Time*
#beta-discussion
livid ice
barren flax
Around how much would the prize for it be?
livid ice
Cost is unknown
barren flax
Ok :)
livid ice
Beta said 25 dollars
barren flax
Cool
livid ice
Who knows what would it be
spark lance
How can you join your friends exactly?
lusty light
Go to your constellation stone at home and scroll over to where your friends are, if your friend is online there will be a glowing circle around their star
Tap on their star and you can teleport to them
@spark lance
static terrace
Just making sure the stuff i’m getting in the shop isnt charging me correct? For IOS beta. I heard itll never charge u even with a price i’m just triple checking lol cause it showing a price was confusing.
static terrace
Thank you!!
quaint onyx
I would love for just a $50 iap that gives you nothing.
Just let us buy the dern game
And be done with it
I would actually rather buy that than the founder's cape and all that fancy stuff
$50 to make iap's disappear, completely
And I don't mean 50$ to get every iap ever released. I mean 50$ to make the little shopping cart button disappear
narrow valley
This experience happened in beta, but this can apply to the main channel as well.
I've met someone with a campfire who invited me to burn the tall wasteland graveyard plant, and they seemed determined to do it. After burning that plant, I friended them and gave them the nickname "Madlad" for doing such a daring task
finite pumice
@quaint onyx how I wish this too. The IAP obsession ruins the game for me.
nova stag
What is iap?
worn field
in app purchase 
nova stag
Thank you~
worn field
you’re welcome
white drift
Is there any say that they will be using heart currency for any of the travelling spirits?
pearl dock
Tidak setiap kosmetik dari setiap musim akan muncul pada Roh Kunjungan. Adalah bijaksana untuk merencanakan ke depan dan mungkin menyimpan cadangan kecil, yang saya tahu sulit. Kami akan berkomunikasi di sini, dalam game, dan
lusty light
@pearl dock please keep discussion in English!
finite pumice
So now we have the returning spirits offering a chance to avoid the fear of missing out. An act of altruism would be to offer old, past seasonal items for free after (say) 6 months. For people that want them now they’d pay during the season. For others they must wait. TGC doesn’t have to miss out in the seasonal wave of sales but taking advantage of this FOMO thing is not very “Sky” to me.
vapid drum
@finite pumice but they are free of charge , like money wise.. the items only cost candles.
To give away stuff totally for free isn’t in the line of the game , since everything ingame costs either hearts or candles
finite pumice
Well then I apologize. My understanding was that those candles are bought in packs by ppl. If I’m wrong I’ll remove that. I don’t want to say stuff that’s plain wrong.
vapid drum
Nope, from what I’ve seen on social media is that people didn’t anticipated the traveling spirits coming since almost no one reads the patch notes 🤣 and they are stressed out to buy candle packs to purchase the items cause they didnt save upo for them
I would be really freaked out if the items would have cost like 20 hearts. That’s way more difficult to get
tardy dove
i still really want there to be an in game news board of sorts, so the amount of misunderstandings or people being caught off guard is narrowed down some one i dunno
high copper
@finite pumice well right now 6 spirits (1 season) take 3 months to completely get through travelling spirits.. assuming the seasons are going to be as lengthy as rhythm, the gap between getting the season and getting them for free afterwards is 1 year
vapid drum
@tardy dove even the notes written at the start of the game aren’t being read by most people
Thirst thing i always check when doing an update is to see what the update brings
high copper
But this does put alot more weight on the value of candles/hearts, as they are needed for way more things and travelling spirits only stay for 60 hours. Players will have less spare candles/hearts to use for their friendships and constantly farming to keep up
tardy dove
true, but i kinda want some thing more obvious than that, the problem with the message of the day is that it disappears as soon as you click start and you can't view it again until you start up the game again
high copper
Yah I agree. A newsboard/upcoming events at the start menu would be perfect
finite pumice
So... it’s not really free unless you have masses of candles in stock?
high copper
The 2 1/2 days was enough to get 46 candles for the mask if u max out all 3 days ..
But people didnt know about it earlier on to stock up, to avoid havjng to farm all weekend haha
elder musk
I have previously put in suggestions channel that TGC would need to implement an in-game notification system, like a notice board or an npc with the ! mark over their head, related to upcoming events in the game, e.g. a countdown to travelling spirit with info about required "currency" so people can save up. Not every player is on Discord or social media, and hardly anyone reads the patch notes to be honest.
The main interaction point for any player (customer) is the game itself, so customer-facing communication would primarily need to take place using that interface, every other channel is complimentary.
hollow compass
I think the original idea was to have the welcome screen message work that way, but I doubt anyone reads that one.
Plus, it's been wrong on multiple occasions.
gilded parrotBOT
The iOS and Android betas are full at the moment. To join future beta invite waves, watch for announcements in #beta-announcements! Give yourself the beta role here by tapping the 
in #old-𝚛ules to be notified of important updates.
hasty vessel
I like that idea, maybe when selecting the quest giver a page pops up with all that information. For example a live countdown for the season duration an upcoming events section and the quests for completion on that day
pure stag
In the form of an e-mail, appear on the stone of receiving candles and love
This does not add extra buttons
hollow compass
Given how many people don't even bother to read the seasonal FAQ, I'm not very optimistic they will read a random NPC message board. But it is perhaps an idea worth exploring at least.
pure stag
No matter how you do it, there will be players choose to ignore, the current problem is that there is no in-game email notification
vapid drum
Oh please , no more ingame messaging at npc or stuff like that , the start up message screen should be more then enough
If players to choose to ignore update messages , patch notes , social interactions through other players or social media .... well then it’s their bad
hollow compass
well, I think you can't ignore the many players who do not have access to the social media outlets (for whatever reason), so there does need to be some sort of reliable in-game information. But from what I understand, the welcoming message is hard-coded and therefore more difficult to change on the fly. This could prove difficult if something unexpected happens that all players need to know. We already know that the starting date for a new season is often announced very close to actual start, which I assume means TGC works with very short and/or improvised project timelines.
Another big issue is language barrier. Not everyone is fluent in English.
@marsh grail there are no seasonal candles in beta, since the season is effectively over
only to test the swing spell from the quest giver
there are no candles, just quests and the one candle at the Home shrine
spark lance
TGC back at it again, it could change in live. Thought they learned from the Halloween cosmetics fallout. Lot of money for something that does nothing new or special IMHO.
stoic badger
Im happy it’s not only a few people going, “whaaaat” over the price X)
@elder musk Agreed, it would be nice to see better in-game communication
empty inlet
^^
blazing sail
Sadly, I think there’s probably enough people who will cave and buy it at that price.
stoic badger
With these things its never about whether people will pay the money or not because every game has a dedicated group of people that won’t think twice before purchasing new or limited items, they just love the game, want all the stuff and will pay what they can to get it which is why a lot of freemium games price items like this - this pricing has a precedent of working, but that’s not the important question or the important issue with this.
The discussion should be centered more about how pricing and releasing items in this way affects the way people relate to the game, the way this causes people to relate to each other and the way this business decision affects the emotional resonance of the game.
The ways this might cause people to feel envy or jealousy towards other people, the ways this makes people relate to their items as if they are an investment or a compulsion rather than because they personally identify with the item, the ways that some people having different or more game functionality or cosmetics creates a social class divide, those are the important long-term ramifications that affect who still plays the game, what emotional and social energy they bring to it, and how new players experience the game (and whether they stick around or not).
hasty vessel
Straight facts Takanu! The only thing I feel grateful for about the swing is that it’s really opened up the conversation about where this game is headed and the overall consequences an item like this will bring to the game. I hope the team listens to what we are saying because it will impact how and why we continue to play in the future
near locust
This ^^^. Also, simply having the ability to make these purchases is not the only factor in determining if people do. Out of a sense of responsibility, a lot of people will balk at spending over a certain limit on a mobile game each month. And as you said, the timbre of the game will change if it stratifies into haves/have-nots with any extremity. So far I have really loved the people I’ve met here, and want to stay engaged. But my internal limit on how much I’m willing to spend on this virtual space will plummet if the financial pressure ratchets up and that affects the social aspect of the game. Tough balance - they need to keep the lights on without destroying the place.
narrow valley
The environment players are familiar with sets the expectations. For example, hang out in a popular twitch stream for long enough and you get used to seeing a few select viewers spend literally hundreds of dollars a week on one streamer just for the sake of giving
15 dollars for a funny meme alert, they pay for it
stoic badger
Agreed, there is a feedback loop that’s established with stuff like this too, in much the same way game developers engineer cosmetic purchases in a way that reinforces the “expected way to play”, used as a psychological wrench to encourage other people who haven’t bought in to do so in order to feel socially accepted.
whole marsh
^^^completely agree
stoic badger
Games like Fortnite wouldn’t have the derogatory term, “default” without this social engineering
Its a good thing Sky currently doesn’t (yet), and that moth is more used in a compassionate way to help new players
narrow valley
moth-helping culture is good
yesterday I assisted a moth in getting every wasteland spirit in one go
stoic badger
Awesome :)
narrow valley
Saw they raised the candle for the 
spirit, so I immediately assumed they needed the rest
brittle sparrow
Omg when the sky will be released for android and i ll get good in it i wanna help people too 
blazing sail
Takanu, you know I always agree with you. 😛
Already get a little annoyed when I see people with the ultimate gifts on day 1 of the season.
But at least that’s just a temporary issue. The swing set is a few days to decide whether you’re willing to miss out on it completely.
barren flax
Does anyone know what the upcoming traveling spirits will offer?
stoic badger
@blazing sail Ehehehehe, i dont think people spending money to get everything on Day 1 is a game issue currently as it’s not a required behaviour and isn’t much of a coerced one, it only comes into play at the end of the season. If people want to throw money at TGC just to get them earlier then i dont currently see it as a problem.
@barren flax AFAIK, the next one offers the red fluffy cape and the candy corn hat, its currently cycling through Season of Gratitude spirits
barren flax
ooo alright thanks!! but does that mean the fur cape will be available?
@stoic badger
barren flax
alright thanks!
blazing sail
@stoic badger Yeah, agreed. I rather TGC be supported by impatience like that than limited availability expensive items.
It’s just...this kind of spending usually pushes games even further into F2P yuckiness bc devs see what people are willing to spend JUST TO HAVE COSMETICS EARLY
woeful lodge
@barren flax what happens in beta is not a guarantee of what will happen in live. We will know for sure only when either they put out an official announcement or when it comes out in 2 weeks.
barren flax
Yeah I know but thanks :))
woeful lodge
@stoic badger @blazing sail
You know what MIIIGHT make sense would be for them to introduce $100 (or some such) instant season packs. Instead of $20 for you and 2 friends to start the season, you pay $100 and get everything up front.
blazing sail
Just like the bat cape/pumpkin hat sold and now they’re pushing for a $25 item.
woeful lodge
I thought $15 was too much for a cape and still do
blazing sail
But people are paying more now. They buy the pass + $100 worth of candles
woeful lodge
And $10 for a hat. Lol.
blazing sail
So why would they introduce something that’s less money for them?
blazing sail
True but I don’t think there’s a huge percentage of people doing that?
woeful lodge
There are a fair few, but I don’t know whether the Dev cost makes sense vs the potential revenue or lack thereof.
blazing sail
Right
The question is whether selling that would get more people to buy it than are buying it now, j guess
But god I hope they don’t add something like that
woeful lodge
I’ve definitely gotten the impression that introducing new IAPs is not a negligible amount of effort, for sure.
blazing sail
It already feels gross
woeful lodge
Agreed
blazing sail
Like...paying not to play the game just feels very sleazy if the devs push you towards that
I guess you can already do it, but they’re not packaging it together to make it more palatable
woeful lodge
🤣 I hadn’t considered it in quite those terms but that’s totally what it is.
blazing sail
It’s admitting that it’s not particularly fun to collect the candles and that they’ll let you pay to not do it
Like... for now you can pretend the candle packs are for people who come up short and don’t want to miss out on the ultimate gifts
woeful lodge
On a related note though, I disagree with our members who talk about this issue in terms of “pay to win”. There’s a fundamental problem with the argument since there is nothing in the game to “win”.
blazing sail
But if you offer a one-off package, it really is saying “we don’t think you’d want to play to earn your cosmetics so now you don’t have to”
stoic badger
@woeful lodge Doesn’t seem like a good idea from the perspective of players IMO, its better socially speaking if people just buy the progress they want then TGC suggesting people do this in a direct way
blazing sail
Yup
woeful lodge
I have one friend in game that habitually buys more candles because they have gotten themselves into too many daily heart trades and can’t farm enough candles.
blazing sail
Ouch
woeful lodge
Really a personal in game resource budgeting problem but they really like feeling helpful
blazing sail
I’ve just been telling people not to send me bc I need to build up my reserves and I’m not even doing any heavy farming these days
woeful lodge
Unfortunately knowing that that’s how they’re backing the hearts makes it a bit toxic.
I had to do that too
I’ve picked back up with 2 heart buddies just in case we do end up seeing something that costs 999 hearts.
blazing sail
I’m ignoring anything that costs 999 hearts
woeful lodge
Agreed @stoic badger
Personally I don’t like exclusive content for money. Exclusive content should be rewards, badges, symbols for actions taken, longevity, secrets found, etc.
I still think that the largest by far untapped recommendation source in the game is spells and spell packs.
blazing sail
Now that I completed al my constellations, I’m enjoying not having to farm light much. I just get some here and there so I have a reserve for friends
I really have no interest in farming enough for 999 hearts
By the time I get there the game will probably be on its way out
woeful lodge
They could make so much off a $5 pack of 5 random spells.
They would make even more on $5 packs of 5 specific spells.
blazing sail
Yeah, spells are the only consumables and they’re not OP enough to create an imbalance if people wanted to spend money on them
woeful lodge
I still hope the InvisiCape doesn’t cost that much but it is a perfect example of exclusive content that is a status symbol. Same goes for the Beta cape.
worn field
that could (sort of) make the game play to win, with people buying instant-recharges to get through eden. that’s a possible downside of having spells as IAPs.
woeful lodge
You did this awesome thing, so here, you get this thing that nobody else gets.
blazing sail
The swing set will be a status symbol that you can only get with money
woeful lodge
Not a status symbol then
blazing sail
Except.... I don’t think farming your life away should be considered an achievement
woeful lodge
That’s why the price needs to be lower, but having something that costs a lot a lot isn’t necessarily horrible.
blazing sail
Instead, be like hey good job. You got everything. Take a rest and just play around with glitches and stuff
woeful lodge
Not in and of itself
blazing sail
They could just have an ultimate reward for completing all the constellations
woeful lodge
There does need to be a reward for someone who unlocked everything else tho
blazing sail
Doesn’t have to have an extra ridiculous cost on top of that
lusty light
Ktjn said they’re working on implementing that
woeful lodge
The elder hairs are another perfect example of good status symbols
blazing sail
I actually wanted some sort of rainbow cape once you unlock all the basic capes so you don’t have to choose between them
woeful lodge
@lusty light working on an ultimate ultimate?
lusty light
Yes
tawny prairie
idk after grinding a lot , I don’t really wanna grind more haha. I already not huge on hairs as my grind item lol
livid ice
Same lol
tawny prairie
I wish they had more options than just hairs
but it seems it’s going to be hairs > next ultimate > etc
woeful lodge
The game def needs more finite badges of achievement. IAPs are not achievements.
blazing sail
I still find it silly that the elder hairs cost hearts. It’s only 2, but how many times did people get excited and go to Eden without any hearts and not be able to buy their hair?
woeful lodge
This^
tawny prairie
4 hearts for valley ahaha
livid ice
Achievement like go to eden 10 times take people to eden 5 times , get this XD amount of stars , spend this amount of candles
Would be nice things like that
blazing sail
I made sure when I went to get 5 hairs at once that I had extras. Didn’t want to take any chance
woeful lodge
I finished and wanted my reward
livid ice
Open this XD door
woeful lodge
Lol yeah I got all 7 at the same time.
blazing sail
You shouldn’t have to pay for a reward
livid ice
Game Center trophies would be nice to be implemented again I think :”v
blazing sail
Same with the seasonal hearts. It feels weird that you got that far and have to spend more to get the hearts
woeful lodge
Also hard agree
blazing sail
Anyway, so I’m 10000% against super grindy items that just encourage unhealthy habits
Or spending
Or multiple accounts
worn field
that’s why i don’t mind the ultimate reward ‘just’ being a hair
blazing sail
Or all three
livid ice
I was saving for some gratitude stuff I didn’t have but since I gotta wait so much I spent 120 candles on friends yesterday
XD
tawny prairie
little achievements that I could only see would be a nice touch
tawny prairie
hearts?
woeful lodge
Ugh don’t get me started on the prices in the friend tree.
blazing sail
Haha
I keep trying to hold onto some candles so I can be that friend who just unlocks everything at once but i don’t think that’s ever gonna happen
blazing sail
Just returning hearts to people who send me (when I don’t need) drains my reserves
livid ice
PS i got those candles by grinding
blazing sail
Omg Dae
livid ice
I have never bought any candles
blazing sail
But
blazing sail
Why didn’t you save some
blazing sail
Oh ok
woeful lodge
I don’t have any problem with the price of the upgrades (side stuff) to main friend expressions costing more than expected, but the fact is that it costs way too much to unlock warp.
blazing sail
Do you have everything else completed?
blazing sail
Oh ok
livid ice
Im waiting to see what’s up
blazing sail
So that’s fine
woeful lodge
Especially right now since parts of the game are unplayable in a group without warp
blazing sail
That’s what candles are meant for at that point
Yeah and they made warp harder to get now
It used to be cheaper/lower in the tree
woeful lodge
Now it’s like a total of 10 ascended candles I think?
blazing sail
Should just be free to anyone who wants it to make up for the unstable servers
At least until the day you can hold hands with a friend and not get thrown to two different servers
woeful lodge
So there’s that issue but
There’s also the fact that if you get server split, you can’t just go home then jump back in where you left off
woeful lodge
Assuming you’re not in a locked area like the forest clearing or new area
blazing sail
Also, not being able to join in any of the newer areas is a huge issue
woeful lodge
There are more and more unjoinable areas, I think they’re intentional, but it makes it more likely that IF you get detached and disconnected you basically have to start the level over and hope you don’t get split again or just be resigned to the fact that you need to finish alone.
Prarie is the worst one because even joining, if you are joining someone who is by the butterfly catcher, you still appear in the commons.
But the cloud tunnel is a server consolidation point every time, so its impossible to join then fly to the butterfly catcher and expect your friend to still be there.
blazing sail
Yup
I’m glad the tunnel has auto-pilot now tho. I can just do something else while my kid flies through for the 80,000th time
near locust
I’m pretty certain that sometimes you can’t join someone not because they’re in an “unjoinable area”, but because there are already 8 people in that server. And I think this happens a lot more recently with all the patches.
finite pumice
@blazing sail auto pilot? No!? Is that for real?
blazing sail
Yeah you don’t have to do anything in that prairie tunnel
The clouds push you through
analog citrus
Eden server spits are the worst. I gave up on trying to help anybody cause we'd get split up half the time and I felt bad for leaving the noobs all alone to die on their way up the mountain. RIP noobs 🙁
finite pumice
Oh I don’t go through there anyway. But that means that the players very early experience is that of auto pilot not the joy of flight. (But then I guess it hasn’t been decent flight since 0.4.6 anyways)
tawny prairie
Idk I’ve noticed the control circle pad doesn’t show up half the time and flying seems off lately
hollow compass
with the new update to Prairie the tunnel's auto-route is wrong also
I think it still uses the old path, so you tend to fly through the clouds at two points instead of in the middle of them
little thing that annoy me 
finite pumice
@hollow compass try flying over the top. It’s more fun and you can often prevent the ridiculous forced landing.
sweet cypress
Does anybody have that picture of all the traveling spirits and their prices? I’m checking to see how much I need to grind for later.
worn field
we don’t know what the next traveling spirits will be, unfortunately, let alone what their items and prices will be.
sweet cypress
I could of sworn I saw a post In beta? Oh well thanks anyways!
worn field
no problem 
tawny prairie
we had old photos of the two spirits we saw but they never lets us see the second spirit for longer than a day ish
We don’t know the order or the price anymore
white drift
Has there been a travelling spirit with heart costs yet??
worn field
in beta, yes
white drift
Has anyone posted a picture of the constellation
lusty light
Prices in beta don’t reflect what will be in live, and since there were only 2 spirits shown there isn’t anything to go off of
The second spirit that was shown in beta isn’t going to be the second spirit shown in live
white drift
So there wasn’t a travelling spirit with a heart cost, I was lied to 
lusty light
There was
But it’s not going to look how it did in beta
We only saw that spirit for a day and the other spirit we saw was in beta for weeks with rapidly changing prices
Everyone kept getting mad that the weasel mask was going to be 60 candles because they were looking at beta content but in live it was just 36 candles
stoic badger
That also happened after feedback though, which is part of the purpose of this beta <w<
proven kindle
Will this swing be a part of an upcoming season or a store item ?
stoic badger
In the beta it’s a store item and it’ll probably remain that way, but that’s just my guess. When it’s in live is when that decision will have been made.
worn field
nothing in beta is final, after all
proven kindle
Season of rythm ultimate reward is pretty bad, I hope change ultimate reward with swing
scarlet glen
how to access beta?
stoic badger
!betafaq
gilded parrotBOT
The iOS and Android betas are full at the moment. To join future beta invite waves, watch for announcements in #beta-announcements! Give yourself the beta role here by tapping the in #old-𝚛ules to be notified of important updates.
worn field
!betafaq
gilded parrotBOT
The iOS and Android betas are full at the moment. To join future beta invite waves, watch for announcements in #beta-announcements! Give yourself the beta role here by tapping the in #old-𝚛ules to be notified of important updates.
stoic badger
welp <w<
scarlet glen
!betafaq
gilded parrotBOT
The iOS and Android betas are full at the moment. To join future beta invite waves, watch for announcements in #beta-announcements! Give yourself the beta role here by tapping the in #old-𝚛ules to be notified of important updates.
stoic badger
B)
lusty light
@proven kindle they won’t change the the seasonal trees in any way after it leaves beta
hexed lynx
Please tell me in order to awaken the fish call spirit the eden candle cost wont stay the way it is right now lol--
empty river
it's a placeholder, when they find a place for the capeless cape it will go back to normal
hexed lynx
Ok whew 
fresh quiver
Multiple people can't sit ||on Oreo|| at the same time anymore???? 
blazing sail
It was hurting his back
spark lance
Anyone know where the seasonal candles in？
atomic trail
@spark lance there are no seasonal candles, just quest giver is at home
celest yarrow
🌞Good Morning🌞 My Mostest Beauteeefullest Skysapian Sisters & Brothers
😁HAPPY😆HAPPY😃HAPPY😊 TUESDAY
I hope y'all have a Terrificly Terrific day
Lots of 🤍❤🧡💛💚💙💖💜🖤 & 
🪔🕯️to all 
🤗🎉
SORRY I MISSED YESTERDAY! HOPE Y'ALL HAD A MARVELOUS MONDAY
harsh sandal
Anyone know when we can join beta testing on iOS?
lunar zealot
When they open up more slots. Which they will announce in #beta-announcements
They will tag the Sky beta role, so the best you could do is give yourself that role in #old-𝚛ules
dire rover
Jesus christ
white garnet
whats wrong?
west sage
Omg i need to do that right away 
elder musk
@dire rover Is he in beta? 😜
vapid drum
He’s everywhere 😒
dire rover
I was just overwhelmed by the extreme emote usage
spark lance
Is the blue beta cape still obtainable?
lusty light
!betareward
gilded parrotBOT
The Beta Cape was a one-time reward for the testing period prior to the iOS global launch. A future reward is not planned.
spark lance
Ooooo
open depot
How do I become beta in-game?
gilded parrotBOT
The iOS and Android betas are full at the moment, @open depot. To join future beta invite waves, watch for announcements in #beta-announcements! Give yourself the beta role here by tapping the in #old-𝚛ules to be notified of important updates.
finite pumice
@lusty light ||I thought the beta cape was still obtainable via the office. ||
tawny prairie
honestly the founder cape pack isn’t that bad
it’s 115 candles + a cape , that’s more than the largest bundle which is 60$
plus I see it as supporting the company vs buying candles
but I don’t buy candle packs because I think the prices are very high ,
dire rover
Yes that's the only part I see making sense, I just have a personal issue with the prices of the extra montization. To look at it as a "collector's edition" item works I guess.
tawny prairie
yes I don’t like these single items for high prices much
dire rover
Then again their intent is that "if you really need it", you can buy. It's not as directly predatory as the game in no way forces you to have to buy candles at one point.
1-3 hours of collecting light to get 5-7 usd worth of candles is a fair trade as there are no obvious money-pits
But still, things like the swing irk me
If there are too many "collectors items" that are priced for half of a AAA title I'm definitely going to sit out, but it just feels bad when you're a big fan of the game and you are forced to continously spend and spend to get the endgame items of it.
Having already spent and planning to spend on each season pass that comes and being faced with items like the founders cape despite it's candle bundle, is a blow to the face
It's not like you can optionally trade 999 hearts or something for it either
blazing sail
So any update on the swing set?
dire rover
That could even be an achievement with a hidden reward except the founders cape. I could see paying for the founders cape an unlocking a hidden reward that requires 333 hearts or something, or if you don't pay it's a total of 999
Seems to me like they're pushing it out for $25 but then again, who really knows
They won't speak publicly about things like that, too delicate to start a semi meaningless community discussion about it
blazing sail
Well, if there’s any significant change (other than price), I assume we’d see it in beta before live
dire rover
If we're being realistic about it the real test of putting it into the beta isn't price, it's seeing how players abuse it
Can they place it in unintended places and clip out etc
blazing sail
I still think it would make more sense as a fixed item instead of a backpack
blazing sail
It looks kind of silly when they’re all over the place
It’s a lot bigger than the table and campfire
dire rover
Yeah it seems they made it and then whomever is in charge of microtransaction items asked "how can we monetize that"
"Make items we can monetize"
blazing sail
😿
dire rover
I mean it's pretty clear how they're going about things. It's definitely a challenge how they monetize so they don't frustrate players and turn a long term profit, but they're also not adding things of great value imo
Instead of a halloween cape for $20 or whatever it was, I would have expected pants-hat-cape-pumpkincandybag
blazing sail
What bugged me about the Halloween thing is that they could have given us a whole Halloween-themed season (didn’t have to be pumpkins and bats exactly) but gave us rain season instead and then sold us the Halloween stuff outright
dire rover
They did the same with the santa hat
"No traditional seasons but we'll try to cash in a bit"
That's what it feels like to me
blazing sail
Yup
tough quest
Hopefully next year we will get halloween and maybe something christmassy with red and green. Honestly if they made the seasons a bit shorter they could do both one after another
stoic badger
I would give TGC more credit than that given what they have demonstrated so far - from the way they’ve talked about the game creatively it seems like they want to keep the bulk of the stuff they plan and put into the game “in universe”, as something that feels like it belongs in the game world rather than something that just makes you think of reality (id argue this is further backed up by how the Halloween items were only sold in the only “non-canon” area of the game). By doing this they are afforded the opportunity to set a more interesting tone and the ability to create new concepts instead of recycling old ones.
If i were to wager anything on why this IAP exists at the price it did id guess one or a number of the following:
- They had time to fix and finish the item, the current season was already finished and out and the item didn’t fit into their plans for the next season, so it made more sense to release it as it’s own item.
- As a company that has large investments from hedge funds whose goals are to maximize investment, adding additional items for purchase helps achieve that.
- The cost analysis estimates being made suggest that the price point is a way they would maximise the revenue generated from it, so lowering the price wouldn’t proportionally increase purchases.
I think they’re looking at other business models very closely, looking at whats successful and then trying to pluck one or two ideas to test and implement to see what works and what doesn’t. IMO from the other games that have implemented it i’m not sure why they think they can pull this one off without affecting the community and the emotional resonance of the game at large but maybe they want more data before deciding whether or not that’s the case for them. While far more difficult I think they’re better off prototyping new monetization ideas and setting a bigger trend instead of following a bad market. Much easier said than done of course, but the alternatives feel... dubious.
As for the placement of the swing set @dire rover , I actually kinda want to see more of this. One of my complaints of the game is that the game’s levels aren’t versatile in the way you can interact with them or use them as a stage for interaction with others. There’s a certain broad state of play that each level sets up universally and theres little in the way to change that or to build on top of that with your own ideas or tools While I think the swing set lacks the physicality and mechanics to really do that, just the shape, material presence and the game feel you get from being able to do that do make for something.
Given how the levels themselves never change, seeing different uses of the environment like when you see traveling musicians helps me at least feel more grounded in the moment in the game, instead of just using muscle memory to bounce between candles or quest points.
(i need to stop writing huge responses, < _ <)
lusty light
Seasons aren’t going to rerun but the straw hat might come back in the future as a traveling spirit
foggy wing
sterile plinth
I'm so happy that season was added back for a few days, I'm gonna be able to get the white cape today that I've missed during the season 
kindred bluff
it would be nice if the bat cape + pumpkin hat cosmetic spirits merged (or stayed separate) as a traveler spirit later in the year <:P
if the traveler spirit thing keeps up there won't be any spirits left very quickly and i wonder what they'll do about it (other than just reusing spirits <:| )
would also be nice if they spaced out older spirits with newer cosmetics and newer things inbetween so that it lasts longer!
hollow compass
I agree with Takanu here, the game is its own universe with its own celebrations. This is probably because the game is available in all types of cultures around the world and not everyone celebrates Christmas and Halloween, or can relate to them. I personally hope TGC continues to make their own holiday seasons inspired by many different things in the world.
odd umbra
I saw someone placed the swing in game, I wonder are we able to obtain it already or?
exotic atlas
It’s still being tested in beta, did you see it in the live game?
odd umbra
It’s my second time seeing it
lunar zealot
I would report it if you see it in the live game, since it’s not there yet
final lance
blazing sail
The travelers are meant for people who missed them the first time, so there’s no such thing as “running out.” There will always be new players who don’t have those things.
random sequoia
Guys, I play the live version and I’m not being able to find this info anywhere... How much are the travelling spirits charging for the Lighseekers items? Those are the prettiest capes in my opinion and since I don’t wanna spend real money on them, I’d love to plan ahead and save the candles and hearts to get those.
empty river
We don’t know, those spirits weren’t tested in beta
Besides! The announcement was edited and now we don’t know what spirit will be arriving next 
kindred fossil
i recommend saving at least 100+ candles and at least 15+ hearts, sounds like a lot, but possible within 2 weeks
random sequoia
Oh boy, thanks @empty river and @kindred fossil. Better go get those candles...
left sparrow
Are there some lightseekers traveling spirits already?
radiant drum
All the information we know about traveling spirits is on #news - the next one will be next weekend on live but we don’t know which one yet
We will only know anything when TGC announce it themselves, and most likely won’t see any of them in beta anymore
left sparrow
Ok! Thanks Mirian!
sand dawn
Uhh, reading news, next weekend isn’t feb. 14.. that would be feb. 7, no?
exotic atlas
Next weekend as in the next one after this weekend
sand dawn
Every time I forget... I click beta feedback because it’s highlighted for having new content.. not for me to read 
hasty vessel
When the season of rhythm has finished, during the break period the travelling spirits will arrive weekly 🤩 I just need them for more resize potions 🧪
lunar zealot
Weekly? When did we hear that? I thought it was biweekly off season as well? 
Oooh, thank you! I must’ve missed that last part 
hasty vessel
Exciting right? 
I guess this will give players more incentive to log in and farm for candle light
spark lance
I am already in android beta. Can progress from android be bring over to iOS beta?
fresh quiver
Yes, you just need to link your google account to game center
lunar zealot
No you can’t transfer betas, you’d have to join the iOS beta separately from Android beta.
Since iOS beta uses your apple ID as an identifier if you are a tester or not.
Which, I believe also means you can’t carry your beta progress from Android to iOS either, unfortunately @spark lance
lusty light
Yes you can
You just sign into google on iOS beta and your android beta progress carries over
lunar zealot
Ah true! 
But you need to be a tester for iOS already though., don’t you?
lusty light
Yes but they were just asking if it’s possible to transfer progress
lunar zealot
i misread. 
spark lance
W
quaint onyx
So, what I miss over the past few days?
vapid briar
Everything. We deleted all of beta. It is no more 
lunar zealot
vapid briar
I couldn't resist 
icy falcon
but i'm playing rn, am i in limbo 😱
lunar zealot
I could tell, Ktjn
vapid briar
Yeah, that was a really fascinating talk, even I learned a lot.
lunar zealot
It was two hours well spent. 100/10 would do it again.
quaint onyx
Anyone still recovering from https://globalgamejam.org/ over the weekend?
minor shard
hi, anyone know where the seasona candles are in beta today check forest, and vault dont see them
lusty light
There are no seasonal candle bunches in beta
minor shard
not today?
there were at the start of season on rhyth in beta i kinda stopped after the ended the seaoan, and sneakly brought it back a while after it end 
lunar zealot
They didn’t add back in the candles a few days back when they reactivated the season as it wasn’t needed for the testing they where doing / are doing.
minor shard
ah i see thank you @lunar zealot it got me tripping 
dire rover
You know what I'd really like as a single item?
A broom.
So I can sweep around the levels and actually mess around.
Imagine finding a player in Orbit, sweeping away.
Hanging out in home? Better sweep a little.
timber elk
Lol that would be cute
dire rover
If they were actually smart we could have a mechanic that would allow us to sweep up the oil/darkness stuff in wasteland
dire rover
There's little you can do that affects the game world and lets you feel part of it. You go around with your candle lighting darkness and torches and you can ping at butterflies, and that's pretty much it
Not saying I'm now demanding a permanent gameplay addition But thinking out performance safe ideas that give players something to do ingame that keeps them busy and isn't directly boring is one of the things very, very few mmo's get right
Until we get another two years of mobile phone upgrades we won't be seeing a lot of "stuff" because of the strict performance budget
🧹
timber elk
I think it was pretty unnecessary to flat out call TGC stupid because their game doesn’t have additions you want
You make good points. Some more ways to interact with the environment would be pretty awesome. but a broom? if u gon criticize a company that’s been doin this for years, maybe think of somethin a little more practical in relation to the game
dire rover
Of the top of my head fun things would be stuff like:
-
marshmallow/dango vendor npc that you have a weekly/daily quest with collecting fragments of some kind because the npc needs that, rewarded with marshmallows you can grill/warm on torches.
-
Broom, already explained
-
Lantern you can carry on your back
-
Ingame camera to take more fun selfies/pictures
-
Glasses your sky kid can wear
-
Picture books about the game's lore
I never mean to say they are dumb. There's a difference in stating "They're dumb for not adding item X" and "a real 200IQ idea would be X"
And if you don't criticize things you experience or use any form of scrutiny you're just riding along. There's value to be had in forming your own opinion and voicing that.
Tradition and habits are just people doing stuff older people have done because they've told to do so or they haven't thought about anything else. Often it's like that with game development.
That's what testing, market analysis and surveys are for. There will definitely be a moment when a player expects a thing to happen > it doesn't happen > player contacts game devs > game dev replies with "we never thought about that".
The discord is invaluable to hear what the most dedicated players have to say, because a lot of those players are the average player, they've just decided to be vocal about their fandom of it.
Saying it's dumb to recommend a broom item because "they've been doing this for years" makes absolutely no sense as new ideas are how the world goes forward. They can just chooes not to listen to it
near locust
Heh. In the main suggestion channel I just suggested a crab-toy, like those fishing-pole cat-toys that have the feather on it, only with a wee little stuffed sky kid as the bait. I'd want to be able to swirl and fling a caught crab. I know that's some dorky (and highly unlikely) shizzle right there. So y'all go ahead and suggest whatever weird detritus is in your head. Don't worry I'm here to make the rest of you look good by comparison.
delicate grail
!betafaq
gilded parrotBOT
The iOS and Android betas are full at the moment. To join future beta invite waves, watch for announcements in #beta-announcements! Give yourself the beta role here by tapping the in #old-𝚛ules to be notified of important updates.
dire rover
If they made the journey cape actually cool or added scarfs ...
vapid briar
Bear in mind, we have to get Sony's permission to add anything related to Journey in the game.
stark night
@vapid briar you’re is the manager of the sky of the light?
vapid briar
I'm three Krill in a trench coat who helps herd all you wonderful sky children.
stark night
spark lance
@lusty light @lunar zealot thank you 
Sadly I am only a tester on android beta platform but not iOS
vapid briar
Really though, I work as the liaison between you, the players, and the design team. When you suggest cool stuff, I pass that along. When you hate a feature, I pass that along. When you think we did something cool, I pass that along. When you have questions, I do my best to answer them. When things are in concept, I try to anticipate how you all will react to it, and help bring potential pain points to light. If the game breaks, I let the designers and engineers know, then I relay any information they give me back to you. I write patch notes and FAQ guides. I fave the posts on twitter or instagram or answer your questions there. We're a tiny studio and we all wear a lot hats to bring Sky to you, but you all make it truly wonderful.
sorry for the smol novel.
timber ridge
Thanks for the hard work, Ktjn. ^^
dire rover
You're doing a good job Ktjn.
I really hope you have a little stack of hats you wear every day
rare mantle
When did the season come back???
stoic badger
Mmm, thanks for the good work @vapid briar 
rare mantle
Are there seasonal candles in the vault? I don't see any
tawny prairie
season isn’t back. Just the quest giver to get swing spells for testing
rare mantle
Ohh .. darn. I really wanted to finish leveling up the dance emote. :( I wish they'd extended the season for beta in general. Live gets it for a really really long time.
tawny prairie
well we are just testing for live
rare mantle
I understand.. it's just a bit sad for players like me who only have the beta option
finite pumice
Um @tawny prairie that is not a corgi.
tawny prairie
lol I know my current dog isn’t a corgi
stoic badger
New beta update o - o
stoic badger
I like how as soon as i log in theres 7 other people waiting around 😂
austere merlin
you’d have to ask Sony’s permission to add anything journey related
But the ip is owned by jenova Chen? Wouldn’t it be his call? Or is that not how it works
stoic badger
It’s owned by Sony
austere merlin
Ah
stoic badger
TGC made it, but Intellectual Property tends to get owned by the publisher as part of the publishing deal
Not all the time, and thesedays it happens less
lusty light
Yes, tgc was under a contract with Sony to make journey
I believe the contract was also for flow and flower, but I could be wrong on that one
stoic badger
I feel like it could equally be true and not true X)
austere merlin
Ah, thanks for the Info 👍
stoic badger
You only tend to see this in higher budget games, and even then it’s stopped happening as publishing has gotten more competitive
quaint onyx
Hopefully this update doesn't delete my everything
stoic badger
Everything still exists (FOR NOW)
I wonder if anything happened with the.....
whispers softly
the swing
lusty light
It got a model update
quaint onyx
New swing hotness?! Worth the risk!
stoic badger
Oh yeah, the lack of colour made it look the same
dem bevelled edges are looking mighty fine
stoic badger
100$ for the full set, what a value
Nah, theres no content additions
I dont know how to report this bug im seeing, I dont know if its worth doing as a result
quaint onyx
Ooh?! New bug hotness?!
stoic badger
Someone offered me a candle and I ignored them....
... and now the gift is haunting me as a floating icon in the sky
It’s karma really
quaint onyx
You unfriendly meanie 
stoic badger
quaint onyx
Lucky we don't have friendship jail anymore
stoic badger
👀
spark lance
How to join the beta
gilded parrotBOT
The iOS and Android betas are full at the moment, @spark lance. To join future beta invite waves, watch for announcements in #beta-announcements! Give yourself the beta role here by tapping the in #old-𝚛ules to be notified of important updates.
burnt finch
so how's everyone feel about the swing's price change?
its $19.99 and comes with a gift pass now
... will players who get a gift pass the day the swing goes live even be able to complete the season by then?
stoic badger
I think they might only if they did it every day
stoic badger
Does it make it better value? In a roundabout way yes.
Does it change the social dynamics at play? ....no.
@prime belfry In TestFlight you can see patch notes
prime belfry
Ah so not descriptive then
stoic badger
I dont remember where they put the detailed ones omo
I dont think they bother typing them up for small patches
Which is understandable
stoic badger
o///
worn field
i don’t seem to be able to place a swing on someone else’s swing now, which is probably for the best. no making swing tower abominations in home
stoic badger
My bets on the candy cone* dude but no-one knows
feral sparrow
not in beta yet?
worn field
nope
dire rover
$20 swing less bad still bad
worn field
no problem
stoic badger
“Sorry you feel jealous about my sick swing, have a season pass?”
Its a slight concession on value but they’re not actually giving anything up as i’m not sure if they’re banking on paying customers forming direct trades with each other to save money on future seasons
So its like you giving someone else that just to be nice without resolving the initial social dynamic issue that crops up
feral sparrow
10$ good 15$ borderline
stoic badger
I think the ideal solution would be to sell it for a fat stack of candles and not make it a timed item, but they’ve cornered themselves by not having any economy sinks for candles in the end-game, so the people that would buy this likely have a nice stockpile
dire rover
I mean adding a gift pass is a decent addition, I'll give them that
If we have 50 days left from the 14th, when this is likely to be put in (valentines) it's something I can see be.. okay
worn field
the idea might be that you give the gift pass to someone you love, which is on theme (since it’s for ‘days of love’)
stoic badger
I think it would make more sense if you could gift the slide to be honest
One for you one for a friend
Most people who want a season pass probably has it because you need to buy early to get everything
burnt finch
honestly it's really hard for me to find people to gift passes to, everyone already has a pass
stoic badger
Yeah, im just arranging trades with a friend in the future, this doesn’t feel like a good value concession
With only a drop of $5 it indicates that they really wanted to keep the item at this price
dire rover
That's what I said
burnt finch
i think i'd feel better about the price if tgc was more transparent about why they want to sell it for so much
dire rover
Also same on the passes, everyone I friend already has it, those who don't are brand new players who haven't decided on whether or not to do eden, and I'm not giving it to someone who's flaky
burnt finch
are they hurting for money? i'll gladly buy if that's the case
stoic badger
@burnt finch Well it helps us, but we are also a tiny percentage of the playerbase
spark lance
i just had someone tell me no instruments are free in sky. Is it true?
stoic badger
@spark lance You need hearts to buy instruments, or you can get one from the season pass
spark lance
how many can u buy with hearts
stoic badger
@spark lance Something like 8 instruments
worn field
if you mean free as in doesn’t cost any real money (e.g. dollars) then most are free
spark lance
okay phew
stoic badger
^-^
spark lance
i liked the instruments
dire rover
That's a good point. If they were upfront and told the community that they're selling season passes as a main source of income and event-based items to give players something fun while making a profit- It would be much more alright.
The expectation and the outrage at the intital $25 swing has been the same as the last items; TGC has said the game is about giving and how they don't want to deploy predatory monetization tactics- yet they put out items priced at half of a full AAA game
The best thing is communication, whether it's to say they aren't going to change the item or pricing, or what the mtx they want to try out is
stoic badger
@spark lance The instruments are pretty cool, im not much of a music person though
spark lance
the way you can just play them and create your own songs, bruh. You can just do that for 20mins if your bored
stoic badger
I dont really like where the touch controls are positioned though, and im busy learning a dozen different things x _ x
spark lance
i see
stoic badger
On a 13 inch iPad their position is rather awkward, and I cant use my smart keyboard instead
spark lance
i got no sky friends so i can just play and hope my music guides them to me
apparently u can play silent night. im going to learn it
stoic badger
@dire rover I think for me the worst part of the IAP is actually the exclusivity bit as I find it crosses a line Jenova Chen made a point about in an inverview (can’t remember if it was Eurogamer or somewhere else) where stuff like the kinds of cheap “””50% off limited time only””” deals obscure your sense of value. I’ll have to find the link at some point.
Timed exclusive items works in a similar way because a large part of their demand is artificially driven by the scarcity of them, people would be less willing to pay $20 if this wasnt a timed item.
If they’re having problems meeting their values with their business goals then it’d kinda be nice to know that, they’ve set up community expectations here.
dire rover
Yeah it feels very scummy sadly. In most mobile games that scam is often ignored, but here.. the way they've positioned themselves early on makes these extra items feel bad
spark lance
what happened to their 1 and 2 friends adventure passes being cheaper then a solo one
idk did that happen or did i eat too much sugar?
lusty light
It still is cheaper
You get 3 passes (1 for you and 2 for friends) which is buy 3 get one free
spark lance
Yea that's cool. It's like- you know teaches people about generosity and stuff
okay im being lame- ima leave
stoic badger
Im sure they will
spark lance
if these people drown in their own money cause of how amazing this game is. They're going to wonder mhmm what if it was doubled, tripled even. Then raise the cost of everything and people will still play it but not get the adventure pass
worn field
the game is still wonderful to play if you never buy any IAPs
spark lance
just wait a while till we have people who buy it driving in hover cars, scooters or skateboards
or one of those bicycles that fly when you peddle them
worn field
i’d actually love that
spark lance
seriously? hey TGC hire me lol
kindred bluff
imagine playing sky for the first time and this lamborghini just shows up
spark lance
yeah it's probably too early in history
worn field
yeah. it would be funny tho
spark lance
imagine if they call stuff different things then us lol
worn field
“skyborghini”
kindred bluff
i mean remember the motorcycle dlc in breath of the wild
spark lance
"this is a Quopiro squi"
kindred bluff
imagine we had those
spark lance
yo they can have anything
kindred bluff
wait since like in the poll "eating something" was an option for an emote..
what do sky kids eat
crabs for dinner!
spark lance
they eat light obvi
worn field
i don’t think that has to mean they eat
kindred bluff
i mean they kinda absorb it through their skin haha
worn field
bcs they’d just be copying the actions of a spirit
kindred bluff
ohh
spark lance
ooh
kindred bluff
but like upgraded emotes
dry pivot
Lv3 sip a tea
spark lance
they mastered how to dance
kindred bluff
monkey see monkey do
worn field
we’ve seen that they don’t even necessarily fully understand the emotes they’re copying, since the ‘sleep’/‘faint’ emote is based on watching a spirit die
spark lance
and when one sky child starts being creative and does something different they go "the hell...That's not what we learned today!~"
kindred bluff
"well.. i eat light
..
.
everyone around me is made of light.."
or the shiny bois
do they just eat them
yo
spark lance
dude...what is sky really about...?
kindred bluff
what if the krill are just trying to free the devoured stars
spark lance
yes. krill are just made to look evil..sky children just tell themselves they're good but the krill are the good guys
omg.
spark lance
we shouldn't tell anyone we found this out
kindred bluff
LOCK IT IN VAULT
nobody should ever know
this information will cause the entire universe of skylanders to explode
spark lance
let it rot in eden so the elders won't erase our minds
kindred bluff
yes
spark lance
has anyone been able to find seasonal candle bunches these past few says
kindred bluff
they should be where the seasonal spirits usually are, but i'm not in beta and i'm not sure if there's a glitch goin on there haha
spark lance
yeah im aware of the locations.. haven’t been showing up for at least 2 other people
dry pivot
there's no seasonal candle bunch in beta
stoic badger
dry pivot
Rhythm quest giver is back to test the swing spells, and I think the return of the seasonal constellation and seasonal quests are like side effects
stoic badger
Seems so
vapid briar
The candle clusters aren't turned on, we just needed the season active for the correct quest npc to show up.
stoic badger
The community manager is still awake? :O
vapid briar
Nope, it's one of her clones 
stoic badger
vapid briar
I'm at home, but the build dropped so I keep an eye on things, to ensure nothing critical happens overnight.
burnt finch
have a nice night @vapid briar 
near locust
I love bugs (the non-exoskeleton kind). What was it?
stoic badger
@near locust I dont know how to reproduce it yet, but im pretty sure theres one when someone offers to be your friend and you ignore them. When they left the icon for accepting or “upgrading” the friendship remained when I hovered around other interactables
Ill poke at it more once I write some final feedback about the swing thing
near locust
Interesting. It sounds a little like the persistent particle effects bug at the home constellation area... except this one is mobile.
kindred bluff
i've experienced it in live
stoic badger
Oh. Theres still a lot of bugs so that doesn’t surprise me 🙈
kindred bluff
it happens a lot since i tend to buy things quickly and leave the menu without the animation completing
if that's the glitch you mean!
craggy badge
It’s real kitchen hours
hollow compass
I was hoping they had fixed the auto-pilot tunnel route in Prairie, but I guess not.
spark lance
some people can't fly tho
i manage to go the opposite of where im supposed to go. That's how bad i am
hollow compass
@spark lance what do you mean?
hollow compass
floral root
My umbrella is gone. Is there anyone like me?
blazing sail
Wow the beta channel has been active
Was there an update overnight?
Wait the swing comes with a gift pass for the swing itself or for the adventure pass?
$20 for swings for you and a friend would make a lot more sense than slapping on an adventure pass to add fake value to it
Nearly a month into the season.
A swing for yourself and a friend would cut down on the exclusivity of it. This doesn’t.
But sounds like they’re not really budging much on that price.
spark lance
There’s a lot of time left in the season so, although I haven’t done the math on whether you can still get all the cosmetics, there’s still a lot of time to get a lot of cosmetics and make it more worth
this season is longer than usual after all, so getting a pass a month after the start date is more worth than before
high copper
Passes carry over now, so it need not be given this season
It is alot better than the previous offer though and adds a more sharing aspect to it which is quite great. Honestly if all exclusive purchases from now on includes a way to share more premium features to friends who are not fortunate enough to spend on the game, the game would be moving in the right direction away from such disparity in the community and I welcome this, even if TGC has not yet found an all round solution to the exclusivity issue
blazing sail
Yeah, but it doesn’t fix the issue of these expensive limited time items that serve as status symbols in a game that’s trying to be “more”
People who wanted to share passes with friends already bought the pack
I don’t think giving those people another pass solves this problem
quaint onyx
That is interesting, everyone's who wants the pass already has the pass
blazing sail
It seems more like what Takanu said, where they’ve done the math and figure they won’t lose much by giving an extra pass to people who already spend money on the game and will likely buy more passes next season anyway.
high copper
Yup, i never expected them to find a way to fix an underlying issue so soon anyway. Its a great compromise for now, im quite impressed by TGC actually. The overall value of the swing is much lower now. Gift passes carry over so they can be gifted next season, the value is still there
blazing sail
I don’t think it fixes anything, honestly.
high copper
Yes, it doesnt, i never expected them to fix anything so soon
blazing sail
And it’s only an underlying issue if they make it one. They’re the ones creating it right now with this item.
quaint onyx
They carry over? That does fix a bit.
blazing sail
They could fix the underlying issue by not offering exclusive items that are costly and only available for a few days.
It’s still in beta, so they don’t have to go through with it. That’s how they can fix it.
If they don’t create the problem, they don’t have to fix it. 🤷♀️
high copper
They have been doing this exclusive item IAP thing for awhile as a secondary source of income. This is a long term underlying issue, not just this item. The issue stems more than just our side, but their financial side too. We should be actively finding/suggesting ways to shift this source of income to a more friendly one. Completely removing this sourc of income is not a solution on both sides yet. Constructive feedback helps improve the game, expecting things to be fixed just like that doesnt
quaint onyx
I mean, they want strangers to communicate non-verbally. So the actual item may be a special case. This is the first functional item they've offered isn't it?
blazing sail
There have been very few holiday items so far and this is the most expensive one — and first one that isn’t just a cosmetic
And I did offer feedback. Lots of it. Cheaper, making it include an extra for a friend. Giving away something that’s unrelated doesn’t fix it
And again, it doesn’t need to be fixed “overnight” if it doesn’t exist in the game yet.
The more people excuse each move like this, the better they’ll feel about pushing to make things even more imbalanced
I don’t think “they need money” is an excuse for whatever monetization they come up with
quaint onyx
Hmm, think with 50$ as the target price, the price of every other game like this. Starter is 5, founders is 25 right? If they did this as 20$ plus a season pass for yourself at the start of the season. That would be perfect
high copper
Again, it is a long term underlying issue, that is not just on the game side but on financials and possibly many other facets. Your solutions dont solve the other facets. Infact, they still cause exclusivity. I am not excusing them, i am applauding them for their current effort, even if it hasnt solved the underlying issue yet. I was and still am on your "side" of this issue, and I am not giving them a free pass. But i do want this to move to a discussion on creative ways to shift the monetization to some other way, not eliminating it (because it will likely not happen)
blazing sail
But it’s not the start of the season. And they know that a lot of people buying the swing will buy an adventure pack next season anyway.
I don’t think it’s our job to figure out the business side of things for them — just express displeasure when we don’t agree with their choices.
And I already offered up one big solution — make everything in the shop giftable
Let people who WANT to spend lots of money on the game gift whatever they want to their friends and not be limited to the season pass
high copper
@blazing sail hmm then id suggest u read their post at #beta-announcements on constructive feedback, the reddit link
blazing sail
That would help even things out. The reason the season pass works so well is that it doesn’t work as a status symbol. You can’t tell who paid and who didn’t
high copper
All of it on there, including other reddit users comments might enlighten u on constructive feedback
high copper
yes im just gonna say i agree with what ure saying, youre not wrong. We're talking abt different things aha
quaint onyx
This whole thing could be flipped on its head if they announce Android goes live Valentine's Day
Then it makes sense
Kinda
blazing sail
I just don’t think we have to apologize for them for every decision that warps the whole feel of the game.
high copper
Aha Android Live on valentines day would be a treat
quaint onyx
How would making it giftable not warp the feel? Not criticizing, just curious
high copper
Ive felt this fomo feeling for every person ive met with cosmetics ive never seen before, all the time limited items or $$ limited items, since i started late
Maybe if they found a way to make the game less on what we individually have but more on what we collectively have
blazing sail
If it’s giftable, it’s not just available to those with lots of money to spare
Same as the season pass
It’s what sets it apart from other F2P games, IMO
It might not be as fair as everything being available always and forever for free, but it’s way to monetize that’s more palatable
quaint onyx
I guess, it does go more with the core ideals of sharing and gifting. The idea of gifting items must of been brought up at some creative meeting at some point. They must of had a reason to have it be a personal purchase only. Curious now
high copper
How about a way to share cosmetics we own, not give everyone we know what we own but maybe we can select one item we own in our library to be a "shared item". So whenever we are with our friends(in the same area, hanging), all of our friends can use that item we selected, it can be cosmetic or functional. So we will also be able to swap/use items in the menu that our friends share too
blazing sail
The seasonal items don’t act as status symbols. At the moment they’re more like symbols that you’ve been around longer.
quaint onyx
Maybe they underestimated the generosity of the people playing a game about generosity
high copper
Yup sharing passes is one of the best things in this game, rly sets it apart
blazing sail
Right now, there’s no visual difference between someone who spends $1000 to buy gift passes for all their friends and one of those friends who got it for free
With the exclusive holiday items that are only available for cash for the person who buys it, that changes. It’s a status symbol. The haves and the have nots.
high copper
I wonder how many people got the individual gift passes 🤔
floral root
In Beta, you got wasn't yours.
quaint onyx
I could possibly see the giftable items things developing a 'black market', someone buys 20 over 20 different accounts, waits a month, sells them at 50$ a piece...
But even then...
There must be a really jaded, former WoW dev on staff
high copper
@quaint onyx ahaha omg
quaint onyx
I'm gonna suggest the giftable item idea too!
blazing sail
The whole bundle thing with the pass makes me think of those cell phone ads where you get saddled with a bunch of things you don’t want as part of a “package” deal
Like, people just want the swing to be $10 but they don’t wanna do that, so instead let’s pretend we’re giving you $20 value
Even if you don’t need that pass.
Or want that pass
Same reason I don’t think candles are a fix for a pricy item. But I guess enough people see it as one so they do it.
quaint onyx
What's the equivalent of the table: 30 hearts - 90 candles min. What's the price to buy like 100 candles in live?
blazing sail
@quaint onyx Then they could make limited time items only giftable during that period. That would solve that issue.
I don’t think you can compare an in-game currency that’s farmable with something that’s only achievable with cash.
high copper
Actually ya, its a great idea! if all items were like the passes, bundles of: buy 1 for yourself, buy 3 for the price of 2 or 1 as a gift, itll be alot better and palatable. I would actually consider buying the bundle of 3 for the price of 2 like i always do
Helps solve the exclusivity alot too
blazing sail
I know it means a new currency to program into the game. But it would certainly fit with the whole message of the game a lot more than those items do in their current state
high copper
@blazing sail i think they might need to find some other way to display the other kinds of gifts, if not the currency display on the left would be rows and rows of different item gifts
blazing sail
Haha yeah. But if it disappears after the few days ends, they could just reuse the same one?
high copper
Nah, limited time gifts wouldnt sit well with players, many will lose them when they run out of time before meeting their friends
blazing sail
That’s how passes used to be
I think if they only sell in packs and not singles it can be ok
I wish items weren’t limited time to begin with, but they seem big on that
high copper
Yup thats why tgc changed it to carry over, they listened to the community. Hmm yup limited time is a big thing in this game. I think most value of season items are from the fact that u can only get it at a certain
vapid drum
I like the idea of limited time items , it keeps it exclusive wether they cost real € or not.
And it justifies the price that way
See it as a good bottle of wine , those are made with love and lots of time in limited badges. That makes them rare and expensive
blazing sail
My issue is with exclusive items being costly and there’s no way for those with more disposable income to share them with friends.
Notice how no one really complained about the Santa hat bc it was $7
I bought it without much thought and I don’t usually buy in-game items like that
But $20 is shutting out a lot of people who either can’t spare $20 for a single in-game item or are, ya know, trying to spend responsibly.
Hence, status symbol
blazing sail
Feels like the game is poor-shaming or something
vapid drum
Santa hat for that price , lots of comments about price being to high
Same with the pumpkin
And cape
But if you take a cape or a hat for 7,5€
Or a swing for 20
That can swing and can be used as a chat device 🤷♂️
A mini car is cheaper then a big dodge
And btw , a status symbol?? Some might wear it as it was a status symbol, but it’s just a damn funny use full thing
blazing sail
I don’t remember seeing a lot of complaints about the Santa hat
And it is a status symbol. Just like a fancy car would be
In a game that promised to be different
These exclusive one-off items didn’t exist when the game first started and now they’re becoming more frequent and more expensive and more likely to cause jealousy
vapid drum
Hmmm .... what I was trying to say , 7€ for a mere wearable or 20€ for an actual useful thing. In comparison the price is right.
And items being only purchased only by real money , well , that’s just part of a business model.
But so there are many different opinions on matters
Which makes us all unique individuals
livid ice
ISNOt that useful @vapid drum
There’s tables
And theres bonfire
That’s just a pretty item
vapid drum
The swing is a chat table too
livid ice
For only 2 people
Chat table is an in game item
There’s no need for more communication ways
They just did it so it looks cute and people wanna buy it
old gale
I agree with Dae! I could buy it, but I won't pay $20 for an item that is less usful than items I already have.
vapid drum
What is bugging me is that by stating that the swing is a status symbol , you’re actually shaming people that buy it
livid ice
I’m not
vapid drum
Well @old gale that’s correct , you don’t have to buy it , just like everything else in the game. It’s really playable without purchasing things and have good cosmetics too
livid ice
If they wanna give TGC their money they’re on their rights
But isn’t like is needed
Is just a cute cosmetic
Not a needed cosmetic
vapid drum
Yup 👍
livid ice
Every single company does this ,people who likes cute stuff will pay more ,and there’s a lot of that with Sky and there will be more
vapid drum
Yes , and that’s no problem in my opinion
blazing sail
It’s shaming people who buy it? What?
livid ice
Is not a problem
But is what App said
Shaming people who don’t have money for it
Example
Me
:”)
I’m a f2p
blazing sail
I’m trying to shake the game for creating a status symbol, not the people who buy it. That makes no sense.
livid ice
I prefer to play 2 more seasons than get a swing
vapid drum
Yeah , why not 🤣 @blazing sail
old gale
App makes a good point
livid ice
What is scary is what I’ve been saying ,if people keep buying pricey stuff the economy goes up prices go up because of the demand of the item
vapid drum
I’ll just swing with the wind
blazing sail
“Every single company does it” is not an excuse when TGC claims to be specially trying to be different than all the other F2P games/companies out there
livid ice
You’ll see all prices being 20+ if there’s a good amount of people who pays for it
vapid drum
It’s not a free economy market
dry pivot
it is different though, the other game my sister is playing costs few hundred bucks a month if they wanna get every seasonal cosmetic (seasonal alone)
white root
It's still a business
livid ice
we are aware Rob
blazing sail
“This game is worse” doesn’t mean you can’t criticize TGC when they’re choosing to do things that take away from the overall message of the game.
dry pivot
kids are playing Sky they shouldn't teach them that players can get everything free of charge
dry pivot
we don't need to get everything
vapid drum
Lol, this discussion really lives 🤗
livid ice
I have 2 friends that are always feeling bad cuz their kids
They can never get passes
And makes me feel bad
They suffer
Theyre kids
Kids
Bro
blazing sail
There’s a very thick line between “wanting everything to be free” and wanting the monetization of the game to be in line with its overall message.
No one said the devs shouldn’t make money
vapid drum
7€ for a hat and 10 € for a swing ??
dry pivot
does it solve the problem? cutting the price to half?
blazing sail
Just don’t like these exclusive limited time items in a game that’s meant to be all about friendship and sharing and not “who has the most exclusive items”
livid ice
It kinda does to most people
I mean I’ll still not buy it
But the price is more fair
livid ice
It doesn’t have to be super exclusive
Is just pixels y’all
Isn’t the last brand of Victoria’s Secret
dry pivot
i don't really think that having a swing can mean that much
livid ice
Exactly
dry pivot
everyone gets free swing spells anyway
vapid drum
@livid ice it also depends who wears it
livid ice
It depends if who has it has money to pay or not you’re right Rob
I have friends who said please yes take my money
For the 25 dollar offer
Just the swing
Because they can afford expensive items
old gale
if they cut the price in half, then they need twice as many people to buy it.
livid ice
Twice as people will buy it for sure
blazing sail
It’s just changing the whole dynamic of the game and creating a larger gap between the F2P players and the paying ones
And what I liked so much about this game is that you couldn’t really tell who spent money
vapid drum
@livid ice I meant who wears the Victoria secret
blazing sail
Just because they need to earn money doesn’t mean they have to do it in a way that completely changes the dynamic
livid ice
Well I mean ... if I could exchange my candles for credit to buy those items
It would be dope
I would have 40 dollars credit
I could get the swing
😂
blazing sail
Yeah they’re not gonna let you sell your candles back to them lol
TGC doesn’t need your candles
livid ice
Yeah 😂
dire rover
If you look at the bigger picture they’ve succeeded somewhat in their price baiting.
Offering the single item alone for a massive, extreme $25. Outrageous.
Couple of days later, “consider feedback” and lower to $20. Add in 1x gift pass”.
Result; sell item for 10-5x what it’s worth anyways and make big money while they think customers “should be happy they relented on price”.
livid ice
“Should be “
Basically the swing would be only 60 candles if they put it candle wise
4 candle packs of 5 dollars
dire rover
I mean people have eyes, while they’re not fooling me there’s plenty of people who won’t bat an eye anyways because of the whale player situation that is inevitable in all mobile games
You just have to look at life and think “is it seriously worth it to spend 20 of my money on a swing in a game about giving? Is my extra spending capability that vast”
blazing sail
You can’t compare real-cash items to candle prices
Since no one pays you to farm candles
blazing sail
You can’t actually sell your candles
blazing sail
So it’s not the same
dire rover
Its a fair assessment, how many candles or hearts would it be worth? Why isn’t there a non-irl money option?
livid ice
It has to be with a price compared with the one people are praying
Do u not think TGC does this types of math to make things fair
blazing sail
Because they don’t want everything to be F2P
livid ice
Again , Ktjn said the fluffy cape from gratitude could come back
But there’s people who payed
For it
20 dollars
blazing sail
I’m saying they’re not gonna make it available for candles so I’m not sure why we’re comparing it to candle prices
livid ice
The price of it as a spirit should be equal or maybe a little more up than the ones they payed
dire rover
Are the season passes alone not bringing in enough money vs server and employee costs? Are they that far away form hitting their profit projections?
livid ice
To make things fair
blazing sail
If the item were available for candles we wouldn’t be having this discussion
dire rover
Imo it’s a laughable that they put out this type of game, keep claiming it’s about gifting and empathy, but pull these things on the regular
livid ice
We know App
blazing sail
I’m confused
blazing sail
Ah
livid ice
There’s no reason to be confused
Well TGC said on their livestream they making the game with stuff as cheap as possible ,but non of us know how much that is or whatever else they gotta pay plus paying employees
But
blazing sail
That’s what I keep saying, Starflame. People have gotten so used to F2P shenanigans that they’re willing to excuse it even in games claiming to be different.
livid ice
Exaggerated prices won’t make it
blazing sail
I mean, at what point is enough enough?
dire rover
A company as “highly regarded” as TGC should be more creative in their monetizing, let’s be honest
vapid drum
What had the purchase of a swing has to do with empathy and gifting ????
blazing sail
I give very little time of day to most F2P games and play primarily games that ask for money once and that’s it
vapid drum
Empathy and gifting is what you do in the game yourself
blazing sail
I stuck with Sky because it was different — to a degree
livid ice
I’ve never received a gift from TGC in the game I thought the Christmas hat was gonna be free lol ,well ,what they say is on the marketing nothing is for free
dry pivot
the game is free
vapid drum
Yup
dry pivot
I said not everything is free
blazing sail
Lots of games are free
dire rover
Yeah not even an ingame gift, I was very surprised it was so expensive
livid ice
I would pay 50 dollars for sky if I could get everything
blazing sail
That doesn’t mean the monetization isn’t predatory in most free games
dire rover
Game being free doesn’t excuse it from predatory, uncreative monetization tactics.
Lol
blazing sail
And we’re not the ones claiming Sky is/should be different. TGC said it themselves
Just because they can do something doesn’t mean they should.
livid ice
“The game is free” of course would u just play it and finish with the free stuff without paying for season or exclusive items ,of course not ,of course you would want to dress nice like others and have cool stuff
blazing sail
I had this issue with another game that I won’t name bc it doesn’t deserve free publicity but...
It started off as a normal paid game and then they switched to to F2P
It was a game about meaningful stuff. Different stories. One of them had you playing as a girl with anxiety
And you could pay to make it easier and take away your anxiety
Like holy crap
livid ice
Game with stories
dire rover
The company’s core values have been very good until the release of Sky, leading us to believe there’s something more sinister pushing the buttons now trying to bend the strings on what they can do vs what their players are okay with.
Literally no one, and I mean no-one will report the $25(now $20) swing ingame without having played for a while.
Ingame chat is a 7(6?) candle unlock and most players can’t really converse with each other. Most are kids who are playing and don’t understand the value of cash shop items, leading them to believe that what the game prices items are is reasonable. Because the people who make the game are obviously reasonable people lol
livid ice
The nice options are payed
blazing sail
Like, don’t make a game with a meaningful message that has monetization that breaks the message. The end.
dire rover
Almost all the content is paid as well
What was the last ingame drop we got? I honestly can’t remember
dire rover
Everything has been pay2lookcute
They’re banking on valentines being a very money driven event
100%
You don’t need a degree to see when you’re being ripped off tbh
dire rover
Exactly
dry pivot
it was 15 in live
dire rover
Ridiculous
vapid drum
@dire rover you’ll be surprised at how many older people play the game
vapid drum
If not more then young kids
livid ice
Ohhh
orchid nexus
It's pretty weird to suggest that needing to pay the bills is sinister. if you have constructive thoughts about what business model works for a company that gives their game away for free though, go for it
dire rover
Yes, I have a fair bit of people on my friend list pushing 30 actually
orchid nexus
making money on a free game is not a simple piece of math
dry pivot
charge players monthly and only offer the first month free
orchid nexus
and making everyone happy with how you monetize is literally impossible
dire rover
Considering their game passes more than cover the cost of a $60 game over the year, and their moral standpoints over the past years I’d say “sinister” is a word chosen with care
blazing sail
Being an adult doesn’t mean you have to be ok with throwing out $20-25 on an in-game item
livid ice
Is not if the price isn’t as high even people that wouldn’t pay for it would agree the price is right
blazing sail
Adults gamble away their entire savings, too
Adults drink away their entire savings
vapid drum
Pushing 30 🤔omg I’m way over that 😭
livid ice
The swing would be nice for 7.99 - 9.99
tawny prairie
on ‘one’ item
blazing sail
Preying in people’s weak impulses is not a great way to make a living
tawny prairie
The gift pass does not add to this 20$ value to me
orchid nexus
I think it's disingenuous to compare alcoholism to cute outfits in sky. None of the cosmetics are required in order to enjoy the game
dire rover
We come back to the “you don’t need to buy it” argument with this, the result of that discussion is “you don’t, but the game is about collecting in the end anyways and they’re banking on those that want to collect everything”.
Like most things in life it’s about expectations and how “everyone has their price”. But, that price is followed by how much you’re willing to let your reputation dwindle for the act.
livid ice
But the game would be more enjoyable with cute stuff on game and u know that
tawny prairie
I agree none of the items are required but why are single items priced so high?
blazing sail
Alcohol isn’t required to enjoy life, either
tawny prairie
I just want some info on their pricing
dire rover
Addiction is a serious condition Alex
tawny prairie
the bat cape was 20$ , a hat was 15$
blazing sail
They’re feeding off of people’s FOMO
Again, I don’t take two seconds to comment on most other F2P games because they’re not pretending to be doing it for anything but the money
vapid drum
Oh FOMO , I get
orchid nexus
These are false equivalencies. Sky also doesn't pretend to not be a game that needs to support itself.
blazing sail
You don’t criticize a casino for taking advantage of people’s weak impulses because that’s what they are. But that’s not what Sky is supposed to be.