Insert your controversial opinion here

[obtuse dragon]

Oh yeah

Italy would have taken the Mediterranean if they didn’t become axis

It was Italys military command who were incompetent fascists

The Italian military was strong

The rescue of Dunkirk was over hyped

[valid shell]

i agree with this point

uhm by significant you mean their contribution or size?

[obtuse dragon]

Contribution

[gritty relic]

https://tenor.com/view/crying-shower-gif-16008859

[opaque rose]

Hot take: instead of killing Hitler, give him a scholarship to art school

[crisp lantern]

Hmmmm

I like it

[gusty bane]

Tuxedoes are for formal and high society events. Suits and ties are for more casual events. Change my mind.

[inner mortar]

he's gonna be a great racist artist

[inner mortar]

Robes for all events

[valid shell]

how about a scholarship into architecture

[opaque rose]

Naw cu

*cuz

He found Henry Ford’s book ‘The Great Jew Problem’ while on the streets in the 1920s

He wouldn’t be on the streets since he would be at art school

Big brain nove

[meager jolt]

He was recommended into pursuing that if I remember it correctly

unfortunately his feelings got that hurt that he outright refused

not sure whether him being an architect or artist would've really changed much in the grand scheme of things

he would've likely still fought in the great war and still held the same sentiment that he accumulated during his young adult years

[inner mortar]

You have no idea what is being called for in the streets of Vienna before his rejection

[meager jolt]

death threats against jews?

even if Hitler were to somehow not get into politics

someone else may have taken his place

or maybe not

[steep pine]

Who believes in death penalty.

[lunar widget]

I don’t have much of an opinion on it.

[rough elm]

Yes

It is neccassary

Oh look a person who killed 15 children lets let him live

[limpid folio]

Arguably more inhumane to let them suffer in prison for an unquantified amount of time when they get life without parole

Psychologically more deviating in a way

[rough elm]

Maybe let them fot for a year or 2

rot*

Beat them regularly

https://tenor.com/view/shrimp-as-that-clash-royale-hee-hee-hee-haw-gif-25054781

[limpid folio]

Human rights?

[rough elm]

Not to brutal criminals

If you commit a horrible crime

you automaticlly forfiet your rights

[limpid folio]

Human rights are either universal or not

If they’re not universal

Then why would they exist?

[rough elm]

Why

why do mass murderers get human rights

wh do those who kill for enjoyment get human rights

[limpid folio]

Bc at the end of the day

They’re human too

And would rather not be treated like shit

Prison takes away most of your freedom anyway

[valid shell]

me

it's necessary to take out an extreme criminal

[valid shell]

if their existence equivalent to a menace to the wellness and safety of society

then their rights to life could be justifiably revoked

[rough elm]

So they commit horrible crimes but we still need to consider there opinion and how they feel

@limpid folio

[crisp lantern]

me, sometimes

the thing is

when you lock up a prisoner in a super max prison

you lock up the jailer too

[limpid folio]

Life without parole effectively does that anyway. The knowledge that yku wont ever leave is often enough damage to their mental state and execution is more expensive than life imprisonment anyway

Death penalty doesn’t serve as a deterrent and it’s arguably more humane than life without parole

[valid shell]

i object that execution is more expensive

as aside costly electric chair or lethal injection

there are a bunch of cheaper methods to execute someone

moreover wouldn't it be costly to impose a life imprisonment on an inmate instead?

[limpid folio]

https://deathpenaltyinfo.org/policy-issues/costs

[valid shell]

wait are you by the side of death penalty 💀

[limpid folio]

No

It’s more expensive

“Assume that the state saves money by employing the death penalty…. Has been proven wrong”

[valid shell]

the pre-execution of inmates are indeed costly with many trials must be held and legislative figures to be hired

but isn't it worth the cost of killing an inmate rather than to let him stay and wreak havoc more?

just imagine what he could do in the prison if he has to stay forever with bad guys

and jails couldn't possibly make him repent about his actions

[crisp lantern]

Many US states have brought back firing squad cause injection is too expensive

[limpid folio]

And ineffective

[opaque rose]

Communism was kinda gas

[opaque rose]

https://tenor.com/view/coming-helicopter-tank-flying-tank-soldier-gif-17054649

[steep pine]

The Russians still won the war in Crimea (1853)

[rough elm]

No

[lunar widget]

[inner mortar]

imagine giving criminals an easy lockup
this is why we implement cost effective correctional labor

[rough elm]

HELLL YEAAHHH LABOUR CAMPS

[inner mortar]

I could even come up one with religious zeal

[rough elm]

MAKE EM WORK TO DEAHT IF THEY LEAVE WHIP EM

[inner mortar]

for one thing, when they perish in the work, they can reincarnate into better lives, or so they're told

[steep pine]

(They still got what they want 2 decades later)

[rough elm]

OR WE CAN WHIP EM TO DEATH

[inner mortar]

no, they can only be whipped to work 'til their slow death

[rough elm]

HELL YEAH PROLONGED SUFFERING ALSO TASER THEM FORM TIME TO TIME

[steep pine]

you guys should at least give them some incentive to keep working despite harsh conditions

in order to keep their loyalty when you suddenly find yourself at war

[inner mortar]

their forgiving mercy shall be that of freedom from their sinful prison that is their mortal corporeal body

Praise Okran

[valid shell]

yes

executions were still carried out anyways

with cheaper means

[valid shell]

yes 🔥 🔥 🔥

i love you my comrade 🔥 🔥 🔥

communism for life 🔥 🔥 🔥

communism for free 🔥 🔥 🔥

[steep pine]

Gas as in farts.

[valid shell]

no 👿

[crisp lantern]

*are still carried out

A certain political figure in the US has said he wants to livestream executions

[valid shell]

interesting

[opaque rose]

It’s a prank bro

[steep pine]

Idk but hussars swinging swords riding a fucking quadbike (or a normal motorcycle) sounds kinda sick

[lunar widget]

I like history

[steep pine]

I like it too (preferably military history)

[lunar widget]

I love it all

[valid shell]

most of the time we're here cus of military history lol

can anybody tell why military or political history are more appealing than other types?

[steep pine]

because every major shit that ever happened in history happened through war

and for some reason, its also because the soldiers (it probably could be me, but I can't stop eyeing on the soldiers)

[opaque rose]

Allies could’ve won faster if they started attacking Germany when the invasion of Poland began

[gusty bane]

Latinas are the best.

[lunar widget]

Source?

[crisp lantern]

I 100% agree

although

personality wise

they will rule your lives, and not in a good way

[gusty bane]

https://tenor.com/view/o1-smile-sonic-gif-11792051701285795440

If Shadow loves Latinas, then they are the best.

[gusty bane]

True. 😔

[inner mortar]

it has hype

it too shall fade, but history always fascinate everyone with stranger tales

[lunar widget]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-huh-cat-huh-etr-gif-15332443943609734737

[opaque rose]

“The source is I made it the f—k up.” -Senator Armstrong

[steep pine]

Im convinced that if Frederick the Great were alive today, and has access to the internet, he would be reading all the gay comics in there (change my mind)

[inner mortar]

or probably connive with Bundeswehr homies

[gusty bane]

Both Nazism and Communism sucked and were horrible. That is my opinion.

[lunar widget]

Not very controversial in my opinion. I agree

[gusty bane]

You be surprised. There are those on the internet that still strongly support either nazism or communism. So I say both suck.

[lunar widget]

Ah yes, tankies

[gusty bane]

Tankies?

[lunar widget]

It’s a British Cold War term for Communist

[gusty bane]

Ah I see. Well, new word retain. Thanks for the new information. 👍

[lunar widget]

Of course

[valid shell]

how dare you 😡

[inner mortar]

anarcho feudalism is peak human progress

[steep pine]

But they are still are small minority especially the Nazis but you probably can find commies in any american college.

[left egret]

A mix of capitalism, communism and socialism is good

Ish

[valid shell]

yes

[inner mortar]

So China?

[crisp lantern]

yes

Even the Catholic Church which is anti-communist maintains that universal healthcare is a human right

which i found interesting

[stable moon]

mig-23 sucks

(how did bro got shot down by a construction vehicle)

[opaque rose]

Aviation requires 0 skill anymore

All you do is aim & press a button

Back in the old days it was actually tough to be an aviator

[crisp lantern]

I get that

But

You’re pulling multiple G’s

[meager jolt]

yeah

besides you'll probably still need know how in case shit hits the fan

[rough elm]

https://tenor.com/view/shrimp-as-that-clash-royale-hee-hee-hee-haw-gif-25054781

[pastel patrol]

The Thompson/Tommy Gun is nowhere near as amazing as people or pop culture make it out to be. It’s heavy, has a cyclic rate that’s way too high, has a complicated field disassembly and was really expensive for what it was. Only reason people love it is because gangsters used them and they show up in a lot of WW2 photos, which kinda led to them being overused. The Thompson’s cool and everything until you realise it was more or less obsolete by the time war broke out… And then you realise it kept going all the way to Vietnam

[eager lodge]

nerd

[steep pine]

Ah. I see an M3 grease gun enthusiast.

[lunar widget]

So why did the used it throughout WW2 than?

[pastel patrol]

Because it’s just what they had on hand

Hell, some marines in the pacific were still using M1928’s

Notice how as soon as WW2 ended, the M3A1 replaced the Thompson officially, they only clung on just because that’s what some units still had

[inner mortar]

When the forum becomes a killzone for admins

please, bring no mercy upon these tainted scamlink users

[steep pine]

Bigfoot is real, the US never landed on the moon, the holocaust never happened, the earth is flat.

And birds are drones controlled by the goverment.

The US goverment are UFOs

Elvis Presley is still alive and so is Michael Jackson.

[valid shell]

average american conspiracist mentality 💀

[lunar widget]

Oh god not that again

What organization in the US says that birds are drones again?

[steep pine]

no one just a meme

[remote hazel]

The DoomerPosters?

[lunar widget]

I’m not sure

[crisp lantern]

“The Birds Arent real”

Thats what they r called

[lavish field]

All pigeons are secret government drones with built-in laser eyes and missiles (real)

[lunar widget]

Here’s my controversial opinion

History is better than getting a GF for me

[lavish field]

[lunar widget]

[inner mortar]

Get countered boy: History is worth it if you get laid because of it

[lunar widget]

YES!!!! YOU’RE DAMN RIGHT LAD!

[upper oriole]

Communism is based

[inner mortar]

Based on empty pockets

[gritty relic]

Fake American

[lunar widget]

I love America

[remote hazel]

[gritty relic]

Real American hates imperialism, communism, fascism, love democracy, freedom 1st and 2nd amendment

[remote hazel]

Even tho America was kinda the first thing but ok

[lunar widget]

So William McKinley is not a real American?

[remote hazel]

Time for the most controversial opinion

If it were between a man or a bear in the forest, I’ll go with the man

[lunar widget]

What you going to do

[remote hazel]

Mock the people choosing the bear(there’s a lot of them)

[gritty relic]

Propaganda

[lunar widget]

Huh?

[gritty relic]

You are propaganda

[lunar widget]

I mean he did aggressively expand US territory

[remote hazel]

It’s not propaganda if it’s true

[lunar widget]

It’s not propaganda just because you don’t like it

[gritty relic]

The fact ROC are better than Qing is true

[remote hazel]

Prime Qing > Prime ROC

more game impact

[gritty relic]

I should’ve KMS

[lunar widget]

I just find them interesting

[valid shell]

YEs- No..!!!

[inner mortar]

I'll tell ya something about McKinley and the successor after him: They are technically hampering Chinese revolutionary efforts against the Qing Manchus by conquering an anticolonial government, whose delegate in Japan has procured funds from the then visiting Sun Yat Sen

[paper scaffold]

Time traveller: assassinates McCarthy

The timeline:

[upper oriole]

Yes

Did you not hear about the great workers revolution of 1989 in times square

[limpid folio]

https://tenor.com/view/nalog-gif-25906765

[valid shell]

yeah

workers demonstration

how big it was

otherwise nothing happened innit

[crisp lantern]

yes
bernie sanders in front of that m1 abrams is so inspiring

[proud barn]

That byzantium was the continuation of the roman empire and not a separate Greek empire

[rough elm]

Yep

slowly it became a seprate empire tho

[inner mortar]

Never made Rome into a secure core territory tho

And that Rome transforms into so many pretentious peoples

[valid shell]

Operation Enduring Freedom was a failure

[paper scaffold]

He's talking about the geopolitical consequences that arose from US involvement in the region

[valid shell]

yeah

the so-called victory of coalition force might have been on theory

aside from rooting out bin laden

they couldn't pacify the region

while escalating unsolved violence and extremism in a number of countries

[rough elm]

Taliban still won

after the end of the operation they raised an army of nearly 200,000

[meager jolt]

temporary victory

hollow victory in the long run

[inner mortar]

Technically, anywhere else that's not Afghanistan counts as multiple victories

My image alone speaks of a controversial opinion it seems

[gritty relic]

June 4th, 1989

[inner mortar]

T R U E ! ! !

[valid shell]

On this day, the Kuomintang massacred thousands of protestor students after rolling tanks and troops in the Liberty Square in an attempt to quell a political demonstration that demands liberalism and democratization

[gritty relic]

I should’ve block you

[valid shell]

haha

get rekt

[meager jolt]

rarr

prob not too controversial or contrary of an opinion

but the prince William, duke of cumberland was a very mediocre commander

at best

and simply inadequate

only given his position of power as a military commander due to his royal connections

and blood

the only victory he ever had

was at Culloden moor

hardly a hard fought or

a near damn run thing

with him having superior numbers

a professional and more uniform government army

along with some failures/inadequacies on the jacobites

from lack of cohesion, professionalism from the majority of its levied clansmen

along with some poor terrain conditions that badly impaired the highland charge

[obtuse dragon]

Nixon was W

[lunar widget]

How so?

[obtuse dragon]

Environmental Protection Agency, ended the draft, opened the doors for civil rights, oversaw moon landing, dedicated $100 million to the war on cancer, first president to give a shit about Native Americans and desegregated Southern Schools.

[lunar widget]

I think I’ve heard of some of this

[inner mortar]

Nixon was Watergated

[obtuse dragon]

Free my mans Nixon

[steep pine]

There are only 2 genders.

[left egret]

Frfr true

[crisp lantern]

Nixon is underrated, poor dude made a mistake and his legacy was tarnished

[limpid folio]

Vietnam was a mistake

Lying about Vietnam was an even bigger mistake

He was dropped into an unfortunate position wherein he was expected to make decisions about things he hadn’t been fully briefed on before and so made a few rash decisions

But trying to hide the truth behind the reality from the public and media would never have worked

That only happens effectively in a world where the government controls the media

[obtuse dragon]

Ong free my mans

[rough elm]

fr

[inner mortar]

technically, he dabbled little on it during Ike's presidency, right?

[left egret]

This server is one of the best communities I joined. The server accepts people into their circle quickly and there is little to no toxicity.

Furthermore, ever since I have been active in the server, older members actually converse w me and enlighten me with past events.

This server is so friendly and inclusive while still discussing historical topics with and in times of crisis, it unites together

Shutout for @lunar widget for being such a great guide in my past few months here. You are truly the best

Whoops I pit this on controversial opinions

Oops

[crisp lantern]

This truely is a controversial opinion

[valid shell]

germans were the actual one to send something into space first

[lunar widget]

Oh thank you

[rough elm]

True man @lunar widget Your one of the best members here but rlly almost everyone in this server is great

[crisp lantern]

the best one is griff

someone ping him so we can get him into the party

[lunar widget]

Thank you

[rough elm]

frfr

[tiny heath]

https://tenor.com/view/yapping-yapping-level-today-catastrophic-yapanese-gif-13513208407930173397

[gusty bane]

Cats are cool

[lunar widget]

Cats🤝dogs

[left egret]

Fr

[meager jolt]

cats are more neat than dogs

dogs are kinda overrated

I don't like their loud barks

pretty annoying

cats are calmer

more reserved and quiet

[steep pine]

Cats don't contribute anything to society.

Dogs can work for Law Enforcement, Rescue, military

Cats do nothing.

They just sit around and wasting space

They're aren't even loyal as a pet.

[rough elm]

@tiny heath How the hell have you not been banned

<@&676111857404346369> <@&669024387743219713> This dude has violated Rule 2 multiple times

and will probably continue to do so

https://tenor.com/view/monokuma-gif-18036253

[meager jolt]

each to their own

still cats played a big role in keeping rodents at bay

keeping cathedrals clean of pests

likewise for trade and military ships since they were part of humanity

very goofy fellas 🐈 🐆

[steep pine]

that compared to what dogs can do

[meager jolt]

fair enough

still hardly "useless"

no?

[steep pine]

Maybe it was a bit over exaggerated but still dogs contribute way way more to society than cats do.

[meager jolt]

that's your perspective

yes dogs have more role

but eh cats have their niche

I'd be more happier to see cats more often than dogs

they're much quieter and reserved

but yeah

each to their own

🐶 🐱

dogs are waay better than goldfish

or rats

[steep pine]

Cats eat you after you die.

[meager jolt]

and dogs don't?

this pretty much applies to pets in general

at least anything with a leg or two

[steep pine]

There are more cases of cats eating their owners than dogs.

[meager jolt]

I would not put too much faith in such broad stroke

I don't think it will matter how well trained or loyal a pet is

if they're starving, they're not gonna die for nothing

[steep pine]

I respect loyalty

dogs have loyalty

cats don't

[meager jolt]

nah

bullshit

[steep pine]

Would you disagree that dogs are more loyal?

[meager jolt]

dogs are loyal no doubt

but more than cats?

nope

[steep pine]

I have to go sleep we will talk about this later.

[meager jolt]

k

[tiny heath]

Can't stop this sigma

[left egret]

This man

Is a menace

[rough elm]

frfr

[steep pine]

Will your cat protect you if someone attacks you?

[meager jolt]

no because domesticated cats are simply not evolved to be confrontational

they're not dogs

you're comparing oranges to apples

[steep pine]

That's why dogs are more loyal

[meager jolt]

dumb argument

[steep pine]

They will fight for you

Cats don't do you favours

[meager jolt]

cats have their own niche

[steep pine]

But dogs are still more loyal.

Whether you like them or not.

[meager jolt]

I don't think they are significantly more so

but yes dogs are neat

[steep pine]

There is a reason why dogs are called a man's best friend.

Not cats

[meager jolt]

each to their own

[meager jolt]

besides

I'm pretty sure that was born from the fact that dogs were the first domesticated animal

no?

[steep pine]

But that already means something how come cats weren't domesticated first?

[meager jolt]

cats are not as social as the wild ancestors of domesticated/pet dogs

cats are their own niche

it would be as ludicrous as expecting fish to climb trees

or apes to learn language

[steep pine]

When you mean loyal are talking about how cats are loyal to humans or loyal each other?

Because dogs no doubt are the most loyal to humans.

[meager jolt]

loyalty is mutual, no? I don't think cats are any less loyal to their fellow beings or to their human owners/caretakers

[meager jolt]

loyal? yes, but inherently more so than cats? I disagree

dogs are no less capable of being reserved or oppurtunistic

granted it all depends on care and training

[steep pine]

So what they're equally loyal or what?

[meager jolt]

equally loyal

I'm not sure why you wanted to place one above the other earlier

[steep pine]

How are cats loyal?

[meager jolt]

as dogs? caring for their owners, showing love and being in company?

what else?

[steep pine]

Would you agree with me that dogs are more attatched to their owners than cats?

[meager jolt]

I think that cats and dogs are equally capable of being attached to their owners

thing is that dogs are more dependent on their owners through evolution, though I would hardly use that as an infallible case for dogs being supposedly "better" and more worthy than their feline counterparts

these are generalities

dogs can be as independent as cats, meanwhile other cats can be more dependent on their caretakers

[steep pine]

There for they more attatched because they are more resilient.

[meager jolt]

resilient by what metric?

[steep pine]

You said so your self

[meager jolt]

physical strength and fight?

yes

but I'd hardly call that a factor that simply makes them "superior" to cats as companions

[steep pine]

Yeah but they like to be alone.

Like very alone.

[meager jolt]

no?

not sure if I'd call dogs necessarily anti social

they have co existed with cats for years and evolved slightly to cater to such mutual symbiosis

[steep pine]

Because they aren't

Cats are anti-social

[meager jolt]

cats lean more to being independent and aren't as dependent as dogs, but I would not call cats outright anti-social

just like there are domestic dogs that might be more reserved and less dependent on human contact

there are outliers and generalities

but cats are not outright anti-social

[steep pine]

Dogs will save your life and even die for you

That's loyalty

[meager jolt]

as if cats don't?

absurd

[steep pine]

You said cats wouldn't defend you from an attacker.

Cats are not in law enforcement

Military

Rescue

[meager jolt]

you don't need to fight to defend

[steep pine]

How would a cat save your life

[meager jolt]

cases will vary wildly and be situational

but a cat may run to find anyone nearby

and cats might be present and stay with their owners during dangers, it all depends

dogs are no less capable of abandoning their owners to danger

and there are indeed cases of that happening

[steep pine]

There are way way way more cases of dogs saving lives than cats

[meager jolt]

either way both pets are no less superior or inferior to each other

[meager jolt]

does that descredit the cases where cats do?

what about cases where dogs don't?

key point is that it all depends on the individual animal

[steep pine]

There are still more cases where cats don't save lives.

[meager jolt]

does that discredit cats entirely?

[steep pine]

No

[meager jolt]

should a case where a dog cowardly runs away be a case to descredit all dogs and their loyalty? absolutely not

it would be highly unfair

[steep pine]

It just proves dogs are more loyal in general

[meager jolt]

I disagree

but each to their own

[steep pine]

If country A with the same military strength as country B but country A has won more wars than country B then you can say that country A is a more likely to win a war than country B

[meager jolt]

I don't see why you're using that as a analogy

just agree to disagree

[steep pine]

Ok

[steep pine]

Touche

[inner mortar]

experiences decides conflicts

war defines everything moment kek

[lunar widget]

Agreed

Rap I don’t like, but classical is very good

[inner mortar]

current rap is dogwater when they did not dominate 2023, just to implode into rival disses by next year

T-rap mixes are no longer trendy anyways

[paper scaffold]

That's not a controversial opinion. That's a fact.

Taylor Swift: Oops, I forgot my makeup. ✈️ ✈️ ✈️

[lunar widget]

Dropkick Murphys

[late belfry]

Islam is 100% not the religion of peace, not that I have anything against Muslims but as a religion it’s definitely not peaceful

[rough elm]

Now

Whats your reasoning @late belfry \

Just curious

cause I agree and disagree with this view

[lunar widget]

Oh I’m now curious about this, ping me when you respond to MBHpower

[crisp lantern]

I somewhat agree with @late belfry and ill b on to discuss this in a bit

I too have nothing against muslims in general and certaintly not the ones here

[dusty idol]

vietcongsoldier4239 has been warned

Reason: Posted an invite

[lunar widget]

Oh cool

[valid shell]

well you gotta elaborate more on why

i believe the otherwise

if anybody think islam is not a peaceful religion possibly because of how many jihadist wars they started

or how many crimes and bombings islam extremists had committed for the past decades

then no

that particular religion ranked the second just behind christianity in the number of practitioners

1.9 billion followers as of 2024 to be precise

and the number of bombers and attackers was estimated to be nearly 50,000 by 2021

that was like 0,002% of the whole muslim followers

muslims across the world is also pretty mixed

many of them are pretty laidback

adhering to the religion while attempting to construct trust and showing pro-social behaviors

[lunar widget]

That’s pretty small, than again that’s just people who had attacked

[valid shell]

yeah

it's too small compared to the whole religion

[lunar widget]

What about numbers just showing extreme Muslims?

Also this is kinda breaking rule 3 due it being past 2012

[steep pine]

Jesus is King

[lunar widget]

Hong Xiuquan is The Heavenly King

[rough elm]

Based monothiest

[crisp lantern]

It's also good to note that Christianity and Islam are the two most persecuted religions

Christianity is persecuted in 145 countries and islam is persecuted in 139

(also two christian evangelists were just beat up in uganda)

[lunar widget]

Where you got these numbers?

[crisp lantern]

(their attackers demanded they give up their faith, the christians refused, but they survived the attack)

[crisp lantern]

wikipedia, from Pew

https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2020/11/10/harassment-of-religious-groups-continues-to-be-reported-in-more-than-90-of-countries/

[lunar widget]

Just horrible

[crisp lantern]

Indeed
The Gospel says "The world will hate you, but know that they hated me first"

Also the third most oppressed religion is Judaism

Which

I find awfully ironic

That the three abrahamic religions responsible for stirring up the most hub bub are also the most oppressed

*at least in western history

[lunar widget]

I know atheist are disliked quite a bit (note the word dislike), but I know it’s been improving.

But this is for the US

[crisp lantern]

I'm willing to keep an open mind. Does anyone have any information about Christians persecuting Muslims in the modern day? I keep looking for stuff but can't find any. I always like to balance out my research by seeing if the "other side" does the same thing. (In this case, persecution). The Islamic oppression of Christians is well documented in modern day.

*in some countries

as I said i have nothing against muslims in general and nothing against the muslims here. There are a few bad apples who ruin the party for everyone

[lunar widget]

Indeed

I would like to research modern religious/secular “persecution”.

No offense but I’m skeptical of when Christians say they are the most persecuted in the world.

[crisp lantern]

I get it. But look at those stats I sent. There's also a Nigerian Christian refugee at my parish with some crazy stories. (Nigeria is its own can of worms) Also, there's a lot of African seminarians who come to the US to study in peace then go back to their countries where they may face persecution

It's real, and it's documented

China is another can of worms

Because there are two Catholic Churches there

and the Vatican is trying to negotiate, but we are seeing some medieval type sht where the Chinese want some control over the church

[crisp lantern]

one church is approved by the state, and the other is underground and persecuted

[lunar widget]

Yeah china is Notorious for that. And I’m not saying that Christians aren’t persecuted? I’m just skeptical on the scale of it.

Particularly when it comes to the US

[crisp lantern]

Sure. I'm doing some simple google searches now. As the stuff I sent says, Christians are the most persecuted but its not by much

[crisp lantern]

there's almost no persecution here. Of anyone, really. The only stuff that can be percieved as persecution has to do with free speech stuff that prbly violates rule 3 in a major way lol

[lunar widget]

We can move this to DMs

[crisp lantern]

We have stuff easy in the US and in the Western world in general.

[lunar widget]

True true

[rough elm]

Patriot act

post 9/11

[crisp lantern]

Well, I dont count George Bush as a Christian. Im talking organizations the scale of Boko Haram etc

Anyway that affected “christians” too lol

[rough elm]

European islamaphibia

anti immigration

rise of the right

[crisp lantern]

Christians arent beating u up and killing u and burning ur mosques

[rough elm]

Yes but thier colonisation caused muslim extremism

so christians kinda brought this upon themsleves

[lunar widget]

Wait he’s not a Christian?

[remote hazel]

Idk how but out of all the English monarchs, you’ve chosen the bipolar one

[lunar widget]

I mean, I have mood swings some days

[crisp lantern]

Hes prbly the only male monarch americans give a damn about

[crisp lantern]

Erm, we’ve been duking it out since 632. Also, the Patriot act was after muslims blew up the twin towers

[lunar widget]

Ah so you actually love him

[remote hazel]

that's cus most Americans don't know of Emperor Norton

[rough elm]

And those muslims blew up twin towers because of american funding of israel

[meager jolt]

those ayrabs should not be surprised for being bombed for every attack they make, very hot take

[crisp lantern]

So
America funds its ally
Muslims dont like that
Muslims kill 3000 americans

Checks out

[rough elm]

Muslims dont like America funding the oppression of other muslims

So they were like "Hey what if we hijack some planes ram 1 into an administrive center one in a millitary center and 2 in like some office buildings for the economic center"

[valid shell]

truly a braindead move

[rough elm]

Yep

[valid shell]

they didn't really expect it only gave rise to islamophobia across the world

[rough elm]

Yeah they were fricking dumb Osama had 6 IQ points

at most

[valid shell]

and middle east just became more messy with increasing american intervention

[rough elm]

Yup

and the center of it all

the goddamn levant

Someone should nuke the whole place including syria and lebannon

That region has been the cause of so many damn wars

[valid shell]

nah uh

that won't work

cus nuking syria and lebanon only further contaminate the region with widespread radiation

and extremely infuriate the muslims

like they been oppressed for almost the 20th and 21st century

bombing them more only sow seeds of hatred and perpetual wars

it wasn't syria and lebanon that gave rise to extremism

it was the domestic violence and how mismanagement from regimes

coupled with reactions of international community and big guys that gave rise to it

[rough elm]

Tru

But I said that as a joke m8

[high parrot]

Pineapple hurts my mouth :(

[slender acorn]

Real

[lavish sun]

My controversial history opinon…
Hmmmm…

French ww2 tanks were actually pretty decent, and they were great in their intended roles

And France should be considered as one of the major allies, because they still had their empire, and they retained military forces all the way through with free french divisions, both air, naval and ground based.

Unless France is considered a major nation

Then I’m rather silly

[meager jolt]

decent tanks at best for sure

[gusty bane]

My controversial opinion, cats are cooler than dogs.

[crisp lantern]

Some one tell @meager jolt that this is a history server not a biology server…..

[meager jolt]

of course I know that

duuh

silly

[steep pine]

Birds are better than Cats

[meager jolt]

You're going to gulag for that 😡

[rough elm]

HERESY

[slender acorn]

. . .

[gusty bane]

https://tenor.com/view/i-beg-your-pardon-gif-25374687

[lavish sun]

I gotta disagree there buddy

[near estuary]

Hitler had a good solution for over population

[lavish sun]

No

Just no

Please

Just

No

[slender acorn]

Not wrong

[lavish sun]

He did not bro😭

He had a terrible solution

[slender acorn]

Nah bro it was great you got to go to a summer camp

[lavish sun]

Not funny

[slender acorn]

WAIT A MINUTE IT’S YOU! I didn’t recognize you without the cat pfp

[lavish sun]

Ye

The almighty Larry

[slender acorn]

Larry the humorless

[lavish sun]

Nay i am Larry the Cat

[valid shell]

yeah ingenious fr

making a bunch of people go camping then never come back

great summer camps they even had furnace and physical labor to keep those people in shape

then they spreaded their summer camping campaign to the whole of europe which was another big milestone

[rough elm]

<@&939306955116249088>

[lavish phoenix]

Personally it comes off as shit ironic joke, but @slender acorn it is probably best if you refrain from making comments like that

[small quail]

what does this mean

[radiant cove]

If hitler stopped attacking countries after austria he wouldnt be such an bad leader he united the germans after all

[lunar widget]

Well there’s a the part of requesting people and being a dictator

[lavish sun]

No

That is not Hitler

[remote hazel]

you know this personality type or smth?

[lavish sun]

Uh no

Just

Hitler would never stop at Austria

And he would keep on imprisoning and executing Jews

[radiant cove]

Im talking IF he stopped at austria

That is very unrealistic sadly

[lavish sun]

):

[kind compass]

the united states was so close to collapse inbetween 1919-when franklin got into office

[tender quail]

thats not that controversial i feel like the nation was in turmoil

[inner mortar]

franklin harding?

[ashen vortex]

franklin roosevelt is think

[inner mortar]

bruv, you've replied to sarcasm

the whole world seemed to teether into turmoil right by the end of WW1, but managed to herald unto the politically tense economic booming of the Rolling '20s

[stable moon]

US overlooking japanese war crime is designed as a "fuck you" to the chinese people

[inner mortar]

They just got... different priorities

As well as when certain theatrical situations change such as the Bamboo Curtain

A past necessity left in the dustbins of policies

[opaque rose]

Allies could have ended WWII instantly if they weren’t dumber than an earthworm

By allies, I mean Britain Poland and France

[limpid folio]

Why?

[rough elm]

Yes

they could have marched into berlin

as soon as polan was invaded

the germans had no troops at the border

[inner mortar]

I wonder how such a rapid day 1 Allied response would fare to take offense upon the Rhineland?

[tender quail]

sorry a little late but i mean there were trials held just search the International Military Tribunal for the Far East sure it wasn't on the same scale as Nürnberg but that definitely wasn't the idea

[steep pine]

Agreed

[lavish sun]

My controversial opinion is that uuuuuuuhh

Templars fucking SUCK

Idk I just don’t like em

And a lot of people I meet that like them are assholes

And they like them cus they killed loads of Muslims

[remote hazel]

May the Father of Understanding Guide Us

[meager jolt]

seems like they're doing their job

I mean as knightly christian band, what else can you expect

[crisp lantern]

[lavish sun]

And that ain’t a good job to be doin

[lavish sun]

Yeah

That doesn’t mean it was a good thing to be doing

[crisp lantern]

seems like your dislike of templars is arbitrary
since there were a heck ton of monastic miliatry orders

[lavish sun]

Fym arbitrary

[crisp lantern]

seems like you've singled out the templars for some reason

when there were many other orders

like the one in my pfp

[lavish sun]

I know there were many religious orders that fought in the holy lands and against non-Christians but I especially hate the Templars because all of the assholes I was talking about them act like they were heroes

[crisp lantern]

ahh okay

well i think that some were heroes but as with all just conflicts there were some bad ones

[lavish sun]

They say they are serving god but I don’t think god wanted his children to savage eachother in the sand

That’s what I hate about every crusading order

[crisp lantern]

Erm
yes but also no

Obviously I, as a Christian, think all war is bad but some wars are less bad

And some wars are just

[lavish sun]

War is all money money money as a wise woman once said

[crisp lantern]

If you hate the Crusaders then you gotta hate the Muslims who were also waging offensive wars

against Christians

[lavish sun]

I hate all of them

I fucking hate everyone in the crusades

Everyone

[crisp lantern]

gasp! Islamophobia!

[lavish sun]

You’re looking at a guy who had to deal with Muslim friends being bullied and harassed by degenerate Christians on many many servers

I’m not saying all Christians are degenerate

A lot of Christians I know are really nice and quite accepting of non-Christians

[crisp lantern]

well, there's a lot of bad blood

and it's still ongoing

[lavish sun]

I know and it HAS to stop

All bad blood has to stop

[crisp lantern]

tell that to the extremists lol

[lavish sun]

Tell that to the degenerates I was talking to

[crisp lantern]

You only see Christians being "extreme" online
I mean, muslims are the ones blowing stuff up

[lavish sun]

They think they’re hard because they supposedly have crusader ancestry and they’re racists

[lavish sun]

There are many muslim officials in 1st world countries who are against all the extremism

Hol on a sec

[crisp lantern]

yes i know this

Many of the muslims on this server are pretty cool

and I bear no hate towards anyone

but I still think the Crusades were justified

but I also think Christians are called to treat everyone charitably

[lavish sun]

They’re as justified as any “war as a response to threat”

[crisp lantern]

"threat that had manifested itself and conquered one christian country"

[lavish sun]

One of the five pillars of Islam is charity

And during the Irish famine the Ottoman Empire donated 40,00£ to the starving, in defiance of the British government who forbade them to do so

[lavish sun]

Shaykh Sumar Al- Qadri is a man who stopped many young men from fighting in wars brought on by Muslim extremists

[crisp lantern]

while also massacring christian armenians

[lavish sun]

When was this?

[crisp lantern]

Christians have lost their violent tendencies while Muslims (some) haven't

[lavish sun]

Muslims in the Middle East haven’t

Most others have

And there are “Christian” organisations such as the triple k if you know what i mean who do some realll bad things

There are rotten Christians and rotten Muslims

But unfortunately one has more than the other

It’s unfortunate that anyone has them

[lavish sun]

(Well there certainly are some who have been disillusioned by war, like anyone would be)

[meager jolt]

"religion of peace"

[crisp lantern]

u counting KKK as christian? brother they are anti catholic

[eager lodge]

bruh did not just post this hot garbage

cring map

[crisp lantern]

yes i thought it was rather one sided

seems like it counts every skirmish as a "battle"

[opaque rose]

The Panther D sucked

[rough elm]

Bro forgot the lords resistance army

[rough elm]

Bruh the christians asked us to invade Iberia

Also the Muslims were VERY tolerente

[rough elm]

Did you forget about the fact that christians burned women who could do math

While the Islamic world went through a scientific golden age

hell you christians stole the stuff we invented and claimed credit

[rough elm]

Still protestent ISIS is anti Shia

@crisp lantern Think about what your typing before you type it please

[lavish sun]

I did put air quotes

I believe they’re Protestants

[rough elm]

Radical southern protestents

[lavish sun]

Yeah that’s it

They’re fucking crazy

I hate em

[rough elm]

They helped Mexican secular government against catholic rebels

https://youtu.be/LNzX5UbbO7I?si=H20EKAsjcogDSrPL

[lavish sun]

Wtf is Ireland doing there bro😭🙏

[rough elm]

GLORY TO IRELAND

[dusty idol]

crhulhuthesquood has been warned

Reason: Mass emoji

[lavish sun]

Uuuuh

[rough elm]

Catholic ireland helping catholic rebels ig

[lavish sun]

When was this war

Like what year

[rough elm]

1929

[lavish sun]

Oh

[rough elm]

Extremist terrorism has been caused by the west

[lavish sun]

Ireland became independent in 1922 and they were extremely poor so why tf would they go in there

[rough elm]

mainly in their export of weapons to israel and their ruthless bombing campaigns in Iraq and Afghanistan making no distinction between civilian or millitary targets

many of the people who I know and who went off to fight in afghanistan said they went to help the afghan people

[lavish sun]

I thought you were talking about Ireland 😭🙏

[rough elm]

Lol I meant muslim extremist

[lavish sun]

Yeah makes sense

I’d want to help them too

Some people did end up helping but others committed war crimes

[rough elm]

But yeah then they say "ERRMMM muzlims are Backward and terrible it snot like we colonised them then bombed them into the stone age"

[rough elm]

The Americans killed 50K in afghanistan

[lavish sun]

Yeah man I get that all the time

[lavish sun]

Yeah man

Wasn’t nice

[rough elm]

Then they caused the deaths of another 200K in Iraq

hell American involvment directlly led to the rise of ISIS

Bush is the father of ISIS

(Hello CIA this is a joke conversation I do not mean any of this)

[lavish sun]

I know a guy who literally calls himself “Portugal” because he is so madly in love with Portugal and he says all of those things

[rough elm]

Bruhhhhhhhhh

[lavish sun]

And he thinks Ireland is a shit country because we have a weak military

Like I won’t lie

We seriously are freeloading

Militarily

But

Ireland is a cool place

Doolin

Dunleary

Cork

Loads of nice places

[inner mortar]

This map is very controversial... for simply being wrong in the matter of holy wars waged all over Europe and the Mediterranean

[rough elm]

Even though Ireland is anti-immigration I can understand it, my mom has a half German freind who fled to Germany due to domestic abuse reasons and she says a lot of her fellow immigrants don't respect the rules and regulations that the german gov imposes

[rough elm]

Ireland seems very scienic

Shame you guys were next to england

[lavish sun]

Most reasonable people I know welcome migrants

We like them (:

Well most of us do

Some

Some don’t

[lavish sun]

Well put it this way

If it weren’t for them

[rough elm]

Yeah thats my point the criminals are very rare yet people generilize them

[lavish sun]

We wouldn’t have good laws

[rough elm]

tru

I am proud of the english who came out in droves to counter protest the rioters

[lavish sun]

Like one of my neighbours is a refugee from Ukraine

[lavish sun]

All those far right guys

They’re crazy

[rough elm]

Yeah

Cowards too

[lavish sun]

They think they can go around and burn down businesses

[rough elm]

The britian first leader fled england

[rough elm]

And attack mosques

[lavish sun]

Not gud

[rough elm]

Guess what the families victims of the stabbings actually helped rebuild and clean up a mosque that was attacked

[lavish sun]

Yeah and in the incident where a handful of kids were killed

They weren’t killed by a migrant

They were killed by some crazy welsh guy

And a migrant man actually tried to stop them

But the far right were so quick to cover it all up that it ended up with migrants taking the blame

[rough elm]

Yup misinformation is crazy

[lavish sun]

Ong

And also

There is a socialist paramilitary movement in Ireland rn💀

I’m actually worried

They want to have Northern Ireland

[rough elm]

Commie ireland?

[lavish sun]

And they want lots of Marxist shit

[rough elm]

New Hoi4 focus

[lavish sun]

Lesgoooo

[rough elm]

Someone took millennium dawn too seriouslly

[lavish sun]

Which will lead to some violence

[lavish sun]

Yeah

Hol on

[rough elm]

The troubles 2

[lavish sun]

Irish Civil war part 2: electric boogaloo

[rough elm]

PAHHAAAA

[lavish sun]

They don’t even show their faces

[rough elm]

"Hey guys join our defnitlly not millitant terrorist orginisation"

[lavish sun]

Yeah fr

[rough elm]

"Promise we won't bomb civilians"

[lavish sun]

And I live in a very small town

You could almost call it a village

And there are posters like that all over the place

[rough elm]

Damn

[lavish sun]

And they only have enough balls to put them on the poles for signs

[limpid folio]

Do you have many murals on the sides of buildings?

[lavish sun]

No

None that I’ve seen

[rough elm]

Thats the average terrorist orginisation a bunch of spineless cowards

[limpid folio]

There's loads in larger town/cities

[rough elm]

brb

[lavish sun]

And I’ve been living in this small village my entire life

[lavish sun]

Me too

[rough elm]

(Oh btw to clear up on the KKK part the KKK has, like an edgy teenager, gone through many phases the current phase is their smallest they were extremely popular in the 20s then in the '60s they became smaller and more militaristic targeting civil rights movements their modern version is a bunch of small cliques across the US)

https://youtu.be/tKA5YnxveXw?si=U6o0X3_xg2hDGyNs

heres my source

Oh also @crisp lantern I belive you forgot about the european brotherhood

A radical Christian/European nationalist group that engaged in arson bombings and assaults targeting immigrants and left-wing activists

[rustic pawn]

Terrorists are cowards regardless of background tbh

[lavish sun]

Ong

[rough elm]

frfr

[rough elm]

The orginisation saw immigration as a "muslim invasion"

[rough elm]

Same source

[rustic pawn]

A lot of media looooove to take the background of different extremist groups and then claim that's how everyone in the wider group behaves.

[rough elm]

Yup

[lavish sun]

I mentioned this guy before to the Kermit guy (that is what I am calling you now @rough elm ) but there was a guy I met and his username was Portugal because he was absolutely madly in love with his country and he pretty much did everything you just said there without a second thought

[rough elm]

Kermit guy is fine lol

[lavish sun]

Thank you Kermit guy

[rustic pawn]

Nationalism smh

[rough elm]

fr

[lavish sun]

I told him: “not every Muslim is the same” but he literally denied that

AS IF THEY DONT MAKE UP 24% OF THE HUMAN POPULATION

[rough elm]

Average european ultranationlist

These ultranationlist cause muslim extremist terrorism

I mean if you've been oppressed and bullied for being muslim your probably gonna want some payback

[lavish sun]

And he sent me a load of propaganda made by edgy rednecks (weird combination, ik) and one of them said: “Arab scientists made a Time Machine that took them back to medieval times called Islam”

LIKE BRO ISLAM WAS CREATED IN MEDIEVAL TIMES

AND THEY WENT THROUGH A GOLDEN AGE UNTIL THE MONGOLS AND THE WEST CAME ALONG

[rough elm]

Yup

Well not rlly a golden age even then muslims were really sectarian and stuff but that was just regular medival activities

[lavish sun]

I’m not Muslim, I’m an atheist, but I have much respect and admiration for a lot of things Muslims and muslim countries have done

And also

In medieval times when the mongols came around

[rough elm]

Thanks

[lavish sun]

Into the Middle East

[rustic pawn]

I respect everyone as long as they don't try pushing an agenda down my and others' throats.

[lavish sun]

A Muslim envoy came to England to propose a Christian-Muslim alliance
And the English king actually considered it
But a fucking BISHOP
Interrupted them and said that they should go back to the Middle East and go kill themselves fighting the mongols

[lavish sun]

Fair

[rustic pawn]

I am of the belief that all countries and groups have done both good and bad things in the past.

[lavish sun]

That’s true

Anyway

I fear we have ventured too far into the realm of unwholesomeness

So

https://youtube.com/watch?v=vEXfKoXXFUo&si=VzXPts-EflHYZhFL

[rustic pawn]

Cats ❤️

[lavish sun]

Hey uh out of interest @rustic pawn who’s the guy on your pfp?

Is he a New Zealand military commander or smth

[rustic pawn]

My current pfp is of Alexei Brusilov - arguably the greatest Russian commander of WWI. Unlike many of his contemporaries in the Stavka, Brusilov advocated for operations using innovative tactics and openly listened to the advice of his officers. This can be seen with the Brusilov Offensive, which utterly crippled the Austro-Hungarian Army.

I plan on changing my pfp to a different commander for each month haha

[lavish sun]

Oh yes he was in charge of the Brusilov offensive
(You’d never geuss)

[lavish sun]

Do Eamon De Valera next time

[limpid folio]

I'd say Collins was a more notable commander, due to his role during the war of independence

[rustic pawn]

I'll consider him 😀

[lavish sun]

Yeah fair

[limpid folio]

Its pretty hard to keep control of an armed force with little/no centralisation, yet the IRA was fairly effective in doing what it did

Considering that local brigades had very little contact with IRA HQ

And local commanders had a lot of autonomy

[rustic pawn]

This might be breaching rule 3 tbh

Read Rule 3

You can't discuss events that happened after 2012.

[wooden warren]

Could Poland have resisted Invasion from N*zi Germany the Soviet Union and the Slovak Republic?

With or without help

[lavish sun]

With help

[lavish sun]

They might’ve been able to resist Germany without help
Emphasis on the might
And the definitely could’ve resisted them with help
But they couldn’t have resisted the Soviets with or without help

[rough elm]

So @crisp lantern what do you say to that

Your precious christians are the victims it's not like they colonised the globe destroying countless unique cultures and enslaving millions every single modern war is a product of colonialism and christian imperialism

[rustic pawn]

And when this is said, we don't intend on targeting and bullying Christians themselves. We're just saying this to remind them, and especially Christian apologists, that not everything is black and white and that Christian powers have also done bad in the past.

[rough elm]

Yup

A lot of christians are really cool people

It's not the common civilian enslaving locals it's the crop at the top

[lavish sun]

Both Christianity and Islam did that but in medieval times Islam did more and in Renaissance/Victorian/whatever was in between the Christians did more

[lavish sun]

Exactly

[rough elm]

Yup

[lavish sun]

Yeah the world is a bit shit

[lavish sun]

-guy who says hot takes

[rough elm]

Truer words have never been spoken

[lavish sun]

Except for : “It is what it is”

[rough elm]

fr

[wooden warren]

Oh wait wrong chat

😅

[lavish sun]

You should know you are danzig

[crisp lantern]

bruh i dont have time nor energy for this debate

but lets see

alright i dont feel like scrolling through here and picking out ur claims

can u summarize them for me

[crisp lantern]

I have never claimed that

I am just saying it's awfully popular to bash on Christians and things Christians do nowdays and we don't deserve all that

Yes we've done bad stuff

But that has never invalidated the truth of our teachings

[crisp lantern]

I somewhat agree. Some of the most heinous crimes done by Ottomans came at the Renaissance and this period was where we saw an Ottoman golden age, when they expanded tremendously.

But as they went into the 1600s (excluding 1683) and 1700s their place on the global stage lessened

[crisp lantern]

hehe my precious christians

Did you know it was the Church who advocated for anti-slavery measures?

[lunar widget]

I agree and disagree with you on that. DM me if you want to talk more about it

[lunar widget]

I know the Catholic ex-slave Toussaint Louverture was very important in the Haitian Revolution. Haiti was the first country to ban slavery.

[crisp lantern]

Indeed. Many of the leaders of that revolution were Catholic. And Jesuits helped alievate their sufferings when they were slaves

And the Jesuit Peter Claver, now a saint, spent his whole life working among slaves, trying to make a difference

It was a Spanish Dominican who raised awareness of the horrors of slavery in the 1600s

[crisp lantern]

I can almost guarantee that the people who bitch about the Inquisition, the burning of the 300 by Mary I ( a good start btw*), colonialism and slavery, have not heard of Nicosia, Famagusta, Augustin Bragadino, Fez, the murders of Andrew Balboa and the Patriarch Joseph

[rough elm]

I don't think he was part of the papcy

[lavish sun]

What about Columbus finding the americas

And all the natives being forced to be Christian and being enslaved

That happened at the same time as the renaissance

[lavish sun]

And the reason why is because teenage rednecks on the internet like to bully non-Christians and that leads those non-Christians to feel a bit bitter to Christians, and they then expose the crimes committed by Christians for purposes related to Christianity

You see there are a lot of channels out there on YouTube like redeemed zoomer who convert loads of young men to Christianity, which is pretty good but some of those newly converted Christians start doing all the bad stuff I said there

Not the war crimes

Obvi

But

Yknow

[rough elm]

Same applies to non christians too i've had many athiests attempt to bully me out of my religioin

"Lol God is stupid imagine your prophet marries a nine year old" (which is false btw most sources agree the marrige was around 14-16)

[lavish sun]

Well as an atheist

Fk those guys

[rough elm]

Based

[rustic pawn]

Chad

[lavish sun]

It’s all misinformation

[rough elm]

Yeah it's people like that who treat religious people as dumber and unenlightened that pushes many to online and sometimes physical extremism

[crisp lantern]

"oh no people changing their whole lives take some time to adjust to it?"

[crisp lantern]

Again
The Church worked against Slavery in those parts
Were they always succesful? No.

Worth mentioning that Colombus was imprison in part for slavery

(ofc it went downhill from there)

And there were genuine conversions as well

[lavish sun]

I wouldn’t doubt there were a lot of corrupt clergymen who wanted to profit off of the slavery or were just racist

[lavish sun]

Yeah

But not nearly as much as many as forced conversions

[crisp lantern]

I don't know. I've heard that anywhere between 2-9 million natives were converted in the wake of Guadelupe.

[lavish sun]

There was probably all sorts of ways they were converted

It is 9 million people some of them must’ve believed genuinely in god and some of them must’ve been forced

[crisp lantern]

And then there were missionaries working on their own, before the Spanish government could get there in force. Especially in modern day Southwest USA

One example is Junipero Serra. He founded 17 missions

On his own, before the Spanish could really get there

According to legend he also brought grapes to california, starting the Californian wine trade

wait no thats not a legend

[lavish sun]

Well, it still stands that across the americas there were Christians who attacked and forcibly converted natives. Especially in North America.

[crisp lantern]

Indeed.
(actually i would say the French did it less)

But again, if we get back to the principal argument, muslims did this as well

[lavish sun]

They all did

[crisp lantern]

they use intimidation tactics to keep people in line
and from 632 to 732 they ran a violent war of expansion

[lavish sun]

Every single civilisation or belief or whatever has done shit like that

[lavish sun]

That’s in medieval times

[crisp lantern]

oh we talking renaissance?

well muslim didnt really expand there

but imo the best parts of the christian vs muslim rivalry happened there

[lavish sun]

Fym the best parts?

This is not a fucking tv show

[crisp lantern]

We have the sack of Cyprus, the Battle of Lepanto, Siege of Malta, Seige of Vienna, Szieget

[crisp lantern]

interesting then

[lavish sun]

Ok

[lunar widget]

Same

[lunar widget]

Idk if this guy was a redneck, but some time ago this guy kept trying to convert me over discord

[lavish sun]

Same here actually

He was just constantly saying that I was stupid n shit like that

[lunar widget]

Damn

Who was it?

[lavish sun]

Some shithead who called himself slatt

[lunar widget]

Ah

Anyways annoying when that happens

[rough elm]

@crisp lantern That war was after diplomacy failed and they treated their captured lands fairly and forced conversations were not a thing in fact many later caliphs wanted more non Muslims for the Jizyah tax

[crisp lantern]

"convert"
"no"
"well i guess diplomacy failed and we gotta conquer you"

[lavish sun]

Isn’t that literally just the crusades

[crisp lantern]

no we never wanted them to convert
we just wanted our land back
and for them to stop attacking us

[lavish sun]

Every religion at that time wanted everyone to convert to it

[crisp lantern]

so that was part of it ig

[lavish sun]

There is no guessing of that, it was absolutely certain the Christians there wanted the Muslims converted or DEAD

There were no “heroes” in the crusades on either side, just lesser shades of barbaric and evil fighters

[crisp lantern]

no Louis IX is my personal hero

Cat really jumping on my grammer huh

[lavish sun]

Well John Deacon is mine get on my level bro is a level 1. Crook in mafia city

(Joke)

[lavish sun]

I am the word police

[crisp lantern]

Louis IX is like if feudalism and communism had a baby

bro fed beggars every day

[lavish sun]

Well I’m not sure on that one

But obviously I can’t say every king was a wanker so yeah I hope that is true

[crisp lantern]

I am tho

[lavish sun]

As in, you’re sure that he fed beggars?

[crisp lantern]

yeah

[lavish sun]

Well then

The rest of the Louis’s did NOT keep up the family tradition

[crisp lantern]

no

he is the only french monarch to be a catholic saint

and one of the only french men i like

[lavish sun]

I’m talking about the other Louis’s

Like Louis the 16th

Yknow

French Revolution

[crisp lantern]

yep

[rough elm]

The Byzantines attacked the muslims at Mu'atah and the Sassanids tore up the prophets letter and threw the messege bearer out of his city

[rough elm]

Yup excluding salladin tho the guy was a chad

[rustic pawn]

The same also happened to First Nations in Canada, Aboriginal Australians and the Maori.

[rough elm]

Glory to christian Britania and christian Francia