#(WIP) Using Fluid Dumps or Mechanical Fluid Pumps for Water Wheels? I made some maths about it...

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static oasis
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Fluid Dumps

Unit conversion

If you do not care about the maths, just skip this part.
Okay, first difficulty: the fluid dump base output is 3 units per hour, and the water wheels conversion rates are expressed in m^3/s... the units do not match!
So what is 3 units per hour expressed in m^3/s?

The easiest part is 1 m^3 = 5 units, so 3 units = 0.6 m^3.

Then we need to convert hours to seconds so 1h = 3600s, right? Well... no. We want to convert beaver hours to player seconds. How do we do that?
A beaver day consists of 768 ticks, and each tick lasts for 0.6s, so 1 beaver hour = (768/24)*0.6s = 19.2s

Finally, we can calculate 3 units/h = (0.6 m^3)/(19.2s) = 0.03125 m^3/s

The table

With the fluid dump output in the matching unit, I can now create the attached table below.

The table below lists the amount of power generated by each beaver in a power wheel, the water output per fluid dump, and the amount of power generated per water wheel of each type and per fluid dump. Finally you can see how many Water Wheels of each type you would need so that each beaver in a fluid dump would generate as much power as if they were in a Power Wheel. All of this depending on their well-being score.

I also included bots at the bottom. Of course they cannot work in power wheels, which is why some columns are left as N/A.

Okay, but how do Fluid Dumps compare to natural sources?

For comparison, you'd need 32 Fluid Dumps without work speed bonus, or about 9 at full well-being (+260% work speed) to generate 1 m^3/s and generate as much power as listed in the water wheels tooltips.

And what about water input?

Honestly, I'm editing this because I just thought about this. I'll have to make proper calculations later, I do not have time right now.
But I have the feeling the results would be quite oof, you'll need a lot of pumps to feed the dumps

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Mechanical Fluid Pump

Maybe instead of Fluid Dump, you thought of using Mechanical Fluid Pumps, but then you realized how expensive they are. With enough water wheels you could cover the cost, but how many? I made the calculations below.

Well... that's a lot!
The good news is that the amount of water wheels needed does not depend on the amount of mechanical fluid pumps, as long as your channel can handle the water flow.
The bad news is you'd need both many pumps and many wheels...

(table removed because it was incorrect, see the fixed version a few comments below)

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Using Fluid Dumps or Mechanical Fluid Pumps for Water Wheels? I made some maths about it...

twilit pasture
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Uh.... I'm pretty sure that you have the wrong numbers for the wheels. I know compact doesn't take 77 to pay for a mech pump, and ft only needs 21

static oasis
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Hmm... 🤔

twilit pasture
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Should be 11 large, 24 compact, 21 ft

static oasis
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It seems I'll have to double check the values I found in the wiki with in-game experimentations...

twilit pasture
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Someone just pointed out that wiki shows mech pump as .15, it should be .25 unless I've lost me marbles

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Can't check from bed though

static oasis
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Yup, .25 does match with the amount of wheels you mentioned.

static oasis
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Table updated with pump at .25 m^3/s

image.png
twilit pasture
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Compact still looks high

static oasis
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It does generate much less power than the large ones though, 60 vs 270 (or 120 vs 540 as displayed in game), the ratio seems right to me.

twilit pasture
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Ft and large are seeing effectively .125cms while compact gets .25

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It's based on average flow not total flow

static oasis
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Need more testing 😄

twilit pasture
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I mean it looks like you're theory crafting, which nothing wrong, but it may be worth actually building out

static oasis
twilit pasture
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There's ways to build compact to actually produce more than large for the same area used

static oasis
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There's probably an issue with the dumps numbers as well then.

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I did test with FT and it seemed to match my theory crafting, I think the large one is fine too, although not tested, but the compact is probably wrong.

twilit pasture
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Tbh i didn't even look at that because of how inefficient and irregular dumps are for power

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Also you have to add in significant hauler support

static oasis
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Inefficient with workers, but dumps are quite small... but then you'd need pumps to get the water... a lot of it (tbh I thought about it only after I initially wrote this)

twilit pasture
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Yeah. Each dump is 2 workers, plus hauler support

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Except for FT large pump, that one has better ratios

static oasis
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But they're bigger too

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So you'd need a lot of space any way

twilit pasture
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Ehhh

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So technically yes, they're bigger than one

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But they take up a little over half the shoreline space compared to 3

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But one large is actually like 4 or 5 (can't remember) normal pumps

static oasis
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Ok, it takes slightly more space than 2 normal pumps (9 vs 4, not counting the pipe above the water), and pumps as fast as 5 normal pumps.

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Suddenly my guide feels meh and full of mistakes, is it worth keeping it?

twilit pasture
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just have to refine it

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you did the hard work, you just found out some variables are slightly off

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should be able to do a straight swap of variables in your formulae

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the hard part is the logic

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and i hope i didn't break your will to make guides-we need more

static oasis
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Okay, I wrote a notice at the very top to warn that there are some mistakes, I'll need to come back later, I cannot do it right now.

twilit pasture
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it may be worth creating a clean thread when you're done though, and removing this one once you're done with the new

static oasis
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You are probably right, I don't think I'll be able to replace the screenshots.

twilit pasture
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above image edited in

static oasis
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Using (WIP) Fluid Dumps or Mechanical Fluid Pumps for Water Wheels? I made some maths about it...

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(WIP) Using Fluid Dumps or Mechanical Fluid Pumps for Water Wheels? I made some maths about it...

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Apart from those mistakes you pointed out, do you have any comment about the wording or formatting, anything else?

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Wait something isn't right, I didn't take into account that the FT and large wheels effectively receive half of the flow (because it's split in a 2 block wide channel), but somehow it's the compact one that happened to be wrong. There's something else I do not get.

twilit pasture
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i convert things differently, so i would have to do math and unfortunately i don't want to do that right this second

static oasis
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It's fine, I'll figure it out (I hope)

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Oh, I think it's because the fluid simulation runs at 0.5x speed. Okay, I'll come back to it tomorrow probably...

twilit pasture
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not anymore

static oasis
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But I did get my values from the wiki, seemingly from when it was still the case.

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So using the new in-game values and paying attention to the 2-block wide wheels should fix everything.