#Sony PlayStation

1 messages · Page 3 of 1

tropic stratus
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wouldn't be super surprised...i made a fix back in july for this game because the game has samples in the SPU fifo but never writes them to SPU RAM, so the core couldn't go into pause logic

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if you have anything reproducible, please tell me

azure hatch
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speedrunning the game right now to open the ticket on github lol

tropic stratus
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no need to hurry, i will not look today

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what is the bug? sound effect, background music?

azure hatch
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sound effects, happens when very certain items are picked up and/or used

tropic stratus
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hmm, difficult to do a savestate for that, as likely the data in ram is already corrupt. I hope it's not deep in the game or i can get there with a memcard?

azure hatch
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i'll try for both, one of the savestates was reproducible and i'm confident the next one will also be

hidden prism
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I'm not taking the side of the other rude person, but when I first joined this community I specifically asked about PSX and a few others and were told it was "impossible on Terasic" due to gate complexity and clock speed. I took it more as getting n00b plebs to stop asking repetitive questions, as folks didn't know me or my background at the time. I see folks repeating these "canned answers" to common questions/inquiries from enthusiastic but non-technical new users.

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I see similar problems in the modern console jailbreaking community -- there's so many non-technical folks persistently asking the same questions, to the point the answer becomes of a reduction of a reduction just to quiet the noise and get back to a technical discussion. When there's finally a real question for the answer, the folks repeating the overly-reduced auto-response then have a credibility problem.

dry drift
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Who said it was impossible on Terasic?

hidden prism
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when I joined this discord a few years ago, I asked a number of questions to try and understand the root limitations, and there were a few folks. I don't store my discord logs like I did with my mIRC logs back in 1996, so I don't remember who said it. I remember it was more than one person, and it was across this discord and the retrorgb discord.

manic valley
dry drift
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Maybe the retrorgb discord

manic valley
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Either way .. this discussion is futile ..

full nimbus
manic valley
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What was meant to be a compliment to the creator has become some twisted monster I want no part of ..

dry drift
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I was initially fighting the people who said PS2 was feasible

wooden rose
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Ah so that's what that space is for... Here I thought conductors just enjoyed the tiny cans of hot coffee from the vending machines here

full nimbus
wooden rose
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I'll have to go get a Seiko pocket watch then

frail storm
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Klonoa is just incredible... once you play that one, you will never forget it. It's lovable in every possible way: actual gameplay, music, art direction, story, emotional content... I wish you and your daughter have a great time with it. I have gone back to Phantomile countless times by now 🙂

subtle dragon
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Pulled this from the archives

IMG_5544.png
waxen elk
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klonoa is definitely high on my list, for a person who loved platformers, I really didn't play much past rayman, spyro, and crash on the ps1

ivory verge
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Psio alternative ? 😋

abstract drift
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woah

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looks like more of an xstation?

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whats crazy is it seems to be connected to the cd port

ivory verge
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Open source! 🙂

abstract drift
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oh, nah its still soldered in like an xstation apparently

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neat though

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a pi pico may actually outpower the chip xstation uses iirc

jovial jay
ivory verge
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Nothing difficult

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🙂

abstract drift
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also, rama has literally done years of research to make xstation as accurate as it is now, so this will have a lot of catching up to do

ivory verge
solemn turtle
wooden rose
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Klonoa owns, loved it as a kid

quick gyro
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i finished Klonoa on the PSX Core a few Monts back, worked great! The Game is maybe my favourite Platformer on the PSX now.

wooden rose
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The sequel is said to be very good too, I have not tried it yet

quick gyro
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i have the Switch Remake but i did not try it yet. I tried to get it to work on my modded PS2 and its THE Game that causes the most trouble there. There are threads over threads from people trying to get it to work while the original PS2 Copy is super expensive for PS2 😄

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i guess i will just play my Switch Remake then, even if there is some downsides i heard from reviews

wooden rose
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Well there's always emulation

quick gyro
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Also the PS2 Klonoa Game changes resolution between cutscenes/ingame/pause so without something like a rt5x or a crt it will show many black screens 😄

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i know but i never tried to emulate it and my pc is a bit old by now

wooden rose
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Ah fair fair

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I wonder how it would fare on an OSSC

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Been thinking about picking up a cheap PS2 slim here

abstract drift
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pretty badly

wooden rose
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Oh yeah? Shame

abstract drift
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it also crashes on opl

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hard game to play

wooden rose
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What about the old FreeMcBoot style backup method?

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ESR I think?

abstract drift
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i think its okay off a dvd-r

wooden rose
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Alright, I might try that then, I still got a spindle

abstract drift
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it used to work on older OPL aswell apparently

wooden rose
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I would need to get a PS2 first ofc, and softmod it

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Which should be pretty easy

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I am actually wondering if I could use the PSX core to copy the necessary memory card data haha

abstract drift
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er, probably not i think its too big for a ps1 card

oblique frost
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I don't think ps1s can read ps2 cards anyway which freemcboot needs I think

wooden rose
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Ah yeah it seems to be too big

abstract drift
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there's an exploit for the ps2 these days that you use to bootstrap from a dvd-r

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freedvdboot or something

wooden rose
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Oh, neat

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That would do

abstract drift
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use that, make yourself freemcboot, and so on

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or just get freemcboot off ebay its mega cheap

wooden rose
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I left my copy of Action Replay home - it's also trashed and hard to get working lol

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True

oblique frost
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I've got a modbo'd slim around here somewhere I could use to make freemcbooties

abstract drift
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there's also options now to do that other exploit

wooden rose
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Oh, well if you can make me one, I'll buy you a beer

abstract drift
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the one that like, makes your actual ps2 bios region free and stuff

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i've forgotten the name of it, only came out last year

wooden rose
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I could also just install a proper chip

abstract drift
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mechapwn

oblique frost
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would not suggest installing a "proper chip" all the softmods these days seem better

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modbo is a PITA

abstract drift
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yeah i'm not sure what my modbo really does for me anymore

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it made bootstrapping everything really easy

wooden rose
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Well I've always done softmodding and such, but never used a modchip in a PS2

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I was pretty big into the scene back in the day

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Before FreeMcBoot, I used Action Replay and some disk swap utility together with a network initialization disk I got from Sony for free

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That particular disk had a maxed out TOC

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So it was perfect for swapping

abstract drift
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hopefully someday we get a more perfect OPL or even a whole ODE or something

wooden rose
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Action Replay had a feature to launch any arbitrary elf from USB

abstract drift
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ps2 really deserves better than the mess we have rn

wooden rose
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Also it's pretty wild, I don't know any other unlicensed disks that run on PS2

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Yeah, it is a treasure trove of great games

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I forgot the story of Action Replay MAX

abstract drift
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at least we get hdmi mod for it soon apparently

wooden rose
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I don't remember how they managed to make disks that worked on unmodded PS2

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Less-than-legal probably

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Sadly the disk's material quality is quite bad, and mine has stopped working due to scratches and such

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I have buffed it many times, it cannot be done again

abstract drift
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the ps2 laser isn't the most bulletproof either

wooden rose
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Correct yeah

abstract drift
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esp if you've had it reading dvdrs

wooden rose
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I did get particularly high quality ones for backup stuff

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Cause it was notoriously fuzzy

oblique frost
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I remember the days of taking apart my phatty ps2 every so often to clean the laser to get it to read retail disks

abstract drift
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its weird how underserved ps2 is really compared to other retro consoles

wooden rose
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I cleaned my slim laser quite a bit, but that's easier ofc

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Probably cause people don't largely consider it retro yet

abstract drift
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no ode, no hdmi mod (so far), only clones of clones of old chips available, no replacement dvd drives, no replacement psus

wooden rose
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Give it a few years

abstract drift
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yeah

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i hope anyway

wooden rose
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I think these things usually happen when people who grew up with a console in their formative years grow into late 20s or so

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Then you get this resurgence in the scene

abstract drift
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compare to xbox or gamecube though

wooden rose
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Xbox was always very hackable

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GameCube has the Nintendo perk

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PS2 does have stuff like running games from USB, but last I tried it (well over a decade ago), compatibility was somewhat spotty

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And slow ofc

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oh right, OPL does that

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I don't remember what I used in the late 00s early 10s

oblique frost
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didn't someone come up with network loading on ps2? which should be faster than usb I think

wooden rose
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Yeah, that has been a thing for a long time afaik

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It's better than HDD some say

oblique frost
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well if you've got a slim it's either network or usb, no expansion for hdd

wooden rose
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Considering I have a server now, it's a real option

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Yeah that is true

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I did actually play online with my old slim

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Surprisingly pretty good looking back

oblique frost
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I remember once playing DDR SuperNova online with my slim

wooden rose
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I played Battlefield 2: Modern Combat

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Real good game honestly

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Singleplayer has this cool little gimmick where you can switch to another soldier to play if you can see them

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It also switches when you die

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Online was really well done too

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graphics look great too imo, for PS2 that is

shut escarp
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THPS3 was my online crack ps2 game

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Auto modellista got a lot of online play too

shut escarp
hidden prism
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I can’t find any of my old questions

solemn turtle
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it's possible that it was on the classic gaming discord which hosted MiSTer discussions before this place was formed

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if you really think it was 3+ years ago

oblique frost
dry drift
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CG discord is still there as well

hidden prism
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Sorry, I see now that it’s the search being flaky (at least on mobile). I must be thinking of Smoke’s@discord server or RetroRGB and not this one. At this point, it’s equally likely my memory is just faulty and I apologize.

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When I first joined these hardcore retro gaming servers, I remember asking about lots of possibilities that I saw and getting quite a lot of negative feedback. I’m probably conflating who said what where, but I remember those initial impressions because the first PSX Patreon was such a surprise after that.

dry drift
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I was on smoke’s server so probably not there but yet maybe retrorgb

slow tusk
slow tusk
hidden prism
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I think in a few of these communities, the long-time constituents can also sometimes speak beyond their knowledge. This happens all the time in the jailbreak and emulation communities, where power users make all kinds of incorrect statements about what is and isn’t possible, even though none of them could describe DMA transfer timing or bus contention

slow tusk
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As a non-power user, I can tell you misinformation without a question of doubt that N64 will eventually work on de10 nano

hidden prism
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That’s not to say they aren’t without any hard-won knowledge, but they start to confuse themselves with implementers sometimes 😉

abstract drift
slow tusk
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Hahaha

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I think it's so funny that it's come up enough that there's an infographic

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Like an airplane safety panel

dry drift
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If I’m telling you something it’s because we’ve discussed it pretty extensively and it’s been researched - which is not at all to say I’m never wrong. I was wrong about 32X, hopefully wrong about Saturn, maybe some other things. But not about PSX.

abstract drift
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we could use some stickers about stuff you actually can do 🙂

dry drift
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The main thing was I didn’t want to have misleading expectations and have people think mister would be like software emulation and everything would come.

abstract drift
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it was the hot topic for a long time, since we just didn't really know for sure exactly where the line was

slow tusk
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I definitely see it being much simpler just to say "no" than to have the same technical explanation multiple times a day/week to people that don't absorb the effort or wouldn't appreciate the explanation

dry drift
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We knew the line was a little bit beyond PSX and definitely not Dreamcast or PSP or PS2

slow tusk
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Speaking of MiSTer and software emulation, wasn't RetroArch supposed to have some kind of front end on it?

abstract drift
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i was a bit surprised that DS turned out impossible

slow tusk
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Or did that diaf?

dry drift
stoic meadow
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In terms of what's still remaining on the edge of possible, I'd say it's probably Namco's System 11 being that it's based on PSX and given the current maturity of the PSX core, could be considered nearest-neighbour. That said, most of what was on that board is already there on PSX so the appetite for that is probably low.

slow tusk
abstract drift
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cps3 will probably be pushing it

dry drift
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The real issue with System 11 is that it would be a different developer to explore it

abstract drift
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on the memory front

dry drift
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If Saturn comes without compromise then CPS3 probably will also

slow tusk
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How much further would you say we probably have to go before we tap out on available resources?

abstract drift
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its hard to imagine much beyond saturn/cps3

dry drift
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PSX is maxing out but has a lot of nice features

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Anyway we all know who the person is who will push the edge of what is possible 🙂

abstract drift
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basketsnake?

dry drift
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Yes

abstract drift
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oh sorry i thought you said decent

dry drift
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Basket snake

slow tusk
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I haven't seen any talk about actual interest - are core devs interested in the MiSTer project evolving to a different FPGA, costs be damned?

dry drift
slow tusk
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We all know sorg just needs to decide on one and everyone will follow

abstract drift
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you can get a board to do n64 for like... about $1500 iirc?

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and it wouldn't do dreamcast or anything

dry drift
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My feeling is if you build it people will come but a lot of people are not looking forward to the smaller user base

abstract drift
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i'd buy it but i have poor impulse control

slow tusk
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Same

abstract drift
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it'd be a lot to even ask developers to spend that much tbh

dry drift
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It’s really a chicken and egg situation

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No audience so no development; no development so no audience

stoic meadow
# dry drift The real issue with System 11 is that it would be a different developer to explo...

Yep, I imagine given that the System 11 was a prototype PSX in essence, there are probably more than enough architectural differences for it to be quite a headache. I imagine Robert's work could help solve some issues and provide guidance, but it'd likely be a case of a ground-up rewrite with some elements pulled in, rather than the reverse.

As we already know there's not been a whole tonne of board-level reverse engineering done on these 3D-age arcade systems in the FPGA world.

System 22 would be nice and is older and weaker on paper, though a little more complex architecturally from my understanding. Still, there's a fair bit of content there that's not available in a half-decent form elsewhere, so that could be appealing to someone. It'll be a long time before someone has the time and skill to take that on though I'm sure.

shut escarp
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8 misters linked for tokyo wars here we come 2024

stoic meadow
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Oof ignore that, just realised the twin DSP's on System 22 are beefy as hell for the time.

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That explains with Namco's early 90's racing cabs sounded better than everything else at the time and for the next 8-10 years or so. 😂

stoic meadow
shut escarp
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that was one of the biggest spectacles of an arcade setup for sure

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my D&B had it for a long ass time

slow tusk
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That would be amazing

subtle dragon
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Like it's not Model 2-level ofc but I thought it was a bit high

hidden prism
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I am always curious about the hairy edges of what’s possible on constrained hardware, so I’m very curious where one would actually hit a ceiling in reality versus hypothetically

hidden prism
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SH2 in the Saturn core opens up some interesting computer stuff also

wooden rose
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I still think it would be kinda cool to have a fantasy system on MiSTer, composed of hardware that really pushes the FPGA to its limits

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Question is, would people program games and such for it?

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Basically, designing a custom console that never existed

dry drift
wooden rose
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Fun, I guess. I would if it existed

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But it is very niche yes

dry drift
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Most people would rather have more than ten people play their game

wooden rose
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True...

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I also was thinking of a hypothetical RPG Maker core, which is also kind of silly

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I looked online and the first result is a guy named Matt asking about it

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@hidden prism this you? https://forums.rpgmakerweb.com/index.php?threads/matts-intro.16093/

RPG Maker Forums
Matt's Intro

Hello, I'm Matt, and I downloaded RPG Maker VX Ace (30 day trial) about an hour ago. I have about an hour of experience making RPGs and I really look forward to making a few games with my kids, which is what started this.

I have a question that I want to append here, as I can't decide which...

summer sage
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making a game engine is really a software task

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doing it in HDL is not only tedious and largely ineffective, but also pointless

wooden rose
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Oh I agree, the thing I was talking about would be a fantasy console more than an engine

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Unless you mean RPG Maker which, yes thats right

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That's one of the reasons why I think it's silly

tacit fox
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PICO-8 core when

oblique frost
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we have a chip8 core, which is like the original fantasy console

summer sage
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pico-8 is a scripting language and closed source, although there's partial open source clones of it

wooden rose
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Shame it isn't entirely open

hidden prism
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Nope, that’s not me 🙂

oak atlas
wooden rose
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You probably can do that already with EasyRPG

hidden prism
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I love the person’s message, though — I’m definitely thinking about how to introduce Punball Construction Set and things like RPG Maker to my 7 year old

wooden rose
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That's why I thought it was you haha

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And he went straight into "what would be the requirements?"

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When I have kids I want to get them interested in game dev too

hidden prism
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She’s already done a bunch of symbolic coding stuff (Osmo, Scratch Jr, Plugo, etc) and some Turtle/Logo coding

wooden rose
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Fun stuff

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As a kid I did a bit of Turtle stuff too, this V-Tech laptop I had had a version of it

hidden prism
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I am more thinking of the skill of how to break down a problem and iterate on the solution

wooden rose
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Looking back, that's quite amazing for the time period

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Well that comes with the territory I suppose

hidden prism
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but knowing how much work goes into a game, like knowing how film effects work, is also a good way to attain a deeper appreciation

waxen elk
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I'm hoping pico-8 open sources at some point, great prototyping tool

hidden prism
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I thought pico8 was so cool, then I learned it wasn’t OSS and I was then confused why it had such a following

wooden rose
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cute 8-bit graphics p much

hidden prism
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(was re: old person yelling at clouds)

waxen elk
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the dev is pretty nice and practically gives it away in pretty much every bundle imaginable

hidden prism
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In terms of hypothetical things to model in FPGA, is there an implementation of Knuth’s MMIX yet?

waxen elk
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I like open source, but devs gotta eat too

oblique frost
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I think TIC-80 is the open sauce one people tend to go for

waxen elk
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They should be allowed to make that choice

wooden rose
hidden prism
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With Patreon, Ko-fi, GitHub sponsors, and farming yourself out as a contractor, it’s never been easier to have a pretty good living with pure OSS engagement — depending on your needs

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Closed source does not equal cash flow

wooden rose
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The hard part is succeeding at getting that initial traction

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It's a risk

waxen elk
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If you bought the first ever humble bundle or voxatron, you have pico-8 which was a fun surprise

wooden rose
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I'd love to do OSS "professionally", and make a living off Patreon and such, but I would still need to do contract jobs for Japanese companies in particular if I am to stay in Japan

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You don't qualify as freelancer here if you don't work for Japanese companies and make at least around 1500 USD in contract work a month

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Once you satisfy that threshold you can do whatever else you want

waxen elk
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Not having a patreon also means you can develop your software without as much time pressure, you pay for the software as is and when it gets updates it gets updates

wooden rose
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I think it's fine to do so

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Although I am not a fan of how many products are sold as time-limited licenses, e.g. no updates after a year

visual depot
waxen elk
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I don't mind paying if it's affordable and I'm getting a full product out of it, that subscription crap can go to hell

wooden rose
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Yeah, sadly it's so prevalent....

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Especially on mobile

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I once bought an app and it sprung a subscription upon me for the "full unlocked feature set"

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I promptly uninstalled it and got a refund

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Also stuff like Termius, a terminal emulator for iOS and Android. For "Pro" it only has a subscription mode as well

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Now why would I pay a subscription for a terminal emulator...

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no thanks

visual depot
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because it's the best terminal emulator on Android and it's stupid cheap ($6 a year dude. Come on)

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It has phenomenal keyboard functionality for an Android terminal app

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that's like $0.50 a month... really not a lot

wooden rose
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Oh per year? I am stupid then

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I misread and thought it was per month

visual depot
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oh lol

wooden rose
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Okay, maybe I will look into it again

visual depot
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that's fair then

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Yeah that would sound bad haha

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I don't think a terminal app could survive with $6/month license, as that would get no sales

wooden rose
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I wonder...

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There's people flush with cash enough

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Anyway, getting way off-topic

visual depot
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😛

hidden prism
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I always think about the support aspect as a source of ongoing cost for the app developer. Helping people debug terminal emulation issues is instant sainthood IMO

tropic stratus
tropic stratus
abstract drift
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oh interesting

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$250 is less than a n64 hdmi mod + everdrive

slender junco
rare gyro
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I bet that if people start developing N64, DS, Pentium, and whatever else on Kria, it'll pick up popularity

full nimbus
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all of those are immensely difficult to do. A Pentium is years of effort. As you progress up the generations the effort required increases.

rare gyro
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oh yeah, without a doubt

full nimbus
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plus you get to the stage where is there really anything on a pentium that a modern PC cant play perfectly well

rare gyro
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there is some work already done for DS and N64

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which could perhaps be ported over

full nimbus
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The DE10 with its HDMI and IO is near perfect, The Higher boards that are cheap miss these features

lost summit
rare gyro
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yeah, so you'd better still keep your de10 nano. but for plenty of people, $250 isn't a whole lot, to get cores which call for a more powerful board.

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heck some people spend that much on just a case

quick gyro
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it doesnt help much to split the community. if not many people switch from the Mister to the new device or buy both, will there be motivation for the developers to start creating cores for it?. Its like FPGAzumSpass said once, if nobody or almost nobody uses what you create, its hard to stay motivated for long to keep developing it.

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so i guess a successor has to be able to to what the de10 can do now and then also be more powerful

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i would love DS and N64 cores but im not sure if i would buy a new device for it right now that then cant do the previous cores

tacit fox
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For me personally, MiSTer already covers 100% of the consoles I have nostalgia for. For everything else (PS2, DC, N64, etc), I'm really thinking about getting a Series S running emulators on it

tropic stratus
iron abyss
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I hope a good candidate board comes along someday and Robert is still interested, DS & N64 would be cool. I could even see buying that board for just those. (Well if the N64 core could output analog to a tube that is) People spend $250 on all sorts of dumber things in retro.

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People spend $250 to buy Earthbound

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Cmon! 😉

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It doesn’t even split the community if it can’t do the other systems. It’s all win. Sorg can get practice making a framework in Xilinx in case that’s better very long term.

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More of a sidekick than a replacement, a Robin to misters Batman. Are you sold? This message sponsored by AMD

scenic reef
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SDRAM over fiber definitely doesn't seem impossible as long as the SFP+ port can be controlled directly by the FPGA side I would think.

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There are huge datacenters with shared DDR4/5 over SFP+ already so the bandwidth and connector isn't an issue, just the latency.

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Also that robotics one has 4x ethernet, but ethernet as a standard would be nowhere near the latency required I think.

solemn turtle
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The DE-10 Nano will eventually have an end of life too and that point anyone new to the hobby will be forced to go with something else.

tropic stratus
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@scenic reef there are some low pin count memories that could fit at least the needs of NES and SNES. The mega65 is also using one of these

quick gyro
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i know but i talked about Kria, if we could get N64 and DS on this board but it could not run many cores the Mister can run now, it would kind of be a split and i think that would maybe not make it a success

scenic reef
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The thing that makes an FPGA platform a success in a post-MiSTer world is going to be the software side of things and how accommodating the development ecosystem is to developers. If the cores are there and the price is under $1000 there will be plenty of people buying into it.

tropic stratus
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overall it seems strange to use a board with newer FPGA, fast technology and then being forced to do compromises from the very start because not enough pins...

scenic reef
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It's because the market for these boards seems to be machine vision and modern automation, they have two camera connectors that are modern direct connected to the fpga

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I've seen this with other new ones too, also PMOD is becoming more popular, and having SDRAM on a module is in lower use now with the boards that have HPS equivalents because DDR3/4 and bigger BRAM should be sufficient for most development projects.

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I think any real MiSTer successor would likely be an eventual Cyclone VI release on a DE10-Nano successor or a custom board with a Cyclone VI.

tropic stratus
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also i have to say, i'm not super happy about the fpga size of the kria. It's only 30% more than mister has for logic. For a potential successor i would hope for 2x size minimum

scenic reef
tropic stratus
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the nexys video i used for DS devlopment has the same logic size as the kria and i already ran into a wall when adding dev tools to the core and it was still missing 3D...

subtle dragon
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Wouldn’t be surprised if we just never get a successor at all

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And it’s just MiSTer/DE-10 Nano forever

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Or at least for a very, very long time

scenic reef
#

It looks like twice as much because they say it has 256k "logic cells", but the way Xilinx calculates that number is like 30-50% boosted compared to the way Intel calculates their "logic elements".

#

Also, Vivado is just not a friendly dev environment, personally from the perspective as an amateur. Maybe the industry pros like yourself have a different opinion. To me it's horribly confusing and a mess.

#

The install for Vivado just to target the Kria is as large as the largest AAA games 😄

tropic stratus
#

there is a nice dev board using the 2x as big ultrascale zynq with a dedicated ram slot, which could fit a real ddr4 module ... OR ... a selfmade sdram module 😉

#

unfortunatly it's 1500$ currently. Was 999$ 2 years ago

#

but either way, still too expensive for a community project like mister

#

maybe in 5 years we have that power in the 200-500$ range

quick gyro
#

i got friends that told me last year they will buy a mister once its a bit cheaper and now its way more expensive than last year. kind of sad that some people just have to hold back already

dry drift
#

I told em not to wait 🙂

scenic reef
#

If you buy a psx modded with ps1digital + xstation it's probably about the same price as a misteraddons kit

quick gyro
#

i told them too but they dont listen to me 😄

summer sage
wooden rose
scenic reef
summer sage
#

just like the de10 isn't really the cost of mister, the dev kit isn't the cost of the kria

quick gyro
#

i kind of hope terasic creates something

scenic reef
#

the support for the kria board is not great either, i opened a ticket months ago when i first got it about the TPM errors and heard nothing back

wooden rose
#

Because they do sell these locally at nice prices

lost summit
#

is a more sophisticated I/O board with SDRAM and a second FPGA could be some kind of evolution of the project ?

scenic reef
wooden rose
#

shame...

summer sage
#

intel is overdue to release a new generation of budget fpgas like the cyclone v

scenic reef
#

Vivado is a really dumb mess to work with from my perspective so I wouldn't waste the money. The main reason I got the Kria was to explore machine vision opportunities at work and to get it before it went out of stock.

wooden rose
#

I could see it happen, in a round-about way projects like MiSTer are good for Intel too

scenic reef
#

In the end, if you want to do machine vision stuff I would get an Nvidia Jetson Nano instead.

wooden rose
#

Perpetually out of stock here and extremely expensive for whatever reason

#

But machine vision wouldn't be something I would play with much, so it might be a bit of a waste for me

scenic reef
wooden rose
#

Ah maybe after clearing up my house trash problem

#

I can't use the printer atm

scenic reef
#

yeah do that first 😛

wooden rose
#

It's the toughest thing to do in my life currently

#

Anyway, some day maybe there will be a DE20-Nano or something

#

I am not sure how the margins are for Terasic, I thought they were quite slim but I may be mistaken

scenic reef
#

For the DE10-Nano? I suspect the margins are slim but they sell a ton of them compared to their more expensive boards no doubt. You need both the bread and the butter, they sell other products that are obviously very high margin.

wooden rose
#

Yeah for the DE10-Nano

tropic stratus
#

how is the price going for the smaller fpga retro gaming boards? i don't really follow them...

scenic reef
#

Most are sold out, some the price is going up. There is a new batch of MiST boards being made, possibly the last.

#

I think the ZX-Uno might just be totally out of stock, lemme see again, it was for months.

#

the issue with them is the Cyclone IV they usually use is just out of stock everywhere

#

yeah antonio still has the zx-uno in stock, still cheap at 105 euros

#

zx uno uses a spartan XC6SLX9-2TQG144C which... lemme see the stats, i don't think it has that much

tropic stratus
#

oh well, that is super small

#

my first FPGA dev board i got in 2008 or so was double size

scenic reef
#

yup, i'm surprised they can fit as many cores as they do

#

not having hdmi video helps

#

snes will probably never come to that, and I don't think they have Genesis for it

tropic stratus
#

hdmi doesn't cost much if you only allow integer scaling 😅

scenic reef
#

😛

#

yeah i mean if the HDMI was just doing 720p/1080p out by default or something it would probably be much slimmer

#

then make it always use vsync 1 to save space as well

summer sage
#

HDMI still needs a transceiver if you want decent resolutions

tropic stratus
#

anything above 1080p for sure

summer sage
#

i'd consider any board without a transceiver chip "not really hdmi" because it's going to be loaded with troubles

wooden rose
#

sometime ago someone posted an open-source FPGA dev board with an open alternative to the HDMI standard, I can't remember what it was called

scenic reef
#

If the whole scaler could be fit on a smaller low power fpga (which it probably could), you could have one SoCFPGA for the cores and other stuff and the separate fpga for the scaler connected to an hdmi IC directly,

tropic stratus
#

the problem with that is the small low power FPGA cannot do highres scaling due to the required high clock, at least on the pins...

#

on mister i think the scaler is running higher clock than any core uses internally

#

it would be nice for building cores to not route this every time 🙂

wooden rose
#

Is such a thing possible? Like, pre-assembling a module

scenic reef
#

or even a cheaper non-SoC FPGA, not necessarily low power

wooden rose
#

I guess if you had a board with two FPGAs, you could dedicate one to scaling

scenic reef
wooden rose
#

Ah, neat

scenic reef
#

but it will hurt your ability to do full system testing

#

so it can have some drawbacks

#

you do design partitioning, however when you do this it will not do fitting optimization as broadly and you can be designing sub-optimally by accident as a result

wooden rose
#

Reads a lot like what we do in software land

scenic reef
#

in modern cpu design this is common, it's called floor planning

#

well you floor plan anyways, but this is like a quartus compiler method of implementing floor planning more rigidly

#

so to speak

wooden rose
#

AMD then, ofc, has chiplets

scenic reef
#

well within each chiplet is a floor planned design with partitions on the AMD chips

wooden rose
#

of course, yeah

#

i gotta restudy most of the hardware stuff i knew

#

been so long, i've forgotten

#

Most of what I learnt was in the context of software performance, e.g. cache-friendly coding, pipelining memory access

scenic reef
#

AMD Zen 2 Ryzen 5 3600 x-ray scan for example, you can physically see the partitioning somewhat.

48258310027_43ce166462_o.jpg
wooden rose
#

The compilers do a lot for you, but they don't know context very well

#

Oh yea

#

this part stands out to me

image.png
#

also in that picture it looks like the bottom-right has an unpopulated space for another one of these chips

scenic reef
#

yes

wooden rose
#

Is that cache?

scenic reef
#

the generalization keeps costs down, chiplets help with that, people noted on a recent 7xxx series that they sometimes install a half-activated chiplet into another slot, so there are like two variations of the same cpu to use of the silicon and cut costs due to broader binning

wooden rose
#

That's not new to AMD actually

scenic reef
#

chiplet design in general is paying dividends

wooden rose
#

Or well, chiplet is

scenic reef
#

sure, but i mean instead of installing 2 chiplets they install 3 chiplets

subtle dragon
#

They also just came out with RDNA3

scenic reef
#

anyways this is off topic

abstract drift
rare gyro
#

I wish this were a real game

stoic meadow
# subtle dragon I thought System 22 was _way_ more complex than PSX

Yeah I commented again a few minutes late after rechecking. The PSX has more sophisticated and better clocked core processors, but are architecturally laid out in a way more accessible way from what I can tell.

System 22 is using less sophisticated architectural components, but architecturally looks to be more complex. At a glance and from a laypersons perspective, it looks to me as if the dual DSP's would likely be the most performance-prohibitive components to replicate in an FPGA implementation.

tender tartan
#

And before someone comes up with the idea to implement System 22 without sound; the DSPs are the GPUs of the system, in modern parlance

subtle dragon
#

Huh, okay

hidden prism
#

look at the trend in Sega's hardware division at the time: Genesis -> 32X -> Saturn (complexity choke point), System 16 -> 18 -> 22 (complexity choke point)

#

not to take away from their technical achievements, but from a lifecycle/sustainability perspective, other folks were doing better

ornate walrus
#

I believe the unpopular opinion is that the dual SDRAM could push the mister a bit further. New hardware will take a while to be cheap and available. DE10 is the sweet spot and it will be for a while now, folks. N64 can wait.

iron abyss
#

Yeah Sega sucked at hardware but the risks they took and the things they pulled off with model 1 & 2 in the arcade changed the game

#

Sony only decided to do a 3D focused system after seeing what Sega was doing in the arcade

ornate walrus
iron abyss
#

Yeah agreed, they changed the game and then proceeded to lose 😉

hidden prism
#

I wouldn’t say they “sucked”, but they limited their own success in several dimensions

#

undeniable game design, art, and music synergy

#

and yes, internal competition at the cost of a conscious high level strategy often leads to suboptimal outcomes. As an employee of several consumer electronics orgs that spanned oceans, it does seem to be a pattern — but mostly on the US side

#

(IME)

wooden rose
#

A catalogue of all released games from start to December 2004

#

Comes with two disks (one for PSX one for PS2) that contain loads of save data

#

These disks have been dumped of course, but it is cool

shut escarp
#

This is super handy for like fighting game saves with all the chars unlocked and things of that nature

abstract drift
#

i think that was a pin in the old channel

#

we should probably pull over the best of the pins

summer sage
#

I had lots of problems with that pack, at least getting it to work

#

maybe it's better now, it's been some time since I last tried

shut escarp
#

It’s just a big folder of MCD save files that I dropped in my PsX folder so if I don’t want to use the auto created card I can easily navigate to it and find the respective game

#

Not all of the save files in it are necessarily or the same quality so you may have just hit a few duds on games you tried to load

tropic stratus
#

anyone knows if this loading screen with spinning letters in SOTN is normal behavior?

austere otter
#

I miss Pezz´s videos

austere otter
tropic stratus
#

for me it is only with small waves like this

austere otter
#

yeah, its like you said. The small waves

tropic stratus
#

maybe i'm hunting ghosts here....

full nimbus
#

vampires

austere otter
#

where did you see the weird spinning loading?

#

also, what region is it behaving like that?

tropic stratus
#

"You can actually spin the loading screen with the d-pad!"

#

you learn something every day 🙂

austere otter
#

oh shit

tropic stratus
#

i usually don't press buttons on loading screens...not sure why. Maybe i still think this can crash the computer, haha

austere otter
strong hatch
#

did you ever realize these rooms are also for loading between areas? it even says CD with a little disc at the top. I didn't pick up on that for a really long time lol

00-CD.png
shut escarp
#

Yup. Intended lol, been doing thst for 20 years

ember cedar
strong hatch
#

that is valid, it just depends on when it checks the sticks for determining what neutral is

west storm
#

I'd expect a lot of games would have implemented mini games during loading screens if Capcom Namco hadn't patented the idea and prevented others from doing it. They first did it for Ridge Racer on the PSX. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2015/12/loading-screen-game-patent-finally-expires

Electronic Frontier Foundation
The Loading Screen Game Patent Finally Expires

In 1998, the U.S. Patent and Trademark Office issued Patent 5,718,632, on a method for avoiding “unnecessary wastage of time” in video games. What’s transpired in the 17 years since then can best be described as an unnecessary wastage of time. Namco’s patent covers “auxiliary games” that a player...

strong hatch
#

namco

#

but yeah, the patent expired as loading screens became less of a thing too

#

basically gone now

visual depot
#

that's interesting because Smash Bros Brawl let you practice fights while loading for a match online...

bitter lintel
#

daily sotn checks i see

ivory verge
#

Yeah, sotn for life

strong hatch
#

I really gotta finish my fist weapon only run I started a few months ago, I'm just about at the inverted castle

mystic violet
# tropic stratus

oh man - why do I see this now 😄 I thought you were trolling us 😄 yes the d-pad can control the loading screen 😄

serene nebula
#

I never knew that!

mystic violet
#

left and right moves the corers left or right and up down drag the corners up or down

#

you and even fold the text over itself 😄

twin walrus
vernal sundial
#

some ps1 games have some wild music player modes

#

devs put wacky visualizers in sometimes

#

i don't know if anyone has compiled a bunch of them yet

twin walrus
#

this is currently the only game I know that has a dedicated music player that goes in-game. most other games typically have to go into attract mode but that requires waiting.

tropic stratus
#

67 Mhz version of the PSX core. Please only use for tests/fun and don't report bugs for it. CPU is always running at double clock speed in this special version, you cannot select/change it!

📎 PSX2XCPU.rbf
ivory verge
#

♥️

#

Feel the power ! 😁

terse pollen
#

Should both be ~4mb? Perhaps the Patreon download didn't go well

ivory verge
#

@terse pollen Patreon one is zipped to 2mb

#

🤨

pearl shell
#

It is hard to believe that this time last year the core didn't have sound and now it has a 2nd CPU 🙂 thank you so much Robert

ivory verge
#

@summer sage can you please pin this ? #1046940919607345272 message

dry drift
ivory verge
#

thanks 🙂

abstract drift
#

fun

#

i can't believe star wars darkforces runs so badly even with the cpu doubled

ivory verge
#

😄

abstract drift
#

they should never of released it

#

duke3d on the other hand, LOVES it. i think its mostly 60fps now (fps counter doesn't work in duke3d so have to guess)

#

quake2 not seeing a huge improvement, gpu limited i guess?

#

thats easily the best version of duke3d now. running miles better than the pc version does on ao486

#

@tropic stratus when vertical crop is engaged could you skip rendering pixels that are going to get cropped anyway? for gpu limited cases

tropic stratus
#

let me see, i doubt it's really gpu bound

abstract drift
#

maybe they had a hard cap in as a backstop around 45 fps or something

#

silent hill sparodically hits 60fps now and also various loading screens go insanely faster 😄

tropic stratus
#

i wonder how you even get 45. For me 40 is max

#

you can see if it's gpu bound if you go for 24bit + widescreen. if fps don't drop, it's not gpu bound

abstract drift
#

it may of not exceeded 40 actually yeah

forest trench
hallow plinth
#

Any examples of good frame unlocked games I can test?

#

Is the cpu clock speed selected using the turbo option?

tropic stratus
#

there is no select, it's baked into this special core

#

you can activate turbo additionally

#

i mainly tested with revolt, shadowman and diablo

terse pollen
terse pollen
tropic stratus
#

loading times are mostly slow due to CD. Data is copied with DMA anyway, so the CPU speed shouldn't make much of a difference

waxen elk
#

Kings Field 1 (us) would be a great test

tropic stratus
#

normal vs turbo high vs 2x+turbo high

grafik.png
abstract drift
#

kings field?

#

oh, yeah ofc it is

waxen elk
#

Oh damn.

abstract drift
#

does anyone feel like a google sheet thats just a list of games that work really well on the 2x core?

waxen elk
#

After the pal release, it was discovered the game was designed for 20 fps on ntsc, but it rarely came close to that.

willow sundial
waxen elk
#

I plan on checking with master edition of PSX Doom, it came really close to locked 30 fps on turbo

#

https://www.doomworld.com/forum/topic/101161-gec-master-edition-psx-doom-for-the-playstation-beta-4-released-11162022/

Doomworld
[GEC] Master Edition PSX Doom for the PlayStation. Beta 4 Released ...

PlayStation Doom: Master Edition. DoomWiki page by @Dark Pulse Finally, Beta 4 is released NEWS: Fourth Beta Release PSXDOOM BETA 4 [11/16/2022]. NEWS: PSP Beta 4 Release : PSP_PSXDOOM_MASTERED_BETA_4 (397MB). Conversion by @Kroc This version isnt more than a hack of the original PSXDoom game. On...

abstract drift
#

interesting

#

i wonder if we could romhack framerate caps into more games

abstract drift
#

is it as good as it sounds?

waxen elk
#

Yeah, if you like PSX Doom and want more, it's got everything, even the Romero and sigil maps

abstract drift
#

what do they mean by dualshock support?

#

has it got like... modern-ish controls?

waxen elk
#

It has the capability, but you'll have to remap the buttons

#

2x cpu and medium turbo is a locked 30 on sigil which is pretty incredible

abstract drift
#

thats awesome, i don't think ao486 can manage that even with fastdoom and 100mhz

waxen elk
#

Well in parts, still 20 fps depending on where you look

#

Still leagues better than what it once was

abstract drift
#

very cool

#

has it still got the psx music and sfx ?

waxen elk
#

Yep

abstract drift
#

someone should port fastdoom to psx 😄

#

its like, 100% faster than regular dos doom

waxen elk
#

Knowing the doom community I wouldn't be surprised if that's already underway

tulip moat
#

A lesser known game I want to test out with the double speed CPU core is the Japan-only game Ganbare Goemon: Kuru Nara Koi! Ayashige Ikka no Kuroi Kage

That game is a bit of an anomaly, since it tries to go for 60FPS while also running in the PlayStation's 480i resolution. It's one of the weaker Goemon games sadly, but at least it's a technical curiosity.

tulip moat
#

Okay so I don't know if this is a bug or not, but I've been noticing a lot of desyncs while playing PS1 games. It turns out that for some reason, the refresh rate is off-sync and I don't know why.

Any suggestions to fix this?

20221214_080323.jpg
ivory verge
tulip moat
#

Yes.

ivory verge
#

your vscale settings ?

tulip moat
#

Currently the vscale mode I'm using is Integer Resolution Scaling.

#

Again I'm thinking it's a bug, since I don't have this problem with the other cores.

ivory verge
#

try vscale 1 or 2

ivory verge
tulip moat
#

So I changed it to vscale 0, and now it is syncing like it should.

I didn't even know Integer Resolution Scaling had that refresh rate quirk.

ivory verge
#

psx is "heavy" for resolution switch

#

vscale 1 should works fine too

#

I guess there is no rule, a lot depends on the tv/monitor how it handles

abstract drift
#

psx switches resolutions way more often than really any other core

#

vrr might help them go faster

#

i mean, even aside from 480i->240p switching, the horizontal resolutions changing all the time too

#

the refresh rate thing your seeing is normal though, that readout just isn't accurate

tulip moat
#

Thing is that it was desyncing just randomly. It had nothing to do with the resolution changes, and I deliberately set both the vertical and horizontal lines to fixed in order to prevent that.

#

And yes I had VRR on. I made sure to keep that on in order to prevent screen tearing or stuttering.

serene nebula
tropic stratus
#

sure

#

Re-Volt with all enhancements on isn't bad now 🙂

tropic stratus
tulip moat
#

A little trick I do with the widescreen hack is that I deliberately leave it on the 3:2 setting so that it fills out the 4:3 setting on my monitor.

I did this because setting the horizontal lines to fixed doesn't fill out the 4:3. So far I haven't seen any glitches related to this, so I just leave it on.

tropic stratus
#

in some games it will not work, e.g. Spyro or shadowman will produce glitches at the edges even with 3:2 unfortunatly

wooden rose
#

Neat, gotta try out the double CPU thing

subtle dragon
terse pollen
#

Just tried the 2x core with Tenchu and G-Darius.
I get a noticeable boost with Tenchu, up to 45fps but G-Darius... it's so good to see it running at a fixed 60fps

mystic violet
#

wait where is this core?

lost summit
#

it is pinned !

mystic violet
#

derp thanks

tropic stratus
#

didn't upload it to the testbuilds, because it's so special, it makes no sense everyone is using it without thinking about what it does

mystic violet
#

true

#

if they use this and then run the 'official' core they compain 'it slowed down!'

#

althought most of the time you wouldn't notice

#

does turbo work? 😛

tropic stratus
#

you more or less want turbo high all the time with the 2x core. 2x clock speed alone is doing about as much as turbo high in the normal core, so it's pointless to switch to 2x without using turbo there

mystic violet
#

wow 😉 (sorry no audio recorded)

tropic stratus
#

must be some SOTN insider?

mystic violet
#

well normally when the power up appears it slows down

#

it's one of the worst slow downs on the PSX in my opinion

#

this goes buttery smooth

ivory verge
#

somehow it never bothered me , I thought in the 90s , that it was intentional 🙂

tropic stratus
#

it wouldn't bother me that much after the fight to risk using those hacks, but nice that it works smooth with it 😅

mystic violet
#

let's try your favorite - revolt 😄

#

perfect

#

but seriously - I don't over-steer anymore

#

much much better gameplay

tropic stratus
#

yes, you really need high fps in this game for better controls

twin walrus
hidden prism
#

Just beautiful, great work Robert! I love that you keep pushing out the boundaries to find the exact edge of what’s possible on this FPGA system

#

I’m really fascinated by the cache improvements, as I wonder if a decent enough L1 cache size and latency would allow some software that hypothetically needs higher clocks to perceptually operate the same due to fewer pipeline stalls

#

I don’t think it’s a “magic bullet”, but my fairly educated guess is that it does give some notable amount of net compute throughput headroom that may unlock other platforms

manic valley
#

Awww man ! I’m late to the party ! Getting new super psx core now!

twin walrus
#

what super psx core?

#

is it part of the update_all or separate?

mystic violet
#

pinned

ivory verge
#

Double speed clock cpu core

twin walrus
#

based

#

I wonder if I won't need Ridge Racer turbo disc with this for 60fps 😆

#

can I have full race grid instead of 1v1?

wooden rose
#

This isn't a psx core bug report but just something amusing. I managed to crash FF7 by entering the submarine and getting on my Chocobo on the same time - never seen that before

mystic violet
#

underwater chocobo didn't compute

manic valley
#

No crash with alien trilogy

#

Should we be reporting findings here ?

twin walrus
#

he said no reports

#

it's for fun

#

I forgot to ask earlier. Would hacking the PSX core like this allow for someone to just port arcade data into PS1 data?

#

although, I'm sure someone made mention that arcade hardware had slightly altered specs from PS1.

full nimbus
#

Its mostly to show that the PSX processor can be run at the speeds needed for the PS1 based Arcades

ivory verge
full nimbus
#

Robert has said he has no interest in Arcades, so it would be up to someone else to do the arcade version

manic valley
azure niche
#

Up to 40 FPS in the field and battles, too

manic valley
#

awwwww man let’s see what doom does!

rancid anchor
#

seems lots of games have locked framerates, ff9 battles are still 15 fps, blaster master is stuck at 20 fps

#

wonder how hard it would be to change this...

scenic reef
manic valley
#

I feel like the latest release basically equates to rock solid ever unfaltering frame rates

scenic reef
#

I think maybe the taito fx1-B was the one that would be the hardest

#

Multiple sound chips, two additional dsp's

manic valley
scenic reef
#

Taito G-NET might be tough because of the weird io

#

Simulating compact flash and CD PCMCIA interfaces, not sure how tough that would be.

tropic stratus
#

please don't report bugs for the 2x core...it's possible there are even problems not related to the higher clock speed, but real bugs due to different handling of external components, but i honestly don't want to put much time into this. If a game works it's fine, if not...well bad luck

#

i rather spend the time fixing bugs on the real core

manic valley
#

Sounds good !

tropic stratus
#

of course you can mention that games don't work with it so others are warned, just don't expect me to fix it 😅

manic valley
#

Only one so far that crashed was army men air attack II .. having a ton of fun experimenting, thanks a million for this release!

#

Also I would just like to mention that the fps doesn’t tank in the big open areas of ultimate doom and it’s awesome

manic valley
ivory verge
hollow stratus
#

@tropic stratus way to go. Messing up my whole video schedule with this sudden release 😉 awesome work (obv joking)

mystic violet
#

@hollow stratus it's not a release

#

just mention it's experimental else we'll get this channel flooded

hollow stratus
#

Oh I know. I always warn people it’s just for fun

#

I’ll do it next Thursday. What games should I be testing that best rep the diffs

#

I can pick some but I’m sure there are some good examples around

ivory verge
#

yeeaahhh and hundreds of bug reports in core on github 😛

hard laurel
#

PSX2 ?

ivory verge
lost summit
manic valley
#

Turn off fast cd seek though …

rich vault
#

@tropic stratus the issue seems to be gone in version 20221023.

twin walrus
#

Twisted Metal 2 at a steady 🤌

image.png
#

should be an inside joke emote 😆

crisp shale
# abstract drift quake2 not seeing a huge improvement, gpu limited i guess?

It uses pre-calculated data to help with the rendering AFAIK.
There was an article about this with some info from the devs a couple of years ago. I think such an article has vanished from the Internet nowadays though, like the one with Tomb Raider 1 devs talking about Sony helping them to profile the performance of the game and solve bottlenecks.

abstract drift
#

i think some of that stuff was in Official Playstation Magazine

vernal sundial
#

so i forgot but, for a consumer crt running composite, should I have "Dither 24 bit for VGA" off or on typically?

manic valley
#

You guys need to try rayman 2 with the new core 40fps solid

twin walrus
#

those are great time capsules

#

and PlayStation has had so many promotional discs.

summer sage
hidden mistBOT
#

twenty added with the name "twenty"

azure hatch
#

anyone keeping a list of games worth trying with the new 2x cpu core? bust a groove 2 and the jumping flash games are definintely my recommends

vernal sundial
#

in #1049874847330738286

azure hatch
#

got it!

twin walrus
shut escarp
#

thats my fav song from bust a groove

mystic violet
wooden rose
mystic violet
#

@wooden rose there is a general tread about this see the forums 🙂

tropic stratus
tropic stratus
crisp shale
#

When you go race in the more complex tracks, such as Venice Canals, even with the regular core maxed out, it can't keep a solid framerate. Sometimes still dipping to 20 fps.
While with the new core, it's mostly 30 fps in the entire track.

#

Much better!

#

I just beat the game using the experimental core, it seems to work great with Hydro Thunder.

tropic stratus
#

does the game have some kind of wave mechanic later on? i only tested it in the first level and found it sad they don't use the water much....well maybe i was too much hoping for a waverace clone

crisp shale
#

Not much. It does have like forward movement of the water that gives you a boost in spots but nothing special.
What's great about the PSX port is that it's really accurate to the arcade into the smallest details; including lighting and transparency effects.
You have a lot of see-through segments in the later tracks or stuff that in the N64 port, for example, reduced the draw distance in terms of texturing (you can notice it during very high jumps over the water).

For a game with wave mechanics, check Dead in the Water.

#

Here's a rather old video with poor quality that demonstrates it:

tropic stratus
#

thanks, will try that game 🙂

crisp shale
#

the title screen uses a very high res.

#

Another game that got better results was Jarret & Labonte Stock Car Racing (TOCA World Touring Cars).
When you race under rainy conditions, the performance is much better with the PSX2XCPU core. From 20-22 fps to 25-27 fps in traffic.
Far better.

subtle dragon
tropic stratus
#

Too bad that dead in the water is more a fighting game... even in racing mode it's not like some mario kart power ups, but instead you die permanently and loose the race if they hit you some times 😦

#

maybe i find some cheats 😅

subtle dragon
#

Robert, I hope you’re feeling alright

#

If you ever feel like you need a break, we’re all here for you

tropic stratus
#

it's all good, don't worry. I usually feel bad when i need to take a break for some days, e.g. when sick. It's not work if you have fun 🙂

#

(ok ok, sometimes it's annoying when you work on some issue and run out of ideas)

subtle dragon
#

I meant once you’re ready to move on from the core as a regular project, but that works too

tropic stratus
#

yes, i will move to something different next year. I could probably spend my whole life on psx and still find new stuff, but i think it's in a condition where i'm allowed to work on something new

subtle dragon
#

For sure man
Whatever you end up doing next, we’re all for it

crisp shale
# subtle dragon Even the DC version has problems with those details? Interesting

Yep:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MEvlpEt4PRc

This comparison only shows superficial details but it's already possible to see some stuff.
The PSX port is the only one that preserves the wobbly texture movement for the reflections on the water, the only one that uses additive alpha blending for the water spray, all the transparency effects, all the reflections, etc.

YouTube
N-tertainment X-tended
Hydro Thunder | N64 vs PS1 vs Dreamcast vs Retroarch vs Redream Com...

This is a side by side comparison of Hydro Thunder for the Nintendo 64, Playstation and Sega Dreamcast (plus their respective emulators). Please enjoy my video, and give a like if you approve of my work.

My Discord: https://discord.gg/x9TjK78WwY

#HydroThunder

▶ Play video
subtle dragon
#

Huh, that’s interesting

tropic stratus
#

nice, dead in the water has build in cheats with button combo. one for god mode(no boat destruction, pure race mode) and one for big waves chefkiss

crisp shale
#

I didn't know that. Cool!

dry drift
abstract drift
#

it does more wave-related stuff iirc

pseudo plinth
pseudo plinth
serene nebula
abstract drift
#

yeah

#

its not a port its practically a sequel, some of the same tracks though

#

plus, runs way better

serene nebula
#

It’s funny that Microsoft owns that IP

crisp shale
# pseudo plinth I didn't know that and actually watching the video the look of the psx version i...

Yeah, its original version is an arcade game.
The N64, Dreamcast and PC (Windows, 2001) ports were all developed by Eurocom and they share most of the same characteristics/issues. The PC port is the better out of those three.

The PSX port was developed by Blue Shift, a company that had previously released Vapor TRX for the Midway Seattle arcade platform; that game was produced by Atari.
So, they may have had access to more info about the original game than Eurocom or they were just more competent/dedicated to it, IDK.
They surely tried to use the PSX hardware in the best way possible. In some details they went beyond what the arcade game was using; like the spray with additive alpha blending, the now transparent smoke for the Lost Island's volcano, and the flashing of the boats (when using boost) now being a lighting effect rather than just flashing white.

There's a lot of TLC put into this port. Ex: all the Eurocom ones lack the arcade announcer voice samples during the loading sequence; the PSX port has them.

I've always liked this game a lot 'cause IMO it's the best 3D arcade game made by Midway, way better than the Rush series. The track design is insanely good, especially for a boat racing game.

manic valley
#

How does it compare to the rest I mean ?

visual depot
#

I've been trying to find some old console game (I think PS2) that was semi-music game, but with multiple colored rails. Very electronic art style, kind of futuristic. But I could never figure out what game it was. It was a demo in Wal-mart 2 decades ago

#

But yeah didn't know all this about Hydro Thunder. I had played the arcade version years ago

#

when I was a child. Was crazy fun.... lots of feedback in vibration haha

#

iirc anyway

full nimbus
# visual depot I've been trying to find some old console game (I think PS2) that was semi-music...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97_-9KXauR0

YouTube
10min Gameplay
Rez ... (PS2) Gameplay

Rez gameplay for the Playstation 2.
Played on the original console and recorded with Elgato Game Capture HD.

▶️ Longplay Video on my Second Channel: https://youtu.be/noKqZXqWoh0

► PS2 playlists:
PS2 - Top 10 videos etc.
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLljauD_hVEDIVuMflLYCTkYC4WPV_KOac

All my Playstation 2 (PS2) videos
https://www.youtu...

▶ Play video
visual depot
#

nah

#

I know that game, but not it

#

(Rez is a fav FYI)

hallow plinth
visual depot
#

the one I'm thinking of ACTUALLY had like colored dots on a metallic rail iirc, that you had to move left/right to move across to the beat

crisp shale
# manic valley How’s the version included in the midway arcade treasures 3 collection for Gc an...

Hardcore players usually prefer both the 2001 Eurocom PC and the Dreamcast ports over the Midway Arcade Treasures 3.
The emulation has performance (framerate is noticeably lower than on real arcade hardware) and timing issues, so there are input issues that will affect you if you try to go for the secret routes 'cause some of the jumps are tightly timed.
I don't remember how is the controller support in that collection. I do know that out of the classic console ports, the PSX is the only one you can use dual analog controls, as in the arcade.

manic valley
crisp shale
visual depot
#

holy shit I think that's it

#

I didn't think it was a PS1 game all this time

twin walrus
serene nebula
visual depot
#

yeah honestly this game looks like possible hidden gem material

#

looks really cool

dry drift
#

Hidden from whom

serene nebula
#

from gem hunters

mystic violet
#

B.L.U.E.: Legend of Water (English Patched) PSX ISO 🙂 that was quick of that website

visual depot
#

I generally patch myself

#

lol

#

I don't trust others to do it right. harder to mess up with xdelta but with snes patches it's so common for someone to do it wrong

#

BPS is a little more guaranteed to not fuck up, because it also verifies hashes, but there's just so many IPS patches still in the wild.

vernal sundial
#

I never trust myself to do it right on the other hand

#

Already messed it up with multiple translation projects

visual depot
#

as long as the hash for the rom you have is matching the one in the readme, and you don't try other hacks, it should be fine. most of the time big hacks won't work with others.

#

Trial and error sometimes, but yeah

manic valley
#

Gekkido way of the fist is such a blast to play !

#

And that nu metal soundtrack just pushes it right over the edge to good game

hard laurel
manic valley
#

Now does one go about adding cheats to the core or soliciting news ones be added ?

#

I’m asking because some games have codes that unlock frame rates and that would be ideal for the psx2x core ..

manic valley
#

Need for speed high stakes runs at 50-60 fps in first person view mode

#

Amazing

stuck stirrup
mystic violet
serene nebula
mystic violet
#

1 year ago 🙂 nice

#

(October 10th to be exact)

lilac scaffold
#

hey folks, I recall reading theres a tool that you should run over a game after you language patch it (just patched B.L.U.E) before playing, but I cant remember the name

abstract drift
#

if the language patch was done recently you might not have to

#

i also... can never remember the name of that damn tool lol

visual depot
#

Does anyone know the full steps to get SNAC working with a GunCon?

abstract drift
#

you just sort of plug it in?

visual depot
#

I can't get it to recognize buttons or movement with the gun. I've tried both the RCA port on the SNAC adapter and the green cable on the component out

#

nothing

#

I have a guncon 1 from Japan

#

my CRT is a KV-36fs200. works fine with nes lightgun

abstract drift
#

how are you testing?

visual depot
#

Elemental Gearbolt

abstract drift
#

try time crisis first, might be nothing but thats always my default

visual depot
#

If I switch out "snac port 1" for "GunCon" to use the first controller as a guncon, that works

#

but not the physical guncon

#

is there anything else I have to do besides set the controller port to snac-port1?

abstract drift
#

nope

visual depot
#

hope I don't have a busted guncon :S

abstract drift
#

maybe? the fact no buttons are even working isn't good

#

load up time crisis and make sure it takes you to the calibration screen

#

if it doesn't detect a guncon it'll skip it

lilac scaffold
#

Thanks Freddo, much appreciated 🙂

#

ahh no binary, might only be available for registered users on terraonion website?

visual depot
#

Nothing

abstract drift
#

yeah

visual depot
#

@abstract drift found the issue. had a theory. It was correct. My case is just thick enough that the USB doesn't seat in the port enough to fully connect

#

:/

#

kind of unfortunate

#

is there a way to still use the .mcd files from the MiSTer SD card with a snac plugged in? It seems to be forcing use of the SNAC memory card slots

#

I'm trying to even manually mount the .mcd file with Elemental Gearbolt and the game says no memory card inserted

lilac scaffold
#

you can mount it manually as slot 2 but many games dont support that. Otherwise have to disable SNAC for P1, load/save, re-enable SNAC

#

or use a physical mem card with SNAC P1

visual depot
#

does the memcard pro not work with the MiSTer?

#

I guess I'll have to dig for my memory card :/

tropic stratus
#

haven't heard of any report of it not working

visual depot
#

:/

lilac scaffold
crystal ferry
#

Would you consider adding an option to move the FPS counter down so it can be seen on a CRT better? Its halfway into the overscan area and i've calibrated the set with the 240p test, plus there's various resolutions to account for on CRT.

ivory verge
crystal ferry
#

too bad, its fun to see how much the framerate drops in some games. I can just connect the HDMI output and see it there at least

tropic stratus
#

moving it down would either be a silly option that costs ressources or it will be down for all outputs, which makes no sense for hdmi as it would be annoying inside the view. That being said, you can easily modify the core if you want.

dusky martenBOT
# 
OFFSETX                => 4,
OFFSETY                => 4
tropic stratus
#

just set different values here and compile

visual depot
#

Thanks for the share. Pretty much explains the issue as I'm using the retrocastle board. Pretty sure 7.5v is not normal for a memory card :S

#

The hardware revision for the memcard pro dropped to 3.5v why the hell wasnt that the target in the first place. No wonder it got much cheaper.... They changed all the guts to remove the FPGA.

lilac scaffold
#

NP, i remember porkchop mentioning his PSX SNACX has 7.8v for rumble but no idea if that's meant to be accessible to the memcard. If memcard pros dont work on PS2 slim without a mod I'm going to guess not

visual depot
#

The older revisions don't work on PS2 slim without a mod.

lilac scaffold
#

yeah

visual depot
#

Memcard pro designed out of spec

abstract drift
#

they used the rumble power line is all

visual depot
#

And it kind of pisses me off that they expect me to pay $50 for the new product when mine was built poorly

lilac scaffold
#

ahh so it is normally accessible by PS1 mem cards on original hardware?

visual depot
#

I see.

lilac scaffold
#

just not normally used

abstract drift
#

yeah it works perfectly fine on a normal psx

lilac scaffold
#

but not PS2 slim, odd

abstract drift
#

mister is the out of spec one

visual depot
#

Yeah I've used it on my psx but it won't work on a PS2 slim which I didn't know.

#

I understand it seems a new chip made the redesign possible but I basically have a deadweight of a device with issues that were not made clear in production... I'm not asking for a free replacement, but paying full price for a revision with no discount feels kind of like a sting to me..

abstract drift
#

the gen1 ones pull from the rumble line since they need so much power for their fpga and stuff, the new design reduced the power usage a lot

#

its also like half the price of the original i think? doesn't use an fpga at all anymore i think

visual depot
#

Or at least offer a replacement program. Ship the old in and get a heavy discount.

#

No it was only $80 originally and dropped to $50

#

Actually could have been $70 originally.

#

I don't remember

abstract drift
#

this is why i got snax

visual depot
#

I feel that the sd2snes program was way better done... Trade in your old flashcart and get up to like half back I think.

#

I guess that requires a different business model and the components of the flashcarts are reusable .... But can you blame me for being salty.

abstract drift
#

mister doesn't do gameid anyway so its a pretty bad experience with mcp

visual depot
#

I can't even use the automatic memcard feature on it without an xstation mod yeah.

abstract drift
#

the openbios is meant to be adding it at some point i think

visual depot
#

I personally think they overpromoted it.

abstract drift
#

that'll be better

#

its perfect on a psx, which is exactly what they promoted it for

visual depot
#

Let's just stay I haven't had good experience with console modders...

abstract drift
#

i've known the creator of the mcp for a really long time, so i'm pretty biased

#

he did almost all my complex modwork, dcdigital/ps1digital/xstation etc

visual depot
#

I had a perfect PS1 and was planning on getting a psio and then found that the xststion was way better.... But a pain to install.

abstract drift
#

yeah once you find an installer you trust never lose them lol

#

i know a guy in the uk if thats any use to you

visual depot
#

I had a local guy ruin my 1/1/1 SNES and nearly ruin my N64 with UltraHDMI

#

He was recommended by a shop for console mods

abstract drift
#

ouch

visual depot
#

He also jacked up my gba I think

abstract drift
#

stop using that guy lol

visual depot
#

Yeah well when he was doing stuff for me because he feels bad it was hard to not give in

abstract drift
#

if you goto the xstation channel on rgd there's a bunch of installers who hang out there

visual depot
#

At this point I'm kind of locked into the mister even though I own the games

#

It's just more convenient and better output to HDTV plus I can get analog output at the same time without the retrotink 5x softening the image up a lot

#

Ntm that my setup is component based

abstract drift
#

true yeah at this point i don't really know why i keep my psx around anymore 😄

#

it has HDR output i guess thats nice?

visual depot
#

I can't use component with the ps1

#

At least not in my testing

abstract drift
#

they don't output component natively

#

you can do it on a ps2

visual depot
#

Yeah

abstract drift
#

but yeah at this point i don't have a reason to boot my real psx anymore

#

the cores just all round better

visual depot
#

I have my setup fully automatic as much as possible

#

Bandridge automatic 4-port switch for scart and gcompsw

#

Technically could hook the scart to my CRT with my RGB2COMP but the only ones I have on scart are PS1 and dreamcast and my CRT doesn't work with above 480i signals

manic valley
#

Dang it’s cold!

ivory verge
#

where ? 😛

manic valley
#

Wisconsin USA!

ivory verge
#

my wiev haha

IMG_20221216_093511.jpg
#

now is probably 30cm of snow , iglo car

manic valley
#

Looks about the same as here lol

#

About 4 inches of snow

abstract drift
#

German translation for FFT

tropic stratus
#

all those long games, who is supposed to play them all? We finally got through Klonoa now and this is really a short game. I actually fear starting SOTN or FF9 will lead to another half finished game that is never completed 😦

ivory verge
#

I still can't finish God of War Ragnarok, release was 9 November....

shut escarp
#

SoTN doesn't take that long to get through

ivory verge
#

yes, it's not a long game

#

FF9 is huge 🙂

manic valley
#

Yeah I’m like 37 hrs deep and not even on the 4th disc yet

#

Ffix that is

#

And btw does the psx2x core increase draw distance ?

waxen elk
#

Currently going through persona 3 in the mornings before work and goddamn is it long

mystic violet
#

Persona 3 is not on the PSX

#

but yes - all shin megami tensei games are pretty long

waxen elk
#

Might go back and play If on psx, I think that's where the persona timeline starts

tropic stratus
#

I easily spend 20 hours or more with each of the GBA castlevanias(except the double castle one), because i play again with different character or build. I guess it's the same for SOTN. Just completing it at minimum %...not sure if that is a good experience.

waxen elk
#

I prefer short and replayable over long experiences

#

Trying out different builds or routes is pretty fun

#

I think it's why I prefer FF1 so much, just roll some new characters and you're done in 20 or so hours

tropic stratus
#

so how long does it take for just completing it at minimum % for a bad player on first try? 10 hours? I have to note that i savestate abuse at the start of a boss, as i cannot stand running to them again and again

abstract drift
#

15.5h

#

for 100%

waxen elk
#

DQ1-3 have pretty solid play times for me. DQ4 really drags since you're just constantly replaying and relevelling every time the character switch happens

tropic stratus
#

nice page. It's about the same time as aria of sorrow so maybe i can do it over christmas 🙂

waxen elk
#

I need to finally set aside time to play the post NES Castlevania games.

#

See what all this metroidvania hoo ha is all about

#

Finally tried my hand at scrolling shooters, but I just couldn't get into it.

summer sage
#

you can easily beat SOTN in a day

#

if it's your first time you might want to savor it though

#

and do all the exploration

#

try to get 200.6%

waxen elk
#

Welp, time to add it to the list

mystic violet
#

if you want to just have a fun time and not care about leveling up for bosses... just activate the cheat for crissaegrim and equip it

#

you normally can only get it in the library in the 2nd part of the game

summer sage
#

a lot of people can't handle the stiff physics

#

if you're in that camp, there's patches to make the physics a bit more modern

waxen elk
#

I have a pretty high tolerance for that sort of thing.

#

My only hard line for retro games is unnecessary tedium, then the cheats and patches come out

pearl shell
#

Robert, you can do bad ending pretty much in 3 - 5 hours

#

Cube of Zoe > Wolf > Jewel Of Open > Leap Stone > Mist > Bat > Richter Fight

#

now True Ending however is the same up to Bat then is like Bat > Gold Ring > Echo of Bat > Spike Breaker > Silver Ring > Holy Glasses > 2nd Castle + all 5 Vlad Relics > Dracula Fight

visual depot
#

Cup of Joe -> Wolf down breakfast -> Open the gates of hell -> MiSTer -> Cat -> RICHAAAAAARD

pearl shell
#

lol

#

if you play a Randomiser though you will be guaranteed 3 Vlad relics before 2nd Castle

visual depot
#

Best president. Sorry not sorry for off topic

tropic stratus
#

@ivory verge i tried to reproduce the dave mirra bug, but cannot with latest build, it didn't happen in 20 minutes. Anything special you did? i tried to do about what is in the video, but no "luck"

slow tusk
visual depot
#

Yeah the gen 1 is a 7.5v

#

3.3v is what the retrocastle board takes.

ivory verge
slow tusk
#

With SNAX, I can use both the memcard pro and the Retro Fighters Defender wireless controller. I highly recommend considering SNAX for the future, especially with Saturn on the way, if you're going to use original (or modernized for the original) accessories.

tropic stratus
#

it's really tedious if it's so rare and i need to check at least 5 build for it to happen and must be 100% sure for each...

visual depot
#

I was wanting the retrocastle because it could slot into the side of my MiSTer. Unfortunately the USB is not long enough to settle into the port with my thick case. 😦 So plan kind of busted.

#

It even stays nice and snug T^T

hidden prism
#

@tropic stratus how similar is the PSX GTE to the GE in the SGI Indy workstation? might be a relatively small leap to get 1992 IRIX up and running

ivory verge
visual depot
#

Honestly it's probably like a mm short. Sometimes I can get the led to turn on with certain angles (not moving with power on). So I wonder if I could modify the case a bit to make it fit.... Hmmm

#

Someone told me here I could save to SD card saves with snac connected but I guess either they were wrong or didn't mention I have to switch controllers each time.

ivory verge
slow tusk
#

Can you access the memcard pro on its own through the BIOS menu?

serene nebula
#

@tropic stratus Mega Man Legends is a great game to play with your kids

#

It’s relatively short too

slow tusk
#

It's just a great game, period

waxen elk
#

Art style still holds up too

slow tusk
#

The tank-like controls are a little antiquated, but not offensive

serene nebula
#

for a kids game

waxen elk
#

The game doesn't require precision so thr controls are fine

serene nebula
#

I’m kidding I love Mega Man Legends lol. It’s so great.

slow tusk
#

It is a kid's game

#

Most games are kids games

#

Especially from that era

serene nebula
#

yeah but I was mocking that viewpoint

waxen elk
#

There's a butt in the second game so be careful parents

slow tusk
#

It's everyone's butt according to the ESRB.

visual depot
slow tusk
#

I don't think you can via SNAC. I'm assuming the retrocastle only has one port? I don't know anything about it

waxen elk
#

Micromaniacs has breasts and gore which is pretty incredible for an e rated fox kids video game

slow tusk
#

The SNAX board has two ports for two players and I know that can be assigned depending on support from the core, but I don't think you can assign the psx controller port and memcard slot to different ports on a single port device given how those slots work on OG hardware

slow tusk
tropic stratus
#

don't know, megaman always felt cheap for me with super low jump, bottomless pits and falling directly into spikes in a new screen. I never tried the 3d ones, but i suspect it's a lot of shooting just like tron bonne?

ivory verge
#

when it hangs

tropic stratus
#

@ivory verge maybe i can try again some other day....would need to find the first build that broke it...finding broken builds is safer, as it only needs to happen once. But when relativly sure it needs a longer play with the last non-broken to be sure. Overall, i estimate easily 3-5 hours for that undertaking and i don't even know if that info helps a lot, could be some timing change, making it a random effect 😦

#

as Rama mentioned it also is a topic on xStation, i wouldn't be surprised if it comes down to some internal CD timing

ivory verge
#

it's too random , there's no way to reproduce it \

tropic stratus
#

that reloading the disc helps shows that the game is waiting for some CD response that never comes...unfortunatly we cannot find out when it already hangs

waxen elk
#

Also, Legends is an action rpg. Almost has a classic mmo vibe with how it controls.

serene nebula
#

Tron Bonne was the second game in the series, MML2 is the third

slow tusk
#

And MML3 is the sad.

waxen elk
#

Honestly the MML3 didn't really seem like what people wanted anyway. Maybe someday

cloud steppe
#

I see the PSX core has an option to flip the screen upside down. Is it possible to add rotation for some of the tate shooters? I was just curious.

lilac scaffold
#

does the single bin/cue english patched policenauts version that's 'available' work OK with the core?
the patch itself references using a .iso

lilac scaffold
#

tried it, cue files had invalid reference to the bin but it seems to work OK once that's corrected. Wondering if the single bin format could mean lost cd audio or anything

oblique frost
#

the original unpatch policenauts dumps are single bin/cues as well, so it's all fine

lilac scaffold
#

ahh great, thanks for confirming 👍

tropic stratus
abstract drift
#

finally something for dualram to do?

tropic stratus
#

well, would probably work, but all that effort for such a feature? and then you also leave out the analog board crt people...

abstract drift
#

doesn't seem worth it yeah

visual depot
#

how many tate shooters were there on PS1?

#

It wasn't exactly arcade hardware was it?

swift pendant
#

Well I mean technically it was very much arcade hardware given its other uses, but I take your meaning - not many rotated shooters in the home catalogue

tropic stratus
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i doubt there is even a single official game which doesn't offer rotate itself(and depends on tate)

dry drift
wooden rose
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Now I'm wondering if there isn't a way to rotate the screen using the HDMI transceiver

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Probably not.... doesn't seem sensible

eternal vapor
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On a similar note, would it be possible to have options to offset the screen position? Some games have this in their settings but don't seem to remember it when resetting the game. Most games appear centered already but I recall at least one that's a little off center on my CRT for some reason

serene nebula
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What would rotating the screen achieve, the games will still be 4:3 when rotated.

ivory verge