Nintendo 64

[last wraith]

truth is that it was always that blurry, but we were not accustomed to razor sharp panels of today

which present all the imperfectments of every game lol

also alot of that era games haven't aged very well

the devs were still struggling with finding good ways to control characters in 3D environment

just look at the Castlevania 64 games

they are shockingly ugly compared to the contemporary Symphony of the night

[craggy cradle]

1st gen 3D console games don't look good as we remember

[last wraith]

i just wish there were lots of more 2D games from the 32/64 bit era. Alot of these have aged really well. Seems like the devs had perfected the 2d sprite games and finally had powerful consoles to use it but instead wasted all the talent on crappy 3d games

[craggy cradle]

blame sony

[last wraith]

Wonder Project J2 on N64 is a good example

Nanatsu Kaze no Shima Monogatari on Saturn another one

ironically both games never had western releases

[topaz otter]

The worst way is on an Emerson 15" CRT TV through RF

Anything else is a step up from that

[jagged summit]

I have encountered an issue with the core where I will load a game but it will load to a black screen. I need to then enter the Mister menu, do a cold reboot, and then open the core and reload the game for it to run successfully. Has anyone encountered this?

[turbid warren]

you say ironic, i say intentional decision made by western executives

[lament linden]

@random girder Taki featured your design in his video he just released. https://youtu.be/shKwRz9MD-A?t=705

[random girder]

Oh wow! Thanks for letting me know!

[last wraith]

How the west fucked up gaming industry

[tender pine]

Sorry, but this is utter nonsense. How you gonna play Mario 64, Wave Race 64, Goldeneye, Ocarina, Majora's Mask, Blast Corps, Pilotwings 64 and No Mercy - to name a few - only to say it was a waste??

The main reason I come on here however...

Has anybody got good experience comparing the N64 Digital with that of the Ultra HDMI?

[last wraith]

I’m not saying all 3D games were crap. I’m saying I wish there were more 2D games

[tender pine]

You've almost countless 2D games. You couldn't play all the good to great 2D games in one lifetime.

[last wraith]

Countless 2D games on N64?

Which?

[tender pine]

Not on N64 because that would be entirely counterintuitive. The console, cpu, GPU and controller were designed around bringing things kicking and screaming into a 3D revolution.

If you want 2D you had Saturn which because when it attempted 3D it come out in a rash.

[last wraith]

Hence why alot of the 2D games from that era have aged better than the 3D ones

Not all developers did the switch to 3D smoothly.

[tender pine]

Maybe the pseudo 3D games on Saturn and PSX have aged badly but the vast majority of those on N64 have a timeless charm.

[last wraith]

no alot of them have aged like crap

[tender pine]

Who's going to play Mario 64 for the first time and think 'i wish we had more 2D'...

[last wraith]

especially with that vaseline blur

[tender pine]

Which 3D games on N64 have aged like crap?

[last wraith]

The Castlevania games for instance

Compare it to Castlevania on PSX

[tender pine]

Also that vaseline blur thing is both a fallacy and if an issue previously entirely not today.

Ok. Castlevania.

What others?

[last wraith]

there are too many to mention

Hybrid Heaven

Superman 64

[tender pine]

Hybrid Heaven is solid.

[last wraith]

it looks like crap

😄

[tender pine]

Superman 64's problem isn't with aged 3D but poor gameplay.

[last wraith]

I know. I have the japanese cart.

Carmageddon 64

Mortal Kombat Sub Zero

[tender pine]

I know. I played it in the day and in 2024.

[last wraith]

utter crap 😄

[tender pine]

None of the games you've mentioned are as bad as you suggest. None of them.

[last wraith]

that Mortal Kombat game more or less killed off the franchise

[tender pine]

You need badly to broaden your aesthetic perspective.

[last wraith]

It's very wide

[tender pine]

The MK franchise was based entirely on blood and gore. Not good gameplay.

[last wraith]

Batman Beyond. Another game that's aged graphically like milk

Power Rangers Lightspeed Rescue

[tender pine]

Again. You are only naming games lacking in good gameplay. Neither of these games have aged badly in a 3D sense.

[hushed nova]

it's nearly 2025 and I'm witnessing a "someone doesn't like a thing I like" conversation

[last wraith]

they have aged horribly and you are blind to see it 😄

I'm not even talking about gameplay

I'm talking about graphics

because good 3D graphics was made back then

[tender pine]

'graphics'...

[last wraith]

just look at Psygnosis and some of their 3D stuff.

[tender pine]

Spoken like a true noob.

[last wraith]

Wipeout alone was a testimony to how good 3d graphics could be made in the right hands

"noob" 😄

[tender pine]

Wave Race 64 and Pilotwings have Wipeout on PSX licked.

[last wraith]

LOL

"noob"

[chrome quest]

Time machines are real after all. Gotta live and let live people, lets enjoy some N64. We all have different tastes. If you think someone else blind to to not agree, sorry buddy, some introsepection might be nice

[tender pine]

Wipeout sold on its chav soundtrack.

Not good graphics or gameplay.

[last wraith]

you probably weren't even there when it was out

[tender pine]

Noob chavs ate it up.

I was.

[last wraith]

there was nothing like it

[tender pine]

For good reason.

[last wraith]

So yeah my point still stands. Alot of devs did a bad transmition to 3D and more should have output 2D games 😛

[tender pine]

Yeah. Also we should have stayed in caves and not went out exploring...

We should have just stuck with two wheels and not tried four...

[last wraith]

We could do both. Are you aware that there are methods of masonry and linen weaving that mankind had perfected in ancient times times that scientists not even with modern science can replicate in it's delicacy. Once you perfect an art it's not always given that it will be transferred to coming generations.

[magic girder]

https://youtu.be/NDTwS7psDbA?t=2

[topaz otter]

Chopper Attack 64

its a stuttering mess of a game with sluggish controls and absurdly high difficulty

and the little rambo man that jumps on your helicopter screaming is annoying

also Gex 64

but that's all I'll say about that one because the lizard mafia will come out of the woodwork to defend him

[zinc dew]

[turbid warren]

never have premarital gex

[gritty basalt]

To be fair, Gex 64 is an inferior port of Gex 2: Enter the Gecko compared to the PSX version. Somebody had to have been smoking something in order for them to think that replacing several of the levels that were cut in the N64 version with a half-assed underwater level was actually a good idea (I remember some music tracks being cut too, and I think the title screen from the PSX version was also cut if I remember correctly). If anybody's gonna play Gex 2, they should play the PSX version where its at its best! Gex 64 is something that you should only give to the kid of some brother-in-law that you don't particularly care about or something if you're expected to give 'em something to play as a gift or something ("Here, Jimmy, boot up your dad's N64 and give this thing a spin!").

Also, speaking for myself, I'm not part of the lizard mafia -- I'm part of the lizard yakuza.

[gritty basalt]

And always practice safe gex -- you wouldn't want any unwanted pregnancies! 👌

Sweet!

[lunar ginkgo]

cries in Megaman 64

[tender pine]

So much crap and revisionism when talking N64 and early 3D games as a whole ☝️

[zinc dew]

like wat

[neat sierra]

People thinking N64 had more than 5 games worth playing

[quick light]

Resident Evil 2
Biohazard 2
40 Winks EU Proto
40 Winks US Proto
40 Winks Piko Interactive

[green epoch]

no visual novels? is this even a real platform?

[iron wren]

Probably around a quarter of the n64 library is worth touching, the rest is early 3d shovelware because nobody knew how to make good 3d games yet

[lone geyser]

Even the good games require more historical context to justify them than the SNES

SMW is a good game. SM64 is a good game...considering

ALTTP is a good game. Ocarina of Time is a bad game good game...considering

Now that I think about it, the times I consider N64 to come out ahead are when the SNES experiments with 3D /3D effects like Mario Kart and Star Fox

One of the actual best games for the N64 is probably Tony Hawk's Pro Skater, but that one is better on other systems so it doesn't count toward the N64 library so much

[tender pine]

Anybody, and I mean anybody who uses the term 'shovelware' can be immediately discounted as having an original thought or suggestion.

[zinc dew]

I like shovelware

[tender pine]

Like the N64 had little more than half a dozen games and even them having aged badly. Seriously. The N64 has a good 50 games which today are still well worth anybody's time. I don't know if I could say that about the PSX or Saturn...

[marble cargo]

The worst Nintendo 64 game is still not as bad as the worst SEGA Saturn and PS1 games.

Like you need to actively try to reach the same level as Death Crimson.

[tender pine]

Shovelware is a term that started getting bandied about during the Wii gen from miserable and ignorant types who were tethered to their grey, dullish and poorly performing PS3/360 games.

[zinc dew]

I like shovel ware, please shovel it into my hands

[tender pine]

Give me the 5 and I'll give you 5 more in a heartbeat...

[tender pine]

SM64 is a good game full stop. Considering what exactly?

Not just a good game, one of the best games of all time. A freaking revolution.

[zinc dew]

Considering it was made by Miyamoto!

damn not funny, ok

[marble cargo]

Super Mario 64 was a good game, the part where Luigi slowly ate the flesh of that Toad in excruciating detail was kind of weird not gonna lie.

[tender pine]

Give me a game which genuinely brought such a seismic revolution that say Mario 64, Wave Race or Goldeneye - for example.

[lone geyser]

Obtuse camera controls, strange behavior that players are likely to encounter (invisible walls, kick vs dive mechanics), "exit on star" is bad and makes the 100 coin stars occasionally frustrating. It's also been surpassed by future iterations and other 3D platformers in ways that SMW hasn't. It was a revolution, sure, but revolution is context, and it doesn't improve the game on its own merits

||Also ugly||

[tender pine]

The camera was incredibly accurate, more than it had any right to be considering acrobatics and worlds in Mario 64. For the few times it required tweaking, that's what the yellow arrow buttons allowed.

The rest was none of it bad.

[zinc dew]

Remind me to never get on @lone geyser’s bad side lol, dude will tear me up

[tender pine]

Also. "Passed by future 3D iterations"? Well, Sunshine fell way, way short and while Galaxy and Odyssey are both exceptional, neither of them possess the magical wonder and infinite possibilities of Mario 64.

Reason why that hub is arguably the most iconic and loved hub even today.

[neat sierra]

I’d give it a B+

[tender pine]

You can't account for taste...

[neat sierra]

I’m just kidding it’s a great game, showed that 3D platformers could be done well

A-

[tender pine]

Take away the - and you have it bang on.

[neat sierra]

What’s the hub? The castle?

[tender pine]

N64 owners had Mario 64, Saturn owners Nights Into Dreams and PSX owners Croc...

[lone geyser]

Λ-

[tender pine]

Yes. The castle is the hub.

[iron wren]

Odd take but ok

[tender pine]

Not an odd take.

[iron wren]

I guess you’re entitled to your own opinions

[tender pine]

That's just it. So are others but too many of the opinions of others are based on others people's takes as opposed to their own.

[neat sierra]

AndrewPH steals thoughts? That’s pretty cool. Like right out of a persons head or do I have to write it down first?

[iron wren]

And you’re making the assumption that I’m parroting somebody else’s opinion rather than my own experience with the n64 library

[neat sierra]

What am I thinking now?

[iron wren]

I’m using a commonly used and accepted term to describe the relatively low effort of a large portion of the systems library. You yourself said there are 50ish games worth playing nowadays, which is just about 13% of the entire library

[neat sierra]

Wrong. I was thinking about whether it’s better to be Professor X or Juggernaut

[iron wren]

That was my second guess

[tender pine]

Right. And the rest are just ok-ish to bad games, not 'shovelware'.

[quick light]

The N64 exists to play that interesting Resident Evil 2 port

[green epoch]

I hate to break it to you all, but the N64 was actually bad. It had good games, but it was actually bad

that's just science

You can like bad things

but it was bad

[neat sierra]

People like 3DO

[green epoch]

I like 2003's The Core staring Aaron Eckhart

[lament escarp]

It was so bad that it was good

[neat sierra]

And GameGear

[green epoch]

that's a bad movie

but I love it

and that's ok

[neat sierra]

“People”

[mint shadow]

Science is amazing

[tender pine]

What do you mean "bad"? Like talk about lazy accusation...

[green epoch]

more science

[tender pine]

Bad is just an adjective but placed in a sentence it develops context...

Science.

Now, explain if you will how or why it's "bad"...

[green epoch]

Sorry....ahem. The N64 was of poor quality, unpleasant, and unwelcome.

It's ok to like bad things!

[zinc dew]

Oh my gosh it’s like I don’t even know you!!

[tender pine]

Just as I suspected. A troll.

[zinc dew]

no name calling please

I am the only troll anyways

[green epoch]

Our Troll, comrade

[iron wren]

I would argue that the n64 had a larger percentage of bad games than other platforms, but also a larger percentage of great games, with fewer in the middle.

Psx had 10x the amount of games n64 had, so more mid games per capita

[quick light]

The Jesus Fish is far from a troll. Id say they are more of a RE2 Tank Control Enjoyer

(which I guess is worse)

[green epoch]

You take that back

[zinc dew]

@tender pine how much do you like the N64

[iron wren]

Chad re2 tank control enjoyer vs virgin goldeneye control stick user

[tender pine]

For me it's the best home console of all time.

[quick light]

Did you grow up with the N64?

[tender pine]

Well I grew up with the ZX Spectrum, Amiga, SNES and N64, in that order.

[quick light]

As I guess I'd feel the same way in terms of the PS1. (As that was my main console)

Ahh

[tender pine]

I'm speaking objectively.

[green epoch]

I'm not trying to yuck your yum, paz. You shouldn't feel anything other than joy when thinking about the N64. But it was a bad system. It was built to be something it could not be. It failed at what it set out to do. It had some banger games, but it was a bad system

[iron wren]

N64 is some of the most misdesigned hardware that ended up being great in spite of its flaws, which is a fantastic outcome

[tender pine]

That's not a coherent and almost oxymoron.

[iron wren]

Lmfao

[quick light]

I'm looking forward to playing some N64 games on the mister. But I feel like the main ones id want to play like Zelda, it has a pc port.

One thing I think is underrated related to the N64. The N64 DD. Shame that wasn't successful enough and we didn't get it. (Same with the Famicom Disk System)

[iron wren]

It’s great in spite of the design flaws

[tender pine]

What design flaws?

[green epoch]

the fact that that system produced mario and zelda are miracles and speaks to nintendo's talent as a game maker

[quick light]

Ok, if I want to get technical. I'm annoyed pal N64 doesn't support RGB natively and they have to be modded.

[zinc dew]

Do you like it….. THIS MUCH???

[quick light]

HOLD THE PHONE

[iron wren]

Terribly slow rambus, devkit significantly faster than retail hardware leading to devs not really knowing how their game will run in reality, really really expensive storage medium limiting games

[quick light]

I see 40 Winks

[quick light]

Are you a 40 Winks Enjoyer?

Just like me?

[zinc dew]

It’s ok, I have fun with it

[green epoch]

One of these games better be mischief makers or god help me

[tender pine]

So, like any home console, limitations, compromises and design choices.

[zinc dew]

I got lazy with the stickers LOL

[mint shadow]

No one likes it that much, that must be AI generated

[green epoch]

Robby doesn't fuck around

[zinc dew]

But yeah

[quick light]

It's one of my fav platformers on the PSX. Looking forward to trying the N64 version.

[green epoch]

my favorite game on the system

[zinc dew]

Y’all might enjoy this

Ok I’m done flexing, sorry lol

[iron wren]

You can challenge any “misdesign” with this excuse, so…

[lament escarp]

I have this on mister, dunno what's so special about it.

[neat sierra]

Finally a piece of your trash that’s cool

[iron wren]

Yes, every mistake made in business was due to it being business

[quick light]

Woah, it seems like someone has wrote on your cartridge.

Send it to me, I don't mind 'damaged' carts

[iron wren]

I’ll have to confiscate this, that’s actually mine

[quick light]

To this day, I have not finished any Zelda game apart from BotW

[neat sierra]

Can’t remember do you have them all or not quite?

[zinc dew]

ARRGGGG I missed out on that because my ass got beat at E3 when they were doing the Star Fox 64 competition

[quick light]

A very bright green

[zinc dew]

Nah, not all. I just bought the games that interested me.

[tender pine]

Extreme!

[zinc dew]

So I like a lot of N64 games lol

[neat sierra]

Hold on

[iron wren]

The built in 4-controller-ports without needing an accessory was goated though, made setting up parties way easier than any ps1 or ps2 setup

[neat sierra]

You liked Quest64?

That was just collecting be honest

[green epoch]

Ok, Robby is confirmed trustworthy

[kind mountain]

N64 was def the height of playing together with friends

[tender pine]

Let's see some controllers and/or cool accessories...

[neat sierra]

Wii

[kind mountain]

I remember trying to find one to buy that first Christmas it was out

[neat sierra]

N64 was good for couch play but Wii brought everyone to the table

[kind mountain]

I was 10/11. I remember calling around everywhere asking if they had one in stock and I would get laughed at

I called Service Merchandise on my birthday expecting to get laughed at and they said they had 1 left. I begged them to hold it for me since it was my birthday

[lone geyser]

I sure wish there were a game where you roleplay as a Japanese train conductor with strict timing rules and esoteric one-off controls that someone could showcase

[neat sierra]

In conclusion, Nintendo is the best company and deserves to sue everyone for its games for all time

[kind mountain]

My mom got home from work and I made her drive me to get it. 🤣

[green epoch]

God Service Merchandise, Rest in Peace

[tender pine]

The verdict is in...

10 out of 10.

[green epoch]

I think the biggest problem with the N64 (and, honestly, most nintendo consoles after that) was that it was FANASTIC for nintendo first party titles. But when you had 3rd party titles, you'd be better off playing them literally anywhere else

[hushed nova]

is this like when my crappy company kept winning 'datacenter provider of the year' awards in various magazines?

[green epoch]

Nintendo didn't have the "definitive" version of any multiplatform title

[neat sierra]

Or paying to get onto the ‘best places to work’ list

[green epoch]

I hope you're better business bureau accredited!

[neat sierra]

I bet threatening to report someone to the BBB doesn’t carry much weight anymore

[green epoch]

nah, since you have to pay to get on the list

I think people smoked out that scam a while ago

[kind mountain]

lol remember writing down the numbers for what you wanted and the stuff coming down the belt

[green epoch]

the catalog was so cool though

[rich warren]

Ah Service Merchandise - where a kid could see toys, video games, smoking pipes, sporting goods, watches and jewelry in one place

Ours was next to a Hill's which is where I saw a PlayStation for the first time

And I saw a Genesis for the first time with Ecco the Dolphin at Service Merchandise.

[zinc dew]

Yeah dude, I buy just for Nintendo games and anything else is gravy.

I learned that lessons with the N64 lol

“Where are the games????”

[green epoch]

nintendo games are worth it, though

[kind mountain]

lol same. Then Hills became Ames

[rich warren]

oh snap - Springfield Ohio???

[kind mountain]

Pittsburgh lol

But close

[rich warren]

it's all the same in the midwest - lol

[kind mountain]

Figured you had to be up this way with those stores together

[kind mountain]

https://tenor.com/view/eat-cats-alf-kill-kittens-death-to-eating-gif-25009422

[rich warren]

lol - yeah that was surreal to see anyone care about that town

[eternal ravine]

N64 used paper boxes for games
SEGA wins again

[gritty basalt]

Having just completed Mega Man 64, yeah, I also agree that port kinda sucks

[gritty basalt]

I like shovels

[lament linden]

@random girder Uploaded STL single color variants for your case. I have not printed it yet, as I am going to have it resin printed, and all the extra colors need gluing, but if you would like to share, here is the link. https://makerworld.com/en/models/807506

[random girder]

Thanks! Boosted and liked haha.

[spare meadow]

Amazing! Is this for Mister PI only or does it’s compatible with de10-nano too?

[lament linden]

Only mister pi

[spare meadow]

Thanks, love this case. Hope we see a release for the De10 at some point too

[topaz otter]

What about the et cartridge pits, when they actually shoveled softwares into a hole

Hence the term, shovelware

[mossy vector]

Shovelware term came from shoving every last BBS game or application onto a CD-ROM.

[zinc dew]

Hell yeah, brother!

[topaz otter]

And there's 25 more that haven't been cleaned or tested

[zinc dew]

I love NES

[topaz otter]

Famicom was cheaper than nes versions

But man MegaMan 1 is a hard game

[quick light]

Famicom games look amazing

There's just no uniformity. Different publishers have different shells and a multitude of colours

[green epoch]

God those are pretty

[topaz otter]

They rattle though, the board isn't tight

You can shake them and the board has play in there

[green epoch]

yeah but....here, come close.....we both know you have no intention of playing them

[topaz otter]

I just collect all the colors like infinity stones

https://tenor.com/view/gloop-gif-25555044

I actually have the cart adapter that makes them work on nes

[green epoch]

they are so pretty

Can you not open them up and tighten them down?

[topaz otter]

No famicom carts are made that way, it still plays just fine, it's a clamshell design that snaps together and sandwiches the board

[quick light]

I can't remember seeing any screws on my couple of Famicom carts.

Ahh

[topaz otter]

They fixed this with the nes

[green epoch]

ahhhhh

[topaz otter]

The MegaMan games are also harder

They added difficulty modes in the US versions I think

[quick light]

Yeah, I find stuff like that neat

[green epoch]

yeah

[quick light]

The little changes.

[green epoch]

they did a lot of stuff around difficulty because they were worried that folks in the west couldn't handle it

[quick light]

It's a thing with Resident Evil and Biohazard. There would be more zombies in an area or more loot.

[topaz otter]

Yeah I just looked it up, rockman only has hard mode

[green epoch]

they did stuff like that with final fantasy as well, iirc

and, obv, super mario 2 didn't come west until much later (as the lost levels)

[topaz otter]

Yeah it actually first came out in super Mario all stars

We were like what in the hell is this

[green epoch]

yup

it's on my kid's game and watch and it confused the hell out of him. he was like "uh, dad, why can't I play as the princess in this mario 2?"

[quick light]

Was trying to think then if I owned the Super Mario 2 on fds. I don't think I do, only got the first Zelda on the floppy disk

[green epoch]

so we had to have the doki doki panic talk. real parenting moment

[eternal ravine]

This game trips me out

[latent dagger]

If I'm not mistaken, the "deblur" on a modded console is a post-process effect that is applied to the output image before it leaves to go to the TV.

The "deblur" you get from MiSTer is by way of turning off certain filters on the game engine level would via the core so that stuff is just disabled from the start before a frame is even rendered completely.

So the mod chip method well of course have a varying effect on different games depending on how they look whereas the MiSTer will be properly deep blurred on every game because it's getting rid of the thing that causes it to be blurry in the first place at the source.

[topaz otter]

Did you tell him that no two markets are the same, and sometimes emerging market conditions mean that existing product has to be retooled

[topaz otter]

It's just a GameShark code that disables the bilinear filtering on some N64 games

The result, on a real console, is you get aliasing and jaggies everywhere

So it looks like early 3d games on the PC or ps1

With it on it blurs everything as a form of antialiasing, looks like Vaseline on the screen. Anything non CRT makes it worse cause your LCD wants to apply it's own filtering

It doesn't work on all games, some it makes worse

[latent dagger]

There is that too with LCD and feeding a lower resolution than what it wants so it then wants to upscale and do other stuff to it so yeah, MiSTer with 1080p output will also look better that way too

[lunar ginkgo]

pray for my soul. it's time for the water temple

[mint shadow]

🙏

[rich warren]

https://tenor.com/view/kramer-levels-seinfeld-gif-4990075881081886202

[topaz otter]

I actually don't know why people complained about it so much

the boot swapping is tedious but you get where you do it so fast you don't even notice it

[lunar ginkgo]

It's also the changing of the water levels. Running a round back and forth while trying to figure out the puzzles is a nightmare.

[vapid hawk]

yeah you can get kinda stuck in a loop

also i think you can easily accidentally sequence break it? and then it gets really confusing

[marble cargo]

The extra item slots in the 3DS remake really do make a big difference with the Water Temple.

[last wraith]

https://www.twitch.tv/rakanai

Omg a decompile of Star Fox 64

[topaz otter]

interesting

[knotty zealot]

soon you'll be able to play that crap in 16k120fps

[lament escarp]

Now rip the textures out of star fox zero and we have an actual good looking and good playing star fox game after 50 years of waiting.

[topaz otter]

just one of the textures from the gamecube is bigger than the filesize of that entire game

[lament escarp]

https://tenor.com/view/this-big-national-honey-bee-day-the-murder-hornet-its-big-its-huge-gif-22526553

[topaz otter]

i wish it was

[hollow rune]

It doesn't look that bad...

[dry island]

hi all, anyone got a link to the N64 Turbo core latest build please? 🙏

or instructions on how i can find it on this channel? both much appreciated, thanks

[vagrant ivy]

Its in the pins or here

#1096015979055697940 message

[dry island]

Thank you, it says no access, how do i gain access please?

[green epoch]

@zinc dew we need a purge in n64

[zinc dew]

I just gave you the “Cycle Accurate” role, please try again

[dry island]

thank you trying now

Thanks i got the 29/09/24 build, that the latest i take it?

[green epoch]

Yep

[dry island]

thank you

[zinc dew]

You forgot the most important step

you must accept the N64 into your heart

[dry island]

Already have done for the last 30 years almost

still play Goldeneye and PD on original N64 with a CRT to this day 😄

[languid dune]

I on the other hand have become one with the N64.

[green epoch]

Gross

[turbid warren]

please don't put your dick in the N64 cartridge slot

it voids the warranty

[lunar ginkgo]

The expansion slot on the bottom, however....

[eternal ravine]

Wait, I mean use the RAM slot

[lunar ginkgo]

Is making a Perfect Dark BBC joke gonna get me banned from the server?

[eternal ravine]

Hard tellin', not knowin'

[unique coral]

For anyone living in europe, the "Saffun" wireless controller is on BF sale -20% on amazon.de

https://www.amazon.de/-/en/gp/product/B0D13DYS8T

€31

You need to have a prime membership but I had a free 30 day trial when I logged in so its worth checking out..

Broke down and got 4 myself...

[latent dagger]

Because these are just generic and "saffun" is just a random brand that doesn't actually make the controller you can buy these for about that price off eBay. Just search for wireless n64 switch if you want it for switch or just N64 for actual n64

[zinc dew]

yeah, mine isnt even Saffun, some rando company

[unique coral]

I know it's a generic controller, that's why I put it in quotations marks. But people here call them saffuns...

I cant find any for that price on ebay here in europe. Especially if you include the shipping

And potential duties and sales tax on top of that

[zinc dew]

Yeah I call em Saffun too since that’s the brand most people recognize

[blissful wolf]

in fact I've ordered that exact amazon.de listing, with the ~forbidden~ deadzone issue I found

[trail swallow]

Hot take: Water Temple is one of my favorite dungeons

[lunar ginkgo]

It's certainly unique in a way that stands out. Having said that, there are certain tasks in OOT where I know my run is going to come to a grinding halt and I dread them. Water temple is one such instance.

[lament escarp]

Water temple is fine, only thing they should've done differently was making the boots regular items like in oot 3d.

[unique coral]

uff, I had to look up what you where talking about. I hope its only your controller that's dodgy and not a design flaw. Will have to test when I get them.

[blissful wolf]

I hope its not "hardcoded" deadzones because maybe down the line I could swap the stick, but I do think it might be a hardcoded per axis deadzone, and the manufacturor is a mystery so no way to adjust the firmware lol

[unique coral]

@zinc dew Could you run that joy testing app and see if you have the same problem?

https://www.vkbcontrollers.com/pages/downloads

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xE_Z36w4No

or anyone with one of these clone controllers

I could still cancel the order

[blissful wolf]

its amazon, you can always return it

i'm keeping mine for now as eventually I'll downgrade it to the player 2 controller when I find something better

[unique coral]

Yeah, I could return them but I would avoid the extra hassle and pay return postage

[zinc dew]

I’m sure it’ll be ok

[last wraith]

How do they compare to the NSO controller?

[latent dagger]

Which filters are you using?

[lunar ginkgo]

JVC

[trail swallow]

Good thing there’s a hack for the N64 version that does just that

[tropic cove]

n64 core, mister fga in Sony KV-29FV310 with rgb mod

[unique coral]

Saffun has much lower latency, NSO a bit better build quality

[lament escarp]

Yeah but it's not all that great on a n64 controller since it maps the boots to the dpad, which is pretty much out of reach of my 2 hands.

[zinc dew]

Yeah that’s basically it. I was going to go into details but you nailed it.

[hollow rune]

I need to try that hack though. That does sound nice

[blissful wolf]

the forbidden other n64 stick. (if it had button remapping it would have actually been sick but unfortunately it had a terrible button layout that made no sense for how most "flight" games worked)

[minor fog]

Just done it myself, I feel your pain. Remember to look under the platform in the central tower. 🙂

[lament escarp]

I played around with patcher 64 quite a bit but found that none of the oot enhancements are very meaningful.

[junior pine]

Do you guys happen to know if the N64 "Saffun" gamepads have upgradeable firmware?

I'm asking here because I know a lot of us use them on the MiSTer with the N64 core

[lament escarp]

@zinc dew you have one of those, do you know?

[zinc dew]

Don’t think they do

[blissful wolf]

No one knows who even manufactures them, let alone how to flash firmware onto them

[zinc dew]

No name chinese companies aren’t in the business of providing support for their products. Even if they don’t even work, they straight up DGAF.

Case in point, I bought two “Saffun” GameCube controllers and the analog triggers were completely broken. I returned that shit. So make sure you buy those controllers from a place you have hassle-feee returns. The markup is worth it.

[topaz otter]

Because you pay 30 bucks for it and they make it with 50 cents worth of plastic

And a dollars worth of electronics

[zinc dew]

Yeah

[zenith vault]

the prepatched version of perfect dark off of archive is a bit smoother than the manually applied patch i did from what i saw on this disc earlier. idk the reason why but either way, with the turbo core this game is quite fun https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENXn_sG3-9U

[zinc dew]

That’s interesting, good to know!

[modest helm]

Nice. When you say the pre-patched version, which pack is that included on archive? (BTW not asking for the link)

[zenith vault]

It's on its own with a good search, not in a pack. I think upload date was Jan this year.

I think archive took down the direct file link but left up p2p ways to get it and as a result it might not show up in its own internal search but idk I'm not a geologist

[eternal ravine]

Is that a holographic fireplace?

[zenith vault]

Yeah it's an electric one I screwed into this TV stand. It fit perfectly in the middle. I just use it for the light effects really, but even with the heat part on it kicks it out a ways

[latent dagger]

Oof, it's almost that time of year again that I'll be pulling the space heater out of the closet

[tender pine]

https://www.rightsprite.co.uk/shop/summer-cart-64-n64-everdrive/

Anybody confirm or deny this is a legit site to buy one of these new flashcarts? Only id read some sellers don't quite adhere to the open source nature of this particular item. Thank you.

[zinc dew]

What does that mean for the end user?

[tender pine]

Well I've heard some features may be disabled and full support isn't guaranteed.

[zinc dew]

Damn, that’s not great

[quick marten]

So is there anything the N64 core isn't good at these days?

I bought an N64 recently, but I'm thinking about returning it and just getting a mister. Turning off the VI Vaseline (without patches) + Turbo core makes me think the OG hardware is outdated except for speedrunning.

[plush summit]

How do you return an N64?

[blissful wolf]

making my dad come home with the smokes

(I think the main "impossible" is disk drive stuff)

[green epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/back-to-the-future-back-to-the-past-flying-car-gif-14179778

[latent dagger]

It's more expensive but this is the real deal
https://krikzz.com/our-products/cartridges/ed64x7.html

This is one is cheaper but it lacks a couple pieces inside.
You can scroll down to see what's different
https://krikzz.com/our-products/cartridges/ed64x5.html

[broken creek]

Summer Cart 64 isn't a clone. It's an opensource cart that apparently has a little more functionality than an Everdrive and a fraction of the price due to requireing less expensive components. I don't know much about it in practice though. I have an ED64 X7 and it gets the job done. Mister is my N64 now though.

[lament escarp]

What do these everdrive 64 do that mister doesn't?

[latent dagger]

Let you use an actual 64

[lament escarp]

So no actual features?

[latent dagger]

[spare meadow]

SummerCart 64 can run 64DD natively

[lament escarp]

That console never existed

[tender pine]

I'm fortunate I have an X7 N64 Everdrive but was looking at this Summer Cart as a good alternative. The fact it's open source could lead to some interesting developments.

[tender pine]

The shape Robert has gotten the N64 core, not much. This however is something to be paired with OG hardware.

[quick marten]

Take it back to ToysRUs of course... No I just got it from an eBay seller that takes returns

[latent dagger]

You posted what you posted because of concerns over the fact that you are buying something online and whether or not you'll get scammed.

My response to that was basically "if you're that concerned about taking a risk in buying something online, then get this instead since it's 100% guaranteed to be what you paid for because it's the official site for the guy who created the everdrive selling his everdrive."

Otherwise nobody can entirely vouch for anywhere online that sells random Chinese made open source stuff. That's why you use a credit card cuz then you can charge back if they scam you.

I would have said use something like PayPal in the past but in recent times they seem to not ever side with the buyer for anything.

[green epoch]

yeah they kind of went the other way on that

[latent dagger]

@tender pine but if you want a different kind of safety net, buy one of those carts from Ali instead since they tend to have a pretty good money back with practically no questions asked policy
https://www.aliexpress.us/w/wholesale-Summer-64.html?osf=direct&spm=a2g0n.home.header.0

It can save even more money, but the shipping times can be quite long depending on where you live

[mint shadow]

I was sent a pair of really cheap shoes instead of what I ordered, on an item that had buyer protection listed on it, from ali express.

The seller was not responding to me, I had complied with their absurd customer service requests for verification, and after 3 attempts over 3 weeks to get a refund, they finally sent me a "stop bothering us with this, have a refund this ONE time" refund.

I would not trust ali express to give you a refund without a fight.

[latent dagger]

that sounds like you had issues with the seller not Ali.
Everytime I've done a refund on Ali, it was through Ali. I never reached out and tried to the seller first, I simply showed what I got with a picture and also provided a screenshot of the product page and specified that I didn't get what I wanted and I got the refund within a day or two

I know that it's not being authorized by the seller and instead by Ali because I got blocked by a seller after doing this to them when I specifically ordered a specific model of capture card and they sent me the other one they sell that's super shitty and doesn't even look the same so there couldn't even be the excuse of getting them mixed up.

also never confirm you received your delivery item on your account until after you've inspected the item and also also make sure to open it right away and never sit on it and wait cuz after a short while of the tracking specifiying it was delivered they'll auto mark it as received and process the payment to the seller

[mint shadow]

Their policy is try and resolve it with the seller before going to ali for anything. Tried that and they didn't respond, went to ali, dealt with ali express themselves, got denied 3 times despite ample proof I was sent the wrong item. Item was never confirmed as delivered by me while I was working through the refund process.

[latent dagger]

that's wild. and this was recent? cuz my experience with refunds has only been within this last year

[mint shadow]

This was a few months ago, yes

[latent dagger]

unfortunate you didn't get the same experience I have

still, having an option to get your money back is better than potentially buying from some rando drop ship style site where you may never.
a credit card is still the ultimate solution though cuz chargebacks

[mint shadow]

I was very ready to do a chargeback, but they surprised me with the "stop bothering us, here's your one time only refund" refund the day after my last denial.

[latent dagger]

i hope that your experience was honestly just down to whatever individuals were working at the time

[neat sierra]

Ali sucks, but you know what you are getting into at least and have to accept that sometimes you’ll get your landfill quality stuff and sometimes you’ll get a crap sandwich

[blissful wolf]

I went through two rounds of M1 macbook air screens that arrived with predamaged ribbon cables, sent back no problem and thats a $200 dollar item

Though I’ve heard ali has better relations with the EU because of china/eu trade agreements so there is much less customs bullshit making returns simpler on their end.

Not to get political but I hope the EU doesn’t follow the new us admin off the tradewar cliff

[topaz otter]

everdrive 64 is an actual cart that runs on an actual N64

you can put your own roms on the SD card that goes in it, hacks, translations, homebrew roms

it can also do gameshark cheat codes, and has a usb port for developing your own N64 software

and its updateable with firmware updates

if you want to play on OG hardware and don't want to play cart roullette its the way to go

[latent dagger]

you can load games from an SD card, hacks, translations, homebrew roms, gameshark codes, and also set up a debug output from the MiSTer.

[atomic stratus]

oooh without the rom patches? that pretty cool

[lime topaz]

with a summercart64 and a dual cartridge adapter, you can even use the N64 capture cartridge and N64 modem on the 64DD stuff, without the need for a 64DD

i got my adapter today and have been playing around with the capture cart (it doesn't seem to like my miniDV camera's signal)

the ideal way to experience the N64 core

[zinc dew]

Dude that looks awesome!

Now I want that as a background lol

You know…

I reached out to Sorg about transparencies in background images allowing for the pixel snow to be visible. Like the background image is an overlay on top of it. Would be sweet imo.

[magic girder]

I can imagine the response to this 😅

[zinc dew]

So far nothing! But you gotta shoot your shots.

🏀💪

[magic girder]

🚫

[quick light]

Trying to find pins on mobile is a pain

I'm guessing the turbo N64 core is pinned.

But I can't find the pins

[magic girder]

Settings

[quick light]

Thank you very much

[magic girder]

But also it’s in the repo: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/N64_MiSTer/tree/main/releases_turbo

[quick light]

Cheers again mate.

[trail swallow]

Isn’t the SC64 more fully featured, though?

Like, native DD support

I would love to get an SC64, but they’re always out of stock, and I dunno if I’d want to pay $100 just to play a few games, since I already have an Everdrive 64 V3.

[zinc dew]

Yeah got shot down lol

[magic girder]

I can’t say I’m surprised 😆

[latent dagger]

@quick light yeah, it's kind of split on mobile. In some channels pins are right there and others you have to go into "settings" of all things to find them which makes absolutely no sense and not intuitive at all 😂

[latent dagger]

I guess you didn't see what I posted a little bit further down from my original post about the ED where I linked to Ali Express where you can get an SC for about $45

[trail swallow]

Ah, gotcha

@latent dagger But, since it’s AliExpress, dunno how reliable it would be. Sounds like a gamble. Especially since someone earlier said some manufacturers of SC64’s don’t add all the features.

With a name like Epicjoy and a logo like that, it seems kinda sketchy to me

Also the fact that they give you the option to have games already loaded on the cart. Doesn’t seem like the most trustworthy way to get one.

[vapid hawk]

i just got one and so far its been a delight

make sure you get one with the button on the back like in that pic, thats the latest design

[lament escarp]

And here I am, playing n64 on mister like a caveman.

[latent dagger]

That's just how it goes with China. Quick and basic company names just to get things up and running and sell stuff cheap lol. And since China isn't the US they don't really care about piracy as evident by all those NES clone consoles back in the day that had funny names and came with supposedly over 8000 games.
Just read the title and scroll down and read the details to make sure it has the features you are looking for. There was that other one that had the other type of sticker on it that says Summer Cart with orange and yellow colors

I pretty much guarantee though that any of these reseller websites you go to for retro gaming or whatever that are selling these carts for twice as much are literally just buying them from these AliExpress listings in bulk and then marking them up

[trail swallow]

Interesting

Well, if I can confirm that it looks like I’m buying from the source, I’ll probably get one

[latent dagger]

The source usually is some bulk manufacturer and these "companies" just order them bulk, slap their name on it if it's something they want to put branding on and sell it for a bit more.

For example, what started all of this conversation was a user earlier asking about whether or not they can trust whatever website for the UK they found for buying a summer cart

And when you search for summer cart on Ali guess what you can find

[trail swallow]

Damn

[latent dagger]

These resellers are just buying in bulk from China and reselling in their own country at a markup that's all

[vapid hawk]

with an open design like this basically anyone can place an order for a thousand for jlc or whoever

its using that super popular RPi chip

[trail swallow]

Well, I looked at the description, and it has all the features I’m looking for

[mellow raft]

If they were there then, they're not there now

nvm...

This does not bode well though

🤮

[upper pivot]

The pads that are bridged look like they are meant to be the same net

[trim bane]

Yeah, those bridged pins are all connected to the same, wide trace anyways, it doesn't matter that they're bridged

[latent dagger]

also the way they are specifically bridged two at a time and only on certain ones looks to me like it's more intentional rather than sloppy

except for the one at the bottom that's three

[lime topaz]

i have the epicjoy sc64 since i did some digging and that seemed to have the best feedback on reddit out of the ones on ali. it's been great so far.

[trim bane]

That chip is just a serial-USB converter anyways, there's no way it could cause freezes in gameplay

[lime topaz]

btw, if any SC64 owners are interested in a dual cart N64 adapter to use the 64DD carts, i got mine from discord user maxib55 (from the Randnet+ discord)

[latent dagger]

I feel like some people are just too quick to leave bad reviews and feedback for a faulty item before first trying to reach out to the seller and say they got one that didn't work and get another one. I mean, it happens you know, sometimes you just get a bad one.

[trim bane]

According to the datasheet, all those bridged pins are simply GND. And according to the datasheet, they're meant to be tied together to GND. So yeah, this circuit is perfectly fine and valid

[latent dagger]

ye, sounds to me like dude left a poor review based on it just being faulty and opened it up to then take pictures and start talking about things he knew nothing about

which unfortunately happens way too often

[trim bane]

Although what pisses me off even more are the people who give 5 star ratings like "Item looks good. Didn't try it out yet."

[latent dagger]

that also sucks lol. but I usually take time to scroll through and look for real reviews to then get an idea of people's experience

[trim bane]

Even worse when it then gets an edit like "Item doesn't work, seller doesn't answer" and it remains a fricking 5 star review

[latent dagger]

oof. I always take time before going back and leaving a review. I usually do the whole "3 month review" type thing where I've had the item for about 3 months and leave a review with my experience thus far

[mellow raft]

I'm aware... And I agree.

[vast delta]

I also have an old V3, apparently the latest Everdrive OSes are not compatible with it anymore

[civic wind]

Any idea if they’re using the right speed grade FPGA? I remember the dev talking about some sellers using the lower grade part

He posted timing reports targeting the lower grade part and it couldn’t pass timing

[zinc dew]

I was too far into N64 collecting to ever spring for a flash cart

[tender pine]

Show us...

Best this.

[green epoch]

Imagine if you had used your energy on something fruitful like Atari Jaguar games.

[tender pine]

Nothing is more fruitful than N64. That's science.

[zinc dew]

I’ve got a bunch of different N64 consoles, controllers, and more games too

I don’t have CIB games up there

[tender pine]

Talk about exceeding expectations 🤯

Wait. WTF are those doom cartridges...

[quick light]

If you don't have it. I highly recommend Nightmare Creatures 1 on the N64. I believe it was NTSC exclusive. Luckily someone in the UK was selling it when I got my copy.

(Always jealous seeing that 40 Winks Cartridge)

[zinc dew]

Yup I’ve got that

probably doesn’t have a end label, I stopped applying them like three quarters of the way through lol

[topaz otter]

happy mistersgiving

[worn delta]

That is quite the collection Robby, are you at the point where you have a list of what you don't have rather than what you do?

[zinc dew]

Nah, I’m done collecting.

I mainly bought games to play them, and the MiSTer plays it all!

[topaz otter]

makes sense

I have an entire tub full of N64 games

and now every gizmo in existence can play N64 games

[lament escarp]

So this is what the inside of a mister looks like.

[spare meadow]

Master Quest? That’s pretty cool! Didn’t know that’s existed

[zinc dew]

It’s a repro cart, haha.

[magic girder]

I was absolutely gonna make a wrestling joke after you posted the pic of your collection. You really laid the smackdown

Send disc pics

(PS1 disc pics)

I hear you have a sizeable collection

[zinc dew]

It’s too much lol, I have it spread around because of large boxes and long boxes lol

[magic girder]

any other consoles you collect for?

[trail swallow]

N64 was the last console I collected for

Got a handful of games that are now rare before they shot up in price

Such as Rocket: Robot on Wheels and both Chameleon Twist games

[latent dagger]

@zinc dew explain.
Are they special reprints given to the devs of the new games or something? Or did you just replace the shells cuz they were damaged beyond repair.

[zinc dew]

I collect for every Nintendo, Sega, Sony, SNK, and Microsoft platform and have sizable collections for every one. Also Vectrex and Evercade lol.

I guess I do some big box PC games too.

[quick light]

I miss old Big Box PC games

They don't make them like they used too. My Redneck Rampage has some newspaper article in it

[latent dagger]

I love how Robby seemingly is intentionally ignoring the questions about those Doom games

[magic girder]

That’s awesome! 😎

[cerulean elk]

You’ve let me down

[green epoch]

He has buck bumble what’s the problem?

[zinc dew]

What, I have second attack too

[cerulean elk]

Someone doesn’t know the alphabet then

[zinc dew]

I guess not lol

[zinc dew]

https://youtu.be/K0DDY299Ly4?feature=shared

[cerulean elk]

The Texas alphabet only goes up to A anyway. All you need for Alamo

[storm vessel]

What does compression do? 🤪

[daring meteor]

300GB of SSD Space is cheaper than a 64MB cartridge was back than

Even without accounting for inflation

[lament escarp]

Yeah, but why are modern games so little fun while games from the 90s and 80s keep me up till 2am?

64MB well spent, I'd say.

[latent dagger]

games used to be good because they had to be, otherwise nobody would buy your games and you would go bankrupt and fail as a business.

[lament escarp]

Ah, so the polar opposite of today, where good developers get canned by publishers.

[latent dagger]

yep. and IPs get bought up only to then be shelved and never touched again except every so often for a "remaster" or "remake" and it's the laziest type too and they charge you $70 for it

[lament escarp]

Oh you're describing the best case scenario there. Most of the time these IPs are just not accessible anymore.

[worn delta]

I feel bad for kids these days who get a game for Christmas, and they can't just plug it in and get playing. They have tens of gigs of patches and updates they need to do before they can play, which can take hours on a slower connection.

[lament escarp]

Took me the best part of a day setting up the ps5 pro. And that was with an existing psn account and transferring the games via harddrive instead of downloading.

[worn delta]

I remember when a mate gave me his copy of one of the recent COD games, I think Modern Warfare of MW2, and I just wanted to play the single player. Dicking about getting my PS account to work, updating the console, then having to download tens and tens of gigs of updates for the game... Then I had to make some Activision account or dig up my old one... Then after a day or two of all this crap and I was ready to play, I found out the single player campaign wasn't on the disc and has to be completely downloaded and it was tens of gigs to get that which was another day... And after all that I was so pissed off I never even played it.

Compared that to when I got Goldeneye for Christmas. Slap in the cart and I was headshotting Basketsnake within a minute

[magic girder]

I do still like modern games, but one of the worst things is how the AAA industry doesn’t create new franchises as often. Grand Theft Auto 6, Final Fantasy 16, 21 mainline Call of Duty games (Black Ops subseries is on.. 6?)

Budgets through the roof so risk taking goes down 😔

[lament escarp]

Yeah and then they bitch about not selling 10 bazillion copies after giving Bobby Kotick 9 bazillion as a bonus.

[magic girder]

I’m surprised that the CoD games even sell nowadays. I think I played them from like 2005-2009, but they just got samey. I guess there’s always new younger gamers though

[lament escarp]

Yeah. But I wouldn't want that fate for any franchise I enjoy tbh. Just imagine seeing the dead corpse of something you once enjoyed being paraded each year.

[zinc dew]

Gaming is now run by accountants, they don’t play games, just want to make money

[magic girder]

You’re complicit 😉

Mr Borderlands 4 (actually the 5th game?)

[lament escarp]

Closest for me is assassins creed, should've stopped after 3 and 3 should've had a real ending. Now I'm just disgusted by it's continued existence and ubisoft is still not dead for somw reason.

[magic girder]

In defence of ubisoft, activision, Robby - I’d rather have an entirely new game (even if yearly) than a live service game 🤢

[lament escarp]

Careful, Robby is gonna tell you that you're a vocal minority, people love live service and his cybertruck is proof.

[magic girder]

Bringing it back round - the N64 was a great generation for innovation. Embracing 3D and creating some new franchises as well as building on old ones

But maybe the start of that kind of thing too - two Zeldas on the N64, final fantasies 7-9 on the PSX, loads of Crash, Spyro…

Capcom win though, like 6 Mega Mans on the NES?

[lament escarp]

To be fair final fantasy had always been a trilogy on a console. 1-3 on nes, 4-6 on snes and 7-9 on psx.

I replayed them all on mister, and they're all great. Like really great.

Which is curious, since I did it after getting the pixel remaster and wondered whether the originals were as soulless as well.

[magic girder]

How do they compare?

Haven’t there been like 90000 remasters of some of the early FF games? I feel like SquareEnix made a big deal about the pixel remasters but it wasn’t the first time they redid the art in a pixel style

[lament escarp]

The pixel remaster are basically the same game 6 times with different sprites. And huge stutter when moving since the movement speed doest fit the 60fps refresh of consoles.

[magic girder]

I should probably look up which version is best and work my way through the old ones

Probably originals or GBA

[zinc dew]

Dragon Quest

[magic girder]

I love Dragon Quest

[trail swallow]

I’ve watched comparison videos on the older FF games, in all cases, the GBA version seems better.

[magic girder]

SNES > NES versions of the early ones though

[magic girder]

Good to know. Thanks

[lament escarp]

Originals imo. For the first one I'd recommend final fantasy restored with the ff4 font, second and third ones are fine as is with a translation patch.

[magic girder]

Conflicting information

I require consensus!

[trail swallow]

Heavily depends on whether or not you’re a Ted Woolsey fan.

[lament escarp]

Different people, different opinions!

[magic girder]

No!

[trail swallow]

I’m personally not really

[magic girder]

I don’t even know what a Ted Woolsey is

[zinc dew]

just play the original nes games like Miyamoto intended

[lament escarp]

There are also great retranslations for 4-6, no woolsey required!

[trail swallow]

Translator for SNES FF games and Chrono Trigger

[magic girder]

I take whatever translation I can get 😅

[zinc dew]

yeah who cares who the translator is lol

[magic girder]

I get that there are differences, but I’m not gonna play the games multiple times to determine the differences 😅

[trail swallow]

I prefer the GBA translations, personally

[magic girder]

Plus you’ll never get a translation that makes everyone happy anyway. Some people prefer literal, others prefer something more like dynamic equivalence etc

[lament escarp]

Just start ff1 restored with the ff4 font hack. Contact me when you finish it and I'll have the next set of instructions ready.

[trail swallow]

Thing is, Woolsey’s translations were good for the time, and he did his best working with the SNES’s text space limitations.

[lament escarp]

For 6 I used a patch that ported the gba translation to snes iirc. Was great!

[magic girder]

After I brave my way through Xenoblade, which you also recommended, and is proving a grind to get through 😅

[zinc dew]

damn shots fired

[trail swallow]

But, those translations left a lot of detail out that was in the JP script.

[magic girder]

I just don’t get it guys, sorry. I want to be wrong, and I hope I am… but my god is it crap so far

[zinc dew]

who cares who did the translations

[trail swallow]

Xenoblade is one of my all-time favorite games

[lament escarp]

I finished that game 4 times on 3ds, twice on wii and 3 times on switch. Why are you so weak?

[magic girder]

It’s just so boring!

so boring

[zinc dew]

@magic girder just buy DQ3 HD2D

like Miyamoto intended

[magic girder]

Yes!!

DQ can do no wrong. Except 7, that one’s… not that great

(Again, got bored half way through)

[lament escarp]

Woolsey is known for not being entirely faithful to the original script, the text limitations also being an issue. He certainly has a recognizable style which makes him a bit infamous.

[magic girder]

@zinc dew lobby your mod buddies and get us an RPG channel

Use your power for good, not evil, for once

[lament escarp]

Keyword "buy". No mather how many versions you already own. Just give money. Consome. I need a cybertruck.

[zinc dew]

yes true, I need another one

[magic girder]

tbh consuming even if not playing is fine here, because DQ releases need a western release by default

[trail swallow]

One of the main things a lot of people prefer about the SNES version of Chrono Trigger over the DS version, is that Frog speaks in Medieval English.

[magic girder]

I do love that

[trail swallow]

I personally think the accuracy of the DS’s translation makes up for it, though

[lament escarp]

I hate it. Nobody else from his time speaks like that. Why does he?

[magic girder]

Because he’s frog and he’s awesome!

But I also love the “accents” in DQ games

[lament escarp]

After I made my way through phantasy star (I'm at 3 currently) I look forward to playing good rpgs again

[magic girder]

Ah, so you’re gonna skip the Xenoblade Chronicles X re-release then?

😏

[lament escarp]

Maybe. Didn't enjoy it much on wii u tbh. It ending when the story picked up any speed didn't help much either.

[magic girder]

My trolling failed 😭

[zinc dew]

DS Chrono trigger best

[lament escarp]

If you're really a dev develop a ds core already so we can play all the juicy ds games on mister.

[magic girder]

DS DQ 4-6 best

[zinc dew]

I own all those

So good

[rich warren]

GBC DQ 1-3 best too!

[magic girder]

Me too. DQ5 cost me like £140 last year 😭

Shoulda just emulated it

[lament escarp]

Those versions are great. Try the nes retranslations if you're into old versions.

[lament escarp]

No emulation. All hardware.

[magic girder]

No compromises

[zinc dew]

Yeah I love those too

[tender pine]

How do I convince somebody oblivious to the obvious the N64 put both Saturn and PS1 to shame?

[lament escarp]

3 hands are better than 2, obviously.

[languid dune]

Does the PC version have the DS additions?

I know it launched in a super rough state, but I think they've fixed it over time.

[languid dune]

I also really dig the SNES version of DQ3! Currently playing the HD-2D remake, and it's solid as well, but I'm not really digging the art direction of the backgrounds.

[upper pivot]

Are both black and white 8bitdo 64 controller preorders back in stock? Seems like it but I distinctly remember the white ones being sold out before.

[tender pine]

8Bitdo 64 Bluetooth Controller for Analogue 3D, Switch, Windows, and Android (Black) https://amzn.eu/d/0cbh3nj

[upper pivot]

Huh? Thanks, although I wasn’t asking for a link. I know it’s being sold on Amazon. I was just wondering whether they somehow “restocked” white even though it’s still on preorder and it was sold out previously

[tender pine]

Christ. Sorry. Next time I'll not bother...

[magic girder]

I’m gonna go out on a limb and that that the graphics of the 3D games have generally aged better for the N64

[lament escarp]

I'm not convinced on the whole "putting to shame" thing. All 3 of these consoles have timeless classics and are worth playing. Sure, sega stuff always feels like bizarro world to me but it's also fun that way.

[magic girder]

Agreed with that

I’d say the Saturn is my least favourite but I still enjoy it immensely

(Of the three)

[lament escarp]

Back in the day when operating on an extremely limited pocket money and maybe birthday gifts I get it why people were so partial to which console is best, since it was a huge investment. But it's all just mister now.

[rich warren]

Cool - yeah I'm looking to get those too. Don't have physical copies of 1-3 so it's nice they are doing those

[trail swallow]

My favorites are the Super Famicom versions. Those are the versions that got ported to GBC.

[lament escarp]

I like the simplicity of the nes versions tbh.

[trail swallow]

Dunno about 2 and 3, but I know Dragon Warrior on the NES is supposed to be a slog, with way too much grinding.

Heard good things about Dragon Warrior 4 on NES, though.

I mean, if I was a kid in 1986, I probably would’ve had the patience to finish the original Dragon Warrior. But, that’s not something I ever would feel like doing now.

[lament escarp]

I played through 1-3 recently and the only thing that bothered me a bit was the lack of a ingame worldmap tbh.

Grinding is only necessary in the very beginning. Afterwards you can sidestep it if you play smart.

Grinding mostly for gold anyway.

[native monolith]

Dragon Warrior is indeed quite grindy - it masks what would ultimately be a very short game. DW2 is better, but requires a bit of a grind near the end for sure - the cave to Rhone and the last area are tough. At least if you make it to the shrine, you get free healing.

As for DW3, that's where the series got downright amazing. Both it and DW4 are extremely playable even in their 8-bit forms.

You might have one or two choke points in DW3/4 where you want to grind, but it's mostly not very. They're really built around the idea of going into a dungeon until you've exhausted your resources, getting out, then going back in to finish it off.

I'm going to use this HD-2D remake to justify beating it yet again. (I've beaten the NES game many times, and the GBC and SNES versions once.)

[zinc dew]

I love h2-2D remake

[trail swallow]

Those look pretty cool

I’ll wanna play the Super Famicom versions first

[eternal ravine]

Phantasy Star ruled 8-bit console RPGs

[native monolith]

I like everything about PS except the combat. DW3 is far superior, and even DW2 was better.

I'd also take FF1/3's combat. (FF3 is a legit great game. FF1 is very good too.)

[iron wren]

I used to chill to feasel grinding out DW1 runs in the mid 2010s. Hours of repetitive noises, quite nice to nap to

[magic girder]

I got into DQ with DQ11, and I remember the Tim Rogers review where he described it as “perfectly balanced”, where you didn’t need to grind at all, because the incidental levels you’d get as you made it through the game was enough to mean you were always perfectly levelled. I like that design much more than old fashioned grind

After that I went to the DS remakes of 4-6 and found them to be similarly balanced. 7 remake (as far as I made it through) also seems that way

But I guess DQ1-3 were a different time

JRPGs are fun when they’re balanced that way - but not when they require grinding

[lament escarp]

I don't quite agree with that argument against grinding as it takes the agency from the player. Good example are the shin megami tensei games starting with 3. They are turn based and extremely strategic. Yes you can grind your way past a boss when you play badly but most of the time it's way more dependent on your strategy and setup.

That being said, not all rpg need to be quite as challenging as smt tends to be and dq11 is for all intents and purposes pretty much perfect.

[hollow rune]

I did not like it when I played it on Switch

It felt somehow too packed and yet doesn't ever feel impactful but I know I am alone

[lament escarp]

I'm marathoning the phantasy star series right now. 1 is the best out of the first 3. I hope 4 makes it all worth it.

[hollow rune]

I've heard 4 is the really good one and 3 is like not good

[lament escarp]

2 would be good if you wouldn't need written directions for all it's dungeons. 3 is just... bland. But not aggressively so.

[magic girder]

I think you should be able to grind past enemies (makes it easier for people who are not as good at the game), but it shouldn’t be required. Required is just bad game design and padding

Plus, who really likes grinding?!

[lament escarp]

That's my point, maybe you should git gut!

[magic girder]

So you’re saying that all JRPGs are sufficiently balanced that you never ever need to grind? 😉

And that includes, going back to the original topic, DQ1 and 2? 🙂

[lament escarp]

It's not like the game says: nah bro, not lvl 20. And I've experienced plenty of people not engaging with the game systems like buffs/debuffs/status conditions and then complain they can't get past enemies unless they grind. Not to mention in most old rpg like ff1 and ps1 or dq1 you grind more for money rather than exp, which gives it a risk/reward system. Pass the good equipment now to be able to afford the even better equipment later.

[lament escarp]

If you take away the first hour as a tutorial, pretty much yes.

[magic girder]

To be honest, I don’t know the first three DQs well enough to comment in either direction (although the others I’ve played were definitely fine without grinding) - but at least for the first one, the need to grind does seem to be a common concern - and, knowing how some JRPGs occasionally go, it wouldn’t surprise me if it did need some

But I will defer to your opinion on this one 🙂

Although I don’t buy that all JRPGs are balanced so as to never require grinding, and that anything otherwise is just a skill issue 🙂

But I do agree with your point about buffs and status conditions. They’re easy to not engage with - until they’re not 😅

[lament escarp]

Most old (80s/ early 90s) rpg set you up to grind for the first hour or so as a tutorial since the rpg formula wasn't was well known or understood by players. I think this is the main reason why people bounce off the games now. Also, "require" always implies that the player has no agency in the matter. If someone refused to block in a fighting game and then complained the game is unbeatable unless they have more health you wouldn't raise the same argument.

[magic girder]

There are definitely cases in many games where there’s a point where there’s a significant jump in enemy strength. If you’re sufficiently under levelled they can one-hit kill you, then no amount of “git gud” is gonna help you 😅

[hollow rune]

This is a good point. I am almost done with DQ1 after picking it up on and off the past year, and I really just use offensive moves. But I think I would get more out of it if I dug in a bit more

[magic girder]

And ironically, that is more likely to impact you when you’ve been chronically under levelled (because you were “gud” the rest of the way through the game)

[lament escarp]

Put enemies to sleep, block their magic, that way you can kill enemies way above your weight class and get money fast. Then make your way to a new town, don't forget you can flee battles that aren't advantageous for you and buy stronger equipment.

[magic girder]

(Under levelled / poor equipment etc. you might have just made poor equipment choices earlier on and therefore need to get extra money to get the “right” stuff)

[hollow rune]

This is what I should have been doing @lament escarp

[lament escarp]

I'm much more worried about the flip side: rpgs becoming so "accessible" and easy that they're plainly boring. People don't engage with debuffs? Get rid of it. Elements? 3 at most. Progression? Strictly linear, so your progress and level is predictable. Boss? Enemy with bit more hp.

I would like your opinion on ff13 tbh, that game... doesn't require grinding. Or anything. Sometimes you get to change roles in battle. 😅

[compact depot]

I’m usually OK with some sort of grinding on RPGs but I just can’t stand excessive random encounters

I think that’s the reason I did drop DQ3?

[lament escarp]

Most modern rpgs use a minimum of steps where no random encounters are possible (and a maximum of when it needs to trigger) and is only random within that field. Old rpgs tend to be completely random, which can mean getting 3 encounters for 3 steps if your unlucky. 😅

[spare meadow]

@zinc dew Maybe you will like this:

Its a brazilian LoZ: OoT original cartridge that was released with a giant box and an exclusive guide.

I have this since it was released.

Don’t know if it’s got released in another country too

[eternal ravine]

PS II has a great VIBE and was quite a challenge bitd

[lament escarp]

I only remember 69 chutes in one singular dungeon.

[eternal ravine]

That guidebook was a cool pack-in
At first, we tried to not use it

But yeah, I am also hoping to play PS IV through one day

I never played the PS Online games, but I know some people were hooked like crack

[lament escarp]

I hope someone makes a romhack for 2 and redesigns all the dungeons. The game has great bones but the dungeons are far, far beyond what they should be.

[eternal ravine]

I find that game to be trippy, like it has an atmosphere right from the intro music

[lament escarp]

Some nice backgrounds for the battles would also be great. Like all the other phantasy star have.

[eternal ravine]

The year was 1989

[lament escarp]

PS1 had them in 1987 on an 8bit console.

[eternal ravine]

PCs were starting to have the 486
I bet SEGA just wanted to make a complex and long-lasting RPG like those on PCs

[lament escarp]

From what I heard PS2 was made in 6 months. So all the weird decisions probably weren't meant to be in the end product.

[eternal ravine]

6 months for SEGA was like a year for other devs

[native monolith]

I like the rest of the Phantasy Star series more, even the maligned third game. But PS4 is a stone cold classic. Almost perfectly paced and balanced, with great presentation. It stacks up with the best of the era.

[eternal ravine]

I wish I had more fun with Lagrange Point for Famicom
Inspired by PS for sure

Still worth it for the graphics and sound

[native monolith]

Yeah, someone was talking about it and it apparently has an insane encounter rate.

It sounds absolutely wild, though. Hearing FM synth from an NES will always be weird.

I actually imported the cart a while back, not that I can play it that way. I just like having carts of various translated RPGs.

Another game clearly inspired by PS is Star Odyssey. It had a release by Super Fighter Team. It's... not great from a gameplay perspective, but I appreciated that it went into interesting places story-wise.

[eternal ravine]

I wish I had a fullset of Konami software for Famicom
Such a great library of fancy carts

I had a good number, but sold them as a lot

And they were just loose carts

Crisis Force was probably the coolest one I had

[native monolith]

Oh, man, Crisis Force is so cool.

It's also expensive now. 😛

[eternal ravine]

Salamander is the Coolest Cart

[native monolith]

Noice.

[eternal ravine]

I wish N64 had carts like that
Maybe there are clear Everdrives

[green epoch]

Man that’s pretty

[deft matrix]

my summercart64 is

my 64 X7 is clear red also

[topaz otter]

You can just put the everdrive in any case you want

Well, you may have to modify it for the USB and SD card slot

[storm vessel]

Manual for aggressive people 🤘

[latent dagger]

go full resin 3D printing, do a bunch of sanding and polishing and make your own clear carts

[vast pollen]

I have an issue with my NSO N64 controller where I have to keep resyncing it to the Mister every time I reboot

Anyone encountered this problem?

[lament escarp]

Afaik this can happen with combined bt/wf adapters.

No real solution other then using separate adapters.

[zinc dew]

He's correct. No solution so you either deal with it, get another bluetooth adapter, or get another wireless controller.

[topaz otter]

I bought one of those N64 blue retro wireless adapters

I haven't tried it yet

[vapid hawk]

oh yeah my intecgaming bluetooth kit arrived i need to try that

[tender pine]

Anybody got any recommended Bluetooth dongle for mister which will negate these issues when using the NSO N64 controller?

[latent dagger]

I would assume any

the issue isn't that it's the wrong BT dongle, the issue is that it's a combo dongle

[zinc dew]

Just avoid the combo BT/Wifi dongles I guess.

Damnit he beat me to it

[latent dagger]

I've also seen some people claim they have issues with trying to use newer BT 5.4 dongles on MiSTer in general so maybe stick to something that isn't the bleeding edge

[turbid warren]

heehee "dongle"

[latent dagger]

here's a BT 4.0 dongle from TP-Link
https://www.amazon.com/TP-Link-Bluetooth-Receiver-Controllers-UB400/dp/B07V1SZCY6

or you can get a generic 4.0 dongle for about $2 from Ali https://www.aliexpress.us/item/2251832793111170.html?

with like $2 shipping

[zinc dew]

Yeah, I need a good BT dongle

[latent dagger]

just be careful when selecting an item from Ali where the page has more than one variant option. as two of the options on this link I just gave you as an example are BT 5.0 (which shoudl also work honestly)

here's another one that's $8 instead of $12.
This ones is BT 5.0 and should be fine. It's honestly 5.3/5.4 I think is the issue.

This exact brand I am literally using a 4.0 version of on my MiSTer lol. (I bought it back in 2019) https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07GVD1JWF

[iron dove]

the '5.4' ZEXMTE's have been reported to not work by a couple of folks, my '5.1' (with the big antenna) works great. Not sure about that specific model

[latent dagger]

4.0 imo would be better and more guaranteed due to drivers

I think 5.4 is great though for other more general purpose uses on PC for things like audio and connecting multiple devices to a single adapter

Is BT really so low spec that it uses USB 1.1? bruh.

just now noticing the USB spec on my 5.3 adapter lol.

[iron dove]

yeah sounds reasonable, the 5.0/5.1 ZEXMTE's were the recommended model for a fair while (#help message), have a 5.1 on both my MiSTers and the 5.4 on my PC

usb1.1, lol

it's 'full speed'!

"For Bluetooth® 5, the modulation rate has two options. The first is 1Mb/s like Bluetooth v4.0/4.1/4.2; the second is what we will discuss next, 2Mb/s. "
https://www.bluetooth.com/blog/exploring-bluetooth-5-how-fast-can-it-be/

chuck 6 of em on a usb 1.1 hub

[topaz otter]

the radio shack headphones that connected to a base station by infrared should about do it

[mellow terrace]

I have this one and it works perfectly with my NSO N64 controllers: https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B09DMP6T22

[quick marten]

Weird issue... I can't map the A button to the X button on my PS4 controller. It makes it through the remap fine, but in game it does nothing. This only happens in the N64 core, and if I map a different button for 'A' it works. Am I going mad?

[iron dove]

id try mapping the controller in main then the core again

if no go, try deleting any files starting with 'n64' in /config/inputs then map again

[broken creek]

Pretty cool update from Kaze regarding his game and 60 FPS Mario64 https://youtu.be/Drame-4ufso?si=PovGSpmKj27WMhW2

[storm vessel]

I've always found fan games or these kind of technical monuments interesting but ultimately they're quite often just not as fun as the original title inspiration.

[cold pollen]

I agree

There is a Super Mario World hack I'm following though I want to play

[zinc dew]

I definitely don’t disagree but the way I view it is that the good ones feel like expansion packs. Not as good as the original concepts as a whole but they expand it in different and very interesting ways that still makes for a compelling time if you’re a fan of the original game.

[storm vessel]

I'd love some recommendations that are that good. 😄

[zinc dew]

That’s a good question, what are good rom hacks that are good for the N64?

Off the top of my head I think Smash 64 Remix is really cool with all the new characters and stages!

[storm vessel]

Doesn't have to be N64 tho 😉

[cold pollen]

That smash bros one probably

[cold pollen]

Oh you said that lol

Reading is hard

[mortal panther]

Smash Remix, definitely.
Mario Kart 64 'Amped Up' as well.

My two favorites.

[topaz otter]

Sometimes I don't know if this dude enjoys modding Mario 64 or if he just enjoys making videos about it

[topaz otter]

The Mario 64 mod that gives it two player split screen

And it works on real hardware

[zinc dew]

Does it work on the MiSTer core? I’ve got no Everdrive. 😭

[topaz otter]

No idea, you could be the first to discover whether it works or not

[magic girder]

If it works on real hardware, I have faith it will work on the core

[lament escarp]

The core is like ||better|| hardware.

[spare meadow]

Agree. I am just waiting for the release of the multipallete turbo core to put my N64 it’s box 😀

[broken creek]

I suppose we’ll see! In the video he states that all Mario modding is the byproduct of him developing his own game that he has yet to reveal but promises to release.

[topaz otter]

He's been saying that for years though

I mean he's a talented dude regardless

[tender pine]

The Mario 64 reduced lag hack.

[latent dagger]

Funny. I remember saying some shit a long time ago about how I don't think he's actually going to ever release the optimized version of SM64 and it looks like I was right

[zinc dew]

I hope the game he’s working on is a wholly original creation. I’d love to see him be able to sell it.

[lament escarp]

Robby: I love to watch capitalism.

[zinc dew]

Ok fine, I hope his game is wholly original so he can do whatever he wants with it.

I think that’s not capitalistic, right?

[green epoch]

Our game, comrade

[lament escarp]

No, but we both know you mean: I hope it's wholly original so Nintendo won't sue his ass off because dear lord, do they have nothing to do other than beating down on anyone who could even begin to question their world dominance.

[rare relic]

Not really a good mod, it down scaled the res and the fps was bad even on the turbo core. Probably only good on emulator

[topaz otter]

We played it on the real N64 and it ran fine

[wanton sun]

would be very surprised if anything run better on the hw compared to the turbo core

but i'm sure someone here will try both 🙂

[gritty basalt]

So, I got a question regarding button mapping for the N64 core. I've been trying out a few Ocarina of Time rom hacks, and a lot of them make use of the D-pad as a means to quick-select specific items that aren't tied to the C buttons, but I haven't been able to get this to work properly. What ends up happening is every time I move Link around during gameplay using my analog stick and I happen to move the stick in the direction of an item that's shown on the D-pad quick-select icon Link will end up selecting that item. For example, in the rom hack "Legend of Zelda - Ocarina of Time Redux", the ocarina item is set to the down button on the D-pad, so every time I hit down on the analog stick Link will stop moving and pull out the ocarina. The only way I can get around this is to slightly tilt the stick down instead of moving it ALL the way down, but this has the effect of limiting Link's downward movements to a slow walk. Another rom hack called Ultimate Trial has items assigned to all buttons on the D-pad right from the beginning, so no matter which direction I move the stick it registers as inputs for the D-pad and the items get swapped around/used.

Is there a method that I can use that can allow me to map the D-pad independently of directional movement, or is that not possible on the core?

[vagrant ivy]

you need to complete the mapping in main. There is a bit right at the end for the 2nd analog stick

most people miss it

[gritty basalt]

I'll give that a try. Thanks!

[vagrant ivy]

also depending on which mode you have the stick in the d pad can be an an analog axis

[gritty basalt]

Well, I've run into a new issue. I'm using a wireless Tribute 64 controller which only has one analog stick on it, so when I get to the bit where I need to map the second analog stick I can't get it to register any of my inputs past that point. So I'm assuming that the mode thing you mentioned must be the problem, so I looked at the sticker on the back of the controller and it has the following four modes: "Input Switch", "Default", "Legacy", and "All Star". Should I try swapping between these modes until I can get something to work?

[zinc dew]

Hit the user button to bypass

[gritty basalt]

I'll try that

No dice. I'm right back where I started

[vagrant ivy]

try mapping the c pad as the 2ng analog stick

[gritty basalt]

No dice on that, either. The button mapping in main starts by asking for a D-pad input test using the right button, which I try doing first, before moving on to the two analog sticks. I can get stick 1 to register, but stick 2 refuses to register anything I press. So I tried using both the analog stick and the C pad for the d-pad test, yet I always get stopped at stick 2 input testing.

I think the Tribute 64's lack of a second analog stick is preventing it from being able to register any input past stick 2. Not enough input options to actually work properly, I guess.

[rich warren]

Might be a power issue. Has happened to me if controllers don't register inputs. I had to unplug an optical mouse.

[vagrant ivy]

its supidly hard to mapo the N64 controllers

[gritty basalt]

The only things I have hooked up to my DE-10 is just a small external USB hub and wireless dongles for my most used controllers, so small to where I doubt it's drawing enough power to mess with anything. It's just a simple four-port hub.

[vagrant ivy]

I did it once with the NSO and then never again

but that was months ago

is the hub powered ?

[gritty basalt]

Nah, it draws power from whatever device it's hooked up to.

[vagrant ivy]

remove everything from it but the thing to run your N64 stick

[gritty basalt]

Alrighty

[vagrant ivy]

also run the N64 controller in windows and watch what the windows controller tester reports the c Buttons as

on one of mine it was an analogh s tick in one mode

[rich warren]

Specifically, I could not map a N64 USB knockoff controller until I unplugged a USB optical mouse. Was using a 5v 3a supply.

[vagrant ivy]

and digital in another mode

[gritty basalt]

I went ahead and actually used a free port on the DE-10 itself and removed the external USB hub. Still the same result as before. As for the "windows controller tester", do you mean this?

https://apps.microsoft.com/detail/9nblggh4pnc7?hl=en-US&gl=US

[vagrant ivy]

no the setup USb game controller

built into windows

then properties

[gritty basalt]

C buttons register as follows:

UP: 12
LEFT: 1
RIGHT: 11
DOWN: 4

[vagrant ivy]

so its digital in the mode you have

and you mapped it in the core ?

[gritty basalt]

Yeah, I mapped it to the core. I'm able to register everything needed for navigation and selection sans stick 2

[vagrant ivy]

the Dpad at the start was wierd I have a vague memory of it being the analog stick and not the dpad

[gritty basalt]

I'll try seeing if switching the modes via the methods listed on the back of the controller might help in some way. I got no other ideas ATM.

Switching it to "input switch" now has it lissted as an "Xbox One For Windows" controller.

Wait no, sorry, mistook the image you posted for my window.

Okay, still a Dinput

Gonna try "Default" now...

[rich warren]

Might also be worth deleting the controller mapping profiles from the MiSTer to start fresh

[gritty basalt]

I might only do that as a last resort. I might try using another controller with 2 sticks and seeing what happens then. If I still run into the same issue, I'll consider doing it then.

[rich warren]

thankfully the files for the specific controller should be easily identified by the file date, so you won't have to delete all of your other controllers. I've been there...

[gritty basalt]

Hm. Either I'm doing the input switching wrong, or the instructions aren't accurate, because I keep getting the thing listed as Dinput.

Just for the heck of it, I'll try another controller real quick and see what happens.

If the worst I have to do is use another controller for some of these rom hacks, then it's ultimately doable.

My 8BitDo Ultimate controller registers analog and D-pad input separately! Moving the stick down doesn't cause D-pad input to be registered. So, the good news is I at least have something I can use if I can't figure out how to map the Tribute 64 the way I want.

Looks like the input switching for the Tribute 64 requires you to hold each combination of buttons down for about 5 seconds, which is why I couldn't get it to work before. "Input Switch" now has it listed as a "XBOX 360 for Windows" controller.

[spare meadow]

Love the turbo core! It is the better away to play N64 games!

I commented a few post above that I am just waiting for the release of the new version of the Turbo Core with the multipallete fix the send my N64 for it’s box for good😀

[gritty basalt]

I'll try mapping the controller with this mode and see what happens

[vagrant ivy]

where as I dont like the turbo core. N64 was never meant to be played in Turbo mode

[gritty basalt]

It's inauthentic to what you'd get on real hardware, sure, but I see it as a sort of companion piece to the standard core that offers particular enhancements to certain games if you want them. And in RE2's case, pretty much the only core at the moment that can play that game with as minimum amount of bugs as possible

[untold dragon]

I like it for games that would really be helped with improved framerate. Though I have run into issues. In Gauntlet Legends the narrator does not speak, which is a shame because it's a game that really benefits from the increased speed.

[gritty basalt]

The input switching on the Tribute 64's being difficult with me now for some reason, and what modes I WAS able to switch it to still leads me to the same issues with mapping it in main that I previously mentioned... so I think I'm just gonna throw in the towel on this and just use my 8BitDo ultimate for the rom hacks that require the D-pad as a separate input. Not the end of the world, but it still kinda sucks because I wanted to play these rom hacks with a N64 button layout.

Kinda now makes me wonder/worry whether or not 8BitDo's upcoming N64 controllers might end up encountering similar issues when trying to map them in main.

It'll only have one analog stick and a D-pad, after all.

[latent dagger]

you say that, and then yet when I play Castlevania on the N64, and get the horrendous slowdown to the point of feeling like I'm moving in seconds per frame rather than frames per second, I stop caring about "authenticity" because I just want to actually play the damn game

and I doubt the devs of the hardware and the game ever "intended" for that to really be the case and it is rather more due to unfortunate budget and time constraints

[tender pine]

Anybody who buys the Tribute 64 deserves everything they get...

Kidding. Or am I?

[latent dagger]

https://tenor.com/view/sus-whos-sus-not-me-gif-7283757931826139493

[tender pine]

On a semi-serious note however. Why are these relatively cheap but poorly ineffective N64 clone attempt controllers so popular? They function like garbage.

[green epoch]

"relatively cheap" answers your question I think

[tender pine]

Yeah, but, particularly in these instances, it only leads to heartache. False economy.

[zinc dew]

Sorry, if you’re not playing how Miyamoto intended then are you really playing the game?

[stone pilot]

I'm pretty sure Konami's intended way for you to play Castlevania now involves a slot machine

[zinc dew]

Ok, that was way better than my joke lol

[latent dagger]

lolol

[mortal panther]

Pachinkovania

[broken creek]

You know us too well, Robert 🙂

[trail swallow]

I try to use the Turbo core when I can. It makes so many games much more playable.

[cunning fern]

Is there a reason why the core only does 480i to 480p in clean HDMI mode? I prefer the original look but there is no option to get rid of the combing artifacts.

[mossy vector]

The signal literally leaves the real n64 as even/odd fields.

N64 cannot do progressive scan, which would double the memory bandwidth.

[cunning fern]

Using the "clean HDMI" video options will convert 480i output to 480p in high res games. eg: rogue squadron. I suppose it is doing something similar to the PSX core 480p hack. What I don't see is a toggle for that like on PSX, the feature is currently tied to the clean HDMI option.

[mossy vector]

I interpreted what you were asking as wanting the vi post processing effects to happen at a height of ~480 pixels at 60 fps, something that the real system cannot do.

I have no other way to determine what you mean by original look, other than the dedither, divot, bilinear smoothing, and edge AA.

[latent dagger]

the "original look" of N64 is the combination it's softening and smoothing effects, with composite blending on a CRT viewed through a CRT mask of some kind.

Take away the CRT and you would need a much older LCD display (or maybe a plasma) that can more natively handle the lower res, otherwise you aren't really getting the "original look" but if you mean to say you want it to look just like how it does when outputting to a modern display with original hardware, the closest you can get to that with HDMI output is doing 480p and letting the TV scale it the rest of the way.

Otherwise you need an analog output of some kind to get native res output (assuming your modern TV has analog inputs you can use) then let the TV handle the scaling still.

you could try using a CRT filter of some kind while outputting to 1080p or 1440p (4:3 so like 1920x1440) with integer scaling enabled via HDMI on a modern display and see if it gets you closer to the "original look"

[mossy vector]

I was interpreting the comb effect as the biggest problem. Which can be reduced with a deinterlacer.

[latent dagger]

clean HDMI "should" fix that shouldn't it?

otherwise you're looking at needing to let the modern TV handle the deinterlacing which it might not do via HDMI since interlaced signals are typically from analog sources.

or getting a scaler like the GBSC

[lament escarp]

The comb effect from the weave deinterlacing you mean? You could simply set deinterlacing to bob if you like that look better, I use an rt4k with direct video which supports motion adaptive deinterlacing, the best of both worlds.

[topaz otter]

the developers intent was to give you the most optimal experience that time and limited resources allow

anybody that suffers through a game with poor framerate and laggy controls because they think that was the developer's vision is a fool

[lament escarp]

I also think "intend" is way overrated. Personally I like to play my games on the stock core without any bells and whistles because I prefer the simplicity of it just working rather than testing out which game improves or breaks on the turbo core. But that's my personal preference, nothing to do with the devs.

You just do... you.

[zinc dew]

More power to people playing however they want, in fact I think it’s amazing we’re able to turn off so many hardware features.

But I run it stock, give me the Vaseline!!!

||I also run the Turbo core with as clean a look as possible||

[cunning fern]

Happy to know I am not the only one who likes stock vaseline. The issue is only weave deinterlacing is enabled when using the stock mode. There is no Bob deinterlacing option, nor the 480p option used with clean HDMI. Maybe that is a limitation of the core, just wanted to know if a separate 480p option without enabling the clean HDMI mode was possible. If not, maybe a bob deinterlacing option can be implemented if there are any resources left.

[zinc dew]

I dunno, seems fine to me. 🤷‍♂️

[cunning fern]

It is fine for 240p titles. All high res, 480i games suffer from weave artifacts. Rogue squadron, which I suppose is the most popular 480i game is really hard to play that way.

[lament escarp]

Bob not being there seems weird though, thought it was there.

[zinc dew]

Ohhh, for 480i

[turbid warren]

480i is a lot of eyes 😮

[lament escarp]

Indeed, I also can't find an option to set it to bob. Guess I didn't follow up since I started using an external scaler.

[zinc dew]

damn, low key flexing on us with your external scaler huh

[gritty basalt]

I completely forgot to do this before logging out earlier, but I wanted to thank everyone who tried to help me out with my button mapping issue earlier. Even though I couldn't really resolve it in the end I really do appreciate the assistance you guys offered. Feel kinda dickish for not saying this earlier.

[gritty basalt]

In my defense, these were pretty much the best option I had at the time 🙁

[vapid hawk]

whats wrong with the tribute64? loads of people got those they work fine

[cunning fern]

I don't like the build quality, but otherwise they do work very well with the core. Finished Mario 64, both Zelda's, WWF no mercy, Paper Mario, Star fox, so real issues to comment. I own the wireless V2 version.

[lament escarp]

I tried the tribute and brawler 64 and out of the 2 I liked the brawler better tbh. Still sad the n64 modkit has issues in switch mode.

[broken creek]

Brawler is so bad lol, I’m surprised you’d prefer it!

[weary beacon]

one thing i've noticed in mario kart 64 is, there's a section of frappe snowland with a bunch of snowmen that slows down really badly on real hardware, but on the mister core, it doesn't slow down at all, not even in the standard (non-turbo) core. anyone venture a guess as to why that is? is the core just that well-optimized?

[neat sierra]

It runs a little fast

The memory timings can’t be perfect due to mister hardware capabilities

[topaz otter]

Don't the snowmen and the penguins have a lot of polygons, moreso than anything else

They are the showpieces for that level after all

Nevermind they are sprites

And the penguins are in the other level

[weary beacon]

they are indeed sprites yes. i'm not shocked they slow down on a real n64, but it's still noticeably severe. once i played on the mister core, it's honestly tough to go back to the real deal lol

[zinc dew]

What were the conditions? Single player cup race? Time trial? Multiplayer? Or it doesn’t matter?

[weary beacon]

i've only tried it in a normal singleplayer race thus far. if it happens there, i would imagine it happens in multiplayer too. not sure about time trial

[zinc dew]

I’ll try to check it out on my N64.

[wanton sun]

there cores memory interface is on average slightly too fast to compensate for the times where it cannot fulfill the original delay, so it can catch up