secret thing

[feral snow]

Yeah this is my answer

[karmic rose]

cult leader + spirit of ivory + fang gu could be funky actually.

[unkempt tangle]

TB butler -> Hermit

If you are executed, your team looses. You think you are a townsfolk, but you are not. You might register as evil and as a minion or demon.

[supple dirge]

Baron adds drunk and hermit drunk let's go!

[karmic rose]

A waltz with insanity: ->

or steward

[unkempt tangle]

TB anything -> Pit Hag

wait actually maybe thats not so bad

Saint is the only REALLY bad thing about it

[karmic rose]

Harold Holt's Revenge: -> would swing that win rate pretty hard

[zenith lotus]

TB imp -> athiest

[sharp violet]

TB Poisoner -> Witch

[pure meadow]

Noooo evils one win con :(

[junior knot]

TB: Imp -> LoT

BMR: Lunatic -> Drunk

SnV: Vortox -> Zombuul

[tardy wyvern]

shab -> lleech

pit-hag -> baron

baron -> marionette

here are my 3 contributions

replacing imp on tb is too easy

[ivory ridge]

me when i'm being contrarian

😔

[sour harness]

There are far worse changes tbh

Librarian kinda actually works

Heretic hatter hermit recluse

Like that's a fine set of outsiders

Gonna feel bad in fang gu tho

[karmic rose]

yeah I mostly dislike librarian fang gu

[sour harness]

Fair

[spiral pollen]

I only posted it to get a reaction out of people

[tardy wyvern]

it’s not the worst tb switch but also what other outsider are you putting on tb

[unkempt tangle]

damsel might be fun

[spiral pollen]

yeah realistically I think its probably the only character you could potentially switch

on TB

[spiral pollen]

zealot perhaps

[unkempt tangle]

TB Soldier -> Anything

script ruined

[karmic rose]

obviously

beginner friendly 🙂

[dry sluice]

S&V: ->

a friend who dislikes evil twin unironically printed versions of S&V with and replaced by and

these were not played

[karmic rose]

evil twin is so maligned

[cold veldt]

why poisoner nooooooooo

wait why remove cerenovus????

[fleet hedge]

HHR ->

[dry sluice]

also dislikes (disliked?) the madness mechanic
apparently mutant was fine though

[muted crescent]

Damn kinda hard 🤔

Butler -> Hermit on TB is so bad for a character swap hard to think of same-character type swaps that'd be worse

[junior knot]

I think da to witch on BMR is up there

[muted crescent]

Yea I ws thinking like da to vizier

[wispy nest]

BMR - ->

[junior knot]

bmr -> ->

But what this question is really teaching me is just how many existing characters are loadbearing on their home scripts

[unkempt tangle]

most townsfolk can be replaced i feel

[foggy grotto]

TB: Imp with Riot 😍😍😍

[junior knot]

Riot with misreg 🙉 ❤️ ❤️ ❤️

[marsh pike]

SNV Artist -> Gossip

TB Slayer -> Courtier

[pseudo fulcrum]

quadjank
Alchemist -> Steward

just to mess with Hystrex

[karmic rose]

oh courtier on mono demon scripts is rancid

[tardy wyvern]

this wouldn’t be awful if you ignored virgin and slayer

[karmic rose]

Harold holts do not interact

[gusty bear]

snv: town crier -> acrobat

[coarse fern]

Snv Vigormortis —> Yaggababble

[versed junco]

SnV Vigormortis -> ||Skinkulus||

[dense moat]

->

[sour harness]

Funnily enough there's basically nothing to counter a steward lol

It's exactly boffin philo

[karmic rose]

let's just put steward on all of hystrex's scripts

[coarse fern]

Why limit to just Hystrex

Put it on every script

[pure meadow]

YEAH! STEWARD!

[junior knot]

I thought we were trying to ruin scripts?

[wicked zodiac]

luf goblin -> vizier

[sour harness]

Oh that's evil I love it

[junior knot]

Use amne for double vizier

[sour harness]

The savant is now incapable of getting info that isn't either useless or game solving 😈

[karmic slate]

"There is a Goblin in play or Exactly 1 player is Poisoned"

[sour harness]

But but it's a vizier script now

[fleet hedge]

It gives you info if there's a Canni claim

You would always know whether the first statement is true so you're basically just being told whether or not there's a poisoned cannibal

[lost thistle]

tb: uh literally any townsfolk->courtier

anyways
snv sweetheart->drunk

i like this because of how subtle and yet absolutely devastating the change is

the drunk just fundamentally shatters so many things about how SnV works, but in a subtle way

its not immediately breaking

but it just fucks up the script

anyways another fuckup:
BMR shabaloth->Lil Monsta

this one is vile because of how badly it fucks with stuff like chambermaid and minstrel

[supple dirge]

Players dying on a minstrel night 🔥

[lost thistle]

we also get Lil Monsta DA

lil monsta just fucks up BMR

[foggy grotto]

add boomdandy to BMR 😈

“hey guys let’s test this fool for science”

kaboom

[hollow oasis]

apparently that's been tested

it sucks

[tardy wyvern]

it doesn’t seem awful

until you remember that people who can’t die can’t die in boomdandy explosions

[hollow oasis]

As in you can't do science because it ends the game

I mean

when you do science

you're testing if people are good

when there's a boomdandy

you have to check if they're good first

which is like

...

cmon

[grizzled marsh]

I actually really want to see what it looks like instead of SnV + fibbin in text games

And tbf i probably don't have in mind everything it messes with
Vortox -> true info
Pit-hag -> you're now drunk!
No dashii + drunk + pit-hag is also an interaction
Juggler
Savant could be interesting
Cerenovus + drunk is also something
Fun combo with evil twin
Barber could make an interesting swap
Fang gu. Just fang gu
Vigorkilled minions next to drunks is also gonna be something

[grizzled marsh]

And now i really want to see that, now that this "short" list has more than only the first three in that list xd

And ofc outsider count but that's not really an interaction with any particular role

TB butler -> hermit is a classic since hermit was revealed but that's something i didn't see anyone mention for today's question

[grizzled marsh]

I'm blind

[karmic rose]

yesss best type of answer

I did once play a game where all the characters were randomly chosen, and it was DA/Mastermind/Lil' Monsta

It did not work very well

[pure meadow]

Drunk -> drink :3

[pure meadow]

(Trouble brewing)

[junior knot]

sailor?

[pure meadow]

Need to find something brb

Here. The Drink from this beauty

[junior knot]

i love how it still calls it the Drunk in the text

[foggy grotto]

7/3: which character of each type would you say is most considered a “filler” character on customs scripts and why?

[hollow oasis]

Most people slap it on, without any interesting advice in mind(because what ever it does is usually solid)

[indigo osprey]

Savant, Amnesiac

[hollow oasis]

It does like nothing, what vote socials does it even cover for

Need O-mod and Droison? Xaan's got you covered.

[ivory ridge]

i have beef with this character

like, a lot

[dusty thistle]

"If this demon doesn't work on this script, I don't know what does!"

Alternatively, because o-mod and extra evils.

[muted crescent]

as said

I find is often filler even where it's not great, but it's not rlly disastrously awful

def has bad interactions but it's often like you need a quiet minion and the remaining ones dont work

[dusty thistle]

is a bit of an "ol' reliable" character. Among novices Drunk is a bit more common since it's a TB character, but I find Puzzlemaster just so much easier to whack on script.

[muted crescent]

is also slapped on a lot

[dusty thistle]

Tack on and you have both your o-mod and droison solved.

Another thing to note is if you have any sort of deathmod on town's side, your solution to o-mod will probably be .

[wicked zodiac]

can't believe nobody has said yet

guys it's an explanation for double claims!!1

[dusty thistle]

Because Pixie never claims Pixie. At least one of the townsfolk examples was actually the Pixie.

Probably Amne, since both mizu and Kenobi mentioned it.

[feral snow]

Amnesiac and Xaan are literally script fillers and exist solely for that purpose (amnesiac for testing stuff and Xaan was made specifically because of all our complaints)

Kazali gets put everywhere even if it doesn’t belong because “look generic boring demon that’s easy to put everywhere” (it’s not)

Idk about outsiders but I feel like no one will object to me putting zealot here

[indigo osprey]

drunk also works basically everywhere imo

except if there is a puzzledrunk

[feral snow]

Drunk I think is way harder to scriptbuild than people think

[junior knot]

Drunk is used as a filler outsider, even if it is very much not a filler outsider

[dusty thistle]

More experienced scriptwriters know Puzzlemaster is the superior filler outsider.

Though it still isn't much better.

[feral snow]

Puzzlemaster is used when Drunk is considered unacceptable

I think PM has its place too and that there are better places to use it than as a drunk filler

But it exists

[dusty thistle]

Speaking of characters tossed on for the lulz, . Everyone loves Lunatic, it's objectively hilarious. Hence why everyone haphazardly tosses it on script.

[torpid mist]

I do think Klutz is the ultimate filler Outsider tbh

By nature of it not being explicitly bad with anything

[dusty thistle]

I threw Snitch on my Leviathan script for similar reasons, so that works here too.

[torpid mist]

Snitch has some bad interactions or just places where it's effectively a blank token (which is bad), mainly on Spidow or even GF scripts or generally scripts where doubleclaims are less of an "issue"

[dusty thistle]

I agree. Klutz runs into similar problems on Leviathan. There is no "one size fits all" in BOTC.

Klutz and Snitch is the closest we get, I think.

[fast anchor]

Snitch is a bit of a nothing Outsider but I feel like when it goes on scripts it usually has some intent

whether that intent is more than "there's at least one of LM/Poppy Grower on this script" is up for debate

[dusty thistle]

Now I want to change Snitch out of my Leviathan script. The only reason it's there is because of Magician. I probably should just remove it.

[fast anchor]

TF: Fisherman- the filler townsfolk that gets put everywhere, honorable mentions to for also being this
O: Drunk - I mean, it usually works, it's just that there are some areas where it works better than others. Honorable mention to
M: Xaan - It's a one-size-fits-all Minion, so it's no wonder that it's here. Honorable mention to
D: Ojo- though I really wish people didn't use this as filler so often, since on BMR-like scripts it really can shine beyond "hey you have a sniper rifle". I guess is kinda fillery but that usually has a purpose for being on a script. Honorable mention to not for being filler but for being a script presence Demon that's a bad idea to put in play on scripts that haven't extensively thought it through

[dusty thistle]

Recluse could also fit the role of "designated filler outsider" since misregistration is so much fun.

[indigo osprey]

I hate how bad no dashii is a filler demon

[naive flame]

TB
becomes
becomes
becomes ,removing
👿 becomes or

BMR
becomes
becomes
becomes
becomes

SnV
becoming
becomes
becomes
becomes or

I went for one of every type..

[karmic rose]

Lleech SnV... rancid thanks

[sour harness]

Does anyone else see the vision 🙏

[hasty abyss]

BMR: devil's advocate -> poisoner

[fast anchor]

tbf if you're adding a +1 to S&V there are worse things to add than Lleech

[zenith lotus]

nah put lleech on GoS 😉

[fast anchor]

the Demons don't attack at night, but instead win after a set number of days

[ivory ridge]

xaan is not script filler

[zenith lotus]

actually there's no room in the character text for a timer 😦

[ivory ridge]

😭

[zenith lotus]

so they cant just slap it on

[ivory ridge]

nor kazali

[feral snow]

the entire reason it exists is to fix script building issues

[ivory ridge]

i agree

that does not mean it’s a filler

[feral snow]

you should read the part where I said Kazali isn’t script filler

[feral snow]

just make it not kill

[ivory ridge]

i can’t lie i have not seen kazali being put as a script filler

[feral snow]

look harder

it’s everywhere

[zenith lotus]

TRUE

forgot about that

[feral snow]

it’s always “I needed a 4th Demon”

[hasty abyss]

yeah i see imp more frequently

[feral snow]

always

[hasty abyss]

the random outsider count is pretty bad

[feral snow]

oh yeah “I needed Outsider mod” too

[hasty abyss]

and often times there are really obvious choices for it

hmm do i want a vizier or a poisoner

[junior knot]

Ooh wait, do i want a pit hag or scarlet woman?

[ivory ridge]

wdym it's the 7th least popular demon

[junior knot]

https://tenor.com/view/why-not-both-why-not-take-both-gif-11478682

[hasty abyss]

why is lleech so high

[junior knot]

Isn't that published scripts?

[hasty abyss]

that's insane

[ivory ridge]

and like, riot levi alhad are notoriously solo script that skew the statistic (there are practically 0 confound because no multi-demon script have them in)

[ivory ridge]

what is the implication here

[zenith lotus]

its interesting

[junior knot]

I think squall is talking about cust scripts here

And reddit and other informal places

With baby script builders

[ivory ridge]

are there something that uniquely distinguish botc.script over these places

[feral snow]

yeah go look through #custom-script-discussion and reddit

[junior knot]

Not like official experienced type people

[zenith lotus]

stuff on that site is mostly content scripts

[feral snow]

seemingly

[ivory ridge]

anyone can make a botc.script account

and upload it freely

[junior knot]

I think it's also a question of drafts vs finished copies

[junior knot]

I understand

[ivory ridge]

1. this is not true, script are being updated constantly, no meaningful distinction between 'draft' and 'finished'
2. assuming point 1 is false, is there a particular reason why kazali get put more on drafts vs finished copies to a statistically significant degree, there cannot be that many vati running around telling people why kazali is bad on x script

[junior knot]

It's more of a psychological thing, imo. Botc.script just feels more official, and so people are more reticent to publish something than discord or reddit

[ivory ridge]

i don't want to entertain a person's personal experience (squall) that lead to a generalized false conclusion that people end up parroting

[junior knot]

fair point

[ivory ridge]

like there is definitely people who use kazali as a script filler

but i don't think it's to a meaningful degree

[ivory ridge]

counterpoint: bpower

[unkempt tangle]

Cannibal

It can only have abilities already on the script, it basically has no bad interactions, and to be honest it just feels kinda weak

[hasty abyss]

noble
recluse
cerenovus
imp

[unkempt tangle]

cerenovus can break a script if the other minions are quiet

Savant is maybe the ultimate filler

I end up putting it on pretty much every script

not because I super want to

[next marlin]

Cere is definitely the easiest loud minion to script for

[unkempt tangle]

but just because it never doesn't fit, and i always need more townsfolk

[next marlin]

It can play quietly and in 1 minion breaking to confirm a cere in play is pretty brutal

[sour harness]

I love lleech barber! I love lleech snake charmer! I love lleech pithag

Yeah it just doesn't work actually

[junior knot]

It helps when there are extra downsides for execution to be careful of

[junior knot]

i love killing the host with the twins still alive bluffing a pithag demon change

[unkempt tangle]

So my answer would be:
Cannibal/Savant for TF
Klutz/Mutant for Outsider

It's kinda hard to think of filler minions, each minion changes the script.
Cerenovus is probably the closest to filler I can think of.

For demons, Imp usually works.

[junior knot]

also Good twin lleech host is definitely fun

[indigo osprey]

Everything that is decided by the st is easy to put on scripts

[karmic rose]

Besides what's been mentioned, townsfolk wise, aren't too bad on most scripts

[junior knot]

goblin is litterally easiest filler minion taht exists

[indigo osprey]

What’s the easiest character (tf) to put on scripts with info not decided by the st?

[junior knot]

paci/farmer can get super confirmatory

[junior knot]

soldier

[unkempt tangle]

Cannibal

[karmic rose]

paci can't be bluffed the same way that farmer can

kill!!! your!!!! minions!!!!

[junior knot]

whoops misread RK as paci here

my b

[karmic rose]

And then have them come out and claim to have strawpassed lategame

understandable, bird gang

[junior knot]

Info wise, works on pretty much every script with the minor exception of where its too weak and where it can be too strong

Recurring info wise, I think might actually be the least offensive non-st guided EN type info role

but i could be conviced otherwise

[sour harness]

Shugenja usually works but there's usually a better option

And it's like fine with lleech

[unkempt tangle]

Chef seems like a balanced role on most scripts

[junior knot]

was answering this hystrex

[junior knot]

YSK its not Typhon

[sour harness]

I mean sure

[torpid mist]

Chef is strong but usually fine

[sour harness]

I've seen a chef solve as early as day 2

That was BSN so maybe it doesn't count

[torpid mist]

some characters definitely don't work with Chef and some help Chef be less dominant

[unkempt tangle]

chef solves rely on confirming layers as evil

[torpid mist]

Spycluse is def nice with chef

[junior knot]

misreg feels almost necessary with chef?

[karmic rose]

recluse/spy temper chef

yeah

[junior knot]

ok council staying on message i see

[sour harness]

Summoner also tempers chef

[karmic rose]

lmao

so true

[sour harness]

For basically the same reasons as misreg

[unkempt tangle]

base 1 minion

[sour harness]

Doesn't change anything

[junior knot]

tempers is way too weak a word here

[sour harness]

Junks

[karmic rose]

summoner junks so many YSKs

[sour harness]

It's like only partial junking tho lol

[unkempt tangle]

Knight: YSK two players, at least one of which will become the demon

[junior knot]

unless its vortox

[sour harness]

It's not like WW or anything

[torpid mist]

Knight is the weakest centralizer in the game istg

[junior knot]

Knight goes hard on legion scripts though

[sour harness]

Knight is op in legion

[unkempt tangle]

YSK the alignment of all players

[sour harness]

That's just how being evil works

[junior knot]

only in outed legion

[torpid mist]

Use Steward for Legion scripts, that's enough

[karmic rose]

if the knight learns players that can become the demon, that's an ST/script issue

[junior knot]

which, like, skill issue

[junior knot]

next iteration of my bad script catalogue, coming up

[unkempt tangle]

throw atheist on every script as a filler townsfolk, what could go wrong?

[karmic rose]

I do enjoy knight + imp/other demons, with player knowledge that I will never show the knight minions in an imp game

but I like conditionals like that

[karmic rose]

figuring out that the knight probably saw a minion -> it's not an imp game

[ivory ridge]

holy shit ysk high priestess

[junior knot]

Tried to absolutely minimize the amount of legal knight pings

[ivory ridge]

it's two en steward!, so half of a hp

[junior knot]

and by legal i mean according to hystrex's definition

[karmic rose]

well I mean I'll gladly show a minion to the knight for 3 of the 4 demons on script lol

[indigo osprey]

I have a homebrew thingy, where every character is 2 characters at once

Such as the bountyward: 'You start knowing one good player. You start knowing one evil player. If the evil player you know dies, learn a new evil player.'

I mixed the knight with the flowergirl on that script and it reads:

"You start by knowing two players that aren't the demon and probably won't be. This info is safe from the demon. Each night*, learn if the demon voted today. "

the clarifier that all knights need

[barren zenith]

[tidal quiver]

I'm surprised that nobody's saying mario

it has the fewest problematic interactions of any minion and I certainly used to use it as filler

[junior knot]

That's because it doesn't do anything (1) it can easily accidentally out the demon (2). While mechanically it has no impact it drastically warps the meta and socials of any script it's on

[karmic rose]

filler characters:

ezpz

[hollow oasis]

Still gonna die on the ojo heretic hill

[lost thistle]

add boffin puzzlemaster to SnV

[junior knot]

That's not a +1

[pure meadow]

that's the point :3

(Me and athe once played in an snv +1 game that had boffin pm and was just generally kinda a clusterfuck)

[junior knot]

The real +1 to add is Typhon

[fast anchor]

too far

[ebon idol]

In defense of fisherman it is just good

I mean, if your ST is good to be clear in the hands of mid and new STs fisherman is a token I’m not excited about drawing

But it’s filler but it’s nutritious and tasty filler

[lost thistle]

what broke me was when nexus (somehow) was worldbuilding with a boffin pm and i was like “hey nexus what the fuck theres no way thats actually a thing”

[pure meadow]

nexus? was he even involved in that game??

[grizzled marsh]

Where did that came from?

[tidal quiver]

on the botc script database, theres a 'statistics' tab

[grizzled marsh]

Ty

[junior knot]

When you're feeling all the saddies
And you need some extra baddies
Extra evils
I guarantee yah

When you play with some more people
and you need some extra evils,
SoI
It doesn't lie

[muted crescent]

Ye, I think support is diff from filler

to me is very script clue/support but not exactly filler

[junior knot]

I will say for my first while playing I was convinced that fisherman was on SnV and Oracle was on BMR

So there's that

[torpid mist]

what hill is there to die on

[foggy grotto]

The thing is this is actually pretty playable which is funny

[next marlin]

[time isn't real]: We've asked about our favourite questions from this thread before, but what are some of your favourite answers?

[fast anchor]

@dense moat canonizing High Priestess x Pixie during the first shipping question

[dusty thistle]

This answer is one of the best we've ever had.

Now whoever answers next, continue the chain.

Please

[lost thistle]

probably every single occultist shittymorph

[feral snow]

I’m so glad people liked that idea I thought no one would get it

[grizzled marsh]

The next answer for today's question will certainly be in the podium

[feral snow]

Bros celebrating their own post before it happens

[fast anchor]

Visionary

Lepakon you were right that is a good post

[lost thistle]

was the occultist being brought up randomly a meme before that? or did that start it

[hollow oasis]

That’s it’s a good interaction actually

[torpid mist]

oh yeah I agree

[feral snow]

Occultist being brought up was already kind of a joke in the sense that it was just a homebrew people talked about a lot. I really liked the shittymorph posts and how I always laughed when I read them, and I wondered how I’d adapt that to this server. As for adding them to the end of long paragraphs, that was all me I think. I’m really glad this stupid joke has continued to make people laugh every day, just like how the Occultist is mad they learned something new every day, but can learn a fact once per game.

[junior knot]

I think my favorite might be the Evil Intimidating Horse from not that long ago

instant classic imo

[foggy grotto]

probably anything from that day where we made character abilities 1 word at a time

[versed junco]

I think this one was very cool and clever and clever and cool

[muted crescent]

5 July: Thoughts on Wraith ?

[lean isle]

Wraith is an interesting character. Haven't seen in practice, making it work in non irl formats is tricky.

[cold veldt]

wraith is literally the coolest thing ever

[indigo osprey]

I don't like a character that teaches a skill set that is basically cheating. I have seen other games have similar ideas before: I still done like it

[acoustic chasm]

The only questionable hint that feels like "cheating" is listening to when players stop talking mid sentence

[wispy nest]

Yeah

[acoustic chasm]

I think its still OK if you rationalise it as "all players accept a social agreement. Only the Wraith may break it and thats ok"

[dry sluice]

funny character idea, idk what it's supposed to do on a script, will probably never play with it

being outed sucks and I don't like tying it to a stealth check

[next vault]

Havent played in a while (havent even played with Hermit) but I don't like the Wraith because it doesnt do much

Like I'd rather be a grim peeker

[indigo osprey]

How is that cheating?

[acoustic chasm]

In live games, it implies someone has been woken by the Storyteller at an unexpected moment

Say you notice that at the start of the night, and the character they claim doesn't wake n1

You may have found an evil player

[indigo osprey]

...

I mean

If I notice someone being suddenly cut off

that' is not cheating?

how the fuck is that cheating?

Like, that's an ST-error (and a player error) more than anything

I enforce the rule that during night time conversations, it's 'prohibited' from asking people direct questions

and as an ST, I just wait or pauze when they are mid sentence: waking them when they are mid sentence is probably not a thing you should do

but if an ST did it

and if someone caught that

that ain't cheating lol

[fleet hedge]

This is why cards exist 😭

[indigo osprey]

I think people are talking about real life games

[fleet hedge]

You can talk while your eyes are open?

[indigo osprey]

Not everyone is equally good at multitasking

[fleet hedge]

Well then that's part of the game

[indigo osprey]

that is what I said, yes

[fleet hedge]

Fair enough

Idk everyone I've played with seems fine with talking while e.g. making their Fortune Teller choices

[indigo osprey]

sure, but for example al-hadikhia choices might be a lot more higher stakes

or the correct kill in final 4

etc.

like some choices are easy and evident

others... aren't? I can imagine that it sometimes is a bit more difficult

or who to cerenovus as hat

what^

[cedar sky]

Wraith is a cool name with a cool icon and a cool ability. 10/10

[cyan reef]

looking forward to seeing it in action, especially in person, though I'm not likely to see it for a while...sounds really fun though

[feral snow]

I playtested wraith (in my own group, I’m not a TPI employee) about a year ago. It was so popular that it’s still a running joke in our group

Seeing people peek behind long hair or get out of their chair to look around me is great

It’s also great seeing people frantically look around for a wraith before getting info

[dense moat]

https://tenor.com/view/dio-brando-gif-25280711

[supple dirge]

Not a tpi employee.... yet

[feral snow]

Trust me I’ll keep asking

[grizzled marsh]

I'm barely playing IRL, so i still need to see how it's turned into online. For now i'm still seeing it as "worse spy" but i'm yet to see how it allows evils to coordonate and how much they can be catched (and if it's using rng, i'll probably end up unsatisfied in a similar way than for psychopath)

[ebon idol]

dont really feel this is very respectful lol

[ebon idol]

I like it, will never play with it online, but interested to see it in my IRL group eventually

[fleet hedge]

iirc evils can private chat with wraith at night on the app or something like that

[foggy grotto]

super cool IRL, kinda weird on the app, unplayable in livevoice and livetext and probably longtext too

[dusty thistle]

Wraith is an interesting minion, and it certainly opens up potential play patters and can allow for better evil team coordination. I'm neutral on it for the moment. My one thought is that I'm surprised that the character named "Wraith" is a minion. I would've thought it would be a demon. It's like finding out the character named the "Dragon" is a minion.

[shrewd cloud]

Absolutely fire artwork. And while I do still think it’ll probably be weaker than Spy on average, I have come around to it probably having a lot of potential in person where coordination is so difficult for evil (though I haven’t gotten to play with it yet)

I’m pretty skeptical of it online though, both because of how the proposed official app changes will work out and because I just don’t think Wraith’s coordination is as helpful as in person. But again, haven’t tried it yet, so I’m keeping an open mind

[feral snow]

July 6, 2025:

It doesn’t matter if it’s good or finished. This is a creative exercise above anything else. Starting at the moment you finish reading this prompt, you have exactly 60 seconds to invent a homebrew character. Go!

Outsider: If 2 consecutive executees are the same alignment, evil wins, even if dead.

[hollow oasis]

Townsfolk: Each night, choose a player. They register falsely to good abilities.

[supple dirge]

Madman (townsfolk) players you vote on might die

[marsh pike]

its definitely leaning towards the fun side of botc rather than balance

it definitely isn't like, adding much to the game by existing

and its very swingy/almost luck based with its power

especially online

its fun but its not balanced

[warped urchin]

Townsfolk: Each night*, learn which player the storyteller believes is losing the game for their team

Idk man I panicked

[coarse fern]

Minion: If an outsider is mad that you are evil, they might die at any time [-1 or +1 outsider]

[marsh pike]

(Townsfolk): Each night*, become the alignment of the most recent executee.

lmao

[feral snow]

These are great I love it

[feral snow]

Good

[coarse fern]

I’ve like

[feral snow]

Pressure breeds creativity

[coarse fern]

Never done homebrew

[feral snow]

That’s the point of this prompt

[coarse fern]

Damn you for this prompt Squall

[feral snow]

I made this prompt because one day I was in a homebrew rut and dark said if I didn’t make 10 characters in 10 minutes I’d be kicked out of APoC

[sharp violet]

Townsfolk: Each night* pick a player: they die. Then, if they are a Townsfolk, you die too.

[feral snow]

This is hilarious

[feral snow]

This is funny and interesting. Not sure if it’s balanced

[feral snow]

Might be an outsider ngl

[feral snow]

This is super funny. I have no idea how helpful it is

[feral snow]

Yeah this is funny too lol

[feral snow]

This is interesting

Definitely a townsfolk

[hollow oasis]

it honestly looks like luis homebrew

[supple dirge]

A Townsfolk and outsider that have the exact same ability text would be funny and interesting

[marsh pike]

(Acrobat)

[shrewd cloud]

(Minion) - If someone chooses a player, they secretly choose that player’s clockwise neighbor.

[marsh pike]

Townsfolk + Outsider at the same time idea 😭

You start knowing a player: if they are executed, their team wins. [-1 Outsider if known player is Evil]

[shrewd cloud]

Then this Minion doesn’t talk to their Demon and the Demon accidentally kills themselves night two

[feral snow]

Limit it to good players to prevent that

[marsh pike]

(Minion): Good players might register as their clockwise neighbor's alignment & character.

silly

[feral snow]

This is technically not the same thing

[marsh pike]

ik its not

[shrewd cloud]

Your wording is probably better in most situations if I was actually trying to build something

[marsh pike]

It only counts for information not mechanical abilities tbf

[shrewd cloud]

Yeah. So if this was turned into an actual thing and not just something I shat out in 30 seconds, the wording I’d use would probably depend on what else is on script

[feral snow]

Yeah I’m not expecting it to be perfect ofc

[feral snow]

Re: this I think I made 2 actually decent characters, 4 that needed big changes, and 4 utter garbage

[hollow oasis]

yo we take those

[feral snow]

This is kind of a townsfolk imo

With a phrasing change it’s solid

[hollow oasis]

that's a TF yea

[tardy wyvern]

Demon: Bomber

Each even night, choose a player. Tomorrow night, they die and their living neighbors might die.

[fast anchor]

Demon: Each night*, choose a player: they die. Then, you may choose a player that voted on you today: they die.

[dusty thistle]

Outsider: Each night, choose a player. They might misregister until dusk.

[supple dirge]

I'm going to misregister them as dead and announce they died in the morning

[simple crystal]

Townsfolk: each night, learn the number of alive Townsfolk.

Kinda a worse Oracle, except the ysk outsider mod part might actually be op now that I think about it

[marsh pike]

would be interesting with evil number changing as well lol

like Summoner or Lord of Typhon

[next marlin]

@feral snow it's the ysk vigor amne

[simple crystal]

Oh that's true

I think combining that with hidden outsiders like poli/heretic/drunk who wouldn't out on death might make it interesting rather than oppressive

[muted crescent]

Realtor(Townsfolk): You start knowing a player who is not a Minion & doesn't neighbor the Demon.

[hollow oasis]

better knight tho?

[muted crescent]

yea

[hollow oasis]

alright I guess

[muted crescent]

tho not strictly better

[hollow oasis]

I mean unless you specifically give one of their neighbors

[muted crescent]

its like a slightly weaker steward and knight in one 🤔

[hollow oasis]

Yeah it's like

better knight but like

it doesn't matter enough

[karmic rose]

Familiar (minion) - once per game, receive a "quest". If completed, choose two players that night: they die.

[dusty thistle]

I am 100% giving this townsfolk the demon at some point.

[indigo osprey]

This is a better knight

[coarse fern]

Yeah unless it learns one of its own neighbors

[warped urchin]

This could learn the demon right? Since the demon isnt a minion (most of the time) and doesn't neighbours themselves?

[indigo osprey]

It could, but they still always learn 2 people that aren’t the demon (like a knight) and someone that isn’t a minion (so knight +)

[indigo osprey]

A knight can learn themselves (which I do in teensies)

[coarse fern]

Oh right

Yeah just better knight

[tacit fiber]

Ambusher (Minion) - Each night*, choose a player: another player who chooses them tonight dies.

[ivory ridge]

Outsider: Each night, become the alignment of the team the Storyteller think is losing

i feel like this challenge make me rehash over idea that barely work in the past, and then ran out of time 😭

I also almost type out a Townsfolk that goes something like "Once per game/Each day, you may visit the ST & made a statement, they will correct it/change one word to something true/false"

the slash is because all the idea hit in my head and i don't know which aspect is balanced, and then i give up

[acoustic chasm]

Townsfolk: You know 3 living players, at least 1 of which is a Minion.

Pretty notable differences

[karmic slate]

tbh I read it at You start knowing

[acoustic chasm]

Yeah

[karmic slate]

not You Know

[acoustic chasm]

The issue is if all Minions are dead, the ability breaks

But it could be "if all Minions are dead, learn this" or smth at the end

[marsh pike]

really powerful

[acoustic chasm]

Ye

[marsh pike]

could just make them drunk if all minions are dead

[acoustic chasm]

Fair

[marsh pike]

"You know 3 living players. At least 1 of which is a Minion. If no Minions live, you are drunk."

[junior knot]

Outsider: If an evil player is executed, a good player might be executed as well.

[indigo osprey]

That’s almost a townsfolk

[feral snow]

Ooh this is spicy

[feral snow]

This is cool too, though it needs a really careful script I think

[feral snow]

I like the idea. I’d probably limit it to alive players and not themselves

[feral snow]

I ran this as an Amne ability once. It was vigor on catfishing and they bingo’d day 1.

[feral snow]

This is very specific lol but I like it

[feral snow]

Ooh. This is flexible enough to not be too oppressive but the kills are super powerful

[feral snow]

I like it. Would the death prevent them from getting info (ex. Would a fortune teller die before learning the yes/no?)

[cold veldt]

me looking at my coop

[feral snow]

I’m making an effort to reply to everything lol

[feral snow]

I like alignment flippers

I’m a little worried it might feel bad to be always losing but maybe you can make a play

[feral snow]

This is cool though

Definitely workable

[ivory ridge]

this is what hercules see when fighting the hydra, i assume

[feral snow]

Woah permanent “you know”. I made a garden of djinn rule based on that but it didn’t win

Def needs that drunk if all minions are dead clause

[feral snow]

I’m trying to figure out how much value that execution has

Granted that might means the ST will always be able to make it bad

It reminds me of Luis’ Rancher

[junior knot]

Good executes the Demon, so the ST executes the Good Twin

[tidal quiver]

demon: en*: pick a player: at the end of the night, they and anyone they chose dies

[ivory ridge]

oh

[next marlin]

me when I'm this demon on an FT script

[tidal quiver]

the first thought that popped into my mind was literally the vigor except it only worked on the first minion you kill so I had to frantically restart

[ivory ridge]

LMAO i thought they mean the demon

😭

[tidal quiver]

now that would be a good ability

look "the first minion you kill registers as dead but does not die" would be neat

that was my first idea

[junior knot]

This on a zombuul script

Quintuple taps galore

[tidal quiver]

I mean it's just worse vigor but basically

[junior knot]

• Vortox if you wanna be really funny

[feral snow]

I’d definitely make the demon not be able to die this way

But I like it

[junior knot]

Finally, a way to deal with Lycanthrope

/j

Imagine this with juggler though

Although it is interesting how it lets them still get info

[tidal quiver]

I'm not sure if juggler would trigger since it's like juggler not choosing goon (and it being a daytime action)

I wonder if the inverse is more interesting: they and anyone who chose them dies

[karmic slate]

https://tenor.com/view/look-at-all-those-chickens-gif-20113673

[dry sluice]

Photographer (Townsfolk): Once per game, publicly say a fact. Tonight, learn whether that fact applies to exactly one evil player.

The fact can be e.g. "Is wearing a red shirt" or "Woke to their ability last night." But ok, now that the 60 seconds are up, I see that this doesn't work because you can twist the fact to smuggle in any Artist question.

[sour harness]

(Demon): Each night*, choose a player: they die & uhh uhm hmmm

(Demon): Each night* choose a player: you swap characters with them. After day 5, evil wins.

[sour harness]

I'd call it a trait not a fact but I see the vision

[wispy nest]

Aliment????

[sour harness]

No

Just character

[wispy nest]

Bruh 😭

[sour harness]

It probably needs the option to not swap actually

But like, swap with your minions

[dry sluice]

I like it. It's like Lil' Monsta without the jank

[pseudo fulcrum]

I've got 2 for you because the first one that came to mind was kinda a joke so I tried to come up with another one

Po-soner (Minion): Each night, you may choose a player: they are poisoned. If your last choice was no-one, choose 3 players tonight.

Demon: Each night*, choose 3 players (all players learn this): each silently choose a number. The players who chose the highest and lowest numbers die, and the other is poisoned for that many days and nights.

[feral snow]

I fuck with this hard actually

[feral snow]

Best demon ever made

[feral snow]

I see the vision

It’s kinda cool

[feral snow]

Shoutout to Po-soner not having a duration so it poisons forever

[pseudo fulcrum]

Dammit

[feral snow]

I fuck with the demon hard though

[pseudo fulcrum]

You know the intention

[feral snow]

It’s really strong but it’s cool

[sour harness]

^^^

[pseudo fulcrum]

The idea of having to come second in something is always really cool (Game Changer reference?!?) and I've always wanted to put that in a demon somehow

[sour harness]

It actively can't choose itself which is maybe good for balance reasons

[ivory ridge]

"is the demon" & "is counterclockwise from you in the nearest direction"

[sharp violet]

“Is Mizu”

[dry sluice]

This demon is really cool.

I wonder if it can be a simpler Tomb-esque demon like "Each night*, choose 3 players: each chooses a number from 1 to 3. Players who chose the lowest number die."

[pseudo fulcrum]

(part of me wants to see how Luis' Bloodwrite would go if it chose 3 and the second survived)

[ivory ridge]

this demon is super duper strong i fear

[pseudo fulcrum]

Also, the ability text is long enough, so this would probably have to be a almanac explanation but in the case of equal numbers, the ST chooses who's higher

[dry sluice]

Or even like "Each night*, every player holds up 1 to 5 fingers. Players who chose the lowest number die."

I guess town strats too much about that during the day

[pseudo fulcrum]

Also this needs like infinite poison reminder tokens lmao

[dense moat]

**??? (Outsider):**If you vote for a player nominated by evil, you become evil.

[lost thistle]

Demon: Each night, choose 2 players. Players you have chosen at least twice die.

[ivory ridge]

oh right

eh just make the poison reset each night

[lost thistle]

wait i feel like somebody else already made this

[feral snow]

Yeah it really needs that lol

This is sick with scarlet woman

But maybe needs some small tweaks

[feral snow]

Actually I fuck hard with this assuming ties kill both of them

[feral snow]

Ooh I like this too. It can’t ever turn good but I think that’s fine

[feral snow]

I feel like I’ve heard of similar but I’m not 100% sure

I think it’s super flexible and I’m not sure how strong it is

[feral snow]

This is maybe what I’d do

This lets it choose itself if you’re a pro gamer

[lost thistle]

me when im poisoned for negative pi days

[ebon idol]

Minion: Each night, choose two players, and good or evil. The first must be mad that the second one is good or evil

[lost thistle]

also what would happen if its a tie?

[ivory ridge]

the hydra after hercules discover fire:

[ebon idol]

the ha(r)ppy

[lost thistle]

must be mad.. or what?

[ebon idol]

ran out of time

they must be mad or they die

not in game 😨

[feral snow]

Yeah very similar to harpy

It’s kinda cool though

[primal crescent]

make a script with that as the bootlegger rule then i'll add it to the library lmao

[feral snow]

Luis you need to answer the prompt

[primal crescent]

no i don't

bc the minute is up

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/577980138155933697/1365711690531995759/Wowee.gif

[feral snow]

Damn you’re getting kicked from APoC then

[ivory ridge]

can't wait to see you become a traveler again for unexplicable reasons

[karmic rose]

Amalgam [traveler] - you have the ability of the most recently suggested reddit homebrew character

This is a constant check btw

[supple dirge]

I want to a see game where players spam reddit to give them the most op ability possible

[cold veldt]

the only problem with this idea is that without interference from the group playing with it, this traveller will exclusively have “All outsiders are drunk [+1 outsider]” as their ability

[hollow oasis]

The psyop did work

[feral snow]

Omg I saw this on botc circlejerk

[junior knot]

Scriptception?

[worldly jasper]

Minion: for everyone that mentions your name today, you learn what their info is too tonight

[junior knot]

Day drinker (Demon): Players who wake up at night to gain information die. Players may choose to avoid waking up. Players who gain information during the day gain false info.

To supplement wraith shenanigans with a Barrowfog on script

[feral snow]

I’m not sure how to feel about this one

I’m not sure the info is worth it

[feral snow]

This is insane lmao

[junior knot]

See but nominations just became a lot more fun with it on script

like the me you him whos on first shenanigan in that amongus game a few years back

[junior knot]

i think i actually hit on a fun design space with DD Wraith and BF, but definitely needs a ton of tuning

[feral snow]

It needs some changes I think

[junior knot]

oh def, but a minute is a very short period of time to come up with a concept and bang out wording

Mr Mediumwig

[ivory ridge]

you think so?

[junior knot]

is this shade or genuine? can't tell mizu

[ivory ridge]

oh i actually did not read the ability, i was just waiting for squall to reply and then immediately hit him with "make a homebrew in 1 minute, now"

ok now that i actually read the ability

so good always win by just never wake up ever and then execute everyone because uh, demon can't kill

[feral snow]

First off I already made one

I followed my own prompt

[junior knot]

who said other abilities can't kill

[feral snow]

Second off yes this is an insane ability

[junior knot]

shopify?

[ivory ridge]

shopify?

[feral snow]

Ability

Autocorrect

[junior knot]

how?

[ivory ridge]

cool now that you're here make a homebrew demon in one minute, now. the timer will start in 5 seconds

@feral snow

30 seconds left

[junior knot]

I love how instead of changing it to ability (what you originally intended) you changed it to autocorrect

[feral snow]

Demon: Each night*, you and each dead Outsider choose an alive player: they die. [+1 Outsider]

[ivory ridge]

15

[junior knot]

chef's kiss

[feral snow]

FUCK

[ivory ridge]

with the edit included, that's 3 seconds left

to the timer

[feral snow]

I’m in shambles today

[junior knot]

I love how this demon can easily accidentally kill itself

[feral snow]

Yeah it needs work but the idea is there

[ivory ridge]

chicken got your feet?

[feral snow]

No

[junior knot]

squall drank too much celebrating american independence from beyond the border

duh

[ivory ridge]

???

we're living in us wdym

[junior knot]

that's the shambles cause

[ivory ridge]

isn't this the 51st state

[junior knot]

depends who you ask

[zenith lotus]

thats puerto rico

[junior knot]

I thought it was greenland?

[ivory ridge]

i almost write 11th province 💀 instead of 51st state

i wonder if canada ever acquire america, how would redraw the border

because a province here is super big

[tacit fiber]

I’d say yes

[feral snow]

Okay interesting

Anyways mizu didn’t do the prompt so everyone shame mizu

[coarse fern]

Shameeeee

[ivory ridge]

wtf no i did

[feral snow]

Where

[ivory ridge]

didn't you reply to it

[coarse fern]

This

[ivory ridge]

probably feels really bad to play

but hey! info outsider!

[feral snow]

Ah yes

[ivory ridge]

also i swear this has been done before, somewhere

i mostly mull over homebrew idea and then silently scrap it

[feral snow]

Yes

I made this so you had to post it

[ivory ridge]

i do be living your head rent free 😔

but no, the only thing i'm posting is your address

[primal crescent]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-tennis-cat-meme-brick-cat-cat-brick-gif-1174694866650002420

[grizzled marsh]

Demon: EN* choose a player: they die. Once per game, choose that they become evil instead

[dense moat]

Demon: EN*, choose a player: they become evil. [No Minions]

[junior knot]

This would go hard on BSN

(kidding)

[sour harness]

this is a personal attack directed at me

[primal crescent]

Alr I’m going to try it, but I’m going to roll a random character to get some inspo

Cannibal

Hm

??? (Outsider) - If an evil player dies by execution, 1 of their alive evil neighbours gain their ability, even if you die.

[foggy grotto]

mfw the scarlet woman gets the demon ability twice after town executes the demon

[primal crescent]

I’m fine w that actually lmao

Just execute the SW first

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/577980138155933697/1365711690531995759/Wowee.gif

[dusty thistle]

This is hilarious with Po. You just get 3 kills every night.

Shab too, four kills each night but the ST is going to start rezzing people left and right.

And Al-Had can get up to 6

Really any multikiller makes this stupidily broken.

I love it.

[wispy nest]

This can increase a lot with legion

[feral snow]

See now you’re getting it

Honestly you could drop neighbour and just give it to the Demon

[primal crescent]

you could but imo it's more interesting to ping it to a neighbour

[feral snow]

Fair enough

[karmic rose]

[7/7] what's one character that you like that your group hates, or vice-versa?

[feral snow]

Huntsman

My group are such whiny babies about Huntsman and oh my god it’s awful

I had one person finally come around to it because they actually tried making a Huntsman script and went “wait omg Squ4ll is right Huntsman is a Townsfolk”

[tardy wyvern]

for whatever reason there are people in my in person group that are very vocal haters of the Acrobat and I don’t know why

also my group hasn’t seen the beauty of New Riot yet and also hates Leviathan

also this goes beyond the scope of the question a bit but my group HATES bmr and most of the bmr characters

specifically gossip a lot of people in my group are like “gossip is so weak because it just makes the death count arbitrary” like, yeah if you’re bad at bmr it does lolol

also obligatory cult leader mention

[hollow oasis]

Legion(insert legion engineer trauma)

[ivory ridge]

squall trying to say something positive about their group: challenge impossible

[feral snow]

be a better group then

I’m kidding they’re good friends and I value them

I just disagree with like every single one of their Clocktower takes

[ivory ridge]

huntsman is a bad character though

i think it has its place on whatever base script that its getting put on

but also if minstrel is release today without the context of bmr

maybe it is better off not releasing

i think judging a character without a script yet by its interaction that uh, is not on said script is fair

[hollow oasis]

App players think engineer legion scripts are good(that one script TPI recommended) and then think legion sucks

[ivory ridge]

oh wait i can answer this: wizard

i love wizard

best minion ever

but everyone including squall refuse to run wizard

😔

or my wizard script

[hollow oasis]

Oh

That’s uncool of them

[ivory ridge]

ikr

like i would st a legion script for them (and livevoice if they ever vote it)

but they wouldn’t do it for me

https://tenor.com/view/ahoklollmao-noooo-nooo-noo-no-gif-17139315586294057944

[hollow oasis]

Like

[minor pier]

Wizard is probably my favorite official character, it's so fun to run.

[hollow oasis]

Wizard is prob best minion

Specifically because I like changing good’s wincon

[feral snow]

What??!!

I run and play wizard

[ivory ridge]

run good* wizard script

[feral snow]

See I do I just don’t run fang Gu drunk

That’s fully unrelated to Wizard

[hollow oasis]

Oh LOL

[feral snow]

Mizu is still lying anyways like half our group loved wizard

[hollow oasis]

Ngl

I keep hearing “unsolvable wizard”

[supple dirge]

This is so real

[hollow oasis]

Now

That’s a skill issue

[ivory ridge]

nuh uh

[hollow oasis]

From the ST

[ivory ridge]

two of the people there fundamentally do not agree to wizard script

[feral snow]

Two out of like 200

[hollow oasis]

This is the Botc discord equivalent of ToS “why me”

[feral snow]

Get over yourself

[ivory ridge]

the amount of time my wizard script have been denied 😔

over like, wizard atheist or wizard wincon spam

[feral snow]

Wizard atheist was ran one time

Stop lying

[ivory ridge]

and that immediately sour all wizard idea and no wizard was ever run again until the 24 hours botc

https://tenor.com/view/ahoklollmao-noooo-nooo-noo-no-gif-17139315586294057944

[foggy grotto]

a lot of my group thinks chef is useless

i gave someone a chef 0 once and they straight up told me and the town “cool i have useless info”

[versed junco]

have they tried, and hear me out on this

building worlds

[tardy wyvern]

how many players does your group usually get

[foggy grotto]

9-20 it really varies

[tardy wyvern]

chef 0 in like 8-9 players is usually not too helpful but in anything more than that it’s extremely good

[foggy grotto]

but i’d say an average of like 12

we usually get 2 minion games

[tardy wyvern]

ok in that case your group is wrong Lmao

[foggy grotto]

tbf it’s not all of them

some of them see the glory of chef

the funny thing is they have no problem with clockmaker

[tardy wyvern]

clockmaker is a lot more blatantly overpowered on its home script than chef is

[foggy grotto]

yeah fair

[tardy wyvern]

mainly because tb has misreg

[karmic rose]

my hot take is that wizard usually ends up being weaker than most other minions LMAO

[versed junco]

especially when people keep wishing to be funny instead of helping their team

[cold veldt]

my immobile demon looking on in terror as i wish to become a tree after they've been seen correctly by the ravenkeeper

https://tenor.com/view/arriba-gif-12324188786972117417

[karmic rose]

real

[versed junco]

I'm all for the funnies, but wizard has exhausted its maybe two jokes

[ivory ridge]

i wish a townsfolk become mayor 2 🥺

[versed junco]

three jokes

and one of them's good

I did wish to gain the ability of hit lynchdale role vizier once

[ivory ridge]

oh btw you know about the good lynchdale almanac

i realized pretty early on that i could just adjust the link from “good character” to “evil character” and gain full access of the almanacs

https://tenor.com/view/raccoon-im-out-bye-run-away-flee-gif-16153664

[versed junco]

I'm confused

you realised the links are at the top

[ivory ridge]

NOOOOO

i did not know that

i can't read

wait this is kinda peak

[versed junco]

See I did it because it was a good idea

It just also happened to be funny

[ivory ridge]

wait you're the lynchdale creator?

no way

as in "no shot"

[versed junco]

No I meant the wish

I merely chronicle its lore

[ivory ridge]

a true storyteller

[fleet hedge]

I am Warwick has an original idea?

[versed junco]

that's I Play Warwick to you

[hollow oasis]

could honestly be slapped on actual vizier

it's pretty cool

[versed junco]

The highest praise

[grizzled marsh]

In this server: Marionette is my least favorite character, while most people seem to be fine with it. And wizard is fun but it's hard to find games with wizard
With my group: most are big fans of drunk and lunatic, i don't particularely have a strong love/hate with either. And on the opposite side, i'm almost the only one that's asking for virgin (+ UT when it's in play) science on tb

[hollow oasis]

See

the difference

is that

This server

does not love TB(most think it's just good)

[foggy grotto]

you have not met livevoice

[acoustic chasm]

livevoice loves tb

I love TB

[wispy nest]

I personally love pacifist. And the reason for the hate of it is that it is good da bluff and feels very outsider like. So when I see pacifist on a non BMR-like script, I get very excited

[hollow oasis]

play my legion script?

[wispy nest]

No

Does it have paci and no da 😲

[wispy nest]

What is it called

[hollow oasis]

It has paci and DA

but uh

just run pacifist like on BMR

or give it in savant info

(I had a game with 4 exe survivals. in a row)

[wispy nest]

I think paci is good on any script because it is like a virgin

Or nightwatchman

[tidal quiver]

That's generally fool's gimmick, as far as the exe survival chars? Of spending an exe to confirm yourself

[wispy nest]

Just needs to balanced right

[tidal quiver]

Virgin is already strong but protecting the player instead of instantly killing them is very strong for tempo

[wispy nest]

I don’t like fool

[tidal quiver]

Well you see, the secret is that fool isn't meant for BMRlikes

[wispy nest]

Fool is soooo meh

[tidal quiver]

Fool is interesting to find droison

[wispy nest]

Yeah

BMR does it well

[tidal quiver]

Not as an exe survival character and only tangentially as a bait role

[wispy nest]

But every other script, it sucks

[tidal quiver]

I'd argue that BMR gets away with it but for a different reason than most scripts, I think it's stronger to find evil droison as opposed to good

And generally more interesting on something like a xaan script

Or some other sort of evil droison

[faint ember]

time to run outsider amne and outsider pacifist

[karmic rose]

I like fool on BMR as a way to force evil to chew through more characters LMAO

[tidal quiver]

it's the world's weirdest WW-confirmed ravenkeeper and I'm not elaborating (half because funny and half because I gotta run)

[dusty thistle]

I love Organ Grinder, mainly due to how fun it is to time as the OG and trying to coordinate town when fighting the OG, but a lot of live voice seems to hate it.

[tidal quiver]

no way @malvora

[fast anchor]

epic ping failure

[marsh pike]

i don't have a group, but a character I like that most people seem to hate is evil twin

[feral snow]

That’s a common one yeah

[marsh pike]

idk i like evil twin

[feral snow]

People seem to hate evil twin but it’s so good mechanically

It’s one of the best designs in the game

[marsh pike]

I think snv isnt the best at showing why evil twin is good

how do ppl feel abt cult leader

i rarely see it

[supple dirge]

I love evil twin but I think I could count the number of times I've seen it on a custom script on 1 hand.

[sour harness]

It's a cool concept but poor design imo

However it works extremely well on The Phantom Detectives from the world cup

[hollow oasis]

Love it

[supple dirge]

Cult leader's ok, I don't really want to go for the win condition as a good player and don't really like how much time it can take up in the day

[hollow oasis]

but like

I play cult leader.... to win with good

[sour harness]

Just don't give them a widow to explain the cult past d1

"cult? Ok raise your hand in 3 2 1 freeze ok no cult"

[supple dirge]

I'm usually not the one running cult leader if its being run lol

[marsh pike]

I had a traveller idea earlier thats basically cult leader but instead of winning the game or requiring a vote, it just sways the Storyteller to make decisions in its current alignment's favor lol

[sour harness]

Fair

[hollow oasis]

the Cult Leader's job should be convince everyone your neighbors are good.

This is wayyyyy easier if you kill your neighbors when you're evil

[marsh pike]

can i see it?

the script

[sour harness]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1349782157673103472/1376471365292523641/SCR_ThePhantomDetectives_v5p2.png?ex=686d7a1b&is=686c289b&hm=fc1a4aec2e44b5be49e31e84e04659238e6316e632969544f261209cd42c4228&

Note the djinnlegger rule at the bottom

[foggy grotto]

7/8: I have never seen minstrel work on a customs script, does anyone have a custom script they’ve seen where it actually does? if not, create one >:)

[marsh pike]

sigh now i have to

[fast anchor]

A Grimm Chorus by Zets

[muted crescent]

Lol I think I played a game of it with him as Minstrel and he specifically got annoyed at how much my existence messed with people's info

Then I got summoned into a Po

[coarse fern]

Virgin for whatever reason

[foggy grotto]

which way

[hollow oasis]

sounds like the first

[coarse fern]

I like it, my group hates it

They think it’s an outsider

[foggy grotto]

has your group just like never played TB or something

after a virgin execution i usually just explain to any new players that the virgin is confirmed good

or someone else does

and then all rejoice

[coarse fern]

We’ve played it plenty

I’m still the only person who actually wants to nominate the virgin

[foggy grotto]

tragic

i hope they soon see the light

[coarse fern]

Someday 😔

[muted crescent]

Scarlet Woman

[tardy wyvern]

cult leader SUUUUUUUcks

[foggy grotto]

^

ignore my pfp it has a cool design

god (TPI) gives its coolest designs to its jankiest characters (CL, Vigormortis)

[cold veldt]

cult leader is pretty cool when the ST isn't allowing players facilitate obnoxious bits through attempting to form a cult

Paradox runs it well where he does cult votes immediately upon a claim, and the CL is expected to explain themselves before trying to form one

[foggy grotto]

i mean yeah part of CL is annoying time waste but that’s not the main issue imo

[tardy wyvern]

“cults are annoying” is like the tertiary issue

and an issue it shares with like 4 other good characters

[fleet hedge]

cult leader suffers from the mezepheles problem

most players just want to be evil

[cold veldt]

i disagree. cult leaders being assholes and playing for evil does not make every single cult leader game a slog, it's fully the 500 funnymen that want to form a cheese cult

[feral snow]

That’s what I thought Dell was saying

[fleet hedge]

At least in my group, Cult Leader has helped evil more than it has helped good on net

[tardy wyvern]

this is also not my primary issue with cult leader lol

[next marlin]

these characters are both good because I relate spiritually to their aesthetics which means they lack any other issues

[next marlin]

that's my biggest issue with it

[tardy wyvern]

by tertiary issue I mean the third most significant issue imo

[fleet hedge]

I would disagree with Vigor being janky

It tends to be on par with the other S&V Demons

[next marlin]

I don't really mind the "townsfolk goon" thing because in the end a cl with confirmable neighbours is a wincon with no counterplay

[tardy wyvern]

my main problem with it is just that cult wins never feel satisfying to go for in early or late game

[next marlin]

but the 390576068506895 cults are awful

[cold veldt]

that's fair

[tardy wyvern]

people don’t want to go for cult wins early bc they want to play the game, and they don’t want to go for them late because the cult leader is probably evil

[cold veldt]

but i feel like limiting the cheese cults and having only actual cult leaders desperately trying to get people to join their cult to avert certain disaster would make it a much more thrilling process

[fleet hedge]

Yeah this is my other problem, CL is a win con that if good wants to go for at all, they have a better chance of pulling off in the early game than the late game

[next marlin]

I ran a game once where a series of lucky snipes solved the entire evil team d1 and town executed the recluse for "being next to the cult leader" (cl claim was saint trying to bait a kill)

[karmic rose]

I've seen an empath in whalebucket claim CL until evil gave them a sober 2 😭

[tardy wyvern]

i agree but it doesn’t change my fundamental problem with cl game design wise

for clarification I do find fake cults annoying. CL is just such a bad character that it has problems that transcend that lol

[fleet hedge]

Also a lot of storytellers will just keep CLs evil whenever they have at least 1 evil neighbour

which just makes it even more outsidery

[foggy grotto]

the amount of CLs that just turn evil and die about it is alarming

vati said they don’t mind TF goon but

i do

it’s not a TF design and the “empath but worse” ping you get from it does not make up for it

[spiral pollen]

yep ^

this is the main issue

[foggy grotto]

especially when you’re incentivized to lie about said ping to play for your team

just run Kenoboi™ Brand Cult Leader and wash away all your worries!

[versed junco]

Kenoboi™ Brand Cult Leader being?

No advertisment is complete without the product

[tardy wyvern]

kenoboi CL is a way way way better character than vanilla CL and is still bottom 5 in the game probably

[cold veldt]

dawg can you say what it is then

[tardy wyvern]

each night learn the alignment of one of your living neighbors. if all good players join your cult, become that alignment and win

[versed junco]

No advertisment is complete without customer complaints

[karmic rose]

oh that's a much better TF

[spiral pollen]

yeah it's better in every way

[foggy grotto]

100% agree lmao

[dusty thistle]

My hot take is that every single character in clocktower is good.

Design wise. Alignment wise some of them are evil.

[tardy wyvern]

i think like 85% of them are good

[dusty thistle]

Interestingly if we do the math, exactly 2/3 of all characters (ignoring travelers and fabled) are good characters.

92/138

[supple dirge]

Just like real life

[lost thistle]

idk i think the recluse is evil

7/8: Rename an existing character to something like “the Bluffer Scuffer” or “the Thinker Stinker”
(if you arent brainrotted by #speculation-and-spoilers you probably wouldn’t get this, ask somebody who is to explain it to you)

[dusty thistle]

Xaan->the Cooler Baron

[foggy grotto]

my question got buried i think 😔

[feral snow]

Damsel -> “Outsider must hide her”

[feral snow]

Yeah rip

You got an answer at least

[foggy grotto]

saul good

[feral snow]

I just don’t know of many minstrel scripts

[fleet hedge]

This proves that Minstrel doesn't work on customs

[tardy wyvern]

my bad I didn’t see your question I saw the cult leader mentioned and had to go hater mode

To answer it: No

[fleet hedge]

/j

[tardy wyvern]

Except maybe AGC but I’ve never played that script with minstrel in the bag

[dusty thistle]

To answer your question Kenobi, also no

[feral snow]

NOOOOOO GOOD MOON RISING

[tardy wyvern]

This script is ass but it’s not minstrels fault

[lost thistle]

lleech bmr 🤢