thin zealot
This script focuses on a full, interesting slate of Plague Doctor / Minion jinxes (and no others), along with some interesting worlds for the Puzzle Master to play in. Other than the PM, all the other outsiders want to remain quiet.
Including the Sentinel to keep Outsider count a mystery.
Would love to hear feedback.
reef brook
I think you should swap puzzlemaster for Drunk so you don't need sentinel
Sailor, grandmother, and acrobat aren't consistently bluffable
Sailor is also a poor interaction with lleech, despite how they seem. If the sailor is the lleech host, town will probably execute them for science, then win by accident. That doesn't tend to feel good for either team
thin zealot
I think you should swap puzzlemaster for Drunk so you don't need sentinel
Do you mean: if the script has Drunk instead of PM, then all 4 outsiders will want/need to be quiet?
thin zealot
Sailor, grandmother, and acrobat aren't consistently bluffable
Do you mean on this script, or in general? Are you saying these roles should never get used, or just never get used in combo with a certain other character?
thin zealot
Sailor is also a poor interaction with lleech, despite how they seem. If the sai...
I did not consider that. That's fair. What's another execution blocker I can use instead? Tea Lady also feels bad with Lleech.
reef brook
Do you mean: if the script has Drunk instead of PM, then all 4 outsiders will wa...
Not really? I mean that since the Drunk doesn't know that they're the Drunk, and the baron adds in outsiders, the outsider count is enough of a mystery as is without sentinel
reef brook
Do you mean on this script, or in general? Are you saying these roles should nev...
I mean on this script. All of them are bluffable on BMR for example, because that script has devil's advocate and assassin (among others)
reef brook
I did not consider that. That's fair. What's another execution blocker I can use...
Ultimately you don't really need any execution survival to cover for a lleech, but if you want some then devil's advocate is really your only good choice
-# (DA doesn't make sailor a good combination with lleech still, even if it becomes bluffable)
thin zealot
whoa how'd you make that small type?
reef brook
-# like this
thin zealot
Ultimately you don't really need any execution survival to cover for a lleech, b...
can you go into this more? without execution survival, won't the Lleech be hard confirmed if someone survives execution? i know it doesn't end the game, but it outs the survivor as evil
reef brook
yes, it does, but ultimately that's a fine dynamic for lleech to have
thin zealot
gtocha
i'll consider swapping sailor, g'mother and acro, tho i'm not sure every role needs to be bluffable?
reef brook
i would argue that every role needs to be bluffable yes
otherwise if someone claims it they're just good
thin zealot
i feel like at least G'mother and Acro can bluff well enough given the poison potential in the room
thin zealot
Out:
In:
thin zealot
ugh forgot Magician/Spy jinx, which i don't like. considering swapping out Magician for the new Lycan, which feels actually fun now when paired with Lleech. The ST can make the Lleech host be the evil-registrant for the Lycan.
But maybe i'm missing something
flint bridge
whyd you take out puzzlemaster
thin zealot
because with a lleech, the PM will have to basically flip a coin about which character is puzzle-drunk, and that's not great
flint bridge
oh sure
thin zealot
maybe i'll swap magician for amne
shadow pawn
because with a lleech, the PM will have to basically flip a coin about which cha...
awww, but PM lleech is such a cool interaction. If the lleech is outed, you can distinguish between the lleech host and the PM drunk with the guess. If you guess the host, you dont get the demon, and if you guess the PM drunk, you do get the demon
thin zealot
@shadow pawn never thought of it that way. this only works if lleech is outed tho
dusty elm
No DA with lleech 😦
thin zealot
pacifist is there to cloak the lleech protection against execution
dusty elm
Pacifist feels like an outsider here ngl
thin zealot
oh yeah? how come?
dusty elm
oh yeah? how come?
It means that the lleech could be a pacifist proc, which is harmful for town as it allows the evil team to build worlds where the lleech (after surviving execution) is good.
I'd remove pacifist and add DA
Since DA is supposed to harm town
thin zealot
i see. it's using a TF power to help evil hide. makes sense.
dusty elm
awww, but PM lleech is such a cool interaction. If the lleech is outed, you can ...
Baron + drunk is a better interaction tho
*imo
thin zealot
i see your point about DA but the foundation of this script is having 5 minions that have PD jinxes.
i can remove paci
shadow pawn
fair enough
thin zealot
need a new TF now
dusty elm
Librarian?
It could help locate a hidden drunk
And therefore help town find the real host
Or even build confirmation chains
dusty elm
that's 4 YSKs
TB has four?
thin zealot
right
dusty elm
Any more is bad tho, yeah
Cause then town has much less ongoing info
I'm slightly apprehensive about acrobat
As it could be very powerful and a semi-obvious lleech host when they're alive in final 3
Also gossip + yaggababble makes gossip an outsider
As deaths could be arbitrary
thin zealot
As it could be very powerful and a semi-obvious lleech host when they're alive i...
fair. actually, a worse issue is the acrobat chooses themselves to be safe and accidentally wins the game
dusty elm
fair. actually, a worse issue is the acrobat chooses themselves to be safe and a...
The acrobat would be droisoned in that case
thin zealot
oh i guess they woudln't die in that case
yeah
i'm not as concerned with final 3 issues. if they get that far, the game's been a success (in my book)
thin zealot
Also gossip + yaggababble makes gossip an outsider
gossip point is interesting. i put gossip in to help cover po
dusty elm
Po isn't going to be covered by gossip that much tbh. It could hide a po-charge, but again that's very slightly outsider-y
Boomdandy + lleech is really good actually
I never thought about that
They can bluff that they're droisoned to bait town into killing them
thin zealot
💯
one other idea i just had is remove spy for goblin (which also has a PD jinx) and then put in magician, to help with the lunatic play
i think goblin can be hard for newer players, but then again spy can be a bit overwhelming. tho i do love that it can appear good
dusty elm
one other idea i just had is remove spy for goblin (which also has a PD jinx) an...
Spy adds a really fun dynamic to grandmother where the grandchild has to think "is this my grandmother or just the spy?"
thin zealot
yeah true
dusty elm
And even vice-versa
thin zealot
grandmother seeing the spy as a fake-good grandchild?
dusty elm
Yep
thin zealot
yeah true
ok i'm convinced it's worth keeping
as for PD jinxes, a friend saw this script and said "On the PD, I think there are two fairly common schools of interpretation on the jinxes". but didn't go into it. do you know what he's referring to? i just konw the rules say you give the new minion power to an active minion
dusty elm
as for PD jinxes, a friend saw this script and said "On the PD, I think there ar...
No clue
shadow pawn
there’s a group of jinxes that are just “A living minion gets the ability instead” but the others are pretty unrelated
thin zealot
right but what other way is there to play them? what's the other school of thought?
i'll ask him but just curious if y'all knew
thin zealot
I swapped Gossip for Empath. Gossip was there to cloak a double or triple Po kill, but I think I'm ok letting the Po out themselves if they want. They're going to be incentivized to hide it for a few days to convince folks there's a Lleech.
I considered Preacher (esp for Marionette) but some minions here aren't as fun with it.
thin zealot
v2. We played with the above script and it went great, tho evil won 3 times, twice with Boomdandy. (Technically the first Boomdandy was a PD kill that triggered the BD ability.) I chalk this up mostly to inexperienced players, but in the interest of balance, i removed Po and put in DA, and I'm gonna swap Amnesiac for Preacher
jovial thistle
PD lol
thin zealot
yeah i don't love the new jinx design but what are you gonna do
the script was built on the idea of seeing the tiny PD head on all minions
thin zealot
I think both have merits. I think the justification was less clutter but this doesn’t feel like less to me, and meanwhile the rule about where the jinx goes isn’t easy to summarize. It used to be “attached to evil if possible” (afaict) and now it’s “attached to whichever already has a jinx” which feels … muddier