glossy radish
Your Era 1 is iffy with the 103 family. That pretty much be E2+. The S1 may fit in E1 but it he a stretch.
I'd have to research the tanks in detail but it seems okay. You dont need to have a tank in every slot, even more so if the tanks are so similar. The Cents come to mind
dim socket
IKV 91 ALT 1 can be replaced with the IKV 65 ALT 5 if needed
polar radish
Eh, I disagree on several key areas with this TT.
The first, and most obvious, is the lack of Era 3 Tier 3 tanks. One in the whole TT, but two premiums? The L140 being based off the CV90, but not coming from the CV90120 is a bit of a mistake in my opinion. The O140/40 being a pod mounted turret would be ideal coming from the UDES 19 or 32.
Another issue I have is that we really don't need so many lines. We certainly don't need a tank in every single position, that just stretches the line too thinly. For example, we do not need quite so many Era 1 T1. WG seems rather content with having a single tier 1 for each nation, something that I can't truly disagree with.
There's also some odd omissions. The Strv 81 and 15cm Kranvagn come to mind.
There's also too many Strf 9040's. The 9040C, for example, having no ATGMs, would be horrible in Era 3. Too modern as well I believe.
open quiver
Its just a concept idea war gaming will rework where tanks are if they where to add them
dim socket
Eh, I disagree on several key areas with this TT.
The first, and most obvious, ...
I do get where you're coming from with the disagreements so I'll elaborate on why I did it all like this
#1 the L140 I have as a premium listed as for placement to see where it could go if it would be a premium or tech tree - I'm indifferent on if it gets put in top era 3 as tech tree or premium.
#2 The O140/40 is just a manless turreted version of the regular T140/40. If it was made with the concept chassis model from the drawings and the small model that was made of it and it had some different more compelling stuff to it then it would be fitting for the top spot *of that line specifically. It entirely depends on where they want to go with that one much like the L140.
#3 we need more tech tree era 1s let alone just more era 1 tanks in general. There's too few tanks in that era currently compared to both era 2 and 3.
#4 CV9040Cs have much better protection of armor/angles coupled with better gun systems/apfsds rounds that would make it night and day over the 9040/56. The 9040/56 is just a stock 9040A with the bill launcher bumped up into era 3. If that can work as well as it does (ish), then an upgradable, more armored, accurate, and penning version of that should be more than adequate as long as the alpha damage per shot is slightly increased from 50 to 60
#5 I utterly despise lines that have gaps in them unless it's absolutely necessary because of a lack of tanks. Also it just makes a line look worse structurally when there's that one gap in an otherwise good looking line (your Japanese one comes to mind with that implementation)
Strv 81 would be covered over by the British centurions of era 1, and the krangvan 15cm I wasn't too interested in personally but it would be fitting nonetheless as a premium
Strv 81 I guess could also be an era 1 premium if they really wanted it to be that
My proposals are all of a conglomerate of lines for one nation that are for wargaming to pick and choose to their liking
polar radish
1: The L140 variant was, if memory serves, specifically based on the CV90. It would make sense to include it after cannon armed CV90s.
2: The O140/40 had a turret pod mush like the UDES 19/32. Hence why I suggested those two. I'd personally have the 19 as a tier 1 and 32 as a tier 2.
3: We do need more Era 1s, but not more Era 1 Tier 1. Tiers 2 and 3 are the ones people play.
4: I'm more concerned about the firepower than armour. Extra armour on a light just reminds me of the Stingray II, additional weight for no tangible improvement to armour. As such, I personally see no reason to add the B and C. Especially over things like the CV9025 and 30.
5: I am not a fan of gaps either, but I am even less of a fan of playing threw or four nearly identical tanks. The Japanese line really taught me how enjoyable it is to play the same tank four times in a row, and I don't mourn the omission of the TKX-1.
6: It's less the Strv 81 and more the earlier Centurions as a whole. No Strv 101 or 102 either. Surprised you didn't add the Strv 102 120. The Kranvagn with the 15cm would also be rather unique, so probably should also be included
dim socket
I don't know of that 102 120 until after I finished making this
I finished "" this a couple months ago but didn't actually post it until I did
As for the 101 and 102 they're redundant because of my future British proposal
The big thing I saw with the complaints for the Japanese line with the "same 4 tanks" was not that they were of the same kind of tank make, but that their stat differences were so negligible per tank to tank and upgrades
Unlike say the 5 t-80s and T-72s that exist and all have clear leaps in upgrades that set each other apart going upward linearly in power - less so for the BM to BU but it still stands
limpid moth
As for the 101 and 102 they're redundant because of my future British proposal
That shouldn't stop them from being added here
polar radish
Unlike say the *5* t-80s and T-72s that exist and all have clear leaps in upgrad...
Those absolutely get complaints too. They're not popular for that reason.
dim socket
Those absolutely get complaints too. They're not popular for that reason.
They're more so not popular and complained about because they kinda just suck at what they do
I don't think I've seen anyone ever complain about there being "too many" of a particular kind in either of those lines, but if you say so 
At least the differences in stats between them actually make something of them even if they are rather anemic or just bad
polar radish
One of the major complaints about the Eastern tree is how "samey" the line is, especially the heavies.
The same thing will happen to the CV9040s. How much more armour do they have, and will it actually matter when facing 400mm APFSDS rounds routinely?
The exact same issue affects the Strv 103 line, if not moreso. I can't think of any real difference between the B and C that really matters that the B wouldn't get as an upgrade anyway.
dim socket
The auto cannon light line could be further condensed down if needed with equal spacing between tank tiers to make it look good and functional.
S103 line complaint for that is pointless because there is the split line option I have to not go the full 6 S tanks per the individual players wants.
As for the S103C over the B, it has side armor unlike the B for model difference #1 alongside the other stuff listed on just the Wikipedia page for it, not even counting other sources documents for what was included for it.
The CV9040C armor I would imagine to be pretty parallel to that of the desert warriors side armor in terms of thickness, and even more layers that are angled. It would be up to wargaming for armor values for that.
When I get back home I'll revision both light tank lines to see if I can structure them in a way that they have spaces but will actually make the lines look/function better.
As for the main 3 lines that go into splits leading to the T140/40 I'm not compromising those.
dim socket
this could work better
more streamlined and the spacing makes it all look "whole" i feel
CV90105 (P) though has the TML turret like on the nexter vextra 105 and swiss Piranha 2/3 5x5 test chassis, the actual ammunition is DM23/33 like on the leopard 1s and is reflected that way in warthunder
thats why i bumped it down to top era 2
oh and another thing, the premium tank placement is kinda arbitrary when it comes to specific tier
i have most of them placed to where I think they would fit best, but some aren't due to space issues
from other proposals i've made, but I think this Swedish one is alright when it comes to proper tier placements for premiums
limpid moth
A Strf 9040 C as a tier 3 won't be appealing to people as it doesn't have missiles
high isle
A Strf 9040 C as a tier 3 won't be appealing to people as it doesn't have missil...
if the cannon goes brrr hard enough it could be fun tho
limpid moth
if the cannon goes brrr hard enough it could be fun tho
I agree, but you have to look at it from the perspective of the player ase as a whole
I'd replace the Strf 9040 with the Strf 9025 and the 9040A with either a 9030 or 9035
Then replace the 9040B with the 9040A
dim socket
I'd replace the Strf 9040 with the Strf 9025 and the 9040A with either a 9030 or...
9025 is a no go simply because its the bushmaster 25mm
that thing as the only weapon? even if the damage was buffed up it would be pretty bad offensively unlike the 40mm bofors
cv9030 maaaayybeeee? but the 35 i think is too "modern"
as for the A replacing the B that makes no sense since the Strf 9040/56 (BILL) is a stock 9040A with the BILL launcher put into mid tier era 3
a top era 2 upgradable 9040A without the BILL launcher would be fine for era 2
limpid moth
9025 is a no go simply because its the bushmaster 25mm
that thing as the *only* ...
Tbf you did want variety, I gave a suggestion.
Yes the bushmaster is crap, but at least it'd be on a tier 1
dim socket
ans then an upgradable bottom era 3 9040B would be essentially the A but buffed up in practically every way - like how it was irl
dim socket
Tbf you did want variety, I gave a suggestion.
Yes the bushmaster is crap, but a...
9025 would be more fitting for era 1 but then that would be an 80s/90s tank put into tanks that come out in the later half of the 40s to 50s
its just not really a sound option unfortunately and i even had that in my initial run of the line prior to me setting it up and making the post
limpid moth
That's why in my proposal I went with the light line being a mix between cannon armed and autocannon armed
dim socket
i wanted my light lines to be split in order to emphasis the weapon systems and their differences whilst also having a unique auto cannon only light line
i think out of all the different lines ive made the strf line is the only one that is purely auto cannon only
limpid moth
i wanted my light lines to be split in order to emphasis the weapon systems and ...
Which is a cool concept, unfortunately Sweden didn't make many "lights" so you have to make do with what they made
dim socket
they made a good amount - especially blueprint, but i have to work with what is logical and historical with progression whilst keeping theme
limpid moth
Also going back to why I suggest getting rid of the 9040B
Strf 9040B: Strf 9040A updated with improvements to armament (new fire control software, electric firing pin, fully stabilised gun with internal stabilisation and reserve sight with video camera for the gunner), improved suspension for better accuracy and crew comfort while moving, new instrumentation and new seat belts.
It's just a more accurate 9040A
Unlike the C which got add-on armour
dim socket
i see
so the norwegian 9030 can actually work
and lets say the 9040C becomes bottom era 3, then the Lvkv 9040C can be top tier with mixed around stats and the ability fire its more unique HE-VT shells that could act as rotary cannon rounds that cause bleed-through damage
that would make it unique and give spall liner a better place in era 3 as there are currenlty no bleed-through weapons in era 3 if memory serves me right
limpid moth
Yeah, there is no bleed/rotary in era 3
dim socket
yo actually thank you for that recommendation it makes things more sound with progression
polar radish
For the cannon armed lights, Hagglunds did enter into the US AGS competition with a Ikv 105 variant
dim socket
@limpid moth actually the 9030N shouldnt be for the bottom era 2 in the tech tree - should be more of a tech tree
9040 base would be more fitting as it sets up for the future 9040s in the line
limpid moth
The 9025 is the original prototype of the Strf 90
dim socket
and then it immediately got superseded by the 40 version
limpid moth
Yes, but it should be the tier 1 with the 9040 base a tier 2
dim socket
a bushmaster 25mm as the only weapon on a vehicle even with a damage buff would be anemic at best
makes more sense to go with the base 9040 as the tier 1
so if it was to look like this and skip redundancies it would be best for it to function like that evolutionarily within the line
dim socket
Strv 74 (like in ww2 but classed as a light)
Ikv 91
Ikv 105
CV90105 (P)
CV90120 (P)
Strv 2000 L140
glossy radish
Forgot to mention for the E3 MBT's I think it should only be the versions with the 40nn Co-Ax as otherwise I don't think they will stand out as much.
dim socket
That would only be the T120/40, T140/40, and O140/40
dim socket
@glossy radish actually, you just gave me an idea
dim socket
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