Arcade - Taito F2 System

[tidal heron]

So I've tested some other games, and most of them seem fine with that ini change. But Arkanoid Revenge of DOH is definitely busted. It's either way too sensitive or the polar opposite depending on the core and spinner's settings. Is there any way to add an exception to the ini for that one game?

[marble oxide]

Yeah, just use the setname

[tidal heron]

So "Arkanoid - Revenge of DOH (World)"? Or do I need to put .mra at the end of it?

[restive wadi]

if its a sensitivity issue, try adding this to the very end of your mister.ini

spinner_throttle=200```

should prob move to another channel now cameltry is working 🙂

[brittle rock]

I like the art, but keep in mind that that version lacks the SNES mouse support of the US and EU versions.

[restive wadi]

yeah, just wanted a cameltry pic and that one stood out
F2 is the way

[brittle rock]

Actually, the SNES one has some extra levels, so it's definitely worth playing.

Some neat stuff like being able to to change the ball to Bub from Bubble Bobble too.

Only in the "On the Ball" version, though. JP version has the Operation Wolf guy's head instead.

[restive wadi]

ahh cool, wonder if ill need to make the spinner show as a mouse again to get it going in SNES. never tried

[marble oxide]

fixed(?) cameltry just came down in update all. I'm not near a mister to test it but I assume it's working now

[uncut orchid]

not near a mister? purchase more

[marble oxide]

I have brought shame to my family

[ebon mauve]

Yes, Zakks attempts to ruin my cores launch have been thwarted.

[marble oxide]

the arc of the universe bends towards justice

[uncut orchid]

rm mame/cameltry.zip

OOPS WRONG WINDOW SRY

[chilly coral]

no worries, cameltry again

[tidal heron]

Because changing the ini to make every core see the iCode spinner as a spinner was causing some issues, I ended up just making the exception for Cameltry instead. So only that game sees it as a spinner. Was just getting to be too much to test everything again. So that worked!

[restive wadi]

got it going for SNES cameltry, you need it reporting as a mouse there

[opal granite]

Yes the Cameltry ROM that update_all pulls is missing a file. Double click on the Cameltry ROM in the games > mame folder and add this file to the ROM

[marble oxide]

2 things:

1. this has been fixed
2. you should delete that attachment as it's copyrighted material

the problem was the arcade DB was pulling an old version of the rom. it was updated in mame .275 and that's what the core was built against. the db has been updated, though, so it should pull the right zip now

[opal granite]

Just wanted to help. That file fixed it for me and Cameltry works perfectly again 🙂 .

[marble oxide]

i appreciate you - we just have to be careful with that stuff 🙂

[opal granite]

File deleted 🙂 .

[opal granite]

Also the ROMs that update_all pulls have the alternatives ROMs included but update_all does not pull the alternatives MRAs. I had to set them up manually (every alternatives ROM works then 🙂 ) but I feel like that those alternatives MRAs should be pulled by update_all as well.

[uncut orchid]

it pulls them now

[opal granite]

Nice - I did update_all yesterday and it was not the case then. Nice that it has been fixed so fast 🙂 .

Will the other Taito F2 games (in particular = Metal Black, Dead Connection and Thunder Fox) included in the core as well ?

[uncut orchid]

I'm sure he'll get to them

[opal granite]

I really hope @ebon mauve does Taito F3 next 🙂 . And great work on the Taito F2 core as always @ebon mauve .

[hardy spruce]

I actually asked wickerwaka this. He said no, since RCAVictorCo is working on one off and on.

I want the F3 core as much as anyone!

[late lichen]

Do analog sticks on a controller work well with Cameltry?

[wet hornet]

Maybe somewhat that but also he said the hardware is totally unrelated so it’s not like it would be building on any of his work anyway.

[topaz oar]

Kaiser Knuckle on f3 has got to have one of the the hardest boss fights ever in a 2d fighter

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7OHyHYiU5x4

[ebon mauve]

Yes

[zealous robin]

I feel as if Im missing something. I have run update_all multiple times now, and nothing Taito F2 is coming down.

[marble oxide]

Check the arcade folder just to be sure. Check for cameltry

[zealous robin]

OK, I do show Cameltry, what other games are associated (at this point) with this Core? Pixel Cherry Ninja was saying that Ninja Kids was there, but I don't see that one?

[wet hornet]

Liquid kids

[zealous robin]

By the way, Amazing!

Oh, so I was looking for the wrong game!!!!!!

LOL

[wet hornet]

#news message

[zealous robin]

Also, just curious, I am assuming that these games are also not "organized" in the folders yet either?

[wet hornet]

Wicker wrote it all down and instead you watched a video and forgot about that too 😉

[zealous robin]

LOL, apologies

I should definitely watch the "news" channel more. I do tend to watch the test-builds, and unstable-nightlies!

[wet hornet]

Toya said he was adding them to the organizer, not sure if it’s done yet

[zealous robin]

Thats awesome!

Thanks for your help

[ebon mauve]

The Ninja Kids, so it's gonna be with the T's

[topaz oar]

mucking about with the core, loaded up final blow and in the attract "dynamite joe" is apparently 5 foot 12 lol

[wet hornet]

How many Kids are there? Adults should step in and help

[ebon mauve]

So many typos and/or engrish

[zealous robin]

@ebon mauve - How I didn't check that LOL, now I see it with the "The" !!!

[hardy spruce]

How's Gun Frontier working on here?

[next plume]

Played through PuLiRuLa last night. Works great, and such a fun game.

[rich kernel]

does the screen go blank for anyone else when trying to adjust the analog video H-pos in any of the f2 games?

[agile geyser]

I went through it yesterday as well, its a bit short, kinda repetative, but a wild ride nonetheless.

[steel imp]

it is but very think carboard and the stick works great in mame and the snk collection but needs some tweaking to get the best out of it.

[flint hound]

Remember, it's Gun & Frontier

Gun Frontier already happened, it was called the Wild West. But a Gun & Frontier? Wow, such a cool name.

[dry stone]

sorry if this has been asked already, but does this core support direct video?

[autumn beacon]

I just fired up cameltry in dv mode and it worked

[dry stone]

sweet, thank you ❤️

[flint hound]

The Gun & Frontier guy isn’t ever going to come back and get mad at me. : (

[marble oxide]

They are making a YouTube video about how toxic the F2 community is

[flint hound]

[dry stone]

you killed the man, not the idea

[flint hound]

I mean I agree with him, no clue why they changed the name to something sillier sounding lol.

[dry stone]

🫡 🇺🇸 🦅 🗽 ⚖️

[forest flower]

Oh, I'm here Robby, I'm here...

or should I say, I'm here Robby&TerribleTaste, I'm here...

[ebon mauve]

https://tenor.com/view/jason-momoa-chair-popcorn-time-ready-to-party-dis-gon-be-good-gif-24174564

[forest flower]

You can't kill what is already dead (from hearing people say Gun & Frontier)

Is it Wicker&Waka? Is it Xtra&Smiley? Is it Dino&Rex?!?

For shame, SHAME!

[dry stone]

metal & black

[forest flower]

I blame all fo this on that British guy Ninja Cherry Coke, he called it by it's Devil name in a video and now all you kids are into D&D and Harry & Potter

Oh shit, now I'm doing it! It's a scourge I tell you! A Scourge & Curse!

[forest flower]

OK, that one sounds kind of cool.

aI has failed me and chosen to leave out the & on my image

clearly, it has already passed human intelligence

[chilly coral]

it's gunmetal gray

[static dirge]

Never trust anyone with your magic stick. I learnt the hard way.

[spark mountain]

very cool core, I love cameltry! thanks

[pseudo dirge]

This cores so hot right now 🔥 🔥

🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥 🔥

[versed rain]

just finished pulirula, noticed there is a couple of screens in the ending with the layers in the wrong order, - Cogs in front of the character sort of thing

[flint hound]

I mean Xtra&Smiley would be kinda cool

[forest flower]

That's why AI will never replace a real human!

[wet hornet]

You should probably check git and file and issue in case wicker is unaware.

[flint hound]

Git&Hub

[forest flower]

lol

here is another miss

https://kai-magazine-software.fwscart.com

It's called Death & Lead, but I think Death Lead would have been a better name, cool looking game though.

[brittle rock]

At least they didn't rename it Gun &/or Frontier

[tidal heron]

That would have been even better! 🔥 🔥

[ebon mauve]

If you have save states those are super useful.

[versed rain]

I haven't, I'll grab one later on for you

[ebon mauve]

I no shame save stated my way through some cameltry levels the other day.

[versed rain]

@ebon mauve Here you go, look for a couple of screens after the credits finish

Like this

[ebon mauve]

Perfect. Thank you.

[marble oxide]

Here is a good one for you: I think Gun Frontier's DV crop data is off by one line on each side (+1 on the top/left and -1 on the bottom/right). This could also just be a tink4k oddity

Only ever seen that with the cave cores. Totally not important, but the type of "bug" only the brainworms would find.

[ebon mauve]

Hmm. So you can fix it manually and it looks fine?

I’m dubious of the alignment of that game because it always looks like the UI is cropped at the top.

[marble oxide]

yeah, if I manually crop, it's totally fine. not worth fixing, just not something I have seen before outside of the cave cores (other cores will get cropping wrong occasionally, but the fact it's exactly one line on each side is what was interesting to me)

[static creek]

Tried to enjoy Mega Blast yesterday but now I see why this game is not held in high regard. The ship sprite is too huge. I cannot get past bullets that are 2-3 cm apart on the screen. So any bullethell skills are counterproductive here. You will try dodging bullets that cannot be dogded with that sprite. Having blasters on all 4 sides of your ship doesn't help it either. It makes you misjudge your real size and your proportions.

[hardy spruce]

I also tried Growl... It wasn't fun. Too many enemies on screen, graphics are gawdy, and bosses can interrupt any attack. I remember it more fondly on Taito Legends. At least Ninja Kids is still good.

[clear wren]

This folder doesn't have any games within it, did I do something wrong or is it not updated yet?

[hardy spruce]

If you run update_all, the games will have their own files under the Arcade folder

[clear wren]

I do see the games individually, are they anywhere in the organize arcade folders all together?

[hardy spruce]

Isn't there a subfolder for that under Collections?

[clear wren]

Yep that's the picture I showed, collections/mister core/taitof2alpha/nothing inside

[lavish crown]

just copy the MRA files in there. done

[clear wren]

Sure I can do that. I guess the Organized script is not updated yet.

[restive wadi]

the folder there should be taitof2 (collections/mister core/taitof2)

organizer was updated a few hours ago, maybe run another update

[clear wren]

Did it and nothing changed. Is there something I need to do to make the update all run fresh? Like deleting some logs or something

[restive wadi]

hrm, that screenshot looks quite different to my _Arcade/_Organized/_3 Collections/_2 By MiSTer Core/ folder

try renaming _Arcade/_Organized on the SD card and letting update_all recreate it

[clear wren]

Ok trying it

[clear wren]

That fixed it! Thanks

[fathom pewter]

Arcade organizer is updated

But theypsilon has disabled it by default

So you need to enable it

Note for future users

[marble oxide]

I was wondering why it suddenly stopped working on my misters

[reef grove]

I Love Taito F2, i have Growl , The ninja kids & Mizubaku daiboken PCBs. Growl is fun for 4p action... plus im vegan ^^ - I had never played Megablast before without awful lag & i enjoyed it, thanks a lot !

[flint hound]

Ok, I've added text commands to give you a list of shortcuts to all the pinned posts in a channel. Type "#channel name pins" and you'll get it. I covered the most popular channels.

For Example: #1358555491546169354 pins

[brave snow]

Taito F2 (Arcade):

• Core Developer
• Download Core
• Testing Sheet
• Important Info

[pseudo dirge]

Great idea 💡 👍

[autumn beacon]

Got the Thunderstick spinner. Wow Cameltry is a whole lot more fun with it

Even did the janky box case

[flint hound]

Using a spinner on Cameltry is cheating

[ebon mauve]

I still haven’t played with a spinner.

[marble oxide]

It’s so good with a spinner. I just bought a second one for the crt downstairs

[brittle rock]

That reminds me of a Track and Field machine I played equipped with a trackball. Made it too easy to complete most of the events. Though Cameltry uses a spinner normally (not cheating) and Track and Field usually uses all buttons.

[flint hound]

Yah sorry was just making a bad joke

Cameltry with a spinner is divine

[odd yacht]

How does using a trackball work with Track And Field, I mean it's a button basherr, left, right and fire. OR is it that if you spin the trackball quickly it's "hitting" left and right a lot quicker?

[spark mountain]

cameltry is divine

[hardy spruce]

Agreed

[chilly coral]

camel is nice try

[brittle rock]

The latter. You spin the trackball instead of hitting the buttons.

[wary crescent]

A spinner is basically two buttons that you're hitting in a particular pattern. Trackball is basically two spinners, so you could hook up one of the axes and spin it to get rapid left/right

They're all quadrature encoders just going in a pattern

[feral sapphire]

Was just about to mention this! Recorded my first playthrough of the game with a buddy on Monday
https://youtu.be/fcyNK25AIJE?si=-bZSpFmMCVUBFgg3

core is awesome so far, looking forward to trying the other games soon here. Thanks as always for your hard work @ebon mauve !

Looks like some noise happening for sprites when scene transitions occur also in PuLiRuLa, definitely noticeable when stages start

[ebon mauve]

Great thanks!

What kind of noise?

[wet hornet]

Passing gas, Walrus ate Arbys

Oops I mean he had a chip butty for lunch

Wait no walrus is US, my whole life is a failure

[ebon mauve]

6am here bro. Too early in the day to watch someone humiliate themselves.

[wet hornet]

Just another demon to keep me from sleeping

[feral sapphire]

lines in the character sprites, i'll find a timestamp for ya

[feral sapphire]

Okay reviewed it again quick and couldnt find the transition noise I saw before.. will have to re-watch the entire video to try and spot that. There was another thing that stood out, where black rows of horizontal dots show up when there is a lot of action on the screen. Usually at bosses. You can see it when we fought ol' dong-nose here:
https://youtu.be/fcyNK25AIJE?si=pgqLPDicYp9hhnon&t=308

And also at the final boss when we did some kind of super-magic, at the beginning of the spell and also at the end where it shows the world map after the explosion:
https://youtu.be/fcyNK25AIJE?si=mefQTYcvabXbYFA3&t=1244

The character sprite transition noise might have been a different game! We played like 6 or 7 back-to-back and I took notes for issues in a few of them. I'll re-watch the video and see if it's in there somewhere. I'm relatively sure that it was in PuLiRuLa

[ebon mauve]

So those black dots are the CPU updating the color palette, when the CPU is writing to the palette a black pixel is output if the screen is being drawn at the same time. I this case I don't know if hardware would have the same artifact or not.

The boards often have a way to control this behavior, where it forces the CPU to stall until a blank, so you don't get the black dots on screen. I haven't worked out what the address is of the register on all the different boards. MAME typically doesn't have it.

Driftout is crazy because for a lot of the attract mode half the screen has dots in it. The hardware has the register for fixing this, but it isn't used. I'm thinking of adding an option to the core to force the behavior.

So many artifacts on the F2 that are true to real hardware:( I've been meaning to record a side-by-side of Growl on the real PCB to highlight how accurate the artifacts and to help verify timing.

Oh and @feral sapphire, I really appreciate the videos. They are a really useful reference. Thanks.

[feral sapphire]

Aye, and it looks like the black dots show up on the single board variant of PuLiRuLa, at least at the dong-nose boss. Found a recording of the pcb here: https://youtu.be/nK8m479XAhA?si=diej2HaKlm6FWrPv&t=386

timestamped to where you can see similar patterns there. i'll check the boss fight also

[ebon mauve]

Nice!

[feral sapphire]

yeah i saw some hints of it at the boss fight also. scanned through the video and that super-rare magic we got at the end wasnt included, so couldnt compare that. Probably not easy to find footage of that on original PCB, i'd imagine

[feral sapphire]

Just wish i had more time to record them! Not often friends come over for 2p arcade game sessions nowadays lol. Definitely gonna hit up PuLiRuLa again when the core is done to record a playthrough of the japanese version, since it seems like there is some censorship in the usa release from what the dude was saying in the video with PCB footage

he had a mixture of japanese game and english language on his board from swapping the roms mentioned at the beginning. wonder if theres some kind of hack out there that does the same thing

[crystal anvil]

Just wanted to say thanks for the core.Taito egrat spinner is great for cameltry.(not that I have figured how to get the buttons to work)

[versed rain]

Also noticed that just before that boss when the ice gives way and you fall, there's a layer issue compared to the arcade play through with that section of the ice

[idle root]

you have to setup in the main mister menu and declare one of the button as the right button.
too bad the controller menu doesn't allow to skip the directions, it's a bit disturbing, or I don't know how to do it

[crystal anvil]

Exactly It registers but what do I do after that.

[idle root]

you skip every useless control with space or user on io board
and register first button, coin and start

then one button at least should be registered

[idle root]

I can detail more if you need

[crystal pilot]

What’s this camel toe game I keep hearing about?

[timid abyss]

Don't give me that kinda lip! (Also, 'what if the Sonic bonus levels were a whole game' but way better than that sounds)

[chilly coral]

isn't that mario galaxy?

[hardy spruce]

How is the Sonic bonus level Mario Galaxy?

[chilly coral]

it can be

[restive wadi]

running around a globe, collecting coins instead of blue orbs
basically a palette swap

[feral sapphire]

Man Cameltry feels great after getting the spinner dialed in for close-to 1:1 stage rotation. Thanks for including all the sensitivity ranges you did there @ebon mauve. At 200% sensitivity with the reflex adapt in spinner mode with a PS1 JogCon, it feels incredibly fluid and easy to control

Such an odd game. The continue screen character looks like it was made by the same folks who did the anime cutscenes for ys 1&2 on PC engine CD.

[pseudo dirge]

What a lovely end screen sunset!

[feral sapphire]

oh derp wrong screenshot'

[pseudo dirge]

Yeah I see what you mean, very similar. Cool art.

[stable drift]

Oh jeez I forgot about the jogcon spinner option, I bet that feels great on cameltry

[feral sapphire]

its amazing. just cleared the whole game with it. Set the OSD sensitivity to 200% in spinner mode, set the jogcon to spinner mode (L2+R2 + mode) and change the sensitivity to the highest setting on the jogcon also (hold dpad-up and press mode). That will give you close to 1:1 dial/stage rotation which is ideal for this one.

[marble oxide]

looking at jogcon controllers on ebay

[marble oxide]

Waka, if minor crop stuff (and I mean minor) is of interest to you, let me know. I dunno if that's something you care to look at.

[ebon mauve]

tink related?

[marble oxide]

Probably? Might be on the morph too. But the thing that brought this up turned out to not be F2. Insector X is a JT core, as it turns out (even though it had a similar off by 1 crop issue) 🙂

[chilly coral]

a whole pixel??

[wet hornet]

Unplayable

[marble oxide]

I SAID IT WAS MINOR

My brain worms don't know waka's brain worms

so I don't make assumptions

[ebon mauve]

Yeah, I do want to know about crop issues. At least to determine whether it is my fault or not

[feral sapphire]

Played through a few games on the core last night with a buddy. Went smooth for the most part besides Don Doko Don, we got to stage 32 and I think my buddy was trying to find the start button and hit coin a couple times on accident and it locked up the game:

https://youtu.be/zQXrolyBXnU?si=kw9L1kgMOdMxtvFN

Locked up on a black screen that just says "COIN ERROR"

Man Growl was such a neat game at first, really enjoyed the large variety of weapons and throwback to double-dragon style gameplay, but hot damn that final boss is one of the worst in gaming history. completely ruined the game

[uncut orchid]

yeah, that's not a 'core bug' but the real hardware behavior doesn't really map well to having coin buttons mapped to pushbuttons

stop trying to steal free credits!

[ebon mauve]

Huh. Should I limit the coin input to once every few frames?

[uncut orchid]

yeah, pulse on rising edge of button for X clock cycles

might have to play with how long, I think I've seen another core use around 100ms

[feral sapphire]

lol yeah he was smashing that button like it owed him money 🤣

[forest flower]

For other games that have this issue, I think the better fix would be in the MiSTer framework to limit coin presses to pulses rather than change it on a per game basis, but I'm no dev, so I'm talking out my ass, I'm hoping Google translate works on ass talk to English for you.

[uncut orchid]

there's no way to do that, framework has no idea what buttons do

[ebon mauve]

Mister doesn't have any concept of coins, everything is just a button. Adding the concept of coins would open a whole can of worms around coin slots.

[uncut orchid]

it already sucks for 1P/2P start, imagine 4x coin slot bindings!

[chilly coral]

supporting jamma style dual coin slots would go a long way

[forest flower]

My TMNT 4 player is ready!!!!

🐢

[fathom pewter]

Please keep real hardware behavior

There is another core that has similar issue as Zakk mentioned

Trying to remember

[uncut orchid]

it's probably more than one, most don't do anything to the bound coin buttons

it's more a matter of what triggers coin error in that particular bit of software

[fathom pewter]

I found it

Nova 2001

[forest flower]

it happens on real hardware too, like Cave PCBs. My supergun, the HAS has a setting to make the coin button a single pulse like a real coin going through, to avoid the freeze.

that's why I think it should be a framework setting, not a per game change, but whatevever, I'm here for the games!

[ebon mauve]

Do coin slots have some expected pulse duration, or are they just simple mechanical switches?

[uncut orchid]

"yes"

they're mostly just some form of a switch, but a lot of arcade games have some kinda anti-fraud shit that will just error out if they deem the input is held too long or spammed too much

[forest flower]

This is correct.

[ebon mauve]

Okay. I'm going to say 3 vblanks.

Coulda implemented Metal Black tonight, instead I'm doing this.

[uncut orchid]

you have to do your part to prevent fraud

[wet hornet]

Can’t wait to diddle my coin switch to see if I can defeat wickers defensive code

[ebon mauve]

<@&806015468916703282>

[uncut orchid]

hold up let me get my $250k

[somber torrent]

Okay, that was cheeky

Wait I said to delete the messages

Ggrrrrrrrrrrr

[ebon mauve]

thank you

[forest flower]

It's the better outcome.

No one likes a hung coin shaft.

[ebon mauve]

I think this is all my brain can handle right now.

[hardy spruce]

I've heard of people who enjoy a hung shaft

[static creek]

I predict some @thorny dagger jokes incoming in 3...2....1..

[thorny dagger]

sir you offend me. Do you think I would be so crass as to make purile genital jokes?

[static creek]

Purile genital jokes??? Not at all, sir!!

[marble oxide]

ur mom is crass

[thorny dagger]

your momma so crass she doesn't even blink when I stick it in her a....NEVERMIND I AM ABOVE THIS

[hardy spruce]

Okay, now you belong in spicy off-topic

[ebon mauve]

Fixed the PuLiRuLa sorting issue

[mortal trout]

I left an issue note on the GitHub for Liquid Kids.

As I don't know if the issue was already known.

I tried with the stable version and I compiled the latest current version a moment ago, it remains.

[versed rain]

That issue is mentioned in TODO.md @mortal trout

[ebon mauve]

It's known, yes, but thank you for the github issue.

[ebon mauve]

F2 ebay prices are out of control

$700 for a thunderfox rom board

[uncut orchid]

almost any arcade stuff is like that now

[flint hound]

I feel like emulation authors should get a deep discount.

No real way to verify that but it would be nice.

[ebon mauve]

I just make cores so I can buy the dip

[uncut orchid]

no, in some cases being an 'emulation author' either causes the price to go up, or the item to become unavailable to you

[mortal trout]

Never reveal your true being.

[flint hound]

Zet-Tzu

[ebon mauve]

I use a device to mask my voice since my thick Irish brogue is so distinctive and recognizable.

[uncut orchid]

wait you have an accent? gross

[real aspen]

Has there been an update to the core today? p.s I tried Growl arcade archives last night on Switch 2, and it doesn't have the weird sprite teleport glitch that happens on the F-2 core. I presume the core is still in Alpha? cheers

[ebon mauve]

Sprite teleport glitch?

[ebon mauve]

Si

[real aspen]

Yes Martin, there are occasional moments where foreground character sprites will flicker and disappear at repeatable sections of the game that doesn't occur on MAME or other retail ports. Next time I play it, I will write down when and where it occurs. Cheers.

[ebon mauve]

Grab a save state if you can.

[real aspen]

Okies will try to be 'quick draw Mc Graw' and snap it.

[ebon mauve]

hah

[odd yacht]

So it is. Ya fecken egit. 🙂 Sorry taken from Father Ted...

[flint hound]

DRINK!

[odd yacht]

I was going to complete that sentence @flint hound but figured I best not! 🙂

[chilly coral]

yes let's keep it FECKless

[odd yacht]

haha. 🙂

[ebon mauve]

Taito sometimes has a lot of "my friend's really good a drawing" energy:

[dry stone]

as goofy as it can look i'd argue it's part of the charm sometimes honestly lol

[ebon mauve]

Anyone have any footage of the Thunder Fox attract loop?

[wet hornet]

Namco consolette? Love the look of those with the “floating” control panel. Never seen one in person

[hardy spruce]

Thunder Fox has one of the most brutal enemy death sounds lol

[reef grove]

Yes, 18 inch version, my favorite candy cab by far !

[wet hornet]

The mint green ones are my favorite in pics. Such a cool looking cab. There were a couple in the background of some anime I was watching and they were immediately recognizable

https://beepgamecenter.wordpress.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/fc2blog_20141018101105ee5.jpg?w=480&h=640

[reef grove]

Yeah, mint green ones look even better, this one is from Hijya San Collection ! I got it in blue and got used to it but i share your opinion, mint green looks always great on candys !

[ebon mauve]

Thank you!

[untold brook]

Beauty of a cab

[tidal heron]

https://tenor.com/view/what-unfriendly-looking-girl-you-dropped-this-king-gif-17833489

[reef grove]

Glad to be of any help ! I dont have an scope but i have a multimeter and a logic probe if you need further assistance...

[reef grove]

😏

❤️

[untold brook]

Beautiful

[feral grove]

Played a handful of F2 games during lunch today, good work Martin.

Also, Final Blow art is really creepy to me. It moves so oddly

[ebon mauve]

New core release today with support for Thunder Fox.

[uncut orchid]

weird way to spell Metal Black

[ebon mauve]

@static dirge is desperate for a new video because the MiSTer MaFIa are threatening to take his kneecaps.

[static dirge]

Yep, one is gone. They call me sir Limpalot

Thanks for the ping. I'll check out thunder Fox when I get home.

Humbly waiting for a train

[potent delta]

Thunder Fox worked fine (finished it), only a few graphic glitches. Some kind of small horizontal lines/strokes are buzzing in the image.

[static dirge]

Just finishing up.

[ebon mauve]

That’s why this big chonker is on the bench now.

[dry stone]

so looking forward to metal black... probably my favorite F2 game. godspeed waka 🙏

[next plume]

Is the update with Thunder Fox on UpdateAll? If so, I know what I'm playing tonight. Thunder Fox rules.

Thank you, wickawaka, for all of your hard work and dedication. I'm sure everyone here appreciates it.

[marble oxide]

it is

[primal silo]

Thank youuuuu wicker!!! wait this game for a long time. Congrats for the excellent work ❤️❤️❤️.

[hearty smelt]

Is Dead Connection uses the TC0480SCP ?

[ebon mauve]

Yes

[dry stone]

dead connection is such a cool game

[chilly coral]

so, so many pins

[versed rain]

pulirula is much better, but there is just one thing I noticed at the end, when the key is turned, you can see the full key and a couple more pixels after it towards the edge of the screen, on the PCB it goes off the edge slightly as per https://youtu.be/nK8m479XAhA?si=BxY-lRLZnxAHXBZ7&t=1394

[static dirge]

#Thunderfox

[ebon mauve]

Metal Black is the sequel to Gun And Frontier?

[fathom pewter]

According to Arcade Italia

[marble oxide]

huh, i figured that they said all they needed to say with Gun & Frontier

Also, this means we need to start calling it Metal & Black

[tidal heron]

I always thought of Metal Black as a spin off of Darius.

[solar fractal]

Nice dev interview for both games if you haven't seen it already... https://shmuplations.com/takatsunasenba/

[dry stone]

i think that's how it began life no?

either way, it's a sick game. metal black looks and feels like no other shmup i've played

[tidal heron]

I love how hard it goes when you defeat a boss.

[dry stone]

right!

[tidal heron]

https://tenor.com/view/reaction-blownaway-gif-7186324

[marble oxide]

whoa whoa whoa wait. The badguys in The Ninja Kids are Satanists? God the 90s were so much cooler than we deserved.

[forest flower]

It's actually Dino Rex 3

[ebon mauve]

Dino And Rex.

[uncut orchid]

wicker and waka

[brittle rock]

I was disappointed that the twisted version of Metal Black bears no resemblance to the original and turns it into a car combat game.

Joking aside, I like the game quite a bit and have it on Saturn, which is a nice port.

[dry stone]

ving did an excellent job with the saturn version of metal black

as they did with their other arcade ports

[ebon mauve]

Taito really invested a lot into their attract loop intros

[dry stone]

MB's is really cool

[static creek]

A nice port, but not faultless. In comparison to Gekirindan it was great though.

Gekirindan was the only F3 game that was ported to Saturn (would have preferred Grid Seeker much more)

[solar fractal]

By my count there are 10 F3 ports on Saturn.

Bubble Symphony
Cleopatra Fortune
Darius Gaiden
Elevator Action Returns
Gekirindan
Taito Power Goal
Puzzle Bobble 2
Puzzle Bobble 2 X
Layer Section
Kyukyoku Tiger II

[fathom pewter]

Gekirindran has fantastic soundtrack

[dry stone]

it does. i hope to see an F3 core someday, as it's one of my favorite arcade hardwares

there's like, 40 or so games for the thing too, right? so you'd be able to knock out a lot of stuff with it

[static creek]

Ouch 😳

[wary crescent]

@ebon mauve THANK YOU for your info on the weird black level issue

I have my cameltry pcb again and it's gonna get fixed, still have a blurry video issue to track but this gets me closer to getting my board up and running in a way I like

[ebon mauve]

Let me know what you discover.

[wary crescent]

A friend of mine has a Puzzle Bobble board that we were trying to track the brightness issue with, I didn't have the PCB in front of me though

That board has some sharp video so I'm a little curious if there's other differences, we were going off of a Nastar Warrior schematic that noted the pin you pointed out as a ground

I'm actually curious, by any chance did you happen to notice any other pins that were "Ground" that aren't actually ground pins?

[ebon mauve]

It's not uncommon with these taito chips because they often have extra functionality that some games don't use so those inputs get connect to ground or VCC to force some behavior. The 260DAR has an ACCMODE pin that I think is in some schematics but not others.

I'm curious why they would have enabled these elevated black levels. Like some arcade monitors expected it or something

I guess arcade monitors typically have a cutoff adjustment for the black levels

[pseudo dirge]

Tayto chips!!!

[static dirge]

Are tasty 😋

[static creek]

The silence has been notable. It appears Metal Black resists having its secrets unveiled."

[marble oxide]

waka has been busy updating the mister laggy core to my intense (but fair) specifications

[ebon mauve]

Summer hits hard.

[uncut orchid]

what are you? European?

GET TO WORK

[marble oxide]

I suddenly understand why waka stops responding to my PMs between 3 and 7pm

[ebon mauve]

Oui

[tidal heron]

Let him wicker his waka. I mean let him cook!

[wet hornet]

This is going to come up in his performance review

It would be sad to have to let him go

[marble oxide]

sure

but

the shareholders

[ebon mauve]

I've been analyzing the 480SCP chip. Recorded it's memory access so have a good understanding of how that works. I have my testroms up and running on a Dead Connection board.

I've been sidetracked a little bit diagnosing some issues with the board itself.

[undone helm]

So many games and so little time lol

[umbral hill]

freaking wrong channel

i screwed up!

[marble oxide]

In this house we believe that forgiveness is divine (but never pay full price for late pizza)

[restive wadi]

Happy balls

[restive wadi]

that black rectangle in top right is there during gameplay too, but only if its background. when its the foreground layer it shows normally

unplayable

[ebon mauve]

I believe that on real hardware that entire top line is missing.

[umbral hill]

Joust2 has a similar thing where the original display obscures that kinda.

[opal granite]

I really hope somebody takles the Taito F3 on the Mister = it's worth it for Riding Fight alone 🙂 .

[dry stone]

definitely agree. F3 has one of the best libraries of any arcade hardware

[wary crescent]

Darius Gaiden, Elevator Action Returns, Rayforce/Gunlock/Layer Section/Galactic Attack

Puzzle Bobble 4 for me

I have a Bubble Bobble 2 cart that I really should play

[dry stone]

cleopatra fortune, kaiser knuckle, landmaker, puchi carat, etc.

so many bangers

[next plume]

Bubble Symphony, Lightbringer/Dungeon Magic, and the others listed above would be awesome to have on MiSTer.

[undone helm]

For some reason all my ROMs load fine but not a one recognizes the coin button. I can see the game but can’t play them. Am I missing something?

[tidal heron]

Did you map it to a button on your controller within the core?

[ebon mauve]

What kind of input are you using?

[ebon mauve]

I'm planning on doing a video discussing the F2 system and the development process. Is there anything in particular people would like to see covered?

[pseudo dirge]

Sounds very interesting! I'd love to see that!

As far as what should be covered I would suggest keeping your genitals covered at all times.

[ebon mauve]

Great call out, thanks

[marble oxide]

Don’t let these philistines get in between you and your art

[orchid swift]

Could talk about how the boards/tools you build helped compared to how you did your previous cores

[marble oxide]

I’m interested in the whole process of how it goes from board to core, but thats probably more basic (and in depth) than what you’re talking about

[forest flower]

What tools you used on the PCB to get readings

[wet hornet]

What did it feel like to finally deliver Dino Rex for Taco and know you made him a happy boy?

[ebon mauve]

Felt empty

[wet hornet]

@sleek helm It’s because you couldn’t beat those dinos. He’s not mad, he’s just disappointed

[tidal heron]

His shame will be eternal.

[sleek helm]

If you could only see me play growl bro ..

[sleek helm]

I’m a master ranked player in half a dozen fighting games .. I’ll be fine lol

[sleek helm]

Fucking summer bro!!

And that new capcom collection kinda took over my game time

[ebon mauve]

If I got a dollar for every excuse I could retire.

[sleek helm]

Well that’s two of em ! Not sure about retiring but you might be able to get an icee!

[sleek helm]

I got a query ! First of all thank you for prioritizing and getting Dino Rex out the door right away! That being said did you discover any insights into the hardware while working on Dino Rex?

Also you shoulda just waited for the last quarter to release the core right around the holiday season .. it’s just common sense ..

But for real .. my main question is .. what is next ? What is your dream core to work on ? And also talk about what you need to happen to fulfill those ambitions .. oh and what’s your favorite video game of all time ?

Have you ever played Megaman ? And do you any original concepts or ideas for a game of your own ? What’s your favorite gaming memory ? And yeah that’s it

[ebon mauve]

Learned a lot from Dinorex. I probably shouldn't have done it when I did it because it did a lot of stuff that final blow did. It's a later game and they knew how to push the sprite hardware more.

[sleek helm]

Everything happens for a reason bro!

[ebon mauve]

Really? Then maybe you can explain why my HERO couldn't beat the game. What was the reason for that gut punch?

[marble oxide]

You met your hero. Classic bungle

[sleek helm]

Don’t worry bro I can do it !

[undone helm]

Using my 2.4Ghz m30 8bitdo genesis controller. Controller is mapped but coin isn’t recognized >_<

[idle root]

I have the same controller and no issue. Maybe you'll have to define your mapping for the core ?

[restive wadi]

the HW testing is particularly intersting, using picoROM etc on original boards to verify/test behaviour
kinds of considerations around recreating how things worked in a way that works well on FPGA, vs 'netlists'
reusing existing things and 'wiring' them up
using what's found to improve MAME

all the things 🙂

[tidal heron]

But did you map it in the core? Actually mapping the coin button to a button on your controller. Just making sure to cover every possibility.

[ebon mauve]

Enable free play in the dip switches and see if any of the other buttons work.

[ebon mauve]

What did you do?

[severe quiver]

I know probably the last thing on your mind but do you intend to add high score saving support to the f2 core?

[ebon mauve]

It will get added at some point. It's on todo list.

[severe quiver]

Amazing news and again thanks ... if anyone knows jotego please also ask him to look at high saving in his framework ... I keep posting to him but for some reason my request is ignored 😁

[raw summit]

bit late, but maybe a discussion of how save states helped in testing and development. I think you touched on it before in the other thread. not sure if it goes any deeper than that though

or wording it differently, did you find the effort involved in implementing save states helped with the overall testing/development?

[uncut orchid]

I always forget how weird/pointless/annoying those bonus stage things in Metal Black are

[gusty belfry]

Where can I get the new beta core and mras to play Metal Black?

[flint hound]

This hasn't gone wide for good reason, still lots of testing to be done and it has potential to break existing games - #1345451572368244827 message

So if you run into any issues, please be cognoscente of that and report them in #1345451572368244827, thank you very much!

[static dirge]

I'd love to host it as a live or recorded chat.

[ebon mauve]

I don't think it'll be a live thing, probably a few videos covering different topics.

However, I have to clean my desk before I can do it, so it may never happen!

[fathom pewter]

Gotta hide the sensitive stuff

[marble oxide]

the hammer is for when the plunger gets stuck

[vagrant dust]

Is the death jingle missing in Liquid Kids a known issue?

[versed rain]

It's not mentioned in TODO or the github issues and I don't think its been mentioned here before

[ebon mauve]

Yeah, not known. Please add a GitHub issue.

[languid swift]

Did Dead connection and Metal black ever hit Update_All?

[restive wadi]

Not yet

[tall terrace]

Does anyone know if the character shadows or reflections in Pu Li Ru La are supposed to shimmer or wave?

[versed rain]

Yes the PCB has flickery shadows

[flint hound]

MiSTer wins again!

[versed rain]

Not flickering on mister tho. I'll add an issue to git

[ebon mauve]

If you have some video from hardware that would be great.

[versed rain]

I don't. It's just from memory but you can sort of see it in this https://youtu.be/j72jGVe9Wtg?si=4qwtRWRklXQaR9i2

Or in the Saturn and psx versions

[ebon mauve]

Looking at the video I'm guessing they are using the same character sprites for the shadows, but changing the palette and shrinking it vertically.

The shimmering is probably this same artifact from sprite scaling #1345451572368244827 message

[gusty mantle]

FM-TOWNS version has no shadows... 😔

[dry stone]

good thing we're never getting an fm towns core

[tidal heron]

Out of spite, someone will make an FM-Towns core now!

[orchid swift]

There already is a WIP one that Puu has been working on, if you use the WIP DB you can try use it... Good luck though if you don't know what you are doing (I don't know how to use it)

[potent delta]

The FM-Towns WIP core won't load much anyway. It's not that far progressed.

[dry stone]

i know this is incredibly rich of me to say as someone who doesn't know a lick of programming, but i wish puu-san hadn't abandoned the x68k core in favor of working on pc-88/98 and towns. i would've much rather just had the x68k core completed and buttoned up

[orchid swift]

It isn't that simple. He actually did do more work on x68000, but the problem is he doesn't use GitHub, and after a lot of work was put in to take what he did and get it working properly on MiSTer he didn't port back those changes and kept working on his version. As a result it would be incredibly painful to unpick and bring over the work he did after and any work he might do in the future on it.

People are free to work on whatever they want, but personally I wish he had taken the generation of Japanese PCs before the ones he worked on to completion. I.e. Sharp X1, FM-7, PC-6000, PC-8000 which we don't have cores for but have all the parts and would have been a lot more straightforward for him to do as a Japanese developer.

[hearty smelt]

PC8801 and X68000 he started around 2015.
FMTowns just started 2023.

[orchid swift]

And both PC-88 and x68000 took a hell of a lot of work from others to get from what he did to what we have in MiSTer now, and both those cores are still pretty rough and far from feature complete and bug free

[hearty smelt]

PC8801 can run lot of contents (maybe around 80% to 85%) but have some missing features and some bugs

Yosinda puts a lot of time on it also

[orchid swift]

Yeah, a good bit of work was put in last year to improve it that was nice to see

[static creek]

As long as x68000 plays Cho Ren Sha, I was happy and I didn't check other games. Is that the most complete of Puu's cores?

I thought about checking the unofficial PC98 core but gave up.

[dry stone]

i mean you can always play the windows port of cho ren sha anyway

cho ren sha ran alright the last time i tried the x68k core, but there was a lot of popping in the audio. many other games i tried (garou densetsu special, cyberblock metal orange ex, y2, etc.) loaded but had severe audio and/or graphical issues

[ebon mauve]

Anyone have access to a cameltry pcb?

[ebon mauve]

I suspect MAME is wrong about the alignment of the pivot layer but can't confirm it

[dry stone]

wonder if there's any video capture from the real pcb on youtube

[wary crescent]

Hello!

It's boxed up somewhere (I know which box, just went through a bunch of stuff) and the video on it's a bit blurry but I have one!

[wary crescent]

Video level's also on the high side, but I have the tools to do a pin lift and solder now

[ebon mauve]

Okay, I'll post some screenshots of some stuff in the first level and if you can get some shots in the same locations that would be great. No rush.

[wary crescent]

That works, it'll be photos from the TV, I'll see if I can get the RT4K to give me a clean image

As clean as I'll be able to get at least

[ebon mauve]

New release tonight, 20250910. Support for Metal Black and Dead Connection should be in update_all now

[uncut orchid]

F2 core gets BIG update

[dry stone]

welcome back to video esooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooterica

[fathom pewter]

will update arcade organizer

[fathom pewter]

done

[fathom pewter]

If anyone wonders, Taito F1 and F2 are the same. Even the MAME driver consolidates all games into F2

[hearty spear]

nice one

[wary crescent]

I did get everything unboxed: PCB, supergun, and PSU. Need to smoke test it but I should be good to grab images.

Also found my OSSC which has what I believe are the sharpest settings I could get dialed in. My board is plagued by what appears to be a DAR with slow rise/falls on the RGB signals

Should hopefully be good enough to get what you need, worst case I'll sample it generically with the tink

[ebon mauve]

Great! I'll try to get you some screenshots or a video this evening.

I'm basically going to highlight a few areas in the first level of Cameltry and have you confirm whether it matches what hardware looks like.

[wary crescent]

I'll see what I can do tonight, worst case I should have some time tomorrow

[ebon mauve]

Whenever you have a chance, no rush.

[wary crescent]

Oh that's not too bad then

Yeah I see what you mean, like it's offset?

It's late tonight but I'll try to grab this during lunch tomorrow

[ebon mauve]

Yeah, just a pixel or two. It might be tough to see if the output is soft

[wary crescent]

Vertical will still be sharp, so I should be able to still confirm some things

[gusty mantle]

It seems that Thunder Fox lost a layer

[wary crescent]

Well, I had thought I was going to have some stuff to do during the work day today, but I guess today's going to be pretty open

I had to put one thing on hold and the other thing that just got assigned to me was immediately assigned to someone else

[ebon mauve]

Hmmm, what did I break I wonder. I even tested it a few days ago because I didn't want some cockney making an attack video about me!

[wary crescent]

Alright, starting to hook everything up. Pin 74 on the DAR's joined with 75 and 76 in a fairly wide trace, which is...annoying.

It might not be too hard to cut though, thinking on it

Eh, not gonna mess with it for now. Gonna see how the Tink makes things look

[fathom pewter]

Nuking Arcade folder and cfg file?

After that rerun update_all

[idle root]

now I know what a cockney is

[wary crescent]

Curious here, is this present in the current version of the core?

There's an attract "how to play" sequence that has some pauses in a few places

[ebon mauve]

It's from the current version yeah. I don't know if the attract mode is consistent so I just played. If you want to just record some video of yourself playing and letting the ball sit in various corners I can use that too.

[ebon mauve]

No, it's definitely broken

[wary crescent]

Here's what I have to deal with btw

Phase is as good as it's going to get

Does this seem usable at least?

Not the attract sequence necessarily, just the quality

Granted, Discord compression's a thing too

[ebon mauve]

That's more than good enough.

[wary crescent]

Lemme boot the MiSTer up and just see how the attract looks there

I need to do an update anyways IIRC

(I'm also trying to find my rotary controller, if I can't find it I'll have to rig up something)

Oh interesting, the attract sequences don't quite line up

ROM differences maybe?

Lemme record it

[ebon mauve]

I noticed the attract loop isn’t the same every time. But don’t know if that is an issue with the core or not.

[wary crescent]

Let me switch back to my board, that makes me wonder then

Here's what I was referring to, there's a "bump" near the end

No luck on the rotary controller so lemme see if I can just rig something quick and dirty up

[ebon mauve]

Are both those videos from your board?

Or the second one is mister?

[ebon mauve]

Seems like at the last point in the attract look all version do a "Jump". World and Japan time it so that you jump to the left. The US version seems to mis-time it, maybe?, at the jump doesn't do much. But you can hear the jump noise in all three versions.

[wary crescent]

First is the board, second is the MiSTer

The one with the "jump"

And yeah, I don't have audio on the board atm but I assume it plays the sound there (I just don't have it hooked up)

Also, I found an issue on my board! Wondering why my spinner setup doesn't work, I don't think a 4.7k resistor is supposed to be reading...1.2ohm.

I need to take it out of circuit to confirm but the other ends are reading 4.7k, so I suspect there's a resistor array going out. Think I can work around it by doing this as 2P?

It'll be annoying but I'll make it work

[wary crescent]

Aha, my dead F3 has a 4.7k array. Lemme get these swapped in and rig up a pullup situation on these lines

[feral narwhal]

Wow, this Dead Connection looks amazing! Never played a game like that on arcades. Super music and sound effects, destructible environment...plus mafia themed.
Thank you very much wickerwaka!

[wary crescent]

I don't have an official Taito spinner handy and the lines on the Cameltry PCB are pulled down by the 4.7k array, not up. The other lines have a typical pullup arrangement so it shouldn't be too hard to mimic that

[ebon mauve]

It's such a fun game!

[feral narwhal]

Do you recommend that we use some audio filters on your cores or are they already as close to originals as possible?

[wary crescent]

Alright, it's jank, but spinner's hooked up

@ebon mauve I think you might be accurate here, lemme pull up your video again

Lemme try to mimic here

@ebon mauve How's this look?

That's on PCB, I just turned off decimation and tbh the image looks cleaner that way

I can rock back and forth a bit more at the beginning if needed, or if you need me to get the marble against a specific side

Using arbitrary angles here, but it looks like at "0" (flat) and "270" degrees (near the end) it looks like it's in contact with the surface, but at "90" and "180" degrees it's hovering

[ebon mauve]

Oh nice! Yeah, I think it looks exactly the same.

Thank you so much for taking the time to get these videos for me. I know it can be a pain in the ass to dig stuff up and get setup.

[wary crescent]

Well, I just moved so it was all mostly in boxes

Here's a better "flats" example: at start it's 0-1 pixels below floor, then it's 0-1 above, 0-1 above, and 0-1 below

My very jank setup btw

Rotary encoder repurposed from an old project, a couple pullup resistors since the two lines are pulldowns, then my normal arcade stick going into the supergun, all scattered around the living room floor rofl

The spinner controller I was trying to find plugs in between and has an MCU to scale a 360PPR encoder to the...486 or whatever PPR Taito spinners ended up at. Just bare it's a bit on the low sensitivity side.

[ebon mauve]

This was my setup.

That was on driftout

[wary crescent]

Alright, gonna play a couple more rounds on the real PCB before I put it away for the time being

If there's something else that comes up let me know and I can always pull it back out

[wary crescent]

Alright, I got through the special course

[untold brook]

Defo looks the same and it even clips in a bit to one wall like you experienced

[untold idol]

I’m so happy to be able to finally try Dead Connection – thank you! Really fun game 🙂

[restive wadi]

Didn't see a single swapped tile on a playthrough of dead connection on latest core. Thanks Waka

[steady token]

Am I the only one who experiences issues on the Japanese version of Dead Connection and the single PCB version of Metal Black? Both games show a misplaced image, but in a different way. For Metal Black, it's moved to the left and is noticeably cropped. For Dead Connection, not only is it moved to the left, but also the top of the image is displayed at the bottom of the screen. There may be other issues, but these ones are the most noticeable.

[untold brook]

Do you have a picture of the issue?

[steady token]

I can make screenshots, yes. Will send them in a few minutes.

[steady token]

Metal Black, single PCB:

Dead Connection, Japanese release:

Thunder Fox is also somewhat broken, but this has already been reported above.

[restive wadi]

Same thing here with alts Dead Connection (Japan).mra and Metal Black (World, single PCB).mra
The main mras are OK

update_all gets an older metalb.zip without the 'metalba' folder inside also, Metal Black (World, single PCB).mra needs it

[ebon mauve]

Yeah, the Dead Connection japanese mra needs to be tweaked.

Didn't realize there was a single PCB metal black version. MAME is broken for that one too.

Dead Connection (World) is also a single PCB version and it is slightly different hardware. The dual board versions don't use the TC0100SCN tilemap generator but it is still part of the F2 main board so it is used to generate video timing signals. The single board versions drop the TC0100SCN and probably generate the video signal from the TC0480SCP which results in slightly different offsets.

[ebon mauve]

Latest release fixes this and Thunder Fox

[static creek]

Thank you for all your efforts. Almost done with F2 it seems. What are the last hurdles to be taken?

[idle root]

Thank you Martin🙏 As a developer, it's always disappointing to introduce involuntary regression.

[ebon mauve]

Still ten games left to do, so a decent amount of work.

[tidal heron]

Also want to say thank you for all the work on this (and your previous Irem arcade work). Always appreciated!

[spice heron]

Regarding that the README says that the PCBs are not marked with F1 or F2, and that it’s unclear if they can be regarded as a “system” like the F3 can. I suppose the answer is “no” since every PCB is unique, and it wasn’t really marketed as a system or platform. but some games do carry “F1 SYSTEM” labeling.

[ebon mauve]

What game is that?

[spice heron]

Thunder Fox

[ebon mauve]

Single board?

[spice heron]

I believe so, yeah

[wary crescent]

I think my Cameltry board just says "F system"

It's also weird because you'll get games like Puzzle Bobble, which are "B system"

[thorny dagger]

Taito naming conventions for “systems” has one of two methodologies; strict adherence to an actual design or random ass “what silicon is cheap right now…ok cool throw it on the next game” groupings

Half their boards are made up of half of the same chips as their last board. The other half is locked off designs they didn’t change at all

JC is the worst offender. They moved location of GALs so even if every board will boot every game you can get wrong textures on models due to it

[ebon mauve]

Thunder Fox is completely unique also. It's the only F1/F2 game with two TC0100SCN's

[thorny dagger]

I can’t imagine navigating all this shit while making a core. Hope you keep a bottle on your bench

I mean I’ve got Taito boards with schematics for the filter board that don’t even match the filter board

[wary crescent]

Just means you have schematics for a different filter board

[feral narwhal]

Did anyone else notice on Dead Connection that since the update, the level objects like cars, barrels, chairs are all "pass-through"? I mean you just pass through them.

[marble oxide]

have you updated recently? like in the last 48 hours?

(I haven't tested it, I just know there were issues with the previous build)

[thorny dagger]

It’s a NOS kit 🤣

Taito would just change shit and not tell anyone

[thorny dagger]

That’s just the sequel Ghost Connection lol

[wary crescent]

That's...well, I'd say that's Taito

But others are guilty of the same rofl

[feral narwhal]

I mean i ran update today, i don't know if/when something was changed.

[thorny dagger]

Basically. I did a custom JAMMA conversion harness for Night Striker with a HAPP flight stick for someone like 5 or 6 years ago? Like 20% of the schematic was just wrong. Pointed to connectors that weren’t even populated on the PCB

[wary crescent]

Doesn't surprise me with this era of stuff

[thorny dagger]

Yeah they were just making it up on the fly. The stuff between pure JAMMA and pure JVS is a minefield of randomness

[wary crescent]

My favorite thing about JVS is the USB plug :)

The "NOT USB" USB plug

[restive wadi]

In dead connection I can walk thorough chairs in the first level, and barrels and (stationary) cars in the second level under TaitoF2_20250916.rbf, TaitoF2_20250910.rbf and the initial test release #1345451572368244827 message

hadnt played the game before Waka added support in the core, assumed it was normal 🙂

I tried the 3 rbfs and current/original test mra

[feral narwhal]

I was playing the game every day because i like it 🙂 Definitely those objects were blocking previously because you'd use them as (not very efficient) cover or they'd simply obstruct your passage.

[ebon mauve]

I’ll take a look. Nothing has changed in that area. That’s all cpu.

[feral narwhal]

Weird, maybe I'm imagining, but I'm almost certain that objects such as the car on the 2nd level were not pass-through. I'll run the game again to check.

[ebon mauve]

Just tried it on mame and on the core and you can walk through most objects in both. The arm chairs and plants in the first level, cars and tires in the second.

[feral narwhal]

I apologize then for a false bug. I don't know how I missed this - I played the game every day. Sorry about that.

I was absolutely certain that the car on the 2nd level was a solid obstacle because i was covering from bullets behind it.

[feral narwhal]

That was really stupid of me. I'll check and compare with a previous release next time i notice an issue.

[ebon mauve]

Don’t worry about it. Just a normal part of development.

[feral narwhal]

thanks

[violet badge]

In "Don Doko Don" I see two 1-Pixel lines in the title screen (to the right in the star-shaped yellow impact). It looks wrong, and videos on youtube show the shape without the lines - but I have no original hardware to compare.

did not manage to take a picture of it

here is a screenshot from youtube with arrows indicating the problem area:

I ran update_all yesterday

[ebon mauve]

#1345451572368244827 message

[ebon mauve]

Yup. I grabbed a save state today so I could work out what’s going on there.

[static creek]

We have now quite a lot of soccer games from the same time from Konami (Premier Soccer 1993), IREM (Dream Soocer 94), now Taito (Football Champ 1990, Euro Champ 1992). They look so similar. Did someone compare those already?

[ebon mauve]

They are all so similar, I don't know which ones I might have played in an arcade 30 years ago.

[untold brook]

Only one worth playing in arcades was Seibu Soccer, loads of ways to score, even headers

[static creek]

Not seeing anything Seibu coming to MiSTer anytime soon

[umbral hill]

okay so what's the best game on this system and why is it dino rex?

[dry stone]

that's a shame. seibu has a small but strong lineup of arcade titles

[brittle rock]

Zero Team is good stuff

[static creek]

I know just one FPGA developer that obviously had a look on that 🥳

(but personally I want to have him skip the japanese quiz games and move over to Bonze Adventure 🤪 )

[dry stone]

bonze adventure was taito right

hope to see more taito stuff beyond F2 someday. F3 is one of my all-time favorites

[static creek]

Not too far from F2 (Bonze)

All those early Visco shmups are running on that board. And Cadash which is a classic

And there is still hope that this could be a "one PCB fits all" thing.

Not like the F2 boards which have just the name in common

[dry stone]

here's hoping

the good thing about a potential F3 core would be it's all the same hardware (afaik), just with interchangeable rom carts

[static creek]

Yeah, but F3 was more or less ruled out for now (Amiga 1200 CPU not yet cycle accurate)

[dry stone]

that's unfortunate

[static creek]

Let's go for the low hanging fruit for now

A lot of games deserve to be preserved. And a lot of the F3 games are on Saturn at least

(sadly not Grid Seeker which has such a great art style)

[dry stone]

that's true, there's plenty of other stuff that's probably a lot easier to tackle at this stage

i have a running list of arcade boards i'd like to see implemented eventually

[pseudo dirge]

Football Champ is waaaaaay better than Seibu Soccer.

Sorry, what I actually meant to say was waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay waaaaaaaaaaaaay better.

Which is why it was everywhere in Europe.

[flint hound]

https://tenor.com/view/schmoedown-friday-night-titans-coy-jandreau-kristian-harloff-quirky-mercs-gif-25247990

https://youtu.be/Yq1fySmrE1s?feature=shared

[untold brook]

Shots fired, I will give FC a try tonight

It better have a super shot, headed goals, similar players for the time like Gazza and the God team

Oh and the jump and kick to the face tackle

[pseudo dirge]

https://tenor.com/view/hat-trick-hero-football-champ-football-futbol-taito-gif-17191130994774124805

Look at dis!

[untold brook]

Oh it seems very like Super sidekicks

[ebon mauve]

woah, is that Football Champs?!

I need to learn how to do a super shot

[pseudo dirge]

Ha ha I do remember gazza's hair and Maradona's afro

Seibu was great

I was travelling round Europe at that time

93 I think

Italy france Spain every bar seemed to have Football Champ

Big crowd of kids always around it going crazy

I also really liked Tecmo 90

And then later Tecmo 94 on the neo geo

And also Seibu

Here is my top 5 list that nobody asked for:

Football Champ 🏆
Tecmo 90
Tecmo 94
Seibu Soccer
Soccer Superstars

[undone helm]

The new Tecmo 2025 is out based on week one players and a more balanced gameplay (no more Bo Jackson running around like crazy lol)- expect them to update it as the season goes on too!

Here’s a list of the updates to the game:

https://sblueman.com/tecmo-super-bowl-2025/

[static creek]

Tecmo 90 > Tecmo 94? Premier Soccer? Dream Soccer 94?

[static creek]

I asked;)

[pseudo dirge]

I love tecmo 90

[ebon mauve]

Is this canon?

[pseudo dirge]

Yes
And furthermore
I defy anyone to challenge this ranking

https://tenor.com/view/fire-gif-10341555270454130792

[flint hound]

pins updated with a link to the latest test build

[brittle rock]

Those Kunio soccer games on NES also have some crazy super shots.

Odd seeing Washington Commanders instead of Redskins in Tecmo Super Bowl.

I like Football Champ quite a bit, but Taito Legends 2 botched it and messed up the controls.

I also got the FC Tecmo Bowl and NES Super Bowl recently.

[bleak dome]

Hi guys just tried Football Champ on my CRT Trinitorn are these graphics glitches normal because the beta status?

Several glitches also on the baseball game…

Or maybe is the wrong Roms I’ve used?

[ebon mauve]

Looks like you are using the wrong RBF file.

[bleak dome]

uhm I've downloaded it from here...

[marble oxide]

Yeah, but is it the only one in the arcade/cores directory

[bleak dome]

ah maybe have I to delete the "official" one?

[marble oxide]

Yeah. The mister is likely using that one

[bleak dome]

ah ok thanks!!

[static dirge]

I can confirm, I had the same issue.

It's having multiple rbf files

[mortal trout]

Thank you for the accuracy improvements on TC0200OBJ.
Liquid Kids works great now with release 20250929.

[versed rain]

was just about to write the same

[undone helm]

Yes! Finally beat the Liquid Kids final boss 👌🏼. Thank god for that save state feature too so I could pick it back up a day later ^_^

Not the highest but not the lowest score holla 🙌🏽

Not sure if this a bug per se but I’ve noticed on any CRT monitor when you do analog video h-pos past -3 the screen goes out of sync. I only bring it up because most of the horizontal games work on -3/3 but are just a touch off by about -2.

That said, didn’t know if this was a signal PCB thing but thought I’d mention.

Great work!!!!

[ebon mauve]

Thank you, I think you are the first person to praise save states!

[undone helm]

I don’t always have time to play 50+ levels of DonDokaDon all at once. Pause helps too. I don’t play for high scores all the time- I like fun narratives even in a shmup lol

[undone helm]

Think I found a small bug in Solitary Fighter. When you map the controls kick actually maps to jump and vice versa.

Just beat Metal Black holla 🙌🏽

[ebon mauve]

Thanks. I probably just need to flip them in the mra

[undone helm]

Cameltry at 25% d-pad feels nice and smooth ~_^

[ebon mauve]

New core release: PuLiRuLa shadow fix and Euro Champ 92 support.

[flint hound]

you kick ass, dude. thank you

[ebon mauve]

PuLiRuLa finally playable

[tidal heron]

So would you call this a shadow drop release!?

[wet hornet]

Now it’s not weird

[tall terrace]

https://tcrf.net/PuLiRuLa_(Arcade)

[fathom pewter]

Arcade organizer uses the Japanese version of PuLiRuLa due to the following:

[gusty belfry]

I checked the Mister Dev channel, but don't see the download link. Where can you get the new core?

[ebon mauve]

It should be on update _all

[marble oxide]

it is

confirmed that the shadows are glitched working as intended

[forest flower]

I have both the Japanese and the English PCB and the English one still has the legs, just on the last stage not on the middle one.

I also have it for Saturn and PSX, and I think the PSX follows the English version, were you don't see the legs until the end.

My buddy has there (3!) copies of it for the FM Towns, so I'll have to play it at his house one day to figure out that situation...

[wet hornet]

A legs man I see

[tender marten]

Euro champ 92 somekind of visual glitch.

[ebon mauve]

Consistent or just a random occurrence?

[pseudo dirge]

I've been playing euro champ 92 alot and there is no glitch for me so far.

[tender marten]

This error is consistent, but it only occurred for me on the game's 'presentation' screen, right after one of the teams scores a goal—and only at that moment.

I love letting arcade games run and just watching them, with that goofy smile on my face hahaha.

[pseudo dirge]

Ah I see I haven't seen much of the attract screen.

Ill stick it on now and have a look

[pseudo dirge]

I'm not seeing any attract mode glitches here.

[marble oxide]

I'll spin it up

@tender marten if you open the menu, press right, and scroll down to about, what is the build date on your core?

[marble oxide]

Ran it for about 25 minutes. All my celebrations had legs

[tender marten]

TaitoF2 v251010

I see now, I got a error, loading the core: "mame/uerach92.zip/c80-0c80-03.57 not found

[marble oxide]

delete the zip and then have update_all redownload it

[idle root]

Taito F2 core in its glory, my setup at a retrogaming exhibition, yesterday.
Thank you Martin 👍🏻

[wet hornet]

Awesome setup, did people think mister was great or very great?

What were you using the trackball on the taito mini for?

[idle root]

yes great, but costly, according to them. 😕

people were very interested with the rgbmatrix dmd
and very pleased to test spinner games like cameltry and puzzleloop2

[wet hornet]

Ha retro game collector people thought mister was expensive? Unless they are hooking up consoles and carts directly to free CRTs they got all of from a yard sale I find that hard to believe they can be honest with themselves and that opinion

[idle root]

puzzleloop2 and cameltry

[idle root]

it's not cheap but yeah I don't think it's expensive, especially with clone hardware

[wet hornet]

I suppose when you’re already invested in retro gaming cruft mister looks like a decent expense on top of that rather than a replacement

[ebon mauve]

Mister isn’t expensive enough. It should be on marble not a cheap wooden table. If people ask how much it costs just scoff and turn away.

[orchid swift]

If you have to ask then you can't afford it.

[ebon mauve]

Thanks for showing off MiSTer and the core!

[idle root]

people were really surprised how good and smooth cameltry plays using a spinner

[flint hound]

What’s the cup from

[idle root]

it's from the exhibition event

[flint hound]

That’s cool

I thought that was your room lol

I’m like damn, this guy drinks wine while playing retro.

[idle root]

special beers

[mortal trout]

I didn't have time to go this year.
But the others also showed me photos and a video of Cousin Hubert performing karaoke for the opening of TokiMemo on Prologue 21. 😂

[idle root]

the karaoke was behind me 🤣 but we're running out of topic

[mortal trout]

Thanks for representing the 'MiSTer' section there.

[idle root]

the goal is to inspire vocations

[undone helm]

Two things- 1. Where did you get that full color marquee (I only have a black and white ttyoled at the moment)? And 2. Are you using that experimental driver for your taito trackball & spinner (I was nervous about using it)?

[idle root]

it's a DIY project : https://github.com/kconger/MiSTer_web2rgbmatrix
nothing experimental regarding taito egret 2 mini support : you just have to add specific entries inside your mister.ini

example : https://github.com/funkycochise/Insert-Coin_Res/blob/main/MiSTer (Entry for Egret2 Spinner).ini
[taitof2]
spinner_axis=2
spinner_vid=0x0ae4
spinner_pid=0x0701
spinner_throttle=100

[undone helm]

Awesome! 👏 thank you for the info ^_^ time to level up!

[idle root]

The dmd is driven by a trinity ESP32 arduino able to connect to wifi.
a script is run on the mister side, and when a core is launched, the information is provided to the ESP32, this triggers a specific gif found on a SD card, to be shown on the dmd

[idle root]

most of the time you will have to set up the core to paddle/spinner mode
I just also have special build for centipede, sensibility value didn't have sufficient range

[solar fractal]

Is that controller compatible with the PS1 core too?

[idle root]

I never try

[undone helm]

Gotcha. I’ll work on my setup stat. Always new ways to play. Been playing Cameltry with the d-pad set to 25-50% sensitivity and it nice but that rotation makes that much better. I only played it once before on my egret 2 mini. Got those sonic 1 bonus stage vibes for me. Love it!

[solar fractal]

Ok, thanks anyway,

[idle root]

it should though

[solar fractal]

I thought so too but first hand confirmation is always nice if possible. I think I will get it anyway before the prices get silly which they are bound to sooner or later.

[idle root]

i'm afraid they're already

[solar fractal]

Compared to new sure but still not excessive imo, spinners aren't exactly cheap on their own either.

[odd yacht]

oooo new release overnight. @ebon mauve what's new? I can never figure it out finding out what's changed. Not saying this is the case, but you look a newly compiled core, and they rarely say what's changed, been fixed. Okay I like changelogs! Many thanks for this update.

[static creek]

No new release today as far as I can see. The last one is from 2 weeks ago. Just fixes to the "Quiz" branch

[ebon mauve]

No releases, been working on the quiz games.

Whenever I do a release I post in the forums with release notes.

[ebon mauve]

New core release with all those quiz games everyone has been waiting for

[dry stone]

finally, my life is complete

[uncut orchid]

I love quizzes

[tidal heron]

Riddle me this! How many of us are playing the quiz games! 👀 🤚

[bright tulip]

Quiz Chase HQ and Crayon Shin are on attract mode lately and my family are trying to learn Japanese. Thank you wikerwaka, always playing and running your cores.

[ebon mauve]

Are the questions still relevant today?

[marble oxide]

I don't mean to be culturally insensitve but has anyone seen Crayon Shinchan Orato Asobo and Quiz Crayon Shinchan in the same room at the same time? I'm going to need to see some paperwork that these are actually different games

(doing tink4k profiles)

[ebon mauve]

wow

"all these japanese quiz games look the same to me"

[neon garden]

@ebon mauve I own a real Mahjong Quest PCB and I would personally be interested in seeing a core, but it's one of those things where maybe 1 or 2 people would actually play it. I think there are maybe a handful of western people that collect mahjong PCBs.

[marble oxide]

tend to your own house before critiquing others!!

shameful.

[uncut orchid]

what's the custom hardware on that mahjong game? is it just controller stupidity or did they like slap a different video chip on it?

[brittle rock]

I wish there were more quiz games translated or localized into English. I like Quiz and Dragons quite a bit, though that one came to the US first.

Speaking of Chase HQ, the two detectives from that game were in Rolling Thunder style game named Crime City, which is on System B.

[ebon mauve]

It's got an additional 64K of work ram, different/unknown input system and the tilemap has some kind of banking implemented.

[wary crescent]

Everyone loves a mahjong control panel (this is actually one of andy's old photos IIRC)

[next plume]

Awesome work on the F2 core. I am curious, does this open the door to other boards from that era getting cores. Most notably, hoping for Cadash and Raimais.

[severe quiver]

Has high saving now been added in latest core?

[static creek]

Cadash sure is a classic 😉

[ebon mauve]

Not yet.

[severe quiver]

Thanks for confirming 👍

[ebon mauve]

Yes, most of the components for taito "bronze" games has been implemented

[undone helm]

Quiz Crayon Shinchan is dope. Love the whole kid getting all the ingredients for ramen lol.

Tried Quiz Chikyu Bouri Gun and there seems to be sprite layer prioritization issues (mostly in the cut scenes). Still having fun and not knocking the work just wanted @ebon mauve to be aware if he’s still working on the quiz games.

[static creek]

Good game, the adventures of the bronze bonze from far east

[static creek]

I guess that filing a bug report on the tracker with clear steps to reproduce is the best idea to have bugs fixed.

[undone helm]

Agreed. I wasn’t sure because I had never played the game before and it just seemed a little off with sprite flickers and characters popping in and out of the background. I’ll research more before I submit a report. Still enjoying these quizzes ^_^

[neon garden]

This is actually not my photo but I have one like it.

I hope if Cadash is ever added there's the possibility of supporting the link cable. It runs off a HD64180 microcontroller, and the link port has exactly 8 pins, so it should work over SNAC nicely 🙂

Mahjong Quest ROM board.

[ebon mauve]

Interesting.

No extra ram, two unpopulated 5563 chips next to the cpu rom.

RTC

No dedicated IO chip

[wary crescent]

Funny, I pulled it from an old post of yours

[neon garden]

Yeah it's on my blog but it's not my image.

[ebon mauve]

Well, I bought a broken cadash board

It will probably need a breakout board to do the link cable

[orchid swift]

Ah nice, more Taito. Do we know if the other games listed on System 16 use identical hardware or do they all have different chips and things on them?

KNOWN TAITO BONZE ADVENTURE GAME LIST
Asuka & Asuka
Bonze Adventure / Jigoku Meguri
Cadash
Galmedes
Kokontouzai Eto Monogatari
Maze Of Flott
U.N. Defense Force : Earth Joker

https://www.system16.com/hardware.php?id=652

[forest flower]

Bro, I have 3, I could have sent it with the other game! Let me know in the future if you need help!

Also, very excited! Cool game and the link up feature is neat. I wonder if it's possible to have MiSTer emulate two PCBs output to a single HDTV, so the screens are side by side?

That's my dream for the Ninja Warrior, Darius, and X-Men 6 player game.

[ebon mauve]

There are some variations. Sound hardware differs, some games have a c-chip for security. Cadash has a microcontroller for communication.

[orchid swift]

Ah OK, system 16 only giving half the story as usual

[ebon mauve]

I don’t plan to be drinking and ebaying. It just happens.

[ebon mauve]

Hardware looks simple enough that that would be possible.

[wet hornet]

So you’re saying its time to build a setup with 3 CRTs and mirrors (not a sex thing..for now)

[tall terrace]

Woah that bonze looks like a great little line up of a lot of genres

[hearty smelt]

No quizz game 😅

[forest flower]

I've been there too... let me know if you need me to mess with a working one for you.

I do have a scope, but you'd def have to walk me through usage.

[forest flower]

Oh man, that would be freaking EPIC!

[undone helm]

Just played through Cadash for the first time on Genesis. Gonna run it back on TGFX-CD next.

[forest flower]

Awesome, I'm curious to know which one you consider better.

[undone helm]

From what I’ve read the TGFX version has better graphics /sound and 2 other classes. Damn- now I want to do full replays with the mage, priestess, and ninja 🥷 characters lol

[forest flower]

Dang, that's awesome! I might have to run through them on MiSTer, break out the PCB for a final run through

[tidal heron]

We're doing Liquid Kids in the game-challenge right now!

[feral sapphire]

I had so much fun with Liquid Kids during that challenge that I decided to try for a 1cc in the game and finally nailed it in the core yesterday! Great game.
https://youtu.be/lQC11BmO53A

[severe quiver]

I know work has started on igs pgm but is there any news on highscore saving being added to this core?

[flint hound]

Nope, not yet