to well….

Landorus-

[knotty mirage]

Fair enough but i mean if you play on close team sheet it could be nice surprise

[mighty stump]

So its not mirai

keke

[bold geode]

Here comes Tofu to say skill issue

[solid frigate]

idk how to explain lol

[jade dust]

Miraidon doesn’t like caly ice besides amoonguss or electrabuzz

[foggy lodge]

Anyone plays Caly Ice here that could help me with that match up?

[jade dust]

Or in trick room

[solid frigate]

I think you have to see my Mirai Team first-

[jade dust]

Doesn’t like caly shadow either

[molten oasis]

Isn’t Mirai kinda bad into the caly’s?

[bold geode]

What is team

[jade dust]

Yes

[foggy lodge]

Gimme one second

[bold geode]

Iirc Caly S was weird but manageable
Caly I MIGHT be a decent MU?

[molten oasis]

Maybe I’ll play kyogre lol

[solid frigate]

I think thats the main Reason why Iron Crown is in My Miraidon Team lol

Iron Crown and Lando I

[jade dust]

What can those do to caly s lol

[molten oasis]

I already run rain with Zac

[bold geode]

Get your wet ass dog outta here

[molten oasis]

Same to you

[solid frigate]

Lando I is Scarf.

And Most Calys Run either Tera Fairy which i can use Sludge Bomb or Tera ghost.

[molten oasis]

Go run something better

[solid frigate]

look like bro did not take the Memo

[bold geode]

HEY
Mfer needed a bath, your dog was already washed

[foggy lodge]

https://pokepast.es/8c146c78ad3ddb99

[molten oasis]

Idk bro I don’t see any zama’s anywhere

[solid frigate]

Iron Crown Pressures Caly Ice in Endgame if Miraidon is not Dead and still alive

[molten oasis]

Just see a certain horse

[jade dust]

Well if they don’t have any speed control or screens

[solid frigate]

hold up

Lemme pull the turtle out

[jade dust]

Screens make caly s even more cancer

[solid frigate]

Trick Room Fari and Tailwind Whims?

[bold geode]

Now someone correct me if I'm wrong
Actually @mighty stump shouldn't Entei and Ogerpon do well against Caly I here?

[solid frigate]

Do you know what Scarf Lando Hits in Speed?

[molten oasis]

Uhm

[foggy lodge]

Gholdengo also works

I think i can't bring Koraidon to that match up tbh

[jade dust]

Not higher than tailwind caly

[bold geode]

Tera Water Goldie does better into Caly I, but I understand the Normal for Caly S

[gentle crag]

Result: 229.500000

[jade dust]

And not lower than after you clafable

[molten oasis]

Something like that torrent

[solid frigate]

I have Tailwind On My Team and Trick Room-

[bold geode]

Fuck I have to get back into Reg G brain
Actually I need to ladder to Master Ball

[jade dust]

Hence why I said this

[solid frigate]

its 252 speed if its Max Speed Scarf Lando

[bold geode]

Aight Thundurus Therian, get back to work buddy

[molten oasis]

Not a bad thing

[molten oasis]

You’re timid?

[jade dust]

I was running amoonguss exactly to stop after you clafable

[molten oasis]

I gave you the modest 252 calc

[solid frigate]

if its Timid,But Modest is your calc

[gentle crag]

Result: 252.000000

[molten oasis]

There ya go

[bold geode]

@molten oasis did Stamina Duck win again last night?

While we VC'ed?

[molten oasis]

Yea pretty sure

[solid frigate]

I need some context in what happened

[bold geode]

Ok
@mighty stump I've come to the conclusion that Stamina Duck is eternal

[molten oasis]

P2 against archaludon

I think you csn paint the picture

[bold geode]

P2 Traced Stamina

And just
Would not die

[jade dust]

It’s one of the few cases that Archaludon got a personal move that isn’t STAB

Very few mons have that

Why does Victini learn the dragon trio moves again

[solid frigate]

LMAO THE FUNNY

i need to do the tech one day lmao

[bold geode]

The duck was
ETERNAL

Well the thing is it's a roll if you get it

[solid frigate]

we praise the eternal duck

[bold geode]

Cuz my understanding was it traces the ability of the Pokemon right across from you unless the ability wasn't able to be traced, but it didn't work like that all the time

[solid frigate]

its a 50/50 most of the time

[bold geode]

Apparently it can Trace Good as Gold, so I'm waiting for that

[forest arrow]

Stamina duck putting in work lol

[solid frigate]

im screwed lmao

[bold geode]

Babe I'm cold
Let's snuggle

[forest arrow]

Babe I’m at work, come save me from my misery

Then we snuggle

[solid frigate]

lol

[forest arrow]

Ok back to work I go, gm everyone!

[bold geode]

Tf I already started laddering?

[bold geode]

Fuck it come here

[molten oasis]

[plain drum]

LMAO?

[bold geode]

8-10 Wildbolt Storms
Not a single one para'd

[chrome knot]

wtf did i come back to

[bold geode]

Dogshit

[chrome knot]

i KNOW

[bold geode]

Thundy let me down

[molten oasis]

idt that what she was refering to

[bold geode]

Ribbity toilet

[molten oasis]

https://tenor.com/view/explode-spongebob-gif-749203212715440276

[mighty stump]

Nice gif bozo

[chrome knot]

tofu

[mighty stump]

Wat

[chrome knot]

ursh rilla are over incin in usage my fantasy is goated

[mighty stump]

Based

I think Rilla > Incin

[molten oasis]

shut up

[chrome knot]

https://tenor.com/view/iron-leaves-pokemon-pokemon-scarlet-and-violet-gif-4551971412055280233

[molten oasis]

they havent been working today its annoying

[bold geode]

Iron get back here

[chrome knot]

iron fuck you

[bold geode]

Iron stay

Iron your mom

[molten oasis]

Iron shut up

[bold geode]

Iron your mom

[molten oasis]

you're gonna iron my mon? thats weird

[bold geode]

Yeah she has wrinkles

[molten oasis]

so do you

old man

[bold geode]

No I have rolls

[molten oasis]

sure

[solid frigate]

what

[solid frigate]

the Mon i dont know how to build lol

[molten oasis]

good its trash

[solid frigate]

Honestly its meh

Boulder At least gives Rock Coverage

Iron Crown is Fine but still lacking in MU

[molten oasis]

its not good lol

[torn parrot]

Tell that to Mr number 1 guy

[molten oasis]

ok

[craggy dagger]

[solid frigate]

Nova Lurked

[timber falcon]

any reg H teams i can use

struggling to build my own

[craggy dagger]

i’m addicted to iron ball sableye

[mighty stump]

side eye

[timber falcon]

things havent been going my way since rayquaza

[mighty stump]

kek

[timber falcon]

you said you made some kinda chesnaught - armourouge - blastoise team right?

[craggy dagger]

[timber falcon]

how did you find a function for blastoise

[dapper crag]

Pokémon No. 9: Blastoise

Type

Water

Abilities

Torrent, Rain Dish (Hidden)

HP/Atk/Def/SpA/SpD/Spe

79/83/100/85/105/78

Total

530

Other Formes

Blastoise-Mega

SableyeBot version 4.28.0

[timber falcon]

i know how chesnaught would function, and armourouge ig

[dapper crag]

Blastoise's moveset:

Physical Moves

Aqua Jet, Aqua Tail, Avalanche, Bide, Bite, Body Press, Body Slam, Brick Break, Bulldoze, Counter, Crunch, Dig, Dive, Double-Edge, Dragon Tail, Dynamic Punch, Earthquake, Facade, Fake Out, False Swipe, Fissure, Flail, Fling, Flip Turn, Focus Punch, Frustration, Giga Impact, Gyro Ball, Headbutt, Ice Punch, Ice Spinner, Iron Tail, Liquidation, Mega Kick, Mega Punch, Natural Gift, Outrage, Power-Up Punch, Rage, Rapid Spin, Return, Rock Slide, Rock Smash, Rock Tomb, Rollout, Secret Power, Seismic Toss, Skull Bash, Smack Down, Strength, Submission, Tackle, Take Down, Waterfall, Wave Crash, Zen Headbutt

Special Moves

Aura Sphere, Blizzard, Brine, Bubble, Bubble Beam, Chilling Water, Confusion, Dark Pulse, Dragon Pulse, Flash Cannon, Focus Blast, Hidden Power, Hydro Cannon, Hydro Pump, Hyper Beam, Ice Beam, Icy Wind, Mirror Coat, Mud Shot, Mud-Slap, Muddy Water, Round, Scald, Signal Beam, Snore, Surf, Tera Blast, Terrain Pulse, Water Gun, Water Pledge, Water Pulse, Water Spout, Weather Ball, Whirlpool

Status Moves

Aqua Ring, Attract, Block, Captivate, Celebrate, Confide, Curse, Defense Curl, Double Team, Endure, Follow Me, Foresight, Hail, Haze, Helping Hand, Iron Defense, Life Dew, Mimic, Mist, Mud Sport, Protect, Rain Dance, Reflect, Refresh, Rest, Roar, Scary Face, Shell Smash, Sleep Talk, Substitute, Swagger, Tail Whip, Toxic, Withdraw, Work Up, Yawn

Notes

A move displayed with Bold text benefits from Same-Type Attack Bonus when used by Blastoise.

SableyeBot version 4.28.0

[craggy dagger]

ehhh-
knowing tofu, armarouge is prolly not what you’d expect

[timber falcon]

true, he didnt exactly mention indeedee

[bold geode]

Hai Nova

[timber falcon]

i really gotta know how people find and use the value in certian mons, or in any mon at all

seems to be my problem

[mighty stump]

Well

It’s a balance of finding value and accepting where there is no value

Lol

Blastoise was fine but I ended up taking it off since it didn’t work out the way I want

Hydreigon also got booted

[solid frigate]

Moment

[timber falcon]

oh so it didnt make the cut

[mighty stump]

My own personal approach is to see teambuilding as a puzzle

You’re trying to find things that fit in where they have to

[timber falcon]

im bad at puzzles

[mighty stump]

It’s also having a stepwise thought process/progression as well

[timber falcon]

is synergy something i should be focusing on, or individual roles

[molten oasis]

is this worth adapting to?

like as a mental standpoint? im looking for, new ways to think of the game to hopefully minimize the rage issues

[mighty stump]

• Define what you want from your slots. This is decided by your playstyle
• Fit Pokemon according to what you need and want. You cannot force Pokemon to work in roles they cannot/are not meant to fulfil
• Understand that Pokemon considerations go beyond things like type advantages and simple matchups. Other game concepts like tempo/momentum control or board set-up are definitely “roles to consider”

• Making sure you have a clear understanding of what your Pokemon are bringing to the table. This allows you to make an informed decision as to what board states you plan on setting up and how you’re going to do it

[timber falcon]

what do you mean by playstyle, is that in terms of playing tr, psyspam ect. Or someones individual peference

[mighty stump]

Individual preference.

[mighty stump]

That’s been my mental standpoint. The whole point of VGC to me has always been figuring stuff out

Playing other people have always been secondary to my main wants out of the hobby

Like I always say, one loss now is one less in the future

[timber falcon]

ok i think i get it

[mighty stump]

Maybe this is too much thought/an over-complication to some people

But that’s just how I see things

It’s easier than I make it out to be, and more straightforward

[timber falcon]

for example tofu, whats your playstyle?

[mighty stump]

I think because I can simply vocalise my full intent, that it seems more overbearing

[mighty stump]

Control

My preferred playstyle has always been to prevent opponents from clearing their gameplans and choking out their options

Essentially creating a guaranteed pin due to lack of options since I’ve covered bases

A good example of different playstyles would be me vs Yotam

Yotam prefers a more aggressive playstyle, essentially reducing opponent resources through strong tempoing and good momentum to the point where they run out of resources to respond

It’s potentially a more volatile method.

Mine, which is slower, is more open to being influenced by RNG

Crits, flinches, etc

But otherwise outside of RNG, can be pretty consistent and less read reliant, since you can logically dictate the match

It’s exactly why you see my teams tend to be bulkier/slower

[timber falcon]

so first i have to identify my own playstyle, which is step one, at least thats what im understanding

[torn parrot]

Interesting
I like to go on the offensive, it’s more fun for me

[mighty stump]

Easiest way to do it is to just see what you enjoy when playing a match

Do you like watching HP bars go down really fast?

Do you like countering every move your opponent makes?

[craggy dagger]

though if you want results maybe don’t put random things together on a team like me?

[mighty stump]

Do you want to go for reads and outplays?

Do you prefer having a consistently executed approach that has a myriad of options?

[timber falcon]

i guess i like prefer to play it safe, and control the entire game? whether it be offensive or defensive

[molten oasis]

i see, might try this out

we're discussing playstyles?

[craggy dagger]

pawmot looks interesting in H though :0

[mighty stump]

Don’t fall for it

[timber falcon]

pretty much, im trying to figure mine out rn

[mighty stump]

Although Conkledonk would say otherwise

[molten oasis]

conkeldurr is a thing?

[mighty stump]

Also, most importantly, do not get too caught up on labels of things.

[torn parrot]

I like the type of playstyle where i have a train they have to stop or they get run over

[mighty stump]

People always want to define things like “This is Hyper Offense” or “This is Balance”

[craggy dagger]

fall for pawmot?

[mighty stump]

And then think they have to fit a shape into a hole all the time when teambuilding is a lot more flexible when you understand why you’re doing what you’re doing

[mighty stump]

See, mine would be knowing I can stop the train from running in the first place

You have a train but no rails

That’s the best part, Pokemon can accommodate for so many approaches even if teams look the same

You just have to know where to look

[timber falcon]

but wont you have to be able to indentify the opponents wincons/plans just by looking at the mons?

[molten oasis]

ive always labeled my playstyle as balance

[mighty stump]

And what’s exactly what I do

Lol

I glance at teams and poke holes in them all the time

[torn parrot]

Absolutely 🤝

[mighty stump]

I accumulated all this experience and knowledge cause I want to know

[molten oasis]

that explains why my teams seem to always have holes when i come up to you about them lol

[mighty stump]

I want to know

If I lose, I won’t next time

If I win, I can win better next time

I don’t care how many times I lose, cause I’ll end up figuring it out

It may look like sometimes I sit on a high horse doing nothing but be mean about peoples teams but the amount of work I did to get on to the horse is probably more than 100 players worth

Just love the hobby

Everything comes easy after

[molten oasis]

interesting

uhm, so, what would my playstyle be, if, meh nvm i should know an be able to figure it out

[timber falcon]

did u ever have a period where you didnt know your playstyle or has that been your from the go mindset on how the game works?

[molten oasis]

set up a guy to sweep and wipe the field ig

[mighty stump]

I encourage even the most menial of achievements if it gets more people playing cause at the end of the day that’s what I want, but I also don’t want people just having a terrible experience from the get go by having bad expectations

[mighty stump]

Not really. I don’t know if you read my most recent blogpost

But essentially my approach has always just been to learn

And how I lament the fact I don’t necessarily have a consistent lifeline to someone better than me to learn from directly

[bold geode]

Tofu's been fucking around and finding out

[mighty stump]

You essentially want to get your own gameplan rolling without having to account for an opponent’s play. Therefore identification of those holes in an opponent’s gameplan is key to realise what situations you’re going to be able to take it and run away with said game

[mighty stump]

Basically. I’m pretty observant and obsessive so I picked things up quickly enough

I had better players than me speak

So all I did was listen

[empty turtle]

does anyone have good recommendations for competitive Pokemon in the current regulation

[mighty stump]

This point is pretty paradoxical

[mighty stump]

If you go to something like Munchstats it pretty much tells you the most used Pokemon data wise.

[empty turtle]

???

[mighty stump]

For early team concepts you can visit YT channels like CloverBells or you can visit LabMaus to find teams that played in tours

[empty turtle]

ok thx

[foggy lodge]

What do you define for playstyle? Like the teams someone uses or how they pilot x team?

[rustic mountain]

both

[mighty stump]

A mix of both. Your Pokemon choices are going to be influenced how you play

[rustic mountain]

^

[mighty stump]

And how you play are going to influence how the Pokemon work

For example

A more offensive player might want Belly Drum Snorlax

A more defensive player would prefer Yawnlax

Some people want Calm Mind Covert Cloak CSR

Some want Specs Tera Ghost

[rustic mountain]

yawnlax >>>

[mighty stump]

Some prefer Throat Spray Farigiraf

Some stick with Sitrus Berry

Think about how you want to achieve your victories:

• Do you just wanna start firing away with big moves?
• Do you wanna set up a dangerous raid boss?
• Do you just want to play chess and checkmate your opponent?

[foggy lodge]

Huh

Yeah makes sense

I suppose 3

Is playing safe a playstyle? xd

[empty turtle]

when does regulation H start

[rustic mountain]

yea the specifics of how players choose the items/evs/moves etc really set apart what they want to go for. wen u get much more acquainted with it u see the hybrids of tw balance, tailroom, dual weather etc where players opt to pick more then 1 archetype so to speak to achieve their desired result. its still falls in line mostly w/ wat they like playing, but the optionality increases (higher skill ceiling)

[rustic mountain]

yes

finding middle ground plays most times is gna have u win consistently cuz ur not betting it all on if x can ohko y or w/e

[torn parrot]

Big moves
big pokemon
big plays
O:

[rustic mountain]

it typically falls in line w/ balance

[mighty stump]

For example:

• Scarf Kyogre with Tailwind just to blow things up
• Set up CSR hiding behind a series of utility/control mons is basically a raid boss
• Crystal Rain essentially focuses on creating Kyogre as a raid boss as well via screens/utilities
• The third would be something more akin to your balance gameplans or some CIR variants where they just choke out the opponent

[rustic mountain]

since balance allows u to make those middle ground plays easier

[mighty stump]

P much

[rustic mountain]

but its ofc possible still w/ ho and stuff

[timber falcon]

after a bit of thinking, ithink ive found the way i wanna play

which is just to be able to use any mon i want to use

[mighty stump]

You don’t have to stick to one playstyle either. Either way, the habits you create will show in your teams and your play

If you look at all my teams

They essentially have a very similar pattern

[timber falcon]

now that i look back at my team building, i aways thrive for the odd, or new set

[rustic mountain]

yea for sure, like i enjoy balance most but i def still do ho stuff

[mighty stump]

The formula is rarely changing

[timber falcon]

btw tofu tha blog is amzing, ill read the rest later

[rustic mountain]

ive seen a lot of teams do well and in the players team report or w/e they speak on how they basically recreated a past team and filled the roles similarly (diff format diff mons available and shit)

[molten oasis]

how'd you figure that out?

[empty turtle]

could any one help me with finding good pokemon for regulation H and good ev spreads

[mighty stump]

For me personally:

• I have a set of consistent gameplans that account for majority of the metagame matchups. Preferably done within a condensed form. These usually would be my “focal points”
• Control elements allow me to accommodate for anything more left field, while giving stability in established matchups. I define these mons as the “anchor point” as well.
• Essentially at this point my team is complete, and I would have one or two mons dedicated to patching holes in matchups I find iffy

[mighty stump]

You like to set up your raid bosses but don’t know when to set up basically and when to get the ball rolling.

Your teams have always tended to what you want

But a lot of the time they fail to complete interactions with the opponent and accommodate for that

[rustic mountain]

stuff like munchstats i think has data like that compiled as of now for useage rates at least

[molten oasis]

soo uh, i need to learn when to set up?

[mighty stump]

Again, Munchstats can give you direction there. It will detail the most used mons and sets they use including items and some common EV spreads

[empty turtle]

thank you both

[mighty stump]

A lot of people fall into the trap of “I have to set up to do something”

[knotty mirage]

Is tera ghost best tera type for scarf ditto ?

[mighty stump]

You can still do things without necessarily trapping yourself in tunnel vision

[zinc totem]

okay im going hate indeedee M and torkoal combo

[mighty stump]

Pretty much accounts mostly for FO

[rustic mountain]

yea prolly

[zinc totem]

after you eruption is so paain

[craggy dagger]

[mighty stump]

Like sure

I have NPlot on Gholdengo

[bold geode]

Basically like board states are big

[mighty stump]

Doesn’t mean I have to click NPlot

[nocturne holly]

If reg g I think normal

[mighty stump]

I can just click MIR

[molten oasis]

ok, so i need to learn when to click attacks and when to set up?

[knotty mirage]

Alright then it can even get bonus boost for astral barrage if it transform into caly shadow

[mighty stump]

Two Shadow Balls = One NPlot + Shadow Ball

[timber falcon]

tofu, you said "you cannot force pokemon to fullfil roles they are not meant to fullfil" iicr. How does one know the role its supposed to fullfil?

[mighty stump]

Yep

[mighty stump]

Im just going to copy paste what I wrote in my beginner guide real quick

[molten oasis]

the teams i make acomplish what i want but i need to learn when attacking over setting up is better

and vice versa

[mighty stump]

Or tbh I’ll just link it.

[bold geode]

Basically it comes down to just assessing what actually benefits you more in that turn as well as later if that makes sense

[mighty stump]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1lXNgrt04lDGwQjLmGuOSsZ2E67q__HpAwDrc4pwWDrE/edit

[molten oasis]

yea that makes sense

[mighty stump]

Go to the section “Choosing and Building your Pokemon”

Although my understanding of mons is far greater than when I wrote that guide, it still pretty much holds

Understanding the stats, typing advantages (beyond basic coverage, like Ghosts avoiding FO), movepools, all inform what the Pokemon can do

[molten oasis]

nice paste lol

[forest arrow]

https://pokepast.es/c786ae2572867f43
Tofu bulk up ok here yeah?

[mighty stump]

Pretty much

[rustic mountain]

really experience helps u discern that the most, u start seeing player tendencies and making informed decisions based on what ppl are likely to do in a given situation (they wont just give me dengo here i have blitz pressure, oh this mon is next to incin nd i have ko pressure they prolly protect and p shot lemme double up on incin or fake out and atk (if fo is available ofc) it gets more nuanced tho as u go further in cuz then good players subvert those expectations

[mighty stump]

Correct. It’s also why scouting for player tendencies can be really key especially in Bo3

[rustic mountain]

for sure

[bold geode]

Like one way I can explain it
In one set, I kept getting burn on Zama when they had Incin Amoongus
I didn't mind that and didn't focus on shutting that down or killing Incin because if I'm burned, I can outpace and not get spored so

[mighty stump]

And why sometiems people find it hard to perform in CTS Bo1

Because you don’t necessarily have the time to create an informed expectation of how your opponent will account for the same information

[bold geode]

Basically like weighing actions

[mighty stump]

Correct

[molten oasis]

so i need to get more experience to learn when it is and isnt good to click set up moves?

when im ready to play again

[rustic mountain]

its much less forgiving in that regard

[craggy dagger]

ooo
that was a good read :0

[mighty stump]

Understanding when to set up, understanding when it is more valuable to retain your boosts vs sacrificing for boosts to preserve the Pokemon, etc

[mighty stump]

I wrote it quite soon after I started hahaha

[rustic mountain]

this level of awareness is huge. sometimes u try and play around something like that and lose and instead it was better to just do wat u said and eat the burn and just be like ok now what? and keep chunking things down haha

i did it w/ cir plenty

[molten oasis]

ok, i get that

[mighty stump]

I dedicated 2 weeks of getting the information, making it all neatly laid out, and having a nice aesthetic

Hence why I’m happy to have a blog

Currently working on my Reg H post

[molten oasis]

hopefully i can apply this new knowledge soon enough

[craggy dagger]

[mighty stump]

and I’m still wondering about my Team Theory post

[bold geode]

I had IDBP Zamazenta with Tera Dragon
So I was like I can easily just ID up and outpace burn, but I can't outpace sleep

[rustic mountain]

makes sense

[craggy dagger]

Team theory :0

[mighty stump]

Basically I plan on just vocalising a bunch of concepts that make sense in my head whenever I approach building teams and how I tweak, test and accept the final product

Such as what we’ve essentially discussed today

Also including formalising your own approach to things

[rustic mountain]

call it team theory tuesdays w/ tofu

[molten oasis]

but its wednesday-

[rustic mountain]

im aware

[mighty stump]

I can’t decide if I want to make a massive dump or if I want to do it piece bt piece

[timber falcon]

i thought it was thursday

[craggy dagger]

pft
That fits well :0

[mighty stump]

Cause every time I have a set of information

I always reconsider things and approach it differently again

So I end up restarting

[craggy dagger]

its sunday 2032

[timber falcon]

WAIT ITS ACTUALLY WEDNESDAY

[molten oasis]

yuh

[mighty stump]

I’m pretty much the definition of “it is that deep, actually” 🤓

[timber falcon]

summer holidays rubbing off on me already 🫠

[molten oasis]

lol

[tranquil kraken]

[timber falcon]

anyways, i think its abou time i try teambuilding

[rustic mountain]

indeedee f over palafin in useage? wow

[mighty stump]

The best way to get good at teambuilding is just to play too.

And making sure you stay up to date on information

It’s why I stress just watching some regionals

[molten oasis]

so from, just i wanna recap so i understand this, i need to play to gain better experience to learn when i need to do things instead of just, trying to win

[mighty stump]

You learn about interactions

You see how top level teams interact

You can see how some teams with team reports express intent and witness it’s execution

[timber falcon]

can people also learn from the odd ones?

[mighty stump]

Trying to win isn’t the goal

Understanding is

Winning comes naturally after

[molten oasis]

well thats what i was doing...

thats, probably why i spiraled

[mighty stump]

Of course. This is where nuance comes in and forming of your own opinions

For example

[rustic mountain]

i think in a sense yea, looking at the whole of the quality of your matches and learning from them whether wins or losses. you gotta be able to see what you couldve done better in both cases

[mighty stump]

I completely understand Jamie Boyt’s logics and teams

Through and through

I don’t necessarily agree with the execution

But you can wholeheartedly learn

[timber falcon]

cause there was that dewgong armourouge team in reg G that did really damn well on showdown ladder, it really intrigued me to see someone be able to use pokemon like gloom and be succesful with it. Is the problem that im not as skilled, or am i missing something else.

[mighty stump]

and consider such approaches

[mighty stump]

Did you read Biei’s report/watch the YT video?

[rustic mountain]

boyt is a great example of being able to make weird things work but only after having a deep understanding of the game

[timber falcon]

never found the official

[molten oasis]

he made a video on that?

[mighty stump]

Biei released an official video regarding the team

[molten oasis]

ooh

[timber falcon]

do you have a link?

[mighty stump]

and iirc, Biei’s a girl

or a she, at least

[molten oasis]

sorry

[mighty stump]

But can’t confirm that

[timber falcon]

wait i mightve watched the gameplay

but i dont remember a report

[mighty stump]

https://youtu.be/hIBZUZISU3o?si=EyRpJ1YYqDCdRjzh

[timber falcon]

thanks

[mighty stump]

Like for example

[timber falcon]

oh yeah ive watched thus

[bold geode]

Also one thing I forgot to mention is like
It's also good to practice being more aware too
I try to do it with OTS since it's a little easier knowing the items and stuff, but it can be done CTS too
But like I feel like some people look at OTS and just think about the items and stuff and don't realize just actually how many small interactions there are that the OTS doesn't tell

[timber falcon]

guess i just wasnt concentrating

[mighty stump]

Do people like my Snorlax set? Probably not. It definitely has its pitfalls and awkward board states, but the logic I have with it is nothing but sound

Let me send my OPL match

[rustic mountain]

i think ots creates its own set of mind games and type of play that cts just isnt possible with

[chrome knot]

tofu

[rustic mountain]

you knowing certain things your opponent has or can do and them knowing you know that

[chrome knot]

wanna come work my shift for meeeee

[mighty stump]

G1: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2024regg-2173117728-gzy1ule4j7yesmob6ncicn6mndaiysdpw?p2
G2: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2024regg-2173119869-b6bb12vzn6hqoni5wv6fb7emfxpzktmpw
G3: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9vgc2024regg-2173122683-9zqxnzfwtubfh6lpiwgmp3vh0w8bm6epw

In particular, G3 expresses my logic foremost with my set

[mighty stump]

Hell no

I had a stressful shift today

[chrome knot]

WTF

[mighty stump]

This saturday I have more consults than the senior veterinarian

[molten oasis]

damn

[mighty stump]

I’m not looking forward to it

[chrome knot]

ur the real deal

[torn parrot]

This is some wacky af gameplay I’m ngl 😂

[mighty stump]

Also another note is that G2 I cant make the fancy FO Ghost type play because they’re Covert Cloak CSR

[bold geode]

Right but I feel like people forget the other interactions or just don't know about them
Speeds, how the abilities interact, what order they interact, what moves first, the actual pressure in the current board state, what they could possibly have in the back, there's so much going on even in one game

[torn parrot]

That’s fun

[mighty stump]

The burden of knowledge is then feeling like you’re doing something wrong and beating yourself up because you’ve entered a fallacy of “I know things therefore I should be winning”

[chrome knot]

i cant fucking believe it

[mighty stump]

Logic is sound

[bold geode]

Yeah
But that's also when the assessment part comes into play

[mighty stump]

See

A lot of insightful team reports like MeLuCa’s San Diego team report

Aaron Traylor’s Miraidon team

Biei’s video

[bold geode]

Cuz sometimes you could've messed up somewhere or maybe they just outplayed you

[mighty stump]

These are all things that are so good to help build your understanding and approach

[molten oasis]

i should also probably stop beating myself up

[bold geode]

Like even if you have the knowledge, it never guarantees a win, just helps you reach that goal

[mighty stump]

It may feel like studying but to me if you love the game it’s basically just more Pokemon content

It’s a video game. It’s a casual hobby. The beautiful thing is that its so low stakes that it simply does not matter how many times you make the same mistake until you stop making it

[bold geode]

Yeah
And sometimes like hell it's worse when people use a niche thing for something
It's usually easier to say "oh that's weird, it sucks" than it is to go "that's weird, why did he use it"

[mighty stump]

• Look at something
• Understand it
• Form an opinion

[bold geode]

Yeah
Like when Michael Zhang first used Chandy in LA
Was it weird? Yes
Did he have a reason? Yes
Was it valid? Yes

[mighty stump]

• Understand that there is majority opinion for a reason

• Understand that exceptions exist to the rule

• Understand you cannot just poof exceptions into reality

[timber falcon]

is being unique a factor for a mon

[bold geode]

But why use that unique mon

[timber falcon]

good point

[bold geode]

What's the reasoning?
What value can it bring?

[timber falcon]

im kinda just tryna figure out which mon i should start off with

[bold geode]

These are a couple of a few questions you can ask yourself when looking at stuff

[rustic mountain]

damn the 4-0 g3 haha nice lax adjustment. those sleep turns were rough for them haha but i think even if they woke up turn 2 u had options w/ rapid strike and lax still present

[bold geode]

Which comes with what you wanna accomplish

[timber falcon]

i wanna make counter + mirror coat swampert

[rustic mountain]

yea its very involved, and u basically have to have a lot of that internalized already otherwise ur not gna make a good enough decision in the 60 seconds of move choice time

[molten oasis]

that was a really fun set to watch

[bold geode]

Right
Thankfully I am quick with changing stuff

[gentle crag]

dollarmonke has given 1 Gen Rep to treeco.

[mighty stump]

Yep, It’s a gameplan I know I had but they definitely did not know about

[bold geode]

Like I was helping someone with games right
And I was trying to have him change moves as quick as I could cuz I kept forgetting "wait they can't change as fast as I can"

[molten oasis]

i like the hearthflame a lot on that team

[rustic mountain]

well u did a good job conditioning them to think u wouldnt bring it anyway, lax disrupts them big time they had to atleast have some awareness of that

[mighty stump]

Every move realistically came into play and I just clicked Fissure cause no loss if I missed, massive gain if I hit

[rustic mountain]

wdym? like changing team stuff or ur move choice?

[bold geode]

Move choices

Like while playing going back and changing what I'm gonna do

[rustic mountain]

i was peeping that like, hes just clicking this as a net positive cuz if it hits hes so golden lmao

but even tho it wasnt u still were generally fine

thats wen fissure is its mostly deadly

[mighty stump]

The logic of Yawn Fissurelax is:

• Yawn stops momentum build up, forces switches
• Fissure has incredible punish potential, especially in neutral turns where there is no significant loss scenario, and gives a potential out always in losing situations. Paired with Yawn, which locks down one turn guaranteed of sleep or one switch, you can essentially get up to two Fissure clicks a turn
• Double-Edge is just the largest damage button I had access to and a great neutral
• Helping Hand just adds on to the punish power of low momentum plays and ups the tempo very quickly

[rustic mountain]

also i saw aldrich join in g1 is he in the team league? i was on the same team as him in another league a cppl years back

[mighty stump]

Yeah he is

He’a in the Koraidon league for OPL iirc

He’s also my Team manager for the other league

HAHA

[rustic mountain]

hahah wow yea he loves vgc

nice dude

[rustic mountain]

yea it seemed like u said everything came up basically out of those. other then double edge which y would u click it at all that game haha

[mighty stump]

Remember that you need to have a reason beyond wanting to force a mon especially when you’re going to be using opponent-dependant moves like Counter/Mirror Coat

[mighty stump]

My -6 Snorlax

[rustic mountain]

lmfao

[mighty stump]

1/24 crit or 1/3 chance to OHKO

[rustic mountain]

it took no damage either that was fire

[molten oasis]

so, when building do i need to consider why im adding things on, but like, not go too deep into why? if that makes sense

[mighty stump]

Bonus points to Snorlax for resisting both CSR and CIR

[mighty stump]

Intent is everything. You don’t have to have deep dive logic but you have a good general idea of why they’re there

[rustic mountain]

id imagine both need atleast 1 or 2 boosts for hh and draining kiss to do any meaningful damage