Advice on a concept for a WRAITH script

[languid topaz]

Lemme know if you have thoughts / advice very rough concept designed to obscure Wraith info while still being useful.

Outsiders carry a lot of importance for both teams (finding / manipulating them)

Another thought was introducing not in a particular order

Juggler / Math / Empath/ Slayer / Soldier / Oracle

Thanks!

[bronze hinge]

First off: can you sort your script? In the script tool, hit the sort button in the bottom left, makes the script a whole lot easier to read 🙂
Then: You've got 9 evils and you're missing a townsfolk. The 9 evils part isn't necessarily bad, you just never see it as a by-effect that each script needs 13+ TF (most often exactly 13) in order to leave enough bluffspace for evils, and 4 outsiders in order to mechanically function. That only leaves 8 spots on the script, which is the reason you see a lot of 4/4 (and some 5/3) scripts

[languid topaz]

You're right I was meant to get rid of Pukka!

here's the revised.

V1 - changed (no Pukka + Minstrel for a proper 13/4/4/4)
V2 - Alteration but with less BMR vibes and Math / Gossip / Juggler / Oracle /Empath for -Mayor - Minstrel - Fool - Pacifist -Monk)

[bronze hinge]

My feedback will be related to V2.

Your demons are all quite "niche" and asking very specific questions from your script. Not that they're bad or can't work together, but they require a bit more thought than the regular demon.
No Dashii - Strong demon, but needs a town that's not "confirmation" roles heavy and very "information" roles heavy. Think Empaths, not Virgins. Why? Because a drunk Virgin is very easy to detect, as their ability can not work, while a drunk Empath can easily get some correct or at least believable info, making it harder to find the No Dashii and thus a more interesting puzzle. Also, any outsiders added by the evil team are preferrably on the demon side (think Fang Gu, not Baron) because they cannot both be in the starting bag, and additional outsiders make the No Dashii very strong, as the TF neighbors are sitting further apart. Your script has Xaan, which is passable, as long as you keep the Xaan number relatively low in No Dashii bags. Lycanthrope, Banshee and Tea Lady however, are easily confirmed to be poisoned, so a No Dashii sitting next to one of these is just a sad demon, waiting to get executed.
Vigormortis - Vigormortis kind of has the same problem, poison wise. Confirming that a Vigor is in play is very doable for some of these roles. Another requirement for Vigor is that (most of) their minions have ongoing value when killed at night: let the Vigor have an actual upside. Apart from maybe Xaan and Wraith, I think your script does great in that aspect, and even these two minions are very decent.

Lleech - Lleech wants to hide its host as well as possible. The best Lleech host, is the host that never wants to get executed. So as little as possible first night info roles (which you have 0 of) and as little as possible BMR science roles (roles that want to ex themselves and learn stuff when they die or don't die). You have Tea Lady, which is awful for a Lleech. Imagine being the Lleech, hosting someone at random and learning that they're next to a Tea Lady, getting nominated for information day 1... Good game, I guess. A Lleech doesn't need all the cover, let them be outed when executed, they're just fine. A Devils Advocate quickly becomes very oppressive with a Lleech, so I'd personally reconsider that one

I think the minions in general are fine, although some of them are very loud. A night with 2 deaths can only mean that there was an Assassin kill, which confirms there is an Assassin in play (assuming no weird Moonchild shenanigans - I'm getting to that later - or Gossip or Acrobat. That may be enough to obscure the Assassin, but I think it's on the lower side). That's not a huge issue, but on smaller games (7/8/9 players) that means that there is not DA, no Psycho, no Xaan and no Wraith. That's a lot of info, so the Assassin will want to hide that, as most of these minions work best when good has a hard time figuring out if they're in play. Example: Knowing there is no Xaan in play, means that the outsider count can never be increased. On an 8 player game with supposedly 2 outsiders, you know one of them is lying. The same loudness pretty much holds for a Psycho, which is even worse, because they might just randomly get executed and outed. DA is kind of obscured by Lleech and Wraith is just weird, so I think these are generally fine, if you choose to keep them. Xaan gets stronger the more hidden your outsiders are. Drunk is devastating with at least 2 of these demons and Xaan makes it even harder for good to learn anything if a Drunk is in play. Golem and Moonchild however are very very open, as the first is just mechanically confirmed (remember what I said about No Dashii? The same holds for Lleech! A Lleech hosting a Golem is just sad) and Moonchild has this thing of very easily mechanically confirming themself, unless exactly an Assassin kills an additional player and an evil dies at night... that's barely an outsider. Barber is where you want your outsiders for this script to be, I think

[languid topaz]

Interesting - thanks for the thoughts

What would be your reccomendations: the purporse of the script is to play with Wraith, and to obscure to the Wraith as much info as possible (currently think Wraith is TOO strong)

The idea is to do it in 2 main ways, pick 2 'character' types.

All of town either DOESN't WAKE at night OR WAKES and selects ONE player

This gives info to the Wraith, but keeps evil guessing if Town want to play closer to their chest.

With the objective in mind, what would you reccomend to swap out (be it Townsfolk, demons or minions)

I do agree with the Drunk, I think changing the Drunk to Recluse for Empath could be interesting

I also agree with Golem, posioning golem is so sad.

I think Golem works better in the V1 script

even tho it has posioning, cause town survives in other ways

[bronze hinge]

You say Wraith is too strong, but I think that can only be tested with regards to a script. There are scripts where the Wraith is pretty much a Spy that knows all the choices but can't misregister, with perfect communication for evils. That's a very strong Wraith. There could also be scripts where no-one wakes during the night and the Wraith just does nothing. Or anything in between.

Making a script with the purpose of making a certain character weak is a wrong mindset, I fear. Imagine playing a script, built around the premise that a certain character is nerfed on that script. And then you draw that token out of the bag. That's sad 😦

There's plenty of stuff going on with the TF that needs a good look, but it's past midnight where I'm at, and I think that if you try to fix the things I already mentioned about the evils and the outsiders, you're a long way of making a decent script already

[languid topaz]

Thanks!

[vagrant star]

Gave +1 Thanks to @bronze hinge (current: #1859 - 4)

[bronze hinge]

V2 is wayy better than V1 btw, V1 has a lot more "mechanical" roles, which all these demons hate

[languid topaz]

Hmm - here's at attempt at fixing some of the issues, let me know what you think?

And this is the same but with Tea lady and no monk v5

[languid topaz]

and another attempt but with better minion I think?? - let me know which direction you feel is best or if I'm making any obvious errors - appreciate it!