programming

[olive sable]

oh

[amber fractal]

who is buying this

[opaque wharf]

Well someone apparently

[olive sable]

it looks absolutely terrible lmao

[amber fractal]

I'm nearing my alibaba ratelimit o7

[opaque wharf]

How

[amber fractal]

It is just that low

America moment

[olive sable]

lumineq displays seem to have the ultimate refreshrate but suffer from lower resolutions

[amber fractal]

what is suffering to you

[olive sable]

lemme see the exact details

[amber fractal]

elp

[olive sable]

ye same thing for me

[opaque wharf]

Do a funny and just curl it without verifying the cert

[sage crag]

pankokokoko

[olive sable]

Technology             Commercial Source  Max hz         Transparency
Transparent EL         Lumineq            1000Hz+        ~80%
Transparent MicroLED   Muxwave / Leyard   240Hz - 500Hz  ~90%

nice formatting

[amber fractal]

konii rate display

[sage crag]

its bad

[olive sable]

konii when will you become transparent and do 1800hz?

[amber fractal]

[olive sable]

then we can spin you at 900rpm

[olive sable]

i admit i worded that poorly

[sage crag]

please do not spin me at 900rpm

thats 15 rotations per second

[olive sable]

yep

[sage crag]

i will die

[olive sable]

we also need to OC you to 1800hz

[obsidian mantle]

Oh my god

[amber fractal]

I just answered this on my phone

[olive sable]

only a 90000% overclock

[amber fractal]

I saw it and knew I needed to post it

[sage crag]

the centrifugal forces will turn my brain into organised layers of various density fluids

[olive sable]

we dont need your brain

[sage crag]

i need it

[olive sable]

then leave your brain at home for a bit while we do this tech demo

[sage crag]

you are

stupid

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1421861060507602944/1425936142754123927/neuroCatModeOfOfnnfOOf.webp

[olive sable]

[amber fractal]

https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/advertising-equipment-transparent-lcd-display-15inch_1600470313852.html
look at the video demo for half a second

[olive sable]

at this point i feel like getting called stupid by konii is not actually an insult

[sage crag]

if i were trying to insult you it would be a lot more hurtful

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1072697081443131476/1459353564764835902/A5D6E55C-09FB-4941-B002-2F28164FCAC3.gif

[olive sable]

[olive sable]

well

you are

a tv

get rekt

[sage crag]

and a genius

and

amazing

and super cool

and the best ever

[olive sable]

this is probably the most konii has used words in the last 2 weeks

[amber fractal]

eww 8ms pixel response time

[sage crag]

wrrr

[sage crag]

https://tenor.com/view/borzoi-snoopa-lord-foog-dog-funny-gif-20125052

[olive sable]

konii is 2hz, thats like 500ms response times

[sage crag]

response time to a new image is different to image presentation rate

[amber fractal]

I'd be more concerned if you couldn't do so thanks

[olive sable]

true

[sage crag]

wrr

[olive sable]

9.1" Lumineq 640*400 Resolution, only $1200

[sage crag]

wrr

[amber fractal]

[sage crag]

response time is how fast the pixels change colour or something

[olive sable]

ye

[amber fractal]

you know, I'm starting to prefer the small ones

[sage crag]

you need the response time to be shorter than the refresh interval otherwise you get ghosting

[olive sable]

thats going in the quotes channel

[amber fractal]

[sage crag]

my response time is 170ms

i do not have ghosting

[olive sable]

had to take a screenshot, dont mind me

[amber fractal]

Can we just tile the 1 inch ones, I'm seriously thinking the larger ones are a scam compared to grabbing those in bulk.

[olive sable]

so uhm

technically yes

but in reality no

[amber fractal]

wiring is a whole nightmare

[olive sable]

the borders of the screens have dead zones

the pixels don't go all the way there

trimming them down has major risque

[amber fractal]

At best you get 4 layers of offset bois

[olive sable]

and even if you succeed, you need to route the cables

ye

[amber fractal]

that one is a fate worse than death even if you can mod the cables to be transparent

[olive sable]

idk why i spelled risque the french way

[amber fractal]

I wasn't going to question it

[olive sable]

TFEL displays require high-voltage pulses (~180V–200V) to light up
ah, i see

so we'd need to build a death hazard

[sage crag]

risqué is a word with a very different meaning in english

[olive sable]

i know

[sage crag]

dentge

[olive sable]

im just trilingual and halfbraincelled

[sage crag]

i think the latter is all that matters

[olive sable]

also its not my fault yall use that word for pervy stuff in english

[sage crag]

it is your fault to use the word though

[olive sable]

[sage crag]

wrr

[olive sable]

ok

idea

so

DLP projectors

1 bit DLP can do 32KHz

[amber fractal]

Back to projectors because this is not happening otherwise

[olive sable]

2 bit can do 8KHz
4 bit can do 3KHZ
6 bit 1.1KHZ

[amber fractal]

so we are stuck at 6 bit

[olive sable]

well, that or 4 bit

4 bit less colours but higher refreshdensity

[amber fractal]

I'd take higher color space over what amounts to 2 degrees

[olive sable]

6 bit is 64 colours per channel

[amber fractal]

wait,

[amber fractal]

Ideally we'd do 5 to have the legroom

but alignment exists

32 color is decent

[olive sable]

5 bit can do potentially 2.5KHZ from what i can find

[amber fractal]

That seems like the best compermise

What res would this be at

[olive sable]

to get that high refreshrate we need to get a DLP per colour channel

[amber fractal]

alignment

[olive sable]

my projector downstairs has that

its not too bad to align

you just put a cross of each colour, and then manually align each dlp.
mine is motorized

for our purposes well need to do something cheaper probably

[amber fractal]

I agree, until the fact of where this would be

[olive sable]

okay so

[opaque wharf]

Hmmm, 3 color laser with galvanic motor

[sage crag]

not a problem, just make a gpu

[olive sable]

if we use a DLP. its immediately not gonna be portable

[amber fractal]

do we have the abillity to even power it from the base?

either one or seperared

[olive sable]

if we're gonna do projector style, just have a slipring power cable

[amber fractal]

that feels like a forced move due to high voltage

[olive sable]

power suply can remain still

[fleet jungle]

why

[olive sable]

slipring will do 12V or whatever to the projector parts

[obsidian mantle]

i mean, they could have at least made it somewhat good looking
they just put normal layout in a transparent case

[opaque wharf]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mirror_galvanometer?wprov=sfla1

[obsidian mantle]

however its supposed to be cheap and backside will probably face the wall.. i guess its fine

[amber fractal]

I see the vision here

[opaque wharf]

Nah, we rotate the whole assembly. Have fun aligning the optics lmao

[olive sable]

from what i can find, DLP7000 XGA should support this.
the problem is that if we need one per channel, so 3 total....
and they're a grand total of... ||$1050|| per piece

[amber fractal]

that was for the transparent tv case

[obsidian mantle]

yesyes

[olive sable]

do we not need to rotate the projector????

cuz how else you gonna project on a rotating piece of acrylic?

[opaque wharf]

Rotate the viewer

[olive sable]

[opaque wharf]

https://tenor.com/view/the-universe-tim-and-eric-mind-blown-mind-blown-meme-mind-explosion-mind-explosion-meme-gif-18002878

[amber fractal]

[olive sable]

unless you use some type of mirror system?

[sage crag]

instead of rotating the screen

make a cylinder screen

and rotate the viewer

and put the viewer inside the screen

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1421697759383130223.webp?size=48&name=smogfrog&lossless=true

[olive sable]

actually

nah nevermind

actually

[opaque wharf]

I am too sleep deprived and tired to think this further. Lemme know the vision after I wake up

[olive sable]

we jsut need the light to come from a specific direction, not to start at a specific point in space

oh

but then we're back at HOE panels

damn you sony

[amber fractal]

Spin the mirror

I'm also eepy

[olive sable]

Spinning a mirrot has the same issues tho

[velvet vale]

embeded systems people, anyone have zephyr experience?

[opaque wharf]

Having an issue with it?

[velvet vale]

ive never used it but i need to teach it in like a few days, someone told me the workspace setup for STM is a little complicated?

[opaque wharf]

Depends on what your focus is I guess. If you are an engineer and just wanted to work, then just jump into their STM32CubeIDE. If you have a background in SE, then you'll know what a compiler is and how cross-compilation work. ST now provides an improved support for using 3rd-party tools like VSCode as your favorite editor, and using CMake for their build tools. There's also platformio (a vscode extension) if you regularly use different MCU

But if you need to use zephyr to teach it, then I suggest just use platformio or read the official zephyr docs

Platformio has the advantage of abstracting away the complexities but can be limiting when you need to do more advance task or cross referencing the official zephyr docs

[dull egret]

I am not sure I've ever heard of Zephyr, before now, but Reddit seems to have a number of people complaining about it being terrible and bloated

[opaque wharf]

Well, that is the price to pay for any abstraction. Zephyr is quite high in the abstraction level after all

Like, if you need to add a peripheral, you just need to add their descriptor

[sage crag]

wrr

[rigid snow]

wrr

[quaint vigil]

wrr

[rigid snow]

bime day 176 currently de85

[faint sandal]

:evilhands:

[sage crag]

85 ohisee

[rigid snow]

deee now

[obsidian mantle]

so i have a struct defined in one header file, and i want to use it in another header file
i included header into header but it stays undefined
is it normal in cpp?

is there a way to make it work

actually the VS doesnt see it undefined, it only appears undefined on build

oh nvm it does see it undefined too

[dull egret]

Oooo, that's interesting.

This Zephyr convo forced me to look up stuff I won't be able to start for some months (hopefully by Summer), but Emacs has a way to configure an Arduino ESP32.

Emacs sure does have everything

[hard raptor]

me when i add all 3 movements of moonlight sonata... it's more than 14 minutes long 🙁

[obsidian mantle]

can this happen because i use #pragma once in both headers and one of them is .h and another is .hpp?

[obsidian mantle]

when i define a copy of struct in same file it says redefinition 💀

i guess i have some random header connections now

[dull egret]

Says these things use some sorta bootloader for sketches, though...

I definitely gotta look stuff up... Thought I could just flash some C and Assembly onto Arduinos...

Zephyr is an RTOS
Heh... I thought it was a library, when I read it earlier...

Hmmm... I wanted to flash a bootable SectorLISP onto some ESP boards...

Or a custom ROM in ASM that has a built-in LISP interpreter...

Heh....

Well, I'll worry about that at a later point...

At least I know where I'd be going (somewhat), now, and what books NOT to buy...

[hard raptor]

section .text
    global _start
    
_start:
    mov eax,2 ;System call for forking
    int 0x80  ;Call kernel
    jmp _start

Seems like a good program (this is a joke, please don't ever use this)

[sage crag]

32 bit mode

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1277044182527246358.webp?size=48&name=minyanstare&lossless=true

[hard raptor]

i think the second movement is actually beautiful... why no one ever include this in their covers

[opaque wharf]

Can't wait for F00D day

[hard raptor]

https://github.com/Izaz-Ali/awesome-forkbomb
there is a whole github repo full of em

[sage crag]

section .text
  global _start

_start:
  mov rax, 57 ;fork
  syscall ;go my fork
  jmp _start ;go my fork go my fork go my fork

[opaque wharf]

Yeah, it is an RTOS which is why I said it is quite high up in the abstraction level

[rigid snow]

i just realized i never cleared my recycling bin since getting a new ssd which was almost 2 years ago

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1360837088379015204.webp?size=48&name=minyanlookup&lossless=true

[hard raptor]

also just noticed it going onto the 3rd movement at the end there

[dull egret]

I see. Yeah, that's not what I'd be looking for, for my own things.

So good unexpected heads up.

[rare bramble]

I just shift + del everything

[rigid snow]

but then i can't ctrl-z

[opaque wharf]

I like to live dangerously

[sage crag]

i always use

rm -rf

for file deletion

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1061113840852533339/1452612577145262183/3DNeuroCutenessAmbushWithBeautifulScenery.gif

[opaque wharf]

If you want something a bit lower level, there is embassy but I think rust ecosystem for embedded is not quite there yet

There is also https://modm.io

[sage crag]

can i have your uh please

[rigid snow]

va

[hard raptor]

may i call myself officially a classical composer now tho?

[opaque wharf]

Then the poor lad will be va

[rigid snow]

but you didn't compose this

[opaque wharf]

I actually recommend this one if you want some abstraction but still reasonabme

[hard raptor]

i kinda did

i didn't compose the original

but i still had to make certain instruments play different parts in a way that works

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1072697081443131476/1459353564764835902/A5D6E55C-09FB-4941-B002-2F28164FCAC3.gif

[hard raptor]

i did compose some originals tho, but this i arguably the biggest orchestral thing i did

[rigid snow]

is this on the master

[hard raptor]

mhm

[rigid snow]

cursed

[obsidian mantle]

but then i will only have va

[hard raptor]

cursed? or just smart usage of a thing that is not made for the way i am using it?

[rigid snow]

ye you're saturating

[opaque wharf]

You should ask one of konii's "r"

[rigid snow]

at least i think that's what you're doing

[opaque wharf]

So you can be a var

[obsidian mantle]

i was thinking wav

but var is cool too

[opaque wharf]

The probability of konii giving up one w is low since she only has 2

[hard raptor]

what it's actually doing.. at least as far as i could hear when i tried it out.. is it makes the attacks of the pianos a bit clearer

[opaque wharf]

Bur r? She got lots of r

[obsidian mantle]

i agree but i want your "w" or "r" in return

[dull egret]

Nice, that looks like a good place to start

[sage crag]

you can have wr if you also give me v

[hard raptor]

it's kinda a wierd way to use it...

[sage crag]

[hard raptor]

but i have wierd fx chains on all my instruments in this project

[obsidian mantle]

i dont need both

i only need 1

[sage crag]

in that case you can give me v and uh for just w

[obsidian mantle]

does anyone want "r" or "w"

[sage crag]

if you had w and r you could become war

[hard raptor]

imma record them on the piano group rq

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1458912973526663352.webp?size=48&animated=true&name=doc_20260108_074827_M&lossless=true

[hard raptor]

not a full play but just showing the chains

[obsidian mantle]

what is ''war''

how do you do this so its not on new line

[sage crag]

war

[obsidian mantle]

oh wait

wrong symbol again

war

war test war war

nice

who decided these 2 have to be different ` and '

oh wait

war

[rigid snow]

[obsidian mantle]

i get it

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1455273822625333375.webp?size=48&name=mlntcandy&lossless=true

[obsidian mantle]

no i dont want war

[sage crag]

[hard raptor]

only the 2 ungrouped instruments don't have any of this

the 2 ungrouped ones have a lot of compression tho

[hard raptor]

basically threw all the Arturia compressors on there + Pro-MB

also put a silly little widening chain on the Voice/Choir group

[rigid snow]

clearing space on my ssd and checking large files. so far, i for some reason have:

• the entirety of lrclib (42gb sqlite database)
• 15gb of board evals from lichess
• 30gb of different llm weights i tried literally once each
• 10gb of nvidia nsight snapshots i took just to play around with here
• average rust project (see screenshot)

21gb

[opaque wharf]

No node_modules?

[rigid snow]

those are mostly barely 1gb

[opaque wharf]

Pnpm?

[rigid snow]

ye and bun

idk where the caches are though

must be small

[hard raptor]

Interesting drive usage (it not listing my linux drive tho)

[opaque wharf]

Usually at %APPDATA% or wherever near minecraft folder is

[rigid snow]

pip is 15gb, uv is 14gb, npm is 5gb, pnpm is 2gb, bun is 2gb

bun is the only one in the home dir

oh right, cargo is also there, 2gb

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1061113840852533339/1452612577145262183/3DNeuroCutenessAmbushWithBeautifulScenery.gif

[rigid snow]

also gradle, 6gb

and nuget at 3

[hard raptor]

i forgor fortnite was still on my E Drive

now it has more space

[frozen hollow]

The pain of a 256GB MacBook

I want to delete even like the included backgrounds

[rigid snow]

i know it

i have one

[hard raptor]

how does this fit in 144 MB lmao

[frozen hollow]

I use grand perspective but it’s really hard to see what you can delete. Rn I can’t even upgrade my os

[rare bramble]

I like to use spacesniffer for looking what takes up space and where, highly recommend it or a tool like it that just gives you a visual graph of everything

[rigid snow]

ye the screenshot is from windirstat

i just always used that for ages now

[frozen hollow]

Every time I mentioned windirstat someone online told me I was stupid and should use something else with a name like speedtree

Then I forgot what the other software is called

[rigid snow]

i don't care, it works and is what i'm used to

[opaque wharf]

KDE Filelight (or was it fileflight?) my beloved

[sage crag]

its the former

[frozen hollow]

That’s what I always say

I can consistently remember the name windirstat

[sage crag]

if you go to the uk you'll find someone who pronounces window as windir

[frozen hollow]

I live in Scotland

Windy

[sage crag]

https://media.discordapp.net/stickers/1432138279679033354.png?size=160&name=YouShouldBeFrightened&lossless=true

[opaque wharf]

English is hard

[hard delta]

afternoon prog chat

do i give in to the temptation and play the funny game or do i install docker and mess around with silly things

[olive sable]

wrrrrrrr

chest pain getting better, so im not dying

its more likely to be a lung infection or something

[nocturne olive]

There I halved it

[frozen hollow]

I’m surprised I can play a flac in discord

[nocturne olive]

A FLAC is just a WAV but with compression enabled

If you can decode the compression real-time, you can play the file

[sage crag]

wrrr

[faint sandal]

well in case i've never seen a graphics card catch on fire before

now i have

[rough bloom]

[faint sandal]

i may have burned a 1070

magic smoke and all that

[rough bloom]

just randomly?

[faint sandal]

so my eGPU dock stopped working with my 1070

the main board won't turn on when the 1070 is plugged in + PCIE cables plugged in

i decided to remove the pcie cable power pins and

turned on the dgpu

and magic smoke came out

somehow the 1070 was being fried with just pcie slot power alone

[rough bloom]

yeah that's weird, I can only assume that the dock was damaged somehow and delivered improper voltages through the PCIe slot

RIP GTX 1070

[faint sandal]

i hope it isn't actually perma damanged because that 1070 was with me through uni

and it's an evga card

"hi guys can you guys still service this 1070 i got from u guys ages ago"

[rough bloom]

wdym not perma damaged
it let out the magic smoke, you're gonna have to replace some components at least

[faint sandal]

i mean what's the evga taipei hq up to these days

surely they have nothing better to do and still have some components lying around

[rough bloom]

[faint sandal]

good sign

[opaque wharf]

Dang, John nVidia really nuked John EVGA

[olive sable]

surely only some resisters got fried and the gpu is fine

[faint sandal]

i mean it probably was just some resisters that burned off

it was towards the edge of the board that caught fire

also the board now reeks of burned smell

[opaque wharf]

That looks like a power management IC

[olive sable]

if thats the only damage then thats okay probably

but since this was caused by something else being broken id still be skeptical

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1061113840852533339/1452612577145262183/3DNeuroCutenessAmbushWithBeautifulScenery.gif

[opaque wharf]

I want evil to be there with neuro

[sage crag]

[olive sable]

[haughty basin]

training looks good

[nocturne olive]

Doesn't look that good to me, to me that looks like it's maximally fitted already

What kinda model even is that?

[visual pawn]

looks to me like you didn't need so many epochs

[obsidian mantle]

ok i think i can make some kind of skyrim integration
idk about full autonomy (i have some ideas about how to make basic movement/fighting bot but it might not be good enough)
all menus seem to be doable (dialogue prototype controlled through tony is done)
doing barter menu rn and i think there is nothing that will block me from doing every menu in the game

at least that

[haughty basin]

@nocturne olive @visual pawn r/whoosh 🤣

[nocturne olive]

Wa

[obsidian mantle]

full autonomy would be so wicked

[haughty basin]

maybe someone gets it, I'll respond in an hour if nobody does 👀

[fleet jungle]

when I saw it I inwardly groaned

[olive sable]

i hate braess's paradox

sometimes i think i like physics, but then i get reminded that the physics i like is the small subset of baby physics

[sage crag]

well, its an obvious problem

[olive sable]

the solution just feels counter-intuative. which is why its a paradox i guess

[fleet jungle]

Just realized your profile pic is a close-up of a screen pixel matrix. Nice

[sage crag]

wrr

[fleet jungle]

wrr indeed

[olive sable]

what is the name of a square but it has been turned 180 degree on one side making it helical?

[sage crag]

if you let

M = the maximum throughput of a system,
T = the throughput of a system,

T = F(M), where 0 <= F(M) <= M

F(M) can only be directly proportional to M when F is a linear function of just M, and no other variables

if there are other factors involved, F(M) may not be a straight line

not that its a robust answer, but its easy to see why increasing the maximum throughput of a system may not increase the real throughput

especially if you are only considering a subsystem, which is the case with roads

[quick condor]

I think the highlight for me was Vedal's rant about discord api python libraries. At the time I was battling a similar issue and it was good to know I wasn't the only one annoyed

[olive sable]

konii im afraid putting it in math terms makes it less clear for me cuz im not math brained, im visual learner
my main take-away is parallel distributes while series makes it more pain

[nocturne olive]

I think it was Discord API Unity libraries

Because Neuro's frontend stuff is all Unity and most of Neuro is seeminly implemented in Unity

[sage crag]

you can think of it as T_c depending on T_p and T_n, nin addition to M_c

where T_c is the throughput of the current road section,
T_p is the previous road section,
T_n is the next road section,
and M_c is the maximum throughput of the current road section

again just a simplification me not given it much thought

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1422218876388642906.webp?size=48&name=MiniHmm&lossless=true

[rigid snow]

letters

[sage crag]

https://tenor.com/view/borzoi-snoopa-lord-foog-dog-funny-gif-20125052

[rigid snow]

subscript

smol

_leter

[sage crag]

ye

[olive sable]

ok now thats not math, thats abstract concepts

[sage crag]

no, it is definitely math

its just not formalised

[tender river]

math is famously not abstract at all

[olive sable]

unformalize it please

i need my math crude and rude

[sage crag]

its not formalised

[olive sable]

no

less words

[sage crag]

less words doesnt make it easier to understand

[olive sable]

uh

dumb it down

you know im of sub-average intelligence

[sage crag]

"the throughput of the current part of the road depends on the throughput of the previous and next parts of the road, in addition to the maximum throughput of the current road"

[rigid snow]

imagine D is nuts

[olive sable]

what?

[rigid snow]

[sage crag]

there are other variables too, but this is the simplest way to prove that the throughput isnt defined as a linear function of the maximum throughput, and hence an increase to the maximum throughput doesnt necessarily lead to an increase in the throughput

wrr

[tender river]

if throughput is always guaranteed to be at its max level then increasing maximum throughput increases real throughput
if any other factor can cause it to not be at its maximum then increasing max throughput may not increase real throughput

[sage crag]

good explanation

[olive sable]

its buffering

give it a second

[rigid snow]

#nerds

[stray dragon]

you fucker

[olive sable]

t explain it to me like im 5

[sage crag]

t

[stray dragon]

loss

the meme

[sage crag]

pattern recognition as expected of the letter t

[stray dragon]

oh my god it even fits the name of the meme

i hate it

[rigid snow]

why did you explain

not forever make fun of sam

[stray dragon]

sam wouldn't get it

he's too stupid

[visual pawn]

a lot of people don't know ctrl alt del

the gen alpha kids

...or zoomers frankly

[olive sable]

i never understood the loss meme

[sage crag]

sam would learn about it in 2 months and it would have been funny

[rigid snow]

it's pattern recongnition

like 67

[visual pawn]

it was a time where instead of tiktok we had webcomics

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1277044182527246358.webp?size=48&name=minyanstare&lossless=true

[stray dragon]

or maybe he never would

[olive sable]

i never understood 67

[sage crag]

what do you understand?

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1424073798692507813.webp?size=48&name=NeuroConfused&lossless=true

[visual pawn]

too young to understand loss, too old to understand 67

[olive sable]

a decent chunk of vulkan i suppose

opengl

the graphics pipeline

[sage crag]

i dont think the age is the problem with comprehension here

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1461025580651909212.webp?size=48&name=tehe&lossless=true

[rigid snow]

ctrl alt del is the least insane thing they don't know, try, idk, files? like file systems

[olive sable]

i was never realy exposed to loss the meme until like 2 years ago, and its jsut not funny

[visual pawn]

is loss much of a meme without knowing the context of why people memed on the webcomic?

[rigid snow]

yes

[visual pawn]

I guess it has a life of its own now

[sage crag]

the concept of a filesystem is alien to most users of computers

though the concept of a file is more familiar

[visual pawn]

ctrl alt del the webcomic lol

[rigid snow]

oh the fucking

[olive sable]

i know filesystems exist. i think i know the name of some.
how they work is beyond me tho

[rigid snow]

that's not what i said

[stray dragon]

i don't know the reason but i do know that ctrl alt del made an "animated series" which is absolutely terrible to watch

[rigid snow]

i mean the concept of files and folders

kids don't know

[olive sable]

even on a phone you have those tho

[stray dragon]

there is one funny moment in the whole series and it's just this

[sage crag]

structured file hierarchy

too complicated

[olive sable]

the fuckign galery app has folders

[rigid snow]

no reason to ever touch them

[visual pawn]

it's just from a time where having a webcomic where the premise is "hello fellow gamers" was enough to make you successful

[stray dragon]

yeah lines up

[sage crag]

its not like the bar has moved upwards

its just moved left

or right

its moving around on a 2d plane

[rigid snow]

[visual pawn]

into loss

[olive sable]

i jsut think 67, loss, and a bunch of jokes in that simialir trend are not funny when you're not involved in the group that made the original meme

[rigid snow]

727

[olive sable]

or maybe its my hyperautism

[visual pawn]

but yeah, the original meme was playing on the idea that this dumb gamer webcomic suddenly decided to do a drama about miscarriage

but I guess the joke now is just recognizing the meme

[olive sable]

that was a miscarriage?

[visual pawn]

that's what the loss was, yeah

[olive sable]

i thought the woman died

[sage crag]

the concept of a meme as a self-propagating piece of information

if you think about it, information is kinda like bacteria

https://media.discordapp.net/stickers/1432142118624825556.png?size=160&name=StareAtYouNeuro&lossless=true

[rigid snow]

what information attached to 67

[sage crag]

associated culture

[olive sable]

hand up emote, hand down emote

[stray dragon]

loss is funny once you learn to recognize it when it appears

[rigid snow]

if you dig deep enough you arrive at basketball

but that literally

has nothing to do with the meme's success

[sage crag]

some bacteria are beneficial, some are neutral, and some are harmful, and they can be transferred from person to person

[stray dragon]

someone posts a confusing image, other people are like "oh my god why", and then you sit there staring at it for a while looking for the hidden meaning, and it's just the stupid fucking loss pattern

[olive sable]

ok but memes dont make me violently ill for a week

[rigid snow]

the amongus crewmate thing too

pattern recognition

[sage crag]

the success of a meme strongly depends on the number of contexts it can be reused in without becoming more stale

when it comes to a number, maybe its so stale to begin with that it just persists

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1277044182527246358.webp?size=48&name=minyanstare&lossless=true

[rigid snow]

human like pattern recognition it that simple

[sage crag]

though pattern recognition memes are a bit different

[olive sable]

the among us meme thing was funny for a week or so, but then liek the internet does best they kept doing it so it stopped being funny

[sage crag]

its a classic joke setup right?

to break an expected pattern is the basis of "joke" humour

[olive sable]

kilroy isnt funny but i apreciate it

[visual pawn]

kilroy is historical

[olive sable]

it at least has some actual value

[sage crag]

in the case of pattern recognition memes, the subversion comes from the existence of a pattern in a place where it is nonsensical

most human like this juxtaposition

[olive sable]

i miss when jokes had humour

[sage crag]

naturally pleasing

[visual pawn]

but I mean, it also has the appeal of inside jokes

signaling to people that you're part of the same group

[sage crag]

mhm

[sage crag]

what's white and black and red all-over?

[stray dragon]

it also subverts your expectations of what the hidden meaning is once you realize that there's a reason the image was posted

gets your hopes up, and then it's just loss

[olive sable]

mickey mouse?

[sage crag]

a penguin in a blender

[olive sable]

wow

poor penguin

[stray dragon]

wasn't it "what's black and white and read all over" with the answer being "newspaper"

[sage crag]

yes

[stray dragon]

oh wait it only makes sense if you hear the question instead of see it

[sage crag]

"read" sounds like "red", so the joke its its own subversion

[olive sable]

oh, the joke has lore of being based on a different joke

[sage crag]

yes

[stray dragon]

i see

[sage crag]

a popular answer is also "a badger in a blender"

[tender river]

in case of cars its not as simple as throughput though
by building car infrastructure, you encourage more people to use cars
cars aren't a very efficient method of transportation, so new lanes can fill up quickly when people learn about them, resulting in the same problems there were before
but it's not just that, by building bigger roads you don't just encourage car travel, you discourage other modes of transportation, you push people to use cars while its possible that they could normally use a bus or a bike or just walk, or maybe they choose to drive to a big store across the city instead of walking to the nearby grocery store

[olive sable]

my answer wasn't too bad, altho mickey mouse also has yellow shoes

[rigid snow]

[sage crag]

its still a throughput problem, but its complicated.

you can try and model with supersources and supersinks but it neglects locality

wrr

makes me think of cellular automata

[rigid snow]

we should gzip people and send them via email

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1461026561871577132.webp?size=48&name=EmiAlso&lossless=true

[rigid snow]

way more efficient than cars

[sage crag]

ye anyway, simple model that shows the nonlinearity of the throughput of roads just require network flow problem

more accurate model useful if trying to demonstrate why it occurs rather than that it does occur

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1340027364540940288.webp?size=48&name=evilThink&lossless=true

<- @tender river

[tender river]

[visual pawn]

best I can do for you is a rar

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1461026561871577132.webp?size=48&name=EmiAlso&lossless=true

i skimmed the video

it might only speak once

in the 6 hours

[quick condor]

Discord api libraries in general aren't great for voice. Especially since discord expects you to handle all of the malformed responses (if it even decides to send anything) for me it translated to a silent web socket drop but for him it seems to be a memory leak

[nocturne olive]

Hem

[nocturne olive]

The memory leak has nothing to do with Discord as far as I'm aware

[sage crag]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFTPJxR6gFE
@tender river read the description

wrr

[tender river]

[quick condor]

He specifically said it only happens with discord. A different system is used for karaoke and it doesn't have the problem

[tender river]

sloptuber

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/emojis/1421939230250369034.webp?size=48&name=AtorinWow&lossless=true

marumaru

○○

thank you mozc

[tender river]

i remember this channel though

not sure from where

[faint sandal]

apparently my original ps4 also broke

[tender river]

arg thread or here maybe

[faint sandal]

nothing feels like working today it seems

my ps4 pro works at least

but it's not jailbroken and it's 1am and therefore I can't do the bd-jb

was gonna try shadps4

[sage crag]

If the current nightly build doesn't work, please wait 24 hours for a new build to occur. If that build still doesn't work, contact Tom (pytom at bishoujo.us, or @renpytom on Twitter/X) to find out what's wrong.

that website is very classic looking

last edited as early as 2005

nevermind, 2009

i wonder why they still use that site since they use github and have a dedicated domain at renpy.org

apparently slay the princess was made with renpy

huh

and ddlc

[tender river]

what do you even mean by "that site"

[tender river]

renpy one of the most popular vn engines

[faint sandal]

why do all the renpy games look like that

their menu systems all look the same and feel clunky as hell

[tender river]

speaking of vns

[sage crag]

virtual nachines

[nocturne olive]

Virtual Neuros

[visual pawn]

I think it's a template or default, at least I don't remember having to actually construct menus and saving/loading last I played with ren'py

[rigid snow]

renpy one of the most popular vn engines

ftfy

[visual pawn]

but also why the saving/loading doesn't always make sense with the game

[tender river]

true

i dont know any other ones

[rigid snow]

me neither

[tender river]

they're usually stuff like addons for existing game engines

[visual pawn]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_visual_novel_engines

they apparently exist

https://tyranobuilder.com/

hiyori jumpscare

[tender river]

oh i remember nscripter

[rigid snow]

3d character live2d

[tender river]

ert

[nocturne olive]

Live2D is apparently 3D now

[rigid snow]

live4d

[haughty basin]

is this loss or loss

[vestal prism]

hiyori my beloved

[olive sable]

i dont understand why the blender presets for rendering animations ar elike this

at least you can change them easily

but why use cpu as compositor?

why not have persistent data on gpu instead of sending all the models each frmae by default?

the options are there

[nocturne olive]

Maybe they don't want to write a ton of different GPU kernels

[olive sable]

its not the kernels

those are jsut blender setting you can turn on if you want

there's no reason to have them off by default

[visual pawn]

lossy

[steel mesa]

hey guys I made my first cat6e cable, how is it?

[olive sable]

Im no expert but its probably fine

[quick condor]

You don't want me answering

[nocturne olive]

Looks plug-innable to me

[olive sable]

Apparently iys cuz weaker systems will run out of vram that way

[steel mesa]

Hell yeah! My computer now has lightning in it after I plugged it in! Although it's too strong for the computer, it started burning because of the speed of light

Sorry for the shit jokes I'm doing 200 5m cables

[quick condor]

It looks like it isn't crimped but the green and white brown are swapped. The outer insulation should be inside the connector so that it is clamped in place. Wires aren't positioned ideally for a deep fit and seem to be angled

[olive sable]

Seems like old compositor was cpu bound anyways, and it was bad on gpu

They just didnt change the default after updating the compositor in 4.2

[tender river]

do you have a cable tester?

[sage crag]

cable tester called

router and pc

[tender river]

i recommend one because a cable can still be usable if its not crimped properly

it will just have lower bandwidth

[sage crag]

wrr

[tender river]

wrrrr

[sage crag]

ye

wrrrr wrr

that me

[olive sable]

True

It stillworks even on only 2 cables

We neber bothered testing our cables, probably should have

[quick condor]

Rate this cable

[steel mesa]

naw i go based on trust

[olive sable]

0/75

[sage crag]

what constitutes the 75 points

[nocturne olive]

cable/2^16

[rigid snow]

16

[opaque sigil]

[rigid snow]

the cursed thing here is

[haughty basin]

it reminded me of this

[rigid snow]

cable is set to "cable" which becomes NaN in math expressions

[nocturne olive]

Em

[nocturne olive]

Hem

[rigid snow]

but xor converts that to int and ints can't be NaN so it's just zero

and 0^x=x

obviously

[nocturne olive]

Hem??

[rigid snow]

js moment

[nocturne olive]

JS is weird and stupid

[olive sable]

I felt like it

Vibes based

[rigid snow]

weird world of w h a t

[sage crag]

what problem

wayland protocol

protocol go wherever it want to

[rigid snow]

people will do anything just for the sake of it

too much free will

[nocturne olive]

WayTooLand

[cursive halo]

looks like a whip to sub the interns..

[olive sable]

you can never out way the land

[sage crag]

land is pretty heavy

[olive sable]

@amber fractal i have an idea

this gif does not look good at all

[amber fractal]

[olive sable]

projector in the bottom, motor wherever you can fit it, if need be iin the top

[azure lynx]

um.. if it was that easy, everyone would already sell one

[olive sable]

um.. im innovating over here

[amber fractal]

yeah, we've been debating for hours on approaches

[azure lynx]

curious what size this is intended to me.

[olive sable]

well, i made it 3m tall in blender, but ideally it will fit on a desk

[azure lynx]

"fit on a desk" like a cup or "fit on a desk like a 3d printer"?

[olive sable]

somewhere inbetween

like the size of a tablet

[amber fractal]

Now that my brain is a bit more awake, you do realize how much of a pain encoding video for that is going to be.

[azure lynx]

what is the projector shining on? what all is going to need to move? and how fast?

[olive sable]

it shoudl be fine honestly. i know what im doing

probably

[azure lynx]

"trust me, I know what I'm doing." is a punchline.

[amber fractal]

I'm surprised I'm invited at all because I know almost nothing on this space.

[olive sable]

its not liek i know much more tbh.
i know how to get 3D models into video output cuz of my opengl and vulkan experience

the screen part is what i need to figure out

[amber fractal]

Anyways, the previous convo had 1800rpm, display tech only moving if possible as part of a second mainboard. And Sam needs to say what the material is this time.

[olive sable]

1800hz, of the display

not rpm

[amber fractal]

I was close, wrong measurement

[olive sable]

the idea for this is that all the electronics stay still, the projector just projects upwards through a lens that makes it go straight up.
and the only rotating thing is an acrylic helix

[amber fractal]

How many projectors are you thinking?

[olive sable]

well

1

[sage crag]

rolling shutter would make recording it awful

[olive sable]

recording is the least of my worries here

[azure lynx]

you should be able to simulate that with a projection mapping in blender so you can see what it would look like.

[olive sable]

recording is also bad for crts

and every single other display with the refreshrate matching the camera speed

[azure lynx]

any reason you'd want to use a helix of acrylic instead of a flat mirror at an angle?

[olive sable]

cuz projector at the bottom

if its flat we have 99% of the light going nowhere, and 1% hitting the entire acrylic piece

[azure lynx]

are you intending to rear project onto the acrylic?

[olive sable]

from bottom

to top

up

vertical

[azure lynx]

you still will have 99% of light going nowhere, just more going straight up and not hittng anything

[olive sable]

bruh

lemme sketch this out for you

[azure lynx]

why not a flat sheet of acrylic instead of a helix?

[olive sable]

oh my days

[azure lynx]

your problem isn't going to be too much light

[olive sable]

thats not the thing its solving

give me a sec here

impatient

[azure lynx]

(by which i mean: it's going to be dim with a thin strip target being illuminated)

[amber fractal]

The problem here is figuring out how to get an origin of light from a point in 3d space.

[olive sable]

projector

up

acrylic

reflects

if its flat

then it doesnt work

cuz the light goes up

anf it being flat

would mean

the light goes past

[azure lynx]

how much of a twist is there supposed to be on the helix?

[olive sable]

180 degress

so full circle lookign from the top

full coverage

but only once, no overhangs

[haughty basin]

someone coded this exactly because they had time travellers using their library before, so they added an extra check
makes sense to me

[azure lynx]

what problem is twisting it solving?

[olive sable]

bruh

you see

[azure lynx]

it's covering 1/2 of the surface

[olive sable]

a projector is projecting a 2D image

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1061113840852533339/1452612577145262183/3DNeuroCutenessAmbushWithBeautifulScenery.gif

dont you think youre explaining badly

[olive sable]

then you can do it

jeez

[azure lynx]

the surface at the bottom when you twist it is 1/2 covering the surface above it

[sage crag]

if you say the same thing 3 times its not going to cause a magical understanding

wrr

[olive sable]

if you rotate a plane among the centre 180 degrees, both sides will cover half

[azure lynx]

versus not covering any with a tilted ellipse

[olive sable]

2 halfes make a full

[rigid snow]

what are we doing, holograms again?

[azure lynx]

make a model and do a projection mapping from a light source where the projector will be.

[rigid snow]

[amber fractal]

At least attempting to

[olive sable]

behold

a circle

but deep

[visual pawn]

what exactly is the goal here? do you want to project a 3D model using a projector or do you want a 2D image visible from any angle or

[olive sable]

3D model thing ye

[amber fractal]

3d model from a projector ye

[sage crag]

i also dont see a reason to use a helix over a tilted elipse

[amber fractal]

This is the part where we start to get creative because we burned through all of the tradional options yesterday

[visual pawn]

and do you want this to actually work like a hologram or just a pepper's ghost thing?

[sage crag]

in principle all you need is a full range of height

[azure lynx]

they want a motor as well

[sage crag]

if its rotating

[visual pawn]

because I'm pretty sure without viewpoint tracking you won't get a true hologram out of a projector

[olive sable]

tilted eclipe could technically work, but you still need to attach it to the pivot point somewhere, and helix is jsut more convenient for that

it also looks cooler

[sage crag]

you can, you just have to trick the eye

[azure lynx]

you can do it for a narrow range of view angles.

[olive sable]

thew whole point is to not use eye tracking by making the light actually look like its coming from the correct point in space

[azure lynx]

but it probably won't work for a 4'6" as well as 6'6" person at the same time

[olive sable]

which is why we're using aprojector

[visual pawn]

but this is supposed to be 360 from above and below and etc.?

[olive sable]

it will

[sage crag]

you just have to use the height of the point in 3d as a time offset

[olive sable]

yes

[sage crag]

and make it spin fast enough

[olive sable]

900rpm ye

1800hz projector

[sick owl]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fqOs2chL3NQ

I didn't realise ps4 emulation had gotten this good goddamn

[amber fractal]

I think we are choosing not to do that, just let the jar have a lid and base

which does help a bit

[olive sable]

if we manage to put the motor in the bottom next to the projecotr, top could work

[visual pawn]

ok so you want a point cloud of sorts and for the projector to sync so that it displays the right point whenever the helix intsersects with said point?

[olive sable]

bottom is where projector goess o thats a nop

[olive sable]

ye

basicly that

[azure lynx]

i think good luck with that. i've had experience with POV displays on things rotating at high speeds before. the tricky stuff going to be the engineering, not the design.

[sick owl]

It feels like they created the GNM to Vulkan shader recompiler and then overnight Shad went from a strong but slow start to a viable emulator

[olive sable]

i think this design is a lot more financially viable than HOE panels, transparent OLED, microLED, or lumineq

[amber fractal]

-# How this started this time is that computable wanted to build one of these for

[opaque sigil]

bloodborne is a bit of an outlier tbf

[visual pawn]

you want a projector both above and below? or just one side?

[azure lynx]

before declaring victory, see why it's not already commercially available. there is likely some engineering issue like it not being bright enough unless you're in the dark or noise.

[olive sable]

the most pricey part is going to be the projector,a nd a motor with precise enough speed to matcht he projecotr speeed

[visual pawn]

yeah, I suspect the issue is going to be how it, well, looks

[olive sable]

in terms of light its going to suffer ye

[sage crag]

also safety

900rpm helix

[olive sable]

its going to have a lot better resolution thant the LED ones tho

[sick owl]

Its an especially good example but the games list is already pretty crazy

https://shadps4.net/compatibility/

[sage crag]

finger slicer if broken

[olive sable]

i dont care about safety tho

[sick owl]

Filter by playable and you can see there's some impressive compatibility now

[opaque sigil]

i should replay bloodborne on pc

[visual pawn]

this would be the non-projector version I guess

https://youtu.be/cA4L49habEY?t=84

[sage crag]

if you can, a lazer projector would probably be better than a standard one

[amber fractal]

I second that choice

[sage crag]

brighter

[sick owl]

Like here's Yakuza 0 (not my system but its from the compatibility list examples)

[azure lynx]

LED ones have the advantage of being practical and bright. extra resolution you could potentially get with parallel strips of LEDs offset slightly vertically and then the code just illuminates them slightly later when they rotate around vs the main strip.

still low res vs projection though

[visual pawn]

unless it's a flexible display or something lol

[amber fractal]

It isn't like we are attempting to create a product.

[sage crag]

cant you rotate a piece of acrylic into shards

[sage crag]

like, if the rotation is at a resonant frequency

[amber fractal]

[azure lynx]

what is the aesthetic you want? coz that determines how you can do it

[sage crag]

of a floor or table that its placed on

it could destroy itself

lol

[olive sable]

well, it would have to be a industrial laser cuz commercial ones dont do 1800hz

[amber fractal]

Not 3k for the display tech alone is the aesthic

[azure lynx]

acrylic also likes breaking when it touches stuff at high speed. consider alternatives like polycarbonate.

[sage crag]

consider alternative like hologram from star wars

get it imported from

[olive sable]

there will be an accrylic cylinder around the spinning part, should be fine

[visual pawn]

well it actually come to being cheaper if you're requiring a 1800 hz projector?

[sage crag]

space

[amber fractal]

boi the transparent screens are so expensive to go large

[olive sable]

where do i buy space holograms?

[sage crag]

space

[visual pawn]

the plastic itself can explode from the spinning

[sage crag]

ye

[visual pawn]

without being touched

[abstract flint]

Hey look

[visual pawn]

like such: https://youtu.be/0yNAbHKF8pY

[sage crag]

i think the slow mo guys did a video on spinning a cd

oh theres one

lol

[abstract flint]

We can make neuro have a much longer context window with this

Means more memory for neuro

[olive sable]

but if we go monochrome star wars route, those projectors do actually exist at these refreshrates commercially, there's a 1440hz one https://vpixx.com/products/propixx/

[amber fractal]

Second time I've seen this paper talked about here, still have no clue what the benifits of it are

[abstract flint]

https://youtu.be/huszaaJPjU8?si=T4c4n8FJcDzfe597

explainer

[visual pawn]

actually even if it doesn't explode

[visual pawn]

https://youtu.be/zs7x1Hu29Wc?t=152

spinning it can cause it to warp

[azure lynx]

what will be the point of the projector? why do you want it? what is it for? who will be looking at it? is it for "everyday" use or just a toy to show off when you get a visitor? is it for 1 person at a time or multiple?

[olive sable]

the point is to be cool and awsome

[azure lynx]

for whom?

[olive sable]

and the budget is roughly 3K

for me

i am the guy

[amber fractal]

@olive sable are we sure this is even cheaper than the other things?

[sage crag]

wrr

[abstract flint]

Effectively what it would mean is that Neuro would be able to recall every conversation she’s had

[olive sable]

i didnt check the price of that specific model, but having a stationary projector will be cheaper than a spinning one

[abstract flint]

Best part is it doesn’t require changing neuro’s model

[sage crag]

ウルルルル

[azure lynx]

where did you get that from? the abstract doesn't mention "infinite memory"

[sage crag]

ブルブルブルブル

[sick owl]

english only mods pls fix

[amber fractal]

It could as well also be 5k or something and a transparent lcd would be bettee

[olive sable]

probably only me will be looking at it, but the goal of the design is to make it viewable form all angles at the same time.
eye tracking based ones are boring and sad and an insult to my interest in sci-fi tech

[sage crag]

me speaking english

[visual pawn]

apparently it's $1.3k according to a random mailing list

from 6 years ago

[olive sable]

[frozen hollow]

Buruburuburu

[olive sable]

nice

[visual pawn]

oh, well this is $1.3k at least: http://lab-perception.org/dlp4710/

[sick owl]

buhbuhbuhbuh

[olive sable]

1.3K per colour

[visual pawn]

http://visionscience.com/pipermail/visionlist_visionscience.com/2020/004268.html

[real sierra]

[olive sable]

it seems like only texas instruments makes DLP chips at these refresh-rates

thats interesting

[sick owl]

That's not English ↓

[sage crag]

白ロロロ shirororo

[azure lynx]

10 million tokens isn't infinite.

[sage crag]

[real sierra]

[sage crag]

[abstract flint]

They tested the context upto 2^18th tokens

[real sierra]

I keep avoiding making an attacking system in fumoquest

[sage crag]

[opaque sigil]

isn't that like 250k

[real sierra]

every time I try to work on it, I find a side quest and spend all day on it

[sage crag]

do it later (later)

[amber fractal]

yeah it is

[sage crag]

262k

[real sierra]

it just relies on so many systems

[azure lynx]

2^18 = 65536 * 4 so 256k

[opaque sigil]

close enough

so not much at all

[real sierra]

damage from an attack depends on equipment and skills so I needed to make the UI for both of those

[azure lynx]

2^18 is the size of Gemma 3's context window

2^17

[sage crag]

the claim is also about performance compared to llms at high context windows

not just the possible context window length

not that i care

[opaque sigil]

guess that makes more sense

[abstract flint]

To be fair i’m still reading it but I think it seems that it proforms well over 10million tokens

[sage crag]

performance as in quality of response

[amber fractal]

neuro is very much not running at that anyways, the L word of all of that processing.

[real sierra]

I have higher performance after eating yummy food

[abstract flint]

Its true

[sage crag]

https://tenor.com/view/bunny-rabbit-pats-pet-bunny-pats-gif-19861222

[sage crag]

it did say it was potentially cheaper to run than llms (with high context windows), so maybe if it takes off

[amber fractal]

I can see that for not regenerating cache

[abstract flint]

The most important take away is better recall over long long contexts

[sage crag]

increasing context window to infinity wouldnt solve fundamental llm problem of hallucination and blatant incorrectness anyway

[azure lynx]

what is the trade off? if there's not trade off, what's the trick?

[amber fractal]

just depends on by how much, and also figuring out the game stuff with actions.

[sage crag]

im sure it would benefit neuro though