Leafcoats - New faction (Early Access)

[desert rover]

Blame all the really great modders this community has! 🙂

[torpid patrol]

that a good thing?

[desert rover]

Very much yes

I fear the game might crash if it tried to build with the ground udnercut.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, you have to rotate them fairly often, otherwise there's just 1 side you can never have a door.

[hidden cape]

This will make things easier. I was trying to be 100% efficient and not use the filler blocks. This makes much more sense tho

This is all good info. Thank you

[desert rover]

@torpid patrol So... about adding in dynamite. It works, as I am sure you expected. However, Except in certain niche situations, I find I greatly prefer the shovel and extract means of digging. But I do like having the option.

@torpid patrol

I think I just found a minor bug. The upper level of the hauling post acts as if the 4th wall is blocked, despite visually being open. This highlighted path cannot connect to the road. The path on the top of the hauler's post does connect to the road.

[acoustic yarrow]

There's an expansion mod to add dynamite

[desert rover]

Yep. That is what I was discussing.

[acoustic yarrow]

ahh, gotcha

@torpid patrol You're also missing a bunch of translations from Leafcoats (that are present in Emberpelts):

• enUS: Building.DecorativeFloor
• deDE: Building.DecorativeFloor, NaturalResource.AppleTree, Good.Apple, ToolGroups.Platforms, ToolGroups.Industry, Floodgate.Flat, Good.Lubricant
• itIT: Building.DecorativeFloor, NaturalResource.AppleTree, Good.Apple, ToolGroups.Platforms, ToolGroups.Industry, Floodgate.Flat, Good.Lubricant

I discovered this while getting timbertrees working with them,

[desert rover]

You have sparked my curiosity. Timbertrees? I didn't see that in your steam workshop.

[acoustic yarrow]

It's not on steam

There's an online version here: https://darkskies.za.net/~norman/timbertrees/v0.7/

I don't have Emberpelts or Leafcoats uploaded yet

[desert rover]

That is cool!

[acoustic yarrow]

Post for it is at https://discord.com/channels/558398674389172225/1258681137362899005

[torpid patrol]

I don't actually have any german or italian translates on LC yet.

[acoustic yarrow]

ahhh, that would explain it

The Emberpelts translations cover some of the missing values

[desert rover]

@torpid patrol So even with 100 levels, I have hit the build limit. 😛
(Of course, that was one of my goals.)

And yes, 2 of those trees pass through the land from the tree below (1x1 space only). One is ladders only, the other is solid block for power and materials.

I did one hole using the Leaf Coat method of extract and shovels. The other hole was lots of 3-stack dynamite. This is one rare case I liked the dynamite better. But all in all, the Leaf Coat way of digging serves me better.

[torpid patrol]

I'll fix this in the next update.

[willow valley]

i'd like to participate in the beta, but i've never done betatesting before.
What beta feedback are you looking for - just bug hunting, or general feel-of-gameplay feedback? Also, is there a risk to other save files (non-leafcoat ones)?

[desert rover]

I can't answer for Bob on the first part, but there is no risk that I can conceive of. Modded save files are even in a different folder than regular game ones.

[wise mulch]

Not moded save, experimental saves

[hidden cape]

I messed around some more tonight. I still don't understand how to attach branches

[desert rover]

My bad. I always run experemental.

[desert rover]

Okay, I'll do a quick tutorial for it. 1 sec while I grab some screen shots.

[hidden cape]

You can dm me if you don't want to put it here

[desert rover]

Might help other people. Old posts helped me understand the sky walkways for EmberPelts.

[wise mulch]

weak hope that someone will scroll back and read 😭

[desert rover]

You have 3 main options.

• get lucky (actually there is a science to it, I just don't know all of them)
• use a branch block
• use a treetrunk side block with branch access.

Everything you need is in one bar at least.

(more)

[wise mulch]

@torpid patrol , congrats 😍 👏

[desert rover]

For the "get lucky" method, take the branch bridge of the length you want, then rotate it so that the end by your cursor points to the tree. (I do this on the ground myself)

The go up the side of the tree and see if it will turn green anywhere. If it does, you have found a valid connection point.

This method doesn't guarantee you can put the branch exactly where you want it. So there are the other two... (next)

I want my branch at this height. So, I select one of the two branch pieces. (in this case I'll do both) I like the hole facing towards my ladder. The other side hole will appear when we connect the branch bridge. Again, the curser side of the bridge piece faces the tree part. But now that you have placed this one, you can grab abother one and connect it.

(more)

I already know I will get luck on the other tree at this height, which is why I chsoe it. Note that the hole just appeared in the other tree. That wont always happen. So unless you plan both trees at the same time, you may have problems.

This next one is even smoother.

[willow valley]

good to know then. ty

[desert rover]

Here, we have a single bridge 5 units long. It connects to your branch piece and the hole in the side of the tree opens for it.

You can also hang a recreation building (or several) off the side.

Tack on another branch bridge if you want and just go wild.

Then go back and finish up your tree if you want. You will have a gap on the half-height piece. That is intentional and wont hurt the parts above it.

[desert rover]

Any questions?

[torpid patrol]

I think most of the nasty bugs (think game crashing) should have been found and fixed, most of the feedback is just... Missing text, or something that behaves differently than you'd expect.

[hidden cape]

This makes a lot more sense. I just wasn't getting the connection points to light up green. I'll have to experiment more and get back to this thread

[desert rover]

Good luck. 🙂

[willow valley]

what mods do you need for leafcoats? I have a bunch of stuff installed but i want to make sure to turn everything off except for leafcoats so no bugs are caused by interactions

is it just leafpelts and ladders?

or do you also need harmony for ladders

[desert rover]

I -think- harmony is needed. I'm not certain on an absolute minimum build, however. Liek I said, I'm mod-happy. 😛

[acoustic yarrow]

Offically I think it's only BobingaboutScriptPack that LeafCoats requires (in the mod manifest).

Steam and mod.io say that Ladders (and hence Harmony) are also required

[willow valley]

end game when there are no more beavers alive screen says 'folktails' instead of leaf coats. don't ask me how i know

[acoustic yarrow]

lol

[willow valley]

this guy can't seem to be able to find the trees on the other side of the river

nevermind. im an idiot. didnt mark them for cutting

[wise mulch]

Levee drag orientation issue 😢

[torpid patrol]

I mean... that's because of the way buildings that change model depending on neighbours work.

There's only 1 model where it has 1 edge connected to another block, so it always uses that one, and rotates it so that one edge matches where the connection is. That means the planks on top change orientation.

So... Power Dam. You can't drag it.

If I try and change it so you can drag it, it drags the wrong way (So they're not connected, and water runs the wrong way over it), which means I'd need to rotate everything in the definition to make it work.

That means all Power Dams that already exist will appear to rotate 90 degrees when you load a save game from before the change.

Would this be too disruptive, or should I do it anyway?

[wise mulch]

Vanila levee don't have such an issue, that's I reported.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, that's because the Vanilla one doesn't change model based on neighbours.

It's a feature, not a bug ;P

[torpid patrol]

Added some missing locale entries.
Edited Hauling Post upper floor ladder access.
Reduced Lumber Press Injury chance.
Edited Housing Unit Block Occupations so you can build branches on the sides of it.
Edited Grape Vine Model and Texture.
Added description to power dam saying it only has sideways power connections.
Lowered costs of the Tappers Shack.

[acoustic yarrow]

Just add a new prefab and hide the old one.

[torpid patrol]

and how long do I leave it there? forever? hmmm

its not a bad suggestion though.

[acoustic yarrow]

You could remove it at "next major release"

or when there's some other incompatible change.

I assume the BackwardCompatiblePrefabNames don't support rotation 🙁

could probably be added through a script

[torpid patrol]

hmmmmm

Yeah, that's the thing, can I detect the backwards compatible prefab name thing.

[limber mason]

Cannot say enough how much I love this faction

Excellent work

[acoustic yarrow]

I'm only 1 hour into the video, still 2 more left to go 🙂

Maybe you could patch PrefabNameMapper.TryAddPrefab to rotate the prefab if the name has a #rotated suffix.

[torpid patrol]

hmmm

[acoustic yarrow]

urg, wrong place though, and doesn't help with removing the old entity though

How are object rotations stored in saved games?

BlockObject.Orientation

[torpid patrol]

Probably.

But I'd have to intercept the Load command, check the name of the entity before it's loaded, and rotate depending on if it's the old or new one.

You can't just change the orientation, you'd have to move the entity to the same position with the new orientation.

[acoustic yarrow]

Couldn't you just adjust the orientation when loading the entity.

eg: if loading with old name, then instantiate new name and rotate

[torpid patrol]

Maybe, but if you register the placement more than once in the same tick, the game crashes

and the default loading routine will register the entity

[acoustic yarrow]

I'd hope that the object isn't placed until they're all loaded,

because the "removing objects without support" code still has to run

[torpid patrol]

It's a problem I was running into with the Emberpelts Tubeways (you know, because the platform thing, changing if you can build on top of it or not, and if it's supporting the building above it or not) was crashing the game, that's why it only updates when the game is running, and not when it's paused.

[acoustic yarrow]

yea, I was thinking to patch WorldEntitiesLoader.InstantiateEntity

[torpid patrol]

You can actually bypass this. there's more than 1 way to delete an object... in fact I had the opposite problem with the remove terrain function, I had to specifically look to see if something was supported by the terrain tile and not initialise a demolition cascade if it was.

[torpid patrol]

It's neen so long since I've used Harmony, and I only did it once, I can't remember how to write a harmony patch.

[acoustic yarrow]

heh

[torpid patrol]

Probably best to just worry about it later.

Do the other thing for now. Hide the existing Power Dam, make a new one that's rotated.

[torpid patrol]

I'm not even going to do that right now, I'm just going to make a note that I should.

[astral ermine]

it appears the game doesnt like if you go to loosen dirt on the bottom of the map

repeated it again just to be sure, crashed at 97% completed.

[glad oriole]

Might want to use the same script as dynamite to check if it can be placed

[wise mulch]

Why I'm not surprised that is also a tree ❓ 😍 👏

[zenith vector]

all the tree bases are great. hopefully we keep getting more awesome building pieces for the trees as the mod grows

[wise mulch]

Hope for something that allow another tree on a branch 🙏

[zenith vector]

my vote would be for a full blank layer (maybe one of those optional doors) and a side piece with an integrated ladder. Looking at a full wind tower and there's no way to get power to/from without a full layer with a power connection (and a door to get up and build it). but i bet you could go down a rabbit hole and make all sorts of tree pieces

[zenith vector]

I think there is a dependency that isn't being enforced (and isn't technically required). When i load up without the ladder mod, i get a very dev mode name and description, but including the ladder fixes it. I don't know if it's meant to be a dependency or not, but it works fine without the ladder mod (except for the name and description strings)

[worn ivy]

Ladder is a "spiritual dependency."
That is to say, it isn't actually needed; it just says it is.

[torpid patrol]

Is this also true with Remove Terrain?

[torpid patrol]

what item or "Locale Entry" isn't correct?

[torpid patrol]

While Ladder doesn't prevent it crash.... it does prevent log spam from the nav mesh grid.

So you can play without it... but should have it.

I should probably set ladder as an actual dependency.

[zenith vector]

it's the same for both ladders, but they seem to work just fine. if i install the ladder mod they both show up correctly (just 'ladder' as the name and an appropriate description) - english localization if that matters

[zenith vector]

so are the dirt excavator and badwater rig. so good.

[astral ermine]

the power dam could really be made "drag-able". would be a nice little QoL update for it

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, we were talking about that earlier. It drags the wrong way, so would need to edit that, which would then break every instance everyone has already build, or do some trickery.

[astral ermine]

that doesnt sound fun at all lol

[torpid patrol]

Yeah

[astral ermine]

floating control towers 😛

[acoustic yarrow]

(To be read in the voice of ZoidbergProfessor Farnsworth) "Good news everyone, I added Leaf Coats to timbertrees", example

[tawny zealot]

Heh, the vanilla dam drags the "Wrong way" for me too, is it based off of the vanilla one?

Well the mod looks intersting, I'll have to try this or Emberpelts next!

[willow valley]

i gotta say i really adore the sideways industry buildings. its so fun and they are lovely models

[willow valley]

hmm. why is that not connected

rebuilding it fixed it

okay what the heck its not working again

it says entrance blocked. by what?

[torpid patrol]

Uuuuhh, that's not right.

is that how it builds on a branch bridge?

[astral ermine]

No, off a tree it looks fine. I just wanted a control tower out in the middle of my tree farm and gave that a try. Didn't notice it for hours lol

[astral ermine]

piece thats helping the floating control tower

what is the branch piece supposed to do anyway? i cant seem to get it to attach to any tree pieces, except on the ground. the branch bridge works fine

[twin steeple]

My game crashed 3 times after using the 'rubble dynamite' (forgot the name).
The 1st time I don't remember exactly when it happened but I had used the 'rubble dynamite'. The second and third time, I paid attention and it happened after blowing some up. 2nd time happened after 8-10 rubbles had been removed. 3rd time it was around 30ish.

[astral ermine]

dont use loosen terrain on the bottom of the map. it doesnt like that

brought it up yesterday too

[torpid patrol]

The bridge is supposed to only connect to the side of the tree, the "Branch" (Bad name for it) was supposed to be a connection to the branch bridge that can be placed on the ground... it's kinda redundant since I changed the way things work, and basically just a fancy path.

[torpid patrol]

I'm really not sure why this is behaving like that.

[torpid patrol]

The screenshot kinda says it all here. why is there that floating tile above the branch, and why can you build on it?

It's set to Stackable (supports building on top of it) when it's not supposed to. I can turn that off.

For context, the Branch and Branch Bridges were based on the Emberpelts Walkways/Skybridges then edited. so they originally had a roof, so it made sense for them to be stackable. I guess I forgot to make the single block version not stackable.

[fallow smelt]

is there plans to add something like water beavers sequoias? giganormous 3x3 trees that reach 14+ upwards?
(those come available only later with science to unlock advanced forester / tree nursery)

seen a lot of fun screenshots of your mod. but kinda missed some fancy giant trees to complement the buildings
(i.e. there's too few green leafs imho, at least above 3m from ground)

harvesting 'branch-trees' from the branches of the giant tree buildings would be fun too (if that wasn't a huge pain to handle the soil). like pruning the overgrowing greens to let light into the homes, look down on poor ground dwellers 🙂

[astral ermine]

Happy to help 😀. Personally lean more towards the FT for the base factions. So really enjoying that you're making another modded faction closer to them

[hidden cape]

just a naming discrepancy

[torpid patrol]

an easy fix.

These are the types of errors I missed because I did a lot of my testing with my other mods turned on.

[hidden cape]

np, just helping out and enjoying the mod

[acoustic yarrow]

#1258681137362899005 makes it really easy to spot missing translations, because I add Untranslated: to strings that are missing translations.

@hidden cape Which language do you use? The English translation for the Levee with Zipline Beam seems to be present in version 0.7.10.11 of the mod at least.

[boreal sundial]

Question, I noticed beehives are included in the mod, but I know they don't boost the rate of chestnuts, mangroves, and other tree/bush crops in the base game. Have they been recoded to change that here?

[acoustic yarrow]

All Trees Only crops if I remember correctly.

[hidden cape]

Maybe I haven't updated

[acoustic yarrow]

Did you get from Steam or mod.io?

[boreal sundial]

Yeah, and leafcoats have no crops ...

[acoustic yarrow]

yea

[torpid patrol]

I guess I should remove the bee hive then.

[torpid patrol]

Or...check why it works on crops and not trees, and add it to trees where appropriate? I can't really edit berries, but I could edit the others, like apple trees, dandelion, mangrove and chestnut.

If it's possible anyway, it's probably just a "Is effected by beehive" script.

[valid sleet]

I think applying it to apples and dandelions would be good if possible. Could you also incorporate the honey mod, so they can use the hives to make honey cakes even if you dont get the fertility bonus that adds a food group.
If that mod is simple enough and won't break with updates and make yours reliant on another mod..

[torpid patrol]

It would probably need a specific version of honey mod making for leafcoats.

I mean, where do you make honey cakes?

Also, pretty sure it edits the behive to make it connect to a path and be accessible, so it would need the edited leafcoats beehive to be edited again.

You're basically starting over.

[valid sleet]

Never mind then 😅

[acoustic yarrow]

builder.AddDecorator<Crop, Pollinatee>(); is what enables it (in PollinationConfigurator)

so it probably wouldn't be hard to add Pollinatee to the trees manually,

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, should be easy to add that to the unity prefab for the trees I'm adding.

Most of them are already clones anyway, even from vanilla, so i can change their order.

The only ones I can't easily change are the ones in Common, basically anything in the map editor, so berry, Birch, pine and oak.

[fallow smelt]

technically you can replace the common ones to use your own prefabs?

having bees pollinate berries too would be kinda cool

[hidden cape]

Steam

[torpid patrol]

And while I'm not against that, it would effect folktails too, and I'd rather not.

[wise mulch]

This should be illegal 🤣

[worn ivy]

It definitely isn't BOSHA compliant, at least.
That ladder either needs a cage around it or should require a belay system and harness.

[torpid patrol]

Edited science cost of 6 long Branch Bridge.
Grape Vines now occupy 2 blocks high.
Adjusted Grape Vine Watered colour again.
Edited "Branch" to not be Stackable.
Fixed access to buildings above a zipline.```

I've just been doing a fix or 2 every day, so, since the list has a few items on there, I decided to just release an update.

[acoustic yarrow]

mmm, I noticed that Steam has been pretty bad about auto-updating mods recently. https://discord.com/channels/558398674389172225/1283367971280126087 helps with that.

[hidden cape]

Ya I usually use the update button

[hidden cape]

This has been the most fun I've had in awhile with the beavers. Thank you for all the effort you put into this

Work in progress

Is the wood press (log making/plank building) intended to be late game? I've been hesitant to use it (power consumption/resources)

[fallow smelt]

that's a pretty cool map for this faction!

[hidden cape]

Beaver twist or new beaver twist. It's quite fun. There's a lot of hidden "plumbing" that's complicated to undo

[torpid patrol]

Glad you're enjoying.

[astral ermine]

Quite enjoyed my first test run of it too, wish the tree could be make more tree shaped with stuff and not as much really big log. But fully understand you're in early testing and this is faction 2 you're tackling. Which is crazy in and of itself

[hidden cape]

I liked stacking the industry

[torpid patrol]

And bonus points that items move themselves?

[hidden cape]

Huh?

[worn ivy]

Trees have a fancy function where goods produced in a tree will be automatically sent to any consumers or storages of that item in the same tree: no haulers needed.

Haulers are still needed to haul between different trees, however.

[astral ermine]

Yeah, that is a really nice feature. Nice productivity boost to the less efficient FT production chains

[hidden cape]

Huh? Well then. I'll have to experiment some more now

[acoustic yarrow]

Not sure if JC reported this crash. Seems to have happened when a lumberjack was selected, and then the cut trees menu was opened. Kinda weird.

[astral ermine]

i tried re-creating what he thought it might have been, i couldnt get the crash to repeat from that

might still be what caused it, but maybe something else was also at play

[acoustic yarrow]

ahh, could easily be

[torpid patrol]

I saw that in his video. I have no idea why leafcoats could be doing that if ft/it do not, I don't have any fancy scripts on my trees or lumberjack flag. Tree murderer is simply a need that looks for an event, so shouldn't be related to the cutting area tool.

I just assumed it was related to Lukes highlighting mod.

[acoustic yarrow]

ooohh, that's far more likely, yea

[limber mason]

Oops yeah I didn't report it. But I do have tons of other mods so I didn't want to automatically think it was specifically a leafcoats thing

[hasty kettle]

rly cool. thx for sharing.. you finalised a lot of things that are possible on the map... really nice to see

[hidden cape]

Holy crap, you made this insanity?! I applaud you. I spent so much time going up and down layers figuring out the plumbing. Sending beavers into tight spaces to undo blockages. It's a real test of what is possible

[torpid patrol]

Janleon is a map god.

[hidden cape]

I'm definitely checking out other maps. Thank you @hasty kettle

[hasty kettle]

thx a lot and happy to hear

[vocal sparrow]

Hey @torpid patrol really enjoying the mod! Is there any chance of branches to transfer power between trees in the future? Using platforms, etc is a bit clunky atm....

[torpid patrol]

I mean... maybe, I guess.

[torpid patrol]

I made a note of it.

[worn ivy]

Honestly, I think it would be interesting to have a branch variant that conducts power, but can't be walked on.

[acoustic yarrow]

Maybe power lines should be able to hang onderneath the branch?

[hasty kettle]

a branch that conducs power sounds like a very good idea.
i dont think power lines would fit. beavers are using kinetic energy in timberborn not electric energy... or maybe with a building that transfer the kinetic energy into electric.. but that feels like overkill for sutch a small addition

[fallow smelt]

there a 'power shaft extensions' mod that adds tunnels and bridges.
likely not yet enabled for leaf coats, but imho those might work well for branch-branch or root-root connections

[torpid patrol]

I am thinking a Branch Bridge variation that has a power shaft on the deck instead of a pathway.

[torpid patrol]

hmmm, looking into this. It feels weird that you can build the Loosen on the bottom layer but not remove.

[hidden cape]

Now there's some thinking. But how would they build it. Unless you scaffolded around

[torpid patrol]

Okay, so... Dynamite includes a decorator of BottomTerrainLevelValidationConstraint

I can try and manually add that to Loosen Dirt and see what it does.

[torpid patrol]

so this works...

but now you also can't build it on the layer above the bottom layer.

I'm probably going to need to make a custom new thing specifically for loosen terrain

where you place it like Dynamite.

or...

Edit the script slightly to let me specify a demolition height offset.

(It's not going to work when I forget to compile the new script pack)

One possible side effect of these changes...

The placement of the "Loosen Dirt" object may be different, and if so, could cause problems.

oh, no, seems to be in the same place.

this isn't right though

and remove terrain doesn't work at all

so I obviously broked it

[torpid patrol]

I not only fixed it, but fixed the bug, by changing how it works.
You shouldn't even notice the difference on the player end, except for not being able to build on the bottom of the map

hopefully

[torpid patrol]

Playing with the thing to recognise the name when you include a command up front. like <color=#000000> and <size=30>

[torpid patrol]

@limber mason I send you a DM a few days ago offering to help write your Patreon List Beaver Namer thing we mentioned on that stream, but you didn't respond.

I guess I got caught in your spam filter.

[limber mason]

Yeah my DMs are a mess. I'm at work right now, I'll message you later tonight

I appreciate it

[torpid patrol]

I'll probably be asleep by then, but we can work through it.

[limber mason]

No worries

[torpid patrol]

anyone understand what he's saying?

[acoustic yarrow]

Maybe treated planks?

Pineamber == pine resin

unless you mean the "op" part, in which case "over powered"

[astral ermine]

Yeah, best guess pineamber is treated planks.

[acoustic yarrow]

Updated #1258681137362899005 to pick up the latest release.

[hasty kettle]

As a German who unfortunately doesn't understand his fellow Germans perfectly, I would assume the same. 😄

[torpid patrol]

Edited the "Tunnel" script used by LeafCoats Remove Terrain and Loosen Dirt to add a Z offset. (so you can set it to delete the block below the object, makes it able to function more like Dynamite)
Edited the Beaver Avatar and Texture setters for beavers with Unique names to also work with names that include a command, such as <color> and <size>
The Setters will also match First Names only if the full name isn't found. So an Icon and Texture for "Gary" will also match to a beaver named "Gary II" or "Gary Jr".

Name Generator:
Updated Leaf Coats patterns.
Added some more unique icons for certain names.

Leaf Coats:
Removed some redundant files.
Changed the Loosen Dirt to function more like Dynamite, which will prevent you from being able to build it on the bottom tile. Should look and function exactly the same as before otherwise.
Needs script pack update.
Fix Ladder Locale entry.

[hidden cape]

He's saying there is little use for the treated planks. Maybe change the recipe for contamination barriers to use treated planks instead of metal. Which isn't a bad idea as there isn't much use for treated plus it would help getting contamination barriers online sooner. The ladders being too op is a dilemma because yes they make life so much easier but they are kind of required for vertical movement of the trees. Can't remember if they were free at start or locked behind science. If free, maybe lock behind science at a little more than stairs?

[worn ivy]

Locking ladders behind science seems hard to justify when the District center has one built-in.

[torpid patrol]

The mine still uses them.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, Ladders are a little on the OP side, but they're kind of important for the Leaf Coats build style

[hidden cape]

I forgot about the mine. The map i chose was so ruins dense that I haven't gotten to using the mine

[hidden cape]

Ya. This was my conundrum as well. I think it's fine. I actually really enjoy the ladder and it's style

[wise mulch]

Even this : #1377606620342648832 message ❓ 🤣

[hidden cape]

I mean... Scaling entire cliff sides... I will say I had the thought to build an infinity tower to access an area but changed to a more reasonable longer route for continuity. But that's a me thing

Maybe a different cost, not sure. You're always going to get opinions on too easy, change this etc. I think bobingabout did a great job making this.

[hidden cape]

got this error report with the beavies. only have leafcoat mods running and steam update button

its the loosen dirt mod/portion. just watched a beaver build to 95% then the game crashed

leafcoats beta: v0.7.10.13, leafcoats badwater: v0.7.10.0, leafcoats explosives: v0.7.10.0, bobingabout scriptpack v0.7.9.7

all versions seem to be up to date

[acoustic yarrow]

log snippet:

InvalidOperationException: Cannot place BlockObject LooseDirt.LeafCoats(Clone) at (3, 6, 15).

Timberborn.BlockSystem.BlockObject.AddToService
Timberborn.BlockSystem.BlockObject.Reposition
Timberborn.BlockSystem.BlockObjectFactory.CreateUnfinished
Timberborn.BlockSystem.BlockObjectFactory.CreateFinished
Bobingabout.BobingaboutTunnel.OnDeleted
Timberborn.ConstructionSites.DeleteOnFinishConstructionSite.NotifyDeleted
Timberborn.ConstructionSites.ConstructionSite.FinishIfRequirementsMet
Timberborn.ConstructionSites.ConstructionSite.SetBuildTimeProgress
Timberborn.ConstructionSites.ConstructionSite.IncreaseBuildTime
Timberborn.ConstructionSites.BuildExecutor.Tick
Timberborn.BehaviorSystem.BehaviorManager.TickRunningExecutor
Timberborn.BehaviorSystem.BehaviorManager.Tick
Timberborn.TickSystem.TickableComponent.StartAndTick
Timberborn.TickSystem.MeteredTickableComponent.StartAndTick
Timberborn.TickSystem.TickableEntity.TickTickableComponents
Timberborn.TickSystem.TickableEntity.Tick

Can you post a screenshot of what was at (3, 6, 15)?

hmmm,

ahhh

so the stack is [open space, ground, loosen terrain]

so when loosen terrain completes, then the ground can't be replaced with blockage loose dirt, because it wouldn't have anything to rest on

I wonder if this is a side effect of the fix to prevent building on the bottom of the map.

[acoustic yarrow]

as a work-around try Remove Terrain instead

[hidden cape]

ok. ya i noticed there was an open cavern in the map below. so maybe its a support issue

[hidden cape]

still having fun

[torpid patrol]

Probably

I'll have to try and remember tomorrow to look at the script and do a check to see if it has support before placing the block.

[acoustic yarrow]

I assume the built in game tunnel works correctly, so that sounds good to me

[torpid patrol]

The current version of loosen dirt actually functions more like Dynamite than a tunnel. It just then tries to place an object in the tile BELOW where it was.

Like a Dynamite Tunnel hybrid.

[torpid patrol]

I added 1 line of codfe

if (!_stackableBlockService.IsStackableBlockAt(placement.Coordinates.Below())) return;

of course I had to add 3 lines of code to load the _stackableBlockService

as I feared, that's only looking for "Stackable Blocks", so, now you're unlikely to see the loose dirt at all

So, for testing purposes, we have an arch like this

Build one of these on each of them

when finished

Middle one just "Collapses", so no loot.

In the technical instance, it just doesn't place the loose dirt.

[fallow smelt]

can you easily patch it to iterate way down here?

regarding the 'below' check?

[torpid patrol]

Also, check the message box in the bottom left corner.

[torpid patrol]

I'm not sure what you're asking, way down where?

[fallow smelt]

the way the 'loot' is placed just appears to look downward once

if it not finds a block there, it might just iterate further down, couldn't it?

[torpid patrol]

the floating loot?

[fallow smelt]

this one

[torpid patrol]

placing loot just places it where the block was, causing it to float, that's what you're talking about, right?

[fallow smelt]

now i'm confused myself^^

[torpid patrol]

you're asking if it can look further down to place it on the floor

instead of floating in air?

[fallow smelt]

that too, yeah

[torpid patrol]

what else then? because I'm not sure what you're asking

when demolishing the floating terrain block and you get no loot?

[fallow smelt]

in this arch example the middle 'loot' is lost as it not finds any support - could it not try and go down to 'place' it?

[torpid patrol]

It's not actually the "Tunnel" (Loosen dirt tool) that places the loot, that just places a Loose Dirt. It's when you demolish the loose dirt that it places loot.

So, since the Tunnel just isn't placing the loose dirt, because it's floating, it doesn't get to the generate loot phase.

That would be doable, but a more complex fix

[fallow smelt]

oh, ok

[torpid patrol]

like, I'd need to define a "Loot to drop if you can't place the object" on the tunnel code. It's doable.

[fallow smelt]

oh, that's how you solved it!

i thought you placed the object directly

[torpid patrol]

well, I haven't written it yet.

[torpid patrol]

It's complicated ¦3

When the "Tunnel" is "Completed" it demolishes itself, and places a new object in it's place, the loose dirt.

When the loose dirt is demolished, it creates loot in it's place.

I should probably fix the "Floating loot" thing before I try and copy that code to the tunnel as a "If you can't place the item, place loot instead" function.

[fallow smelt]

yeah, makes sense

[torpid patrol]

I should probably rename Leaf Coats from Beta to Early Access at this point. It's mostly stable, just incomplete.

[fallow smelt]

just realising that placing the loosen on a floating block is weird in itself. that's not possible with tunnels i believe.
there's another edge-case with those: when you have two floating blocks and replace one, the other can loose support and 'vanish'.
in case of dynamites the material is refunded (to next free tile) but what would happen with the loosen dirt?

[torpid patrol]

It's because I changed it's functionality to be more like Dynamite.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, probably get refunded too? I'm not sure.

does it really matter?

in the grand scheme, it's fairly cheap.

[fallow smelt]

yeah, not really

in either case

was just curious as such edge-cases feel weird during the game

[torpid patrol]

I mean, when you remove terrain from under terrain, what happens? it just collapses and dissapears.

so, imagine you try to loosen dirt, and that happens to it.

anyway

Loose dirt removal, lets try something

so what happens when I demolish that tower of dirt?

that's not what I was expecting.

Cannot place BlockObject RecoveredGoodStack(Clone) at (53, 159, 9).

hmmmm

could be related to registering entities...
Let me comment out that falling rubble fix.

no it still does it.

This is something I'll need to look at another day.

Worst case scenario, remove the rubble spawner from loose dirt...

Which means no early game dirt.

Loosen Dirt creating loose dirt then just becomes an inconvenience for not having extract yet.

Fixed crash on tunnel script when trying to place an object in floating terrain. (Leaf Coats loose Dirt. It just doesn't place anything in that situation now)
Fixed floating rubble on Rubble Spawner scipt (leaf coats loose dirt removal.)

[torpid patrol]

Will have to look into fixing that crash in this scenario later.

So... Would it be that bad of a thing if Loose Dirt no longer drops Dirt?

[wise mulch]

If nobody will ask me to make Dirt mod available for LeafCoats, it's OK 🥳

[hidden cape]

@torpid patrol quick check, did my issue resolve?

[torpid patrol]

What was your issue again?

[hidden cape]

This

[torpid patrol]

Oh, crashing when you build loosen dirt with nothing under it. Yeah, I fixed that.

[hidden cape]

Ok

[torpid patrol]

I don't prevent you from building there, I instead just don't spawn the loose dirt.

[hidden cape]

That's fine. Just never watched a bug in real time before

[hidden cape]

If I were to build a stack of medium windmills, is there a horizontal connection? Or do they only have vertical?

[torpid patrol]

Only vertical. You need to put something else in there, probably at the bottom, for it to connect to.

On that note, I think the tree topper windmill has power connections on the sides.

Wait, when did I get my Eager Beaver status?

[wise mulch]

@torpid patrol , congrats on promotion 😍 👏

[torpid patrol]

Thanks.

[wise mulch]

Well, you earned-it. With two factions, of course ...

[torpid patrol]

Lots of work went into it.

Next addon mod for leafcoats, Tree Beavers. Or beaver trees?

You plant a tree, when it becomes mature, turns into a beaver.

Also need to think about what the wonder will do.

That's assuming I can figure out how to do it. I assume there's some sort of event on when a tree matures. If not I'd have to implement a tick counter of some sort.

[worn ivy]

The only problem is that now I actually have to look at usernames to see who is talking.
I guess you could repurpose a "farmhouse" by moving it to housing, and trigger the beavers to spawn on harvesting?
It would definitely take some managing by the player, though.

[torpid patrol]

Harvest the tree to spawn a beaver, that's an interesting idea.

[torpid patrol]

Oh wow, you got it too, you're not brown text anymore.

[worn ivy]

As for the wonder... They would definitely lean toward something like the Folktail's Earth Recultivator.
It would be kind of fun if it randomly spawned trees around the map, and give the players a good reason to try and make larger maps completely green.

[fallow smelt]

Timberborn.Growing.Growable has a HasGrown EventHandler

that one is triggered when plants reach grown state

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, hard to see past the earth recultivator because it fits the leafcoats so well.

[tawny zealot]

I was thinking of this, you should totally do this!

[torpid patrol]

Not sure when I'll get around to it, but I'll make notes in my to do list so when the modding mood strikes me next, I'll work on it.

I just need to not spend all day almost every day for almost 3 months straight (with a 2 week break) working on mod stuff like I did for Leaf Coats. Just a couple hours a day every other day for a while.

[hidden cape]

That's awesome, it's literally a nursery. A building called a nursery and it plants baby beaver seeds

[torpid patrol]

I was thinking just the standard Forrester plants "Beaver Trees", literally the same way you would with any other tree.

[hidden cape]

Also maybe just like a tree topper asthetic, so the top of some of the buildings can look like trees but give a bonus

[torpid patrol]

"Roof"?

That's what I was thinking anyway, a tree topper that's just a fancy looking "Roof" that gives the roof aesthetic buff.

I could probably model a simple one... like, maybe take the top of the large water pump and edit it slightly to fit the tree profile.

then maybe add a few other features to it to make it more leafy.

[worn ivy]

You know, with the automated logistics within a tree... Automatic wonder reloading!

[torpid patrol]

I think Wonder is actually on the list of possible buildings that it works with.

I did some early prototyping where it just links every building in a district.

The leaf coats version puts that script on the building itself, then adds extra "Link" nodes, and creates a "Web", basically a list of buildings it's connected to.

and it just sends items to, or pulls items from the building first on the list with the highest priority.

[hidden cape]

The roof concept would work. Just something so it doesn't look like I have topped off trees everywhere. I have put up the large windmills, Ferris wheel and observatory tho

[pulsar crest]

Suggestion: put leaves decoration similar to how the observation decks are. They attach to bridges. so we can put many bridges and we can in theory have very leafy big trees. Please ignore if this has been suggested before :)

[hidden cape]

gonna call this build done. theres no roofs so i cant do that buff

[torpid patrol]

I'm not sure if it was suggested before, probably, but it is something I plan to do. Probably merged with the roof buff.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, I know ¦3

[acoustic yarrow]

oooh, what about "roofs" that you install on bridges, to make them covered bridges?

attach like observation bridges, but probably just need to be platforms (that can only be placed on bridges),

something like

[torpid patrol]

Maybe. Might block the ability to build other things there.

Not sure if I can limit to to bridges.

[tepid lodge]

Is it possible to make it so that when the beavers of the faction die, they turn yellow? Something like withered leaves

[worn ivy]

Perhaps the death event could be used to trigger a script that changes the beavers' name to include a color code?

Or do the corpses no longer have names?

[tepid lodge]

I would also like to point out a bug related to stick bridges. It turns out that they can be connected like this, which doesn't look very nice. I don't know if this is a bug or if it was intended that way.
Well, speaking in principle about these branches - maybe make them need supports every, say, 10 blocks?

[torpid patrol]

... perhaps I should draw some graphics in the base tile.

[tepid lodge]

Ukraine localization

[hidden cape]

Along this line. My only minute issue was the pathing on the rounded corners squares off, so it hangs over the edge of the corner. I don't think there's anything that can be done. But in the grand scheme of things it's nit picking over a well made mod

[tepid lodge]

I reported bugs and made suggestions for improvement lol, what nitpicking.

[hidden cape]

No I meant me saying the squaring off vs curved paths would be me nitpicking the mod. Sorry if that wasn't clear

[tepid lodge]

Surviving on a difficult level is unfortunately almost impossible, you need to think about something about it

I tried on the original maps

[torpid patrol]

Impossible in what way?

[tepid lodge]

There is not enough food. The grapes simply do not have time to grow before the beavers start dying en masse(

[torpid patrol]

You can do dandelions in 6 days, I think if tou can buikd a fermenter. Grapes are more like 13.

But, I'll see if I can make a faster growing plant

[tepid lodge]

Hmmm, for some reason I didn't think of dandelions.

[tepid lodge]

Maybe something like raspberries? In real life, they grow incredibly fast.

[fallow smelt]

i see brambles covering the world haha

[wise mulch]

Only if you dare to use vertical spreading, from Configurable growth mod 😛

[hidden cape]

i feel like this was a learning curve for the faction. i started out vanilla with no prior knowledge to see how well i would do (normal setting). i was expecting a farm, only had berries, didnt even plant grapes for almost a full 2 cycles. once you know the forester is the end all be all building, i think your frame of reference and play style changes drastically. the fermenter is cheap and a single beaver treadmill can power one. but again, not having prior knowledge of how the faction worked meant i started out at a disadvantage and had to learn quick

[torpid patrol]

They do have a few things that make them unique

[wise mulch]

Some (a lot, in fact), likes extreme height 🤣

[willow valley]

i actually think it would be nice if the "tree terminator" buildings like observatory and big windmill came with leaf toppers and roof bonuses built-in, because otherwise its awkard to juggle wanting the bonus but needing to put one of those buildings there

[astral ermine]

that actually sounds like a good idea. give the roof bonus to the pieces that are designed to top a tree

[willow valley]

it does make me wonder though 🤔 tree topper would probably take up extra space/tiles
might then make it awkward to fit if your trunks are too close together
maybe having options with and without, with terminating buildings with intergrated toppers costing more?

would clutter up the building menu with extra options but thats not the end of the world

[willow valley]

i had the instinct of spacing my buildings like trunks would be spaced in a forest, seeing them all next to eachother like this is unexpectedly shocking. would make sharing power much easier...

[wise mulch]

sharing power , this is the goal.

[willow valley]

yeah doing it for mine was a pain XP i had to go unlock tunnels for it to run it underground

would be fun to get a branch thats just for sharing power

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, not a bad idea.

[torpid patrol]

if you've been watching JC the Beard playing on youtube, he's basically been playing as intended, so fairly spaced out trees.

[wise mulch]

Not so sure about "bridged" windmills 🤣

[astral ermine]

But you must remember, we absolutely will play as not intended too lol

[hidden cape]

I built a forest, spaced about 6 tiles away. But I was also restricted space wise due to my map choice

[meager olive]

that's cool though, your trees share roots! like that irl tree that grows a forest from one plant!

[glad oriole]

been a bit since I read this thread, and uh... For the roofs bit, why not have the tree toppers give roof buffs for just that 3x3 footprint?

[torpid patrol]

Of course, and I can't stop you.

It's also a good way to find bugs, things I didn't account for.

[astral ermine]

https://tenor.com/view/im-doing-my-part-serious-stare-gif-11979677

[torpid patrol]

Well, I've not been working on it for a bit, but there's the question of food balance.

Without crops, it's a pretty harsh start.

I think most of the trees are fairly fair, which brings us back to Bushes. Can't really edit the blueberry bush. Dandelions grow pretty fast, but need the fermenter.

Which brings us to grapes. What times would you suggest? I'll try and best calculate the yield to keep it balanced, just want to know Times.

[hidden cape]

If you know how to play and set up a fermenter with a treadmill early, I don't think it's an issue really. Personally it was more of a mindset that you get crops from farm and fermenting was phase 2 of a build instead of out the gate

[astral ermine]

Gotta try hard a time or 2 to get a better feel still. But not knowing about the dandelions made normal a little hairy to start waiting on the grapes.

[willow valley]

Yeah same here. Starting was difficult only because I was used to playing other factions that use crops

I’d maybe swap grapes and dandelion position in the menu maybe? To suggest to go for dandelions first

[torpid patrol]

Reasonable suggestion there.

I forget, does the fermenter cost planks, or only logs?

[astral ermine]

just logs iirc. like 15 of them

[torpid patrol]

That is appropriate for early game

[acoustic yarrow]

https://darkskies.za.net/~norman/timbertrees/v0.7/enUS_LeafCoats.html#:~:text=Fermenter says 25 Logs

(for version 0.7.10.12, but I think 0.7.10.13 was the same)

[torpid patrol]

Still pretty good for early game.

[acoustic yarrow]

yep

[torpid patrol]

And treadmill is what, another 25 logs?

Plus 15? For the forester?

[acoustic yarrow]

20 Logs for Treadmill

25 Logs for Forestor

[torpid patrol]

As you can tell, I'm not looking

So that's 70 logs, and some grow time.

I guess it could be a bit cheaper, but that's not too bad to get food running in 6 days

Assuming there's that many logs at the starting area, but it includes forester to make more trees.

[acoustic yarrow]

Maybe it could be moved before the Food Processor?

i.e. things that are already unlocked should appear before locked items?

[torpid patrol]

Valid feedback.

[acoustic yarrow]

Same for Forester and Lumber Mill before Pruning Flag and Lumber Press

[torpid patrol]

It does go berry, dandelion, grapes, then trees, right?

[acoustic yarrow]

yea

I think so

[torpid patrol]

I'll look at these, assuming I remember to, when I get home from work.

[acoustic yarrow]

That's the order in which timbertrees has it, and I think I have it right in there

Blueberries will keep the beavers alive and don't cost any logs 😛

(assuming the starting area has some -- which it probably does for the other factions)

[tepid lodge]

If you place a piece of wood structure on a ladder, it won't block the passage. The same should be true for other buildings.

[torpid patrol]

Should this also cost planks?

[torpid patrol]

Can you explain that better?

[stiff holly]

Probably something other than just logs, since it's mid game.

[torpid patrol]

yup

[tepid lodge]

This is how my route goes. I placed a decorative piece of wood on top of the ladder, and it doesn't block the beavers' path—they go right through the wood.

[torpid patrol]

hmmm

[stiff holly]

Looks good to me

[torpid patrol]

CHAD JR GREW UP.

[hidden cape]

I think this is key. The logical order of these items being in the correct left to right progression order would make things easier to understand.

[hidden cape]

I think all the cost and math are right. Making a fermenter cost planks would put you behind quick, so logs makes sense. Also it's a change in mind set. Normal beavers you plant, eat raw, then slowly progress to fermenting, but you have like 2-3 raw things. Here you just have berries and dandelions and you don't tend to think to ferment first cycle

[willow valley]

i wouldnt mind branches and bark being incorporated into more recipes instead of logs, potentially. I only really grew them late game when I transfered over to making instead of cutting down logs
it would encourage making logs/planks earlier, too. I didn't find the plant murderer debuff to be serious enough to discourage me from cutting down trees

if i remember right, the gatherer flag for bark and branches is locked, right? might also encourage going into less tree murder early by having that unlocked at the start of the game

if you want to encourage people to switch over earlier, by any case

[willow valley]

ah, i see bark being implemented here, ha. should have scrolled down

[torpid patrol]

Agreed. I mostly just used whatever the materials already was when making buildings and intended to go back and edit them for leaflets specific things, but never did.

[barren smelt]

I can't beLEAF how much work has gone into this

[torpid patrol]

I spent so much time on this, that I'm basically taking a break from modding.

I've barely touched it for 2 weeks.

I think with a few more tweaks though, I should change it from Beta to Early Access.

and I'll change it to just full release whenever I make the Wonder and Roofs

[astral ermine]

just noticed something sly, or perhaps unintentional, that happened because of your small storages. they cant be used as a really cheap bridge early on unless the gap is at least 2 deep.

[torpid patrol]

I wouldn't say it was the intent of making them like that, but I was aware it would prevent that when I did it.

[astral ermine]

started a hard run on diorama earlier. have made it to the first bad tide at least. though even knowing what i needed to do for food, i still ran out a couple of times in the first 2 seasons. not sure what to do, but some early balance could use some tweaking for sure

[hidden cape]

Ya, I honestly didn't even use the bark/branch thing until the very end. I was rushing to test things more and realized the debuff wasn't too bad. I did have a large bark branch farm, but I didn't want to wait for the processing so I forced regular oak farming to speed things up

[barren smelt]

Wise choice. Burnout is real

[torpid patrol]

indeed

[ebon rivet]

Someone had shared a picture of a Rainbow Eucalyptus tree and also mentioned large decorative trees... is it the WBO or Emberpelts but one has a Giant Baobab Tree as a "recreational" item where benches could be added and water could be tapped.
Maybe something like the Giant Baobab tree but as a Rainbow Eucalyptus Tree, that could be pretty neat!

[acoustic yarrow]

Waterbeavers have a Baobab tree Giant Sequoia

I thought that they had a Baobab too though,

hmmm, maybe via the "Special Map Reader mod"?

[acoustic yarrow]

(I think it's only on mod.io)

[fallow smelt]

waterbeavers once did have them or the map reader mod had. but U5 or older version.
giant bamboo and pumpkin been 2x2 in U6 too.
there's the issue with U7 and random rotation now. plants rotate around 0,0 now, which makes anything bigger than 1x1 go out of it's plot
so only the big sequoias left now, being 3x3x14+

[fallow smelt]

it's called 'MorePlants ! Reader' on steam

[acoustic yarrow]

(and it's called "extra-crops" as the mod id on mod.io)

I saw pumpkins and giant bamboo had to become 1x1 for the first July release (3.0.7)

[wise mulch]

YA, rotation issue with 2X2 models.

[acoustic yarrow]

I wonder if a "Hue & Turn for Mods" could fix that

[wise mulch]

Maybe, but for almost all players, to manually fix each item will be ... overkill 🤣

[acoustic yarrow]

That's why I added the "for Mods" suffix.

[fallow smelt]

writing a custom line of code that moves the rotation base point depending on size might be simple

[acoustic yarrow]

I wonder if a mod could be made to read that from the prefab definition could be made

[fallow smelt]

not sure lukes mod changes that or just applies rotation

[fallow smelt]

is there need for it?

[acoustic yarrow]

I think "Hue & Turn" you can set the rotation origin too (not 100% sure)

How else would you set the center? I guess you could look at the size of the object?

[fallow smelt]

not considered that. just assumed it used whatever the default was?

might be cool to have big plants and not worry about rotation looking odd

[acoustic yarrow]

I think it changed to now use the center of the model

[fallow smelt]

that's what it looks like, yeah

[acoustic yarrow]

Whereas maybe previously it used the model origin (I'm not sure)

[torpid patrol]

Point of interest.

Like Emberpelts Wet Fur, Plant Murderer also prevents breeding, but you probably don't notice it as its only the lumberjacks who don't breed.

[wise mulch]

Watch out for Luke. Maybe will make a new season (raining with cutted trees) 🤣

[acoustic yarrow]

lol

[pulsar crest]

might be overkill but maybe Plant Murderer can act like Injury where they completely stopped working (due to guilt or shame) and they need contemplation spots (instead of medical beds) to recover. is it too dark?

[torpid patrol]

Considering it's a 100% chance to get it from cutting down a tree, this would be too disruptive.

they cut down 1 tree, get the "Injury" so have to heal, this makes the job vacant, so someone else cuts down 1 tree, etc.

Either you cycle through a large population of beavers, or you barely get any trees.

[wise mulch]

Not to mention that contemplation spot is locked behind science ...

[hidden cape]

I did not know it caused them not to breed, good call out

[restive zenith]

Got any tips for a starting colony?

Also I love the ability to build vertical so easily, its a really cool idea.

[torpid patrol]

Plant grapes and dandelions ASAP.

Build a fermenter to ferment the dandelions powered by a treadmill.

I see you have grapes already

[hidden cape]

All of this. There are no farms. Get a Forester or two up early, only one or two tree cutters since the tree murderer debuff means those beavers don't breed

[torpid patrol]

I pushed an update.

Leaf Coats 0.7.10.14: 
Added Ukraine translations by AskSm
Adjusted the order of Food buildings to suggest you build the Fermenter first, for Fermented Dandelions.
Added Pollinatee (Effected by Bee Hive) to Dandelions, Grapes, Apple trees, Chestnut trees and Mangroves.

[torpid patrol]

I haven't done any real tests with the Tree and Bee Hive stuff yet, I just added Pollinatee to those plants.

[hidden cape]

nice

[astral ermine]

guess ima have to grab the update quick and give it a test

[astral ermine]

well, observed 4 out of the 5 for multiple growth cycles each with 2 beehives basically right next to the plant i was watching, and none of them had any sudden jump in growth like the crops will do with the FT and using the beehives

[torpid patrol]

Hmmm

I'll have to look into it i guess.

[astral ermine]

was hopeful that it was just that simple to get beehives up and running, i personally like using them. lets you feed a fair amount more beavers without expanding crop sizes when done right and just a few farmers, or in this case gatherers getting a small debuff

[restive zenith]

Me planting grapes was literally a "this sounds interesting" 🤣

[torpid patrol]

As far as I can tell looking at the code...
Crops get Pollinatee

But Pollinatee effects Growable.

Both Crops and Trees have Growable.

So I see no reason why Pollinatee shouldn't work on Trees.

[hidden cape]

So innately trees have growable in base game code?

[astral ermine]

Wonder if that's hitting the tree itself, not what grows on the tree?

[fallow smelt]

timbercommon growth boost does speed up tree growth too, but not the fruits

the way pollinatee is applied should work with trees too. but likely will not apply to fruits without patching?

[torpid patrol]

oh, right... It's probably doing that, speeding up the tree growth phase, not the fruiting phase.

it makes sense now

[torpid patrol]

I can't look at the code right now, but from what I recall when I looked at that... I can't just clone Pollinatee, because Hive directly interacts with it.

I guess I could clone Hive too.

[fallow smelt]

you could register a new decorator with growable too

polinatee is real simple tbh

[torpid patrol]

I don't need to do a decorator, all that does is automatically add a script to any prefab with another script.

I can simply apply the clone to my trees, and the hive clone to my bee hive

And yes, it's pretty simple

I'd need to edit the Pollinatee clone to point to... Harvestable? (Not looking at code right now) instead of Growable.

It's something that sounds very doable.

[fallow smelt]

'Gatherable Spec' chestnuts say otherwise. with 'Yield Growth Time In Days'.
Pretty straight what Growable + Cuttable do together for the log part.

[astral ermine]

yeah, sped up the tree growth, ran a little test quick

[torpid patrol]

It is written

Needs more testing

but... I'm still in that... need a break from modding mood, so... since it didn't crash, I'm just going to release the update, but it definitely needs testing properly.

Added new Gatherable Pollination set of scripts for a Hive and Pollinatee, that will progress growth on Fruit rather than Plants```

```Leaf Coats 0.7.10.15:
Added new Gatherable Hive to the Hive and replaced Pollinatee with Gatherable Pollinatee on plants. This should make the hive progress Fruit progress, rather than plant growth progress.```

[torpid patrol]

So if you're doing mixed factions, the Leaf Coats Beehive will work for all crops and Leaf Coats fruiting plants (including Dandelion but not Berry), but the Folktails one won't.

Note: It's not all trees, just specific trees, like Apple, Chestnut, Grape, Dandelion and Mangrove as listed here.

It's also specifically the Leaf Coats Copy of the plant.

[torpid patrol]

Anyone who tests this, let me know how it goes.

[astral ermine]

I'll try to remember after work 🙂

[torpid patrol]

Leafcoats - New faction (Early Access)

[torpid patrol]

Beta implies Unstable.
Early Access implies Stable.
Both imply unfinished.

[torpid patrol]

anyone try it yet?

[fallow smelt]

sorry, little time today again. will look into playing with it lots tomorrow

[astral ermine]

Couldn't get to it last night unfortunately

[torpid patrol]

ok

[astral ermine]

working as intended now

doesnt provide any plant growth

and just the plants that you wanted have the food speed increase from the hives

and tested all the trees, not just the fruit trees

[fallow smelt]

i'm rather confused by it not adding any indicator to the plants

had two test games, one on vanilla cliffside map and one on map made with lapans more plants (which must load before leafcoats or will disable grapes..)

and in neither case hive did anything visible to UI

[fallow smelt]

no effect: eucalyptus, pine, willow, berries, maple - and log-trees
effect seen: grapes, mangroves, dandelions, apples, chestnuts

[torpid patrol]

Probably because I didn't any graphical hooks into the new script

It's something I've never payed attention to anyway.

So, that's why I forgot it exists.

[astral ermine]

if you wanna watch someone get a little unhinged with the leafcoats. MiGly Plays is giving them a try on a YT series right now. been helping him out via the comments where I can

[heavy dagger]

I've recently started my first leafcoats game (cool idea with the tree-trunk aesthetic, can't wait to see how it looks in mid and late game), and I have a couple of questions/suggestions:

1. shouldn't removing plants with the "mark resources for demolition" tool also give the plant murderer debuff? or is that not easy to code?
2. I think it would make sense to take away birch and oak from the faction, since they don't produce anything, and removing oak would push them even more into the "don't cut down trees" direction

oh, and for the first couple of days, is the idea "plant grapes asap and pray you survive on berries until they give fruit", or am I missing something?

[fallow smelt]

dandelions, fermenter and beaver-power are helpful for early food

[wise mulch]

take away birch and oak will be a bad idea, since will make almost all maps unplayable (will be not enough wood available since growing trees takes a long time) 😱

[fallow smelt]

especially since oaks provide a decent amount per tile i can't see any way round that

birches could be replaced by willow or eucalyptus technically without much loss imho

[wise mulch]

not a chance to make a dam until second drought come ...

[astral ermine]

1. bobinng has stated that its something he wants to look into at least, along with not getting the debuff for cutting down already dead trees if possible.

[fallow smelt]

curiously scavengers getting logs from ruins also get the tree murderer debuff

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, I was considering replacing Birch with what became Eucalyptus, and Oak with what became Willow, but the game doesn't like when you replace a tree with no inventory, with one with an inventory. It crashes.

At best I could just remove them, but then it means pre-made maps have no birch and oak on them at all, which hinders you early game.

[torpid patrol]

and as mentioned, #1, not easy to do.

It's implemented as it is, because that was difficult enough itself, but relatively easy to implement, Because I simply hook into the existing "On Tree Cut" event.

I do plan to go deeper and make it so dead trees don't count, and using builders to demolish trees do count, but that's going to need a lot of extra custom coding.

and right now, I'm taking a break from Modding.

I spent about 2 months straight doing nothing but working on leaf coats, then ran out of steam. I came back and did a few final things after a 2 week break, but I really need a break from it.

[heavy dagger]

and I guess the game is coded in a way where you can't just remove the forester's ability to plant them?

[fallow smelt]

the time and thought is really showing in it. plays real nice and fun already

[heavy dagger]

it's already amazing, in the name of everyone who enjoys the base game a lot, but finds it has a bit too little content, thank you very much for both your factions

[heavy dagger]

another random idea: what if leafcoats were missing the teeth grindstone? after all, the tree murderers deserve the broken teeth

[fallow smelt]

they can sharpen their shovels with it 😇

[torpid patrol]

hmmmmmm

Punish the tree murderers.

[wise mulch]

Make them work in the treadmill to recover 🤣

[astral ermine]

Speaking of the treadmill, i think the treadmill makes to much power.

Smaller than the FT power wheel, but makes 10 more hp base, and the connection is more versatile.

[hidden cape]

I think it was to be inline with the fermenter. But it does make it a bit easier

[heavy dagger]

even if it was halved and the fermenter stayed the same, you'd just need to build 2 in the early game, wouldn't be a deal-breaker, I think

I was also trying to estimate the efficiency of artificial wood, and is it meant to come out leagues worse than tree-murdering? because I think the total came out to around 11 tile-days per log, over 2x more than maple (ignoring oak since in my headcanon LC can't plant them), not to mention all the extra beaver-work; I don't think a measly -2 wellbeing offsets the disadvantages of artificial logs nearly enough

(I was thinking that maybe multiplying the output of the artificial log maker by 2x, to make it somewhat competitive with maple, or even 3x to give it oak efficiency, would fix that)

[hidden cape]

Agree with this. I just kept the murder debuff up for 95% of my build. Didn't even realize it meant those beavers couldn't breed

[acoustic yarrow]

Hmmm, I wonder if a negative area effect from the lumberjack would make it "better" (i.e. worse)

[torpid patrol]

Fair comments

[willow valley]

disagree
i like that the amount of power it generates is exactly how much a fermenter needs

[heavy dagger]

I don't think so, I usually keep my tree farms well away from the rest of the population; unless it'd be something like "no one in the same tree building complex as a tree murderer can breed", but that sounds both difficult to implement, and even properly define "tree building complex"

[fallow smelt]

there's also the early game implications of having only 12 beavers and at least on of them is a tree murderer

on a long run artificial logs/ planks beeing much slower than planting and murdering oaks was a challenge to patience indeed. even went to make planks from artificial logs only, as that was more efficient than making the plank from branches directly.
it did work and support a lot of building and mining still. just somewhat really slow on a smaller map compared to other factions.

on the other hand: to get same output of industries / wellbeing as with 100 folktails it only needed around 80 beavers with with leafcoats. so it did feel balanced alright for me.

[heavy dagger]

imo that would be an interesting aspect / early challenge

[heavy dagger]

maybe, but water engineering projects still take the same number of logs as other factions since levies are the same cost

and for me that's the core of timberborn

[fallow smelt]

surprisingly i used a lot of dirt for such things with leafcoats - i usually not, but it was so much more efficient here

might be a little too efficient to get a full block of dirt from loosening up another?
(otherwise it's 1 branch per block + metal, versus 48 for a levee + resin)

[heavy dagger]

using dirt does sound like a solution, maybe even the intended one for LC, I usually do play all the non-whitepaws factions with "no terrain modification", i.e. no building or destroying dirt, rule

[lyric lake]

A suggestion came in JC's leafcoats livestream playthrough just now so just writing the suggestion in case anyone isn't gonna watch the livestream

Allowing the fountain of joy to be placed on top of the tree and using pumps or something to pump water from any water storage in that trunk to the fountain of joy since resources throughout the trunk can be accessed anywhere.

Maybe if there is no water storage then disallow placing the fountain of joy at the top

Not sure whether this could be possible though

[fallow smelt]

making it stackable on top of the tank would be possible easily in itself. there's an option for that, to depend on certain building below. but that would force it to be placed there only i think.
not sure about the other part and the pumps. it being supplied by hauler or not needing any actual water (like it can get them from the roots or something) would sound fun to me still.

having more tree toppings would be great imho and the fountain certainly would look awesome there

[hidden cape]

Maybe there's some sort of way since there's a way to put the large water pumps in water.

[harsh fern]

Are roofs just missing? I was trying to get all bonuses like i do in my playthroughs and I think roofs are missing, correct me if I am wrong

[hidden cape]

Roofs and wonder are missing. Bobingabout says he will fix but needed a break since he has been nonstop modding since emberpelts. That's why the faction is in early access

[barren smelt]

That's the choice players make when playing early access.

[harsh fern]

That's fine, he can get to it when he likes, I'm just grateful for the mod, can't be demanding shit.

I just wanted to confirm that roofs are missing in the mod, and it's a known issue, I'm not demanding a fix.

[hidden cape]

Agreed. I'm on the same page. I love the mod (as well as emberpelts). These modders work so hard and for no pay. Just love of the game and I'm sure it helps with coding experience

[torpid patrol]

👍

I do still read comments every now and then

[torpid patrol]

Karen is angry.

[torpid patrol]

Simultaniously better and worse then the previous attempt.

Also this is just me poking an AI thing, it's not leading to anything.

it instantly just deletes the beaver teeth and gives her human teeth.

That's the Karen Icon from the Name Generator mod BTW, if you didn't already know.

[hexed crescent]

@torpid patrol I was looking at mods for Factorio and I saw a mod - don’t remember what exactly it was called - but it was bobs (put mod name here) and thought it sounded cool so I click on it and my reaction was hey I recognize that profile picture 😅😁

[torpid patrol]

yup, I made Factorio mods before modding Timberborn.

with a few things between

but not everything is popular.

Factorio and Timberborn are the only efforts that really took off.

[steel frost]

Treavers... It should be treavers 😛

[torpid patrol]

Some of my files still refer to them as Treevers, because that's what the project name was before I decided on Leaf Coats.

when you visit the steam workshop and see your mod in the top spot... feels good.

[hasty kettle]

earned

[torpid patrol]

Thanks~

I mean, it was a lot of effort.
I'm just glad people are enjoying it.

[harsh fern]

Some of your maps are also quite fun with leaf coats. So far I've tried two maps

[steel frost]

Yea but treavers not treevers 😛

And I'm really enjoying emberpelts, and patiently waiting for your work on the treavers since I know you needed a break and there's still more you want to add to it.

[torpid patrol]

A few people have been mentioning not being able to build housing units in certain places.

anyone else having this issue?

[wise mulch]

I bet that they are missing the central ladder ...

[torpid patrol]

That was my thought too.

but I can't rule out that they've installed a mod that is breaking things.

so, I'm going to assume they forgot a ladder.

[hollow parcel]

This may be a dumb question, but I couldnt figure out what the branch does. Not the Branch bridge, the part that is just called branch. It cant connect to the side of the trees, and cant be built on top of so I think Im missing something. Or is it just a leftover of an earlier branch bridge building mechanic?

[acoustic yarrow]

yea, I think it used to be required to connect a branch bridge to a tree,

although wouldn't that be what "Treetrunk Side Block with Branch access" is for 😕

[hidden cape]

I think I had this issue previously. I think the branch is misnamed/awkwardly named. I think it's just a fancy path that can only be built on ground level

[torpid patrol]

It basically functions like a fancy path, to be honest.
It's designed to be an interface between ground, or on top of a non-tree building (if you can find one) so that it doesn't look silly when you have a random branch bridge sticking out from nowhere.

[hidden cape]

like if you're pathing from the top of a tree house to land next to it if it lines up correclty

[torpid patrol]

yup

[torpid patrol]

hmmmmmmm

[worn ivy]

hmmmmmmm indeed

[torpid patrol]

how far should I take this?

[worn ivy]

I think it's reasonable for the existing two sizes of platforms.
Overhangs… to me, it would feel like they're structurally unsound if you put a ladder through tha base block. I know at least a few people really want them though.

[hidden cape]

I have been on team ladder overhang for a long time

[torpid patrol]

The problem with an overhang is, what side do you put the ladder on?

if you put it on the side, you can flip it, and it does both sides. But there's 4 valid places to put the ladder.

Also, bottom left corner. x3

[worn ivy]

Oh, right. Keep in mind that the log is getting moved in 1.0

It will be directly below the population counter, possibly transparent purple, and collapsible.

[torpid patrol]

I noticed.

[torpid patrol]

Will take some getting used to.

[boreal sundial]

With an overhang you can also just place the ladder on the side you want it on (or both)

[boreal sundial]

Does the hole allow building on top of for leafcoat buildings? I know they've gotta be supported in the center.

[torpid patrol]

It counts as support, just like a ladder does.

[torpid patrol]

Question.

Geothermal vent.
Now, we're supposed to build a power generation building on top of it, but in theory, we don't have to.

What should it do for Leaf Coats?

Honestly, I'm thinking just a geothermal power plant as a tree base, but we could in theory make it generate science or something instead of power.

[boreal sundial]

Plant growth effect in radius around it?

[fallow smelt]

being an attraction and giving some science or area effects around the tree sounds fun
those wont be on all maps sadly

power plant sounds fine too. just it's not giving anything really but for the visual alternative to windmill..

[boreal sundial]

My question is, is the aquifier drill going to be part of a tree, or a small tree?

[torpid patrol]

Fixed Shower Pipes. It was using the end piece for the middle piece.
Increased Shower Pipe length to 4.
Make "Tree Topper" buildings include Roof Aesthetic bonus. (Large Windmill, Observatory, Carousel)
Reduced costs of Ladder and Stairs, and remove science unlock cost, to match the simple ladder.
Tweaked Grapes growth time: 3 in 4.2 days instead of 5 in 7 days.
Added a 3x3 and 5x5 metal platform with a ladder in the middle.

[torpid patrol]

probably not going to make that part of a tree, not sure yet.

[steel frost]

Maybe an arm that goes on a base peice? Idk

[worn ivy]

For some reason my thought is to make it look like a root of a tree.

[lyric lake]

There is no wonder in this faction yet right?

[acoustic yarrow]

I think that's correct

[worn ivy]

correct

[torpid patrol]

Not yet

[merry sinew]

Came back to play Timberborn after a break and was giving the Leafcoats a try -- I'm really enjoying what you've created here. It's a very different playstyle but it's extremely enjoyable. Thank you for making it

[torpid patrol]

Still incomplete, but very playable.

I still need to model the new trees, and add a Wonder

And honestly... that's most of what it needs to be complete

Not sure if I should do it for U7, or just call it complete enough for U7 and work on updating it for V1.

[merry sinew]

I'm not a modder, but if I understood the announcements then isn't the way structures are done in mods changing in V1? If that's the case, I'd say U7 is complete enough for me personally. You've already put in a tremendous amount of work and doing things for U7 and V1 both would mean a certain amount of duplicated work

[hidden cape]

I would agree. I think as a prototype it's a success and if you're going to put effort into it I would suggest v1.0. this way you're not fixing the old version then having to do the new one

[acoustic yarrow]

It also depends on how soon 1.0 gets to the public branch

[boreal sundial]

I'll be honest, I'd love to see the wonders for u7 version of them, but if you want to wait till v1 drops for that, I completely understand.

[acoustic yarrow]

I suspect that the majority of the work will be modeling the wonder, and converting from U7 to 1.0 wouldn't be much work, but I'm not the one doing it, so ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[torpid patrol]

I could in theory make it for U7, then export it to JSON and rework it for V1.0.

There's still a few issues with converting files, so it's a bit of extra work.

I don't have a model or anything for it yet though, and I'm still not exactly sure what to do for the wonder.

I know we've discussed the wonder before.

but my notes literally just say "No Ideas." for the Wonder ¦3

[torpid patrol]

I think you're probably right here. Depending how much scripting I do, it shouldn't be too much work to update a U7 wonder to V1.

One of the biggest issues I've encountered so far is that a lot of the leaf coats buildings use multiple copies of a custom script.

The new format doesn't allow you to use multiple copies of a script, only 1. So I need to figure out which scripts I use that have more than 1 copy of it, and rewrite it to allow for an array.

and there's a good reason why it's already not an array, you can't have custom classes in prefab scripts. To change from a single instance to an array would require the current script spec to be a class that's on the new script spec

That will probably be fixed for V1, but I've not looked into it yet.

I THNK the main problem scripts are things like when the graphics change based on what's next to it. Like the walls on an Emberpelts Walkway, or the door that appears when you build a branch on the side of a Leaf Coats building.

Every single position that can change graphics, is it's own copy of the "Door" script.

[chilly edge]

Hello there @torpid patrol! I absolutely love the leaf coats! I have not run into any bugs despite running a great many IQ tweaking mods (mini-map, stable time of day, floodgate automatic, etc). I love the new buildings and the overall visual vibe. The tree shapes are amazing and mimic my natural play-style.

I do have one frustration though, and I'm wondering if I could help the implementation along. The "willows" keep driving me crazy. I have so many willows growing on my land and began willow-crafting this summer (which put me in the frame of pruning and using willow branches in real life!). The current tree looks nothing like a willow (the birch would be closer).

I am an artist, but I have limited experience with modding. But if given some assets to work from (or told where to get them), and some links to appropriate tools, I'd be happy to contribute to this project.

Also, the icons are something I can definitely help with; 2D art is my specialty, and iconography was a lot of how I made my living in my twenties.

Honestly, I feel like the leaf coats were made for me, or with me in mind. It's my ideal faction by a long shot! I would really like to help progress along on this, and I have some time in the next week to do so. Please shoot me a message anytime! ✨👌🏻

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, that's one of the things on my to do list.

It's current form is literally just the Maple tree.

I don't plan to update the U7 version any further, but could make an exception for tree models, or other small things. I'm currently working on Emberpelts V1.0 and will move to Leaf Coats V1.0 when that's finished.

The reason I didn't do better Willow tree models was mostly just because of Burn out. I'd worked on Leaf Coats for 2 months straigh, taking up basically every waking moment when I didn't have other obligations. I NEEDED a Break. I took a week off, then wrapped up what I had already made to make it playable, then pushed a release, doing nothing but bug fixes for the few weeks that followed.

If you do want to model a Willow and Eucalyptus tree for me, I can get you any source files needed to do it, all the trees from the base game... But they've changed them all slightly for V1.0

On that note, I'm not sure if we need Eucalyptus anymore, the original intention was to strip bark from birch, but it wasn't possible to do that, the game crashed if I tried.
It Might be possible to do that for V1.0. Luke (theapologist316) mentioned he added logs as a harvestable in a mod called Renewable Trees.

[chilly edge]

Yes, let me give it a try! ✨ Most of my 3D modding work was all for Kubifactorium, so this will be an interesting new challenge! What program is used to make the edits/models? Blender?

Also, I'd love to give the icons a shot. The "fruit salad" and many others are not parsable (the images are too tiny), and obviously Willow trees, curved levees (love that idea!!!), roads with hedges, and some other things need their own icons (since they are currently just duplicates).

[torpid patrol]

You can tell I got burned out. ¦3

If you send me a DM, I can send you any files you like.

[acoustic yarrow]

Luke's mod is called "Daisugi Forestry (Renewable Log)" if you are looking for it.

[steel frost]

Keep your sanity homie. You do great work, but we can wait

[torpid patrol]

How am I still top off the most popular list?

[boreal sundial]

It's a fun faction

[acoustic yarrow]

Most popular over 3 months, and it was released just over 3 month ago.

With several YT's trying it == good publicity?

[torpid patrol]

Yet nobody signs up to my Patreon o3o

[hasty kettle]

well deserved Bobing!

[hasty kettle]

The only thing that comes to mind is that I personally hear from all sides here in Germany and overseas that people are short of money.

It's quite clear that it's not due to the quality of your work.

[torpid patrol]

Oh, yeah, I'm not making any assumptions on why people aren't donating. I don't have a lot of money myself, so rarely donate.

[torpid patrol]

Started importing things for Leaf Coats

I just noticed the Mossy Planks texture (that I'm using all over the place) is actually using the Folktails texture, not the slightly modified leafcoats one ¦3

[torpid patrol]

Leaf Coats Plants should be easy enough to update. They're all Vanilla, plus Emberpelts Apple Tree, and Lapan's Grapes (So far, still need to make the other trees)

Apple tree is already done, because I've done Emberpelts, and I was fiddling with the grapes before I Started.

[torpid patrol]

Slowly working through blueprints.

Gonna need to update the script pack for Leaf Coats.

[torpid patrol]

Which would be the least inconvenient?

1. Script Pack requires Harmony.
2. Leaf Coats includes a specific script for "Plant Murderer" that requires Harmony.
3. Leaf Coats requires "Script Pack +" that requires Harmony.

The first option would effect all my other mods that require Script Pack.

[hasty kettle]

1. harmony

in the end i would i say whats easiest for you

for us users its just one more click.. download takes seconds

[acoustic yarrow]

I would assume most players (with mods installed) already have Harmony installed

oh, nevermind, all options still require Harmony, so that's the same for all

[torpid patrol]

Yes.

[worn ivy]

Honestly, from a player of perspective, 1 and 2 are the same.

The only difference would be for people using the multiplayer mod, because it's incompatible with harmony. If it were only required by leafcoats specifically,they could still play emberpelts.

I would say 2.

[torpid patrol]

Number 2, put a leaf coats specific script in leaf coats, does sound fair.

[torpid patrol]

Might not need Harmony at all. eMka has actually helped me figure out how to do the plant murderer thing by hooking into WorkStarted and WorkFinished events.

the advantage is the method for doing it with Builders Demolishing is very similar to collecting from plants.

there's no way to tell the difference between Cutting (killing the plant) and Gathering (not killing the plant) though, so, probably still need to filter by good name. So if you "Gather" and collect Logs, you'll still trigger plant murderer.

I'm doing tests at the moment, so the cost is still mostly hardcoded.

[boreal sundial]

imo, plant murderer script should be in the leaf coat mod, not a separate script pack unless you plan on reusing it elsewhere.

(So #2)

[torpid patrol]

I probably don't need to use Harmony actually.

But I am looking into other things at the moment.

since I don't have leaf coats working, I'm making all the Emberpelts depressed by cutting down trees, giving them Wet Fur

oh no, I chopped down a tree, now I'm sad because I Have wet fur!

when It's finished, I'll change it to "Plant Murderer"

[torpid patrol]

I'm kinda torn. Should I go back and edit the U7 script pack to make the Plant Murderer work better there?

in the middle of V1 upgrades.

[boreal sundial]

Probably finish V1 upgrades so you don't lose track of progress and then update U7?

[torpid patrol]

Perhaps

I'm not feeling up to working on much today actually, kinda dozing off

[torpid patrol]

I know I asked this before, but I don't remember the answers.

What would Leaf Coats build on an Aquifer and Geothermal vent?

[viscid zinc]

On an aquifer, what about a sprinkler system (irrigation tower) to keep everything watered? Something similar to the original irrigation tower or the watering cannons from Whitepaws.

On a geothermal vent, what about a steam oven, giving them another way to make cooked food, or it could be used as a power source for a sauna or heated mud bath. It could be used for upgraded buildings, like a steam drill for excavating, a steam saw building for increased plank production, etc.

[torpid patrol]

The problem with giving them a way to make cooked food, is that not all maps have the vent, so what do you do there?

the problem with "Sprinkler" is if you don't pull the way out of it somehow, you're basically turning it into a "During the wet season, the area around me is irrigated" node, which kinda feels like a downgrade vs just gushing water.

The Sauna would probably better fit Emberpelts.

Honestly, I was mostly thinking that the geothermal vent could generate power, like Vanilla, but an alternate building you can place on there to generate Science, a bit like a Number Cruncher.

[wise mulch]

You can use a tunnel to place a "vent", but, may need after to lock-it again behind science ...

[torpid patrol]

I don't really want to give people a way to build objects that they then can't remove.

[wise mulch]

true, fair point.

[torpid patrol]

I think that's why things like water sources occuply all bellow, so that you can't then tunnel out the wall under them to demolish it.

So, while the idea of a Sauna for Emberpelts and Steam Cooker for Leaf Coats are both tempting, that's basically adding new "Needs" that can only be achieved on some maps.

Would probably work fine for an addon mod, but not for the core faction buildings.

[torpid patrol]

PlantMurderer

[boreal sundial]

For vent some sort of pressure treated lumber assembler that makes the branch + bark recipe for logs/planks cheaper.

Aquifer, I really want to say something that causes water to spout out of the top of the tree like a fountain, because it'd look cool, but I know needs can be funky.

[torpid patrol]

I mentioned that Grapes have a very slightly better food time than most other foods (1 item per 33.6h per tile) vs most other foods (36h) and someone posted this

Given the calculations for the ingredient ratios basically treat Grapes, Apples and Mangroves the same (1:1) vs Berries and Maple syrup (3:1) or Dandelions and Chestnuts (2:1), tweaking the growth time of Apples and Grapes to match Mangroves (to 1 per 36h per tile) is viable without breaking any recipes.

[tawny zealot]

Lol the all caps

I remember Lapan saying he was adding a second way to get power on maps that don't have flowing water, talking about the new vents

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, That's one reason why I don't want to not have the power generator option

Wooo

First V1 successful game load!

As you can see by the broken plant texture there, there's still a lot to do

Mud Pit's custom (for 3x2 tiles) animation doesn't look right either.

[tawny zealot]

Heh those are some big bubbles 😅 😁

[torpid patrol]

I'm having problems where it just doesn't want to look right.

This is the best I've got so far

This is what IT looks like, so what it's supposed to look like.

[torpid patrol]

that's a lot of dancing beavers

these are just recoloured vanilla assets, but, banners

I did the same with EP, I'll probably try and make my own later.

[torpid patrol]

Okay, for Aquifer, I'm just going to go with a normal drill.

I could try and do a more complex tree base or something, but due to the "Placed on top of" building requirements, It would have to be that + shape, not 3x3, so it wouldn't really work.

but I'm going to make something a bit more custom for the Geothermal vent.

Tree base power generator.

[torpid patrol]

eMka is a legend.

helped me fix the bubbles.

I'm going to need to remodel this, it seems

Big lad.

[torpid patrol]

so...

People have mentioned the bark and branches doesn't feel like it's worth it, because you need a lot more trees than even mid-range trees.

[torpid patrol]

I'm honestly thinking that the solution is that the plants either give more Branches/Bark, or grow faster.

Calculations on the Fruit says I should:
Buff Apple trees by reducing fruit growth time from 8 days to 7.5 days.
Nerf Grapes by increasing fruit growth time froom 4.2 days to 4.5 days.

Basically, it's 1.5 days per item. 5 for apple trees, 3 for grape vines.

[torpid patrol]

but in theory, not everything should be perfectly balanced, so I'm not sure if I want to make those changes.

[acoustic yarrow]

I haven't played but from watching JC the Beard and Disturbed Simulations it seems you need 4x more trees of one type than the other. I don't remember if it's more willows than eucalyptus, or the other way around.

[tepid lodge]

Suggestion:
To make a new way of reproduction - through a plant. A special tree, which looks like a large berry like a translucent tomato, inside of which you can see a small beaver. When the tree grows, it becomes a beaver.

[torpid patrol]

I was just looking into moving Bushes over to the farming tab.

I don't think that's easily doable, unlike buildings, there is no "Put it on this tab" option, it seems to be Farmhouse vs Forester, so you'd have to move Berries over to be plantable by the Farmhouse for it to appear on the Crops tab.

[torpid patrol]

Okay, so, with the V1.0 faction specific modifications, I can edit the Berries file for leaf coats only.

I'm going to add the beehive script to it.

Should I make any other changes? (To things like growth times)

[wise mulch]

Maybe you can block the Daisugi Forestry mod with Leaf Coats ? Sorry, @idle ibex 😭 https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3601143522&searchtext=dais

[idle ibex]

just say it's not compatible and make user disables it when playing

[hidden cape]

Growing leafcoats is hilarious

[wise mulch]

I wish to have in manifest "incompatible" section 🙏

[viscid zinc]

I'd increase the yield and leave the growth time as is.

[torpid patrol]

The maths is in.
Fastest Log production is Oak at 3.75 days per log growth time (I know it's a bit higher than that when you take planting and picking into account)

Slowest is Birch at 7 days.

Pressing 1 Log takes resources that would take 14 days to grow, so double birch.

Pressing a Plank takes 15.5 days.

These values are basically "Growth time per item per tile"

so if you have a field of oak, it's 3.75 days per log per tile.
vs 14 days harvesting branches, bark, and resin to make 1 log.

if I just said... Get 2 logs in the recipe, that brings it down to 7 days, same as birch.

and similarly, 2 planks, brings it down to 7.75days for a plank.

do you think that's a good plan?

my maths was slightly off, it's only 11d and 11.5d, but double the output brings it to 5.5 and 5.75 which brings it around that of farming Chestnut trees for wood.

[viscid zinc]

This might be sound harsh, but I don't mean it that way.

If the point is to avoid cutting and for the leafcoats to engage in the branches and bark systems, those systems should be a good option, not just an barely acceptable alternative.

Is the tree murderer debuff just a few points of negative wellbeing, or is it something that needs to be cleansed with time (and atonement) like an injury? The incentive for the system should be better than just throwing beavers at the debuff system.

If the best is 3.75 days via cutting oak plus the tree murderer, then I think the branches and bark should be ~5 days. Similar to vanilla, oak is the primary source of logs for most people. This system should be closer to oak than birch.

(Side note, perhaps make the debuff last longer but also include an atonement shrine to cleanse it slightly faster.)

[torpid patrol]

Tree Murderer counts the same as Injury. Beavers with it will not breed.

[viscid zinc]

The new calculations of ~5.5 days put them in a better spot comparatively than 7 for sure.

[torpid patrol]

Yeah, that's why I was going over it again.

I don't want it to be as good as Oak, but I don't want it to be as terrible as Birch either.

5.5 for logs and 5.75 for planks feels fair.

and this is just growth times, doesn't including Planting (add an hour) and cutting (add another hour) (Plus add walking time to the tree from the gap, plus add carrying time back and forth from the tree to lumberjack flag)

You instantly already drop the planting time, because you don't need to replant the tree.

[viscid zinc]

I haven't played in a bit. Are these systems unlocked from the start or do they require science?

[torpid patrol]

so, the 5 day pine becomes more like 5.3 days, and 5.5 becomes more like 5.6.

[torpid patrol]

growing and harvesting the plants are unlocked from the start, but you need to research the press.

The press is a bit expensive though, at 450 science and it costs 20 metal.

[viscid zinc]

Hmm. So that's like late early-game/early mid-game.

[torpid patrol]

You basically have to start out chopping down trees, yes.

I could cheapen it.

I don't think the science is too much, but Metal Blocks does push it into the mid game

I guess I could change from Metal Blocks to Gears.

[viscid zinc]

Do you want them to start chopping down trees, or should they engage with this system as early as possible?

You mentioned being able to change vanilla items faction-specifically in V1 (the berry bushes).

What about having these unlocked from the start or building with easier resources? Make cutting down trees the last resort instead of the first resort.

I don't know if you can modify starting resources other than berries and water (I'm sure it's possible for y'all). Whitepaws starts you with a cart that you can demolish and it gives specific resources needed to progress. You could work something like that. A LC game starts and instead of the initial district center, a giant tree stump is the starting building that can be demolished to give people the needed branches and bark and resin etc to get production up and running from the start. It would be slower than cutting, but more thematic, I think.

[torpid patrol]

I mean, you'll need to start by chopping down trees, because everything costs at least logs.

but if I change it to cost gears instead of metal, that doesn't break anything, and brings it into the mid-early game, when you'd usually start making gears.

actually, probably more on par for when you can make treated planks

[viscid zinc]

True, there just wouldn't be a way to avoid the cutting of trees initially, which I think is fine. It's a good way to introduce the tree murderer debuff. Your choice as the creator is how long you want the default colony for the regular player to suffer through that until they discover or invent an alternative method.

That could honestly be a good side mod to modify the leafcoats difficulty: players could choose the unlock conditions (science cost, material cost, minimum cycle to unlock etc) for that system. Someone like JC could choose to make the unlock cost 5k science and catalyst for a more difficult playthrough. I suppose they could just not use the system to make it harder though.

[torpid patrol]

I think where it is now isn't bad, just land usage intensive, so giving 2 logs or 2 planks instead of 1 will help offset that.

[torpid patrol]

so I've updated all plants except the Hedgepath.

since the hedgepath contains a hedge that's resized down, and you're barely able to notice the plant sway on the hedge, is it even worth me remodelling it?

huh

hedge path does jiggle

[worn ivy]

That will certainly make decorative paths lively.

[torpid patrol]

I think it's moving too much. it shouldn't be moving like that.

I'm probably going to have to redo it.

[torpid patrol]

Willow tree

[hasty kettle]

they look cool

[torpid patrol]

but can I model it?

[torpid patrol]

can you tell what we have here?

I still need to do a bit of editing.

[placid patrol]

a siamese birch with brown stem

[torpid patrol]

Even if you were just saying what you saw, you're still wrong, because those are't birch leaves, they're Maple Leaves 😛

[placid patrol]

a genetically modified siamese birch with brown stem

[torpid patrol]

I's supposed to be Willow and Eucalyptus

the mangrove looking things to the side growing on land, some of them have brown bark, others have white bark

Guess which is read to have the bark removed.

[placid patrol]

the white ones are shiny so that must mean those are ready

[torpid patrol]

Correct. White is ready.

[hasty kettle]

looks good

[torpid patrol]

Tweaking a few things, but I'm going to do the dangles.

That's a dangles

just one.

and it waggles in the wind too

[hasty kettle]

looks nice, more will look cool i think.. is it going to be all the same then or can you generate them random in addition,.. here 5 there 2

etc.

[torpid patrol]

unfortunately, just 1 model, all the same.

[hasty kettle]

still very nice looking

[acoustic yarrow]

Willows have lots of dangles, the more the better

hmm, apparently I have a bias towards weeping willows

[torpid patrol]

I mean, they are going to have more than 1 dangly, I just did 1 to see how it looked

[acoustic yarrow]

Are you going to model it so that the dangles only appear when they're ready to harvest?

I'm not sure how it would look, but you could make them always visible, and then change color (like white) when they're ready to harvest.

[torpid patrol]

That's the part the beavers cut off.

so as you can see, the ones on land there, most of them don't have the danglies

but how do they look when dying...

nice.

okay, so, that's willow and Eucalyptus tree models done.

or should I add even more danglies?

[placid patrol]

i'd say more danglies, less crown

[torpid patrol]

hmmm

[placid patrol]

to what extent can you change the length of those dangling twigs? some variation in the length might make a big difference

[torpid patrol]

no variation from 1 tree to another, just variations within the same tree

and they do currently have different lengths, it's just hard to see when zoomed out

[placid patrol]

hmmm

yeah ok, I can see that

[torpid patrol]

I know it's not a perfect model, but considering it was Maple... This is good enough for now, right?

[placid patrol]

well the fact something like this is possible is in itself already nice

and when they're moving they are kinda blending in with eachother so its good

[torpid patrol]

Except for the new things for the new nodes like the Aquifer Drill, everything I've done for V1 should be able to be backported to U7.

I'd have to convert it to the way U7 wants it, but, I can do that.

but I'm not going to do that until V1.0 is ready.

[hasty kettle]

well done. moving looks nice, very good work

[acoustic yarrow]

Looks very nice

You could make thin the top of the tree by removing ~half of the green?

not sure how easy that is in the model

[torpid patrol]

hmmm

[torpid patrol]

I mean, the U7 version won't have sway, when I backport it.

The To do list is shrinking.

I think the only real thing left to do for V1 leaf coats initial release is to add in something for the Geothermal vents.

I want something a bit more custom for leaf coats though, so when I get around to it, I'll have to make new models.

[hidden cape]

I know the main missing pieces of u7 were roofs and wonder. Will these still be under development with initial release?

[torpid patrol]

V1 will just be everything in U7, plus things for the new objects.

Wonder and decorative leafy things will come later

I already added Roof Need Satisfaction to some of the tree toppers.

[hidden cape]

Nice. Appreciate all your hard work

[torpid patrol]

wait a moment...

Why does the Levee merge with neighbours, but not the Power Levee

[torpid patrol]

Also, send me ideas for the Wonder.

every time I think about it, I just keep coming back to the Earth Recultivator.

[outer python]

Hmm. A tree colony (with linked roots) that can irrigate the land a short distance around itself, and spread into that newly-green land?

So mechanically, the wonder itself is a huge central trunk (maybe baobob-like?), that they "build" (but for lore/progress animation, more like planting and tending it while it grows). When complete, each activation spawns an otherwise un-plantable tree that is an irrigation tower, somewhere within the AoE of the wonder

[outer python]

or maybe it could spawn a "seed" resource that let you plant (build) one, if plants can't use the timbercommons irrigation component.

[torpid patrol]

That's a lot of custom stuff...

[torpid patrol]

Honestly, I'm thinking something closer to the FT Earth Reclimator.

You press the go button, it triggers the AOE buff need, and has a special visual effect, like the lanterns flying off.

[worn ivy]

It wouldn't fit the theme well, but...
They try to build an exceptionally tall tree and accidentally build a space elevator.

[torpid patrol]

x3

I'm having thoughts on this.

[worn ivy]

In terms of actual ideas...

• A tree-topper variant of the Folktail's wonder that actually spawns wild plants on the map.
• A wonder that forcibly irrigates all plants in a certain radius for some period of time.

[torpid patrol]

As said, I'm not sure I want to start adding extra special map editing things, like spawning plants, or random irrigation. Just a Poof, looks fancy, all done kind of thing like the toher wonders.

[hidden cape]

Could do the iron teeth thing but with a leafcoats skin on the glider

[torpid patrol]

Launch the plant beavers into oblivion?

Everyone gets plant murderer

[worn ivy]

That would be an anti-wonder.

[torpid patrol]

Gives the huge +10 wonder buff too

I thought that would be too big for discord

can you tell what it is yet?

[silent shoal]

https://tenor.com/view/more-power-home-improvement-tim-allen-drill-gif-145526285852763861

[torpid patrol]

I meant the thing next to the drill.

[boreal sundial]

Geothermal tree

Am sad that aquifer drill isn't a small tree

[torpid patrol]

As previously mentioned, would be very hard to do.

I can't occupy the corner tiles at all, otherwise the game says "You're not placing it on an aquifer"

So, you have to keep it to that + shape.

[boreal sundial]

Oh, not a base for the tree house. I meant like an oak tree with roots for the + shape.

[torpid patrol]

oh, I finally got it animating!

I was missing an event bus register ¦3

I wonder what this could be.

[worn ivy]

Looks like a numbercruncher sub-mod to me.

[torpid patrol]

not sub mod.

Number Cruncher for Leaf Coats, but...

[worn ivy]

I feel like it needs clock hands on each side.

[torpid patrol]

clock hands?

[worn ivy]

This is what it being up in a tree makes me think of:

Oh... Geothermal-only numbercruncher?

That's clever.

[torpid patrol]

yes.

so it doesn't go up in the tree, it's ground only

I'm wondering how much science it should generate.

[worn ivy]

Given the limited access to geothermal vents… setting it a bit high seems fair, though it also depends on the unlock cost and build cost.

Personally, I think I would set both the unlock cost and build costs somewhat high, and make it count like 3 to 4 numbercrunchers.

[torpid patrol]

I don't tihnk it should cost extra science to unlock

but cost more to build.

[torpid patrol]

My to do list is short.

There's only 1 thing left on it for the 1.0 update.

After that its pure expansion, like a wonder.

And leafy decoratives.

But i think I need to backdate some of these upgrades to U7 too.

Like the plant murderer thing, and tree models.

[viscid zinc]

Keep it simple then. The wonder can be a beaver-launcher like the IT. Extra points if they are floating down either by holding a giant leaf like a parachute or surfing through the air on a leaf-board. Or go the FT route and have it shoot out giant dandelion puffs instead of lanterns. That asset should already be somewhat in the game.

[boreal sundial]

Make it a tree base that's a rocket engine to send the treavers to other planets.

The rocketree

[acoustic yarrow]

There are plants that shoot their seeds, so not entirely implausible

[torpid patrol]

A rocket? That's very not leafcoats. They won't even light dynamite.

[worn ivy]

Go play whitepaws if you want a rocket.

[hasty kettle]

really cool work. looks great

[torpid patrol]

Honestly, that was also my first thought.

[torpid patrol]

I think i went with a cost of 100 of each, planks, gears, metal blocks and treated planks.

[torpid patrol]

Also i need to make a note to remember to update the tree icons for eucalyptus and willow

[steel frost]

Once I get a job again, I'll take a look. Lol

[hidden cape]

If it's a geothermal only number cruncher, what happens on maps with no vents? Is there a normal number cruncher? Or will this work just needs to be powered like a normal number cruncher?

[torpid patrol]

You just don't get one.

[hidden cape]

Ahh ok. So no number crunching on maps without vents

[torpid patrol]

yupo