#Scarlet, the Red Hood - Discussion Thread

1222 messages · Page 2 of 2 (latest)

ocean roost
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hey folks, im tackling scarlet for a few days and i wanted to pick ur brains on something... is attack power crit build a thing for scarlet? i wanna ask before joining and ruining a lobby with a bad build

river quiver
ocean roost
river quiver
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just get 7 league in addition to the power talents, make sure u have murderous intent also

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with 7 league you get a free double strike to get a combo pt

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so power dash atk, special dash atk defense into power

ocean roost
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Thank you for taking the time to guide me @river quiver

river quiver
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also @ocean roost consider adrenaline to attack quickly as well, and imo shapeshifter is good with this build cus more cooldown to work with

ocean roost
river quiver
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ye thats best

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just dont get slash flurry its attack pattern cant be dashed out of

ocean roost
river quiver
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wolf special does lots of stagger damage, so does aggresive defense, scarlett special and shotgun stagger but special delay sucks

ocean roost
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And for eating big targets

river quiver
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I pick cloud if I need setup but if I feel my damage is lacking I take shotgun, that ult is pretty good honestly

ocean roost
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@river quiver honestly, i prolly should have just did mono dash build. i didn't really need my power for dmg

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hollow remnant
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So both ults are viable? I didn't have much success with the Shotgun.

river quiver
slender hill
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they know what they did

warped yarrow
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Does anyone have advice for using Scarlet's werewolf form? I just got this game and I liked the fantasy of a rogue character with stealth and dashes and stuff, and I feel comfortable kiting and getting damage off with her human form but as soon as it turns to night I'm just completely clueless on her

near tree
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The main advice would be just don't: most people just take shapeshifter and spend most of the game in human form. You'd mostly just go werewolf for getting hp back or in act 3 when your build is complete so you kill everything easily regardless of form.
Actual advice though, use defense mostly when you have a charged up power ready, use the intangible on the special to dodge attacks, be mindful of wolf form's larger hitbox, and use ult 2 as werewolf ult 1 blows

warped yarrow
quartz atlas
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Just realized that the collection bonus for Raven's Eye getting changed is a nerf for Scarlet's alt ultimates. At least the alt wolf ult got buffed....

hollow remnant
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But a major buff for the Shotgun ravenpog

urban wasp
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What's wrong with other starting talents

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The worst part about changing between forms for me is it happening in moments that aren't quite opportune

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Haven't tried high difficulties with her yet though.

hollow remnant
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Since I tried shapeshifter, I'm never ever choosing another starting talent again.

near tree
# urban wasp What's wrong with other starting talents

The problem is the swapping, not necessarily the talents. The design for scarlet is just bad: neither form is particularly great at anything at base, having different forms would normally mean you have better versatility but in this case it doesn't because you dont choose when to transform, you're forced to swap at the halfway point when killing bosses which can stop you from killing bosses in one cycle, all these mean her base trait is a downside and she doesn't even get an active trait like every other character does to help her kit

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it doesn't help that scarlet's wolf from sucks in early chapters because of a bigger hitbox and not alot of aoe so you don't want to be in wolf form early game either.

hollow remnant
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She is not the most powerful, i rarely achieve most damage with Scarlet but with Shapeshifter she is the most fun character for me.

static pine
tacit plume
# urban wasp The worst part about changing between forms for me is it happening in moments th...

There is a lot of layers to Scarlet that have been nerfed, balor eyes nerfs, even the starting crit talent I think was nerfed at some point...this is what imo caused shapeshifter to be so "ok..I guess it's always shapeshifter".

Shapeshifter is very versatile and is a "probably safest choice, when in doubt just pick it", not only cause you can control forms, but also it makes "leaning into any build" easier including ult cds/charges value.

But I personally sometimes do go for the special/crit talent, depending on what I see in the shop, or if I am teamed with an Aladdin who uses up his wishes early and I see a lot of crit.

I think the boost of stats/damage will feel easier to abuse if you have Aladdin crit boosts or something in the shop for special (or just believing special build will happen lol).

Leaning into crits will snowball my damage fast regardless of wolf, usually going for fan of knives/double attack playstylet, cause that works on wolf/human well.

Special spam build getting activated faster by the starting talent giving the boost of damage is worth forgoing shapeshifter- to me, but there's a risk you just don't get a lot of special items, and shapeshifter is the safer "ok maybe I shouldn't focus on special then" choice to have had. Special works well on both forms.

Power one...I think...if this talent...gets a revamp of that when you kill something you reset power and get a free combo point or 2 or something - lol....it'd be maybe more fun to consider. I think when Murderous intent used to refill all your combo points this was more "ok fair", but after the nerf...not really imo.

hollow remnant
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The "maybe reset" of power feels so bad, compared to Carmilla's starting talents. Gaining +1 Vitality and healing on kill is a big improvement for solo plays.

quartz atlas
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It'll always just be weird to me how Scarlet's the face of the game, but her base kit is actively painful to play around and the devs have continually nerfed her. I only started playing when they added Gepetto but I feel like she wasn't considered high tier then, and that she's just become worse and worse since

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I feel like Pam's Balor's Eye boss instakill was personally responsible for a good chunk of the nerfs lel

tacit plume
# quartz atlas >There is a lot of layers to Scarlet that have been nerfed I'll forever be upset...

I agree that I was surprised why did she get looked at 'that hard' compared to the rest lo, but maybe it could depend what footage out there made the build look too obscene. I mean honestly she's still ok to me, so maybe it was warranted.

I think maybe the special being way too "big of an aoe", made it feel like lol everythings is exploding out of existence. I don't mind the special angle nerf, but I wish they just juiced up the power talent and the power angle - eviscerate is too much of a joke, would it really be a big deal if the bleed is significant damage?

But honestly if they don't do anything, I like her still personally, she has her perks and unique fun angle, is she categorically underpowered I really dunno.

near tree
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The change that I feel would help her identity would be to make her default trait have an active that allows you to use an ability from the other form - at reduced effectiveness to make it not broken.
it would give her versatility for having two forms without taking away the forced werewolf transformation theme that they want to keep

placid loom
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Werewolf is supposed to be a curse. It's reflected in gameplay no way they're changing that.

quartz atlas
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Werewolf sure feels like a curse, I'll give you that

quartz atlas
# tacit plume I agree that I was surprised why did she get looked at 'that hard' compared to t...

I mean I still like Scarlet, she's my main and I know she has her strengths, but yeah I do feel like she's categorically underpowered.

Human Power? iframes, 40 damage at 0 combo points, 100 damage at 3 combo points, and since she gets a guaranteed crit that bumps up to 155 without extra crit bonuses. That's... actually very good. I booted up a couple of other characters and it goes
Ice Queen Power: 50
Gepetto Power: 50 (dummy) 25 (hammer)
Melu Power: 50
Juliet Uncharged Power: 80 (lol)
Juliet Charged Power: 120 (LMAO)
but the problem is that she literally has 2 (3 with Devourer) Power talents with one of them being ok but requiring her to do more setup to get mileage out of it, and the other is one of the worst talents in the game. So it might be a great Power, but it never gets any significant upgrades and it doesn't scale well with Power stack/CD objects (OR HER OWN GODDAMN POWER STARTING TALENT) because she needs to get combo points to actually deal damage with it.

Human Special? A great AoE but it being a delayed attack that requires you to lead enemies into it while also stunning you if you get hit by it is... cruel. Is especially worse in MP if the horde is on an ally so you have to run around just to try to hit enemies with it. The fact that there are TWO talents that are dedicated to removing these downsides is messed up, I can't think of anyone else who has to deal with that.

Human Defense is the best Defense in the game. 2 seconds of intangible, a way to steal objectives without fighting a single enemy, and also the best way to lose aggro so you can teleport somewhere? God bless.

And then you get to Wolf Form, where your best choice of playing it is to simply not use it. The problems behind it have been talked about to death, big hitbox, a tanky playstyle that's incompatible with higher difficulties, and a SINGLE TARGET AUTO LOCKON POWER THAT DEALS 150 DAMAGE (at 3 combo points, 60 at 0) WHICH IS LESS THAN HUMAN FORM THANkS TO GUARANTEED CRIT

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And sure if it crits then it'll deal more damage but that's STILL LESS DAMAGE IF THERE'S MORE THAN A SINGLE ENEMY AROUND. I SURE HOPE A WEAK LITTLE GRUNT DIDN'T GET IN THE WAY OF ME TRYING TO HIT THE HEALER. The only thing Wolf Form has going for her is the Special, which only had the downside of being easily punishable if you're trying to hit a horde, but if you've got Distant Explosions then you replace it with a new downside: Actually having to play Wolf Form

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The fact that you're supposed to play half the game like this as Scarlet is just insane. Honestly, if Wolf Power was just a bit better than I wouldn't have such a big problem with the form period, but it's like it's been scientifically engineered to be as bad as possible and act like literally nothing else in the entire game. There's no other single target attack and there's no move with iframes that you have so little control over.

placid loom
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I wouldn't rate scarlet in underpowered. If anything, she's always middle of the pack or even on the strong side. She's the character that has the most balanced state atm between all her talents and starter traits (even if it's still imperfect).

tacit plume
# quartz atlas I mean I still like Scarlet, she's my main and I know she has her strengths, but...

I am just honestly not with the "wolf is terrible" train.

I think the character is very flavorful, and I really am not with the "wolf needs to be deleted" mentality at all. Like I want to hear flavorful suggestions to what is it that would make wolf cooler, not delete her duality conept, that is very depressing to me, I think Scarlet has the cool factor down, to reduce everything to "she needs to not be wolf for my dps" is just - not a fan.

Wolf is decent if you play around that when you are wolf you can AA in a wider and "stupid" more than Human form by face tanking stuff, sure maybe it's not "big damage" which seems to be the main goal always for some reason, but it's fun in it's own way to me. The power and special both being able to dodge while "thriller" attacking is fun to me.

That does need a few items specifically to make it more comfortable which is defense cd, maybe some armor, maybe a mermaid tear or 2, which I guess if playing with mods it's a lot to need compared to others...maybe black lotus/holy grail. Wolf also has the more offensive ults - in a way, especially now that shotgun is lul. Howl was nerfed in range and damage still lol.

Also how her crit damage is balanced around that human defense gives you 100% crit chance, but wolf has no innate crit advantages at all...maybe that's where the core issue is dunno for sure. Maybe the crit talent/power should offer wolf something extra than human. Special talent/build is fine on both imo.

Idk...I mean I played a lot of wow druid, and she gives me that vibe of bear/cat druid vibe...I get that how wolf scales doesn't super align with human, but I find it as the unique thing about playing her is making both forms work?, is it unviable in certain situations..I didn't fully test that, but yes some characters are more obscene than her, but not everything has to be the same "level" , especially in a pve game Idk.

However yes I do feel like Eviscerate, and the Power talent are the main "need" something.

quartz atlas
# tacit plume I am just honestly not with the "wolf is terrible" train. I think the characte...

I really am not with the "wolf needs to be deleted" mentality at all
Neither am I, I've never said anything like that. Just because I'm complaining about it doesn't mean I want it gone.

face tanking stuff
Yeah, that's how you're supposed to play Wolf but when you're on Nightmare with a horde of 15 enemies in front of you that can each take off half of your HP in a single hit that simply isn't viable until you get a bunch of armor and healing items, which means that for all of Act 1 and maybe even Act 2 you have to either adopt an ill-fitting hit and run strategy with Wolf, or simply avoid playing as Wolf entirely.
I like playing as Wolf once you've got a build going, but the fact that you need to get a build going in order for half of a character's gameplay to not be awful just sucks. I want to like playing Wolf, instead of dreading it.

placid loom
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You can facetanking early as act 1. It just requires flurry. And later 60 base armor and 40 vit per act.

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or adrenaline 🤷

quartz atlas
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Maybe it's just me, but I feel requiring good RNG to be able to play the character as intended is bad design.

tacit plume
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but that would not be unique to Scarlet, I feel like that is the concept of rogue games really..."ow you were not lucky...so this run is not gonna be great" that

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that's the tug and pull of those type of games I think xD

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Like Carmilla for example, she does have the power to make her "lol everything dies"...but if you don't get her special spammable she feels ughhh

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a lot of them are like that...Juliet's strength is that she's the least like that I think

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and I think Juliet turned out that way to the whole "we don't want coop" fiesta

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but also I think they wanted Juliet to be the "bring a long a friend and easy game" type of vibe

quartz atlas
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Juliet's..... Juliet.

tacit plume
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which I think is fine...if Scarlet was conceptually boring and not interesting to play is where I'd feel reaal ughh...but she has a strong unique vibe to her...again buffs would be lovely...or not. Tbh I think the thing is I am unsure about what vision of "balance" do they actually want lol xD

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because like you said...why was she nerfed like that compared to the rest?

quartz atlas
# tacit plume Like Carmilla for example, she does have the power to make her "lol everything d...

I feel like that's different. Like, Carmilla's base gameplay encourages you to hit and run to build up blood, and then use that blood for big damage. You can do that without needing anything special, but you can make it better or build her for a different style of gameplay instead.
Wolf form's base gameplay encourages you to be a tank, and you can totally do that right out of the gate on easier difficulties, but on harder ones you just can't do that. I frankly can't think of anyone else where they can't do their main function unless you get items to do that.

tacit plume
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They also went out of their way to make maps look all weird to counter stealth mechanics in general...

quartz atlas
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Stealth has always been a weird aspect of the game to me lel

tacit plume
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I feel like if the other two starting talents offered wolf an extra push given that the mechanics that were nerfed impacts both of them, but it tones down human but bullies wolf further is maybe the real core issue. Like I remember the crit talent nerf was very..."really??"

quartz atlas
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I actually don't remember that nerf, what was it?

tacit plume
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I think just the numbers of it really let me check...I mean it was pretty strong on human form of course....but I didn't think it was doing anything insane compared to the rest

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‘Shadow Strikes’ now gives +0.5% crit chance per objective (from +1%) and now has an x30 objective count (from x25)'

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so 10% difference...hopefully xD

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I know now the end of the world...but it's all of it combined I guess. 25% crit on your attacks is a big deal for how wolf works

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‘Energy’ now increases crit chance by +4%/+5%/+6%/+7% per combo point spent (from +4%/+6%/+8%/+10%)'

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‘Explosive Rush’ Special now deals 40%/50%/60%/70% damage (from 100%/125%/150%/175%) This def helped people never notice is wolf bad or not, cause it was the bread and butter of life

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and wolf makes the talent work "faster to see" in a way, cause human needs short wick. It's still pretty darn good from a stagger angle on wolf I have to say, even if not going for a special build at all lol

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Like I remember the first time I played I thought Shadowstrikes is the "leaning on human great, wolf okish", Devour is the opposite where maybe if you kill something with wolf you regain all the combo points and the cd. It wasn't, but then when I saw murderous intent filling all combo points I was like ok I see the idea there, but that's still probably better on human?, cause other wise what's the point of a reset power if I need to combo point it for it feel good...

Maybe wolf needs a little "devour hilarity" angle to stop the hate xD :(.

violet kindle
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wolf just isn't good with the base kit. single target power, special on a long cooldown, healing from defence not enough to face tank. it becomes usable once you get your build going with dash/special but otherwise it's more of a situational shapeshifter thing like cycling cooldowns or to stagger/finish off an elite once most of the camp is already dead. with base kits you are almost always better off just being human form

near tree
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Even ignoring how weak wolf is with the base kit, the forced transformation is just neither fun nor good design. There's no playing around the transformation to your advantage, the trait provides mainly disadvantages to the character, you actually lose another button to press if you don't have shapeshifter, there's no synergy/interactions between the forms and it actively breaks the flow of gameplay

eternal junco
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Yet that’s what makes her herself, and it’s super unique and fun. It’s possible it’s not balanced correctly, but it’s extremely neat

tacit plume
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I think if the talent "wide attacks" gives scarlet a small bonus, but gives wolf an "extra bonus", that might save him, orr just any talent gives him a "reliable no crit based" advantage to contrast human's vibe maybe...i dunno

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orr even that the ace of spades set bonus makes aa chaining feel actually good with a crazy bonus...Idk what is it with "dash attacks can be crazy"...but aaing just like that has to be in check. Double Attack +700%...wide attacks...+20% :3

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like snowqueens AA build being targeted to be no fun allowed...from multiple lances to...just 2...why is that the unacceptable "gamebreaker" concept compared to the rest

zealous flicker
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wolf needs something hahaha

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tbh it's good enough in base nightmare because that difficulty isn't hard for us oldies with 1000 hours in the game, but it would be nice for the character not to become weaker in every metric other than base kit sustain every night

tacit plume
# zealous flicker yeah devour is better on human too

I agree I don't think nightmare is "omg wolf is unbearable" yet...but I think she has a lot of talents that if just tailored a little more for wolf...maybe it'll do something.

Devour starting talent, make it the "I can't wait for night time" vibe, cause human is already doing ok. Eviscerate's bleed a lot stronger on wolf? lol like Merlin's Sacred Strike bleed insanity would've make more sense on Wolf I think?

True Instincts...gives wolf something else maybe even straight vitality stat might be better to scale of all the vitality angles, maybe something like romeo's "Fencing Reflex" but a "dodge vibe" instead.

Wider attacks a bit of an extra bonus for wolf would compliment Adrenaline attack speed angle, and hint at what wolf is "good at". I don't feel like he needs a super crazy push to be relevant..just a little and in a flavorful way.

Then you could play wolf in the AA/slashflury/chomp, shred people fast with adrenalined AA theme, as opposed to Human's "sneaky back stab setups" vibe....which he already is like that tbh..but maybe just needs an extra push.

zealous flicker
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Yeah completely agree something should be done to make wolf feel less awful haha

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And failing that can we just make shapeshifter part of the base kit so the quests don't also feel awful

eternal junco
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Plz no shapeshifter base. Buff wolf and make the swap itself stronger somehow so the change is a neat feeling instead of “why am I wasting time watching this animation”

tacit plume
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Also the more I play her just for testing purposes...it's a lot of small things that were not "scarlet changes", but they impacted her more than the rest in a serious way, so honestly maybe she truly does need buffs/reverts overall.

Like cultists for example...they used to stop attacking if you "stun" them namely with special, so if they start attacking you, time a special around stopping them, now they'll get stunned, then "restart" their attacks fast?? and they even have better turn with it.

It's just a lot of stuff that was nerfs to casual stunning with very heavy "no you can't stealth that, you must gauntlet most things".

The stealthing antics is what she got by after the many nerfs she got - imo.

Also the spam of big thing with big stagger bars, with endless spawns, while dodging your own special xD, and stagger bars force you to stay on the target cause they drop fast (did they always drop this fast?)

And wolf's heal value is already nerfed naturally as healing is what is impacted as you raise difficulties, and even modifiers punish the heal mechanic more xD. Wolf's CD reduction might help offset that.

The crit rose "fix" she could've capitilized on quicker before..now it honestly I feel you kindda need the special starting talent boost and a level 2 pulverize to have some decent snowball cause of needing cleave so much.

A lot of enemies also now kite you around when you chain aa them in a a very "why all this??" way, healers are a lot spammier and all type of other stuff, the list is a little long..but it punishes something that wants to AA melee just to enable what actually does damage unlike Beos/Aladdin "stronger/bigger" AAs, but does nothing to those who cleave in masses from across the screen xD.

It's alot of changes against "how she works".

She has a heavy need to stand in the mess in a very "not like the others" way...I think I have been multiplaying for too long so I didn't notice how ?lol? she is on compared to the rest in solo now.

quartz atlas
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But I'd also be happy with them just making the transformation anim shorter so you don't miss out on a boss' stagger phase lel

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Really, why didn't they ever think to delay the time of day changing if the boss is still staggered?

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It's not like Piper or Carmilla players would complain about that

eternal junco
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Yeah the transform itself needs some changes I think. It coming with strength in one direction and a shield in the other might be fun. Full cooldown refresh is definitely something, but not always

violet kindle
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I mean all they'd really have to do is shorten the animation to be like shapeshifter so it doesn't disrupt your dps so heavily

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but then again they seem to be attached to themes even if it sacrifices player enjoyment so maybe they care more about the feel of scarlet going through an extended/painful animation than how it makes it less fun lmao

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personally I would love to see the stats on scarlet starting talent pick rates

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because it wouldn't make much sense to be attached to the day/night theme if 90% of players are just picking shapeshifter every time lmao

placid loom
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I rarely pick shapeshifter on my side, even if I know it's the correct play

river quiver
placid loom
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Taking either special, even more rarely shadow strike.

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Too used to the dash from distant explo, or bombing away

river quiver
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Shadow strikes is supposed to be pretty good right?

placid loom
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it's alright.

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It's one of the best quest in the game imo

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it encourages doing something you should alr do

river quiver
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I'm wondering, on a dash build shadow strikes might be better than shapeshifter for starting talent

placid loom
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shapeshifter is good but I feel like outside of ulti/pure defense build, it's not that much valuable over the rest

river quiver
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For power shapeshifter is arguably good because of how different her power functions but then the damage with shadowstrikes for power is probably greater

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But like when I personally don't know what build I'm going for if the shop is obtuse I feel shapeshifter gives me the option to go for anything

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God I really wish starter talents could be rerolled

placid loom
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If I see epic dup + random dup, it's one more reason to go special 😄

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At the end of the day, it's just a matter of habit.

river quiver
violet kindle
# placid loom shapeshifter is good but I feel like outside of ulti/pure defense build, it's no...

disagree tbh. it's kinda mandatory for power build because power wolf is bad and you get a loooot of utility out of it on the special build, especially before you're fully online since you can rotate your cooldowns, shapeshift, use your cooldowns again and basically clear any camp immediately in the mid game. you lose out on a bit of special damage but gain so much out of being able to double ult/rotate both of your cooldowns at will

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it's also just the best general starter so you can go into any build depending on what the game gives you without losing out on anything and you don't have to deal with being in wolf form in disadvantageous situations alongside getting an additional iframe+heal

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plus you don't lose dps vs bosses

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it's just so much better lmao

tacit plume
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I mean I think snowqueen used to have something day and night oriented a looong time ago and they scratched it I assume cause they felt it'll be too suffocating.

I like the day and night dynamics honestly...but I think they just need to make it that both modes are different "strong fun" not "if only it was constantly day/night" feelings that's it /shrug.

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from reddit : "Regarding the Snow Queen, my understanding is that her trait and power deal damage during the day (+ chill) but they leave areas of effect during the night, which last a few seconds and chill anyone who crosses them during that time." Wow so power didn't damage at night time..? hilarious xD

quartz atlas
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Yeah, the Snow Queen stuff got nixed super early on. You can tell they really wanted the day/night cycle to be a big thing but they could just never get it to work. Each act has less and less enemies that react to it, they added a single new Hero who's affected by it, it's kinda a shame.
There's the essence of a good idea in there, like Pied Piper has higher single target damage during the day and the ability to do piercing damage at night, so maybe you wanna go after single targets during the day and groups at night... except that the game doesn't have content like that outside of the key/quest bosses.
Trees drop spiders at night so maybe you wanna try only fighting them during the day.... except that you don't know what enemies will be at a camp until you get there and wasting time is the worst thing you can do so this is something you'll never take into consideration except for maybe when you have the wood quest.
As is the day/night cycle is just something you sorta adapt to as you're fighting pigs and trees in Act 1 and then you never think about it again unless you're one of the 3 characters who actually use it. And Scarlet's the only one who can actually "plan" around it, except that said planning is just ignoring an objective as Wolf and going back later in human form to stealth it

tacit plume
# quartz atlas Yeah, the Snow Queen stuff got nixed super early on. You can tell they really wa...

I mean I dont feel it had to be "scrapped" in that way, I think the day and night element is def a cool "game/character" enhancing vibe.

I mean Carmilla...I feel she was pretty cool execution on that whole day and night thing. Her core mechanics are not super affected (I mean she's busted tbh- but fun xD), and the day/night talents/trait express the "guilty but vampie" drama nicely, the differences are useful to play around but not vital to "enjoy" a run.

But after her they seem to just resigned the concept completely - for now-maybe-lol.

Piper, he's still gonna AA the same and his AA/Power in both forms are strong, but you get a bit of a different flavor vibe.

Scarlet, I personally like some characters having more "dramatic" differences, but I just think the heavy blanket nerfs compared to the rest of the characters just cause "human op video?" is weird, and that wolf has no "I get to be the strong/fun form now" talents in comparison.

Like most baseline talents seem to reward human's "guaranteed crit" situation, short wick is a lot more value on human, is already fun cause of stealth.

Adrenaline/True Instincts reward "both", I mean Adrenline can be cool on wolf if you get there, but in a way it also makes human able to ignore wolf more.

True instincts movement speed is far more "fun" and usefull, and if anything I think wolf needs it more than human lol.

I don't like the flat bonus health tbh, flat armor is better probably to make his defense "easier value" or even vitality still meh and boring imo but idk.

"Too Fancy" maybe make it you can scout what a poi is on wolf "earlier", can "smell the camp" from further away with a cool "red trail" animation, now that's instincts!

Maybe Evisceration be "really stronger" on Wolf sacredstrike/wildmagic type of strong D:.

Savagery/whatever gives wolf easy crit chance to offset the "no innate crit" difference.

Cleave now happens every 3rd attack on wolf. IDK! xD

Shorter Def Cd would be nice but unsure.

glossy parrot
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when does scarlet turn into a wolf during boss fights?

tacit plume
foggy nimbus
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Hmmmm it seems that scarlet users in china really love shapeshifter🤔

river quiver
foggy nimbus
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I think they should buff default trait though🤔 the basic one needs some love
We have to lose a few seconds each time we transform
Maybe a few more buff after transformation helps, not only 2 seconds of invincible

weary tinsel
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I think default trait needs to have the heal maximum HP that's now in shapeshifter, maybe also throw in strength buff for a number of seconds

orchid stratus
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how do you play this character on ocaid?

eternal junco
weary tinsel
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I think it could be interesting if she could attack faster in human form (assassin rogue vibes) while wolf form attacks slower but larger AoE (slightly larger than it is now) and higher damage numbers.

foggy nimbus
foggy nimbus
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Random thought

Cleave: Altered attack pattern. Scarlet do a series of 3 hit combo, the last hit attack all enemies around, do 200/225/250/275% damage and award 1 combo point.

Slash flurry: if Cleave is learned, the last hit will be a cleave attack.

Would it be better if changed to this?

whole imp
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Is scarlet more of a hit and run hero?

foggy nimbus
whole imp
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Is it worth levelling up shapeshifter to max?

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I find myself shifting forms often

tacit plume
# whole imp I find myself shifting forms often

A lot to say...the point of shapeshifter is to stay in human as much as possible and use shapeshifter in "emergencies/healing backup from leftovers" to have human ready again and stay in it, you kinda want to get away not being in wolf at all "mostly" - a lot to say lol. The idea is also to use up the "dual ults/reset" for certain situations/lucking out on ult charges/cd.

Human power cleaves, and has the ability to provide crit damage for power, and has stealth. That's the point of staying in human. So no maxing shapeshifter quickly is not the greatest idea imo. You want to invest the "quick maxing" to something that gives you a lot of needed damage. Early double attack/pulverise and special focused/~fan of knives.

If you are not capitilizing on that which is normal if you're just figuring the character still, then shapeshifter is kinda ugh...you lose a lot of hp, and you get no bonus damage stats at all which is what the rest do (devourer is not worth it atm).

Frankly if you are completely new to Scarlet, try the special build..being stuck in forms kinda helps you understand why shapeshifter is good.

The special talents are all good and are "straight forward upgrade value" (some of the other talents have twists and turns about what point are they "good", and upgrading is depends worth).

Special is not super fixated on combo points management, and does a lot of stagger/interrupts and cleave damage and will make both wolf/human function "ok", and you get to be ranged in human and resposition easier with wolf - the special is an iframe on it, but up to you.

Other wise you want to rush maxing double attack/fan of knives dodging antics, cause that again works on both human/wolf ok. The idea is to make your dodge spammable and just double attack fan of knives is your dps.

Survival items help a lot with eating mistakes, so holy grail/black lotus/defense charges/cd reduction/armor. If you get defense to be spammable staying in wolf is a lot easier depending.

foggy nimbus
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btw if go ATTACK build maybe using wolf form works better.
Cuz wolf ATTACK has better hit box (wider) than human form (longer reach but narrow)
I miss double stab a lot but almost never miss a wolf double claw
If you still miss a lot consider picking wide attacks to compensate.

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They’re very different

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And wide attack make huge difference on ALL ATTACKS

IMG_6877.jpg
whole imp
foggy nimbus
whole imp
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I meant the talent hehe

foggy nimbus
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But spike won’t be affected. Although it inflicts ATTACK damage, it comes out when you push DASH.

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So, long story short, wide attack affects: default attack, double tap, cleave and slash flurry.
They are all done by pressing ATTACK.

foggy nimbus
tacit plume
# whole imp What about cleave?

I agree with Hagane, AAing on wolf is easier, like just double attack alone gives wolf access to easier burst to play around, and the healing of it can be real nice, just need to make dash/defense spammable, and you can start to ignore human more if you wish.

Cleave attack is...cute-ish for commiting to autoattack chains/adrenaline...it increases +30% per upgrade, and procs honestly pretty frequently (wide attack is +5% per upgrade lol).

The issue with it -imo- is autoattacking in general tends to be meh in the game, game rewards dash attacking antics more. Like fan of knives allows you to dps stuff from range, it's bursty...roses...blah blah. Also adrenaline needs combo points..but using them mainly on fan of knives feels "easy cheese".

Cleave's randomness/range/commiting to AA chains baiting you to damage, and the whole stagger bar whatever...meh. It's nice "shredding" fun though still, try it with black lotus/armor/defense cds wolf and aa heavy build to get it out of your system..or maybe you'll like it, I mean I kinda doxD.

violet kindle
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cleave is more of a chapter 1 talent that helps your early clears before you move towards an actual build

foggy nimbus
river quiver
foggy nimbus
tacit plume
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I think the theme is if the build needs rng to activate then sure it can become "stupid strong" no problem...I am not sure though tbh.

foggy nimbus
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Now the ATTACK build of many characters are tied to DASH, and DASH build are generally easy to make but lower ceiling

foggy nimbus
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Random thought of Bite remake
Power through: Scarlet charge and push all weaker enemies forward she until hit an elite or the farthest target, then deal 40 damage to them. Deal +70% damage if there is only one target.
Combo point add +50% damage each.

zealous flicker
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I think if wolf was less bad compared to human, not taking shapeshifter would feel less bad

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Fan of spikes helps wolf a lot but it still feels so fragile

placid loom
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It's not as bad if you take distant explo

zealous flicker
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Yeah bomberwoman is a good way to make wolf less bad

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But even then I'd rather be human 99% of the time hahaha

violet kindle
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it also doesn't feel AS bad if you get explosive rush at level 2

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like it becomes playable at least lmao

zealous flicker
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Altho the new throwing charge up thingy makes human feel a bit worse on DE too

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True true

placid loom
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Flurry and explosive rush are both very good l2 talent

zealous flicker
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Still can't believe explosive rush got nerfed when things like final burst exist lmao

placid loom
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imo, they fill the same niche, early game talents that make you there through the midgame

violet kindle
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there's also stuff like power dive and lucky shots which are just significantly stronger passive casts than explosive rush

zealous flicker
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Tbf lucky shots didn't exist when explosive rush got nerfed

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But that talent is pretty overtuned

violet kindle
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I'm hoping they'll rebuff explosive rush with the talent rework/balance patch or something. it kinda reminds me of raven effigy/father time's where they nerf one thing (removing the defence charge) then add something even stronger

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like if raven effigy was too strong with charges how can they justify cooldown which is even stronger? if explosive rush was too strong before how can they justify lucky shots from juliet defence?

zealous flicker
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I just hope they find a way to make base wolf feel enjoyable and satisfying

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And not like a liability

violet kindle
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yeah that's the dream

placid loom
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I think it's a bit different. One charge is much better than a single cd. But as you stack them, yeah, cd becomes much more relevant.

zealous flicker
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It kinda depends on base cooldown and length of encounter, can't really say one charge is better than 1 cd as a blanket statement

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Or vice versa

placid loom
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If you start a fight with two charges (which should always happen), how much time cd take time to catch up.

violet kindle
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I think in the context of a run there's almost no situation I want a charge over cdr

zealous flicker
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I mean both are good right

violet kindle
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if I'm playing around defence in any way I'm taking cdr epics and combining that with an early father time's is so good

zealous flicker
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I'm not too sad seeing one over the other

placid loom
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I'm only sad when I see the joker 😄

violet kindle
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I think scarlet might actually be the only character where a charge is acceptable to me

zealous flicker
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Defence charges are definitely better than cd on wukong hahaha

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Silly example of course

violet kindle
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ok that's true lmao but I would be sad to have to take either

zealous flicker
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I guess cd isn't too bad for the 40 armour but having to get 3 of them feels pretty bad

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And I'd rather find a coat on wukong tbh

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And def charge set bonus always feels funny

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Funniest on human scarlet since we can animation cancel def with attack and stack up that movespeed like crazy

placid loom
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Defense dash with fan 7 league is prob the silliest build on scarlet.

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perma immune, perma leech, auto aim

zealous flicker
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Yeah lol

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700% AD scaling for fun too

placid loom
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Also 100% crit

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for good measure

zealous flicker
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So many people though FoS was bad when it first released LOL

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Glad it's gotten the respect it deserves

placid loom
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it's just hard to get there.

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I've yet managed to do a flurry adrenaline chain spam power run

violet kindle
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I've always wanted to do explosive rush wolf with flurry+adrenaline+double strike with seven leagues and enough power cdr to chain with the rest into special charges for balor's

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but it's just 100x easier to play around murderous intent and accomplish the same thing

placid loom
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That was fun

image.png
placid loom
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only viable at less than 3 players however 😢

foggy nimbus
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Will explosive rush trigger pulverize?

Btw I have a suggestion about it:
explosive rush:
1, now human form explosive rush will do exactly the same as wolf form does.
2, will increase the damage(wolf) or range (human) of POWER, since you have extra momentum from SPECIAL.

fiery stirrup
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am i gonna find a character i enjoy as much as scarlet...

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shes so perfect and lovely

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and her lore is so niceeeeeeeeee

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and the wolf is cute....

tulip glade
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I finally have to write a review about Scarlett, because her current state is honestly hard to ignore.

Her ultimate, “Hunter’s Souvenir,” is a joke. Beowulf becomes untouchable during his ult, while Scarlett just stands there, stuck in animation and taking damage. Brilliant. As it stands, it’s a dead ability and needs a fix.

Her revive animation is also longer than others for no clear reason. It just feels unfair.

Then there’s her bomb that stuns herself… and the “solution” is a skill to stop it. That design makes no sense. No other character has this problem.

Her starting abilities are mostly useless. “Shapeshifter” is the only one that actually feels worth it. The rest need serious rebalancing.

Bleeding is another issue. By the time it deals meaningful damage, the monster is already dead due to endgame attack spam. It needs to be replaced with something impactful.

Quick points:

“Evisceration” – useless
“Savagery” – irrelevant in endgame
“Shapeshifter” – should be baseline
“Distant Explosions” & “Short Wick” – feel like base kit

“Explosive Rush” is weak compared to Beowulf’s “Secondary Tremor,” which is stronger and has no conditions. That’s just bad balance.

I have 986 hours in the game, mostly on Beowulf. He’s easier and more effective, while Scarlett feels clunky. Meanwhile, skills like “Sparkling Shield,” “Blazing Runes,” and “Raging Chain” are overtuned. “Raging Chain” used to require skill—now it doesn’t.

This isn’t about making the game easier. The balance just isn’t working.

It feels like updates cater more to inexperienced players than to those who actually play endgame.

The game needs a proper rework. Talk to experienced players—or just open it up for mods.

Difficulty is fine, but that’s what difficulty settings are for.

placid loom
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Hunter souvenir is insane stagger in solo play (which turn into infinite money in chapter 3). it's just there for that. In multiplayer, you always pick Grandmother's souvenir.

I agree the revive as wolf is a pain point (kinda memey in a way).

For the rest, beside Evisceration and Savagery, I disagree with all the points you raised.

Evisceration is bad partly because there's no really payoff for going power, since combo generation through purely focused power do not exist at the moment. I think it's one of the talent that would be better if we generated 3 cp in a single flurry, and 2cp when you kill with devourer.

Savagery, like all its equivalent in other characters, should have a stat multiplier based on act number (I'm fine with it starting lower if that's the case).

marsh mirage
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Hi, I really enjoy playing Scarlet as my main—I mean, you get to play a werewolf, which is genuinely cool.

I’ve tried a wide range of builds and playstyles to figure out what works best, and I usually play on the highest difficulty with modifiers like Dried Wells, Corruption, Disease, Oppressive Nightmare, and Enraged Enemies—basically as challenging as possible, because that’s what I enjoy most.

That said, I’ve noticed the same issues Bommes pointed out. The most effective strategy is still the crit build. It’s fun, sure—but no other approach comes close in terms of power. Crit just feels overtuned, while other options don’t feel rewarding enough to justify picking them. The same goes for some of the talents MrBommfrittus mentioned: from my experience, they’re simply not worth taking, which is a shame considering how much I’ve experimented with different setups. Of course, preferences vary from player to player.

Part of what makes Scarlet so fun is that she’s not easy to play—you can pull off some cheeky plays using her stealth. Still, I think it would be great to revisit her design and rebalance a few talents. Even her starting talents feel like they would make more sense as tier-two options. Nothing really competes with Shapeshifter—it’s just more tactical and opens up more possibilities. It’s unfortunate that the other starting talents end up being ignored.

Honestly, I’d even accept a revive time that’s three times longer—if it meant removing the self-stun from her special ability without having to “sacrifice” a talent for it. I’m not entirely joking about that. xD

foggy nimbus
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I just think they should make her ULTIMATE 60sec cooldown and let shapeshifter give +50% penalty
Others… basically agree. She feels “obsolete” and need a bigger rework

wheat warren