Nintendo 64

[latent galleon]

i just remember going full "ackchyually" with @twin barn in those comments

also finding that video

👀

[dusty tusk]

Hmm, can't seem to get the patcher to even work, keep getting exceptions

Python you fickle thing you

[tidal zenith]

MISTER FPGA NEW N64 CORE IMPROVEMENTS YOU WONT BELIEVE WHAT GAME NOW WORKS

BUT IS IT READY?

[rose elbow]

if mister doesn't play carts it must be some emulation box or something /s

[zinc dew]

it is an emulation box

[latent galleon]

honestly robby i am not sure if that was peak hype, but it seemed like it...google trends is useless we are too niche

[rose elbow]

true true, but even with the new analogue announcement, playing carts seems to be a big difference for a lot of people

[raw oriole]

Emulations must be very small, as it is a tiny box to keep them in

[thorn flax]

I was working in a hotel, just before the 1st lockdown. I'd love to know what convinced me to get one

[rose elbow]

also what kinda name is mister sounds dumb

[tidal zenith]

ACKHTCHUALLY

[rose elbow]

jeff gerstmann showing off the mister (and analogue products before that) on giantbomb is pretty much what got me to buy one.. shout out

[zinc dew]

oh yeah that’s really cool

[deft tree]

me hunting for a neogeo multi solution was how i stumbled into it

[tidal zenith]

like everything in my life, I had FOMO

I also camped out at like 5AM at target to get that stupid NES Classic

[zinc dew]

I wanted to do a PS1 ODE and hdmi upgrade around the time, basically did a price comparison and went with MiSTer

[raw oriole]

I'd just converted my Dreamcast to HDMI, and was looking around for ways to do the SNES, NES, Megadrive, Atari 800, ZX Spectrum, QL and whatever else I have in the retro clutter upstairs.

All in one! Amazing. Sold.

[deft tree]

i still have an Xstation sitting in a box in my drawer

that will probably never get installed lol

[raw oriole]

I'm awfully glad I didn't succumb to fomo and order one of those N64 HDMI things, they were nearly £300 shipped ($80 shipping! Fffff)

Procrastination wins again! Eventually

[zinc dew]

Oh yeah I wanted one of those too lol

[deft tree]

I didn't do that, but I did get a 64+expansion card+x7 everdrive

[raw oriole]

Yeah, I've spent a while hovering over the buy button on Krikzz carts. Like the HDMI, just a bit too expensive. And now look where we are

[thorn flax]

I've remembered! it was gamesack

[deft tree]

I've gotten a lot of use out of my 64 though, so no complaints really

[raw oriole]

Oh, me too. But I did get it in ~2002

Had a TV it worked with until 2016 🙂

[deft tree]

i yard saled my childhood 64 in high school

[tidal zenith]

i yard saled everything good

I sold a dreamcast with a binder full of cd-r's to some lady and she actually came back

"my son said these games are fake"

[deft tree]

hahaha

[tidal zenith]

yeah no shit lady, it's a dreamcast and like 40 games for $50

[rough flax]

i shoulda done this earlier but here are some more widescreen rom patches for various n64 games (including pilotwings 64, beetle adventure racing, 1080 snowboarding, etc.) 🙂

[fair stump]

Same here

[rose elbow]

oof i did do that... and similar with dreamcast too 👀

no HDMI mod tho, thats the one thing i held off and probably wont bother at this rate

[tidal zenith]

I use a crappy little HDMI box for my DC and it's 97% fine

and a clone GDEMU

[rough flax]

a small addendum

[latent galleon]

thank you, friend

[cerulean elk]

To go from “ok enough” to “perfect” video wise is such a jump in price

[tidal zenith]

yeah, but I am no pixel peeper

[cerulean elk]

Shockingly me either

I’m still rocking my Framemeister

[tidal zenith]

throwback

[languid dune]

I'm a pixel peeper. I peep those pixels every chance I get.

[tidal zenith]

scandalous

[languid dune]

You don't know the half of it.

[cerulean elk]

You must be used to looking at really small things

[tidal zenith]

that'd be my wife

[languid dune]

You don't know th.....damn it!

[cerulean elk]

@languid dune measures his you know what in pixels and his lasting power in lag milliseconds 🤣

[languid dune]

[placid quiver]

I just got my 8bitdo modkit in; got every button to work except c up and c left which is weird; tried multiple membranes too, don't know if it is a board issue

[tidal zenith]

it's only detectable using a MiSTer Laggy

[latent galleon]

@placid quiver naw, you are good

try switch mode

or map c buttons as analog stick 2 in direct input mode

i had the same question when i got mine

[placid quiver]

The buttons don't even register as presses?

[latent galleon]

correct

but only in the mister menu setup

[ember linden]

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nYbkbUMUr1KSvt2gT2tnnS3u7_Q7k_RmfiDz8GFTwMY/

ended up updating @worn delta 's doc a bit yesterday

added a column for Disk Swapping since it was a topic of discussion, plus a column for the unreleased 64GB cable since it does have support within released games lol

[worn delta]

Many thanks for that!

[latent galleon]

@placid quiver i may be explaining poorly, but you can be happy it isn't defective

[placid quiver]

Youre good! It worked

I was really frustrated there

[worn delta]

I assumed nothing used the keyboard but rafnet, but now wondering if anything else did

[prisma ivy]

again with the late comments here sorry: no no no, you gotta tickle their balls
(hopefully please god someone gets the reference)

"YOU WON'T BELIEVE CORE IMPROVEMENTS"

[ember linden]

randnet only, in fact the keyboard is the only n64 peripheral that begins with RND instead of NUS

im sure someone made some homebrew to support it

[worn delta]

Ah, I was wondering if maybe Sim City used it, a shame it didnt

Do you know if that one used Mouse?

[ember linden]

you could only buy the keyboard through Randnet. It made sense

[orchid nimbus]

Yay!!!

[ember linden]

mouse works yes

oh, in simcity?

that i gotta confirm

i thought you meant in randnet

[worn delta]

I thought I saw someone mention sim city could use the mouse but I may be wrong

[prisma ivy]

hold up

[ember linden]

I'm pretty sure it works

[prisma ivy]

we playin Sim City 64 now?

[worn delta]

You can do

[prisma ivy]

geez I stop paying attention for a day and now we're playing 64DD games

[worn delta]

The cart conversion in the HTGDB Everdrive pack is playable

[prisma ivy]

amazing!

[worn delta]

I don't know to what extent but I was in the tutorial

[prisma ivy]

one step closer to taking a picture on Gameboy Camera and importing it into Sim City 64 😛

[ember linden]

you wont be able to do that with cart conversions because they cant save, plus no disk swapping

[prisma ivy]

ahhhhhhhhh

oh well it was just sillyness anyway

something to do just because it was so ridiculous

[worn delta]

Are there translation patches for the disk versions?

[ember linden]

yes

[worn delta]

That's great!

Glad those exist

[prisma ivy]

are we in a second golden age of retro gaming?

oh wait

uh

that sounds weird

are we in the golden age of retro gaming?

[ember linden]

In fact, some of those games have something neat called "combo roms", where if you use the original 64DD disk but run the combo ROM through something like an Everdrive, it will translate your actual copy in realtime by loading in the translated files

[prisma ivy]

we have so many options. There are so many translation patches, QOL patches, complete hacks, so many ways to enjoy old games right now

[ember linden]

it lets you play an english version of mario artist and still save to a disk

https://youtu.be/IIIvYStmZME

[worn delta]

To temper expectations, Robert has said DD support is (rightly) low priority and we are going to be up against it in terms of space and resources, so don't get your hopes up on proper DD support in the core. But who knows, if it doesn't fit maybe it will one day on a future successor board. 🙂

Akuji has been helping me fill out a sheet of what DD games make use of what additional hardware and peripherals as this is not well documented and will be useful for testing the cart conversions, and maybe one day the actual disks.

[ember linden]

As much as I softly push for the proper support I totally understand where priorities need to be

[prisma ivy]

I have zero expectations for 64DD core. I had zero expectations for N64 core as well.

MiSTer was just freakin' fantastic last year. Now developers are just adding the gravy

[worn delta]

The DD is one system that I have wanted since it was announced but never got one and wish I did years back when they were expensive but not insanely so. Has always eluded me and do hope one day I can experience it properly emulated 🙂

[prisma ivy]

I enjoy the outliers of video game hardware just because....well... they tried their darndest

I root for the underdog a lot

[ember linden]

I got one about a year ago by gambling + bidding on an "unknown state" one from buyee, it was pricy but way cheaper than ebay

since then I built up my 64dd game collection, I'm now only missing the randnet exclusive items which I'm not going to bother with (the keyboard, doshin 2, and the pro tour golf game) because they can go upwards of a grand each

[prisma ivy]

oof

expensive

[worn delta]

Good effort getting what you did

[prisma ivy]

oh Akuji that was you who posted the nice picture the other day of your collection all lined up on the shelf right

[ember linden]

ye

[prisma ivy]

👍

[worn delta]

Prices are so nuts for things now from Japan I am glad I got what I did when I did, got a working Satellaview so that is something

[ember linden]

Just realized, I never showed the thing itself

[worn delta]

Very nice

Is that a Saturn bottom right?

[ember linden]

a v-saturn yeah

[worn delta]

Fire.

[ember linden]

got it from when i was in japan a few weeks ago

[zenith orchid]

I just stashed away my N64, since I don't have an ED64 for play TLB games anyway

[ember linden]

drive is broken, still gotta put my fenrir in it

[zenith orchid]

And I only have one N64 game

sf rush 2049, which plays just as well on the core

[normal basin]

tested 3 controllers for N64 on blissbox pro, cannot get y axis on analog to work

using the mister controller test non of my n64 controllers will allow me to use the y axis on analog

anyone else have this issue? I have most recent release

[zinc dew]

I don’t have that issue but I also haven’t tested with a bliss box.

[normal basin]

Heya Robby what are you using?

I also have a few diff snac adapters but didnt see any settings for those

[zinc dew]

Hey friend. I’ve used the MisterAddons SNAX adapter and Reflex Adapter. Both have worked fine for me.

But admittedly I just use that cheap saffun controller now, haha.

[normal basin]

ohhh so snac works then, nice!!!

ill try those

No matter what though, the fact N64 works after all of the nay saying...Im psyched!!

[eternal ravine]

N64 stole the console design from 3DO
Uhh, the corner pillars anyway

[normal basin]

I thought for sure it would have required dual ram

[eternal ravine]

[zinc dew]

It’s not part of the core just yet. Blue was very kind enough to make a fork that includes SNAC support for testing - #1096015979055697940 message

It’s an earlier version of the core. Basically don’t expect SNAC integration into the core until its closer to being complete. But for now please enjoy that build!

[fair stump]

My brain

[normal basin]

cant doenload it?

nm got it

[orchid nimbus]

https://tenor.com/view/hello-robby-robby-felix-tag-gif-26409188

[dusty tusk]

Glad someone menitoned the ares emulator, great for testing hacks before sending them over to the core

[solemn marlin]

Cool, which one do you play the most? Mister?

[prisma ivy]

I take it Ares is a really good software emulator?

[brisk edge]

It's trying to be a lot more accurate than most

[prisma ivy]

Neat

You must need a powerful machine for that

Unlike MiSTer

[dusty tusk]

Sure, but if it boots on ares it'll likely boot on mister

and vice versa

btw, no dice in patching bottles revenge in, I've tried just about everything

[prisma ivy]

Oh yes. Sorry I didn't mean to imply otherwise

[dusty tusk]

No worries. I think emulators like that are more useful for testing than playing

[ember linden]

I've had this before the n64 core existed so I've been sticking with real hardware, although I've been checking up on the core a lot just to see what's new

[solemn marlin]

Meant generally speaking out of all the consoles but that's cool. You feel like you will be able to remove the n64 at one point once the core improves?

[fair stump]

How long is this intro to Zool?!

I swear I've been here pressing B for like ten minutes without any sign of gameplay

[eternal ravine]

Wait, did N64 actually get a Zool game??

[fair stump]

Japan only, yeah

[eternal ravine]

Oh, thank goodness
It's not this Zool

[fair stump]

😆

Bit different than that

[eternal ravine]

I can only imagine the potential shittiness

Of a PAL-exclusive ZOOL 64

I bet AI could render us a glimpse

[fair stump]

This has not been checked since August but the FMV near the beginning of Yakouchou II has some pretty extreme graphical corruption

[fluid loom]

Haha. I was the one in the “pissing match” which it really wasn’t. I only tagged you to get Pat to actually learned something first hand about the N64 core instead of telling me I was basically full of shit. The guy doesn’t seem very knowledgeable about anything outside of mainstream stuff. I didn’t want to drag you into the conversation, just was pointing the guy to your space to learn.

[cerulean elk]

Haha I didn’t mind at all. Tag me any time 🙂

[ember linden]

I think the n64 is here to stay lol. In terms of all the systems it would surprisingly be Gamecube

[thorn flax]

looks the same as the corruption in Pokémon Puzzle League

[solemn marlin]

Gamecube? Why's that 🤔

[ember linden]

I've been revisiting games I used to play back when it was out, I got a Broadband Adapter that I use to load games from a NAS using Swiss

I've also played the few LAN games like Mario Kart Double Dash between the Gamecube and the Wii using Nintendont, it's very fun

Pac-Man Vs. is also amazing with friends

[fair stump]

Ah, good to know 👍

[solemn marlin]

Yea sounds good, it's a great console so not knocking it, also had no idea you could do lan stuff, interesting

[ember linden]

LAN was not supported well at all, I think there's like 7 games that touch it

Dolphin added support for it a year ago and their blogpost uses my room to show my session between Dolphin + Wii + Gamecube lol

https://dolphin-emu.org/blog/2022/09/13/dolphin-progress-report-july-and-august-2022/#50-16838-add-hle-broadband-device-by-schthack-and-many-additional-fixes-by-sepalani

a lot has changed since then, no more dining room table as a computer table anymore lmao

[solemn marlin]

Lol that's amazing, can't say I know much about it, it's stable?

A meager list of games but still cool

[ember linden]

it's stable when you stick with wired and not too great with dolphin on wifi but can be passable

[solemn marlin]

I'd want a phantasy star online set up with nothing but crts and wired gamecubes

[ember linden]

I did get online with my gamecube using a community server, it's neat

[solemn marlin]

But isn't the wii u the best choice for that since you can play gc+wii and wii u? And homebrew

I mean, if you need to keep one out

[stuck summit]

Wii U is input lag city

[solemn marlin]

Hm

[elfin depot]

Wii U also doesn't do 240p if I'm not mistaken

[fair stump]

I've run into this twice, could anyone tell me what it says?

[honest ermine]

Game needs 123 blocks, clear some space or play without a memory pak

[fair stump]

Ah, thanks!

[honest ermine]

Translation apps are amazing 😂

[native mesa]

There's nothing worth playing on wiiu that wasn't ported to switch

[hot spoke]

Not even Wind Waker HD or Twilight Princess HD?? 😭

[elfin depot]

Xenoblade Chronicles X

[hot spoke]

I'm really curious about this 🤔

[rose elbow]

Yoshi's Woolly World is another one. especially in comparision to Crafted World

Nintendo looove to drip feed their ports of old games as slowly as possible to give the market some time to justify spending full price over and over again

i love nintendo games but stuff like this def shits me

[latent galleon]

that game is so pretty upscaled

[ember linden]

https://schtserv.com/forums/app.php/welcome

[iron dove]

mario v DK remake incomming

love that game but... $65 for new gfx and coop

[orchid nimbus]

https://tenor.com/view/count-duckula-cartoon-gif-21923020

🥹

[eternal ravine]

Body Harvest seems to rely heavily on the vaseline blur to hide the low rez of gameply
Must have taxed the system pretty hard?

corrected

[iron dove]

Mario64 hack mario & luigi dual adventure seems like it works well on latest core, had gfx issues on N64_20231014.rbf and earlier

[manic basin]

Gaht I love British cartoons from the 80s.
@iron dove so the weird cloud issues with Jugemu/Lakitu are gone in the latest build? I'll have to give it a go!

Luigi's screen, as is customary for all second players, took the brunt of it.

[iron dove]

i was getting flickering over the screen right from the start on the older core

[manic basin]

Yeah, I had some elements definitely flickering. I was still shocked it worked (even on real hardware).

People are amazing.

[iron dove]

yeah for sure 🙂 most mario hacks arent too friendly with real hardwre

peach's fury still has issues, lucy's levitation seems improved also tho

[brisk edge]

started playing that the other day, such a happy fun platformer

[iron dove]

although in lucy's levitation, the tree textures almost look like they're animated on the core, are static on simple64

[brisk edge]

I do hope that in the future more hacks target real hardware, always kind of a bummer when it's locked to emulator only

[iron dove]

peach's fury is rated 'excellent' for hardware compat. but I'm guessing the issue is still with the hack not the core. need to get my 64 n 64drive out to test it there

[brisk edge]

I've played most of it on real hardware some months ago, I don't remember running into any issues other than the occasional framerate dip. Since I'm sure kaze probably used the decomp, maybe he used some obscure functions that aren't typically used or something

[worldly quartz]

yes this is true probably due to hdmi supports 480p and above only

[daring meteor]

There's analog outputs on the Wii U

[iron trail]

It does do 480i though so you can do analog out to an SD TV

[iron trail]

Yeah this

No 240p is a bummer

[worldly quartz]

can the n64 do 480i?

or was Nintendo too cool for it then?

[wanton sun]

several games do 480i

[mossy vector]

I was able to complete Pilotwings 64 tonight. All gold medals on main missions, at least silver on Extra bonus games to unlock all birdman stages.

[weary palm]

Majora's Mask bombers notebook is 480i

[worldly quartz]

are there games that switch between resolutions like on PS1/Saturn?

[wanton sun]

wow, you really must know this game in and out. I can barely make bronze in the later stages. Thank you for verifying it. As you are probably VERY familiar with the game, any issues you have seen?

[worldly quartz]

so that I know OSSC would not be great with them

[eternal ravine]

Don't a number of expansion pack games use 480i

Resident Evil 2 goes ham wild

[mossy vector]

Zero crashes., works beautifully. The only thing is maybe LOD is used for the brick detail texture on the landing targets and I think no mip-mapping which is evident on some of the really lowres building textures. But nothing weird like spiraling out of control! so the floating point math calculations are spot on.

[weary beacon]

Do you think a 480p hack would be easy? Maybe it would take less ressources than implement weave/bob deinterlacing?

[wanton sun]

there are some ideas how that could work, but it would loose the VI features (AA, dedither, ...)

[worldly quartz]

would it be blurrier in that regard?

[eternal ravine]

Some games look pretty good with all VI disabled

[wanton sun]

no, less blurry, but more jaggies and banding

[worldly quartz]

ah so some sacrifices oh well

[wanton sun]

it would be using the scalers direct framebuffer mode to output the image from ddr3 where it sits without using VI at all

however, i'm not yet sure if the way the n64 stores data is currently accepted by the scaler

most likely the scaler would need a modification to output the correct color format at least

[worldly quartz]

although that 480i to 480p is just for analog output?

[weary beacon]

ParallelRDP can increase the output resolution to 2x or more, any chance to have the same on the core?

[hollow rune]

Can I mark it on the spreadsheet for you? It was USA, right?

[wanton sun]

only if you give me a larger fpga 🙂

[latent galleon]

mister 3.0

[dusty tusk]

Here's hoping Mars turns into something worth upgrading to

[wanton sun]

there is not that much space available in mars

at least with the currently proposed fpga

[mossy vector]

Yes USA. I'd sure appreciate it if you would.

[latent galleon]

it almost seems like a sidegrade except for the generational update in speed

[wanton sun]

it still needs to show how efficiently it really is, but double resolution in both directions is really 4 times pixels, so 4 times RDP size or maybe 2 times with double clock speed(133mhz), both is very ambitious

[dusty tusk]

Is there more detailed specs for mars, they're proposing Dreamcast, so I'd hope they can back it up

[weary beacon]

MARS can run 4 times faster, 266MHz should be achievable 😉

[tulip coral]

i've never understood the appeal with 240p games rendered at super high resolutions - for me they just look so wrong. the contrast between the 240p 2D assets and the hyper sharp polygons is straight up bad. the final fantasy switch ports demo that pretty well. i'd take 240p on a big screen any day over the same game with some 240p textures / backgrounds and 4k ultra sharp polygons

[latent galleon]

i like to do the upscale/downscale thing in ares, which is basically just expensive antialiasing

but still running at native resolution

[brisk edge]

I mostly feel the same, though, it's at least fun to experiment with what emulators can do now. It's mostly 6th gen onwards that I think benefits from boosting the internal rendering resolution

[latent galleon]

anything gamecube or later really just looks better as far as nintendo consoles go

[little socket]

You upscale to ridiculous resolutions nowadays to downsample back to og res

[tulip coral]

makes me wonder what Analogue are planning with their '4K' talk on the N64 console. will that be interannly rendered at 4K? cos if so, i'd pass

[brisk edge]

I would think it's just upscaling, since the next generation of upscalers are starting to aim at 4k. But yeah who knows

[latent galleon]

when i render higher than native in software emulators the texture all start looking disjointed and strange to me

like stuff stops blending

[tulip coral]

heres an example shamelessly nicked from reddit - the Switch 3D models look objectively MUCH better rendered at higher res. but as part of the scene, against the low res background they (for me) are a jarring contrast. althrough the original res models are far less defined, they fit with the background and the scene works. if that makes sense

[thorn flax]

this is a crime against art

[rose elbow]

the CRT kinda filters for example could really benefit from 4k

[latent galleon]

yeah that type of stuff really drives me crazy

[rose elbow]

makes me feel lucky i grew up during that time coz looking at the original looks fine to me hehe

gimme them chunky pixels

[tulip coral]

yea agreed

[wanton sun]

not sure where you get these strange numbers from? no, mars will not run the RDP at 266mhz, i can tell you for sure

is that from the initial tweet telling mars can do 400mhz and cyclone 5 can do 100mhz? if yes, that was just wrong. Mister runs several parts way above 100mhz, e.g. scaler

but it depends on the logic. A simple NOT may work at 400mhz on the cyclone5, while a 64bit single clock divider only runs at 5 Mhz or so

[zenith orchid]

MARS: Massive Ambitions, Really Sketchy

We'll just have to wait and see though.

I would love to see next level MiSTer some day. I wouldn't mind if it is MARS, if they actually deliver.

[worldly quartz]

So mars deramcast isn't gonna happen?

someone keeps claiming that

[quaint pewter]

claiming stuff is easy, showing it off in reality is hard. I could claim to have a foot long shween.

[weary beacon]

I have read that MARS is using Ti180 M484 FPGA running at 400MHz, but as you said it must be "up to 400" with simple logic. Sorry!

[worldly quartz]

I guess

Oh well, at least that will give me time to setup my retro to ps4 area

lol

[zenith orchid]

Maybe A Real Stretch

[worldly quartz]

although are there any notable arcades with n64 internals

[zenith orchid]

I hope it becomes a thing though. Maybe Achievable, Really Skeptical.

[worldly quartz]

Yeah it's kind of hard to get into it at the start since even some devs are negative towards it

[zenith orchid]

Another thing is, how feasible and how willing devs will be to port MiSTer cores to it, and support it

[worldly quartz]

not being a big update

[zenith orchid]

Yeah, there's really a lot to it

[versed cairn]

They’ve promised Dreamcast and that’s the killer app I think if they can get it good

Though hearing the speed depends on logic

I hope they can hit the 128bit 200mhz Dreamcast hitachi cpu

[zenith orchid]

the leap from 5th to 6th gen is pretty significant

they also mentioned naomi

[worldly quartz]

although DC is like the low end 6th gen but kind of forward thinking

[versed cairn]

It’s still a huge leap from any 5th gen

[zenith orchid]

yeah, compared to N64 its a massive leap

[worldly quartz]

yeah. although ps2/xbox would be wonderful

specially xbox with the need for recap

[versed cairn]

We’re talking about n64 core struggling to get 480p on the mars. Makes me sceptical a 480p machine like the Dreamcast would work

[worldly quartz]

yeah, I'd say 5 more years

[zenith orchid]

PS2s are so easy to get, and so easy to softmod, and you can emulate it pretty well. I heard the input lag is quite minimal

[versed cairn]

Ps2 would be huge just for the potential interlaced work around

[quaint pewter]

Original XBOX is over 700mhz cpu

[versed cairn]

Lots of games will not work in anything but interlaced on the ps2. Even with mods

[zenith orchid]

but that's in the software. some games have a built in progressive mode, most don't

[worldly quartz]

GCM works for some games thankfully

[versed cairn]

Yeah some

[worldly quartz]

suprisingly some reach 1080i lol

[versed cairn]

I love experimenting with it

But lots of my favs like onimusha and devil may cry are locked to interlaced

Early games mostly

[zenith orchid]

my entertainment setup is the MiSTer and 6th gen and up consoles. The MiSTer saves so much space its ridiculous

[versed cairn]

Same. That’s my living room setup right now too

[worldly quartz]

I have 5th gen on mine and I'm like was I impatient?!

like when I got the n64 last year, I was like wtf did i buy this?

[zenith orchid]

I would love DC on FPGA, but the platform would probably be way more expensive than an ODE on the real thing

[worldly quartz]

i mean, you can justify it as a DC with ODE + HDMI

that's like 1K usually

[versed cairn]

I already spent the money on a hdmi moded one with a ode, but fpga just excites me

[worldly quartz]

like how much a mister is compared to an n64 + hdmi mod

[zenith orchid]

Or just feed the VGA into an upscaler

[worldly quartz]

Yeah, the 5x VGA output is pretty good

[versed cairn]

It’s not that bad if you can do the install yourself

[worldly quartz]

although it's annoying to walk to switch the box

[versed cairn]

But I know most can’t

[worldly quartz]

yeah, micro soldering is something I need to learn

[zenith orchid]

I already have a behar bros Kuro

[versed cairn]

That ribbon cable is a nightmare

[worldly quartz]

I probably ened a good iron first

[versed cairn]

It’s very stressful 😅

[worldly quartz]

I would have done n64 rgb for practice

[versed cairn]

I hear the ps2 hdmi ribbon is even harder

Most are failing it

[wanton sun]

their DC developer has the GPU done already and seems optimistic, so the chances are good?

[zenith orchid]

yeah, DC hardware may also be well documented

[worldly quartz]

hope it gets a big community

like more FPGA communities would be great to lower prices

in theory

[vapid hawk]

my installer said it was really difficult, but he still got it done 🙂

it does sound like maybe the hardest one so far, mainly because of the ps2 using unleaded solder

[daring meteor]

200MHz CPU, oh boy

[versed cairn]

Also it attaches on three sides of a chip

That’s crazy

[zenith orchid]

Knowing sega, the games probably didn't push the hardware that much

[vapid hawk]

and there's a massive oscillator in the way meaning you have to solder it at an angle

[versed cairn]

My god

[vapid hawk]

see how the flex doesn't lie flat

this is why i leave these to the professionals 😄

[zenith orchid]

all that work for direct digital to digital video.. I'll stick with component

[versed cairn]

I can’t believe it requires this many pins and set up like this

[thorn flax]

looking good my dude

[versed cairn]

Ps2 is such a special beast. The mod chip install are also very hard

[thorn flax]

some of those are just for physical support

keeps the flex anchored

[vapid hawk]

yeah not every pin tapped is always used

[versed cairn]

Right. I think it was like that on the Dreamcast and n64 ones too

[vapid hawk]

its the unleaded solder thats killer

you have to basically remove it all and redo it with leaded

[thorn flax]

if I have to solder another ps1digital

[versed cairn]

I’ve tried using unleaded and it’s the worst

[thorn flax]

one time I had to use a hot air gun and tweezers to put several gpu pins back in place

[versed cairn]

It always looks so dull. You don’t get those nice solder joints

[zenith orchid]

With wires you can make it a work of art.

[vapid hawk]

i think thats normal

[thorn flax]

I hadn't realized fat ps2 also used unleaded. thought that only took over when the EU forced it back inthe mid 00's

[vapid hawk]

nah everyone was already moving that way

[thorn flax]

jump before you're pushed

[timid torrent]

Depends on the alloy. The two most common I've seen is SAC305 (dull joints) and SN100C (very shiny joints)

[versed cairn]

Oh good to know thanks

[timid torrent]

If you have to actually solder stuff by hand, I much prefer SN100C

but it's harder to get

[versed cairn]

If I do the mod maybe I should rework the chip off and resolder completely with leaded

[vapid hawk]

yeah solder washing they call it

[thorn flax]

seeing this makes me want to mod my ps2 slim. but until the ide rebuild gets more refined I'll wait.

maybe play some bomberman

[vapid hawk]

there's a flex for ide rebuild now

it's called ide-resurrector

[zenith orchid]

I just use analog video. so much less work

and it's cheaper

and closer to the original experience

[versed cairn]

Honestly the analog video of the ps2 is really good

[vapid hawk]

it varies from ps2 to ps2 how good exactly

[versed cairn]

It’s just the interlaced that makes it weird

Yeah that’s fair. But overall I think it’s better then Xbox or GameCube

[zenith orchid]

Anyway it's worthwhile to have a good upscaler.

[versed cairn]

Xbox has a lot of noise

And GameCube is 4:2:2 native

I have a savings account just for when the Retrotink4k drops

[vapid hawk]

yeah now i just need a 4k scaler to hook all these hdmi mods to and i'm done

[zenith orchid]

yeah I'm so looking forward to it

[thorn flax]

pal ps2 forced into ntsc looks terribad

[vapid hawk]

ps2 was my last console w/out hdmi

[thorn flax]

had to import a few motherboards from the US

[versed cairn]

Pal continues to get the short end of the stick

I think pal Xbox and GameCube don’t even support 480p

Or it’s hard to get working

[vapid hawk]

they'll both do it with mods

[thorn flax]

xbox did. just grab a component cable

[vapid hawk]

nah a pal xbox will still only output 575i/480i even with a component cable

[thorn flax]

I swear it was in settings

[zenith orchid]

component is the only way to get analog 480p right?

[vapid hawk]

its only in settings if your bios is set to ntsc (which is what mods let you do)

[thorn flax]

perhaps every xbox I've seen is softmoded lol

[versed cairn]

Yeah, scart could do it but for whatever reason they didn’t allow it

[vapid hawk]

there's like, 1 or 2 tv's that can take 480p over scart

[versed cairn]

Didn’t hd TVs in Europe have scart?

[vapid hawk]

yeah, but they didn't take 480p over scart ever, also nothing really outputs it

[versed cairn]

Just the ps2 I guess

[vapid hawk]

you can shove 480p down a scart cable these days and feed it to an OSSC and that'll work

[zenith orchid]

my DC vga box can output 480p over scart

[versed cairn]

That too. My Dreamcast can scart 480p

[vapid hawk]

yeah the cable is physically capable (if well shielded) of up to 1080i

[versed cairn]

Crazy

[zenith orchid]

vga makes a better connection though

[versed cairn]

We never had scart here so I never knew that limitation since the scalers can take it

My pvm can take it too, but that’s a very special monitor

[zenith orchid]

same. when the scart craze happened, I bought a shinybow scart to component converter and that lasted me a good while

[vapid hawk]

heh

[versed cairn]

I still have two of those lol

[vapid hawk]

the idea of a scart craze is quite funny here, everyone already had all that stuff 😄

[versed cairn]

I eventually rgb modded my crt though

[vapid hawk]

nobody wants it anymore either, i've been just given scart cables that used to have like £200 RRPs and stuff

[zenith orchid]

I still use mine for my dreamcast

[versed cairn]

I would like a few of those…

[vapid hawk]

check ebay and just look for brands like ixos / qed

from europe

even with shipping they're still a steal

[versed cairn]

Nice, thanks for the tip

[zenith orchid]

what's that?

[versed cairn]

It can be expensive to buy good shielded scart cables. End up making them a lot of the time from other cables

[vapid hawk]

fancy cable brands basically

[zenith orchid]

ah

I really don't want to bother with scart anymore.

[vapid hawk]

i'm thinking about removing all the analog video from my setup now

it'd make all the cabling a lot neater

[versed cairn]

Ps2 is the last system in my living room that’s analog

Should just do it and mod the damn thing

[vapid hawk]

i've still got a saturn technically but the mister cores probably going to replace that

[zenith orchid]

Yeah it's just 6th gen for me. got scart for ps2 and dc, component for Xbox, and s-video for GC

all else is digital

[versed cairn]

I have modded my Wii,Xbox, and Dreamcast with hdmi mods. It makes cabling so much easier

[zenith orchid]

oh right, component on Wii as well

[vapid hawk]

it sounds like the new morph scaler actually has an analog output. i.e feed everything via hdmi to the morph and it'll give you one single scart or vga output

alongside the scaled hdmi output

[versed cairn]

Oh that’s neat

[vapid hawk]

yeah so i can pull all my analog cabling but still use my pvm now and then

[versed cairn]

Like a dual mister screen setup

[vapid hawk]

yeah i'm just not sure if it'll be fast enough for lightguns

[versed cairn]

Probably not. Those are so finicky with timing

[vapid hawk]

yeah

[versed cairn]

Ps2 has so many light gun bangers

[vapid hawk]

i could just give the pvm its own dedicated ps2 tbh

[versed cairn]

That’s how I have it. I have a second ps2 in the office just for lightgun games haha

Can’t live without my time crisis

[vapid hawk]

everyones forgotten or never knew how fun lightgun games were i feel like

everyone i let play on mine goes bananas for it lol

[versed cairn]

My girlfriend isn’t into fast moving action games but she loves light gun games. Gets really competitive with score lol

[vapid hawk]

something about the simplicity and immediacy of it. zero lag. people expect it to be like a wiimote and are delighted when it isn't 🙂

[versed cairn]

I wish they would make new ones with a new guncon. Would buy that in a heartbeat

[worldly quartz]

Really should setup batocera for ps2 light guns

[vapid hawk]

seriously if you like lightgun games they live on now in VR

Crisis Brigade2 is VR time crisis more or less. Pistol Whip is time crisis with dancing instead of ducking for cover

https://youtu.be/AAv0X9fc6DY

[loud pebble]

Weird that there was never a lightgun for N64.

I never thought about it before!

[thorn flax]

I've pondered it a few times.

nintnedo not making a rip off of Virtua Cop is an odd omission

heck, they could have made bank selling light guns for a 4 player duck hunt 64

Logan's Ally 64 would have the potential to be amazing too

perhaps they had plans but nixed them with the uptake in shootings that started 'round that time

Sega US sure wanted some distance between them and official light gun support

[brisk edge]

tbf it's not like they did a lot with the super scope either so maybe they just didn't think it was worth exploring

[loud pebble]

I'm really loving the N64 core. I hadn't touched N64 for years so I had forgotten about the immediacy of it compared to the cd based systems. It feels really arcadey. F-zero is so blisteringly smooth and the little Nintendo touches like the way the text "FINISH" spins at the end when you blow past the finish line. Satisfying.

[orchid pike]

Has anyone been able to connect the Retro Fighters Nintendo Switch Online controller?

[thorn flax]

don't forget to play the DD cups on the expansion kit version

saving the extra tracks wont work yet (some save functions need to be changed in the cartridge ports)

[woeful grove]

d cups?

[thorn flax]

bigger

double d's

[woeful grove]

it's too early for clever jokes, I need coffee

[thorn flax]

same

always

[solemn marlin]

I always have the double ds for my expansion pack

[toxic pumice]

DD-1 is really weird. I didn't like that cup too much but other than boosting myself off the outside loop in the first track, the rest was relatively straight forward

DD-2 is excellent but Big Foot can absolutely do one.

[thorn flax]

I did the DD-1 boost death too

that was great

I was in 30th on lap 3 thinking "where have I gone wrong"?

then I was all like

https://tenor.com/view/spinning-anakin-good-trick-star-wars-gif-8665986

[toxic pumice]

Lol

They bait you into it with the rough ground too.

Cool I'll just boost over it and ignore the slowdown, oh wait...

[native mesa]

Playing OOT without most of the VI is really quite something. I feel like those colorblind people that get those glasses to let them see color

[thorn flax]

the floor is squares

I wonder if some of the super low res textures were for the sake of performance or storage limitations

[wanton sun]

OOT without dither and dedither can feel like using some old 16 color monitor that only has green and brown and colors in between

it's not a bad compromise in the end, given how large scaled those textures often are. Lesser colors allows for higher resolution. So without those tricks it would be even worse

[daring meteor]

Someone here probably plays on one of those

[wanton sun]

ok, i was not fair, OoT in starting area does not use 4 bit textures, but 8 bit, so 256 colors at least

[mild ether]

My early gaming experiences were CGA.

[native mesa]

It kinda has like a paint stroke effect with the 3 point texture filtering

[brisk drum]

Happy Friday to everyone !

[zinc dew]

No talk of other FPGAs here unless it’s relevant to the core. Move all that discussion to - #fpga-platforms

Thank you very much. 🥳

[thorn flax]

[zinc dew]

To give context I think the discussion is great, especially if it’s directed at Robert with questions. I just want to keep potential arguments over in #fpga-platforms

but you know what’s one thing we should be doing more of?

Letting @wanton sun know how much we love the N64 core and how thankful we are for his work on the MiSTer! 🥳

[fair stump]

It kind of ends up being the same discussion every time

[mortal panther]

Wow, Robby's getting brave. He's scolding Robert for being off-topic, too. 🤣

Just gotta show everyone who's boss sometimes, eh? 😉

[zinc dew]

No actually not scolding anyone. It’s why I said “relevant to the core”.

[mortal panther]

Kidding, of course.

[zinc dew]

Also I am not boss, I am a custodian

[wanton sun]

After some hours it feels like the general channel sometimes, but i'm not always free of guilt 😅

[zinc dew]

To be frank, this channel is for you. So it needs to be what you want.

[mortal panther]

Custodians generally have all the keys to the castle. 😏

[native mesa]

We're all just people with similar interests so it's what happens

[mortal panther]

They have the real power.

[zinc dew]

if you want to discuss hydrogen atoms every night then I will direct discussion towards that. Weird but I get it.

We are here to support you

[mortal panther]

Didn't mean to start anything. Just having fun. 🙂

[zinc dew]

I can be demodded and banned in a moment’s notice. Unfortunately I lack the power to do that to myself.

[zinc dew]

You started nothing. You make excellent points and I always appreciate chatting with you,

[marble cargo]

Been trying to complete Banjo-Tooie to 100% on the core. I think the only issue I've encountered is some of the polygons occasionally glitching out for a frame, but otherwise it is very stable.

Like the only hurdle is just the anti-piracy, but at least that can be bypassed. So worst case scenario, there is at least a work around.

[mortal panther]

They would never dare. The people would rise up!

[zinc dew]

If anything my comments weren’t considerate enough. Even Kitrinx provided me some feedback and y’all are right.

[worn delta]

Robby is on point here, unless Robert wants to talk about Analogue or Mars then let's keep all that talk in the FPGA platforms channel.

[native mesa]

Hydrogen atoms are very important for semiconductor manufacturing

[zinc dew]

I will be better with my messaging in the future. Thank you @worn delta for providing better clarity and your support.

[marble cargo]

Banjo-Tooie feels like one of those games that gets better when you do repeated playthroughs. Because you are familiar with how the game works, so you can make routes to streamline completion.

[zinc dew]

I want to play it again.

[native mesa]

Does Germany do anything for Halloween?

[wanton sun]

It's horrible. Maybe because i just don't like it. Halloween is mostly putting plastic in front of your house and feeding little children with tons of sugar

[thorn flax]

I have a question!

has your research into the architecture of the n64 lead you to believe light gun support was ever a thing nintendo might have planned to pursue.

or would their be no trace of that at the ic level

[wanton sun]

i haven't found or read anything about lightguns for n64 at any point, so i just don't know, sorry

[thorn flax]

that's cool, we were talking earlier about n64's odd absence from lightgun gaming

I got daydreaming about a duck hunt 64

[marble cargo]

I wonder if there's a technical reason why a lightgun was never made. Maybe all the post-processing messed with the accuracy?

[wanton sun]

i hope for americans halloween has more to it. It seems quite popular, so it must be more

[dreamy grove]

Americans just seem to like sugar

[oblique crow]

There's a lot of pop culture steeped in Halloween. Not really about the candy, for adults anyways

[dreamy grove]

And dressing up

[thorn flax]

ideally 5th gen light guns just scanned the position of the crt electron gun

so no graphical effects outside of brightness should matter

[native mesa]

Well it's mostly for the kids but I do a party every year

For adults. Costumes. Booze, food

Dancing , karaoke with a fun vibe

[little socket]

Cannot even ban yourself? Are you a disney djinni?

[thorn flax]

unlimited moderating powers, Itty bitty cyberspace

[wanton sun]

@zinc dew you are doing a great job here, really

[thorn flax]

when he's here

more absence than my dad

[zinc dew]

Thank you but when I’m not please let me know or let @woeful grove know. I only care about what is best for you and the discord.

But you are too kind, thank you

[fair stump]

@wanton sun anything you need from us right now beyond just running through more games?

[worn delta]

Something I was wondering Robert, what game came packaged with your N64? You mentioned you never played Goldeneye, in the UK we pretty much all got that bundled with our N64 so was huge here

[wanton sun]

Mario64 came with it

goldeneye was not available in germany, or at least not easily

[native mesa]

They called them pak in paks

[worn delta]

Oh, was Goldeneye banned for violence?

[wanton sun]

yes until 2021

[thorn flax]

oh yeah the censorship law

Microsoft pushed to have it unbanned

[wanton sun]

i didn't know it existed when i was still playing n64, but honestly TWINE was great, so i don't feel like i missed much

[little socket]

Should habe gotten the 20 or so years auto umban by then

[native mesa]

Interesting. What was the cutoff for violence in games? I know Wolfenstein was playable just sans symbols

[mortal panther]

The N64 (at least in the US originally) didn't even have a pack-in game. I had to buy Super Mario 64 separately on release.

[worn delta]

Oh wow, must have been funny when people in Germany finally played Goldeneye... "You banned this until 2021?!" 🙂

[daring meteor]

The best Pack in game is the Doctor V64

[thorn flax]

Nintendo hated pack-in games

[little socket]

Yeah, should have banned it globally for that abysmal framerate

[river shale]

Could anyone briefly explain to me why slowdown happen in FPGA recreations of consoles? In my mind - the logic gates either work or do not work. Are slowdowns because of memory access times? Is it because of use not knowing exactly how the transistors in the n64 are laid out, and so we need to find more efficient ways to implement logic? An example would be much appreciated.

[wanton sun]

also i got the n64 when it was already released for some time, i think christmas 99 (maybe 98? but i think it was 99). Which was good, as plenty of titles where already available

[daring meteor]

In this core specifically or in some other cores?

[zinc dew]

Are you referring to slowdown that’s beyond what a normal game performing on original hardware would do?

[twin barn]

Interesting. In the US we didn't have a pack in game with the n64 until dk64

[little socket]

No sm64 pack on release?

[mortal panther]

The slow-down occurs in real hardware, too... so if the FPGA implementation is accurate, naturally it occurs there as well.

[zinc dew]

Yeah, I remember it being a big deal that the N64 didn’t come packaged with Mario.

[vapid hawk]

on a finished core usually any slowdown you see would of happened just the same on real hardware

[river shale]

Yes - I’m talking about a slowdown on the FPGA that does not exist on console.

[twin barn]

Yeah, in general you bought the system for the somewhat high price at the time then bought an expensive cartridge for it. The economics of this were part of the reason the system didn't do as well as the psx.

[native mesa]

My brother got an N64 I got a Gameboy pocket and pokemon

[mortal panther]

The attach rate on SM64 was through the roof though.

[twin barn]

Exactly. You were either the kid that got sm64 for it or GoldenEye, or both

[daring meteor]

On N64 core its

Memory latency, but original memory had bad latency, core usually runs better because of that
RSP is slower
DMA FIFO is not implemented

[river shale]

So memory is not organized properly, causing the processor to search longer?

[wanton sun]

no, missing features that would make the processor execute things faster usually

[daring meteor]

The memory is of a different type
But, as I said, usually its actually faster, not slower

[mortal panther]

I've had a habit for years of buy a new console on release along with all of the other titles that were avaible at launch... even if they were games or genres that I didn't really care for.
I got lucky with the N64 because of how expensive most of those cartridges were, and there ended up being only two titles available then (Super Mario 64 and Pilotwings 64).

Several others were annouced, from what I remember, but all delayed.

[vapid hawk]

i rented n64 games a LOT, buying one was a big commitment. you could have 2-3 PSX games for the price of one n64 one a lot of the time

[native mesa]

Man N64 was a trainwreck

[mortal panther]

Even though pickings were slim at launch and disappointing, that quickly subsided once I got it home. Super Mario 64 was my world for quite a while, so I ultimately didn't care. 😄

[arctic sky]

Oh memories. Got it launch day 96 , with no games . Rented Mario 64 from blockbuster.

[native mesa]

We had a local rental store that wasn't a chain

[zinc dew]

It’s honestly impressive it did as well as it did considering the competition. Nintendo was extremely fortunate to be bailed out by so many high profile games that weren’t made by them.

[native mesa]

Just Rare really

[little socket]

Na college students bailed it out

[zinc dew]

lol TRUE

[mortal panther]

When your choices are limited, you're forced to spend more time with what is available to you, and perhaps develop a deeper appreciation for it. I doubt I would have spent much time with Pilotwings 64 (or even purchased it in the first place) if 5 or 6 other games were also available at launch.

[devout belfry]

Tbf Nintendo also made two genre-defining games on there themselves

[little socket]

Without them it would have been marginally more successful than saturn

[zinc dew]

They did and Mario 64 single-handedly sold that system for a long time. Then the promise of Ocarina of Time carried it too.

[native mesa]

Collectathon genre should never have existed

[daring meteor]

All praise Mario 64

[arctic sky]

I also bought 2 jaguars for 50 bucks apiece at Kaybe toys . I gave one away lol . Kasumi ninja hahaha that’s all I had . It was garbage

[zinc dew]

I read that in the Macho Man voice and it was incredible.

[devout belfry]

And there never was anything like either of those games on PSX and definitely not on Saturn

[mortal panther]

"The cream rises to the top!"

[arctic sky]

I got mailed a VHS tape for both Saturn and the 64 . It sold me on both . And as a recent graduate back then I was broke buying all that stuff

I was in the danger zone brother !!!!

[devout belfry]

What sold me was going to best buy and seeing Mario 64 on that huge 3x3 CRT display

[orchid nimbus]

and free vhs tapes!!

[devout belfry]

I was transfixed

Also this is like 10 topics ago, but y'all sleeping on the best use of the Transfer Pak: Mario Golf/Tennis

Nothing hits like taking my generic Lvl.99 character and crushing a drive 600 yards

[mortal panther]

Sure, there have always been impressive generational leap moments with new consoles, but experiencing Super Mario 64 astounded me in a way no other new console ever did. I was just blown away. I didn't care about any controller remarks or complaints. For me, it was just as radically different as the game I was playing, and I was enjoying the hell out of it. I remember thinking "This is 3D done right!", and it was an absolute joy to play... frustrating camera angle issues aside.

[solemn maple]

Are the cpu opponents harder on the ntsc version of Mario Kart compared to PAL?

Sure feels that way

[marble cargo]

I think it's because both Mario Golf and Mario Tennis don't work on the core at the moment, so there isn't an incentive to talk about them.

[thorn flax]

got a US vru for $6

now I can play Densha De Go properly

[zinc dew]

Well said, amigo

[native mesa]

Why didn't Nintendo make an Ultra Gameboy with the transfer pak

That alone would have sold consoles

[thorn flax]

the big N made a few weird choices with that system

[native mesa]

They put all their eggs in DD

[thorn flax]

and then didn't launch it in the only territory where it might have made a difference

[nimble needle]

Whoops wrong discord sorry

[oblique crow]

The 8bitdo hall effect kit is calibrated perfectly.

[devout leaf]

This may be dumb but on the spreadsheet is completable the same as playable but someone beat it. Brain is ID foggy.

[oblique crow]

85,85,-85,-85

[native mesa]

Yeah

[devout leaf]

I love that stick.

[devout leaf]

Thanks! Seeing more games playable makes me excited to play someday soon.

[mild ether]

Imagine what could have been if Nintendo went for a CD addon instead of a funky disk drive.

Could have been some really decent games

[native mesa]

They didn't want to pay sony

[devout leaf]

FF7 never jumps ship and the entire history of games is rewritten. Sega survives, Microsoft probably doesn’t join, etc.

[prisma ivy]

10x the vaseline game content

imagine how long Brian's Quest could have been. Imagine the London Symphony Orchestra soundtrack on redbook audio

[devout leaf]

Can we crowd source a remaster?

[oblique crow]

I'm buying like 20 of these kits now

[orchid nimbus]

eh

you know that's software calibrated right?

[mild ether]

I think Microsoft would have tried anyway since they were really going after getting Microsoft in the living room. Might not be where it is today though.

[oblique crow]

All I know is this reports perfect values, where as even my oem sticks have wild values and gc values go square

[lone geyser]

On the core or on real hardware?

[oblique crow]

That's enough for me

[lone geyser]

Because the core will almost always give you perfect values because of a small outer deadzone

[oblique crow]

This is on my n64

[lone geyser]

Nice

[oblique crow]

Using a blueretro

[devout leaf]

I got the same results too. It’s a damn fine stick and feels real good playing.

Deciding if I want to put one in my Pikachu controller or leave it stock and mod a different one.

[lone geyser]

Is that a GameCube stick then?

[devout leaf]

Yeah looks like one

[oblique crow]

No

Well

In terms of shape?

Similar

But the gate is OEM

Oem style rather

[lone geyser]

So it's just a wireless adapter for an N64 controller?

[oblique crow]

With a hall effect stick

[devout leaf]

I bought just the stick

[oblique crow]

Hall effect stick can be gotten separately

[devout leaf]

You can do it all though

[oblique crow]

Yeah

[lone geyser]

Ah. I missed that. I've heard good things but also that they fail at a couple specific maneuvers in GoldenEye for whatever reason

But if you don't know what those maneuvers are you're probably fine, lol

[native mesa]

how do you enable high res mode in perfect dark?

The option is missing for me

[oblique crow]

How'd you get pd working o.o

[native mesa]

There's a patch that removes TLB

maybe it also removes high res mode

[oblique crow]

Ah

[weary palm]

Yes it does.

It's a performance hack

[daring meteor]

I think it forces high res mode?

[oblique remnant]

Singleplayer isnt possible without exp pak I believe. Btw on real hw there isnt any performance boost still got 10fps

[weary perch]

the CPU should be the same. the PAL version runs 20% slower though, so it's just a bit easier in general

[thorn flax]

was it like 5fps for pal?

[weary beacon]

My take is that anyone who missed this era and wants to understand why Mario 64 was such a big deal needs to first play Bug! for 30 minutes

[devout belfry]

Granted, we got stuff like Ape Escape and Spyro later

But neither of those are comparable either

Despite being very good

[zinc dew]

Basically confirm why it’s one of the best Saturn games. I’ll take precision platforming and humor over whatever Mario 64 was trying to do.

[mortal panther]

lol

[zinc dew]

ok I’m trolling, I’m not serious. Sorry lol

[mortal panther]

You actually had me there. I was thinking "Whoa, what game are we talking about?"
scrolls up...
"Damn... got me again." 🤣

[dreamy grove]

Am I gonna ruin my controller if I try to put silicone grease on the original joystick?

[cold pollen]

I'm interested in this new Frank persona, during what hours will you be Frank and what can we expect from him?

[cold pollen]

Ha! As if I could remember stuff in a game

[zinc dew]

IT’S ME FRANK. Waddya mean the kids still love the Nintendo 64? It’s twenty twenty three for crying out loud, don’t they gots some pickle ball they could be doing?? Get outta here!!

[cold pollen]

You had me at pickle

[weary palm]

Pickle Rick!!

[safe robin]

I did not know it was on the index in Germany. my version seems like it was packaged there 😅

Also added the European rating

Was seen as okay for 15+ year old teens

[weary palm]

They ban strange things in Germany

[fair stump]

Are pal n64 cases usually all black like that?

[safe robin]

You mean with a black border? Yes

[fair stump]

I like the look but it does make the only for n64 peel kind of not make sense

[fair stump]

Wow I do love that look

[safe robin]

I also got the best Turok Version. with real Robots!

oot has a nice black and gold style

[weary palm]

No gold carts in Eu

That I know of

Kinda wish I saved my boxes. Not that I want them, but people seem to value them.

[safe robin]

But I got one

[weary palm]

Aha?

[prisma ivy]

Ah I remember looking at the box art for Mace The Dark Age as a kid and thinking WOWWW SO COOL

[toxic pumice]

Dark Rift as well

Was saying this in here before though, those games sit just on the right side of jank for me

I absolutely love a brilliant shit game

[safe robin]

My oot also is not gold. I got it on launch day here in Austria. I remember I was so hyped for the game and checked the website if it every day. There was an area where you could explore the castle like a old dungeon crawler by clicking on the left, right or middle part of the picture and you could navigate to the next part of the castle that way

[weary palm]

Yeah, you're right. I forgot that my MM is gold too. xD

[fair stump]

Wow japanese n64 packaging is even more gorgeous. USA really got the short end of the stick

[cerulean elk]

we always did

[prisma ivy]

Japanese box art was always great

[fair stump]

Just look at these 👀

[prisma ivy]

And usually the spines on the box/cd case had the same theme for a pleasant look on a shelf

That F Zero box 🔥

[cerulean elk]

thats just unnatural

[thorn flax]

how can something so wrong feel so right?

[novel junco]

Goofy question, is the stick calibration part of mister main/stable now? Or does it still require mister unstable?

Recently switched to unstable and my retrobit USB n64 pad was TRANSFORMED from an ungodly, sensitive mess to a very capable controller. Just making sure running update_all won't break it 🥹

[thorn flax]

have you setup the samba.sh script?

[languid dune]

Where is the 3D art/sticker!?

[thorn flax]

makes sending files back and forth so much easier

[iron dove]

The range fix / calibration is included in the latest stable main

[novel junco]

Sweet! Good to know thanks! 🙏

[topaz otter]

This is actually a great point, that whole era was full of semi 2d\3d platforming games that felt like they were halfway to being something really great

but either due to technology limitations or the developers not being familiar with 3d hardware they just missed the mark

[devout belfry]

Looooot of 3d platformers with tank controls in that era

[solemn marlin]

Just finished south park rally, just as bad as it ever was 👍

[weary palm]

Why is it called tank controls? Tanks are not controlled like that.

[orchid nimbus]

Tank you 🙂

[tidal zenith]

I think it’s because tanks use two sticks to control

[loud pebble]

Tanks turn slowly in place

[devout belfry]

So tanks are closer to Katamari Damacy than Bubsy 3D

[loud pebble]

Maybe?

[devout belfry]

QED

[solemn marlin]

What's this? It's not running on the core right, it's that doom conversion?

[zinc dew]

Yeah, someone in a magazine called it that erroneously and it spread like wildfire.

[loud pebble]

don't tanks go forward, stop, turn, go forward

[tidal zenith]

https://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3224958/horror-declassified-an-examination-of-tank-controls/

This is why Tank Controls are called what they are. Older style tanks could not change direction freely. They had to stop completely before turning.

[wraith estuary]

tank controls are called that because game developers used to deploy actual mini tanks to help design movement mechanics. They'd place tanks in a room and observe how they navigated. If the tanks could smoothly turn on the spot and move forward and backward, the design was considered perfect for gamers!

[tidal zenith]

TIL

[zinc dew]

tank controls were fine

[orchid nimbus]

no every tread on the tank is controlled separately

[fair stump]

I hear the next doom is exclusively tank controls

[daring meteor]

They're called tank controls because in 1956, Soviets attacked Hungary

[loud pebble]

Goldeneye has a great tank sequence.

[lament escarp]

So whats the plan for the weekend?

[vagrant ivy]

Takeover the world like we do every night

[eternal island]

so many people seem to love the n64 controller and ill never understand. nostalgia can only go so far.. i still don't have the third hand to hold it properly. maybe i havent reached enlightenment yet

or maybe i just need to be so fast i can take up two spaces with one arm at the same time

better get training

[lament escarp]

I never had a n64 as a kid and even I like it. You're not supposed to hold all 3 prongs at once, there are different "stances" to support different kinds of games.

[eternal island]

it was one of my most used... controller batches when i was young, and i hate it lol

i wished there was something else. the amount of joysticks that just kinda.. sat there after a while. could move the controllers and the joysticks would be so loose theyd flop around

im okay with it though. have a spare around here i think. switch one. i can let a buddy use it. he loves them too

whenever someone was better at goldeneye than i was, i gave them the floppy joystick controller to use

my secret strat

too bad i still lost..

[zenith orchid]

I know I'm late to the conversation about pack in games, but I remember being so disappointed the N64 didn't come with SM64 or any game at all. The SNES spoiled me by not only providing SMW, but also a card you can fill out to receive a copy of super mario all-stars in the mail.

[native mesa]

I want that more accurate KF7 Soviet model

[lament escarp]

That sounds really neat!

[lament escarp]

Dang, will I even be allowed to play it on the core?

[zenith orchid]

Yeah, it really sold the idea that Nintendo really has your back. And then the NES coming with SMB/duck hunt with the lightgun included

[stone pilot]

Around that time, though, you started to get more bundles. I think my childhood N64 was bought at Costco or something, in a bundle with SM64

[thorn flax]

https://tenor.com/view/giggle-laughing-gif-20076831

[zenith orchid]

was that later on? I think I got mine close to the original launch date

[stone pilot]

I think usually, yeah

[zenith orchid]

SM64 was basically the only game I owned for the entire time I had the system. I was renting games all the time

[dense wagon]

In the case of the n64 didnt it ship like most do these days, basically you got just the console. but stores did bundle them typically. Everyone i know who initially had N64s in the intial wave basically always had either SM64 or Goldeneye

[zenith orchid]

And there weren't that many exciting options to choose from

[zenith orchid]

for Nintendo that wasn't the norm, so that might be when this started

[dense wagon]

For mine i got mine toward the middle end of its lifetime, the store i got it from bundled it with Golden eye and gaveme a pretty good discount on OoT which was exactly what i wanted so haha

yeah thats a good point i never thought of it that way

all the other systems did come with something to play, in the box

[zenith orchid]

Yeah, I ended up trading my N64 for a refurbished PSX with Wild Arms. I was sooooo much happier.

[dense wagon]

was funny actually when i went up to enquire about the n64 the guy basically was like... oh yeah not sure i can sell it because we dont have SM64 to put with it... and i was like... errrm golden eye an option? and the dudes eyes lit up like... "Oh yeah, i forgot we can bundle it with that"

[zenith orchid]

I really felt Nintendo kinda gypped me. it just wasn't the same value as SNES and NES were at those times

That's kinda hilarious! Getting a pretty violent game bundled in with a Nintendo console

[dense wagon]

haha yeah good point there too

[zenith orchid]

Personally I would've been happy with F-Zero X, but that didn't come out until 1998

when dreamcast was the talk of the town

[fair stump]

Parlor! Pro 64 may be the first console pachinko game I can kind of understand and doesn't look like a mess

[zenith orchid]

Man, to think that even Wii U had a bundled mario game.

[dense wagon]

yeah Wii even had Wii Sports

or Sports resort

[daring meteor]

TIL the SNES SF2 bundle was PAL only

[weary palm]

I own 20-ish N64 games.

[daring meteor]

Also funny it has like 50 box arts

[daring meteor]

Most didn't

[weary palm]

Starfox 2

[zenith orchid]

Ah, yeah I didn't get mine on launch date

[weary palm]

My Wii U came with Nintendoland, or did it? Unsure.

[daring meteor]

(Funnily enough I have the Mario Bundle Wii U too, imported from Canada because it was very cheap there, only 300 CAD I think)

[brisk edge]

Gotta enjoy how stupidly huge the Pokemon Stadium box is.

[zenith orchid]

https://www.raphnet-tech.com/products/dual_n64_to_usb_adapter/index.php
anyone have experience using this on MiSTer?

I'm finally getting tired of using a DS3 controller to play N64 FPS games

and remapping the controller to play THPS

[orchid nimbus]

Brawler64 time!!

[zenith orchid]

I already have 2 original N64 controllers though

I don't start working until next year so my budget is pretty tight

[orchid nimbus]

8bitDo time

[dusty tusk]

Adding additional mapping of c-up and c-right to up and right buttons on a traditional controller, while having B and A on left and bottom buttons, continues to work pretty well for nearly every game I try THPS and Densha de Go in particular.

[zenith orchid]

how does additional or alternate mapping work anyway?

[dusty tusk]

Just press menu button on mappings you want to skip and then when a button comes up that you also want to map somewhere else, you just press the corresponding button

In particular, I've dual mapped Z to the triggers; L to Select/Back; and have done the aforementioned C-mappings

Thinking of mapping c-down to select/back instead as that's used for zooming out camera quite a bit

[zenith orchid]

so does it register both inputs to the key it's mapped to simultaneously?

I guess it's useful for Z and L, since some games use either one or the other

[weary perch]

when i'm not using the saffun i get by pretty well with mapping the 8bitdo ultimate with C left/right on the back buttons and C up/down on the north and east face buttons respectively

[zenith orchid]

but doom64 uses both

[native mesa]

is this blasphemy?

[dusty tusk]

A surprising amount of games uses the up and right c-buttons like up and right buttons on traditional controllers

[zenith orchid]

I would really love it if you could cycle through alt input mappings

[weary perch]

SF Rush drives me nuts... press c-up thinking it's gonna switch up the camera and no, it actually resets your car 😄 😄 😄

[dusty tusk]

That's gotten me into so much trouble in that game

[solemn maple]

What's a good game to play on this core if you just want to kill an hour or so?

[dusty tusk]

DK64 has been my go to kill time game. Just explore and collect stuff

[solemn maple]

Was never too fond of that game as a kid but maybe I'll like it more now 🙂

[tidal zenith]

follow that dolphin!

[solemn maple]

is that a name of a game? 😮

[tidal zenith]

https://tenor.com/view/waverace-nintendo_64-racing-jet-ski-nintendo-gif-23208506

[dusty tusk]

I think he's referring to Wave Race

[native mesa]

A racing game probably

Or Starfox

[fair stump]

Play War Gods

[solemn maple]

Never played Wave Race 🙂

[orchid nimbus]

oh new build

[solemn maple]

liar?!

[orchid nimbus]

didn't catch it yesterday

[fair stump]

[dusty tusk]

Wave Race was all I played back on the Wii

[native mesa]

Something big has to be brewing though right?!

[dusty tusk]

N64 Modem bros, our time will come soon

[eternal ravine]

https://tenor.com/view/poo-song-greatmightypoo-gif-10370893

[weary palm]

Did you use a WaveBird?

[native mesa]

Wave Race was a playable character in smash, you could only wave dash with the wave bird

[weary palm]

True story

[compact skiff]

New build!

[fair stump]

Wtf

[vapid moat]

[fair stump]

@orchid nimbus you wizard

[eternal ravine]

Vampier is reaching for the bog roll

[native mesa]

idk does it go up on git before it's linked here?

I'd like to think he's a wizard

[cerulean elk]

lol of course new core

[fair stump]

Could somebody get a screen of the starcraft menu on real hardware? I'm starting to wonder if their font was just bad

[dusty tusk]

whats up with the rumble pak and controller pak changes?

[solemn maple]

How do you get rumble to work on the NSO controller? I'm on the latest unstable mister build and have the p1 controller set to rumble in the core menu

[orchid nimbus]

turn off all the options and check

[tidal zenith]

you might need the zImage file?

#unstable-nightlies message

[solemn maple]

New core 🙂

[fair stump]

Turned off all VI and filters and it looks like this on the new 10/20 core

[solemn maple]

Where do I put the zImage file?

[dusty tusk]

Looks like 480i only displaying 240 lines

[orchid nimbus]

with

[mellow raft]

https://youtu.be/gFhPP-fpu2E

[fair stump]

Osd says 474i

[orchid nimbus]

@fair stump apperently this is real hardware https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c9Km6vazzCw

[solemn maple]

Thanks for the help, it's working now.

[dusty tusk]

The core doesn't de-interlace right?

I'm pretty sure in video settings you can choose to display the other interlaced lines

[fair stump]

Flipping the swap interlaced option didn't appear to change anything for me

[dusty tusk]

(I don't think the option is functional)

[weary palm]

Lines seems to be missing from the font, though.

[weary perch]

interlaced doesn't seem to work correctly yet, only displays half the fields i think

[wanton sun]

it's vi...

left is without vi, right with

so the framebuffer and interlaced output is fine, it's somehow the line fetching messing it up

at least this has nothing to do with the bugfix today

[fair stump]

Ah ok, I assumed that was part of it

[wanton sun]

no, the background and text starting with x position 512 was wrong

it was wrapped, showing the previous content again

[dusty tusk]

What does "move cpak and rpak to gamepad module" mean?

[wanton sun]

pif no longer handles cpak and rpak internally, but send out data and received data back like real hardware

main reason is that emulated gamepad including paks is now the same as SNAC for pif

[native mesa]

So a real cpak can be used?

Theoretically

[wanton sun]

when SNAC is finished, yes

[orchid nimbus]

\o/

[native mesa]

And TPAK?!

[mortal panther]

2PAK?

[native mesa]

Snac pak

XPAC

[thorn flax]

so some of the temporary hacks that held the core togrther were removed for the real deal

[wanton sun]

in theory: when one pak works with snac, all should work

[cerulean elk]

Proton Pak?

MiSTer collects ghosts?

[mortal panther]

"I don't do hacks! That's not my style!
...but yes." 🤣

[native mesa]

It's more of a reimagining

[fair stump]

So that peach fade out should work now?

[desert crow]

Nice, I'm excited about the new build. Thanks FPGAzumSpass!

[mortal panther]

or the teleport spots?

[zinc dew]

I'm excited you're excited!!

that's not sarcasm, genuinely excited for this lol

[native mesa]

I'm excited that you're excited that he's excited

[dusty tusk]

great time for dither fans

we're really moving up in the world

[prisma ivy]

Dither shmither

[dusty tusk]

gameshark cheats rely purely on ram right?

[native mesa]

Does the random noise effect all dithering?

[waxen bear]

I know it's a small thing but so cool to see Mario warp effect working now 🙂

[thorn flax]

by jove you were right

[thorn flax]

"it's a me || ||"

[dusty tusk]

charles martinet as mario is so nostalgic now

[quaint pewter]

Thabeast721 uses real hardware doesn't he? He just uploaded his Starcraft playthrough today.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2QAAWQMNuA

[fair stump]

Looks like Robert is aware of what's happening #1096015979055697940 message

[quaint pewter]

Nice. Just trying to catch up, and missed the line under his pics.

[zenith orchid]

not convinced. update your profile pic to reflect that 😂

[zinc dew]

I have StarCraft 64, what do you want me to confirm

[zenith orchid]

I wonder if the core can handle a massive zerg rush

[fair stump]

We need you to beat the whole game

[zinc dew]

lol noooo

[quaint pewter]

In thabs playthrough it ended up being 70+ hours. Is it the longest N64 game?

[dusty tusk]

I'm trying to think of any other games that had transparency effects that could have been broken until now

[weary beacon]

If Castlevania COULD boot, it's various dither dissolves wouldn't have worked until now

[toxic pumice]

Cool, Starcraft 64 fix. 🙂

[brisk edge]

it's definitely up there, Ogre Battle 64 would probably also be close

you know what, I'd say probably Super Robot Wars 64 if you want to do all routes with the different protagonists. Granted, it's not translated, but it's quite a long strategy rpg. There's branching paths, and at least 55 missions

[solemn marlin]

https://youtu.be/P0jSs8J3goU?si=HH3gbtj-RAdGyWQ2
Knew it was robo blast, just with a low poly mode 😏

[thorn flax]

but it isnt

good guess tho

[zenith orchid]

So the SM64 teleport effect is correct now?

[wanton sun]

here is what starcraft interlaced does: it renders to two framebuffers and displays from the alternating. However, both contain the full image and are read out for lines 0,2,4,..., which are sent to the screen. So they are doubled. If I patch the second frame to be output with 1 line offset it works. However, the game does not set any of the possibilities to do that offset and i don't know why. Could be a bug in the core or i don't fully understand interlaced output

[languid dune]

Dang it Robert! Another new build while I'm currently hooked on Super Mario Bros. Wonder!? Don't make me choose!

[zenith orchid]

Hey its not going anywhere 😄

[languid dune]

What exactly does the cpak and rpak change do?

[zenith orchid]

one saves and the other rumbles

ohh the change

[wanton sun]

who needs old 2D games when you can have 3D, it's easy to choose 😛

[dusty tusk]

Maybe the offset is default behavior?

[solemn marlin]

Sonic jam, damn they should've made the whole game look like that, so fresh

Instead of it being a glorified menu, it seems

Sorry nvm, had to know what it was, the n64 controller was a red herring smh

[wanton sun]

found it: in project64 starcraft changes the starting line, in my emu and the core not. Need to find out why

works now in my emulator, hopefully i can fix that also in the core tomorrow

reason is this: https://github.com/RobertPeip/Mister64/blob/main/rtl/VI_videoout.vhd#L217

[simple olive]

VI_CURRENT <= videoout_reports.VI_CURRENT & '0'; -- todo: need to find when interlace sets bit 0, can't be instant, otherwise Kroms CPU tests would hang in infinite loop