Emberpelts - New faction!

[stray dragon]

should let me know what it was trying to do when it crashed

I bet it's the first one, or the 3rd one.

The 1st one

...

Which is a line that itself does 3 or 4 instructions

so expanding that 1st one into 3, it still crashed in the 1st of of those 3

GameObject modelAsset = _assetLoader.Load<GameObject>(modelPath);

[stray dragon]

if this is the problem, it's so dumb

the example path I based this on uses /, but I used \

that's not it. I'm not sure why it's failing.

I wonder if it just doesn't like the prefab I'm trying to load. Lets try one that is loaded elsewhere.

[stray dragon]

no idea why it's not working, so I'm like... screw this, Patch into MechanicalModelVariantFactory to load the prefab, by bodging a fake MechanicalModelVarientSpec, then taking just the model of the MechanicalModelVariant object that it creates...

And... it works... sorta.

given that the entire stack is lit up though, I don't think this is going to solve what I've been trying to fix.

[sharp glacier]

=(

[stray dragon]

Lets fix the placements

Okay. it looks and functions exactly the same as when it was all just one complete model.

[sharp glacier]

Is...is that progress?

[stray dragon]

not really

This was my last idea to try and make indevidual pipe segments of the bridge light up.

also, that's the wrong red.

[sharp glacier]

Oh. What's causing issues getting individual segments to light up when the vanilla tubes already do that?

[stray dragon]

Yeah, because it's all technically 1 building.

The game only lights things up on a building per building basis.

[sharp glacier]

So the vanilla tubes aren't technically one building, but your tubes are?

[stray dragon]

Each tube is it's own building, so each tube section lights up by itself.
But the entire bridge is also 1 building, so when a beaver (or bot) is in any tile of the bridge, the entire array of tubes on the bridge lights up.

[sharp glacier]

Ohhhhh. Now I see what you're doing. Tube bridges.
What makes those different than just using overhangs?

[stray dragon]

so, I just tried a thing to have different models, but, it's still technically 1 building.

[stray dragon]

I mean, you could, but this is 1 tile lower, like an actual bridge.

[sharp glacier]

So you gain an extra tile of height to work with, because the bridge and the tube occupy the same space, right?

[stray dragon]

Yeah

[sharp glacier]

Hmm.

[stray dragon]

I'm not even sure what else I'd do from here.

[sharp glacier]

At this point, with my knowledge of the code, I can only see two paths. Separate them back into two buildings, which might make it pointless? I don't know if your bridge has any other benefits (though a unique look is the only reason some people need).

Or you can ask for a dev's help I guess.

[stray dragon]

The problem is how to have a bridge that you can build tubeways, and only tubeways on.

AND block sideways connection, so 2 bridges next to each other don't connect to each other.

[runic glade]

Ooohhh... I didn't even consider this potential issue...

[sharp glacier]

I'm at a loss. Sorry. In someways, modding a game can be more challenge than just making your own, since you have tight constraints to work within.

[urban linden]

if you're trying to build a seperate bridge that allows only tubeways, why not incorporate the tubeway into the bridge? make it a combined object

[sharp glacier]

That's what Bob already tried, but is having issues with.

[runic glade]

The problem with that that Bobingabout is trying to solve is that as soon as a Beaver enters any segment of the bridge, the entire segment lights up.

[stray dragon]

yup

[stray dragon]

Yeah, since it's all technically 1 building, then if a beaver (or bot) is in any part of the bridge, the entire bridge lights up, not just the tile they're in

[stray dragon]

Should I release this as it is?

[sharp glacier]

Is there a pressing need to release it asap? Or can you wait a bit for emka to get back to you?

[stray dragon]

I guess it can wait

[faint seal]

Could you make it so instead of being a set length bridge, it is made from multiple smaller segments that can be attached to the previous one without support? If you made two collision boxes designed to mesh with each other, sort of like a keyhole, could that allow such a connection to be made?
This would not only solve the light issue, but add a new unique feature to this faction.
I have zero knowledge of the game code, and minimal coding knowledge in general, so I don’t really know if this would be possible.

[tight oyster]

#1300977672037339188 message Seems like that's been considered if I'm reading your message correctly

[faint seal]

I’m thinking they technically attach on top of each other, but for all intensive purposes they act like they’re next to each other. You have a seperate starting piece as well.

[tight oyster]

Yah, I know nothing about writing mods like this so I just remembered seeing a similar question asked already

[faint seal]

I’m thinking that idea was to vertically connect them.

For what I do know of this game, this is a very important distinction.

I’ve never seen any example of a structure connecting vertically when browsing the workshop, like decorations to mount on the side of a dam or whatever without having to rebuild it.

[spiral trout]

I think the point of it being a bridge was because it wasn't possible to have a "hanging" piece in midair connect to another piece. It had to be supported underneath; thus the long bridges allow for these structures without support under each section of tube.

[worn tusk]

Sideways is, traditionally, viewed as a horizontal thing

[stray dragon]

https://youtu.be/bJbTAj-JfP8?t=3393

JC discovers how the tiny tubeway station works.

[weak monolith]

YA, still missing gates and crossings 🤣

[faint seal]

By connecting the pieces vertically I was referring to the vertical faces, sorry for the confusion.

[stray dragon]

Vertically, you mean up and down?

[faint seal]

I mean model them so they can place as if they’re vertical but have the model extend sideways and down.

[stray dragon]

I'm working on it anyway

[faint seal]

They would connect like this: (red is the starting piece)

[stray dragon]

That is a way to do it, but I didn't want to have to connect to something above like that.

[stray dragon]

this is actually just a side effect for getting the bridge to work.

[stray dragon]

to have each piece light up seperately, rather than the entire bridge if a beaver is anywhere on it, I basically combined a bridge, with an overhang, and other Z offset fudgery like in the water pump to have that Z shaped block occupation as in your example, with it auto-placing a special straight only tube section on it.

There's nothing stopping you from just deleting those straight tube sections and replacing them with something else... like another bridge.

so, unlike other bridges, this one actually occupies "Top" like an overhang, so there's probably a few things you can build a bridge over, that you can't build a tube bridge over.

but if you can build an overhang over it, you can build a tube bridge over it

[faint seal]

Could you make them act like the district crossings to add that prevention to deleting the tubes?

Where they share certain so get constructed all at once for example?

So while the tubes are separate buildings, they act like one?

[stray dragon]

no, that's a special mirror function.

I mean... I guess I could look at how that works to try and add it in...

I hadn't thought about that

I've just uploaded it though x3

Bobingabout Script Pack:

Moved Tube Platform Controller scripts to the Tubeway dll file, and renamed them to be more appropriate.
Added skybridge floor script.
Added a Tubeway Bridge Model scripts.```

Emberpelts:
```Added Skybridge Ladder and Stairs.
Skybridges (Except stairs) can accept access from below.
Added Skybridge bridges
Added Tubeway bridges```

Emberpelts Ladder:
```Changed from TubeSpec script to Tube Accessible Path Modifier script. It's the part of Tube Spec I actually want to use.
Added english locale entries```

Bob Tiny Tubeway Station:
```Moved the Emberpelts version to the new Tubeway group.
Italian translations by sp1um```

[faint seal]

You can update it once you’ve figured it out and the old version can still exist in the same way high power shafts live on.

[stray dragon]

It's more likely I'll replace the entity, but hopefully in a way that won't break it for anyone.

[faint seal]

I was about to say that there’s no reason not to just make a new one, but then you’d have to maintain the old one for players who were already using it as well.

[stray dragon]

Yeah

I'm not entirely sure how the linked building thing works, but it seems to be specifically 2 buildings linked together, so I'd probably end up having to write something new.

[faint seal]

Some of the science costs changed, forester should only need 30. Started a new save and this is not the case.

[normal kraken]

I am going to use your mod to make art! Hope to show you later next month. 🫡

[stray dragon]

I did reduce the sceince cost on some. I may have missed that one.

If anyone spots any inconsistencies like this, let me know.

[stray dragon]

interesting things you can make with the tubeway bridges, if you demolish the tubes on the bridge.

Yes, that's a bridge where I demolished the tubes, and built 3 bridges coming out sideways, demolished the tubes, and built a stockpile on it, with access

this is probably a bit cheaty

[urban linden]

https://tenor.com/view/nope-no-shake-head-danny-de-vito-no-way-gif-13459123

[faint seal]

Yeah, that’s quickly going to be abused.

[faint seal]

@stray dragon have you heard anything about an issue stopping farmers from planting crops when the farmhouse is set to prioritise harvesting, even when there is nothing to harvest?

Nvm they are again I was too quick to make assumptions sorry ):

[faint seal]

Would dry-suits, an item “consumed” by the beavers to make them immune to the wet fur debuff be a good idea?

[stray dragon]

It would probably end up like medicine if I did that, where beavers don't want to work, and leave to go get a cure just because they have wet fur.

A buff that reduces a debuff is probably not a bad way to try and implement it though.

[faint seal]

Hypnotherapy office for beavers would be a totally great idea.

I just noticed bricks aren’t in piles but warehouses. Wouldn’t piles make more sense?

[stray dragon]

Yeah, I did have them in piles at first, but it requires a model, and I wasn't up for doing that back when I first started.

[faint seal]

Fair enough

[stray dragon]

If I were to do it now, I'd probably end up writing a custom stockpile script for it. But you're limited to a specific number of items per footprint area, which isn't that friendly to work with. Also, those would be large bricks.

[faint seal]

What’s the faction ID? I’m doing a play through and I want to add an enderpelt themed and exclusive tail in the near future.

[tight oyster]

Looks like just Emberpelts?

{
  "FactionSpec": {
    "Id": "Emberpelts",
...

the JSON in this mod really doesn't want to work with non Timberborn JSON parsers 😦

Bob ...

[2:06:27] % jq .FactionSpec.Id Blueprints/Factions/Faction.Emberpelts.json
jq: parse error: Expected another array element at line 29, column 5

[faint seal]

Ok, thanks

[stray dragon]

It has comments in it, timberborn is okay with comments, but other parsers say no.

And I think that error is a trailing comma, which again, timberborn is okay with.

[tight oyster]

Not going to ask you to change it if the game doesn't care but sadness why does the game allow weird JSON?

[stray dragon]

Apparently, it's an option you can choose in the json parser. Allow and ignore trailing commas, and comments.

But strictly by the standard, it's not technically allowed

They say if you want to add a comment, you should add a new element named comment.

Which is okay, unless you're just trying to temporarily comment out a line.

But then, I want comments between some elements of an array, that would screw up parsing the array.

[tight oyster]

Oh 100% agree with you. Comments are one of JSONs biggest downfalls but in most places, if you need comments in JSON, you’ve picked the wrong format (but in this case you don’t have a choice and thankfully it allows them)

[stray dragon]

If I ever get back to writing my game, I'll go with json allowing for comments and extra commas

Other games ive modded have used ini config, xml, lua and even their own custom language.

Lua was probably the best for custom scripts, and allowing removal of entries, even dynamic if this do that else blocks...

But json is pretty friendly for a data block.

So I'd probably either go with JSON or something custom.

Maybe JS

Or some custom form of JS

Basically, JSON but also with instructions.

Factorio is still a standard by which I judge the modabillity of other games.

Timberborn modding is lacking in many areas, but being able to essentially write custom code in C# goes a long way.

It let's you add new custom behavior which Factorio doesn't.

Let's just say I enjoy modding Timberborn

Even if half the time, I'm doing this.

(Why do you think the poor guy wears a hard hat in the mod preview images)

[sturdy estuary]

Maybe a beaver size dryer, powered with energy, like those for wet humans found in water parks?
https://www.tripadvisor.com/LocationPhotoDirectLink-g55138-d276480-i158479456-Zoo_Knoxville-Knoxville_Tennessee.html

[stray dragon]

hmm

the problem with a cure being a location, is as soon as they touch water, they completely abandon what they're currently doing to go get cured.

so they end up constantly going back and forth between the workplace and cure without actually getting anything useful done.

this is the type of thing I want to avoid.

The other idea where they use an item, and it protects them for a while is a better idea, because if its available, they'll go use it, then they go back to what they were doing, and "Get wet" again, but aren't bothered by it, so they're not constantly going back and forth.

[worn tusk]

pretty beavers

[worn tusk]

Mr. Stormy

[sharp glacier]

lol

[sturdy estuary]

Alien? 👽

[urban linden]

https://tenor.com/view/eww-oh-god-god-no-smh-terrible-gif-23016518

[spiral trout]

Terrifying. The look on those beavers' faces... those are soulless husks coming for you.

[stray dragon]

I think its the mouth, it even has lips.

[stray dragon]

Kiwis named beavers?

[faint seal]

What have you been feeding them!

[weak monolith]

for sure, in a crash, the witness beavers will fight for beaver color 🤣

[tight oyster]

Is that a contaminated Emberpelt? 😛

[worn tusk]

supposed to be ripply

[worn tusk]

yessir, he should stream today if you wanna see your hours n hours of labor used sorta nicely

[stray dragon]

How are you making those skins?

[worn tusk]

i used https://openart.ai/credit/openart-trial

they give you 50 extra credits (10 extra pics) if you register with discord

got a handful

[stray dragon]

I thinking did, but couldn't figure out how to use it.

[worn tusk]

lapan?

[stray dragon]

Lapan yeah. But I didn't know how to use it, so it didn't give me anything that remotely looked like the texture file I fed it.

My free credits had an expiry date too, so they're probably gone by now.

[worn tusk]

make sure you set your style strength lower than default if you want it to look sorta like a beaver skin still

[stray dragon]

I can't do it right now anyway, I'm at work.

[worn tusk]

did you use openart? the free account and free discord credits are separate

the link i used has extra discord cred you gotta accept or receive

[stray dragon]

Probably, I just signed up with my Google account.

[worn tusk]

i think you can join their discord, get the cred, and leave

[stray dragon]

Previous point still stands though, I can't do anything right now, I'm at work.

[worn tusk]

it's not revolutionary but i got some gags

[stray dragon]

I was trying to make more leafy beavers

But there's other options too. Like imagine an emberpelt that looked like it was made of fire.

[worn tusk]

i'll see what else i can find while kiwi is streaming today

[stray dragon]

Anyway, you wanna try doing some crash tests for me?

[worn tusk]

yeah what's crashing?

i got 30m before i gotta leave for work myself

[stray dragon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1293781782294036563/1349821870685421719/image.png?ex=67d527d4&is=67d3d654&hm=92fd88d88060a87e03ca9dfed011f1e0f0bcce3410eeb2d2c0fdec161e51fd41&

Connect lots of lodges like this, game crashes.

I don't know if it's specific to the 2x2x1 lodge or not

[worn tusk]

what does player.log say?

[stray dragon]

Related to Wandering, index out of bounds when picking a destination.

[worn tusk]

interesting, latest ember and script will do this?

[stray dragon]

Ever since I added the linking houses, yes, latest included

Build lots of lodges like that, it will crash. Use fight club mode to make itbfaster for testing, you can keep the game on 3x speed.

Try it with the other types of lodge for me, see if it's specific to the lodge or if any others crash too

[worn tusk]

will do

[stray dragon]

There's 22 there, so, none of them have a door linked to the road, the access is from a big lodge. Aim for similar numbers. If it runs for 2 minutes with 30 stacked houses of a different type, that type is probably fine.

I have a theory, and if I'm right, the only other house that might crash is the big 3x2x2 lodge with the door on the ground floor.

[worn tusk]

god you made this crazy weird. how did you get no door on selected lodge but you did on the one next to it?

[stray dragon]

I have no idea... if the one next to it has a door because a beaver can stand on that tube, then the selected one should too.

[stray dragon]

How are you loading these by the way. Custom beavers by name, or another method?

[worn tusk]

namelist has full list and byname has them in their respective youtube/twitch/rumble json

but the byname doesnt need to be in the namelist, does it?

[stray dragon]

There's an option to add to names list in the by name list. So it doesn't need to be in both lists.

[worn tusk]

word i'll look at that after work

[stray dragon]

How did the housing tests go?

[worn tusk]

i didnt get a crash yet

[stray dragon]

Hmmm

I'll have to try more myself too, but that is interesting.

[worn tusk]

imma try to replicate your build piece by piece and see

[stray dragon]

Use fight club mode to make it faster.

[worn tusk]

time is something i aint got at the moment, i'll have to catch ya later

[stray dragon]

Layer

Later

Dawn autocorrect

...

[upper bane]

maybe make a beaver fight club. like mad max beaver dome. 2 beavers enter, 1 beaver leaves. the winner get a permanent buff, but cant compete again

[stray dragon]

Fight club is just what I call ||dev mode||... because the first rule of fight club us, we do not talk about fight club.

[upper bane]

i know, but it got the gears spinning in my head

[stray dragon]

I could call it Bruno mode too.

[upper bane]

i talk about bruno all the time

[stray dragon]

X3

You know the song though.

[upper bane]

we dont talk about bruno the song

[stray dragon]

Wha does the loser get? A debuff?

[upper bane]

2 beavers enter...1 BEAVER LEAVES

i guess a permanent debuff

[stray dragon]

Death

[runic glade]

...I thought they were a gal?

[raw night]

just for curiosity, will tubeway bridges ever be released as a separate mod?

[stray dragon]

You mean for Iron Teeth?

Maybe.

[raw night]

yes 😉 and okay 🙂

thank you ^_^

[weak monolith]

This is building from inside tubes at next level 😮 😍

[stray dragon]

so this crashed the game

my theory as to why seems to be correct

this isn't crashing the game.

but you can't connect the skybridge (or connection between multiple lodges) to the side of the lodge tile with the door, or up and down in the same area.

So I'm wondering if I should change the graphic to make it look inset like the others, similar to a mini lodge

also they're coming out to stand on the tubes.

[sharp glacier]

That's...unfortunate.

[stray dragon]

which part?

[sharp glacier]

The walking on top of tubes part.

[stray dragon]

a side effect of the way I programmed them for Emberpelts.

Even though you can't see the platforms, they technically have one that's invisible.

new lodge design. Thoughts?

[sharp glacier]

It's cute! I love the porch.

[stray dragon]

and when it has no door, it would look like...

nah, that needs to change.

[sharp glacier]

lol. Just livin' in a box.

[stray dragon]

okay, I think the better option is...

[sharp glacier]

Does the porch appear in other spots if a door appears there?

[stray dragon]

no.

[stray dragon]

this basically follows the style of the other lodges.

if the door is inaccessible, they put a barrier in front of it.

subtle

[sharp glacier]

Nice, I like that. So does this mean this one can only connect from the porch?

[worn tusk]

adds depth, character

[stray dragon]

and the new large lodge.

[stray dragon]

It will function the same way as normal. but that one tile will not connect to neighbour housing or skybridges anymore.

and hopefully the game won't crash anymore either

[sharp glacier]

lol, that's always a plus.

[faint seal]

(U7): The Vertical Power Shaft Intersection pieces added by the mod still cost science despite the base game pieces no longer doing so.

[stray dragon]

thanks for the update there.

[faint seal]

Have you found the cause of the crash yet?

[stray dragon]

Seems to be nav paths in the door tile.

That's why I'm redesigning the lodges, to make it clear that there's no connection points on those tiles anymore.

[faint seal]

And the porch looks better as well.

[stray dragon]

so hopefully I'll release an update later today with this fix, and...

an edit to the tube script that lets you delete them from under platforms.

[faint seal]

A minute has passed. It’s later!

Jk

[stray dragon]

x3

it takes about 20 minutes to compile emberpelts >.>

[faint seal]

I can’t expect you to be simultaneous about this

[stray dragon]

oh, and I should make the vertical power shafts unlocked by default.

and the beavers just stand in the doorways looking out

the thing to remember is that they would have always been there previously, but hidden behind the wall.

[spiral trout]

I love that they give the impression of windows or balconys on a highrise. That's a really cool look.

[stray dragon]

Gotta make sure it all functions as intended, but then I'll push the release.

also puts a path right to the door, like the effect on bridges.

[stray dragon]

Patch notes:

Bobingabout Script Pack:
Edited the Tube Platform script to change the tube's Stackable status if placed directly under a platform. This will allow you to delete a tube from under a platform.
Fixed Typo Block Object Position in BobingaboutTubePlatformVariantSpec.

Emberpelts:
Reduced science cost of Forester hut to 30.
Updated to new BobingaboutTubePlatformVariantSpec Block Object Position spelling.
Updated Lodge and Large Lodge to hopefully fix crashes related to housing connections, related to Wandering Destinations.

Updated to bring Lodge and Large Lodge in line to the new Emberpelts version.

[faint seal]

I clicked where the red circles are and these positions select the gravity battery from those angles when it is in the current state.

[stray dragon]

hmm

[stray dragon]

I don't see how.

[faint seal]

Nor do I. Some sort of math error within the game itself maybe?

[stray dragon]

Probably.

[faint seal]

Maybe the game has the hit box for the weight lower than collision for some reason?

[stray dragon]

the weight has no collision mesh.

[sharp glacier]

Hey Bob, do you upload to mod.io?

I answered my own question. Thanks Bob. <3

[tight oyster]

https://mod.io/g/timberborn/m/bobingabouts-housing-optimize

Oh cool

[stray dragon]

I do.

There's even a mod.io exclusive.

[tight oyster]

Oh?

[stray dragon]

The custom beaver names mod

Since the user edits the blueprints to add names to it, you don't want a Workshop update to delete your names lists.

[faint seal]

Would adding an in game ui to do it per save be a good idea?

[stray dragon]

While it saves the current names list, it doesn't save the full pool, unless of course I wrote in saving an entire new name pool.

But then it's per save... plus I've never done GUI stuff.

[faint seal]

There are already ui builder mods out there, maybe one doesn’t require a dependency for the output? And it would be a great change to learn.

[stray dragon]

I've already written this one though.

if I were to change anything, it would probably be to add a json somewhere.

but then, I don't know how to access things outside of the mod folder.

[brazen herald]

The Mod Settings mod is probably the best way to do it,

I think LongStringModSetting is the class you want (requires DefaultModFileStoredSettings too)

check out FileStoredSettingsExample for how to use it

[tight oyster]

Does it save mod settings in the Windows Registry (Or a plist on macos, I think)

[brazen herald]

no, in an external json file

Path.Combine(Application.persistentDataPath, "modSettings.json")

[tight oyster]

Because I have this
"ModSetting.eMka.GoodsStatistics.EMAAnalyzerSettings.ConsecutiveMicroChangesThreshold" = 5;
If I ask macOS to read the com.mechanistry.timberborn file

[brazen herald]

yea, ModSetting will store settings in registry/plist files by default,

but that can be overridden, and the long string support actually requires it (to be overridden)

[tight oyster]

Ah nice okay thanks

Final off-topic thing here, where is that persistentDataPath?

[brazen herald]

ref: https://docs.unity3d.com/6000.0/Documentation/ScriptReference/Application-persistentDataPath.html

so I'd guess the same folder as Player.log?

[tight oyster]

Nope. Logs go to ~/Library/Logs thankfully

this is in ~/Library/Application Support

Anyway, sorry Bob for hijacking your thread

[brazen herald]

cursed

[stray dragon]

That one on the right, in the front, looks sad.

[stray dragon]

And this one looks made of stone.

[worn tusk]

yes i know they are upside down

[stray dragon]

Sad girl and stone dog x3

Show me the one from this morning that I said looks like it has lips.

[worn tusk]

let's see...

[stray dragon]

Oh hod

[worn tusk]

i flipped it to map the face better i think

i mean, i flipped this one to use in-game

[stray dragon]

Holy...

[worn tusk]

yeah this is the one you see in screenshot lolol

[stray dragon]

Regret

[faint seal]

These skins should be a mod.

[stray dragon]

They are, nadca made it for Kiwi

[worn tusk]

i dont know if i added any weird ones yet

but yall are welcome to em

[stray dragon]

Ak

[worn tusk]

this was based off lapan's experiments although those look better

[stray dragon]

I like the leaf beavers lapan sent me.

Still considering making them a faction

[worn tusk]

with bobing's super scripty mod pack, you can make your own freaky beavers. here's the jpgs i generated last night and this morning before work

i think next time, i'll flip the reference photo first, so it doesn't think the eyes are facing right side up

[stray dragon]

Windows

I'm just wondering if I should make any changes to any of the other housing, like the double, triple, vertical, double vertical and tenement lodges.

if you look at this for example, you have that diagonal beam in front of the window of the house next door

so... Get rid of the diagonal beams, and replace them with a full vertical?

[urban linden]

makes sense

the diagonal beam looks a bit redundant anyways at the bottom

[stray dragon]

and then I don't know if it's taking it a step too far, but you could also make it more like that large lodge, but with the door upstairs.

it probably has more character to keep the balcony

I'd have to change all the construction sites too...

[stray dragon]

I'm looking at this doorway, I know it's the style, but I can't help but think it would look better if the log supports stopped at the bottom of the horizontal beam, not at the top of it.

[stray dragon]

Should the corner supports still go all the way to the top...

Or all supports stop under the roof plank?

[upper bane]

I like bottom since it's consistent with the other supports

[stray dragon]

yeah

[stray dragon]

The alternative is they all go to the top.

[spiral trout]

The bottom picture, with no supports going all the way up, looks as though the roof isn't secured to anything.

[faint seal]

There’d be the floor of the building below for that

[spiral trout]

Sorry, the bottom picture, not the bottom of the model. Edited to be clearer.

[stray dragon]

so this is the general design

with a slight deviation on the Large Lodge.

[worn tusk]

I'm a fan of them going to the top

[tight oyster]

Is that a universal power shaft?

[upper bane]

I don't mind if all the support columns go through to the top. Just consistency. If one does, all do

[stray dragon]

yeah

[stray dragon]

It's a TUBE. Not a power shaft.

[tight oyster]

Oh that makes more sense thanks

I guess I'm not used to seeing them in this view

[upper bane]

Btw, not telling you how to make your mod, just some input

[stray dragon]

No, I agree with you. Perhaps it's because I'm used to it being all the way to the top, but anything else just looks wrong. and half and some being to the top and some not looks even more wrong.

[upper bane]

I get what someone else was saying how it looks like it's just laid on top of they dont go through. I must say you're focus on even the most minute details is impressive

[stray dragon]

Which works for the doorway frame on the Large Lodge, but not on the main building's roof.

[stray dragon]

so nobody is gonna comment on this?

[tight oyster]

It's a house where a tube is the only entrance? (I haven't fully been following your changes to the faction, but maybe there's also internal doors if it touches another house?)

[stray dragon]

Actually, that's the back side of the triple lodge

But like the Skybridge connects to the house, (and there's already a skybridge section with a tube connection on 1 side) I'm working on another version, that's a full tube piece that connects in every direction, but 1 side is a housing connection.

not sure if I should though, because in theory it can connect to a skybridge, but what would that look like?

if I hide the lodge, it basically looks like that.

I'm gonna need to make custom scripts for this too.

[tight oyster]

Not going to lie, I've been getting a bit lost recently trying to follow every varriation of tubes/skybridges/etc you've added.

I like the ideas though, sometimes I wish the housing in general connected if it touched so this area didn't need as much reworking to add more homes at the same level

I opened an older Iron Teeth save recently on a map I'd just completed for Folktails and they had more beds with like 1/3 the space used and it was less twisty to get to all the doors

[stray dragon]

Yeah, I'll probably give this a miss for now.

I've been looking at the linked building code, and it's spaghetti.

[stray dragon]

Yeah, the triple lodge vs the barrack for example, same size, but the IT version holds an extra beaver.

then the large lodge is 50% bigger, but has 60% more beaver space

when I play IT, I prefer to use the large lodge, but I know most people seem to use the Rowhouse or large rowhouse.

[sharp glacier]

I have mixed feeling about cnnected housing.

[stray dragon]

yeah?

[sharp glacier]

Yeah. I like it as a concept, but I'm not sure I agree with it gameplay-wise. I feel like connected housing sidesteps the entire point of pathing to things and lets you just build an entire block of houses with only one path going to it and call it a day.

It discourages building interesting towns/cities/apartment blocks/whatever because you just slap down a cube and you're good. No space for deco or interesting layouts that might naturally occur from the constraints in base game. Forgive me if I'm wrong, I haven't followed it too closely.

I know, I know, "you don't have to just build blocks! You can build how you want!" But people will frequently take the path of least resistance. And the most permanent solution is a temporary one.

Again, I like it as a concept, and your skybridges make it way cooler. I like the idea of little boxed in paths between houses and such, you can make really cool looking things with those. So please don't think I just hate or something.

[stray dragon]

Yeah, It does give you more oppertunity to be lazy...

The new Large Lodge does look pretty cool though.

[sharp glacier]

They do.

[stray dragon]

Actually did minor changes to all the housing. Look at the triple lodge there. Removed the Z style support on the corner, for more of a H support.

[upper bane]

I do like the interconnected concept. It allows for better verticality when building housing

[stray dragon]

I like it as something to be more unique.

Perhaps it's something I should have put on some houses, not all, and they cost more than just logs.

[stray dragon]

Is it too late to make that change?

[tight oyster]

Depends, did you release these things for both u6 and u7 or just u7?

The fun thing when you release /anything/ these days is someone will find a way to use 100% of it and then you're stuck unless you don't mind breaking their save/workflow

[stray dragon]

Just u7, it uses a new feature added to make tubes possible.

[weak monolith]

Maybe those houses a separate mod, for some who really want . and, faction default to be some more ... normal ? I mean, not even a social beaver will not be happy that others pass their houses when trying to have kits 🤣

[tight oyster]

Then I'd say it's not too late. Too late would be when u7 hits stable

Lol

[stray dragon]

Put houses as they are now in a mod, and then make other changes?

Though, no breeding is done by overwriting the houses, so I'd need to have 2 versions of that...

I guess I need to write a new version to disable it in a script.

[weak monolith]

Could be. Will have another new mod to handle, but will not break some saves ....

[tight oyster]

Tangential, quick question Bobingabout, do the berries in Emberpelts show up as pinkish purple or any faction as long as the script pack mod is installed?

Worded that weirdly but I hope it made sense

[stray dragon]

No, that's a faction specific texture replacement.

[tight oyster]

Ah cool cool. I liked it

[stray dragon]

You could write a blueprint to make the change to other factions.

[tight oyster]

I generally disable the faction mods when I'm not playing as that faction, but what else does the script pack do that would affect other factions? I may leave it enabled if it's just visual changes like this

(Like I have a mod that swaps the textures for planks and treated planks because it's just cooler to my eyes)

[stray dragon]

To stop breeding I delete procreation house from the prefab. Not sure how to delete a component in code.

[stray dragon]

The script pack is like timberapi in that it let's you add things.

The only thing emberpelts mod does that would effect other factions is add in the 4 unique beavers.

[weak monolith]

It's old, but may give an idea : https://github.com/mwerezak/NaturalProcreation

[stray dragon]

I don't know how that mod functions, but I was already thinking instead of using the vanilla procreation house script, perhaps I could clone it and add in code that would allow me to turn it off if the other mod is installed.

Or ask emka how to remove a component from a prefab in code.

[weak monolith]

It remove breeding pods and, all procreation houses from all houses (redundant for FT, but it not matter)

[stray dragon]

Yeah, but does it edit prefabs, or code afterwards?

[weak monolith]

only code

[stray dragon]

I can't load that link from my tablet

So, a tomorrow job.

[weak monolith]

YA, and another code to worry on the next game update 😢

[stray dragon]

Oh, it uses harmony to modify the original procreation house script.

[weak monolith]

YA

var dwellings = objects.OfType<GameObject>()
.Where(obj => obj.TryGetComponent<Dwelling>(out _))
.Where(obj => !obj.TryGetComponent<ProcreationHouse>(out _));
foreach (var obj in dwellings)
{
Log?.LogInfo($"Updating object {obj}.");
obj.AddComponent<ProcreationHouse>();
}

        _factionObjectCache = objects;
        return _factionObjectCache;

[stray dragon]

What version of the game is that for? It looks old.

[weak monolith]

U5

https://mod.io/g/timberborn/m/natural-procreation

[stray dragon]

So that uses AddComponent, I'd want a RemoveComponent.

Delete ProcreationHouse from them all

Or vica verca, add it only if the disable breeding mod isn't installed.

[weak monolith]

well, if for some reason a remove will now work, default could be IT breading and modded to add procreation ...

Sure, disable breeding pod mod will become.... enable procreation 😱

[stray dragon]

I don't want to invert the logic really. I'd want default behaviour to be breeding. I also don't want to force people to install a secondary mod to get basic functionality.

[weak monolith]

That's why I hope for a RemoveComponent

[sturdy estuary]

Sorry, I've been asleep, wrong time zone. 🤷🏼‍♂️😁

[faint seal]

Bob could make it so the code remains in Emberpelts, and is toggled by a setting present in the save file, as to allow the change without breaking anyone’s save.

Once the seperate mod is a thing, there can be a short migration time for players who want to continue using the feature, before it is removed from the Emberpelts mod.

[faint seal]

Bug Report: District Gate Path Rendering Bug.

Nothing major, when a path is connected it seems to be resolved.

[faint seal]

btw its a really great mod!

[spare ocean]

i just started a greedy beavers save and one of the beavers fittingly named bobingabout is red... hmmm. emberpelts easter egg cause i have the mod active but not being used perhaps?

[stray dragon]

The 2 different versions of the lodge would require 2 different versions of a prefab.

Timberborn modding doesn't really allow for a "This prefab or That prefab" type decision.

[stray dragon]

Yes.

That's the only thing in the Emberpelts mod that will effect other factions.

[stray dragon]

I knew about this one, it's because the path is drawn using Driveway spec.

I'd probably have to write my own custom script to get it to draw correctly.

actually, I didn't use Path Variation Spec because it won't work on anything not a 1x1x1 (And the gate is 1x1x2, I wanted it to actually occupy 2 blocks tall), I didn't think of that at the time, but I later made a clone of the Tube Variation Spec for tube bridges, I could do the same for path variation spec to fix this.

[stray dragon]

Yeah, this uses "AddComponent" to add Procreation House to any Dwelling.

AddComponent doesn't exist anymore.

also, I have this block of code that is already barely readable.

            foreach (var position in spec.TubePositions)
            {
                Vector3Int coordinates = blockObject.Coordinates + blockObject.Orientation.Transform(blockObject.FlipMode.Transform(position, blockObject.Blocks.Size.x));
                ReadOnlyList<BlockObject> blockObjects = _blockService.GetObjectsAt(coordinates);
                BlockObjectSpec blockObjectSpec = tubePrefab.GetComponentFast<BlockObjectSpec>();
                if ((from blockO in blockObjects from block in blockO.Blocks.GetOccupiedBlocks() where (blockObjectSpec.BlocksSpec.BlockSpecs[0]._occupations & block.Occupation) > 0 select block).Any()) continue;
                if (!_stackableBlockService.IsStackableBlockAt(coordinates.Below())) continue;
                ConstructionSite tube = _constructionFactory.CreateAsUnfinished(tubeSpec, new Placement(coordinates, blockObject.Orientation, blockObject.FlipMode));
                if (tubeSpec._placeFinished) tube.FinishNow();
            }

Rider lets me right click on the foreach and convert it to a LINQ expression... where it converts the entire block to a single line of code.

            foreach (var tube in from position in spec.TubePositions select blockObject.Coordinates + blockObject.Orientation.Transform(blockObject.FlipMode.Transform(position, blockObject.Blocks.Size.x)) into coordinates let blockObjects = _blockService.GetObjectsAt(coordinates) let blockObjectSpec = tubePrefab.GetComponentFast<BlockObjectSpec>() where !(from blockO in blockObjects from block in blockO.Blocks.GetOccupiedBlocks() where (blockObjectSpec.BlocksSpec.BlockSpecs[0]._occupations & block.Occupation) > 0 select block).Any() where _stackableBlockService.IsStackableBlockAt(coordinates.Below()) select _constructionFactory.CreateAsUnfinished(tubeSpec, new Placement(coordinates, blockObject.Orientation, blockObject.FlipMode)) into tube where tubeSpec._placeFinished select tube) tube.FinishNow();

The second version is probably slightly more efficient, but it has zero readability.

it has 4 wheres and 4 selects in it.

[worn tusk]

You sneaky devil

[stray dragon]

I didn't lock the names thing to specific factions

Most of that code was purposely meant to work for all factions, because it does things like giving a beaver with a Folktails texture the Folktails icons. So if you use Greedy Builders, it makes each beaver have appropriate icons.

I guess I could try and add a faction filter to the beaver names list thing.

[worn tusk]

Can you add the attachments? Would be cool to give some the pilot sunglasses

[stray dragon]

Those are set per job AFAIK...

are you suggesting a beaver just have an attachment regardless of job?

[weak monolith]

Maybe, if possible, by attraction . Imagine beavers inside swimming pools wearing bath swimsuits or, maybe, in water, a snorkel ? 🤣

[worn tusk]

Yes

I would model more attachments if it's within my skills

Maybe spiked shoulder armor should the humans come back

[stray dragon]

it took longer to fix this than I Thought.

There's actually a "Bidirectional" driveway built in, but rather than showing up if either end is connected, it requires BOTH ends to be connected to show up.

So this is basically a custom driveway script that has 3 different path models. 1 for "Down connected", 1 for "Up Connected" and 1 for "Both Connected".

I'd do a wooden path variant too, but the only way to do that right now would actually be to do another custom script with the wooden path models, but the question is... when should it show dirt path, and what should it show wooden path? I'm not sure I can detect what it's next to easily to do it automatically, but then it's like, what if it's next to stairs at both ends?

would be easier to just made a 2nd gate with wooden path.

[faint seal]

Could you make it so the gate can occupy the same space as a path piece visually? That way, you only need a single district gate and the player can control the shown path? Or you could add a tiny raised platform to the model so this is a complete non issue.

[stray dragon]

that's what I tried first.

the game crashes if you delete the gate and leave tha path there, because now you've achieved the impossible, you've connected 2 districts via a path.

[faint seal]

Could you make it so the type of path shown is selected like a recipe in a production building, with none selected being the default path?

[stray dragon]

eeeehhh....

I mean...

if it's something the driveway script can read, I can set it

I'm just not sure how to do the GUI stuff with the options for what to set.

[spare ocean]

i think thats pretty cool, also makes your beaver unique when it does spawn. i don't think it should be restricted to certain factions.

honestly, i dont know if this has been asked for already but a greedy+emberpelts addon thats a seperate mod but requires both mods would be cool.

[brazen herald]

well, there are a couple of other special beavers, but all limited to modders (if I remember correctly)

[stray dragon]

I think that's on zxuiji's todo list.

[sharp glacier]

lol

[tight oyster]

What are they referring to? 😛

[stray dragon]

I made factorio mods. Angel is also a factorio modder.

[tight oyster]

Gotcha, that's funny

[stray dragon]

Yeah, it made me smile.

I might be ready to publish the update. I'm thinking I should do the update with the new graphics and fixes first, then play with changing costs of houses and linkability after.

But which houses do you think should link?

And which shouldn't?

[sharp glacier]

I would, honestly, decide on which houses you want to have linkability before releasing the update.

[stray dragon]

There's really no need to hold back on releasing something that is stable. Plus I'll have to work on that other housing reversion mod.

Question still stands.

Which houses should and shouldn't link. What should they all cost?

[sharp glacier]

Fair enough.
As for the question, I havn't been following enough to have any suggestion there, so you'll have to wait for someone else to drop by.

[stray dragon]

If you've played emberpelts at all, you should know what houses exist.
So just suggest a new price for each house, and if you think they should link.

[sharp glacier]

I have not played Emberpelts, I'm sorry to say.
I just enjoy seeing your work and chiming in sometimes.

[stray dragon]

Fair enough.

[upper bane]

I like the linking, it's a unique twist

[dry socket]

hey

i got a question

i tried to play emberpelts on u7 but it keeps crushing and logging me out

is any mod needed to run emberpelts?

[weak monolith]

https://mod.io/g/timberborn/m/bobingabout-script-pack It is also on steam

[dry socket]

oh ok

thank you ver ymuch

[stray dragon]

Change logs:

Added a new path drawing script for District Gates.

Removed Mechanical Connection points on the door block of Lodge and Large Lodge to make them consistant with other lodge designs.
Updated all lodge models slightly.
Updated District Gate to use new Path drawing script.
Updated Housing to use new Procreation House Dynamic setter.

Updated for latest version of Emberpelts.

Now to look at the next Emberpelts update.

Lodge costs (Should they cost more than logs? Planks? Bricks? Metal? how much?)

Should any of the lodges NOT connect to the skybridges? if so, which, and why?

thoughts?

[weak monolith]

Medium lodges should cost also planks and the big ones, planks and bricks (at lest the bigegst one)

[stray dragon]

The question there is, where do you draw the lines between small, medium and large?

the double vertical for example is only twice as big as the standard lodge, same size as the double lodge, but is 4 blocks high.

[weak monolith]

Well, the houses height 🤣

[dark summit]

Yeah as they get taller they should need more study building materials

[stray dragon]

if you go by height.

Lodge is 1
Vertical, Double, Triple, and Large are 2.
Double Vertical and Tenement are 4.

If you go by capacity...

Lodge and Vertical are 3.
Double and Double vertical are 6
Triple and Large are 9
Tenement is 18.

[weak monolith]

Not by capacity, or Tenement will end needed metal block 🤣

[stray dragon]

Nothing wrong with that.

Lodge and Vertical lodge only needs logs.
Double and Double Vertical also needs planks
Triple and Large also needs bricks

Tenement could just be double the cost of Triple, but could also cost some metal.

If you instead go by height.
only the lodge needs logs only.

Vertical, Double, Triple and Large would cost Planks

Double Vertical and Tenement would also cost bricks.

honestly, I prefer the capacity version more.

[weak monolith]

Hmm, in our world, a skyscraper would require stronger materials than a warehouse style house. But, in beavers world, is up to you. 🤔

[stray dragon]

Beaver engineering

you can make an invinitely long tube bridge.

[spiral trout]

As someone who basically goes from the starting lodge to setting up stacking, bonus-sharing, adjacent, tenement skyscrapers and don't use any of the in between houses, I like that you get more capacity at essentially a larger, but discounted cost.

How is your cost increase going to affect the overall cost-to-utility ratio that is the basis of the current cost structure.

Does linking have a fixed cost regardless of capacity (but a changing resource type), or does increased capacity also increase the linking cost?

[stray dragon]

Well, linking is just automatic.

though I'm not sure which houses should keep linking.

[faint seal]

You can stack a regular lodge up to the height limit. An extra cost per height would defy game logic.

[faint seal]

Bug? Report: The tubeways on the Tubeway Bridges are not solid, unlike the regular ones.

To clarify the one built into the bridge is.

[stray dragon]

That was intentional.

The idea was that you're not supposed to be able to build in the tube bridge...

but then there's nothing stopping you from just deleting that cheaper to build straight only non-stacking tube piece and building the more expensive one on it's place... or another tube bridge... or even a storage.

[dry socket]

what are the skybridges?

what do they do?

i don't understand

[stray dragon]

In the latest versions of Emberpelts, houses connect to each other (Pathing) when placed next to each other.

Skybridges are a walkway, like a path or tubeway, that connect to housing, so you can connect housing that isn't directly placed next to each other.

[upper bane]

It's aesthetically pleasing. Instead of no railing bridges or platform. Don't need beavers just falling off platforms after a long night of apple juice drinking

[dry socket]

oh so you don't have to place homes with road acces

you just need a skybridge

that's cool

[stray dragon]

It's more than aesthetic though, they perform a diffrent function. They don't connect to the path network, they connect to the lodge network.

[stray dragon]

indeed. It's a new Emberpelts feature.

[upper bane]

Nice. I really do like them. Makes building a housing complex fun and looking clean

[stray dragon]

yup~

[shrewd stirrup]

i would very much love the aesthetic niceties of the skybridges for other factions tbh

paths on platforms in default game look like conveniently placed tripping hazards more than anything

emberpelts are a quite appealing faction

[urban linden]

im liking these screenshots

[faint seal]

I crashed the game

It occurred when I took a 5 long metal platform, placed into some double platforms, and placed tubeways on top.
I’m not at my computer right now so I can’t get the log file. Also could you please remind me of the log files location?

[tight oyster]

If you got a Oops the game has crashed screen, it'll be a zip file inside of Documents\Timberborn\Error reports

[faint seal]

Ok. I was able to replicate it. Here is a screenshot of the setup.

Bug Report: When I dragged in the new tube (green) through the platforms, on top of the metal platform, which was poking through the double platform (unbuilt one included), with this specific setup, the game crashes. If instead the unbuilt one is a single platform ontop of the metal one, the crash does not happen.

It may be related to an old vanilla bug that crashed the game when a non-solid Tubeway was placed underneath a platform, with another Tubeway on top. I haven’t tested this on IT, I’ll do it when I can.

It may also be related to the solid/nonsolid duality of the emperpelts tubes, depending on what the original patch accounts for.

It does not happen IT vanilla. I think the patch may have included preventing regular tubeways from pointing up, thus making it impossible in IT.

The solid/nonsolid duality tubeways does not have this.

And it is a legitimate use case too. This technique really helps with retrofitting existing structures.

@stray dragon looks like I have a bug for you.

I think the solution would be to make being in the top layer of any platform should force it to be nonsolid, breaking the duality and thus voiding the problem.

[stray dragon]

I'm working today, so it'll be a while until I can look, but I have been changing the code recently. I'll have to try your set up with the new code.

[stray dragon]

Error log said it crashed running change stackable...

I have changed the code, so it might work, but that is a bit of an edge case scenario.

I'll have to try later.

[stray dragon]

did I do it right?

Like I said, I've already been making changes.

The current released version has an invisible platform that occupies top and corners, and the drawing option only includes Supports, or full platform, so you get odd results under a double or triple platform. It also doesn't actually test if the "top object" (placed directly under a platform, in theory) actually supports anything, just assumes it does.

The new version I've been working on...
The invisible platform only occupies Top, no longer occupying corners, which lets you build a double or triple platform over a stack of tubes, Has an extra drawing option for Platform Top only, so it will draw a platform on top of a tube placed under a double/triple platform, plus actually checks if the platform built over the tube supports things before turning off support. Plus with 3 drawing options, I completely revamped the "What should I draw" logic.

and it seems by changing this logic, I may have already fixed your bug... hence... Did I build it right?

note: invisible platform is only created when you build something on top of the tube. in this new case, it's one of the conditions of drawing Top

            bool drawPlatform = (bool)_tubeSupportBlock && !tubeAbove && needSupportAbove && !alternateSupport;

needSupportAbove is when it detects something on top of the tube that needs support (like another tube)

alternateSupport is if it detects something like a platform or an overhang in the same tile as the tube.

corners is if it detects an object in the corners (like legs of a platform) in the same tile as the tube.

_tubeSupportBlock is if the invisible block exists (Which prevents you placing things in the same tile as the tube if something else it on top, without this it's possible to build an overhang through a stack of tubes, which severs tube connections)

tubeAbove is if the object on top of the tube is another tube, in this case, don't draw the platform.

There's also top, which is if an object exists occupying top in the same tile as the tube (like a platform or overhang), but that's only used as part of the "Create a hidden block" logic.

[stray dragon]

Edits to Emberpelts Tubeway Platform script, can now draw the platform top seperately, and performs more checks for supports.

Emberpelts:
Changed Tubeway "Platform" to not occupy corners.
Changed Tubeway platform to show correctly when you build on top of a tube under double and triple platforms.

hopefully this fixes the issue

[faint seal]

Yes

[stray dragon]

So hopefully, it's fixed now.

[faint seal]

Yay!

[stray dragon]

update, and give it a try.

[tight oyster]

oh umm

[weak monolith]

It's really cute 😍

[stray dragon]

Buttface

[faint seal]

My, My! How rude!

[stray dragon]

He has a face on his butt!

[stray dragon]

So, did the update fix the crash?

[faint seal]

I haven’t played Emberpelts since the update, and I’m not able to now. Whenever I do get round to playing, I’ll let you know.

Which probably won’t be within the next ~12 hours.

[stray dragon]

That's fine, I have a long day myself.

[upper bane]

What does the fox say? KilLl meEEEeee

[faint seal]

@stray dragon it doesn’t appear to be fixed. I updated and it still happened. Placing the tubes, I dragged towards the station. I’ll test dragging away next.

Also in you test we’re you using the tubes used on the bridge 🙃

Nope, dragging away makes no difference

And I don’t get the crash screen if that means anything.

In my test I used the 5 long overhang, I don’t think that’s make a difference but maybe?

Hang on

[stray dragon]

hmmm?

[faint seal]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3449301586

Here’s the setup

[stray dragon]

you sure you have the latest version?

just checking as steam doesn't always push the update.

you need Emberpelts 0.7.1.8 and Script Pack 0.7.1.6

[faint seal]

I removed all my mods and reinstalled them

[sharp glacier]

Verifying your game files can help assure you get your mods updated.

[faint seal]

✅

[stray dragon]

so, this?

[faint seal]

All the mods I have enabled (checked)

Yes

[stray dragon]

placed on a tube?

[faint seal]

Yes

[stray dragon]

huh, yeah it did crash. That's odd, because it didn't for me last time.

[faint seal]

Those are all double platforms except for the one with the tube, right?

[stray dragon]

yes

[faint seal]

🎉

[stray dragon]

hmmmm

  at Timberborn.BlockSystem.BlockObject.AddToService () [0x00038] in <07bf244697964feca3fd644c53f19196>:0 
  at Bobingabout.Tubeway.BobingaboutTubePlatformVariant.ChangeStackable (Timberborn.BlockSystem.BlockObject blockObject, UnityEngine.Vector3Int position, Timberborn.BlockSystem.BlockStackable blockStackable) [0x00062] in <4c34628fc14943d78cc33b6288f00f6a>:0 
  at Bobingabout.Tubeway.BobingaboutTubePlatformVariant.UpdateVisibility () [0x001b7] in <4c34628fc14943d78cc33b6288f00f6a>:0 
  at Bobingabout.Tubeway.BobingaboutTubePlatformVariant.UpdateModel () [0x00000] in <4c34628fc14943d78cc33b6288f00f6a>:0 

[faint seal]

This all just means it couldn’t be placed, right?

[stray dragon]

Yeah, but why?

speculation: because, you just placed it, it's trying to update some sort of value that hasn't been initialized properly yet.

[faint seal]

I believe the old (IT) bug was to do with tubes trying to pass through platforms, intersecting a solid surface.
Impermeable floors are 2d and wouldn’t affect it.

Fixed a crash caused by building Tubeways under platforms that already had Tubeways on them.

[stray dragon]

I think this is related to something eMka warned me about.

placing the block calls reposition, which adds the block to the service.

fairly sure eMka said you can to wait at least 1 tick between calling that again, so...
it creates it with reposition, then I call reposition again.

[sharp glacier]

Sounds like someone ignored the prophecy.

[stray dragon]

Hmmm, I need to check something.

why does it crash with a 5x1 platform, but not a 6x1 platform?

oh it does crash on 6x1, why didn't it before?

[faint seal]

In 🙃 mode, there are two tubes available for Emberpelts: the normal one and the one used on the bridges to the right of it, which do not connect upwards.

[stray dragon]

So why didn't it when I did the test?

Yeah, I checked that

the straight one isn't solid

[faint seal]

I used the small tube station.

[stray dragon]

I placed that block for my test, and it didn't crash.

but if I delete it and place it again, the game crashes.

[faint seal]

Did you place the ones in that test individually or drag it?

[stray dragon]

it doesn't matter which you do, it crashes.

[faint seal]

Did you place the station afterwards?

[stray dragon]

.....

I deleted it 3 times and placed it again, and it crashed only the 3rd time.

Perhaps it is an issue with the drag.

[faint seal]

Maybe the crashing is somewhat chance based, depending on the timing?

If it gets placed at the right time, would it be possible to have the calls happen on separate ticks? I wouldn’t think so but maybe?

[stray dragon]

Timing shouldn't be an issue if it's because it's trying to add to service twice in the same tick.

I don't get it

[faint seal]

I’ve heard of chance based crashes before resulting from weird calculations.

Could it be location based maybe?

Every time I’ve tested it it’s crashed and I only moved my test setup once?

[stray dragon]

hmmmm

I figured something out

I added an private bool initialized = false;
tag

the end of private void UpdateVisibility()
has initialized = true;

then only call ChangeStackable if it's initialized

Stable AF

Even though I've done basically nothing... (3 lines of code) and I don't usually release changes this small... I'm gonna do it

[faint seal]

Hooray!

[stray dragon]

now you try it and make sure it worked >.>

Because you seem to be able to break it every time I think it's fixed.

[faint seal]

Ok

No Crashes!

[stray dragon]

awesome

[faint seal]

This cheeky beaver left the tube there to demolish this.

I think its just the animation though.

[faint seal]

Bug Report: Builders can use unbuilt tubes. Not tested with other beavers or IT (No patch to the experimental branch to my knowledge, I haven't heard of this bug in vanilla, and you just made changes to the tube logic for EP).

[faint seal]

Nothing is truly safe from being broken.

[tight oyster]

why you gotta keep breaking the Emberpelts? 😛

[faint seal]

It’s not intentional!

On a side note, charcoal should be stored in warehouses to keep it dry.

[tight oyster]

Interesting, so it's in piles while bricks are in warehouses?

[faint seal]

If it werent for this I never would've known!

[faint seal]

yes.

[faint seal]

The Wise Words of Bob.

[tight oyster]

Yeah, I remember reading that

[faint seal]

Maybe it could have a late game geothermal power plant? I’ve noticed that it doesn’t have particularly great passive power producers.

[stray dragon]

I've never seen this behaviour before.

When it comes to navigation, they should just be the same as normal tubes....

this is when you build something on top of them, isn't it?

I think it's the phantom block. To make it work right, I had to include the path nav mesh in it.

Which means... there's technically a completed tubeway block in that tile.

I'll see if I can limit it somehow without breaking it.

however, this isn't a "Crash the game" bug, so I'm not going to make publishing a fix a priority.

I think I fixed it already.

instead of this

go with this

That's the nav mesh of the hidden platform block that makes it so you can't intersect a vertical tube with a platform.

like this

[old granite]

Love Emberpelts!

Please could you add a 2x2 storage? The usual mod for that crashed TB.

[stray dragon]

That's Lapan's mod, right?

Keep in mind that MOST modders also have a day job, couple that with the fact that U7 is experimental, and the devs have already broken ALL mods TWICE in this experimental run.
It doesn't exactly motivate modders to rush into updating their mods for U7.

Tobbert has already outright said that he's not going to update choo choo until the devs anounce that U7 is going stable.

For me, there's 2 factors as to why I kinda rushed into updating Emberpelts.

1. I only work 2 days a week right now, so have the spare time and enjoy modding it. (Most of the other modders who have been around longer than me like Lapan and Tobbert are in burnout mode, they don't enjoy it as much as they used to)
2. I was unaware that updates during this experimental phase, breaking the mods was not only likely, but probable.

[stray dragon]

Updated housing costs to use more materials:
Add plank cost to lodges with 6+ beavers.
Add brick costs to lodges with 9+ beavers.

[fallow imp]

Oh new version, but changelog looks nothing concerning localization changed, so

[stray dragon]

Yeah, I added a few things. thanks for the update, I'll add this for next time.

[stray dragon]

https://youtu.be/bo3cvPaz3nU?t=522

JC discovered the cheese.

[raw night]

hehehe

[stray dragon]

just doing experiments.

Charcoal beaver lacking needs for raw food.
Emberpelts beaver lacking needs for grilled food.

nor related to what I'm doing, but, this doesn't look right.

[stray dragon]

Okay, I fixed this.

[stray dragon]

so with this, now I need ideas.

What current items in Emberpelts should be EP only, and which should be Charcoal only?

and then, what things could I add to satisfy the things missing from the other?

[upper bane]

EP?

Oh nm I get what you mean

What do you mean by charcoal only? Did I miss something?

[stray dragon]

@upper bane See this example.

Basically for the past couple of days, I've been working on a script to allow beavers to have different needs

[upper bane]

What's a charcoal beaver

[stray dragon]

The ones with the grey fur.

[upper bane]

Haven't played them yet. I've watched JC but haven't paid close enough attention. There's 2 colors of beavers, they do different things?

[stray dragon]

not currently, but that's the idea, they should want to do different things.

The question is, which things should each want to do, and what else could I add in?

Current max wellbeing is 76, if I filter needs down, that number will drop, so I'll have to add in new things so each type of beaver maxes out at 76.

Important things like the Wonder should remain universil, but some of the smaller things...

Like, they want to eat different foods, or one goes to the contemplation spot, while the other uses the back scratcher instead.

[shrewd latch]

Are you going to force it to have roughly equal numbers of each type of beaver?

Also, what about the Easter egg beavers?

[stray dragon]

Currently it's about 5:1 red to grey. I wasn't planning on changing this ratio.

And the easter egg beavers... I could either pre-assign them to a specific faction, or pick one at random

when it comes to food, for example, they'll still eat food they don't like, but not gain any wellbeing from it... like Blueberries.

so they'll try and eat food they like, unless it's not available, then they'll eat anything.

[urban linden]

this sounds overly complicated tbh

[shrewd latch]

I agree.
If only 1/5th of the beavers even care about grilled foods, I would be inclined to just to skip them entirely.

I'm not saying it doesn't have a use. It could be used to create some interesting differences in behavior, but the reward has to be worth the extra effort to interact with this system.

[upper bane]

I don't mind you putting in the effort, but on the user end. Having to do the math that only 1/5 of your population will benefit from a food type, job condition, etc then it'll get frustrating doing the mental gymnastics of how much land you need to use to grow said crops and how much storage

[stray dragon]

if it's the ratio of beavers, I can change that.

[upper bane]

If it were 50:50 I don't think I'd be that bothered. Say like bio vs bot beavers. I know bio isn't using catalyst and bots aren't eating food. But mentally I can gauge how much I need

[stray dragon]

you control the ratio there.

[sturdy estuary]

I think basic things like some easy food or back scratchers should apply to both, to help in early game. Differentiate the more expensive things in late game.

[upper bane]

This makes sense

[stray dragon]

Keep in mind this only effects wellbeing. If you have food they don't "Need" (Like), they'll still eat it for the hunger. (as far as I can tell) but they won't go and use the back scratcher if they don't have the need for it.

[upper bane]

You could be like JC and ignore well being all together until like the final episode

[stray dragon]

So the main things I'd say that only some want would be foods (like Charcoal want Grilled where Emberpelts want baked) or small wellbeing things, like Contemplation spot vs Scratcher.

I don't really want to be making big things like the Carousel that's unique between them, maybe 1 at most, and similar, maybe 1 or 2 aesthetic things.

[sturdy estuary]

JCs style of playing is confusing and confused at the same time. I'm always wondering how he manages to have his beavers survive at the end.

[upper bane]

That makes sense grilled vs baked. But then adjust ratio so you don't need a mega ton baked and like 10 grilled

[weak monolith]

It means the you haven't watch how RCE play 🤣

[upper bane]

I'd say it's streamer luck. I've died to far less

[stray dragon]

Welcome back to timberborners!

RCE is probably the only non-Emberpelts Timberborn Youtuber I'm not currently watching.

[sturdy estuary]

Only cities skylines yet. But RCE does it intentionally, while JC seems to be honestly inept...

Or it's just pretending? 😁😁😁

[weak monolith]

For sure you don't want to watch an "incident" with your faction 🤣

[upper bane]

He claims he would never fake ineptness for the views. Some times it's hard to believe, then I flood my fields with bad water and humble myself

[shrewd latch]

Never done that, nor had a contaminated beaver.
But I also dump my reservoir a day early if a badtide is coming and I don't have a bypass channel.

[faint seal]

I think this just complicates things irrespective of the ratio. Maybe as an extension mod (like project phoenix) but I don’t think it’s a level of complexity everyone can enjoy.

[stray dragon]

I am kinda thinking the same thing. I have written the script in it's own mod so far, so if I add new things to satisfy needs, it would be an extension mod.

[faint seal]

One of the great things about modding is the ability to customize gameplay. Having some features as extensions increases this flexibility.

Also any progress on making the Tubeway bridges act like single objects?

[stray dragon]

not yet, it's hard to figure out what's what, as the mirroring thing is built into the current linking thing, it's written specifically for the district crossing.

So I'd probably have to completely rewrite something new.

[faint seal]

It would’ve been nice if it was written to make it nonspecific, though the perceived use cases of such a feature is understandably small.

[urban linden]

a not so typical housing block thanks to the skybridge options that are available

[stray dragon]

I mean, if I could even seperate the two, linking is written specifically to link to 1 other building, and in this case, the bridge has up to 5.

[stray dragon]

Looks amazing!

Though, I think maybe the name "Skybridge" isn't the best.

[urban linden]

housebridge

[weak monolith]

Nope, will end with beavers live on it 🤣

[sacred kelp]

the pile:

the sky bridges and connected housing is really cool 👍

[raw night]

yay, connected housing. time to dynamite down to the bottom of map and stack tenaments from bottom to top

[stray dragon]

Other words that come to mind are... Walkway or Corridor.

[urban linden]

walkway sounds appropriate

[stray dragon]

but then should I add prefix or suffix to it

like... Lodge Walkway?

[sacred kelp]

probably, itd help clarity

[upper bane]

I like lodge walkway

[stray dragon]

I'll make a note of that.

so, any thoughts on the...

this thing

red and grey beavers having different needs, and adding new need satisfactions

[tight oyster]

I could see the fun to it, but also confusing

Especially if players open the overview panel that shows average well-being and are like, why are half my beavers not getting Apple need met wth?

[stray dragon]

Yeah, I'd do this as an addon mod on purpose

so you opt into it

But, what should I include?

I'm probably looking at 10, no more than 25 welbeing total unique between the two, bringing total potential welbeing if it wasn't filtered to less than 100.

[tight oyster]

Yeah, not sure to be honest.

[stray dragon]

The real challenge is coming up with something new.

[shrewd latch]

One thing I could see is changing how much they like fire.
Could you make 2 copies of the fire need, with Embers getting +2 and charcoals getting +1?

[stray dragon]

I could......
everything that gives fire would tell you it twice though

[shrewd latch]

I was afraid of that.

[stray dragon]

Other ideas?

[weak monolith]

Maybe you can also split the juice need 🤔

[faint seal]

Could it link like this?

[sturdy estuary]

And maybe add blueberry juice? They're just so annoyingly useless once the first farm is running...

[weak monolith]

OH no 😱 More juice ❓ 😮 🤣

[sacred kelp]

thoughts on removing apples as a well-being thing cus they feel like blueberries but they have a purpose with apple pies and im tired of them eating my apples when im trying to turn it all into pies

[urban linden]

if you need idea's, maybe some of these are to your liking https://discordapp.com/channels/558398674389172225/1064824959697944666/1348286269213380699

[faint seal]

I think you just need more apples 🍏

[stray dragon]

The food side is probably easier to do.

Though, would need to override a few things...

Like, adding new types of pie, grilling more things.

While I used Grilled vs Baked as an example, I don't think I want to do that specifically because the grill is lower tier than bakery.

Either way, add more cooking options, maybe even an extra juice, and change which ones each like.

It's the other things I want ideas for, like the Contemplation spot vs Scratcher example.

[spiral trout]

Why did you skin a beaver... This is horrifying!

[spiral trout]

This was going to be my comment. The grill is early game especially with the first recipe not requiring any other items. The bakery is all multi-ingredient recipes.

What about instead of a mud bath, there was a charcoal bath (that didn't require power since you're there for the heat and the soot)?

They would get their charcoal need whereas the Embers wouldn't get anything from that.

The question becomes is this really worth it? 1) because of the ratios, (you can adjust); 2) because of bots, 3) because you can't assign specific beavers to specific jobs.

I think segregating out the early game needs into two different "intrafaction races" slows down overall wellbeing, or it forces you to expand the breadth of your wellbeing sources with the same population size, thereby reducing the efficiency of your entire colony. Instead of 1 grill servicing the entire population, you need 2 grills or 1 grill and 1 bakery making 2 different things to cater to different needs instead of both providing boosts. And you might still get the less wellbeing beaver doing the job because you can't select specifics.

Is it possible to give beavers specific hard boosts like bots? In addition to increasing wellbeing overall, would it be possible to give the charcoal beavers a specific bonus (potentialy using theapologist's buff/debuff mod as a start) if they ate or used a particular item?

You could keep the charcoal beavers rarer, and if the player doesn't do anything differently, they function just like the embers do; but if you do cater to their specific need, they get a phenomenal boost that puts them ahead of the embers in terms of (choose x: move speed, efficiency, carrying capacity, etc). Then is there a way to force a beaver with a specific boost (flagged with a particular item use) to have a priority for a particular job? If a charcoal had a +4 carrying capacity, you could prioritize that beaver with that item to be a hauler instead of working in a bakery, for example.

Doesn't have to just be charcoals either. It could also be an Ember with a specific flame tattoo, if you have it coded to pull from a bank of tattoos with differing percentages.

There could be a big colony announcement in game when one of these prophesied beavers is born, via procreation by 2 beavers with minimum wellbeing of X or both having recently eaten a specific super food, or is born with a low chance from an advanced breeding pod.

[stray dragon]

I did say I'd make it an addon mod so I'm not forcing it.

That's also a wall of text.

It is possible to have a super-boost item, and using the beaver faction specific need filter, lock it to a specific colour beaver.

[spiral trout]

Yeah, but it's several posts that just happen to be one after another!

[stray dragon]

Even indevidual posts are kind of a wall of text.

[spiral trout]

You asked for responses and ideas!

[stray dragon]

I'm just saying it's a bit hard for me to read is all.

I get the gist of the posts.

[sharp glacier]

It's alot better then a new post for every five words!

[stray dragon]

But yeah, there is a bit of that. If you cater for Emberpelts, you might be ignoring the Charcoal beavers, which means where you might be expecting 10 wellbeing, you're only getting 8 or 9.

so you end up having to build an entire new grill just to feed 10 beavers their special food.

And also, can do it that other way too.

since there's 5:1 red to grey beavers, you could have 5 different juices giving 1 wellbeing each, vs 1 (so a 6th) special juice that only the charcoal beavers drink, that gives you 5 wellbeing.

[old granite]

I like the idea of a multi"racial" group. Perhaps you could just have them behaving differently? Not sure what factors are available.

Please though could you improve the faction wonder? It feels like a let down that it doesn't work right?

[stray dragon]

It works fine for a group of Pyromaniacs.

[stray dragon]

and what do you m ean by behaving differently?

The best I can really do is need driven, so the only real behaviour differences would be going to different attractions, liking different aesthetics, and eating different foods.

[stray dragon]

So I'm working on a food expansion mod for Emberpelts...

The aim of the design is that I want to add about 10 wellbeing points of food, then incorporate that with the split needs mod so some things only Charcoal likes, and some only Emberpelts like, and of course some that both like.

There's currently 20 points total in food and drink.

I made bell peppers edible, added Pepper juice, and also added needs for Applejuice and Tomato juice, rather than those 2 juices just satisfying apple and tomato.

1 point each for +4 wellbeing.

so there's another 6 to go.

I don't think it warrents another food, but I need ideas for cooked foods.

Like... Grilled Beetroot

2 wellbeing, costs beets and canola in the grill, like grilled peppers

[sharp glacier]

Have you considered trying food combinations that, instead of having their own well being, add well being to the relevant constituent ingredients?

[sharp glacier]

Oh, that's interesting. I'll have to leave that to the mod players though.

[urban linden]

pizza --> tomato + peppers + flour

disregard the cheese

[stray dragon]

this feels wrong.
_text.text = _loc.T("UI.BeaverFaction", _loc.T(_beaverFactionSplitNeeds.DisplayName));

works though

[stray dragon]

Yeah, but it ends up with less than if you just have singles, and since most of the ingredients are directly edible, it offers less drive to cook.

[sharp glacier]

What do you mean "it ends up with less"?

[stray dragon]

probably fits Pasta better than Pizza

[stray dragon]

I mean... Apple, Tomato and Radish already exist, so I'd just need to add Beet, corn and Pepper...

Then you add Grilled, Baked, Pie, flour, and maple syrup...

and you've basically covered everything

you basically end up having to set some of them like Maple Syrup to high values like 4 or 5 to make up the 20 points, so one processed food item can be giving you 10 wellbeing points.

I've missed a few in this description, but I did look into it previously, and it's actually harder to do and balance than the normal method.

[sharp glacier]

Mm.

[stray dragon]

Scones.

Berries and Flour

I gotta look back at this again to calculate new times and ratios.

[stray dragon]

So why are some biofuel recipes just objectively garbage?

There's literally no reason to use anything other than Badwater or Beets as EP.

so I'm going to change them

Canola will yield 30, same as beets, which actually puts it on par

(so it's pointless in a different way)

Corn, 10 hour, double the water, yield 50.

Radish, 4 hour, yield 20

to note Beet and Canola are 6 hour yield 30

Radish is still least efficient, but at least it's not garbage now.

[stray dragon]

Okay, so, review so far

New mod: Beaver Faction Split Needs.
Default config defines Emberpelts and Charcoal as different factions, but lists all emberpelts needs.
It also defines Folktails and IronTeeth, with a Greedy Beavers definition to say it contains Folktails and Iron Teeth.

[sharp glacier]

Is this a mod you made?

[stray dragon]

New mod: Emberpelts: Food Extension.
New foods: Pepper Juice, Grilled Beets, Scones and Pepper Bread.
They all have their own needs.
New additional needs: Edible Peppers with a Pepper need, Apple Juice and Tomato Juice.

That's +11 to food need wellbeing.

[stray dragon]

yes

If you install both mods, the Food Extension includes definitions for altering what needs the Emberpelts and Charcoal beavers have.

Emberpelts no longer like Grilled Peppers or Stuffed Peppers, but will want Grilled Beets, and the Apple and Tomato juice needs.

They also don't want the new Pepper, Pepper juice, Scone or Pepper bread.

Charcoal beavers will want the Pepper, Pepper juice, Scone and Pepper bread needs, but not the new Apple Juice, Tomato Juice, or Grilled Beetroot, and also won't want Apples, Tomatoes, Apple Pie and Baked Beets.

so... Apples, Tomatoes and Beets => Emberpelts
Peppers and Berry scones => Charcoal

As far as I can tell, they will still eat the food they don't like, they just don't get the wellbeing bonus from it.

Like with Berries, they'll eat any other food they like if it's available, but still eat the Berries (or food they don't like) when hungry.

So the Food Expansion is a double edged Sword.

by itself, it makes it easier to get more wellbeing.

include the Beaver Factions Split Needs mod, and it makes the game more complicated to max out wellbeing (because you have to make all the food, but in different ratios, to get back to where you were)

[sharp glacier]

Will they only eat the food they "don't like" if there is no other choice?

[shrewd latch]

I think it is untested, for that is how it works for berries.

[stray dragon]

Yeah, as far as I can tell, the food they'll "Want" to eat will be the one with a need, of the least satisfactory.

They'd rather eat a food at 95% satisfaction and overfill it than eat a berry.

same should apply for this food, they'll only eat a food that doesn't contain one of their needs if they can't find one that does have one of their needs.

Juice is another question though, I'm not sure how Juice works, because all juices satisfy Juice, but then some have needs for specific juices, like Pepper juice vs Apple Juice.

In "Vanilla" Emberpelts, Apple juice has Apple need and Juice need, where Corn Juice has Corn Juice need and Juice need, so it balances.

But with this new mod, Charcoal beavers will only see the Juice need on apples, vs Juice need and Pepper Juice need on Peppers.

So in theory they'll prefer Pepper Juice, Corn Juice or Red Juice first.
Then Apple Juice or Tomato Juice if there isn't a first choice.
Then Water if there's no juices.

and Similarly, Emberpelts will want anything but Pepper Juice first.
Pepper Juice if there's no other juice.
And Water if there's no juices.

[shrewd latch]

That begs the question of if they would target a food with no wellbeing bonus before one with a wellbeing penalty...
Not that I could ever really see a valid reason to make a food with a wellbeing penalty, unless it had some other effect.

[sharp glacier]

Fills hunger much more, but makes a beaver more thirsty. That would be a fairly standard effect.

[shrewd latch]

Hmm... That sounds like military rations.
Which would actually be pretty fitting for the Ironteeth.

[stray dragon]

they'd probably target the wellbeing penalty food first, because Vanilla didn't have Debuffs like that in mind ¦3

I ran into a similar issue with "Applies Wet fur" things before, they'd actually go to the thing that gave them wet fur to try and cure wet fur.

Decontamination pods.
They'd get wet, then go to the Decontamination pod that applies "Wet Fur" to cure their "Wet Fur", so you'd always have someone in there.

That's why it doesn't give wet fur anymore.

[spiral trout]

Two separate, but related questions.

You set wellbeing bonuses once somewhere then added or removed needs from factions to determine which of them would actually use the items in game.

Is it possible to define different item wellbeing bonuses based on factions such that if a charcoal eats this, it gains +x, and if an ember eats this, it gains +y? Or is wellbeing bonus only able to be defined once?

Is the wellbeing bonus defined in the item's code or faction need's code? i.e., is the item coded with wellbeing +x, and anyone who eats it with the applied need receives the wellbeing, or is the beaver coded to gain wellbeing +x if they eat it with the applied need?

If it's possible, it could be used for something like this example: both factions still want fire and to relax, but the embers could gain +2 from fire sources (terrace, brazier, campground, etc) and the charcoals only +1; and the charcoals could gain +2 from a charcoal pit/bath and the embers only +1.

[shrewd latch]

#1300977672037339188 message

[stray dragon]

The need is defined as a need, and attached to the item (Or attraction). The Faction Filter I've written just lets you turn the need on or off on a beaver per beaver basis.

for one faction to get +1 and another to get +2, you'd have to have 2 different needs, and enable a different one per beaver, but the food would then tell you both of these effects.

[stray dragon]

I'm not sure how I've broken it, but it seems to be having difficulty detecting the faction of a beaver.

the initial setter

wait...

I know what the problem is

I'm loading a really old save.

the original version grabbed the texture from my texture setter mod, the newer version reads it from the actual texture set

It must be running BEFORE the texture setter replaces the texture.

[stray dragon]

Gotta patch the texture setter to try and just read the vanilla texture before trying to set a random one.

This might still result in weirdness...

[sharp glacier]

Isn't troubleshooting fun?

[stray dragon]

mod load order seems to matter 😛

Yeah, if you have script pack first, everything works fine, but if you have it after the split needs thing, it can mess things up

so you'll have a grey emberpelt and red charcoal.

[sharp glacier]

Oops.

[stray dragon]

Well, 2 fixes.

Talking about the texture setter here. The Start() function can run in any order, depending on mod list load order, so...

1. The Load routine does everything except actually set the texture, so add the set texture here? (probably pointless as the vanilla texture randomizer runs after it)
2. If no texture is set, read the current texture from the model and add it to the texture setter.

"OptionalMods": [
{"Id": "BobingaboutScriptPack"}
]

I wonder if I do this, it'll fix the issue?

It's only an issue if you're loading a version of a save with texture setter (script pack, or late U6 emberpelts) without the beaver faction split needs mod.
if a beaver is created while you have both, it should be fine as the faction ID is saved to the beaver.

oh, nuts... the split needs thing doesn't have a texture saver

Should I just make the script pack a dependency?

[sharp glacier]

If it makes things easier for everybody, would it be a problem if you did?

[stray dragon]

if it's not, I basically just end up re-implementing the same thing.

Because if the faction ID is saved, then the beaver skin should be saved too, otherwise when you load the game you'll end up with the textures randomized again

script pack already saves the textures

and if it's a dependency, I can just read the saved texture from script pack to avoid doubling up functions

[sharp glacier]

Hey Bob, when yous tarted Emberpelts, were you just doing specifications?

[stray dragon]

Originally, but only for like, a week. it became clear very early on that if I wanted something that wasn't just my own version of greedy builders, I needed to do more.

Also, now the filtering thing is broken. They seem to have factions assigned, and it's assigning them correctly, but not filtering anymore.

[sharp glacier]

What examples did you look at to learn making a faction through specifications?

[stray dragon]

Originally Greedy Builders, but then later extracted assets helped

[stray dragon]

Okay, this is a Fight Club moment.

You create a beaver, and the filters aren't applied

hmmm

okay, it's not just fight club. Sometimes new beavers are made without the filters applying.

Lets try the tick trick

I made Tobbert a Folktails beaver

a Folktails beaver in Emberpelts doesn't like anything.

his max needs is 21

Meanwhile battery is part of AmpEars, but there's no definition for AmpEars, so he likes Everything, and has a max welbeing of 87

[tight oyster]

lol

[stray dragon]

I defined Whitepaws

Emberpelts have even less that whitepaws like, his max is 15.

Here's a dilemma.
these un-filtered beavers are going to have both "Wet Fur" and "Wet Fur Bad" needs.

[faint seal]

I had an idea for power…
(View full conversation as I briefly explain my idea)

[stray dragon]

https://tenor.com/view/fight-club-rules-dont-talk-dont-talk-about-fight-club-brad-pitt-gif-6144996

[stray dragon]

Dev mode be like

[upper bane]

Fight club powered? Kicks and punches generator

[stray dragon]

Sounds like something from Rick and Morty.

[brazen herald]

[F/A] Disturbed wanted a powered badwater pump. Not sure if that's something you've though of.

[stray dragon]

I have thought about it. Even thought about a beaverless powered bad water rig. Not sure if I want to implement either.

[weak monolith]

YA, bots in badwater pumps means.... powered ones .

[tight oyster]

what does [F/A] mean ?

[stray dragon]

I guess something I have also thought about but not looked into... an advanced automated pump that gives both water and badwater, based on thr contamination level of the water you're pumping. But I'm not sure how I'd do that.

You'd need a different progress bar for each water type, so 2 manufacties on the same building, and I don't think the game is designed to handle that. Especially given how GUI fragments work.

[weak monolith]

why, just add both recipe and keep manual switch the recipe will be enough

[stray dragon]

I guess I could add a 2nd recipe, but I don't think I want the normal automated one to have bad water, as it would be cheaper than the bad water pump.

But I wanted both in one, thing about the automated pump... the water mover one, not the liquid to item one.

[weak monolith]

No, the 3 worker pump could be the one, sure, with great unlock cost to unlock and to build.

[stray dragon]

Based on the FT large pump?

[weak monolith]

why not ?

[stray dragon]

Big automated pump.

What is bad water used for?

Dynamite and extract?

[weak monolith]

dynamite, mostly

[stray dragon]

What if I could make it give you extract directly?

[weak monolith]

Well, you could give all outputs based on contamination level (water+ [water from badwater + extract])

[stray dragon]

You can't have a dynamic recipe though.

[weak monolith]

with no code, for sure you can't

[stray dragon]

It would be 1 and 1, or 1 or the other 1. The speed is controlled by contamination level, that's why I said you'd need 2 manufactories to give water and badwater.

[weak monolith]

or, maybe, centrifuge to give extract and some water ?

[stray dragon]

The automated water pump already uses custom scripts for the animation and on/off state.

[stray dragon]

So a new product?

But then there's still then2 different scripts for sucking up the liquid

[weak monolith]

no, just multipe output for a recipe

[stray dragon]

Each trying to control thr recipe speed

[weak monolith]

Was about centrifuge, not pumps

[stray dragon]

Centrifuge what though?

[weak monolith]

anyway, is useless since Emberpelts like juice, not water 🤣

[stray dragon]

They still use water

Corn juice contains water

Are there any other recipes that use water? Fuel I think.

[weak monolith]

and.... , dirt recipe 🤣

[stray dragon]

Sure x3

I'm not sure how the recipe works exactly, I think it's just "1 water every 0.3 hours" or something. The fact that it actually consumes world water is done by a script.

So giving extract instead of badwater could be done just with a different recipe, but choosing water or bad water would be harder.

I'd need to look at code again.

[weak monolith]

But, could be revers of water dump. Choose the recipe and, will work. Dumps add water or badwater into the world

and, should work with the same script if give negative value 🤔

[stray dragon]

They have a script specific setter though. You'd need that, the workshop stuff, and it picking the right pump script.

Probably end up with a custom manufactory script.

Because not only do you need the recipe to only pump the specific water type, but you also need the speed to be set from the one you're using.

I'd rather just have 2 recipes for badwater and extract.

[weak monolith]

Not sure is worth, to make a extract script based on contamination level....

[upper bane]

I tried to Google but couldn't find an answer, @brazen herald would have to follow up

[tight oyster]

Same tbh. Google was not helpful here

[stray dragon]

Hopefully it would just work the same as a badwater pump.

Just spit out extract directly

[brazen herald]

No idea, it's part of their discord username.

[tight oyster]

OHh okay

Thanks

[brazen herald]

disturbedsims is their id

[brazen herald]

I'd guess F/A stands for Farming agency

[stray dragon]

Okay, I think I have this where I want it.

If you play a single faction game like Folktails, it doesn't do anything, and doesn't edit the GUI.

If you play a Multi-faction game like Greedy Builders or Emberpelts (EP and Charcoal beavers), then the GUI will add a "Faction: Emberpelts/Charcoal/Folktails/IronTeeth" GUI element, letting you know what faction each beaver is registered as.

Certain named beavers like Bobingabout will have a prefered faction, so if he shows up in Emberpelts, he'll always be an Emberpelt, never a Charcoal. Similarly, Tobbert will always be a Folktails in Greedy Builders, never an IronTeeth. But if their faction isn't in the game you're playing, they'll pick a different one, so if you play Greedy Builders, Bobingabout could be either, and if you play Emberpelts, Tobbert can also be either.

Battery Smooth also prefers AmpEars and Lapan prefers Whitepaws, not that either are currently in a multi-faction faction.

[raw night]

cool

[stray dragon]

okay, I released it

[stray dragon]

hmmmm

[urban linden]

a bigger lumberjack? sure why not, but why all those additional features

[stray dragon]

No idea.

[brazen herald]

Just stick a storage next to the lumberjack.

I guess that doesn't give extra workers