#Neuro Sama Survivors-like

1 messages · Page 4 of 1

sharp meadow
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ye that could do

tired haven
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Seems good to me, which stage are you on right now?

hard moth
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Gonna start working on endless mode tom

tired haven
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Ok cool

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Let me know if you need help with Kotlin stuff once you start on the server

hard moth
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new map UI, ill need to do a lot of refractoring to get endless mode working I think so probably no visual updates for a long while

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hard moth
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Idk wth I was thinking when I wrote the enemy script because this is a mess... evilDeadge

tired haven
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I guess the thought was probably "whatever works"

hard moth
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yah I'm re-writing it

tired haven
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Makes sense to me

hard moth
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I thought for some reason it would be a good idea to have some stats have constant, default values, and some of them to not cirSlain

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all important stats will now have a constant base stat

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that should allow me to do things like, scaling difficulty for endless mode

tired haven
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Well, sounds good to me, since I also rewrite LMI a little bit at one point to clean it up due to the original implementation being a bit of a mess

hard moth
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Ok me updating the UI seems to have broke the pause /endgame screen so I'm also gonna have to remake that cirSlain

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but I think I got hardmode working

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Gonna see how Holocure does their endless mode

hard moth
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remade pause / victory screens. Victory screen is a bit more fancy now with a cooler transition

tired haven
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Sounds good to me

hard moth
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sprite ofc to be replaced with the appropriate character art

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and always set to the AI. i.e. if you win with Neuro -> Neuro art, win with Evil -> Evil art

tired haven
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Cool, I like the idea with that

proven minnow
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good

hard moth
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Made a quick sketch for the Neuro sprite art but I think I want a pose that shows more action so probably won't go with it. NeuroSip

Also unsure if the character arts should be pixel art or not. Ig it should be pixel since everything else is pixel art, but some games do a combination where the game is pixel, but character art is not.

neuro_sword_raise_sketch.png
tired haven
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So far everything you have is pixel art, so you should probably keep that the case unless you add a ton of non-pixel art graphics in this update

hard moth
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make sense, I think Ill do pixel art. More comfortable with it too, so that's a bonus.

tired haven
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Yeah, makes sense

hard moth
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Endless Mode Implemented! Score is based on number of enemies killed, and different enemies give different score increase, from slime being +1 to the boss being +100.

image.png
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the difficulty, for now, increases by a factor of 1 every wave starting the third wave

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so, by the 6th wave enemies have x5 HP and x5 ATK

tired haven
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I assume the score will be what it sends to the server

hard moth
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Yes, and score does not gain scale by time survived as of now, only by what types of enemies are killed, and as time progresses higher score enemies spawn more

tired haven
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It could be a good idea to add some kind of multiplier to the socre that slowly increases over time

hard moth
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yah I probably should do that

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actually I can probably multiply the score by the damage multiplier, which scales by time already

tired haven
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That would probably work pretty well

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Then once you finish all that stuff, you will need to figure out an auth system, figure out what way you want to exchange data between the leaderboard server and the game, figure out how encryption with the protocol works, and then probably make a server and integrate the needed functionality into the game

cerulean bear
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What's the definition of a wave in endless? I know there are dense waves of enemies and times where few enemies spawn, but there's also those vertical walls of enemies or is the boss part of each wave?

finite hull
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can i ask how you slow down the animation preview on aseprite kotge?

hard moth
hard moth
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At least, this is how I do it

finite hull
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oh wait i placed mine at 50

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its supposed to be longer

hard moth
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Default is 100ms I think

finite hull
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thanks its okay now

Aseprite_t2OVQZcZPd.gif
cerulean bear
hard moth
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waves progress regardless neuroXD and the boss gives around ~100 score compared to other enemies like ~10 so killing the boss should be a priority

cerulean bear
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Killing the boss is more of a priority for survival than anything.

Assuming one could survive with the boss on screen and it did pause wave progression, then killing as many enemies before the boss dies gets way more score in the end

hard moth
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oh I think ill publish the beta version of the endless mode around tomarrow

cerulean bear
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Either way the boss would die eventually

tired haven
hard moth
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still learning kotlin so no score uploads yet, and I can try adding functionality to move the cursor using arrow keys before publishing

tired haven
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Ok then

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I would definitely like a keyboard-only mode for at least the game itself and preferably also the menus

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Then I can actually (hopefully) test the game on RD mobile with a keyboard

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You could make keyboard control of the cursor in the game an option in the settings, and have the menus always usable with the keyboard

hard moth
tired haven
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Ok then, completely fine, next week will actually be better for me being able to test it

hard moth
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doing a bunch of small changes to the warning signs NeuroSip hopefully they end up looking better.

hard moth
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ok ima try adding collision boxes to the characters so they don't always overlap each other. Going to see how much more lag it increases and if it doesn't affect it much I might keep it this way NeuroSip

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I've also added dmg numbers to the enemies when they're hit

tired haven
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Making the enemies overlap less could make some upgrades worse, so keep that in mind

hard moth
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ok gonna try my best to finish up everything and upload the endless update today. No leaderboard yet (Still figuring out Kotlin and reading through the docs) but everything else should work. Hopefully.

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  • bunch of UI and effect updates
tired haven
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Did you make a keyboard only mode?

hard moth
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Not yet, and probably not until the server is done mainly because I can't figure out how to keyboard only a scroll.

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there are two in the same page so I can't just use arrow keys

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ill have to figure something out

tired haven
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Keyboard only menuing should just be highlighting different buttons and snapping the scroll if needed

hard moth
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yah something like that

tired haven
hard moth
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two scrolls in one page so I' have to figure out how to snap between them

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one for AI one for Collab Partner

tired haven
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If you have two scroll bars, you can just make each a highlightable button that can be selected and scrolled with the arrow keys

hard moth
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I can probably do something like that

hard moth
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update being uploaded in around an hour from now will ping my playtesters list when done.

hard moth
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I think I got it working NeuroSip I hope the performance cost isn't too much but lots of overlapping enemies were the largest cause of lag before so maybe this might actually reduce lag. Idk. will have to see.

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enemies can still overlapp though its like a 6pxls avoidence

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gonna export game now and hope for the best

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I'm going to be working on Neur TCG but if there is a bug tell me so I can fix it right away

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uploading neuroKuru

finite hull
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Based

tired haven
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Downloaded, will check out properly once I've woken up properly

tired haven
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This is gonna be the first game I try after overclocking my GPU I guess, too bad I can't run it at 4000 FPS because of it having no disable VSync for now

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The anti-aliasing here looks a bit out of place for some reason

image.png
hard moth
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err I'll look into that I'm just using the default UI's for those for now

tired haven
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Why can I click on these?

image.png
hard moth
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I probably should also change that

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its a different type of text box then the one I normally use cause there's a lot of text and probably a feature I didn't know of

tired haven
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The music looping comes with an odd click noise

hard moth
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didn't touch the music so that is peculiar, but noted

tired haven
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Might have been there before without me noticing

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You could make it so the borders for these are Anny's border color for Anny

image.png
hard moth
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yahh all the characters should have unique borders next update

tired haven
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This should have Neuro's color, as it is listed under Neuro's upgrades

image.png
hard moth
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I think ill automate the coloring to be based on the character, so it should always be accurate no matter what

tired haven
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The credits menu lacks a scroll bar

hard moth
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yah it looked a bit ugly with it so I wanted the auto-scroll thing that Holocure has and never got around to adding it. Until I have that I probably should add the bar cirSlain

tired haven
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The bar should be there, it's kinda annoying for me to scroll on this mouse without a scroll bar or middle mouse scroll, because just using the mouse wheel is quite jumpy

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This is what happens if I try to click this button

image.png
hard moth
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Err hopefully I have the server implemented by next update so I don't have to fix that in the first place

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if not I'll figure out how to properly disable it

tired haven
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I think I might have gone trough the menus now, unless there is more I missed

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I assume there are no other maps yet, since there is no button for changing maps

hard moth
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not yet, at least not until I finish the leaderboard

tired haven
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I also assume the leaderboards will have separate sections for each map, so build the server around that

hard moth
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also btw the character menu is going to have option to just click the below panels to switch character so you don't have to use the scroll

tired haven
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If you want, I can help with the server, since I'm quite decent at Kotlin at this point

hard moth
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that would be great

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I'm going to set up the godot part of it first

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so I know what I need to request and stuff

hard moth
tired haven
tired haven
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I assume the numbers that flash for a few frames above enemies are damage numbers

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They are kinda too fast though

hard moth
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noted, I can slow them down pretty easily

tired haven
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Make sure the animation is in seconds and not frames

hard moth
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Its like a second I think exactly but it fades so its not visible for the entire second

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the size of the number also relates w the damage

tired haven
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It's visible for like a tiny moment

hard moth
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ig I didn't take into account of the fading

tired haven
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Any fix for the framerate issues yet by the way? I want to see how much faster I can run the game now

hard moth
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err, aside from the last one, no, but I'm hoping spacing out the enemies increased performance since one major issue last time was the enemies cloggin up too much

tired haven
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I'm referring to the issues preventing you from having a VSync off setting

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Would be kinda cool to have the ability to run the game at 1000+ FPS again

hard moth
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oh that no

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erm

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maybe after the new map

tired haven
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These enemies are not moving

image.png
hard moth
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cirSlain I thought I fixed that

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I guess not

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since that impacts game balancing ill fix it rn

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I know what causes that

tired haven
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Evil just managed to do 0 damage somehow

hard moth
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with what weapon

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that just shouldnt happen

tired haven
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The knife thing

hard moth
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Alr noted

tired haven
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It happened again, this time on two enemies at once, although one of them died somehow (both were regular slimes)

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It keeps happening constantly I guess

hard moth
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is there scenarios where she actualy does damage?

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oh

tired haven
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Yeah, but also in the exact same strike she deals damage to other enemies

hard moth
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I think I know the issue

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the knife is programmed to only deal single-target damage but it still theoretically 'hits' enemies close by with 0 damage

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Ill fix it with this march fix

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uploading soon

tired haven
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Cool I guess

image.png
hard moth
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nice, the spacing out seems to work

tired haven
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I guess so

hard moth
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ok i implemented the changes exporting & uploading them now after one run

tired haven
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Evil feels pretty helpless without the fireball upgrade

hard moth
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don't think I updated Evil though. Maybe the spacing out makes it harder for her to kill?

tired haven
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I think her knife is just weak

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It hits enemies too slowly or something

hard moth
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I can slightly reduce cooldown ig

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but am going to give evil another weapon (also Neuro) soon

tired haven
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Trying to teleport near the fences functioning as obstables can cause a target out of bounds issue, I recommend if trying to teleport inside a field object, teleport to the closest valid position instead

hard moth
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make sense

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I went extra-safe on the teleportation so you can't go out of bounds and cheese the game

tired haven
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Perfectly logical

hard moth
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theres probably a way to get nearest valid position

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ok uploading new update

tired haven
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Ok then, I'll switch to that on the next attempt

hard moth
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uploaded neuroKuru

tired haven
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I'm suddenly getting a lot of 4090s again

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1.31 is an odd version number, you should have used 1.3.1

hard moth
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I updated it on the page at least

tired haven
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By the way, since the game balance can change if the game gets updated, I would recommend splitting the leaderboard scores by version too. I can help with storing version number metadata and formatting the database of scores, assuming it can just be a simple Json that is used to store stuff, I'm pretty familiar with Kotlin Json

hard moth
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make sense

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for huge game balance changes I may implement that

tired haven
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It's not hard to implement in Json at least, I can do it easily

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I could easily make a class you can call functions from that stores stuff based on version and map and retrieves metadata and stuff

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I feel like I have an idea of how the data could be stored and stuff

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lv6 fireball is indeed a dangerous upgrade

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I feel like being able to outspeed Evil is needed for that one

hard moth
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or outheal, if you are playing with Anny

tired haven
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I guess, but that is kinda hard

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Do you have any interesting endless upgrades by the way? That is kinda needed for endless mode to work

hard moth
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hmm, aside from the usual ATK up or HP up idk

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if anyone hav ideas plz gib

tired haven
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Yeah, the AI specific upgrade and the damage and HP upgrades for the different characters are obvious ones to add

cerulean bear
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I'll be able to play later tonight

Honestly, maxed fireball isn't to bad to survive with filtered. Level 1 and 2 of filtered are meh, 3 is solid and 4 is bonkers good. 20 damage from evil means you take 2, so even vedal can survive it.

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For endless, I think a wider variety of upgrades, and the ability to change what upgrades you bring could be good.

For example, you can take 3-4 attacks, 2-3 defensive upgrades and 5-6 support upgrades.

This would take some work to figure out how to balance it, but it's probably better to iron this out early so you can design around it.

Also, if you go with this, the drone and pizza upgrades should probably be reworked to not have 2 separate upgrades. You would need to fill a slot for the drones and the swarm upgrades, and same for pizza, making them worse in a way.

tired haven
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There is already a way to select your starting upgrades

cerulean bear
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Well yeah, but you have access to every upgrade every game (depending on character choice of course)

hard moth
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Seems like a good way to introduce a more varied playstyle, though, I would need to implement a lot of new upgrades for it to work NeuroSip

tired haven
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For now the current system seems good, you can expand it later

cerulean bear
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Btw, it doesn't necessarily need to be x slots for attacks, defense/healing and for support.

You could just give, say, 10 slots and you can do with them as you please. This could allow for pacifist runs if someone wanted to

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This also means you don't need as many upgrades for the system to work. If there are 10 slots and 15 possible upgrades, that could still work

tired haven
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As Kotge said, it would require quite a lot more upgrades to be implemented, so it would be something for a later major version

hard moth
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Ill def keep it in mind. Might also be a good way to have more 'specific runs' w certain upgrades when there becomes too many

tired haven
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For now the current system is probably good, no need to cram too much in one major version

cerulean bear
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The numbers are just examples btw. Neuro has 9 upgrades, so 9 slots and maybe 12 upgrades could be a test for it

tired haven
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If you need help with the leaderboard server, let me know and set up a GitHub repo or something and I'll do my best to help with it

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I could probably write a class for the leaderboard that you can then pull from and push to with the server logic

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I have some good ideas for how it would work

hard moth
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Alr, leaderboard is next thing on the list pretty much so ill start work on it soon

tired haven
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Ok then, feel free to ping me at any time if you need help with Kotlin

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And ping me when you have something like a repo set up if you want me to write a storage class of some kind

cerulean bear
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Oh, btw, when you post a new version, could you maybe have the most up-to-date version pinned? It makes it easier to find if there's a bunch of messages you don't need to scroll through, and for new people who want to try playing.

hard moth
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Oh err I dont really have perms for that but ig I can ask a mod

tired haven
hard moth
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Oh yah

tired haven
cerulean bear
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Oh, I guess that's true. I don't know why I didn't think of that

hard moth
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The already pinned link should work

cerulean bear
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Forgot about the update until this morning, and the first thing i noticed was the lack of main menu music

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also, the farms description says peoples moms have gone missing? neuroD

tired haven
cerulean bear
tired haven
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Check the settings or something, as well as Windows volume and stuff like that

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And check the selected audio device and its ability to play audio

cerulean bear
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i checked that first and its full in game, and my own pc isnt muted

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i got the usual microsoft and avg thinking its suspicious, maybe that did something?

tired haven
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My audio is perfectly fine

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What OS do you have?

hard moth
hard moth
tired haven
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Is there an OS difference? Do you have Windows 10 or 11?

hard moth
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10

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my laptop too dum cpu or something for 11

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but thats fine I don't need 11 I like my 10

tired haven
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I also have 10, because 11 is terrible

hard moth
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good to know

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even if I don't really have a choice in this

tired haven
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If Miffin man has 11, it might just be another Windows 11 issue

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I have seen Windows 11 cause a lot of completely random issues that never happen on Windows 10

cerulean bear
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I have 10

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ive never had issues like this with the previous versions. ill try one of those

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turns out, the last version no longer has main menu music either

hard moth
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huh, peculiar

tired haven
cerulean bear
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So i got it working. tmodloader wouldnt even try to open so i restarted and it works now. gonna try hard mode for a while before i moved onto endless

cerulean bear
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so i just had a killer endless run with a score of 15k exactly and a time of 20:24 (funny coincidence lol). i will start uploading this, my winning hard run, and a run with a bug (and a funny but inefficient strategy) in maybe 20 or so minutes

hard moth
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wth

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I can't even comprehend that score because I haven't tested the endless mode higher then 50 points neurowheeze

tired haven
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Would be a good score if the leaderboard was already implemented

hard moth
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yah I might just as well use it as a test score

tired haven
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Let me know when you have a repo set up for it or something and I can try to make a class for managing the leaderboard data easily

cerulean bear
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I've started uploading the hard run now. I used the same starting characters and upgrades for each run, and as for the bug, i'll give a timestamp for when that happens.

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but basically, an enemy phased through the fence. likely got pushed through it by a horde of enemies is my guess

hard moth
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oh

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probably a result from the new avoidence collision thing I added

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I can probably figure something out

cerulean bear
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i mean, ive gotten neuro to jump the fence before this update

hard moth
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enemies can't neuro can

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I can probably 'turn off' avoidence collision if an enemy is nearby walls, or add avoidence to walls themselves or something like that NeuroSip

cerulean bear
hard moth
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erm, private vid can't see

cerulean bear
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right, i forgot about that neurOMEGALUL

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should be good now

hard moth
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huh, some of the enemies seem to turn bluish for some reason. Does that happen often? I've never incountered it

tired haven
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I saw it multiple times, I thought it was a stun visual or something

hard moth
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oh yah nvm its a new feature I added don't worry guys NeuroClueless

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no uh its a bug I'll also need to look into why that happens

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probably something to do with the fact that I changed the being hit animation

cerulean bear
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tbh, i thought it was related to their health

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i wasn't paying much attention to it though so idk

hard moth
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oh

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Evil abuses her own mother for hp

cerulean bear
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tbh, that's not how i thought about it, but i was like, "can't she just hit me for health?" so i tested it and indeed, she can steal vedals or annys soul

hard moth
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it makes sense ig, I programed it as hp per damage she deals, not damage specifically to enemies

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pretty bad return though

cerulean bear
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the good endless run should be up just before the stream

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yeah, that wording is why i tried it

tired haven
hard moth
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yah I mean its not a bug and and works as intended so I'll keep it

cerulean bear
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anny has natural regen so its not horrible. plus i think that was level 1, maybe 2, and i had filtered level 1 or 2

hard moth
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oh, I forgot about the filter. Could be an interesting strategy than, if you are low on HP for Evil

tired haven
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It is an interesting strategic element

cerulean bear
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filtered reduces friendly fire damage, so by taking less doesn't she heal less? it makes it take longer if nothing else

hard moth
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oh right, also forgot that filter applies to damage going out of Evil NeurOhISee

tired haven
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That additional thing just adds a lot of strategy

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Is the damage indicator thing fixed by the way?

hard moth
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It being too short? not yet, the only thing I fixed rn is the march

tired haven
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Ok then

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I guess I'll just wait for stuff to get fixed and for development on the serverside part to start

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I can make a data management class for the leaderboard whenver

tired haven
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For some reason I really feel like I want to do that soon

hard moth
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I can try setting up the repo tomarrow NeuroSip

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need to watch strim now NeuroCheer

tired haven
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Ok cool. I'll also be watching and capturing the stream

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So tomorrow is definitely the earliest I can do stuff like that (I spent the time before the stream implementing some slash commands)

cerulean bear
tired haven
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By the way, when you make the server repo, make sure it uses JDK 21 and Kotlin 2.0, as well as Kotlin DSL for Gradle, let me know if you need to know more stuff for configuring the project

hard moth
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will do, gonna start in a couple hours, want to read up on HTTP requests first

tired haven
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Ok then. Once you do make the repo or something, you should give me access so I can make the data management system for the leaderboard data and help with stuff if needed

tired haven
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I would assume the server data structure could look something like this

image.png
finite hull
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Time to join thei discord tho

hard moth
finite hull
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Made a Bot?

hard moth
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Making it so you can link your Discord account to Neuro Adventures! and store your high score

tired haven
# finite hull Made a Bot?

Discord applications can be much more than just bots, Neuro rants for example uses Discord authentication in a similar way to how Neuro adventures will

hard moth
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also uhh I'm gonna have to re-set all settings again neuroSad2 (Final one I promise)

Mainly because I want to use .json instead of .save I've been using until now

finite hull
hard moth
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yah I've been using settings.save but it's unreadable oustide of Godot

tired haven
hard moth
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if I switch to like .json I can go edit it even out of Godot

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and its much more expandable, I can add more settings more easily

finite hull
hard moth
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yah neuroHypers in fact NeuroAdventures! is open-source so if you want to look at the code you can

finite hull
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Oh shit fr?

meager ember
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@hard moth shot you a dm, could you take a look 👀 neuroPray

finite hull
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Letsgo thanks 🤝

hard moth
tired haven
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(I recommend the latter)

finite hull
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Oof hope not, even if I'm new to this I can feel that Doesn't bode well

tired haven
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What part?

finite hull
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Former

hard moth
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erm. currently anyone can view but I can hide it. Probably for the best.

finite hull
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Yea

tired haven
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Yeah, server code is usually not public for security reasons

finite hull
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Imo every multiplayer stuff should be hidden

tired haven
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At least there was basically no final externally visible stuff done yet

tired haven
hard moth
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Ok welp server is now a private repo

tired haven
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But hiding the server is a good start

finite hull
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The game just sends out leaderboard data to the server anyway right?

tired haven
hard moth
finite hull
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Lul

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Head scratching for someone who can't make health bar yet

finite hull
hard moth
tired haven
opal terrace
tired haven
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I guess so

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So you really can't easily hide whatever is going on with that stuff outside of the server

finite hull
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I'm like 4 small animated character sprite left and maybe make some platform sprites too after continuing gdquest tutorial

hard moth
# 
<html>
<style>
    body {
        background-color: 1A1A1A;
        position: absolute;
        top: 50%;
        left: 50%;
        -ms-transform: translate(-50%, -50%);
        transform: translate(-50%, -50%);
        text-align: center;
        vertical-align: middle;
        font-family: arial;
        font-size: 24px;
        font-weight: bold;
    }
</style>

<body>
    <img alt="" width=50% src="https://user-images.githubusercontent.com/63984796/166126738-063f7b9b-8f78-4d3d-9853-79000f95549c.png">
    <br>
    <h2 style="color:e0e0e0;">Success!</h2>
    <h2 style="color:e0e0e0;">Please close this tab and return to the application.</h2>
</body>

</html>

If someone has a better source image than the placeholder, that would be great

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this is for the redirect website after you've connected your discord

hard moth
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ok nice superbox got me a link

hard moth
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Ok I think I got this thing working cirFeelsGreat

image.png
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Now just have to connect things to serverside ...

tired haven
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Make sure to push any changes you make to the server so I can make changes if needed

hard moth
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Gonna mainly work on TCG tom but server after that

tired haven
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Ok then

hard moth
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Taking notes this stream

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For adding miniko character later

tired haven
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We'll see when I end up implememting the backup coroutine

tired haven
finite hull
#

Is it normal to think about the correct code in the middle of work? I was just thinking and thought up a beginner code to use to change state if the character is walking or running, tho I don't know if itl work yet lul,

hard moth
# finite hull Is it normal to think about the correct code in the middle of work? I was just t...

If me programming stuff for my projects in on unrelated class is normal, thinking about code in work should be too neuroHehe

I usually use a state machine for that https://youtu.be/XTrrsT3hV-w?si=ETvJZ1yz_aORh4ip

Though for Neuro Adventures specifically since there are only two states (Run, Idle) I just check whether velocity is zero or not. NeuroSip

YouTube
Gwizz
Godot 4 State Machine Tutorial

Quick tutorial on how to make a basic state machine in Godot 4!

▶ Play video
finite hull
tired haven
#

Not 100% sure

hard moth
#

Same w gdscript 0 is interpreted as false

tired haven
#

Ok then, pretty interesting

#

Let me know whenever you make progress with the server and I'll take a look at it or something

hard moth
tired haven
#

Are you sure showing multiple versions at once is a good idea? I would think you should only be showing one version at once, unless you want to make the logic of fetching stuff way more complex

hard moth
#

one version one map yah gonna update

#

ok updated leaderboard UI. checking 'your scores only' just hides all the other scores from other players.

image.png
tired haven
#

I assume that score there is a placeholder

meager ember
#

kotge & superbox, lemme know once that's ready 👉 👈

tired haven
#

We're quite close, all it needs I think is the auth stuff

meager ember
#

cheers. i'll dm you to ask for details once it's done

tired haven
#

Ok then, we can explain the server API when needed

#

The API is quite simple, you will likely only end up needing 2 request types

hard moth
#

ok leaderboard is even closer to completion. The last score over there is an actual score I sent to my local server for testing NeuroSip

Playable update though will still take a while since I want to make sure the server is secure + the 100 bugs and features that I haven't fixed/implemented yet.

image.png
tired haven
#

Progress is coming along well though

#

Since the server is on a JVM, at least we probably don't need to worry about memory vulnerabilites

hard moth
cerulean bear
hard moth
#

ok im like 99% done will get the rest finished tomarrow.

image.png
#

Really the only thing left is making the 'your scores only' thing work + ordering the scores from greatest to least, and mabe clicking on each score to see more details

#

though all those are client-side stuff server is like done

tired haven
#

Yeah, the server seems to be pretty much ready to be compiled and used

hard moth
#

owoYay made login more pretty depending on how my bugfixes go update could be out in couple days time.

image.png
tired haven
#

Server setup is now finalized

#

Just waiting on the client to be finalized now

#

Was there someone that wanted to utilize the server API?

hard moth
#

oh yah

#

@meager ember

meager ember
#

thank you, i'll dm shortly (any time from now till Sat catSUS ) neuroPray

tired haven
#

Ok then I guess

#

Well, I guess we'll see what happens

cerulean bear
#

Question. Will the public leaderboard show multiple scores from 1 person if they are high enough? I might wind up taking it over if so

tired haven
#

Yes, it will store all scores by all users as long as the scores are not the same exact score instance every time

cerulean bear
hard moth
#

ok halfway thorugh bugfixes I think

tired haven
#

Sounds good to me

#

Hopefully we'll get to testing properly with a release soon

hard moth
#

just a minor UI improvement left (corrected colored upgrade boxes). Update will go live tomarrow neuroHypers

tired haven
#

Sounds good to me

hard moth
#

Roadmap is now:

More Achievements and Achievement Account sync (v 1.5), Miniko (v1.6), and ARG map (v1.7)

tired haven
#

Ok cool, let me know whenever you start working on the achievement sync I guess

hard moth
#

will do

cerulean bear
#

The leaderboard might be helpful in determining what's good and what isn't. If all the highest scores use the same stuff, then it's obviously very strong.

Also, one thing I would like to see added to the leaderboard is the ability to see what characters the person selected.

Maybe in the future, some kind of replay feature could be added? Idk the logistics of this though, or whether it's reasonable to implement due to needing to store the replays somewhere.

hard moth
#

also update going live in a couple hours (hopefully)

#

replays... erm.. probably not feasible

#

currently available data for each score

image.png
#

In the future, I may add the ability to view what upgrades were used too, but that will be a future plan

#

Actually for that super will have to do some stuff to make sure the server has backwards compatibility so Idk how that will work out. Maybe have used-upgrades be an optional field or something like that

#

But for now, I'm not adding it since erm don't wanna do featurecreep for this update

tired haven
#

And you would basically need to reimplement the game input system completely and make everything 100% deterministic

hard moth
#

yah I figured it won't be possible

tired haven
#

Yeah, not without eliminating all randomness and trough that much of the fun of the game

tired haven
# hard moth In the future, I may add the ability to view what upgrades were used too, but th...

It is possible to do, you would just need to send the upgrades as a JsonArray, but I would need to update the server and you would need to make sure the old clients don't care if extra stuff is sent and that the new clients can tolerate if the field is null (or something) instead of a JsonArray and to keep backwards compatibility with old client score sending it would need to be made an optional parameter (which can be done with a simple nullable variable and a if (variable == null) check

#

But it is possible

tired haven
tired haven
cerulean bear
#

Yeah, I figured replays would be a stretch. But yeah, adding the ability to view upgrades used at some point will be helpful for figuring out roughly how good an upgrade is, depending on people's scores and what level the upgrades were at

tired haven
#

Yeah, they are really not feasible, but showing used upgrades should be fairly easy

tired haven
hard moth
#

yahhhh erm

#

Things happened

#

taking longer then expected

tired haven
#

More bugs?

hard moth
#

not really I'm just making some of the icons for the upgrades sprites a bit better while I automate the upgrade borders.

tired haven
#

Ok then, I guess I'll wait

cerulean bear
#

We have tenma collab. The game can wait a couple more hours neurOMEGALUL

tired haven
#

Yeah, and I have a tomfoolery bot to program

hard moth
#

(For ref)

#

I'm remaking it

#

ok I think thats good enough

tired haven
#

Looks good

meager ember
#

Looks really good vedalCheer

hard moth
#

ok erm mostly everything is done but I'm having toubles with the y sort so uh ill probably upload tomarrow neuroCry

#

the y-sort is broken for enemies neuroCry

#

nvm I fixed it

#

still gonna export tomarrow 5:00 AM and I think I need to go to sleep

#

but everything is ready to go neuroHypers

tired haven
#

Sounds good to me

#

Seems like there is now also data on the leaderboard or something

hard moth
#

Yup my first score

tired haven
#

Seems like it went trough fine

hard moth
#

Died fast on purpose though

#

Mabe tom I do a actuall full run

hard moth
#

ok uploading in like 10 minutes

tired haven
#

Ok then, I can try to test within like an hour

hard moth
#

ok well windows export is working fine... but the leaderboard in the web export is not working... gonna try fix it but worse case scenario the web version will have its leaderboard disabled

#

welp ill have to disable leaderboard for the web ... apparently its one of the limiations of a web export, networking stuff is limited.

#

I kinda suspected this would happen. oh well

tired haven
#

I guess the web version can't host the redirect thing

#

Makes sense to me

#

Browsers can only use HTTP requests and websockets

hard moth
#

basically

image.png
#

yah

tired haven
#

Yep, that's basically a browser limitation

meager ember
#

oh, is the leaderboard server implemented on raw tcp sockets?

hard moth
#

no, but the Neuro Adventures! client uses a TCP server for discord oauth stuff

#

Ok upload finished!

tired haven
tired haven
meager ember
meager ember
tired haven
#

Should be easy to hook into, I can explain the API and how to use it whenever you want

meager ember
#

thank you, give me another day to deal with work, i'll message you thereafter

tired haven
#

Ok then

tired haven
#

This scroll bar here is messed up

image.png
#

Everything loads really fast for me, I wonder if it has something to do with me having the server

hard moth
hard moth
#

For me

tired haven
#

Yeah, for me it's literally as fast as my RAM allows probably

finite hull
#

Oh let's FUCKING go

tired haven
#

The latency when running the game remotely is actually not that bad

#

A teleport attempt to the middle of nowhere said that it's out of bounds, which is definitely not the case

hard moth
#

I think (I hope) I can find a solution

tired haven
#

The damage dealt number also sometimes is still too brief for some reason

#

Maybe someone randomly poking at the server or something

hard moth
hard moth
# tired haven Odd

Huh, when was this? If it was a while ago it could be from me attempting to fetch leaderboard data from the web, which didnt work out.

#

Well if that was the case it shouldn't happen anymore since I updated the web version to just have the leaderboard disabled

tired haven
#

Oh, that is entirely possible, that exception is for sending a packet that does not conform to the Json formatting

hard moth
#

yahh the web version probably send something that doesn't work

tired haven
#

Very likely

hard moth
#

sad, I think my algorithm to order the scores from highest to least may have failed. Gonna see if I can quickly update this.

image.png
tired haven
#

Yeah looks wrong

#

Also, I just randomly managed to beat the boss in like 2 seconds

hard moth
#

huh

#

with what upgrade? Were you able to see?

#

Anny stars can do that, but if its something else might be a bug NeuroSip

tired haven
#

Yeah, it was stars and then Evil's fireballs to finish off

hard moth
#

oh yah that was a strategy I remember, fully charged stars against boss. NeuroSip

#

and you can technically wipe it out almost instantly

#

ok i figured out the error in sorting

#

I was comparing the scores as strings

#

I should comapre them after conversion to integers

#

gonna upload patch soon

tired haven
#

Yeah, although convert to Long instead unless it's like Python where there is no intager limit

hard moth
#

erm I'm just going to hope no one gets a score higher than 9223372036854775807 I don't think Godot has a long int

tired haven
#

So all values in Godot are 64 bits?

hard moth
#

idk at least the integer is a Signed 64-bit integer type

tired haven
#

You could make it so if a score exceeds the limit and fails to be converted (throws an exception or something) you just compare it as string and add it to the top

#

Just a bit buggy, but scores that high are unlikely anyway

#

It's just a safeguard

hard moth
#

I think it may literally be impossible

#

but, it should be fine the score will just wrap around apparently

#

so it becomes negative

tired haven
#

In Kotlin I would just do

try {
  scores.add(score.toInt())
 } catch (e: NumberFormatException) {
  fallbackStringScores.add(score)
}```
hard moth
#

like if the number is too big, there is no exception, it just wraps around basically.

#

so I could check if the value is negative and handle things differently

#

9223372036854775807 + 1 is -9223372036854775808

tired haven
#

In Kotlin it is impossible to convert a string that is a larger number than the limit into the type, and it throws the exception instead

hard moth
#

welp patch has been uploaded

tired haven
#

Ok then I guess

hard moth
#

looks like its working neuroHypers

image.png
tired haven
#

Looks good to me

hard moth
#

From the looks of it the highest possible score will probably be in the 10,000s range NeuroSip (Miffin got 15,000 so basing off of that)

tired haven
#

Interesting I guess

#

Well, adding the server and stuff seems to have been a success

hard moth
#

small patch uploaded. Vedal's stun wasn't working fully as intended. If you aren't using Vedal it doesn't matter.

#

next update I think ill attempt to optemize the game even more because if there are too much enemies the game still lags

tired haven
#

Makes sense to me, let me know when you want to add achievement saving or something

hard moth
#

yah, that'll be with the next update too, but Im gonna try and make more achievements first.

tired haven
#

Also, I'll probably try to make a port override for testing the server more easily next update

#

You should make the server port configurable on the client build if you can too

hard moth
#

wdym

tired haven
#

So you can quickly change it when you need to test new stuff

hard moth
#

like, ability to quickly change the port?

tired haven
#

Just for testing and stuff

hard moth
#

rn all I have to do is edit prod.cfg

tired haven
#

Like add some kind of config to the build where it uses a different port on build if needed

hard moth
#

yah I can export with a different prod.cfg

tired haven
#

Useful for when you want to test the server locally for new features

#

But yeah, let me know when you want to try implementing new stuff for the server and I can do stuff like make a few classes to handle things

hard moth
#

will do

tired haven
#

I think at least saving the achievements should be easy, just add a second endpoint and its own request handler, I could do it really quickly
Saving upgrades in the leaderboard should be easy too, just a quick nullable (default = null) JsonArray variable

hard moth
#

yah, and as for the client side older versions shouldn't have issues and for newer versions I can just not show upgrades if a score doesn't have them

tired haven
#

Yeah, pretty simple

#

You should probably store upgrades with their levels by the way

hard moth
#

I just uploaded minor patch again, this time to add flash to elf cauz i forgor.

hard moth
tired haven
#

Ok cool

#

That way you only have to store the highest level of each upgrade

#

Makes things a bit more efficient

hard moth
#

ok turns out I was making the game accidentally harder by spawning the boss every look-wave

#

erm

#

gonna upload patch soon

tired haven
#

Yeah, I noticed the boss respawned, I thought it was intentional

hard moth
#

it is intentional, but not as frequently as now

tired haven
#

Ok then I guess

cerulean bear
#

So I got 15k while the game was harder?

Also, gonna download and eat the leaderboard now

hard moth
cerulean bear
#

Ah, then that makes it easier tbh. More points before the enemies get too strong

cerulean bear
#

Yeah, looking at the leaderboard, I probably got a few thousand points from bosses alone. Possibly half even

cerulean bear
#

Leaderboard takeover complete

#

have fun trying to beat that one

#

i've had a bit of a big head the past few days because of magic survival, and i think it's bleeding over to here lol

tired haven
#

Yep, that sure is a high score you added there

image.png
cerulean bear
#

not as satisfying as 15k on the nose though

tired haven
#

At least I should be able to get higher scores now that I'm not remoting

cerulean bear
#

i will upload the run later, mainly because my dad's downloading stuff atm

#

but it's gonna be a long one. 30:35 for the run, not counting pause time

cerulean bear
#

Uploading the first run! It's gonna take like an hour and 20 minutes though

#

I am gonna upload my third run too, but not because I barely beat my score. I was getting kinda screwed with rng early on, I started employing new strategies, and started abusing the teleport cooldown mechanic.

I debated uploading both because it's over 1 hour combined, but i'm just gonna do it

#

i'm probably gonna be more selective with what i upload from now on though because of how long the runs will likely be

hard moth
#

Seems like Evil + Anny is the way to go for now

cerulean bear
#

yeah

hard moth
#

though, my personal best was using Vedal + Neuro

#

it doesn't come close to 20k +

cerulean bear
#

fireball is absolutely busted, but filtered is even more busted

#

so is teleport

#

tbh, neuro and vedal seem underpowered more than anny and evil being op

hard moth
opal terrace
#

Btw for the web leaderboard problem, you can generate a random "state" (I think is the name) that gets sent along with the discord request. Then have discord redirect to a page on the leaderboard server and store a "state" to token (or code at that point) Dictionary. The client can then receive that from the server given it knows the state.

tired haven
#

We already have all the server stuff figured out and integrated in the client

#

And it seems to be working perfectly well

opal terrace
#

Not for web apparently. Also how do you deal with me having an http server already? Does it just not work?

hard moth
#

erm, wdym by having an http server?

opal terrace
#

I might already be running a local http server on your port.

tired haven
hard moth
#

uh

tired haven
hard moth
#

idk actually I should have probably changed the local one to something more unique

opal terrace
hard moth
#

http://localhost:1500/api/auth/discord/redirect

Is the local redirect uri

#

so port 1500

#

I can add another redirect uri I guess

#

though

#

@opal terrace does logging in not work in your system?

Its only used once for logging in

opal terrace
#

No, I'm just pointing out flaws I see. You don't have to address them, but randomly spinning up http servers on peoples computers is not something I expect a game to do.

hard moth
#

That was how it was done in the Godot tutorial I watched, what will be a better way?

tired haven
#

Well, if we do change how things work, that would mean we would need to create a new request type to keep backwards compatibility or something

#

So we can keep the existing stuff in place

hard moth
#

Yah so I won't apply the changes to this game

#

asking for the Neuro TCG mainly

opal terrace
tired haven
#

By the way, I think the issue with damage numbers seems to be that they are tied to the enemy sprite, so when the enemy dies and despawns, the damage indicator also disappears

hard moth
#

var redirect_server := TCPServer.new()

This is the server btw

#

(of the client)

opal terrace
#

I can write the new version and you can see if you want it. I have the server code after all.

tired haven
#

Sure, as long as it doesn't break compatibility

opal terrace
#

The client is still on github, right?

hard moth
#

yah

opal terrace
tired haven
#

Currently it seems the redirect URI is stored on the server, so keep in mind you will have to store another one probably

#

Also, I have not yet implemented the server debug port override

hard moth
#

@opal terrace

So will the change be, instead of creating a TCP server in the client to act as the redirect srever, the leaderboard server is used as the redirect server?

#

and this would also allow the web version to have a leaderboard?

tired haven
#

I thought that one is impossible to validate?

opal terrace
#

Basically, yes. And then securely passing it back to only the correct client.

tired haven
#

And how do you validate that?

opal terrace
#

wdym by validate?

hard moth
#

I was attempting to do something like that but what stopped me was what super pointed out, idk how to send back to the correct client.

tired haven
#

And which redirect goes to which client

opal terrace
#

Discord allows a "state" query param to be set and will keep that when it redirects back. That is the identifier for the client.

tired haven
#

Oh, so we make the server send the client some kind of state parameter that then gets sent to the Discord API thing and that then has to be given by the client to get its access token?

#

Makes sense to me I guess

opal terrace
#

Not exactly. The client generates it and sends it along. That avoids some back and forth.

tired haven
#

Ok, so the client generates the state thing and sends that to the server and Discord API and then when the redirect comes in the server sends back the access token in response to the state thing?

opal terrace
#

Yep

#

Took me like two afternoons to figure that one out for Toasted!.

tired haven
#

Interesting

hard moth
#

Makes sense I think CirnoBuffering

tired haven
#

Well, it does not seem like an obvious solution at all

#

But it makes sense now that you explain it

#

Well, you can implement it if you want, but let me first just make the server port overrideable in the configs

hard moth
#

yah and the server will need to be added as a redirect URI option I'm assuming

#

plus some changes to the client

opal terrace
tired haven
#

Done, port override added

tired haven
#

But I guess I can do that techincally

hard moth
#

I think the .env file is not in github

#

oh

#

you mean the code

tired haven
#

Yeah, but I can make .env.example

hard moth
#

do you also need an anonymized prod.cfg of the client?

#

Actually if you need it I can probably just send it to you

opal terrace
#

Why anonymize that? If it is part of the client, it's public anyways.

hard moth
#

yah I just realized that

tired haven
#

Done, .env.example added

opal terrace
hard moth
#

no

tired haven
hard moth
#

Was going to

hard moth
tired haven
#

But I said to not do that

#

Because I know what that thing is

hard moth
#

yah

#

I'm starting to think the godot ouath2 tutorial I watched is kinda not so good.

tired haven
#

Apparently Evil can clip trough fences a bit

hard moth
#

technically Evil / Neuro can clip through anything

#

I tried giving them collision but didn't work out and they kept getting stuck

#

so now they can just phase through stuff NeuroSip

#

Mabe Ill figure out a proper solution one day

tired haven
#

Makes sense to me

opal terrace
#

Why can't they pathfind to the player?

hard moth
#

it does

#

and avoides the fences

#

but sometimes a part of Evil / Neuro's sprite overlaps with parts of the fence

tired haven
#

Where did the retry button go after losing by the way?

hard moth
#

I think I forgot to implement it

#

will do for next update

#

Well, I have it, but its set to invisible and clicking it does nothing cirSlain

#

so I think I put it there and forgot to implement it

tired haven
#

Welp, I guess you can implement it for next update

#

I think some enemies might have just spawned on top of Evil

hard moth
#

can occur if Evil is on the edges, sicne that is where the enemies spawn. I should add a check to prevent that prob.

tired haven
#

Yeah, sounds like a good idea

hard moth
#

Roadmap for now. Though, progress will probably be really slow for a while since my uni is starting in a couple days. (Balancing should be removed I already did that.)

image.png
#

and rn I want some of the TCG done

tired haven
#

Seems good to me

#

Anny can really do a lot of damage if she gets close, too bad her healing falls off later in the game

cerulean bear
tired haven
#

I assume there are still no endless mode specific upgrades, such as damage and healing multipliers you can get endlessly

hard moth
#

not yet, should add along with the achievements update

tired haven
#

Makes sense to me

#

Thanks for adding that framecounter by the way, I only noticed I've been running on 60Hz probably since the motherboard upgrade because it is there

cerulean bear
#

Yeah, i decided to turn it on a few updates ago because i thought it might be helpful. although i forgot to turn it on until partway through

#

i didn't watch these before uploading, but i assume its probably choppy again?

tired haven
#

I literally wasn't utilizing my 165Hz display because I didn't realize the motherboard swap changed it

cerulean bear
#

yeah, it's choppy, rip

#

it's only choppy in the recordings, not in game

tired haven
#

Oh cool, chaning the display settings unbricked my OBS

#

How did I not notice it was wrong until now?

cerulean bear
#

I'll try messing around with mine next time to see if i can fix whatevers making it choppy. it started doing that a couple versions of the game ago and idk why

tired haven
#

I feel like Evil is faster on 165Hz relative to Anny, or just the first level of programming socks is bugged somehow

cerulean bear
#

its the socks. i remember seeing it be talked about a few months ago

tired haven
#

Seems like it's a bug with level one programming socks

hard moth
#

lv1 specifically?

#

i remember fixing something relating to them

tired haven
#

Yeah, specifically with level 1 Evil is faster than Anny

hard moth
# 
if upgrade.lvl >= 1:
        collab_partner.max_speed = collab_partner.BASE_MAX_SPEED + collab_partner.BASE_MAX_SPEED * 0.05
        ai.max_speed =  ai.BASE_MAX_SPEED + ai.BASE_MAX_SPEED * 0.5
    if upgrade.lvl >= 2: 
        collab_partner.max_speed = collab_partner.BASE_MAX_SPEED + collab_partner.BASE_MAX_SPEED * 0.10
        ai.max_speed = ai.BASE_MAX_SPEED + ai.BASE_MAX_SPEED * 0.10
    if upgrade.lvl >= 3:
        collab_partner.max_speed = collab_partner.BASE_MAX_SPEED + collab_partner.BASE_MAX_SPEED * 0.15
        ai.max_speed =  ai.BASE_MAX_SPEED + ai.BASE_MAX_SPEED * 0.15
    if upgrade.lvl >= 4: 
        collab_partner.max_speed = collab_partner.BASE_MAX_SPEED + collab_partner.BASE_MAX_SPEED * 0.20
        ai.max_speed = ai.BASE_MAX_SPEED + ai.BASE_MAX_SPEED * 0.20
tired haven
#

It goes to normal on level 2 again

hard moth
#

well I guess this is the issue

#

*0.5

#

not * 0.05

#

ill upload fix rn

tired haven
#

Yep, that makes sense

cerulean bear
#

guess thats what happens when you only wear 1 of them

hard moth
#

update should be up

tired haven
#

Gonna switch to it for next run

tired haven
#

Cool, the upgrade menu can deal with having less than 3 upgrades available

hard moth
#

yah I programmed something for that situation I remember

tired haven
#

Seems like it works

#

I can now only get pizza

#

Well, I now also have a 20K range score

#

I could really see the effects of enemy scaling

hard moth
#

huh

#

at that point the enemies should be getting stronger exponentially

#

ill go check

tired haven
#

Yeah, the enemies could deal a ton of damage

hard moth
#

oh its working then ig

#

can they also take more hits?

tired haven
#

Yeah, even the most basic ones that spawn could tank like 5 fireballs

hard moth
#

ok its working then

#

I guess Im just personally really bad at the game, I can't seem to get higher then 1k

#

but then I'm using vedal + neuro which is harder

tired haven
#

Yeah, Neuro and Vedal need buffs

#

It could be that one of their major issues is lack of healing

#

Their healing system is very basic, being a pickup that gives them HP, so maybe adding an endless upgrade for healing multiplier could help, not sure. You might also need to buff their chicken bake and cookie upgrades, maybe also add some way to add defence for them or something

#

One of the major reasons Anny and Evil can get so far is their advanced healing

cerulean bear
#

also, i didnt expect leaderboard competition so soon lol. i'm gonna have to work to keep my spot

tired haven
#

I figured things out

hard moth
#

Do you guys think Anny / Evil healing should be debuffed as Vedal / Neuro healing is increased or just increase Vedal/ Nwuro healing? Asking mainly because I am worried ~ 30min might be too long for one game run and making the game more difficult might be able to reduce one game time

tired haven
#

I think Anny and Evil are fairly well balanced

#

The difficulty up until the first boss at least is definitely about what I would expect

cerulean bear
#

evil's healing is pretty bonkers, but thats because it scales with damage. Maxed fireball lets her heal crazy fast

tired haven
#

Then after that there is a long section where you're quite powerful, like many other games seem to have, until you start struggling again and eventually lose to the enemy scaling

#

Yeah, that is pretty much how that goes, but eventually the scaling exceeds it

#

You can't really survive max fireball early game, so I feel that is balanced for the most part

hard moth
#

Hmm I should tomarrow mabe get a completely new player to try the game, and see how they react to the difficulty levels NeuroSip

tired haven
#

To me the balance feels fairly on par with some other games I play

hard moth
cerulean bear
#

as for game length, i personally dont find it too bad, probably because i'm used to it. Good runs in magic survival on the newest map currently take over an hour when you include boss waves pausing time and way more level ups/chests pausing it too.

tired haven
#

Yeah, the game length isn't that bad

tired haven
hard moth
#

Erm maybe ill just ask around on the tech channels or something like that

#

But if you can find someone that will work too

tired haven
#

I'll ask around a bit maybe

hard moth
#

Need to neuroSleep today though 4 AM here

cerulean bear
#

could maybe ask in NN? i'm sure you could find a few people easily like that. and yeah, go sleep. don't pull a vedal

tired haven
#

I got Flash to play the game yesterday, apparently he said a reroll for upgrades could be good (sometimes you get RNG that is so terrible it's literally just 3 useless upgrades) and possibly might want to make remapping inputs possible (such as changing the movement and ability buttons)

cerulean bear
tired haven
#

Yeah, remapping keys is a good idea, for the reroll idea I was just relaying what Flash said

cerulean bear
#

I don't disagree with the reroll. As long as there's some cost or limiter I think it's fine

#

Anyways, it's my turn to go to bed. 2:15 am here lol

tired haven
#

Makes sense to me, correctly implemented the reroll could be good, like maybe you get only a certain number of rerolls per run or something

hard moth
#

neuroNOTED noted

#

remap + reroll when more upgrades are added

tired haven
#

Input remapping should be easy

#

Just a new settings menu or something

hard moth
#

yah should be easy, lots of tutorials on it too NeuroSip

elfin pike
#

Yeah been playing for couple hours, my fingers really been strained without option to use different key like arrows key to switching hand. And lack of reroll really frustrating after a while since you will be stuck with upgrade that you really don't need. That's pretty much from me from first couple hours playing it

cerulean bear
#

I've noticed that enemies don't seem to move when they spawn until you get near that part of the map, then they all charge you at once. It's very easy to get boxed in by running away, because you are likely to pull another horde.

this actually got me killed last night for a time of 7:27 though neuroHypers

#

side note, my dad commented on the main menu music. he said it sounds a little like lord of the rings

rugged condor
#

I had like 2 fps when I discovered an army of mobs chilling in the other side of the map

opal terrace
#

I have the new auth implementation finished, just need to test it on Supers server.

tired haven
#

The game is actually able to drop frames on my incredibly powerful PC, how?

#

And I have no idea what's even bottlenecking it, the game isn't using a full CPU core and the GPU is also barely utilized

tired haven
opal terrace
#

Idk if I can do that, let my try.

tired haven
#

(Kotge will have to test it locally first before I deploy, since I can't locally test the client until a new release is out)

opal terrace
#

It worked for the server at least. No idea why I have push perms.

tired haven
#

Probably because it's a private repo and you were invited by Kotge or something

opal terrace
#

I guess so. I opened a PR for the client.

tired haven
#

Seems like you added a crashing condition to the server, maybe a copy paste failure from other error handling stuff

#

I'll fix it once I take a look at it properly

opal terrace
#

Huh, where?

tired haven
#

There could be an error here that is not accounted for, such as InvalidArgumentException

image.png
#

Either of these could throw that

image.png
#

Less than 30FPS on my machine by the way

#

Crazy stuff

#

I feel like this is an issue only with the latest version somehow

#

Neuro adventures is built with debug?

image.png
#

Sub 20FPS

#

Only a couple enemies (this is before first boss kill)

image.png
#

Below 10 FPS, item collision is just broken now

#

It's literally unplayable

#

I died to the lag

#

i7-12700K + RTX 4070Ti by the way

#

I feel like there might be some new major bug in the enemy spawning system or something with this lag

#

I think it has to do with enemies spawning off screen and not starting to move before they get rendered, not sure

#

Well, now we know that really low framerates cause issues with item collision

tired haven
#

The game definitely needs a fix for the stuff with enemies off screen (especially at the field edges) not moving until you look at them, in the late game going to clear the laggy enemies from the edges of the field is literally just impossible

hard moth
#

Ill look into the server tomarrow and pull the changes neuroHypers

#

For the enemies not moving

#

I think I know exactly what is causing it

#

Will also fix tom and push a fix

tired haven
#

Ok then, you can release the new login system in the same patch

#

Once the server is set up of course

hard moth
#

Alr

tired haven
#

I have read and understood at least most of the code Robotino wrote, so if you have issues with testing it, feel free to DM me

hard moth
hard moth
tired haven
hard moth
#

Should be easy to revert

tired haven
#

By the way, Flash was lagging a lot all the time, I'm basically only able to run the game at a good framerate because of my overkill hardware in its current state

#

And even mine can die pretty easily if I don't get the needed upgrades for killing the enemies globally

hard moth
#

Hopefully my revert fixes this issue

#

But ill look into even more ways of optimization

tired haven
#

Yeah, I feel like the game does need some optimizations

#

But first we can patch that issue and get the new login system implemented

cerulean bear
#

It gives me some lag, but my PC isn't high end. My PC is probably way outdated if anything.

I probably don't have too many issues performance wise because I circle the map to pick up exp

tired haven
#

Yeah, I had one run where I didn't go trough most of the map most of the time and didn't have high enough fireball level, where my PC just absolutely died (<10FPS)

cerulean bear
#

If there's that many, knife and pizza would clear them faster probably due to no pierce limit

tired haven
#

Well, I literally couldn't play the game well enough to get stuff like that because of the lag

hard moth
#

pretty busy today but I think I can pull the updates and apply the fix later at night NeuroSip Mabe if I have time I can even run some tests

elfin pike
#

I will try some more after the bugfix mabe

hard moth
#

reroll neuroHypers

image.png
#

I made it so that you can reroll as much as you want

#

but obviously, with a penalty

#

each time you reroll, the exp required to reach the next level increases by 5 exp multiplied by the amount of times you rerolled. So if you reroll once, the next level takes (usual amount to reach next level + 5). Reroll twice, the next level takes (usual amount ot reach next level + 10).

#

I.e. if you are in level 1, level 2 requires 6 exp to reach. However, if you reroll once, 1x5 = 5 so it will take 11 exp to reach level 2 instead.

#

penalty is shown once you reroll at least once

image.png
cerulean bear
#

Does this affect future level ups?

#

Like, aside from just the next one

tired haven
hard moth
#

So first reroll will always result in a penalty of 5 exp

#

Ima upload this now

#

Hopefully nothing breaks NeuroSip

tired haven
#

Oh, ok then

cerulean bear
#

It seems super cheap to me, but that's because I'm used to losing 80% and up of my current level to reroll neurowheeze

#

But yeah, it seems good 👍

tired haven
#

Well, let me know when the new build is available (and Flash might want to know too)

hard moth
#

ima upload it now but if its broken uhh it might be fixed much later cauz me gonna sleep w neur strim

tired haven
#

Ok then, hopefully it's not broken then

hard moth
#

done!

#

oh nice @opal terrace leaderboard works for web too now neuroHypers

tired haven
#

Oh cool

#

Web having leaderboard should make it more accessible

hard moth
#

yah definetly

tired haven
elfin pike
#

aigh im trying it now

tired haven
#

I'll probably try it soon too, likely after the Neuro stream

opal terrace
hard moth
opal terrace
#

I don't think so. It still fails with CORS errors, which should be fixed by the server update.

hard moth
#

you mean the web version?

#

it loads for me

image.png
opal terrace
#

huh

hard moth
#

and I can login

opal terrace
#

wait, you have a different uuid

hard moth
#

Windows also works

image.png
hard moth
opal terrace
#

your url is different from mine

hard moth
#

huh

#

so the web version does not work still on your end?

opal terrace
#

yes

hard moth
#

wierd

#

any idea what may be causing the problem?

#

welp I tried on incognito where Im not logged in and it still works

opal terrace
#

Maybe itch is still propagating the update? I can try with your url.

hard moth
#

hmm maybe its a browser thing

tired haven
hard moth
#

it works on firefox but not on edge

#

at least for me

opal terrace
#

I'm on firefox too

hard moth
#

huh, well for firefox the difference is clicking play creates a separate window, on edge the game is still on the page

#

will that make any difference

tired haven
#

Whatever the issues is, it doesn't seem to be a code issue

hard moth
#

different browser settings mabe neuroHUH

#

Super does the web version work on your end

tired haven
#

Works fine

hard moth
#

strange, mabe like browser permissions then

tired haven
#

Who knows

hard moth
#

until i figure the problem out i should prob add a warning that the leaderboard might not work on the web version NeuroSip

tired haven
#

Maybe

opal terrace
#

I may have an idea. We have a stupidly strict firewall setup that blocks every port by default. Maybe I'm hitting that.

tired haven
#

Possible, sounds likely at least

#

Probably doesn't like something unusual like port 8727

hard moth
#

doesn't explain why it doesn't work for my edge though neuroUhm

tired haven
#

Edge is just bad

hard moth
#

well, can't argue against that

tired haven
#

Firefox is the best browser

hard moth
opal terrace
#

not anymore, it should just be blue chromium nowadays

tired haven
#

And Firefox is the one browser I care about the support for

#

I have completely deleted Edge from my system

tired haven
#

Is this supposed to happen?

image.png
#

@opal terrace

opal terrace
#

Looks like someone visited /redirect with a wrong state/code. May have been me testing with some online proxies to see if it's my fault.

tired haven
#

Entirely possible I guess

#

You should have probably added a catch for that one though

#

Or something

#

Not sure

opal terrace
#

It didn't crash the server so it should be fine.

tired haven
#

Yeah, but this error just takes too much space in the console, so I'll add a more specific catch for it

elfin pike
#

is there any list of things that will be added to the game or currently been working on. I kinda want to suggest to add power up to mob drop, things like magnet (absord all exp on the map), freeze enemies, some kind full heal for both collab partner and ai, flamethrower style weapon that burst enemies, and mabe more but that's what I can come up for now. Any thought

tired haven
#

Sounds like interesting ideas, although the magnet with the current system sounds like a performance nightmare, even the old 4x range causes massive lag on my system

cerulean bear
#

A magnet effect does look cool, but even magic survival has a fps drop with it. What if it just removed all the exp from the map and gave it to you directly?

tired haven
#

That would definitely achieve the same thing with way less performance loss

cerulean bear
#

The game feels better now that the enemies don't cling to the sides. Parts do feel easier, while some harder

#

Picking up exp is a bit more of a pain to collect because it gets scattered thanks to Evils fireballs, but I dont need teleport to cross the fence late game. Also more space to weave between enemies

#

I didn't notice any bugs, but all the exp lying on the ground started giving me lag. The sheer number of pizzas probably didn't help though

hard moth
elfin pike
#

cool and glad to be helping on the testing too

tired haven
tired haven
#

I just got a decent idea for how optimizing lategame exp could be possible (this is inspired by a system in Minecraft): if there is a lot of exp in an area, instead of just letting them sit, combine them into one larger exp pickup, possibly with a different sprite to indicate it being stacked, Minecraft does that for exp orbs and some other games do something similar too, it's good for improving performance

#

Waking up and seeing this was crazy by the way, I have some catching up to do

image.png
cerulean bear
#

Yeah, that was a crazy run. Thing is, I could have gone longer, but I messed up and reacted too slowly

#

I plan to count up how many pizzas I had. It was kinda ridiculous. I probably had at least 30

tired haven
#

Crazy stuff

cerulean bear
#

But that definitely sounds helpful for reducing lag

#

At that point, 2 hits and I was dead. They were taking like 60-65% of my health, so I had to be real careful

tired haven
#

Yeah, the scaling goes crazy in the late game

cerulean bear
#

I'm gonna switch over to neuro and see how far I can take her, and I have ideas for that

#

Although I have an idea for a meme that requires evil, so I'll probably do that at some point too. The reroll should make it easier to do now

tired haven
#

I guess I'll have to keep trying to get long runs with Anny and Evil

tired haven
#

Oh cool, new lowest score record

image.png
cerulean bear
#

yeah, i got top and bottom 3, get wrecked

#

the bottom 3 are kinda in part my starting upgrades, part rng, and because the feathers are so pathetically bad, that the only silver lining is it's better to have them than to not

#

also my stinginess in not rerolling

#

side note, i was tempted to try and make my first score on the leaderboard 69

#

I have a lot of thoughts on the balance of various upgrades and a few other ideas, so i'm gonna type it in a google doc as there won't be enough space here.

I'm doing it before my pea sized memory makes me forget, and I want to go in depth with a good chunk of it at least.

It will mostly be ideas and suggestions that I have basically

tired haven
#

Ideas to fix the balance for Neuro and Vedal?

#

Currently one of the major issues as far as I know is their bad healing

cerulean bear
#

anny and evil arent safe either tbh. i'm not sparing any of them neurOMEGALUL

#

but yeah, mostly neuro and vedal

tired haven
#

Well, a balance overhaul like that would basically mean a new major version, at least to keep the leaderboard fair

#

The leaderboards is designed for easy version separation

cerulean bear
#

yeah, that would be the case

#

which is fine by me honestly. an alternative could potentially be to sprinkle a couple in the major versions currently planned, but i'm not trying to rush things

#

i'm just doing it now because i have the memory of an old man

cerulean bear
#

so I've started on the doc, and I probably won't finish it today, but here's a better explanation of what exactly I'm doing and why.

It will mostly be my thoughts on the current balance, and I plan to go through each upgrade in detail. I'm also putting my thoughts on a couple other things too.

I'm doing this because I'm actually really enjoying playing the game, and I've been having fun coming up with ideas to balance it out too. Enough fun that I'm starting to consider if it's something I want to work towards as a career.

I just wanted to say this before I drop a several page long document, as I know it will likely be a while before any serious balance changes start getting worked on. In short, I'm not trying to be a pest, but rather I'm probably getting a bit too absorbed in this lol

meager ember
#

You guys now have your own leaderboard on Neuro Chat Elo too!

(also please if someone can provide better badges for me neurOMEGALUL )

image.png
#

you're all too good at the game neuroMad

image.png
tired haven
cerulean bear
#

Looks good! Makes it easier to figure out everyone's top score, especially as more get added to the one in game. I kinda like the little badges tbh, but it took a bit for me to figure out what they meant.

Anyways, I'm gonna take a much needed break because I was thinking of this for a few hours before I even mentioned it here.

hard moth
cerulean bear
#

I think the nuke is bugged. the description says 12 damage, but it's doing 8

#

at least, thats what the damage indicator shows

#

also, is the rum base damage of 1? if so, i coulda sworn it did more than that before lol

cerulean bear
#

turns out, neuros sword is also 1 base damage. i seriously thought it was more neurOMEGALUL . I'm kinda glad i decided to play them again before doing their part of the doc

cerulean bear
#

Even the drones have 1 base damage. If neuro were to ever see this doc, she'll probably ban me in an instant neurOMEGALUL

hard moth
hard moth
#

so its really a base damage of 2

hard moth
cerulean bear
#

Welp, RytSty just gave me more to test with that vedal score. I thought i was done with vedal testing neurOMEGALUL

tired haven
#

By the way, do XP pickups and enemies get animated off screen? If so, that is a huge resource sink right there

tired haven
#

Also, I recommend exporting the game executable with a release configuration instead of debug, a debug build is usually less efficient

hard moth
hard moth
meager ember
#

evil + turtle

hard moth
#

thats crazy

#

Damm I kinda want to see their upgrades lvls

#

I should really implement that next update NeuroSip

#

(along with heavy balancing and achievements rework)

meager ember
#

(also i'm not salty i got bumped from #7 to #8 catdespair )

cerulean bear
# hard moth (along with heavy balancing and achievements rework)

I was just thinking about this like an hour ago, and maybe instead of heavy balancing overall, maybe it's better to focus more on Neuro than everyone at once.

Evil is definitely too strong in some aspects, and Anny is mostly well balanced if you forget portal exists.

Vedal is useable, but is outclassed by Anny in survivability and also in general. I did 1 run with Vedal this morning, and that 20k score was almost entirely due to Evil alone. Vedal did very little overall to help.

If I were to make a tier list for the characters as a whole, I'm not sure if the inuke is enough to save Neuro from F tier. I've been struggling to get a good grip on how good her upgrades are, mostly because of her swords being near impossible to use effectively and safely at the same time. But in general her upgrades tend to feel weak/detrimental

#

Tldr, Evil, Anny and Vedal are playable, but Neuro kinda feels like a boss that you can't kill and always follows you.

Or like mining with only creepers in Minecraft

hard moth
tired haven
#

Yeah, I can definitely agree that especially Neuro's swords are very impossible to play with that well because of how it forces you to aim behind while the enemies come from all sides and most other upgrades Neuro has are quite bad compared to everything the other characters do

tired haven
tired haven
cerulean bear
#

I think probably the easiest way to deal with the swords is to slow neuro down. She's quite a bit faster than Vedal, so he can't really outrun her.

If Neuro is brought down from 75 to 65 speed to tie with Vedal, I have a rework/buff in mind for Vedal that should help him create distance from neuro too.

Anny's portal should buy more time before neuro catches up too this way

tired haven
#

That would still be kinda bad compared to Evil, since with Evil you don't have to worry about distance to her

#

the thing with Neuro is that she really tends to get close to you and with max level swords, you're literally forced to aim backwards from where you're going, causing a lot of the issues

hard moth
#

NeuroSip hmmm

sullen lark
#

buh

hard moth
hard moth
tired haven
hard moth
#

hmm true no damage would be too powerful. Will think of some ideas

#

if anyone hads them also plz tell

tired haven
#

Yeah, Neuro in her current state seems like a nightmare to balance

#

The swords don't allow for ranged attacks with travel time, but having them do damage limits aiming too much

hard moth
#

Evil doesn't kill you as long as you don't get too close, but Neuro is actively out to kill you, seems accurate to lore neuroClueless

tired haven
#

The ability to aim in all directions is mandatory pretty much

tired haven
hard moth
#

my current best idea is swords to reduced but not 0 damage to collab partners

tired haven
#

Evil feels fairly decent in the balancing aspect though

#

That would still limit aiming too much, since you would still be losing HP, especially with Vedal

#

Since Vedal doesn't have good healing

hard moth
#

true...

tired haven
#

But even with Anny not being able to completely avoid damage while being able to aim everywhere would be an issue

#

Definitely a balance nightmare