Leafcoats - New faction (Early Access)

[torpid patrol]

it's also not easy to see what you're drawing when this is what you see

I think I got the Jags on the lightning bolt pointing backwards

either way, @acoustic yarrow, give me feedback.

[acoustic yarrow]

heh, looks like they're crying.

[torpid patrol]

is that a good or bad thing?

[acoustic yarrow]

looks weird

I wonder if it would look better on the shoulders or upper torso

[torpid patrol]

hmmm

[acoustic yarrow]

mmm, maybe searching for tatoo ideas would be useful

yea, https://designyoutrust.com/2018/04/circuits-and-nature-unite-in-georgie-williams-futuristic-tattoos/

[torpid patrol]

I don't really want to do something too complex, I'm not really much of an artist

and I'm basically just drawing on a Skin, a Texture, so it's not exactly a 1 to 1 with what you draw.

[acoustic yarrow]

yea

[torpid patrol]

so, you like it on the shoulder better?

I suppose I could try and do it down the back

[acoustic yarrow]

yea, shoulder looks much better. I assume the other shoulder is pink?

[torpid patrol]

yes

I can change colours too, I just went with the example from the images shared previously.

[acoustic yarrow]

I'd go with bluer blue, and more red,

[torpid patrol]

I can change eye colour too, or fur colour for that matter, I just drew it on default Charcoal beaver, I think you mentioned that at one point.

what do you mean by Bluer Blue?

[acoustic yarrow]

Yea, I think on charcoal would be fine, although that doesn't match the leafcoats very well,

currently it's cyan and pink, something closer to blue and red would be nicer

i.e. less to no green

[torpid patrol]

so, you want the more... Royal Blue colour.

I can see how you'd say it's Cyan, but it has less green than Cyan already

Like I said, based on the colours...

here

[acoustic yarrow]

yea, it's accurate to the colors in the pictures, just not my preference 🙂

I'd like shiny, but I don't think that the game can render that can it?

[torpid patrol]

I'll move them closer to blue and red

[torpid patrol]

I mean it can, but that means changing the normals, AO and or Metalic layers too, and things currently aren't set up to give beavers a unique layers other than Albedo (Main Texture).

[acoustic yarrow]

yea, something like anodized aluminum apparance, but I don't think the game is set up to do it

so a deeper blue & red might be the closest to achieve that

[torpid patrol]

So, you want to be a Charcoal Beaver, or should I change the base to something else?

[hidden cape]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1377606620342648832/1466048080011853965/images_49.jpg?ex=6987d96c&is=698687ec&hm=3766620182860056d2e6a28a1e8a0c009388ec80afc8a93f7cbf5dd833abead8&

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, I saw that one too.

[acoustic yarrow]

Charcoal is good, I think the stripes will probably show better on gray, than the other colors

[torpid patrol]

so you like it as is, or do you want me to change things?

I can change things like tail colour, eye colour, etc.

[acoustic yarrow]

maybe the middle colors from https://www.schemecolor.com/navy-blue-and-red.php, #020082 and #BA0600?

[torpid patrol]

also I think I lost track of something over time as I was making things, because Emberpelts and Charcoal beavers have blue eyes, but their icons have green eyes.

[acoustic yarrow]

heh

[torpid patrol]

BA0600 is basically pure red.

there's a little shade in there, so it's darker than FF0000

and I think the blue is basically the same, says 240 degrees, but is considerably darker.

numbers say its about 50% liminous where the red is 73% luminous

[acoustic yarrow]

yea, maybe #CC0000 and #0000CC then?

[torpid patrol]

I went with the original colours, because it has the more... Flourescent feel to them than pure colours.

also, something I noticed back when I was doing Factorio modding. I made Spitters with a hue of 240 degrees...

They looked purple on my monitor at the time, like REALLY violet.

[acoustic yarrow]

or do those look too saturated?

[torpid patrol]

"Pure" blue seems to have the least consistency of any colour on monitors.

[torpid patrol]

(The ones I'm currently using are set to 100% saturation and 100% luminocity)

[acoustic yarrow]

so #ff0800 and #0400ff?

[torpid patrol]

It's your design, so I'm not going to completely ignore your imput. While I'm not much of an artist, one of the things I am pretty good at is colour theory and colour design philosophy

for example, while designing a character (Snake-like, but Pokémon themed) I came up with several pattern colours

these are 2 of the final designs I went with.

I also considered this one as a Sylveon inspired design, but when I started to do the maths on it, it actually looked terrible.

[acoustic yarrow]

Sylveon's is nice, my son would be requesting an Umbreon in 2 seconds flat if he saw it

[torpid patrol]

You want Yellow markings on black then? 😛

You know what...

[acoustic yarrow]

no, I said my son 😜 not me

[torpid patrol]

Take a look at that blue

[torpid patrol]

does it look somewhat familiar?

[acoustic yarrow]

I may have seen it before 🙂

[torpid patrol]

No I didn't colour match it to umbreon or anything like that, I just played around with the sliders and settled on that, by looking at the this.

There's a reason why this blue on black actually shows up quite often

Basically: Colour theory says it's a good blue to put on black

My monitor already hates the blue you chose.

That or my eyes, I'm not certain.

[acoustic yarrow]

heh, those look good

[torpid patrol]

can I tweak the blue slightly into the green?

like this

[acoustic yarrow]

yea, show what it would look like

[torpid patrol]

I'm not entirely sure what it is, but to me, anything that's too close to the 240 degree colour range doesn't look right.

almost like I can't see blue properly

It's REALLY dark, and triggers "Ultra-violet" feelings to me

[acoustic yarrow]

Neon blue is #1F51FF, (227°, 88%, 100%), not sure what you ended up with but it looks more in that direction

[torpid patrol]

my software doesn't show it in degrees, let me math this

[acoustic yarrow]

(Neon red #FF3131, looks too washed out for my liking)

[torpid patrol]

223 degrees

Yeah, 3131 basically means turn saturation down... well, to 88%

Both of the colours used here are still set to 100%100% on Saturation and Lightness

well...

depending on the scale, there's no "White" or "Black" lean, so 50% luminoicity, which is 100% lightness

[acoustic yarrow]

so which colors are you using at the moment?

[torpid patrol]

or vica verca, the slider literally just says L

[acoustic yarrow]

looks good to me

[torpid patrol]

for reds, I typically go with anything from huge 0 to about huge 10

after 10 it starts to look orange

as for blues, I typically usually use from about 160 and below

[acoustic yarrow]

The Google Color picker has RGB, CMYK, HSV and HSL

yea, 170 is definitely cyan to me

[torpid patrol]

that's 170 degrees, which is out of 360, my numbers are out of 256

so 170 degree is more like 240

[acoustic yarrow]

240° is solidly blue, yea

[torpid patrol]

and I typoed, I meant 160

which is 225 degrees

[acoustic yarrow]

200° is about the start of "blue" for me (142/256)

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, I'd use 140 to 160, or about 195 to 225 degrees as "Blue"

You start getting closer to 240 and to me it starts to become more Violet.

[acoustic yarrow]

for me that's only around 245° (174/256)

[torpid patrol]

now... contextually, yes, 240 is blue. But only for small areas.

[torpid patrol]

so, how happy are you with this?

did you want any other changes, like eye colour, tail colour, etc?

[acoustic yarrow]

mmm, let me compare the textures

where are they in the exported files?

[torpid patrol]

ummm... Materials/Beavers/Faction I think

[acoustic yarrow]

do they all have blue eyes?

interesting,

brown would be prefered,

the gold beaver has also auburn

[torpid patrol]

I gave Leafcoats Yellow (Gold) eyes

[acoustic yarrow]

I can't find their image, is it in the mod, or the script pack?

[torpid patrol]

Leaf Coats mod

data directory

Materials/Beavers/LeafCoats/Adults

[acoustic yarrow]

ahh,outside the assetbundle, not inside

[torpid patrol]

Yeah

Same place for Emberpelts, except obviously Emberpelts not Leaf Coats

note: I may have hidden special beaver textures inside the asset bundle

[acoustic yarrow]

Beaver looks good in game too

The colors might need to be switched with each other, nautical minded will want port to be red 🙂

[torpid patrol]

sure, I can swap

like this then

icons

hmmm

Can I just go with a Charcoal and give it yellow eyes?

[acoustic yarrow]

yea

[acoustic yarrow]

heh, I was remoted into my machine, started downloading a Unity update, and it went into sleep mode because the remote session terminated because there wasn't enough network bandwidth for it

[torpid patrol]

¦3

You're sure you want Norman, not Normanr?

[acoustic yarrow]

yes

[acoustic yarrow]

63, heh that's me when I don't want to get up in the morning 🙂

[torpid patrol]

I renamed a random beaver I had with a duplicate name

[acoustic yarrow]

yea

[torpid patrol]

okay, slight problem with just giving a charcoal yellow eyes

you can't really tell

I doubt anyone actually noticed emberpelt icons have green eyes but beaver models have blue

Terrible drawings

If you think you can do better, feel free to try.

[acoustic yarrow]

ohhh, that's nice

[torpid patrol]

they're probably not going to be noticable when you resize them down to the size they appear in the game

I can probably do better, but I need to head to bed.

so not right nwo

[acoustic yarrow]

Hopefully the last two are never needed, but mistakes can happen 🙂

[torpid patrol]

yes

I mean, look at Cokenose

that's his natural face

[acoustic yarrow]

Does his infected avatar look any different?

[torpid patrol]

Basically just the same icon as a contaminated Charcoal beaver

Also, Cokenose gets a unique texture and icon like the other named beavers, but his name isn't in the name pool

So you have to actually name a beaver Cokenose to see it

[acoustic yarrow]

so no chance to auto-generate?

[torpid patrol]

I removed "Coke" from the prefix of my Charcoal name geenrator, so, even with that mod, he won't show up naturally

Though, now with my other mods, Split Breeding, District Control and Building Control...

It's actually possible to have lots of Charcoal beavers, rather than just a small chance

so I should expand my name generator.

[acoustic yarrow]

What's the earlier version of the game and script pack that support custom beavers?

[torpid patrol]

{"Id": "End", "List": ["fur", "pelt", "paws", "tail", "hide", "face", "nose", "belly", "teeth"]}

[torpid patrol]

I think as far back as U6

I don't think it's the same level as it is now, and back then you had Specs rather than Blueprints, but you could do it.

[acoustic yarrow]

ahh, the sets were added later,

[torpid patrol]

Yes, Sets were added later, when I added Bot Name Generator

Ironically, I allowed you to add a custom name list for Bots, but never actually made the Name Generator compatible with bot naming

I semi-did, you're allowed to actually define a bot name generator, but I didn't define one, and there's no hook for it to do anything with it.

To make it work, you'd either need Harmony, or Name Generator would need Script Pack as a dependency

I can probably get around that, so it can link to script pack without it being a dependency, but that might require some complex coding.

[acoustic yarrow]

I just went with 0.7.10.0 as a baseline

[torpid patrol]

what are you planning to do?

[acoustic yarrow]

Put it into a separate mod for my son

he's still playing on non-experimental

[torpid patrol]

aha

hold on

[acoustic yarrow]

my first pass did absolutely nothing (in 0.7),

[torpid patrol]

I can't remember how different U7 and V1 are.

[acoustic yarrow]

Mine is similar, I just removed the Charcoal suffix from the graphics,

it works fine in 1.0

[torpid patrol]

it probably isn't expecting the filename to end with .blueprint

Compare...

Emberpelts mod

the files in U6 data/blueprints/custombeaverbyname to the ones in V1 data/custombeaverbyname

oh, don't forget U7 NEEDS that Blueprints subdirectory

[acoustic yarrow]

yea, that was my next guess

That might actually work for 0.7 and 1.0 then

[torpid patrol]

hmmmm

put it in the blueprints subdirectory, and have .blueprint as a suffix on the end of the file.

Yeah, might work.

are the files internally the same between U7 and V1?

[acoustic yarrow]

yep, that was it

close enough that it works,

[torpid patrol]

awesome

[acoustic yarrow]

U7 doesn't care about the file having a .blueprint.json extension

and V1 doesn't care about the Blueprints folder

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, it looks for keywords like .optional, but it's not looking for .blueprint, so it will just see it as a suffix, like .Norman

Awesome

anyway, off to bed. Have fun

[acoustic yarrow]

ciao

[torpid patrol]

I need to put some serious thought into what to do for a wonder.

Though I do want to try and keep it on par with vanilla, so no fancy features like making the map green, or spontaneous plant growth.

[outer python]

A Mallorn tree, a new bakery recipe for Lembas, and a lawsuit from the Tolkein estate

[acoustic yarrow]

"Just this morning I received a letter saying please see attached..." -- (||Skye Storm||)

[worldly trellis]

I still think Grow the wonder. instead of build. haven't given much thought to the effect.

[astral ermine]

Kinda like lapans whitepaws, having the giant golden sequia tree, have a giant maple tree. You'd research a special forester with a set "grow" boundary, aka the 7x7 area typically reserved for wonders. Then once done the forester needs to feed the tree water and extract?idk... but when launched releases a bunch of the little helicopter seeds out into the world

[worldly trellis]

I was thinking extract, Dirt, Bark and Branches. Maybe Golden Apples for the effect

[zenith venture]

Idea for the wonder, some form of the World Tree ( Yggdrasil? but Beaverfied? )

I chucked "Yggdrasil timberborn style" into Gemini and it gave me this

(Obviously this is just for inspiration 😄 )

[torpid patrol]

Not sure I'd want that as a wonder, but it does match leafcoats building style.

[pulsar crest]

Hi @torpid patrol ,
I am getting an error loading my leafcoats save.
InvalidOperationException: Need with id Apple not found or multiple needs found
I am wondering if you can help me out.

[torpid patrol]

well, I was about to head to bed, but... I have seen that issue before. I can't remember what was causing it.

Zxuiji send it to me. Are you using any of his mods?

[pulsar crest]

i have it in my installed mods (the Greedy... factions) but for this save, i only used just the Leafcoats.
no worries. Go to bed. I will experiment disabling the Greedy factions to see if it fixes it

[torpid patrol]

I don't remember all the mod configurations, could be a mod load order issue too, not just if you have them installed.

For example, you want Greedy factions after Emberpelts or Leaf Coats, but extension mods like Emberpelts: Food Extension after Greedy factions.

[pulsar crest]

oh. okay. i'll review the order too. Thank you. I will post my observations here (if i ever figure it out)

[torpid patrol]

Good luck!

Keep in mind I've just spend the past 8 hours (with only a half hour break for food) working on v1.0.10.0 updates.

[outer python]

I reported that error last week, happened if I had greedycoats or greedy embers in the load order prior to split needs.

if I loaded split needs first, no crash but the wet fur and plant murderer debuffs didn't work

haven't tried again with all of today's updates

[torpid patrol]

That's probably it then.

Not sure why split needs after would cause it to complain about apple.

Since I haven't gone to bed yet...

okay, they don't have #append in the file, that could be it.

[outer python]

Here's the post with a player.log: #1377606620342648832 message

my theory was it was actually the "or multiple needs found", since leafcoats and emberpelts both have apples

but we never specifically confirmed that.

or at least, I had to leave and you had something else too,

[torpid patrol]

there has to be a faster way to move a mod down 40 steps in the mod list

hmmm

it didn't crash, but filtering isn't right.

Emberpelts for example have Wet Fur and Wet Fur (good and bad)

but only Folktails have Carrots

okay, there's definitely some corruption here. the Emberpelts and Charcoal files are identical.

oh wait, that's normal

you have to put food extansion after split needs

wait...

why do emberpelts have 78 need score, but Leaf coats only 66?

I know there's no 10 points from the Wonder, but that's 2 points lower than they should.

Missing Swimming Pool and Greenery.

So, Faction mods first.
Then Greedy Faction mods.
Then Split Needs
Then Emberpelts Food Expansion.

Most of the other mods (like Split Breeding, or adding buildings like Emberpelts: Project Phoenix and Leaf Coats: Badwater don't care about load order)

Minor update for Greedy factions compatabillity.
Added missing Leaf Coats needs Swimming Pool and Greenery.
Also renamed WindGauge to Weathervane

off to bed.

[outer python]

Ok, that load order works now, and even made the Wet Fur/Plant Murderer debuffs appear

Thanks!

[torpid patrol]

Thought.

Change Pruning Flag to be unlocked from the start (if it isn't already) and add a Pruning Lodge (Like the Gatherers Lodge)

Probably not going to do it, but it's a thought.

[torpid patrol]

I have other thoughts too, unfortunately still no plan for the wonder.

Most of the other things I'm thinking about are aesthetic

[astral ermine]

I'm all for upgraded buildings to make the less beavers more efficient locked behind science and resources

[torpid patrol]

yes

[torpid patrol]

Updated for V1.0.10.1 - Fixed for change to the new Entity Namer system. (Fixed Bot Namer crash)

Updated for V1.0.10.1 - Fixed for change to the new Entity Namer system.

[torpid patrol]

difficult to test for when the mod just doesn't work for me.

[torpid patrol]

Since I can't test myself, due to not being able to run base Greedy Coats/Nation... Try this.
let me know if it works.

[torpid patrol]

We have greedy builders, embers, coats and nation...

I'm considering a few of my own.

Emberpelts and LeafCoats for example.

I'm also not sure if I'd want other combinations.

Leaf coats for example feel like they'd mesh well with folktails... but then their food choices and some features of architecture mesh better with iron teeth.
And vica verca with emberpelts

Emberpelts feel like they'd get along better with iron teeth, but building style and food feel more folktails.

I think if I do anything, I'd do Emberpelts and LeafCoats, but then go the other way, and make the Charcoal faction, mostly Emberpelts but with a few changes.

Then the Emberpelts and Charcoal faction... but Charcoal are already in Emberpelts.

So perhaps it would be a Charcoal free Emberpelts faction?

[torpid patrol]

Update for latest version of Greedy Coats/Nation.

[torpid patrol]

So, apparently there's a bug where you can't name the Leaf Coats (and Emberpelts) district buildings.

I'm also thinking I should make the Contemplation Spot satisfy Greenery, because the beaver is basically staring at a flower.

On the note of "Named Buildings", currently only the district center does that.

Should I make other things namable?

[torpid patrol]

Fix not being able to name a district center.
Since the Leaf Coats contemplation spot has flowers, they now also grants Greenery wellbeing.

[muted prism]

Translating to deDE I stumbled over these missing lockeys. Are you interested to include this translation in the mod?

[torpid patrol]

Yeah.

You've done translations for me before, if you want to add new translations, that would be cool.

[muted prism]

Will be playtesting the translations for a little longer.
Regarding BeaverPlant. For me both plant descriptions are not visible and the doubled growth time for adults seems not to work. Both showing 5 days growth time.

[torpid patrol]

Adult plants start another timer once they're fully grown.

so
Child plants will have the beaver born as soon as the plant grows.
Adult plants will start a 5 day maturing timber when the plant grows, then when the timer fills up, the beaver is born.

[muted prism]

So it's like other harvestables like berrys, grapes etc. Would it then be possible to add the fragment for the second stage?

Translation deDE

[torpid patrol]

Yes, but it has a unique locale entry.

[muted prism]

Changed the Good.Shovel entrys from "Schaufel" to "Spaten". Spaten is specifically used for loosening dirt.
And thank you very much for another great vanilla-like faction. Another great gameplay variation.

[torpid patrol]

I guess that's like the difference between Shovel and Spade

It'll be in the next update, but I'm not going to push an update just for this... unless I don't do anything before V1 goes stable, then I'll release it anyway, even if the mod doesn't need updating.

[desert rover]

A new deceptively dangerous map {333 x 222 x 111+13} I made that I am currently testing with LeafCoats on modified normal (I -always- do 100% building refund).

The first test was with WhitePaws, but my computer started really choking at 1,500 beavers around cycle 35.

My current goal is to get this colony to around cycle 75, to see if I have a snowball's chance of surviving a late-cycle explosion I have planned. 😉

@torpid patrol In case I have never said it, I much prefer this ladder over the default ladder. 🙂

[torpid patrol]

It's why I included it.

and changed the price and everything so they're the same, just a costmetic difference

The one in the frame is supposed to be the one you use in the tree core

[desert rover]

I like it everywhere. Prevents visual ladder abuse too.

[torpid patrol]

Ideally, the other one should be limited to "Against the wall"

not even Stackable, just "Against the wall"

[desert rover]

Since it is only visual abuse, how important is it to change?

[torpid patrol]

but that would require editing not only the block object validator, which in theory should be possible because there's one to allow it to be built on the side of terrain, but also additional code for the rotation.

[desert rover]

Save your effort for the final monument. 😛

[torpid patrol]

and I'm not sure how important it should be.

Also I've kinda been avoiding working on that, partly because I haven't finalised the idea

I've actually been thinking more about the Charcoal faction lately.

[desert rover]

I get this.

[torpid patrol]

the idea for Charcoal faction is...
Make a set of new Wellbeing and Decoration buildings (half as many as currently exist in Emberpelts, specific combinations), make this a Emberpelts Amenities Extension pack (like food extension)

Then for Beaver Faction Split Needs, make a division between them so Emberpelts like some, and Charcoal like others, with about a 3rd of them total in common (so they both like 2/3 of the whole range)

Then, based on the split needs divisions, make a Charcoal Solo Faction, and an Emberpelts Solo Faction.

[desert rover]

I've never messed with the split, but that sounds neat.

[torpid patrol]

So, the original Emberpelts faction, with Food Expansion and Amenities Expansion would be equivelent to Greedy Builders.

I could do the Embercoals faction as the two together, but the original Emberpelts mod already has the two together, so I'd rather keep that as the combined faction mod.

[desert rover]

Floodgate Scripting with LeafCoats

I thought I would share one of my little script configuration for LeafCoats.

image 1 - simulated drought showing nearly everything sealed up.
image 2 - simulated flooding causing the floodgates to drop a bit
image 3 - simulated overflowing causing floodgates to fully open
image 4 - actual normal operating condition (generating power) without any overflow
image 5 - (actual weather) bad tide starts - everything opens
image 6 - bad tide is here (dam is producing power as the water level rises faster than it can drain)

top floodgate script (signal from depth gauge):

condition:(and (le (sig Signals.NOX.main.drain) 265) (and (ne (sig Weather.Season) 'DroughtWeather') (ne (sig Weather.Season) 'BadtideWeather')))
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 160)

condition:(and (gt (sig Signals.NOX.main.drain) 265) (and (ne (sig Weather.Season) 'DroughtWeather') (ne (sig Weather.Season) 'BadtideWeather')))
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 150)

condition:(and (gt (sig Signals.NOX.main.drain) 280) (and (ne (sig Weather.Season) 'DroughtWeather') (ne (sig Weather.Season) 'BadtideWeather')))
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 100)

condition:(and (gt (sig Signals.NOX.main.drain) 290) (and (ne (sig Weather.Season) 'DroughtWeather') (ne (sig Weather.Season) 'BadtideWeather')))
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 0)

condition:(eq (sig Weather.Season) 'DroughtWeather')
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 200)

condition:(eq (sig Weather.Season) 'BadtideWeather')
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 0)```

middle floodgate script (opens/closes powered dam):
```py
condition:(eq (sig Weather.Season) 'DroughtWeather')
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 100)

condition:(ne (sig Weather.Season) 'DroughtWeather')
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 0)```

bottom floodgate script:
```py
condition:(ne (sig Weather.Season) 'BadtideWeather')
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 100)

condition:(eq (sig Weather.Season) 'BadtideWeather')
action:(act Floodgate.SetHeight 0)```

(The scripts are using Igor's automation mod - it exports in lisp)

Oh, and if you were wondering, here is the setup from behind.

Contemplating the toxic waste radioactive doom!

[acoustic yarrow]

linq? Maybe you meant Lisp?

[desert rover]

Yes. I keep doing that. -FIXED-

linq is a data query language

[acoustic yarrow]

Language-Integrated (Natural?) Query

[desert rover]

I did -not- know that. I just know I had to learn it on the fly enough to make something work, pre 2010.

[acoustic yarrow]

huh, apparenly only Language-Integrated Query. Natural is not part of the name

[desert rover]

I have to keep reminding myself that this isn't WhitePaws; I should have had robots at least 5 cycles ago.

[desert rover]

I also realized that will a little creative stacking I could get everything needed "inside" one tree.

@torpid patrol we need a tree shelf! Something that uses 1/3 of a floor and has a platform on top of it like the bot part factories. 😉

Of courser if I really had my way, you'd make 3 more of the 2x3 storage units with opposite configuration on the door placement so I didn't have to use so many medium piles to balance the stairs.

(In my mid- to late-games the sides are used up by bot charging stations so no longer work for ladders.)

[desert rover]

Well, a couple of bad tides later and I discovered I needed to revise my script. Three conditions could be active at once and it was behaving unpredictably. I believe I have it fixed but before I post it I want to test through another bad tide (whenever that hits).

[acoustic yarrow]

btw, log are still showing these warnings (maybe you fixed already I don't remember):

FactionSpecGoodsValidator failed for Faction LeafCoats: GoodCollectionSpec with id  LeadCoatsAddons  not found
FactionSpecNeedsValidator failed for Faction LeafCoats: NeedCollectionSpec with id LeadCoatsAddons  not found

The leading double space is an issue with the FactionSpecGoodsValidator code (it's present in the debug string)

but the extra trailing space seems to come from the CollectionId?

[torpid patrol]

Adjusted Decontamination pod to be in line with new vanilla.
Updated for v1.0.11.0, Fixes only, no new features added yet.

Updated for v1.0.11.0

Updated for v1.0.11.0

Need "Clock" => "DecorativeClock" as per V1.0.11.0

Added German translations by juf0816
Fix Typo in unused Need and Good Collection
Updated for v1.0.11.0, Fixes only, no new features added yet.

Added German translations by juf0816

Beaver Faction Split Breeding:
Updated for v1.0.11.0

[torpid patrol]

Mergeable Valve

Should the wood on the valve be white?

like the levee?

[desert rover]

I would say yes... just to make it look a little more different from the sluice

But being mergeable, I am not 100% certain on that.

[torpid patrol]

I plan to remodel the sluice anyway

Leaf Coats Valve is sideways mergeable, just like the Sluice, because pretty much everything in Leaf Coats is Mergeable.

[desert rover]

I prefer the green look then.

[torpid patrol]

I didn't do the side

[desert rover]

That back row looks really good

show it with a row of levies on top?

[torpid patrol]

like that?

[desert rover]

I think I really like that

[desert rover]

Yes!

[torpid patrol]

in theory though, from the front like that, the only way to tell the difference between a valve and a sluice is by the green bar.

back is a bit more obvious

I think I'm going to change the sluice to be all wood

and change the recipe to not need metal

I could adjust the wooden top a bit too, to be more like that of the levee

[desert rover]

I have less of an opinion on the top, but that is because it usually has other stuff on it, or, at minimum, one of your hedge-lined roads.

No... I like the top adjustment even if it will usually get buried

While you are designing stuff, what did you think of my "wishing-for-this" requests? 1) Would they be easy and 2) would you even consider them? #1377606620342648832 message

I don't want to eat a lot of time right now while you are trying to get updated if they are going to be a significant effort.

(or if you just don't like them)

[torpid patrol]

hmmm

I thought you were talking about Branch Platforms, but then it mentions storage...

I'm not sure if I'm confused, or that's multiple ideas.

[desert rover]

There are 2 ideas.

1. a tree platform 3x3 total, but only 1x3 is part of the tree. the other 2x3 extends outward to put stuff on.

2. make opposite-entry-positions variants of the 3 3x2 storage items. So we have a 3x2 liquid storage with a bottom entrance and one with a top entrance. And so on for the other two.

[torpid patrol]

So, Tree platform. kind of like an overhang, except the base of the overhang is a tree block?

[desert rover]

Exactly. In function like the bot part factories.

[torpid patrol]

I was planning on making (and delayed due to the 1.0.5.0 bug that deleted things on tubeway bridges, and would effect this) a Branch platform. Kind of like how you can put the Branch Contemplation Spot on the side of a branch, you'd be able to put this Platform on the side of the branch, and build decorations on it.

[desert rover]

This is what inspired me:

[torpid patrol]

plus just branch decorations overall

but I guess I can do something like that too

[desert rover]

That would be cool.

[desert rover]

I really liked being able to add the refinery in there.

[torpid patrol]

I'm not sure about making new storages though. Part of the reason why the doors on the Piles and Warehouses are backwards is to help differentiate them

[desert rover]

I usually put them in pairs for ladder reasons when I want the sides to still be usable. Often that leaves me with a major excess of piles. /laughs

Could just be me though.

[torpid patrol]

Offset the heights

they're 2 high, you don't have to put everything on the same slice

Put a 1x3x1 house on one side or something, then stack more 1x3x2 warehouses on top of that, the doors will be offset from the others

[desert rover]

That is an option and one I have done, but I like them even for ease of putting big things like wind generators up and such.

[torpid patrol]

That's where you put something else 1 high on the top.

Granted, there's not a lot of 1 high options

[desert rover]

That is the problem. More 1 x 1 x 3 options would be really cool.

[torpid patrol]

a small house, a bot charging station, and one of the branch access blocks, that's about it of the useful things

last number is height, so 1x1x3 would be like the 1x1 storage, but 3 high instead of 2 😛

[desert rover]

Using houses leads to the WhitePaws problem of ending up with more bavers than one needs.

[desert rover]

1 x 3 x 1 then. 😛

[torpid patrol]

Either use no breeding and beaver plants, pause the house, or just don't have a dedicated housing block.

if you use something like Commute Balancer or Housing Optimise, you really should be mixing houses in with your workplaces.

[desert rover]

Again, because of WhitePaws, I have trained myself not to pause housing, which is considered cheating. I need to break that conditioning for LeafCoats

I love Commute Balancer. It is even working adequately for 2nd shift although I was warned it could be funky.

See, a lot of my problems are just that; --my-- problems.

[torpid patrol]

It is possible that one mod will move a beaver, then the other mod moves them back.

Commute Balancer optimises for them to live near their work, where 2nd shift optimises for everyone working in the same building living together.

[desert rover]

But I figure if I am having them, sure others might be.

[torpid patrol]

in theory, they both have the same end goal.

I'll put the "Tree Overhang" on the list, with a description of what it is.

[desert rover]

In function, so far at least for me, they play nice. Even in WhitePaws with 1.5K beaver population.

[torpid patrol]

there's also ideas for breaking the 3x3 tree trunk style, but some things like the storages would be hard to do.

[desert rover]

I have so many ideas but I don't want to overwhelm you with them.

[torpid patrol]

I mean, you'd need 4 variations of the 1x3x2 storages.
the current "Both ends curved" version.
a "one end curved" version.
a "Neither end curved" version.

These can't be done dynamically, because the pneumatic tube and power transput connections will be different.
Then the "One end curved" version MAY need 2 versions (a left and a right) depending on if it can be flipable.

Why wouldn't it be flippable? position of goods would be different inside them. The Liquid storage would probably even need a unique plane for each variant.

that last point is also a reason why it can't be done dynamically.

[desert rover]

I was just requesting 3 new ones, still having the rounded sides.

[torpid patrol]

Yes, but this is a previous request I've had.

[desert rover]

Ah

[torpid patrol]

and I'm not against it, it's just a lot of work.

[desert rover]

I default to everything rounded except when it isn't.

[torpid patrol]

the rounded corner levees are... interesting too.

[desert rover]

I like them and use them when i can.

[torpid patrol]

people are requesting a version where they don't stop water, because it leaves that hole as the water is expecting a square levee

[desert rover]

I never noticed the hole?

I should load up a LeafCoat game. I was just playign with the new stuff so I was in IT.

Yep, now that I am looking for it I see the water hole.

This is sorta silly, but also half serious for when you are pondering new stuff.

I can't do it justice in-game, but imagine if you will some rounded platforms that could support larger storages. To keep it from being so visually jarring, the bottom platform would have a curved bottom going to the center trunk. Then there could be a top platform that does the same, but in reverse.

Then one could make onion-dome like bulges in their trees.

[torpid patrol]

onion

[desert rover]

Except in the middle, not the top.

[torpid patrol]

not sure I like the arrow on top.

[desert rover]

I like the dark one but not the light one.

[torpid patrol]

dark and light what?

[desert rover]

arrows

[torpid patrol]

ah, yes.

I could put metal arrow on it, but I wanted all wood.

Could try another material.

[torpid patrol]

how's that?

[desert rover]

The brown? or both?

[torpid patrol]

The brown

Brown is the all wood sluice, where the other is the Valve

[desert rover]

I like the brown myself in this context.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, I think it fits

I know this isn't the Emberpelts channel, but, here's theirs

[desert rover]

I'll switch channels.

[hidden cape]

I like how it looks kinda mossy

[torpid patrol]

Can you tell I drew the dam decoration icon by hand?

[hidden cape]

Looks like all the others. Good job if that was hand drawn

[torpid patrol]

I often use vectors to make it look neat. That one i was just like... YOLO! Freehand it!

[torpid patrol]

So, this is the sides of a levee

Dam

Sluice

Valve

I'm not sure I like that the Sluice and Valve are different from the Levee and Dam

[desert rover]

That extra bottom border will make them standout more form the side, but I am not auew if I see that as a bad thing or not.

[torpid patrol]

To be fair... in MOST situations, the side would be hidden anyway

The Front and Back are what you're more likely to see

[torpid patrol]

I am just not motivated to work on mods today.

Updated water wheel power reading display.

Emberpelts:
Fixed Windows
Updated water wheel power reading
Added Valve, Clutch and Gate from V1.0.11.
Changed Sluice to be all wood, and changed it's cost to 6 planks and 4 gears.
Added Tubeway Gate.

Leaf Coats:
Fixed Windows
Updated water wheel power reading
Added Valve, Clutch and Gate from V1.0.11.
Changed Sluice to be all wood, and changed it's cost to 6 planks and 4 gears.

I think that's all the parts from 1.0 except the actual automation sensors (and outputs like Fireworks)

[desert rover]

Fireworks were fun.

[torpid patrol]

I haven't tried any of the automation stuff myself yet

just the things I've added to Leaf Coats and Emberpelts.

[desert rover]

I have said it before somewhere (maybe even here) but it feels very much like the automation in Oxygen Not Included.

[torpid patrol]

I'll figure it out when I get around to trying it.

I have no idea how much vanilla was modified to make automation work, hopefully things just work in Emberpelts and Leaf Coats, they have a lot of custom scripts.

[desert rover]

At a glance it seems universal, so I am thinking it is a whole new subsystem and maybe the regular buildings simply need set to be automatable? We could be that lucky.

[torpid patrol]

I'll find out soon, I guess

[torpid patrol]

Sluice vs Valve.

Valve: A one way flow limiting device, allowing you to set the flow rate allowed through, can be controlled by sensors and automation logic buildings.

Sluice: A simple on/off valve without flow limiter, with contamination percentage sensor built into the input and water level sensor built into the output.

I haven't really poked the logic stuff yet, but is there a way to have a valve allow flow of different speeds based on logic conditions?

Or what about height of floodgates?

I should ask in another channel.

Nore to self: Vanilla change i probably need to account for.

Stairs, Tubeways and Ziplines now allow to be completed if stranded beavers are standing in them.

[desert rover]

You can definitely change the height, but only 2 height settings per valve, from what I experienced.

Same with the floodgates. They have an on height/rate and an off height/rate.

As an example, I had one at 0.95 and the other at 0 for drought protection.

In another setup I did the whole badwater off the side with one contamination sensor and two sets of valves. One set was 0 & 1, the other set was 1 & 0.

Actually, instead of 1 they were "unlimited"

For finer control, keep using Igor's automation.

[torpid patrol]

Given how busy my weekend is going to be, I think the best bet for doing the required changes, is to just leave it until monday

I doubt there'll be an update on monday, but I'm sure there will be on tuesday

so monday and tuesday will be a good time to react to the changes over the week, and convert the automation stuff into Emberpelts and Leaf Coats.

[torpid patrol]

I don't think I want to remake the Throttle Valve with the curved fins.

[torpid patrol]

Fireworks is on Common...

so I gotta remove it on Leaf Coats, and re-add it on Leaf Coats: Explosives ¦3

[torpid patrol]

it works but

probably not a great idea to include all 4 faction's dynamites in the list

I mean, it's great for compatibility on something like Greedy Nation, but...

[acoustic yarrow]

Looks like there's a missing localization step

That plus Distinct() would make the message shorter

[torpid patrol]

It's not my custom message, it's Vanilla

and the untranslated locales aren't locales, they're buildings not loaded, so because they're not loaded it's probably not looking up the building's locale entry

[torpid patrol]

Something else that needs some thought.

Leaf Coats Badwater Rig, built on the badwater source is the only source of Extract.
What do we do on maps without a badwater source?

There's the Seep, could build a rig on that, but there's no guarantee that a badwater seep is present either, it could all just be drains.

[worn ivy]

It could just be badtides.

Just seeps probably needs dealt with, since a vanilla map has that, but I doubt we will see a vanilla map with only drains/badtides.

That said, maybe a variant that has a pump hanging off the side, with logic that only shows it in the menu if no badwater source is found?

[torpid patrol]

I was afraid that would happen x3

[torpid patrol]

with the way things work, you'd have to build on top of it, can't easily interface from the side

fixed it

[torpid patrol]

Storage doesn't work, but the other 2 with icons do...

Lets see if I can do the storage trick

yup, the trick worked.

this is the trick by the way, Just put the paper on a layer by itself, then put the rest of the model as a child.

So I think that's the leaf coats ones all complete

Should start on Emberpelts

Some of the models between FT and IT are different, as a general rule Emberpelts would use FT models and Leaf Coats would use IT models, so where the models differ (like the speaker) I'll have to start over, but otherwise I could just use my Leaf Coats file as a starting point for Emberpelts.

(and the speaker is one of the pain in the backside ones to do)

[torpid patrol]

looks like it's just speaker and chronometer

[torpid patrol]

One of the problems with trying to convert the Leaf Coats models to Emberpelts...

Leaf Coats actually have 5 used basewood textures (and I remember the places for each of them. Brown is standard wood, Dark Brown is for Bases and some features, Green is for accents, White is situational, light colour and Light Green is doorsteps)

Not only can I not really remember where the Leaf Coats textures are supposed to be used (Because I did it longer ago), but there's only 4 of them, so I can't just do a direct translation from Leaf Coats to Emberpelts.

Leaf Coats also typically follows the Iron Teeth model to a degree, so if they used Indigo, I use Green, there's no direct translation for that from Folktails.

I THINK I need to be using Plaster Black on some of these things.

[worn ivy]

What block occupation does the detonator have?
Just middle?

[torpid patrol]

just Top

Between Path and Dynamite, that's the only one not used

It's basically standard for things that go on top of other things.

[worn ivy]

Huh... So you can't fit them under overhangs, then.

[torpid patrol]

unfortunately not

but... It NEEDs an occupation, and Dynamite uses almost everything else.

Let me see if they changed it in vanilla

this is vanilla

[torpid patrol]

If it occupies Top, it can't be placed under an overhang

if it occupies Middle, it can't be placed in front of a Sluice or Valve

I'll change it to Middle and see what happens.

EP and LC version that is

this happens

what? X3

[torpid patrol]

updated to match the v1.0.12.2 models.

Also, yes, that lip look on the contamination sensor was intentional

[torpid patrol]

Revert Models and Cost of Sluice back to pre-v1.0.11.0 state.
Added Fill Valve with the Wooden Sluice model and cost of 6 Planks 4 Gears.
Updated the cost of the Valve (now named Throttling Valve) to 5 Planks, 5 Metal Blocks and 5 Bricks.
Added Automation buildings.

Revert Models and Cost of Sluice back to pre-v1.0.11.0 state.
Added Fill Valve with the Wooden Sluice model and cost of 6 Planks 4 Gears.
Updated the cost of the Valve (now named Throttling Valve) to 5 Treated Planks, 5 Metal Blocks.
Added Automation buildings Minus Detonator and Fireworks Launcher.

Added Detonator and Fireworks Launcher.

Added customizable light color.

[torpid patrol]

Bobingabout, Gary, Cokenose, Battery Smooth, eMka, Norman, Tobbert, Lapantouflemagic

Gary is a weird one, in that the name generator WILL Generate "Gary" for a few factions (definitely leaf coats, not sure about others), and then it will assign the icon and texture for him to be a leafcoats.

It also has the LeafCoats faction listed as the prefered faction, but because it's created from the name generator, rather than a special name, that part might not function.

I'd need to double check the code.

[hidden cape]

Timberborn Mod Squad

[torpid patrol]

Now allow to be completed if beavers are standing in them.

Tubeway Levee:
Now allow to be completed if beavers are standing in them.

Now allow to be completed if beavers are standing in them.

Tubeway Top Connection:
Now allow to be completed if beavers are standing in them.```

[sudden folio]

I didn't answer back then but thank you Bob for the explanation on how the Beaver population spreads for house breeding.

This vanilla breeding mechanic does indeed make the Leafcoats' start harder because you always have a few beavers with a debuff at the start since it's the only way to get wood.

If like me you keep pausing/unpausing the lumberjacks you can end up even worse with too many beavers with the debuff and your population plummets, especially since all you have available at the start are smaller houses (costs less wood, which you are currently hoarding to lessen the debuff).

[fallow smelt]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?edit=true&id=3686783117 the frog now blesses leaf coats too 😉

hope my trying to match it to the faction is acceptable?

[torpid patrol]

yes

Thought

Replace this

with this

[fallow smelt]

nice detail on that one!

[torpid patrol]

It's just the same as previous, except I resized the huge grinding wheel down, and put 2 side by side

[fallow smelt]

yeah, those little details make such a difference in how it feels

[torpid patrol]

Makes it feel more... Violent

Like it's actually going to "Eat" metal, and chew it up

[torpid patrol]

Build and load the game to test a thing
end up messing around and quitting without testing it

looks alright

[torpid patrol]

So...

Tangent talk gave an idea, not sure if I should do it or not

You know how when you slice down through the terrain, Platforms have an "Uncovered" model, where the actual platform is missing, so it's just legs.

What if I did that with Storages so you can see down into them?

Should I?

[fallow smelt]

i mean, it's a pretty cool idea and would look fancy and fun and i would plenty enjoy it

but it's likely some effort to do and . .not many might notice it

[torpid patrol]

It's... 12 buildings. and all I have to do is chop the top off

It's not that much work.

but still, should I?

[torpid patrol]

Apparently

It was a big waste of time

somehow I made it worse

[torpid patrol]

Rollback I guess

[astral ermine]

no such thing, you now know 1 way which it wont work... haha

[fallow smelt]

sorry it not worked.. 🙁

[torn jewel]

was there a different district center in the past this looks different to current

[torpid patrol]

Thats from the very early days. The main change was to the bark colour on the outside.

[torpid patrol]

so, this building occupies 5 tall.

if you actually rotated the lens down, wouldn't it stick out the side as much as it sticks out the top?

I'm also just thinking perhaps I should reduce the height a little, so I don't have to occupy that top tile.

[fallow smelt]

a dirt block on top would go half-way into the green

but not really matters i guess

the only situation it would really matter is map-height-limit?

[worn ivy]

How likely is it to clip something on that top layer if you simply remove the collision?

[torpid patrol]

Depends what you're doing. It will still occupy Top, so you can't build anything that puts a floor on the level above, so even if you do get clipping, it's not going to do something crazy like stick through the floor.

[fallow smelt]

yeah, only dirt blocks/ side attachables would be able to

could you run a branch or bridge through it?

[torpid patrol]

so this is a valid position, and as you can see, sticks through into a neighbouring building

that's about how much it sticks through the top

Bridge requires air below (so can't be built if something occupies top below), Branch actually occupies part of the tile below, so no in either case.

[torpid patrol]

So, if I just change the height from 5 to 4, it's probably not going to change much, but you can build the tree 1 tile higher.

[worn ivy]

If it does end up being an issue later, I would just make the radius of the dome slightly smaller.

[fallow smelt]

given the location of those i'd doubt it is likely a situation like this happens anyway

the size looks really cool as is tbh

[torpid patrol]

Yeah

[torpid patrol]

Stairs and Zipline Stations now allow to be completed if beavers are standing in them.
Corrected Fill Valve Blueprint.
General asset restructure.
Updated Shredder model.
Changed the Observitory to only be 4 blocks tall. Not much should change but you can build your tree 1 tile taller.
Include empty LeafCoatsAddons Good and Need collections

[torpid patrol]

more people commenting on the AI images.

[merry sinew]

Anti-AI sentiment is getting pretty fervent as of late. And honestly, you're nicer about the comments than I would be. My response would be "I don't have $200 to drop on hiring an artist to make assets for the hobby I do for free in my spare time solely because the users don't like AI. Here's my Patreon -- pay me and I'll pay an artist."

[torpid patrol]

$200 is probably about right.

I intend to spend the €500 I got for Modder of the Year on the art for this mod.

The Faction Select icon for Emberpelts cost me $90CAD

[desert rover]

I understand the hate from the artists who were ripped-off to make a lot of the base that AI was built on, but AI, just like CGI before it, and so and and so forth, is here to stay. As the old saying goes, "The genie is out of the bottle".

This kind of hate of change and innovation has been going on for longer than most people realize. Example:
Adolphe Sax, the Belgian inventor of the saxophone (patented in 1846), faced extreme, life-threatening harassment, relentless legal battles, and concerted efforts to destroy his reputation and livelihood. His rivals, primarily Parisian instrument makers, saw his revolutionary designs as a threat to their business, leading to a "campaign of persecution".
Sax's reputation eventually helped secure him a job teaching at the Paris Conservatory in 1857. He continued to make instruments later in life and presided over the new saxophone course at the Paris Conservatory. Legal troubles involving patents continued for over 20 years, with rival instrument makers attacking the legitimacy of his patents and Sax suing them for patent infringement. He was driven into bankruptcy three times: in 1852, 1873 and 1877

[merry sinew]

I'm almost 100% on the artists side when it comes to AI. The problem I have is when those artists freak out about AI and then follow it up with "but you could do the ethical thing and pay me insert insane price here to do it for you."

If growing up in the age of online piracy taught me anything it's that people will almost always pay for quality or personalized things, or things they love, provided they have the money. Everyone needs to pay the bills, but the common person doesn't have any more money than the artist does.

I have even less sympathy for end users/mod users who freak out about AI art. They receive what's largely a labor of love for free and feel it's necessary to judge the creator because of small amounts of AI art? Put your money literally where your mouth is if you're going to complain and either pay for the art yourself or make it yourself without expecting payment -- like the mod author is doing for you

I feel the same in reverse about AI code. I will always, infinitely, prefer human code. If an artist wants to make a mod and has no code skills though? I get it. Not great, but I'm not going to judge either.

[acoustic yarrow]

I used AI to generate a whole bunch of test boilerplate today, saved me a whole bunch of time, but then when it came to filling in what was really needed, it was quicker for me to do it than wait for the AI to do it right.

So I let it do the boring stuff, and I'll do the important part.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, 3 of my mods have AI assisted coding. And that's the key word, assisted.
My most common prompt was "Look at this code and sanity check it for me", very little code was generated by the AI, and when it was, I was asking for ideas on how to solve a particular issue. Like where in the code would be best to patch with Harmony and how do I do that.

There's probably less than a dozen lines of AI generated code in an about a thousand line document for beaver faction building control.

Same with beaver faction district control and commute balancer is built around a specific piece of code from building control.

Those are the only mods where I used the AI for assistance with code. Because I either wasn't getting a response when asking people (District Control some people did help me get started with Harmony, Normanr included) or just didn't want to bother people when I could ask the AI (Building Control)

In the past with my other mods, I googled for code help. Takes a while. Asking the AI is basically just a faster Google search.

When the code is still 95%+ unassisted written by me, I don't feel like it's unethical to use the AI.

A lot of the time, we'd discuss why I wasn't doing a thing, only for it to bring it up again 2 posts later.

I also refused to use AI code until I understand what it was doing and why.

Keep in mind I've never used C# outside of modding Timberborn.

I think it was Luke ( TheApologist) who suggested I ask AI when I was asking for help with code.

[tawny zealot]

I'm fine with the AI art. I think we should chip in and help you pay for real Art as time goes on and more and more people use the mod

[torpid patrol]

At this point in time, I just need to find the right artist.

I have some money set aside for it

All this talk about it though, you know I'm going to get all the scammers and beggers commenting asking if I'm still need this month's and even years from now.

I made a comment in mod creators a while ago, and after 5 or 6 people asked if I needed it drawn, I eventually deleted the original post

[torpid patrol]

so, a thing worth mentioning.

MiGly was complaining that Leaf Coats was taking forever to load, and getting a 3 second pause every time a building completed

after some investigation, it's due to the crappy way I wrote setting up Pneumatic tubes.

Basically, every time one is built, the code recalculates the entire network system. All networks, all connections.

He had enough buildings that it locks up the game for 3 seconds when you build something (which doesn't sound like much), but consider on game load, the game is literally placing everything again then applying settings to it.

Instead of taking 20 seconds to load (when I disabled this connection script), it was taking 20 minutes to load.

Yeah... I'm going to have to rewrite this code.

[iron spire]

ouch

[torpid patrol]

Complete rewrite of how the Pneumatic Tube Connection system creates and changes connections, to dramatically improve performance. (Should improve Loading times of Leaf Coats games, and remove any potential game freezes when beavers complete buildings.)

[torpid patrol]

after the coding, my tests show it takes about a minute to load the save (instead of 20) and I'm not seeing any noticable delay when building or deleting a structure with Pneumatic tubes.

and there's still room for improvement

[tawny zealot]

Might be good enough though

[worn ivy]

It was taking 20 minutes to load?!?

[torpid patrol]

Wee trees was, yes.

[astral ermine]

doesnt help he builds like an absolute madman lol

[torpid patrol]

It was purely based on the number of buildings he had, not where, and how my crappy code was reprocessing all of them on every change.

And since the load routine rebuilds the map effectively by just places all the things in the right place and setting them to the right state, that meant it was reprocessing some of them thousands of times while loading the game.

[true quartz]

Starting a new save, and testing part of my adventures in making your factions compatible with Whitepaws... Learned I could reshuffle the Natural Resources to... and immediately was like "Hey, I can make Birches and Oak trees long term viable!"

Oaks do branches, might need to rebalance them, I'll see how I feel playing this save. But I feel pretty gleeful I could do this for LeafCoats, so they're not just for deco as much as I like making deco forest setups

[torpid patrol]

Back when I wrote leaf coats in U7, the intent was to add Bark as a harvestable resource to Birch, but the game didn't allow a "Migration" to add an item, it would crash trying to load an inventory that didn't exist.

[true quartz]

And now it's got the Blueprint Modifiers, which enables this.

[torpid patrol]

Even without those... you could disable birch and do a migration to force another plant to load in birch's place, and that would still crash

[true quartz]

Also funny how we landed on the same Birch for Bark logic. Side note on that actually, the fact that you made the general bark gatherer a Eucalyptus Tree. My adoration, for seeing them in a game.

I am Aussie, I see my tree

[torpid patrol]

I guess I could change things to make birch give bark and get rid of Eucalyptus.

honestly though, I'm not sure it'd worth doing that as Branches are just as important as Bark, if not more so, and I want to keep Willow. So getting rid of Eucalyptus to give Bark to Birch is a little pointless.

[true quartz]

That is my Home, I grew up next to a giant Eucalyptus, the way it would shed seasonally, I like the potential to have choice of which one will be bark resource from my modifier. And works imo.

[torpid patrol]

I bet it smelled good

[true quartz]

Oh very distinct

We once even had a Koala show up in one of the trees on our street

It was like "Hi, Hi! Where did you wander in from?"

Eucalyptus is just, pleasing. Also the choice makes the LeafCoats stand out, same with the willow, though the models you use don't feel very willow to me... but that's because I'm used to the ones with the trailling branches that kind of make a leafy cover, the "weeping willows"

[torpid patrol]

they do that when the branches grow out. that's what they cut off.

but yeah, I could remodel them a little more, but it's just a recoloured and slightly modified birch

I'm not good ad modelling

[true quartz]

God, if you do decide to swap the Eucalyptus bark gathering to Birches though, you could do an edible from them

Sooooo, this is just something for the back of your mind, but I will be honest, the other reason for their nickname of Gum Trees. Their sap, though I don't think it's every species, the sap is edible.

Me and my family used to go out in the season and collect and eat it.

[torpid patrol]

sounds fun

[true quartz]

It is. So yeah, that can be an alternative, but more ideal would be if both options were viable but it looks like plants can only have one harvestable 😔

Also ultimately up to you, I'm more throwing it out as here's an option for it. And because I'm like "Hey my tree! From my home!"

[true quartz]

Oh, an aside, but I'm curious, for the Beaver Plants add on, are you planning on making a higher tier planting building or something to eventually lock the adult beaver plant behind?
Just because right now it's kind of like "Why would you plant child plants when you can have the adults immediately?" and maybe I'm dumb to the balancing but it's yeah...

[torpid patrol]

Thats why Adult plants take twice as long to grow

They both say 5 days, but the adult plants have a maturing timer after the plant grows, where the child beavers just pop straight off the plant.

[true quartz]

A hidden timer, got it.

And one that makes sense

[torpid patrol]

People have been pointing out to me how in V1 LeafCoats have some flaws

Since they don't normally have a badwater pump, or Centrifuge...

On New maps with no Badwater Source

1. There's no place to build a Rig, so no way to get Extract.
2. One way to deal with the Water Seep giving Badwater in a Bad Tide is to clean it with a Pump, there's no pump so no way to clean it.

1. Since you typically have either BadWater Sources or Badwater Seeps (or both), one suggestion is to add a bad water Rig for the Seep

2. Add some sort of Dome or Filter to the water seep.
   The Dome would just give you manual control over it being open or closed, and since the badwater dome can already be automated with the automation system, this could be automated that way too.
   The Filter would basically just be the dome that is already automated.

Thoughts?

Thoughts happen

what if... a Seep Dome, can be built on the Badwater Seep too?

[hoary patrol]

A seep dome that has an internal water storage system?

[torpid patrol]

Why don't we already have a Badwater Seep dome?

[torpid patrol]

Well, it would behave just the same as the badwater dome, so... no, that's more the sort of thing a Rig would have.

[torpid patrol]

this

and open

thoughts?

[desert rover]

Nice, and so easy to build on top of!

[torpid patrol]

in theory, yes.

[true quartz]

Oooh neat

[torpid patrol]

Same building works on both seeps

Though, Given that Leaf Coats have 2 different painted metals, and use Purple for Badwater buildings, I'm considering trying to do that.

[torpid patrol]

It look longer to make this work than it should, because I'm out of practice x3

[hidden cape]

Stahppp

[torpid patrol]

yes

[hidden cape]

Can they be used with the new automation? Not saying they need to. Don't need you doing extra work

[worn ivy]

If you look at the video, it had three options for being open or closed.

[hidden cape]

Ty. I'm just blind when I see cool new stuff

[desert rover]

Thank you for giving them time to open and close. Instant open and close on dome things like this is just too safe. I like a little danger.

[viscid zinc]

Very cool looking. Could you either adjust the sound to be less metal dome and more wooden or use a different sound from another building that fits the wooden acoustic better?

[torpid patrol]

No, they don't have the option, I checked Vanilla Domes and they don't have it either.

[torpid patrol]

I'm not sure how difficult it would be to add automation to domes.

At the end of the day, the dome itself is actually pretty simple.

wait, there's 3 options there...

what's the 3rd option?

3rd option is automation, you can automate it

[torpid patrol]

so the answer is yes, you can use them with the new automation

[torpid patrol]

I think this slight modification looks better, and fits in with Overhangs and Platforms better

[desert rover]

Nice!

[verbal horizon]

Trying to wrap my head around leafcoats buildings, it's a puzzle when some storages have entrance upstairs 🙂

Also I see that birch bark was already discussed, I have similar dumb idea - rl willows grow both in shallow water and outside. Would be a boon if they were so flexible ingame too.

[worn ivy]

Not really; you have ladders by default.
As for willows… they already do that.

We discussed it in the past, and it turned out to be trivially easy to implement.

[verbal horizon]

I had problems trying to build ladder under large pile entrance...now I retried, guess it was my own clumsiness. Would perhaps help if it shows up as red instead of completely vanishing when the placement is invalid.

[verbal horizon]

Can please willows be marked like "semi-aquatic" in the flavor text?

[desert rover]

I had found it by accident, then went testing all the trees. 😛

[astral ermine]

just a minor detail.

side note, dont think its possible to play LC on the Timberpunk map on hard mode haha

[main phoenix]

Hello hello what would timberpunk need to make playing as leafcoats possible?

[astral ermine]

All their food needs 2 cycles. The plants grow, then harvestable stuff needs to grow

Pretty sure my first cycle was shortest possible, but rushed getting the aquifer running and planting food to grow, but was still at least 4-5 days from at the earliest to getting consumable food. Even found your little stache of berries underground

Struggled with water but managed, beavers starved to death

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, I think the game over text on both Emberpelts and Leaf Coats just points to the Folktails locale entry.

[torpid patrol]

I think the biggest issue with "Difficulty" on Leaf Coats is due to them not having any crops, only Bushes and Trees.

So you can't have the 2 or 3 day growth times of carrots and... whatever IronTeeth have, the fastest growing plants require like, 5 or 6 days before you can get fruit from them. And you have to build the building that plants them. So even if you have a great start, you're looking at about 8 days to get food started.

So, if you play on Hard, and don't set up some sort of dam really fast, it is possible you can wipe without getting a single crop, so you're often dependant on a starting area having ready-to-pick berries

[astral ermine]

So to morr directly give an answer to the question, maybe just upping the hidden cache of berries to 75-100ish would buy you a couple more days for things to grow which might be enough time without doing big changes to things on the map.

It looked really neat. I spent a good bit looking around the map and got an idea of a plan put together before I let the beavers set foot out of the DC

[main phoenix]

I will look for a way to make it compatible, for now feel free to edit the map in editor to give yourself a bunch o berries

Cuz it Might be a while until i can get around to it

[outer python]

Or just do a custom difficulty and give yourself more starting food

[verbal horizon]

Suggestion: farming mushrooms on logs to get some food quickly.

[lavish kindle]

@torpid patrol Minor potential bug with the Leafcoats Wood Workshop: It has an optional second entrance on the side, but if you connect a path to that entrance, it does not show as connected to the network. You must still connect to the other entrance. This might be the intended behavior, in whch case, disregard, I just wanted to make sure you were aware.

[torpid patrol]

semi-intended, you need to at the very least put a path in front of the other entrance, even if you don't connect that path to a path.

I could in theory get around it, but that would cause other issues

[lavish kindle]

gotcha, thanks.

[astral ermine]

not bad for a 1 day build. didnt run any issues that I noticed, so thats good 🙂

[main phoenix]

adjusting TP2 for leafcoat compatability

[main phoenix]

i changed the initial food stockpiles to foods that leafcoats can nom, leafcoats now start with more food than the 2 base factions.

[main phoenix]

never mind leafcoats use fermented chestnuts, not roasted

ok you start with standard amount of foods :)

[iron spire]

yay!

[torpid patrol]

I think the only Vanilla food that Leaf Coats actually have would be Berries and Mangroves.

[torpid patrol]

Been working on the Wind tunnel

they look somewhat more similar in animation now

also I changed the colours, it had the same purple vertex colour as IT, and I'm like.... LC wouldn't use IT colours like that, lets make it yellow with a few green ones.

better?

[lavish kindle]

I love it.

Question, does the LC Large water pump not work with badwater at all?

I have had one for several days now, but it does not seem to be working. Wanting to make sure I am not just missing something.

[worn ivy]

Is it labeled as a badwater pump? No.
They don't actually have one; instead they use a fancy badwater rig with a built-in centrifuge to directly produce extract.

That may change, but it is the current setup.

[lavish kindle]

The description says Badwater contamination slows pumping, it was not clear that it doesn't work at all. That may be a vanilla limitation, not a LC thing, I don't think I ever tried it before. I just like the LC LWP, so favor it over the other pumps.

I have the explosives for LC mod, so it does have a badwater pump, not just the rig

[worn ivy]

So, what that means is that the speed decreases linearly according to contamination (i.e. half speed at 50%, 1% speed at 99%, completely stopped at 100%). The base game does the same.

Badwater pumps do the opposite: the lower the contamination, the slower they work, stopping entirely at 0%.

[lavish kindle]

Yeah, I never tried in vanilla because the description was vague, so I just used the specific pump. I tried this one since the LC pump is substatially different

[torpid patrol]

It's a water pump, it doesn't pump bad water.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, that's how Vanilla ones work too.
100% water: 100% speed.
50% water 50% badwater: 50% water speed, and if you let it pump it'll slowly turn full badwater in the pond and stop pumping.

[torpid patrol]

Leaf Coats: Explosives needs you to also install Leaf Coats: Badwater, otherwise there's no way to obtain badwater.

[lavish kindle]

I presumably already installed it since I have the badwater pump. I just like the large water pump better. oh well, I'll live 🙂

[torpid patrol]

Think Folktails.

They have a Water Pump, Large Water Pump and Badwater Pump.

For Leaf Coats they have Water Pump and Large Water Pump, with Badwater Pump in Leaf Coats: Badwater

[lavish kindle]

Yeah, I get it. I never tried the LWP in vanilla because I was too lazy to figure out what "slows with badwater contamination" meant. But the benefit of the LC LWP made it worth trying.

[verbal horizon]

and you have to connect power anyway so fermenter's next

And re: badwater, I was on map that does not have classical badwater sources (Down the Plughole) only seeps. Had to add them in map editor to get any extract. Clearly non optimal.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah

I've been thinking about a solution to that issue

Basically a Badwater Seep Rig.

[verbal horizon]

Perhaps would be in character if they had phytoremediation plants that would clean slightly contaminated water and produce extract.

If it's even possible to implement, plants affecting water they are in.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperaccumulator#Phytoremediation

[torpid patrol]

honestly not sure. would probably have to code something new for it.

[lavish kindle]

Bob, why no single wide gravity batteries to match the corner ones? Just a balance decision?

[torpid patrol]

Nothing stopping you from using the corner ones as a single elsewhere.

[lavish kindle]

Oh. Duh. Never thought about that.

[torpid patrol]

Still a WIP

but

turns it on

Seep fits under there

[torpid patrol]

not sure if this is better or worse

[worn ivy]

Mini extract rig for use with seeps?
It doesn't function as the base of a tree, but that's to be expected since it's the wrong size.

[torpid patrol]

Seep Rig, yes.

and correct, can't function as the base of a tree because it's the wrong size.

[worn ivy]

That should solve most of the edge cases.
There's still the potential for problems if the only source of badwater is badtides, but at that point, honestly, I would just say to go play a different map, since that's just as problematic for all the other factions.

[torpid patrol]

Or install the Leafcoats badwater mod

[torpid patrol]

oh, look who's working here

Need to move the smoke spawn point slightly, and add Locale entries and a new icon

[worn ivy]

The contra-rotating top makes for a neat visual.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, I thought it would look better than them both rotating the same direction.

4 beavers vs the Badwater Rig's 10.

Same recipe

Requires 200 power instead of 500...

Half the cost

slight model update too

Door frame colour changed, and the "Rust" is now a crust along the top edge, rather than all down the wall

[worn ivy]

Basically, smaller in every way.
That said, 10 beavers has always been insane in the badwater rig. Most of the time even 2 beavers is excessive.
Not to mention that the Folktail's version has as much storage as a LARGE TANK.

...will the storage capacity be equivalent to a medium tank?

[torpid patrol]

Since I'm using the same recipe, the storage will be the same on both rigs.

which looks to be 500.

I also just had a thought on a different layout.

unlike the badwater source where it's basically flat to the ground, so entering on the ground floor makes sense, the badwater seep is about half a block tall, so you can't just walk in on the ground floor the same way. So maybe I should make the door upstairs.

adjusting the height slightly...

would put the door here.

[acoustic yarrow]

Can you see the smoke spawn points in the editor? or do you have to check them in-game?

[torpid patrol]

Can see them in the editor, but they're not exactly intuitive as to where the smoke will actually come from.

this is the correct placement

[desert rover]

I don't know why that amuses me but it does.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah.

[verbal horizon]

I love the observation terrace! Had to make a screenshot (see #📷screenshots )

[lavish kindle]

@torpid patrol Any idea why these ziplines are not connecting to the network? Beavers are having to walk to the building, despite the zipline.

[torpid patrol]

try place a path in the middle there.

[lavish kindle]

That did it.

[torpid patrol]

Not sure why it's drawing the nav mesh marker, but they're technically not connected, because there's no Path or Ladder in the same tile that the doors are opening onto

If you did put a path there, not sure why it's not working

[lavish kindle]

I've never needed a path before, but possible this is the first time I have built one above a tank as opposed to a warehouse or pile.

[torpid patrol]

In theory, even with a Warehouse or Pile, in theory you should need a path there too

or a ladder

[lavish kindle]

The ladder is built in to the warehouse.

[torpid patrol]

All of them are the same, there's no nav meshes above this point, which means the warehouse isn't connecting to anything on top of the warehouse

you need to add a ladder, or path on top to make it connect sideways

or another building with a ladder built into that tile, like a Builders hut

[lavish kindle]

Weird. I guess I have just always built the ladders before noticing they weren't working

I have had just two ziplines across from one another with nothing else many times. They must have not been working except to transit through.

[torpid patrol]

I dunno what to say, what you've built, there should be no connection between the doors

now, if you built it on top of a ladder, that's different, Ladders do have path connections on top

so if you built it on top of one of these ladders, then it would connect

anyway...

[lavish kindle]

What I have had previously was essentially this. I've had setups like that for long periods, but it looks like they never actually worked, and I never noticed. They allowed beavers to pass through, but not access the building. I assumes it automatically connected to the path.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, those aren't connected

[lavish kindle]

I always add laddeers eventually to build higher, but not always until I need more [whatever]

[torpid patrol]

The ladders would fix it.

or as said, if the level below was something where you manually built a ladder, that would connect, because ladders are a bit odd

[lavish kindle]

Yep. Just never noticed

[torpid patrol]

so why does my door not work...

It correctly hides the model when it should be hidden, but doesn't unhide it.

[torpid patrol]

From what I can tell, it's failing the CanConnect check

what I'm not sure about is why.

It might be the lack of "Is Path"

here we go

[torpid patrol]

Doing some minor model tweaks at this point.

So the base needs to be that high (Even though it's larger than it needs to be to cover the seep), for the mechanical connection.

so I moved the metal band up to the top of the bark, rather than below it, because it fits better there. I also just moved things around a little.

you might be able to tell the lower part of the roof was squashed up a little more.

still looks reasonable with alternate connections too

I think there's just 1 more tweak I want to make

Change it back from the metal door to a green wooden door.

[astral ermine]

Odds of fireworks coming to LC anytime soonish?

[iron spire]

Soon(tm), I'm sure 😉

[torpid patrol]

They're already in the Explosives addon mod

The problem is...

1. They're made in the Explosives Factory, which Leaf Coats don't have without the Explosives addon.
2. They cost Badwater which leafcoats don't have without the Badwater addon.

So i put them in the Explosives addon mod

[astral ermine]

Makes sense I suppose

[torpid patrol]

The problems with trying to make a more unique playstyle is sometimes you have to make sacrifices and compromises like this.

[astral ermine]

Didn't even think to check that. Knew that was an additional mod for them, but knew it wasn't... for lack of better phrasing I guess, in the spirit of how the faction was setup to play so I have avoided that one

[torpid patrol]

Yeah.

Unfortunately that means no fireworks in base leaf coats

[astral ermine]

Makes sense. Nbd. Just gotta grab another mod when I get home haha

[abstract reef]

What exactly does the beehive work on? I'm assuming berries, grapes and apples

Anything else?

[astral ermine]

Should be most things

No to maple and pine off the top of my head

Berries, mangroves, grapes, chestnuts, apples, and... memory failing me... lol

Dandelions

[worn ivy]

It specifically does not work on the initial growth of trees and bushes, but does work on most secondary products.

[abstract reef]

Thank you

[torpid patrol]

It also works on crops like a normal bee hive, but LC don't have any.

That's only important for multifaction stuff.

[worn ivy]

But does it work on the beaver plant?

[astral ermine]

Would be funny, no idea on that.

They just wanna get off the plant quicker so they quit being stung... lmao

[torpid patrol]

no

[torpid patrol]

LOL

[astral ermine]

Would be a funny addition for the adult beaver plants. Takes a little time off the maturation, but pop off the vine with bee stings

[verbal horizon]

waitwhat, there's a beaver plant?

[astral ermine]

Add on mod to go with the base LC mod

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, Leaf Coats: Beaver Plants is an addon that lets the Leaf Coats plant "Beaver Plants" that grow with a beaver on them, it's their version of a Breeding Pod, except it's mostly automatic, you can't pause them and you need to keep the ground irrigated, else they die.

[desert rover]

I love them!!!

[torpid patrol]

Leaf Coats can be a little confusing on what addons you're supposed to use.

Because there's Badwater and Explosives that you're not supposed to use, but exist for those who want to.

Then there's Beaver Plants that you are supposed to use.

With Emberpelts, it's more like, Yeah, Sure, use everything.

There's only really Ladder (which I could just make part of Emberpelts like I did with Leaf Coats) and Project Phoenix.

There's also Food Expansion, but that one is a bit more "How do you want to play?" type of mod, because I like the full Beaver Factions thing, that really needs that to be worth it.

[torpid patrol]

I think I may have spent too long doing minor edits to the Badwater Seep Rig.

can you even tell all the changes I've made?

[desert rover]

Looks great

[torpid patrol]

with all the work I've put into it, it should~

[torpid patrol]

and I should say, thanks for saying

[hidden cape]

Is the bottom one the final? Looks good either way

[torpid patrol]

Of the 3, the first and last are the same model.

The 2nd is what it changes to when you put a branch in front of it.

Because, most leafcoats buildings are dynamic in some way

[runic wedge]

Cool! This is looking really good!

[torpid patrol]

Bobingabout Script Pack:
New script UnderlyingWaterSourceModelChanger for the Leaf Coats Seep Cover.

Emberpelts:
Updated the Wonder of Fire's fire to be more appropriately sized.
Changed the Phoenix Distillery bubbles particle effect.
Fixed wind turbine flooding too easily.

Leaf Coats:
The Gate now correctly merges graphically with Fences.
Fixed beaver height of Wind Tunnel.
Added new Seep Cover, a Dome that can be built on the Water Seep and Bad Water Seep.
Added new Badwater Seep Rig, Similar to the Leaf Coats Badwater Rig, but it has a 2x2 footprint to fit on a Badwater Seep, but requires power and produces Extract like the Leaf Coats Badwater Rig.

[worn cradle]

Is there an option for a rig to actually pump Badwater (for explosives and fireworks) or do the poor Leafcoats have to get it manually? I discovered the rig making extract last night and got quite confused. If there isn't another option, maybe having the rig use a recipe could work.

[astral ermine]

no way to get bad water in the base mod. need an add on mod

Leaf Coats: Badwater

i was just asking about fireworks just the other day myself

[worn cradle]

I have that mod. Guess I have to pump it manually then. I really wanted to avoid visible badwater on this build too 😭

[astral ermine]

well, without too much effort you can keep it mostly hidden still. just have a little 1 wide channel inset 1 from the edge of the map if possible, dug down as deep as the pumps will go. extra creativity points for hollowing out a channel part way up and put contamination barriers there and covered up. then automate everything so they only pump when theres bad water there and you need to pump

😛

[torpid patrol]

I mean, their style would be to not use badwater at all, that means no explosives and no fireworks. That's why they have alternative terraforming methods.

The Badwater and Explosives mods exist as extension mods for those who want to play them more traditionally (as you would place FT or IT)

I wasn't expecting Fireworks to even be a thing, but I added them to the Explosives mod anyway.

[worn cradle]

In the spirit of no badwater/explosives, perhaps in the future, instead of dynamite, the leafcoats could develop a water-based analog that performs the same function. The material cost could start at a log and 5 water for a single and double/triple would use 10/15 water. Basically forced liquefaction. Just a thought... QoL question - would it be possible to add the ability to pause/unpause the numbercruncher? The IT and EP can both pause theirs and it makes automation easier.

[torpid patrol]

1. I'm not sure you need Liquifaction, you have seen the Loosen Terrain and Remove Terrain options, right?
2. Why would you want to pause the number cruncher?

The LC Number cruncher just sits on the Geothermal Vent and produces science points. It doesn't consume nor generate power, it just generates free science for existing.

Why would you want to pause that?

[worn cradle]

I have seen, and extensively used, those options. In fact, they would make a great standalone mod for other factions. I was only asking due to ease of scaling. I'm currently terraforming Thousand Island, and that is going to be an absolutely STUPID amount of shovels, lol. The numbercruncher question was more me just being anal about numbers, automation, and persistent perfectionism.

[warm thistle]

Question on Balancing of the Leafcoats Beaver Plants:
Am i understanding it right, that for the adult plants it spits out an adult beaver as long as the plant doesnt die during the process whereas the baby beaver plant has the benefit of releasing the beaver earlier?

[torpid patrol]

Basically, same conditions, 10 days for adult vs 5 days for child.

The functional difference:
They both take 5 days for the plant to grow.
Child Plants just plop the child out at this point.
Adult Plants have a 5 day maturing timer.

At any point, the plant can run out of water, or be contaminated, at which point the death counter starts.

[warm thistle]

Thanks!

then i got it right - and i like the choice of having to take care for a plant or for a baby beaver

[worn cradle]

In thinking over my terraforming scale issue, I came up with an idea that would both solve my issue and be fully in the spirit of the mod. Specifically, the "Remove Terrain" ability, could be theoretically be altered to allow for double and triple depth removal, the idea being that number of Extract determines depth, from 1 to 3. A possible solution to the Fireworks could be to replace them with Water Cannons, Fountains, or fireworks derived from something like Bark and Extract. This way, the functional gameplay benefits of Badwater, Explosives, and Fireworks can still be achieved without ever actually using them. The Tool Factory could possibly be renamed just the Factory and produce Shovels and the eco-friendly Fireworks. Just another way to make a very fun faction even more enjoyable.

[torpid patrol]

If you want to excavate large volumes of dirt, do the edges method.
Just tunnel under the area and take out the sides and the interior will just collapse away

[torpid patrol]

Very early stages of something I'm working on

Tree overhang

[torpid patrol]

I'm going to end up doing several variations.

the main ones being a 1x2 and 1x3, to extend out the side of a tree by 1 or 2 tiles

but then the corner should be treat differently

Can be a 1x2/3 for extending one side only, or 2x2, 2x3 or 3x3 to extend out in 2 directions.

[worn cradle]

I was literally thinking about this exact overhang idea as I was playing last night. Can't wait to see the results! 😄

[torpid patrol]

It looks kinda terrible when you look at it like this

but it does actually have the normals to bend it more subtley

[torpid patrol]

ah crap

you can't see where my cursor is, but when you flip this building, the anchor point doesn't flip with it, so you can't actually place the flipped version

Looks pretty good though

but I'm going to have to make a 2x3 flipped version.

or...

[astral ermine]

Oh, I'm so moving almost everything into the trees with this

[torpid patrol]

The Pneumatic Tubes (Capilleries) will work through it too

[signal fulcrum]

Yes, I really like the idea of ​​modular construction.

Do you plan to create platforms of different lengths? With straight and curved walls to create different architectural styles?

[torpid patrol]

Already did.

I'm not going beyond what the 3 length, overhanging by 2

[signal fulcrum]

Do the angles also measure 3 in length to create consistent platforms?

[torpid patrol]

angles?

you asking if it will look smooth? no

[signal fulcrum]

nop

[torpid patrol]

hmmm

[signal fulcrum]

It's difficult to explain from one point of view to another.

from one angle to another angle.

[torpid patrol]

just looks like this from the side

does that answer your question?

[torpid patrol]

Okay, let me draw it.

can you read that?

[signal fulcrum]

Ah ok, now I understand.

[torpid patrol]

this problem is bugging me

Can't make the 2x3 flippable, because if I do, the cursor is in the wrong spot.

[acoustic yarrow]

Have you tried the Modular Platforms/Overhangs? I know it's broken at the moment, but it looks like it could be used for dynamic building.

blegh, it also requires Harmony

[torpid patrol]

the icons

[desert rover]

This is soooooooo much better than what I asked you for!

[torpid patrol]

While there's nothing stopping me from making larger ones, I think on balance, this is all I want to make.

[desert rover]

This actually will make what I asked for, but not as a single piece. This is so much better!

Can you @ me when this is live so I can experiment with it? 🙂

[torpid patrol]

Could be a while, I'll probably forget you asked by then ¦3

[desert rover]

Such is life. 😛

[astral ermine]

if ppl want further from the tree, could just put dirt on top of them and go from there

[torpid patrol]

or just put another one on the edge

like how you can put an overhang on an overhang

[desert rover]

I will, of course, abuse this. But it will be fun!

[torpid patrol]

I should probably increase the costs. They transmit power and pneumatic tubes on all flat surfaces. Thats means all but the platform side on the square ones, minus the rounded side on the corner ones, and up on the full flat surface of the platform

[torn jewel]

what if u made it so that even if the ground is flooded beavers can live completely in the trees with water up there even and all

[worn cradle]

I will gloriously abuse them as well! Beaver motto - When physics doesn't work, make your own.

[torpid patrol]

what's new here?

[desert rover]

The platforms attaching to other items

[torpid patrol]

Basically, a Branch Platform

People were asking for the platforms that can go on the side of bridges, that you can build Decorative items on

Since you can only place one "Branch" in a tile, I added "Branch Platform" that goes out 1 side and "Branch Double Platform" that goes out both sides.

So, the features of the next update so far are.
Tree Overhangs.
Branch Platforms.

Here's my Idea's list.

Tree Overhang (a 1x3x1 base like the house, and platform that sticks out the side, similar to how the Bot Part Factory works)
Add platforms that go on branches to be able to place 1x1 items like decorations on them.
Badwater Seep Rig?

I think I just finished them all

that doesn't mean I'm done though

my file is big, and there's multiple lists around it.

Like...

To do:
Wonder
Roofs
"Leafy decorations"

with no specific "Ideas" attached to them.

[signal fulcrum]

Did they draw them by hand to add an icon?

[torpid patrol]

I drew those icons myself.

Well, Semi-jigsaw, because some of that icon is taken from Vanilla Overhang icon.

[signal fulcrum]

Are they difficult to draw? Could you make a short video tutorial on how to draw a Timeberborn icon?

[torpid patrol]

I mean... I use an ancient art program from like, 2000, because I know how to use it, I seriously doubt anyone else actually uses it, so any guides I'd make would only be semi-useful at best.

[worn ivy]

What program?

[torpid patrol]

Jasc Paint Shop Pro 8

[acoustic yarrow]

ahhh, good ol' PSP

[torpid patrol]

yup

[desert rover]

I know that well! Wasn't that the last one before Corel bought it and turned it into photo enhancing software?

No, 9 was.

It and GIMP are my goto for image stuff.

[torpid patrol]

I know Coral bought it by 10

[worn ivy]

I'm testing to see if Krita is a decent replacement for GIMP, given GIMP's glacial development.

[acoustic yarrow]

I've never used it, but it looks like a better creative tool than GIMP

[torpid patrol]

I know some artists who use Krita

[desert rover]

I have never heard of Krita. I shall have to research it.

Not that I do much with graphic editing anymore now that I'm no longer modding CK2.

[dapper citrus]

I am trying to do the Oasis map on hard with the leafcoats. Is there any way to clean the water oasis from badwater? I don't see anything to pull bad water out of the source in the mod.

[worn ivy]

Use a mechanical pump or rush to get a cover on the source.
Seat covers are allowed on both types of seeps.

[dapper citrus]

That would mean rushing metal O.o. And a lot of cogs. I can't do that in time -.-

Change of plan I guess. Rush the pre-build ancient aquifer and use the high ground only once the low ground becomes unusable.

[torpid patrol]

Wouldn't the badwater pump have also cost metal?