Remove Ardennes

[patent bay]

This is unacceptable, the map Ardennes needs to be removed from rotation in Cold War.

[muted ruin]

remove it from the entire game

[tardy socket]

I'v not played CW for 6 months, but this looks like its not a map problem to me.
7k damage total, 18 players doing zero damage and it's won by capping out!
A tier 5 game in WW2 would produce much better damage than that.
So what happened?

Did both teams go left and they got to the cap before you did?

[steep atlas]

It’s a map problem

Early cap with no damage happens on this map 10 times more than any other map

[compact agate]

That happened to me too on that map!

[quick merlin]

This isn't even a map problem.... it's a base capture problem which is worse than the map itself.
They Really NEED to do something about the flag capture issue.

[muted ruin]

the map is terrible

[woven kraken]

Defend your base.

[compact agate]

Cant defend your base when its teammates!

@woven kraken

[woven kraken]

Its 2025 , there are no teams in CW, only Wolfpacks. If you want to do damage don't go more than 1/2 way on a map, turn around and do damage on my cappers. Yes, you will probably die but you would have done more damage if you didn't bother defending your base. If you dont want to die cap the red the base. Its that simple.

[compact agate]

I seem to need to say this again. You cant stop your own teammates from capping.

[woven kraken]

No you can't . And WG can't stop people playing the game the wrong way. They could help by locking the caps early for 2-to-3 minutes max. Sooner or later everyone just might learn to defend a base, on both sides. My comment above works for both sides. And the players who capped quickly on the green side might be happy with a win. Looking at the break down the 'winners' were heading towards a loss if they hadn't capped.

[upper trail]

Until they take the bases away you need to live with it. This happens all the time. It’s not the maps fault it’s crappy players that are the problem.

[quick merlin]

They DON'T need to take it away... all they have to do is either add MORE TIME... Implement a VOTING SYSTEM... Or LOCK IT Untill the remainder 5 or 7 minutes or something.
They can easily do ANY of those things, or another idea that can work.

[tardy socket]

Just watched your video from last night. Yes i'm a long time subscriber.
100% of both teams go left and they cap before your team.
This is not a map issue it's a team issue and a training issue, but not like in a choo choo train though LOL
I was surprised to see them cap in just 30 seconds, but to be fair your team had one in the cap before them.
So how to fix it? It's not the maps fault that happened.

[tardy socket]

I also noted your team spawned to the left of the cap by a considerable distance. This may have contributed to the left charge?

[woven kraken]

of the 3 Podium players 2 are vets and I is a rookie.

[tardy socket]

It made me laugh when the TD over looking Riki's teams cap decided to join the game 2 minutes in, and what did he do? He went left ffs :)))

[tardy socket]

Some mileage in what The Truth just said above.

[tall phoenix]

I think lemming trains and base location is a big contributor to this issue. I don't play CW so I can be wrong though.

[woven kraken]

And speed. All CW vehicles go to fast offroad.

[compact agate]

Its a little bit of all of it. Speed, map, players, wolf packs, bases not designed for CW. They all help make this an issue. Theres a reason ww2 doesn't have this issue.

[tardy socket]

We do have this problem in WW2 and it's not just on this map 😦

[compact agate]

I have never seen an early cap in Ww2 what tiers? I don't play 9 or 10 much.

I cant imigine trying to early cap in my T95 lol. The match would end before I got there lol.

[tardy socket]

Well for some months iv only been playing T5 to T8. Many times i push a flank but quickly realise no one is comming with me and so have to find a defensive possition quick or fall back. At that point you know the game is a loss unless the red team is doing something the same.

[compact agate]

Oh yeah for sure. Its frustrating. My clan mates and I will call that loss the minute we see it. Sometimes we try and hold that side. Sometimes we just wolf pack and hope. Yesterday i had a match where we killed one side outnummbered and still got to the other side of the map to flank the rest. Was satisfying.

However thats suoer rare normally just get squashed and frustrated.

[tall grail]

I don’t know if it would make a difference these days, but both bases have been moved from where they used to be. It looks like WG intended the battle to be centered around the city center, but that has failed.

[compact agate]

Its a simple fix just add a time limit. Cant cap 1st 5 mins. Easy simple.

That or make small maps team death match only.

That or the defend 1 base.

[silver dune]

The map is fun at low tiers as it shows be like it used to be as well

[unborn cliff]

all of these problems would be fixed if they removed the map from the game

[silver dune]

Another wrong answer

[unborn cliff]

yuh ardennes is truly a great map

ur actually so right

[silver dune]

Low tiers as it should have been

[silver dune]

That's a team problem not a map problem

I've never had a problem with this map

This is why I say 98%@compact agate

[compact agate]

I still argue its multiple issues adding into each other.

[silver dune]

The map isn't hard to defend and if ur on cw it's much easier

Team placements are always a problem on any map so u can't expect much but if in a platoon u can easily defend

Or stay more in the back

[compact agate]

Well say what you want but its not just a player issue. The game has plenty of blame. However we have already talked about this before.

[silver dune]

It's both tbh

But still don't put all the blame on map design

When it's not the only issue

Reasons like that is reasons why I have no respect for certain people

[compact agate]

Well if you read both my takes. I blame a little on a few things. Small changes could help boost player experience and force better play.

[calm seal]

Yeah, i Agree, for some reason no one wants to divide the teams, even if you move the other side, you are alone against the entire team, and the result is one caps and no one gets anything done.
I would prefer to have the good solid maps made for CW and the big maps of WW2 that work in CW than WW2 maps that never worked in the first place i don't mind waiting a bit for more CW maps in the meantime if the few maps we have are the decent ones: And is not only Ardennes is also Fisherman's Bay, some people don't like mountain pass but i don't mind it to be honest.

[patent bay]

The game in question and my further thoughts:

| It's Time for Ardennes to GO | World of Tanks Modern Armor |
https://youtu.be/nFiqBZe6U9Y

[tardy socket]

Your statments did it for me in that vid last night "From spawn If you turn right you are going to die" and then " If you turn left you are likely to survive".
Sorry Rikki i hate to say this but that total rubbish. You have the experience and a mini map so use it. The riight flank was left completely open like a match of the day Christmas bloopers special.

[tardy socket]

You also mention about the herd thing but there are two flanks so every game needs two herds. A left herd and a right herd.
TBH you was at the front of the left charge and 14 others behind you so i would not blame you and it was over so quickly.
Its a team training thing, a spawn placement thing. Not a map thing.

[silver dune]

This map shouldn't be fully removed from the game

The map was originally a low tiers map in WW2 and still should be put as it

@muted ruin low tiers don't have a hard time playing it

[silver dune]

This is also bad team placements as well

Not so much the maps

All u need to do is sit in the back and u can pretty much see everything

Say what u want Kellen but blaming everything on a map isn't a good look for u

[muted ruin]

It was a bad map in 2016, its a bad map in 2025. But it doesn't matter what I say because you are just going to argue with it regardless.

[silver dune]

Just proves my point honestly

[noble otter]

Ardennes was the worst map before 6.0, and it is the worst map post 6.0. Sun s**t coast feels like Redshire after Ardennes.

[patent bay]

If you feel you can play otherwise and show us all how it should be done then by all means, be my guest.

[carmine hedge]

🥱 usual response

[compact agate]

Why cant you guys understand its all correct. Why does it have to be this childish only my staments are correct.

Some understand this but alot are being needlessly stubborn.

[carmine hedge]

They could try putting team destruction on the map and take the capping away

[silver dune]

A lot of it is just bad teamwork

People tend to be like sheep on the game for some reason like if one person goes left 98% will go left or even 100%

But if some cases it not like that

The map isn't as bad as u think it is

[compact agate]

I actually like this idea for small maps. Mabey the base defending one too.

[carmine hedge]

It could be tested

[compact agate]

The players ability to play in that way is because of CW design and bases not being adjusted for faster tanks as well. It all adds together.

However the fact ww2 has this issue too says map does have a factor to play.

Its never just 1 reason.

[silver dune]

I mean in that case it's not just that map tho

All maps are like that in a way

Tanks are to fast like u said

[compact agate]

Correct. CW as a whole needs adjustments.

They just wont

[silver dune]

If the made the maps bigger then it would be better

[compact agate]

The map I got a zero game all around in was great wall.

Thats why I say its everything not just one thing.

[silver dune]

Another good map but some tiers/era doesn't work with it

It's like putting cw on mines

[compact agate]

Base cap limits or adjustments to modes would help significantly.

[silver dune]

Good map for small tiers but anything higher it sucks

[compact agate]

Idk small maps can be fun more so with team deathmatch.

Great wall is an old fav.

[silver dune]

If they add a delayed timer that would help

[silver dune]

True but if they are to small then people won't get anywhere

[compact agate]

I want more mode diversity though. We get 90% capture the base.

[silver dune]

Honestly I wish we would have new/more permanent games modes

Gets boring after years of playing the same thing

[compact agate]

It would bring players back and motivate old players more.

[compact agate]

Worst part of WOT Console.

[silver dune]

The only new mechanics we gotten is for premium tanks only

[compact agate]

Yup main reason I buy them. However I say all types of play should have a free decent version.

[silver dune]

Besides the rocket tanks but that's it compared to everything else that was added

[compact agate]

Double barrel was just addes so mabey thats a hint. Same with boosters.

[silver dune]

Almost forgot about them

But that's 2 out of everything else

[compact agate]

Yeah I know. I was saying that opens the possibility of a double barrel line. Mabey double barrel abrams 🙂

[silver dune]

That's another reason I prefer wt now or cts

[silver dune]

Let's not give them that idea

[compact agate]

I wish I could enjoy WT.

[compact agate]

No do it. Late the haters hate lol.

[silver dune]

U still could

[compact agate]

This is quite off topic though

[silver dune]

True

[tardy socket]

Im not a youtuber nor have I been a CC so i'v got no oven ready tutorial video to show you on how defend your own base.
But don't worry i can just tell you instead, it's dead easy.
Don't leave you base undefended to start off with! But if it does happen you should follow the indtructions below.
1, When you see your base is undefended someone should go back and defend it.
2, This can be initiated by pinging the map to bring it to everyones attention and hopefully resolve the situation.
3, If that don't work you should consider turning around and go defend it yourself.
4, If that to fails and it's then an epic loss please do post another video asking for the map to be removed so we can all have another laugh about it 🙂
I hope you have a sense humour Rikki, its all about having a bit of fun.

[calm seal]

AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH it was that easy man?
Dam everyone is wrong but youuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
i just had to defend the baseeeeeee? really?????????? GOD DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAM!!
XD
I can also kill 15 tanks a game by myself easy 🤣

[compact agate]

Ha! Pinging the map makes people go the opposite way half the time.

[calm seal]

Or worse, everyone goes full sheep mentality and goes exactly were you pinged.

[compact agate]

Either way hopping your team acts right is a lost cause. Either they lost the ability to care, dont know any better, and or choose to ruin games for the troll.

[compact agate]

I have tried to defend my base with 0 help enough to know its extremely rare for players to defend the base.

Even the ones camping at the base die in secs most the time. This is why I cant play solo anymore. Its just not fun.

Its only getting worse too.

[calm seal]

Bad games are going to happen, no matter what, the idea is to reduce the chance of them happening, and Ardennes is not helping for example.

[compact agate]

Yup

[quick merlin]

That's DISGUSTING! 2:03!?!?? My God WG NEEDS to do something already. This shouldn't Ever happen at all!

[calm seal]

Yeah this map is quite bad in CW, it works in ERA 1 but is not made for ERA 2 and 3

[quick merlin]

I haven't had an issue with the map in neither Era 2 or 3. I was referring to how quickly the base capture was.
WG Should really do something about the flag mechanics.

[last sphinx]

So because you and 5 other of your clan mates left the base unattended and I’m assuming went left straight from get go you now complain you got capped out

[compact agate]

What is so wrong with a cap limit. At best no early caps can happen. At worst matches last longer then 3 mins.

[last sphinx]

We’ve had this discussion plenty of times

[compact agate]

I have bad memory sorry. No need to answer if you already have.

[last sphinx]

I’ve always said easiest way around it is first 5 minutes of a game it’s 3 minute capture regardless of the players on the base
9 minutes in it should go to a 2 capture same scenario with players
And 12+ 1 minute
But resets for the 3 minute timer would be 1 minute per player shot and can only be reset once that minute is up.
1:30 goes to 30 seconds and the 1 minute will be 30seconds reset per player

[compact agate]

Wait so you agree that would be good. Also I believe I liked that answer last time too. Sounded like you didn't think base change was good. Must be you dont want the map removed. That I agree with.

[last sphinx]

All they need to do is move the base locations it’s not that hard or inpliment the time adjustments and reset adjustments I’ve suggested. A triple cap at the start of the game is not getting reset because everyone yeets out of the reach of the base on that map

[compact agate]

I dont disagree.

[calm seal]

Yeah is ok, i let them have the win, wasn't feeling like killing them all that day XD

[woven kraken]

Its another missed opportunity for WG in so far a different map could have been brought back, one that better suits CW.

[last sphinx]

It’s a good map just Dosent suit a capture based game mode

[woven kraken]

Personally I don't care either way. But given WG is still bringing back all our lost maps, and that to save $$ the map should be non-controversial for CW and WWII, and be used by both modes, I would have thought there are other maps WG could have done.

[odd sierra]

Maybe tie in base capping to health pools so they are an option at say when your team is down 30-40% now there are health bars.

Then you can have a red circle around the flag capture and when you can capture it goes green or something like that.

*coop playing for 4pts in event.

[compact agate]

Coop counts?

[odd sierra]

Yes, I finally was getting 4pts in each game last night 6 for 6 and 100k+ avg each game

[compact agate]

Hmmm neat to know. Time to make silver.

[compact agate]

Mbt 70 makes alot more.

[odd sierra]

Mbt doesn’t take and bounce shots like t4 for event. It’s hard for me to willing take damage and bounce rounds but for the event I do it

[compact agate]

Fair fair.

Welp thanks to you im going to finish the event

Wasnt gona bother do to lack of value but this will be faster.

Bot abuse is all this is lol

[odd sierra]

Glad I can assist and more bot abuse 😆

[spice sequoia]

I hate the map but feel there are worse maps which I would rather remove

[last sphinx]

Wiesel tow I average 300-500k

[compact agate]

Yeah but MBT 70 can be owned by anyone.

[odd sierra]

I looked up the silver earn rate on a MBT 70 - 155%, T4- 160%, Wiesel- 165%, Thumper -165%

[tall grail]

One thing that I can say about Ardense is I am growing increasingly tired of the winter maps.

[last sphinx]

So can Wiesel if you buy it when it’s on sale

[compact agate]

Correct the 70 is always on sale

[compact agate]

Thumper is 165 nice.

[odd sierra]

The only issue with the Thumper is it's slower then the T4, armor isn't as good.

[compact agate]

Yup I agree.

I liked the thumper better as a TD

[odd sierra]

They misclassed it, it really needed stabs. They fixed but newer tanks are faster, more agile, and better armored.

[compact agate]

Yeah, I know. Its a preference. Only TDs now are 477, 490, and jaguar 1

[odd sierra]

Yeah, I don't like that the 477 and 490 should have op fronts, all vehicles should be penned in the front somewhere. Like lower plate.

[compact agate]

You actually can penn both from the front and HE is easy dmg.

However penns from the front are limited without HE

[silver dune]

What has the highest overall ?

[compact agate]

I think 165 is and multiple tanks have it.

[odd sierra]

Using HE is so lame. HE is meant for soft targets like concrete buildings, no armor vehicles. Heat for lightly armored like bmp and Bradley. APfsds for heavy armor. Atgms for light armor vehicles and heavy (weak spots like areas where armor is thin-roof or back areas)

[compact agate]

Well Im not sure why they made that decision, to be honest CW armor and penn is awfully designed. I use what I got though and find I have far less issues with them. Im one of the few people who enjoys seeing a 477 or 490. Easy dmg because people think they cant be killed.

This isnt for slow fire tanks though.

However even in my 477 I still use HE to kill other 477s and 490s.

[odd sierra]

In the in end it’s a game. I guess they thought it would be cool for an op front tank. HE is from Ww2 so that’s how tanks get damaged like an IS7 if you can’t hit the pike in front.

It works or HE would be useless in the game.

[compact agate]

Yeah

[odd sierra]

I just enjoy the game for what it is (despite my opinion) not what it doesn’t have.

[compact agate]

Its more social for me these days.

[quartz cradle]

Players hate it so much that people understandably avoid the city because generally they wont get out alive, unless massively armoured. This ultimately leads them just to cap to get the game over with.
It really doesnt work in any mode.

[compact agate]

Oh I never thought that could be a reason that map is capped more then the rest

I hate that but I can understand.

[last sphinx]

I’m not too bothered by it personally I could have got back but this is the issue

Spawn k0 where the base should be and spawn a1 where it should be

Instead every team has straight run more or less to the enemy base if they turn left

[tall grail]

If my memory is right, those areas (A1 and K0) are where they used to be.

[spice sequoia]

Just increase the cap timer to like 4 minutes

If they ain't gonna remove it or only have it for lower tiers

[silk tartan]

Map gets re-added to the game just to immediately get the player base to demand it get removed again, classic.

[calm seal]

No one asked for this one XD
players asked for more big CW maps, and some PC versions of removed maps, but no one asked for Ardennes, let alone that map in CW.

[silk tartan]

I mean, it probably should just be a WWII map at least, I just find it funny.

[tardy socket]

Turns out I do have a youtube channel! Forgot all about it ( must be an old age thing )
So what we have here my friends is a WW2 T8 battle from yesterday, starting from the same spawn positions as Rikki team did.
But in this game we attacked both flanks with equal force and this happened. And only 3 zeros to boot across the board 🙂
https://youtu.be/28jliCKGv3E?si=eKr_O-f95cxjY56c

I welcome comments on the game. As i said it's not a map thing it's a team thing.
Remember there are 2 flanks people.

[torn cliff]

Bottom line crap map not though out . You would not put tanks in close currently or built areas .It is like sword fighting you get so close🤣🤣🤣 we need more El Alamein maps lots room to manouvere as a team and stand off 👍 👍 to fight

[patent bay]

If it works in WW2 then that’s fine. I specifically stated CW though.

[compact agate]

Ww2 is not CW. For all that talk. Also it CAN have good matches. However what is the majority. Its easy to just pick the one battle that goes well. However how many bad ones in the middle.

So if you wana act superior mabey think about it fully or you'll look arogant.

[tardy socket]

Ok I'm not been arogant or superior as someone just implyed. Emily looking at you 🙂
There was 14 other people on my team that helped win that battle and i did not come top as im not a top player.
It just was the first time I'd had that map/spawn where Rikki's team did since Remove Ardennes was posted.

My WW2 team played it spot on, challenging both flanks. If I'd been in Rikki's CW battle i would have defended the right flank cos it needed defending! Maybe someone would have stopped and come with me? I don't know.
It wasn't defended cos everyone charged left and the reward for that was an eppic blow out no fun game.

And before you all start repeating it's a CW thing and you don't know this or that type comments, I have had a few battles in CW before now and do know what it can be like.
The spawn and base possitioning could be better for sure to help stop crazy one way charge phenomenon keep happening.

[patent bay]

I think the issue people are taking with your rhetoric is that as an individual player you say with absolute confidence "If I'd been in Rikki's CW battle I would have defended the right flank", only to follow it up with "Maybe someone would have stopped and come with me?" If you'd done what you say, no one would follow you and you'd be the first to die with no change to the result. Your later question indicates that not even you are certain you'd have support against 15 tanks.

95% of CW players have, at some point or another, thought and then tried what you say, only to get wrecked in the process. After 3 or 4 attempts doing what you're saying, losing 0.5 - 1% on a mark each time while losing their incentive to play, people give up because it's not worth doing.

If you think the map is fine as is then that's cool. The observation from most though is that, in its current format, this map is not suited to the pace of CW. The wolfpack, group, herd mindset cannot be changed, but it can be discouraged by altering the cap locations and the spread of initial spawns.

As I state in the video posted above, the same meta was observed on Dukla Pass and WG fixed it. All people are asking is for the same fix to be applied to Ardennes so that some balance can be brought to the map, like it has on Dukla Pass.

[calm seal]

Yeah i played platoons of 3 and we get full head on 7 or 9 Tanks in a row that went the other side and destroy us, there is no way in that map, for CW is terrible given the Spawn and base cap locations, when the flag is in the middle or there is no flag, the games are more enjoyable.

[last sphinx]

At the end of the day make it a team destruction only mode or single base capture the encounter mode just doesn’t work on the map