Marks Of Excellence Revision.

[haughty mist]

I'd like to start off with a little back ground on me:

• I currently Have 6 Gold Marks
• I have 28 3 Marks
• Currently trying to three mark the entire German tech tree

Now I see a lot of people complaining about bot farming, I too complain about this issue. Bot farming allows players to get marks with relative ease, I won't say it is easy because bots can totally ruin your game if their RNG is hitting. I have done all of my marks legit without bot farming, and some of those gold marks really made me question whether or not they are really worth it.

The main issue is how do we fix bot farming. Since it looks like bots are here to stay then I suggest we take a different route to solve the bot farming issue. So here is my proposal.

Marks Of Excellence now have an Upper Limit on 3rd and 4th marks, this upper limit determines how high the bar can be set. For example, take the Taran, we are going to use the info on wotconsole.info for this, I understand these are not 100% accurate but we can use them as a example.

What the marks are now
1 mark- 4003 DMG
2 mark- 5235 DMG
3 mark- 5851 DMG
4 mark- 6097 DMG

After Upper Limit Change Introduced
1 mark- 4003 DMG
2 mark- 5235 DMG
3 mark- 5400 DMG
4 mark- 5600 DMG

By adding the upper limit you basically Help people who do the marks legit. This wont affect bot farming as you'll still be able to bot farm for marks. What this will prevent is the artificial inflation of average damage values.

Take the Jag for Example (which I have 3 Marked) 4735 DMG - Gold Mark. This tank is NOT capable of doing that every game. Its too slow and the armor doesn't work well enough. You would dang near have to bot farm in order to do that a game. By introducing an upper limit you could effectively drop this number to something more reasonable like 4000 DMG.

I am by no means saying make marks easy. This is a proposal to fix the bot farming issue for people who actually put in the work and have the skills to do it legit.

[hollow oxide]

I agree with this, this would make botfarming marks a lot faster

[bronze meteor]

The math on MOEs means that botfarming doesn't really affect the target values significantly. My guess is somewhere around 10-20 target dpg max increase because of bot farming.

The reason is that the calculation doesn't care about the actual damage someone deals while botfarming. If you have a game that's above the moe target, the target goes up, below, target goes down, the actual damage doesn't matter. All that matters is your % of games above or below the target. Good players that have a chance of marking already beat the target 60-70% of the time. Increasing that to 75-80% really isn't gonna change the MOE target very much, especially on tanks with higher battle counts.

Bot farming is an issue simply bc it makes marks feel less "deserved" but it doesn't really make things much harder for everyone else

[jolly cargo]

It'd be nice to have the vz55 and cs-63 be a bit more possible

[crystal ferry]

Developers just need to add 1 condition for marks, if in battle more than 4 bots, the mark does not change. This will solve the mark problem right away.

[haughty mist]

The problem is there isn’t just 1 bot farmer, so while one might increase it by 20 damage, 5 is 100, 10 is 200, and this is where it becomes an issue. Eventually the marks become inflated bad and there is no possible way to reach them

[jolly cargo]

It really depends on the popularity of the tank as well

Like good luck with the Chinese tanks 🤣

[haughty mist]

Honestly lol @jolly cargo

[jolly cargo]

Maaaan I wanted to 3 mark the vz 55 and cs-63 but oh my lord the req is crazy

[haughty mist]

I'd love to do the jag gold mark, its the only tank in that line that I have not gold marked

[jolly cargo]

The Jag is SLOW though

[bronze meteor]

No, 10-20 is a reasonable estimate considering all the bot farmers out there. Player population is far more of an issue than bot farming

[bronze meteor]

Yeah both of those have too many good players playing them (and not enough bad players) and it makes MOEs hard. A year ago or something WG said the median VZ player had 57% win rate or something. That’s what makes MOEs so hard on certain tanks

[haughty mist]

yep with like 0 armor according to all the heat shells sitting inside of my tank lmao

[haughty mist]

I suppose the population doesn't help either.

But you cant deny that the guy a couple weeks ago saying he was bot farming for his rogal gold mark and was doing 8000 damage a game, that is not healthy to an average value at all.

Especially if he does that consistently over 100 games.

[bronze meteor]

For sure I agree that it's unhealthy but it's not the reason MOEs are out of control on certain tanks. WG split the playerbase massively with CW and Co-op and refuse to properly adjust MOEs to compensate for the much lower WW2 population

8000 dpg and 7000 dpg have the same effect on the mark. And long term, somebody sweating against bots for 100 battles will increase the mark slightly short term, but for less time. That same person sweating 100s of battles for months in normal MM is gonna inflate the mark almost as much and for longer.

[jolly cargo]

Yeah it can get plastered by prems, but it does have a scary gun

[finite ruin]

And the guy also said because he was the first with a rogal gold mark even wg console congratulated him by doing it. They shouldn’t reward such an behavior in my opinion.
Moe is and ever was an PvP reward.

Situation with our devteam feels a bit sad.

[jaunty peak]

You can't do that because not everyone can play earlier in the game or lives in a specific timezone. I see bots at 4pm for me

[finite ruin]

Then we need another reward for doing damage against bots. Probably another color for the gunmark 🤷🏻‍♂️

or you can just play but you can not earn an PvP achievement. It’s simple

[olive sail]

Bots are really not needed. They could just relax back to 5.0 bs MM during off hours and problem be is solved. That would be 1000 better solution than mixing bots in PvP game.

[haughty mist]

See and that’s why I propose this idea, because with the rework everyone could mark regardless of what time, when they can play, etc etc, if you remove bots from it all together some people won’t be able to mark because they work night shift/odd hours/etc etc

[finite ruin]

Where is the challenge to play against bots? Do you have fun playing against them knowing these are not real people? I mean it is playing fifa against the ai at amateur difficulty. It is an honest question. 🙏

and if so… probably you have fun playing at amateur difficulty what is fine for me. But why do you think you deserve one of the highest PvP achievement in this game like 3marks or gold marks like players who hustle against real people?

[lapis ledge]

If u want to play against bots, then play coop

But a Pvp achievement shouldnt be earnable againsg NPC's

[jaunty peak]

No, I don't have fun against them, but they exist and I see them. I still mark, but I don't go out of my way to look for bots.

You cannot stop players from earning marks just because they live in an awkward timezone or work in a fashion that isn't 9-5.