programming

[olive sable]

[tender river]

me find wait

[sage crag]

ball thing where wheel in ball and you spin ball and wheel rotate

[olive sable]

Sorry i lost the plot at ball

[tender river]

oo called gyro ball

[olive sable]

What in the hell is that?

[sage crag]

never see before in life

[rough bloom]

ye never seen before

[sage crag]

wrr

[tender river]

me cant do not try that hard tho

[sage crag]

[olive sable]

I feel like thats not even motor control, thats just strength

[sage crag]

gyroscope not motor control

[silent cloak]

Balls

[sage crag]

sam not know gyroscope self stabilise

[olive sable]

Anyone with hands and a working motor control center can turn their hand

[sage crag]

me want to spend money give idea

small cost

NOT titanium cube

[olive sable]

Unless the nerve doesnt work i guess

[silent cloak]

Working hands

[olive sable]

The goal is to turn it while it stabilzes tho

So its mostly strength based

[sage crag]

sam make confident statements about thing he never try

this because sam idiot

[silent cloak]

Professional rage bait

[sage crag]

that me job

[olive sable]

Its muscle training

[rough bloom]

apparently it's both?
need control but also improves wrist strength

[sage crag]

sam not try it lalalalala

[silent cloak]

https://tenor.com/view/jarvis-ragebait-this-guy-iron-man-tony-stark-gif-3966857531535969686

[severe path]

VSCode sucks

[olive sable]

Booooo

[severe path]

[olive sable]

Get out

[silent cloak]

Truth nuke

[sage crag]

wrrr

[severe path]

Ahem....

Python and Rust are the worst languages ever created by man.

Ok, I'll stop now.

[trim valve]

[olive sable]

[sage crag]

[silent cloak]

The best language is Java

Everyone else is wrong and vibecodes

[trim valve]

best language vb.net

[sage crag]

it because llm die every time it write java

[rough bloom]

just VB
no .NET

[silent cloak]

The only language ive ever forgotten how to use

[severe path]

Everyone should start using VB for their AI stuff. Their productivity would go up by 1000x

[silent cloak]

True

[severe path]

And they should create nice fancy GUIs, too

[olive sable]

Scratch still beats all those languages

[silent cloak]

.vbs is better than .sh

[sage crag]

me go sleep and die now

[olive sable]

cya

dont die, we still need internet 2 to exist eventually

[clear sedge]

python i agree with, rust is.. simply controversial at worst

[rough bloom]

revive later

[olive sable]

wrong

python has its uses

quick and dirty language

[clear sedge]

dirty

filthy

language

[sage crag]

nrrrr maybe

koo

[clear sedge]

i hope python dies a slow and painful death

[olive sable]

why are all pokemon larger than the pokeball?
why are there no small pokemon?

[severe path]

If I were to be serious...

Rust crates do encourage dependency on software that is poorly understood. This may lead to a problem in the future, where legacy code becomes so poorly understood, that the Rust Programming Language collapses under its own weight, therefore causing the chain reaction which will eventually crumble our entire society.

[silent cloak]

Javascript be like

[sage crag]

3 awoo a day keep esbuild away

[olive sable]

wth is an awoo?

[rough bloom]

<-

[silent cloak]

The sound sound a wolf makes

[clear sedge]

do you know what wolves are

[silent cloak]

https://tenor.com/view/the-alpha-is-typing-sigma-alpha-wolf-gif-10143133280856345138

[olive sable]

i didnt know we were talking about wolves for some reason

yall furries ngl

[silent cloak]

I dont use rust

[sage crag]

wolves are a type of bacteria that is found on apples

[clear sedge]

python:
javascript:
typescript:
java:
pretty much most languages with popular package managers and metaprogramming abilities:

[olive sable]

reject code, embrace scratch

[clear sedge]

reject computers, embrace sticks and stones

[olive sable]

konii fact of the day i guess

[sage crag]

sam drop in arctic sea

[silent cloak]

Until they break your bones...

[olive sable]

which artic?

oh

[clear sedge]

replace your bones with sticks and stones

[olive sable]

artic is north

[sage crag]

sticks and stones may break your bones but computer falling on your head will also hurt a lot

[olive sable]

i forget its artic and antartic
for some reason im thinking antartic and proartic

[sage crag]

anterior posterior

[clear sedge]

isn'ti t arctic and antarctic

[sage crag]

[silent cloak]

Its the place with all the ice

Obviously

[sage crag]

nrrr

me keep

14% of ice

[clear sedge]

just call it iceland north and iceland south atp

[sage crag]

[olive sable]

ice is a rock

[rigid snow]

[sage crag]

some ice is a mineral, some ice isnt

[silent cloak]

Truth supermassive blackhole

[olive sable]

snow is only 1 crystal

[sage crag]

depend on the pressure and conditions which it form in

[olive sable]

snow is not rock

ice is rock

[severe path]

I would say that before, the dependency problem was only seriously bad with high level languages. With C, it is harder to link libraries with your specific use case, for example.

Rust is a low-level programming language, where it is extremely easy to check in a bunch of libraries.

I do actually believe this will be a rather serious problem in the future, although the ramifications can be debated.

[sage crag]

rust low level

[rough bloom]

[sage crag]

what if we run out of dependencies

because

dependency farmer

stop farming

go on strike

[olive sable]

konii is hogging al the dependencies with her 2.8e17 addons

[silent cloak]

Node_modules

[sage crag]

me rich in dependencies none fulfilled though

wrr

[olive sable]

thats sad

[sage crag]

it joke

[rough bloom]

impossible
dependency farmer replaced with AI

[trim valve]

im kinda confused, are you saying its a bad thing that its easier to use libraries?

[olive sable]

sure

[rough bloom]

unlimited left-pad

[sage crag]

me have water and bed happee

[olive sable]

[sage crag]

dependency farmer replaced with machine

[severe path]

In order to depend on a dependency, a dependency will be required, which will require a dependency to grab another dependency to issue that dependency.

[sage crag]

bootstrap is not a paradox in programming

it just thing you do

[silent cloak]

Everytime u use a dependency, weights should be added to ur hands

So the more u use the heavier they become

[sage crag]

ye they are its called oxidation

[severe path]

Yes... Although it isn't obvious how at first.

[sage crag]

it just add weight slower than your skin flake off

[tender river]

random ideas
yubikey improve konii opsec
rgb lamp with tasmota fun controlling tho mine quickly broke because of a leaky capacitor
kendama me have one
many other random options like nice tea or bath bombs or whatever 🤔
me not suggest anything hobby related or hair/skincare related since you're much better equipped to give yourself advice on that
oo another one mug mug (custom print)

[sage crag]

list

[trim valve]

yubikey expensive 😔

[tender river]

ye clone exist

[sage crag]

yubikey waste of time already have passwords on usb

rgb lamp me have rgb RAM dont need

[severe path]

Its sort of like when someone farms for you, and then you forget how to farm by yourself, and then that farmer dies.

[tender river]

yubikey can use passwordless decrypt

[silent cloak]

Blood authentication

[sage crag]

mug mug

[clear sedge]

rust has expansive metaprogramming in the form of its macros, you can literally generate more rust with rust in a single compilation in a more advanced way than you can with c
i would call rust mid-level at best

that said, most rust programmers know rust in and out because they're borderline obsessed with it, i don't think it's that big of an issue in that regard.. it's like saying arch users don't understand their system

[sage crag]

easily faked

[tender river]

me use as alarm clock lamp turn bright -> easy to wake up

not need if sleep schedule good

[sage crag]

me not need alarm wake up same time every day even if i sleep late

[silent cloak]

I own 2 of the world's loudest alarm clocks

[olive sable]

i feel like blood authentication is jsut giving robbers more reason to "dispose" of you

[silent cloak]

The sonic boom ones

[sage crag]

rust is a high level programming language

[clear sedge]

https://tenor.com/view/correct-power-chainsaw-man-csm-agree-gif-2034489833296620644

[silent cloak]

Isomorphic authentication by using a brain scan

🔥

[sage crag]

easy fake me just cut off your head

[tender river]

rust extremely easy to check libraries

[sage crag]

cargo tree

[silent cloak]

U would have to be fast

[tender river]

rust projects

famously use few dependencies

one or two

[sage crag]

syn isnt dependency it part of stdlib

[silent cloak]

[sage crag]

reqwest 100 dependencies

lock to tokio

[clear sedge]

every time i've compiled a rust project i've been stuck on the dependency resolution for ages

[sage crag]

tokio 2 dependencies because their crate id a monolith

[clear sedge]

it's borderline comparable to java

[rare bramble]

having easy access to libraries and being able to choose not to use them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it being basically impossible to rely on lots of libraries because you are the package management

[severe path]

Or just use rust core, with a bunch of asm! macros

[sage crag]

pointless

[severe path]

It really gives you an idea of the inner workings of the language

[sage crag]

no it doesnt

ignore language use asm

not give you any insight

[tender river]

me think reason go js rust use so many dependencies language issue make hard to do thing have to use library for everything

[olive sable]

jsut use straight binary

[tender river]

language terser more expressive -> library not need

[clear sedge]

ignore asm write machine code

[silent cloak]

Make ur own library

Easy

[clear sedge]

asm is too high level

[sage crag]

ignore asm write asm

[clear sedge]

there's pseudoinstructions and shit

[rough bloom]

Cargo has lockfiles
don't need to resolve dependencies just to compile application

[clear sedge]

machine code is not a 1:1 translation of asm

[olive sable]

why use a library easily for a 2 week project when you can spend 4 years making the exact same thing yourself?

dumb programmers trying to not wast all their time

[sage crag]

asm is 1:1 translation to machine code

[olive sable]

im the smart person for wasting all of my time for no reason

[silent cloak]

Tbh its necessary for some APIs that are just built like absolute shit

(Like the twitch one)

[clear sedge]

some assembly languages may be, but there's still abstraction in most assembly languages

and most assemblers

[trim valve]

ok but like, there's this for everything

[clear sedge]

there's macros, structs, pseudoinstructions

[trim valve]

you could be your own doctor

[olive sable]

assembly languages? theres more than 1?
i thouhgt it was jsut 1 asm

[trim valve]

and your own farmer

etc.

[clear sedge]

[sage crag]

asm is 1:1 to machine code, only abstraction is name of instruction

[trim valve]

but there's merit to letting some people do one thing well

[severe path]

The library isn't always suited to your specific purpose.

Also, building your own libraries does get easier with practice. Instead of it taking 4 years, it may only take 2 weeks once you're an expert.

[trim valve]

instead of trying to do everything yourself badly

[sage crag]

that not asm, that asm with macros, structs, and pseudoinstructions

[noble zodiac]

lemme reimplement tokio real quick

[silent cloak]

Just write straight up machine code atp

[sage crag]

i prefer smol

[trim valve]

the thing is here, why not become an expert in your specific interests, and share that with people

[silent cloak]

Every build is customized for the user

[trim valve]

by making a library

[olive sable]

ok but like. do you expect every game studio to reinvent unity or ue5?
do you expect them to make their own gpu drivers cuz using prebuilt stuff is bad for some reason?

[tender river]

oo camera you mention want try dumb phone and camera

[clear sedge]

that's regular ass asm, you can choose not to use certain features in your assembler but it does not change the fact a lot of assemblers have those abstractions in place

[severe path]

No.

[sage crag]

[olive sable]

so libraries are good

[severe path]

But there are benefits to rolling-your-own.

[olive sable]

well ye

[noble zodiac]

also implement your own crypto functions. Famously a good idea

[sage crag]

smart idea

[severe path]

It's not like it is bad all-around.

[sage crag]

assembler have feature =/> feature is part of asm

[clear sedge]

good luck writing asm without labels

[silent cloak]

Can we make a compiler that compiles rust into Java JIT

[trim valve]

ooh

camera is fun

[severe path]

Also, machine code does have natural built-in macros, in case you didn't know.

[tender river]

jit

[sage crag]

me bread have mold but mold not a feature of bread

[severe path]

Very useful :p

[clear sedge]

do you mean bytecode

[tender river]

anyway this exist https://github.com/IntegralPilot/rustc_codegen_jvm

but

[sage crag]

ye expensive tho

[tender river]

scala better

[sage crag]

also rust_codegen_clr

[silent cloak]

Thats honestly funny

[olive sable]

making your own version of stuff is helpful in some cases, but most of the time you're doing unnecessary work.
if its not your goal to make library xyz yourself then why would you go to the effort if the original provides everytihng you need?
i feel like using libraries doenst make code bad

[silent cloak]

I kind of want to try it out

[tender river]

ye f# better

[trim valve]

😔

true

[silent cloak]

Its the worst of both worlds

[trim valve]

buy terrible camera

[sage crag]

camera need research

[trim valve]

ezpz

[sage crag]

jvm not bad

jvm good

[clear sedge]

jvm is awesome

[sage crag]

good piece of tech

[trim valve]

cameras are a good excuse to go outside at silly hours

[clear sedge]

i'd go as far as to say java is awesome

[rare bramble]

please do not run rust code on the jvm, that seems like it breaks the geneva convention

[sage crag]

me not understand problem

[silent cloak]

I started with Java then moved onto C#

[clear sedge]

fuck you i'm gonna go make doom run on rust on the jvm

[silent cloak]

But i still prefer directly compiling

[severe path]

I'm not saying libraries makes code bad.

If everyone is dependent on something they neither can understand, nor fix, than bad things may or may not happen.

[sage crag]

i dont think this would be hard at all

just use existing rust doom project and rust_codegen_jvm

[clear sedge]

correct

[sage crag]

[tender river]

require nostd

[clear sedge]

the leftpad in question

[silent cloak]

Just chain a bunch of code generators in a row

Moving language to language

[olive sable]

isnt most things in tech based on things people dont understand and cant fix?
the fucking nvidia gpu drivers on linux barely work

[sage crag]

vm with good JIT often better runtime performance than native

[sage crag]

[severe path]

Yeah. That's why it sucks. Ditto!

[silent cloak]

Yeah but I still have to abandon it for a lot of stuff

[sage crag]

it not because nvidia cant fix, it because they dont care about desktop linux

why would they

[olive sable]

ye

[clear sedge]

nvidia is kinda cringe

amd >>>

[olive sable]

so like, i dont see why that would make a specific language bad, when its a problem for every language

[sage crag]

the cost of the employees to make the drivers work would be more than they make from desktop linux

[silent cloak]

As they say there are either languages u complain about or languages u dont use at all

[rare bramble]

they could fix all the driver problems with like 0.05% of the AI profits they get

[sage crag]

they for-profit company

why would they

[clear sedge]

i don't complain about java that often but i still use it a fuckton

[tender river]

c approach to library only one this issue not happen library hard to pull and only used where really necessary

[sage crag]

counterpoint is it cause everyone to start carrying around their own library of utils

[severe path]

Some languages encourage it more than others, like Rust with its crates, and NodeJS, with NPM.

At least with C, it is more difficult to link libraries together with your program. You have to specify a library binary, and its header files.

[sage crag]

bad bad

[tender river]

true language/stdlib issue tho

[silent cloak]

I had to do that with Unity development

[clear sedge]

technically you don't have to have something's header files to link against it

[sage crag]

fixed in cpp

[tender river]

see plus plus

[sage crag]

you dont need it at all

[olive sable]

i feel like stdlib is like one of the only places everyone uses the same standard in tech, lets keep i that way

[sage crag]

not even a technically

you just need the symbol to exist

[clear sedge]

it is a technically

technically you can do that

[silent cloak]

Don't forget C-- is a language

[olive sable]

i will forget

this is a threat

[tender river]

c-- use for haskell codegen

[clear sedge]

in most cases you wouldn't do that

[sage crag]

ye so is D and F and F#

unoriginal name

[severe path]

Yeah, dlfcn.h has that covered.

[trim valve]

and ffmpeg

[tender river]

ye c-- designed for haskell

[olive sable]

C is the best one of the alphabet names. and the other ones can kinda fuck off ngl

[clear sedge]

what about B

🐝

[sage crag]

kounterpoint

[olive sable]

never heard of B

[clear sedge]

wdym you've never heard of B

it's C's older brother

[olive sable]

never heard of b means i never heard of b

[silent cloak]

I know of D

[clear sedge]

v

v

[silent cloak]

I didn't hear of B

[olive sable]

[clear sedge]

[olive sable]

yall keep making fun of my typos

[tender river]

me like b more than c

[clear sedge]

i like d

[silent cloak]

A/A# is a thing

[clear sedge]

the language

[tender river]

c switch use types for memory layout big mistake

[clear sedge]

i like the language d

i've never used d but it seems cool

[silent cloak]

Ada port

[olive sable]

you might be on to something

erm

rule 3

[clear sedge]

blyat

you saw nothing

[tender river]

its like uuh in between ocaml and c++

[clear sedge]

i've never used ocaml

[tender river]

me have no reason use d over ocaml it nice language tho

[silent cloak]

Use Z++ if ur an SQL fan

[tender river]

me neither wrote lots of f# tho because c# bad

[silent cloak]

Wrong opinion

[clear sedge]

controversial opinion

c# is fine

[olive sable]

B has fun, instantly S tier

[tender river]

return exist -> me destroy language

[tender river]

this not b

this ocaml

[olive sable]

oh

[tender river]

or not ocaml

something like that tho

[silent cloak]

I can't stand languages like those

[olive sable]

i google programming language B and this came up

[clear sedge]

main() {
   extrn putchar, n, v;
   auto i, c, col, a;

   i = col = 0;
   while(i<n)
      v[i++] = 1;

   while(col<2*n) {
      a = n+1;
      c = i = 0;
      while(i<n) {
         c =+ v[i]*10;
         v[i++] = c%a;
         c =/ a--;
      }
      putchar(c+'0');
      if(!(++col%5))
         putchar(col%50?' ':'*n');
   }
   putchar('*n*n');
}

v[2000];
n 2000;```

source: wikipedia

[olive sable]

[clear sedge]

auto != c++ auto afaik

[tender river]

ye lack of experience understandable

[clear sedge]

just means auto storage

[tender river]

me like using weird language its fun and teaches you thing

[clear sedge]

it's implicitly int

[olive sable]

doesnt seem too bad

[silent cloak]

Rust borrowed the ugliest parts of those syntaxes sadly

[tender river]

lack of experience

[clear sedge]

rust is fine

[olive sable]

rust is fine

the community isnt

[clear sedge]

i find it painful to write but it's really fine

[tender river]

rust community less insufferable than rust haters

[silent cloak]

The language ain't for me personally

[silent cloak]

Cap

[clear sedge]

almost on par with twitter art "fixers"

[sage crag]

rust community majority just writing rust

people external to community make noise

[trim valve]

[sage crag]

"rust good" "rust bad"

[trim valve]

ye same view

[clear sedge]

rust good i just don't feel like writing it most of the time

[tender river]

rust is uuh

[olive sable]

fine

[silent cloak]

Everyone talks about what the best language is supposed to be

[tender river]

i'd use it in areas where libraries are important

[silent cloak]

What about what the worst one is?

[clear sedge]

java best language

[tender river]

elsewhere no thankies

[clear sedge]

python worst language

[sage crag]

rust is good for code sharing

[olive sable]

c++

[silent cloak]

I mostly agree

[sage crag]

rust not good for program writing

[severe path]

I like Lisp

[olive sable]

actually, i dislike C# more than C++

[tender river]

like as in "used once or twice" or as in "i use emacs and guix"

[sage crag]

not to say it make bad programs, more to say iterating a design with memory safety is difficult

[silent cloak]

I found this

[tender river]

ye me think gc easier approach to memory safety rust performance not needed most use case

[severe path]

As in, I use Emacs sometimes, and I program with CLISP enough to really like it.

[sage crag]

why haskell above rust

[clear sedge]

java's not on here i'm gonna cry

i'm gonna actually cry

i can't believe this

[sage crag]

computer fast memory fast

[silent cloak]

Its most hated ranking

[clear sedge]

i'm killing everyone

[olive sable]

wow

[clear sedge]

wait

most hated

[sage crag]

ye so why haskell above

[clear sedge]

OH

WROST

[sage crag]

make no sense

[clear sedge]

WORST

[olive sable]

u dum

[clear sedge]

i'm sparing everyone

[rare bramble]

I have just found that I make whatever fundamental changes I need to make to my codebase, then fix all the red errors, then the code just works, even for like ~1000 line changes

[severe path]

Elisp is quite useful

[clear sedge]

look i've only had 16 hours of sleep today

[tender river]

2019 also using job market as indicator

[stray dragon]

where's matlab

[silent cloak]

Job markets dont know what they want

[clear sedge]

#0

[stray dragon]

why is TYPESCRIPT on there

[silent cloak]

Honestly true

[stray dragon]

wtf

[silent cloak]

I had that for a uni class and it was kind of ass

[sage crag]

they know they want the best and they want it now

[olive sable]

ts deserves it

[sage crag]

[clear sedge]

why is lua so high

[tender river]

me not care about industry me program for fun and cool research not for make money

[olive sable]

cuz roblox

[stray dragon]

it costs $1000 per year outside of uni

[clear sedge]

lua is fine as a configuration and simple scripting language

[sage crag]

me program as habit

[clear sedge]

roblox uses luau

[silent cloak]

We need a server wide language ranking

[clear sedge]

different language

[silent cloak]

That won't make people fight at all

[olive sable]

you could say the same thing about python lol

[clear sedge]

superset of lua

[stray dragon]

matlab uses a proprietary IDE

[olive sable]

thats my point

[clear sedge]

don't you dare bring that filth into this discussion

[sage crag]

1 is a superset of 0

[olive sable]

https://tenor.com/view/cant-handle-the-truth-gif-7916035

weak

[clear sedge]

YOU CAN'T EMBED A PYTHON INTERPRETER INTO A PROJECT AS EASILY AS A LUA INTERPRETER

IT'S INFERIOR

[silent cloak]

https://tenor.com/view/mewing-bird-gif-16835999897918525830

[olive sable]

I LITTERALY DID, I HAVE PYTHON RUNNING IN WASM

now stop shouting

dum

[clear sedge]

why would you DO THAT

[olive sable]

because i can

[sage crag]

annoying loud

shut

[stray dragon]

rain

inside voice

[clear sedge]

-# ok

[olive sable]

and you cant stop me

[stray dragon]

thank you.

[sage crag]

t

[stray dragon]

hi konii

[severe path]

WRITE(6,*) "I DECIDED TO SHOUT TODAY."
STOP
END

[olive sable]

hi t

[sage crag]

hit

[stray dragon]

hi sam

[sage crag]

[olive sable]

konii werent you sleeping?

[stray dragon]

don't hit

[clear sedge]

sorry i woke her up

[sage crag]

i forbot

[clear sedge]

my bad

[olive sable]

erm

[stray dragon]

shut up sam

[olive sable]

okay

[stray dragon]

i didn't mean it that way

[olive sable]

[silent cloak]

ErmScript

[severe path]

COMPUTERS USED TO SHOUT ALL THE TIME IN SOME WIERD ASCII-LIKE FORMAT. IT IS A LONG-HELD TRADITION.

[silent cloak]

My favorite language

[sage crag]

[stray dragon]

but you're not a computer

are you?

[severe path]

As far as I know, no.

[tender river]

me decide for you
#1. intercal
#2. mips assembly
#3. uiua
#4. agda
#5. fractran
other language not include lack of vote

[stray dragon]

lame

[olive sable]

im fine with that

[sage crag]

old mcdonald have a farm u i u a

[silent cloak]

Besides mips ive never seen a project use these

[tender river]

me not ask

[olive sable]

at vanorsigma pin please

[silent cloak]

But atleast i have something to Google now

[clear sedge]

#define erm assert
#define actually ;

main() {
  erm (1 == 1) actually
}```

[silent cloak]

Stealing this

[warped narwhal]

nah, make actully = ;

erm (1 == 1) actually

[clear sedge]

[olive sable]

[sage crag]

#define erm assert(
#define actually );

[clear sedge]

[silent cloak]

Finally

Good programming...

[tender river]

#define true false
#define false true
nothing happen

[sage crag]

erm 1 == 1 actually

[warped narwhal]

the best way to test private code in c++ still remains to #define private public

[silent cloak]

If ur program has no output it prints "NOTHING EVER HAPPENS"

[clear sedge]

the poor man's reflection

[warped narwhal]

if a program runs without output, did it ever run in the first place?

[silent cloak]

return nothing;

[olive sable]

what are you doing?

[clear sedge]

hol up, let them cook

[sage crag]

pure program with no output idempotent

[olive sable]

all in

[warped narwhal]

whitebox testing private c++ code

[olive sable]

whitebox?

[clear sedge]

opposite of black box

[warped narwhal]

opposite of black box

[clear sedge]

black box see nothing
white box see everything

[olive sable]

ye i got that far, but what would that even mean?

isnt that just visble code?

[clear sedge]

advanced printf debugging

[tender river]

pure terminating program evaluation order independent

[olive sable]

why need to put public private

[tender river]

confluence

[warped narwhal]

imagine you have a class in c++ that has a private variable m_var which has no getter, and you need to test that it is set to a specific value after you call the function void my_function(void), how would you do that automatically without using a debugger?

[olive sable]

print

[warped narwhal]

but it's private

[olive sable]

in the function

[warped narwhal]

it's not your code to change

[olive sable]

if its visible code i can change it

[warped narwhal]

what if you only have the header?

[olive sable]

uh

never had that issue

[severe path]

Get a reference to a class, and print out the value at the offset that it it stored.

At least, that's how I would do it.

[olive sable]

wait

[clear sedge]

just cast T * to a char * and print that genius

[olive sable]

i dont remember how that works

nodt matter anywyas

[clear sedge]

int intAtOffset = * static_cast<int *>(static_cast<void *>(&obj) + offset);```

[warped narwhal]

you can't get the offset of private variables iirc

[severe path]

You do something like:

void *a = &class;
void *b = a + offset;
int *c = (int *)b;
printf("%i\n", *c);

[tender river]

compile in debug mode read from dwarf metadata

[warped narwhal]

the shared library you're using was compiled in release mode

[clear sedge]

filthy c style cast

i'm killing you

[severe path]

I program in C, not C++.

I am now awaiting my death.

[clear sedge]

oh then it's fine

but if you pull that shit in c++ i'm coming for you

[olive sable]

crazy 180

[sage crag]

wrr

[olive sable]

if im doing code that requires me to check a private variable in one of my libs, then idk what i woudl even be doing

[clear sedge]

just

use a debugger

[warped narwhal]

you see, the real answer is actually to use public_cast<type>::my_private_var

[clear sedge]

that's disgusting

i love it

[severe path]

Or you can peek the memory using an oscilloscope, if you really don't want to use a debugger.

Just shove the prongs into the right wire, and watch the magic square wave stuff happen.

[clear sedge]

that's called an external debugger

[olive sable]

koelkast

[clear sedge]

scary

[sage crag]

blur

[clear sedge]

i think my network speedometer is fucked

[sage crag]

wrr

[olive sable]

crt noises intensify

[sage crag]

wrrr

[warped narwhal]

https://godbolt.org/z/qo7x1bePK

here it is in action

[severe path]

I'm not a C++ programmer, but I can tell that is cursed.

[sage crag]

@tender river

https://tenor.com/view/mini-miniko-minikomew-gif-1425820994898369756

[olive sable]

took me a while to figure out that was a nose and not a mouth

[tender river]

[sage crag]

MONKA <- hd remake

[tender river]

it very hd

[sage crag]

possibly too hd

[tender river]

Content Description: a cartoon drawing of a girl with glasses and a video game controller on her head

[sage crag]

Content Description: :MONKA:

[severe path]

[sage crag]

not quite

that :MonkaOMEGA:

:MONKA: <- different species

phylogenetics complicated me forgive you

[olive sable]

forgot the space invader creature pin smh

[severe path]

Can you post a png of what you are referring to?

[rigid snow]

why is her mouth open

[sage crag]

that's clearly MONKA's braincell

[sage crag]

https://tenor.com/view/mini-miniko-minikomew-gif-1425820994898369756

[severe path]

oh

whoops

[olive sable]

thats not a png

[sage crag]

png colloquialism for image

same deal

[olive sable]

but gif

[tender river]

it image

[sage crag]

it image

and recipient has not voiced complaint

can only assume this is a satisfying response

[olive sable]

[severe path]

Indeed

[rigid snow]

iiiii

[severe path]

The PNG committee will now be disbanded. Thank you everyone for your participation. We shall be on our way now.

[sage crag]

finally

image format with more than 1 page of formal specification

useless to world

[rigid snow]

i invent png replacement

gzipped bitmap

[sage crag]

png replacement, png without image feature

[rigid snow]

gzipped bitmap image

[sage crag]

ye without image feature

no icd profile

no uuh

animation

no uuh

png thingies

whatever they do

[warped narwhal]

theoretically you can store any arbitrary buffer in a png file, so we could have a gzipped png inside of a png

[sage crag]

tiny program that:
0. takes 1x1 transparent png

1. constructs new png with the binned data of the 1x1 transparent png
2. repeat with the previous png

will it create a predictable pattern or will it be boring

[rigid snow]

gzipped gif

[sage crag]

gif

gif

gif

say 3 times in mirror head explod

[warped narwhal]

is it pronounced gif or gif?

[rigid snow]

gif

[olive sable]

gif

[sage crag]

its pronounced squirble

[olive sable]

i ahve some bad news to bring to yall

[sage crag]

ok

[rigid snow]

jraphics interchange format

[warped narwhal]

you're moving to javascript?

[rigid snow]

to lisp

[tender river]

next generation image format

web native

[rigid snow]

njif

[tender river]

ship wasm

[tender river]

it render on canvas

[olive sable]

press the sound thingy

[tender river]

can use domain specific compression algorithm

algorithm small only 1mb

[olive sable]

gif, soft g
literally nobody wins

[rigid snow]

it just opens the image

[trim valve]

chayleaf you're just explaining fonts

[olive sable]

i meant google it yourself

i cant embed google translate yet

[tender river]

font not web native

please i need investor money

[rigid snow]

what is web native

opposite of native

[tender river]

it

work on web

[olive sable]

https://translate.google.com/?sl=nl&tl=en&text=gif&op=translate

[tender river]

only

[rigid snow]

that's crazy

ye i'm pronouncing it like that from now on to piss off both groups

[sage crag]

ppoi jan

[olive sable]

[trim valve]

https://github.com/harfbuzz/harfbuzz-wasm-examples

[tender river]

this but with ukrainian g

[rigid snow]

not quite

it's softer no?

[tender river]

ye it is

[olive sable]

soft g, dutch g

hard g is h

[rigid snow]

[trim valve]

https://fuglede.github.io/llama.ttf/

[rigid snow]

WHAT

???????

[warped narwhal]

huh?

[trim valve]

smh you guys are missing out

[sage crag]

ok

[idle dune]

Thinkpad acquired

[olive sable]

arbitrary code execution

[tender river]

does llama.pdf exist

[idle dune]

It makes me 15.4 in MAC look like a netbook

[trim valve]

I mean that's fine

[rigid snow]

why is it running windows

[trim valve]

it's supposed to do that

[olive sable]

ye

[rigid snow]

you can embed js and forms so it can exist

[rigid snow]

nuh uh

[olive sable]

i jsut realized this doesnt make sense to yall

in belgium we dont use hard g, in netherlands they do

we use soft g for everything cuz less agressive

[idle dune]

Because I just got it, don’t worry, Linux will be installed after I do my Spreadsheets assignments.

[tender river]

https://github.com/harfbuzz/harfbuzz-wasm-examples

[olive sable]

so

[tender river]

text rendering

[olive sable]

i can put python in there too

[trim valve]

ye

make font that executes python

[tender river]

ye in practice they just use rust for everything tho

[trim valve]

who needs jupyter anyways

[tender river]

also its still very very nonstandard and disabled by default i think

[severe path]

Text rendering is a rabbit hole

It never ends

It may as well be equivalent to 3D rendering in complexity.

[sage crag]

oh ok

it fails immediately

somehow i dont think it likes arbitrary bytes

[silent cloak]

i need to start scheduling breaks for myself when i get trapped in the coding mindspace

[tender river]

try EncoderOptions::new(bytes.len(), 1, Default::default(), BitDepth::Eight) or something

https://github.com/harfbuzz/harfbuzz-wasm-examples/raw/main/calculator/calculator.gif

font that renders as evaluation result

[sage crag]

need to isqrt

[tender river]

do you want square image

[sage crag]

ye

[tender river]

i wrote a steganography algo once encode data in jpeg chunks

visible artifacts but original image still legible good enough

[olive sable]

when you rotate them, they rotate

[sage crag]

it work with greyscale

[sage crag]

imag

riveting

this 30 iterations

100 iterations

very convincing random noise generator

not cryptographic though

[tender river]

is original like 1x1 or something

[sage crag]

300

[sage crag]

yes

[tender river]

look same size

[sage crag]

here it is with a different (1x1)

[sage crag]

ye

probably sqrt growth

on size

so limit

[tender river]

https://bjia56.github.io/ai/translate-ttf-a-translation-engine-in-your-font/

[sage crag]

10000x

is it just me or

it reach asymptote

[tender river]

maybe entropy/compression

[noble zodiac]

huh... github is starting to charge money for self-hosted github runner

[sage crag]

wrr

[tender river]

me have gitea

[sage crag]

i ran with quality 0

i think

asympote

[tender river]

wrrr

try decoding back

[sage crag]

good idea

discord renders it

but not here

i can only decode once

otherwise it says "no more bytes

"

it did recover original 1x1 if i just encode one time

it embedded

2 time

3 time

4 time

[tender river]

is png safe against arbitrary trailing data

because if you just isqrt then you truncate if you isqrt+1 you pad

[sage crag]

isqrt+1 cause panic

isqrt-1 works

(bytes.len()+1).isqrt() also works

[tender river]

then pad bytes until len is a square

[sage crag]

integer square root removing +1

[sage crag]

this if i do that

let mut size = bytes.len().isqrt() + 1;
loop {
  if size * size == bytes.len() { break; }
  bytes.push(255);
  size = bytes.len().isqrt();
}

me brain not working but i think this should work

[tender river]

ye even +1 not necessary

hmm no idea probably have to encode in specific way

[sage crag]

without +1

same imag

+1 get lost in the isqrt

iteration 255 now big

[olive sable]

bi

[tender river]

line

[sage crag]

if i make it pad out to 4x the size, i can encode in colour maybe

[olive sable]

[sage crag]

[sage crag]

i wonder if they have interesting fourier transform

[olive sable]

big line

[tender river]

oo right padding line

[sage crag]

what happens if i pad out with the bytes of the original image instead of

255 byte

here

it does look a bit different must mostly the same

lines must be exif metadata or something

[rigid snow]

noise
i leave for 10 minutes come back
noise
i leave for 20 minutes come back to
noise

[sage crag]

nop stripping metadata make no diff

must be some funny encoder pattern

[severe path]

Data is noise

[sage crag]

i forgot to increment i

[olive sable]

noise is data, not all data is noise

[sage crag]

redo

looks nearly same :sendoro:

rgb ver

it looks like its not just noise though

there are some weird distortion patterns in it

[tender river]

cat

[sage crag]

[olive sable]

oo

fancy

[sage crag]

before me forget, here what it look like if i dont decode

distortion pattern gone :rrrr:

[tender river]

perlin noise

[sage crag]

nearly uniform except for blocks

luma ver

lines

[olive sable]

why does it keep saying "in a hot way"

[sage crag]

gpt 5.2 great model

[sage crag]

i dont think it does

i didnt tell it to do that, to be clear

[olive sable]

ye i know

[sage crag]

2nd time around

[olive sable]

i guess it wasnt the exct same last time, but it does use the word "hot" a weird amount

[sage crag]

fade into noise

[olive sable]

diagonal line, kinda

noisy

[sage crag]

but there's

ye line

[tender river]

it not noise it

your future

[sage crag]

hav 20.68 Mb image

i did it 2000 times

[rigid snow]

this sounds very cool when played with spectral synth (turned into spectrogram

[sage crag]

sound NERRRRD

[rigid snow]

interesting noise

[sage crag]

send noise

[olive sable]

[rigid snow]

not that interesting on its own but i made a bass synth out of it

[sage crag]

[tender river]

Noise is any type of random, troublesome, problematic, or unwanted signals.

Acoustic noise may mar aesthetic experience, such as attending a concert hall. It may also be a medical issue inherent in the biology of hearing.

In technology, noise is unwanted signals in a device or apparatus, commonly of an electrical nature. The nature of noise is much studied in mathematics and is a prominent topic in statistics.

[sage crag]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1072697081443131476/1439744591837266041/autismu.gif

[rough bloom]

"unwanted"

rude

[rigid snow]

ok i remove sub i added

[sage crag]

i see how toby fox make sfx

[rigid snow]

image of noise

[sage crag]

wrr

[tender river]

wouldnt toby fox probably just use

square/triangle

[sage crag]

no too complicated

instead datarot a png 255 times

[tender river]

[sage crag]

i fixed rgb ver

this just pure noise

[rigid snow]

is this lossy ye

because you grayscale it

image based prng

but better because can't reverse

but slow

[sage crag]

i made it work with arbitrary colour space

here rgba

pretty

[rigid snow]

noise pretty

can i have whatever condition you have

pls

[tender river]

https://media.discordapp.net/stickers/1444538602330787920.gif?size=160&name=🔥AUTISM🔥

[sage crag]

luma16

vs luma8

why file smaller

whatever me not care

[rigid snow]

rain

droplets

[sage crag]

wrr

[tender river]

luma luma yay

[sage crag]

float32

[rigid snow]

[sage crag]

rgba 16

still pretty

more pretty even

not sure how it coping with original pixel

[rigid snow]

it's the same image konii

[sage crag]

it not

it clearly different

[rigid snow]

[sage crag]

look

[rigid snow]

[sage crag]

wrr

[warped narwhal]

is it just me that sees a grid within this?

[sage crag]

no i also see it

i would use fft script but i forgor where it is

[tender river]

if its highly visible its probably noire

[tender river]

me have your script wait

[sage crag]

oh here what happen if i decode btw

suddenly grid go away

which mean grid is a feature of png and not an image artifact

[tender river]

is the grid still there when you scale?

[sage crag]

no

just moire

[tender river]

[rigid snow]

noire

[tender river]

esl

[rigid snow]

it's a proper noun

[sage crag]

moire

[rigid snow]

oh it's not

why did i think it is

[sage crag]

this not full script

full script merge into one image

me find

nevermind lost to time

it gone

[tender river]

chayleaf = backup

[sage crag]

also in discord

chayleaf part of backup chain

[tender river]

import numpy as np
import cv2

def fft_channel(channel):
    window = np.outer(np.hanning(channel.shape[0]), np.hanning(channel.shape[1]))
    fshift = np.fft.fftshift(np.fft.fft2(channel * window))
    spectrum = np.log1p(np.abs(fshift))

    threshold = spectrum.mean() + 0.005 * spectrum.std()
    spectrum[spectrum < threshold] = 0
     
    spectrum = cv2.normalize(spectrum, None, 0, 255, cv2.NORM_MINMAX).astype(np.uint8)
    spectrum = cv2.equalizeHist(spectrum)
    clahe = cv2.createCLAHE(clipLimit=3.0, tileGridSize=(16, 16))
    spectrum = clahe.apply(spectrum)

    return spectrum

img = cv2.imread('/home/user/Downloads/erf.png')
fft_bgr = cv2.merge([fft_channel(c) for c in cv2.split(img)])
cv2.imwrite("fft.png", fft_bgr)

[sage crag]

thankie

[olive sable]

linus did a kioxia nand flash tour

[dry charm]

this journey has been fucking ridiculous

[amber fractal]

lovely nix

[tender river]

this is not nix this is some dotnet tooling config

anyway chatgpt solution bad

to be expected tho

[amber fractal]

I realized after I typed, I'm slow

[tender river]

you should not expect /nix/store/.../ paths to be stable

[dry charm]

neovim

[clear sedge]

[dry charm]

also, yes. Pathing as expected is the worst solution you can do

[tender river]

notlua

[dry charm]

I need to use this config on non-nix system so I must use everything native

and in this case pretty sure notlua won't help

[tender river]

home-manager available on every distro with nix but i assume you dont wanna install nix which is fair