#Small Arms Progression

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slow stream
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Vendors can offer any mk0 weapon. As you find/unlock weapon upgrades/attachments /blueprints they are also unlocked in the vendor. 3-4 random available with a credit sink to re-roll available upgrades prior to the run. Or even has the full list you've unlocked to select from to encourage build craft (this is the one I'm leaning towards personally)

During missions you can find weapon upgrades/attachments/blueprints that you can apply to your weapon. These can either be agnostic to the weapon type (i.e. damage, magazine increase, etc.) or be weapon specific (i.e. x4 scope for the javelin or slugs for the maw). If you finish a mission after discovering them then you unlock them to go into the vendor prep menu. You can keep the weapon you have equipped as long as you like, until you fail a mission, and can freely swap upgrades with mods found in mission or can change upgrades from the vendor between missions for a cost.

I personally believe this would lead to more investment in the weapons and give a sense of progression instead of just hoarding mk3s and not caring about loot past that. This suggestion is made fully from my point of view that weapon carry over is not a good long term mechanic and that small arms should not be part of the inventory slots as they are currently. Multi-tool, chosen small arm, and melee of choice +3 inventory slots for actual loot.

This would be slow incremental changes over a long time. They are small team and other things require priority. This system is an end goal to work towards. Not something to expect in the short term.

arctic agate
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Possibly just to choose from or a 3-4 random available with a credit sink to re-roll available upgrades prior to the run.
I kinda wish for this to have dynamic pricing and scale with what people back vs keep.
Like having a base stock of 100 of each type, but if lots of people bring back mk1 smgs or mk2 ARs and keep their mk3 snipers, then cost of mk1 smgs and mk2 ARs should go down and become dirt cheap (maybe capped to 10% of credits base price) and mk3 sniper should go up (maybe capped to 300% of credits base price)

During missions you can find weapon upgrades/attachments/blueprints that you can apply to your weapon. These can either be agnostic to the weapon type (i.e. damage, magazine increase, etc.) or be weapon specific (i.e. x4 scope for the javelin or slugs for the maw). If you finish a mission after discovering them then you unlock them to go into the vendor prep menu.
I like these. maybe stat rerolling can be another credits sink (think diablo 3 enchanter). Stuff like +dmg% when scoped or dmg vs flying/light/heavy/shielded/unshielded

slow stream
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hmm the upgrades themselves having a stat range would be neat, but my idea for this is more start from a mk0 weapon and then apply 3 upgrades to hit mk3 for the run. So having stat ranges and stuff like that may be to deep for something that will only last a mission, but at the same time that could be pretty cool.

raw magnet
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I'd rather you get to keep your weapons.

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But if you lose them, or don't have any luck finding better ones?

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A progression system like the ships have for upgrading random junk-tier guns, including "I slipped Bozze a fiver for an iron" - should be present, too.

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But no rerolling, please.

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Just make it like the ship. "You brought back a Javelin? Okay, you can always print out a Mk. 0 Javelin. At base, you can upgrade that Javelin for Ingots. Not a lot of Ingots. But a few Ingots."

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But [that gun] remains [that gun]. Lose that gun? Sucks to be you, make a new one.

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With the caveat that if it comes back at all aboard your ship, it goes into your gun cabinet. Even if it was in another player's hands.

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(Because we're disaster survivors, see. In a situation like that, stealing someone's gun is a shooting offense.)

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... And yes, allow a player to intentionally transfer a gun to another player before getting on the ship; if it goes onto the ship in your possession, it's yours.

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That would nearly eliminate weapon theft entirely (You'd have to have a whoopsie and set it down on the ground in the base), which would remove any incentive (save spite, I suppose) for griefers nicking your gun on the ship. (I guess real griefers might go and flush it before a warp.)

slow stream
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I don't know but this feels very close to "leave it how it is" and I don't think the weapons as is either keeping them or losing them on mission end are good for final version personally. The difference from mk0-3 just doesn't feel super great to me currently. I want to feel like I'm investing in my weapon. Which is why I'm hoping for several weapon attachements (10+) to choose from so you can truly "craft" your preferred version of each gun. I also think that starting with the gun you want, maybe buying an upgrade or two from Bozze before setting out, and then finding the rest of the upgrades in the run makes the gun progression a constant chase. I honetly don't want to just load in with the same sniper rifle every mission. We upgrade the ship and it is a constant from run to run. I think the small arms could be a form of variability keeping each run just that much more fresh. Grant some systems that allow the players to mitigate that, in the form of credit sinks, so that if someone really does just want to use the same exact weapon each run they can. Regardless of how and what exactly changes I don't think the current system as it stands should stay personally.

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Ultimately I want a rework of the entire small arms system and not a refinement of current system. I don't want QOL improvements to how it works now. I want a ground up actual small arms system that isn't just finding them as loot in mission and keeping what is in your inventory. As it stands the weapons are treated with the same level of importance as a portable shield generator. I want the true "my weapon" feeling.

wet pulsar
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@leaden elbow What do you think?

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I really like this suggestion

leaden elbow
# wet pulsar <@237066801526210560> What do you think?

IMO, have all types of mk0 weapons always purchasable at the hub for credits, and craftable in mission for materia

Add add-ons/mods and weapon attachments as loot drops, and looting them permanently unlocks those weapon parts to equip in the hub and craft & equip during a mission.

Mk 0 - 3 only exists per run, and you use either materia to upgrade your weapon mk, or you can loot "weapon upgrade kits" to upgrade your weapon mk. Weapon marks reset on run end.

This would all add meta progression, per run goals, and allow players to equip whatever gun they wanted starting at the hub.

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It would also ease gear fear, since the only things you're really losing when you lose a gun is the mk level, since you can craft the gun and attachments

slow stream
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Yeah this achieves basically what I was getting at. I do still want multiple upgrades while only having the ability to have 3 per run. So you wind up with different weapons each run.

leaden elbow
# slow stream Yeah this achieves basically what I was getting at. I do still want multiple upg...

if you're wanting to have "guns be different" per run, then probably the only way to achieve that with weapon mods is to have 2 categories of mods:

  • Normal mods: scopes, mag sizes, etc
  • Power mods: radical weapon mods like changing shotgun to slug shot for massive increased single target damage

There's slots for a specific number of normal mods per gun, choose one per slot.

Power mods would be where you only get offered a limited selection of mods to choose from for each run, and you can only equip one per gun.

There's no point in making normal mods RNG because they're just changing the feel and minor performance of the gun, nothing major enough to make the gun be "different" per run

slow stream
# leaden elbow if you're wanting to have "guns be different" per run, then probably the only wa...

This is basically what I had in mind. I was thinking 3 upgrades per run that you can choose from. Then kinda like the artifacts we have now for the ship have some be "normal" (i.e. damage and magazine size) then "rare/legendary" (i.e. Maw slug rounds). I don't necessarily want the weapons to be different every run, but I do feel like the small arms should be a progression that we are working towards each mission. I'm also wanting several upgrades both agnostic and weapon specific to incentivize the variety. Maybe even have some that can't be bought and needs to found each run similar to how the railgun can't be crafted.

slow stream
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I think my ultimate hope and goal is for it to always, or at least as much of each run as possible, be exciting to leave the ship and find loot. Seeing the "weapon upgrade box" should feel a bit like opening chest and seeing the ship artifacts. "oooh are my favorites in here?" As it stands if you have 3 MK3 weapons on you your just plowing through the sectors only caring about the objective to get to the next thing. The final rewards matter cause maybe you'll get an artifact you want or maybe you'll find a component to convert to M. All the small blue containers people don't care about because they already have everything they want. Those containers equal out to be 5-8 credits if it is on the ship at mission end and have no satisfaction or excitement about opening them. I just want every piece of loot to be exciting outside of loot goblin mode.

leaden elbow
# slow stream I think my ultimate hope and goal is for it to always, or at least as much of ea...

I don't think you're going to get endless "ooo, gun loot!" in this game because this game isn't trying to be borderlands with its endless combinations of gun parts, but it can a little bit more than we currently have.

I'm all for an expansion to the guns, and providing some customizability through weapon mods, but IMO, the different "feel" of the guns per run should be dictated by a power mod that you can swap out in mission if you find one you want, and there's only a few to choose from at the run start.

Regular weapon mods would work like ship components currently do, where you find them once, then you can equip them whenever you want, and possibly spend ingots to upgrade those like components too.

Then you also can make the power mods run specific, and you have to equip new ones with each run, while still having the base weapon customizability as a jumping off point for making the weapon better as a baseline version.

slow stream
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and my whole point here is that ship components is meta progression that carries run to run. The small arms could be run specific so there is something you're still working towards when your ship is "complete" and there is nothing else to rank up you're still trying to make this run's weapon better for the on foot sections.

ashen ridge
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actual progression, actual loadouts

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this is what the people want

slow stream
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eh I want them to lean into the rogue side of the game they've made personally.

open forge
# ashen ridge actual progression, actual loadouts

This is where I'm leaning. I don't enjoy starting from scratch over and over, though that's the nature of these games. Taking some of that out and at least letting me start with a Mk0 would be great. I feel it's waaaay too random right now. But again, this may be the intent in which case they're doing a great job.

slow stream
# open forge This is where I'm leaning. I don't enjoy starting from scratch over and over, th...

My pitch is starting with any mk0 and finding/ unlocking upgrades to be purchased as a prep prior to the mission. As a rogue lite I honestly feel there has already been to many concessions away from it that everyone is going to just end up with whatever weapon they prefer and then get bored because it's the same fight every time. I could just be biased because I like rogue lite, but heaven forbid the rogue lite I bought be a rogue lite lol

leaden elbow
# slow stream My pitch is starting with any mk0 and finding/ unlocking upgrades to be purchase...

I'll be honest... I think you're kinda reaching with calling jump space a roguelite. I see the elements you're talking about that make you think it is one, but there is not NEARLY enough game design decisions that were made to make jump space anywhere close to being considered a roguelite.

Changing things to keep it fresh for repeated runs? Sure!

Actually having enough roguelite elements to qualify for it as a genre? Not even close.

There's not going to be anywhere near the replayability of a roguelite in jump space, purely because all of the levels are strictly curated and created with no randomization other than enemy spawns and random events. The levels themselves are the same every time.

IMO, the better way to handle guns is to let players handle weapon attachments like ship components currently are, add power mods that change how a gun functions that get reset at the end of each run, and make marks reset at the end of each run.

wet pulsar
slow stream
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I ask because I like the way the ships work, but just doing that again for small arms sounds lazy and boring to me. People will just use the same weapon with the same upgrades every time.

leaden elbow
# slow stream It's been described as a rogue lite by the devs. In not trying to force it into ...

Well, if the devs themselves are working towards a roguelite vision for jump space, they've got A LOT of work to do, because I don't see it other than a couple of small elements here and there. I get it's EA, but they don't have basically any of the randomness required for the roguelite genre.

I didn't disagree with your OP, but laid out more concrete terms and a vision for what the larger picture of weapons could look like, and made it in line with how the game currently works and what would probably be reasonable for the devs to implement, seeing as it's very similar to other systems that already exist in the game (components). KISS is as always the best rule when it comes to suggesting things for devs to consider.

leaden elbow
slow stream
# leaden elbow Well, if the devs themselves are working towards a roguelite vision for jump spa...

That's fair and yeah the devs have said they don't want to feel locked to any specific genre so much as do what feels right and good for this game. I agree with KISS, but also disagree with limitations based solely on keeping things in line with what are present currently. Now is the time to try something wild and if it doesn't work take it back out. I think now is the time to try anything they can imagine and refine and trim to something reasonable now. Be ambitious and see where we get. I don't hate your idea but I just feel like there could be something so much more interesting at least tried.

slow stream
leaden elbow
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if you start getting vague and longwinded in your suggestions, those tend to be ignore by devs because they've got 500 other people doing the same thing

slow stream
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I think dream big, but within reason. I don't think my suggestion is out of scope possibly not in their purview but not a crazy suggestion lol.

leaden elbow
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no, I was just curbing some elements and providing more concrete concepts rather than nebulous "we need weapon mods"

slow stream
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I was mentioned all the same mods. End of the day the thing I want them to realize is that the weapons themselves feel good, but currently just feel like any other consumable we pick up with no investment.

leaden elbow
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yeah, that's why I just put them in more concrete terms and categories

slow stream
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Besides there are thousands of games now. They are all going to have the same variations of mods at this point. What's interesting is how we engage with them.

open forge
wild surge
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This is interesting. I'm certainly not opposed. I'm curious to see what direction the devs take for multitools as well.

digital tangle
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I posted this elsewhere, but I have a huge problem with "You bring a weapon you like back, it gets taken away from you, and then it's presented to you on a table in exchange for money", just on the level of "guys, if I wanted to engage in predatory exploitative capitalism, I have an actual job for the weekdays"

Some people would burn the hangar to the ground and scrawl graffiti on the embers.

slow stream
# digital tangle I posted this elsewhere, but I have a *huge* problem with "You bring a weapon yo...

ugh again this is a full misrepresentation of both what I've proposed and of the fact we're playing a video game.

I want to choose any of the weapons to start with. Then go on a mission and find upgrades for said weapon. We either unlock the upgrades via completing the mission after finding it, getting enough copies of said weapon, blueprints, etc.

Then the weapon vendor has a few of these upgrades random with a reroll for credits, or just has all currently available upgrades to build craft with. Maybe you keep the current weapon until you want to change it up so you aren't paying anything between missions provided you aren't making changes to the weapon.You are keeping "your gun" and only paying the gunsmith to make changes to the weapon.

However end of the day all this super weird "they are stealing our guns and we should be able to kill the NPCs and burn the hangar to the ground" you and Shadow have is honestly nuts. It is a space adventure game. It was originally pitched as rogue lite. They added carry over as a band aid because people were confused and didn't like resetting to nothing each run. I wouldn't like that either. I just want a system to actually customize "my gun" and to better invest in it. Right now it is find a random gun with a 3 on it then stop looting because it doesn't matter anymore. That isn't a good system and actively encourages people to skip entire portions of the game and troll each other.

digital tangle
# slow stream ugh again this is a full misrepresentation of both what I've proposed and of the...

Please, it's at best a partial exaggeration. You are (EDIT: were at time of writing, see below) literally proposing "The quick pitch for this suggestion is if ship weapons/progression are overarching and from run to run then the small arms progression can be run specific"

and

"Vendors can offer any mk0 weapon for purchase. As you find/unlock weapon upgrades/attachments /blueprints they are also unlocked in the vendor. If you finish a mission after discovering them then you unlock them to go into the vendor prep menu."

That is literally "you bring something back, the game takes it away from you and then gives you the opportunity to buy it back later"

I get you think people who view it this way are weird, but honestly, given weirdness is defined by the majority, from what I've seen on the carryover discussion, I'd at least give house room to the idea that you're the weird one.

slow stream
# digital tangle Please, it's at best a partial exaggeration. You are (EDIT: were at time of writ...

If you're going to quote mine me why not include "Maybe you keep the current weapon until you want to change it up so you aren't paying anything between missions provided you aren't making changes to the weapon.You are keeping "your gun" and only paying the gunsmith to make changes to the weapon."?

I'm open to several executions for the weapon system. Just don't like the existing one, and I'm trying to think of something that will last longer than just having a locker of MK3s.

Do you have an idea for a weapon system you'd like to see? Or changes to the existing one you'd like? I don't want to just argue back and forth. I'm not "right" and you're not "wrong" we just disagree on how it works. The more we talk about this the more the devs can maybe glean something and come up with their interpretation and will it better than I ever could've described.

digital tangle
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I didn't include that because... is that actually in your post? Or in one of the replies? I think the issue with that is that it dissuades people for trying out different weapons, and has a lot of the same problem as carryover (won't drop it, will do increasingly weird hacks to avoid a loss, etc). But if I just didn't read it and it's right there, I can only apologise

But yeah, I'm currently writing up my own suggestion on this, as there are a lot of the very real problems with carryover (all of which I agree entirely you with). But I want to avoid to write off 90% of the playerbase's very real issues with resetting on mission completion

slow stream
# digital tangle I didn't include that because... is that actually in your post? Or in one of the...

90% is definitely an overestimate, but I'm glad you are working on a proposal of your own, and I do like the critiques of my ideas. I said that in response to you here: #1426935620105801899 message. Basically all of my weapon pitches are also from the perspective of an inventory change that the weapons are removed from inventory and you are choosing a weapon at the beginning of the run and don't have to drop it to continue looting. You can always swap your "equipped weapon" though if you find a new one you like. I'm trying to refine my idea to be enjoyed by as many as possible.

I was interested in this game from the original pitch which definitely included more session based and rogue lite elements. L4D and FTL being two of the big influences. L4d you start every session with just a pistol so it wasn't crazy to me that you did that here too. However I understand how that doesn't feel great and even agree something needed to change from just blank slate every run. Just don't want the existing system to be considered good enough and not get any more work on it.

digital tangle
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90% is definitely an overestimate

I thought so too originally, but as far as I can tell it's the closest thing we have to a representatively sampled poll.

440 vs 41.

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slow stream
# digital tangle > 90% is definitely an overestimate I thought so too originally, but as far as ...

This is a post just asking it to go back to the way it was. I'd disagree with that too and I'm one of the most vocal people against carry over. I do agree that is a surprising number to see there, but I think that just establishes that the demo feel was really bad.

I edited my original post to reflect some of the thoughts I've had during conversations. If you have the time/interest revisit that and see if it makes more sense or is closer to something you thing you'd like too.

digital tangle
slow stream
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Agree the ratio was unexpected. Perhaps a more general poll is needed.

digital tangle
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I do get where you're coming from regarding roguelites, btw, but I think it's really important to view it in terms of "what those games are". I haven't played much LFD, but from what I recall, it's got almost no persistence, each time you're a fresh set of survivors? And the way your ship resets in FTL is that you've either been turned into space dust or saved the galaxy. Not taken out a single jammer somewhere in the outer rim.

Most of the roguelite games I've played where your stuff gets taken from you after the equivalent of a successful Jump Space mission are themed as horrific corporate nightmares where the uncaring company wants you to suffer, and honestly, even Lethal Company let you keep shit until you don't make quota.

slow stream
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Back to demo no Carry over

Carry over as is

Mods buildcraft

I don't know but something has to change

we can pose this question to community at large and see what they say lol.

digital tangle
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I would go with two questions:

  1. Are you happy with the current state of inventory carryover

and

  1. Would you prefer no inventory carryover

blind and in that order.

slow stream
slow stream
lime trench
slow stream
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As it should. I don't want to go backwards. I want to continue moving forward.

digital tangle
slow stream
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I think giving more context to the question is important. That's why I think a poll with some variation to my questions would better align what people want.

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Just asking those two questions is still a pretty tight box.

digital tangle
slow stream
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I don't feel that my questions are biased. It's asking do we go back to what it was, leave it as is, try a mods/ build craft/ load out system, or even a none of those but something has to change.

Feels pretty open to just get a general vibe check without leaning in any direction. I feel like those are basically the only 4 opinions someone could have right now lol.

digital tangle
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Except "mods buildcraft" covers a lot of ground, right?

slow stream
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And we'd want the poll to be semi actionable. If we went with the two then we get those for and those against which is a starting point but then you have to have lots of follow up questions.

slow stream
digital tangle
slow stream
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There is no constraint in a community poll like that. End of the day devs can take that info and whatever they want with it up to and including completely disregarding it. This isn't a do this or else. It's a vibe check of the community so the devs can hopefully learn something prior to working hours on something.

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We also have to keep in mind the systems we are talking about would be worked on by 1-3 people likely, and mostly done by 1. So whatever we end up all agreeing on it'll be quite way out.

lime trench
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Based on the last few dev Q&As the current system definitely isn't the final one and it sounds like they would prefer to keep it geared more towards how they originally intended but are now shifting to a happy medium between between carry over and no carry over

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They were keeping a very close eye on feedback related to it, especially lockers

digital tangle
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I guess my thought is that the more options you offer, the more it becomes "rank these options" and "do you like change".

I think the most interesting part is the fairly stark division between "carryover but make it better" and "no carryover, no pasaran, BURN IT ALL DOWN"

slow stream
digital tangle
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Which sounds like I'm making fun of the other side, but is actually a direct quote of @lime trench

lime trench
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Approving upon or expanding on carry over, and I've said this many times, is adding to a shaky/flawed foundation

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People are now asking for lockers, weapon personalization so you can't steal it, and people are even suggesting that you just keep your weapons no matter where you place them (on the ground or on your person)which is basically loadouts

digital tangle
lime trench
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The issue of defending no carry over is how much effort it takes to explain a system, any system that would replace kt

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It's much easier to sell improving carry over

slow stream
digital tangle
lime trench
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Which honestly now I wonder if load outs should be called "improved carry over" 🤣 for marketing purposes

digital tangle
lime trench
slow stream
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I'm going to rebrand my system in this post as improved carry over as you are maintaining the weapon you found mission after mission with no credit sink unless you are adjusting mods between missions lol.

digital tangle
lime trench
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We got carry over which is not enough, or many people don't realize it's a new mechanic since demo, regardless both populations are asking for more or adjustments.

Early on the first thing I noticed was grieving behavior due to how weapons are found and kept, but I wasn't exactly blaming carry over just yet

digital tangle
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Yeah, which is the clearest evidence that carryover in its current form doesn't work, although the bullshit player behaviours you've identified are the most serious evidence, though.

lime trench
lime trench
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People are now asking for more inventory space because they want to carry over more stuff/refuse to put down their guns

digital tangle
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Oh, it absolutely would. Seriously, if they'd added "so we took the gun away, but look, you can buy it back for 500 times its salvage value", I would have made so many Tom Nook jokes.

lime trench
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Some have also suggest having dedicated item slot types

digital tangle
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I would have been doing all the memes.

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"In the grim darkness of the robot future, the resistance has found a solution in... checks notes... the most exploitative capitalist system since the workhouse"

lime trench
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I think what also what has frustrated me is how much it has also affected vendors

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They can overall help the situation by halving the cost of prep items by like 50%, but the fact that you can carry over ship items is crazy

slow stream
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Carry over negated vendors before they even existed.

lime trench
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Yeah

digital tangle
slow stream
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One thing I know for sure is no matter how this shakes out this is the going to be the first controversial move they make and will be remembered as a dark time lol.

lime trench
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But yeah a mk3 can be worth up to 3 hours of your time or less depending how efficient you are at farming

slow stream
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Yeah vendors are way over priced. I don't even use bozze and vosk very selectively. Credit sink sure but damn those exchange rates lol

lime trench
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If anyone is prepping more than one item I'm almost immediately suspicious they're cheating

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The price of an artifact is insane

digital tangle
slow stream
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Yup. Only the mk3 weapons and melee weapons get bought

lime trench
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Comparing items you can actually make on ship vs purchasing power

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Hard to measure the value of a mk3 weapon

digital tangle
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The artifacts I tend to buy because they're at least fun for the whole team, and I've still got 40k of credits burning a hole in my pocket.

lime trench
slow stream
lime trench
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And so far I haven't needed to use prep at all luckily

digital tangle
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Sure, but that's an optional cosmetic. I could buy it, but why would I? I earned my sniper helmet.

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Having cosmetics be massive credit sinks for the over-invested among us makes sense. But no-one's spending a run's worth of prep on the amount of materia they could lose in a hard-to-find leak.

lime trench
slow stream
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Nothing is final though so I'm not mad at vendors. It'll get tuned.

lime trench
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I have been enjoying the credit buff

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The cases giving 200 is really nice

slow stream
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Hadn't even noticed lol

lime trench
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And stuff going for like 6 to 10 credits for salvage is also a nice improvement. I just like looting

slow stream
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Same I want to always loot. Big part of my investment in this subject of carry over lol

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Honestly why aren't guns worth 100 or more?

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Increase based on mk

digital tangle
lime trench
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But yeah I'm not worried about materia and credit balancing. That's just a few number fixes for them to edit

slow stream
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I think a weapon Smith offering his services to swap mods between runs is a nice optional middle ground.

digital tangle
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Yeah, only reason I have some concerns is that the og numbers were so wildly off that my confidence in the dev's economy decisions is a bit low.

i_receive_you_receive.png
lime trench
slow stream
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But yeah besides that I think we should sell weapons for no worse than half what we are expecting to buy them for. Even then it's a slimy pawn.

thin mica
# digital tangle > 90% is definitely an overestimate I thought so too originally, but as far as ...

Ah, that post. You are insane to think those are actual numbers. I remember seeing it at 30-100 or so. To think, that from the first ~150 people that saw it ~20% liked it, while from the next ~350 only 3% liked it suggests, that there might be a bias here. That bias being, that most people only read the title of a post, then hit the "upvote" button presented to them (here being the large, red ❌ ). It's just like reddit: people, that can't think for themself, or don't want to at the moment, or for a miriad of other reasons, just hit the only button presented to them (you guessed it: the ❌ ) and go on with their lives.

If you look into the people, who actually took the time and effort to read a few comments and join the converstation it is a 50-50 split at best, but i have my opinion too, on some of the "arguments" had there...

thin mica
# lime trench I think what didn't help is no solution was offered, taking away content/buffs c...

Also, i wouldn't say nothing of value was offered there. Most people didn't really care about OP's post (since it became so hard to search back (especially on phone), that i do think it's unlikely anyone have even read it after the first couple of days), rather most people were conversing about how the system should / shouldn't be changed. In that sense it was a thread consisting of every single option and direction, where the inventory system could go.

In the end i do think that thread is a gold mine hidden beneath a pile of garbage.

lime trench
digital tangle
thin mica
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And to the latest few bits about the vendors here: i do think that vendors in the current iteration are a lifeline: they can give you back the gear you had lost, and they can help you make a difficulty jump. Other than that, they are overpriced and useless.

I don't like, how they took out Nisse and nerfed the 25 starting metaria, just to make the extra metaria nearly a must, if you want everything to go smootly, and i also don't like, how a single Mk.3 weapon costs more, than what i usually make during a single day. This is why, i do think, that if they ever change up the inventory system, the vendor system would also have to change too, as the current one is very strictly balanced around the current inventory system.

slow stream
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I still want to point out that post itself was calling for a return to demo times and proposed nothing to replace it. I am one of the ❌ s because I don't like that proposal.

digital tangle
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Yeah, it's a particularly bad version of the form, but if we're talking "people only read the title", which I'd believe, 300 times the number of regular commenters on carryover saw "get rid of it" and responded "❌"

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At that point I think you do want to think "Maybe we need to use caution on what we propose in this area."

thin mica
# digital tangle I mean, I think it's more representative than the number of posts by about four ...

The post itself suggested nothing with it's title and by that metric everyone is more likely to just hit the ❌ and go on with their life and don't care about it. Also, if you think about an " ❌ " it could mean in some people's head (i definetly not say, that many, but some) that pressing it actually supports the post instead of being against it, since it was the only option present and the ❌ = remove isn't that big of a jump.

digital tangle
slow stream
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I see what you did there.

thin mica
slow stream
thin mica
slow stream
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Yup end of the day it is up to the devs to act or disregard the feeback.

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Back to demo no Carry over

Carry over as is

Mods buildcraft

Loadouts

I don't know but something has to change

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I will ask Groove if he feels a poll about the subject makes sense to the team currently or if it is to soon for something like that.

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or I guess if the team even cares enough about it lol. They could just be kinda ignoring it and waiting for us to get tired of talking about it lol.

thin mica