programming

[fast pagoda]

damn i want to watch wall-e again

https://tenor.com/view/ship-water-sea-waves-gif-6215971

[worldly acorn]

https://tenor.com/view/wall-e-robot-space-fly-flying-gif-8058416

[glad path]

ithinkthatssomethingdifferent

[worldly acorn]

Might be

Nah same movie

[glad path]

"trust me ffrfr'"

[midnight sigil]

sir I think this can be refactored

[sage crag]

posix universal abi

[glad path]

what does teh b stand for ._.

[fast pagoda]

no sorry i was just hopping in my vehicle to grab my copy of walle

[stray dragon]

clang has worked, and apparently shiro's example bot is dogshit

[obsidian mantle]

threads doesnt work in cpp
its over

[sage crag]

its for the bindings

[sage crag]

yes it picks a random move

[glass flower]

no you just have the same issue we all are having

[stray dragon]

ah i see

[midnight sigil]

just expose board

:SMH:

[fast pagoda]

i played 2 rng bots against each other for like 100 games i think the average game was over 200 moves

[stray dragon]

i've finally caught up

[glad path]

can someone write lua bindings for me

i am too lazy & too busy

[sage crag]

yes we talked to shiro about this, shiro doesnt want to

[midnight sigil]

forcing us to use extra tokens I see

[sage crag]

its true functions are more portable for ffi than c structs and globals

[sage crag]

its 1 more token

[fast pagoda]

the board is on top of a picture of vedal and shiro at the christmas party (embarassing) so he cant expose it

the reason this was done was legitimate but classified

[glad path]

whar

[midnight sigil]

shiro be yelling "I CAN CODE" to vedal frfr

[final tinsel]

i think im prob gna end this game...

[glad path]

neuro too

[midnight sigil]

it's stucked on 69

-11:34:16 time left slaps hard

[glad path]

fun fact: your code can't be more than ~7mb if i did the math right

[rigid timber]

how so?

[final tinsel]

i set it to unlimited

[glad path]

no more than 64bits per token
no more than 1000 tokens i think

[rigid timber]

long variable names tho

[glad path]

cant be more than 64bits of data

in one token

[final tinsel]

i.e. Happy Birthday Shiro var1, Happy Birthday Shiro var2 etc

[glad path]

its a rule

[fair horizon]

Trying to get the files fully setup is already draining me, I haven't even started coding yet 😭

[rigid timber]

variable names don't hold data

[midnight sigil]

1024

[glad path]

real

[glad path]

roughly the same

I rounded everything

[lime galleon]

Im wondering how do you train this thing

[midnight sigil]

it's kinda broken on windows rn

I'm forced to halt

[real sierra]

you should probably make it a timed game

[final tinsel]

yeah i adjucated draw and started a timed one

[glad path]

shiro does it the api thinguy run on mac correctly

[real sierra]

haven't tried on mac but I would think mac is more similar to linux

[final tinsel]

true

[glad path]

grammar is not present in the above above sentence

[midnight sigil]

use en-croissant if you really want to do stockfish vs stockfish

[glad path]

en-croissant??

pawn-croissant

[midnight sigil]

you need to actually expose the apis

[rigid timber]

real and true, everyone should do a search and replace with those variable names before submitting their bot

[lime galleon]

It should work fine if it doesnt have linux dependencies

[nocturne olive]

I wonder how long it will take for the Kotlin bindings to be fully added

[stray dragon]

downloaded the setup, installed it, finished the installation, restarted the terminal, tried the command

neat

i'll use clang for now

[real sierra]

not long, just have to review the changes

[final tinsel]

erm
what do that mean

[midnight sigil]

Known issue

Fix here

[nocturne olive]

Alright
Remember to also add it as a supported language to the main readme I guess

[midnight sigil]

have you download MSVC build tools

[obsidian mantle]

wtf is this clang about 💀 4 gb ???

more?

[midnight sigil]

no?

[obsidian mantle]

what am i downloading

[midnight sigil]

[rigid timber]

why are you getting the LLVM source...?

[midnight sigil]

idk man it's hard to get MSVC environment working ik...

[obsidian mantle]

idk i googled install clang

[rigid timber]

[final tinsel]

now im getting this

[midnight sigil]

just don't use gcc

[obsidian mantle]

thanks downloading this now

[stray dragon]

true!

[midnight sigil]

either use msvc or clang-msvc

gcc sucks ass

[stray dragon]

shiro using gcc smh what an idiot

[midnight sigil]

imagine having to download mingw just in-order to compile a program

[tender river]

?????

this problem isnt even gcc related

[midnight sigil]

[tender river]

t's gcc is just old

[stray dragon]

is fixed by not using gcc

[stray dragon]

literally how

[fast pagoda]

gcc is based wym

[midnight sigil]

[stray dragon]

it is literally THE MOST RECENT VERSION

[final tinsel]

so how i do this but with msvc instead lol gcc -shared -o libchess.dll bitboard.c chessapi.c

[stray dragon]

NOT EVEN 2 MONTHS OLD!!

[rigid timber]

nah, definitely old

[midnight sigil]

you don't want to mess with msvc, install clang

[fast pagoda]

msvc

[final tinsel]

i just wanna use pythonnnnnnnnnnnn

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

[obsidian mantle]

why does threads tell me __cplusplus is not defined if im compiling it through cpp project

[tender river]

then gcc is fine but the particular gcc distribution isnt fine threads.h is part of the c23 standard

[midnight sigil]

https://github.com/llvm/llvm-project/releases/tag/llvmorg-21.1.1

get you binaries here

[obsidian mantle]

do i also need to wrap shiro's source into project with some cmake or

[stray dragon]

not if nobody finds out

also why .json

[midnight sigil]

just daily stress of programmers trying to get a library working on their end, and perhaps being a repo maintainer afterwards

[frail mortar]

huh?

[stray dragon]

that'd get super laggy so quickly

[formal quartz]

um if i could ask, if i would make a custom api interface for the chess tournament, i should just copy all the functionality of the existing ones for the api ddl?
sorry i have not really done this kinda stuff before

[frail mortar]

better idea? I only know jsonl rn

[stray dragon]

some format that just appends to the end of a file would be better

[midnight sigil]

sql is always there by your side

[frail mortar]

ty

[stray dragon]

could implement it in txt or csv or use an actual database

[stoic turtle]

I am getting a fatal error: 'threads.h' file not found

I am on mac this time

[midnight sigil]

you use the APIs provided to make a bot

[fast pagoda]

csv/tsv is super ez cuz its just a nothing file

[tender river]

get clang from brew

[stray dragon]

json is bad for storing messages like that because every time a message comes in your program will go "hmmm time to scan through this 200MB json file, find where to put this message in, and then overwrite the entire contents of said 200MB file with the new contents that have 1 more message stored"

[nocturne olive]

Kotlin bindings are real now

[stray dragon]

and you'd be doing that multiple times a second, probably

[fast pagoda]

but le append works just fine you dont have to read it

[tender river]

also make sure to pass -std=c23 (try that before using brew)

[fast pagoda]

with jsonl it jsut needs to slap a \n and append

never open that ish

[real sierra]

if your question is about making bindings to the API for a new language then in general yes, if you make language bindings for the API it should just reimplement the provided functions and not add any other functionality
that said, one exception i've waived for this is memory management; if your language is garbage-collected and you wish to wrap some of the returned pointers in classes to be automatically freed by the garbage collector, that's fine
you can see the python bindings for an example of how this might work (found on the contest repo)

[stray dragon]

i see

[midnight sigil]

it's fineeeee just some I/Os, surely nothing happens when I try to write 100000+ entries in parallel

[fast pagoda]

this mf writing the chatlogs of grok

[obsidian mantle]

how do i link it its run through cmd

[fast pagoda]

the entire corpus of messages it receives simultaneously in all convos

maybe then it'll be a prob

[obsidian mantle]

just check adjascent files bro

[midnight sigil]

don't open a cmd from visual studio or smth

[obsidian mantle]

i made a bat

[frail mortar]

what about adding an append for the jsonl.
i heard cvs is painful for nested data.
I was going to try vector DB for semantic reacall, but I'd still need the jsonl or something I read up on, SQLite.

[midnight sigil]

on right

[fast pagoda]

append should be fine just dont open the file first

[midnight sigil]

you need to pass in the other c files

[nocturne olive]

Yeah I also added garbage collection in the Kotlin one

[stray dragon]

the commands i've found to work for testing:

[fast pagoda]

i saved 250k messages in jsonl sequentially without problems

[nocturne olive]

Very good in a language where nobody is used to manual memory management

[formal quartz]

yeah wanted to try my hand at making it for my preferred language
gonna looks thru the repo, thanks

[obsidian mantle]

how tf have you find that

[midnight sigil]

do clang -o my_bot.exe example_bot.c bitboard.c chessapi.c -std=c23

[stray dragon]

trial and error

[fast pagoda]

me irl

[stray dragon]

actually wait, it should be bot_exec not bot_exec.exe here

[fast pagoda]

throw shit at it till it works

[stray dragon]

oopsie daisy

wait is that even correct

i have no clue what i'm doing LOL

[rigid timber]

you can make it an exe, you just have to give it with exe to cute chess too

[midnight sigil]

if you're on windows you need a suffix

[stray dragon]

will test

[obsidian mantle]

nice it worked thanks

[nocturne olive]

As long as you have a way to interact with C code in your language making bindings is really just a matter of copy-paste

[fast pagoda]

every time anything ever happens w/ compiling reminds me that it was a good idea to swap linux

[stray dragon]

glad i could be of use

[rigid timber]

time to make bindings for NodeJS

[nocturne olive]

Silly

[fast pagoda]

that would probably be fun

[nocturne olive]

Someone would have fun with that probably

[rigid timber]

wouldn't even be hard methinks

[stray dragon]

apparently you do not

[frail mortar]

    path = _user_dir(uid) / "scratch.jsonl"
    with path.open("a", encoding="utf-8") as f:
        f.write(json.dumps({"u": user_text.strip()}, ensure_ascii=False) + "\n")
        f.write(json.dumps({"a": assistant_text.strip()}, ensure_ascii=False) + "\n")
    try:
        summarize_and_persist_if_ready(uid, every_n_pairs=10)
    except Exception:
        pass```

[nocturne olive]

This is the only complex function in my entire bindings ```kt
fun getLegalMoves(board: Board): Array<Move> {
val len = IntByReference()
val movesPtr = nativeBindings.chess_get_legal_moves(board.value, len)

    val moves = Array(len.value) { i ->
        val offset = i * MoveByPointer().size()
        MoveByPointer(movesPtr.share(offset.toLong())).toMove()
    }

    nativeBindings.chess_free_moves_array(movesPtr)
    return moves
}

[formal quartz]

oh, neat :o i think pascal has that. welp time to try

[nocturne olive]

And it's only complex because of memory management

[fast pagoda]

yeah the only part of this that has to parse the file is possible the summarize function depending on what it is

[nocturne olive]

Every other function in the core API is a oneliner

[fast pagoda]

the other part is just appending, should be a-ok

[midnight sigil]

[nocturne olive]

This whole thing is just a bunch of oneliners

[midnight sigil]

I guess they have dumb-protections

[stoic turtle]

it still does the same thing

[stray dragon]

i'm guessing it doesn't work if you try to compile without the suffix but then run the cutechess-cli command with the suffix

yeah "cannot execute command"

[midnight sigil]

%localappdata%

[rigid timber]

well yeah, because if you compile it with the suffix, the file without a suffix doesn't exist

[fast pagoda]

system breached

[obsidian mantle]

guys i did it

[rigid timber]

illegal move

[midnight sigil]

hurray one more personal halted by shibo

whoever solves it first become a mod

[obsidian mantle]

so it repeated last move

interesting

[midnight sigil]

not always

[rigid timber]

the first move, not last

[stray dragon]

time to get to work re-writing the entire bot then

[tender river]

then try gcc maybe

[rigid snow]

plot twist: the move is actually legal and it's just all the runners that are wrong

[sage crag]

has competition started yet

[stray dragon]

i do wonder

[tender river]

it has

[midnight sigil]

started yes

you can change your submission/entry until the deadline so it doesn't really matter

[stoic turtle]

same error

[tender river]

i can only suggest using an old version of the repo that uses pthreads

@real sierra apparently macos has pthreads but not threads.h

[midnight sigil]

gotta ask shibo if he accepts that

[tender river]

might want to ifdef that

[tender river]

nope, shiro will run on linux with latest ver no issue there

[stark needle]

i got it

[nocturne olive]

Time for platform-conditional compilation

[fast pagoda]

[real sierra]

you gotta be kidding me

after i refactored everything to remove pthreads

[fast pagoda]

lmao

[rigid timber]

use pthreads if available and threads.h otherwise?

[real sierra]

my nice code...

[nocturne olive]

Oh the joys of C

[midnight sigil]

gone

[real sierra]

ok ill address that after the windows issue as i have some ongoing changes here

[rigid timber]

you have 500 lines of dense code in a single function to get valid moves, "nice code" is not even in the room with us

[nocturne olive]

At this point just have separate code within ifdef for every platform

[fast pagoda]

it's fun how you might think c/cpp would have essentially universal support without issue given how prevalent and old they are

and then you try to do anything cross platform even on the same target arch and

[midnight sigil]

relatively nice code

[midnight sigil]

windows and linux is fine

macos on the other hand...

completely isolated land

it has their very own dev environment/workflow

[nocturne olive]

As soon as you go cross platform C explodes

I like Kotlin, it just works (tm)

[rigid snow]

that's js

[real sierra]

speed

also it's not copy pasted, there's slight differences per-direction

blame pawns

[rigid timber]

I mean...

[fast pagoda]

i blame prawns

[rigid timber]

if it works it works... (it doesn't work, it gives invalid moves)

[fast pagoda]

https://tenor.com/view/ci-gif-16026417378867312896

[rigid snow]

♟️

[midnight sigil]

♟️:

[real sierra]

the endianness of windows isnt different is it

i guess that might be processor specific

[opaque sigil]

No

That is a CPU thing

[nocturne olive]

Yeah it's from the CPU

[fair horizon]

Why is my compiler complaining that threads.h doesn't exist fml

[real sierra]

macos?

[fair horizon]

Windows, though I'm not using the WSL compiler thing so might have to do with it as well

[obsidian mantle]

how do i convert int to string in c 💀 wtf is this language where my to_string

[fair horizon]

At last I will have to actually install WSL

[real sierra]

strtol and similar funcs wrong direction

if your int is between 0 and 9, you can just do '0' + i to make it a char

[rigid snow]

but wasn't it itoa or something

[nocturne olive]

Kotlin my beloved

[opaque sigil]

It's called snprintf

[nocturne olive]

Having a toString() is literally part of the Any? base class

[rigid snow]

copied from java

[midnight sigil]

wuh wsl compiler?

[real sierra]

fascinating

it seems only black is making illegal moves now

[fair horizon]

Used wrong terms mb

[real sierra]

nope i lied

[nocturne olive]

Weirdness

[nocturne olive]

You may just lack the header because getting STD headers on Windows is like super impossible

[rigid snow]

PS C:\> wsl compiler
/bin/bash: line 1: compiler: command not found

[midnight sigil]

that's C++'s std

[rigid snow]

oh

[rigid timber]

can't believe Shiro would lie to us

[hollow spruce]

class Meta(type):
def new(cls, name, bases, attrs):
print(f"Creating class {name}")
return super().new(cls, name, bases, attrs)

class MyClass(metaclass=Meta):
pass

[real sierra]

[opaque sigil]

itoa is available in c it's just non-standard iirc

[midnight sigil]

it's betrayal

[real sierra]

@tender river are you really sure this is fine

[hollow spruce]

class Point:
slots = ("x", "y")
def init(self, x, y):
self.x, self.y = x, y

[obsidian mantle]

does string exist in c

or they are all chars

[real sierra]

char *

[opaque sigil]

Well change it then

[obsidian mantle]

how do i concat it to some text

impossible language

[hollow spruce]

?

[obsidian mantle]

so i need to make text a variable then shuffle some pointers right then move terminator or smh

not very humane

[alpine frigate]

char*, or your own length-prefixed type

[obsidian mantle]

for operation like "x" + to_string(i) + "y"

[rigid timber]

it's C, it's not meant to be humane

[midnight sigil]

just replace %d with %llu wuh?

[real sierra]

thats just a debug print, that's not the point

the point is that the supposed llu is later stored in an int *

i dont think it would explain the problems but ill try changing it

[opaque sigil]

It's fine

[rigid snow]

i am extremely sad and my day is ruined. how are people supposed to find out how to contact me on skype

[nocturne olive]

That's just not how C works

[opaque sigil]

Assuming you don't have over 2^32 legal moves

[nocturne olive]

If you want that go to Python or Kotlin

[real sierra]

i do not

[opaque sigil]

You allocate a large enough buffer and write into that

[obsidian mantle]

now i remember
i saw it somewhere

[midnight sigil]

I guess it's fine if your size_t doesn't reach over INT_MAX

you can do a check on that if you're uncertain

[real sierra]

its so strange, particularly in the two engine case

[hollow spruce]

root@localhost:~# python3 -V
Python 3.12.3
root@localhost:~# python3.14 -V
Python 3.14.0rc3
root@localhost:~# python3.13 -V
Python 3.13.7
root@localhost:~# python3.11 -V
bash: python3.11: command not found

[opaque sigil]

Why would you even want to have it be an int in the first place

[real sierra]

not only is one getting the wrong length of legal moves array but the contents are also wrong

[alpine frigate]

the humble strcat

[real sierra]

i dont really, it should be a size_t

but it'd be a change to the api header

[midnight sigil]

should be an unsigned int frfr

[real sierra]

so if it wont fix the problem then its not my concern for now

dont need to break more stuff

[midnight sigil]

suboptimal memory usage

time to remove sub-modules and test which part is not working

[opaque sigil]

Unless you somehow end up with negative moves it shouldn't make a difference at all I guess

[midnight sigil]

every boring fix sessions ever

[real sierra]

i just dont understand what could be causing a windows-specific issue

[hollow spruce]

Chatgpt is help full

New string t ✓
Not @steady otter 🚫

[stray dragon]

lol

wrong t

[hollow spruce]

Capital T
Ure small one bro

[hollow spruce]

Ure are usable

[midnight sigil]

you pinged a guy sweating in osu!lazer smh

[stray dragon]

i'm relieved

[midnight sigil]

interuptions

[hollow spruce]

?

Example of template string

from string import Template

Suppose Python 3.14 adds a new t-string syntax, like:

tpl = t"Hello, {name}! Welcome to {place}."

Later, substitute values

ctx1 = {"name": "Alice", "place": "Wonderland"}
ctx2 = {"name": "Bob", "place": "Neverland"}

print(tpl.substitute(ctx1)) # Hello, Alice! Welcome to Wonderland.
print(tpl.substitute(ctx2)) # Hello, Bob! Welcome to Neverland.

From chatgpt

[obsidian mantle]

ok so it doesnt restart bot counter stays

so its api fault

i removed the cycle in main and it said "bot disconnects" after first move

oh i get it

its supposed to be while true

[hollow spruce]

t-strings → placeholders are kept as a template; you fill them in later with data.

[stoic turtle]

if someone sends me the libchess.so will it work, or do I need to compile it myself

[real sierra]

not that it wasn't already known, but the problem is definitely in the C api

[midnight sigil]

it should work

as long as you both has the same system setup and arch

[stoic turtle]

ah, well thats the problem

[midnight sigil]

it's why linux users actually compiles their program everytime they install smth

[clear sedge]

or use appimages

[hollow spruce]

?

[clear sedge]

do you not know what an appimage is?

[hollow spruce]

Nai

[stoic turtle]

is that what chmod +x does

[clear sedge]

chmod +x <file> sets the execute permission of <file> to true

[fast pagoda]

that makes it executable

[clear sedge]

it's basically the linux version of a portable .exe

[hollow spruce]

Wsl ?

[fast pagoda]

id think of appimages more like a container

like docker

[clear sedge]

huh? i mean appimages are bound to work in wsl, it's literally just linux

[clear sedge]

functionally they're literally app images so yeah

but the next best thing to compare it with is portable .exes

[fast pagoda]

yeah i guess if you have no other context

the other thing i was going to say is like an Apk

[clear sedge]

yes

apk

that's a better example

[fast pagoda]

didnt know what would be the best to contextualize it lol

[clear sedge]

still, the most intuitive thing to compare it with is portable .exes imo

you double click it and the app works

[midnight sigil]

[fast pagoda]

oh fuck yeah i complain about this bridge still being in progress every time i can

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FXy6a9XLY14

unreal

[clear sedge]

engine

[fast pagoda]

5

[clear sedge]

it's in the game (sadly)

[midnight sigil]

give me 1% of that money and I can be rich

[clear sedge]

give me 1% of that money and i'll spend it all on alcohol and die by the time i hit 30

[hollow spruce]

Buy whole server rack

[clear sedge]

a whole server rack to keep my alcohol in

[fair horizon]

Give me 1% of that money and I'll buy 3 muffins

[clear sedge]

3??

[midnight sigil]

are you a german, by any chance?

[obsidian mantle]

so these are legal moves it finds turn 0

[clear sedge]

nope

[fair horizon]

Yes, 3. If you want I can share one of them with you tho

[clear sedge]

i hate beer

[real sierra]

g8h6 is a common bad move found

part of the bug im working on rn

[clear sedge]

i do however enjoy the feeling of being intoxicated

[midnight sigil]

[clear sedge]

hate alcohol in general taste-wise

[obsidian mantle]

basically it only found knight moves for some reason

[fast pagoda]

drink enough and the taste doesnt matter after a point

[clear sedge]

that is true, i have experienced that

i still don't remember what i got up to that night

thus i must.. not drink for the sake of my liver

such a cruel fate

[midnight sigil]

🥀

[obsidian mantle]

shiro do you have something to dump the board into string in api

[hoary lion]

3 germans heading to your house rn

[clear sedge]

do they have beers with them?

i could use one right now

[midnight sigil]

"Doctor told me not to consume any alcohol, I started drugging instead"

[real sierra]

not the entire board, but you can dump individual bitboards with the function in bitboard.h

the issue comes somewhere before get_legal_moves apparently

[obsidian mantle]

why

[clear sedge]

unironically the only thing my psyche told me was "hey. that's bad. stop. bad. boo."
..paraphrasing but that's basically how that went

[real sierra]

if i knew why an issue existed, it wouldnt

[midnight sigil]

because it's where you get the legal moves

[obsidian mantle]

you know what is before get_legal_moves
its chess_get_board

how do i see it

ok gotta work it

[midnight sigil]

gl mate

[clear sedge]

gl? like opengl?

https://tenor.com/view/staringsoldiercatok-gif-2130370366885478984

[midnight sigil]

are you sober

[clear sedge]

this is me while sober surprisingly enough

i am under the influence of a whole monster can though

[fair horizon]

I am once again shocked by how oblivious I can be, I spent half an hour waiting for a certain step in an installation process to complete when it turns out I just had to press enter to go the next step 🤦‍♂️

[midnight sigil]

does that count as alcohol

[clear sedge]

no

[midnight sigil]

bro started consuming caffeine instead

[clear sedge]

i started with caffeine

then went to alcohol

now we're back at caffeine

[midnight sigil]

[clear sedge]

watch me turn my caffeine addiction into an alcohol addiction again

[obsidian mantle]

damn get_legal_moves is huge

[midnight sigil]

liver won't be having a rest soon I guess

[clear sedge]

pshhht

i'm fiiiine

i'll live 'til i'm 80 trust

[midnight sigil]

the whole file is 3000+ lines iirc

[midnight sigil]

we'll see 👍

[obsidian mantle]

its 1900

oh its only chessapi

[midnight sigil]

oh

[obsidian mantle]

maybe with bitboard its 3k

[midnight sigil]

shouldn't be

who writes a bitboard implementation with 1000 lines

don't tell me

[real sierra]

yeah the psuedo legal move finder is broke

[obsidian mantle]

bitboards are already empty when it goes to get legal moves i think

[real sierra]

either that or

it's the move making code

[obsidian mantle]

unlocked this

[real sierra]

yeah you may be correct

[obsidian mantle]

result

hold a sec

[real sierra]

this should print out all positions that can be moved to by a piece

per direction of movement

[obsidian mantle]

bla bla same lines again and again

[real sierra]

some of those being empty makes sense

[obsidian mantle]

only place with Xes

[real sierra]

but not this many

[obsidian mantle]

thats all

[midnight sigil]

but won't would it be the same outputs everytime

[real sierra]

those 4 X correspond to the 4 knight moves

[obsidian mantle]

yes

no more X in bitboard bump

[real sierra]

with memory issues you can never be sure

[midnight sigil]

[real sierra]

this gives me a place to look at least

[midnight sigil]

mhm mhm

[real sierra]

i suspect either the move making code or the pseudo-legal move finder

need to know now if the board is actually devoid of pieces

or if the pieces are there and the moves are just not being generated

[obsidian mantle]

wait but it only prints 16 pseudo moves

[real sierra]

16 move directions

[obsidian mantle]

oh

[real sierra]

8 directions for north, northeast, etc.

and 8 for knight moves

[obsidian mantle]

right

so it lost compas only knight works

[real sierra]

only the knight moves are showing up

and they're invalid knight moves

[shadow sinew]

How do I build and run toknt?

[real sierra]

@tender river ^

[obsidian mantle]

opp_pseudomoves are much more alive though

but it truly is opp, goes from white side while bot is black

so opp works but own moves dont

how the hell it works on linux more stable

so get_pseudo_legal_moves is broken

hmmm

can i make the bot play as white

look at him go

apparently he cant play black but can white

still failed though

so white is bad too

he tried to move bishop like its a horse

[fast pagoda]

cuda 13 being 2gigs smaller than 12.9 is something

[midnight sigil]

pog big corps doing refactor?

investors go in!!!

[stray dragon]

it's a horrible process, but here's a visual guide:

[real sierra]

well as far as i can tell, the moves are being read and made correctly

[fast pagoda]

lmfaooooo

[real sierra]

so it must be get_pseudo_legal_moves

[obsidian mantle]

looking into it rn but its a bit messy for my eye

[midnight sigil]

pog source discovered?

[fast pagoda]

chay when considering adding automated release to the build run:

[opaque sigil]

too much effort

[midnight sigil]

using bots in workflow is a headache in github

[opaque sigil]

(ignore that it's like 5 lines to create a release too)

[obsidian mantle]

i'll start with pawns since they clearly cant move in correct directions on turn 1 and white pawns can

[real sierra]

god only knows what in here could be platform-dependent

i guess windows cant do addition

[shadow sinew]

Is there no way to build it with sbt from the shell? (I'm on Arch linux)

[real sierra]

good job windows

[trim valve]

you also have to be signed into GitHub

[opaque sigil]

sbt assembly should work

[real sierra]

ill refactor all adding and numbers out of the code (counting to 10 is too hard for microsoft)

[stray dragon]

i'd have no clue but yeah probably

it's just a jar file

if your os can run java you should be in the clear

[real sierra]

i built toknt from source

once sbt is installed you run it and it gives you an sbt shell or something

and then you run uhhhh

assembly ?

and it spits out a jar somewhere

hidden in 100 directories

[opaque sigil]

just run sbt assembly, no need to enter the shell

[stray dragon]

horrible process

[opaque sigil]

it's under target/scala-3.7.3/toknt-assembly-0.1.0-SNAPSHOT.jar

[stray dragon]

bruh seriously

[opaque sigil]

(assuming you use 3.7.3)

[shadow sinew]

sbt assembly worked

[trim valve]

i mean this is why releases exist, so you don't have to dive into actions

[real sierra]

ul..?

[shadow sinew]

unsigned long?

[real sierra]

unsigned long worked fine on linux

but on windows...

[stray dragon]

i am once again reminded of that one post "i am new to github and i have lots to say"

[shadow sinew]

Try ull

[real sierra]

i had to change all the other longs to long longs elsewhere

but totally missed the ul-postifxed constants...

[fast pagoda]

WHERE IS THE .EXE I DONT GIVE A FUCK AABOUTT THE SOURCEE

[stray dragon]

MAKE A FUCKING .EXE FILE AND GIVE IT TO ME

[obsidian mantle]

install ide and libraries and compilers and cmakes and bitboards to run calculator

[olive sable]

i want to buy a new phone and new heaphones but i need the old ones to break first

damn consumerism

[real sierra]

✅

[obsidian mantle]

was it that constant

[real sierra]

i'll push shortly

it was all the constants ending in UL

on windows, longs are half the size

[formal quartz]

man this dll stuff is confusing to get my hands on xD

[real sierra]

so various masks effectively only operated on the white half of the board

[obsidian mantle]

🪟 smh

[stoic turtle]

I believe you need it to be a .so

[formal quartz]

isn't that only linux?

[obsidian mantle]

ok how do i connect it to cpp now

[stoic turtle]

idk, but the instructions say to make it a .so

[obsidian mantle]

hmm maybe clang will save me

[real sierra]

i've pushed a new version of the C API

please let me know if this fixes the outstanding issues

[stoic turtle]

so I don't need to install linux?

[obsidian mantle]

windows lives

[obsidian mantle]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1385795953822273547/1386619384054677545/evil.gif

[fast pagoda]

actually yeah linux is required sorry

[real sierra]

i dont wanna say anything until i have some more proof it works

"works on my pc" has not been a good metric so far

[stoic turtle]

I still get the fatal error thing

[real sierra]

can you show me the error?

[obsidian mantle]

how does it explain a bishop who decided to make a knight move

if these constants seemingly only appear in pawns

[real sierra]

its more than just pawns

the constants appear for a number of bitboard functions

[obsidian mantle]

oh

[stoic turtle]

I dm'd you, I can't upload images here

[real sierra]

namely, the masks in get_pseudo_legal_moves

[shadow sinew]

So I built the C example_bot but how do I connect that to cutechess?

[obsidian mantle]

i was going to check pawn bitboard and it would be empty, then i would check its parts and probably discovered bad constant too

shiro was faster

[real sierra]

open cutechess, Tools>Settings at the top, "Engines" tab, click plus at the bottom, and set the Command to your executable

[formal quartz]

maybe im just not knowledgeable about this stuff but am i missing something installed, it says i need threads.h? sorry if thats like a obvious question

[obsidian mantle]

i got threads error when i tried to build it in C

[real sierra]

which operating system are you using?

[formal quartz]

win 10

[real sierra]

it seems hit or miss if windows has threads.h

[obsidian mantle]

i can show error in visual studio when building with its embedded compiler how is it called msvcsn something

[stoic turtle]

it does mac as well dw

[real sierra]

and macos seems to only have pthreads

[obsidian mantle]

c++*

[shadow sinew]

cutechess won't let me open the binary as an engine. Does it need a special name or something? (it's example_bot right now)

[stoic turtle]

ok back to installing linux

[obsidian mantle]

you must build it

to exe

[shadow sinew]

I did

[real sierra]

it shouldn't require a special name

[shadow sinew]

No exes on Linux 😛

[obsidian mantle]

press the plus button bottom left

[fast pagoda]

i dunno about you but i can click a .exe and run it just fine

on arch

[real sierra]

you may have to set the working directory to the same directory to make sure it can find libchess.so

[fast pagoda]

totally nothing needed right ootb surely

[obsidian mantle]

the plus button is black and the background is black too, terrible design

oh are you on mac
then im no advisor here

[shadow sinew]

I haven't built a libchess.so (haven't found any guide on that). I built bitboard.c and chessapi.c to libchess.a

[obsidian mantle]

i will try to figure out how to fix threads and build in cpp

[shadow sinew]

I can build an .so though if that helps.

[opaque sigil]

@tender river merge pr for toknt ci releases when you see this

[real sierra]

ah no you're right, there shouldn't be a need if you're just using C

i apologise lol

can you try just running the executable on its own to ensure it isnt crashing in some way on start?

you can use the following test input to get it to pass the first blocking api call:

uci
position startpos
go infinite

[shadow sinew]

When I start the executable on it's own it just idles. So no crash or anything.

[stray dragon]

ok tested new chessapi.c file, works

[shadow sinew]

Yeah that works.

[real sierra]

please see the above test input

[real sierra]

on win?

[real sierra]

if it's not crashing then it's odd that cutechess cant start it

[stray dragon]

yep

[real sierra]

is it marked as executable (chmod +x)?

[shadow sinew]

Okay now it worked for some reason.. Maybe I had to start cutechess in the same working dir?

[real sierra]

maybe

well if it works it works

[fast pagoda]

cutechess is an unexpectedly heavy build lord wtf is in this thing

[sage crag]

[sage crag]

Type type

[real sierra]

now then...

[sage crag]

c++

[real sierra]

making this work on mac as well

[fast pagoda]

we out here Type typing

[real sierra]

need to use preprocessor directives to optionally use pthreads.h instead

[opaque sigil]

qt

[real sierra]

anyone know how portable __has_include is?

[opaque sigil]

i don't think there's anything more portable than that but i could be wrong

okay apparently it's part of the c++ standard but not the c one but it doesn't matter because every noteworthy c compiler is also a c++ compiler anyway

[real sierra]

wtf

how do i tell if i should use threads.h or pthread.h if i cant tell which exists and which doesnt

[opaque sigil]

it's fine

there are usually macros you can check

[real sierra]

"it's fine" and then the 50 people with incompatible systems wander in here asking what happened

[obsidian mantle]

so when buillding as cpp the only issue is crt_secure warnings which can be bypassed
and threads.h

threads.h is included in chess_api.c and doesnt get __c_plus_plus define for some reason

hmmm

so i need to include threads in cpp file

but chess api should remain c

[opaque sigil]

__STDC_NO_THREADS__ for checking if there's no support for threads.h i guess

[shadow sinew]

#ifdef _WIN32 ?

[opaque sigil]

sometimes you need to let little johnny with his 20yo freebsd system suffer the consequences

[obsidian mantle]

ifdef mac pthread
else threads or smth

[stray dragon]

damn i was too slow

[real sierra]

that works

[stoic turtle]

I couldn't figure out how to get a linux vm running

[rigid snow]

i'm so glad i don't hate rust

[obsidian mantle]

do i really need to convert chessapi.c to cpp

so threads see it

[stray dragon]

no

[opaque sigil]

it should already be valid cpp as is

[obsidian mantle]

how do i tell threads.h that its cpp
if its included in c file

threads error

not defined

threads.h included in chessapi.c

[opaque sigil]

that's fine

[obsidian mantle]

main cpp file calls functions from chessapi.c through chessapi.h which has extern c thingy

[opaque sigil]

the compiler defines that macro

[obsidian mantle]

do i just use clang

i really like visual studio debugging

[opaque sigil]

visual studio should come with clang too

or maybe that's an optional thing you need to enable

[real sierra]

good thing i just commented out all the pthreads code instead of deleting it

pthread_create and thrd_create have different signatures for the function they want

time for a cursed wrapper

[tender river]

__has_include

[real sierra]

found more portable way

[formal quartz]

while shiro is working hard i found a bridge solution for the meantime at least

[tender river]

[stoic turtle]

mb I think I was one of those

[stray dragon]

example bot just leaves after one game? but it's doing stuff in a while(1){} loop

[formal quartz]

-# seems there is a portable threads alternative called tinycthreads that i could use inplace of threads for now [just replacing the include] (well i have to figure out the rest to see if it actually works xD)

[glass flower]

seems like the c api is fixed for me too

[formal quartz]

-# which also means i uninstall visual studio again

[stray dragon]

wait it's just abandoning the game on the first turn? huh

[obsidian mantle]

if there are still bugs
lets rebrand tournament to "make chess api work without problems in under 1 month"

and then do the chess tournament

is this good?
fetched with github desktop idk if it worked

[real sierra]

i tentatively have the pthread.h support re-added, which will allow use on mac

going to run some tests to ensure it works before pushing but it should be a pretty straightforward change

[obsidian mantle]

it was ul right? and now its ull?

[real sierra]

should be ull, yes

[opaque sigil]

there's UINT64_C(num) for adding the suffix too btw

[real sierra]

that seemed ugly

[opaque sigil]

i mean yeah but who tf remembers all these suffixes

[obsidian mantle]

also more tokens

[real sierra]

and I wasn't sure if I should trust that, because I don't know what type (num) is when I type it

[stray dragon]

ok so it just disconnects immediately and does absolutely nothing else

[real sierra]

adding ull is the only thing I know for sure makes the literal a different type

[stray dragon]

guess i try resetting EVERYTHING in the file to the example bot

and now it works

ok

sure

[opaque sigil]

all the macro does is add the ull suffix or whichever one it is for the current system to the literal you give it

[nocturne olive]

Holy Kotlin STD ChessApi.getLegalMoves(board).associateWith { 1000 }

[obsidian mantle]

got stalemate too nice

looks like it actually works on windows but someone got problems with linux earlier today i think

good luck linux guys

[nocturne olive]

That's so few tokens

For a very big operation

[tender river]

1. .gitignore changes unrelated (you can push them separately if you want)
2. i'd prefer manually triggered releases because pushing a release on every commit is weird

[fast pagoda]

i pooped out a shell script that autoclones toknt repo and then builds it + moves the .jar right in the root because malding and now my life is better AND people find me more attractive when i go in public

i will use it once and have wasted an hour

maybe twice

[real sierra]

it a macro

I'll consider then, thought was type

[nocturne olive]

I have started writing the first version of my own Chess bot

In Kotlin obviously, and holy this STD is gonna be amazing for this

[tender river]

sbt assembly to build a jar. alternatively, sbt to enter sbt and run a.c to run it on a.c

[real sierra]

kotlin sweep?

can your extra tokens make up for a whole JVM in between

[nocturne olive]

Just look at this oneliner to generate a scored map from the legal moves on the board

I do need to make it mutable still, but that's tiny

[real sierra]

14 tokens

[trim valve]

scored?

[stray dragon]

evaluation function probably

[nocturne olive]

Yeah I'm gonna use at least on the first version scores to eval moves

[stray dragon]

quantifying how good each move looks

[trim valve]

oh right

I got confused because that snippet specifically did something different

[tender river]

printf is a separate matter

[opaque sigil]

i'd make a separate workflow for the 2nd that can only be triggered manually, that good enough?

[obsidian mantle]

there is some clang++ that should be able to compile c and cpp together
but it fails

[final tinsel]

cuz of this event when i type ch into windows search to open chatterino i get cute chess instead

[tender river]

clang++ cant compile c and cpp together its just for c++

build libchess.so instead

and link to that

[obsidian mantle]

isnt so a mac or linux thing

and windows will explode

(im clueless)

[tender river]

windows is the problem of windows users i dont care

[nocturne olive]

This is gonna be very interesting

[tender river]

1. cc -o libchess.so -shared bitboard.c chessapi.c -fPIC
2. c++ -o bot_exec -lchess bot.cpp

its technically possible that shiro's c files are cpp-compatible, but not guaranteed at all

so thats the best way to go about it

[nocturne olive]

On one hand, having to put ChessApi. before most API functions will eat some tokens, but on the other the Kotlin STD is amazing at making small code

[obsidian mantle]

whats cc

hard to search just 2 letters

oh i think i found it

so i have to install linux to do it
naaah

[opaque sigil]

if yes then it should be fine now

[real sierra]

the pthread.h version isn't working

[opaque sigil]

[nocturne olive]

I'm gonna be making the absolute most out of type inference, dropping non-needed brackets and small stuff like that

[real sierra]

why is this not working

[nocturne olive]

I'm not even at 128 tokens yet and I already have some kind of logic

[real sierra]

this should be a 1-to-1 faithful replica

[stoic turtle]

where the toknt releases at

[opaque sigil]

https://github.com/TiltedToast/toknt/releases/tag/latest here's one

[obsidian mantle]

is it ok if i change chessapi to export it as dll and then link it to my cpp

(idk if it will even work)

[stoic turtle]

thx

[stoic turtle]

when shiro runs it, it will be using the .so one

[real sierra]

you can export the chessapi as a dll to run it on windows, should be fine

[opaque sigil]

add a conditional attribute that's just empty on non-windows systems and make that the new default

[obsidian mantle]

but i need to add some shenanigans in it

[real sierra]

but i will be running the submissions on linux so don't rely on windows behaviour in your bot code

i'll be using the standard chessapi release, i would not suggest modifying it

[tender river]

you didnt comment out this is the only difference i could find

[real sierra]

if the original needs changes please let me know

[obsidian mantle]

i mean if you will build it

and i somehow manage to build it on windows

and then there are problems with building it on linux

am i disqualified

[real sierra]

hold on i havent pushed the pthreads-compat ver yet

because it doesnt work with pthreads for some reason

[tender river]

ye i meant in the pthreads->threads.h commit

[real sierra]

admittedly im not sure if this is an ethical testing method

#undef __STDC_NO_THREADS__
#define __STDC_NO_THREADS__ 1

[opaque sigil]

that's not how this works

[clear sedge]

https://tenor.com/view/wtf-nasty-disgusted-gross-spongebob-squarepants-gif-16884688

[real sierra]

[clear sedge]

right in front of my monster energy drink

come on

[opaque sigil]

sadly you can't gaslight the compiler

[real sierra]

my system has threads.h so its kinda hard to test a feature that relies on not having it

[obsidian mantle]

do i just do it in filthy c then since its 99% chance i will not be able to participate with cpp

[opaque sigil]

okay fair then

[obsidian mantle]

i guess

[clear sedge]

do it in holy c

[obsidian mantle]

c is like x10 tokens

[tender river]

you can participate with cpp but its up to you to figure out how to do it on windows

[obsidian mantle]

if i figure it out on windows

[clear sedge]

just don't use msvc/windows specific behaviors

easy

[real sierra]

idk anything about c++ so i cant help you

[obsidian mantle]

will shiro figure it out on linux?
what if it doesnt build

[clear sedge]

use posix like a sane person

you can build posix apps on windows

[obsidian mantle]

or i will have to install linux, master it, and figure it out on linux

[fast pagoda]

ZealC

[tender river]

shiro will figure it out, but it wont build if you rely on platform specifics

[fast pagoda]

https://github.com/Zeal-Operating-System/ZealOS

[clear sedge]

you don't have to master linux

you can literally open a linux mint vm, install vs code, and go from there

[fast pagoda]

unless you want to be 16bit only in holyC

[obsidian mantle]

shiro wont touch cpp code on linux

i will have to master linux then

yeah i will just do c then

whatever

[fast pagoda]

you can enable wsl2 and run vscode in gui with the wsl linked to it just fine

[clear sedge]

the struggles of windows c++ programmers

[fast pagoda]

when i was on windows i spent months with wsl2 being the only thing i actually run vscode from

[obsidian mantle]

if i had cpp chess api you would have struggles with your c

same with linux-windows

[clear sedge]

may i suggest looking into cygwin

[fast pagoda]

dont talk to me unless your environment looks like this 😤

[rigid timber]

ew cygwin

[fast pagoda]

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/cpp/build/walkthrough-build-debug-wsl2?view=msvc-170

[nocturne olive]

There's so many little functions I never even knew about but that perfectly do what I need

[real sierra]

@tender river can you take a look https://github.com/shiro-nya/2025-chess-bot-tournament/blob/pthread-compat/src/c/chessapi.c

im not too sure what the issue is here with the pthread mode

[fast pagoda]

threading

is the issue

[real sierra]

oops left the test line in

[fast pagoda]

in general

[clear sedge]

general? you silly billy, this is the programming text channel!

[real sierra]

blame UCI for requiring it in the spec

[nocturne olive]

I actually got the evaluation result getting to this short

This is crazy

[real sierra]

MAXBY

[nocturne olive]

No need to even sort

[real sierra]

I WISH

[nocturne olive]

Yeah there's so many amazing little convenience functions like this

[real sierra]

my maxby is macro'd to hell and back

and still prob longer

[nocturne olive]

Kotlin STD is amazing

[clear sedge]

me when i'm in an implicit behavior contest and my opponent is kotlin (i'm cooked)

[tender river]

not really implicit tho

[nocturne olive]

Only 145 tokens so far

[tender river]

its very clearly defined

[clear sedge]

where is it defined

[nocturne olive]

It's defined as the argument to the lambda passed to maxBy

[clear sedge]

what are you passing to maxBy

[tender river]

you're passing legalMoves to maxBy

[clear sedge]

it's so much syntactic sugar it's practically syntactic diabetes

[nocturne olive]

Well it saves tokens, so

[real sierra]

right mindset

[tender river]

and it is again clearly defined by the language standard

[real sierra]

abandon all morals to save tokens

[nocturne olive]

Indeed

[clear sedge]

syntactic diabetes

[nocturne olive]

But tokens

[clear sedge]

i do not condone this monstrosity

i'm sticking to my c

[real sierra]

#define bclose ) {

my c is beautiful

[nocturne olive]

Less tokens used means I can use add more functionality

[real sierra]

expanded, my bot is 1500 tokens ish

squeezed into 1024 with macros

[clear sedge]

it is implied to exist because you never explicitly state what it is

there's a difference between explicit and defined

[stoic turtle]

how use token counter

[tender river]

you never define what void is in c

[nocturne olive]

I don't even have macros and don't even need them

[rigid timber]

huh... so I got pthreads to compile on windows (also I hate vcpkg now), but it always gives me a1a1 as the only move

[tender river]

or what ( is

[clear sedge]

it is not an operator tho

[tender river]

void is not an operator either???

[clear sedge]

it is literally an implicitly defined variable

you can't compare it to a type

[opaque sigil]

java -jar /path/to/toknt.jar /path/to/source/file

[stray dragon]

@stoic turtle

[tender river]

i forgot you're a java dev

carry on you're beyond saving

[nocturne olive]

I just realized I'm using an outdated bindings version

[clear sedge]

[nocturne olive]

I gotta update it and the release on GitHub

I changed one little thing after compilation, that being how Move.promotion works

[real sierra]

gotta go for now

[opaque sigil]

kotlin is not implicit at all, now scala on the other hand with its implicit defs

[real sierra]

ping me if you discover new bugs

[olive sable]

@real sierra

[obsidian mantle]

ok so the plan is
i either code it on linux entirely
or do it on windows and then fix 5000 issues transporting it to linux

[real sierra]

theres a new branch on the git repo with experimental pthreads support, it doesn't work on linux but if you feel like finding the bug for me that'd be great

[clear sedge]

i prefer my languages with explicity

[tender river]

call it verbosity

languages are literally made to abstract away common operations

if you cant abstract some repetition away thats a failure of the language

[fast pagoda]

3. enable wsl2 and be fine

[rigid timber]

you know what's fun? your old pthreads commit works on Windows if one screws around with vcpkg for long enough... (and then does all the ull and uint_64t stuff)

[opaque sigil]

chay go merge the thing so i don't have to grab the link to my fork when people want a release

[nocturne olive]

That's not very token-saving of you

[tender river]

[obsidian mantle]

is it windows-to-linux converter?

or the opposite

where to i code with it, on windows or linux?

[clear sedge]

you run it in windows

to run a linux environment

[stray dragon]

it's a virtual machine in windows that runs linux

[nocturne olive]

New fixed Kotlin bindings with the proper Move.promotions should be a thing now

[obsidian mantle]

i will spend 5 months setting it up dont i

[clear sedge]

no it's actually pretty simple

[stray dragon]

so you can use windows while having a virtual linux machine set up and running at the same time

[clear sedge]

i think at least

[tender river]

@real sierra you should use pthreads semaphores instead, shrimple as that

[stray dragon]

it's been made pretty easy to use

[obsidian mantle]

and i code in that enviroment and run bot there too

[stray dragon]

yep

[fast pagoda]

it's literally like

[clear sedge]

yes

[obsidian mantle]

and code in notepad

[clear sedge]

no

[fast pagoda]

wsl enable or something

in a terminal

[clear sedge]

you can use vs code

[fast pagoda]

https://learn.microsoft.com/en-us/cpp/build/walkthrough-build-debug-wsl2?view=msvc-170 @obsidian mantle

[obsidian mantle]

i gave it a gliplse it looks like a 1-2 week path to set it up (maybe im wrong)

[fast pagoda]

wsl --install

then wsl --set-default ubuntu

[obsidian mantle]

so i install that thing, then install vscode in it and im good to go?

[fast pagoda]

then wsl

[clear sedge]

yes

sudo apt install code iirc

while in wsl

[opaque sigil]

you don't install vscode inside wsl

[fast pagoda]

yep then wsl

[clear sedge]

you don't?

[fast pagoda]

yes you do

[opaque sigil]

you just connect to it from the host

[fast pagoda]

oh wait it tells you not to now

i forgor

https://code.visualstudio.com/blogs/2019/09/03/wsl2

[opaque sigil]

it installs the code server inside wsl2 and connects to that

just like with ssh

[fast pagoda]

you launch the wsl inside vscode terminal

[clear sedge]

doesn't wsl have its own wayland-comp/x-server or whatever

[opaque sigil]

yes but wslg sucks

[obsidian mantle]

soooo..
like i said.
master linux or die

[fast pagoda]

if you are in vscode, open your terminal (in vscode) and run wsl code . once it's installed

which again is just wsl --install (it does ubuntu by default) -> install the wsl extensio -> do that

[clear sedge]

using wsl is hardly mastering linux

[obsidian mantle]

this is pretty grim

[clear sedge]

you'll be fine

[worldly acorn]

You wouldn't believe

[nocturne olive]

Look at all this token saving syntax

[fast pagoda]

using wsl2 for months in vscode got me to the point that i just installed linux from how much i preferred to use the freakin wsl2 over anything in my normal install but otherwise it works great for what it is

[clear sedge]

possible in java too btw

[obsidian mantle]

what if my linux is different from shiro's linux and it will all break
or does it not work like that

[fast pagoda]

no it does not work like that

[nocturne olive]

Well Java still needs more tokens than Kotlin

[obsidian mantle]

assuming shiro wont lift a finger helping fixing cpp code

[nocturne olive]

If someone wants to grab the Kotlin API and use it with Java, it should work fine

[clear sedge]

sigh
yes yes, semicolons

[nocturne olive]

Oh yeah semicolons are the death of Java

Compared to Kotlin

[obsidian mantle]

vscode in windows or in wsl

[nocturne olive]

Java is just not viable, Kotlin meta

[opaque sigil]

windows

[real sierra]

that's what I originally had until I dumped it for threads.h

[obsidian mantle]

alright downloading vscode lets see what i can do

[fast pagoda]

vscode in windows will run natively in windows but the backend will be connected to the wsl2 so like if you run stuff in terminal it'll be theshell from wsl

[real sierra]

now it would be a lot of annoyance to switch

I think

[fast pagoda]

it's pretty similar to just connecting to a remote linux machine and developing on it from vscode

[real sierra]

I'm also not sure if semaphore.h is everywhere pthread.h is

[obsidian mantle]

and i need the wsl machine running

[fast pagoda]

and by similar i mean pretty much identical

[obsidian mantle]

and hope it will all connect

[real sierra]

so if I already have a custom semaphore primitive why add the dependency

[tender river]

well than theres your bug... probably