CW QoL Concern

[tribal orchid]

its propably easier to dodge missiles in lights than in heavies in first line

but sure

xDD

[worldly horizon]

Yes of course you do even though you don’t play heavies in era 3

[umbral seal]

❌ not how opinions work bro

[tame hinge]

it’s easy to dodge them regardless

[tame hinge]

i play mediums and heavies in era 3 and i seem to do fine without being hit with rockets mr gold mark

[tribal orchid]

yea cuz everyone just shoot them when enemy can dodge it xDD

[tame hinge]

positioning and awareness

[tribal orchid]

thats why i got a lot of dmg in t-55 with missiles

[worldly horizon]

Worthy informed opinions from experience then

[umbral seal]

Thanks for acknowledging that. Should maybe take my advice on handling missiles better.

[prisma harness]

Like for the opposite side of sturm I don't care about ww2 hardly at all but I still know what's stupid about it

[tame hinge]

same with the other guy he’s got like 3 ww2 battles

[tribal orchid]

sure bro

[prisma harness]

I used to really like ww2 but that's a different story for a different time

[tribal orchid]

like wiesels, elc are not op too

[tame hinge]

two things can be true at once

[tribal orchid]

u just need to to git gut

[worldly horizon]

Maybe you should actually try playing era 3 heavies then you might get some idea of the problems

[tribal orchid]

sadly im bad

[tame hinge]

clearly

[prisma harness]

Literally is something you need to have in cw unless you want to get slapped by atgm's constantly

[tribal orchid]

weird tho thats i get more dmg with missiles

[tame hinge]

you can watch, play or learn from others and form a genuine opinion

[tribal orchid]

even in merkava 3

surely i dont make more dmgs with missiles

but yeaaaah

[tame hinge]

course you do it’s 1100 vs 530 alpha!

[tribal orchid]

skill issue for sure

[tame hinge]

on god bro

[tribal orchid]

and the games with 15k dmg on warrior, begleit etc its just luck cuz lights and atgms are so bad

[worldly horizon]

Watching a skilled person do anything doesn’t mean you can just pick it up and do it yourself

[umbral seal]

Maybe you should try listening to other people. I'm far from the first person you've tried to argue with on this, and your opinion has clearly been contrary to the norm around here

[tribal orchid]

cuz its easy to counter them

[worldly horizon]

Only because all of the missile firing people have come out of the woodwork

[tame hinge]

sturm is a skilled player

[tame hinge]

i don’t even play atgms

[tribal orchid]

maybe because he dosnt play heavies?

[worldly horizon]

And so am I

[tribal orchid]

[prisma harness]

Rage bait used to be good SMH

[umbral seal]

Brother your takes on atgms have been so out of left field you genuinely have a reputation for it on this server 💀

[tame hinge]

skilled bot farmer maybe but you haven’t shown any battle competence

whining about basic things if you can 4 mark you can counter those things

[worldly horizon]

Because they are unfair and need nerfing

[tame hinge]

it’s genuinely just module damage + certain atgm platforms that are problematic

[worldly horizon]

No getting 4 marks can be done without competence cant it

[tame hinge]

yeah they can

[worldly horizon]

They just can’t

[umbral seal]

Yeah I agree there are issues (chiefly module damage) but it doesn't warrant shoving the entire class in the dumpster because 3 platforms out of both eras are too strong

[tame hinge]

maybe you’re an elite 4am gamer

[worldly horizon]

This test is going to shove heavies in the dumpster

[tame hinge]

doubt it

[umbral seal]

I dont think it will, but we will see

[prisma harness]

Like bruh I play freaking cw coop 85% of the time but I'm very much aware of what's op in cw

[tame hinge]

it’s not like you counter those problems with heavy tank speed as it is

and if you’re worried about them getting away try aiming for tracks it tends to help

[umbral seal]

Obv we haven't gotten the numbers so it's hard to say but given the goal is to give purpose to lights and mediums while still keeping mbt top speeds on hard terrain, I'd assume it means they will just be generally slower than those classes offroad

[worldly horizon]

Yes and I play co-op as well and the marder 1a3 comes top for damage nearly every game

[tame hinge]

are you accounting for player skill? the marder is also much stronger against BOTS than actual people

[worldly horizon]

I guess you are one of the best players on the game you know so much

[prisma harness]

Coop dosen't give accurate performance results for tanks

[tame hinge]

i’m an ok player with game and also regular smarts i guess

[prisma harness]

But it can still give a vague idea how it might fair in mp

[umbral seal]

cant wait until they realize this over at ST 🙏

[worldly horizon]

It’s a level playing field equal targets for everybody and you can’t compete with it on damage

[prisma harness]

St?

[umbral seal]

supertest

[prisma harness]

Ah

[tame hinge]

speaking of i faced someone testing the H3 on pc today

[prisma harness]

Oh yeah they test against bots lmao 🤣

Completely forgot about that

[tame hinge]

yeah this is what i’m talking about

[worldly horizon]

It shows the marder is too capable

[tame hinge]

in co op against bots that hardly counter you

[prisma harness]

The thing is tho is the marder1a3 truly to strong or is the only actually good light tank in era3 like objectively

[worldly horizon]

What’s that got to with it it’s combined dpm is way too high

[worldly horizon]

It’s too strong

[tame hinge]

it has a pea shooter main gun that isn’t penning every shot it fires

firing it at range is also ill advised

[tribal orchid]

and we are talking about only tech tree ones?

[worldly horizon]

This stormer and the desert warrior are too good as well

[prisma harness]

Even the premium lights in era3 aren't that good tbh most of them are Bradley centric

[tribal orchid]

huh ? warrior is amazing stormer propably even more but yeah whatever.

[prisma harness]

They are hard carried by the tow,s

[worldly horizon]

The desert warrior shouldn’t be bouncing 120mm shells

[tribal orchid]

or the wiesel lul

[sudden edge]

https://tenor.com/view/thats-a-fair-observation-shea-brennan-sam-elliott-1883-thats-fair-to-say-gif-24226003

[prisma harness]

That's a different case it had stupid thick slate armor

[tribal orchid]

cuz 200 dmg from HE or yellow track damage with apfds from 120++mm into wiesel its fair, but yeah skill issue i guess

[worldly horizon]

It’s stupid that any of these soft tanks can bounce 120mm rounds

[prisma harness]

They generally dont

[umbral seal]

i hate to be that guy but typically an LT/IFV eating around is because it didnt contact the damage model.

[tame hinge]

imagine if sloped armour actually had angles that bounces shells

[prisma harness]

The stormer has that happen a few times

[tame hinge]

isn’t that the same with the merkavas?

[worldly horizon]

Well that needs to be changed

[tribal orchid]

lets just ask wg for terminator with 90km speed and 477+490 ob armor and call it a day

ofc premium one

its should be TD too?

[umbral seal]

thats kinda the point of spaced armor/modules being modeled though? Its annoying as heck when it happens but beyond making the spaced armor part of the damage model there isnt really any other option

[prisma harness]

Sorry sturm your thread got so derailed people can't just have simple conversations and debates

[umbral seal]

eh it was a pretty general thread tbh. Kinda figured i was opening the door to it when i suggested nerfing rat tanks alongside the implementation of the QoL update

[tribal orchid]

so guys

if those changes gonna be huge and get to live

[tame hinge]

i think cold war needs tank roles instead of ww2 like tank classes

[tribal orchid]

its also gonna be harder to beat or flank ob477 and 490 cuz its gonna takes more time to do it

[tame hinge]

more damage for me then

[tribal orchid]

so can we nerf them too already?

[umbral seal]

should be a bit easier if you come with speed built up since terrain resistance effects rotation speed

[tribal orchid]

like being to possible pen their lfp with 120 atleast with gold ammo?

or still only premiums can have stupid armor on front?

[tame hinge]

that would be good for the 490, the 477 would need armour model changing i think

[tribal orchid]

what u mean by that exactly

[tame hinge]

there’s armour behind the lower plate in layers i think

[tribal orchid]

well nerfing their armor will include those changes propably so ofc its needed

[tame hinge]

there’s a tiny amount of visible armour but that would have to be widened

[worldly horizon]

Rat tanks ? The wiesel ?

[prisma harness]

Honestly i don't have much issues killing the belka atgm's into it's turret kills it so easily now the molot that one is a different story you can pen it's lower plate with atgm's the roadwheel works with 150mm+guns and the back half is a possibility for a ammorack

[tribal orchid]

so lets make heavier slower, nerf the wiesels, elc, ob477 and 490, osorio i guess too, and some other op things, maybe including fv4005 so ppl can have fun on era 1 with other tanks than this fv.

[tribal orchid]

well cuz atgms are stronger, i wants to pen them without sweating in the front

[umbral seal]

wiesels, elc ss12, were the ones i named specifically yeah. With less small maps, slower mbts, and more tdm its going to be an absolute burden trying to find the things on the map

[tribal orchid]

like they can pen

and still only atleast lfp

i know u can pen them in some scenarios but be serious

and im talking about tech tree tanks with 740 pen max

[worldly horizon]

The test is stupid for those reasons alone

[tame hinge]

Leave the 4005 its already got tons of nerfs. They need to add more Era 1 TDs so theres more options.

[prisma harness]

Actually it's because atgm's act like heat and have 85 degrees of angled performance so that means the belka,s turret ring is a easy weakness

[tribal orchid]

so u mean more TDs which gonna be biased too

[umbral seal]

i think it is going the right direction but they just havent considered enough of the repurcussions, especially in regards to those tanks

[tribal orchid]

cuz thats only way thats ppl gonna stop spamming fvs

cuz most of ppl plays them cuz they are strong

[prisma harness]

Also the fv4005 was already nerfed it's fine now tbh

[worldly horizon]

I agree I think they should nerf the fv4005

[tribal orchid]

and adding more tds which are not going to have higher alpha dosnt gonna change anything

[tame hinge]

I also think more armor is important but CW players cried until they neref the IS4.

[tame hinge]

Its already been nerfed. They need to add more armor and diverse tanks.

[tribal orchid]

k lets just forget fv4005 atleast its not a p2w and u dont need to spend a lot of time in era 1

[prisma harness]

Id prefer not to go into that rabbit hole again but I do agree heavy armor is something cw needs more of

[worldly horizon]

The nerf didn’t make any difference to it’s performance

[tribal orchid]

lets just nerf those premiums in era 2 and 3 atleast please

also if ppl wants less yolo rushes zergs

[tame hinge]

Yes it did.

[tribal orchid]

nerfing the ob477 and 490 gonna helps too

cuz its so stupid that TDs just rush better than heavies.

[worldly horizon]

They still do 10k plus damage no problem

[tame hinge]

Era 1 is just still too easy because its lack of armor. To easy to penn anything.

[tribal orchid]

if u ppl talking about lights should be faster than heavies then tds shouldnt be more capable to survive more than heavies

[tame hinge]

So can a thrungva or a good 107.

[worldly horizon]

The fv107 isn’t balanced

[tame hinge]

Thats kinda the issue the lack of armor makes it to easy to penn everything.

[prisma harness]

Thing is about the molot and belka those are assault td,s like the tortoise in tier9 but the problem is they are stupid fast

[tribal orchid]

problem is they almost dont have cons surely u can kill it but thats not the case, those tanks in good hands

especially in platoons

[prisma harness]

And honestly the molot should be the slowest tank in era3

[worldly horizon]

But if you bring in tanks that the 107 can’t pen in the side the tanks that are already in the game won’t get played anything like as much

[tribal orchid]

are just stupidly biased and if ppl crying about yolo rushes

[tame hinge]

is 10k in era 1 an achievement now?

[tribal orchid]

they should ask for nerfing most rushing braindead tanks first

like for reall their lfp are not that big anyway

[tame hinge]

Asking to nerf TT tanks is crazy when premiums run the show.

[tribal orchid]

not even mentioning their stupid side armor

[prisma harness]

Some tt tanks are broken but the vast majority is premium tanks which are the problem

[tame hinge]

nerfing premiums has never been WGs MO though

[tribal orchid]

sure sure aim for the wheels wheres no armor, surely i can do it in for example ob640

[worldly horizon]

Personally I think the 107 and fv4005 make era 1 miserable to play

[tribal orchid]

british powah

[prisma harness]

Never was but that could be changing soon assuming this thing actually happens

[tame hinge]

i wasn’t fond of the M103 being fast with decent armour and alpha but i wouldn’t call it broken

[tame hinge]

yeah but that’s nerfing S tier broken premiums

[worldly horizon]

It’s not broken

[tribal orchid]

era 1 its overally badly balanced in tt

[tame hinge]

They nerfed the 101 and made it basically useless. Thats why they need to just make most bad tanks better. Not nerf everything.

[tribal orchid]

like era 1 merkava line

those tirans are garbage poo

[tame hinge]

i said that

[tribal orchid]

amx30 its better in any way

its even bounce more

[tame hinge]

very

Stop asking for just nerfs all the time. Buffs are just as important.

Thats why the devs are doing both.

[tribal orchid]

yeah buff the ob640, t72bu and type90 2 alpha

[prisma harness]

Talking about the era1 m103?

[tribal orchid]

they are garbage anyway.

[prisma harness]

Or tier9

[tame hinge]

the amx 30’in both modes has an underrated armour model and @prisma harness knows all about it

[tame hinge]

yeah

[prisma harness]

Yep the amx30a bounces quite a bit more then you'd expect ik this because I have it 3 marked

[tribal orchid]

overally french line is good

[tame hinge]

i enjoy the ww2 amx 30s

[prisma harness]

It's a very strong tank it's one of my favorites

[tame hinge]

incredibly. the era 2s are fine and the amx 40 keeps getting buffed for no reason

[tribal orchid]

i kinda love merkava 3 but the road to get this beauty...

when grinding leclerc was just turn off u monitor and u ends with 10k+ dmg anyway

[prisma harness]

The m103a1 is my only other 3 marked tank in the game and wasn't the easiest thing to mark but glad I pulled it off

Tried to 3 Mark the t72av but stopped at 2

And same for m1a2 Abrams

[tribal orchid]

why

[prisma harness]

Lost patience for it ngl

[tribal orchid]

cuz?

[tame hinge]

i just got it to 90% trying to elite it and left it

[prisma harness]

Horrendous team for one reason

Constantly dropping my %

[prisma harness]

Might have to return to the mark grinding it's my favorite era3 mbt also the first one I got so id like it 3 marked

[tame hinge]

i think my abram’s had a 40% w/L when i got 85%

it was my first one too but for 3 marking in cw i only play premiums so i can get silver

[tribal orchid]

u can get a lot of silver even with tt if u dont spam gold

[prisma harness]

Ngl when I was grinding the marks I uhh used gold ammo only

740mm pen is nuts

[tribal orchid]

well im guess im too bad to understand this propably

so why jst everyone runs with only gold?

i need it to pen only premiums like osorio

[prisma harness]

Because higher pen

[tribal orchid]

but for TT tanks u dont need more pen

[prisma harness]

Nah

[tribal orchid]

its easier to hit since u can pen more spots

[prisma harness]

Higher pen means less rng less likely to bounce

[tribal orchid]

but if u can aim whats the sense

u just permatrack anyway

[tame hinge]

i want silver though

i fire straight standard unless it’s an amx 30

[prisma harness]

I make silver in cw coop so I don't feel obligated to grind premiums in mp

[tribal orchid]

like maybe for abrams sometimes i use gold to pen it in the fp when theres a good player in it who knows how to evade hits in the mantlet and turret ring but for all other tanks meh u just spam lfp

wheels, permatrack all the time and farm them

but when i see ob477 or 490 im not going to play rng fiesta if i can pet it side or not so i load gold, same with osorio so i can actually pen it in the front when theres actually player who remember thats he have armor only in front

[prisma harness]

Only Abrams that has strong enough front armor to bounce standard somewhat easily is the a2 m1 m1a1 and thumper can be penned in the front by standard m1a2 maybe if you lucky

[tribal orchid]

i mean its depends which tank u play for sure

cuz merkava have garbage pen

and garbage pen in gold too like i dont really see the point to use gold on it

[prisma harness]

Spamming gold means it's extra armor means nothing you just rip through it

[tribal orchid]

anyway most of time i just spam lahats cuz they are just so easy

like looking at merkava atgms i dont really understand sense of russian atgms

[prisma harness]

Id still use it's gold ammo because higher pen less likely to bounce meaning more likely to do damage

[tribal orchid]

but if u aim for spots where u can pen with standards u pen like almost always anyway?

and yet how often u need to deal with front armor of heavies in era 3

not that often i assume, or im just playing on bots lobbies

well fine for me

[umbral seal]

Well now the test is live and I am pretty confident in still standing behind this post. Would like to add in tho that beyond the rat tanks needing addressed the Osorio really should be effected by these changes. Era 2 ifvs could also use some top speed reduction rather than terrain resistance changes