Atari Jaguar

[warm oasis]

So do we not have a specific 020?

[fossil lintel]

mame sources just speak of 68000 (p12)

and those I would trust more than random ai

[dreamy hinge]

the only 020 we have is tg68k which 'does not value cycle accuracy'. I don't know how good/bad it is though. seems ok in amiga/macplus/gauntlet/CD-i. although I suspect the computer cores are a bit more tolerant of any timing incorrectness there

[warm oasis]

Hmm, what does CDi use it for...

[dreamy hinge]

the cd-i cpu is a variant of the 68k

[warm oasis]

Ah well, sounds like it may not be as simple as reusing what we have, that is a shame

I was thinking, this conversation feels familiar, and we basically had it a few days ago. The heat is getting to me. 🙂

#1345451572368244827 message

switchable 68K CPU-Core

The TG68K.C is an IP core for FPGAs. It can be easily switched between a 68000, a 68010 and a 68020. There are now many projects in the retro computer area that use this core. There was a lot of feedback from this area. So the core could develop very well. Many bugs could also be eliminated. The core does not value cycle accuracy. The core saves the FPGA resources with a good execution speed

[thorny swift]

yes its still here

[mental briar]

Ash was futzing with it iirc

[gentle bobcat]

I tested the single-RAM core (dated 7-30) with my Multisystem 1... and it DOES appear that the audio channels are reversed for Audio CDs anyway. I used a stereo test CD and left was right and right was left. ALL of the JagCD games worked fine for me... although the first time I tried to load Dragon's Lair and Primal Rage, I got a CD with a ? on it. After playing other games and coming back to those, they loaded and worked fine... although I don't know what buttons to hit on Dragon's Lair nor Space Ace and just die over and over. I guess I should take a look at the fine manuals.

Not sure why some folks are having issues with both the dual-RAM and the single-RAM core with crashing games. I assume they have verified .cdi files but who knows. What's Ken Making did a parts overview for the Multisystem 2 (no, I don't have one of those yet) and he noticed that they put faster RAM chips on the board... and when he tested the RAM speed, he got a reliable 150MHz. I should test my Multisystem 1 and see what I get.

[warm oasis]

Great work checking that audio channels on the core, hopefully an easy fix for GR.

If you are into the audio CD side and interested in kicking the tires on the other CD cores, might be worth checking the other ones and see if the channels are all fine on them. It is likely some of them haven't been closely looked at.

[gentle bobcat]

I haven't used any audio CDs on any other cores. I wonder what format the media has to be in? I did see AWBacon have a video showing off several audio CDs and the audio players that come up. I remember seeing Playstation, MegaCD and TurboDuo... but maybe he was showing some footage from Taki Udon on the SSO? Of course, he didn't test the sound channels.

Ok, my RAM reliably runs at 141MHz on the Multisystem 1.

I did have to play Tempest 2000 unto the later 20 stages.... but quit early... before all of my ships were gone. I do have to admit, that T2k is a little more sluggish on the single-RAM core. Seems like there are more sound dropouts too but I could have imagined those.

[small charm]

We didn't fork anything, so there's nothing to upstream right now.

[gentle bobcat]

Now I'd love to see, the making of... documentary. 🙂

[small charm]

You can read the disk, dump the disk, or play a matching copy on local storage based on the inserted disk.

[small charm]

Basically, we finished the dumping/linking to local files first. Then, we started doing reading live from disk without forking. That is also done at this point. It works amazingly for most PS1 titles, due in large part to work Robert already added to the core a long time ago. It runs even better on other CD systems. Mega CD, Saturn, and PCE CD are great (I haven't tried Jaguar). The best overall would be to add CD support directly into the OS. It would be indistinguishable from an SD card based on preliminary test.

[warm oasis]

Well if it works well then hats off to you, that's really impressive. I didn't think that it would be possible to stably play games off a disc.

[small charm]

I didn't either based on everything I read and I was told prior to trying to do it.

[gentle bobcat]

How'z 'bout this here Jaguar core? (Trying my best not to act like an entitled brat.)

[small charm]

I need to buy Jaguar games to try

[ashen spoke]

I’m so sorry

[gentle bobcat]

There was a dude on eBay trying to sell his massive Jaguar CD collection for $19,000.00. (not joking).

[ashen spoke]

oh wow

Is there even a cheap Jaguar CD game? lol

[dreamy hinge]

every time I look at just making main fake a cdi from bin/cue/chd all the cdi code on the internet makes my head hurt

[gentle bobcat]

I was looking on eBay just now to see if I could find that insanely overpriced collection... but that was some time ago... and no. Anyhoo, I saw dozens of games I had never even heard of before.

[mental briar]

does the jag cd have copy protection? couldn’t you just burn one?

[gentle bobcat]

Songbird Productions has some new stock since they have been doing reproductions. I'd send you some but I don't have any CDs anymore, just carts.

[ashen spoke]

Oh yeah that’s right

[small charm]

I can’t even find them in China

[gentle bobcat]

You can fake it a little by using audio CDs and the VLM. Hey, that's what mainly butters my toast.

[small charm]

Does Jag have an audio player like SS?

[gentle bobcat]

The VLM... VIrtual Light Machine, written by Jeff Minter.

Search for "MiSTer VLM" on YouTube and you'll find an example of the VLM in Jaguar core.

Search for "JagCD cdi audio" on an archive site and there are some samples from Jaguar games.

[gentle bobcat]

Minter later made a VLM for the Nuon and much later... the built-in audio player on the Xbox 360.

(me drifts off to sleep)

[tropic rock]

I believe burnt CDs should work. The only copy protection is to prevent changing code (in session 2). Copies should work fine. Jaguar game CDs are just 2 session audio CDs. Note that the core currently requires cdi format or my custom cue.bin file to describe the table of contents of both audio and game CDs. If that info is provided, everything else is just seeking to the correct place on te CD and streaming the data.

[dreamy hinge]

have I just missed any documentation of the cdi metadata format(s) or is it really 'just look at these tools written in 2008'?

[tropic rock]

If timing does not match, issues may show up. My code is not very tolerant of timing changes in addition to assumptions made by game developers.

[tropic rock]

The only info I have on Disc Juggler cdi format is from the code here: https://github.com/jozip/cdirip/tree/master

You can see my read handler code here: https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Jaguar_MiSTer/blob/master/Jaguar.sv#L1071

[lyric pelican]

if (cd_state == 4'hF) begin // cache (header size - 1)

[tropic rock]

My cue.bin format is described here (with a picture in the post above): #1055574003810578503 message

[dreamy hinge]

probably wouldn't be too hard to fake it on the main side to do cue/bin->"cdi" into the core. although it always weirds me out the "support" for sessions in cue files is via comments

[tropic rock]

It is because cue files do not have a keyword for sessions defined. Specifying it with one will break parsers that follow the standards.

[small charm]

If so, then this should work reading from a physical disk.

[dreamy hinge]

the only annoying wrinkle with it now is that you have to proxy the reads because you have to return cdi metadata inline with data

[small charm]

Native .cue would be best, followed by native CD.

For Jaguar, native CD probably won't be faster/better though.

[tropic rock]

This converts bin/cue ripped with brasero to cdi format if helpful.

#1055574003810578503 message

[queen tendon]

I ordered a SuperStation and am excited to receive it. Do you foresee a revised dual ram capable version for the line?

[small charm]

I don't think so. More than half the console is dedicated/wired to the GPIO pins that would be used in dual SDRAM.

[queen tendon]

Thanks for the insight Taki! Hopefully Jag and Saturn will be solid on single and/or on par with the dual cores down the line. ✌️ - Appreciate your dedication to the community and the gigantic contributions you have delivered.

[small charm]

Thanks

[midnight robin]

I don't know about Jag, but Saturn core will always need dual SRAM due to it's architecture, it was said by srg320 time ago, there's no way around it except the "fast timmings" hack that breaks other things.

[queen tendon]

Well, I’m glad I have a standard DR setup as well. I could not help myself and ordered the SuperStation. I’m sure it will be awesome in its own right.

[midnight robin]

I would order the SuperStation myself except for the lack of DualRAM 🙁

[gentle bobcat]

My two dual-ram builds are MiSTer Pis.

[sacred blade]

With Netlists from the OG hardware involved, does this core have the potential to be among the most accurate cores?

I understand that the Mega Drive core might be the most accurate core because it is Netlist based. And Neo Geo is the next best thing because at least any (?) chip is supposed to be reverse engineered by Furrtek.

Can Jaguar be close to those in terms of accuracy?

[gentle bobcat]

I'm not sure how one, as a user like myself (aka NOT a dev), would determine which core is the most accurate. It is like asking which diamond in a pile of diamonds is the hardest. They are all pretty darn hard.

Compared to the BigPEmu emulator, which I don't think aims to be cycle accurate, I would imagine the Jaguar core, on a dual -RAM setup at least, is more accurate.

[warm oasis]

I don't think anyone made any tests for Jaguar either, so it isn't like other systems where you can compare test results

[gentle bobcat]

I would assume the DE10-Nano hardware has some speed limitations compared to the Jaguar hardware... where they decided to use dual-RAM in an attempt to overcome. If the MiSTer Project someday adopts the DE25-Nano (if they ever release one) that has DDR4 rather than DDR3.... that might allow them to simplify or eliminate the dual-RAM scheme. Note that I'm just imagining all that as I'm not educated on the fine details.

[tropic rock]

I gave my assessment of the accuracy of the dual ram core on the forum. https://misterfpga.org/viewtopic.php?p=99919#p99919

At this point I expect the dual Ram core to be extremely accurate. It is to the point where only very small inaccuracies remain. For an example, see here https://forums.atariage.com/topic/377653-scoreboard-mysteries/. This discrepancy is likely due to trace length or some unexpected analog effect (in what should be a digital section). In the netlists, two different outcomes are being expected at the same time, so the outcome is indeterminate from a digital design (it is writing two different values to the same register at the same clock on a dual port register).
It is also important to note there are more than one hardware version of the Jaguar. The core is based on a set of netlists that may be different than any of the existing hardware revisions.
The possibility for errors still exists, but the core is in a very good state.
The above only applies to the Jaguar itself. The CD code is not based on netlists and is much less accurate. I produced it from trying to understand assembly code, comments in source code and best guesses. I do not have any actual hardware so it is all based on a best guess functional recreation. Timing (especially seek timing) is likely to be off. That said, I have tried to recreate register interfaces as they exist and have implemented both single and dual rates to match theoretical speeds fairly closely https://github.com/greyrogue/Jaguar_MiSTer/blob/b73768335b936ccfb6b597f18eab3351c2fb812e/rtl/Rework/butch_i2s.v#L144 . Should be within 0.001 of 9.279 for dual.

Note that one speed test was written by CJReboot who wrote the recently released Jumping at Shadows homebrew among others and several tools/programming aids for the Jaguar). This test returns almost identical results to real hardware. Granted it is only one test

Because the actual netlists are being used, the core should be farily accurate. It uses the data bus exactly like real hardware so contention and timing for using the bus for ram, carts and BIOS should all be accurate including waiting for RAM refresh cycles like the console RAM needs to do.

[tropic rock]

Meeting RAM timing has not yet been ruled out for single RAM. It is just at the bottom of my list to attempt.

[warm oasis]

Great work! If you had access to an actual Jag CD would it be helpful?

[tropic rock]

I am not sure what I would do with it at this point

[glad dome]

What is missing for the core to be available as a stable release? Meaning using update all.

[tropic rock]

Hard to say. It could probably go right now, but it is tempting to hold off until single ram is more stable. I have boot rom loading working, but I wanted to move it to DDRAM so it can be reloaded if overwritten by a large cart. Memtrack not working is also not ideal. Basically it can be done at any time, even though my TODO is still in progress. See the bottom of https://github.com/MiSTer-devel/Jaguar_MiSTer/blob/master/README.md

[warm oasis]

It would definitely be good to get the boot.rom for CD finalised before going live, so that can be auto set up for people. Any more thoughts is bin/cue and CHD will be possible?

[tropic rock]

I am unlikely to do them myself. They would require some changes in Main.

[mental briar]

I think zakk was looking at it

[warm oasis]

I see CD+G in the list, now that is in Mega CD and PCE is it easy to port over?

[dreamy hinge]

technically chd can't be used for this core. chd doesn't retain session info

it probably wouldn't be too hard to create mister specific metadata to make it work, but it's so few discs it doesn't seem worth it

[ashen spoke]

I am in full agreement but it is inconsistent with every other disc based core now. Preferably CHD is still supported so people arent confused.

Easy for me to say since I don’t have to do the work of course

[half cove]

I've stopped compressing the images to CHD

[karmic spire]

for which reason?

[sacred blade]

I guess that all upcoming Multisystem2 and Taki Superstation users will be single RAM only without being able to upgrade, so a certain demand is certainly there and any work on that front will be very welcome.

[half cove]

Main reason was the whole index issue with some games. On the Saturn core.

[sacred blade]

There were issues with the PC Engine CD games as well on the Analogue Pocket

[dreamy hinge]

if you still want to save space the list of "index 02" games is well known and you can just not compress those

[mental briar]

The saturn core is the only one that is affected

None of the other cores know that index 02 exists

[karmic spire]

By the way here's some stats i made about how much Redump cd games have more than 02 indexes:
#1103404843512631357 message

[dreamy hinge]

I'd be interested in real hardware tests on the megacd with the few games that have those indexes

just because they exist doesn't mean the game uses it

it could just be some weird "we put an index marker here so you can skip to here in an audio player"

[half cove]

Saturn's KOF 96 uses it to play the music from the middle between rounds.

Or the game software itself do it, can't recall. Sorry for derailing the channel.

Any Jaguar CD game worth getting?

[south canyon]

Hi all, testing the Jaguar core (Jaguar_ReworkSingle_20250730.rbf) on a MiSTer Pi default setup. CD .cdi games boot fine, but cartridge games (No-Intro .rom set) won’t get past the BIOS — I just see the Jaguar cube and then it resets. BIOS is boot.rom, and I’ve tried with the checksum patch option enabled. Am I missing a setting, or is cart support still limited in this build?

My boot.rom crc32 is fb731aaa

[mental briar]

I would check your jag roms.

the boot rom comes down with update all's bios database

[south canyon]

So you recommend the jag roms?

[mental briar]

I think you want .j64 roms. lemme look what mine are

yeah. j64

[south canyon]

ok tanks i will try some j64 roms then

[mental briar]

This is a known good bios: #1055574003810578503 message

[south canyon]

ok will try the bios too

[ashen spoke]

For comparison I only had four games across every disc based console that had index02.

If you don’t need to compress then don’t, it is awesome to have that much free space. But if you do need to compress (like me) there is absolutely zero negative repercussions. Just check the handful of games on the Saturn core tha have an index02 and don’t compress those and you’re good!

Here is that list - #1046941029296779344 message

for me Dark Legend and Dark Saviour were the only ones I cared about on Saturn. The other two were on the upcoming 3DO core (yes I already have a library waiting lol).

[south canyon]

weird not work neither with j64 and with normal or good bios

[gentle bobcat]

@south canyon - What is it doing? You get a red Jaguar screen or what?

For cart games, make sure you disable the CD related settings.

[ashen spoke]

Someone tell me if this is cool - https://forums.atariage.com/topic/382321-math-crunchers/

Also I don’t know if its using assets that belong to a commercially sold game

[gentle bobcat]

Doesn't look like it uses any commercial assets to me as it is pretty basic. Just some lines, numbers and a jaguar square face. The music is also very basic... with a single repeating song. It appears to challenge one on the multiplications table from 2 to 9.

[ashen spoke]

Damn, well thanks for trying it

[uncut atlas]

it would be nice to cleanup to the codebase and get rid of all the old/dead code floating around and clean up the file organization

@tropic rock did you ever figure out the eeprom anomaly on the bus? That was perplexing

ie why eeprom on the schematic uses the ebus but it doesnt make logical sense or work

[south canyon]

Yes i get a red Jaguar screen and get stick there. I will disable the CD related settings later, thank you for the feedback

[gentle bobcat]

@south canyon - If you have the CD settings on, then it'll keep a cart from doing anything... I'm pretty sure. At work at the moment and can't double-check.

Hopefully they'll fix that where selecting a cartridge changing any needed settings, or loading a CD changes any needed settings... but thus far... it is a fairly manual process.

[warm oasis]

Sounds like GR is almost done getting the auto selecting console/CD BIOS so when that comes in it will be much more streamlined for people

[outer veldt]

Definitely some people must have had a secret 'behind the scenes' option to preorder before the rest of us. It's disingenuous crap like that that makes me want to never deal with these people again.

[ashen spoke]

I feel your frustation and I'm sorry. I am in no way affiliated with them but that kind of thing happens for literally every product out there.

[south canyon]

Yes that worked i unable Quick CD and Cd enabled options and now the cartridges work with no issue. Thanks for the feedback i do not think have that options activated could have an effect in roms carts loadng. Hopefully with new updates they make things more straightforward so you can load cartridgs and CD more easily.

[gentle bobcat]

@outer veldt - I ordered on the 5th (the day before the public opening) because the Heber guy responded to a YouTube comment I made on their video... where I said I was so impressed, I'll take one of everything... and he gave an order-now link. I think I waited a day or two as I needed to contact my bank to allow a UK purchase on my debit card... and I'd expect others used that link also... and that probably wasn't the only place that link might have been shared.

Heber had a Bluesky (or whatever it is) post that showed the processing levels. The order number started with 6000... and the first level they are working on is from 6000-6500. I'm in the second level from 6501-7000... which is the same range I think you said you were in. Point being, there were 845 orders ahead of me... and I think about 1,000 or so ahead of you. There were later levels for an additional 1,500 or so. I wonder how long it'll take before that 846th one gets shipped? 🙂

https://bsky.app/profile/heber-limited.bsky.social/post/3lwoo72lsvc2v

Heber Ltd. (@heber-limited.bsky.social)

Thank you for your amazing support and enthusiasm for the Multisystem2. We know lots of you are keen to know when to expect your order. We’ve created some levels (because you know, it’s a games console!) to help give you an idea of where your order is in the shipping process.

Bluesky · Aug 18, 2025, 3:03 PM

[outer veldt]

Great so despite ordering 2 minutes in I'm in the third group. I am asking these people why we were never informed of an 'order now' link. This is the kind of BS that makes me want to cancel. Thank you for sharing the information.

[gentle bobcat]

Ah, I know you feel frustration... but really... they are doing the best they can. Nothing you say now is going to make anything happen faster... so why waste your time? I feel your pain. 🙂

I think at that point they really had no clue how many orders they might get and were just trying to send out some early feelers... but I am generally an apologist.

[outer veldt]

It isn't about doing the best they can though. When they secretly allow some people to order early to be first in the queue, that is intentionally dishonest. I'm the opposite of an apologist, I'm a wise consumer. I hold people to the standards that they claim to be working to.

[unborn steeple]

If they didn't make them at all, would you be happier?

[mental briar]

I think you might just be lacking empathy, and assume that because you have paid for something you can make demands of it

I am not happy with some of the stuff they are doing either, but I understand that this is likely a much more popular product than they were anticipating and are now scrambling to meet the increased demand

I say this genuinely trying to save you heartache: if you're upset now, I would recommend you cancel your preorder. It is going to take a while before things stabilize, and it will likely get worse before it gets better.

[gentle bobcat]

But it wasn't "secret", it was in public.

[dusk slate]

[outer veldt]

It isn't anything to do with lacking empathy or making demands, you don't know anything about me. I followed the project from the beginning and was told that preorders would begin on a specific date and a specific time. I don't appreciate being misled. That is the wrong way to conduct business with me and no other consumer should tolerate that either.

[mental briar]

like I said, I think you probably should save yourself some heartache. wait for them to become generally available

[dusk slate]

That's what I did with the Analogue Pocket. Just waited for general availability. Placed an order when they were in stock and it shipped like a day later.

[outer veldt]

Thank you for your advice. You have convinced me. I'm going to cancel

[uncut atlas]

what is multisystem2 and why is it in this channel?

[gentle bobcat]

Fair and balanced... as we have been also mentioning... the SuperStation One and it's ability to run directly from CD. Oh, what's the SSO and why is it in this channel? COUGH

I plead the fifth your honor.

[ashen spoke]

do you pronounce it JAGWHAR or JAGYOUARE

[mental briar]

JAGYOUARE on the streets. JAGWHAR in the sheets

[near aurora]

jah guar

[dusk slate]

Jag wire!

[outer veldt]

No it wasn't. If it was public knowledge that you could leap to the front of the queue instead of waiting for the preorders to officially start, everybody would have done that.

[frosty oracle]

I pronounce it like Jeremy Clarkson. "It's a jaaaaaaag"

https://tenor.com/view/top-gear-jeremy-clarkson-james-may-richard-hammond-jag-gif-21660022

[ashen spoke]

When you play Jaguar are you Jagging?

[frosty oracle]

Depends on the game I reckon. Do I want a quick Jag or a jaaaaaaaag

I think I own 3 games for the jag

Doom, AvP and that flying one

[ashen spoke]

do you actually own Jaggorinos (games for the Jaguar)

[frosty oracle]

Oh of course. In my cupboard I own the complete NTSC U collection. Id take a photo and show you but I've lost my key to the cupboard

[ashen spoke]

Damn well I beleive you

ur mah boo

[gentle bobcat]

The MakerSpace where I work printed for me the two side flaps and the cart flap in red... for the Jaguar (pronounced Jagwar like Jag-Far) theme I wanted. The UK place would have been ~$23-ish bucks without shipping. This was $4.65. I'll take a picture when I get a chance.

[uncut atlas]

in new york we say Jaygwah

[rain sierra]

Nice cuppa CAWFEE in the Jaygwah.

[outer veldt]

The Japanese say Jagaa

[carmine wedge]

Tobey Jaguire

[south locust]

I say Jaguar /Khagwar/ in spanish... the ugliest console in the world, but it has Tempest 2000... It makes me to respect it.

[outer veldt]

Jagwire wins for being the weirdest

[south locust]

if the core runs TEMPEST 2000 is enough for me... 🤣

[outer veldt]

It runs runs Jagaa CD. I am playing vidgrid

Saying it twice like a cd rom rom

[dusk slate]

Damn Jag, you are the hippest cat I ever did see.

[outer veldt]

As Marc Bolan would say: all you cats

[outer veldt]

challenged my refund for ass kissing new metadopey console.

[outer veldt]

Dowdle. just bumped you up a slot.

[gentle bobcat]

Thag you berly buch.

(in voice of Cerebus the Ardvark with a cold)

[gentle bobcat]

At the risk of being off-topic yet again... supposedly the "De Minimus Loophole" ends tomorrow and a number of nations, including the UK have announced they are temporarily suspending shipments to the United States... mainly because they don't have the process of how to handle tariffs for deliveries that haven't had them for almost 100 years. And my Multisystem should be shipping any day now... or not? 🙁 If anyone knows anything about the situation, please share... even if that means in a direct message if our friend Kitrinx puts the topic hammer down.

[mental briar]

i think the royale mail is going to have something set up by the end of next week. I ordered an RGB card for a CRT from a british shop and that's what they told me. They also said that UPS and Fedex should be fine

but we should really talk about the multisystem in #fpga-platforms

[gentle bobcat]

Thanks for the suggestion.

[uncut atlas]

I mean, you're welcome to talk about this.. but why in this channel? we have general chat and off topic channels

[gentle bobcat]

@uncut atlas -I guess I'm just bad at Discord... and don't routinely check out a lot of different channels and would miss any responses where the sender didn't @ me.

I'm usually parked right here.

[rain sierra]

Dowdle would have to leave Jaguar thread which would leave it frightened and vulnerable without its protector.

[serene widget]

https://youtu.be/qO0r2ETPD3s

[gentle bobcat]

Wow, I thought the video was going to be about something completely different... like save as in preservation in FPGA... but this is another one of those... how hind-sight is 20-20 type videos on what different steps or changes Atari could have done and succeeded rather than failed. I'm not a big fan of those, and I've seen a few, even for the Atari Jaguar. I do like Sega Lord X's content 99.9% of the time so maybe I need to give this one more of a chance rather than stopping after realizing the meaning of save.

[gentle bobcat]

I think the video totally misunderstands the 64-bit claim of the Jaguar... which seems to be the norm these days.

[uncut atlas]

that video is about as good as you'd expect from someone who calls themselves "sega lord x"

[mental briar]

sega lord 9 was taken

[gentle bobcat]

Pish posh.

At least he wasn't Sega Lord 69.

I'd guess it was probably some handle he came up with when he was 10 years old.

[dusk slate]

Can't hate someone who uses music from the Genesis Batman game as their theme song.

[ashen spoke]

Sega Lord X is fine, average stuff

He gets a lot wrong and has bad takes but he does a decent enough job with presentation and clearly passionate about Sega

[rain sierra]

I would hope Sega’s lord would be passionate.

[outer veldt]

I love how he has a presenter voice while putting down Sega games: "Playing this game more than once, is like getting kicked in the nuts, then immediately asking for another kick in the nuts"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atvyaN-a7no&ab_channel=RedCowArcade

[grizzled bloom]

Sega Lord X is funny af, I used to watch him in the background a lot, his videos are not great. However he has a lot of weird anecdotes and puzzling metaphors he always uses that crack me up. That and his weird staccato YouTube voice…

[grizzled bloom]

He’ll also always brings up like random games like Joe Montana’s Football or whatever as the thing that saved the Genesis or doomed the Saturn etc etc

“If only the Saturn had its own version of Joe Montana’s barbecue beach party, then perhaps we’d all be sipping martinis and playing the Saturn 5 right now”

[scenic briar]

I stopped trying to watch his videos when he spent 7 minutes comparing console sizes on a console review. I gave up.

[dense ravine]

The bigger the console, the better, right?

I’ve heard women really love a guy with a big console

[outer veldt]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qO0r2ETPD3s&ab_channel=SegaLordX Let's save the Atari Jagwire!

[gentle bobcat]

We already talked about that above.

[mental briar]

Please, Sega Lord X was my father, call me 11

[dusk slate]

I refuse. You will be Sega Lord XI instead.

[mental briar]

Please, XI Jinping was my father, call me winnie the tooh

[tall sequoia]

So I finally also got a NTT controller (for 3 Euro from Yahoo 😛 ) - my plan was to use it on the Jaguar core but my SNES to USB adapter does not support the additional buttons of the NTT controller 🙁 . With the SNES to SNAC adapter the additional buttons do work BUT the Jaguar core has no SNAC / NTT controller option 🙁 . Would it be possible to add a NTT controller option to the Jaguar core ? @mental briar @tropic rock @warm oasis Or how do you use / connect the NTT controller to the Mister that the additional buttons work in the Jaguar core ?

[ashen spoke]

SNAC is to read the original controllers. Hopefully at some point SNAC will be added to the core but don’t expect NTT support unless it works natively. I.E. someone made a SNES TO Jaguar adapter,

Right now the best method is to use an original Jaguar controller with the Reflex adapter.

But maybe someone does have the NTT controller working via USB so it’s a great question to ask. I’ll pin it too.

[tall sequoia]

Reflex box 50 bucks, Jaguar cable 10 bucks, shipping to Germany = 30 bucks, customs = around 20 bucks, OG Jaguar controller = 70 bucks. 180 bucks total to using the OG Jaguar controller = no way in hell. How I just wish somebody would build those damn Jaguar to USB adapters and sell them 🙂 .

[radiant cradle]

reflex can be used for many things tho

[ashen spoke]

Yeah, everyone’s situation is different and I appreciate you using USD to better illustrate your example. A Jaguar controller only cost me $50 USD for example.

[tall sequoia]

That's a good question if a SNES to USB adapter exists that does support all NTT controller buttons.

[ashen spoke]

I’m hoping someone knows of a solution for you.

Or alternatively if there’s a USB controller with a numeric keypad built-in. It would be wonderful if there was a solution for people that didn’t require the purchase of an adapter or SNAC.

[radiant cradle]

of course 180 dollars for a jaguar controller is only 2.82 dollars per BIT of amazing gameplay on jaguire

[frosty oracle]

You are correct. I have a timville 4daptor. Which i believe is based on Reflex so its that 1ms latency. But the 4daptor supports 4 controller ports. Atari/Sega, N64, NES and SNES. That cost me £20 shipped to me.

I got it initally for the SNES port so i could use my SN30.

[ashen spoke]

Side note but I love the name Timville. It sounds like an Animal Crossing town name to me lol.

[rain sierra]

Daemonbyte

The OG MiSTer USB controller adapter fully supports the NTT data pad.

If you’re handy you can assemble one for like $5 or $10 depending on what you have laying around.

[ashen spoke]

Hooray!

[spiral spoke]

I was just searching for the github https://github.com/MickGyver/DaemonBite-Retro-Controllers-USB/tree/master/SNESNTTControllersUSB

It is easy to build and cheap. I think i will buy a Xbox controller chatpad for the computer cores but also for the jaguar core.

[rain sierra]

They can be assembled dirty cheap if you don’t care about appearance.

[ashen spoke]

Probably some 3d printed cases for it available?

[rain sierra]

Probably by now. I bet there are a bunch of pro micro cases that can be printed.

[sterile moss]

the triple controller/4dapter are daemonbite based and support the NTT pad

[rain sierra]

There’s even a Jag Daemonbyte 😁

[sterile moss]

had to update the FW on my old triple controller, works well after that

[rain sierra]

Yeah, Tim’s 3dapter and 4dapter are a branch of Mick’s Daeomonbyte.

I miss Mick. He was a good fella

[mental briar]

I know for sure that pork’s adapt and boot’s rp32 support the ntt as well. Not sure how helpful that is but here we are

[rain sierra]

Yup. Lots of options.

Well, two lol

[ashen spoke]

Two is better than none!

[sterile moss]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuzC_hjWU5Y

[gentle bobcat]

I just use the Reflex Adapt with an adapter for the original Jaguar controller and an original Jaguar controller. That NTT controller is for people who don't like the Jaguar controller. I'm not aware of any other console where people are recommending not to use the original controller and use a different one instead... but there you go.

It can be a pricey setup... but it can also work with "the PC" and other adapters for other consoles.

[tall sequoia]

So this one would work with the NTT ? https://ultimatemister.com/product/ultimate-triple-core-sega-nes-snes

[tall sequoia]

An OG Jaguar controller costs between 60 - 90 Euro here in Germany. That's why 😉 .

[gentle bobcat]

I bought two new-old-stock Jaguar controllers off of eBay for $50 each right at the tail end of when they were plentiful. Some of the higher end controllers for contemporary consoles are going for > $100. I don't see how people afford them.

[tall sequoia]

I'm in the boat = I dont spend more than 20 Euro max for a controller 😉

[warm oasis]

I do hope someone someday will come up will an easy way to use a regular controller and map number keys for systems that had them built in to a number pad on a keyboard. I even bought a dedicated number pad awhile back when I wrongly thought you could do this already.

I know there is some esoteric way to do it with an ini file, but a clean, simple way to map this would be great for systems like Jaguar

[rain sierra]

NTT has the benefit of shoulders for strafing without spending $500 on a Jag pro controller too.

[gentle bobcat]

It would also be nice if someone would come out with a new batch of reproduction Jaguar controllers at a budget price.

[rain sierra]

That would be amazing.

How long ago was that reissue from that dude on the Atari forums?

I would imagine he’s still tooled up

[tall sequoia]

I mean Atari makes 7 different colored 2600 controllers for the Atari 2600+, they could do a new Jaguar USB controller easily.

[gentle bobcat]

I also got a repro Atari Jag Pro controller at the tail end of their availability from AtariAge for $60. I don't like the dpad on it... which is why I ended up buying the new-old-stock Jag controllers after that.

I also have an original Jaguar so mutiple uses for that stuff for me.

[rain sierra]

2600 has more endearment and nostalgia with the demographic that has the money to spend on such novelties. Jag is sort of seen as a wart lol .

[rain sierra]

This is good to know. Of your NOS pads do they have black or grey membranes?

[gentle bobcat]

Yeah, I do find it annoying how the modern Atari has shown the Jag no love except for whatever role they might have played with the company that came out with the Atari 50 collection and the Jaguar software-based emulator it encludes, which was the basis for BigPEmu. The obvious reason is userbase size. The 2600 had tens if not hundreds of millions of users and the Jaguar had about ~250K at best.

Black buttons.

There have been about two dozen 2600 clone systems released that have had authorized Atari branding.

The pricing on the newest 2600 colored wireless controllers is $40.

https://atari.com/products/pac-man-cx40-joystick-rede (example)

[sterile moss]

Should do, ask them to confirm.
Depends on the firmware if all the NTT pad buttons work

[ashen spoke]

I bought their repro CX40 and it was basically identical to the original ones so they make good stuff.

[gentle bobcat]

I have a VCS (their modern-ish mini-PC based console) sitting in a drawer that I've not been able to use because it refuses to connect to my wifi... which is the default provided by Spectrum... and widely deployed.

I've tried to use various Linux distros on it (the VCS) but none seem to be stable on that very unique hardware combination.

[tall sequoia]

How do you do that ? Just connect the adapter to the PC over USB and put the other firmware file on to the adapter ?

[frosty oracle]

What is ntt?

[sterile moss]

The daemonbite adapters are all Arduino based.
I use an older version of https://github.com/timville85/4dapter
Id assume the one you linked supports NTT but check with the seller

[frosty oracle]

I also don't know what controller to use for the Jag core. I do have a Jag controller.

I do also have the 4daptor (which I think is the same as the triple controller but with the added N64 controller)

Oh ntt. The SNES controller?

[frosty oracle]

That's pretty cool. Id guess that would work fine with my 4daptor to play Jag stuff. Not sure on the controller bindings though.

But then again, I guess nothing else would use the numpad

[sterile moss]

SNES gambling controller, good for Jag 🙂

[gentle bobcat]

@Penny - The Jag controller needs more pins than SNAC can accomdate but the Reflex Adapt has a driver for it... although it can only do one controller... so if you want more than one, you need multiple Reflex Adapts... but I'm guessing almost no one uses more than one Jaguar controller at a time.

[gleaming echo]

yeah well would that be a good JAG controller substitute?

[frosty oracle]

Hey mate. I see, yeah I haven't really looked into connecting my Jag controller to the mister.

But I do own the 4daptor which is either based on daemonbite/reflex. I could theoretically connect that strange SNES numpad controller to it

I should probably sell my Jag at some point as we now have this core

[frosty oracle]

Have you tried it?

[sterile moss]

Most Jag games don't need the numpad, you can bind the buttons to analog stick directions in a pinch

[mental briar]

yes, it's...uh...better than the jag controller :p

[frosty oracle]

Ah right

[rain sierra]

NTT works well enough in a pinch. Many of us already have them from the dark days of Mister. Again, those shoulders are nice for AVP and Wolfenstein

[mental briar]

low bar but here we are

[rain sierra]

I admit I want a real Jag controller tho

[frosty oracle]

Worth picking one up then? There used to be a good Japan import website I used to buy things from but I can't remember the name

[sterile moss]

Yep, got one connected with a triple adapter

[frosty oracle]

And the Numpad binds don't affect anything else? (Guessing whatever works for you would work for me as we have the same adapter thing to a degree)

[rain sierra]

Nope

[sterile moss]

Nah they're independent

[frosty oracle]

Right sweet. Ty for the info

Il look online now.

[rain sierra]

It’s literally a ~20 button controller lol

[sterile moss]

As long as the adapter supports them properly

[rain sierra]

Yep

[gentle bobcat]

The Jaguar controller is the best controller ever made. Every game should use 17 buttons!

[frosty oracle]

I think the Jaguar is a very interesting console, especially the controller. They combined the Numpad thing from the 2600

[sterile moss]

Interesting is the right word 🙂

[gentle bobcat]

Obviously TheJesusFish and I disagree on the Jag controller but we already knew that. 🙂

That's easy for me to say because I'm an original Jag owner who loved it back in the day... being an all out Atari fanboi prior.

[mental briar]

I just don’t like how squishy it is. That didn’t stop me from buying 2 (and two adapts) so I could use both

But you know I don’t kinkshame. If you like the jag controller, then I say god bless it

[ashen spoke]

What’s the numerical keypad for? To call your mum to pick you up? Wagagagagagaa

||I’m just kidding please don’t take me seriiusky||

[gentle bobcat]

I'm an odd duck as I don't really like modern controllers or games much at all.

[rain sierra]

I’d say you’re with the right crowd then. 🙂

[ashen spoke]

Speak for yourself, I pretend to be a nerd who’s here 24/7 just to seem cool

[rain sierra]

I do prefer OG controllers as much as possible but there are times modern conveniences take priority

I hope some day I can be as nerdy as Robby

[frosty oracle]

On the topic of Jag controllers

With that triple adaptor/4daptor. Can we connect 2 controllers at once and use both?

[sterile moss]

He's got the controller overlays. Dedicated prop comic

[frosty oracle]

I have a theory. A game theory

[sterile moss]

'Default: Optimized for MiSTer, PC, Raspberry Pi, etc. - reports as 3 separate controllers (NES/SNES combined) and supports multiplayer from a single unit'

[frosty oracle]

But I'm not sure it's going to work

[rain sierra]

I have sone 3daptors and I recall that you can use all the ports simultaneously but the bindings are a bit different from controller to controller

[frosty oracle]

The sega port that's on them. We can plug Atari controllers in right?

[rain sierra]

Not certain on that. I recall Atarti wired their port a bit different than Sega. I’d look at the Daemonbyte repository

[frosty oracle]

If they do work. My theory was, couldn't we plug in a SNES controller and an Atari 2600 numpad controller. If they both work simultaneously. Then we have replicated the SNES ntt

[sterile moss]

They'd be different players

[frosty oracle]

Ah

[rain sierra]

Oh I see what you’re getting at. That would be an excellent experiment

Oh right

[sterile moss]

You can use a controller and kb, that's always p1

[rain sierra]

That ol chestnut

[frosty oracle]

You could even like print off the keypad overlays too. As it's going to be one standard size.

[frosty oracle]

Oh

[rain sierra]

Like Count said, they are indeed seen as separate

[frosty oracle]

I might do that then. Just buy one of them portable numpad only keyboards.

[sterile moss]

If it's just for Jag, any dual analog controller will do the job, map the numpad to stick directions + clicks

[gentle bobcat]

I actually use the 1 2 and 3 buttons in T2K to change view on some of the larger playfields... and then to zoom back on on the smaller ones.

[sterile moss]

Messy but most games don't use em and that + shoulder buttons gives you enough stuff to map

[frosty oracle]

Knowing me id probably forget what the numbers/analog stick direction would do in the game.

Would have to make little sheets with what the direction of the stick does in game.

[gentle bobcat]

We have images of all of the overlays and there is a company who sells repros. I bought most of the repros.

[frosty oracle]

I'm reinventing the keypad overlay haha.

[sterile moss]

Yeah same, been happy with the NTT

[frosty oracle]

But shrunk to the stick and the shape of a circle

[gentle bobcat]

numpad is also very useful for the VLM as all of the effects are 3 digit numbers

[rain sierra]

This is one of the main reasons for me wanting an OG controller.

[gentle bobcat]

A lot of the cheat codes (originals in games) are combinations of numpad buttons held together.

[gentle bobcat]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zljBWIoZNl0

I still want to know what's up with that Jaguar Doom rebuild that improves a number of things including adding music?!?

[mental briar]

It didn’t work too good iirc

But I also am not sure I was using the right rom

[gentle bobcat]

As best as I could figure, the people who made it really wanted to commercialize it by having physical carts made (and a few were made) but likely ran into a licensing barrier that stopped what they wanted to do .

I don't think these are the same as a rebuild I saw on some other Atari podcast that I can't seem to find at the moment. Video mentions something about its description. Wink. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1706q8-qJg

[gentle bobcat]

Doom Slayer Edition is the one with music. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNEemCFBfm4

I believe I've shared that in the past.

[gentle bobcat]

The Doom 2 2011 (which was made by patching the original Doom game) seems to work great. Speed is great.

[ashen spoke]

Is the Jaguar version a decent way to play?

[glossy iron]

The ROM is not available of the slayer edition

[gentle bobcat]

Looks like the JagDoomEx devs want you to compile it yourself from source... which is on github... or maybe I misunderstand.

[gentle bobcat]

The Doom 2 ROMs (now called JagDoomEx) seem pretty good.

Ok, just patched the stock doom.j64 rom with a patch from March... and it has music. Seems pretty good.

[warm oasis]

Playing fine on the core?

[gentle bobcat]

Yep.

https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/149966-jagdoomex/

Hmm, I take that back... with the music playing, it gets pretty frame-droppy and sometimes even audio-skippy pretty fast.

@warm oasis - See the description (the YouTube video description) on that Doom 2 video above.

I've emailed one of the devs to see how they prefer their work to be distrubted.

[warm oasis]

Hmm, are we sure it works without issues on actual hardware with the flash cart?

[gentle bobcat]

It should be noted that searching for ShortRunGames on Etsy has some interesting content.

[mental briar]

[gentle bobcat]

I haven't busted my Jag w/GameDrive out yet to try it.

Looks like Chilly Willy has a MiSTer but may not have checked out the Jag core because it isn't in update_all.

[gentle bobcat]

So, the ones with music, if you turn down the music all the way, it's pretty much back to normal. If you can get used to the conflict between sound effects and music when the sound effects happen, it actually isn't too bad. You get regular music the rest of the time.

[urban mango]

When I tried it on GameDrive it was similarly choppy

[warm oasis]

Ah, that is disappointing but silver lining is probably nothing wrong with the core then. Maybe these are built for an emulator rather than real hardware?

[gentle bobcat]

The regular jag version can be choppy at times in the bigger areas or when there are tons of enemies. I think the rom forks are pretty darn good... but yes, they do also have some choppiness in the same sorts of areas which they do provide more of... bigger areas with more enemies. Admittedly, I'm not all that great at Doom and have only gotten through a small handful of levels in all of the versions.

[ashen spoke]

Bro I just get booty shorts when I look that up. What are you tryna buy on Etsy? 🤣

[mental briar]

jaguar booty shorts?

[ashen spoke]

Those exist!

[mental briar]

literal junk in the trunk

[gentle bobcat]

Maybe use a search engine rather than etsy's site search.

[ashen spoke]

That makes too much sense!

Oh they sell bootlegs.

[gentle bobcat]

Anyone remember the name of that Windows-based CD utility that allows for the creation of .cdi files that is on archive.org?

[spiral spoke]

discjuggler?

[gentle bobcat]

I think that was it. Thanks. (doing an web search with that name to verify)

[sterile moss]

the old CD burning/ripping tool that created the .cdi format, or the tool to convert bin/cue to .cdi?
If the latter: #1055574003810578503 message

[gentle bobcat]

https://metalgamesolid.com/systems/consoles/32-64-bit-era/jaguar/virtual-light-machine-fun-with-the-mister-fpga-atari-jaguar-wip-core/

[gentle bobcat]

Jaguar Infomercial from back in the day. They sure were trying very hard to sell that last 100,000 they had in their inventory:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAYKkC7ueWI

[ashen spoke]

Very cool article!

[outer veldt]

is it as direct as conventional snac? My snacks are dying

[outer veldt]

the one to burn Dreamcast games?

[gentle bobcat]

I got the Reflex Adapt because there isn't a Jaguar controller SNAC and the Adapt could do it. I haven't used any other adapters with it... so I'm fairly ignorant about what all it can do. If I'm remembering correctly, and you should double-check their material, it ads 1ms of latency which very low. Please correct me if I was wrong.

They do have software for MiSTer to switch between the sets of controllers it can handle. I think it can handle three sets at any give time... so if you use a wide range of adapters/controllers, you might have to occasionally switch which controller settings are loaded... but I doubt very many people have to worry about that. And of course it does work with the "PC" as well. I've not used it on the PC but I should try it with BigPEmu sometime.

[outer veldt]

i feel you. But! Unless its Mega drive and Snes, I don't need a snac. Maybe a saturn for the lightgun

still annoyed to get locked out of Shadow Dancer

should contact Jtego on that. Shadow Dancer works very sporadically on crt

[gentle bobcat]

@outer veldt - Yes, I think DiscJuggler was used by the Dreamcast folks to make .cdi files?

[ashen spoke]

How come you want SNAC for MegaDrive and SNE? Genuine question.

[sterile moss]

It was, and the jag games in .cdi on archive were converted from redump bin/cue using the tool I linked

#1055574003810578503 message

[outer veldt]

authenticity

[dusk slate]

I use SNAC for Saturn mostly. I have my original 3D controller still that is basically like-new condition. Plus another normal Saturn controller that I only opened for the first time a couple years ago that I had stored away for like 20+ years.

[outer veldt]

I have the lightguns and racing controllers for saturn, yet it is the adapter I'm missing

[outer veldt]

Is there a saturn snac to buy other than from Heber?

[sterile moss]

snax supports it

ultimatemister has one too, out of stock atm

[outer veldt]

i'm playing on a crt now, does snax work as well?

[sterile moss]

yep

[outer veldt]

ONE of my peeves is playing Mega Drive games with a 4 button configuration and vice versa with Snes. Also I have piles of the original controllers covered in the blood, sweat and tears of my gaming history

[livid laurel]

ooh, just realised since i got a second ram on the way, i might bask in the glory of the jaguar some time soon

[sterile moss]

There's a single sdram build available too

[livid laurel]

hm...maybe testing on that would be more helpful

[sterile moss]

If you need that Jag fix asap 🙂

[ashen spoke]

The goal is to have parity across both single and dual ram builds, thus only have one core.

[livid laurel]

ah okay, for some reason i thought it would be complicated enough to require both, but maybe that was still in the very early days

oh well, singled stick of ram is on the way anyway. i'm glad you guys told me that i could've been using two the entire time without losing snac

[warm oasis]

Hopefully we do get parity down the line, but If someone isn't using an analogue iO board, so has the second RAM slot free, and can get an 128MB stick for a good price (i.e. $25) then may as well go dual ram in my opinion. That's not a lot to spend on the hobby.

[livid laurel]

yeah, for some reason i always thought analog output and snac were on the same board, but i must've either misunderstood or that was some old info i picked up

[mental briar]

No, that makes sense. the old analog boards didn't have room for the 2nd ram (because they used the GPIO header for...analog) so until they started making dual ram compatible boards (which happened eventually) you either had to choose between dual ram or an io board (and the IO board is where SNAC lives)

the discourse around dual ram is very weird. I think there must have been a lot of drama around it originally. Nowadays it feels like if you are just hooking up via HDMI, and the ram is cheap, there isn't much reason to not have it

[livid laurel]

i assume with some people using mister specifically for analog out it being an "either or" situation must sting though this could be rectified with Taki's newer batches and qmtech having ram soldered on?

then again, that would still divert from the overall spec of the DE-10 nano, wouldn't it

[warm oasis]

I know when I got my second ram stick a few years ago it cost me £50, which was a lot considering the benefits (to play the old, buggy Jag core back then) so it wasn't something any normal person should consider. But as said, these days, with ram being that cheap, if you can afford it and MiSTer is a hobby then why not? Same with the RTC module. It's a small QOL upgrade that doesn't break the bank.

Does Taki do really cheap RTC boards?

[livid laurel]

5$

https://retroremake.co/products/mister-pi-rtc

[warm oasis]

That's not worth the wanting if you are ordering stuff from him.

It isn't automatically added to his builds though is it, for some new US rule about batteries being shipped from China?

[livid laurel]

it says the battery isn't included for the separate board at least, maybe it's the same for the entire stack

[mental briar]

it is - the battery isn't included

[warm oasis]

Ah so everyone who gets a Taki build has the RTC on the stack, just without the battery? That's good to know. I wonder how many people who have a Taki clone don't even realise that is there and they just need to add the battery, probably the majority.

[livid laurel]

well for the current batch there are different packs he's selling and only one of them contains the rtc board

[mental briar]

I think it was just preorders? I dunno if in stock stacks have the RTC

ahh there you go

[livid laurel]

only the "turbo pack" has it listed as a bonus

[warm oasis]

Right, got you

[livid laurel]

and i can't remember seeing that board on my stack

[mental briar]

no, it's new with this "batch"

[warm oasis]

For US:

MiSTER Pi RTC

1
$5.00
Cost summary
Item
Value
Subtotal
$5.00
Shipping

$13.00
Total
USD
$18.00

That's rough on the postage for this.

$8 shipping to UK

Oh well, if you are ordering something else worth adding to the order I guess

Doesn't look like that module will work on a non Taki stack though, the official design is different

https://misterfpga.co.uk/product/mister-real-time-clock-board-rtc/

[dreamy hinge]

it's "weird" because even Sorg considers it a developer-only configuration, but there seem to be people elevating it to 'the most accurate mister setup'. I think Sorg's label is deliberate in that it clearly forces developers to make things work on single ram. and I don't think he wants to deal with dual-ram only cores

[warm oasis]

To be honest, his stance is really the best, we don't really want people not bothering to optimise cores and dump things that are only dual ram when they don't need to be

[dreamy hinge]

I think despite his early shitting on analog out he considers at least a semi-important part of the ecosystem now. He may still think you are weird for using it though

[mental briar]

Yeah, I think analog out is definitely married to mister at this point.

The sticking point with dual ram is that it is the most accurate mister set up right now. Hopefully that's not always the case

[frosty oracle]

I think you have to put some special tape thing over the pins so they don't touch some metal when using it with the Mister Pi. At least that's what I remember when I asked about it ages ago.

The slimmer one Taki now stocks would probably be the one to use for Mister Pi

[outer veldt]

I switch between 2 MiSTer stacks, dual and single, I haven't noticed a huge difference

[deep granite]

whats the best way to bind regular controllers to jaguar numpad binds

This is a core I would like to explore when I receive my Mister

[mental briar]

Do you have a controller with dual analog sticks?

[deep granite]

Yes

[mental briar]

So you can get almost all the way there with that. how many face buttons?

that is a silly question, it's 4 because God hates 6 face buttons and dual analog sticks. So if you only have 2 triggers, you're gonna be short I think. You need 17 buttons + the dpad. So with 4 face buttons + start and (I assume) select, plus 2 analog stick gets you 14. If you have 4 shoulder buttons, that gets you 18 buttons. If you only have 2, then you have 16, and something needs to be sacrificed

[deep granite]

I think it’s something that’s per game

[mental briar]

well all the games are going to use the same controller, so as long as you set it up in a way you like, it should be fine. Like I bind 4 and 6 to L and R because that's how you strafe in AVP

[raven lotus]

I know everyone hates giving up analogue out for dual ram, but I will always point out that direct video allows you to do both analogue and dual ram. Yeah, it's a bit jank and if you need simultaneous hdmi and analogue it will incur more costs for splitters, scalers etc, and getting the correct splitter that won't freak out at the off spec resolutions is a crapshoot and good luck finding one that will also be okay with resolution changes like in some psx or n64 games and wait, where was I going with this?

For the record, this is unironically my set up and I've found some of the most bizarre things that needed troubleshooting. Like an HDMI matrix switch that doesn't drop sync on the resolution changes... But only on the even numbered outputs. I thought I was going mad with that one. Or having to set a special custom resolution for CPS1, 1.5 and 2 because neither my hdmi switch or dac played nice with the much, much wider resolution of those cores (5600x240 IIRC)

[sterile moss]

4 directions + click per stick, so both sticks + a cpl triggers gets you the 12 for numpad.
Then face buttons/other set of triggers and start/select for the rest

[mental briar]

Ahh right. I forget about R3 and L3 ( because they are abominations)

[sterile moss]

so kinda fitting for a jag controller 🙂

except the ones with a spinner added, they're beautiful abominations

[gentle bobcat]

If this (https://youtu.be/XsQY0YEqzYo?si=Fy2LpM8_ZEyhaK3a&t=1164) is to be believed, Atari made the Jaguar development kit in a weekend.

[mental briar]

I would normally scoff at that idea but......with the jaguar....

https://tenor.com/bXcCP.gif

[gentle bobcat]

Supposedly Habro bought Atari and its remaining assets (about 100,000 Jaguars, etc) for $5 MILLION... or maybe that was for the assets only?

[fresh urchin]

Heh, 5mil for 100,000- a jaguar is worth $50

[deep granite]

i thought about buying a jag for like $300-$400

and a game drive

but i don’t think i like the console that much to put that kinda money down

[ashen spoke]

I can’t say what’s worth it or not for people other than myself but nostalgia needs to be most of the appeal to be willing to drop that kind of money down for a games console and its games.

I enjoy the core and the library but that’s because I don’t have to spend a dime to do so. If I needed to spend money that completely changes the equation for me.

[fresh urchin]

You got your mister for free?

[dreamy hinge]

mod privilege

[livid laurel]

oh goodness it's actually booting

not saying it shouldn't

[gentle bobcat]

Here's a link that was shared with me recently that is a comprehensive collection of all of the music from all of the Jaguar games. I hope to compile it into a series of .cdi files for use with the VLM but haven't started no it yet.
Atari Jaguar game music
https://downloads.khinsider.com/game-soundtracks/atari-jaguar

It might be more enjoyable if I did it "mix tape" style where each .cdi image has a mix of songs from many titles from the catalog, rather that just here's title A as a single .cdi file... and here is title B as a single .cdi file. Suggestions welcome.

There are 78 titles in the "catalog" some being from games that weren't released.

I know... I can spend tens of hours working on "The VLM Collection" and maybe only 2-3 people are even mildly interested... but such is the pattern of my ecentric life.

[gentle bobcat]

I wonder if VLC can make a random playlist for a hierarchy of directories? I don't want to have to put too much thought into the ramdomization.

[fossil lintel]

you can open a folder with vlc and set it to random playback

[gentle bobcat]

This won't be part of "The VLM Collection" but it has something for most everyone... startup sounds from 218 different consoles, systems, games, companies, arcades, etc:
https://downloads.khinsider.com/game-soundtracks/album/startup-serenade-2002

Of course I would include item 14.

[harsh drift]

In the regards the NTT controller, it works well with this core used through a Blissbox Gamerpro SNES adapter. It definitely feels different playing Jaguar stuff with it though, that awkward controller at least to me is a big part of the Jaguar experience.

[mild karma]

yeah I’ve used the NTT pad with Jaguar via the Reflex adapter and it works well

[gentle bobcat]

524 music tracks total

[mental briar]

On for each button

[gentle bobcat]

Ok. 25 CDs... and a Sampler CD.

[copper creek]

I know I am trying to set up one of my computers to make .cdi files of music CDs that I used to listen to on the Jag CD with the VLM.

[gentle bobcat]

I've tested them with BigPEmu... just copying them over to a microSD card to test on MiSTer before putting them on archive.org.

[gentle bobcat]

Hmm, none of them are working.

Will build them again with a slightly different method.

[gentle bobcat]

@tropic rock - Hmm, bincue2cdi isn't working for me now. A few things have changed... like in on AlmaLinux 10 rather than Fedora 42... and I compiled it on Alma... so I wouldn't think that would make a difference. What I'm getting is that on many of the media I build, it freaks out on the last track... and when played in the VLM, when I go the last track, it instantly puts the time counter for the track on what I'm guessing is the end of the song rather that at the beginning. It will work in BigPEmu... but it won't be able to play that last song. On the Jag MiSTer core, it seems to refuse to do anything. I load the .cdi file, the specifics of the file show up (number of tracks) and then I reset the core... and no buttons are accepted as input. Weird. Hmm, maybe I should verify the prevvious media I had still work.

@tropic rock - Nevermind. I believe it was may own damn fault. I forgot to load the cd bios, loaded the .cdi and then loaded the cd bios after I got a red crash Jaguar screen. Doing it that way does not work. Making sure to load the cd bios before loading the .cdi file works fine. Seeking can sometimes be weird... but you are already aware of that and want to add a buffer/cache.

Yes, all of my media does indeed work. Yeah.

[gentle bobcat]

Tested all 26 audio .cdi files and they are all working great.

[frosty oracle]

So in regards to the Jaguar core. I could theoretically just use an 8bitdo m30 + wireless keyboard with numpad? (Or just a wireless numpad) For keypad shenanigans

[sterile moss]

Yep

works fine with a snes pad + bluetooth KB
map controls for each in the core and they both act as P1

[gentle bobcat]

Good search terms: JagCD cdi

[gentle bobcat]

Just got a 512GB microSD card and am moving from a 256GB card. That's going to take most of the day.

Needed more room for The VLM Collection.

[ashen spoke]

I heard the Jaguar was basically an Amiga with a GPU.

[pallid gulch]

Atari Lynx is also based on A1200

[dreamy hinge]

I heard PCs were just Amigas with crappier cpus

[pallid gulch]

at the end Amiga will win 😅

[uncut atlas]

I heard amigas are just based on an experimental 386 chip from intel where they tried to give it emotions

[dreamy hinge]

and they only succeeded in making it sad?

[ashen spoke]

More like ssad, get it because ssd is a computer

Redownload the jigglebytes

[gentle bobcat]

Robby - The Amiga was known for having multiple processors that did different things... so from a design perspective, the Jaguar was similar... and of course they both had Motorola 68000 family CPUs as the controller for them.

[ashen spoke]

Ok so basically the same, got it!

[tropic rock]

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DSCQMQ27

[mental briar]

the speed at which I preordered that should be measured by science

[stiff pebble]

Does this mean jesusfish is gonna play a game? 😮

[dreamy hinge]

no

[mental briar]

No, but I will print a stand for this

[dreamy hinge]

it means when the one other person who got one has an issue with it, he will plug it in to test it

and he will feel good about his debt

[mental briar]

Also, I wonder if this is the the stick https://www.amazon.com/GAMESTATION-WIRELESS-JOYSTICK-Not-Machine-Specific/dp/B0CT6C5NM8

🙏 🙏 🙏 The Father 🙏 🙏 🙏 🙏 🙏

[stiff pebble]

I'm calling it now, that stick is gonna get shit on by the controller enthusiasts bad

[dreamy hinge]

it's a mame cab sold in a portable form

[mental briar]

nothing on that thing will feel good

it will be bad mouth feel all the way down

[stiff pebble]

The numpad looks mushy af

I imagine it will be even mushier in person

Will be beautiful switching weapons in doom with tactical feedback equal to mashed potatoes

[mental briar]

You will be the best fight for life player in your town

[ashen spoke]

I’m the other person lol, just preordered it

[livid laurel]

i kinda want it

i love oddball controllers

[mental briar]

https://tenor.com/IeFy.gif

[livid laurel]

yeah, it kinda looks like it tries to be that for the entire catalogue of atari games

[radiant cradle]

that atari controller on mister jaguire core

of course it wont be as good as my controller

you can add a dial or a trackball in the analog slots too

[gentle bobcat]

Did John Conner bring that controller back from the future? It looks like Predator tech.

[uncut atlas]

as though playing an atari console could be anything else

[glossy iron]

That's the one for @tall sequoia

[gentle bobcat]

Atari consoles are pure heaven.

[deep granite]

How well does the retail Jaguar library run on this core as of now?

[dusk slate]

Very good.

[deep granite]

I’ve been excited to play the Wolf 3D port on it

[warm oasis]

It should be flawless now for the cart games, my understanding is it is (probably) the most accurate emulation of the console. If you find any issues please let us know, but I haven't seen any reported for a good while

[gentle bobcat]

@fade - CD games are supported as are audio CDs with the Virtual Light Machine but they have to be in .cdi format. Instructions and links to the latest core builds can be found in the pinned items. The core menu has a ton of options in it so it can be a bit overwhelming. If you have any questions, feel free to ask.

[half cove]

It would be nice to have a separate folder for all the audio CDs, so all the cores that can load from audio CDs can look into that folder when a load audio cd is selected. It would be interesting for the few games that allows changing the disc to audio cds.

[deep granite]

Thank you for letting me know about that, I wonder why it uses CDI files instead of bin and cue

[gentle bobcat]

@half cove - You can certainly create sub-directories within the usual games directory. For Jaguar, that's what I have. Three dirs... CARTS, CD-Games, and VLM.

@fade - Grey Rogue started with BIN/CUE files but he didn't have streaming working with them... and I believe they are still in the menu structure. Since they don't stream, they load into RAM and are limited to 500MB. Loading them is also very slow. He may have been able to get them to stream (play instantly) but all other cores I think support chd files... and people really like the simplicity of having a single file per title. That allows for putting them in a single directory. With bin/cue stuff, they usually need their own directory per title. For technical resons, the Jaguar can't use chd files so cdi was scene as a suitable and compatible substitute. Or at least that is my layman's perspective.

[hidden siren]

Love that version; it is afaik (or was, at the time) the only official version with a flame thrower 🙂

[tall sequoia]

No I bought a SFC NTT controller and ordered the Deamon 3 in 1 adapter that I linked far above. When the Deamon 3 in 1 adapter comes in I will test 🙂 .

[glossy iron]

Then keep it in mind if you adapter fails to work with the mister

[half cove]

I meant a new folder inside the games folder, like a core, but only to store the audio images, so all the cores that can play music discs can load them, by a new menu or navigating there manually.

[tropic rock]

It is linux. I think you could sym link a folder.

[dreamy hinge]

yeah, there's nothing stopping you from creating /media/fat/games/Audio and then symlinking it into each game folder you care about

or you can just navigate to it directly from the cd image picker on any core

(.. and then Audio)

actually you probably want to symlink them due to bios auto-loading and such

[gentle bobcat]

@tropic rock : The filesystem is exfat I thought. Does the linux ln command work on that? I'm guessing so or you wouldn't have suggested it. That's good do know... as I can take some of the games dirs and run a tool that looks for duplicate files and creates symlinks to free up a lot of space.

[dreamy hinge]

it has mister specific symlink stuff in the kernel

uses msdos 'system' flagged files to store symlink info

[tall sequoia]

So I bought the SFC NTT controller for 3 bucks on Yahoo with the intention to use it as a (cheap) controller for the Jaguar core 🙂 . With this adapter all 23 buttons of the NTT controller work on the Mister 🙂 https://ultimatemister.com/product/ultimate-triple-core-sega-nes-snes And the nice thing is = you can use the NTT Controller for the Colecovision, Intellivision and Atari 5200 Cores on the Mister as well🙂 .

[rain sierra]

Yep. NTT + DaemonByte was the OG MiSTer GOAT back in the day. Still a great combo.

[mild karma]

The NTT pad rocks

[mental briar]

https://tenor.com/bLQfn.gif

[gentle bobcat]

The Jaguar roar actually came from a Lion... and I guess that character in the image above looks like a lion.

[grizzled bloom]

Oh you haven’t heard of… The Bubster?

[gentle bobcat]

Oh, that's Busbsy. Ok. What type of animal is Bubsy? Something specific or imaginary?

[grizzled bloom]

Bobcat

[sacred blade]

All Felidae at least

[gentle bobcat]

I've tried to leave a link twice now in the last few days yet it is telling me that links are rate limited. Is this something that affects everyone or just me?

[sterile moss]

That message is also used for banned domains like archive

[warm oasis]

We block posting of links to archive.org here to avoid people linking to copyright material

[mental briar]

I just read it for the articles tho

[gentle bobcat]

Ok, then. I was just trying to post a link to archive for a freely distributable book that was released by the author for a book entitled, "Clipped Claws: The Atari Jaguar Story". The PDF version is > 500 pages. Feel free to search for it on archive.org if interested.

[warm oasis]

Is it 100% safe to share? The author is happy with it being on archive.org?

[gentle bobcat]

They posted it there.

It has been there since 2023.

Although in the book there is a page that says, "No printing or selling without explicit permission."

[warm oasis]

https://archive.org/details/clipped-claws

[hidden siren]

It could do with an index 🙂 Looks interesting, and it's not as long as it seems: there's over 200 pages of press releases, but that still leaves 300 pages of writing

[serene widget]

https://x.com/FBXGargoyle/status/1968251676713951629

FirebrandX 😈 ♈️ (@FBXGargoyle)

Yet another reason the Jaguar is the worst-engineered console: I found while stripping the old caps out that the voltage regulator had been fried & replaced (you can tell by the C- soldering work). This happens because the Jag has no polarity protection diode installed. HAIRBALL!

X · Sep 17, 2025, 9:52 AM

[gentle bobcat]

If you are providing a proprietary power supply specifically for the device, I'm not sure why additional internal power supply safety features are needed... but IANAEE.

[stone vault]

I've been away for awhile handling my father's estate.

Thought I'd check and see if anything is new on the Jag core. Is it possible to use CHDs for the CD games yet? Or are tracks still loaded individually?

[sterile moss]

.cdi (discjuggler) format is now supported

Check the pins for setup info

[gentle bobcat]

@stone vault chd format will likely not be supported because that format doesn't have session support which is used by the JagCD... or at least I'm repeating what I was told. 🙂

There are also a few games on other cores where if in chd format, they won't work either.

Luckily .cdi is an all-in-one-file format and does offer, I believe, pretty good compression.

[dreamy hinge]

it offers no compression

[warm oasis]

Would you need to do some work to support CHD on Jag CD, Zakk?

[dreamy hinge]

yes, but chd doesn't natively store session info so it would need custom metadata

[gentle bobcat]

.cdi.zip ?

.cdi.zst ?

[stone vault]

So just toll with bin/cue for Jag CD? Isn't a huge deal. The Jag CD library is small

Do they go in the same folder as the cart based games?

[mental briar]

.cdi files only at the moment

[gentle bobcat]

@stone vault - Yes, but you can make a subdir if you want. I have a sub-directories named Carts, CD-Games and VLM.

[stone vault]

Perfect. That's what I'll do as well

[gentle bobcat]

@stone vault I don't think BIN/CUE files work very well as they don't stream play I don't think... and were limited to 500MB as they were loading into RAM and very slow... unless that was changed. All of the CD games are available as cdi files somewhere.

[stone vault]

Ah ok

I found em

Thanks for your help man. I really appreciate it

[stone vault]

Got it to work. Most games boot fine. But some like Iron Soldier 2 just boot into the VLM. But progress was made at least. But many cart based games like Wolfenstein 3D won't load now. Not sure what the issue could be there but will hopefully figure it out when I have more time to tinker with it

[mental briar]

Turn off the CD stuff - then you can boot cartridges again

[gentle bobcat]

@stone vault - You probably don't need it but here is a tutorial - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=809UNasgB9M&t=281s&pp=0gcJCeAJAYcqIYzv

[deep granite]

I found the cdi files nvm

[deep granite]

Can you install both single and dual ram cores at the same time?

[mental briar]

yes

[dim sundial]

yes, cores are just files. Not really installed.

[deep granite]

yeah i just got my mister and im currently setting up

[deep granite]

then how do you assign cores to consoles by folder?

[dim sundial]

The cores are the consoles, and they know what folder to use.

[deep granite]

of course but when i upgrade to dual ram later, how do I select the dual ram core instead of single without simply deleting the single ram core

[mental briar]

it's labled

[dim sundial]

Console cores are files inside of the _Consoles folder. When you're going through the menu, it's just listing the files (with possibly pretty names provided by names.txt). When you choose a core, it just runs the core file. You can have both cores, and multiple versions of the same core as long as they have different filenames

[mental briar]

Once you get into the menu, it will make more sense

[deep granite]

ok

thanks

i feel like a fish out of water right now

lol

ill get the hang of it

[mental briar]

it's totally fine. we all had to figure it out

I promise we aren't blowing smoke up your ass - the core setup will make a lot more sense once you're booted up and looking around

[gentle bobcat]

So, I put the word SINGLE in the name of the single RAM core and DUAL in the name of the dual RAM core. Both show up. Pick the one you want.

[shadow topaz]

Is Jaguar CD dual ram only?

[dreamy hinge]

no

[gentle bobcat]

@shadow topaz - If you looked at the pinned items in this channel, there are links for both a dual ram core and a single ram core.

[deep granite]

I have an idea for the Jaguar core that can make it more friendly to use for regular controllers without the number pads. How about making a button combo setting that can scroll through the numpad controls 1 by 1 and you can select them with a regular controller through the indicator OSD

[mild karma]

assume that would be a MiSTer Main feature if possible

[deep granite]

I was thinking of something akin to the hotkey on the PS1 core for switching between analog and digital controls

But with a scrolling feature

[ashen spoke]

Probably not happening tbh

We should be able to map the analog controllers to the numpad if anytbing

[wheat tangle]

Hey all, so I kinda missed the boat on info for the NTT Data pad. I have 2 that I cannot get to work and a search shows me they may not work with the Daemonbyte adapters I have from ultimatemister. Are there other adapters I can get that will work?

[mental briar]

hmmm, I thought they worked with daemonbyte

oh maybe not the ultimate mister ones....

according to this it does

https://misterfpga.org/viewtopic.php?t=511

https://github.com/MickGyver/DaemonBite-Retro-Controllers-USB/commit/362c9d136da174a80986112d689689c5c73bc6c8

[wheat tangle]

I saw a previous post with someone that has the same adapter as me with the same problem but no solution. I should have specified it’s the number pad buttons that arent working.

[mental briar]

yeah, i think you may need to flash it with custom firmware but according to this post it works

[mild karma]

hmmm I tried the NTT pad on a daemonbite the other day and it didn’t work

that said, I think there’s a chance I flashed different firmware to one of mine, so maybe I grabbed the wrong one accidentally

[wheat tangle]

Cool thank you!

[sterile moss]

My timville triple adapter needed a FW update to support the numpad on the NTT pad also, works great after

i think later units and 4dapter support it with the FW they ship with

[midnight robin]

@tropic rock I am playing a lot of Jaguar on the MiSTer lately (original Rayman and Tempest 2000 most of the time) and I am missing the "Vertical Crop" option that most other console cores have and that crops the image vertically do make it always an exact sub-divisor of 1080p. Could that be implemented on the Jaguar core, pretty please? It's great for scanlines... Right now it's possible to use integer of course, but image is a bit too small.

[wheat tangle]

So friends I'm at a loss here but the keypad buttons on my SNESNTT Data pad still don't work after updating it with the INO file. I'm using the 3X adapter from ultimatemister. The adapter flashed properly but nothing. Any ideas before I quit?

[mental briar]

see if you can bind them to analog directions in the mister menu - that's what I have to do if I use the retropad adapter

IE, 5 is left stick right. 7 is left stick down. 9 is right stick right and I think....pound(?) is right stick down

if the keypad is recognized in the mister menu, then you're halfway there

Also, I assume you are not in the US?

[wheat tangle]

They needed to be mapped to the mouse buttons! You get the gold star for today!!!! Thanks so much

[deep granite]

So I just figured out binding the analog sticks to the Jag controller keypad that some of you guys were talking about and it actually works pretty well

🙂

[ashen spoke]

Wait, that’s in? I thought it needed to be added lol.

[dreamy hinge]

you've been able to bind analog directions to buttons for years

[ashen spoke]

[dusk slate]

Shame this man!

[gentle bobcat]

Yeah, binding the stick directions is how I did it until I got a real Jaguar controller and the Reflex Adapt with Jaguar adapter. It's a bit pricey but if you use it, rather than it sitting in a drawer, it's worth it.

[uneven cobalt]

That’s what I did as well. It was worth it just to finally experience a dpad that feels worse to use than the 3DO’s.

[gentle bobcat]

I might have to use my Jaguar controller if we ever get a 3DO core.

Because, I guess, new-old-stock 3DO controllers are fairly non-existent.

[deep granite]

I’ve thought about it but idk if I’d use it enough to get my money’s worth

[ashen spoke]

Yeah, I’d only recommend it if you’re a Jaguar die hard or all about the authenticity. Otherwise I’m sure the analog stick binding is fine. I should do it for when I’m feeling lazy and don’t want to bust out the Reflex + Jaguar, which is like 90% of the time I play this core lol.

[deep granite]

Maybe I’ll get a reflex to use my 2.4g console controllers

I have a Krikzz Joyzz and a 8bitdo SN30 i’m kinda interested in using

[olive pagoda]

What is the reason there is a dual RAM and single RAM version for this core? It's hard to find a clear answer on this.

[mental briar]

Dual Ram is much more accurate

[olive pagoda]

I see. It's down to RAM timings and such? Other than that there are no other features or things missing in the single RAM version?

Sorry for the super newb question

[dim sundial]

#1055574003810578503 message

[gentle bobcat]

@olive pagoda - I don't think there are any differences other than performance.

[mental briar]

Fairly certain some games still crash. Someone mentioned that mutant penguins crashed at some point during gameplay I think

[gentle bobcat]

I don't think I've tried that one.

[deep granite]

Something I notice is that the game soccer kid doesn't work

It does that red jaguar screen on startup

[gentle bobcat]

That wasn't, I don't think, an original retail game. You can check the testing spreadsheet (linked to in pinned items I thnk) and see if it has a note.

[mental briar]

It's something grey looked at. If you turn off the cart checksum option, it will boot

it's debatable if it should boot

[tropic rock]

Using dual ram allows the core to run fast enough to match the originals DRAM timing. When running in single RAM the data bus is paused (pausing whatever was asking for the data - and anything else waiting in line m68, tom, jerry). The original game was written assuming original timing would happen. The pausing can have different affects that might include nothing noticeable, slowdowns, crashes or anything really. I implemented a cache in BRAM for single RAM to avoid needing to pause if the cache is used. The cache is only big enough to cover a quarter of the 2MB DRAM space. You can choose which 2 of 8 sections you want the cache to cover and this will affect which accesses will not need to be paused. This may change how often slowdowns occur or if crashes happen, but it might not be enough for all cases.

For Soccer Kid, I suspect the version that does not work without disabling cart checksum would fail on real hardware. My guess is that it was released on a cart that changes it's behavior (like a skunkboard can). If the existing ROM were placed on a standard cart pcb, it would also fail and give the red screen if my theory is correct.

This is only a theory, but I think it is likely correct.

[fallow salmon]

i wonder if de25-nano will have enough / fast enough memory to cover that without dual ram

[deep granite]

https://www.gamesthatwerent.com/2010/09/soccer-kid-atari-jaguar/

It was released by Songbird in 2000

Finished game that wasn’t published by its original publisher because Jag wasn’t selling well

https://songbird-productions.com/product/soccer-kid/

[tropic rock]

I realize it had a cart release, but I still think either the dump is different than the cart or the cart is a skunkboard or otherwise able to skip or alter the checksum. If the existing dump were put on a cart with the original style of pcb it would red screen. That is my theory. The skunkboard theory could be tested by opening up the cart.

[mental briar]

the beta works but I wonder if that was the unpublished version

that was never sold

[tropic rock]

Original pcbs look like this

Just a ROM chip or two and maybe an EEPROM to save

If it has anything more complicated, it could fail the checksum

and still work on original hardware

The core assumes all ROMs are using standard pcbs and does not fully mimic a skunkboard or anything very complicated.

The method for generating the checksum is known so the ROM could be patched to pass the checksum. It is possible it deliberately fails the checksum as a form of copy protection.

[pure bridge]

Out of interest, how much work would it be to implement something like the SkunkBoard in the core, to allow loading .abs/.cof RAM-only files, and to expose some kind of debugging interface (for the Jaguar hardware, not the core itself)?

[tropic rock]

Probably depends on what functionality is needed. Loading different formats probably only needs to be able to specify an address where to load the file and what address to start executing. That would likely need to unlock the console (setting a single register) and skipping the bios. To debug I would just use Signal Tap. It will probably give you everything you would want. Maybe adding a way to turn on the single step mode the hardware supports from the osd. At some point getting kconger's snac jaglink would be a good idea. Not sure what else the skunkboard provides.

[uneven cobalt]

Jaglink would be cool but I long for mtrack support. I’ve never been able to get save loading to work for Highlander on my gamedrive and it would be great to be able to finish the game someday.

[tropic rock]

Memory track is already partially written. I implemented the version that the alpine board used. Unfortunately that appears to be intentionally disabled for retail use. It needs to be swapped to either the AMD version or the Atmel version which use different eeprom implementations underneath.

[warm oasis]

I was reminded of this, and thought might be useful if you wind up looking at CD+G on the core. Some lunatic managed to encode Bad Apple in the format
https://gashlin.net/blog/pages/2025-07-19-bad-apple-cdg.html

Maybe Dowdle can try it out in the PC-E and Mega CD cores and see if it works, he has a penchant for these odd audio formats

[gentle bobcat]

I think I've traditional Bad Apple files... I don't think I've used any optical disk images of it.

[gentle bobcat]

Ok, got the CD+G .iso (I't's like 1.3MB) and will have to try it out sometime this week.

[hidden siren]

huh, I only see a .cdg file which the megacd core doesnt want to open - any clues how to convert it?

[warm oasis]

I only see that also. Not sure what format it needs to be to work with Mega CD or PCE cores

[hidden siren]

It does work when loaded in vlc, but indeed, I had wanted to experience it on mister

[dreamy hinge]

no core supports just .cdg files. they have to be paired with an actual disc image

and probably converted to a .sub file, but I think .cdg is can probably just be renamed to that

[warm oasis]

It does seem far too small to be an audio CD let alone one with graphics

Unless Bad Apple is ten seconds long

[dreamy hinge]

the graphics themselves are small, like 96 bytes a sector or around that

[warm oasis]

CD audio is aboit 10meg a minute

[hidden siren]

in vlc, there is no audio playing for me; could be something I failed to install, but I seem to have all plugins/opt dependencies

[dreamy hinge]

that image does not have audio

[gentle bobcat]

A dude that goes by Tolbat (that is a lizard) who has done quite a bit of work patching Jaguar DOOM has shared some sort of A.I. dev kit for Jaguar development. Not something I have any skills for... but maybe something others might be interested in. I subscribe to his Patreon so let me see if his post is public yet.

https://www.patreon.com/posts/so-you-dont-know-140856127 Might be geared for the DOOM code development?

[mental briar]

Finally, a good use for AI

https://tenor.com/xvDw.gif

[hidden siren]

I finally got to try the CD stuff. I'm so happy this is available and working for my single ram mister, and amazed at the titles available. I mean - some are so weird. Tried 'Baldies' . Nice intro, 0 explanation wtf you're supposed to be doing after it. It seemed to have nothing to do with what I just saw 🙂

[gentle bobcat]

@hidden siren - I don't know how good of a printed manual Baldies came with but there are collections of PDF manuals that should come in handy.

[hidden siren]

Oh, thanks! 🙂 I just hadn't looked - did plan on doing that. But this is one of the things I love so much about the whole mister project; seeing the evolution of gaming over the years ; this would not fly right now 🙂

[silent nexus]

what bios do I need to make the core run correctly? Do I need to place it anywhere specific or rename it?

[mental briar]

In the pins: #1055574003810578503 message

[silent nexus]

I followed all the steps but still can't get it to work lmao

[mental briar]

Are you trying to boot cartridge games or cd games?

[scenic briar]

Saw that snac isn't supported. My respects to whomever is trying to use OG jaguar controls on this core😂

[ashen spoke]

They work perfectly with the ReflexAdapt

[scenic briar]

For more jaguar pleasure 😜

[ashen spoke]

I do hope something gets figured out though

Or the My Arcade Gamestation Retro Gamepad works on the MiSTer - https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0DSCQMQ27

[tranquil cape]

hopefully they can get these working too

[ashen spoke]

LMAO

[silent nexus]

I tried both

I renamed the bios "boot.rom" like it says. Maybe I will try the other file today. Only tried the dark mode one

Placed it in the Jaguar folder. Seemed pretty simple, but nothing runs apparently

[mental briar]

do you get a jaguar logo when you boot the core?

[silent nexus]

No

[mental briar]

then it's not seeing the bios. how is your SD card set up? are the roms on there? are you using a usb drive?

[silent nexus]

Yes the Roms are in the Games/Jaguar folder too. I'm using an SD card.

[mental briar]

The core isn’t seeing the bios. Can you try enabling the bios database on update_all and seeing if it downloads a new bios?

[silent nexus]

Ok will do

[warm oasis]

If you can't sort this then if you set up the W.I.P Cores DB that will grab all the files you need. The Jag BIOS files aren't in the BIOS DB

[silent nexus]

Is this what it's supposed to look like on the menu

[warm oasis]

If you look at the channels under MiSTer Related then you will find WIP Cores DB channel

[warm oasis]

Do you have a dual ram set up?

[silent nexus]

Im sending a Pic, just a sec. I did enable the bios database on update_all btw. It already was.

Yes I have dual ram

[silent nexus]

Where do I find this. Is it part of update all

[warm oasis]

No, you have to paste a line in your download.ini

If you go find the WIP Cores DB channel under MiSTer Related and read that then you will get everything set up

[dusk slate]

My guess is that it's probably just a bad bios file.

[tranquil cape]

FTP non-binary transfer error maybe?

[warm oasis]

Yeah, very probably, or it is in a wrongly named folder

Good shout on transfer error, make sure your FTP client is set to binary and not ascii

[silent nexus]

I use an SD card and add the files manually

[tranquil cape]

Maybe post the file sizes of the bios' and core too. If they are too small then maybe you didn't get the correct files.

[silent nexus]

I'm in the WIP thread. How do I find the files there

[warm oasis]

Scroll to the top and read, all the info there

[mental briar]

wait

oh nm, you have dual ram

saturn dual ram core works ok?

[warm oasis]

Probably worth double checking that you do have a working dual ram system

[silent nexus]

Yes I have the full build

[mental briar]

yeah, but have you tried the saturn dual ram core? Just to verify that the mister sees both ram sticks?

[silent nexus]

I use the core from update all

[mental briar]

https://github.com/MiSTer-unstable-nightlies/Saturn_MiSTer/releases/download/unstable-builds/Saturn_DualSDRAM_unstable_20251011_15ee2b.rbf

try this core

[silent nexus]

Ok maybe I'll try it too

[mental briar]

the update_all core is single ram

[warm oasis]

There is a reasonable chance you don't have your MiSTer set up for dual ram. Try the dual ram Saturn core (could also try the single ram Jaguar core) and see if those work.

Did you buy it advertised with dual ram or did you build it yourself?

[silent nexus]

I built the Mister Pi

[mental briar]

When did you get it? Do you remember what batch?

[silent nexus]

Probably like the 2nd batch

[warm oasis]

Did you flip the dip switch to enable the dual ram?

[dusk slate]

You need to flip a couple switches on the board to ensure it sees it as dual ram.

[mental briar]

don't need to flip any dip switches

9.2 board doesn't need it

Can you take a picture of your board?

[warm oasis]

Check dual ram Saturn first, that is easier to see if it works

[dusk slate]

The fasted test honestly would be to just try the single ram Jag core real quick.

[silent nexus]

Ok single core works

Pretty sure I had bought the full package of the MisterPi though. Is there dip switches I need to flip on it or did I just purchase the wrong thing?

[mental briar]

did you buy a 2nd stick of ram?

Or did you just buy the mega/turbo pack?

[dusk slate]

Yep, so it's absolutely dual ram not set up right.

[silent nexus]

I think I bought the turbo pack

It was close to 200 dollars

[mental briar]

so the turbo pack is only single ram. you have to buy a 2nd stick for dual ram.

but, with that said

you're totally not missing much with single ram. the saturn core is nearly identical, and the jaguar core might still get there (it's still very WIP)

[silent nexus]

I’m mostly getting the boot screen on the Jaguar core. I’m gonna have to check my files later tonight. I can’t get any games to run yet.

[silent nexus]

Hmm, Im still just getting the red Jaguar screen and a roar whenever I try to boot up a game. I do have my cd bios and bootrom set.

[gentle bobcat]

@silent nexus - That red screen is normal until you load a cart rom. What happens when you load a cart rom?

You did say "whenever I try to boot up a game".

[mental briar]

I dunno where you got your romset but, iirc, the core can be picky about roms

[gentle bobcat]

They mentioned multiple color roms (errr, I mean BIOS) so I'm guessing the ones linked to in the channel pinned items.

[mental briar]

well the game roms won't be in the pins. the bios is working, though

[silent nexus]

Ok I'll try another romset. They just reset the bootscreen each time.

[gentle bobcat]

@silent nexus - I don't know if this'll be helpful or not, but a made a screencast that shows the current Jaguar core and the basics of setting it up and using it... with a focus on using the VLM. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iljn2kpW6bQ

[silent nexus]

I've used 2 to romsets so far. One that's J64..and Jag. Still no luck lmao

It just repeats the bootrom each time I choose a game

[sterile moss]

If you're loading cart games, make sure 'cd enabled' is set to no

[silent nexus]

Ayy that worked. 🍾

[sterile moss]

Nice 🙂
@ashen spoke might be worth adding a note to the pin for cd setup about disabling that setting for carts

[mental briar]

Ahh, someone of culture I see

[thorny swift]

the reason to own a Jaguar

[mental briar]

How dare you do fight for life dirty like that

[thorny swift]

thats what I call it when @dusk slate momma sits on my face...Fight for Life

[dusk slate]

You're not wrong dad! Your fight gave me life!

[deep granite]

Some people are into that... 🤷‍♂️

No comment

[uneven cobalt]

Been playing Rebooteroids after finishing Doom. It’s a lot of fun and might be my favorite Asteroids based game.

[hidden siren]

ohhh, I like myself some astroids 🙂 Thanks for the tip! I've spent quite a long time playing Lunar Lander not a week ago, while we're on the topic of vector games (the arcade version, so I'm nicely off-topic here, sorry :))

[ashen spoke]

Lunar Lander one of my favs

[uneven cobalt]

There is a pretty cool homebrew game for the Jaguar that has some Lunar Lander in its DNA, “Gravitic Mines”

https://youtu.be/UqR4oGnJvG0?si=t0ZxkKDdAgFNypdN

[hidden siren]

looks shiney! Haven't checked much of the games that were made after Atari stopped, seems like at least 2 gems 🙂

[ashen spoke]

Yooooo, that game looks sick

[ashen spoke]

sorry i misssed this

[sterile moss]

No wukkas, thought its worth adding a note that the setting disables cart loading

[ashen spoke]

ok, added that to these two pinned posts:

• #1055574003810578503 message
• #1055574003810578503 message

[sterile moss]

Thanks dude 👍

[humble bluff]

https://itch.io/jam/jagjam-2025

[high venture]

Whaaaaat. I've wanted something like this controller forever. Something that covers all of the oddball controls for trackball, paddle, and number pad all in one! I really hope this thing ends up working with MiSTer cores and is decent quality.

[rare island]

i've been keeping tabs on these freaky little guys and their arcade stick counterparts and i'm impatient for them to come out!

[mental briar]

👀

[ashen spoke]

I just saw a video and lmao

[normal loom]

What an awesome game

[mental briar]

Goddamned robots won’t even listen to us

[gentle bobcat]

I'm doing my best to avoid all A.I. as much as possible. DuckDuckGo puts an A.I. summary at the top of their search page results, but other than that, I've been pretty successful.

Currently, it's about 30% accurate, yet it is at the top of the search results?

[fallow salmon]

some search engines let you disable that

[hidden siren]

You can hard disable that in their options

[radiant cradle]

a simple photoshop job but the public craves a piss stained ai picture of it, dreadful

[real spindle]

‎ 🎩

🧿👄🧿 ✨
‎ 🫴

[radiant cradle]

and by photoshop i mean gimp of course

[gentle bobcat]

I feel about A.I. as Carol feels about all but 12 other people on Earth... in the new show "Plur1bus". 🙂

[mental briar]

Imagine kinkshaming someone and offering Linux as an alternative.

[radiant cradle]

you mean lignux

[gentle bobcat]

You're welcome.

[ashen spoke]

how bout u lignux deez fedoras

[gentle bobcat]

I does Fedora.

[hidden siren]

'twas linux, and ksnip; hadn't expected that to be the topic of conversation, but ok 🙂

[frigid dock]

https://bsky.app/profile/katemessner.com/post/3m573m3r5e22e

Kate Messner (@katemessner.com)

Loving today's news that the mysterious "fedora man" outside the Louvre heist was actually a 15-year-old museum visitor who dresses like a 1940s French detective all the time, just because. apnews.com/article/louv...

-# Fedora man unmasked: Meet the teen behind the Louvre mystery photo
Fifteen-year-old Pedro Elias Garzon Delvaux has become an internet sensation after an Associated Press photo captured him outside the Louvre on the day of a crown jewels heist.

Reposts

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211

Bluesky · Nov 9, 2025, 12:16 PM

[ashen spoke]

@tropic rock + @uncut atlas I have a request. Could this core support keyboard combinations for supporting Asterisks and Hashtag. For example allowing for [SHIFT] + 3 for # and [SHIFT] + 8 for * ?

oh wait that's probably a general MiSTer input bind thing.

Because this USB controller works with the Jaguar core:

but the * and # buttons are actually keybord combination inputs

[dreamy hinge]

it lets you directly bind the keypad buttons in core binding menu?

[ashen spoke]

I dunno

[dreamy hinge]

quite the answer

[mental briar]

@ashen spoke bind them to joystick directions. For my rp32, I have to bind numbers on the ntt pad to the left and right analog sticks https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1386746269569122386/1391830356864270547/image.png?ex=6918b588&is=69176408&hm=1f76f8516a542b02ccef5a0affe05d249b2e3d0b962e32be97e80b1e02ddf3be&

So when it asks for left analog right, I press 5. When it asks for down, I press 7

Play with that and see

[dreamy hinge]

he's talking about his new atari controller numpad

[mental briar]

I know, but I wonder if the mapping is a similar idea

[karmic spire]

Are you satisfied with the build quality of this product or in general? these are interesting.

[ashen spoke]

No I’m returning it. The novelty of combining a numpad, trackball, and spinner is interesting but the overall build, button feel, and novelty inputs are all very poorly implemented. Unless you really want an all-in-one controller and don’t mind paying $60 for a poor experience, I’d avoid it.

First things first; this is a controller that is built for MyArcade GameStation consoles so some features aren’t available on other devices such as wireless connectivity and the button light indicators. The light indicators were expected to not function correctly as it requires software to turn them on/off based on which inputs work for each game but the wireless being non-functional for all other devices is a huge bummer. At least it works wired.

As for using the controller, the buttons and Dpad themselves are serviceable but not pleasant to use. It has the nasty mushy feel of a $10 controller you’d find bundled with a mini-console knock-off but with the ergonomics of the Switch joycon controller adapter (the one where you slot joy-cons on the sides). It’s simply not acceptable for the price point.

Next the spinner isn’t smooth and has a lot of resistance which disallows a smooth continued spin. It’s just a cheap plastic miniature knob and its placement on the left-hand side makes it a bit odd for right-handed play. It’s mapped to the left analog stick left/right motion and I’ve noticed it misses inputs sometimes when spinning so it’s rather inaccurate.

The trackball is a similar story but using it feels much worse than the spinner. It’s quite possibly the worst trackball I’ve used and for its size, the sensitivity is way too high with a lot of missed directional readings. Which results in jerky movement. It’s mapped as a mouse so at least it should natively work for any trackball games.

Lastly, the keypad feels alright but they swapped the * and # buttons and they’re mapped as Shift combo button inputs. Really indicative of the level of care put into this product.

[karmic spire]

Thanks @ashen spoke for this complet review. I didn't order it because I was afraid I would have the same experience, even though they seemed very interesting.

[dusk slate]

Robby took the bullet for us!

[ashen spoke]

Sorry for the wall of text

[dusk slate]

https://tenor.com/view/imostergolfra-gif-25274972

[ivory basin]

I think everyone here knew that would be the end result

it does everything, but badly

[dusk slate]

The age old master of none situation.

[ashen spoke]

I mean if you can buy it from a retailer that allows for hassle free returns then try it out. It’s the only controller of its type so maybe the downsides and price aren’t enough to outweigh its potential benefits for some.

I don’t know if my grammar was correct

[dusk slate]

B+ for grammar.

[ashen spoke]

“Aren’t enough to outweigh”?

Tha reads wrong to me lol

[ivory basin]

$60 for a D-Pad and thumb stick controller is already getting into 1990s Mad Catz territory, but it's also a spinner, trackball and a numpad?

there was no way it was going to be useable 😉

[ashen spoke]

the frustrating part is that it all works lol

[ivory basin]

a minor miracle

[ashen spoke]

But there’s enough obvious problems that it sucks

[dusk slate]

Maybe the arcade stick style version will be better! ....whenever that releases.

[ashen spoke]

I imagine like an awesome version of that controller would be $150

and who’s gonna buy that other than weird nerds

[ivory basin]

Yeah, it's a double edged sword

[ashen spoke]

that like to play Jaguar

on their field programmable gate array machine they put together

[ivory basin]

for it to be expensive enough to be worth buying would drive away all the casual Atari fans

[ashen spoke]

If I owned a My Arcade Gamestation and was really into it and wasn’t tainted influenced by you perfectionists I’d probably be satisfied.

But that’s not reality and I’m some stupid asshole who wants to play Jaguar as cycle accurate as possible!

[dusk slate]

Mission accomplished.

[ivory basin]

I am just happy you aren't forcing yourself to use it even though it's crap

[ashen spoke]

I THOUGHT ABOUT IT

I REALLY DID

[dusk slate]

This is what happens after the indoctrination has taken root.

[ivory basin]

Thanks Mario you almost killed me with that click

[karmic spire]

No prob i like complete review like this! 😉

[dreamy hinge]

that video is also a summary of his review

[mental briar]

So you’re saying I shouldn’t even open it then?

[ashen spoke]

I mean I think you should! Maybe I’m too harsh?

Always great to have more opinions

It’s sold out and as far as I know we’re the only two people who have it

[mental briar]

maybe they made 2

[ivory basin]

a very real possibility!

[signal bramble]

Thanks for review but I'm waitting for the big brother arcade thing

Trackball, keypads... reminds me to some old ATMs

Sure that a spinner would be a good option to choose the amount of credit whitdrawn with inertia and all that

[uncut atlas]

I always find it strange when people buy things with the atari logo on them and yet expect something other than mediocrity

[mental briar]

In my heart, I was hoping for mediocrity. I would have been happy with mediocrity, frankly

[ashen spoke]

Look this is a new world for me!

[signal bramble]

Are you insinuating that current holders are milking fans? It can't be true...

[mental briar]

Not John Atari. He would never

[gleaming echo]

Man I was looking forward to this. Can you not just do a better review? Maybe the controller gets better or so.

🤣

[radiant cradle]

desperation for any controller with a keypad on it to play atari jaguar games with

[mental briar]

Weird that the best controller for the jaguar nearly predates it

[gentle bobcat]

No, the best controller for the Jaguar is the Jaguar controller. 😛 You knew that was coming.

[mental briar]

https://tenor.com/7VeS.gif

[gentle bobcat]

Yep.

[ashen spoke]

Maybe other people like it more and are either ok with its build quality or feel the unique combination of all those inputs makes up for it?

Controllers are super subjective so I don’t think my review should be the only voice out there.

Take into consideration that I already own a quality trackball and spinner, and I use the Jaguar controller + Reflex Adapt on this core. So in terms of input variety I’m already covered so I don’t have a “need” for this controller.

[gentle bobcat]

I do not claim that the Jaguar controller would be good for any other core.

[ashen spoke]

The Jaguar Pro controller is probably ace with the Sega Saturn tho.

Bro, imagine laying down some beat downs in SFA3 with this bad boy:

@glacial bloom how humiliating would that be?

[glacial bloom]

Awful

You ain’t doing no half circles on that thing

[uneven cobalt]

I have a pro controller with the dpad swapped out and it’s not terrible.

Still wouldn’t want to use it for anything other than Jaguar lol

[gentle bobcat]

So, how goes development on the Jaguar WIP core ; Any progress? Just curious.

[rare island]

man it's too bad that the gamestation handheld controller's so bad. i was cautiously optimistic about the forthcoming spinoff

assuming that they actually move forward with making it

[tropic rock]

Funny enough I have had a little time and motivation the past couple days to work a little on it. Just fixed the change. DELETED

boot Roms for BIOS, CD BIOS and Memtrack should all work now (memtrack is still not functional).

I have struggled to motivate myself as a lot of these changes don't really fix anything or add anything, so they are not as exciting. But I moved the BIOS to the SDRAM which frees up another 128K of BRAM for single RAM builds (have not hooked that up yet).

I also partially implemented things in a way where using 32MB chips should not break anything (still need a fall back for 32MB chip when using 16MB cart as they will overlap with the BIOS).

And the three boot Roms can be overwritten when using 16MB carts with a 32MB chip, so I am also copying the BIOSes to DDRAM but have not yet implented the code to copy them back to SDRAM.

[sterile moss]

Nice, cd bios (named boot1.rom) now looks to auto load based on the 'CD Enabled' setting 🙂

Thank you GreyRogue

[warm oasis]

Ah great stuff! What should boot ROMs be named now?

[shut night]

Even changes that don't fix things are still fantastic to see. Don't ever think that every release has to be some big news event, many of us are just amazed at the work itself 👌

[tropic rock]

MBios is boot0.rom (K is not supported) CDBios is boot1.rom and nvram.rom (memtrack) is boot2.rom

[mental briar]

yay :). I'll build a single ram version for completeness' sake

[tropic rock]

Accidentally pushed it to a new branch in Main instead of mine, but it is available.

[mental briar]

what crc do you have for your bios file? I am not getting anything to load

[sterile moss]

CD BIOS/games loading OK, cant get the previous normal BIOS or games to load
boot.rom MD5 BCFE348C565D9DEDB173822EE6850DEA (same if named as boot0.rom and doesnt load manually)

related to the K revision not being supported?

[mental briar]

@tropic rock If you have the M Bios, it may be worth sharing

[tropic rock]

It is the same one as before. K has never been supported

[mental briar]

no carts are loading for me

CDs are

but not carts

not getting the bios at all

even tried the standard, non-kun bios

[tropic rock]

BCFE348C565D9DEDB173822EE6850DEA is k bios

[mental briar]

that's the one we have been using

[tropic rock]

I thought that never worked.

[mental briar]

i think we determined it's safe to share the bios. ive downloaded for and they are all K

[sterile moss]

Kitrinx was fine with sharing the modded ones yeah, those are K based it seems
the stock K one works OK with previous build of the core

[tropic rock]

https://forums.atariage.com/topic/209274-jaguar-bios-revisions/

Original link is dead but archives exist...

I guess K did used to work...I thought it never did. I do not why it would have changed.

Maybe some of the compatibility settings affect it. Max compat or vint fix could affect it.

[sterile moss]

same issue here under new core with 6e844759720226e58d55ecaf33608a13 boot0.rom
That loads under the old core

reset OSD settings, enabled max compatibility, saved settings and reloaded core, unable to manually load 6e844759720226e58d55ecaf33608a13 boot0.rom

manually loads OK under Jaguar_ReworkDual_20250730.rbf (auto loads OK if named boot.rom under that core)

tried the combinations of max compatibility and vint fix, no change

[pallid gulch]

is nvram.rom this rom ?
ROM_REGION16_BE( 0x1000, "waverom", 0 )
ROM_LOAD16_WORD("jagwave.rom", 0x0000, 0x1000, CRC(7a25ee5b) SHA1(58117e11fd6478c521fbd3fdbe157f39567552f0) )

[sterile moss]

nvram.rom MD5 9D6E7C120A07CC83127FED86A37A388B
That's the one from grey's link

nvram.rom SHA-1 815D6E8BECCC6720FFB8D349587A382409F30042

enabling 'memory track' gets the normal console BIOS loading 🙂
I dont have a boot2.rom on the SD

[pallid gulch]

thank you 🙂

[sterile moss]

hrm, enabling memory track gets the red bios screen going, but doesnt boot games (after loading a rom it re-loads to the red bios like no game is inserted)

[tropic rock]

I have a theory. I put in the first part of the code to copy the BIOSes from DDRAM to SDRAM in case they are overwritten. All it is doing right now is counting down. The SDRAM self refresh is not running while it counts down. I am trying a build where I set the counter to 0 to see if it is causing issues.

[sterile moss]

cheers 👍

[tropic rock]

Maybe this is more stable. DELETED

[sterile moss]

still the same here, default settings the red BIOS screen doesnt load when the core is launched, loading a ROM stays on black screen
enable 'memory track' setting (no boot2.rom file present) and reload core gets the red screen back, but launching a rom reloads the red BIOS screen

ill try deleting the .cfg files again in case resetting in OSD isnt getting everything